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Re: LF: MOFMT ADSL noise

To: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: LF: MOFMT ADSL noise
From: "Ken" <[email protected]>
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 2009 09:22:46 +0100
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Hi Pete.
Having a weak DSL signal, how does your 500kHz TX output affect the DSL synchronisation?. I am in a similar position, and my 500kHz TX 100mW ERP cw causes complete loss of synchronisation dispite copious use of common mode filters.
 
73.
Ken
M0KHW
----- Original Message -----
From: M0FMT
Sent: Wednesday, October 14, 2009 1:36 PM
Subject: RE: LF: MOFMT ADSL noise

Hi LF group
 
Thank you Jim and Laurence for you interest and information.
 
Lifting this from Wikipedia ....... "With standard ADSL (annex A), the band from 25.875 kHz to 138 kHz is used for upstream communication, while 138 kHz – 1104 kHz is used for downstream communication" ....... 
Jim is right about 136 and I find the band unaffected it is in a dead spot in the ADSL spectrum, assuming its clean of course.
I have considered filters that are advertised but since we have a weak ADSL signal here, easily knocked out by Amateur TX on virtually any band I felt that a filter would make things worse in that respect. The reasoning being that a filter notch sitting right in the middle of the down stream channel would adversely affect the down load times which are only a tad better than dial up here. I may make something and try it, thanks for putting that idea into the mix.
 
It doesn't help that my antenna runs above the BT line (at right angles) to my neighbours place but having said that trials at the furthest distance from the line using a frame ant and battery run RX things were no better. However I did not earth the LW that I will try next time.
 
Thanks to all for the inputs I have filed them for reference.
 
73 petefmt
 
--- On Wed, 14/10/09, Laurence BY3A-KL1X China <[email protected]> wrote:

From: Laurence BY3A-KL1X China <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: LF: MOFMT ADSL noise
To: [email protected]
Date: Wednesday, 14 October, 2009, 3:39 AM

I had the same problem on 500 up in KL7 at home. I ended up moving the modem to the garage where the telephone line comes out of the ground and keeping the ADSL loaded wiring as short as possible -  then on the telephone side of the router  I connected up a pair of reasonable quality of seried ADSL filters outbound for normal telephone wiring in the house. From 20 over noise I cant "see it" now as the big antennae has been chocked off. I only use wireless around the property so it wasnt an issue.
 
Next job is to choke off the noise from the AC power line coming out of the ground - its awful.
 
relates to MTA Palmer Alaska solutions ADSL

 
Laurence KL 1 X
 
> From: [email protected]
> To: [email protected]
> Date: Tue, 13 Oct 2009 23:10:53 +0100
> Subject: Re: LF: MOFMT ADSL noise
>
> Dear Pete, Paul-Henrik,
>
> M0FMT wrote:
> ....> Well I can only conclude it is ADSL because it is just raising the
> noise floor it is very subtle not really identifiable like say TV LTB, it's
> a mush...>
>
> I have problems with ADSL on 500kHz at my QTH - it sounds like "white noise"
> with no audible distinctive features I can detect. The noise can be about
> 10 - 20dB over the band noise here over a fairly wide bandwidth in the MF
> range. It does not seem to be a problem at 136k, perhaps because this is in
> the guard band between upstream and downstream ADSL signals. It is easy to
> tell if you are experiencing noise from your own ADSL connection -
> disconnect the incoming phone line (probably just unplugging the modem from
> the phone socket will be enough) and there will be a reduction in noise
> level. Unfortunately, there also seems to be a significant level of similar
> noise here from other sources, probably my neighbors' ADSL via the overhead
> phone lines.
>
> I have had some success with a noise-cancelling arrangement here, where the
> ADSL noise is sampled using a current transformer made by passing the
> incoming phone line through a ferrite core, and summed with the signal from
> loop antennas via a variable phase-shifting and gain-adjusting network,
> which is adjusted for a null in the noise. Also, moving the loop around the
> QTH shows some positions are better than others. Actually, life is a bit
> more complicated at this particular QTH, since there also seems to be
> wide-band noise originating as very low-level sidebands from the local
> broadcast stations. This requires a second noise-cancelling network to null
> noise from that direction. Also, it was necessary to insert a relay in
> series with the loading coil to disconnect the TX antenna on receive,
> otherwise this coupled more noise into the receiving antennas. But when it
> is all adjusted properly, the overall noise level can be reduced in
> favourable directions by about 20dB, which is worth doing.
>
> Cheers, Jim Moritz
> 73 de M0BMU
>
>


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