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Re: LF: Re: Re: LF station in Bavarian Mountains

To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: LF: Re: Re: LF station in Bavarian Mountains
From: "captbrian" <[email protected]>
Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2003 13:24:32 +0100
Reply-to: [email protected]
Sender: <[email protected]>
The email address for Bauer doesn't work. is this book available in English?

-----Original Message-----
From: Dick Rollema <[email protected]>
To: [email protected] <[email protected]>
Cc: Arthur Bauer, PA0AOB <[email protected]>
Date: 26 July 2003 10:53
Subject: Re: LF: Re: Re: LF station in Bavarian Mountains

To All from PA0SE

Matti, OH2ZT wrote:

In a book Klawitter-Herold-Oexner: "Langwellen- und Laengstwellenfunk" by
Siebel Verlag (2000) is a good description of Goliath system pp 47-52 and
also info about other historical VLF-LF stations.

An extensive description of the Goliath station can also be found in a
book written by my good friend Arthur O. Bauer, PA0AOB, of Amsterdam:
Funkpeilung als alliierte Waffe gegen deutsche U-Boote 1939 - 1945, with
subtitle Wie Schwächen und Versäumnisse bei der Funkführung der U-Boote
zum Ausgang der "Schlacht im Atlantik"beigetragen haben.
The part on the Goliath station is a contribution by Klaus Herold and
comprises no less than 41 pages. There are block schematic diagrams,
drawings of the antenna and earth systems,  technical data of  transmitter,
valves, antenna and earth system, power supply , cooling system,  site and
even costs of the station. Also seven photographs.

You may  also be interested in the reaminig part  of the book and I
therefore list the titles of the chapters:
1. Einleitung
2 Der U-Boot Funkdienst, Amgriffsfläche für den Gegener
3. Ultra versus Enigma
4. Die Funkausrüstung der U-Boote
5. Huff-Duff, ein Durchbruch in der schiffsgestützten Peilung auf Kurzwellen
6. Die britische HF-Peil-Anlage FH-4
7. Huff-Duff sichert Geleitzüge (Augenzeugenberichte)
8. Die Funkführung der U-Boote in der Praxis
9. Die verschiedenen Arten von U-Boot-Funksprüchen
10. Schlussbetrachtung
Erganzende B eitrage
I. Die Metox-Affaire
II. Das Kurzsignalverfahren Kurier (contribution by Ralph Erskine)
III. Funkverfassung ausserhalb der Schwebunkslücke (contribution by Klaus
IV. Der Goilath-Sender (contribution by Klaus Herold

Erklärung von Abkürzungen




This may look like another commercial on the reflector but let me assure
you that I have no commercial interest in the book whatsoever.

If you are interested in the book you better contact Arthur Bauer directly:
[email protected]

73, Dick, PA0SE

----- Original Message -----
From: "Hans-Joachim Brandt" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2003 10:05 PM
Subject: LF: Re: LF station in Bavarian Mountains

Dear Group,

as far as I know, living in eastern Bavaria, just a few concrete blocks can
be found on the mountains mentioned, which have carried the antenna wires.

For more details I guss I had to contact Karl Hille, DL1VU, who lives
to that region (he is a true bavarian, older than me, and lives there since
a long time).

But concerning the Lorenz Company, they got their chance to build a VLF
station at the beginning of the second world war for erecting the so-called
"Goliath" station for communication with submarines, operating at
16 kHz with 1 MW transmitter output and 50% antenna efficiency, employing
the Alexanderson principle. In the "German Museum" in Munich I have read in
a book that submarines before New York could copy this station at a depth
16-20 meters, and at about 8 meters before Japan, using magnetic aerials.

This station has never been bombed by the allied forces (obviously they
wanted to observe the traffic). The book said that at the end of the war
exciter stages were destroyed by the Germans, later the Russians rushed in,
dismantled the station and put the transmitter into acitivity again in the
Soviet Union employing russian tubes. Nothing could be said in this book
about the condition of the ground system.


73 Ha-Jo, DJ1ZB

"captbrian" <[email protected]> schrieb:
> Quick ! , - Is it still there ?   ;-))
> Bryan - G3GVB
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dick Rollema <[email protected]>
> To: LF-Group <[email protected]>
> Date: 24 July 2003 14:54
> Subject: LF: FS formula
> To All from PA0SE
> William Oorschot, PA0WFO, has sent me a copy of a three part article by
> Karl H. Hille, DL1VU, in the German 2002 magazine FUNK: "Die Bergantenne
> Herzogstand - Vor 75 Jahren eine technische Grosstat" (The mountain
> at the Herzogstand - For 75 years a technical amazing feat).  This
> the following.
> The large VLF stations at Nauen and Eilvese in Germany that were on the
> around 1920 were built by Telefunken. The German firm Carl Lorenz AG
> like to supply VLF stations as well but were unable to do so. They could
> supply arc-transmitters of sufficient power but not the enormous antenna
> masts they had to offer with the transmitters in order to compete with
> Telefunken. Steel masts were unacceptably expensive around 1920 due to
> unbelievable strong inflation that started at the same time Lorenz began
> planning the station. So they looked for an alternative. There was an
> example. For the VLF link between the Netherlands and the Netherlands
> Indies (now Indonesia) a large arc-transmitter hand been constructed at
> Malabar on the island Java. The antenna hung over a valley between two
> mountains, obviating the use of high masts.
> Lorenz decided to do the same. They strung an antenna between two
> tops in the South of Germany, the mountains were the Herzogstand at
> and the Stein at 940m. The horizontal distance between the mountain tops
> was 2700m.  About one third from the low end of the sloping wire an
> insulator was inserted and a vertical wire connected the part to the
> Herzogstand to the transmitter in the valley. So an L-antenna resulted,
> against an extensive earth system, using multiple electrodes in marsh
> around the station.. The efficiency of this configuration was found to
> higher than for a T-antenna, in which the whole sloping wire between the
> mountain tops was used.
> Using a 500W valve transmitter strength measurements were performed over
> the whole of Germany and the efficiency of the antenna system was found
> be comparable to the one of Nauen, that consisted of two 250m masts,
> 210m masts, two 180m masts and four200m masts.
> In 1926 the station was ready but it did not become operational as by
> time it  had been found that on short waves a few kilowatt and a small
> antenna could provide long distance communication equal to or even
> than on VLF.
> The reason I mention all this that the article contains an interesting
> formula for field strength at the surface of the earth around  a
> antenna. The formula comes from a 1926 publication by  M. Bäumler.
> (also as attachment).
> Field Strength.jpg
> E = field strength in V/m
> I = current in the current maximum of the antenna.
> hw = effective height in m.
> lambda = wave length in m.
> d = distance in m.
> j = operator for 90 degrees phase shift.
> The first part gives the far field; the second part the electric
> of the near field. The far field diminishes with 1/d, the near field
> 1/d squared. At 2 wavelength distance the near field is 8% of the far
> field, at 4 wavelength 4% and at 16 wavelength 1% of the far field.
> It is clear that the formula is only correct over perfect earth. But at
> distances where field strength measurements are usually performed, and
> certainly at VLF, the influence of the real earth on the field strength
> negligible.
> The term effective height is now mostly used in connection with antennas
> for reception.
> Now an example:
> A vertical antenna of 20m at 136kHz has an effective height of 10m and a
> radiation resistance of 0.028 ohm.
> To radiate 1kW the current must be 189A. The wavelength is 2205m.
> these figures into the formula we find the far field at 1km distance to
> 0.323V/m, which compares well with the 300mV/m that is given by the CCIR
> curves for ground wave propagation.
> 73, Dick, PA0SE
> JN22GD

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