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Re: LF: MF 630m: False Decode or Real?

To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: LF: MF 630m: False Decode or Real?
From: Claudio Pozzi <[email protected]>
Date: Fri, 22 May 2015 13:38:56 +0200
In-reply-to: <[email protected]en.be>
References: <[email protected]> <[email protected]> <[email protected]en.be>
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On Thursday, May 21, 2015 08:47:46 you wrote:
> Hello Wolf,
> 
> 
> 
> well said.

What happens if someone flood the internet 'deep search' channel wit a lot of 
fake callsign etc etc? 
Can someone test this flood?

73 de Claudio IK2PII

> 
> From the IARU R1 VHF managers handbook:
> 
> 
> 
> A valid contact is one where both operators have copied both callsigns, the
> report and an unambiguous confirmation. However no recourse should be made
> during the contact to obtain the required information, change of
> frequency, antenna direction, etc. via other methods such as the Internet,
> DX Cluster, talk-back on another band, telephone etc.
> 
> 
> 
> Similar statements are found in other documents such as contest and award
> rules.
> 
> 
> 
> 73, Rik  ON7YD - OR7T
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________
> Van: [email protected]
> [[email protected]] namens wolf_dl4yhf
> [[email protected]] Verzonden: woensdag 20 mei 2015 22:40
> Aan: [email protected]
> Onderwerp: Re: LF: MF 630m: False Decode or Real?
> 
> Hi Jochen,
> 
> I think the discussion about Opera's own 'deep search' mode (or whatever
> the proper name is) was done here (or on "the other" reflector) over a
> year ago, and the main problem I see is that the 'real time web-based
> exchange' of currently active stations means fooling oneself.
> Consider this: You know there are only four possible callsigns which
> have been transmitting, so in reality the software only has to decide
> for a TWO BIT number. Much easier than "really" decoding the entire
> number of message bits in an Opera message.
> 
> In my very personal point of view, this 'real time web exchange of
> stations (calls) which are currently transmitting' should not be used at
> all.
> For comparison, Markus' (DF6NM's) own deep search uses a quite large
> table which is *static*, which means that his decoder has no chance to
> play unfair (because it doesn't know who's currently active or not), and
> it also doesn't know what others receive (over the internet). What I
> don't know is how many stations are currently in that list, and thus how
> many bits the algorithm effectively has to "decode" (well, it doesn't
> really decode, it also makes a best guess from a limited number of list
> entries to chose from).
> 
> All the additional data which look as if they were "decoded" (eg "VK3ELV
> ... 140w + Top loaded L 18m vert 80m horz") have been taken from a
> database (***including the callsign***), not radio .. the only real
> information  is the '- 37 dB' report, and the two question marks which
> imho may as well have been ten or twenty (considering the season and the
> distance).
> 
> Well just my two pence of wisdom. I don't use Opera and don't think I
> ever will.
> 
> Cheers,
>    Wolf .
> 
> Am 20.05.2015 22:03, schrieb J. Althoff:
> > Hi Wolf,
> > 
> > You are not disappointing me at all. I put this issue under discussion
> > myself.
> > 
> > Please share your opinion about this to this topic to us in detail. Maybe
> > I missed A discussion about this before, but I am very interested in
> > arguments about this Topic.
> > 
> > Thanks, Jochen
> > 
> >     -= DF1VB =-
> >    
> >    -= KH2MM =-
> >   
> >   Jochen Althoff
> >   [email protected]
> > 
> > +491712020206
> > 
> >> Am 20.05.2015 um 21:44 schrieb wolf_dl4yhf <[email protected]>:
> >> 
> >> Sorry to dissapoint you but .. no, no, no, and again, no.
> >> 
> >> 73,
> >> 
> >>   Wolf
> >> 
> >> Am 20.05.2015 20:02, schrieb Jochen Althoff:
> >>> Just popped up at my RX:
> >>> 
> >>> 17:52    477 VK3ELV de DF1VB/3 Op8 Deep Search ?? 16348 km -37 dB in
> >>> Dortmund with 140w + Top loaded L 18m vert 80m horz
> >>> 
> >>> Any comments welcome
> >>> 
> >>> 73, Jochen

-- 
Claudio Pozzi  -  rispondere a  [email protected]

 
 
 
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