From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 18:53:24 -0500
From: Mitch Powell <mitch.powell@sympatico.ca>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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> Have John contact VE7SL if your corresponding as Steve has lots of info on
> Canadian activity and could relay alot of info.
> 
> have John Google 'VE7SL' and he'll get all the low down on Canadian 2200m
> Acivity.  I guess until Joe gets back on Mitch is his best bet.

Scott - at the time Jack did not have internet - I don't know if that has
changed.

Mitch



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ <k2ors@comcast.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 00:59:59 +0000
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> Scott - at the time Jack did not have internet - I don't know if that has
> changed.
    I'm guessing that it hasn't changed given the fact he mailed me a cassette tape instead of e-mailing me with a .wav or mp3 file attached!
BTW the cassette had very good quality copy of my  10wpm cw.

73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
FN42hi


> 
> 
> > Have John contact VE7SL if your corresponding as Steve has lots of info on
> > Canadian activity and could relay alot of info.
> > 
> > have John Google 'VE7SL' and he'll get all the low down on Canadian 2200m
> > Acivity.  I guess until Joe gets back on Mitch is his best bet.
> 
> Scott - at the time Jack did not have internet - I don't know if that has
> changed.
> 
> Mitch
> 
> 


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org,  lowfer@lwca.org
Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 18:59:46 -0900
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WD2XDW on 137.7753/6 KHz DFCW 60 on at appx 0200z 1st March 2005 1Kw input 
35A loop current or so.

Long CW message and  ident at beginning tends to elongate the first 
character as viewed on Argo dot 30 slow.

Status http://myweb.cableone.net/flow

Happy St Davids day boyos

Laurence KL1X/5 em26aq Bville OK




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "captbrian" <captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org,  lowfer@lwca.org
References: <BAY102-F14356BF97104B7EB4F9DD5CF590@phx.gbl>
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 And to you Laurie-radio bach.

Bryan
----- Original Message ----- 
From: Laurence KL1X <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>; <lowfer@lwca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 3:59 AM
Subject: LF: XDW on


> > Happy St Davids day boyos
> 
> Laurence KL1X/5 em26aq Bville OK
> 
> 
> 
> 



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Message-ID: <000b01c51e3b$b1aaed40$0201a8c0@private.network>
From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: lowfer@lwca.org,  rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Cc: "Steve McDonald" <jsm@gulfislands.com>
References: <003e01c51e2b$0f93d220$0201a8c0@private.network>
Subject: Re: [LW] ... --- ...
Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 00:50:17 -0800
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1106" name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
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<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Seems I was alittle quick to call for 
help!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I found the problem.&nbsp; When the two 4013 
dividers are powered up individually they sinc differently (of course they 
would!).&nbsp;&nbsp; Solution: reset one TXs LV PSU until it is in phase or 
share one PSU!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>With the TXs running with a conservative 36V supply 
we get 750W output to the dummy load.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I love the smell of burning dummy load in the 
morning...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 Scott</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr 
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV 
  style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
  <A title=sthed475@telus.net href="mailto:sthed475@telus.net">Scott Tilley</A> 
  </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=lowfer@lwca.org 
  href="mailto:lowfer@lwca.org">lowfer@lwca.org</A> ; <A 
  title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> 
  </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, February 28, 2005 10:51 
  PM</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [LW] ... --- ...</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The smoke test of this Wilkinson Combiner was 
  successfull in that no smoke came out and nothing died.&nbsp; However, we get 
  enough heat to cook an egg on the 100ohm balance 
  resistor.&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>We have a scope match on the output to the dummy 
  load and it shows about 225W from one transmitter, add another and we get 
  450W, success NOPE!&nbsp; The transmitters are outputting ~450W each! 
  Therefore, half the power is being absorbed in the 100ohm balance 
  resistor.&nbsp; Examining the phase relationship of the input to the combiner 
  waveforms indicates they are in phase within ~10degrees and almost equal in 
  amplitude.&nbsp; So what gives!&nbsp; Anyone have some idea what may be going 
  wrong?&nbsp; Of course we have checked and doubled checked the circuit for 
  errors and nothing...&nbsp; All seems as it should according to formulas and 
  drawings we have viewed and designed it from.</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Does anyone have an idea how we could 
  troubleshoot our way through this?</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Any&nbsp;advice would be 
appreciated.</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 Scott and Steve(It's all his fault 
  ;-)</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Check the status of radio beacon 'TIL'&nbsp; in 
  CN89lg at:<BR><A 
  href="http://www.scottboxx.com/radio">www.scottboxx.com/radio</A><BR></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
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Hi Steve I have just had a thought your construction looks fine....BUT maybe
the two coils are too close together and there is some coupling. I wonder if
it is possible to temporarily turn one at right angles to kill any coupling
and see if that helps??
The biggies in my Web page were made with big toroids I believe probably
iron dust rather than ferrite, as the inductance reqquired is not that high

Cheers de Alan G3NYK

----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: <lowfer@lwca.org>; <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 01 March 2005 06:51
Subject: LF: ... --- ...


The smoke test of this Wilkinson Combiner was successfull in that no smoke
came out and nothing died.  However, we get enough heat to cook an egg on
the 100ohm balance resistor.

We have a scope match on the output to the dummy load and it shows about
225W from one transmitter, add another and we get 450W, success NOPE!  The
transmitters are outputting ~450W each! Therefore, half the power is being
absorbed in the 100ohm balance resistor.  Examining the phase relationship
of the input to the combiner waveforms indicates they are in phase within
~10degrees and almost equal in amplitude.  So what gives!  Anyone have some
idea what may be going wrong?  Of course we have checked and doubled checked
the circuit for errors and nothing...  All seems as it should according to
formulas and drawings we have viewed and designed it from.

Does anyone have an idea how we could troubleshoot our way through this?

Any advice would be appreciated.

73 Scott and Steve(It's all his fault ;-)


Check the status of radio beacon 'TIL'  in CN89lg at:
www.scottboxx.com/radio




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <003e01c51e2b$0f93d220$0201a8c0@private.network> <000b01c51e3b$b1aaed40$0201a8c0@private.network>
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Hi Scott....Ah yes you do need to be "in phase"......glad it works well
....keep a fire extinguisher handy !!

It looks my ideas about conditions may be about right..... I have a
decodable signal from Laurence's WD2XDW last night. I have not seen that for
a long time.

Alan G3NYK

----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: <lowfer@lwca.org>; <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Cc: "Steve McDonald" <jsm@gulfislands.com>
Sent: 01 March 2005 08:50
Subject: LF: Re: [LW] ... --- ...


Seems I was alittle quick to call for help!

I found the problem.  When the two 4013 dividers are powered up individually
they sinc differently (of course they would!).   Solution: reset one TXs LV
PSU until it is in phase or share one PSU!

With the TXs running with a conservative 36V supply we get 750W output to
the dummy load.

I love the smell of burning dummy load in the morning...

73 Scott

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Scott Tilley
  To: lowfer@lwca.org ; rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
  Sent: Monday, February 28, 2005 10:51 PM
  Subject: [LW] ... --- ...


  The smoke test of this Wilkinson Combiner was successfull in that no smoke
came out and nothing died.  However, we get enough heat to cook an egg on
the 100ohm balance resistor.

  We have a scope match on the output to the dummy load and it shows about
225W from one transmitter, add another and we get 450W, success NOPE!  The
transmitters are outputting ~450W each! Therefore, half the power is being
absorbed in the 100ohm balance resistor.  Examining the phase relationship
of the input to the combiner waveforms indicates they are in phase within
~10degrees and almost equal in amplitude.  So what gives!  Anyone have some
idea what may be going wrong?  Of course we have checked and doubled checked
the circuit for errors and nothing...  All seems as it should according to
formulas and drawings we have viewed and designed it from.

  Does anyone have an idea how we could troubleshoot our way through this?

  Any advice would be appreciated.

  73 Scott and Steve(It's all his fault ;-)


  Check the status of radio beacon 'TIL'  in CN89lg at:
  www.scottboxx.com/radio




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Hey Alan

We got the bugs out...  Once I found the problem with the lack of sinc in
the 4013 divider stages things have been working as expected.  I thought
about the inductor coupling; however, based on my observations the combiner
is not doing anything negative to the signal train.  We still have >80% eff.

I would like to try this with toroids next and compact it down.  I'm also
dreaming up a bigger badder amp using this concept.  It seems real stable
and doesn't require running the system 'balls to the wall' to get some
serious power from 4 FET and a reasonable PSU voltage.

73 Scott

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 2:49 AM
Subject: LF: Re: ... --- ...


> Hi Steve I have just had a thought your construction looks fine....BUT
maybe
> the two coils are too close together and there is some coupling. I wonder
if
> it is possible to temporarily turn one at right angles to kill any
coupling
> and see if that helps??
> The biggies in my Web page were made with big toroids I believe probably
> iron dust rather than ferrite, as the inductance reqquired is not that
high
>
> Cheers de Alan G3NYK
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
> To: <lowfer@lwca.org>; <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: 01 March 2005 06:51
> Subject: LF: ... --- ...
>
>
> The smoke test of this Wilkinson Combiner was successfull in that no smoke
> came out and nothing died.  However, we get enough heat to cook an egg on
> the 100ohm balance resistor.
>
> We have a scope match on the output to the dummy load and it shows about
> 225W from one transmitter, add another and we get 450W, success NOPE!  The
> transmitters are outputting ~450W each! Therefore, half the power is being
> absorbed in the 100ohm balance resistor.  Examining the phase relationship
> of the input to the combiner waveforms indicates they are in phase within
> ~10degrees and almost equal in amplitude.  So what gives!  Anyone have
some
> idea what may be going wrong?  Of course we have checked and doubled
checked
> the circuit for errors and nothing...  All seems as it should according to
> formulas and drawings we have viewed and designed it from.
>
> Does anyone have an idea how we could troubleshoot our way through this?
>
> Any advice would be appreciated.
>
> 73 Scott and Steve(It's all his fault ;-)
>
>
> Check the status of radio beacon 'TIL'  in CN89lg at:
> www.scottboxx.com/radio
>
>
>
>


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hi Scott, there is one advantage that toroids could bring you could put
three amps together....I think with Wilkinsons you really need a tree so its
powers of two....I am sure i have seen something different somewhere. From
memory, one of the toroidal circuits on my page looks a bit like a "ring"
with the last leg couple back to the first. I think this can be configured
to suit the number of ports available.

Cheers de Alan

----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 01 March 2005 10:58
Subject: LF: Re: Re: ... --- ...


> Hey Alan
>
> We got the bugs out...  Once I found the problem with the lack of sinc in
> the 4013 divider stages things have been working as expected.  I thought
> about the inductor coupling; however, based on my observations the
combiner
> is not doing anything negative to the signal train.  We still have >80%
eff.
>
> I would like to try this with toroids next and compact it down.  I'm also
> dreaming up a bigger badder amp using this concept.  It seems real stable
> and doesn't require running the system 'balls to the wall' to get some
> serious power from 4 FET and a reasonable PSU voltage.
>
> 73 Scott




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Dave G3WCB" <ganymede444@btopenworld.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 11:13:00 -0000
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Subject: LF: Big Bad Amps <was re: ... --- ...>
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Hi, Scott.

If you're into Big Bad Amps, you should check out G4FTC's site
http://www.qsl.net/g4ftc/amplifiers/136khz/home.htm He describes a 3kW LF
amp. that uses 8 x IRFP450's in a bridge arrangement. Biggest PA I've seen
so far!

BTW, if you have two identical TX's already, and you find the Wilkinson
thing doesn't work out, you could re-configure your amps. into a bridge
arrangement instead, bit like the Decca TX's.

Keep that fire-blanket handy!

Cheers,

Dave G3WCB.

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Scott Tilley
Sent: 01 March 2005 10:59
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: Re: Re: ... --- ...


Hey Alan

We got the bugs out...  Once I found the problem with the lack of sinc in
the 4013 divider stages things have been working as expected.  I thought
about the inductor coupling; however, based on my observations the combiner
is not doing anything negative to the signal train.  We still have >80% eff.

I would like to try this with toroids next and compact it down.  I'm also
dreaming up a bigger badder amp using this concept.  It seems real stable
and doesn't require running the system 'balls to the wall' to get some
serious power from 4 FET and a reasonable PSU voltage.

73 Scott

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 2:49 AM
Subject: LF: Re: ... --- ...


> Hi Steve I have just had a thought your construction looks fine....BUT
maybe
> the two coils are too close together and there is some coupling. I wonder
if
> it is possible to temporarily turn one at right angles to kill any
coupling
> and see if that helps??
> The biggies in my Web page were made with big toroids I believe probably
> iron dust rather than ferrite, as the inductance reqquired is not that
high
>
> Cheers de Alan G3NYK
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
> To: <lowfer@lwca.org>; <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: 01 March 2005 06:51
> Subject: LF: ... --- ...
>
>
> The smoke test of this Wilkinson Combiner was successfull in that no smoke
> came out and nothing died.  However, we get enough heat to cook an egg on
> the 100ohm balance resistor.
>
> We have a scope match on the output to the dummy load and it shows about
> 225W from one transmitter, add another and we get 450W, success NOPE!  The
> transmitters are outputting ~450W each! Therefore, half the power is being
> absorbed in the 100ohm balance resistor.  Examining the phase relationship
> of the input to the combiner waveforms indicates they are in phase within
> ~10degrees and almost equal in amplitude.  So what gives!  Anyone have
some
> idea what may be going wrong?  Of course we have checked and doubled
checked
> the circuit for errors and nothing...  All seems as it should according to
> formulas and drawings we have viewed and designed it from.
>
> Does anyone have an idea how we could troubleshoot our way through this?
>
> Any advice would be appreciated.
>
> 73 Scott and Steve(It's all his fault ;-)
>
>
> Check the status of radio beacon 'TIL'  in CN89lg at:
> www.scottboxx.com/radio
>
>
>
>






From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 12:34:58 +0100
From: Dick Rollema <dickrollema@casema.nl>
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Subject: LF: Current "lost" in loading coil
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To All from PA0SE

Several amateurs have found that the current at the bottom end of the 
loading coil is higher than at the top (aerial side) of the coil.
In my station the difference is of the order of 10%.

William, PA0WFO, has a large coil of 8 mH and a 23 m long wire as aerial. 
He measures 1.5 A at the bottom of the coil en 0.6 A at the top.
My theory is that the "lost current"  flows via the capacitance of the coil 
to its surrounding (even a metal object in free space has  capacitance).

The current at the bottom of the bottom of the coil divides between the 
capacitances of  coil and  aerial.

I suggested to William he  measure the capacitance of the coil and of the 
aerial. For the coil he found 150 - 200 pF, depending upon the position of 
the coil and for the aerial 210 pF.
But these values do not explain the large difference in current at bottom 
and top of the coil.

In a transmitting aerial the current increases going from the end of the 
radiator towards the coil.

Now to my question:  does this increase in current also occur in the 
winding of the coil?  My feeling is that the current at the beginning and 
end of a coil should be the same; apart from the current that flows via its 
capacitance to the surrounding.

I also have read that the coil should be considered as an aerial with a 
length equal to the length of the coil.  But on 2 km
that would be an extremely  small aerial, reckoned in wavelength.  So 
radiation by the coil must be negligible.

There are certainly  experts on the reflector who know the answers.  I 
welcome  their views.

73, Dick, PA0SE 




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Walter Blanchard" <blanch@pncl.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <200502271724500058.0418698B@mail.zetnet.co.uk><005001c51cf8$524d6c40$10b80150@p2300> <200502281113330523.07EADBD4@mail.zetnet.co.uk> <007201c51d8c$ab993a60$37b80150@p2300>
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In 1968 I had a long-running correspondence with the RSGB over the IARU 
adoption of what was then the "QRA Locator"; later to become the 
"Maidenhead" locator.  QRA was first proposed for amateur use by a Czech 
amateur OK1VR in 1958 and was subsequently adopted by amateurs in all the 
Warsaw Pact countries. I believe it originated in a USSR military locator 
system already well understood by them. The Western (NATO) counterpart was 
the GEOREF system which I described in an RSGB Bulletin article in 1968. The 
RSGB VHF committee at the time were, somewhat amazingly, unaware of GEOREF 
and thought that QRA was a totally amateur invention. When I started pushing 
for GEOREF, a more logical, accurate and simpler system, I was more or less 
told to keep quiet and stop rocking the boat since the IARU were going for 
QRA and that was that. The rest, as they say, is history.  I forecast at the 
time that QRA would never have the accuracy required for accurate contest 
scoring and that's why Maidenhead has become so needlessly complicated. We 
could also have gone for the well-established world-wide UTM grid but I 
suppose that would have been too easy. It's all too late to do anything now, 
of course, but I have never met a professional geodesist who understands why 
we need Maidenhead. .

Walter G3JKV.





From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "captbrian" <captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Cc: "W.F. Oorschot" <pa0wfo@chello.nl>
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Subject: LF: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil
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I am not an expert at all but a feeling for the answer can often be found by
taking a  predictable answer to a simple example and moving progressively to
the situation under consideration.

(A)If you pull the coil out into a straight wire (all in the mind of
course ) will the current be less at the remote end than the close end ?
Ans. Yes of course

If you make a single spiral turn of the original diameter but stretching the
full length of the wire will it be less ? Ans. of course it will.

How about two spiral turns? Ans, Yes

Three turns ? Ye-es.
Four ? Five ?

Is  there some magic number of turns that the current suddenly becomes the
same at the top and the bottom?  Ans. Never heard of such a thing

OK then ,When you have the coil all put back together (in your mind) to the
original configuration  will there be less at the top than at the bottom?
Obviously yes!!

How much difference is another matter.
(B)
I always thought of a short  loaded antenna as an inductance in series with
the capacitance of the "whip" to make a resonant "acceptor" circuit but I
was coaching a nurse for her american radio amateur  exam so she could use
it on board a far-away sailboat. When talking about bottom loading of a
back-stay antenna with a coil of wire she said "well that's obvious , the
coil is just a winding up of the rest of the wire which should have been out
there in the first place" and ever since I have thought of  bottom loading
as just a winding up of some of the antenna wire. On that basis the current
is sure to be less at the top than at the bottom.

G3GVB

----- Original Message -----
From: Dick Rollema <dickrollema@casema.nl>
To: LF-Group <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Cc: W.F. Oorschot <pa0wfo@chello.nl>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 11:34 AM
Subject: LF: Current "lost" in loading coil


> To All from PA0SE
>
> Several amateurs have found that the current at the bottom end of the
> loading coil is higher than at the top (aerial side) of the coil.
> In my station the difference is of the order of 10%.
>
> William, PA0WFO, has a large coil of 8 mH and a 23 m long wire as aerial.
> He measures 1.5 A at the bottom of the coil en 0.6 A at the top.
> My theory is that the "lost current"  flows via the capacitance of the
coil
> to its surrounding (even a metal object in free space has  capacitance).
>
> The current at the bottom of the bottom of the coil divides between the
> capacitances of  coil and  aerial.
>
> I suggested to William he  measure the capacitance of the coil and of the
> aerial. For the coil he found 150 - 200 pF, depending upon the position of
> the coil and for the aerial 210 pF.
> But these values do not explain the large difference in current at bottom
> and top of the coil.
>
> In a transmitting aerial the current increases going from the end of the
> radiator towards the coil.
>
> Now to my question:  does this increase in current also occur in the
> winding of the coil?  My feeling is that the current at the beginning and
> end of a coil should be the same; apart from the current that flows via
its
> capacitance to the surrounding.
>
> I also have read that the coil should be considered as an aerial with a
> length equal to the length of the coil.  But on 2 km
> that would be an extremely  small aerial, reckoned in wavelength.  So
> radiation by the coil must be negligible.
>
> There are certainly  experts on the reflector who know the answers.  I
> welcome  their views.
>
> 73, Dick, PA0SE
>
>
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "captbrian" <captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <200502271724500058.0418698B@mail.zetnet.co.uk><005001c51cf8$524d6c40$10b80150@p2300> <200502281113330523.07EADBD4@mail.zetnet.co.uk> <007201c51d8c$ab993a60$37b80150@p2300> <004101c51e54$11e9fa80$2101a8c0@AUG2004>
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That is an interesting historical account but you fail to tell us the
reasons advanced for not using Lat. Long. ie trigonometrical definitions on
a true curved surface rather than  draughtsman drawn squares on a
draughtsman drawn simulation on a flat sheet of paper

G3GVB


----- Original Message -----
From: Walter Blanchard <blanch@pncl.co.uk>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 11:44 AM
Subject: LF: Locators


> In 1968 I had a long-running correspondence with the RSGB over the IARU
> adoption of what was then the "QRA Locator"; later to become the
> "Maidenhead" locator.  QRA was first proposed for amateur use by a Czech
> amateur OK1VR in 1958 and was subsequently adopted by amateurs in all the
> Warsaw Pact countries. I believe it originated in a USSR military locator
> system already well understood by them. The Western (NATO) counterpart was
> the GEOREF system which I described in an RSGB Bulletin article in 1968.
The
> RSGB VHF committee at the time were, somewhat amazingly, unaware of GEOREF
> and thought that QRA was a totally amateur invention. When I started
pushing
> for GEOREF, a more logical, accurate and simpler system, I was more or
less
> told to keep quiet and stop rocking the boat since the IARU were going for
> QRA and that was that. The rest, as they say, is history.  I forecast at
the
> time that QRA would never have the accuracy required for accurate contest
> scoring and that's why Maidenhead has become so needlessly complicated. We
> could also have gone for the well-established world-wide UTM grid but I
> suppose that would have been too easy. It's all too late to do anything
now,
> of course, but I have never met a professional geodesist who understands
why
> we need Maidenhead. .
>
> Walter G3JKV.
>
>
>
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Message-ID: <005501c51e5c$5170d220$47540150@p2300>
From: "captbrian" <captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <200502271724500058.0418698B@mail.zetnet.co.uk><005001c51cf8$524d6c40$10b80150@p2300> <200502281113330523.07EADBD4@mail.zetnet.co.uk> <007201c51d8c$ab993a60$37b80150@p2300> <004101c51e54$11e9fa80$2101a8c0@AUG2004> <003d01c51e5a$7da54440$47540150@p2300>
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BTW is there a site with a program that inputs lat.long and outputs the
locator and "wab" ?
Bryan

----- Original Message -----
From: captbrian <captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 12:30 PM
Subject: LF: Re: Locators


> That is an interesting historical account but you fail to tell us the
> reasons advanced for not using Lat. Long. ie trigonometrical definitions
on
> a true curved surface rather than  draughtsman drawn squares on a
> draughtsman drawn simulation on a flat sheet of paper
>
> G3GVB
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Walter Blanchard <blanch@pncl.co.uk>
> To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 11:44 AM
> Subject: LF: Locators
>
>
> > In 1968 I had a long-running correspondence with the RSGB over the IARU
> > adoption of what was then the "QRA Locator"; later to become the
> > "Maidenhead" locator.  QRA was first proposed for amateur use by a Czech
> > amateur OK1VR in 1958 and was subsequently adopted by amateurs in all
the
> > Warsaw Pact countries. I believe it originated in a USSR military
locator
> > system already well understood by them. The Western (NATO) counterpart
was
> > the GEOREF system which I described in an RSGB Bulletin article in 1968.
> The
> > RSGB VHF committee at the time were, somewhat amazingly, unaware of
GEOREF
> > and thought that QRA was a totally amateur invention. When I started
> pushing
> > for GEOREF, a more logical, accurate and simpler system, I was more or
> less
> > told to keep quiet and stop rocking the boat since the IARU were going
for
> > QRA and that was that. The rest, as they say, is history.  I forecast at
> the
> > time that QRA would never have the accuracy required for accurate
contest
> > scoring and that's why Maidenhead has become so needlessly complicated.
We
> > could also have gone for the well-established world-wide UTM grid but I
> > suppose that would have been too easy. It's all too late to do anything

> now,
> > of course, but I have never met a professional geodesist who understands
> why
> > we need Maidenhead. .
> >
> > Walter G3JKV.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: LF: RE: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil
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Bryan, Dick, LF,

I have about 9% more current at the bottom than at the top (1.48A vs 1.37A).
Not as great as difference as William. The coil is 50cm tall, and 30cm
diameter. My antenna is a 30m "Tee" at 6m height with a two-wire top.

I know where some of the RF goes.....I had to remove the fluorescent tube
from its fitting in the Coil House (a.k.a. garage) because it was striking
every time I keyed up. Bit of a giveaway, that...

73,

Dave G3WCB

IO91RM

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of captbrian
Sent: 01 March 2005 12:09
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Cc: W.F. Oorschot
Subject: LF: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil


I am not an expert at all but a feeling for the answer can often be found by
taking a  predictable answer to a simple example and moving progressively to
the situation under consideration.

(A)If you pull the coil out into a straight wire (all in the mind of
course ) will the current be less at the remote end than the close end ?
Ans. Yes of course

If you make a single spiral turn of the original diameter but stretching the
full length of the wire will it be less ? Ans. of course it will.

How about two spiral turns? Ans, Yes

Three turns ? Ye-es.
Four ? Five ?

Is  there some magic number of turns that the current suddenly becomes the
same at the top and the bottom?  Ans. Never heard of such a thing

OK then ,When you have the coil all put back together (in your mind) to the
original configuration  will there be less at the top than at the bottom?
Obviously yes!!

How much difference is another matter.
(B)
I always thought of a short  loaded antenna as an inductance in series with
the capacitance of the "whip" to make a resonant "acceptor" circuit but I
was coaching a nurse for her american radio amateur  exam so she could use
it on board a far-away sailboat. When talking about bottom loading of a
back-stay antenna with a coil of wire she said "well that's obvious , the
coil is just a winding up of the rest of the wire which should have been out
there in the first place" and ever since I have thought of  bottom loading
as just a winding up of some of the antenna wire. On that basis the current
is sure to be less at the top than at the bottom.

G3GVB

----- Original Message -----
From: Dick Rollema <dickrollema@casema.nl>
To: LF-Group <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Cc: W.F. Oorschot <pa0wfo@chello.nl>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 11:34 AM
Subject: LF: Current "lost" in loading coil


> To All from PA0SE
>
> Several amateurs have found that the current at the bottom end of the
> loading coil is higher than at the top (aerial side) of the coil.
> In my station the difference is of the order of 10%.
>
> William, PA0WFO, has a large coil of 8 mH and a 23 m long wire as aerial.
> He measures 1.5 A at the bottom of the coil en 0.6 A at the top.
> My theory is that the "lost current"  flows via the capacitance of the
coil
> to its surrounding (even a metal object in free space has  capacitance).
>
> The current at the bottom of the bottom of the coil divides between the
> capacitances of  coil and  aerial.
>
> I suggested to William he  measure the capacitance of the coil and of the
> aerial. For the coil he found 150 - 200 pF, depending upon the position of
> the coil and for the aerial 210 pF.
> But these values do not explain the large difference in current at bottom
> and top of the coil.
>
> In a transmitting aerial the current increases going from the end of the
> radiator towards the coil.
>
> Now to my question:  does this increase in current also occur in the
> winding of the coil?  My feeling is that the current at the beginning and
> end of a coil should be the same; apart from the current that flows via
its
> capacitance to the surrounding.
>
> I also have read that the coil should be considered as an aerial with a
> length equal to the length of the coil.  But on 2 km
> that would be an extremely  small aerial, reckoned in wavelength.  So
> radiation by the coil must be negligible.
>
> There are certainly  experts on the reflector who know the answers.  I
> welcome  their views.
>
> 73, Dick, PA0SE
>
>
>
>






From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Walter Blanchard" <blanch@pncl.co.uk>
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>> That is an interesting historical account but you fail to tell us the
>> reasons advanced for not using Lat. Long. ie trigonometrical definitions
> on
>> a true curved surface rather than  draughtsman drawn squares on a
>> draughtsman drawn simulation on a flat sheet of paper
>>
>> G3GVB


Seems to be some misunderstanding here. QRA, Maidenhead,GEOREF are all based 
on lat/lon anyway and are true geographical referencing systems. Their 
boundaries, squares etc are all derived directly from lat/lon; they're 
simply attempts to make it easier to describe a lat/lon position without 
using continuous strings of numbers. What you're thinking of are GRID 
systems such as the OS's National Grid Reference (NGR) which are indeed 
drawn on a flat sheet of paper specifically because they're a lot easier to 
use on paper maps and are designed ONLY to be used on maps. Navigators do 
not use NGR for navigation - as you will know if you're a sea captain. 
Grids can only be used over relatively small areas such as the British Isles 
because they get so much out of sync with the real world over large areas 
they become unusable. That's why the USA does not use a true grid system 
like NGR. Incidentally lat.lon uses SPHERICAL trig. relationships.

Walter G3JKV.

 



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 14:35:48 +0100
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
From: Rik Strobbe <rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be>
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Subject: Re: LF: Current "lost" in loading coil
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Hello Dick,

as you noticed there is always a small "current loss"in the loading coil, 
due to capacitive coupling to the surrounding.
Something in the order of 5..10 % seems normal to me. By the way, this 
current loss is not equal distributed over the coil but is larger in the 
upper part ("hot part") of the coil.
I am a bit fussed by the values of the loading coil and antenna 
capacitance, normally these should result in a resonance at 137 kHz. But 8 
mH and 210 pF give resonance at 123 kHz. Or the other way around : to bring 
a 210 pF antenna to resonance one would need only 6.4 mH. Also the 
capacitance of the coil to the surrounding (150-200 pF) seems very large to 
me.
All this might indicate that the coil is placed directly on the ground or 
very close to a large conducting (metal) object.
If that is the case I would suggest to place the coil at a certain distance 
(1..2 m) from ground / other objects and try again.

73, Rik  ON7YD

At 12:34 1/03/2005 +0100, you wrote:
>To All from PA0SE
>
>Several amateurs have found that the current at the bottom end of the 
>loading coil is higher than at the top (aerial side) of the coil.
>In my station the difference is of the order of 10%.
>
>William, PA0WFO, has a large coil of 8 mH and a 23 m long wire as aerial. 
>He measures 1.5 A at the bottom of the coil en 0.6 A at the top.
>My theory is that the "lost current"  flows via the capacitance of the 
>coil to its surrounding (even a metal object in free space has  capacitance).
>
>The current at the bottom of the bottom of the coil divides between the 
>capacitances of  coil and  aerial.
>
>I suggested to William he  measure the capacitance of the coil and of the 
>aerial. For the coil he found 150 - 200 pF, depending upon the position of 
>the coil and for the aerial 210 pF.
>But these values do not explain the large difference in current at bottom 
>and top of the coil.
>
>In a transmitting aerial the current increases going from the end of the 
>radiator towards the coil.
>
>Now to my question:  does this increase in current also occur in the 
>winding of the coil?  My feeling is that the current at the beginning and 
>end of a coil should be the same; apart from the current that flows via 
>its capacitance to the surrounding.
>
>I also have read that the coil should be considered as an aerial with a 
>length equal to the length of the coil.  But on 2 km
>that would be an extremely  small aerial, reckoned in wavelength.  So 
>radiation by the coil must be negligible.
>
>There are certainly  experts on the reflector who know the answers.  I 
>welcome  their views.
>
>73, Dick, PA0SE
>


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=US-ASCII">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY id=role_body style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #000000; FONT-FAMILY: Arial" 
bottomMargin=7 leftMargin=7 topMargin=7 rightMargin=7><FONT id=role_document 
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>
<DIV>It has always been my understanding that the internationally understood 
convention of Latitude and Longitude was unambiguous and capable (with the 
assistance of relevant technology - timing, astro-sighting or whatever and GPS) 
of whatever degree of accuracy was required by the user.</DIV>
<DIV>In Amateur Radio usage, it seems to me that the various locator systems 
have arisen from the need to present location information in abbreviated form 
suitable for voice communication using phonetic alphabet characters under 
DX-chasing or contest operations in the VHF and UHF amateur bands.</DIV>
<DIV>Bearing in mind that many LF operators are using the reflector and similar 
to exchange information supplementary to actual QSO's it seems hardly relevant 
to use such locator systems which in any case usually require translation back 
to Lat. and Long.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>73 de Pat g4gvw</DIV></FONT></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<DIV>Brian,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;I don't know about a site, but there are programs in BASIC in various 
books - "AMATEUR RADIO SOFTWARE" by John Morris GM4ANB springs to mind (may 
still be available from RSGB) which covers the subject and has listings ready to 
type in.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>73 de pat g4gvw</DIV></FONT></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Gary - G4WGT" <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 16:35:18 -0000
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<DIV><SPAN class=656262416-01032005>Brian, Pat &amp; LF,</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=656262416-01032005></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=656262416-01032005>I still have my copy of John's "Amateur 
Radio Software", if you require any specific BASIC program&nbsp;listing I will 
see if it is possible to type it &amp; send it although some are quite lengthy. 
There are several short lists for "Distances, Bearings &amp; 
Locators".</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=656262416-01032005></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=656262416-01032005>
<P>Regards,<BR><BR>Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp<SPAN class=656262416-01032005> 
</SPAN></P>
<P><SPAN class=656262416-01032005></SPAN></SPAN>&nbsp;</P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT 
  face=Tahoma>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> 
  owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]<B>On Behalf Of 
  </B>G4gvw@aol.com<BR><B>Sent:</B> 01 March 2005 15:20<BR><B>To:</B> 
  rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: LF: Re: Re: 
  Locators<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><FONT id=role_document face=Arial>
  <DIV>Brian,</DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;I don't know about a site, but there are programs in BASIC in 
  various books - "AMATEUR RADIO SOFTWARE" by John Morris GM4ANB springs to mind 
  (may still be available from RSGB) which covers the subject and has listings 
  ready to type in.</DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV>73 de pat g4gvw</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></BODY></HTML>

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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <c4.21ff428c.2f539531@aol.com> <004601c51d1b$d3b4ef60$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL> <005301c51d21$c9d78c40$0500a8c0@charter.net>
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----- Original Message -----
From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2005 11:12 PM
Subject: LF: Re: TA FEB27/28


>
> > Nice early copy of AQC starting at 2200Z - 40 minutes before local
> > sunset.
>
> A bit choppier here, but still good to see.
>
> John Andrews

I have a msg from W4DEX dated 14/02/02 sent at 2104
. He says your signal was very strong over an HOUR before my SUNSET and
yours is the only TA signal I have seen during my daylight.
I was only running about 0.5W erp at the time.

73 de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH


>
>


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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi all in the USA&nbsp;&nbsp;and 
beyond.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Is there anyone suitably equipped over there to try 
for a CW two way on 137 khz. If anyone is ready I will rig the LF antenna system 
and have a go. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I will arrange a field day event. The antenna 
system would&nbsp;consist of 3 radio towers each over 100 ft high with a 
suitable LF antenna attached covering approx 5 acres. I have only used one tower 
in the past but will make a bigger effort if there is any interest in W or VE 
land.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I have been heard&nbsp;on the east coast USA on CW 
a few years ago and about the same time W4DEX was able to see my signal over an 
hour before his sunset.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I would bet a QSO is possible given reasonable 
propogation but each end must be suitably equipped with around 1W 
erp.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Looking forward to a positive 
response.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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<DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Hi, 
Mal.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Thanks 
for the report. I'm only running 10 to 20 mW erp...need more copper in the air, 
copper in the ground, etc. I'm rock-bound on 137.695-ish.&nbsp;What time did you 
see my sigs, I wonder?</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Cheers 
&amp; 73,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Dave 
G3WCB </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>IO91RM 
near Slough.</FONT>&nbsp;</SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma 
  size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> 
  owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]<B>On Behalf Of </B>hamilton 
  mal<BR><B>Sent:</B> 28 February 2005 14:43<BR><B>To:</B> 
  rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> LF: G3WCB<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Saw G3WCB active yesterday evening with a very 
  poor signal, just about O copy with me for a while then dropped 
  out.</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>QRG around 137.7 khz </FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH near Scarborough</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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Dave,

nice "O" copy here in JO52ho yesterday.

Capture:
http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm

Same today around 1330z.

73
Hartmut

> Hi, Mal.

> Thanks for the report. I'm only running 10 to 20 mW erp...need more copper
> in the air, copper in the ground, etc. I'm rock-bound on 137.695-ish. What
> time did you see my sigs, I wonder?

> Cheers & 73,

> Dave G3WCB



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> Brian,
>  I don't know about a site, but there are programs in BASIC in various 
> books - "AMATEUR RADIO SOFTWARE" by John Morris GM4ANB springs to mind 
> (may still be available from RSGB) which covers the subject and has 
> listings ready to type in.


Brian,
  if you feel itch on your skin when hearing the word BASIC, I have a C 
routine that
does the Maidenhead -> LatLong conversion, which I have used in Spectran.
I am not the author of the code, I found it on Internet, but don't 
remember where.
But it works !

73  Alberto  I2PHD




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From: "Walter Blanchard" <blanch@pncl.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 17:46:33 -0000
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<DIV><FONT face=Tahoma>The definitive lat/lon to NGR and back converter for the 
UK is on this site :&nbsp; <A 
href="http://www.gps.gov.uk">www.gps.gov.uk</A>&nbsp;&nbsp; It's free and 
on-line. You can also get a stand-alone converter file free but you need to log 
on as a user with Ordnance Survey first.&nbsp; It doesn't include Maidenhead and 
you need to know all about spheroids and datums.&nbsp;The quick-and-dirty 
Maidenhead converter I use is called BD.exe but unfortunately there's now a 
virus of that name and if you have a virus checker running it will be rejected 
otherwise I'd be happy to send it.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Tahoma></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Tahoma>Walter G3JKV.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Tahoma></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Tahoma>&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From: "Walter Blanchard" <blanch@pncl.co.uk>
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<DIV><FONT face=Tahoma>For stand-alone Maidenhead and brg/dist download BD from 
<A 
href="http://www.w1ghz.cx/10g/software.htm">www.w1ghz.cx/10g/software.htm</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Tahoma></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Tahoma>Walter G3JKV.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Tahoma></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Tahoma></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<DIV><SPAN class=916193219-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Dear 
Walter, Bryan and LF,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=916193219-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=916193219-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I use 
"Prefind" which is freeware available from ON6MU and ON2DHT's website <A 
href="http://users.belgacom.net/hamradio/prefind.htm">http://users.belgacom.net/hamradio/prefind.htm</A>.&nbsp; 
It&nbsp;gives B&amp;D from a given location and displays L&amp;L and Locator on 
a&nbsp;map. Various maps are available which cover UK, Europe, etc.&nbsp;The 
L&amp;L and Locator change as you roll your mouse cursor across the map. Very 
nifty.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=916193219-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=916193219-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2>73,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=916193219-01032005></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=916193219-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Dave 
G3WCB IO91RM</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma 
  size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> 
  owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]<B>On Behalf Of </B>Walter 
  Blanchard<BR><B>Sent:</B> 01 March 2005 18:04<BR><B>To:</B> 
  rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> LF: BD<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Tahoma>For stand-alone Maidenhead and brg/dist download BD 
  from <A 
  href="http://www.w1ghz.cx/10g/software.htm">www.w1ghz.cx/10g/software.htm</A></FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Tahoma></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Tahoma>Walter G3JKV.</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Tahoma></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Tahoma></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: LF: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil
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Dick PA0SE and others,

I believe a good way to analyse why more current goes in the bottom of the
coil than comes out the top is to resolve the current in to in-phase (I) and
quadrature (Q) components.  RF ammeters or other sampling current meters
display the resultant (R) current (which equals the square root of [I
squared plus Q squared]).  The I current eventually does some radiating
(from the whole antenna system) and the Q current feeds the parasitic
capacitance (and is a low loss even though it can not be eliminated).  The
actual mechanism is lots of small Q currents distributed up the coil, some
between turns and some to the environment, so the above simplifies these
currents to a single equivalent value of Q at the bottom of the coil.

Using 10% as a difference between I and R currents, the Q current calculates
as being some 46% of I or some 42% of R.  The values are quite sensitive to
the observed ratio of bottom to top resultant currents, and the value of Q
is quite a significant current.

What I'm not so sure about is how to tune in practice for best far field
radiation from the antenna, and whether that condition gives a resistive
input at the bottom end of the coil.  If my above above suggestion is a
valid way of working, then it would seem that a secondary matching network
could be needed to cater for the Q current?

73, Bob ZL2CA


> To All from PA0SE
>
> Several amateurs have found that the current at the bottom end of the
> loading coil is higher than at the top (aerial side) of the coil.
> In my station the difference is of the order of 10%.
>
> William, PA0WFO, has a large coil of 8 mH and a 23 m long wire as aerial.
> He measures 1.5 A at the bottom of the coil en 0.6 A at the top.
> My theory is that the "lost current"  flows via the capacitance of the
coil
> to its surrounding (even a metal object in free space has  capacitance).
>
> The current at the bottom of the bottom of the coil divides between the
> capacitances of  coil and  aerial.
>
> I suggested to William he  measure the capacitance of the coil and of the
> aerial. For the coil he found 150 - 200 pF, depending upon the position of
> the coil and for the aerial 210 pF.
> But these values do not explain the large difference in current at bottom
> and top of the coil.
>
> In a transmitting aerial the current increases going from the end of the
> radiator towards the coil.
>
> Now to my question:  does this increase in current also occur in the
> winding of the coil?  My feeling is that the current at the beginning and
> end of a coil should be the same; apart from the current that flows via
its
> capacitance to the surrounding.
>
> I also have read that the coil should be considered as an aerial with a
> length equal to the length of the coil.  But on 2 km
> that would be an extremely  small aerial, reckoned in wavelength.  So
> radiation by the coil must be negligible.
>
> There are certainly  experts on the reflector who know the answers.  I
> welcome  their views.
>
> 73, Dick, PA0SE
>
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hello LF group.
I am a newcomer here.
27 feb from 01 till 05.30 UTC I copied PA0SE
in DFCW mode and few stations from DL and G in QRSS
(sorry, missed callsigns). All stations are very strong here.
LORAN sticks level about -80 dB in 135.7-137.1 band.
My setup - antenna inverted L, 110 meters long, about
18-10 meters high with loading coil. Ground system -
big metal cellar under my house. RX - FT-817 and ARGO 8x6.
Thinking about transmitter...
-- 
Best regards,
Oleg / ew6cm / KO45hn     mailto:ew6cm@tut.by



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01./03/2005   2043z

 Welcome Oleg at the "crazy copper user company"!

73: Jeff / F6CWN  / JN09TT




----- Original Message ----- 
From: "ew6cm" <ew6cm@tut.by>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 8:32 PM
Subject: LF: ew6cm newcomer


> Hello LF group.
> I am a newcomer here.
> 27 feb from 01 till 05.30 UTC I copied PA0SE
> in DFCW mode and few stations from DL and G in QRSS
> (sorry, missed callsigns). All stations are very strong here.
> LORAN sticks level about -80 dB in 135.7-137.1 band.
> My setup - antenna inverted L, 110 meters long, about
> 18-10 meters high with loading coil. Ground system -
> big metal cellar under my house. RX - FT-817 and ARGO 8x6.
> Thinking about transmitter...
> -- 
> Best regards,
> Oleg / ew6cm / KO45hn     mailto:ew6cm@tut.by
> 
> 


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Hi All,

DJ8WX transmitts on 135,9224kHz.
mode QRSS30.

regards
Uwe/dj8wx/jo43sv



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Uwe</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Will be watching the 135922 TA window 
starting&nbsp;~2200Z.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jay, W1VD</FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE 
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV 
  style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
  <A title=0482183881-0001@t-online.de 
  href="mailto:0482183881-0001@t-online.de">jannsen</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> 
  </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, March 01, 2005 3:57 
  PM</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> LF: TA</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>Hi All,<BR><BR>DJ8WX transmitts on 135,9224kHz.<BR>mode 
  QRSS30.<BR><BR>regards<BR>Uwe/dj8wx/jo43sv<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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Hello Jay,

 I m on 135.9219  qrss30 AR AR

 Teo

 
Best regards,
 YU7AR  KN05BW                          mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 16:56:18 -0000
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----- Original Message -----
From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 5:40 PM
Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: TA FEB27/28


> Mal,
>
> > I have a msg from W4DEX dated 14/02/02 sent at 2104
> > . He says your signal was very strong over an HOUR before my SUNSET and
> > yours is the only TA signal I have seen during my daylight.
> > I was only running about 0.5W erp at the time.
>
> Would you like an award, or would a simple pat on the back be OK?
>
> John Andrews
I do not collect awards  nor do I want YOUR pat. Try and get a signal out
that I can HEAR.
I have had a good response via private Email. Keep your EARS open.
G3KEV

>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 23:10:28 +0100
From: Hartmut Wolff <wolff.h@t-online.de>
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WD2XGJ readable here since 2150z.


73
Hartmut Wolff
Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de  



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <PAEFLMFGBDKKCONLMLBIKEKJCCAA.ganymede444@btopenworld.com>
Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 15:11:30 -0800
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Dave

> If you're into Big Bad Amps...

Don't put those kind of thoughts in my head ;-)

I think with Steve's antenna setup and 1KW we are very close to 1W ERP.  The
Wilkinson seems to work great... Ran it full out last night for a couple of
hours into the dummy load...  I couldn't measure the loss from the combiner
as it is very low and the system remains >80% eff.

73 Scott



----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave G3WCB" <ganymede444@btopenworld.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 3:13 AM
Subject: LF: Big Bad Amps <was re: ... --- ...>


> Hi, Scott.
>
, you should check out G4FTC's site
> http://www.qsl.net/g4ftc/amplifiers/136khz/home.htm He describes a 3kW LF
> amp. that uses 8 x IRFP450's in a bridge arrangement. Biggest PA I've seen
> so far!
>
> BTW, if you have two identical TX's already, and you find the Wilkinson
> thing doesn't work out, you could re-configure your amps. into a bridge
> arrangement instead, bit like the Decca TX's.
>
> Keep that fire-blanket handy!
>
> Cheers,
>
> Dave G3WCB.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
> [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Scott Tilley
> Sent: 01 March 2005 10:59
> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
> Subject: LF: Re: Re: ... --- ...
>
>
> Hey Alan
>
> We got the bugs out...  Once I found the problem with the lack of sinc in
> the 4013 divider stages things have been working as expected.  I thought
> about the inductor coupling; however, based on my observations the
combiner
> is not doing anything negative to the signal train.  We still have >80%
eff.
>
> I would like to try this with toroids next and compact it down.  I'm also
> dreaming up a bigger badder amp using this concept.  It seems real stable
> and doesn't require running the system 'balls to the wall' to get some
> serious power from 4 FET and a reasonable PSU voltage.
>
> 73 Scott
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
> To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 2:49 AM
> Subject: LF: Re: ... --- ...
>
>
> > Hi Steve I have just had a thought your construction looks fine....BUT
> maybe
> > the two coils are too close together and there is some coupling. I
wonder
> if
> > it is possible to temporarily turn one at right angles to kill any
> coupling
> > and see if that helps??
> > The biggies in my Web page were made with big toroids I believe probably
> > iron dust rather than ferrite, as the inductance reqquired is not that
> high
> >
> > Cheers de Alan G3NYK
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
> > To: <lowfer@lwca.org>; <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> > Sent: 01 March 2005 06:51
> > Subject: LF: ... --- ...
> >
> >
> > The smoke test of this Wilkinson Combiner was successfull in that no
smoke
> > came out and nothing died.  However, we get enough heat to cook an egg
on
> > the 100ohm balance resistor.
> >
> > We have a scope match on the output to the dummy load and it shows about
> > 225W from one transmitter, add another and we get 450W, success NOPE!
The
> > transmitters are outputting ~450W each! Therefore, half the power is
being
> > absorbed in the 100ohm balance resistor.  Examining the phase
relationship
> > of the input to the combiner waveforms indicates they are in phase
within
> > ~10degrees and almost equal in amplitude.  So what gives!  Anyone have
> some
> > idea what may be going wrong?  Of course we have checked and doubled
> checked
> > the circuit for errors and nothing...  All seems as it should according
to
> > formulas and drawings we have viewed and designed it from.
> >
> > Does anyone have an idea how we could troubleshoot our way through this?
> >
> > Any advice would be appreciated.
> >
> > 73 Scott and Steve(It's all his fault ;-)
> >
> >
> > Check the status of radio beacon 'TIL'  in CN89lg at:
> > www.scottboxx.com/radio
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hartmut,
     Thanks for the report. Local sunset here was 22:35, I'm very pleased that you copied my signal 45 minutes before sunset.

--
73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
FN42hi


> WD2XGJ readable here since 2150z.
> 
> 
> 73
> Hartmut Wolff
> Locator:JO52ho
> www.h-wolff.de  
> 
> 


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ <k2ors@comcast.net>
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Subject: LF: Decca help needed
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I'm performing the M0BMU mods for my Decca Tx, which was originally on 70.3 kHz.
I've added series capacitors in the tank circuit per M0BMU and taken turns off the tank coils. I need a source of the "faston" type connectors used to terminate the litz and connect the coil to the tank caps. These spade type connectors are wider than anything available here in the States. I've tried to remove and reuse the existing connector, but that hasn't worked too well.  Anybody know where I can get these connectors? 

--
73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
FN42hi


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From: "captbrian" <captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <030220050333.8403.422533EF000640E0000020D322069984990B97010D0A020E06979D0E03@comcast.net>
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Sperry-Marine ?

Bryan

North & South America

24-Hour Service:

Phone: 1 504 371 8365

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Spares & Repairs:

Phone: 1 504 328 9171

Fax: 1 504 328 9855
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----- Original Message -----
From: Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ <k2ors@comcast.net>
To: rsgb lf reflector <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 3:33 AM
Subject: LF: Decca help needed


> I'm performing the M0BMU mods for my Decca Tx, which was originally on
70.3 kHz.
> I've added series capacitors in the tank circuit per M0BMU and taken turns
off the tank coils. I need a source of the "faston" type connectors used to
terminate the litz and connect the coil to the tank caps. These spade type
connectors are wider than anything available here in the States. I've tried
to remove and reuse the existing connector, but that hasn't worked too well.
Anybody know where I can get these connectors?
>
> --
> 73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
> FN42hi
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Warren

Forward a dig. image and I'll see what I can drum up...

Scott

----- Original Message -----
From: "Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ" <k2ors@comcast.net>
To: "rsgb lf reflector" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 7:33 PM
Subject: LF: Decca help needed


> I'm performing the M0BMU mods for my Decca Tx, which was originally on
70.3 kHz.
> I've added series capacitors in the tank circuit per M0BMU and taken turns
off the tank coils. I need a source of the "faston" type connectors used to
terminate the litz and connect the coil to the tank caps. These spade type
connectors are wider than anything available here in the States. I've tried
to remove and reuse the existing connector, but that hasn't worked too well.
Anybody know where I can get these connectors?
>
> --
> 73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
> FN42hi
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "captbrian" <captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <6.1.0.6.2.20050301115700.03662eb0@mail.casema.nl> <004d01c51e98$ec121f00$c401a8c0@quaycustomer>
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Subject: LF: Re: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil
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Can it be that for years we have all looked at the aerial current
distribution diagrams in the handbooks  which show  a constant for the
loading coil and a sine-wave portion for the "whip"  and nodded without ever
demanding that it be a sloping line for the coil?

G3GVB
----- Original Message -----
From: Vernall <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 7:57 PM
Subject: LF: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil


> Dick PA0SE and others,
>
> I believe a good way to analyse why more current goes in the bottom of the
> coil than comes out the top is to resolve the current in to in-phase (I)
and
> quadrature (Q) components.  RF ammeters or other sampling current meters
> display the resultant (R) current (which equals the square root of [I
> squared plus Q squared]).  The I current eventually does some radiating
> (from the whole antenna system) and the Q current feeds the parasitic
> capacitance (and is a low loss even though it can not be eliminated).  The
> actual mechanism is lots of small Q currents distributed up the coil, some
> between turns and some to the environment, so the above simplifies these
> currents to a single equivalent value of Q at the bottom of the coil.
>
> Using 10% as a difference between I and R currents, the Q current
calculates
> as being some 46% of I or some 42% of R.  The values are quite sensitive
to
> the observed ratio of bottom to top resultant currents, and the value of Q
> is quite a significant current.
>
> What I'm not so sure about is how to tune in practice for best far field
> radiation from the antenna, and whether that condition gives a resistive
> input at the bottom end of the coil.  If my above above suggestion is a
> valid way of working, then it would seem that a secondary matching network
> could be needed to cater for the Q current?
>
> 73, Bob ZL2CA
>
>
> > To All from PA0SE
> >
> > Several amateurs have found that the current at the bottom end of the
> > loading coil is higher than at the top (aerial side) of the coil.
> > In my station the difference is of the order of 10%.
> >
> > William, PA0WFO, has a large coil of 8 mH and a 23 m long wire as
aerial.
> > He measures 1.5 A at the bottom of the coil en 0.6 A at the top.
> > My theory is that the "lost current"  flows via the capacitance of the
> coil
> > to its surrounding (even a metal object in free space has  capacitance).
> >
> > The current at the bottom of the bottom of the coil divides between the
> > capacitances of  coil and  aerial.
> >
> > I suggested to William he  measure the capacitance of the coil and of
the
> > aerial. For the coil he found 150 - 200 pF, depending upon the position
of
> > the coil and for the aerial 210 pF.
> > But these values do not explain the large difference in current at
bottom
> > and top of the coil.
> >
> > In a transmitting aerial the current increases going from the end of the
> > radiator towards the coil.
> >
> > Now to my question:  does this increase in current also occur in the
> > winding of the coil?  My feeling is that the current at the beginning
and
> > end of a coil should be the same; apart from the current that flows via
> its
> > capacitance to the surrounding.
> >
> > I also have read that the coil should be considered as an aerial with a
> > length equal to the length of the coil.  But on 2 km
> > that would be an extremely  small aerial, reckoned in wavelength.  So
> > radiation by the coil must be negligible.
> >
> > There are certainly  experts on the reflector who know the answers.  I
> > welcome  their views.
> >
> > 73, Dick, PA0SE
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: WE0H Mike <we0h@genesiswireless.us>
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<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<html>
<head>
  <meta content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1" http-equiv="Content-Type">
  <title></title>
</head>
<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
Warren??? Got that big amp done yet? You or John with a kilowatt should
be up to the task I would guess.<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">-- 
Mike
WE0H
WD2XGI</pre>
<br>
<br>
hamilton mal wrote:<br>
<blockquote cite="mid001b01c51e6e$8a9fee20$39e8fc3e@l8p8y6" type="cite">
  <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; ">
  <meta content="MSHTML 5.50.4807.2300" name="GENERATOR">
  <style></style>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">Hi all in the USA&nbsp;&nbsp;and beyond.</font></div>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">Is there anyone suitably equipped
over there to try for a CW two way on 137 khz. If anyone is ready I
will rig the LF antenna system and have a go. </font></div>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">I will arrange a field day event.
The antenna system would&nbsp;consist of 3 radio towers each over 100 ft
high with a suitable LF antenna attached covering approx 5 acres. I
have only used one tower in the past but will make a bigger effort if
there is any interest in W or VE land.</font></div>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">I have been heard&nbsp;on the east coast
USA on CW a few years ago and about the same time W4DEX was able to see
my signal over an hour before his sunset.</font></div>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">I would bet a QSO is possible given
reasonable propogation but each end must be suitably equipped with
around 1W erp.</font></div>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">Looking forward to a positive
response.</font></div>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH</font></div>
  <div>&nbsp;</div>
  <div>&nbsp;</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">
</pre>
</body>
</html>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Thread-Topic: Re: Big Bad Amps <was re: ... --- ...>
Thread-Index: AcUetFMEOSQnHhc2TjOD2G4Gu/carwAVHdpQ
From: jan-martin.noding@telenor.com
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: LF: Re: Re: Big Bad Amps -or " misuse of Wilkinson combiner"
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But if you wish to combine two signals which has the same source, and they are obviously in the same phase, the wilkinson thing is only adding to the complexity, and it is very bad practice to do so. 
The signals could much better be added directly in series or paralell

73
Jan-Martin, LA8AK

-----Opprinnelig melding-----
Fra: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]På vegne av Scott Tilley
Sendt: 2. mars 2005 00:11
Til: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Emne: LF: Re: Big Bad Amps <was re: ... --- ...>


Dave

> If you're into Big Bad Amps...

Don't put those kind of thoughts in my head ;-)

I think with Steve's antenna setup and 1KW we are very close to 1W ERP.  The
Wilkinson seems to work great... Ran it full out last night for a couple of
hours into the dummy load...  I couldn't measure the loss from the combiner
as it is very low and the system remains >80% eff.

73 Scott



----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave G3WCB" <ganymede444@btopenworld.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 3:13 AM
Subject: LF: Big Bad Amps <was re: ... --- ...>


> Hi, Scott.
>
, you should check out G4FTC's site
> http://www.qsl.net/g4ftc/amplifiers/136khz/home.htm He describes a 3kW LF
> amp. that uses 8 x IRFP450's in a bridge arrangement. Biggest PA I've seen
> so far!
>
> BTW, if you have two identical TX's already, and you find the Wilkinson
> thing doesn't work out, you could re-configure your amps. into a bridge
> arrangement instead, bit like the Decca TX's.
>
> Keep that fire-blanket handy!
>
> Cheers,
>
> Dave G3WCB.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
> [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Scott Tilley
> Sent: 01 March 2005 10:59
> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
> Subject: LF: Re: Re: ... --- ...
>
>
> Hey Alan
>
> We got the bugs out...  Once I found the problem with the lack of sinc in
> the 4013 divider stages things have been working as expected.  I thought
> about the inductor coupling; however, based on my observations the
combiner
> is not doing anything negative to the signal train.  We still have >80%
eff.
>
> I would like to try this with toroids next and compact it down.  I'm also
> dreaming up a bigger badder amp using this concept.  It seems real stable
> and doesn't require running the system 'balls to the wall' to get some
> serious power from 4 FET and a reasonable PSU voltage.
>
> 73 Scott
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
> To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 2:49 AM
> Subject: LF: Re: ... --- ...
>
>
> > Hi Steve I have just had a thought your construction looks fine....BUT
> maybe
> > the two coils are too close together and there is some coupling. I
wonder
> if
> > it is possible to temporarily turn one at right angles to kill any
> coupling
> > and see if that helps??
> > The biggies in my Web page were made with big toroids I believe probably
> > iron dust rather than ferrite, as the inductance reqquired is not that
> high
> >
> > Cheers de Alan G3NYK
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
> > To: <lowfer@lwca.org>; <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> > Sent: 01 March 2005 06:51
> > Subject: LF: ... --- ...
> >
> >
> > The smoke test of this Wilkinson Combiner was successfull in that no
smoke
> > came out and nothing died.  However, we get enough heat to cook an egg
on
> > the 100ohm balance resistor.
> >
> > We have a scope match on the output to the dummy load and it shows about
> > 225W from one transmitter, add another and we get 450W, success NOPE!
The
> > transmitters are outputting ~450W each! Therefore, half the power is
being
> > absorbed in the 100ohm balance resistor.  Examining the phase
relationship
> > of the input to the combiner waveforms indicates they are in phase
within
> > ~10degrees and almost equal in amplitude.  So what gives!  Anyone have
> some
> > idea what may be going wrong?  Of course we have checked and doubled
> checked
> > the circuit for errors and nothing...  All seems as it should according
to
> > formulas and drawings we have viewed and designed it from.
> >
> > Does anyone have an idea how we could troubleshoot our way through this?
> >
> > Any advice would be appreciated.
> >
> > 73 Scott and Steve(It's all his fault ;-)
> >
> >
> > Check the status of radio beacon 'TIL'  in CN89lg at:
> > www.scottboxx.com/radio
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 10:41:15 +0100
From: Dick Rollema <dickrollema@casema.nl>
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Subject: Re: LF: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil
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<html>
<body>
<font size=3>To All from PA0SE<br><br>
I do like G3GVB's kind of reasoning. But I think the situation is
simplified a bit too much.&nbsp; Assume as an example that the coil is
wound on a toroid of high permeability material&nbsp; (e.g. for use with
a QRP transmitter....).<br>
The magnetic flux in the core is proportional to the current in the
winding.&nbsp; When the current increases from one end of the winding to
the other end this would mean thatt he flux in the core would rise as
well&nbsp; along the core. But this is impossible. The flux must be
uniform.&nbsp; So current in must be equql to current out.<br><br>
Now real loading coils are wound on a tubular former without a core. The
coupling&nbsp; between the turns will not be 100 % as in the toroid
case.<br>
The coupling&nbsp; depends on several factors like the length/diameter
ratio.&nbsp; But some of the current equalising effect due to the flux as
in&nbsp; the toroid must be present.<br><br>
So I think that the current in the coil indeed rises from the top to the
bottom but not at such a steep rate&nbsp; as when the winding was removed
and stretched into a straight wire. <br><br>
Hw?<br><br>
73, Dick, PA0SE<br><br>
<br>
At 13:08 1-3-05, captbrian wrote:<br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">I am not an expert at all but a
feeling for the answer can often be found by<br>
taking a&nbsp; predictable answer to a simple example and moving
progressively to<br>
the situation under consideration.<br><br>
(A)If you pull the coil out into a straight wire (all in the mind 
of<br>
course ) will the current be less at the remote end than the close end
?<br>
Ans. Yes of course<br><br>
If you make a single spiral turn of the original diameter but stretching
the<br>
full length of the wire will it be less ? Ans. of course it
will.<br><br>
How about two spiral turns? Ans, Yes<br><br>
Three turns ? Ye-es.<br>
Four ? Five ?<br><br>
Is&nbsp; there some magic number of turns that the current suddenly
becomes the<br>
same at the top and the bottom?&nbsp; Ans. Never heard of such a
thing<br><br>
OK then ,When you have the coil all put back together (in your mind) to
the<br>
original configuration&nbsp; will there be less at the top than at the
bottom?<br>
Obviously yes!!<br>
<br>
How much difference is another matter.<br>
(B)<br>
I always thought of a short&nbsp; loaded antenna as an inductance in
series with<br>
the capacitance of the &quot;whip&quot; to make a resonant
&quot;acceptor&quot; circuit but I<br>
was coaching a nurse for her american radio amateur&nbsp; exam so she
could use<br>
it on board a far-away sailboat. When talking about bottom loading of
a<br>
back-stay antenna with a coil of wire she said &quot;well that's obvious
, the<br>
coil is just a winding up of the rest of the wire which should have been
out<br>
there in the first place&quot; and ever since I have thought of&nbsp;
bottom loading<br>
as just a winding up of some of the antenna wire. On that basis the
current<br>
is sure to be less at the top than at the bottom.<br><br>
G3GVB<br><br>
----- Original Message -----<br>
From: Dick Rollema &lt;dickrollema@casema.nl&gt;<br>
To: LF-Group &lt;rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org&gt;<br>
Cc: W.F. Oorschot &lt;pa0wfo@chello.nl&gt;<br>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 11:34 AM<br>
Subject: LF: Current &quot;lost&quot; in loading coil<br><br>
<br>
&gt; To All from PA0SE<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Several amateurs have found that the current at the bottom end of
the<br>
&gt; loading coil is higher than at the top (aerial side) of the
coil.<br>
&gt; In my station the difference is of the order of 10%.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; William, PA0WFO, has a large coil of 8 mH and a 23 m long wire as
aerial.<br>
&gt; He measures 1.5 A at the bottom of the coil en 0.6 A at the
top.<br>
&gt; My theory is that the &quot;lost current&quot;&nbsp; flows via the
capacitance of the<br>
coil<br>
&gt; to its surrounding (even a metal object in free space has&nbsp;
capacitance).<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; The current at the bottom of the bottom of the coil divides between
the<br>
&gt; capacitances of&nbsp; coil and&nbsp; aerial.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; I suggested to William he&nbsp; measure the capacitance of the coil
and of the<br>
&gt; aerial. For the coil he found 150 - 200 pF, depending upon the
position of<br>
&gt; the coil and for the aerial 210 pF.<br>
&gt; But these values do not explain the large difference in current at
bottom<br>
&gt; and top of the coil.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; In a transmitting aerial the current increases going from the end of
the<br>
&gt; radiator towards the coil.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Now to my question:&nbsp; does this increase in current also occur
in the<br>
&gt; winding of the coil?&nbsp; My feeling is that the current at the
beginning and<br>
&gt; end of a coil should be the same; apart from the current that flows
via<br>
its<br>
&gt; capacitance to the surrounding.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; I also have read that the coil should be considered as an aerial
with a<br>
&gt; length equal to the length of the coil.&nbsp; But on 2 km<br>
&gt; that would be an extremely&nbsp; small aerial, reckoned in
wavelength.&nbsp; So<br>
&gt; radiation by the coil must be negligible.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; There are certainly&nbsp; experts on the reflector who know the
answers.&nbsp; I<br>
&gt; welcome&nbsp; their views.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; 73, Dick, PA0SE<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;</font></blockquote></body>
</html>

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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
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<META content="MSHTML 5.50.4807.2300" name=GENERATOR>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr 
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV 
  style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
  <A title=ganymede444@btopenworld.com 
  href="mailto:ganymede444@btopenworld.com">Dave G3WCB</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> 
  </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, March 01, 2005 5:37 
  PM</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> LF: RE: G3WCB</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Hi, 
  Mal.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
  size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
  size=2>Thanks for the report. I'm only running 10 to 20 mW erp...need more 
  copper in the air, copper in the ground, etc. I'm rock-bound on 
  137.695-ish.&nbsp;What time did you see my sigs, I wonder?</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
  size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>HI 
  Dave</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I 
  did not record the time but it would probably be early evening time. You were 
  vy weak but I could just read the callsign then you got choppy and 
  disappeared. I knew it was a new one cos I have not seen it before and thought 
  you would like to know that you were hitting Scarboro hi</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
  size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial 
  size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
  size=2>Cheers &amp; 73,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial 
  size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Dave 
  G3WCB </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
  size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=759583217-01032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
  size=2>IO91RM near Slough.</FONT>&nbsp;</SPAN></DIV>
  <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
    <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma 
    size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> <A 
    href="mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> 
    [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]<B>On Behalf Of </B>hamilton 
    mal<BR><B>Sent:</B> 28 February 2005 14:43<BR><B>To:</B> 
    rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> LF: 
    G3WCB<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Saw G3WCB active yesterday evening with a very 
    poor signal, just about O copy with me for a while then dropped 
    out.</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>QRG around 137.7 khz </FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH near 
    Scarborough</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 10:53:33 +0100
From: Dick Rollema <dickrollema@casema.nl>
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Cc: "W.F. Oorschot" <pa0wfo@chello.nl>
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Subject: Re: LF: Current "lost" in loading coil
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<font size=3>Hello Rik and others,<br><br>
William tells me that the measurement of the aerial capacitance was not a
very accurate one. So it is probably lower than 210 pF.<br><br>
The coil sits on a wooden stool of about 50 cm high and not too near a
radiator. The coil is wound on a 40 cm diameter PVC pipe and contains 200
m of wire.<br><br>
73, Dick, PA0SE<br><br>
At 14:35 1-3-05, you wrote:<br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">Hello Dick,<br><br>
as you noticed there is always a small &quot;current loss&quot;in the
loading coil, due to capacitive coupling to the surrounding.<br>
Something in the order of 5..10 % seems normal to me. By the way, this
current loss is not equal distributed over the coil but is larger in the
upper part (&quot;hot part&quot;) of the coil.<br>
I am a bit fussed by the values of the loading coil and antenna
capacitance, normally these should result in a resonance at 137 kHz. But
8 mH and 210 pF give resonance at 123 kHz. Or the other way around : to
bring a 210 pF antenna to resonance one would need only 6.4 mH. Also the
capacitance of the coil to the surrounding (150-200 pF) seems very large
to me.<br>
All this might indicate that the coil is placed directly on the ground or
very close to a large conducting (metal) object.<br>
If that is the case I would suggest to place the coil at a certain
distance (1..2 m) from ground / other objects and try again.<br><br>
73, Rik&nbsp; ON7YD<br><br>
At 12:34 1/03/2005 +0100, you wrote:<br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">To All from PA0SE<br><br>
Several amateurs have found that the current at the bottom end of the
loading coil is higher than at the top (aerial side) of the coil.<br>
In my station the difference is of the order of 10%.<br><br>
William, PA0WFO, has a large coil of 8 mH and a 23 m long wire as aerial.
He measures 1.5 A at the bottom of the coil en 0.6 A at the top.<br>
My theory is that the &quot;lost current&quot;&nbsp; flows via the
capacitance of the coil to its surrounding (even a metal object in free
space has&nbsp; capacitance).<br><br>
The current at the bottom of the bottom of the coil divides between the
capacitances of&nbsp; coil and&nbsp; aerial.<br><br>
I suggested to William he&nbsp; measure the capacitance of the coil and
of the aerial. For the coil he found 150 - 200 pF, depending upon the
position of the coil and for the aerial 210 pF.<br>
But these values do not explain the large difference in current at bottom
and top of the coil.<br><br>
In a transmitting aerial the current increases going from the end of the
radiator towards the coil.<br><br>
Now to my question:&nbsp; does this increase in current also occur in the
winding of the coil?&nbsp; My feeling is that the current at the
beginning and end of a coil should be the same; apart from the current
that flows via its capacitance to the surrounding.<br><br>
I also have read that the coil should be considered as an aerial with a
length equal to the length of the coil.&nbsp; But on 2 km<br>
that would be an extremely&nbsp; small aerial, reckoned in
wavelength.&nbsp; So radiation by the coil must be negligible.<br><br>
There are certainly&nbsp; experts on the reflector who know the
answers.&nbsp; I welcome&nbsp; their views.<br><br>
73, Dick, PA0SE</blockquote><br>
</font></blockquote></body>
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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "james moritz" <j.r.moritz@herts.ac.uk>
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Dear Warren, LF Group,

I just discarded the original connector on the end of the litz wire, and
replaced it with an eyelet with about a 4mm hole in it. I then drilled a 4mm
hole through the centre of the big fast-on tab and bolted the connection
together.

I have seen this large size of fast-on used as the chassis earth connection
for some European car stereos - so perhaps it might be worth enquiring of a
company that fits these to see if they have any of the mating connectors, if
you want the "proper" thing!

Good luck with the Decca mods,

Cheers, Jim Moritz
73 de M0BMU



-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
Sent: 02 March 2005 03:33
To: rsgb lf reflector
Subject: LF: Decca help needed

I'm performing the M0BMU mods for my Decca Tx, which was originally on 70.3
kHz.
I've added series capacitors in the tank circuit per M0BMU and taken turns
off the tank coils. I need a source of the "faston" type connectors used to
terminate the litz and connect the coil to the tank caps. 



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "captbrian" <captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>
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Cc: "W.F. Oorschot" <pa0wfo@chello.nl>
References: <6.1.0.6.2.20050301115700.03662eb0@mail.casema.nl><001a01c51e57$6c9ddc00$47540150@p2300> <6.1.0.6.2.20050302101906.03115e40@mail.casema.nl>
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Subject: LF: Bryan's Ratio was  - Current "lost" in loading coil
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I do agree.&nbsp; I did originally say&nbsp; "by 
how much is another matter " , because I do not suggest for a moment that the 
current proportions are the same when coiled up as when stretched out . The 
bottom turn radiates&nbsp;energy  so the current entering the second turn is a 
little less than that entering the bottom one and so on all the way up. At the 
same time the bottom turn is inducing an extra current in the second one to 
counteract the effect !!&nbsp; It seems clear that if two coils of equal 
inductance were tried then the&nbsp; current reduction would be less with a 
close wound coil than with a double-spaced one.&nbsp;&nbsp;We should not be 
calling this "Lost current"&nbsp;;; we havn't lost it, we have radiated it 
!.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>BTW &nbsp;I think i(out) over i(in) could be 
called&nbsp; "Bryan's &nbsp; Ratio"&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>G3GVB&nbsp; ( Bryan near Brighton )</FONT><FONT 
face=Arial size=3>&nbsp; ;-)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><B>From:</B> <A href="mailto:dickrollema@casema.nl" 
title=dickrollema@casema.nl>Dick Rollema</A> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE 
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A 
  href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org" 
  title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A href="mailto:pa0wfo@chello.nl" 
  title=pa0wfo@chello.nl>W.F. Oorschot</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, March 02, 2005 9:41 
  AM</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: LF: Re: Current "lost" in 
  loading coil</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV><FONT size=3>To All from PA0SE<BR><BR>I do like G3GVB's kind of 
  reasoning. But I think the situation is simplified a bit too much.&nbsp; 
  Assume as an example that the coil is wound on a toroid of high permeability 
  material&nbsp; (e.g. for use with a QRP transmitter....).<BR>The magnetic flux 
  in the core is proportional to the current in the winding.&nbsp; When the 
  current increases from one end of the winding to the other end this would mean 
  thatt he flux in the core would rise as well&nbsp; along the core. But this is 
  impossible. The flux must be uniform.&nbsp; So current in must be equql to 
  current out.<BR><BR>Now real loading coils are wound on a tubular former 
  without a core. The coupling&nbsp; between the turns will not be 100 % as in 
  the toroid case.<BR>The coupling&nbsp; depends on several factors like the 
  length/diameter ratio.&nbsp; But some of the current equalising effect due to 
  the flux as in&nbsp; the toroid must be present.<BR><BR>So I think that the 
  current in the coil indeed rises from the top to the bottom but not at such a 
  steep rate&nbsp; as when the winding was removed and stretched into a straight 
  wire. <BR><BR>Hw?<BR><BR>73, Dick, PA0SE<BR><BR><BR>At 13:08 1-3-05, captbrian 
  wrote:<BR>
  <BLOCKQUOTE class=cite cite="" type="cite">I am not an expert at all but a 
    feeling for the answer can often be found by<BR>taking a&nbsp; predictable 
    answer to a simple example and moving progressively to<BR>the situation 
    under consideration.<BR><BR>(A)If you pull the coil out into a straight wire 
    (all in the mind of<BR>course ) will the current be less at the remote end 
    than the close end ?<BR>Ans. Yes of course<BR><BR>If you make a single 
    spiral turn of the original diameter but stretching the<BR>full length of 
    the wire will it be less ? Ans. of course it will.<BR><BR>How about two 
    spiral turns? Ans, Yes<BR><BR>Three turns ? Ye-es.<BR>Four ? Five 
    ?<BR><BR>Is&nbsp; there some magic number of turns that the current suddenly 
    becomes the<BR>same at the top and the bottom?&nbsp; Ans. Never heard of 
    such a thing<BR><BR>OK then ,When you have the coil all put back together 
    (in your mind) to the<BR>original configuration&nbsp; will there be less at 
    the top than at the bottom?<BR>Obviously yes!!<BR><BR>How much difference is 
    another matter.<BR>(B)<BR>I always thought of a short&nbsp; loaded antenna 
    as an inductance in series with<BR>the capacitance of the "whip" to make a 
    resonant "acceptor" circuit but I<BR>was coaching a nurse for her american 
    radio amateur&nbsp; exam so she could use<BR>it on board a far-away 
    sailboat. When talking about bottom loading of a<BR>back-stay antenna with a 
    coil of wire she said "well that's obvious , the<BR>coil is just a winding 
    up of the rest of the wire which should have been out<BR>there in the first 
    place" and ever since I have thought of&nbsp; bottom loading<BR>as just a 
    winding up of some of the antenna wire. On that basis the current<BR>is sure 
    to be less at the top than at the bottom.<BR><BR>G3GVB<BR><BR>----- Original 
    Message -----<BR>From: Dick Rollema &lt;dickrollema@casema.nl&gt;<BR>To: 
    LF-Group &lt;rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org&gt;<BR>Cc: W.F. Oorschot 
    &lt;pa0wfo@chello.nl&gt;<BR>Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 11:34 
    AM<BR>Subject: LF: Current "lost" in loading coil<BR><BR><BR>&gt; To All 
    from PA0SE<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Several amateurs have found that the current at 
    the bottom end of the<BR>&gt; loading coil is higher than at the top (aerial 
    side) of the coil.<BR>&gt; In my station the difference is of the order of 
    10%.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; William, PA0WFO, has a large coil of 8 mH and a 23 m 
    long wire as aerial.<BR>&gt; He measures 1.5 A at the bottom of the coil en 
    0.6 A at the top.<BR>&gt; My theory is that the "lost current"&nbsp; flows 
    via the capacitance of the<BR>coil<BR>&gt; to its surrounding (even a metal 
    object in free space has&nbsp; capacitance).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The current at 
    the bottom of the bottom of the coil divides between the<BR>&gt; 
    capacitances of&nbsp; coil and&nbsp; aerial.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I suggested to 
    William he&nbsp; measure the capacitance of the coil and of the<BR>&gt; 
    aerial. For the coil he found 150 - 200 pF, depending upon the position 
    of<BR>&gt; the coil and for the aerial 210 pF.<BR>&gt; But these values do 
    not explain the large difference in current at bottom<BR>&gt; and top of the 
    coil.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In a transmitting aerial the current increases going 
    from the end of the<BR>&gt; radiator towards the coil.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Now 
    to my question:&nbsp; does this increase in current also occur in 
    the<BR>&gt; winding of the coil?&nbsp; My feeling is that the current at the 
    beginning and<BR>&gt; end of a coil should be the same; apart from the 
    current that flows via<BR>its<BR>&gt; capacitance to the 
    surrounding.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I also have read that the coil should be 
    considered as an aerial with a<BR>&gt; length equal to the length of the 
    coil.&nbsp; But on 2 km<BR>&gt; that would be an extremely&nbsp; small 
    aerial, reckoned in wavelength.&nbsp; So<BR>&gt; radiation by the coil must 
    be negligible.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There are certainly&nbsp; experts on the 
    reflector who know the answers.&nbsp; I<BR>&gt; welcome&nbsp; their 
    views.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 73, Dick, 
  PA0SE<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;</FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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Many thanks everybody for your suggestions.  Latitude and longitude would certainly be the most widely used way of indicating my location, but in practice the information I have been given about the sites I shall be working from is expressed as NGRs. 

As I do not expect to achieve a great range in the experiments, the best way is probably to take the NGRs and convert them to lat/lon so as to be bilingual.

Regards,
John Rabson G3PAI 




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "g3ldo" <g3ldo@ukonline.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <PAEFLMFGBDKKCONLMLBIKEKJCCAA.ganymede444@btopenworld.com>
Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 17:57:54 -0000
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Subject: LF: Re: Big Bad Amps <was re: ... --- ...>
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Dave G3WCB said:

> Hi, Scott.
>
> If you're into Big Bad Amps, you should check out G4FTC's site
> http://www.qsl.net/g4ftc/amplifiers/136khz/home.htm He describes a 3kW LF
> amp. that uses 8 x IRFP450's in a bridge arrangement. Biggest PA I've seen
> so far!

The LF Experimenters Source Book (second edition, now out of print),
forerunner of The Low Frequency Experimenters Handbook, describes a 3kW
transmitter using a QY5-3000A tube in class AB1 with a plate voltage of 4kV.
This design by Tony Preedy, G3LNP used hardware from a salvaged Band II TV
transmitter. The limiting factor was the power available from a single phase
240VAC supply via a 13 amp socket!

Peter G3LDO




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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
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Subject: LF: TA MAR1/2
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--------------010709090605000405090808
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Uwe, Teo

Very light copy. Condx last night  noisier than previous nights. Will
keep capturing if you're transmitting - I monitor DF6NM grabber to see
if there is EU TA activity.

Jay, W1VD

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--------------010709090605000405090808--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: YU7AR <yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu>
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Hello Jay,

Thanks ,maybe this evening to be beter !

73 de Teo


JR> Uwe, Teo

JR> Very light copy. Condx last night  noisier than previous nights. Will
JR> keep capturing if you're transmitting - I monitor DF6NM grabber to see
JR> if there is EU TA activity.

JR> Jay, W1VD


-- 
Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 14:15:27 -0000
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Subject: LF: Lost current in a coil
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A useful test to see whether radiation causes the loss, would be to 
completely screen the loading coil. 

I have never understood why, if the current is thought to stay the 
same from top to bottom of a coil, the voltage is much bigger at the 
top? Is this a phase thing?

Mike, G3XDV
===========
http://lf.apersonalguide.co.uk



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Dick Rollema <dickrollema@casema.nl>
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Subject: Re: LF: Lost current in a coil
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<html>
<body>
<font size=4>To Mike and All<br><br>
</font><font size=3>At 15:15 2-3-05, G3XDV wrote:<br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">A useful test to see whether
radiation causes the loss, would be to <br>
completely screen the loading coil. <br>
</font></blockquote><font size=4>Because the size of the coil is so
small, expressed in wavelength,&nbsp; radiation is
negligible</font>.<br><br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite=""><font size=3>I have never
understood why, if the current is thought to stay the <br>
same from top to bottom of a coil, the voltage is much bigger at the
<br>
top? Is this a phase thing?</font></blockquote><br>
<font size=4>The voltage at the bottom is equal to the output voltage of
the transmitter; at e.g. 100W this is 70V over 50 ohm.<br><br>
As an example let the inductance of the coil&nbsp; be 5mH. Then its
reactance at 136kHz is 4270 ohm.<br>
With an aerial current of for instance 2A flowing through the coil the
voltage at the top of the coil will be <br>
2 * 4270 = 8541V higher than at the bottom.&nbsp; <br>
So total voltage at the top will be 70 + 8541 = 8610V. <br><br>
73, Dick, PA0SE<br>
</font></body>
</html>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Rik Strobbe <Rik.Strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be>
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Subject: Re: LF: Lost current in a coil
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Hello Dick, Mike

it is indeed a "phase thing".
If a 100 W TX causes a 2 A current in a 5mH coil (XL = 4270 Ohm) and 
thus causes a voltage of 8540 V over the coil then at the "hot" end 
the phase difference between U and I is 89.7 degrees :
P = U * I * cos(x) thus x = arccos(P/(U*I))
(assuming no coil losses)
At the "cold" end voltage and current are in phase.

73, Rik

> To Mike and All
> 
> At 15:15 2-3-05, G3XDV wrote:
> >A useful test to see whether radiation causes the loss, would be to
> >completely screen the loading coil.
> Because the size of the coil is so small, expressed in 
> wavelength,  radiation is negligible.
> 
> >I have never understood why, if the current is thought to stay the
> >same from top to bottom of a coil, the voltage is much bigger at
> the
> >top? Is this a phase thing?
> 
> The voltage at the bottom is equal to the output voltage of the 
> transmitter; at e.g. 100W this is 70V over 50 ohm.
> 
> As an example let the inductance of the coil  be 5mH. Then its
> reactance at 
> 136kHz is 4270 ohm.
> With an aerial current of for instance 2A flowing through the coil
> the 
> voltage at the top of the coil will be
> 2 * 4270 = 8541V higher than at the bottom.
> So total voltage at the top will be 70 + 8541 = 8610V.
> 
> 73, Dick, PA0SE
> 





From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <CAF854AAFD1BA543B4CFEFE3F41B4DD60DB8D0@TNS-FBU-2E-014.corp.telenor.no>
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Subject: LF: Re: Big Bad Amps -or " Practical use of Wilkinson combiner"
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Jan-Martin

I've never encountered a situation where something works that would be
labelled misuse.  You must have a PhD.

Bad practice to some may be good practice for others.  We had two seperately
built 500W transmitters we wished to combine.  Why build a new one?  Second
the combiner acts as a filter so we could remove the two redundant LPFs.
>From experiment I can push the two seperate transimitters abit more without
threat of an over current shutdown...

Don't be so negative.  It works and it took only a few hours to rig....

Thinking outside the box...
73 Scott




----- Original Message -----
From: <jan-martin.noding@telenor.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 1:23 AM
Subject: LF: Re: Re: Big Bad Amps -or " misuse of Wilkinson combiner"


But if you wish to combine two signals which has the same source, and they
are obviously in the same phase, the wilkinson thing is only adding to the
complexity, and it is very bad practice to do so.
The signals could much better be added directly in series or paralell

73
Jan-Martin, LA8AK

-----Opprinnelig melding-----
Fra: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]På vegne av Scott Tilley
Sendt: 2. mars 2005 00:11
Til: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Emne: LF: Re: Big Bad Amps <was re: ... --- ...>


Dave

> If you're into Big Bad Amps...

Don't put those kind of thoughts in my head ;-)

I think with Steve's antenna setup and 1KW we are very close to 1W ERP.  The
Wilkinson seems to work great... Ran it full out last night for a couple of
hours into the dummy load...  I couldn't measure the loss from the combiner
as it is very low and the system remains >80% eff.

73 Scott



----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave G3WCB" <ganymede444@btopenworld.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 3:13 AM
Subject: LF: Big Bad Amps <was re: ... --- ...>


> Hi, Scott.
>
, you should check out G4FTC's site
> http://www.qsl.net/g4ftc/amplifiers/136khz/home.htm He describes a 3kW LF
> amp. that uses 8 x IRFP450's in a bridge arrangement. Biggest PA I've seen
> so far!
>
> BTW, if you have two identical TX's already, and you find the Wilkinson
> thing doesn't work out, you could re-configure your amps. into a bridge
> arrangement instead, bit like the Decca TX's.
>
> Keep that fire-blanket handy!
>
> Cheers,
>
> Dave G3WCB.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
> [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Scott Tilley
> Sent: 01 March 2005 10:59
> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
> Subject: LF: Re: Re: ... --- ...
>
>
> Hey Alan
>
> We got the bugs out...  Once I found the problem with the lack of sinc in
> the 4013 divider stages things have been working as expected.  I thought
> about the inductor coupling; however, based on my observations the
combiner
> is not doing anything negative to the signal train.  We still have >80%
eff.
>
> I would like to try this with toroids next and compact it down.  I'm also
> dreaming up a bigger badder amp using this concept.  It seems real stable
> and doesn't require running the system 'balls to the wall' to get some
> serious power from 4 FET and a reasonable PSU voltage.
>
> 73 Scott
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
> To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 2:49 AM
> Subject: LF: Re: ... --- ...
>
>
> > Hi Steve I have just had a thought your construction looks fine....BUT
> maybe
> > the two coils are too close together and there is some coupling. I
wonder
> if
> > it is possible to temporarily turn one at right angles to kill any
> coupling
> > and see if that helps??
> > The biggies in my Web page were made with big toroids I believe probably
> > iron dust rather than ferrite, as the inductance reqquired is not that
> high
> >
> > Cheers de Alan G3NYK
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
> > To: <lowfer@lwca.org>; <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> > Sent: 01 March 2005 06:51
> > Subject: LF: ... --- ...
> >
> >
> > The smoke test of this Wilkinson Combiner was successfull in that no
smoke
> > came out and nothing died.  However, we get enough heat to cook an egg
on
> > the 100ohm balance resistor.
> >
> > We have a scope match on the output to the dummy load and it shows about
> > 225W from one transmitter, add another and we get 450W, success NOPE!
The
> > transmitters are outputting ~450W each! Therefore, half the power is
being
> > absorbed in the 100ohm balance resistor.  Examining the phase
relationship
> > of the input to the combiner waveforms indicates they are in phase
within
> > ~10degrees and almost equal in amplitude.  So what gives!  Anyone have
> some
> > idea what may be going wrong?  Of course we have checked and doubled
> checked
> > the circuit for errors and nothing...  All seems as it should according
to
> > formulas and drawings we have viewed and designed it from.
> >
> > Does anyone have an idea how we could troubleshoot our way through this?
> >
> > Any advice would be appreciated.
> >
> > 73 Scott and Steve(It's all his fault ;-)
> >
> >
> > Check the status of radio beacon 'TIL'  in CN89lg at:
> > www.scottboxx.com/radio
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>




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<DIV>Another good reason to use a combiner is to preserve impedance matching.&nbsp; Running two amplifiers in direct parallel connection will not&nbsp;maximize the available&nbsp;power.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>It can&nbsp;also reduce the risk of damaging both amplifiers if (or more accurately in the real world,&nbsp;"when") one loses drive, or its power supply quits, or other failure occurs.&nbsp; In commercial practice, we would never dream of strapping two amplifiers together without a combiner that provides some isolation between them... or at least&nbsp;employing a circulator in line with each output, which is not very practical at LF.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
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From: "james moritz" <j.r.moritz@herts.ac.uk>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
I do like G3GVB's kind of reasoning. But I think the situation is simplified a
bit too much.&nbsp; Assume as an example that the coil is wound on a toroid of
high permeability material&nbsp; (e.g. for use with a QRP transmitter....).<br>
The magnetic flux in the core is proportional to the current in the
winding.&nbsp; When the current increases from one end of the winding to the
other end this would mean thatt he flux in the core would rise as well&nbsp;
along the core. But this is impossible. The flux must be uniform.&nbsp; So
current in must be equql to current out.<br>
<br>
&nbsp;73, Dick, PA0SE</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy'>Dear Dick, LF Group,</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy'>This is not actually true &#8211; there is
no requirement for the current to be equal in all parts of the winding; if the
magnetic flux is the same in all parts of the winding, the voltage across each
turn will be identical ( = d(phi)/dt), but the only requirement on the current
is that the vector sum of all the (current x turns) products flowing in all the
windings will be that required to generate the magnetic flux phi. As an
example, if you divide the winding on your high permeability core into two halves,
and connect an AC source across one half while the other half is left open
circuit, obviously no current will flow in the open circuit half, while the
other half will carry a current determined by the source voltage and the
winding inductance. The voltage across each half of the winding will be equal,
but the current in each half will be different.</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>The inductance and capacitance of the loading coil depend a lot on how
they are measured and at what frequency &#8211; as a rough approximation think of
the total distributed capacitance as small, equal, capacitors between each turn
and ground. If you apply a signal far below the self-resonant frequency of the
coil to one end of the coil, and leave the other end open circuit, the impedance
at that point will nearly be the sum of the small capacitors in parallel. But
as the frequency increases, the inductive reactance of the coil partly cancels
the reactance of the capacitors, reducing the overall reactance, so the overall
effective capacitance is larger. Because the capacitors at the &#8220;hot&#8221;
open end of the coil have more inductance in series with them, their effective reactance
is reduced more, and so more current flows in them than the capacitors at the
driven end of the coil &#8211; this also means that the voltage across the hot
end capacitors is higher than at the driven end. The limiting case is where the
coil and the distributed capacitance becomes self resonant, and most of the
current flows through the capacitance at the hot end, where the voltage is only
limited by the Q. Of course in practice the distributed capacitance along the
coil will not normally be uniform, and there will be extra capacitance attached
to the &#8220;hot&#8221; end in the form of the antenna, but qualitatively the
same thing will happen &#8211; with most of the displacement current flowing to
ground from the high-voltage end of the coil. The difference in current
measured at the two ends of the coil is due to the presence of this
displacement current. The smaller the antenna is, (and so the bigger the coil
and its distributed capacitance is) the greater the fraction of the total
current flows through the distributed capacitance of the coil.</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Cheers, Jim Moritz</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>73 de M0BMU</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>Exactly</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>if the current were the same than you would have a perpetual 
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>motion machine where more power is&nbsp;coming out than is 
going in.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>the coil is ,, in the simple case,, acting as a transformer 
matching the 50 Ohm </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>to the higher impedance of the aerial </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>we needn't disobey the law of ,,, conservation</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>be nice if we could,, though</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>Bob K3DJC</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=4>As an example let the inductance of the coil&nbsp; be 5mH. 
Then its reactance at 136kHz is 4270 ohm.<BR>With an aerial current of for 
instance 2A flowing through the coil the voltage at the top of the coil will be 
<BR>2 * 4270 = 8541V higher than at the bottom.&nbsp; <BR>So total voltage at 
the top will be 70 + 8541 = 8610V. <BR><BR>73, Dick, PA0SE<BR></DIV></FONT>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
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References: <PAEFLMFGBDKKCONLMLBICEKMCCAA.ganymede444@btopenworld.com> <42251C1F.2080204@genesiswireless.us>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi all,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Nothing useful was received of the RU6LA beacon 
last night.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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Ed,
very strong signal here in JO52ho.
  
Capture:
http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm


 73

 Hartmut



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Subject: LF: Re: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil
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Hi all,

The discussion has brought out some interesting points on what goes on in a 
practical loading coil.  I would like to investigate (measure) some vector 
relationships of current and voltage on a practical setup, but in the 
meantime I am occupied with preparing for an LF DX weekend at Quartz Hill, 
so it will be a while till I can find time to do quantitative testing.  I'm 
interested to find out if maximum current in to the "cold end" of the 
loading coil corresponds with maximum radiation (far field, not near field) 
from the system (system being not only the wire connected to the "hot end" 
of the loading coil).

One can expect a big difference in relationships between tuned and untuned. 
When tuned (the usual situation for LF transmitting) one can expect an 
approximate linear voltage rise (similar volts per turn) and at the top "hot 
end" it will be some Q times the voltage applied at the "cold end".  If 
there is similar stray capacitance per turn, then the current "lost" has an 
approximate linear distribution up the coil, as "lost current" is 
proportional to driving voltage, which increases along the coil.

There will also be a phase shift due to physical length of wire in the 
inductor, with 360 degrees corresponding to a wavelength (even for applying 
DC, there is a finite time from applying excitation at one end till current 
comes out the other end, it is the "propagation delay" that forms the phase 
shift for steady state sinewave excitation).  A coil winding length of 100 
metres of wire is about 4.5% of a wavelength, or some 16 degrees for 136 
kHz.  The stray capacitance will of course modify the ideal situation of the 
16 degrees being proportional to length along the winding, especially around 
the upper part of a resonant coil where the voltage is highest.

73, Bob ZL2CA 




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From: Dexter McIntyre W4DEX <dmcintyre@att.net>
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Someone made a brief appearance just above 135.922 about 0200 utc.

http://www.w4dex.com/argo/135khz.html

Argo time is -0500 utc

Dex


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Dex, Teo and TA enthusiasts

Nice snag Dex.

That would most likely be YU7AR sending "AR". Had some copy here
earlier...but has since faded out. Will continue to run captures.

http://www.advancedreceiver.com/capture/135922030305.jpg

Jay, W1VD



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Wed, 02 Mar 2005 23:14:41 -0500
From: Dexter McIntyre W4DEX <dmcintyre@att.net>
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Jay Rusgrove wrote:

> That would most likely be YU7AR sending "AR".

I just looked at the 137 KHz plot and see that my noise is running more 
than 10 db above a good quiet level.  If that is YU7AR there was sure a 
strong peak in propagation to show up that good with the high noise level.

Dex


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Dex

Hard to say, but the frequency looks correct on your capture...

I have little doubt that's "AR" on my capture...but I'd need a cleaner
ID to be absolutely sure.

Jay

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dexter McIntyre W4DEX" <dmcintyre@att.net>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 11:14 PM
Subject: Re: LF: TA MAR 2/3


> Jay Rusgrove wrote:
>
> > That would most likely be YU7AR sending "AR".
>
> I just looked at the 137 KHz plot and see that my noise is running
more
> than 10 db above a good quiet level.  If that is YU7AR there was sure
a
> strong peak in propagation to show up that good with the high noise
level.
>
> Dex
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org,  lowfer@lwca.org
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Subject: LF: VA7LF testing tonight...
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VA7LF is running as of 0630UTC in FSK120 on 137777.5/777.9

Running ~750W output to the SL antenna array.  All systems appear normal and 
the combiner is working great.  We removed the LPFs as they are not required 
due to the narrow passband of the combiner.  

Any and all reports welcome.

73 Scott & Steve






From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: LF: XES and XGJ in Nuernberg
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Hi John and Warren,<BR>
<BR>
XES and XGJ came through here between 0500 and 0600 this morning - still on the grabber's TA screen. No sign of XDW or VA7LF yet - Hartmut ?<BR>
<BR>
73<BR>
Markus, DF6NM<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "captbrian" <captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil
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Thanks Vernall but..

<<"it will be some Q times the voltage applied at the "cold end". ">>



Where would you measure this?   ..... there isnt any "voltage applied at the
cold end". [It is plugged into the finest earth that cunning hams can
devise.]  The voltage at the "colder " end depends where you tap (if that is
how you feed )?   Or am I wrong ?

If fed with a coupling coil I confess I am lost .

Bryan   50 50 N / 00 16W


----- Original Message -----
From: Vernall <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 8:58 PM
Subject: LF: Re: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil


> Hi all,
>
> The discussion has brought out some interesting points on what goes on in
a
> practical loading coil.  I would like to investigate (measure) some vector
> relationships of current and voltage on a practical setup, but in the
> meantime I am occupied with preparing for an LF DX weekend at Quartz Hill,
> so it will be a while till I can find time to do quantitative testing.
I'm
> interested to find out if maximum current in to the "cold end" of the
> loading coil corresponds with maximum radiation (far field, not near
field)
> from the system (system being not only the wire connected to the "hot end"
> of the loading coil).
>
> One can expect a big difference in relationships between tuned and
untuned.
> When tuned (the usual situation for LF transmitting) one can expect an
> approximate linear voltage rise (similar volts per turn) and at the top
"hot
> end" it will be some Q times the voltage applied at the "cold end".  If
> there is similar stray capacitance per turn, then the current "lost" has
an
> approximate linear distribution up the coil, as "lost current" is
> proportional to driving voltage, which increases along the coil.
>
> There will also be a phase shift due to physical length of wire in the
> inductor, with 360 degrees corresponding to a wavelength (even for
applying
> DC, there is a finite time from applying excitation at one end till
current
> comes out the other end, it is the "propagation delay" that forms the
phase
> shift for steady state sinewave excitation).  A coil winding length of 100
> metres of wire is about 4.5% of a wavelength, or some 16 degrees for 136
> kHz.  The stray capacitance will of course modify the ideal situation of
the
> 16 degrees being proportional to length along the winding, especially
around
> the upper part of a resonant coil where the voltage is highest.
>
> 73, Bob ZL2CA
>
>
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil
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Bryan,

Having a tapped coil is one way to feeding/matching to 50 ohms, and my
experience (for 181 kHz) is that around 2 or 3 turns is about right.  I now
prefer feeding the coax inner to the cold end of the coil and earthing the
braid to the "earth mat".  When tuned the resistance presented varies with
ground loss, but can be matched down or up with either an autotransformer or
L match.

My input about "Q times" is based on the feeder connected to the cold end,
and no tapping.  However, a tapped coil is only a variation for feeding
power to it, and the discussion about current "going sideways" via stray
capacitance is still a fact of life.

If you do measurements, use very low power, otherwise you will fry the
probe.

73, Bob

----- Original Message -----
From: "captbrian" <captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 10:14 PM
Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil


> Thanks Vernall but..
>
> <<"it will be some Q times the voltage applied at the "cold end". ">>
>
>
>
> Where would you measure this?   ..... there isnt any "voltage applied at
the
> cold end". [It is plugged into the finest earth that cunning hams can
> devise.]  The voltage at the "colder " end depends where you tap (if that
is
> how you feed )?   Or am I wrong ?
>
> If fed with a coupling coil I confess I am lost .
>
> Bryan   50 50 N / 00 16W
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Vernall <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
> To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 8:58 PM
> Subject: LF: Re: Re: Current "lost" in loading coil
>
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > The discussion has brought out some interesting points on what goes on
in
> a
> > practical loading coil.  I would like to investigate (measure) some
vector
> > relationships of current and voltage on a practical setup, but in the
> > meantime I am occupied with preparing for an LF DX weekend at Quartz
Hill,
> > so it will be a while till I can find time to do quantitative testing.
> I'm
> > interested to find out if maximum current in to the "cold end" of the
> > loading coil corresponds with maximum radiation (far field, not near
> field)
> > from the system (system being not only the wire connected to the "hot
end"
> > of the loading coil).
> >
> > One can expect a big difference in relationships between tuned and
> untuned.
> > When tuned (the usual situation for LF transmitting) one can expect an
> > approximate linear voltage rise (similar volts per turn) and at the top
> "hot
> > end" it will be some Q times the voltage applied at the "cold end".  If
> > there is similar stray capacitance per turn, then the current "lost" has
> an
> > approximate linear distribution up the coil, as "lost current" is
> > proportional to driving voltage, which increases along the coil.
> >
> > There will also be a phase shift due to physical length of wire in the
> > inductor, with 360 degrees corresponding to a wavelength (even for
> applying
> > DC, there is a finite time from applying excitation at one end till
> current
> > comes out the other end, it is the "propagation delay" that forms the
> phase
> > shift for steady state sinewave excitation).  A coil winding length of
100
> > metres of wire is about 4.5% of a wavelength, or some 16 degrees for 136
> > kHz.  The stray capacitance will of course modify the ideal situation of
> the
> > 16 degrees being proportional to length along the winding, especially
> around
> > the upper part of a resonant coil where the voltage is highest.
> >
> > 73, Bob ZL2CA
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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 Jay, Dex

 Thanks for capture, I transmit next days on 135.9221 qrss 60  AR AR

 Teo YU7AR / loc. KN05BW

 

Thursday, March 3, 2005, 4:56:12 AM, you wrote:

JR> Dex, Teo and TA enthusiasts

JR> Nice snag Dex.

JR> That would most likely be YU7AR sending "AR". Had some copy here
JR> earlier...but has since faded out. Will continue to run captures.

JR> http://www.advancedreceiver.com/capture/135922030305.jpg

JR> Jay, W1VD



JR> __________ NOD32 1.1017 (20050302) Information __________

JR> This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus System.
JR> http://www.nod32.com




-- 
Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 11:45:20 +0100
From: Dick Rollema <dickrollema@casema.nl>
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<font size=3>Thanks Jim for providing the final answer!<br><br>
73, Dick, PA0SE<br><br>
At 19:23 2-3-05, you wrote:<br><br>
</font><blockquote type=cite class=cite cite=""><font face="Times New Roman, Times" size=3>I
do like G3GVB's kind of reasoning. But I think the situation is
simplified a bit too much.&nbsp; Assume as an example that the coil is
wound on a toroid of high permeability material&nbsp; (e.g. for use with
a QRP transmitter....).<br>
The magnetic flux in the core is proportional to the current in the
winding.&nbsp; When the current increases from one end of the winding to
the other end this would mean thatt he flux in the core would rise as
well&nbsp; along the core. But this is impossible. The flux must be
uniform.&nbsp; So current in must be equql to current out.<br><br>
&nbsp;73, Dick, PA0SE<br>
</font><font face="Times New Roman, Times" size=3 color="#000080">&nbsp;<br>
Dear Dick, LF Group,<br>
&nbsp;<br>
This is not actually true – there is no requirement for the current to be
equal in all parts of the winding; if the magnetic flux is the same in
all parts of the winding, the voltage across each turn will be identical
( = d(phi)/dt), but the only requirement on the current is that the
vector sum of all the (current x turns) products flowing in all the
windings will be that required to generate the magnetic flux phi. As an
example, if you divide the winding on your high permeability core into
two halves, and connect an AC source across one half while the other half
is left open circuit, obviously no current will flow in the open circuit
half, while the other half will carry a current determined by the source
voltage and the winding inductance. The voltage across each half of the
winding will be equal, but the current in each half will be
different.<br>
&nbsp;<br>
</font><font face="Times New Roman, Times" size=3>The inductance and
capacitance of the loading coil depend a lot on how they are measured and
at what frequency – as a rough approximation think of the total
distributed capacitance as small, equal, capacitors between each turn and
ground. If you apply a signal far below the self-resonant frequency of
the coil to one end of the coil, and leave the other end open circuit,
the impedance at that point will nearly be the sum of the small
capacitors in parallel. But as the frequency increases, the inductive
reactance of the coil partly cancels the reactance of the capacitors,
reducing the overall reactance, so the overall effective capacitance is
larger. Because the capacitors at the “hot” open end of the coil have
more inductance in series with them, their effective reactance is reduced
more, and so more current flows in them than the capacitors at the driven
end of the coil – this also means that the voltage across the hot end
capacitors is higher than at the driven end. The limiting case is where
the coil and the distributed capacitance becomes self resonant, and most
of the current flows through the capacitance at the hot end, where the
voltage is only limited by the Q. Of course in practice the distributed
capacitance along the coil will not normally be uniform, and there will
be extra capacitance attached to the “hot” end in the form of the
antenna, but qualitatively the same thing will happen – with most of the
displacement current flowing to ground from the high-voltage end of the
coil. The difference in current measured at the two ends of the coil is
due to the presence of this displacement current. The smaller the antenna
is, (and so the bigger the coil and its distributed capacitance is) the
greater the fraction of the total current flows through the distributed
capacitance of the coil.<br>
&nbsp;<br>
Cheers, Jim Moritz<br>
73 de M0BMU<br>
</font><font face="arial" size=2 color="#000080">&nbsp;<br>
&nbsp;</font></blockquote></body>
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Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 11:39:31 +0100
From: Dick Rollema <dickrollema@casema.nl>
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<font size=3>To All from PA0SE<br><br>
Rik is right of course.&nbsp; I had overlooked the fact that the voltage
over the coil is almost 90 degrees out of phase with the voltage out of
the transmitter.&nbsp; So the two voltages cannot be simply added. It
must be done as vectors: SQRT(70^2+8541^2) = 8451,3 V.<br><br>
73, Dick, PA0SE<br><br>
<br>
At 17:04 2-3-05, you wrote:<br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">Hello Dick, Mike<br><br>
it is indeed a &quot;phase thing&quot;.<br>
If a 100 W TX causes a 2 A current in a 5mH coil (XL = 4270 Ohm) and
<br>
thus causes a voltage of 8540 V over the coil then at the &quot;hot&quot;
end <br>
the phase difference between U and I is 89.7 degrees :<br>
P = U * I * cos(x) thus x = arccos(P/(U*I))<br>
(assuming no coil losses)<br>
At the &quot;cold&quot; end voltage and current are in phase.<br><br>
73, Rik<br><br>
&gt; To Mike and All<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; At 15:15 2-3-05, G3XDV wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt;A useful test to see whether radiation causes the loss, would be
to<br>
&gt; &gt;completely screen the loading coil.<br>
&gt; Because the size of the coil is so small, expressed in <br>
&gt; wavelength,&nbsp; radiation is negligible.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; &gt;I have never understood why, if the current is thought to stay
the<br>
&gt; &gt;same from top to bottom of a coil, the voltage is much bigger
at<br>
&gt; the<br>
&gt; &gt;top? Is this a phase thing?<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; The voltage at the bottom is equal to the output voltage of the
<br>
&gt; transmitter; at e.g. 100W this is 70V over 50 ohm.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; As an example let the inductance of the coil&nbsp; be 5mH. Then
its<br>
&gt; reactance at <br>
&gt; 136kHz is 4270 ohm.<br>
&gt; With an aerial current of for instance 2A flowing through the
coil<br>
&gt; the <br>
&gt; voltage at the top of the coil will be<br>
&gt; 2 * 4270 = 8541V higher than at the bottom.<br>
&gt; So total voltage at the top will be 70 + 8541 = 8610V.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; 73, Dick, PA0SE<br>
&gt; </font></blockquote></body>
</html>

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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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TA enthusiasts

A couple "snips" from last night below. 

Teo best showing about 0030Z. Uwe best showing about 0600Z.   

Jay, W1VD

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--------------040609040408000105060506--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <4226808C.9010906@att.net> <000701c51fa4$f949fb40$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL> <68354396475.20050303104753@pyrotherm.co.yu> <003201c51fec$c6485820$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL>
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Subject: LF: Re: TA MAR 2/3
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Jay, Dex I've been seeing similiar "snips" but have just hoped for better
confirmation so haven't made any captures ,but will keep trying for good
capture hr (MD FM19MH)
de Lloyd W3NF
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 7:30 AM
Subject: LF: TA MAR 2/3


> TA enthusiasts
>
> A couple "snips" from last night below.
>
> Teo best showing about 0030Z. Uwe best showing about 0600Z.
>
> Jay, W1VD
>




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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YU7AR schrieb:
>  Jay, Dex
>
>  Thanks for capture, I transmit next days on 135.9221 qrss 60  AR AR
>
>  Teo YU7AR / loc. KN05BW
>
>  
>
DJ8WX transmitting on 135,9223kHz QRSS60 

regards
Uwe/dj8wx/jo43sv


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Hartmut Wolff <wolff.h@t-online.de>
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> XES and XGJ came through here between 0500 and 0600 this morning - still on
> the grabber's TA screen. No sign of XDW or VA7LF yet - Hartmut ?

> 73
> Markus, DF6NM

Markus,
saw XDW last Feb, 24th, nil last night. Best time here for XES and XGJ was
around 0100z and 0600z last night. I haven't seen your capture as I
had a internet failure until 1200z at work. VA7 or VE7 ... I believe the
path is to near at the pole and is not possible at the moment. Maybe
just before a CME arrival?

73
Hartmut



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From: "Steve McDonald" <jsm@gulfislands.com>
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>> VA7 or VE7 ... I believe the
> path is to near at the pole and is not possible at the moment. Maybe
> just before a CME arrival?
>


Hartmut - great strong signals from Iceland last night here on 189...I have
never heard them before but they were very strong laast night. Will do some
beaconing tonight a few hours before your sunrise. We were listening last
night instead of beaconing during the best time.

Steve / Scott  VA7LF



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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 Steve and Scott,

> Hartmut - great strong signals from Iceland last night here on 189...I have
> never heard them before but they were very strong laast night. Will do some
> beaconing tonight a few hours before your sunrise. We were listening last
> night instead of beaconing during the best time.

will be watching the TA window and 137777.5/777.9 is clear.

Hartmut



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Subject: LF: Quartz Hill DX aspirations
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi all,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>For the next two ZL nights (4 and 5 March) ZM2E (at 
Quartz Hill, near Wellington)&nbsp;will be trying for&nbsp;QSOs with VA7LF and 
RU6LA.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>There is about 7 hours 45 minutes of mutual dark 
path between ZL and VE7, and the distance is some 11,700 km.&nbsp; For listeners 
in The Americas the only reliable time I can advise that ZM2E will be 
transmitting is from 0715 UTC, when we make a call for VA7LF using FSK120 with 
frequencies 137.7890/137.7886 kHz (0.4 Hz shift) and content ZM2E ZM2E E, which 
will take 72 minutes.&nbsp; VA7LK will likely transmit from 0830 UTC using 
FSK120 with frequencies 137.7777/137.7771 kHz (0.4 Hz shift), and starting with 
their full call sign.&nbsp;&nbsp;Transmissions from either station after that 
will depend on whether we can copy each other and thus progress a QSO, or else 
there will be repeats of sending full call signs.&nbsp; There is about 12 Hz 
offset between respective transmit frequencies so anyone&nbsp;monitoring would 
need to run two Argo screens if they were to see both sides of events.&nbsp; The 
mutual dark path ends around 1440 UTC with VE7 sunrise.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>There is about&nbsp;3 hours of mutual dark path 
between ZL and RU6, and the distance is some 16,500 km.&nbsp; For listeners west 
of ZL the only reliable time I can advise that ZM2E will be transmitting is from 
1515 UTC, when we make a call for RU6LA using FSK60 with frequencies 
137.7890/137.7886 kHz (0.4 Hz shift) and content ZM2E ZM2E E, which will take 36 
minutes.&nbsp; RU6LA will use the same frequencies and shift, and could reply 
using FSK120 from 1551 UTC.&nbsp; European listeners could monitor events with a 
single Argo screen.&nbsp; The mutual dark path ends around 1800 UTC with sunrise 
at Quartz Hill.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>ZM2E operators are Andrew ZL2BBJ, Mike ZL4OL and 
myself.&nbsp; How we last for&nbsp;two loooong nights with no sleep will also be 
interesting, but with three on site we can tolerate some watching of 
eyelids.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>There is no 'net access at Quartz Hill so this 
could be my last email session till 6 March.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Do you know about Winlink. Email by Amateur Radio.? 
It would give you email access without landline. If not I'll send 
details</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3>Bryan G3GVB</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE 
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV 
  style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
  <A href="mailto:vernall@xtra.co.nz" title=vernall@xtra.co.nz>Vernall</A> 
</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A 
  href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org" 
  title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, March 03, 2005 8:48 
  PM</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> LF: Quartz Hill DX 
  aspirations</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>There is no 'net access at Quartz Hill so this 
  could be my last email session till 6 March.</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <4225CA7F.15619.BBCBA7@localhost> <6.1.0.6.2.20050302162804.02a13ea0@mail.casema.nl> <1109779478.4225e41606d62@webmail2.kuleuven.be> <6.1.0.6.2.20050303113502.02cf20b0@mail.casema.nl> <001f01c52032$6a008600$c401a8c0@quaycustomer> <005e01c52032$f808b120$45b80150@p2300>
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Subject: LF: Re: Re: Quartz Hill DX aspirations
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Bryan G3GVN,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I do not know about Winlink, but&nbsp;no 'net 
access at Quartz Hill means&nbsp;we&nbsp;attempt any QSO entirely by 
radio.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr 
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV 
  style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
  <A title=captbrian@ukonline.co.uk 
  href="mailto:captbrian@ukonline.co.uk">captbrian</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> 
  </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, March 04, 2005 9:52 
AM</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> LF: Re: Quartz Hill DX 
  aspirations</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Do you know about Winlink. Email by Amateur 
  Radio.? It would give you email access without landline. If not I'll send 
  details</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3>Bryan G3GVB</FONT></DIV>
  <BLOCKQUOTE 
  style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
    <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
    <DIV 
    style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
    <A title=vernall@xtra.co.nz href="mailto:vernall@xtra.co.nz">Vernall</A> 
    </DIV>
    <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A 
    title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
    href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> 
    </DIV>
    <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, March 03, 2005 8:48 
    PM</DIV>
    <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> LF: Quartz Hill DX 
    aspirations</DIV>
    <DIV><BR></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>
    <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>There is no 'net access at Quartz Hill so this 
    could be my last email session till 6 March.</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=Arial 
size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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From: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
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> VA7LK will likely transmit from 0830 UTC using FSK120 with frequencies
> 137.7777/137.7771 kHz (0.4 Hz shift), 

Bob 

Please be advised we are using 137777.5 (dot)  137777.9 (dash) as we did last 
night.  If this is a problem we are frequency agile and can QSY.  

We will be monitoring HF 14140 USB until local sunset then the co-ordinated 40m 
frequency +- QRM for final confirmation of RX//TX frequecies... 

73 Scott & Steve 



Quoting Vernall <vernall@xtra.co.nz>:

> Hi all,
> 
> For the next two ZL nights (4 and 5 March) ZM2E (at Quartz Hill, near
> Wellington) will be trying for QSOs with VA7LF and RU6LA.
> 
> There is about 7 hours 45 minutes of mutual dark path between ZL and VE7, and
> the distance is some 11,700 km.  For listeners in The Americas the only
> reliable time I can advise that ZM2E will be transmitting is from 0715 UTC,
> when we make a call for VA7LF using FSK120 with frequencies 137.7890/137.7886
> kHz (0.4 Hz shift) and content ZM2E ZM2E E, which will take 72 minutes. 
> VA7LK will likely transmit from 0830 UTC using FSK120 with frequencies
> 137.7777/137.7771 kHz (0.4 Hz shift), and starting with their full call sign.
>  Transmissions from either station after that will depend on whether we can
> copy each other and thus progress a QSO, or else there will be repeats of
> sending full call signs.  There is about 12 Hz offset between respective
> transmit frequencies so anyone monitoring would need to run two Argo screens
> if they were to see both sides of events.  The mutual dark path ends around
> 1440 UTC with VE7 sunrise.
> 
> There is about 3 hours of mutual dark path between ZL and RU6, and the
> distance is some 16,500 km.  For listeners west of ZL the only reliable time
> I can advise that ZM2E will be transmitting is from 1515 UTC, when we make a
> call for RU6LA using FSK60 with frequencies 137.7890/137.7886 kHz (0.4 Hz
> shift) and content ZM2E ZM2E E, which will take 36 minutes.  RU6LA will use
> the same frequencies and shift, and could reply using FSK120 from 1551 UTC. 
> European listeners could monitor events with a single Argo screen.  The
> mutual dark path ends around 1800 UTC with sunrise at Quartz Hill.
> 
> ZM2E operators are Andrew ZL2BBJ, Mike ZL4OL and myself.  How we last for two
> loooong nights with no sleep will also be interesting, but with three on site
> we can tolerate some watching of eyelids.
> 
> There is no 'net access at Quartz Hill so this could be my last email session
> till 6 March.
> 
> 73, Bob ZL2CA
> 
> 






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"O" copy of the QRSS3 signal from RA3YO.


Capture:
http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm
  

 

73
Hartmut Wolff
Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de  



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Hello jannsen,

Thursday, March 3, 2005, 7:43:09 PM, you wrote:

j> DJ8WX transmitting on 135,9223kHz QRSS60


Uwe ,you are on 135.2219 see on DF6NM graber, correct ??

GL, Teo



-- 
Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



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From: "Gary - G4WGT" <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
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Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 22:23:42 -0000
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Hi All,

Is it possible to configure Argo to use the second sound card in my pc, I
have no problem with Spec Lab but I can't do it with Argo. Has anyone done
it? Is it possible? How?

Thanks

Regards,

Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Hi Uwe and Teo,<BR>
<BR>
my current readouts from the 135.922 Eu window are<BR>
 <BR>
 923.00 (20:56 to 21:14) SM6BHZ testing?<BR>
 922.14 YU7AR<BR>
 921.80 DJ8WX <BR>
<BR>
I have split the TA window to show 137.789 for Ed (strong on 788.75 till 18:48) and Bob (wishful thinking ;-).<BR>
<BR>
At the moment I see YU7DP in QSO with DK1IS near 137.710 DFCW.<BR>
<BR>
Best of luck again<BR>
<BR>
Markus<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In einer eMail vom 03.03.2005 23:08:22 Westeuropäische Normalzeit schreibt yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu: <BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Hello jannsen,<BR>
<BR>
Thursday, March 3, 2005, 7:43:09 PM, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
j&gt; DJ8WX transmitting on 135,9223kHz QRSS60<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Uwe ,you are on 135.2219 see on DF6NM graber, correct ??<BR>
<BR>
GL, Teo<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

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Gary,

  no, the current version of Argo uses just the sound card defined as 
default to Windows.
I am sending you in a private message the preliminary build 215 of 
Spectran which has the
possibility to select the sound card, not necessarily the same for input 
and for output.

73  Alberto  I2PHD
-------------------------------------------

Gary - G4WGT wrote:

>Hi All,
>
>Is it possible to configure Argo to use the second sound card in my pc, I
>have no problem with Spec Lab but I can't do it with Argo. Has anyone done
>it? Is it possible? How?
>
>Thanks
>
>Regards,
>
>Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp
>
>
>
>.
>
>  
>



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From: Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ <k2ors@comcast.net>
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 LWCA LF Reflector <lowfer@lwca.org>
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WD2XGJ QRT for the ZL tests for the next two nights

--
73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
FN42hi


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I see that CFH is on tonight (137.0 kHz), and is rolling into Markus'
grabber.

John A.




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From: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org,  lowfer@lwca.org
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Jay and others...

VA7LF will commence hourly transmissions beginning at 0200UTC.  These 
transmissions will last ~25minutes and the will be FSK120 as we used last night.

We would like to listen on HF and LF for the remainder of the hour until our 
QSO sked which ZM2E begins at 0715UTC.

There will be NO 0700UTC transmission from us so we can begin listening for 
ZM2E.

Please be advised we could clearly hear (AM mode and enjoyed some Icelandic 
music!) the broadcast station on 189KHz last night and believe there is a 
possiblity of VE7->EU propagation.

73 VA7LF


 

 



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From: Steve Dove <dsp@hifidelity.com>
To: lowfer@lwca.org
Cc: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 04:54:43 -0000
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Watcha,

Yes, nasty spiky storm noise tonight, but VA7LF present on the 'Live Part 5' 
Grabulator, too.  Cool!

Watching for the ZeaLots with 'Grab II' as well.  Hope tmw is quieter.  DCF-39 is 
The Loudest it has been all season tonight.  Almost 'normal'.

        Cheers,

                Steve

http://www.w3eee.com


03/04/05 04:02:12, Dexter McIntyre W4DEX <dmcintyre@att.net> wrote:

>Scott Tilley, VE7TIL wrote:
>
>   Dex is seeing us
>
>Not bad considering the Part5 setup isn't optimum for very low signal 
>levels.  Also the present noise level is about 15 dB above a quiet night.
>
>Dex
>





-- 
Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.4.0 - Release Date: 02/22/05



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 20:11:45 -0900
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Nasty storm to the SW of me heading my way - sorry!

Laurence KL1X/5

>From: Steve Dove <dsp@hifidelity.com>
>Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
>To: lowfer@lwca.org
>CC: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
>Subject: LF: Re: [LW] VA7LF in CT?
>Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 04:54:43 -0000
>
>Watcha,
>
>Yes, nasty spiky storm noise tonight, but VA7LF present on the 'Live Part 
>5'
>Grabulator, too.  Cool!
>
>Watching for the ZeaLots with 'Grab II' as well.  Hope tmw is quieter.  
>DCF-39 is
>The Loudest it has been all season tonight.  Almost 'normal'.
>
>         Cheers,
>
>                 Steve
>
>http://www.w3eee.com
>
>
>03/04/05 04:02:12, Dexter McIntyre W4DEX <dmcintyre@att.net> wrote:
>
> >Scott Tilley, VE7TIL wrote:
> >
> >   Dex is seeing us
> >
> >Not bad considering the Part5 setup isn't optimum for very low signal
> >levels.  Also the present noise level is about 15 dB above a quiet night.
> >
> >Dex
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>--
>Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
>Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
>Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.4.0 - Release Date: 02/22/05
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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MarkusVester@aol.com schrieb:
> Hi Uwe and Teo,
>
> my current readouts from the 135.922 Eu window are
>  
>  923.00 (20:56 to 21:14) SM6BHZ testing?
>  922.14 YU7AR
>  921.80 DJ8WX 
>
> I have split the TA window to show 137.789 for Ed (strong on 788.75 till 
> 18:48) and Bob (wishful thinking ;-).
>
> At the moment I see YU7DP in QSO with DK1IS near 137.710 DFCW.
>
> Best of luck again
>
> Markus
>
>
> In einer eMail vom 03.03.2005 23:08:22 Westeuropäische Normalzeit schreibt 
> yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu: 
>
> > Hello jannsen,
> > 
> > Thursday, March 3, 2005, 7:43:09 PM, you wrote:
> > 
> > j> DJ8WX transmitting on 135,9223kHz QRSS60
> > 
> > 
> > Uwe ,you are on 135.2219 see on DF6NM graber, correct ??
> > 
> > GL, Teo
> > 
>
>
Markus and Teo,

yes, I detect it now. must have been the cat beeing at play with knobs 
and keys.

regards
Uwe/dj8wx/jo43sv



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Similar results to JA here.

View of static generator over Atlantic:

http://www.intellicast.com/Local/USNationalWide.asp?loc=usa&seg=LocalWeather&prodgrp=SatelliteImagery&product=World&prodnav=none

Jay, W1VD



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From: "james moritz" <j.r.moritz@herts.ac.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: LF: RE: PE1E Beginners questions /ELK639.
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Dear Peter, LF Group,

(still trying to catch up with my E-mails....)

********************************************************************
>From PE1E:-

Any other antenna suggestion for my ( top floor ) condo at 100' a.s.l. ?
BTW : I am forbidden to span a longwire on top of the building :-(

My first step was to buy a ( professional, be it vintage, all solid 
state ) LF receiver today.
And that's where my second question is about..

It is a Telefunken  ELK 639 with LF as from 9.8 Khz until 570 Khz in 5 
bands.
I wonder if any list member uses or has been using this Telefunken ELK 
639 as well...

...I am eager to learn about the possible experiences on this one.
E.g. : is its stability sufficient for the very narrow QRSS QSO's ?
Should I ( try to ) lock the LO's to my frequency reference ?
If this does make sense, I could ( try to ) lock my Schomandl ( with 
very low phase noise ) or HP 3336B to my e-11 HP frequency standard, 
thus ensuring ( more than - sic - ) sufficient frequency stability )...

Any comment and/or suggestion on the use of the ELK 639 for 136 Khz is 
most welcome.
Any other advices as well.

Thanks.
Peter, PE1E.
****************************************************************

I have an ELK639 RX and have used it on 136k - Selectivity is very good, and
you should have no problem with out-of-band QRM. It is also unusual in that
a wire or loop antenna can be connected to one of the various antenna inputs
directly, without requiring an external tuner or preamp to achieve good
sensitivity - the dedicated LF front end has been designed to do this.

Since it is a mechanically tuned, free-running oscillator, the stability is
not nearly as good as a synthesised receiver. But it is adequate for the
faster QRSS speeds like QRSS3, and similar "visual" modes. The RX has an
external oscillator input which you could use with an external synthesiser,
but to achieve a significant improvement in stability you would also have to
do something about the 525kHz BFO, which is also a free-running oscillator.
Or you could attach a synthesised receiver which tunes 525kHz to the IF
output. Strangely, the ELK639 does not have a product detector, it just
feeds the BFO signal into the AM detector - with AGC on, the IF signal into
the detector is too high for good demodulation. But provided you operate it
with the AGC off, audio gain turned up high, and just sufficient RF gain to
get good SNR, it works OK. This would definitely be something worth
modifying.

As far as antennas go, the problem with a receive antenna close to a
building is that the local QRM level is often very high due to noise picked
up from mains wiring. If this is the case, I would try active whip and/or
loop antennas in different positions around your apartment to try and find
the least noisy location - probably on the roof or balcony if you can get
access...

Good luck on 136k,

Cheers, Jim Moritz
73 de M0BMU


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Nil of VA7LF last night.
Saw Warren, WD2XGJ switching tx off around 2250z.
John, WD2XES started around 2245z. I captured 2 "XES" strings and then
I lost the signal in the noise.
During lowal dawn I copied Laurence, WD2XDW around 0600z this morning.
Overall it was a bit noisy here.
  
Captures can be seen here:

http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm
  


73
Hartmut Wolff
Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de  



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Steve McDonald" <jsm@gulfislands.com>
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References: <809825955.20050304180047@t-online.de>
Subject: [LW] ZM2E at VA7LF
Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 12:31:58 -0800
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We had no copy on the down under signal on their first transmission but
their second call was received at 100%. The cap shows "ZM2E ZM2E E" as
expected, with the 'E' being substituted for the longer 'K'. We acknowledged
with "VA7LF VA7LF Z E" but by then we were running out of darkness and
nothing further from them was heard. These all-nighters are a killer! One
more try tonight.

Steve / Scott / VA7LF

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--------------060604050905060505010206--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Fri,  4 Mar 2005 13:46:46 -0800
From: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org,  lowfer@lwca.org
Subject: [LW] Full ZM2E screen grab...
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We had AOS of ZM2E at ~1040UTC this morning.  LOS occured at 1148UTC.  We 
acknowledged but heard (saw) nothing in response as the sun came up here.

See:
http://www.scottboxx.com/radio_data/zm2e/zm2e00043.jpg

We'll post of actively schedule for the pre-ZM2E sked later today.

73 VA7LF






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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 17:16:33 -0500
Subject: [LW] Imagining zm2e
From: Mitch Powell <mitch.powell@sympatico.ca>
To: lowfer@lwca.org
CC: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Possible ? captures of ZM2E this morning just before
sunrise at London, ON.  Traces began at 1300Z and
continued until shortly before local sunrise.
I hope these are good - certainly not positive ID's
but do suggest another effort again tonight.

http://www3.sympatico.ca/mitch.powell/zm2e.htm

Mitch VE3OT 


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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Dear Group,<BR>
<BR>
Kp = 1 and CFH producing a fat band; TA must be wide open tonight. Activity from this end so far:<BR>
<BR>
 922.5&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; RU6LA (qrss 60)<BR>
 921.4/.9 PA0SE (dfcw 90)<BR>
<BR>
Good luck to all, especially for the ZL challenge<BR>
<BR>
Markus, DF6NM<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org,  lowfer@lwca.org
Subject: [LW] VA7LF schedule for tonight
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The following is VA7LF's pre-ZM2E QSO attempt schedule for tonight:

1) 0200 - 0500UTC -  200 second dot 'LF', this will last 'exactly' 30 minutes.
   On the half hours of the above we will revert to listening to assess        
conditions.

2) 0500 - 0700 UTC - ID and mode as above; however, we're on continously for EU 
sunrise. 

3) 0700 - ? - Begin QSO attempt by listening for ZM2E's signal start at 0715UTC.

NOTE: Some QSO details for listeners...

An 'E' by itself is an end of transimission like a 'K' in normal CW

Our/their callsign followed by a 'Z E' or 'V E' indicates we/they have been 
heard and the report sequence may begin.

The callsigns are repeated in full twice until contact is established. Then 
callsigns are abr. to their first letter... 

Reports are O,M,T,N as by standard EME convention.

Thanks for the reports!

73 VA7LF






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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Fri,  4 Mar 2005 17:10:33 -0800
From: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: lowfer@lwca.org, "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
Cc: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org,  lowfer@lwca.org
Subject: [LW] VA7LF quasi-grabber
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We will be posting our receiving sessions in the following directory.  We are 
starting our receive seesion before dark here with attempts at CFH, DCF-39 
etc...  The files will be named accordingly.

please see our previous email about our transmit schedule...

http://www.scottboxx.com/radio_data/zm2e/

73 VA7LF



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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Steve Dove <dsp@hifidelity.com>
To: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
Cc: lowfer@lwca.org,  rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: [LW] Re: ZM2E into W3EEE!?
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------020401070007090900050906
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Hi Scott,

Thanks for the prod!  Yes, on checking the captures there are smudges and 
some good whacks right on frequency;  quickie snapshot below, time frame of 
which is 1130z to 1136z.  I'd be delighted if you could correlate this against what 
you saw.  If you want I can e-mail you the best piccie.

Will be running 'Grab II' again tonight, too.  Seems much quieter, and DCF-39 
looks just as loud.

Good luck!

        Cheers,

                Steve


03/04/05 21:37:36, "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net> wrote:

>Steve
>
>We noted that the grabulator II may have seen a partial call from ZM2E this 
>morning.  Have a look at the grabs from it around 1100-1200UTC.  You will 
note 
>two bright hi/low sequences on frequency which correspond to our capture of 
>the '2' in their call very good levels. There appeared to be scraps of the 
>other part of the signal in there as well.
>
>73 VA7LF
>


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Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.4.0 - Release Date: 02/22/05

--------------020401070007090900050906--

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To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: Re: LF: Quartz Hill DX aspirations
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Hi LF,

On Fri, 4 Mar 2005, Vernall wrote:
> 
> There is about 3 hours of mutual dark path between ZL and RU6, and 
>the distance is some 16,500 km.  For listeners west of ZL the only 
>reliable time I can advise that ZM2E will be transmitting is from 1515
>UTC,when we make a call for RU6LA using FSK60 with frequencies 
>137.7890/137.7886 kHz (0.4 Hz shift) and content ZM2E ZM2E E, which 
>will take 36 minutes.  RU6LA will use the same frequencies and shift, and 
>could reply using FSK120 from 1551 UTC.  European listeners could 
>monitor events with a single Argo screen.  The mutual dark path ends 
>around 1800 UTC with sunrise at Quartz Hill.

RU6LA is up to 30 dB over noise with bandwidth 0.04 Hz but nothing from
ZL.

73 de RA9MB/Alex
http://www.qsl.net/ra9mb




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From: Dexter McIntyre W4DEX <dmcintyre@att.net>
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Subject: Re: LF: TA 4/5 Feb
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Reviving signals on 922.5 and 923 at sunset in NC.

http://w4dex.com/argo/135khz.html

Dex


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From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9_Manuel?= <jpradoes@telefonica.net>
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Subject: LF: XDW last night
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Hi Laurence and all:

Nice signals from XDW last night, best capture near my local sunrise.

73 de José, EA1PX, loc IN53ti


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CiiigAooooA//9k=
--------------010504060000010309030205--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Here's a copy of earlier post without attachments - maybe this one will
make it through ;~)

TA enthusiasts

Condx started off at 2330Z looking promising for SM6BHZ and RU6LA but
never got more than bits and pieces and no full call signs.  The past
few nights best TA copy occured around 2330 - 0230Z. Will be monitoring
again tonight.

http://www.advancedreceiver.com/capture/135922030505A.jpg

http://www.advancedreceiver.com/capture/135922030505B.jpg

Nothing seen from ZM here but VA7LF solid copy.

Jay, W1VD



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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TA enthusiasts

No EU TA to report - reception likely affected by static from large
storm over the Atlantic ;~{

Monitored through 0600Z then switched over to ZM2E/VA7LK. Will be
looking for EU TA again tonight if stations are active.

Jay, W1VD




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
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Looks like some TA fragments are making it across...

http://www.advancedreceiver.com/pageVD12.html

Jay, W1VD


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Big signal again yesterday evening 579 on 137.7khz, 
also saw HA6PC attempting to work RU6LA.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>De Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Heard RU6LA yesterday evening about 2100 utc on 
137.7 khz approx. He was on QRS but about 579 and would have been suitable for a 
CW qso. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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<!doctype html public "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<html><head><style type="text/css"><!--
blockquote, dl, ul, ol, li { padding-top: 0 ; padding-bottom: 0 }
 --></style><title>LM 05, Varberg longwave seminar
June/July</title></head><body>
<div><font color="#000000">Hi, longwave people from Carl Walde, LW 05
chairman, with my apologies for duplicate messages:</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><br></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><br></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><b>The Varberg Longwave Conference LW 05
will be held in late June/early July 2005.</b></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><b><br></b></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">The Nordic Radio Society, the Grimeton
World Heritage Foundation and AerotechTelub are very pleased to
confirm that the NRS/SAQ Longwave Seminar LW 05, earlier nicknamed VLF
05, will be held as announced 30 June - 2 July 2005 at Campus Varberg,
Sweden. In addition, a tutorial in longwave propagation and technology
will be held starting on 29 June. You may also want book the Sunday, 3
July, for participation in the Alexander Day and the rare event of
on-the-air operation of SAQ, the Grimeton Alexanderson Alternator
transmitter, which was declared a World Heritage in 2004.</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><br></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">This mail contains my introduction and a
condensed version of the first invitation and call for papers. Please
download the invitation and forms from the LW 05 website
http://www.alexander.n.se/longwaveconference.htm which will be updated
regularly.</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><br></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">As this is the first longwave meeting for
years, we kindly ask you to forward this mail, the wider the
better.</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><br></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><u><br></u></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><b>LW 05 INTRODUCTION<br>
</b>from chairman Carl who has been involved in the SAQ business for
decades as manager of the navy telecom division and of the defence
radio division in FMV, the Swedish defence materiel
administration.<br>
&nbsp;</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">At the seventh Nordic HF conference HF 04
on Fårö (http://www.nordichf.org) we spread the news that SAQ, the
80-year old Grimeton VLF station, had been added to the Unesco World
Heritage List. Then, an idea came up to run a long overdue longwave
reunion in Varberg and SAQ. As far as we know there have not been any
VLF meetings since 1992 (York and AGARD Paris).<br>
&nbsp;<br>
Advance information was sent out by email and websites early Autumn
2004. We have received some but not fully reassuring interest. To keep
costs within limits, two foundations will organise a lower-profile 2-3
day seminar beginning at lunchtime Thursday 30 June. The seminar will
cover communications and navigation systems on ELF, VLF, LF and
include a visit to Grimeton with SAQ running on dummy load. If LW 05
will turn our favourably, we will launch LW 08 as a full conference,
HF 04 style.<br>
&nbsp;<br>
LW 05 which will be a scientific and professional event; i. e. with a
fee for taking part. By that statement I do not think that radio
amateurs involved in LF are non-professionals, rather the contrary.
The seminar fee will be about euro 750 including meals, excluding
lodging. The fee for the tutorial will be euro 190. Post-graduate
university students pay half. Family members are welcome (no pay).<br>
&nbsp;</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">For the preceding tutorial we are in the
process of finding literature and lecturers, from industry too. I
would like to receive suitable names. However, we will not be able to
pay those a formidable fee, but good company in good surroundings, and
free registration. Pse help.</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><br></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><b>PRELIMINARY SCHEDULE</b></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">Wednesday&nbsp; 29
June&nbsp;<x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </x-tab>Lunch, tutorial,
seminar registration, evening free</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">Thursday 30
June<x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</x-tab><x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</x-tab>Tutorial/registration, lunch, sessions, exhibitors' party<br>
Friday 1 July<x-tab>&nbsp;
</x-tab><x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</x-tab>Sessions, visit to SAQ, seminar dinner</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">Saturday&nbsp; 2
July<x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</x-tab><x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</x-tab>Sessions, lunch, sessions incl SAQ 80 year
celebration</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">Sunday 3 July<x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;
</x-tab><x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</x-tab>Alexanderson Day</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><br></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><b>LW 05 SCOPE<br>
</b>The Nordic Radio Society foundation (cooperating with SNRV, the
Swedish National Committee of URSI, by stimulating industry,
universities and administrations to keep up their competence and work
together) and the Grimeton World Heritage foundation will sponsor the
first Varberg longwave seminar on radio and radionavigation systems,
but not mother nature emissions such as whistlers. Topics of interest
include:</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; user
requirements and experience<br>
-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; interoperability issues<br>
-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; role in network centric
warfare<br>
-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; propagation studies and
modelling<br>
-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; interference and noise<br>
-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; modulation, coding and link
control<br>
-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; network architecture and
coverage<br>
-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; equipment and
systems</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
software defined radio concepts<br>
-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; multimedia access and
applications<br>
-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; digital broadcast (incl MF)<br>
-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; electronic warfare</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
simulation, modelling and evaluation</font><br>
</div>
<div><font color="#000000">We emphasize the importance of
contributions from users, either as experience from the operation of
existing systems or as requirements for new systems. Technology is not
self-sufficient; there has to be a demand from the organisations that
in the end actually will operate the technology.</font><br>
</div>
<div><font color="#000000"><b>CALL FOR PAPERS</b></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">We look forward to your seminar<b>
contributions not later than March 24</b> (papers or abstracts, any
formatting). Please use the Submission form.<br>
&nbsp;</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><b>SHOW INTEREST TO EXHIBIT AND TO RECEIVE
FINAL INVITATION</b></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">by e-mail to<u>
winnie.svensson@aerotechtelub.se</u>.<br>
<br>
<b>OR REGISTER EARLY</b></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">Please register not later than Wednesday 8
June. Please use the Registration form (download from LW 05
mebsite).</font><br>
</div>
<div><font color="#000000">Participants are registered in the order of
invoice payment. Cancellation&nbsp; conditions are stated on the
registration form. No Internet registration, full signature needed,
invoices and receips for credit card payment will be
mailed.</font><br>
</div>
<div><font color="#000000"><b>LW 05 ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICE<br>
</b>Ms. Winnie Svensson &lt;winnie.svensson@aerotechtelub.se&gt;<br>
LW 05 Secretariat<br>
AerotechTelub<br>
SE-351 80 VAXJO<br>
Sweden<br>
Phone +46 470 42119</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">Fax +46 470 42042</font><br>
</div>
<div><font color="#000000"><b>VENUE</b></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">Varberg campus is situated in the city
center very close to the railway station, the Denmark ferry terminal,
free parking, hotels, cafés, handicraft and art stores, swimming and
spa facilities and the old fortress. Town of Varberg website is
http://www.varberg.se (click Union Jack).</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><u><br></u></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><b>LODGING</b></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">We have pre-booked rooms in hotel Fregatten
(the Frigate) in the campus area (+46 340 677000, fax 611121,
fregatten@comfort.choicehotels.se,
http://www.comforthotelfregatten.se). Refer to LW 05 for discounted
rate.</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><br></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">The youth hostel is in the fortress&nbsp;
(+46 340 88788, fax 627000, vandrarhem@turist.varberg.se,
http://www.turist.varberg.se/vandrarhem). Other alternatives may be
booked through the Varberg tourist office (+46 340 86800, fax 86807,
turist@varberg.se, http://www.turist.varberg.se).</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><br></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">You had better<b> find your lodging
early</b>, as Varberg is a popular summer town.</font><br>
</div>
<div><font color="#000000"><b>TRAVEL<br>
</b>Varberg is situated by the European highway E6, about 70 kms south
of Gothenburg and about 200 kms north of Copenhagen/Kastrup/Malmö,
and is also served by a car ferry from Grenå in Denmark.<br>
&nbsp;<br>
Suitable airports are Halmstad, Gothenburg/Landvetter, Malmö/Sturup
and Copenhagen/Kastrup.</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">&nbsp;</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">Stopping trains go from Kastrup airport
over the Sound bridge direct to Varberg; X2000 express trains run
between Malmö, Halmstad, Varberg and Gothenburg.</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><u><br></u></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><b>IMPORTANT DATES<br>
</b>Thursday 24 March<x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</x-tab>Contributions (papers or abstracts) received</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">Monday 11 April<x-tab> </x-tab>Invitation
with preliminary programme, authors contacted, invoicing</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">Friday 3 June<x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;
</x-tab>Full paper submission<br>
Wednesday 8 June<x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp; </x-tab>Registration official
stop<br>
Wednesday 29 June<x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </x-tab>Tutorial<br>
Thursday 30 June&nbsp;&nbsp;<x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</x-tab>Seminar opening<br>
Sunday 3 July<x-tab>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </x-tab>Alexanderson Day<br>
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<span
></span>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<br>
<b>LW 05 - A MEETING POINT<br>
</b>Conferences are important venues where users, scientists,
engineers and manufacturers meet and have the opportunity to discuss
both needs and solutions. We welcome authors, participants, exhibitors
and companions to Varberg, SAQ and LW 05. We will meet in an excellent
conference theatre, in an interesting exhibition, in the internet
café, at SAQ and in the summer resort of Varberg, well suited to you
and your family.</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000"><br>
&nbsp;</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">In look forward to seeing you in Varberg
and Grimeton and I wish you very welcome,</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">&nbsp;</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">Carl Walde</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">LW 05 chairman</font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">info@walde.se or sm5bf@ssa.se</font> or
sm5bf@arrl.org</div>
<div><font color="#000000"><br></font></div>
<div><font color="#000000">----------------</font></div>
</body>
</html>

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From: "captbrian" <captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <4225CA7F.15619.BBCBA7@localhost> <6.1.0.6.2.20050302162804.02a13ea0@mail.casema.nl> <1109779478.4225e41606d62@webmail2.kuleuven.be> <6.1.0.6.2.20050303113502.02cf20b0@mail.casema.nl> <001f01c52032$6a008600$c401a8c0@quaycustomer> <005e01c52032$f808b120$45b80150@p2300> <000801c52033$f3cf09a0$e901a8c0@bob2l2u6k2n1g3>
Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 11:26:32 -0000
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Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: Quartz Hill DX aspirations
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1" http-equiv=Content-Type>
<META content="MSHTML 5.00.2614.3500" name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Ah it is a matter of choice rather than lack of 
facility. I approve.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>&nbsp;Winlink is a system for email by HF radio for 
offshore sailing hams.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Bryan</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr 
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV 
  style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
  <A href="mailto:vernall@xtra.co.nz" title=vernall@xtra.co.nz>Vernall</A> 
</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A 
  href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org" 
  title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, March 03, 2005 8:59 
  PM</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> LF: Re: Re: Quartz Hill DX 
  aspirations</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Bryan G3GVN,</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I do not know about Winlink, but&nbsp;no 'net 
  access at Quartz Hill means&nbsp;we&nbsp;attempt any QSO entirely by 
  radio.</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV>
  <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr 
  style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
    <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
    <DIV 
    style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
    <A href="mailto:captbrian@ukonline.co.uk" 
    title=captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>captbrian</A> </DIV>
    <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A 
    href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org" 
    title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> </DIV>
    <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, March 04, 2005 9:52 
    AM</DIV>
    <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> LF: Re: Quartz Hill DX 
    aspirations</DIV>
    <DIV><BR></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Do you know about Winlink. Email by Amateur 
    Radio.? It would give you email access without landline. If not I'll send 
    details</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=3>Bryan G3GVB</FONT></DIV>
    <BLOCKQUOTE 
    style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
      <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
      <DIV 
      style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
      <A href="mailto:vernall@xtra.co.nz" title=vernall@xtra.co.nz>Vernall</A> 
      </DIV>
      <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A 
      href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org" 
      title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> </DIV>
      <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, March 03, 2005 8:48 
      PM</DIV>
      <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> LF: Quartz Hill DX 
      aspirations</DIV>
      <DIV><BR></DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>
      <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>There is no 'net access at Quartz Hill so 
      this could be my last email session till 6 March.</FONT></DIV>
      <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></FONT></DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV>
      <DIV><FONT face=Arial 
size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
To: "LF-Group" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>, 
 "Lowfer \(LWCA\)" <lowfer@lwca.org>
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Hi All, a delayed message from Scot (re ZL<>VE tests) brought this to mind
again. If stations advising of transmitting schedules would put in the Date
as well as times there would be less chance for ambiguity in the case of a
delayed delivery through the reflector. I read messages from Scot via the
LWCA reflector last night (4th) but they only arrived via the RSGB LF
reflector this afternoon (1500z 5th). I happen to know the timings given are
for the just completed tests but someone not subscribing to the LW refector
might think it referred to the 5th.

Good work. Conditions were good but not outstanding, it is a pity you did
not make it, but then if it was all easy it wouldnt be worth the effort (??)

Cheers de Alan G3NYK



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Sat, 05 Mar 2005 17:50:05 -0000
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This morning, I worked a new station for me (No:103), DL3ZID. He 
first called me on DFCW3, but was impossible to read. He then changed 
to QRSS3 which was an improvement, but not 100%. A change to QRSS10 
gave a really clear easy-to-read signal. I took screenshots which are 
on my web site, and these clearly show the difference between the 
three modes. With marginal signals, I believe that DFCW is slightly 
poorer than QRSS at the same dot length, because of the added 
complication of the two frequencies, each of which may have QRM that 
might be a 'dot'. 

I think this may be the first time that these three modes have been 
compared in this way with a 'live' marginal signal. If DL3ZID reads 
this reflector, my thanks for the QSO and for the opportunity for 
this comparison.

See the pics at:
http://lf.apersonalguide.co.uk

Mike, G3XDV
===========





From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
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Hi Mike, Mmmm I think it might be "horses for courses" on this one. I
suspect it would depend mainly on the type of noise. I am finding that for
instance John WD2XES and Warren WD2XGJ are transmitting close to one another
and are only about 30 miles apart, so the fading is similar. With lots of
snow on the 30sec slow ARGO screen John is easier to decode with DFCW  than
Warren (QRSS) whose gaps are often filled by the "snow". Certainly the
"slope" of ARGO detection is very steep. I have done some local tests and I
estimate that, with normal band noise, there is only a 3dB difference in
signal level needed to go between "T" and "O". The swap from QRSS3 to QRSS10
is an advantage of about 3dB also. It does point to picking the right mode
for the path, and the conditions.

Cheers de Alan G3NYK

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 05 March 2005 17:50
Subject: LF: Slow mode comparisons


> This morning, I worked a new station for me (No:103), DL3ZID. He
> first called me on DFCW3, but was impossible to read. He then changed
> to QRSS3 which was an improvement, but not 100%. A change to QRSS10
> gave a really clear easy-to-read signal. I took screenshots which are
> on my web site, and these clearly show the difference between the
> three modes. With marginal signals, I believe that DFCW is slightly
> poorer than QRSS at the same dot length, because of the added
> complication of the two frequencies, each of which may have QRM that
> might be a 'dot'.
>
> I think this may be the first time that these three modes have been
> compared in this way with a 'live' marginal signal. If DL3ZID reads
> this reflector, my thanks for the QSO and for the opportunity for
> this comparison.
>
> See the pics at:
> http://lf.apersonalguide.co.uk
>
> Mike, G3XDV
> ===========
>
>
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Mike,

   going from QRSS3 to QRSS10, when using Argo, means that the FFT bin 
size is 4 times
smaller, and this results in an increase of 6 dB of SNR, provided the 
useful signal is still
confined into a single bin. If you are in "experimentation mode", you 
could also arrange
a comparison between QRSSxx and Jason at various speed. That could be 
interesting.

73  Alberto  I2PHD
---------------------------------

Mike Dennison wrote:

>This morning, I worked a new station for me (No:103), DL3ZID. He 
>first called me on DFCW3, but was impossible to read. He then changed 
>to QRSS3 which was an improvement, but not 100%. A change to QRSS10 
>gave a really clear easy-to-read signal. 
>  
>



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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Dear LF Noise-Diggers,<BR>
<BR>
Alan said:<BR>
&gt; The swap from QRSS3 to QRSS10 is an advantage of about 3dB also.<BR>
<BR>
Alberto said:<BR>
&gt; the FFT bin size is 4 times smaller, and this results in an increase of 6 dB of SNR.<BR>
<BR>
My half-penny's worth is that the transmitted energy per symbol is 3.3 times larger, giving exactly 5.23 dB improvement ;-) That's assuming that the FFT bandwidth is somewhere near the optimum (0.3 Hz and 0.1 Hz respectively). I'd go with Alan in that DFCW is more reliable than QRSS, even more so when comparing readability at a given WPM throughput.<BR>
<BR>
Selecting the right symbol time for an opening of limited duration is certainly intricate, as shown by last night's ZL-VA attempt. The peak SNR in Scott's image would probably have allowed higher speed, but how do we know if its going to be "short and strong" or "long and weak" tomorrow?<BR>
<BR>
Funny thing about the delay on this reflector; I got a pile of mail after 14:08 this afternoon.<BR>
<BR>
I wish you success and good luck.<BR>
<BR>
73 de Markus, DF6NM<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

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From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
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>    going from QRSS3 to QRSS10, when using Argo, means that the FFT bin
> size is 4 times
> smaller, and this results in an increase of 6 dB of SNR, provided the
> useful signal is still confined into a single bin. 
> 73  Alberto  I2PHD
> ---------------------------------

Of course. I was not suggesting there was something magical about 
slower speeds, or that QRSS10 should be used when signals are strong. 
It was just that here was a practical demonstration of the huge 
difference in readability on a signal that was just unreadable in 
QRSS3. I know the decibels - but here is what it looks like.

The downside is that the whole QSO took two hours!

Several people have defended DFCW as though I had attacked it. I was 
involved with the discussions when DFCW was first tested, and in 
suggesting some of the improvements made to it. For the record, I 
think DFCW is a very useful mode as it greatly speeds up throughput 
with similar S/N to QRSS. If you look at my pictures, though, you 
will see that on this particular occasion DFCW was slightly worse 
than QRSS.

Mike, G3XDV
http://lf.apersonalguide.co.uk
=====================




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MarkusVester@aol.com wrote:

> My half-penny's worth is that the transmitted energy per symbol is 3.3 
> times larger, giving exactly 5.23 dB improvement ;-) That's assuming 
> that the FFT bandwidth is somewhere near the optimum (0.3 Hz and 0.1 
> Hz respectively).

Markus,

  you are correct, but in an ideal situation. Given that for performance 
reasons the FFT works at its best when done
on a sample length which is a power of two, in Argo, when going from 
QRSS3 to QRSS10 I multiply the sample length
by four, which causes a reduction of four times of the bin size. This 
has the consequence that the noise energy that falls
into a single bin is 6 dB lower, hence the 6 dB gain in SNR.
There are algorithms to perform FFTs on arbitrary sizes, but they are 
slower than when working with powers of two.

73  Alberto  I2PHD




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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
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TA enthusiasts

Big static generator off Carolina coast affecting reception - tonight
may be a washout but will stick with it...

http://www.lightningstorm.com/tux/jsp/gpg/lex1/mapdisplay_free.jsp

Jay, W1VD



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Hi Markus and Alberto, yup my ball-park figure was a bit out....the old
mental arithmetic was not working too well then. My empirical tests showed
an approximately 10dB per decade improvement i.e. 3 sec to 30 sec is 10 dB,
which would tie in with your figures I think. Lyle Kohler's tests seemed to
show this line going close to the theoretical up to 120 sec dots. I guess
when it gets there the important thing is stability so you dont "shower" the
power into adjacent "boxes" so it gets lost in the noise.

This cold East wind we have been having recently really seems to have
produced a lot of noise. The lightning map shows that the only storms are
down in the central Med around Italy, but I have had to reduce the
sensitivity on my capture screen so that I dont think I will see John and
Warren it they active. May be we are getting noise from Jay's storm off the
Carolina coast

Cheers de Alan G3NYK

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 05 March 2005 18:08
Subject: LF: Re: Slow mode comparisons


>The swap from QRSS3 to QRSS10
> is an advantage of about 3dB also. It does point to picking the right mode
> for the path, and the conditions.
>
> Cheers de Alan G3NYK





From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Hi Alberto,<BR>
<BR>
a good time of the night to discuss this last 0.8 dB ;-) My reasoning was that when variing the FFT bandwidth around the optimum BW, the readability for a symbol should change only very slightly - otherwise it wouldn't be an optimum in the sense of a zero gradient of merit. If the BW is made a little too large, you do get some more noise but also benefit from a fractional bit of incoherent averaging; on the other hand if it's too small you only gently start to decrease the signal more than the noise. Even at constant receive BW one gains by transmitting slower, eg. 5s instead of 3s DFCW dashes.<BR>
<BR>
73<BR>
de Markus, DF6NM<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In einer eMail vom 06.03.2005 01:13:58 Westeuropäische Normalzeit schreibt dibene@usa.net: <BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">MarkusVester@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
&gt;My half-penny's worth is that the transmitted energy per symbol is 3.3 <BR>
&gt;times larger, giving exactly 5.23 dB improvement ;-) That's assuming <BR>
&gt;that the FFT bandwidth is somewhere near the optimum (0.3 Hz and 0.1 <BR>
&gt;Hz respectively).<BR>
<BR>
Markus,<BR>
<BR>
 you are correct, but in an ideal situation. Given that for performance <BR>
reasons the FFT works at its best when done<BR>
on a sample length which is a power of two, in Argo, when going from <BR>
QRSS3 to QRSS10 I multiply the sample length<BR>
by four, which causes a reduction of four times of the bin size. This <BR>
has the consequence that the noise energy that falls<BR>
into a single bin is 6 dB lower, hence the 6 dB gain in SNR.<BR>
There are algorithms to perform FFTs on arbitrary sizes, but they are <BR>
slower than when working with powers of two.<BR>
<BR>
73&nbsp; Alberto&nbsp; I2PHD<BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Hi Alan and LF Group,<BR>
<BR>
the noise on the colour DF looks like a green background (distant crackle from ~260°, Central Atlantic?), with some distinct yellow crashes on top (180°, Italy?) - all in all a rather typical constellation I have seen during many nights, especially at times of good long-range propagation. What seems unusual tonight is the overwhelming intensity of Luxembourg effect on DCF39.<BR>
<BR>
73 and good night<BR>
<BR>
Markus<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In einer eMail vom 06.03.2005 02:05:10 Westeuropäische Normalzeit schreibt Alan.Melia@btinternet.com: <BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">This cold East wind we have been having recently really seems to have<BR>
produced a lot of noise. The lightning map shows that the only storms are<BR>
down in the central Med around Italy, but I have had to reduce the<BR>
sensitivity on my capture screen so that I dont think I will see John and<BR>
Warren it they active. May be we are getting noise from Jay's storm off the<BR>
Carolina coast<BR>
<BR>
Cheers de Alan G3NYK<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi all,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I've had a quick look through bulletins but I'm too 
tired (from being up for two nights in a row) to go through them in detail for 
those wanting to find out if they received any of the ZM2E transmissions.&nbsp; 
For information, we had partial success with trying to work VA7LF and RU6LA, but 
no claims for two-way contacts.&nbsp;&nbsp;We see that VA7LF got some reception 
of ZM2E but we did not get anything useful from VA7LF, on either night.&nbsp; 
</FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2>So that listeners can use timing information to 
check their saved files, the following are times when ZM2E transmitted on 5 
March:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>ZM2E&nbsp;sent "N E" at 60 second dot length 
(FSK60) (5 minutes duration) at the following times on 5 March:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>0955 UTC</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2>1052 UTC</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2>1123 UTC</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2>1154 UTC</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2>1228 UTC</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2>1254 UTC</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>1325 UTC</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>1356 UTC</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>ZM2E&nbsp;sent N E E&nbsp;at 60 second dot length 
(FSK60) at 1427 UTC.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>After that we changed to trying to work RU6LA.&nbsp; We were mostly 
listening for RU6LA, but at 1552 UTC we transmitted ZM2E with FSK120, and it was 
our sunrise&nbsp;part way through that.&nbsp; Before that we got quite good 
reception of RU6LA QRSS120, with M grade copy of part of the call sign.&nbsp; We 
understand that RU6LA got some useful reception of our transmission on 5 
March.&nbsp; Pics will be available in due course.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT lang=2 
face=Arial size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" 
PTSIZE="10">&nbsp;</DIV></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML>

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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi all</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Lots of acty yesterday.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>RA3YO and RU6LA booming in all evening also EA1PX 
plus a lot of others.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>All active on QRS but would be workable on CW with 
me.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
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The Carolina static generator began dissipating around 0500Z - not in
time to save the overnight session. No reception to report.

Will watch again tonight, although K=4 at the moment.

Jay, W1VD



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Sorry for this utterly useless message ...
73, Wolf DL4YHF
(no LF activity this weekend due to half a meter of snow in the driveway 
to DF0WD !)


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Dear LF Group,<BR>
<BR>
after some searching, I have found an interesting, quasi-realtime lightning map. It is on the website of the WWLL (World Wide Lightning Location) network:<BR>
<A HREF="http://flash.ess.washington.edu/">http://flash.ess.washington.edu/</A> <BR>
<BR>
They do not claim the sub-kilometer accuracy of some of the commercial networks, but they have a nice global display updating every 10 minutes. The data is based on correlated VLF receivers (TOGA = time of group arrival), and the published spectrograms are also pretty impressive.<BR>
<BR>
It has been quiet on this reflector today, hope its working.<BR>
<BR>
Have fun, 73<BR>
<BR>
Markus, DF6NM<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 15:52:35 -0500
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Markus

Thanks for the link...

Things are much quieter here this afternoon - by this time yesterday it
sounded like summertime.

Will be checking your grabber for any TA activity.

Jay, W1VD


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <MarkusVester@aol.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Sunday, March 06, 2005 3:38 PM
Subject: LF: WWLL Global Lightning Map


> Dear LF Group,
>
> after some searching, I have found an interesting, quasi-realtime
lightning
> map. It is on the website of the WWLL (World Wide Lightning Location)
network:
> http://flash.ess.washington.edu/
>
> They do not claim the sub-kilometer accuracy of some of the commercial
> networks, but they have a nice global display updating every 10
minutes. The data is
> based on correlated VLF receivers (TOGA = time of group arrival), and
the
> published spectrograms are also pretty impressive.
>
> It has been quiet on this reflector today, hope its working.
>
> Have fun, 73
>
> Markus, DF6NM
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Added captures of EA1PX, DL3ZID, DL2HRE, F6BWO, G3XIZ and ON7ZO to my
website:

http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm



  
Hartmut Wolff
Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: Re: LF: Re: WWLL Global Lightning Map
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Jay Rusgrove schrieb:
> Markus
>
> Thanks for the link...
>
> Things are much quieter here this afternoon - by this time yesterday it
> sounded like summertime.
>
> Will be checking your grabber for any TA activity.
>
> Jay, W1VD
>
Hi Jay,
DJ8WX is on 135,9203kHz mode JASON SLOW.
regards
Uwe/dj8wx/jo43sv


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "T Coll" <tcollins88@comcast.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: LF: Re: Re: WWLL Global Lightning Map
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Hi All - What a Great Link -
Thank You !

Regards;
Tom Collind
N0QAZ
Greeley CO US
tcollins88@comcast.net

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Sunday, March 06, 2005 1:52 PM
Subject: LF: Re: WWLL Global Lightning Map


> Markus
> 
> Thanks for the link...
> 
> Things are much quieter here this afternoon - by this time yesterday it
> sounded like summertime.
> 
> Will be checking your grabber for any TA activity.
> 
> Jay, W1VD
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: <MarkusVester@aol.com>
> To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: Sunday, March 06, 2005 3:38 PM
> Subject: LF: WWLL Global Lightning Map
> 
> 
> > Dear LF Group,
> >
> > after some searching, I have found an interesting, quasi-realtime
> lightning
> > map. It is on the website of the WWLL (World Wide Lightning Location)
> network:
> > http://flash.ess.washington.edu/
> >
> > They do not claim the sub-kilometer accuracy of some of the commercial
> > networks, but they have a nice global display updating every 10
> minutes. The data is
> > based on correlated VLF receivers (TOGA = time of group arrival), and
> the
> > published spectrograms are also pretty impressive.
> >
> > It has been quiet on this reflector today, hope its working.
> >
> > Have fun, 73
> >
> > Markus, DF6NM
> >
> 
> 
> 


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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>Hi Jay,
>DJ8WX is on 135,9203kHz mode JASON SLOW.
>regards
>Uwe/dj8wx/jo43sv

Uwe

Sorry,  no copy - just gibberish...

Condx much quieter last night but propagation not up to the task.

Will continue to check DF6NM grabber and run captures if TA activity is
present.

Jay, W1VD




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: LF: RU6's LF FD operation March 1-6
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Dear LF enthusiasts,

Summary info abt RU6's LF Field Day operation at March 1...6
(South-Eastern part of Eu Russia - QTH Machta - QTH-loc: KN97LN -
mobile FD shack-van - http://136.73.ru/ed/index.htm)

MARCH 1
Restoration of the LF TX aerial (the vertical part of TX ANT is
damaged in time of a very strong wind of February 28 - speed up
to 35-37m/sec - it is a lot HAM's aerials is damaged in our region)
No my beacon from 1430z till 1830 for ZLs
Grabber in 60s mode at 137.7813...7780 from 20z
Propagation bad - some traces on freqs WD2XES and WD2XGJ after 1z,
but NO IDs
The noise are higher +6...10db than usually
DCF39's level abt -6db than usually (QRB abt 2000km)
Temp +3...-3(night) degr C,  wind 8..12m/sec

MARCH 2
The new LF TX aerial is restored
Start beacon ("RU6LA" QRSS60) on abt 137.7889 (from 14z till 1834z)
Current in the TX aerial 3.1 A
The noise are higher abt +6db than usually
Make some CQs in QRSS3 after 19z - some signals in QRSS3 - but very noisy
Visual in EU range: S57A(O), YU7AR(O, S6), RA3YO(O, S6), DK1IS(O, S2),
?ZO (T/O - sri ON7ZO calling me), some NO IDs
Propagation is not so good
DCF39's level abt -6db than usually
Grabber in 60s mode at 137.7813...7780 from 22z
Propagation bad - some traces on freqs WD2XES and WD2XGJ after 1z
March 3, but NO IDs
Temp +6...-1(night) degr C,  wind 0..5m/sec

MARCH 3
Start beacon ("RU6LA" QRSS120) on abt 137.7888 (from 1430z till 1846z)
Current in the TX aerial 2.4-3.2 A (very windy - TX Big Vertical close comes
nearer to a tower)
Visual in EU range after 19z: YU7AR(very low - M/O in 3sec mode 1945z),
RA3YO O FB all times, nothing anybody
Make some CQs in QRSS3 - nil
Very noisy - propagation is bad
DCF39's level abt -10...12db than usually
Grabber in 60s mode at 137.7813...7780 from 2130z
Some traces on freq WD2XES and very clear some XES's dots and dash
from 0135z till abt 2z March 4 - nil at other times
Temp +2...-4(night) degr C,  wind 6..30m/sec

MARCH 4
7z the blizzard began and wind continues, temperature abt -3
Make BOG abt 4km long to ZL - copper wire diam 0.3mm
Visual in 120s mode 137.788 - .7895 after 14z - some traces on freq
ZM2E's but NO ID
Start "RU6LA" QRSS120 on 137.7889 from 1530z till 1620z (TX freq is
down to 137.78875 because of temperature in FD shack is down)
Current in the TX aerial 2.8-3 A
Visual in 120s mode 137.788 - .7895 after 1620z - some traces on freq
ZM2E's but NO ID
After 1830z CQ in CW on 136.6 abt 45min - only YU7AR QSO 559/559
After 1915z CQ in QRSS3, but only RA3YO reply
Very noisy and NO any QRM lines on scren (!)
DCF39's level abt -12...15db than usually
Start beacon "RU6LA" QRSS60 on 135.9225 from 22z till 0440z March 5
(abt 2z TX freq down .9223 because of temperature in FD shack is down
and at the end of TX abt 4z the freq became again .9225)
Temp -1...-6(night) degr C,  wind 8..12m/sec

MARCH 5
RA3YO start on 137.703 abt 0830z - very strong
Visual in 120s mode 137.788 - .7895 after 1330z - abt 14..1415z some
traces on ZM2E's(?) freq - NO ID
Start "RU6LA" QRSS120 on 137.7888 from 1515z till 1550z
Visual in 120s mode 137.788 - .7895 after 1550z till 1630z - nil
Start "RU6LA" QRSS120 on 137.7888 from 1630z till 1745z
Visual in 120s mode 137.788 - .7895 after 1745z till 1830z - some
traces on ZM2E's freq - NO ID
1840z start activity in EU range: OH5UFO O in QSO with DL3ZID O/M
DFC39's level is normal
The propagation to Europe began after 1950z - F6BWO (O/M in 3sec
mode !), HA6PC (O), YU7DP(O/M), DL2HRE(O), ON6ND?(T/M)
Start beacon "RU6LA"  QRSS60 on 135.9227 from 23z
Abt 4z March 6 my freq is down to 135.9225)

The equipments:
RX - BOG 1.7km to EU, BOG abt 4km to ZL (copper wire diam 0.3mm),
RF amlifiers, electromechanical filter (wide 2.1kHz, 136.775kHz
center), Kenwood TS-850, ARGO Ver 1 build 134 by Alberto I2PHD

TX - Big Vertical with H effective abt 70m, PA abt 100W Output - current
in the TX aerial abt 2.4-3.2A (various at different weather and wind)
DDS VFO, QRS 4.01 by Rik ON7YD

I have looked argocaps of Dex W4DEX and Jay W1VD is my signals (astable
and coincides on times on mine argocaps) - I believe that the first
receptions of Russia in USA! - I congratulate both!
QRB abt 9016km (W4DEX) and 8066km (W1VD)
Way Russia - Northern America very difficult through auroal oval

Later I shall do a page on my wwww with all interesting captures - request
to send files of my signal

TNX for efforts to all!

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<DIV>Thank you - I like it !</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>73 de Pat g4gvw</DIV></FONT></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hi Mike and all,

yes i read this reflector. Many thanks too for spend two hours time for the qso 
and the screenshots. My locator is JO53PO. 

Eberhard, DL3ZID 


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Jay Rusgrove schrieb:
> >Hi Jay,
> >DJ8WX is on 135,9203kHz mode JASON SLOW.
> >regards
> >Uwe/dj8wx/jo43sv
>
> Uwe
>
> Sorry,  no copy - just gibberish...
>
> Condx much quieter last night but propagation not up to the task.
>
> Will continue to check DF6NM grabber and run captures if TA activity is
> present.
>
> Jay, W1VD
>
>
>
Hello Jay,

no matter what the average ionospheric conditions are DJ8WX will 
transmit on 135,922 kHz mode QRSS30 beginning at plus/minus 2200UTC.
I hope some meaningful signs instead of "gibberish" will appear on the 
screen of your PC.

regards
Uwe/dj8wx/jo43sv



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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi All</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Is there anyone on LF interested in a CWR effort 
(cw revival). Most of those active presently on QRS are perfectly audible with 
me and certainly workable on CW. I have not heard anyone on normal CW for a long 
time.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>QRS seems to have taken over completely on LF to 
the detriment of CW.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
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> Is there anyone on LF interested in a CWR effort (cw revival). Most of
> those active presently on QRS are perfectly audible with me and
> certainly workable on CW. I have not heard anyone on normal CW for a
> long time. QRS seems to have taken over completely on LF to the
> detriment of CW. 73 de Mal/G3KEV

There is CW activity most days, and certainly every Saturday and 
Sunday. In a short period yesterday, I heard CW from F6BWO and DL1EIE 
and had a QSO myself. Perhaps it's about time you joined in.

Mike, G3XDV
==========


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Dear Mal,

Monday, March 7, 2005 you wrote:

hm> Hi All
hm> Is there anyone on LF interested in a CWR effort (cw
hm> revival). Most of those active presently on QRS are perfectly
hm> audible with me and certainly workable on CW. I have not heard
hm> anyone on normal CW for a long time.
hm> QRS seems to have taken over completely on LF to the detriment of CW.
hm> 73 de Mal/G3KEV

In the following LF activity I specially shall do with you sked in CW 

maybe 3 or 2 nights next weekend (MAR 11-13) or MAR 18-20

I'll inform you

In January 2005 I have carried out only 3 CW QSO ;-(((  but I have noticed,
that now in the basic CW QSOs will carry out after QRSS QSO on the same
frequency (in 137.7kHz range)

I listen to you in CW!

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru



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From: "Michael Peters" <m.peters@peters-placke.de>
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hi group,

now my transmitter is working...

if i can match my groundplane i hope i can transmit on next
saturday my first signals on 137kc (danmark - island römö)

yesterday say an other om there is a loran-tx on the island of sylt...
is it correct? is it possible to recieve sigs so nearly? distance from
my holiday qth to sylt is only a few kilometers...

have any information about this?



73 michael dk5na



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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Hello Michael,<BR>
<BR>
the coordinates of the Sylt Loran station are 54° 48' 29.975" N, 8° 17' 36.856" E. This is on the southern part of the island, and ranges to Romoe vary from 32 to 46 km. The nominal peak power of the pulses is 250 kW on 100 kHz, so you will have to expect a fieldstrength of 150...100 mV/m. This can produce several volts on a typical amateur-sized Marconi. The problem is mostly that the Loran emissions contain significant spectral energy outside their designated passband (90 - 110 kHz).<BR>
<BR>
- You can try to reduce the interference using a loop receive antenna. The disadvantage is of course that you won't be able to hear any signals from the null directions. You will also have to detune&nbsp; your transmit antenna during receive to avoid degrading of the loop pattern by mutual coupling. <BR>
<BR>
- To prevent the Loran signal from overloading your receiver frontend, a bandpass filter will probably be mandatory.<BR>
<BR>
- As the pulses are short (&lt; 200 µs), a noise blanker in the receiver can be quite effective. It can however remodulate the Loran repetition rates onto other signals (eg. DCF 39) and create weak spurs which could be confusing in extremely narrowband observations.<BR>
<BR>
I wish you a nice holiday, and success for your first steps on this fascinating band.<BR>
<BR>
73 de Markus, DF6NM<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In einer eMail vom 07.03.2005 22:23:42 Westeuropäische Normalzeit schreibt m.peters@peters-placke.de: <BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">yesterday say an other om there is a loran-tx on the island of sylt...<BR>
is it correct? is it possible to recieve sigs so nearly? distance from<BR>
my holiday qth to sylt is only a few kilometers...<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

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I monitored DCF39 last night, the first time for many months. It was very
strong for some hours and audible over our sunrise.

Mike ZL4OL re54gg



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<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #ff0000 2px solid">
<P>========================================<BR>Message date : Mar 08 2005, 05:07 AM<BR>From : "McAlevey" <MCALEVEY@XTRA.CO.NZ><BR>To : rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<BR>Copy to : <BR>Subject : LF: DCF39<BR>I monitored DCF39 last night, the first time for many months. It was very<BR>strong for some hours and audible over our sunrise.<BR><BR>Mike ZL4OL re54gg<BR><BR><BR>DCF39......What was the best time ?&nbsp;of course the darkness path will be shorter to the UK, but it&nbsp;might be worth trying.</P>
<P>Laurie.&nbsp;<BR></P></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

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Laurie,

strongest signal was 1500 to 1600utc ie Eu sunset, but excellent copy
through till 1900, ZL sunrise. Let me know if you want to try at your
sunset.

Mike ZL4OL


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<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #ff0000 2px solid">========================================<BR>Message date : Mar 08 2005, 10:06 AM<BR>From : "McAlevey" <MCALEVEY@XTRA.CO.NZ><BR>To : "rsgb" <RSGB_LF_GROUP@BLACKSHEEP.ORG><BR>Copy to : <BR>Subject : Re: LF: DCF39<BR>Laurie,<BR><BR>strongest signal was 1500 to 1600utc ie Eu sunset, but excellent copy<BR>through till 1900, ZL sunrise. Let me know if you want to try at your<BR>sunset.<BR><BR>Mike ZL4OL<BR><BR><BR>I will transmit tonight from 1700 till 1830 on 135.921.5, Qrss 120 or Dfcw if I can get it set up. Have to go out at 1830 tonight but if condx still ok will stay on later tomorrow. 73 Laurie.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

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Laurie,

OK, monitoring 135.9215

Mike


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Hi Mike and Laurie, It will be interesting to see what happens on your sked.
This is probably the best time of year for that path. however the condition
look to have taken a downward swing again. Brian's daytime level have swung
up about 6dB again, though the nightime levels on his path were not too
badly affected last night. Steve W3EEE's plot of DCF39 shows signals barely
above the noise. The fast response to the recent disturbance is due to
Steve's path to Magdeburg being through the edge of the auroral zone I
think. I fear that the UK <> ZL path will need to be via one of the poles,
but we shall see......this propagation lark is rather like weather
forecasting....there is a big opportunity for finishing up with an eggy
face.

Good Luck both
Cheers de Alan G3NYK

----- Original Message -----
From: "McAlevey" <mcalevey@xtra.co.nz>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 08 March 2005 05:06
Subject: LF: DCF39


> I monitored DCF39 last night, the first time for many months. It was very
> strong for some hours and audible over our sunrise.
>
> Mike ZL4OL re54gg
>
>



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Nil...

Jay, W1VD


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<P>Thanks Alan for the propagation report. I agree that it does not look good, but I have tried when all was fine,so why not have a go now !&nbsp;As you say its all un-known territory.</P>
<P>73 all Laurie.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</P><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

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	YU7AR was calling CQ on QRSS-3 at about 2020 Z last night
	F6BWO answered him
	After a few minutes YU7AR sent  "  ?  AGN " but F6BWO had I suspect
gone by then.
	ON7ZO then called YU7AR but got no reply.

	All signals were excellent copy.

	73 Chris G3XIZ 

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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hello Chris,

Thanks for report, F6BWO sometimes very strong here, and I have QSO
with Jeff many times . ON7ZO yesterday is NIL , sory I have not ON
yet!

73 and CU, Teo



Tuesday, March 8, 2005, 1:40:26 PM, you wrote:

OC> 	YU7AR was calling CQ on QRSS-3 at about 2020 Z last night
OC> 	F6BWO answered him
OC> 	After a few minutes YU7AR sent  "  ?  AGN " but F6BWO had I suspect
OC> gone by then.
OC> 	ON7ZO then called YU7AR but got no reply.

OC> 	All signals were excellent copy.

OC> 	73 Chris G3XIZ 

O


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Dear LF enthusiasts,

I agree with Alan - "It will be interesting to see what happens on
your sked"

Some datas:
Sunset in QTH Laurie G3AQC at March 8 - abt 1750z
Sunrise in QTH Mike ZL4OL - abt 1830z
Common dark time abt 40 min
Bearing path (short) (G3AQC)  51.6 degr
Bearing path (short) (ZL4OL)  314.8 degr
Distance abt 19160km (abt 20860km Long path)

The path G-ZL passes on the countries : UA1, UA9, JT,
BY, DU, YB(east), VK(east) - abt 8 or 9 hops (?)
The most northern part of a path rises up to 62 degr North
Auroal oval now on http://www.sec.noaa.gov/pmap/pmapN.html is not so
bad for this path (abt North of SM at 13z)

What weather on G-ZL path? look any weather's web
... and look Alan's web:
http://www.alan.melia.btinternet.co.uk/

I believe it's the first TX attempt from Western Europe to ZL

Successes to both in interesting experiments!

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru



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From: Eduardo EA3GHS <ea3ghs@gmail.com>
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Hello,

I could copy only YU7AR too.
My locator is JN01HO, abt 1600km !!

73 Eduardo
http://usuarios.lycos.es/ea3ghs/vlf


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Eduardo EA3GHS <ea3ghs@gmail.com>
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Subject: LF: Last weekend activity: RU6LA & S57A
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Hello,

A strong signal from RU6LA was received last Saturday
night (21h utc) in JN01HO, at 3076 Km far away
from KN97LN. The mode was DOT3 and Ed was
calling CQ. 

I was very happy, too, to receive a signal from Boris,
S57A calling CQ in DOT3 mode. The SN was
12dB, maybe audible but I have not speaker connected.

A more detailed signal report can be seen in my on-line log book:
http://usuarios.lycos.es/ea3ghs/vlf/logbook.html

73 DX from Eduardo


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Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 17:11:59 +0100
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> Later I shall do a page on my wwww with all interesting captures - request
> to send files of my signal

Ed,

there are some captures of your signal from the 2nd-5th of march on my
website:

http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm

73
Hartmut



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Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 17:12:38 +0100
From: Hartmut Wolff <wolff.h@t-online.de>
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Updated my website with the captured signals from 7th of March
2000-2200z: F6BWO, YU7AR, ON7ZO, RA3YO and G3WCB.

http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm


73
Hartmut



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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Monday, March 07, 2005 6:29 PM
Subject: Re: LF: QRQ


> > Is there anyone on LF interested in a CWR effort (cw revival). Most of
> > those active presently on QRS are perfectly audible with me and
> > certainly workable on CW. I have not heard anyone on normal CW for a
> > long time. QRS seems to have taken over completely on LF to the
> > detriment of CW. 73 de Mal/G3KEV
>
> There is CW activity most days, and certainly every Saturday and
> Sunday. In a short period yesterday, I heard CW from F6BWO and DL1EIE
> and had a QSO myself. Perhaps it's about time you joined in.
>
> Mike, G3XDV
> ==========
> Hi Mike
Your signal and all the other G stns active at present are barely audible or
visible with me compared to the EU and Russian stns active.
de Mal/G3KEV

>


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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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----- Original Message -----
From: "McAlevey" <mcalevey@xtra.co.nz>
To: "rsgb" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 08, 2005 10:05 AM
Subject: Re: LF: DCF39


> Laurie,
>
> strongest signal was 1500 to 1600utc ie Eu sunset, but excellent copy
> through till 1900, ZL sunrise. Let me know if you want to try at your
> sunset.
>
> Mike ZL4OL
>
Hi Mike
I would join in for the test if I knew the frequencies involved. Where are
you listening and what speed?


de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH

>



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----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Lesnichy" <ed@dx.ru>
To: "hamilton mal" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Monday, March 07, 2005 6:32 PM
Subject: Re: LF: QRQ


> Dear Mal,
>
> Monday, March 7, 2005 you wrote:
>
> hm> Hi All
> hm> Is there anyone on LF interested in a CWR effort (cw
> hm> revival). Most of those active presently on QRS are perfectly
> hm> audible with me and certainly workable on CW. I have not heard
> hm> anyone on normal CW for a long time.
> hm> QRS seems to have taken over completely on LF to the detriment of CW.
> hm> 73 de Mal/G3KEV
>
> In the following LF activity I specially shall do with you sked in CW
>
> maybe 3 or 2 nights next weekend (MAR 11-13) or MAR 18-20
>
> I'll inform you
>
> In January 2005 I have carried out only 3 CW QSO ;-(((  but I have
noticed,
> that now in the basic CW QSOs will carry out after QRSS QSO on the same
> frequency (in 137.7kHz range)
>
> I listen to you in CW!
>
> 73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru
>
Hi Ed.
I am ready when you are. Let me know and I hope we can both make it again.
You are always very strong with me here in Scarborough/IO94SH
De Mal/G3KEV




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From: Lawrence Mayhead G3AQC <laurie@g3aqc.freeserve.co.uk>
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<P>Many thanks Ed for your comments and interesting calculations.</P>
<P>I will start transmitting at1645, using 160 sec. elements DFCW. Freq 135.921.6kHz as near as I can measure it.</P>
<P>&nbsp;Mike and I&nbsp;have tried this before, but no success ! still here goes</P>
<P>73 Laurie..</P>
<P>&nbsp;</P><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
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Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 10:37:00 -0900
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Subject: LF: XDW back on qrp
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wd2xdw is back on but at a very low power whilst pruning of nearby trees  on 
the golf course is taking place.

The TX is running around 3.5W  DC input at the moment on 137,7753/6 Khz dfcw 
90 to the loop array.

Laurence KL1X/5 em26aq
status http://myweb.cableone.net/flow




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From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
To: "LF-Group" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 20:30:30 -0000
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Subject: LF: Loran-C  future in Europe
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Hi all, I have been alerted to some statements on the NELS web site by
Finbar  EI0CF at malin Head, who has had a bulletin via the Irish
Commisioner of Lights. The following is taken off the home page of the NELS
web site. The link in the notice will atke you to the page and more data
will be found under the news heading in the drop-down menu.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------
NOTICE CONCERNING LORAN-C IN NORTHWEST EUROPE

The Northwest European Loran-C System (NELS) will be discontinued on 1
January 2006.
However the Loran-C signal will remain available in part of the present
coverage area.

The most up-to-date information can be found on http://www.nels.org

Further notification with more details will be issued before 1 October 2005.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------

It would seem that the Northern European nations have withdrawn from the
consortium and it looks as though Sylt and the more northern chain will
cease on 1st Jan next year. So far only the French intend to carry on with
their chain. I suspect that this will not last long when the full cost and
the committment to Galileo (EU GPS) is realised. I also suspect that this
will knock the BT "experiment" on the head.

Finbar send 73 to all his LF friends

Cheers de Alan G3NYK






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Hi, Mal.

Thanks for the call. You were about RST 589 when you called me, but it took
a little while for me to realise what was happening and switch to CW. I
called you afterwards on the key on 136.500, but I don't think my 100W on CW
is enough to make it to Scarborough!

Cheers and 73,

Dave G3WCB IO91RM





From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Thanks for the QSO, Mal. Made it at last!

Very strong signals in this part of the world, near Slough.

You came out pretty well on Marcus's grabber in Nurnberg as well.
73 and hope to work you 2-way CW, when I have a few more watts going up the
spout!

Dave G3WCB
IO91RM

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Dave G3WCB
Sent: 08 March 2005 22:06
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: Sorry Mal!



Hi, Mal.

Thanks for the call. You were about RST 589 when you called me, but it took
a little while for me to realise what was happening and switch to CW. I
called you afterwards on the key on 136.500, but I don't think my 100W on CW
is enough to make it to Scarborough!

Cheers and 73,

Dave G3WCB IO91RM








From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Dear Groups,

Now running a  Colpitts oscillator and hopefully reducing the "chirp"
on my keying a bit.  Running 5 watts output with 0.4 amps aerial current
to a piece of #12 copper wire 100 metres long and 10 metres high.
QRSS120 (approx) on 189.850 kHz +/- 0.5 Hz.

There has been no word yet on an LOA from Industry Canada to resume QRO on
2200 metres.

73
Joe VO1NA


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From: "Walter Blanchard" <blanch@pncl.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Shouldn't get too excited about Loran - it's the organisation that's 
closing, not the transmitters.
Walter G3JKV.

 



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Listening tomorrow morning, Eu Wednesday sunset, 1700 utc to 1900 utc on
135.9215 kHz for G3AQC and anyone else who cares to try, 120 second dot
Argo.

Mike ZL4OL



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: YU7AR <yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu>
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Hello Mike,

Yes I try on 135.9213 under G3AQC ,qrss120,
look on http://members.aol.com/df6nm/Grabber.htm

Teo, YU7AR loc. KN05BW


Wednesday, March 9, 2005, 10:48:19 AM, you wrote:

M> Listening tomorrow morning, Eu Wednesday sunset, 1700 utc to 1900 utc on
M> 135.9215 kHz for G3AQC and anyone else who cares to try, 120 second dot
M> Argo.

M> Mike ZL4OL


M> __________ NOD32 1.1021 (20050307) Information __________

M> This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus System.
M> http://www.nod32.com


-- 
Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Ed Lesnichy <ed@dx.ru>
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Subject: LF: EU->ZL
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Dear LF enthusiasts,

I believe a path YU7AR--------------------ZL4OL is quite good
Sunset in QTH Teo YU7AR at March 9 - abt 1630z
Sunrise in QTH Mike ZL4OL - abt 1830z
Common dark time abt 2 h
Bearing path (short) YU7AR 100 degr
Bearing path (short) ZL4OL  281 degr
Distance abt 17730km
The path YU7AR-ZL4OL passes on the countries : 4K, VU, Indian Ocean,
VK6 - abt 8 or 9 hops (?)

YU7AR----------------------ZL2CA
Sunset in QTH Teo YU7AR at March 9 - abt 1630z
Sunrise in QTH Bob ZL2CA - abt 1815z
Common dark time abt 1h 45m
Bearing path (short) YU7AR 85 degr
Bearing path (short) ZL2CA  293 degr
Distance abt 17900km
The path YU7AR-ZL2CA passes on the countries : UA6(east), VU, 9V,
YB(center), VK8, VK3 - abt 8 or 9 hops (?)

I believe a path G3AQC--------------------ZL2CA is not so good under
wide auroral oval
Sunset in QTH Laurie G3AQC at March 9 - abt 1750z
Sunrise in QTH Bob ZL2CA - abt 1815z
Common dark time abt 25min
Bearing path (short) G3AQC 19.5 degr
Bearing path (short) ZL2CA  344 degr
Distance abt 18900km (abt 21130km Long path)
The path G3AQC-ZL2CA passes on the countries : LA, Arctic, UA0,
Pasific Ocean - abt 8 or 9 hops (?)
The most northern part of a path rises up to abt 78 degr North

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: YU7AR <yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu>
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 <002801c5248d$c27cbab0$565137d2@mcalevey>
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Hello Ed,

thanks for calculation, see this link.

 http://dx.qsl.net/propagation/greyline.html

73 CU Teo
-- 
Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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 <002801c5248d$c27cbab0$565137d2@mcalevey>
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Subject: LF: EU->ZL #2
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------070000010708050303070507
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Dear LF enthusiasts,

I have found interesting ;-)) variant CT1DRP--------ZL2CA
Sunset in QTH Brian CT1DRP at March 22 (equinox) - abt 1845z
Sunrise in QTH CT1DRP - abt 0640z
Sunrise in QTH Bob ZL2CA - abt 1830z
Sunset in QTH ZL2CA - abt 0625z
Common dark time abt 15min (0625-0640z)
Bearing path (short) CT1DRP 266 degr
Bearing path (short) ZL2CA 91  degr
Distance (West) abt 19740km (long path - East - 20290km)
The path CT1DRP-ZL2CA (West) passes on the countries : Atlantic Ocean,
Carribian, Pasific Ocean
It is practically antipodes (antipoddes EA3-ZL2)
Practically same data for EA1PX--------ZL2CA

The path CT1DRP-------ZL4OL passes near to poles and practically there
is no common dark time, but passes lengthways of grey line (!) at
March 9 in 1830z and 7z (look attach)

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru
--------------070000010708050303070507
Content-Type: image/jpeg;
 name="ct1drp_zl4ol.jpg"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
Content-Disposition: inline;
 filename="ct1drp_zl4ol.jpg"

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--------------070000010708050303070507--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2005 16:08:53 -0000
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Subject: LF: CW REVIVAL
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi All</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>CW REVIVAL is working. I had 3 qso's this afternoon 
with DL2FDO, DK7SU LF veterans and a new one DL1DQZ near Dresden. All good 
signals on CW. I also worked G3WCB yesterday evening, his best cw dx so far hi 
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I can work XMODE also, so don't be surprised if I 
call you on CW if you call cq on qrs.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Dear Mike,<BR>
<BR>
at the moment, there are<BR>
<BR>
 922.3/.4&nbsp; DF6NM dfcw<BR>
 921.4/.5&nbsp; G3AQC dfcw "AQC"<BR>
 921.25&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; YU7AR qrss "AR"<BR>
~921.1&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; RA3YO qrss<BR>
<BR>
Happy watching!<BR>
<BR>
Markus, DF6NM <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
mcalevey@xtra.co.nz: <BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Listening tomorrow morning, Eu Wednesday sunset, 1700 utc to 1900 utc on<BR>
135.9215 kHz for G3AQC and anyone else who cares to try, 120 second dot<BR>
Argo.<BR>
<BR>
Mike ZL4OL<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "McAlevey" <mcalevey@xtra.co.nz>
To: "rsgb" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
References: <PAEFLMFGBDKKCONLMLBICEMLCCAA.ganymede444@btopenworld.com> <Pine.OSF.4.56.0503082037530.11141@plato.ucs.mun.ca> <002801c5248d$c27cbab0$565137d2@mcalevey>
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Hello all,

thanks Ed for the calculations. What do the Eu sunrise paths look like?

I saw nothing identifiable this morning but
will look again each morning watching 135.921 to 135.923 kHz.

Mike ZL4OL



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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi All</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Things are really happening. Just worked old friend 
OH1TN after a long time and a new one OH0RJ/Lars also DL2HRE.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>It would be nice to&nbsp;hear GI and EI back on 
CW.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: LF: Re: RU6's LF FD operation March 1-6, from DK8ND
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Dear Ed,
may be I tried to respond to RU6LAs calls in QRSs3. I tried it in saturday evening til 2300 UTC. Have seen good sigs with mm, with the  spectrolab program.TNX report.
My stn: TX 70W/60 Ohm, Marconi with L=4,6 mH, Zin abt 200 Ohm, using a Balun 50R/200R to match the aerial. LOC JN48 UQ, DOK P41.

55, dsw, Hans-Albrecht DK 8 ND



rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org schrieb am 07.03.05 14:49:35:
> 
> Dear LF enthusiasts,
> 
> Summary info abt RU6's LF Field Day operation at March 1...6
> (South-Eastern part of Eu Russia - QTH Machta - QTH-loc: KN97LN -
> mobile FD shack-van - http://136.73.ru/ed/index.htm)
> 
> MARCH 1
> Restoration of the LF TX aerial (the vertical part of TX ANT is
> damaged in time of a very strong wind of February 28 - speed up
> to 35-37m/sec - it is a lot HAM's aerials is damaged in our region)
> No my beacon from 1430z till 1830 for ZLs
> Grabber in 60s mode at 137.7813...7780 from 20z
> Propagation bad - some traces on freqs WD2XES and WD2XGJ after 1z,
> but NO IDs
> The noise are higher +6...10db than usually
> DCF39's level abt -6db than usually (QRB abt 2000km)
> Temp +3...-3(night) degr C,  wind 8..12m/sec
> 
> MARCH 2
> The new LF TX aerial is restored
> dear Ed,
may be I tried to respond to RU6LAs calls in QRSs3. Start beacon ("RU6LA" QRSS60) on abt 137.7889 (from 14z till 1834z)
> Current in the TX aerial 3.1 A
> The noise are higher abt +6db than usually
> Make some CQs in QRSS3 after 19z - some signals in QRSS3 - but very noisy
> Visual in EU range: S57A(O), YU7AR(O, S6), RA3YO(O, S6), DK1IS(O, S2),
> ?ZO (T/O - sri ON7ZO calling me), some NO IDs
> Propagation is not so good
> DCF39's level abt -6db than usually
> Grabber in 60s mode at 137.7813...7780 from 22z
> Propagation bad - some traces on freqs WD2XES and WD2XGJ after 1z
> March 3, but NO IDs
> Temp +6...-1(night) degr C,  wind 0..5m/sec
> 
> MARCH 3
> Start beacon ("RU6LA" QRSS120) on abt 137.7888 (from 1430z till 1846z)
> Current in the TX aerial 2.4-3.2 A (very windy - TX Big Vertical close comes
> nearer to a tower)
> Visual in EU range after 19z: YU7AR(very low - M/O in 3sec mode 1945z),
> RA3YO O FB all times, nothing anybody
> Make some CQs in QRSS3 - nil
> Very noisy - propagation is bad
> DCF39's level abt -10...12db than usually
> Grabber in 60s mode at 137.7813...7780 from 2130z
> Some traces on freq WD2XES and very clear some XES's dots and dash
> from 0135z till abt 2z March 4 - nil at other times
> Temp +2...-4(night) degr C,  wind 6..30m/sec
> 
> MARCH 4
> 7z the blizzard began and wind continues, temperature abt -3
> Make BOG abt 4km long to ZL - copper wire diam 0.3mm
> Visual in 120s mode 137.788 - .7895 after 14z - some traces on freq
> ZM2E's but NO ID
> Start "RU6LA" QRSS120 on 137.7889 from 1530z till 1620z (TX freq is
> down to 137.78875 because of temperature in FD shack is down)
> Current in the TX aerial 2.8-3 A
> Visual in 120s mode 137.788 - .7895 after 1620z - some traces on freq
> ZM2E's but NO ID
> After 1830z CQ in CW on 136.6 abt 45min - only YU7AR QSO 559/559
> After 1915z CQ in QRSS3, but only RA3YO reply
> Very noisy and NO any QRM lines on scren (!)
> DCF39's level abt -12...15db than usually
> Start beacon "RU6LA" QRSS60 on 135.9225 from 22z till 0440z March 5
> (abt 2z TX freq down .9223 because of temperature in FD shack is down
> and at the end of TX abt 4z the freq became again .9225)
> Temp -1...-6(night) degr C,  wind 8..12m/sec
> 
> MARCH 5
> RA3YO start on 137.703 abt 0830z - very strong
> Visual in 120s mode 137.788 - .7895 after 1330z - abt 14..1415z some
> traces on ZM2E's(?) freq - NO ID
> Start "RU6LA" QRSS120 on 137.7888 from 1515z till 1550z
> Visual in 120s mode 137.788 - .7895 after 1550z till 1630z - nil
> Start "RU6LA" QRSS120 on 137.7888 from 1630z till 1745z
> Visual in 120s mode 137.788 - .7895 after 1745z till 1830z - some
> traces on ZM2E's freq - NO ID
> 1840z start activity in EU range: OH5UFO O in QSO with DL3ZID O/M
> DFC39's level is normal
> The propagation to Europe began after 1950z - F6BWO (O/M in 3sec
> mode !), HA6PC (O), YU7DP(O/M), DL2HRE(O), ON6ND?(T/M)
> Start beacon "RU6LA"  QRSS60 on 135.9227 from 23z
> Abt 4z March 6 my freq is down to 135.9225)
> 
> The equipments:
> RX - BOG 1.7km to EU, BOG abt 4km to ZL (copper wire diam 0.3mm),
> RF amlifiers, electromechanical filter (wide 2.1kHz, 136.775kHz
> center), Kenwood TS-850, ARGO Ver 1 build 134 by Alberto I2PHD
> 
> TX - Big Vertical with H effective abt 70m, PA abt 100W Output - current
> in the TX aerial abt 2.4-3.2A (various at different weather and wind)
> DDS VFO, QRS 4.01 by Rik ON7YD
> 
> I have looked argocaps of Dex W4DEX and Jay W1VD is my signals (astable
> and coincides on times on mine argocaps) - I believe that the first
> receptions of Russia in USA! - I congratulate both!
> QRB abt 9016km (W4DEX) and 8066km (W1VD)
> Way Russia - Northern America very difficult through auroal oval
> 
> Later I shall do a page on my wwww with all interesting captures - request
> to send files of my signal
> 
> TNX for efforts to all!
> 
> 73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru
> 
> 


__________________________________________________________
Mit WEB.DE FreePhone mit hoechster Qualitaet ab 0 Ct./Min.
weltweit telefonieren! http://freephone.web.de/?mc=021201


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<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=655472021-09032005>hello 
markus, hello alan, hello group,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=655472021-09032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=655472021-09032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=655472021-09032005>thanks 
for info`s about the loran tx on the island of sylt...</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=655472021-09032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=655472021-09032005>i have 
check the distance - is 35 km to the tx...</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=655472021-09032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=655472021-09032005>it was 
not enough time to build a loop and so i hope my bandpass (from rx041 df8zr) can 
reduce the interference.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=655472021-09032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=655472021-09032005>i will 
report when i be back from my holiday</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=655472021-09032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=655472021-09032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=655472021-09032005>73 
michael dk5na</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=655472021-09032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=655472021-09032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
  <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma 
  size=2>-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----<BR><B>Von:</B> 
  owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]<B>Im Auftrag von 
  </B>MarkusVester@aol.com<BR><B>Gesendet:</B> Montag, 7. März 2005 
  23:32<BR><B>An:</B> rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<BR><B>Betreff:</B> Re: LF: 
  new on 137kc<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT lang=2 
  face=Arial size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" PTSIZE="10">Hello Michael,<BR><BR>the 
  coordinates of the Sylt Loran station are 54° 48' 29.975" N, 8° 17' 36.856" E. 
  This is on the southern part of the island, and ranges to Romoe vary from 32 
  to 46 km. The nominal peak power of the pulses is 250 kW on 100 kHz, so you 
  will have to expect a fieldstrength of 150...100 mV/m. This can produce 
  several volts on a typical amateur-sized Marconi. The problem is mostly that 
  the Loran emissions contain significant spectral energy outside their 
  designated passband (90 - 110 kHz).<BR><BR>- You can try to reduce the 
  interference using a loop receive antenna. The disadvantage is of course that 
  you won't be able to hear any signals from the null directions. You will also 
  have to detune&nbsp; your transmit antenna during receive to avoid degrading 
  of the loop pattern by mutual coupling. <BR><BR>- To prevent the Loran signal 
  from overloading your receiver frontend, a bandpass filter will probably be 
  mandatory.<BR><BR>- As the pulses are short (&lt; 200 µs), a noise blanker in 
  the receiver can be quite effective. It can however remodulate the Loran 
  repetition rates onto other signals (eg. DCF 39) and create weak spurs which 
  could be confusing in extremely narrowband observations.<BR><BR>I wish you a 
  nice holiday, and success for your first steps on this fascinating 
  band.<BR><BR>73 de Markus, 
DF6NM<BR><BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML>

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This the site I use for storm progress across europe
http://www.wetterzentrale.de/pics/Rsfloc.html
regards
peter G8AFN


Original Message:
-----------------
From:  MarkusVester@aol.com
Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 15:38:16 EST
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: WWLL Global Lightning Map


Dear LF Group,

after some searching, I have found an interesting, quasi-realtime lightning 
map. It is on the website of the WWLL (World Wide Lightning Location)
network:
http://flash.ess.washington.edu/ 

They do not claim the sub-kilometer accuracy of some of the commercial 
networks, but they have a nice global display updating every 10 minutes.
The data is 
based on correlated VLF receivers (TOGA = time of group arrival), and the 
published spectrograms are also pretty impressive.

It has been quiet on this reflector today, hope its working.

Have fun, 73

Markus, DF6NM


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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Hello Mike and LF,<BR>
<BR>
many tnx for watching. In any case it was fun trying, and by sheer coincidence we produced a nice colour spectrum on the directional display: from deep red RA3YO up to SM6BHZ on 135923.0 in the near-ultraviolet ;-)<BR>
<BR>
73 de Markus, DF6NM<BR>
<BR>
In einer eMail vom 09.03.2005 20:51:57 Westeuropäische Normalzeit schreibt mcalevey@xtra.co.nz: <BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">I saw nothing identifiable this morning but<BR>
will look again each morning watching 135.921 to 135.923 kHz.<BR>
<BR>
Mike ZL4OL<BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</FONT></HTML>
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--------------040607080600050003070404--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Nil

Will continue to run captures when activity is present on DF6NM 135922
grabber.

Jay, W1VD



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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After only a few characters being visible overnight, there were complete XGJ
and XES ID's on CT1DRP's screen at Porto sunrise this morning. As Alan
frequently reminds us, "less than perfect conditions" does not mean there
will be no signals!

John Andrews, W1TAG




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>HI All</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>If you need OH for dxcc then OH1TN is about at 
present on CW. I worked him this morning at 1143utc on 136.85 khz.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Good signals each way. I have worked him often 
during daytime over the years. Distance about 1600 km. (nearly 1000 
miles)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 and gud dxing </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<html>
<body>
TYo All from PA0SE<br><br>
I am presently writing an article for our VERON magazine
<i>Electron&nbsp; </i>on the early radio experiments by Marconi. In these
experiments spark gaps played an important role. Because I would like to
perform some simple calculations on the peak power radiated by a spark
transmitter I am looking for data on the break down voltage of spark
gaps, consisting of two spheres.<br>
In literature, found on the Internet, 75kV/inch is quoted but it is not
stated whether this is between points or spheres and that makes a lot of
difference.<br>
Temperature and air pressure also influence  break down voltage but I
will forget about that, reckoning with &quot;normal&quot;
conditions&nbsp; of, <br>
say , 20 degrees centigrade and&nbsp; 1000 hectopascal or whatever as
reckoned as standard&nbsp; barometric pressure. <br>
Your help will be very much appreciated.<br><br>
73, Dick, PA0SE<br>
JN22GD</body>
</html>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<P>Will run for a short time tonight&nbsp; 1845-1930utc</P>
<P>73 Laurie</P><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<DIV>Hi Dick </DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Looking in my trusty "Reference Data for Radio Engineers" (won in a rally raffle at least 40 years ago !) the spark gap voltages chart indicates about 30 kV per inch for "needles" and between 55 and 80 kV for spheres spaced and inch apart (depending on the size of the spheres). Hope that helps.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Brian&nbsp;<BR><BR><B><I>Dick Rollema &lt;dickrollema@casema.nl&gt;</I></B> wrote:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid">TYo All from PA0SE<BR><BR>I am presently writing an article for our VERON magazine <I>Electron&nbsp; </I>on the early radio experiments by Marconi. In these experiments spark gaps played an important role. Because I would like to perform some simple calculations on the peak power radiated by a spark transmitter I am looking for data on the break down voltage of spark gaps, consisting of two spheres.<BR>In literature, found on the Internet, 75kV/inch is quoted but it is not stated whether this is between points or spheres and that makes a lot of difference.<BR>Temperature and air pressure also influence break down voltage but I will forget about that, reckoning with "normal" conditions&nbsp; of, <BR>say , 20 degrees centigrade and&nbsp; 1000 hectopascal or whatever as reckoned as standard&nbsp; barometric pressure. <BR>Your help will be very much appreciated.<BR><BR>73, Dick,
 PA0SE<BR>JN22GD </BLOCKQUOTE><p>Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com 

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hello Dick,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>between a peak and a plate it takes 1 
kV.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Between two balls ( diameter?) - spheres - abt 3 
kV.&nbsp; per mm. Don't ask me for kV/m.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 Peter, dj9dw.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE 
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV 
  style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
  <A title=dickrollema@casema.nl href="mailto:dickrollema@casema.nl">Dick 
  Rollema</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">LF-Group</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, March 10, 2005 7:25 
  PM</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> LF: Off topic</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>TYo All from PA0SE<BR><BR>I am presently writing an article for 
  our VERON magazine <I>Electron&nbsp; </I>on the early radio experiments by 
  Marconi. In these experiments spark gaps played an important role. Because I 
  would like to perform some simple calculations on the peak power radiated by a 
  spark transmitter I am looking for data on the break down voltage of spark 
  gaps, consisting of two spheres.<BR>In literature, found on the Internet, 
  75kV/inch is quoted but it is not stated whether this is between points or 
  spheres and that makes a lot of difference.<BR>Temperature and air pressure 
  also influence break down voltage but I will forget about that, reckoning with 
  "normal" conditions&nbsp; of, <BR>say , 20 degrees centigrade and&nbsp; 1000 
  hectopascal or whatever as reckoned as standard&nbsp; barometric pressure. 
  <BR>Your help will be very much appreciated.<BR><BR>73, Dick, PA0SE<BR>JN22GD 
</BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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Subject: LF: Re:Off topic, spark gaps, from dk8nd
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Dear Dick, 
spark gaps are a genuine way of measuring high voltages in a HV-Laboratory. There exist tables for DC and AC 50 Hz. Spark gaps must be used, as it is impossible to use a rotary swich in a meter at 100kV or more. oen of the spheres is doped with an radioactive element to cause discharge always at the same place on the spheres surface.  Break down voltage is checked with observers eye and ears and depends on Voltage (ac/dc, HF), temperature, humidity and absolute air pressure. An uncertainity of about +-2% may be obtained in voltage-measurements. A gross value for break down voltage is 30 kV/cm. Try to get into contact with an advanced engineering school teaching energy technics, machine engineering and High frequency technics. If the schools is specialized on contemporary data processing, electronics and international economy, You are wrong, so an traditional institution is recommended. In my case it is "Georg-Simon-Ohm-Fachhochschule Nürnberg".

73,
Hans-Albrecht
DK 8 ND


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Von:      rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Gesendet: 10.03.05 20:51:22
An:       "Hans-Albrecht Haffa" <dk8nd@web.de>
Betreff:  Re: LF: Off topic


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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hello all,

there was nothing seen overnight except for one strong dash at 1720 utc on
135.9212 kHz. Conditions are quiet with no QRM and low QRN.
Monitoring again tonight 135.921 to 135.923 kHz.

Mike ZL4OL



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 16:46:56 -0500
From: Roger1 <boffin1@compuserve.com>
To: "INTERNET:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
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Subject: RE: LF: Re: Re: 807s
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I still have a few 807s from the mid 1940s,  They were a grreat boon at the
time and I have a very soft spot for them.
Roger, G2AJV.


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>one strong dash at 1720 utc on 135.9212 kHz. 
sorry that should read 135.9211

Mike ZL4OL


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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	for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Mar 2005 00:29:10 +0000
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From: MarkusVester@aol.com
Message-ID: <1eb.369efa58.2f624049@aol.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2005 19:28:57 EST
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: Re: LF: ZL
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Hi Mike,<BR>
<BR>
as far as I can tell, RA3YO was on 135921.05, and right in the middle of a dash at 17:20 (below the yellow marker). He didn't look very strong here.<BR>
<BR>
73 de Markus, DF6NM<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In einer eMail vom 10.03.2005 23:37:12 Westeuropäische Normalzeit schreibt mcalevey@xtra.co.nz: <BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">&gt;one strong dash at 1720 utc on 135.9212 kHz. <BR>
sorry that should read 135.9211<BR>
<BR>
Mike ZL4OL<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</FONT></HTML>
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--------------030007060901010902040706--

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Thanks Markus. That looks very promising. The dash was the only piece of
white in an otherwise very quiet Argo screen. I hope RA3YO will be on again
today. What is his QTH please?

Mike ZL4OL



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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------060002080001000601050304
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Mike,

Friday, March 11, 2005 you wrote:

M> Thanks Markus. That looks very promising. The dash was the only piece of
M> white in an otherwise very quiet Argo screen. I hope RA3YO will be on again
M> today. What is his QTH please?

Dmitry RA3YO's QTH - central Russia - Bryansk - QTH-loc KO73DG
He has such aerial (look attach) and pwr abt 100W Output

RA3YO-ZL4OL QRB abt 16790km

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru
--------------060002080001000601050304
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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Dear LF enthusiasts,

I plan at these weekend 2 night (March 11-12 and 12-13) to be on
Machta (QTH-loc: KN97LN)

I'll listen and to look CW signals in area 137.7 on ARGO's screen
after my CQ in QRSS and if not will be of the large QRSS's QRM, I'll
respond in CW.
Such work is not to the large infringement of the Band plan (??)
In Russia it is possible to work CW (A1A) from 135.7 up to 137.8

I'll QSY on 136.6kHz after TX in QRSS "NW CW"

PSE write down and send wav-files of my CW (I'll write down wav CW also)

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi All</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>For those that listen on 137 khz but do not TX on 
that band please reply to my calls on 7030 khz +/- qrm.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I will listen on that FREQ while I am active on 137 
khz CW. This procedure has always worked in the past. This is a good freq during 
late evening and night time for North America xband QSO'S</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 De Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Walter Blanchard" <blanch@pncl.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Roger,

As long as it's you that has the soft spot and not the 807's!
Walter G3JKV.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Roger1" <boffin1@compuserve.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2005 9:46 PM
Subject: RE: LF: Re: Re: 807s


>I still have a few 807s from the mid 1940s,  They were a grreat boon at the
> time and I have a very soft spot for them.
> Roger, G2AJV.
>
> 



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hi all
I even still have 2 russian made 807 (G807) and one 813 made by EIMAC. If someone is interested??

     Heinz, DM2BHG



"Roger1" <boffin1@compuserve.com> schrieb:
> I still have a few 807s from the mid 1940s,  They were a grreat boon at the
> time and I have a very soft spot for them.
> Roger, G2AJV.
> 
> 



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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TA enthusiasts

No signals noted...but don't believe anyone was "cooking spiders" last
night. Condx here were very quiet and CFH painted a big blue band on
DF6NM grabber.

Will continue to keep an eye open for TA activity.

Jay, W1VD



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:33:29 +0100
From: Hartmut Wolff <wolff.h@t-online.de>
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Subject: LF: G3KEV in QRSS3!
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------090402070901000707090004
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
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Mal,
nice QRSS3 signal here in JO52ho, but I saw stronger signals in the past
from the UK ;-).
See the attachment.
  
73

 Hartmut                          mailto:wolff.h@t-online.de
--------------090402070901000707090004
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Subject: Re: LF: ZL
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Hi Mike,

I'm start today again qrss80 on 135921.06 at 16:40z, but  sunset abt 15:35
QTH is Brjansk  KO73dg

73  Dmitri  RA3YO

McAlevey wrote:

 >Thanks Markus. That looks very promising. The dash was the only piece of
 >white in an otherwise very quiet Argo screen. I hope RA3YO will be on 
again
 >today. What is his QTH please?
 >
 >Mike ZL4OL
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >





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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 18:12:06 -0000
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Subject: LF: Re: G3KEV in QRSS3!
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Hartmut Wolff" <wolff.h@t-online.de>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Friday, March 11, 2005 3:33 PM
Subject: LF: G3KEV in QRSS3!


> Mal,
> nice QRSS3 signal here in JO52ho, but I saw stronger signals in the past
> from the UK ;-).
> See the attachment.
>
> 73
>
>  Hartmut
Tnx Hartmut for the report. I was only running a few watts testing and
setting up the QRS.
Tnx agn
de Mal/G3KEV


                     mailto:wolff.h@t-online.de



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Subject: LF: RU6LA at ZM2E last Saturday
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 boundary="------------090903030006040508010900"
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------090903030006040508010900
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
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Hi all,

The attached graphic shows the best result for receiving RU6LA at Quartz 
Hill on 5 March.  Capture time was about 15 minutes before ZL sunrise.  We 
were requested via 40 metre liaison for ZM2E to transmit before sunrise, to 
see if there was copy the other way, and that is why the capture ends part 
way through an L.

73, Bob ZL2CA 

--------------090903030006040508010900
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no signals seen overnight.

Mike ZL4OL


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hi Mal,

I look you call, but forget turn on PA

Dmitri RA3YO



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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi All</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>UA6LV big signal to night 589 on CW at 2117. We 
both had a solid QSO on 136.6 khz CW</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>&nbsp;QTH 
Machta&nbsp;loc&nbsp;UA6LV-KN97LN&nbsp;&nbsp; G3KEV-IO94SH</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Distance ?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>My previous cw QSO in that direction was with RN6BN 
loc KN95LC on 04/05/2003 at 2138 utc</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Now calling CQ but no one responding </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 23:05:03 +0100
From: Hartmut Wolff <wolff.h@t-online.de>
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Updated my website with the captured signals from 11th of March
1915-2115z: DK1IS, G3KEV, OK2BVG, ON7ZO, RA3YO and RU6LA.

http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm


73
Hartmut



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From: Dmitry RA3YO <ilena@online.debryansk.ru>
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Hi Mal,

Thank you for QSO, you abt S=2

73 Dmitri  RA3YO



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Good and stable signal from WD2XES 0020-0530z.

Captures can be seen here:

http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm


Nothing else copied.

73
Hartmut



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Dmitry RA3YO" <ilena@online.debryansk.ru>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Friday, March 11, 2005 9:10 PM
Subject: LF: G3KEV


> Hi Mal,
>
> I look you call, but forget turn on PA
>
> Dmitri RA3YO
Hi Dmitri
Tnx fer the info and the later QSO. A very good signal here in Scarborough
IO94SH.
Pse ur QTH and loc info for distance.

QSL our QSO on 11-03-2005 at 2307utc solid O copy on QRS3 cw
Pse check around 136.6 khz for a CW QSO when you are on the band again.
about 2000 utc is a good time.
73 de Mal/G3KEV

>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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TA enthusiasts

Only slight traces of AR...condx noisy due to storm off atlantic
seaboard. Seems we're stuck in a weather pattern that places these
static generators between US and EU. Hopefully this pattern will end
soon.

Will watch again tonight.

Jay, W1VD



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From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
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References: <219382830.20050312075816@t-online.de>
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Hi Hartmut interesting. I have good strength plots from John's WD2XES Part 5
beacon. (Warren was not active) John's signal were "O" at midnight but
strengthened about 0045 fading about 0245z and only returned at about "M" at
0500z for 45 mins.
Alan G3NYK

----- Original Message -----
From: "Hartmut Wolff" <wolff.h@t-online.de>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 12 March 2005 06:58
Subject: LF: TA Mar 11/12th


> Good and stable signal from WD2XES 0020-0530z.
>
> Captures can be seen here:
>
> http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm
>
>
> Nothing else copied.
>
> 73
> Hartmut
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Les Thompson <Les@holywell.demon.co.uk>
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Hello Laurie

You are weak but audible up here in the NE just north of Whitley Bay.

IO95FB  55N 1.54W

Receiving on an Icom PCR1000 with a 1 meter square loop spiral wound
sitting a few feet away from me in the shack.

No tx here on any band at the moment except 70cms and we are to far
apart for that.

73
-- 
Les G8ARF / G3VYZ


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #ff0000 2px solid">
<P>========================================<BR>Message date : Mar 12 2005, 01:48 PM<BR>From : "Les Thompson" <LES@HOLYWELL.DEMON.CO.UK><BR>To : rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<BR>Copy to : <BR>Subject : LF: G3AQC<BR>Hello Laurie<BR><BR>You are weak but audible up here in the NE just north of Whitley Bay.<BR><BR>IO95FB 55N 1.54W<BR><BR>Receiving on an Icom PCR1000 with a 1 meter square loop spiral wound<BR>sitting a few feet away from me in the shack.<BR><BR>No tx here on any band at the moment except 70cms and we are to far<BR>apart for that.<BR><BR>73<BR>-- <BR>Les G8ARF / G3VYZ<BR></P>
<P>Hi Les,</P>
<P>&nbsp;Many thanks for the report, there does not seem to be much activity&nbsp; today did hear G3KEV earlier, he ought to be a big signal with you,also DL3FDWO calling for OH or SM, HI.</P>
<P>Thanks for info on your equipment , you are doing pretty well&nbsp;with a small loop indoors, no doubt you get quite a lot of mains bourne interference, would be a good idea to site the Ant. outside the house if possible. Also a larger loop might give you a better sig/noise (that is Rx noise ) ratio.</P>
<P>Running here 1W ERP , the TX is a Racal Decca at about 800 W and the Tx Ant a vert.&nbsp;50' high with 600' of top load. Rx&nbsp;Ant, large wire loop in the trees 20' high and 200' long.Home made tuned pre-amp to old IC781, which is just fine on 137.</P>
<P>Hope to hear you on some time, and a X band QSO would be great. ( I am QRV on 160/80/40)</P>
<P>Many 73 Laurie&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </P>
<P>&nbsp;<BR></P></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Walter Staubach" <walter.staubach@fen-net.de>
To: "RSGB LF" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>, 
 "Staf ON6RR Rans" <Staf.Rans@telenet.be>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Dear All, dear Staf,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial 
size=2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 
last night I had some difficulties with the antenna, although only running 0.5W 
ERP. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>We had strong storm and snowfall , the MW-antenna 
touched the 70cm-yagi and - although the wire is insulated - this caused sparks. 
Thus I reduced the power to less than 0.1 W ERP.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial 
size=2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 
Now the antenna works well again and so I will QRO 4W ERP tonight from 22Z&nbsp; 
to 9Z and QRSS30.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Walter DJ2LF</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<DIV>Hi Les,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>I was interested to see you are using a PCR1000.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>I too have one of these Rx's and have not so far considered it for LF 
as&nbsp;I have others in use.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Have you compared it with anything else?</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Apart from selectivity of loop are you using any other preselection?</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Regards Pat g4gvw</DIV></FONT></BODY></HTML>

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Hello Jay,

Thanks for the report , AR...AR.. again tonight on 135.9213

Teo,  loc. KN05BW


Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



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<P>I have sked tonight with Jay W1VD on 135.921.1/3 DFCW is this likely to QRM any others if so I will QSY up a bit ? Will operate 23:00 to about 00:30 on this freq.</P>
<P>73 Laurie</P><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Ok Laurie, I go up on 135.9220 QRSS60, after 23:00

now I transmit QRSS120 16:30 to about 19:30 on 135.92125

73 and GL, Teo



Hello Lawrence,

Saturday, March 12, 2005, 5:46:08 PM, you wrote:

LMG> I have sked tonight with Jay W1VD on 135.921.1/3 DFCW is
LMG> this likely to QRM any others if so I will QSY up a bit ? Will
LMG> operate 23:00 to about 00:30 on this freq.

LMG> 73 Laurie





LMG> Whatever you Wanadoo

LMG> This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more here



-- 
Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hi Laurie Good luck with Jay. Conditions are not too bad now but still a bit
"location selective" due to fading and they should be getting better (window
getting longer)0 hopefully. I copied John from midnight last night until
about 0245z on 30sec dots.
Cheers de Alan G3NYK

----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence Mayhead G3AQC" <laurie@g3aqc.freeserve.co.uk>
To: "RSGB" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 12 March 2005 16:46
Subject: LF: Re. T/A


> I have sked tonight with Jay W1VD on 135.921.1/3 DFCW is this likely to
QRM any others if so I will QSY up a bit ? Will operate 23:00 to about 00:30
on this freq.
> 73 Laurie
>
> --
>
> Whatever you Wanadoo:
> http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/
>
> This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more at:
http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
From: Les Thompson <Les@holywell.demon.co.uk>
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In article <15d.4c7d573a.2f647476@aol.com>, G4gvw@aol.com writes
>Hi Les,
> 
>I was interested to see you are using a PCR1000.
> 
>I too have one of these Rx's and have not so far considered it for LF
>as I have others in use.
> 
>Have you compared it with anything else?
> 
>Apart from selectivity of loop are you using any other preselection?
> 
>Regards Pat g4gvw

Hello Pat

I only have the PCR1000 and an IC-725 that will cover the 137KHz
band. Between the two of them the PCR1000 is the more stable when
it's been on for about half an hour, it seems to produce fewer
birdies and there seems little difference in sensitivity.

I did try an LF converter that a friend lent me but it didn't
perform well with the loop, looked like an impedance mis-match
as it was reasonably perky when fed with an end fed wire.

No preselector or pre-amp, I only have the loop and when I want
to watch the whole 2.1KHz spectrum I have to dampen the Q with a
560K carbon resistor, I was surprised at how sharp the tuning is.
As Laurie said I really need to get something outside but I'm
still trying different configurations of loop at the moment
and it's easier to play with them indoors.

I've never done anything other than briefly listen on LF before
a few months ago and now know why I could never hear any activity
having done a bit of reading and also monitoring this group for
a short while. I got interested before Christmas when Walter
DJ2LF started his 440KHz tests and then moved lower to see what
I could hear.

Looks like I've still got a lot to learn.

73
-- 
Les G8ARF / G3VYZ

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Subject: LF: No EU received
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Hi all,

Listening out on the beacon part of the band, nothing but noise was received 
here before dawn this morning.

73, Bob ZL2CA 




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "McAlevey" <mcalevey@xtra.co.nz>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <PAEFLMFGBDKKCONLMLBICEMLCCAA.ganymede444@btopenworld.com> <Pine.OSF.4.56.0503082037530.11141@plato.ucs.mun.ca> <002801c5248d$c27cbab0$565137d2@mcalevey> <000001c52674$ed58aa80$6ac536d2@mcalevey>
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No LF signals seen overnight. Looking again tomorrow .921 to .923.

Mike ZL4OL


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Bob and Mike,

Thanks , tomorrow again AR..AR  on 135.92125

Teo YU7AR



M> No LF signals seen overnight. Looking again tomorrow .921 to .923.

M> Mike ZL4OL


M> __________ NOD32 1.1024 (20050311) Information __________

M> This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus System.
M> http://www.nod32.com




-- 
Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



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References: <PAEFLMFGBDKKCONLMLBICEMLCCAA.ganymede444@btopenworld.com> <Pine.OSF.4.56.0503082037530.11141@plato.ucs.mun.ca> <002801c5248d$c27cbab0$565137d2@mcalevey> <000001c52674$ed58aa80$6ac536d2@mcalevey> <000001c5274a$6ba84460$a0c536d2@mcalevey> <73174145307.20050312234216@pyrotherm.co.yu>
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Teo YU7AR,

> Bob and Mike,
>
> Thanks , tomorrow again AR..AR  on 135.92125

Thanks.  I'll be able to monitor for EU beacons for the foreseeable future. 
For information I've now got gear hooked up at home, but earlier in the week 
it was still packed from the Quartz Hill weekend.

73, Bob ZL2CA 



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hi Alan,

> Hi Hartmut interesting. I have good strength plots from John's WD2XES Part 5
> beacon. (Warren was not active) John's signal were "O" at midnight but
> strengthened about 0045 fading about 0245z and only returned at about "M" at
> 0500z for 45 mins.
> Alan G3NYK

nice propagation last night ;-). Copied all "XES" strings between
0040z and 0530z "O".

73
Hartmut



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First signs from "XES" visible here 0040z tonight.

73

Hartmut Wolff
Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de



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Message-ID: <008a01c5277d$c051aaa0$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL>
From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Sat, 12 Mar 2005 22:35:44 -0500
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Subject: LF: G3AQC/W1VD crossband
Content-Type: multipart/mixed;
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<DIV>Excerpt from&nbsp;G3AQC/W1VD crossband qso earlier this evening...M copy of 
G3AQC transmission. Condx not as good as past couple weekends.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><IMG alt="" hspace=0 src="cid:008401c5277d$bd1396a0$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL" 
align=baseline border=0></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 
<IMG alt="" hspace=0 src="cid:008501c5277d$bd1396a0$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL" 
align=baseline border=0>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;Jay, W1VD</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>P.S.&nbsp;Decoder ring not handy? W1VD RM S9 
K</DIV></BODY></HTML></FONT></FONT>

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--------------070307080302090700010409--

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From: "Steve McDonald" <jsm@gulfislands.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <008a01c5277d$c051aaa0$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL>
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  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">Very FB guys!! This is great to see. Hopefully 
  it will encourage more of the same. Excellent....congrats to you both!!!</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">Steve / VE7SLWeb: "THE VE7SL RADIO NOTEBOOK" 
  at&nbsp;&nbsp; <A 
  href="http://www.imagenisp.ca/jsm">http://www.imagenisp.ca/jsm</A><BR>[L.F. 
  Loops] [Tuna Tin DX] [H.F. Maritime DX] [Crystal Radio DXing]<BR>[2200m Band] 
  * NEW [CQ Crossband - 2200m To HF] [NDB DX] 
[Boatanchors]<BR></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hello Jay,

Nice capture from Laurie, I start abt 22:00 and stop 00:30, because very
strong rain coming here, sory  .

 73 Teo

-- 
Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Lawrence Mayhead G3AQC <laurie@g3aqc.freeserve.co.uk>
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------=_Part_28365_15731352.1110714002579
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Hi All,
I will transmit for a short time tonight 135.921.1/.3  say 22:30 to 23;30utc this will be a propagation check.
Also 18:00 to 19 :00  135.921.4/5 kHz, DFCW 120 for ZL.
73  Laurie

-- 

Whatever you Wanadoo:
http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/

This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more at: http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm
------=_Part_28365_15731352.1110714002579
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<P>Hi All,</P>
<P>I will transmit for a short time tonight 135.921.1/.3&nbsp; say 22:30 to 23;30utc this will be a propagation check.</P>
<P>Also 18:00 to 19 :00&nbsp;&nbsp;135.921.4/5 kHz,&nbsp;DFCW&nbsp;120 for ZL.</P>
<P>73&nbsp; Laurie</P><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>
------=_Part_28365_15731352.1110714002579--




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Many thanks to all who responded to my query about the break down voltage 
of a spark gap. I now have more than enough info to continue my article on 
the early work of Marconi.

73, Dick, PA0SE




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Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 13:31:25 +0100
From: Dick Rollema <dickrollema@casema.nl>
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<html>
<body>
<font size=3>Dear Brian,<br><br>
Thanks for your reply. I also possess<i> Reference Data for Radio
Engineers</i>. I found the info you proviided on page 921.&nbsp; This is
what I was looking for!<br><br>
73, Dick, PA0SE<br><br>
At 20:48 10-3-05, you wrote:<br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">Hi Dick <br>
&nbsp;<br>
Looking in my trusty &quot;Reference Data for Radio Engineers&quot; (won
in a rally raffle at least 40 years ago !) the spark gap voltages chart
indicates about 30 kV per inch for &quot;needles&quot; and between 55 and
80 kV for spheres spaced and inch apart (depending on the size of the
spheres). Hope that helps.<br>
&nbsp;<br>
Brian <br><br>
<b><i>Dick Rollema &lt;dickrollema@casema.nl&gt;</i></b> wrote:<br>
</font>
<dl>
<dd>TYo All from PA0SE<br><br>

<dd>I am presently writing an article for our VERON magazine
Electron&nbsp; </i>on the early radio experiments by Marconi. In these
experiments spark gaps played an important role. Because I would like to
perform some simple calculations on the peak power radiated by a spark
transmitter I am looking for data on the break down voltage of spark
gaps, consisting of two spheres.<br>

<dd>In literature, found on the Internet, 75kV/inch is quoted but it is
not stated whether this is between points or spheres and that makes a lot
of difference.<br>

<dd>Temperature and air pressure also influence break down voltage but I
will forget about that, reckoning with &quot;normal&quot;
conditions&nbsp; of, <br>

<dd>say , 20 degrees centigrade and&nbsp; 1000 hectopascal or whatever as
reckoned as standard&nbsp; barometric pressure. <br>

<dd>Your help will be very much appreciated.<br><br>

<dd>73, Dick, PA0SE<br>

<dd>JN22GD <br><br>

</dl>Send instant messages to your online friends
<a href="http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com/" eudora="autourl">http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com</a>
</blockquote></body>
</html>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Dmitry RA3YO <ilena@online.debryansk.ru>
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Hi Lf group

See:
http://ra3yo.narod.ru/gun.gif
It's nice work

Dmitri RA3YO




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Subject: Re: LF:  XES Mar 13th, G3AQC/W1VD crossband
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Dear LF Group,<BR>
<BR>
nice dashes from XES early morning today, also in the noisier parts of Germany ;-)<BR>
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/df6nm2/XES_13Mar05_0430-0530.jpg">http://members.aol.com/df6nm2/XES_13Mar05_0430-0530.jpg</A> (8kB).<BR>
<BR>
Congratulations to Laurie and Jay on your complete X-band QSO. A sniplet from the Eu side shows G3AQC's transmission along with "AR" and RA3YO. Before Teo had to switch off, some strange sidebands appeared his signal, as if there was a slow modulation - antenna swinging in the storm? <BR>
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/df6nm2/AQC-AR-YO_13May05.gif">http://members.aol.com/df6nm2/AQC-AR-YO_13May05.gif</A> (74kB).<BR>
<BR>
Good luck to all<BR>
<BR>
Markus, DF6NM</FONT></HTML>

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Hi all,

Nil received here pre-dawn.

73, Bob



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Hello rsgb,

  copied 12 mar at 23.22 utc.

-- 
Best regards,
 ew6cm at ko45hn                         mailto:ew6cm@tut.by



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Message-ID: <4234A260.10600@g3ysx.org.uk>
Date: Sun, 13 Mar 2005 20:28:16 +0000
From: Stewart Bryant <stewart@g3ysx.org.uk>
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Subject: Re: LF: Re:Off topic, spark gaps, from dk8nd
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In interesting effect with spark gaps is the way that they change character
when they are not used. Apparently the metal surfaces grow whiskers which
are burned away with use. So if you do not use a spark gap for a while
the breakdown voltage lowers, and gradually increases as the whiskers get
burned off. I would therefore think that not only do you need to use a
radioactive source to ensure a source of ionization, but you would need
to run the gap in before getting an accurate result.

The ionization trick is also used in low jitter thyratrons, although some,
such as the infamous KN22B also provide a preionised gas supply
so as to ensure that the discharge characteristics are identical from
shot to shot.

- Stewart G3YSX

Hans-Albrecht Haffa wrote:

>Dear Dick, 
>spark gaps are a genuine way of measuring high voltages in a HV-Laboratory. There exist tables for DC and AC 50 Hz. Spark gaps must be used, as it is impossible to use a rotary swich in a meter at 100kV or more. oen of the spheres is doped with an radioactive element to cause discharge always at the same place on the spheres surface.  Break down voltage is checked with observers eye and ears and depends on Voltage (ac/dc, HF), temperature, humidity and absolute air pressure. An uncertainity of about +-2% may be obtained in voltage-measurements. A gross value for break down voltage is 30 kV/cm. Try to get into contact with an advanced engineering school teaching energy technics, machine engineering and High frequency technics. If the schools is specialized on contemporary data processing, electronics and international economy, You are wrong, so an traditional institution is recommended. In my case it is "Georg-Simon-Ohm-Fachhochschule Nürnberg".
>
>73,
>Hans-Albrecht
>DK 8 ND
>
>
>-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht (HTML) wurde als Anlage beigefügt.-----
>Von:      rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
>Gesendet: 10.03.05 20:51:22
>An:       "Hans-Albrecht Haffa" <dk8nd@web.de>
>Betreff:  Re: LF: Off topic
>
>
>__________________________________________________________
>Mit WEB.DE FreePhone mit hoechster Qualitaet ab 0 Ct./Min.
>weltweit telefonieren! http://freephone.web.de/?mc=021201
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <311067511@web.de> <4234A260.10600@g3ysx.org.uk>
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Subject: Re: LF: Re:Off topic, spark gaps, from dk8nd
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Hi Stwart, the same thing is used in surge arrestors for submarine cable
repeaters....the high voltage clamp is a gas tube, but being in the dark it
requires an little ionisation to be sure it strikes at the right voltage.
Some neons wont strike properly if you leave in the drawer for years.

By the way did you get my reply about the HiRose coax lead ?? or are all my
mails falling into your virus trap ??

Cheers de Alan G3NYK

----- Original Message -----
From: "Stewart Bryant" <stewart@g3ysx.org.uk>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 13 March 2005 20:28
Subject: Re: LF: Re:Off topic, spark gaps, from dk8nd


In interesting effect with spark gaps is the way that they change character
when they are not used. Apparently the metal surfaces grow whiskers which
are burned away with use. So if you do not use a spark gap for a while
the breakdown voltage lowers, and gradually increases as the whiskers get
burned off. I would therefore think that not only do you need to use a
radioactive source to ensure a source of ionization, but you would need
to run the gap in before getting an accurate result.

The ionization trick is also used in low jitter thyratrons, although some,
such as the infamous KN22B also provide a preionised gas supply
so as to ensure that the discharge characteristics are identical from
shot to shot.

- Stewart G3YSX





From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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No signals seen overnight.

Mike ZL4OL


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: LF: Who Calling me?
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------000808040203090908000909
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Dear LF, I just received this fragment of my call sign, then the signal
disappeared!

Cheers

Dave G3WCB IO91RM

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--------------000808040203090908000909--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Added captures of G3XIZ, DK1IS, DK8ND, SP5ZCC, G3KEV, DL3FDO ON7ZO,
S57A, DM2BHG, G3WCB, RA3YO (12th), HF75PZK (12th) and RU6LA (12th)to my
website:

 http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm



73
Hartmut Wolff
Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Dear Pat, Les, LF,

I've been using the Icom PCR-1000 on LF for a few months, and it works
pretty well with my inverted-L antenna. It tunes down to 137 kHz OK so you
don't need a converter, but you do need a pre-amp/preselector to get the
best from the radio and suppress any birdies. I have been using the design
from G3YXM's webpage http://www.wireless.org.uk/circuits2.htm. (The one with
the two Toko coils)

The tuning is very stable and repeatable, the only slight drawback being
that you can't fit any additional narrow CW filters. This is fine for most
LF modes, ARGO etc, but if you need further filtering for audible CW, say,
you can follow it with an audio filter or use a filter program such as
Spectran.

Set the radio to 135.500 kHz USB to view the entire LF band using Spectran.

Dave G3WCB

IO91RM


-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Les Thompson
Sent: 12 March 2005 18:50
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: Re: LF: G3AQC


In article <15d.4c7d573a.2f647476@aol.com>, G4gvw@aol.com writes
>Hi Les,
> 
>I was interested to see you are using a PCR1000.
> 
>I too have one of these Rx's and have not so far considered it for LF
>as I have others in use.
> 
>Have you compared it with anything else?
> 
>Apart from selectivity of loop are you using any other preselection?
> 
>Regards Pat g4gvw

Hello Pat

I only have the PCR1000 and an IC-725 that will cover the 137KHz
band. Between the two of them the PCR1000 is the more stable when
it's been on for about half an hour, it seems to produce fewer
birdies and there seems little difference in sensitivity.

I did try an LF converter that a friend lent me but it didn't
perform well with the loop, looked like an impedance mis-match
as it was reasonably perky when fed with an end fed wire.

No preselector or pre-amp, I only have the loop and when I want
to watch the whole 2.1KHz spectrum I have to dampen the Q with a
560K carbon resistor, I was surprised at how sharp the tuning is.
As Laurie said I really need to get something outside but I'm
still trying different configurations of loop at the moment
and it's easier to play with them indoors.

I've never done anything other than briefly listen on LF before
a few months ago and now know why I could never hear any activity
having done a bit of reading and also monitoring this group for
a short while. I got interested before Christmas when Walter
DJ2LF started his 440KHz tests and then moved lower to see what
I could hear.

Looks like I've still got a lot to learn.

73
--
Les G8ARF / G3VYZ




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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XDW ramping up again - now at 624W input from 0505z appx 14th March 2005. 
Will be back at Fullpower tomorrow after safety checks.

Laurence
137,7753/137,7756Khz dfcw 90
wd2xdw




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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TA Enthusiasts

One or two elements from AQC copied  near end of his transmission at
0000Z. Otherwise no other signals noted. Reception plagued by static
from big Tstorms over the southeasten states.

Will continue monitoring if TA activity present on DF6NM 135922 kHz
window.

Jay, W1VD



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Cc: "Dave Pick" <g3yxm@wireless.org.uk>
Subject: LF WEEKEND
Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:26:35 -0000
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi All</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>There was a lot of countries acty this past 
weekend&nbsp;&nbsp;on 137 khz, all good strong signals both on CW and 
QRS3.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>My best DX&nbsp;was UA6LV&nbsp;on CW 136.6 Khz - 
2824&nbsp;Km.&nbsp;My best so far has been RN6BN on CW at 2970 Km </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>also on CW&nbsp;worked PA0WFO, G3XIZ, DL2HRE, 
DK7SU, DM2BHG, ON7ZO.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>On QRS3 worked RA3YO, HA6PC, SP5ZCC.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>There were others active YU7AR&nbsp;and S57A all 
worked before.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I need more countries to become active</FONT><FONT 
face=Arial size=2>&nbsp;for DXCC, &nbsp;I am about one third of the way so 
far.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Thanks to all those making the effort on 137 
Khz.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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LF enthusiasts,

Monday, March 14, 2005 Mal G3KEV wrote:

..............
hm> I need more countries to become active for DXCC,  I am about one third
hm> of the way so far.
..............

"DXCC 136kHz" 2-way is a difficult task and especially in normal CW !
I believe that now can work on 136kHz band abt 70 countries, but the real
stations are only in abt 30 countries and CW for you it is even less ;-(

Reino OH1TN (OH5UFO) has now 28 countries for "DXCC 136kHz" (CW & QRSS)
http://koti.mbnet.fi/oh5ufo/136log.html
He began to work on 136kHz since April 1997

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: Re: PCR-1000 <was RE: LF: G3AQC>
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<DIV>Hi Dave,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Thanks for the info. I have not tried my PCR1000 on LF but I&nbsp;may now 
give it a try as it would be useful to have an alternative radio available for 
LF.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>73 de Pat g4gvw</DIV></FONT></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: LF: noise level on 137kHz
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Today I noted a higher noise level on 137kHz since 1353z. This
increase of noise could also be seen on the DF6NM grabber. Maybe this
is a result of the DRM transmission from the Deutschland Radio on
177kHz with 500kw.
  
73

 Hartmut                          mailto:wolff.h@t-online.de



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Lesnichy" <ed@dx.ru>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 12:04 PM
Subject: LF: DXCC 136kHz


> LF enthusiasts,
>
> Monday, March 14, 2005 Mal G3KEV wrote:
>
> ..............
> hm> I need more countries to become active for DXCC, I am about one third
> hm> of the way so far.
> ..............
>
> "DXCC 136kHz" 2-way is a difficult task and especially in normal CW !
> I believe that now can work on 136kHz band abt 70 countries, but the real
> stations are only in abt 30 countries and CW for you it is even less ;-(
>
> Reino OH1TN (OH5UFO) has now 28 countries for "DXCC 136kHz" (CW & QRSS)
> http://koti.mbnet.fi/oh5ufo/136log.html
> He began to work on 136kHz since April 1997
>
> 73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru

Tnx Ed  for all the info.
I started when the band became available to UK amateurs in 1998.
So far I have worked 26 countries 2 way on 137 khz plus 2 xband 137khz/7025
khz VE and W

22 countries 2 way on 137 khz normal CW
4 countries 2 way on 137 khz QRS3 (not active on CW so far)
2 countries xband,  my signal on 137 khz and the other stn on 7025 khz,
VE1ZJ and W4DEX plus other W stns also.
I would like to work UA9 area on CW, pse let me know when you are going
there again.
I have worked UA9 and UA0 many times on 160 metres.
73 de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH

>
>



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From: "McAlevey" <mcalevey@xtra.co.nz>
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References: <PAEFLMFGBDKKCONLMLBICEMLCCAA.ganymede444@btopenworld.com> <Pine.OSF.4.56.0503082037530.11141@plato.ucs.mun.ca> <002801c5248d$c27cbab0$565137d2@mcalevey>
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 07:42:29 +1300
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No signals seen overnight. Looking again tomorrow .921 to .923

Mike ZL4OL


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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: lowfer@lwca.org
Cc: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 10:18:07 -0900
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XDW will be intermittent this evening as I play at adding a 3rd large and 
final #4 conductor in parallel on the loop. Its necessary to do this today 
as the leaves are coming out and I dont want a snagging time with my loop 
erection weapon of choice.

Im back at full power +-0.5dBr at 1900z 14th March 05, where r is some 
reference to "optimum measured max local field strength and current 
measurement...."

It looks like I have just 2 or 3 months left of operating time here in 
Oklahoma  before Im "moved" - shame - and I was just starting to get used to 
the fried Okra and y'all..

Laurence em26aq
wd2xdw 137,7753/6 Khz dfcw 90
status http://myweb.cableone.net/flow




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 20:17:02 +0000
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
From: Les Thompson <Les@holywell.demon.co.uk>
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 <PAEFLMFGBDKKCONLMLBIMENNCCAA.ganymede444@btopenworld.com>
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Subject: Re: PCR-1000 <was RE: LF: G3AQC>
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In article <PAEFLMFGBDKKCONLMLBIMENNCCAA.ganymede444@btopenworld.com>, 
Dave G3WCB <ganymede444@btopenworld.com> writes
>Dear Pat, Les, LF,
>
>I've been using the Icom PCR-1000 on LF for a few months, and it works
>pretty well with my inverted-L antenna. It tunes down to 137 kHz OK so you
>don't need a converter, but you do need a pre-amp/preselector to get the
>best from the radio and suppress any birdies. I have been using the design
>from G3YXM's webpage http://www.wireless.org.uk/circuits2.htm. (The one with
>the two Toko coils)
>
Thanks Dave for that, I should have that same pre-amp in circuit
sometime in the next few days and will be interested to see the
difference with my small loop.

>The tuning is very stable and repeatable, the only slight drawback being
>that you can't fit any additional narrow CW filters. This is fine for most
>LF modes, ARGO etc, but if you need further filtering for audible CW, say,
>you can follow it with an audio filter or use a filter program such as
>Spectran.
>
This is my experience with the PCR1000, I was surprised just how stable
it became after allowing it to warm up unlike my IC-725 which has a
permanent drift, not very much but too much for LF listening which is
a pity because I have better filtering in it. I also use a Datong FL3
for audio filtering as and when necessary.

>Set the radio to 135.500 kHz USB to view the entire LF band using Spectran.
>
I do this but found I needed to damp the Q of the loop to see the
full bandwidth, the next loop to be built hopefully will improve on
this.

-- 
Les G8ARF / G3VYZ / RSARS 173


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Subject: Re: LF: noise level on 137kHz
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Dear Hartmut and LF,<BR>
<BR>
yes, I can confirm your observation. The violet (northerly) noise can be found in the stored grabber screenshots, which I uploaded again at<BR>
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/df6nm2/test0503141400.gif">http://members.aol.com/df6nm2/test0503141400.gif</A> (291kB) and <BR>
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/df6nm2/test0503141420.gif">http://members.aol.com/df6nm2/test0503141420.gif</A> (318kB) ;<BR>
you may have to increase the display brightness or gamma to actually see the background.<BR>
<BR>
After a very strong and short peak at 13:53, the noise changed several times at lower levels after 14:00. An a-posteriori evaluation from the calibrated captures within an otherwise empty part of the band resulted in the plot shown here. The arrows are associated with apparent changes in the suspected 177 kHz sidebands, possibly related to tuning activity at the TX site. The level increased from a relatively quiet background of ~ -23 dBµV/m /sqrt(Hz) by about 6 to 10 dB. There may be a little uncertainty due to the 256-colour mapping in the stored gif images, but the RMS averages should be good to within a couple of dB.<BR>
<BR>
Given the groundwave distance of 380 km between Berlin and Nuernberg, this would result in a radiated power density of approximately<BR>
 -13&nbsp; - 79.5 + 20 * log (380) + 0.02 * 380&nbsp; dBW/Hz = -33.3 dBW/Hz,<BR>
equivalent to 0.47 W/kHz or - 60 dBc/kHz, at 40 kHz (!) from the carrier. This is roughly the same sideband level that the 153 kHz DLF transmitter had at the time of its infamous modulator fault. I am not sure whether 177 kHz is currently being operated in the compatible "simulcast" mode, which transmits analog and digital modulation at the same time, and what effect this would have on the spectral envelope.<BR>
<BR>
These interference levels are potentially quite threatening to any weak-signal work on LF. What makes it even more alarming is that unlike analog AM with its relatively low average modulation index, DRM sidebands are continuously at 100% density. Unless radiated powers would be decreased by an order of magnitude, the migration to digital will also be likely to change the character of nightly Luxembourg effect in a nasty way.<BR>
<BR>
So let's make good use of this wonderful band it while it is still usable :-(<BR>
<BR>
Regards <BR>
de Markus, DF6NM<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In einer eMail vom 14.03.2005 16:58:43 Westeuropäische Normalzeit schreibt wolff.h@t-online.de: <BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Today I noted a higher noise level on 137kHz since 1353z. This<BR>
increase of noise could also be seen on the DF6NM grabber. Maybe this<BR>
is a result of the DRM transmission from the Deutschland Radio on<BR>
177kHz with 500kw.<BR>
 <BR>
73<BR>
<BR>
Hartmut&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; mailto:wolff.h@t-online.de<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</FONT></HTML>
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<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>Can anyone recall this equation, I know it was 
mentioned on this reflector before...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>What is the output voltage for an untuned small 
loop into an arbitrarily high impedance?&nbsp; It is proportional to H, and 
presumably F^2, and I seem to recall it is an absolute value, virtually 
un-influenced by losses, conductor diameter etc.&nbsp; Therefore can be used for 
accurate H field (and hence far field radiation) signal strength 
measurements.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>Andy&nbsp; G4JNT</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Ian Drummond described something like this in an early issue of CREGJ.  I will see what I can find.

John G3PAI

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********

On 15/03/2005 at 09:01 Andy wrote:

>Can anyone recall this equation, I know it was mentioned on this
>reflector before...
>
>What is the output voltage for an untuned small loop into an arbitrarily
>high impedance?  It is proportional to H, and presumably F^2, and I seem
>to recall it is an absolute value, virtually un-influenced by losses,
>conductor diameter etc.  Therefore can be used for accurate H field (and
>hence far field radiation) signal strength measurements.
>
>Andy  G4JNT





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<HTML><BODY><DIV style='font-family: "Verdana"; font-size: 10pt;'><DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Hi Andy</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;U =&nbsp;omega * µo * H * area&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>with µo = 4 * pi * 10^-7 Vs/A/m, omega = 2 * pi * f .</DIV>
<DIV><BR>73 de Markus, DF6NM</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>-----Original Message-----<BR>From: Andy &lt;actalbot@southsurf.com&gt;<BR>To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<BR>Sent: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:01:51 -0000<BR>Subject: LF: Untuned loops<BR><BR></DIV>
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<DIV id=AOLMsgPart_2_933454df-b8fe-49bd-8705-56a0ae1e11df>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>Can anyone recall this equation, I know it was mentioned on this reflector before...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>What is the output voltage for an untuned small loop into an arbitrarily high impedance?&nbsp; It is proportional to H, and presumably F^2, and I seem to recall it is an absolute value, virtually un-influenced by losses, conductor diameter etc.&nbsp; Therefore can be used for accurate H field (and hence far field radiation) signal strength measurements.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>Andy&nbsp; G4JNT</FONT></DIV></DIV><!-- end of AOLMsgPart_2_933454df-b8fe-49bd-8705-56a0ae1e11df --></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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Hi Laurence,

nice copy of XDW tonight. It's good to see a DX signal coming through again.

Mike ZL4OL



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Loop induced emf(volts)  = 2*pi*(field strength in v/m)*(loop area in 
sq.
metres)* (loop turns)/wavelength.

Which for the single turn untuned circular loop case, can be
simplified to;

Loop induced emf (microvolts) = 
16.449*freq(kHz)*loopdia(m)*loopdia(m)*field
strength(v/m)

Ref: Terman, "Radio Engineering", Section 11, Para 18.

Dave, ZL3FJ

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Andy" <actalbot@southsurf.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2005 10:01 PM
Subject: LF: Untuned loops


Can anyone recall this equation, I know it was mentioned on this 
reflector before...

What is the output voltage for an untuned small loop into an 
arbitrarily high impedance?  It is proportional to H, and presumably 
F^2, and I seem to recall it is an absolute value, virtually 
un-influenced by losses, conductor diameter etc.  Therefore can be 
used for accurate H field (and hence far field radiation) signal 
strength measurements.

Andy  G4JNT



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<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
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A good discussion (with formulas) on the subject can be found here :<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.vlf.it/octoloop/rlt-n4ywk.htm">http://www.vlf.it/octoloop/rlt-n4ywk.htm</a><br>
<br>
73&nbsp; Alberto&nbsp; I2PHD<br>
--------------------------------------------<br>
<br>
Andy wrote:
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  <meta content="&quot;MSHTML 4.72.3110.7&quot;" name="GENERATOR">
  <div><font color="#000000" size="2">Can anyone recall this equation,
I know it was mentioned on this reflector before...</font></div>
  <div>&nbsp;</div>
  <div><font color="#000000" size="2">What is the output voltage for an
untuned small loop into an arbitrarily high impedance?&nbsp; It is
proportional to H, and presumably F^2, and I seem to recall it is an
absolute value, virtually un-influenced by losses, conductor diameter
etc.&nbsp; Therefore can be used for accurate H field (and hence far field
radiation) signal strength measurements.</font></div>
  <div>&nbsp;</div>
  <div><font color="#000000" size="2">Andy&nbsp; G4JNT</font></div>
</blockquote>
</body>
</html>

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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>TA enthusiasts</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Not much to show...but it is something. Frequencies 
look correct.&nbsp;Will continue watching if there is TA activity.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Time is EST.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jay, W1VD</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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aXyV9JXNkSZLrKyW7hpLsoqTo0rHJbBWoawvJR1pX6Vs351qRy5G4l1XP8XN9VyympGi5sg0
RiHIWjowmPR0wGQ+zyXJDKOXKU2vTIF21KQst9lsa/ydwdjZUzUivysy5gzPLiQnqZSk119l
37rhuuNLdYbcQ0h1/UY0a7spb7p5APMutwr2BiVK/9k=
--------------060007070208070807010002--

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<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>Thanks to all respondees - I knew it was a 
simple formula and was (theroretically) an exact way of determining field 
strength.&nbsp; Just need to make sure the input impedance of the voltmeter is 
significantly higher than the loop impedance to avoid any loading 
effects.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>(Someone here wants to measure the field strength of a 
transmission in the HF band)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>Andy&nbsp;&nbsp; G4JNT</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE 
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">
    <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><B>-----Original Message-----</B><BR><B>From: 
    </B><A href="mailto:markusvester@aol.com">markusvester@aol.com</A> &lt;<A 
    href="mailto:markusvester@aol.com">markusvester@aol.com</A>&gt;<BR><B>To: 
    </B><A 
    href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> 
    &lt;<A 
    href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A>&gt;<BR><B>Date: 
    </B>2005/03/15 10:58<BR><B>Subject: </B>Re: LF: Untuned 
    loops<BR><BR></DIV></FONT>
    <DIV style="FONT-FAMILY: Verdana; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">
    <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV>Hi Andy</DIV>
    <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV>&nbsp;U =&nbsp;omega * &micro;o * H * area&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV>with &micro;o = 4 * pi * 10^-7 Vs/A/m, omega = 2 * pi * f .</DIV>
    <DIV><BR>73 de Markus, DF6NM</DIV>
    <DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV>-----Original Message-----<BR>From: Andy 
    &lt;actalbot@southsurf.com&gt;<BR>To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<BR>Sent: 
    Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:01:51 -0000<BR>Subject: LF: Untuned loops<BR><BR></DIV>
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    <DIV id=AOLMsgPart_2_933454df-b8fe-49bd-8705-56a0ae1e11df>
    <DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>Can anyone recall this equation, I know it 
    was mentioned on this reflector before...</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>What is the output voltage for an untuned 
    small loop into an arbitrarily high impedance?&nbsp; It is proportional to 
    H, and presumably F^2, and I seem to recall it is an absolute value, 
    virtually un-influenced by losses, conductor diameter etc.&nbsp; Therefore 
    can be used for accurate H field (and hence far field radiation) signal 
    strength measurements.</FONT></DIV>
    <DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
    <DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>Andy&nbsp; G4JNT</FONT></DIV></DIV><!-- end of AOLMsgPart_2_933454df-b8fe-49bd-8705-56a0ae1e11df --></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Just happened to notice...Kyoto "real time" DST 
showing +14 at the moment...will be interesting to see where it "settles 
in".</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jay, W1VD</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi All</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>As a result of my recent msgs abt CW acty I have 
now received several msgs about CW skeds from stns in EU.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>These msgs have been sent privately and for those 
interested pse let me know what time suits best and any freq 
preference.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Daytime or Evening is suitable. Let me have your 
choice. I can hear most EU stns that are currently using QRS and hopefully you 
will be able to hear me.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>SV, EW and CN would help towards DXCC</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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Jay,

>Just happened to notice...Kyoto "real time" DST showing +14 at the
moment...will be interesting to see where it "settles in".<

My guess would be a negative plunge. An incoming disturbance usually raises
the horizontal part of the geomag field, and then it drops rapidly, with a
slow recovery. So a sharp up-tick can be a sign of a downward movement to
follow. Or it could be a measurement anomaly! This index frequently doesn't
bear close watching, which is why the results get revised before they are
"officially" used.

JA




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> will be interesting to see where it "settles in".

Or rather where it crashes down too!

Scott





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Hi all,

Nothing seen from EU beacons early this morning.  Will try again tonight.

73, Bob ZL2CA



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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Nw on beacon mode at 1930 utc around 136.8 khz 
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; CW rst 569 on my 80 M&nbsp;E/W&nbsp;vert loop and barely 
audible on the vertical !!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>OH0RJ qth Aland Islands JP90XC 
EU&nbsp;TT2</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>De Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
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Hi Jay, yes I think John has it about right. I look at it this way.....you
are trying to estimate the values of a "current"  flowing round the equator
in the Van Allen belt. This generates a field that you can detect at the
Equator and less so further away from the equator, with a sensitive magnetic
field measuring device (Magetometer) The magnitude of the field due to the
ring current is about 0.1% of the static geomagnetic field. Unfortunately
the magnetometer will also respond to any distortions in the static field.
So the "change in shape" of the magnetoshere caused by the sudden increase
in pressure of the Solar-wind / CME shock front will cause a transient
change. It is not until the electrons and ions have "passed by" Earth and
some have been collected in the "tail" that these are "sucked back" and
enter the ring current. Things move very quickly, but the "transient"
changes can be misleading. I always regard the most reliable values as those
when the Kp has recovered to low values. The transient positive swings DO
indicate an event....I expect that in the next 3 hour period you will
probably see NOAA plot a Kp=4 or even 5 and then the Dst will plunge down to
the -60s again. It will be interesting to see how quickly this affects
Steve's plot of DCF39. His path is quite close to the auroral circle, so
there may be some depression in the later part of the night. If NOAAs
appreciation of the size of the coronal hole is right this should not be a
very serious event, in their terms a minor storm (Kp<6). But I guess it will
"top-up" the ring current again and slow the return to really quiet
conditions.......which may lead to worse propagation (!!) or at least "not
the best levels"
Fascinating stuff this ionoshere !!

Cheers dde Alan G3NYK
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 15 March 2005 18:22
Subject: LF: DST


Just happened to notice...Kyoto "real time" DST showing +14 at the
moment...will be interesting to see where it "settles in".

Jay, W1VD




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Alan,

After a few hours of not seeing any increase in the solar wind speed or
density, I wonder if the Dst isn't just plain above zero. The Dst usually
lags the other indicators, doesn't it?

John A.




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Hi John Uhmmmm Well It takes NOAA about 4 hours to do a planetary K
calculation and the NOAA plot is always a bit behind. But the GEOS Hp and
the Electron Flux plots dont show any disturbance. It could depend on which
stations Kyoto are getting data from. If they have been over-estimating all
day it might be coming back. Certainly the last 5 hours or so Dst estimates
dont look like a transient. Maybe a big bolt of lightning cleared the ring
?? Oh NO.... I know what it is.................. Laurence is back on full
power !!  I wonder whether NASA correlated the "Gap Clearance" with WD2XDW
activity as well as lightning !!  :-))

Cheers de Alan G3NYK

----- Original Message -----
From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 15 March 2005 23:09
Subject: LF: Re: Re: DST


> Alan,
>
> After a few hours of not seeing any increase in the solar wind speed or
> density, I wonder if the Dst isn't just plain above zero. The Dst usually
> lags the other indicators, doesn't it?
>
> John A.
>
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Alan,

> ?? Oh NO.... I know what it is.................. Laurence is back on full
> power !!

Ahhh, the stuff of which legends are made... "Laurence of Oklahoma"! "Lord
of the Ring Current"!

If the fellows on that golf course only knew what was happening in those
trees...

John A.




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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The only signal seen overnight was XDW, M to O copy from 0845 to 1045 UTC.

Mike ZL4OL


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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>TA enthusiats</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Although propagation condx were good...noise condx 
were not. Daily thunderstorms along the&nbsp;atlantic or gulf coasts&nbsp;are 
limiting reception. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><IMG alt="" hspace=0 
src="cid:000701c52a1a$bc3da500$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL" align=baseline 
border=0></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Teo...your shorter "AR" sequence is easier to copy 
than a full call sign - did get one complete "7" on another capture, 
though.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Will keep the faith and continue running overnight 
captures.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jay, W1VD</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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<div class=Section1>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dear Andy, LF Group,</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I did a lot of experiments with measuring
loops a few years back for a project at work. You can get results that are
within a few dB quite easily, provided the loading effect of the receiver/level
meter on the loop is taken into account. However, you do have to be very
careful about nearby conductors, particularly the cables connecting the antenna
and measuring gear. If one of these is anywhere near resonance, gross errors
can be caused, particularly with a small loop. In the upper part of the HF
spectrum, say above about 10MHz, this type of effect can be quite difficult to
avoid. The best bet is to use a battery powered receiver, with a short lead to
the antenna, in the middle of some open ground, in order to minimize the possible
parasitic antenna effects. Using the clamp-on &#8220;EMC&#8221; ferrite cores at
several points on the cables can also help, but at least a few turns through
the core is needed to get usefully high impedance. Because of the much longer
wavelengths, this sort of thing is not so much of a problem at LF &#8211; although
overhead power or telephone lines can produce large errors. A typical tell tale
sign is the signal null is not in the expected direction, or there isn&#8217;t
a clear null at all.</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Cheers, Jim Moritz</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>73 de M0BMU</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b> owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On
Behalf Of </span></b>Andy<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 15 March 2005 12:31<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: LF: Untuned loops</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>Thanks to all
respondees - I knew it was a simple formula and was (theroretically) an exact
way of determining field strength.&nbsp; Just need to make sure the input
impedance of the voltmeter is significantly higher than the loop impedance to
avoid any loading effects.</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>(Someone here wants to
measure the field strength of a transmission in the HF band)</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Andy&nbsp;&nbsp; G4JNT</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:
36.0pt'><b><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Arial;font-weight:bold'>-----Original Message-----</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From: </span></b><a
href="mailto:markusvester@aol.com">markusvester@aol.com</a> &lt;<a
href="mailto:markusvester@aol.com">markusvester@aol.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To: </span></b><a
href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</a>
&lt;<a href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Date: </span></b>2005/03/15 10:58<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject: </span></b>Re: LF: Untuned loops</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>Hi Andy</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;U =&nbsp;omega * µo * H *
area&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>with µo = 4 * pi * 10^-7 Vs/A/m,
omega = 2 * pi * f .</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'><br>
73 de Markus, DF6NM</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:
36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
Verdana'>-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Andy &lt;actalbot@southsurf.com&gt;<br>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<br>
Sent: Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:01:51 -0000<br>
Subject: LF: Untuned loops</span></font></p>

</div>

<div id="AOLMsgPart_2_933454df-b8fe-49bd-8705-56a0ae1e11df">

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 color=black
face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>Can
anyone recall this equation, I know it was mentioned on this reflector
before...</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 color=black
face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>What
is the output voltage for an untuned small loop into an arbitrarily high
impedance?&nbsp; It is proportional to H, and presumably F^2, and I seem to
recall it is an absolute value, virtually un-influenced by losses, conductor
diameter etc.&nbsp; Therefore can be used for accurate H field (and hence far
field radiation) signal strength measurements.</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 color=black
face=Verdana><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;color:black'>Andy&nbsp;
G4JNT</span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</blockquote>

<!-- end of AOLMsgPart_2_933454df-b8fe-49bd-8705-56a0ae1e11df --></div>

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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dear Andy, Jim, LF Group,</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<ol start=1 type=1>
 <li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
     style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>My strong support for what Jim
     has said.  The immediate environment always affects all field measurements,
     not just magnetic field measurements. </span></font></li>
 <li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
     style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Marcus&#8217;s formula is
     correct for free-space and it is in all the books. Wire loss is not an
     issue for a typical open-circuit loop. </span></font></li>
 <li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
     style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>In an &#8216;environment&#8217;
     near real ground, buildings etc., the &#8216;physics&#8217; insists that
     such a loop gives an open circuit voltage proportional to B = mu * H.  The
     presence of the environment means that mu is not equal to the free-space
     value of mu(0).  </span></font></li>
 <li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
     style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>The current in a short-circuit
     lossless loop is directly proportional to the H field and it does not
     depend on the area.  This is not in &#8216;the antenna books&#8217;, but
     it is in some physics books dealing with super-conductivity.  </span></font></li>
 <li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
     style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>There is a third case and this
     is when the loop is resonant.  If the loop is loss-less and therefore 100%
     efficient and power matched to the load of the measuring detector.  The &#8216;physics&#8217;
     demands that the antenna &#8216;capture cross-section&#8217; should be the
     same as the capture cross-section of any short dipole.  In free-space this
     is 1.5 / 4pi square wavelengths. The received power is the (average) power
     density times this (small dipole) cross-section area. The free-space equivalent
     E and H fields can be found directly from this.  This measurement is
     irrespective and independent of (loss-less) loop size.  The &#8216;proof&#8217;
     of this is in the better antenna books, such as Kraus and Balanis.  <br>
     What the system Q ends up being does not matter for this proof.  Some may
     have noticed however that it is a matter of considerable (unnecessary) dispute,
     as reported in the pages of RadCom. However loop (or any antenna) losses
     do matter, because the cross-section area of an antenna is reduced in proportion
     to its (in)efficiency.  This point is in most of the antenna books.   After
     real conductor losses have been minimised and factored out we find
     practical outdoor Qs of 100 to 350.  In a screened room the loop Q can
     exceed 600.  </span></font></li>
 <li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
     style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>There are similar arguments for
     short-circuit, open-circuit and resonant electric field measuring &#8216;whip&#8217;
     antennas.  </span></font></li>
 <li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy'><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
     style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Thus you have six choices for
     measuring the fields of an antenna in a real environment.  Only in free
     space do all six methods give the same answer.</span></font></li>
</ol>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I hope that this is useful and of interest. 
It just goes to show that real life can be hard and difficult, but more fun
than just theory on its own.  Also it has not &#8220;all been done before!&#8221;
</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Mike -  G3LHZ</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b> owner-</span></font><font
 size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
[mailto:owner-</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
 style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>]
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>james moritz<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> </span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>16
 March 2005</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> </span></font><font
 size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>16:37</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> </span></font><font size=2
 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: LF: Untuned loops</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dear Andy, LF Group,</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I did a lot of
experiments with measuring loops a few years back for a project at work. You
can get results that are within a few dB quite easily, provided the loading
effect of the receiver/level meter on the loop is taken into account. However,
you do have to be very careful about nearby conductors, particularly the cables
connecting the antenna and measuring gear. If one of these is anywhere near
resonance, gross errors can be caused, particularly with a small loop. In the
upper part of the HF spectrum, say above about 10MHz, this type of effect can
be quite difficult to avoid. The best bet is to use a battery powered receiver,
with a short lead to the antenna, in the middle of some open ground, in order
to minimize the possible parasitic antenna effects. Using the clamp-on
&#8220;EMC&#8221; ferrite cores at several points on the cables can also help,
but at least a few turns through the core is needed to get usefully high
impedance. Because of the much longer wavelengths, this sort of thing is not so
much of a problem at LF &#8211; although overhead power or telephone lines can
produce large errors. A typical tell tale sign is the signal null is not in the
expected direction, or there isn&#8217;t a clear null at all.</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Cheers, Jim Moritz</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>73 de M0BMU</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original
Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b>
owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Andy<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> </span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>15
 March 2005</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> </span></font><font
 size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>12:31</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: LF: Untuned loops</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 color=black
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;color:black'>Thanks
to all respondees - I knew it was a simple formula and was (theroretically) an
exact way of determining field strength.&nbsp; Just need to make sure the input
impedance of the voltmeter is significantly higher than the loop impedance to
avoid any loading effects.</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt'>(Someone here
wants to measure the field strength of a transmission in the HF band)</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt'>Andy&nbsp;&nbsp;
G4JNT</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:
36.0pt'><b><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>-----Original Message-----</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From: </span></b><a
href="mailto:markusvester@aol.com">markusvester@aol.com</a> &lt;<a
href="mailto:markusvester@aol.com">markusvester@aol.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To: </span></b><a
href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</a>
&lt;<a href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Date: </span></b>2005/03/15 </span></font><font size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>10:58</span></font><font
size=2 face=Arial><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject: </span></b>Re: LF: Untuned loops</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>Hi Andy</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;U =&nbsp;omega *
µo * H * area&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>with µo = 4 * pi *
10^-7 Vs/A/m, omega = 2 * pi * f .</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'><br>
73 de Markus, DF6NM</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:
36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Verdana'>-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Andy &lt;actalbot@southsurf.com&gt;<br>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<br>
Sent: </span></font><font size=2 face=Verdana><span lang=EN-US
 style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>Tue, 15 Mar 2005</span></font><font
size=2 face=Verdana><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>
</span></font><font size=2 face=Verdana><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;
 font-family:Verdana'>09:01:51</span></font><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'> -0000<br>
Subject: LF: Untuned loops</span></font></p>

</div>

<div id="AOLMsgPart_2_933454df-b8fe-49bd-8705-56a0ae1e11df">

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 color=black
face=Verdana><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;
color:black'>Can anyone recall this equation, I know it was mentioned on this
reflector before...</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 color=black
face=Verdana><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;
color:black'>What is the output voltage for an untuned small loop into an
arbitrarily high impedance?&nbsp; It is proportional to H, and presumably F^2,
and I seem to recall it is an absolute value, virtually un-influenced by
losses, conductor diameter etc.&nbsp; Therefore can be used for accurate H
field (and hence far field radiation) signal strength measurements.</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 face=Verdana><span
lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

</div>

<div>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt'><font size=2 color=black
face=Verdana><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Verdana;
color:black'>Andy&nbsp; G4JNT</span></font></p>

</div>

</div>

</div>

</blockquote>

</div>

<!-- end of AOLMsgPart_2_933454df-b8fe-49bd-8705-56a0ae1e11df --></div>

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Hi all,

Same again, a nil report for EU beacons.

73, Bob ZL2CA



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Subject: Re: LF: Untuned and tuned loops
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Dear Mike and LF Group,<BR>
<BR>
thank you for your inspiring comments. I would like to add in a few remarks; hope they will not be regarded as too theoretical...<BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000080" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">&gt;&gt; 1. My strong support for what Jim has said.Â  The immediate environment always affects all field measurements, not just magnetic field measurements. </FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=12 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
The good side for loop measurements is that the magnetic field is much less influenced by conducting or dielectric surroundings than th
e electric field. It is easy for a tree or stone wall to shunt E to ground, whereas distorting H requires a significant current flow, which can only be supported by a large sheet of metal or a nearby wire loop. A nonresonant short pole has no effect at all. And this is "the secret" why TX loops work so well in forested terrain.<BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000080" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">&gt;&gt; 2. Marcusâ€™s formula is correct for free-space and it is in all the books. Wire loss is not an issue for a typical open-circuit loop</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=12 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
The formula connecting U to B is just an embodyment of Maxwell's&nbsp; <BR>
 rot E = -dB
/dt ,<BR>
it should very generally give the correct answer for B and (excluding ferromagnetic cores) also H.&nbsp; It's true even for an electrically loaded loop (see 4. below). However the often-used relationship between the magnetic and electric field (E/H = Zo = 377ohm) is restricted to the undisturbed far field zone.<BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000080" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">&gt;&gt; 3. In an â€˜environmentâ€™ near real ground, buildings etc., the â€˜physicsâ€™ insists that such a loop gives an open circuit voltage proportional to B = mu * H.Â  The presence of the environment means that mu is not equal to the free-space value of mu(0).</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=12 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"
 FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
Yes, but this difference is mostly neglegible. Though our environments may have a lot of dielectric and or conducting objects around, they are hardly magnetic, and Âµr = 1 is an excellent approximation in almost any situation. At RF, even a steel wall looks like a short circuit (due to the eddy currents) rather than a "magnetic wall", which would have high surface impedance. The exeption of course are nonconducting ferromagnetics, like ferrites.<BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000080" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">&gt;&gt; 4. The current in a short-circuit lossless loop is directly proportional to the H field and it does not depend on the area.Â  This is not in â€˜the antenna booksâ€™, but it is in some physics books dealing with super-conductivity.Â  </FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=12 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Ari
al" LANG="2"><BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
The short-circuit current does depend on the effective length of the magnetic flux lines. For the schoolbook case of a long cylindrical coil (n turns, arbitrary core material), we have<BR>
 U = - n area j omega Âµ H, L = n^2 Âµ area / length,<BR>
 n I = n U / (j omega L), = - H / length ,<BR>
easily memorized by the unit "amps per meter" for H. For a "short" ring coil however, the magnetic length is a function of both the wire and loop diameters.<BR>
<BR>
The original induction rule is still correct in the short circuit case, as the current creates a secondary field such that the total flux and the (averaged) H passing through the loop area is indeed nulled.<BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000080" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">&gt;&gt; 5. ...Wh
at the system Q ends up being does not matter for this proof.Â  Some may have noticed however that it is a matter of considerable (unnecessary) dispute, as reported in the pages of RadCom. However loop (or any antenna) losses do matter, because the cross-section area of an antenna is reduced in proportion to its (in)efficiency.Â  This point is in most of the antenna books.Â  Â After real conductor losses have been minimised and factored out we find practical outdoor Qs of 100 to 350.Â  In a screened room the loop Q can exceed 600.Â  </FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=12 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
This raises a fundamental issue on the efficiency limit of a small antenna. For a magnetic antenna represented by a cylinder coil in free space, we would get<BR>
&nbsp
;&nbsp; Rrad = Zo/(6pi) * area^2 * (2pi/lambda)^4<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp; X = omega L = 2pi / lambda * c * Âµo * area / length,<BR>
and using Zo/c = Âµo we get a radiation Q-factor<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp; Qrad = X / Rrad&nbsp; =&nbsp; 3/(2pi)^2 * lambda^3 / volume.<BR>
<BR>
For an electrical antenna represented by a plate capacitor, we have<BR>
&nbsp; Rrad = Zo/(6pi) * height^2 * (2pi/lambda)^2<BR>
&nbsp; X = 1/omega/C = height / (omega*epsilon*area) ,<BR>
and with 1/Zo/c = epsilon we again get the very same value<BR>
&nbsp; Qrad = 3/(2pi)^2 * lambda^3 / volume.<BR>
<BR>
If we have a lossy antenna confined in a small volume, with a given Q&lt;&lt;Qrad we get a maximum possible efficiency of<BR>
 eta = Q/Qrad = 13.2 * Q * volume / lambda^3, <BR>
no matter whether it is an electric or magnetic antenna! The energy storage is necessary to support a reactive dipole field (r^-3) between the physical antenna volume and the radiation zone, beginning at a distance lambda/2pi ("CFA"-promoters will d
isagree here...).<BR>
<BR>
Above earth, the radiation resistances and efficiencies for both types of antenna is doubled, which is plausible if we include the image antenna volume below ground. Somewhat surprisingly, this still holds true for loops above weakly conducting ground, as long as the skin depth (a few 10m at LF) is still small compared to a freespace wavelength.<BR>
<BR>
For a thin wire antenna, the "width" of the effective volume is not given by the wire diameter itself but by the capacitance of the wire. For the rule-of thumb 5 pF/m wire, we would have to use approximately half the height of the wire times its length as the effective cross section. My TX antenna (220pF at 10 m above ground, Q = 200) has an effective volume of 2483m^3 and an efficiency of&nbsp; 0.093%<BR>
<BR>
So much for now, it has become late...<BR>
73 and good night<BR>
<BR>
Markus, DF6NM<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

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Subject: RE: LF: Untuned and tuned loops
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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial PTSIZE=10
FAMILY=SANSSERIF><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dear
Markus (and LF Group)</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Thank you very much for your very useful comments. 
I have a few further comments.</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>(a)<font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></font></span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>On  item 3. below:  It is
useful to note that reflection at the walls of a waveguide and on the surface
of a real earth depend on the polarisation of the wave (and the angle of
incidence).  Also there is a useful analogy with the voltage and current waves
reflected at the end of an open-circuit, short-circuit, or imperfectly matched,
transmission line. When we consider these reflection boundary conditions we
find that mu defined as B/H is not equal to mu(0) just above a conducting or
high permeability material  ( just as you say). Above a dielectric material the
difference between mu and mu(0) is indeed negligible. However then the
difference in epsilon (defined as D/E) is large. We therefore have to consider mu
and epsilon separately initially, and then combine them together progressively
as we move away from the boundary surface. The &#8216;local&#8217; impedance is
usefully defined as Zl = (mu/epsilon)^0.5 and is not in general 377 ohms until &#8216;free-space&#8217;
is reached, away from the boundary.  I wish this was better explained in the
books!  Actually the EMC engineers appear to have a better understanding of
this than the antenna engineers. </span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>(b)<font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></font></span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Item 5 really is the heart
of the matter.  This discrepancy and disagreement between the two theoretical
approaches has existed mainly unnoticed, and certainly unresolved, for about
fifty years -  since Chu (and Wheeler) presented the well known &#8216;Q is
inversely proportional to volume&#8217; assertion that you quote.  I have gone
on record as challenging, and continue to challenge, the </span></font><font
 size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
 color:navy'>Chu</span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> assertion.   The
mathematics for this is impeccable but the &#8216;physics&#8217; and physical assumptions
are not.  My objections include: no consideration of (analytic) continuity of
the fields at the boundary of the sphere containing the antenna; no proof that
the Chu assertion excludes the possibility of additional antenna radiation modes
for which the Chu assertion does not apply; no consideration of the effects on
the large (magnetic and electric) displacement currents in the space surrounding
the sphere containing the physical antenna or the possibility (/probability) that
such currents themselves radiate; and the sometimes large discrepancies between
predicted and measured (loop) antenna efficiency results. I therefore strongly
defend the &#8216;antenna capture cross-section related to antenna pattern and defining
the antenna limiting Q&#8217; view against the Chu-Wheeler (and Kraus electric
dipole) formulas for antenna Q and radiation efficiency. </span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>(c)<font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></font></span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I agree that earth
reflections can double the radiation resistance under the right assumptions. However
some surfaces and wave polarisation can actually halve the observed radiation
resistance.  The philosophical question then is whether the ground under the
antenna is actually itself radiating or just reflecting. </span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>(d)<font size=1 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></font></span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>A further point is that
some antennas close to ground, but not necessarily conductively connected to it,
can launch strong ground waves and this in general will appear as an additional
increase in radiation resistance at the antenna terminals.  </span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>In conclusion the story (or is it saga?) of
small (loop) antennas is not yet finished. We also have to remember that field detectors
are &#8216;reciprocal&#8217; devices and are themselves small antennas.  In my
view there is considerably more to be found out on all these, particularly when
used in a real environment just above ground. .  </span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>73 and regards to all.</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Mike &#8211; G3LHZ</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>-----Original Message-----<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>From:</span></b> owner-</span></font><font
 size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
[mailto:owner-</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
 style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>]
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>MarkusVester@aol.com<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> </span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>16
 March 2005</span></font><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> </span></font><font
 size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>23:19</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> </span></font><font size=2
 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</span></font><font
size=2 face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: LF: Untuned and tuned
loops</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>&nbsp;</span></font></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Dear Mike and LF Group,<br>
<br>
thank you for your inspiring comments. I would like to add in a few remarks;
hope they will not be regarded as too theoretical...<br>
<br>
<font color=navy BACK="#ffffff" PTSIZE=10 FAMILY=SANSSERIF><span
style='color:navy;background:white'>&gt;&gt; 1. My strong support for what Jim
has said.&nbsp; The immediate environment always affects all field
measurements, not just magnetic field measurements. </span></font><font
color=black BACK="#ffffff" PTSIZE=12 FAMILY=SANSSERIF><span style='color:black;
background:white'><br>
<br>
The good side for loop measurements is that the magnetic field is much less
influenced by conducting or dielectric surroundings than the electric field. It
is easy for a tree or stone wall to shunt E to ground, whereas distorting H
requires a significant current flow, which can only be supported by a large
sheet of metal or a nearby wire loop. A nonresonant short pole has no effect at
all. And this is &quot;the secret&quot; why TX loops work so well in forested
terrain.<br>
<br>
</span></font><font color=navy BACK="#ffffff" PTSIZE=10 FAMILY=SANSSERIF><span
style='color:navy;background:white'>&gt;&gt; 2. Marcus&#8217;s formula is correct
for free-space and it is in all the books. Wire loss is not an issue for a
typical open-circuit loop</span></font><font color=black BACK="#ffffff"
PTSIZE=12 FAMILY=SANSSERIF><span style='color:black;background:white'><br>
<br>
The formula connecting U to B is just an embodyment of Maxwell's&nbsp; <br>
rot E = -dB/dt ,<br>
it should very generally give the correct answer for B and (excluding
ferromagnetic cores) also H.&nbsp; It's true even for an electrically loaded
loop (see 4. below). However the often-used relationship between the magnetic
and electric field (E/H = Zo = 377ohm) is restricted to the undisturbed far
field zone.<br>
<br>
</span></font><font color=navy BACK="#ffffff" PTSIZE=10 FAMILY=SANSSERIF><span
style='color:navy;background:white'>&gt;&gt; 3. In an &#8216;environment&#8217;
near real ground, buildings etc., the &#8216;physics&#8217; insists that such a
loop gives an open circuit voltage proportional to B = mu * H.&nbsp; The
presence of the environment means that mu is not equal to the free-space value
of mu(0).</span></font><font color=black BACK="#ffffff" PTSIZE=12
FAMILY=SANSSERIF><span style='color:black;background:white'><br>
<br>
Yes, but this difference is mostly neglegible. Though our environments may have
a lot of dielectric and or conducting objects around, they are hardly magnetic,
and µr = 1 is an excellent approximation in almost any situation. At RF, even a
steel wall looks like a short circuit (due to the eddy currents) rather than a
&quot;magnetic wall&quot;, which would have high surface impedance. The
exeption of course are nonconducting ferromagnetics, like ferrites.<br>
<br>
</span></font><font color=navy BACK="#ffffff" PTSIZE=10 FAMILY=SANSSERIF><span
style='color:navy;background:white'>&gt;&gt; 4. The current in a short-circuit
lossless loop is directly proportional to the H field and it does not depend on
the area.&nbsp; This is not in &#8216;the antenna books&#8217;, but it is in
some physics books dealing with super-conductivity.&nbsp; </span></font><font
color=black BACK="#ffffff" PTSIZE=12 FAMILY=SANSSERIF><span style='color:black;
background:white'><br>
<br>
The short-circuit current does depend on the effective length of the magnetic
flux lines. For the schoolbook case of a long cylindrical coil (n turns,
arbitrary core material), we have<br>
U = - n area j omega µ H, L = n^2 µ area / length,<br>
n I = n U / (j omega L), = - H / length ,<br>
easily memorized by the unit &quot;amps per meter&quot; for H. For a
&quot;short&quot; ring coil however, the magnetic length is a function of both
the wire and loop diameters.<br>
<br>
The original induction rule is still correct in the short circuit case, as the
current creates a secondary field such that the total flux and the (averaged) H
passing through the loop area is indeed nulled.<br>
<br>
</span></font><font color=navy BACK="#ffffff" PTSIZE=10 FAMILY=SANSSERIF><span
style='color:navy;background:white'>&gt;&gt; 5. ...What the system Q ends up
being does not matter for this proof.&nbsp; Some may have noticed however that
it is a matter of considerable (unnecessary) dispute, as reported in the pages
of RadCom. However loop (or any antenna) losses do matter, because the
cross-section area of an antenna is reduced in proportion to its
(in)efficiency.&nbsp; This point is in most of the antenna books.&nbsp;
&nbsp;After real conductor losses have been minimised and factored out we find
practical outdoor Qs of 100 to 350.&nbsp; In a screened room the loop Q can
exceed 600.&nbsp; </span></font><font color=black BACK="#ffffff" PTSIZE=12
FAMILY=SANSSERIF><span style='color:black;background:white'><br>
<br>
This raises a fundamental issue on the efficiency limit of a small antenna. For
a magnetic antenna represented by a cylinder coil in free space, we would get<br>
&nbsp;&nbsp; Rrad = Zo/(6pi) * area^2 * (2pi/lambda)^4<br>
&nbsp;&nbsp; X = omega L = 2pi / lambda * c * µo * area / length,<br>
and using Zo/c = µo we get a radiation Q-factor<br>
&nbsp;&nbsp; Qrad = X / Rrad&nbsp; =&nbsp; 3/(2pi)^2 * lambda^3 / volume.<br>
<br>
For an electrical antenna represented by a plate capacitor, we have<br>
&nbsp; Rrad = Zo/(6pi) * height^2 * (2pi/lambda)^2<br>
&nbsp; X = 1/omega/C = height / (omega*epsilon*area) ,<br>
and with 1/Zo/c = epsilon we again get the very same value<br>
&nbsp; Qrad = 3/(2pi)^2 * lambda^3 / volume.<br>
<br>
If we have a lossy antenna confined in a small volume, with a given
Q&lt;&lt;Qrad we get a maximum possible efficiency of<br>
eta = Q/Qrad = 13.2 * Q * volume / lambda^3, <br>
no matter whether it is an electric or magnetic antenna! The energy storage is
necessary to support a reactive dipole field (r^-3) between the physical
antenna volume and the radiation zone, beginning at a distance lambda/2pi
(&quot;CFA&quot;-promoters will disagree here...).<br>
<br>
Above earth, the radiation resistances and efficiencies for both types of
antenna is doubled, which is plausible if we include the image antenna volume
below ground. Somewhat surprisingly, this still holds true for loops above
weakly conducting ground, as long as the skin depth (a few 10m at LF) is still
small compared to a freespace wavelength.<br>
<br>
For a thin wire antenna, the &quot;width&quot; of the effective volume is not given
by the wire diameter itself but by the capacitance of the wire. For the rule-of
thumb 5 pF/m wire, we would have to use approximately half the height of the
wire times its length as the effective cross section. My TX antenna (220pF at
10 m above ground, Q = 200) has an effective volume of 2483m^3 and an
efficiency of&nbsp; 0.093%<br>
<br>
So much for now, it has become late...<br>
73 and good night<br>
<br>
Markus, DF6NM</span></font></span></font></p>

</div>

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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Hugh M0WYE" <m0wye@thersgb.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 08:50:22 -0000
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Subject: LF: 1000pF Compression Trimmers
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Hi Group,
A few months ago, some of you expressed an interest in compression trimmers
which were being disposed of. It has been decided to feed these out on Ebay
in small quantities, if anybody is interested, the item number is:
7501331294.

They are quite handy at LF frequencies, because of their relatively high
value. I've already used a couple in an LF preamp for my HF tranceiver.

73
Hugh M0WYE


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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
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TA enthusiasts

Nil last night. 

Teo..local time EST is Z - 5:00. 

Will continue to monitor.

Jay, W1VD


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Date: Thu, 17 Mar 2005 17:16:53 +0100
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Added captures of DK1IS, F6BWO, DM2BHG, ON7ZO, VO1NA, WD2XES, WD2XGJ
and G3WCB to my website:

http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm

Last night there was a very high noise level on LF, probably from a
storm over the Atlantic. After 2130z there was no Loran line visible
in QRSS3 mode.



73
Hartmut

Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de



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Jay Rusgrove schrieb:
> TA enthusiasts
>
> Nil last night. 
>
> Teo..local time EST is Z - 5:00. 
>
> Will continue to monitor.
>
> Jay, W1VD
>
Hello Jay,

thanks for the pics and reports.

tonight there will be no transmission from DJ8WX. the PSU gave up its ghost.
the 40Amp fuse melted inclusiv its socket. up to now I dont know why,
seems for no reason.

regards
Uwe/dj8wx/jo43sv




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TA enthusiasts

Teo: Only slight traces received from AR last night.

Uwe: Sri to hear abt problem - noticed that you were missing.

Will continue to monitor.

Jay, W1VD 


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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Dear Warren, John and Joe,<BR>
<BR>
excellent copy of XGJ and WES on the grabber, for about an hour around 05:00. Also a weaker trace on 137777.0 which must be VO1NA - still in QRP mode?<BR>
<BR>
73 and have a nice day<BR>
<BR>
Markus, <BR>
DF6NM in JN59NK<BR>
 </FONT></HTML>

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--------------020307080101040806050005--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>CFH is roaring in this morning on 137 khz at 0830z. 
Condx should be good Transatlantic at present.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Hi Mal,<BR>
<BR>
fadeout here in South Germany was at 7:30, now I can't see the slightest trace of it.<BR>
<BR>
73 de Markus, DF6NM <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
g3kev.ham@virgin.net: <BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">CFH is roaring in this morning on 137 khz at 0830z. Condx should be good Transatlantic at present.</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=12 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
 </FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">73 de Mal/G3KEV</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=12 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
&nbsp; <BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
</FONT></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
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Markus,

Nice shot! I'll add it to the on-line collection.

John Andrews


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Only slight traces of "AR" and "WX". Glad to see WX back on!

Will continue watching.

Jay, W1VD




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hi all, The appearance CFH is not a good indicator of conditions at present
because its erratic transmissions schedules mean it cannot be relied upon to
be transmitting. It was active last night but the levels received here and
at CT1DRP are nothing special. Some of this may be due to location dependent
multipath fading, but generally the peak level was about 10dB below
"normal". The night / day fade started at just before 0600z and though there
was a little peak around 0800z this was 20dB down on the night time level.
Conditions are still a little disturbed and not as good as they were earlier
in the month. John and Warren's part 5 signals were received as decodable
strings on 30 second mode, and Joe's QRP 30 second dot signal was visible at
just "O" last night. There was another minor geomagnetic storm early this
morning, whilst this will not have too bad an effect it will probably delay
the improvment of overnight conditions. Hopefully they will return by the
Easter weekend.

Cheers de Alan G3NYK
alan.melia(at)btinternet.com




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Joe Craig <jcraig@mun.ca>
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Subject: Re: LF: CFH ....??
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Dear LF Group,

I have received authorisation to resume transmissions on 2200
metres and have been running 100 watts 1.2 amps to a 100 metre
wire about 10 metres high.  Running QRSS30 on 137.7770 kHz.
Thanks to Alan G3NYK, Hartmut Wolff and Markus DF6NM for the
reports.

My signals are lower than usual because my aerial is lower.
Mother nature reoriented my 25 tower to a horizontal position
in January so I am using a temporary aerial for the moment.

Joe



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Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 22:13:56 +0300
From: Dmitri RA3YO <ilena@online.debryansk.ru>
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Subject: LF: rx9bs
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--------------050209050206010809050206
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Hi LF group

Today  RX9BS on 137774.5

Dmitri

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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
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Subject: LF: Antenna is up/hrd DL1DQZ
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Hello everone here,

After finishing the power supply and transmitter a long time ago, I finally
have the TX-antenna ready at my parents house. (dismanteld the old 4 times 9
for 144MHz)
Just need to do some tests to find the proper matching.
Loading coil and variometer are ready.
Unfortunatly I have bad ground conditions, and quite some trees around.

It's an 16m top loaded vertical á la EI0CF.

This evening I heard DL1DQZ with 579 calling CQ on 136.40kHz.
Wonder what he was running; at least the antenna seems to pick up
signals........

Meanwhile playing around with Spectrum Laboratory, but sofar only "WX"
visible here,
on a coaxial loop hanging in the garden of my home. (different location from
the TX antenna)

Hope to be on soon, but also rather busy with other radio projects.

73

Dick, PA4VHF (JO32eh)




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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2005 19:52:59 -0500
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>TA enthusiasts</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Nice early copy of WX tonight. Thor's laying 
low&nbsp;for the moment...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jay, W1VD</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Dexter McIntyre W4DEX <dmcintyre@att.net>
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Jay Rusgrove wrote:
> TA enthusiasts
>  
> ...Thor still sleeping...

Not at this latitude!

Dex


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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TA enthusiasts

Condx went downhill quickly after early copy of WX and AR...no doubt due
to big Tstorms over Texas. Full Argo screens from which last night's
snipits were stolen at:

http://www.advancedreceiver.com/capture/032005A.jpg

http://www.advancedreceiver.com/capture/032005B.jpg

Will continue monitoring.

Dex...you need to move away from the equator ;~)

Jay



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: Re: LF: TA MAR 19/20
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Jay Rusgrove wrote:
> TA enthusiasts
> 
> Condx went downhill quickly after early copy of WX and AR...no doubt due
> to big Tstorms over Texas.
> 
> Dex...you need to move away from the equator ;~)
> 

And trade a sunny 70F for a wet 40F on the first day of spring?  A 
little QRN isn't so bad considering that.

Dex


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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Subject: LF: CW MORE
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi All</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I need EA1PX, HA6PC, SP5ZCC and S57A on CW. All 
these&nbsp;stns&nbsp;have been worked by me on QRS3 and have reported that my 
signal is audible, but unfortunately I cannot hear them either on the 80m loop 
or the 30m vertical&nbsp; antennas, although I did hear S57A a couple of nights 
ago&nbsp;when he was on qrs he was perfectly audible and would&nbsp;have been 
workable on CW.&nbsp;</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>A solution would probably be more RF out&nbsp;or an 
improved Antenna system.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I am surprised that there is no acty from LA 
because they seem to be well represented on 160 metres with big 
signals.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2005 17:20:11 +0100
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Subject: LF: Test on 137.7745 kHz
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------070702080306050903060702
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Anybody claim the attached. Captured on 137.7745 kHz 1330z.

73
Hartmut Wolff
Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de?
--------------070702080306050903060702
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--------------070702080306050903060702--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Dmitri RA3YO <ilena@online.debryansk.ru>
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Subject: Re: LF: Test on 137.7745 kHz
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<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
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Hi Lf Group<br>
<br>
It's ra3yo<br>
<br>
Dmitri<br>
<br>
Hartmut Wolff wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite" cite="mid1045371731.20050320172011@t-online.de">
  <pre wrap="">Anybody claim the attached. Captured on 137.7745 kHz 1330z.

73
Hartmut Wolff
Locator:JO52ho
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.h-wolff.de">www.h-wolff.de</a>?</pre>
  <br>
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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
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Subject: LF: heard today in CW/antenna tests
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This morning I did some tests on the TX antenna.
I need somewhere around 4mH to get things running on 136kHz,
and found out that the impedance at that point is around 135 Ohm.
Also discovered something not new for me: I have a very poor earth down
there.
Poor conductive sandground............
So adding a 'ground' didn't make any noticable difference.

During the tests I heard in normal CW:

DK7SU  539 wkg DK6NI
G3KEV 579 clg CQ and wkg ON7ZO who was 529

Later at home I heard DJ5DI with 559 on a coaxial loop.

Today I made a 50Ohm to 135 Ohm transformer and an simple antennacurrent
meter.

As soon as I am ready (time problems, sri) I'll run the first TX tests on
136.1kHz with a little
30W X-tal transmitter.
When this works ok, I'll put the 'big stuff' in the air and see if the
antenna won't keep fire......

73

Dick, pa4vhf



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Gary - G4WGT" <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
To: "LF \(Rsgb LF Group\)" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
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Hi All,

Currently testing on 135.923 KHz sending "G4WGT TEST" at QRS30.

280 watts DC input & 2A antenna current into spiral top load vertical.

Regards,

Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp

Web : http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Hi Gary,<BR>
<BR>
yes, your signal is visible here. My dial says 135923.12 Hz, abt 1 µV/m.<BR>
<BR>
Best wishes<BR>
<BR>
Markus,<BR>
DF6NM in JN59NK<BR>
<BR>
In einer eMail vom 20.03.2005 21:59:31 Westeuropäische Normalzeit schreibt g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk: <BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Currently testing on 135.923 KHz sending "G4WGT TEST" at QRS30.<BR>
280 watts DC input &amp;2A antenna current into spiral top load vertical.<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Gary - G4WGT" <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
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<DIV><SPAN class=468322021-20032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Hi 
Markus,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=468322021-20032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=468322021-20032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I can 
just see my sig on the grabber, testing out the new antenna &amp; G0MRF PA mods 
on air. Should be able to run about 600 watts I will slowly increase during the 
next few days. Thanks for the report.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=468322021-20032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=468322021-20032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I 
don't know what went wrong with the subject line ??</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=468322021-20032005><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=468322021-20032005>
<P><FONT size=2>Regards,<BR><BR>Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp<BR><BR>Web : <A 
href="http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor" 
target=_blank>http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor</A></FONT> </P></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
  <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma 
  size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> 
  owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]<B>On Behalf Of 
  </B>MarkusVester@aol.com<BR><B>Sent:</B> 20 March 2005 21:11<BR><B>To:</B> 
  rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: LF: Content-Type: 
  text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><FONT 
  face=arial,helvetica><FONT lang=2 face=Arial size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" 
  PTSIZE="10">Hi Gary,<BR><BR>yes, your signal is visible here. My dial says 
  135923.12 Hz, abt 1 µV/m.<BR><BR>Best wishes<BR><BR>Markus,<BR>DF6NM in 
  JN59NK<BR><BR>In einer eMail vom 20.03.2005 21:59:31 Westeuropäische 
  Normalzeit schreibt g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk: <BR><BR>
  <BLOCKQUOTE 
  style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px" 
  TYPE="CITE">Currently testing on 135.923 KHz sending "G4WGT TEST" at 
    QRS30.<BR>280 watts DC input &amp;2A antenna current into spiral top load 
    vertical.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: Re: LF: Test on 137.7745 kHz
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Dmitri,

tnx for the reply.

73
Hartmut


> Hi Lf Group

> It's ra3yo

> Dmitri

> Hartmut Wolff wrote:

>>Anybody claim the attached. Captured on 137.7745 kHz 1330z.
>>
>>73
>>Hartmut Wolff
>>Locator:JO52ho
>>www.h-wolff.de?
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>



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Subject: LF: FW: G4WGT - Report
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------080302090102080701000108
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Looks like my first report went into the "bit bucket"...so I've re-sent it!
73
Dave G3WCB IO91RM

-----Original Message-----
From: Dave G3WCB [mailto:ganymede444@btopenworld.com]
Sent: 20 March 2005 22:03
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: G4WGT - Report


Hi, Gary.

You're sigs are "O" copy in QRSS3 at IO91RM near Slough. I think that you
are stronger tonight than you were during your last tests on 27 Feb.
Screenshot of tonight showing the "W" of G4WGT attached (2140_WGT00001.gif)


73,
Dave G3WCB IO91RM

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Gary - G4WGT
Sent: 20 March 2005 21:00
To: LF (Rsgb LF Group)
Subject: LF: Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"


Hi All,

Currently testing on 135.923 KHz sending "G4WGT TEST" at QRS30.

280 watts DC input & 2A antenna current into spiral top load vertical.

Regards,

Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp

Web : http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor



--------------080302090102080701000108
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--------------080302090102080701000108--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 09:07:31 -0000
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Subject: LF: Activity report 19/20 March
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Quite a bit of activity this weekend, and intra-Eu conditins were 
good.

Worked OK2BVG and YU7AR on QRSS3, and F6BWO and DF0WD on CW. 

Also received CW from G3XIZ, G3YKB, G3WCB, G3YXM, G3KEV and YU7AR.

Mike, G3XDV
==========
http://lf.apersonalguide.co.uk




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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TA enthusiasts

Traces of both WX and AR at 0030 and 0345Z. 

Jay, W1VD


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: LF: LF_DW List
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Dear LF enthusiasts,

I have created LF_DW List in Russian for technical and info support of
the LF enthusiasts reading on Russian. Some of them have difficulties with
reading and understanding on English:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lf_dw
DW=LF in Russian

For information - I had correspondence with HAMs of the several countries
not submitted while on LF (DXCC):
4K - Azerbaijan - SA (special authorisation)
4L - Georgia - SA
EK - Armenia - SA
ER - Moldovia - SA
ES - Estonia - 1W ERP
EU - Belarus - CW, 100W
EX - Kyrgyzstan - SA
EY - Tajikistan - SA
LZ - Bulgaria - SA
UN - Kazakhstan - SA
UR - Ukraine - awaiting authorisations
YL - Latvia - 1 and 2 category with 100W Output

???????? ?? ????????? ??? ???????????: lf_dw-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
- ??????? ?????? ?????? ?? ?????
- ???????? ????? ?? ?????? ? ???????? ? ????????????? - ????? ??????
??????? Re (???????? ?? ?????? - ?????? ? ?????? ?? ??????)

??????????: lf_dw-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
- ??????? ?????? ?????? ?? ?????

????? ????????? ? ?? ????????? ??: lf_dw@yahoogroups.com
??????? ????? ??????????? ????????? ???? ??????????? ???? ?? ??? ?? ???????
???? ??????. ????????? ???????: Individual Emails, Daily Digest, Special
Notices, No Emails
??????????????? ????????? ? Cyrillic KOI-8

???????? ?????? ????????? (?? ????? ???? ??????????? ?? ?????????):
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lf_dw/messages

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <002601c526f8$5d392c20$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL> <8152240259.20050312173711@pyrotherm.co.yu>
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 13:45:04 -0000
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Subject: Re: LF: TA MAR 11/12
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----- Original Message -----
From: "YU7AR" <yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu>
To: "Jay Rusgrove" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Saturday, March 12, 2005 4:37 PM
Subject: Re: LF: TA MAR 11/12


> Hello Jay,
>
> Thanks for the report , AR...AR.. again tonight on 135.9213
>
> Teo,  loc. KN05BW
>
>
> Best regards,
>  YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu
Hi Teo
You have a vy strong signal on 137.7 qrs3 and some stns including me hve
been calling u on CW, but you say QRZ or QRS
I think u have a RX problem at ur end.

73 de Mal/G3KEV

>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: YU7AR <yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu>
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Hi Mal,

yes fackt is, mi RX and TX sistem is disproportional, now I test new
K9AY two turns loop for RX.
Maybe build another bandpass receving loop from Jim M0BMU .
Another fact is ,beverage is too long for this location, my main
antena /umbrella/ is good for TX, but for RX I search something better
What is your proposal ?

73 Teo


Hello hamilton,

Monday, March 21, 2005, 2:45:04 PM, you wrote:
hm> Hi Teo
hm> You have a vy strong signal on 137.7 qrs3 and some stns including me hve
hm> been calling u on CW, but you say QRZ or QRS
hm> I think u have a RX problem at ur end.

hm> 73 de Mal/G3KEV


Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: LF: first TX-tests on 136kHz
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Hello just finished my first TX-tests with low power.
Exciting!!

The antenna currentmeter didn't work, so I had to use a screwdriver with
build-in
neon bulb to tune, hihi.

I also found out that, that simple little earthstick is important.
I disconnected it............wooooooooahh!
Burnt my fingers when touching the ground side of the TX...

Just was running 10-20Watts, with some interesting beginners problems
like ringing and feedback art stuff. Noisy cores etc.

I was able to hear my beacon signal at home on a coaxia loop with abt s7.
The first 2km have been travelled,hi.
Suddenly the signal disappeared while listening, and when arriving at the
TX-site
I could already smell the burnt driver FET...............
It had no heat-sink (the final FET has a big one.........)

Anyway it was fun and exciting. Looking foreward to fire up the big stuff!

73!

Dick, PA4VHF




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: lowfer@lwca.org,  rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 18:07:50 -0900
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wd2xdw continues to be off until we shake this stormy southern plains 
depression, associated tstorms and the occasional twister, hopefully remote.

Laurence KL1X/5
status http://myweb.cableone.net/flow




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Gentlemen,
    I was looking up 'qrss' on Google and came up with a website that purports to list some of the keywords that trigger 'Echelon' - the automated  US, UK, Canada, New Zealand spying mechanism.  QRSS is on the list! So are ELF, LF, MF, VLF, ULF, BNC,  Sweep, Racal and Analyzer.  See below:

http://echelononline.free.fr/documents/register.htm

    Our E-mail lists must be keeping the spooks busy!
 

--
73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
FN42hi


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: LF: XES and XGJ Mar, 22nd
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Very strong signals from "XES" and "XGJ" last night.
Captures can be seen:

http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm



73
Hartmut

Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 07:57:17 -0000
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Subject: Re: LF: first TX-tests on 136kHz
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> Hello just finished my first TX-tests with low power.
> Exciting!!
> I also found out that, that simple little earthstick is important. I
> disconnected it............wooooooooahh! Burnt my fingers when
> touching the ground side of the TX...
> Just was running 10-20Watts, with some interesting beginners problems
> like ringing and feedback art stuff. Noisy cores etc.
> I was able to hear my beacon signal at home on a coaxia loop with abt
> s7. The first 2km have been travelled,hi. Suddenly the signal
> disappeared while listening, and when arriving at the TX-site I could
> already smell the burnt driver FET............... It had no heat-sink
> (the final FET has a big one.........)
> Dick, PA4VHF


Ah yes, that's how we all started.
I love the smell of burnt fingers and FETs in the morning.

Mike, G3XDV
==========



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Hi Laurence,

that explains why I have not seen your signal lately. Also there is heavy
QRN here too so I will stop LF monitoring for a few days and resume after
Easter.

Mike ZL4OL



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
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Subject: LF: TA MAR 21/22
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>TA enthusiasts</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>WX made&nbsp;an early showing last night. Best 
signals between 0000 - 0130Z and 0430 - 0700Z. Nothing from AR. Good signal 
levels - copy determined by static levels. Times in EST.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><IMG alt="" hspace=0 
src="cid:002801c52ed1$95f48600$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL" align=baseline 
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align=baseline border=0></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jay, W1VD</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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--------------060608040808040107070406--

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Message-ID: <001201c52ee7$875efec0$92d0fc3e@l8p8y6>
From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <002601c526f8$5d392c20$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL> <8152240259.20050312173711@pyrotherm.co.yu> <001b01c52e1c$414db1e0$25d1fc3e@l8p8y6> <36186466604.20050321210559@pyrotherm.co.yu>
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 14:00:05 -0000
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Subject: Re: Re[2]: LF: TA MAR 11/12
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----- Original Message -----
From: "YU7AR" <yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu>
To: "hamilton mal" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Monday, March 21, 2005 8:05 PM
Subject: Re[2]: LF: TA MAR 11/12


> Hi Mal,
>
> yes fackt is, mi RX and TX sistem is disproportional, now I test new
> K9AY two turns loop for RX.
Tnx info Teo.
I live at a quiet QTH and so noise is not a problem either on the Vertical
or Loop but the loop has a better signal over noise in the E/W direction. In
the N/S direction the signals are in a null and poor reception.
My loop is 80 metres perimiter vertical and if you have space put up as big
a loop as possible and resonate it for 137 khz band.
Your vertical should also be good if your QTH is noise free from Industrial
noise etc.
It depends on your circumstances as regards environmental noise whether you
will be able to hear CW signals.
The big problem for most on LF is noise and they cannot receive properly.
We have worked before on CW but your signals is very loud here and hopefully
we can work again.
73 and gl de Mal/G3KEV

>

>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Gary - G4WGT" <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 19:28:17 -0000
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Hi Warren & LF,

I saw HF, VHF, SIGS, PTT, RFI, UHF, even JASON on the list as well, but it
seems that there are not very many words that we can e-mail safely !!!!

Regards,

Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp

Web : http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Warren
K2ORS/WD2XGJ
Sent: 22 March 2005 03:25
To: rsgb lf reflector; LWCA LF Reflector
Subject: LF: Echelon


Gentlemen,
    I was looking up 'qrss' on Google and came up with a website that
purports to list some of the keywords that trigger 'Echelon' - the automated
US, UK, Canada, New Zealand spying mechanism.  QRSS is on the list! So are
ELF, LF, MF, VLF, ULF, BNC,  Sweep, Racal and Analyzer.  See below:

http://echelononline.free.fr/documents/register.htm

    Our E-mail lists must be keeping the spooks busy!


--
73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
FN42hi



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Gary - G4WGT" <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
To: "LF \(Rsgb LF Group\)" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 19:50:00 -0000
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Hi All at LF,

Continuing with tests this evening on 135.923KHz QRS30 sending "G4WGT TEST"
power up to 400 watts 2.3A antenna current.

Regards,

Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp

Web : http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Gary - G4WGT" <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
To: "LF \(Rsgb LF Group\)" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
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Hi All at LF,

Had to cease tests as I saw arcing on the spriral top load several times, it
has been raining today so it may be due to the wet on the  spiral or
possibly a problem with the higher power or a combination of both. I will
keep you informed.

Regards,

Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp

Web : http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 14:32:51 -0900
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XDW should be back on tomorrow with another dB or so improvement.

In the meantime Im looking for Eu TA on rx - but its very strormy here.


http://myweb.cableone.net/flow/eu00000.jpg      for latest capture from 
em26aq

Laurence KL1X/5




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Andy" <actalbot@southsurf.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 09:03:50 -0000
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Based on reading several works of (pseudo) fiction by authors who claim to
have have 'talked to those in the know' and looking at some relevant web
sites...

That list of sensitive words almost certainly needs to be taken with a pinch
of salt.  Any software looking for terr0r_st activity will look for patterns
of words in an email and match against known addressees.  Those words may
well be on an initial sort list, but would immediately be ignored when
linked with the  rsgb_lf_group destination / source.  So we're almost
certainly not giving them a lot of extra work.  Pity, really.  I would have
liked to think all these amateur radio messages were contributing to the
UK/US tax burden and providing work for No SUch Agency and our equivalent

If you really want to wind up the spooks, you might try repeatedly sending
inane messages in a trivial code we all know GCjQ can crack - such as the
old
Enigma one or a crude substitution cipher.    Then send a whole batch of
messages to overseas using Papa Golf Papa  encrIpt_on.  They are certainly
alert to that piece of software - its a real threat to world democrazy.

Then wait for the black van to arrive outside your house, with an ill
concealed antenna and silvered windows to give it away...

Andy - not paranoid at all! - 'JNT






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TA enthusiasts

Reception was limited due to static from big Tstorms over SE US. WX
popped above the elevated noise level at various times throughout the
period but never produced a clean ID. Propagation good - noise
bad...Nothing from AR last night.

Will continue monitoring.

Jay, W1VD



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Those who say can't know, and those who know can't say.

John G3PAI





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Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 18:10:06 -0000
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Subject: LF: Live Storm Data <was WWLL Global Lightning Map>
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=us-ascii">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1458" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=236510018-23032005>Dear 
LF,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=236510018-23032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=236510018-23032005>I have 
found a Lightning Flash Plotter/Live Storm Data source based in the south of the 
UK. It shows lightning strokes within a 600 km radius of Newport, Isle of Wight. 
Quite handy for&nbsp;us EU LF enthusiasts! There are a few strikes occuring the 
the west of the Cherbourg peninsular right now.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=236510018-23032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=236510018-23032005><A 
href="http://www.isleofwightweather.co.uk/live_storm_data.htm">http://www.isleofwightweather.co.uk/live_storm_data.htm</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=236510018-23032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=236510018-23032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=236510018-23032005>73, 
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=236510018-23032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=236510018-23032005>Dave 
G3WCB</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=236510018-23032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=236510018-23032005>IO91RM</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN 
class=236510018-23032005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
  <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma 
  size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> 
  owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]<B>On Behalf Of 
  </B>MarkusVester@aol.com<BR><B>Sent:</B> 06 March 2005 20:38<BR><B>To:</B> 
  rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> LF: WWLL Global Lightning 
  Map<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT lang=2 face=Arial 
  size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" PTSIZE="10">Dear LF Group,<BR><BR>after some 
  searching, I have found an interesting, quasi-realtime lightning map. It is on 
  the website of the WWLL (World Wide Lightning Location) network:<BR><A 
  href="http://flash.ess.washington.edu/">http://flash.ess.washington.edu/</A> 
  <BR><BR>They do not claim the sub-kilometer accuracy of some of the commercial 
  networks, but they have a nice global display updating every 10 minutes. The 
  data is based on correlated VLF receivers (TOGA = time of group arrival), and 
  the published spectrograms are also pretty impressive.<BR><BR>It has been 
  quiet on this reflector today, hope its working.<BR><BR>Have fun, 
  73<BR><BR>Markus, DF6NM<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML>

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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
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wd2xdw on 137,7752/6 KHz DFCW90 + CW id and info

ON 1936Z 23rd March 05 1Kw output, 4 roughly parall loops in the trees, same 
plane - Main lobes ENE/WSW.

Laurence KL1X/5 EM26AQ




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
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Subject: LF: test TX right now on 136.1kHz
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Hello all,

I will do some tests to check my TX system and to get some reference values
at my home.

Roughly between 20.15UTC and 21.00UTC I will be on the air on 136.1kHz
tuning and
running CW beacon in normal CW. (so, that's in about 15 minutes from now)
You are invited to check your receiver sensetivety as I will run below 50W
output.

Dick, PA4VHF (JO32eh)



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: LF: RE: test TX right now on 136.1kHz
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Hello, Dick.

Nothing seen on 136.100 so far at this location IO91RM (2045 utc)

73,

Dave G3WCB IO91RM

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Dick
Sent: 23 March 2005 19:49
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: test TX right now on 136.1kHz


Hello all,

I will do some tests to check my TX system and to get some reference values
at my home.

Roughly between 20.15UTC and 21.00UTC I will be on the air on 136.1kHz
tuning and
running CW beacon in normal CW. (so, that's in about 15 minutes from now)
You are invited to check your receiver sensetivety as I will run below 50W
output.

Dick, PA4VHF (JO32eh)






From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Michael Peters" <m.peters@peters-placke.de>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 22:05:55 +0100
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Subject: LF: AW: test TX right now on 136.1kHz
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hi dick,

in jo42bh is also nil

at some moments i have seen a sig (abt. 5 sec)...was that your`s...i don`t
know

73 michael dk5na

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]Im Auftrag von Dick
Gesendet: Mittwoch, 23. März 2005 20:49
An: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Betreff: LF: test TX right now on 136.1kHz


Hello all,

I will do some tests to check my TX system and to get some reference values
at my home.

Roughly between 20.15UTC and 21.00UTC I will be on the air on 136.1kHz
tuning and
running CW beacon in normal CW. (so, that's in about 15 minutes from now)
You are invited to check your receiver sensetivety as I will run below 50W
output.

Dick, PA4VHF (JO32eh)





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Subject: LF: first sucses on 136kHz!!
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This evening my low power testbeacon has been received by Klaas, PA0KDM
over an distance of 43km.
It was quite exciting to hear my own beacon back over the telephone!

I was running around 40Watts output and too much Watt input :-(
(It's an bad efficiency amplifier.......)

Next days I'll use to improve my ground; during the test I was running an
80cm long 1 inch copper tube only.....

73!

Dick, PA4VHF



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From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
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Subject: LF: thanks for checking my signal!
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All who tried to pick up my signal: thanks for trying!
I hope to improve the antennasystem, and after that I will fire up the big
one.

Meanwhile I will post a mesage when I intend to do some tests.
My usual test frequency is 136.1kHz (X-tal controlled).

Dick, pa4vhf




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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=US-ASCII">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1491" name=GENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY id=role_body style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #000000; FONT-FAMILY: Arial" 
bottomMargin=7 leftMargin=7 topMargin=7 rightMargin=7><FONT id=role_document 
face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>
<DIV>And some folks just sit on their porch and watch the world go 
by!</DIV></FONT></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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> That list of sensitive words almost certainly needs to be taken with a pinch
> of salt.

Yes, and English is not the only language used in electronic communication...

73
Johan SM6LKM



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Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
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Snowstorm over New England making quite a racket and affecting copy.
Occassional strong signals from WX appear above elevated noise levels.

Jay, W1VD



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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>PA4VHF audible on 136.15 khz CW seems to be on 
BEACON mode</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:50:33 +0100
From: Alberto di Bene <dibene@usa.net>
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To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <005801c52f87$3bad7100$018cf8d4@standalone> <42428003.1050806@tele2.se>
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Subject: LF: RE: Ech_lon
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Johan Bodin wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid42428003.1050806@tele2.se" type="cite">Yes, and
English is not the only language used in electronic communication...
  <br>
</blockquote>
Quite correct... now, let's see what Echelon will react to this :<br>
<br>
<img alt="" src="cid:part1.00040607.06080201@usa.net" height="189"
 width="196"><br>
73&nbsp; Alberto&nbsp; I2PHD<br>
<br>
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <005801c52f87$3bad7100$018cf8d4@standalone> <42428003.1050806@tele2.se> <4242E1C9.3000609@usa.net>
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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 07:19:20 -0900
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Im sure I could see a "W and M" in there.....

>From: Alberto di Bene <dibene@usa.net>
>Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
>To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
>Subject: LF: RE: Ech_lon
>Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:50:33 +0100
>
><< multipart1 >>




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 23, 2005 10:19 PM
Subject: LF: thanks for checking my signal!


> All who tried to pick up my signal: thanks for trying!
> I hope to improve the antennasystem, and after that I will fire up the big
> one.
>
> Meanwhile I will post a mesage when I intend to do some tests.
> My usual test frequency is 136.1kHz (X-tal controlled).
>
> Dick, pa4vhf
Dick
Your signal was perfectly readable early afternoon here and suitable for a
QSO, but you seemed to be in Beacon mode only.
de Mal/G3KEV







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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <NKEMLGOEKANPNJOBFBAFKECLCDAA.g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 18:33:34 -0000
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary - G4WGT" <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
To: "LF (Rsgb LF Group)" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 8:26 PM
Subject: LF: Re : tests.


>
> Hi All at LF,
>
> Had to cease tests as I saw arcing on the spriral top load several times,
it
> has been raining today so it may be due to the wet on the  spiral or
> possibly a problem with the higher power or a combination of both. I will
> keep you informed.
>
> Regards,
>
> Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp
>
> Web : http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor
Hi Gary
If you need a report call me on CW. I am on the band most days calling CQ.
So far I have not heard you on the band.
Morning/Afternoon and evenings in the CW part of the band.
73 de Mal/G3KEV

>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: LF: How to measure antenna current?
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Hello all,

Today changed the groundsystem, resulting in an 4-5dB stronger signal.
I am using an trafo , diode and meter as an indicator to tune the coil for
maximum antenna current.

In this list I often see people mentioning which antennacurrent they are
running.
I wonder how to get these values.
Measuring voltage across an resistor? What about number of turns in the coil
etc?

73

Dick, PA4VHF (getting stronger on 136................)



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <000501c530a5$48c90d80$2102000a@ibm>
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 14:36:24 -0500
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Dick,

> In this list I often see people mentioning which antennacurrent they are
> running.
> I wonder how to get these values.
> Measuring voltage across an resistor? What about number of turns in the
coil
> etc?

Some possibilities:

http://www.w1tag.com/RFA.htm

http://www.computerpro.com/~lyle/currprob/currprob.htm

John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
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Subject: LF: this afternoon's beacon mode
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Thanks Mal, G3KEV for reporting about receiving my test beacon this
afternoon.

I am very very happy to see that the signal was received that far away.
Best heard distance sofar.

Today I changed the simple 80cm ground rod for a 20cm x 250cm copperplate
buried
about 80cm deep into the ground.
I saw a large increase in antenna current, and at my home 2km away from the
TX-site
the signal was about 4-5dB stronger compaired to the first test on the
simple ground rod.
Tomorrow I will add two 3m long 12mm ground rods to the system, and that
should be it
for the time being.

The power I was running this afternoon was around 40Watt output to an 15m
long wire with
a flat pancake spiral coil at the top (abt 2.3m square) and 16 wires, each
around 2.5m like
an umbrella on top of the spiral. (actually the antenna EI0CF tested, as
small garden antenna)

By the way, the tower on which the spiral and wire are mounted is an metal
tower........
Certainly not the best, but it works!

I do have an bigger transmitter, output 300-400Watt or so, but it hasn't an
TX/RX relay, so
making QSO's is still complicated.
As soon as I have solved that I will be on, looking forward to work you in
"normal CW"

73 from JO32eh

Dick, PA4VHF




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Dick,

Just remembered another one:

http://w5jgv.com/rfa-1/rfa-1.htm

John Andrews


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From: "Gary - G4WGT" <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2005 21:10:04 -0000
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Subject: LF: RE: How to measure antenna current?
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Hi Dick,

I use an LF Tuning Meter by Jim Moritz M0BMU, you can get the pdf article
from http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor/LFtunemeter.pdf
or
http://web.ukonline.co.uk/g3ldo/LFtunemeter.pdf

I find it can be used in the shack or at the base of the antenna & the
results are the same, I find it a really useful LF antenna tuning aid.

Regards,

Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp

Web : http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor


-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Dick
Sent: 24 March 2005 19:11
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: How to measure antenna current?


Hello all,

Today changed the groundsystem, resulting in an 4-5dB stronger signal.
I am using an trafo , diode and meter as an indicator to tune the coil for
maximum antenna current.

In this list I often see people mentioning which antennacurrent they are
running.
I wonder how to get these values.
Measuring voltage across an resistor? What about number of turns in the coil
etc?

73

Dick, PA4VHF (getting stronger on 136................)




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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <NKEMLGOEKANPNJOBFBAFIEDGCDAA.g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
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Subject: LF: WD2XES Jason Slow
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WD2XES will be running in Jason Slow mode on 137.779 kHz, starting around
2300 UTC.

John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES




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Sorry Ed
I try on this way. 2 attempts to your URL failed.
    Heinz


Second try. First mail bounced

    Heinz


Dobry djen dorogoi Ed.
Spassibo za QSO i za washe dopis. Moi russky eto otshen malo, tak nado po anglitzky.
You ask for my setup. You will be surpriced: I run 50 Watt from a home made transistor-Tx with a Chech KU607 in the PA. My antenna is a vertical: 10 m high with a toploade of two wires, 20m each. Between the upper part of the vertical and the topload I have a coil of abt. 1mH.
My Rx ist a IC746 with separat preamp.
I thought I was hit by a hors, when you came back on my call. You are my QRB at the moment.
Poshaluista shto eto vashe Locator?
Moi Locator is JO51MW.
Please, what is your setup?
QSL via Bureau or direct?


    73 Heinz

   



"Ed Lesnichy" <ed@dx.ru> schrieb:
> Dear Heinz!
> 
> TNX for QSO!
> How you TX/RX setup?
> 
> 73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru



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Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 11:07:09 +0100
From: Hartmut Wolff <wolff.h@t-online.de>
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Subject: Re: LF: WD2XES Jason Slow
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 John,

 copied only 4 "WD2XES" strings. I made the Jason decoding from a
 recorded wav-file. Compared the decoding with "Hendrix" mode on and
 off. Much better with "Hendrix" mode on.
 Screenshots can be seen here:
 
               http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm

73

Hartmut

> WD2XES will be running in Jason Slow mode on 137.779 kHz, starting around
> 2300 UTC.

> John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES



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--------------090004010006090404050604
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Dear Heinz and LF enthusiasts,

Friday, March 25, 2005 Heinz DM2BHG wrote:

HB> Sorry Ed
HB> I try on this way. 2 attempts to your URL failed.
SRI...
My mail server (dx.ru) has too much strict protection from spam and
viruses
After April 1 my mail server will be with one more modern the antispam
and antiviruses programs
I have one more e-mail on the other server : ru6la (at) bk.ru

HB> You ask for my setup. You will be surpriced: I run 50 Watt
HB> from a home made transistor-Tx with a Chech KU607 in the PA. My
HB> antenna is a vertical: 10 m high with a toploade of two wires, 20m
HB> each. Between the upper part of the vertical and the topload I
HB> have a coil of abt. 1mH.
HB> My Rx ist a IC746 with separat preamp.
Yes, for me it is a surprise also!
TNX for report and info

HB> I thought I was hit by a hors, when you came back on my call. You are my QRB at the moment.
HB> Poshaluista shto eto vashe Locator?
HB> Moi Locator is JO51MW.
QTH-loc of Machta KN97LN
QRB=2052km (by LA0FX software)

HB> Please, what is your setup?
The equipments:
RX - BOG 1.7km to Eu
Electromechanical filter (wide 2.1kHz, 136.775kHz center), Pre-ampl,
Kenwood TS-850, ARGO Ver 1 build 134 by Alberto I2PHD

TX - Big Vertical with H effective abt 70-80m, PA abt 100W Output - current
in the TX aerial abt 2.2-3.2A (various at different weather and wind)
DDS VFO, QRS 4.01 by Rik ON7YD
LF TX ant in attach:
ant is RED (Cu wire 1mm on 4mm polypropylene cord)
BLUE is 4mm polypropylene cord

HB> QSL via Bureau or direct?
Send as you conveniently:

via Russian SRR bureau - Box 88:
Soyuz Radiolyubitelei Rossii, Box 88, Moscow, 119311

or direct: Ed Lesnichy, P.O.Box 1, TAGANROG, 347900

I not so frequently send QSL cards (SRI..) - PSE send me e-mail if somebody
in LF_Group else has not received my QSL card (2-way or 1-way QSO):
RU6LA, RU6LWZ, UA6LV, UA6LO, UA9OC
and also inform as better to send - via Bureau or direct?

I'll dispatch mails with QSLs (LF & HF) in May

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru
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--------------090004010006090404050604--

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TA entusiasts

Another night of good propgagtion along with strong Tstorm activity...WX
and AR signals were of good strength but severly perforated by static.

Will continue monitoring and hoping for a few more quiet nights...

Jay, W1VD



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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TA entusiasts,

I'll make a beacon from abt 23z of March 25 till abt 4z of March 26 on
135.922-923 freq range in QRSS30

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru



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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
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Hartmut,

Jimi Hendrix wins again! You did have better Jason copy on 1 January, but
the noise levels have certainly increased. According to Markus' grabber last
night, he would have had some periods of Jason copy, as well. By the way, 34
"WD2XES" ID's were sent from 2240 to 1125 UTC.

I will run in Jason mode again tonight on 137.779, starting around 2300 UTC.

John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES




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Jay Rusgrove schrieb:
> TA entusiasts
>
> Another night of good propgagtion along with strong Tstorm activity...WX
> and AR signals were of good strength but severly perforated by static.
>
> Will continue monitoring and hoping for a few more quiet nights...
>
> Jay, W1VD
>
>
Hello Jay,

thanks for the reports.

to night Ill be some hours later on the air (135,9221kHz as usual) because
a) Im out and 
b) when back in the shack Ill try to receive Johns echelon transmission.

gl
Uwe/dj8wx/jo43sv 



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<P>Hi All,</P>
<P>I will make an attempt today at 1800-1930 on 135.921.5 kHz&nbsp; DFCW&nbsp; 180sec elements.</P>
<P>Kp shot&nbsp;up today, so&nbsp;probably last chance, also darkness window getting shorter.</P>
<P>Laurie </P><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
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Subject: LF: antenna current/ground system etc.
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Hello all,

This afternoon I aded 2 groundrods of 3m each to the system.
Although antennacurrent is higher now, my signal did not seemed to be
stronger...........

Alan told me already in an mail that grounds can be tricky on LF........

Meanwhile TX/RX system is ready, as well as an bigger 50Ohm to 135 Ohm
transformer.
I hope to finish a bigger current meter tomorrow, completing the station.

That means that I might be QRV from then.
There is however one problem...........
My parents where the TX-site is, have some visitors during Easter, and one
from them
has MS, ans is very sensitive for LF electromagnetic fields........
And indeed, he had some pain in his head when running the test TX this
afternoon.
He could even notice the CW-keying......

Another uncertainty is the weather.........no idea what rain does with the
isolation in the
system (flash-overs or what ever)
Anyway, I will try to be on tomorrow, and hope to work some stations in CW
around the
usual 136.6kHz
(my test TX is X-tal controlled on 136.15kHz, my high power TX has VFO)

73

Dick, PA4VHF


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Subject: LF: RX9BS
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Hi, LF

Nice copy RX9BS last night on 137774. Screenshort attached.
Also saw OSO with RU6LA . Besides I have decode RA3YO called RX9BS.
It is suprisely I can decode RA3YO audible after using mix-then-decimate
program (I use my DigiCnv for Linux) but I can't decode this visualy.
Audibale recieving by eares after mix-then-decimate seems is more
effective. Human brine is very powerfull 'computer'!

73 de RA9MB/Alex
http://www.qsl.net/ra9mb


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--------------040906000400020106030006--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hi Alex and group,

 > It is suprisely I can decode RA3YO audible after using mix-then-decimate
 > program (I use my DigiCnv for Linux) but I can't decode this visualy.

This is in fact surprising... I tried the same years ago and found my 
ears were inferior to the eyes ;-) but I will try the same again which 
my audio playthings (which run under windoze).

At the moment, RX conditions are horrible (due to some strange new kind 
of noise) so all 136 kHz activity from DF0WD has almost stopped. The QRM 
sounds  like luxemburg-type ionospheric intermod, but it occurrs at any 
time of the day.

Best regards / Happy Easter,
  Wolf DL4YHF .


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hi Wolf

On Sat, 26 Mar 2005, Wolf DL4YHF wrote:
> 
>  > It is suprisely I can decode RA3YO audible after using mix-then-decimate
>  > program (I use my DigiCnv for Linux) but I can't decode this visualy.
> 
> This is in fact surprising... I tried the same years ago and found my 
> ears were inferior to the eyes ;-) but I will try the same again which 
> my audio playthings (which run under windoze).

May be it is worth I had play 'slow' record on 'normal' speed of sampling.
Thus QRSS change to conventional CW and few Hz of bandwidth looks like
rather wide audio band (from 0.5 to 1.5 kHz in my case). I like such a
method of qrss recieving. May be because I like CW...

73 de RA9MB/Alex
http://www.qsl.net/ra9mb




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Hello all,

Everything is ready for me to make QSO's on 136kHz!
I will firing up to "big one" today afternoon; exact time is not sure yet,
and also the duration because they expect thunderstorm later today.

I'm planning to start around 12.00utc with some tuning/testing, followed by
CQ-calls around 136.6kHz.
I hope there will be somebody out there!

CU on 136kHz

Dick, PA4VHF



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
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> Everything is ready for me to make QSO's on 136kHz!
> I'm planning to start around 12.00utc with some tuning/testing,
> followed by CQ-calls around 136.6kHz. I hope there will be somebody
> out there!

Dick,

Note that there is a permanent carrier QRM on 136.65kHz in south-east 
England. Best to avoid that frequency.

I will listen for you.

Mike, G3XDV
===========



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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Laurie,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I'm not sure about what day you mean, but I'm 
monitoring for the rest of the ZL night (its after midnight here, dawn will be 
our Sunday morning).</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE 
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV 
  style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
  <A title=laurie@g3aqc.freeserve.co.uk 
  href="mailto:laurie@g3aqc.freeserve.co.uk">Lawrence Mayhead G3AQC</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">RSGB</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 26, 2005 5:46 
  AM</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> LF: EU/ZL</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <P>Hi All,</P>
  <P>I will make an attempt today at 1800-1930 on 135.921.5 kHz&nbsp; DFCW&nbsp; 
  180sec elements.</P>
  <P>Kp shot&nbsp;up today, so&nbsp;probably last chance, also darkness window 
  getting shorter.</P>
  <P>Laurie </P><BR><BR>
  <HR SIZE=1>
  Whatever you <A href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" 
  target=_blank>Wanadoo</A><BR><BR>This email has been checked for most known 
  viruses - find out more <A href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" 
  target=_blank>here</A></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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Only the very slightest of traces.

Jay, W1VD


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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi All</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>CFH has been audible at my QTH this past couple of 
days during daytime all day. TA fans could be in with a chance for a&nbsp;QSO. 
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>de Mal/G3KEV.IO94SH</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 15:32:00 -0000
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> At the moment, RX conditions are horrible (due to some strange new
> kind of noise) so all 136 kHz activity from DF0WD has almost stopped.
> The QRM sounds  like luxemburg-type ionospheric intermod, but it
> occurrs at any time of the day.
> Best regards / Happy Easter,
>   Wolf DL4YHF .

Conditions seemed noisy here today, with signals from yourself, DL7SU 
and F6BWO below normal S/N.

Mike, G3XDV
==========





From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<P>Hi Bob and all,</P>
<P>I will transmit again in about 30mins same freq/mode.</P>
<P>73 Laurie.</P><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: LF: First QSO's on 136kHz!!
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Hello!!!!!

After more than one year of building, testing, rebuilding, questioning etc I
finally became
QRV today on 136kHz.
This afternoon I was QRV from 12.00 to 14.30UTC, and I was able to work the
following stations on 'normal CW' :

#1 DL3FDO, Reiner nr. Frankfurt  my first 136kHz QSO ever
#2 DF0WD, Wolf, well known, hi from Bielefeld JO42FD (work them often in 2m
contests, hi)
#3 G3KEV, Mal from IO94SH, best DX sofar somewhere around the 500km

In the beginning I had some troubles, mainly caused by the first
transformer,
an toroid transforming the 50Ohm from the TX to 135Ohm of the big coil.
This toroid of 58mm diameter ran very hot; to hot.....
Due to this I saw the antennacurrent going down while it became hot.

I don't know  why, because it should be large enough, I thought.

The orginal set up was 50Ohm line from TX, folowed by an toroid transformer
50--135Ohm,
connected to the variometer, and on top of the variometer the big loading
coil with taps.

I decided to change all, and put the whole thing upsite-down.
So the big loading coil is now grounded, the 50Ohm coax goes to a tap, like
1/15 of the total coil length,
and finally the variometer is on top of the whole circus between loading
coil and antenna.
This set up proved to be ok, and stable.
Antenna current was 1Amp.
I could not run more than 300Watt DC input, because the current protection
of the TX came in
at higher settings.

I was operating from my car and I could 'smell' the power sometimes, hihi.
Something somewhere inside the TX got "hot"............

I would like to thank all of you for the help provided the last year while
building my LF station.

Hope to work many of you in the future.

73 from Dick, PA4VHF (JO32eh)






From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: LF: RE: First QSO's on 136kHz!!
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Hello de Iowa USA EN31do,

CONGRATULATIONS!!!!

Doc.

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Dick
Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2005 12:09
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: First QSO's on 136kHz!!


Hello!!!!!

After more than one year of building, testing, rebuilding, questioning etc I
finally became QRV today on 136kHz. This afternoon I was QRV from 12.00 to
14.30UTC, and I was able to work the following stations on 'normal CW' :

#1 DL3FDO, Reiner nr. Frankfurt  my first 136kHz QSO ever
#2 DF0WD, Wolf, well known, hi from Bielefeld JO42FD (work them often in 2m
contests, hi) #3 G3KEV, Mal from IO94SH, best DX sofar somewhere around the
500km

In the beginning I had some troubles, mainly caused by the first
transformer, an toroid transforming the 50Ohm from the TX to 135Ohm of the
big coil. This toroid of 58mm diameter ran very hot; to hot..... Due to this
I saw the antennacurrent going down while it became hot.

I don't know  why, because it should be large enough, I thought.

The orginal set up was 50Ohm line from TX, folowed by an toroid transformer
50--135Ohm, connected to the variometer, and on top of the variometer the
big loading coil with taps.

I decided to change all, and put the whole thing upsite-down. So the big
loading coil is now grounded, the 50Ohm coax goes to a tap, like 1/15 of the
total coil length, and finally the variometer is on top of the whole circus
between loading coil and antenna. This set up proved to be ok, and stable.
Antenna current was 1Amp. I could not run more than 300Watt DC input,
because the current protection of the TX came in at higher settings.

I was operating from my car and I could 'smell' the power sometimes, hihi.
Something somewhere inside the TX got "hot"............

I would like to thank all of you for the help provided the last year while
building my LF station.

Hope to work many of you in the future.

73 from Dick, PA4VHF (JO32eh)







From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Message-ID: <000e01c53248$33596d60$e901a8c0@bob2l2u6k2n1g3>
From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <20050325220203.qhs1h540g88koks0@mailzone.onetel.net.uk>
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 09:08:08 +1200
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Subject: LF: I got something
Content-Type: multipart/mixed;
 boundary="------------020706020400030107030507"
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------020706020400030107030507
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Laurie G3AQC and others,

Before ZL sunrise I received some elements near the declared frequency, see
the attached graphic, 801.5 Hz corresponds to 135.9215 kHz.  I can send the
full Argo capture on request.

73, Bob ZL2CA

--------------020706020400030107030507
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--------------020706020400030107030507--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: lowfer@lwca.org
Cc: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 21:35:19 -0000
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WD2XES is running in WOLF mode tonight on 137.442 kHz, with 200 watts. WOLF
decoding software is still available at Stewart Nelson's site:
http://www.scgroup.com/ham/wolf.html

John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES FN42ch
WD2XES Status: http://www.w1tag.com




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Lawrence Mayhead G3AQC <laurie@g3aqc.freeserve.co.uk>
To: RSGB <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
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Subject: LF: Re. I got something
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<P>Hi Bob, this is quite exciting, I wonder how we can be sure that it was my transmission?</P>
<P>I started at 18:00 utc sending AQC, each sequence lasting 42 minutes and repeated 3 times. The last sequence ended at 20:00 utc. The frequency was 135.921.5/6 Khz as near as&nbsp;I can measure say +/- 0.1 Hz.</P>
<P>Looking at your capture, I can see one possible DFCW shift (there are no gaps between consecutive dot/dash, dash/dot transitions.) Perhaps the original capture shows this more clearly.</P>
<P>I will&nbsp; in any case transmit again tomorrow at the same time.</P>
<P>Thanks for looking 73 Laurie.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</P><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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--------------050901060002050909000100
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Hi Bob,<BR>
<BR>
very nice. The only Eu signals I could see here at the time were Laurie and Teo:<BR>
<BR>
YU7AR: start 17:41 on 135921.82 Hz, end 19:20 on 921.70 Hz, 5x "AR" in QRSS-60<BR>
G3AQC: start 18:01 on 921.51/.43 Hz, end 20:01 on 921.34/.26, 3x "AQC" in DFCW-180<BR>
<BR>
>From your shot I would not dare say who was the lucky one, as both were near 135921.5 and both drifting downward slightly. An accurate time/frequency comparison should reveal the truth ;-) <BR>
<BR>
73 de Markus, DF6NM<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In einer eMail vom 26.03.2005 22:11:02 Westeuropäische Normalzeit schreibt vernall@xtra.co.nz: <BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Laurie G3AQC and others,<BR>
<BR>
Before ZL sunrise I received some elements near the declared frequency, see<BR>
the attached graphic, 801.5 Hz corresponds to 135.9215 kHz.&nbsp; I can send the<BR>
full Argo capture on request.<BR>
<BR>
73, Bob ZL2CA<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</FONT></HTML>
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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Markus and others,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Thanks for comments.&nbsp; For info, my sunrise was 
nominally 1838 UTC, so on my capture it is about 17 ticks from the right 
side.&nbsp; So my best sigs were just before sunrise, and went past it for a 
while before fading out.&nbsp; Mutual dark time with YU7 should be about 1 hour 
50 minutes.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Cheers for now,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr 
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV 
  style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
  <A title=MarkusVester@aol.com 
  href="mailto:MarkusVester@aol.com">MarkusVester@aol.com</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> 
  </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, March 27, 2005 10:04 
  AM</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: LF: I got something</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT lang=2 face=Arial size=2 
  FAMILY="SANSSERIF" PTSIZE="10">Hi Bob,<BR><BR>very nice. The only Eu signals I 
  could see here at the time were Laurie and Teo:<BR><BR>YU7AR: start 17:41 on 
  135921.82 Hz, end 19:20 on 921.70 Hz, 5x "AR" in QRSS-60<BR>G3AQC: start 18:01 
  on 921.51/.43 Hz, end 20:01 on 921.34/.26, 3x "AQC" in DFCW-180<BR><BR>From 
  your shot I would not dare say who was the lucky one, as both were near 
  135921.5 and both drifting downward slightly. An accurate time/frequency 
  comparison should reveal the truth ;-) <BR><BR>73 de Markus, 
  DF6NM<BR><BR><BR>In einer eMail vom 26.03.2005 22:11:02 Westeuropäische 
  Normalzeit schreibt vernall@xtra.co.nz: <BR><BR>
  <BLOCKQUOTE 
  style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px" 
  TYPE="CITE">Laurie G3AQC and others,<BR><BR>Before ZL sunrise I received 
    some elements near the declared frequency, see<BR>the attached graphic, 
    801.5 Hz corresponds to 135.9215 kHz.&nbsp; I can send the<BR>full Argo 
    capture on request.<BR><BR>73, Bob ZL2CA<BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR></FONT>
  <P>
  <HR>

  <P></P>
  <P>
  <CENTER><IMG 
  src="CID:{46F56B24-EECF-4C80-86B8-E070F9196260}/AR_AQC_050326_2000.jpg"></CENTER></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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WD2XDW now at max "radiiated" power from this QTH with PSU/household breaker 
limitations.  Up 1 dB from yesterday. I think thats it....

1152W input, near 1Kw out, measured 46 Amps cool hand Loop current (yikes!), 
Rac around 0.5 ohm.  137,7752, 137.7756  Khz DFCW 90 "XDW" - dash Hi / CW Id 
and message at beginning of sequence (24 mins).

May switch to alien spaceship mode later in the night - looks like DFCW on 
ARGO dot 30 slow with a series of small freq space lines betwen 
137,7753/137.7756 where the "dot" part of the DFCW sequece is. Actual "dot" 
signal is sweeping at a rate of 3.7 secs traingular wave to produce the 
signal pattern.

No forest fires.  No (sic) Volts. No birds falling out of the trees as of 
yet - occasional misguided golfballs only  during Tx sequence (orbit changed 
due to near field issues?)

Laurence KL1X in 5 EM26AQ Bartlesville OK

Status http://myweb.cableone.net/flow




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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
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Hi all,

With assistance from a graphical overlay analysis by Markus DF6NM, it seems 
my Argo capture is a good match to the "AR" QRSS60 beacon from Teo YU7AR. 
I'm still exchanging private email with Markus but he has probably gone to 
bed by now.

The distance between YU7AR and myself is approximately 17,800 km but I would 
like to get specific grid square or co-ordinate information from Teo before 
working out the actual distance.

I'll be receiving again tonight, and so will Andrew ZL2BBJ.  I think that 
Mike ZL4OL could be "away for Easter" and missing the current spot of fun.

Tonight I will run one Argo session at 120 second dot length and another at 
60 second dot length.

73, Bob ZL2CA 




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>but I would
> like to get specific grid square or co-ordinate information from Teo
before
> working out the actual distance.

KN05bw...according to online Buckmaster.

VE7SL



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<P>Many thanks Marcus for the screenshots and analysis. I agree that the elements recieved by Bob were most likely from Teo. So many congratulations to both Teo and Bob.</P>
<P>However I shall still be on tonight !</P>
<P>73 Laurie.</P><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

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Hello Steve,Bob,Markus and oder,


My grid square is OK in Buckmaster, and actual distance is :

KN05BW - RE78IR = 17,906 Km


>>but I would
>> like to get specific grid square or co-ordinate information from Teo
SM> before
>> working out the actual distance.

SM> KN05bw...according to online Buckmaster.

SM> VE7SL



-- 
Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Dear Bob, Teo, Laurie and LF group,<BR>
<BR>
yes, I definitely think that traces of YU7AR were seen by ZL2CA last night. The image overlay clearly shows a match between the narrow dashes on Bob's Argo and my own 21-milliHz capture of Teo's transmission (fat yellowish trace on vertically stretched noise) behind it.<BR>
<BR>
Congratulations to both ! And best of luck, to Laurie and anyone else trying to break that record as soon as possible ;-).<BR>
<BR>
73 de Markus, DF6NM<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">----- Original Message ----- <BR>
<B>From:</B> <A HREF="mailto:MarkusVester@aol.com">MarkusVester@aol.com</A> <BR>
<B>To:</B> <A HREF="mailto:vernall@xtra.co.nz">vernall@xtra.co.nz</A> <BR>
<B>Cc:</B> <A HREF="mailto:laurie@g3aqc.freeserve.co.uk">laurie@g3aqc.freeserve.co.uk</A> ; <A HREF="mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu">yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu</A> <BR>
<B>Sent:</B> Sunday, March 27, 2005 12:04 PM<BR>
 <B>Subject:</B> Re: Argo pic<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Dear Bob,<BR>
<BR>
I tried to align our two screenshots, by first scaling (125%x,400%y) and cropping mine to your Argo borders, and then aligned them manually using iMerge by Jon Grove (<A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/jgroveuk/iMerge.html">www.geocities.com/jgroveuk/iMerge.html</A>), originally made for stacking of CCD astro images.<BR>
<BR>
To achieve the best fit to Teo's signal, I had to assume a time-delay of approx. 9 pixels (108 s), which would be expected due to the FFT processing delay: Argo shows the time when a signal appears on screen, whereas SpecLab tries to compensate for the delay. There would also have to be a frequency calibration difference of about 0.11 Hz beween us, yet unexplained.<BR>
<BR>
I also tried to relate your image to Laurie's signal which would be closer in frequency, but couldn't find a match to his sequence. Another point is that the second DFCW frequency is missing.<BR>
<BR>
So I guess it's time to congratulate - bells and all ;-) <BR>
<BR>
73, and best of luck again for tomorrow's test<BR>
de Markus, DF6NM<BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
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--------------080002070809040901010308--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Not even a trace last night - big Tstorms over SE US. Will continue to
monitor.

Congrats to Bob & Teo.

Jay, W1VD



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Added captures to my website:

    http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm

27th: VO1NA and WD2XGJ (poor TA condx)

26th: WD2XES (Jason), WD2XGJ, VO1NA, G3XDV, OK2BVG, DF0WD, ON7ZO,
      F6CWA, RU6LA, RA3YO, DK8ND and G3WCB

25th: DK1IS, G3XIZ, DL3ZID, G3WCB, RA3YO and RU6LA


Congrats to Bob and Teo!

73
Hartmut

Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
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Nice DC input of around 500Watt, and high antennacurrent over 1 amp.
Really operating at the limit of the protection circuit, hihi.

Unfortunatly (due to easter?) very poor activety.
I called CQ for over 1 hour without repons, except for one station.

Between 09.45 and 10.10utc I was called by an DL2H..... station.
I tried everything to get his suffix, but I just couldn't get it.
Who was this station?

On receiving using an AOR AR7030plus and DSP59+ @25Hz width.

Dick, pa4vhf



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Dick wrote:

>Nice DC input of around 500Watt, and high antennacurrent over 1 amp.
>Really operating at the limit of the protection circuit, hihi.
>
>Unfortunatly (due to easter?) very poor activety.
>I called CQ for over 1 hour without repons, except for one station.
>
>Between 09.45 and 10.10utc I was called by an DL2H..... station.
>I tried everything to get his suffix, but I just couldn't get it.
>Who was this station?
>
>On receiving using an AOR AR7030plus and DSP59+ @25Hz width.
>
>Dick, pa4vhf
>  
>
DL2HRE was calling and copied you well.
73 Ko, NL9222


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Hi all.
Ed, RU6LA told me, that he is sometimes late in sending out QSL's.
If somebody is still missing his card, let me know or contact him direktly.


    Heinz, DM2BHG


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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
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I'm curious whether anyone across the pond tried to copy last night's WOLF
transmission, and whether there is any interest in trying it again.

John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES




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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi All</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>If I get time this evening I will TX on 135.921.700 
khz at QRS 60. I will slip in between the others on the QRG avoiding 
QRM.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Time approx 1815z - 1915z </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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John,

> I'm curious whether anyone across the pond tried to copy last night's WOLF
> transmission, and whether there is any interest in trying it again.

poorer TA conditions last night, than the previous night. I tried it,
but no copy. I'm interested to try it again.

Hartmut



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Hartmut,

Thanks very much. I will run it for the next few nights. 

John A.



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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 17:25:36 +0100
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Subject: LF: ZL condx
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi All</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Condx look gud for EU/ZL tonite. RU6LA has been 
audible all day since 0830z this morning and this afternoon. CFH has been 
audible all day long this past week when active. I have my system on the nose 
for tonite and anything is possible4.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hello LF group,

Im QRT today, my antena coil is melt off last night ,

GL for others !

 Teo

-- 
Best regards,
 YU7AR                          mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: MarkusVester@aol.com
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Subject: Re2: LF: Likely match to YU7AR transmission
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Dear Bob, Teo and LF group,<BR>
<BR>
regarding frequency scales:<BR>
when annotating my ticks in the overlayed clip, I erroneously typed in "922.x" where it should have been "921.x"; corrected version appended here. The "original" is at <A HREF="http:/members.aol.com/df6nm2/overlay.jpg">http:/members.aol.com/df6nm2/overlay.jpg</A> (72kB).<BR>
<BR>
Otherwise I checked my calibration today by feeding GPS 1-pps pulses to the RX, and the resulting 1 Hz lines were deviating less then half a pixel from SpecLab's scale ticks. This would imply that ZL2CA's absolute frequency readout should have been 0.1 to 0.12 Hz low.<BR>
<BR>
73 de Markus, DF6NM<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In einer eMail vom 27.03.2005 11:35:08 Westeuropäische Normalzeit schreibt MarkusVester@aol.com: <BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Dear Bob, Teo, Laurie and LF group,<BR>
<BR>
yes, I definitely think that traces of YU7AR were seen by ZL2CA last night. The image overlay clearly shows a match between the narrow dashes on Bob's Argo and my own 21-milliHz capture of Teo's transmission (fat yellowish trace on vertically stretched noise) behind it.<BR>
<BR>
Congratulations to both ! And best of luck, to Laurie and anyone else trying to break that record as soon as possible ;-).<BR>
<BR>
73 de Markus, DF6NM<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
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--------------040308020608080406070504--

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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Dear Bob, Andrew and group,<BR>
<BR>
my grabber's view of tonight's Eu transmissions can be found at<BR>
<A HREF="http:/members.aol.com/df6nm2/testEu_050327_2000.gif">http:/members.aol.com/df6nm2/testEu_050327_2000.gif</A> (194kB). Players were<BR>
<BR>
DF6NM: tx 19:10 to 19:45 on 922.39/.29 Hz, 3x"NM" in DFCW-100 <BR>
DJ8WX: start 18:08 on 922.05, end 19:45 on 922.01, "WX WX WX W" in QRSS-60<BR>
G3KEV: start 18:09, qro 18:15, end 19:43 on 921.57 Hz, "KEV G3KEV" in QRSS-60<BR>
RA3YO: 921.29 Hz, qsy at 18:35 to 921.43 until 19:15, "RA3YO" in QRSS-60<BR>
G3AQC: start 17:44 on 921.36/.28, end 19:43 on 921.27/.19, 3x"AQC" in DFCW-180<BR>
<BR>
We are all trembling with exitement...<BR>
<BR>
Good luck to Teo for the coil repair work, I guess it was worth it ;-))<BR>
<BR>
73 de Markus, DF6NM<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi all,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I have a nil report this morning.&nbsp; Fishing was 
better yesterday morning ;-)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Thanks to Markus for the analysis.&nbsp; Regarding 
absolute frequency accuracy, I could have up to 0.12 Hz error by way of offsets 
in receiver and the sound card calibration.&nbsp;I'll do some&nbsp;checks 
today.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
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Teo YU7AR,

> Im QRT today, my antena coil is melt off last night ,
>
> GL for others !

I'm glad that yesterday your beacon transmission left the antenna before
coil melt down ...

73, Bob ZL2CA




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Dear Dick, 
it only can be DL2 HRE.
55,
Hans-Albrecht DK 8 ND 


rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org schrieb am 27.03.05 14:14:40:
> 
> Nice DC input of around 500Watt, and high antennacurrent over 1 amp.
> Really operating at the limit of the protection circuit, hihi.
> 
> Unfortunatly (due to easter?) very poor activety.
> I called CQ for over 1 hour without repons, except for one station.
> 
> Between 09.45 and 10.10utc I was called by an DL2H..... station.
> I tried everything to get his suffix, but I just couldn't get it.
> Who was this station?
> 
> On receiving using an AOR AR7030plus and DSP59+ @25Hz width.
> 
> Dick, pa4vhf
> 
> 


__________________________________________________________
Mit WEB.DE FreePhone mit hoechster Qualitaet ab 0 Ct./Min.
weltweit telefonieren! http://freephone.web.de/?mc=021201



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
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Back on 137.442 tonight, WOLF mode.

John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES FN42ch
WD2XES Status: http://www.w1tag.com



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Hello, Dick.

I heard G3XIZ calling you on CW at about 1015 utc, so your signals are
getting to G-land OK!

73,

Dave G3WCB

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Dick
Sent: 27 March 2005 13:11
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: who was calling me this morning??


Nice DC input of around 500Watt, and high antennacurrent over 1 amp.
Really operating at the limit of the protection circuit, hihi.

Unfortunatly (due to easter?) very poor activety.
I called CQ for over 1 hour without repons, except for one station.

Between 09.45 and 10.10utc I was called by an DL2H..... station.
I tried everything to get his suffix, but I just couldn't get it.
Who was this station?

On receiving using an AOR AR7030plus and DSP59+ @25Hz width.

Dick, pa4vhf






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<P>Thanks to Bob and others for listening.</P>
<P>Kp still low so will try again this evening&nbsp; start 17:45utc</P>
<P>73 Laurie.&nbsp;</P><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Laurie G3AQC,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>OK, I'll be listening again overnight 
here.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Also a check on my frequency calibration found an 
0.09 Hz error in my sound card, so I've corrected that, however, that alone does 
not make a signal rise out of the noise.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>No word from Teo about "unmelting" his coil 
....</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE 
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV 
  style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
  <A title=laurie@g3aqc.freeserve.co.uk 
  href="mailto:laurie@g3aqc.freeserve.co.uk">Lawrence Mayhead G3AQC</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">RSGB</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, March 28, 2005 8:06 
PM</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> LF: Re. EU/ZL</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <P>Thanks to Bob and others for listening.</P>
  <P>Kp still low so will try again this evening&nbsp; start 17:45utc</P>
  <P>73 Laurie.&nbsp;</P><BR><BR>
  <HR SIZE=1>
  Whatever you <A href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" 
  target=_blank>Wanadoo</A><BR><BR>This email has been checked for most known 
  viruses - find out more <A href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" 
  target=_blank>here</A></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 10:35:24 +0100
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> Unfortunatly (due to easter?) very poor activety.
> I called CQ for over 1 hour without repons, except for one station.

Congratulations on getting on the air.

There was quite a lot of activity over the weekend, and several 
stations calling you, including me. Perhaps your next move is to 
check that the receive system is as good as it can be.

It is possible the receiver is not sensitive enough, or not properly 
matched. It might be being blocked by out-of-band signals. More 
likely, you may have QRM from local electrical sources such as 
SMPSUs, long-life light bulbs etc.

Some tips:
DCF39 should be a long way over S9.
You should be able to hear the 'chatter' (also known as galloping 
horses) from Loran all over the band.
The band noise should not be 'flat' (white noise). You should be able 
to hear continuous static and other interesting noises.
The background noise should not vary much across the band. If it 
does, you may have local QRM.

Possible improvements are:
A tuned pre-amp (see G3YXM's web site).
If the sensitivity is good, a receive tuner may reduce blocking 
effects from commercial LF stations.
A loop antenna dedicated to receiving (this can be placed to null out 
a source of local QRM).

Good luck. I look forward to our first QSO.

Mike, G3XDV
==========



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From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
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Thanks for the help everyone.
I'm happy to see that my TX-signal is good; so I don't have to bother about
that anymore.

Well, I had quite high noiselevel that morning, so that might explain why I
couldn't hear
the stations calling me.
I was using the TX-antenna for reception, certainly not the best, but as
least it is something.

As receiver I have an AOR AR7030plus, which has good sensitivety and strong
signal handling.
I do realize that from reception point of view my station isn't that good,
and next project will
focus on that, especially the RX-antenna.
However, I'm quite busy with other things, so it might take some time before
I have
better 'ears'

Meanwhile I will be QRV from time to time.
The only permanent thing is the TX-antenna; all other stuff has to be build
up every time
I want to operate. (my car is my shack...)

CU on 136

Dick, PA4VHF



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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">Hi Bob,<BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Also a check on my frequency calibration found an 0.09 Hz error in my sound card, so I've corrected that, however, that alone does not make a signal rise out of the noise.</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=12 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2"><BR>
&nbsp; </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" BACK="#ffffff" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 PTSIZE=10 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="2">...we're working hard on that one ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Markus<BR>
</FONT></HTML>

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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 06:20:02 -0500
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Subject: LF: TA MAR 27/28
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>TA enthusiasts</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>WX&nbsp;peaked above the noise around 
0400Z.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Teo - sorry to hear about&nbsp;meltdown...missed 
seeing your signal last night.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jay, W1VD</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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--------------090401080803050505080506--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Message-ID: <001901c53389$a55563a0$73e8fc3e@l8p8y6>
From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <NKEMLGOEKANPNJOBFBAFKECLCDAA.g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 12:26:38 +0100
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary - G4WGT" <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
To: "LF (Rsgb LF Group)" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 9:26 PM
Subject: LF: Re : tests.


>
> Hi All at LF,
>
> Had to cease tests as I saw arcing on the spriral top load several times,
it
> has been raining today so it may be due to the wet on the  spiral or
> possibly a problem with the higher power or a combination of both. I will
> keep you informed.
>
> Regards,
>
> Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp
>
> Web : http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor
>
>
Hi Gary
What sort of PA have you now got. There was some discussion earlier about
Cap and Res values etc so what values did you find optimum.
73 de Mal/G3KEV




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: YU7AR <yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu>
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Hello Jay and Bob


JR> Teo - sorry to hear about meltdown...missed 
JR> seeing your signal last night.

JR> Jay, W1VD

 this moment I repair loading coil, but antena wire now is only 3, one is break
 out. Signal strong maybe little lower today !?
 I start in abt 18:00-19:30 for ZL  and 22:00-08:00 for W  on 135.9217

 Teo,

-- 
Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



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Subject: Re: LF: Re: WD2XES WOLF
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------080300050209010109050703
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John,

> Back on 137.442 tonight, WOLF mode.

> John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES FN42ch
> WD2XES Status: http://www.w1tag.com

See attachement, have not found the command how to make a txt-file of
it.

73

Hartmut

Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de
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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <009501c5324b$b60f01e0$0500a8c0@charter.net> <002e01c532c7$f8ca10c0$0500a8c0@charter.net> <1339350698.20050327171840@t-online.de> <005501c532d8$c146e220$0500a8c0@charter.net> <00a501c53314$ebca66c0$0500a8c0@charter.net> <706060434.20050328154323@t-online.de>
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Subject: Re: LF: Re: WD2XES WOLF
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Hartmut,

Wow! I did not really expect that we would pull this off. Congratulations!
To my knowledge, my copy of M0BMU  (in 2001?) is the only other T/A WOLF
reception.

What time was the recording made?

Some hints:

1. On Windows 95 and 98, there are some buttons at the top of the MS-DOS
screen that allow you to mark (with the mouse) and copy text. On the newer
versions of Windows, click the colored MSDOS logo in the top left corner.
Then click Edit, and you can mark and copy text.

2. Another approach is to add " >filename " (no quotes) at the end of the
WOLF command line, and the text output will be redirected to the file name
that you use.

3. The "pm" values are quite low on your screen. For WOLF, run a fairly high
recording level, maybe only 6 dB below maximum. The bulk of the audio is
noise, and the actual signal is many dB down. If you use too much level, the
"pm" values will increase in steps of 4096, indicating overload.

4. By the looks of the other parameters, you appear to be OK for frequency
and sampling rate. That is a problem for many users, but you are doing it
correctly.

John Andrews




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "James Moritz" <james.moritz@btopenworld.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 15:15:28 +0100
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Subject: LF: Halcyon PFS-1 off-air standard
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1" http-equiv=Content-Type>
<META content="MSHTML 5.00.2614.3500" name=GENERATOR>
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<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Dear LF Group,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>One of the traders at the Stevenage rally a few 
weeks back had a stack of these frequency standards for sale - I have finally 
got round to looking at one, and it turns out to have some very interesting 
features for LF or other radio use. I don't have any technical data for these 
units, but it is possible to figure quite a lot out by peeking under the 
covers.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>It consists of two parts - the receiver part has a 
10MHz crystal oscillator phase-locked to the 198kHz Droitwich signal - it would 
be difficult to use any other signal, because the RX has a 198kHz crystal, and 
the synthesiser logic is inside a programmable logic IC. The unit comes with a 
remote ferrite rod antenna connected via 50ohm coax. There is an S-meter, and 
lock indicator light, which comes on within a minute or so of a signal being 
connected. On the back, there are 1MHz, 5MHz and 10MHz outputs from the 
receiver.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The other part is the actual frequency standard - 
it takes the 10MHz output from the receiver (or another 10MHz standard), and 
uses this to lock a 20MHz ovened reference (HCD71 -see&nbsp;<A 
href="http://www.hcdresearch.co.uk/71.htm">http://www.hcdresearch.co.uk/71.htm</A> 
) When no 10MHz signal is present, the OCXO provides the frequency standard, 
which can be trimmed from the front panel. The 20MHz signal is available at the 
front panel "monitor" socket, but the main output is from a DDS synthesiser, 
which is set by a row of PCB rotary switches, which can only be accessed with 
the cover off. The synthesiser is interesting, because it&nbsp;seems to use 
binary-coded decimal logic instead of straightforward binary like the AD dds 
chips. This means the frequencies come out as exact decimal numbers, rather than 
the nearest binary fraction approximation, which will inevitably have a small, 
built-in error. The frequency can be set from 0 - 15.999... MHz in steps of only 
10e-4Hz. The output starts to roll off below a few kHz. Since my LF TX has a 
divide-by-100 stage built in, I could use one of these standards at 13.6MHz to 
give tuning steps of 1 micro-hertz, should&nbsp;a need arise... There seem to be 
pads on the PCB for a connector to external switches, so I guess it woud not be 
hard to add a computer interface if you wanted to. The whole thing runs off a 
nominal 12V at several hundred of mA, so would be quite useful for portable 
operation, or battery back-up. It is in a 19" rack case about 45mm thick and 
200mm deep.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I have the phone number of the guy who was selling 
these if anyone is interested - the asking price at Stevenage was 50GBP, and he 
said he had about 60 available at that time.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Cheers, Jim Moritz</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de M0BMU</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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John,

> Wow! I did not really expect that we would pull this off. Congratulations!

Thanks. I was a bit surprised when the characters appeared on the screen.

> What time was the recording made?

0110-0200z.

> Some hints:

Thanks for the hints.

73
Hartmut



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Subject: LF: the use of Epcos cores on LF
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A question, especially for our German members.

Epcos makes (big) cores of so called N30 material.
I previously used an 58mm core to match 50 Ohm to 135Ohm, but it got
really hot at around 400-500Watt or so.
I wonder if this is normal or not (Ui=4300)

These cores are relatively cheap, so I hoped it was a good solution for big
(output) transformers.
Now I am not to sure anymore...........

Also interested to know if anyone has experience in using a low beverage,
let's say 400-500m long at 1m heigth as TX antenna. 
Not earthed/resistor at the end, just a simple very long wire at 1m heigth.

73

Dick, pa4vhf



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LF enthusiasts,

Sunday, March 27, 2005 ZL2CA wrote:

V> Before ZL sunrise I received some elements near the declared frequency, see
V> the attached graphic, 801.5 Hz corresponds to 135.9215 kHz.  I can send the
V> full Argo capture on request.

Bravo Bob ZL2CA and Teo YU7AR!
Best distance 1-way QSO on 136-> QRB=17906km (LA0FX soft)
You expand LF's way and force to work others ;-)
The next step will be for Lawrence G3AQC or ... + Bob ZL2CA, Andrew
ZL2BBJ, Mike ZL4OL or ...?
...we wait for good propagation Eu/ZL...

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <001301c533a6$e3f37c60$2102000a@ibm>
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 18:21:28 +0100
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Hi Dick the Epcos core data is on the web but the PDF file download doesnt
work for me. See
http://www.search.epcos.com/pls/prins/para_search.init?M_SPRACHID=2
I have a number of large epcos cores but have not tried to use them yet.
As to the transformer loss....do you have enough turns ?? Do you have too
many turns. I magine ther is no DC flowing through the winding. Have you
tried stacking a couple of cores to increase the cross-section area??.

Cheers de Alan G3NYK
alan.melia (at) btinternet.com


----- Original Message -----
From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 28 March 2005 16:00
Subject: LF: the use of Epcos cores on LF


> A question, especially for our German members.
>
> Epcos makes (big) cores of so called N30 material.
> I previously used an 58mm core to match 50 Ohm to 135Ohm, but it got
> really hot at around 400-500Watt or so.
> I wonder if this is normal or not (Ui=4300)
>
> These cores are relatively cheap, so I hoped it was a good solution for
big
> (output) transformers.
> Now I am not to sure anymore...........
>
> Also interested to know if anyone has experience in using a low beverage,
> let's say 400-500m long at 1m heigth as TX antenna.
> Not earthed/resistor at the end, just a simple very long wire at 1m
heigth.
>
> 73
>
> Dick, pa4vhf
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Niels Rudberg J?rgensen" <niels.rudberg@post.tele.dk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 5:00 PM
Subject: LF: the use of Epcos cores on LF


> A question, especially for our German members.
> 
> Epcos makes (big) cores of so called N30 material.
> I previously used an 58mm core to match 50 Ohm to 135Ohm, but it got
> really hot at around 400-500Watt or so.
> I wonder if this is normal or not (Ui=4300)
> 
> These cores are relatively cheap, so I hoped it was a good solution for big
> (output) transformers.
> Now I am not to sure anymore...........
> 
> Also interested to know if anyone has experience in using a low beverage,
> let's say 400-500m long at 1m heigth as TX antenna. 
> Not earthed/resistor at the end, just a simple very long wire at 1m heigth.
> 
> 73
> 
> Dick, pa4vhf
> 
The core mentioned is OK for this purpose. I suspect you made the transformer
with too few turns. 
For 500 W (SWR = 1:1) a turns number of 25:40 will be OK.
Too few turns causes a too high magnetizing current with subsequent 
heating of the core.
73 Niels, OZ8NJ+ 


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
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Subject: LF: Re: Re: the use of Epcos cores on LF
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Well that might be the answer!!!!!!!!
I am using 15 turns of 2.36mm wire. The 50 ohm tap is at 9 turns.
I will try again ith more turns of a bit thinner wire to see what happens.
Thanks Niels!

73, Dick PA4VHF


----- Original Message -----
From: Niels Rudberg J?rgensen <niels.rudberg@post.tele.dk>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 8:52 PM
Subject: LF: Re: the use of Epcos cores on LF


>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
> To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 5:00 PM
> Subject: LF: the use of Epcos cores on LF
>
>
> > A question, especially for our German members.
> >
> > Epcos makes (big) cores of so called N30 material.
> > I previously used an 58mm core to match 50 Ohm to 135Ohm, but it got
> > really hot at around 400-500Watt or so.
> > I wonder if this is normal or not (Ui=4300)
> >
> > These cores are relatively cheap, so I hoped it was a good solution for
big
> > (output) transformers.
> > Now I am not to sure anymore...........
> >
> > Also interested to know if anyone has experience in using a low
beverage,
> > let's say 400-500m long at 1m heigth as TX antenna.
> > Not earthed/resistor at the end, just a simple very long wire at 1m
heigth.
> >
> > 73
> >
> > Dick, pa4vhf
> >
> The core mentioned is OK for this purpose. I suspect you made the
transformer
> with too few turns.
> For 500 W (SWR = 1:1) a turns number of 25:40 will be OK.
> Too few turns causes a too high magnetizing current with subsequent
> heating of the core.
> 73 Niels, OZ8NJ+
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Gary - G4WGT" <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 20:48:25 +0100
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Hi Mal & LF,

I am using the G0MRF 300 watt Tx but since blowing several PA mosfets I
decided to carry out the M0BMU PA mods using the original toroid & I can now
run a cool PA up to 650 watts into dummy load bench testing. I put it on air
into antenna & started with 280 watts & on following tests gradually
increased to 420 watts (still cool) with antenna current up to 2.3 Amps it
was at this time I got corona/arcing on the spiral top load so I stopped
tests until I have the time to lower the mast & carry out a visual
inspection of the area of arcing so as to effect a cure. I suspect that I
may have too little clearance between the spiral & the metal fixing
hardware, an inspection will be carried when work & family permit.

Regards,

Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp

Web : http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor



-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of hamilton mal
Sent: 28 March 2005 12:27
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: Re: Re : tests.



----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary - G4WGT" <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
To: "LF (Rsgb LF Group)" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 9:26 PM
Subject: LF: Re : tests.


>
> Hi All at LF,
>
> Had to cease tests as I saw arcing on the spriral top load several times,
it
> has been raining today so it may be due to the wet on the  spiral or
> possibly a problem with the higher power or a combination of both. I will
> keep you informed.
>
> Regards,
>
> Gary - G4WGT - IO83qp
>
> Web : http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor
>
>
Hi Gary
What sort of PA have you now got. There was some discussion earlier about
Cap and Res values etc so what values did you find optimum.
73 de Mal/G3KEV





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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi all,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Nil to report on captures around 135.9215 kHz this 
morning.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <009501c5324b$b60f01e0$0500a8c0@charter.net> <002e01c532c7$f8ca10c0$0500a8c0@charter.net> <1339350698.20050327171840@t-online.de> <005501c532d8$c146e220$0500a8c0@charter.net> <00a501c53314$ebca66c0$0500a8c0@charter.net> <706060434.20050328154323@t-online.de> <000e01c533a0$21b04030$3c01a8c0@JKA> <1788152108.20050328164642@t-online.de>
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WOLF again tonight, starting at 2300 UTC, 137.442 kHz.

John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES



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From: Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ <k2ors@comcast.net>
To: rsgb lf reflector <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>, 
 LWCA LF Reflector <lowfer@lwca.org>
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 22:07:39 +0000
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I've moved WD2XGJ up approx.  0.2 Hz to 137.7799 to clear a Western North America Loran line.


--
73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
FN42hi


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Good one Bob and Teo. It appears I should have been watching Argo instead of
lying in that thermal pool in the Southern Alps. Now that I am home again I
will watch for Eu LF signals overnight.

Mike ZL4OL



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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>TA enthusiasts</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>WX visible from 0200 - 0430Z&nbsp;but with some 
deep fades.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><IMG alt="" hspace=0 
src="cid:002301c5344f$ff0c8b00$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL" align=baseline 
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From: Marek SQ5BPM <sq5bpm@wp.pl>
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Subject: LF: More on cores...
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Hello all,

I noticed that people are using much more turns than me in the output 
transformer, so I would appreciate any help in calculating the correct 
number of turns for the cores I am using here. Messing around the trafo 
would probably allow me to achieve more power than now (450W). Trying to 
go higher causes heavy ringing + FET heating. I've tried almost 
everything to reduce this (different combinations of Zobel network, 
decoupling, inductances in series with gates, screening, grounding 
etc.). In every case around 400W things start to go bad, 450W is a 
border of manageable heat and ringing. I am thinking about making a new 
FET driver in a way that allows regulation of the time of the FET 
on-state, leaving some rest period in-between.

Here are some details about my configuration: the power supply is 45V, 
dropping to 38-39V at around 12A (depending on the 230V mains voltage). 
I am using two R40/24/16 rings made of K2006 material, stuck together, 
for detailed info see 
http://www.kaschke.de/english/framesets/frame_ringkerne.html . After 
experimenting with different configurations, currently there's 2+2 turns 
in the primary winding, 5 or 6 turns in the secondary winding. I 
remember that 4+4 primary didn't work good, but this was just a short 
try with low power - maybe there's a way to make this work with that as 
well. Cores are slightly warm but never get hot. The power supply is 
driven through a coil made of a single core (the same type), consisting 
of 5 turns. This one gets hot only when there's too much ringing in the 
PA. Adjusting turns in this one does not change a lot.

Thanks in advance for any help, I hope to make the TX again from scratch 
this summer: bigger, better & more powerful ;)

73! Marek SQ5BPM

P.S. Don't be surprised seeing another special callsign on LF, these 
days we are celebrating 25-th anniversary of the SP5ZCC Scouts Amateur 
Radio Club. I am planning some LF operation with this call on April 
9-10th. For the time being, I hope to see some of you in the SP DX 
Contest CW/SSB on April 2nd-3rd (HF). Check 
http://www.contest.spdxc.org.pl/en/index.php for more information.


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: YU7AR <yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu>
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Hello Jay,

nice screen capture from "WX" Uwe, I not transmit yesterday ur direction
somting I try from ZL, but ERP is very weak, antena sistem is finished
today maybe !

73 Teo



JR> WX visible from 0200 - 0430Z 

JR> Jay, W1VD



-- 
Best regards,
 YU7AR                            mailto:yu7ar@pyrotherm.co.yu



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Andy" <actalbot@southsurf.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: LF: Re: More on cores...
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For a sinusoidal waveform, the minimum number of turns on a core is given by
:

V(rms) = 4.44. F . N . A . B   where

V is the voltage across the winding
F is the frequency in Hz
A is the core cross sectional area in m^2
B is the peak flux in Teslas

To avoid excessive dissipation, for modern ferrites if you keep B to a value
of 0.2T or less you will be OK.

As an example, for a core of  15mm diameter (approximately an ETD49 core)
used in a 700 Watt PA the 50 ohms winding is calculated as follows :

V = SQRT(700 * 50) = 187V(rms)
This corresponds to a cross sectional area of 177mm^2,  or  A =  177*10^-6
m^2
V = 187, F = 137000, B = 0.2, A = 177E-6

N(min) =   187 / (4.44 * 137000 * 177E-6 * 0.2)  =  8.7 Turns
Taking to the nearest integer above, you will at least need 9 turns for this
winding.  You could use more turns to get B even lower, but now the copper
losses begin to increase as the wire length rises so adding a couple of
turns to get B even lower is the most you really need to do, so 10 to 11
turns is about right for this core.

Note that the type of ferrite is not important, all transformer ferrites
saturate as you get near 0.3T, althoug h modern ones MAY allow a bit higher.
This equation seems to suggest that any size of core is acceptable for any
voltage provided enough turns are used, and in a way this is true, but
getting higher power through the core needs larger cross-sectional area.
The calculations here are more involved, and it is easiest to resort to the
data sheets and look at what the manufacturer claims is the maximum rating
for any particular core.

As a guide line, on my switchmode PA that generated RF direct from 340 Volt
rectified mains (see QEX November/Dec 2002) I found an ETD49 sized core
using 3C85 material would happily carry 700 Watts with B kept to below
0.18T.  The primary winding operating at 29 ohms load impedance was made
with 3mm diameter plastic covered Litz wire, and the secondary winding for
matching into 50 to 150 ohms antenna resistance from 1mm diameter enamelled
wire.    At 700 W continuous operation for several hours in UK summer
temperatures, the transformer core sat around 60 - 70 degrees - comfortably
within its rating

Andy  G4JNT






-----Original Message-----
From: Marek SQ5BPM <sq5bpm@wp.pl>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Date: 2005/03/29 14:46
Subject: LF: More on cores...


>Hello all,
>
>I noticed that people are using much more turns than me in the output
>transformer, so I would appreciate any help in calculating the correct
>number of turns for the cores I am using here. Messing around the trafo
>would probably allow me to achieve more power than now (450W). Trying to
>go higher causes heavy ringing + FET heating. I've tried almost
>everything to reduce this (different combinations of Zobel network,
>decoupling, inductances in series with gates, screening, grounding
>etc.). In every case around 400W things start to go bad, 450W is a
>border of manageable heat and ringing. I am thinking about making a new
>FET driver in a way that allows regulation of the time of the FET
>on-state, leaving some rest period in-between.
>
>Here are some details about my configuration: the power supply is 45V,
>dropping to 38-39V at around 12A (depending on the 230V mains voltage).
>I am using two R40/24/16 rings made of K2006 material, stuck together,
>for detailed info see
>http://www.kaschke.de/english/framesets/frame_ringkerne.html . After
>experimenting with different configurations, currently there's 2+2 turns
>in the primary winding, 5 or 6 turns in the secondary winding. I
>remember that 4+4 primary didn't work good, but this was just a short
>try with low power - maybe there's a way to make this work with that as
>well. Cores are slightly warm but never get hot. The power supply is
>driven through a coil made of a single core (the same type), consisting
>of 5 turns. This one gets hot only when there's too much ringing in the
>PA. Adjusting turns in this one does not change a lot.
>
>Thanks in advance for any help, I hope to make the TX again from scratch
>this summer: bigger, better & more powerful ;)
>
>73! Marek SQ5BPM
>
>P.S. Don't be surprised seeing another special callsign on LF, these
>days we are celebrating 25-th anniversary of the SP5ZCC Scouts Amateur
>Radio Club. I am planning some LF operation with this call on April
>9-10th. For the time being, I hope to see some of you in the SP DX
>Contest CW/SSB on April 2nd-3rd (HF). Check
>http://www.contest.spdxc.org.pl/en/index.php for more information.
>


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Thanks for the capture. Looks like good conditions are continuing into spring.

--
73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
FN42hi





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Subject: Re: LF: Re: WD2XES WOLF
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John,

> WOLF again tonight, starting at 2300 UTC, 137.442 kHz.


thanks for the nice greetings!

This receiceved 0310-0337z:

C:\>wolf -f 792
WOLF version 0.61
t:  24 f: 0.345 a: 1.4 dp: 80.1 ci: 8 cj:456 /JEMZSQPRN IDVE ?
t:  48 f:-0.364 a:-0.5 dp: 79.2 ci:11 cj:165 7FTESVDWQ0IOL.M ?
t:  96 f:-0.363 a:-0.6 dp: 78.7 ci:10 cj:310 *69CTVL/0WLESLQ -
t: 192 f:-0.020 pm:    6 jm:866 q: -8.3 -7.7 YCT/DS8IL.HXK/E ?
t: 288 f:-0.020 pm:    9 jm:866 q: -6.2 -9.1 N0Y399 VMUZOPMQ ?
t: 384 f:-0.020 pm:   13 jm:866 q: -4.1 -7.8 DL5U47TMUT  Y4. ?
t: 480 f:-0.020 pm:   17 jm:866 q: -2.2 -3.8 HI HARTMUT  XES -
t: 576 f:-0.020 pm:   20 jm:866 q: -1.3 -2.7 HI HARTMUT  XES -
t: 672 f:-0.020 pm:   21 jm:866 q: -1.2 -2.5 HI HARTMUT  XES -
t: 768 f:-0.020 pm:   25 jm:866 q: -0.7 -1.8 HI HARTMUT  XES -
t: 864 f:-0.020 pm:   28 jm:866 q:  0.1 -0.9 HI HARTMUT  XES -
t: 960 f:-0.020 pm:   30 jm:866 q:  0.4 -0.3 HI HARTMUT  XES -
t:1056 f:-0.020 pm:   34 jm:866 q:  0.6 -0.0 HI HARTMUT  XES -
t:1152 f:-0.020 pm:   37 jm:866 q:  0.9  0.0 HI HARTMUT  XES -
t:1248 f:-0.020 pm:   37 jm:866 q:  1.0 -0.2 HI HARTMUT  XES -
t:1344 f:-0.020 pm:   38 jm:866 q:  1.5  0.2 HI HARTMUT  XES -
t:1440 f:-0.020 pm:   39 jm:866 q:  1.7  0.3 HI HARTMUT  XES -
t:1536 f:-0.020 pm:   41 jm:866 q:  1.7  0.3 HI HARTMUT  XES -
t:1632 f:-0.020 pm:   42 jm:866 q:  1.9  0.4 HI HARTMUT  XES -


Hartmu



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Subject: LF: WD2XGJ tonight
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--------------070600070708040305090205
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>See attachement.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Juan, EA3FXF</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>JN01HO</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

<table><tr><td bgcolor=#ffffff><font color=#000000>_____________________________________________________________________<br>
Mensaje analizado y protegido, tecnologia antivirus www.trendmicro.es<br>
</font></td></tr></table>
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--------------070600070708040305090205--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <009501c5324b$b60f01e0$0500a8c0@charter.net> <002e01c532c7$f8ca10c0$0500a8c0@charter.net> <1339350698.20050327171840@t-online.de> <005501c532d8$c146e220$0500a8c0@charter.net> <00a501c53314$ebca66c0$0500a8c0@charter.net> <706060434.20050328154323@t-online.de> <000e01c533a0$21b04030$3c01a8c0@JKA> <1788152108.20050328164642@t-online.de> <009001c533de$2f15c7c0$3c01a8c0@JKA> <1823477378.20050329171743@t-online.de>
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Subject: Re: LF: Re: WD2XES WOLF
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Hartmut,

That's a better signal than the night before. WOLF found the signal in 192
seconds, though it took longer to decode. The fading can't have been too
bad, as the signal power builds steadily as each segment is summed in.  I've
had much worse copy over shorter distances. The 15 characters got through in
8 minutes. If only we didn't have to put up with the record/playback
process!

Thanks very much for the effort. I can run this again tonight, if anyone
wants to give it a try.

John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES

> C:\>wolf -f 792
> WOLF version 0.61
> t:  24 f: 0.345 a: 1.4 dp: 80.1 ci: 8 cj:456 /JEMZSQPRN IDVE ?
> t:  48 f:-0.364 a:-0.5 dp: 79.2 ci:11 cj:165 7FTESVDWQ0IOL.M ?
> t:  96 f:-0.363 a:-0.6 dp: 78.7 ci:10 cj:310 *69CTVL/0WLESLQ -
> t: 192 f:-0.020 pm:    6 jm:866 q: -8.3 -7.7 YCT/DS8IL.HXK/E ?
> t: 288 f:-0.020 pm:    9 jm:866 q: -6.2 -9.1 N0Y399 VMUZOPMQ ?
> t: 384 f:-0.020 pm:   13 jm:866 q: -4.1 -7.8 DL5U47TMUT  Y4. ?
> t: 480 f:-0.020 pm:   17 jm:866 q: -2.2 -3.8 HI HARTMUT  XES -
> t: 576 f:-0.020 pm:   20 jm:866 q: -1.3 -2.7 HI HARTMUT  XES -
> t: 672 f:-0.020 pm:   21 jm:866 q: -1.2 -2.5 HI HARTMUT  XES -
> t: 768 f:-0.020 pm:   25 jm:866 q: -0.7 -1.8 HI HARTMUT  XES -
> t: 864 f:-0.020 pm:   28 jm:866 q:  0.1 -0.9 HI HARTMUT  XES -
> t: 960 f:-0.020 pm:   30 jm:866 q:  0.4 -0.3 HI HARTMUT  XES -
> t:1056 f:-0.020 pm:   34 jm:866 q:  0.6 -0.0 HI HARTMUT  XES -
> t:1152 f:-0.020 pm:   37 jm:866 q:  0.9  0.0 HI HARTMUT  XES -
> t:1248 f:-0.020 pm:   37 jm:866 q:  1.0 -0.2 HI HARTMUT  XES -
> t:1344 f:-0.020 pm:   38 jm:866 q:  1.5  0.2 HI HARTMUT  XES -
> t:1440 f:-0.020 pm:   39 jm:866 q:  1.7  0.3 HI HARTMUT  XES -
> t:1536 f:-0.020 pm:   41 jm:866 q:  1.7  0.3 HI HARTMUT  XES -
> t:1632 f:-0.020 pm:   42 jm:866 q:  1.9  0.4 HI HARTMUT  XES -
>
>
> Hartmu
>
>
>




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Andy" <actalbot@southsurf.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 4:06 PM
Subject: LF: Re: More on cores...


> For a sinusoidal waveform, the minimum number of turns on a core is given by
> :
> 
> V(rms) = 4.44. F . N . A . B   where
> 
> V is the voltage across the winding
> F is the frequency in Hz
> A is the core cross sectional area in m^2
> B is the peak flux in Teslas
> 
> To avoid excessive dissipation, for modern ferrites if you keep B to a value
> of 0.2T or less you will be OK.
> 
> As an example, for a core of  15mm diameter (approximately an ETD49 core)
> used in a 700 Watt PA the 50 ohms winding is calculated as follows :
> 
> V = SQRT(700 * 50) = 187V(rms)
> This corresponds to a cross sectional area of 177mm^2,  or  A =  177*10^-6
> m^2
> V = 187, F = 137000, B = 0.2, A = 177E-6
> 
> N(min) =   187 / (4.44 * 137000 * 177E-6 * 0.2)  =  8.7 Turns
> Taking to the nearest integer above, you will at least need 9 turns for this
> winding.  You could use more turns to get B even lower, but now the copper
> losses begin to increase as the wire length rises so adding a couple of
> turns to get B even lower is the most you really need to do, so 10 to 11
> turns is about right for this core.
> 
> Note that the type of ferrite is not important, all transformer ferrites
> saturate as you get near 0.3T, althoug h modern ones MAY allow a bit higher.
> This equation seems to suggest that any size of core is acceptable for any
> voltage provided enough turns are used, and in a way this is true, but
> getting higher power through the core needs larger cross-sectional area.
> The calculations here are more involved, and it is easiest to resort to the
> data sheets and look at what the manufacturer claims is the maximum rating
> for any particular core.
> 
> As a guide line, on my switchmode PA that generated RF direct from 340 Volt
> rectified mains (see QEX November/Dec 2002) I found an ETD49 sized core
> using 3C85 material would happily carry 700 Watts with B kept to below
> 0.18T.  The primary winding operating at 29 ohms load impedance was made
> with 3mm diameter plastic covered Litz wire, and the secondary winding for
> matching into 50 to 150 ohms antenna resistance from 1mm diameter enamelled
> wire.    At 700 W continuous operation for several hours in UK summer
> temperatures, the transformer core sat around 60 - 70 degrees - comfortably
> within its rating
> 
> Andy  G4JNT
> 
> 
> 
> Hello Andy

I must admit that I am not too happy with your suggestion for
0.2 to 0.3 T. Ferrite manufacturers may in their catalogues mention
such values of B, these values are, however, for low frequencies, 
typically 10 kHz. 
As for the loss components in ferrites, eddy current loses are mainly 
frequency dependent and  hysteresis losses are mainly dependent on
magnetization.
In my suggestion to Dick, I used a figure for B of 40 mT. This figure comes
from a formula I have been using for many years. My formula is fairly
conservative with regard to core losses and it also ensures that the 
intermodulation caused by the nonlinearity of the magnetizing current
is negligible. 
My formular for a recommended safe B is:
B  equal to 15 divided by the square root of the frequency, B being in
milliTesla and F in MHz..
This formula is in acordance with recommendations of e.g. the 
ferromagnetic material producer AMIDON and, I think,
also with the pratice of designers of solid state wideband power
amplifiers.
73
Niels, OZ8NJ+ 
> 
> 


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Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 20:32:36 +0200
From: Hartmut Wolff <wolff.h@t-online.de>
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John,

> That's a better signal than the night before.

conditions were better last night. Joe's and Warren's signals were
visible on a QRSS3 screen. There was an early fade in ~2210z and
signals were nearly stable during the night.

>  WOLF found the signal in 192
> seconds, though it took longer to decode. The fading can't have been too
> bad, as the signal power builds steadily as each segment is summed in.  I've
> had much worse copy over shorter distances. The 15 characters got through in
> 8 minutes. If only we didn't have to put up with the record/playback
> process!

The encoded file was the first portion I took from a 10 hours
recording. I'ii try some other parts of the recording later tonight.

> I can run this again tonight, if anyone
> wants to give it a try.

I run 1 rx still on 137.442 kHz

73
Hartmut



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Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 22:46:51 +0400
From: Ed Lesnichy <ed@dx.ru>
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Subject: LF: RU6's LF FD operation March 25-28
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--------------090700040501010107000500
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LF enthusiasts,

Summary info abt RU6's LF Field Day operation at March 25...28
(South-Eastern part of Eu Russia - QTH Machta - QTH-loc: KN97LN)

MARCH 25-26 night
After 19z to look RX9BS's freq in 20s mode
Oleg RX9BS is a new on 136 - QTH-loc: MO05UI, Ural - nr Chelyabinsk
Xtal freq 137.7745
Lamp PA 80-100W - abt 10-80mW ERP
We have finished 2-way QSO after 22z
RX9BS in QRSS20, I'm in QRSS3 137.770, O/O
Best argocap from RX9BS is in the attach (between X and 9 Argo's pause)

After 23z I have made beacon "RU6LA" in QRSS30 on abt 135.9225 till
0430z (sunrise at Machta abt 0320z)

MARCH 26-27 Saturday
In day time DCF39's level was abt -20...-30db(S4..5 !!!) than usually (S7-9)
QRB to DCF39 abt 2000km
High QRN's level (static) +10...20db than usually
NOT any Eu signals
After 18z to look RX9BS's freq in 30s mode
Oleg's signal was abt O...M and after 1930z down M...T
We have made one more QSO, "M QRM" RX9BS typing / M
>From abt 1950z till 23z CQing in QRSS3 on .735 - without success - NOT
any signals and very low QRM lines. DCF30's level abt S9+10 - QRN high
Periodically I look in Argo's 10 sec mode around my CQ freq (.720-.745)
without success

After 23z RX Joe's VO1NA freq .777 (30s mode) in 30' periods and TX
"RU6LA" (QRSS30) from 2330z on abt 135.9225 in abt 28' periods
NOT any signals from Joe till sunrise (abt 0320z)
After 2z have appeared NA's(??) QRM lines: .7801 .7805 (see
attach #2 under peak - 30s mode)
Interesting - the following peak of this QRM lines was abt 0340...4z
i.e. after sunrise at Machta

MARCH 27-28 Sunday
After 7z I saw some EUs (at day time):
DK1IS (CQ) - DFCW10/3 O FB in 3s mode (QSO O/O)
9z/1040/1140/1310 OK2BVG (CQ) QRSS10/3/DFCW O
10z S52AB (CQ) QRSS10 O/M in 3 sec mode
1020z/12/1230/1530 HA6PC (CQ) QRSS3 O
1040z/1140/1310 OK2BVG (CQ) QRSS3 O
14z DL3FDO (CQ) QRSS3 M
i.e. propagation at day time was very good up to 2200km as against Saturday
After 18z CQing in CW (136.8) and QRSS3 (137.700) - NOT replies - only
some NOT IDs
2050-2125z QSO ON7ZO QRSS3 M (his freq drift from .712 down .685 at
ending)
After 21z CQ in QRSS3 (137.735) - some NOT IDs - QSO DF6NM (DFCW3 O)
Periodically I look in Argo's 10 sec mode around my CQ freq (.720-.745)
without success

After 0z RX Joe's VO1NA freq .777 (30s mode) in 30' period and TX
"RU6LA" (QRSS30) from 0030z on abt 135.9225 in abt 28' period
NOT any signals from Joe
After 1z RX Joe's VO1NA freq in 90s mode and from 0120z saw Joe's
"NA" in 90s mode (see attach #3) but I already slept. After 0232z
computer was switched off (??)
The signals from Laurence are not present in this period on the
my argocaps

TNX for efforts, reports and files to all!

1. I have not e-mail at Machta and can not read mail box - We have only
DX-cluster via Packet Radio on 2m on RN6BN's or AB5K's DX-clusters now
- in "Run" windows or "MS-DOS" windows typing TELNET RN6BN.73.RU and
then you will ask you call
- typing SH/U   (= show users)
- call me T RU6LA <text> or T UA6LV <text>  (talk with <call>)
or announce any msgs from any other DX clusters

2. Call me in a slow mode in borders of my CQ freqs - I usually choose
the cleanest freq for my CQ on my Argo's screen:
- for QRSS10 +/- 12Hz
- for QRSS30 +/- 3Hz

3. Write to me if you want to nominate sked with RX9BS - Oleg has
some problems.

4. I and UA6LV have made some the HF antena's preparation for weekend
5. At the weekend on 160/80m we had DX QSOs mainly with a southern
hemisphere (at 26-27 night only Carribian), but on the our sunrise at
28 March and QSO's with California and not enough with East coast NA)

73! Ed RU6LA  ed@dx.ru  http://136.73.ru
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--------------090700040501010107000500--

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No signals seen overnight.

Mike ZL4OL


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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
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References: <002801c5344f$ff7a6800$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL> <493331891.20050329145809@pyrotherm.co.yu>
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Hi all,

Nil to report for EU beacons this morning.

73, Bob ZL2CA



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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: lowfer@lwca.org
Cc: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 15:56:25 -0500
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Subject: LF: XES PSK01
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WD2XES will be running in Spectrum Laboratory's PSK01 mode tonight on
137.442 kHz, starting by 2300 UTC. If conditions are really good, there is
some chance that Hartmut may have a little copy overnight.

All reports are welcome.

John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES
WD2XES Status: http://www.w1tag.com




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Subject: LF: low long wire as TX-antenna???
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I wonder if anyone here has experience in using a low long wire as TX
antenna on 136kHz.

I'm thinking of around 400-500m long wire at 1m above ground.
I still have a lot of 'portable'beverage stuff  lying around from my
previous activeties:
mediumwave and NDB-beacon DX.
Maybe it's worthwile to try.........

Dick, pa4vhf



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: LF: FW: RU6's LF FD operation March 25-28
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------030806080302020003050103
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My previous e-mail got dumped in the bit-bucket again!

-----Original Message-----
From: Dave G3WCB [mailto:ganymede444@btopenworld.com]
Sent: 29 March 2005 20:39
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: RE: RU6's LF FD operation March 25-28


Hello Ed and LF,

RU6LA signals were very strong into UK on night of 27 March.
I've attached a screenshot of F6BWO calling RU6LA at about 2255z 27 March.
RU6LA CQ signal begins at 137.736 kHz on the snapshot.

73,

Dave G3WCB IO91RM

ganymede444@btinternet.com


--------------030806080302020003050103
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
Content-Disposition: inline;
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--------------030806080302020003050103--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Joe Craig <jcraig@mun.ca>
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 <493331891.20050329145809@pyrotherm.co.yu> <000801c5349c$7d5e6d10$e901a8c0@bob2l2u6k2n1g3>
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Subject: Re: LF: Nil EU
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NA will be on during dark, 29-30 Mar.
137.777 kHz QRSS120.
73
Joe VO1NA

On Wed, 30 Mar 2005, Vernall wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Nil to report for EU beacons this morning.
>
> 73, Bob ZL2CA
>
>
>


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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Subject: LF: Re: low long wire as TX-antenna???
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Dick PA4VHF,

Bruce ZL1WB has a "long wire" antenna, strung over a valley, and about 1000 
metres long if my memory is in the right ball park.  The antenna is made of 
"power line" wire and the average height is only tens of metres above the 
valley floor.  The antenna is substantially "horizontally polarised" and 
that is not what the text books talk about for launching signal at LF. 
However, for frequencies around 180 kHz Bruce has an outstanding signal in 
ZL, and was the first to be heard in VK.  That "long wire" is easily the 
most effective home station LF transmitting antenna for a ZL amateur.

So if you have the room for an experiment, I would advise to "press the 
button".  I'm not so sure about the wire being only 1 metre above ground, 
from both loss and safety points of view.

And don't worry about your call sign, I'm sure you have a suitable PA for LF 
;-)

73, Bob ZL2CA

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:49 AM
Subject: LF: low long wire as TX-antenna???


>I wonder if anyone here has experience in using a low long wire as TX
> antenna on 136kHz.
>
> I'm thinking of around 400-500m long wire at 1m above ground.
> I still have a lot of 'portable'beverage stuff  lying around from my
> previous activeties:
> mediumwave and NDB-beacon DX.
> Maybe it's worthwile to try.........
>
> Dick, pa4vhf
>
>
> 




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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I had a 500m wire strung  at 5m on screw into wood insulators thru the 
forests of Alaska, straightline - unterminated but matched and tuned against 
ground. I could get the same amount of aerial current than my big L/T, abt 
3.5A for 300W but Im afraid it was some 10dB down on the L/T array at 
50miles in all directions. Could be the  thick forest, could be the ground, 
could be the...it was also down on DX receive too towards Eu when looking at 
DCF39.

I could start rumbling on about loops but heck I should have used one up 
there...

Laurence KL1X EM26AQ in Okie.

>From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
>Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
>To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
>Subject: LF: low long wire as TX-antenna???
>Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 22:49:14 +0200
>
>I wonder if anyone here has experience in using a low long wire as TX
>antenna on 136kHz.
>
>I'm thinking of around 400-500m long wire at 1m above ground.
>I still have a lot of 'portable'beverage stuff  lying around from my
>previous activeties:
>mediumwave and NDB-beacon DX.
>Maybe it's worthwile to try.........
>
>Dick, pa4vhf
>
>




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
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Mike and others in ZL - are there any listeners in VK that could be 
persuaded to caste-an-ear on 136Khz? I know your a long way from VK and 
probable dont want to associate (!) but you are closer than me...

Laurence KL1X/5
WD2XDW status http://myweb.cableone.net/flow



>From: "McAlevey" <mcalevey@xtra.co.nz>
>Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
>To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
>Subject: LF: Re: ZL
>Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 08:11:54 +1200
>
>No signals seen overnight.
>
>Mike ZL4OL
>




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Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 23:41:28 +0200
From: Hartmut Wolff <wolff.h@t-online.de>
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Copy "NA" since ~2100z.

73

Hartmut

Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de



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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <002801c5344f$ff7a6800$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL> <493331891.20050329145809@pyrotherm.co.yu> <000801c5349c$7d5e6d10$e901a8c0@bob2l2u6k2n1g3> <Pine.OSF.4.56.0503291725020.25032@plato.ucs.mun.ca>
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Joe VO1NA,

OK.  What time (in UTC) is your sunrise?

73, Bob ZL2CA 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Joe Craig" <jcraig@mun.ca>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:56 AM
Subject: Re: LF: Nil EU


> NA will be on during dark, 29-30 Mar.
> 137.777 kHz QRSS120.
> 73
> Joe VO1NA
> 
> On Wed, 30 Mar 2005, Vernall wrote:
> 
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Nil to report for EU beacons this morning.
>>
>> 73, Bob ZL2CA
>>
>>
>>
> 
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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"XGJ" readable since ~2200z in QRSS60.



73

Hartmut

Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Dear Marek,

OK on what people have said about the transformer design. The transformer is
one thing - but what about the rest of the circuit you are using - in
particular, what kind of output filter does the circuit have connected to
the transformer secondary, and is it a voltage-switching (centre tap of
primary decoupled to ground) or current-switching (centre tap fed with DC
via a choke) circuit ?

Cheers, Jim Moritz
73 de M0BMU

----- Original Message -----
From: Marek SQ5BPM <sq5bpm@wp.pl>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2005 1:44 PM
Subject: LF: More on cores...


> Hello all,
>
> I noticed that people are using much more turns than me in the output
> transformer, so I would appreciate any help in calculating the correct
> number of turns for the cores I am using here. Messing around the trafo
> would probably allow me to achieve more power than now (450W)....



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Thanks Hartmut. WD2XGJ began transmitting at 22:00 UTC, perhaps I should start earlier! Local sunset today was more than an hour later, at 23:07 UTC.

--
73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
FN42hi


> "XGJ" readable since ~2200z in QRSS60.
> 
> 
> 
> 73
> 
> Hartmut
> 
> Locator:JO52ho
> www.h-wolff.de
> 
> 


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: WE0H Mike <we0h@genesiswireless.us>
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Subject: Re: LF: low long wire as TX-antenna???
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Couldn't imagine how strong your signal would have been if you would 
have used a big loop in those tall pines. Oh well so many what if's...

-- 
Mike
WE0H
WD2XGI




Laurence KL1X wrote:

> I had a 500m wire strung  at 5m on screw into wood insulators thru the 
> forests of Alaska, straightline - unterminated but matched and tuned 
> against ground. I could get the same amount of aerial current than my 
> big L/T, abt 3.5A for 300W but Im afraid it was some 10dB down on the 
> L/T array at 50miles in all directions. Could be the  thick forest, 
> could be the ground, could be the...it was also down on DX receive too 
> towards Eu when looking at DCF39.
>
> I could start rumbling on about loops but heck I should have used one 
> up there...
>
> Laurence KL1X EM26AQ in Okie.
>
>> From: "Dick" <knaap159>
>> Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group
>> To: <rsgb_lf_group>
>> Subject: LF: low long wire as TX-antenna???
>> Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 22:49:14 +0200
>>
>> I wonder if anyone here has experience in using a low long wire as TX
>> antenna on 136kHz.
>>
>> I'm thinking of around 400-500m long wire at 1m above ground.
>> I still have a lot of 'portable'beverage stuff  lying around from my
>> previous activeties:
>> mediumwave and NDB-beacon DX.
>> Maybe it's worthwile to try.........
>>
>> Dick, pa4vhf
>>
>>
>
>
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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TA entusiasts

First traces of WX received at 2330Z...M copy starting 0000Z. 

Jay, W1VD


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: LF: Re: low long wire as TX-antenna???
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Hi Dick the problem at LF with a long low wire is that the horizontal
component cancels out in the ground and you are left with an aerial that is
effectively a 1m vertical ( the height of the wire above ground).... I can
hear some of the pundits sharpening their pencils....it is actually not that
simple, as the ground level is not the level of the "Earth-plate" you must
take into effect the skin depth of the ground at this frequency. This is
dependent upon the frequency and nature of the soil. Thus at ELF (< 3kHz),
the type of antenna you think of will work quite well (compared with
anything else) the skin depth is proportional to the frequency but the
radiation resistance is proportional to the (frequency)^2. I think you said
you ground was poor, sandy. That would work to some extent if there were no
surrounding lossy "environment"....like trees shrubs and houses. I suspect
this is why the VK antenna across the valley that Bob describes works so
well, the ground is probably very dry and the skin depth is quite deep. From
experience on both sides of the pond, the solution is a vertical, if it can
be up clear of any trees and buildings (at least its own height away from
these "absorbing" items.) If you have trees surrounding you and you cant get
away from them, then a big loop can be the answer. Because of the lower
voltage in a loop it induces much lower currents in the lossy "environment",
so though the radiation resistance may be less that could be achieved from a
vertical taking up the same volume, the loop can be much more effective.

If your vertical is out in the clear you need to look at loss points. First
the insulators... they need to have a long leakage path because the voltage
at the ends will be 10s of kV and any moisture or dirt will cause corona.
Double insulators may be needed and each should be 75 to 100mm long
(receiving antenna "egg" insulators are useless). You may need "corona
rings" over about 200W. These are necessary not only at the ends but at
every "sharp" bend on the antenna run.....try to get a 5 to 10cm radius on
all bends. This is a difficult one to find as you cannot see it and it only
occurs at high power. You can somtimes hear a "sizzeling" or see a dull
bluish glow on a dark night. You can even have corona around the coil,
particularly if it gets damp.

Next you need to get the ground loss down. It sounds as though you have done
as much as you can eaily under the feed point. The next area is to increase
the top load capacity.....what inductance do you need to tune the antenna??
every metre of top wire over "open ground" will add about 6pF to the antenna
capacity. Parallel top wires can be a little as a metre apart....it does not
matter how they are connected, a parallel fan or a meander with have almost
the same effect. Over your 'poor' ground, doubling the top-load capacity
will half the ground loss, giving you four times the ERP. This would be
difficult if not impossible to achieve with ground stakes and "radials"
unless the latter were 200m or so long. As I said earlier the only easy way
to check the ground loss is with a simple RF bridge. You should be aiming
for something less than 70 ohms, it is achievable, and between 40 and 70ohms
is a good target to aim at.

I have not tried this but it is an idea that occurs to me. A good check that
you have tamed the corona losses might be to plot the antenna current
squared against the PA output power...... It should be a straight line, if
it drops off at high powers then you may have "leakage problems". The ground
loss should be resistive and fixed.

Best of Luck de Alan G3NYK

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 29 March 2005 21:49
Subject: LF: low long wire as TX-antenna???


> I wonder if anyone here has experience in using a low long wire as TX
> antenna on 136kHz.
>
> I'm thinking of around 400-500m long wire at 1m above ground.
> I still have a lot of 'portable'beverage stuff  lying around from my
> previous activeties:
> mediumwave and NDB-beacon DX.
> Maybe it's worthwile to try.........
>
> Dick, pa4vhf




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
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XDW into CT1 pre dusk here in OK. XGJ strong too. Looks like a good nite 
coming....

Laurence
KL1X/5
em26aq




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Dexter McIntyre W4DEX <dmcintyre@att.net>
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Subject: LF: Yaesu FT-897 on LF
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I recently purchased a Yeasu FT-897. This is my first new HF radio since 
buying a FT-101ZD about 30 years ago which still operates great. 
Although I hate the thought of owning a radio I can not repair I wanted 
a small portable that might receive well on LF.  So first task was to 
see how well it would receive on 137 KHz.  I just completed a QRSS30 
Argo run and was pleasantly surprised at the results.

The capture below was started as soon as the radio was powered up.  The 
radio was at room temperature but had not been powered in the past few 
days.  Frequency calibration and stability is excellent!  For this 
reception the radio was connected to a 160 meter dipole configured as a 
T. The capture was made right at sunset when WD2XDW and WD2XGJ are 
usually in a fade.  No tweaking of the Argo frequency calibration was 
done for this capture and the Loran lines are right on.  The BFO appears 
to be exactly 700 Hz.

http://w4dex.com/argo/ft897.jpg

W4DEX

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From: Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ <k2ors@comcast.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 00:59:24 +0000
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I'm having trouble with Brian's web page. I only get a capture from 04:57 last night so I can't see how XDW and XGJ are doing at present/

--
73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
FN42hi


> XDW into CT1 pre dusk here in OK. XGJ strong too. Looks like a good nite 
> coming....
> 
> Laurence
> KL1X/5
> em26aq
> 
> 
> 


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 16:25:08 -0900
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you have to catch a good ftp load! Brians' ISP needs a visit from some of 
the "lads"....



>From: k2ors@comcast.net (Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ)
>Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
>To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
>Subject: Re: LF: TA
>Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 00:59:24 +0000
>
>I'm having trouble with Brian's web page. I only get a capture from 04:57 
>last night so I can't see how XDW and XGJ are doing at present/
>
>--
>73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
>FN42hi
>
>
> > XDW into CT1 pre dusk here in OK. XGJ strong too. Looks like a good nite
> > coming....
> >
> > Laurence
> > KL1X/5
> > em26aq
> >
> >
> >
>




From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
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Laurence,

> XDW into CT1 pre dusk here in OK. XGJ strong too. Looks like a good nite 
> coming....

More like a deja vu pre-dawn by the time and date on the capture.

JA



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 17:22:19 -0900
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Subject: LF: TA,  and toroid and more temperatures
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Your right John! - Must be this leap forward  in Eu that did it, or wishful 
thinking on my part....apologies all - I should look more closely at the 
clock/date  times.


Thermals and toroids etc

Ive been playing with this thermal aim and fire temp device (Costco abt 70 
USD Birthday present) and  although I cant vouch for some of the direct 
figures given their surface characteristics it does quickly point to where I 
can do better.

Measurements March 30th 0130Z - Wind S20 Knots, relatively calm in Coupler 
housing - Coupler lid off for 15 mins prior to readings -

Loop Coupler design schematic see W1TAG web or my site

Ambient air 20.6C
Transmitter power into Coupler 1Kw Duty whatever XDW at DFCW90 is plus CW id

Cap Sangamo G3 1.8nF  25.2C
Cap Sangamo G3 3.0nF  26.6C
Cap Sangamo G3 7.5nF  34.3C
Cap Sangamo G2 3.0nF  28.6C

Looks like the sharing of the loop current of over 46.5A is working pretty 
well - even the "small" G2 at 3nF is standing the losses.


Main matching toroid (2:18) 3 stacked 70mm  diam 3C90 - 41.8C (had been 
50.1C with lid taken off)

These toroids  I think  are the near equivs of Ferroxcube T87/54/14 and  
3C90 material


Wires temps in loop - ambient as far as I can tell.


Inside radio room - Ambient 23.5C
Decca PA modules heat sink temps- no air cooling - 1.1Kw input
Module 1 43.6C
Module 2 42.7C
Module 3 43.2C

Homebrew wrapped with black anti abrasion tape (3M) LPF Toroid. (2 x stacked 
3C90 but around 42mm diameter)  58.1C, OK well below the Curie point (over 
200C?) but I have some small  losses here....

More useful/useless info to follow...

Laurence KL1X

>From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
>Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
>To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
>Subject: LF: Re: TA
>Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 01:26:32 +0100
>
>Laurence,
>
> > XDW into CT1 pre dusk here in OK. XGJ strong too. Looks like a good nite
> > coming....
>
>More like a deja vu pre-dawn by the time and date on the capture.
>
>JA
>
>



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Hello YU7AR,

Sunday, March 27, 2005, 8:54:28 PM, you wrote:

Y> Hello LF group,
Y> Im QRT today, my antena coil is melt off last night ,

I saw how this happens, see attach.
-- 
Best regards,
 ew6cm                            mailto:ew6cm@tut.by
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--------------030706000204070108090101--

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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 20:27:55 -0900
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Signal melt characteric on Argo....?

Vy 73

Laurence


>From: ew6cm <ew6cm@tut.by>
>Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
>To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
>Subject: Re: LF: LF/ZL
>Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 13:45:07 +0300
>
>Hello YU7AR,
>
>Sunday, March 27, 2005, 8:54:28 PM, you wrote:
>
>Y> Hello LF group,
>Y> Im QRT today, my antena coil is melt off last night ,
>
>I saw how this happens, see attach.
>--
>Best regards,
>  ew6cm                            mailto:ew6cm@tut.by
><< ar-aqc26-0305at19-30utc.JPG >>


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From: "Vernall" <vernall@xtra.co.nz>
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Laurence,

> Signal melt characteric on Argo....?

Do you not have a bouquet attachment on your PC for replicating smells ?

73, Bob



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Andy" <actalbot@southsurf.com>
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I think you can go a bit further with that Alan.   If you have a really
long, low, wire then the current is returned via the ground, penetrating
down to skin depths.  The result is a big loop, with the dimensions of
(effective) skin depth * length of wire.  So resulting in vertical
polarisation.

This was (still is ??)  the type of antenna used by the US at ULF (67 Hz, 81
Hz ???)  for their submarine communications.     Wires that look like
overhead telephone cables disappearing for hundreds of km into the distance!

If you want a bit of fun reading conspiracy theorists ranting,  do a Google
search for "ULF" to find out about the government's mind numbing radiation
experiments !

Andy  G4JNT

>hear some of the pundits sharpening their pencils....it is actually not
that
>simple, as the ground level is not the level of the "Earth-plate" you must
>take into effect the skin depth of the ground at this frequency. This is
>dependent upon the frequency and nature of the soil. Thus at ELF (< 3kHz),
>the type of antenna you think of will work quite well (compared with
>anything else) the skin depth is proportional to the frequency but the
>radiation resistance is proportional to the (frequency)^2. I think you said
>you ground was poor, sandy. That would work to some extent if there were no
>surrounding lossy "environment"....like trees shrubs and houses. I suspect
>this is why the VK antenna across the valley that Bob describes works so



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 09:35:39 +0100
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> Also interested to know if anyone has experience in using a low
> beverage, let's say 400-500m long at 1m heigth as TX antenna. Not
> earthed/resistor at the end, just a simple very long wire at 1m
> heigth.
> Dick, pa4vhf

I have used a very long wire at this height when operating portable 
on a mountaintop in Wales. It works fine as a low-noise receive 
antenna, but does not work as a Tx antenna.

Mike, G3XDV
==========



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 10:36:30 +0200
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Subject: Re: LF: XES PSK01
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John,

> WD2XES will be running in Spectrum Laboratory's PSK01 mode tonight on
> 137.442 kHz, starting by 2300 UTC. If conditions are really good, there is
> some chance that Hartmut may have a little copy overnight.

Only very little copy. 2 full "WD2XES". Warren, WD2XGJ was very strong
the whole night Captures are on my website.
This is what I captured from the PSK 01 transmission during the night:

---
u e bf1¤Ç yti t o{18}f %el rv {10} e yelnen MA.. W?XEb eo52y4S tonl`n
e ´o X WDo se o{24}HoldeIMn {27}Ø{10}toI t yPo Xoeewae ten,eg MA.g
.ªXê h aeeiX e,tool~n eeseo. 2ásmS Wª ttl.. RD2 el Hden sv&n iDotXte A
Íecreoldeeomorer t ae2e4S ± 'eSgt ldoo aeo ié XElt5DN: t o e MI oW_i
2X en Ri{21} Ooldn F U. WD{28}enoS 2ii eldp MA i. WDES WD2c ES
HedenA.DEND iatES HofMAWs WDdTES WD2XES HoeTen 1Ai . W-o_ sS &uo2c
HolÅ {10}G..eNs?Mmc WXvS HolcR FA ¾Eu{28}d2XES Holiei á:ES d P{9}ù ý
eden MAeo. K¿XES ¾m eoldopFA.. WD2XESWD2MeoS H{15}den MA.. h áXES W,2X
reolaan Ø e ¾Eeo ?laAte. {10}gnte 9S Wrden oe .}En W,{10}Îuo Æoe
dnØI.-n Pm?E;fÙ:ES êl-egM o.utoM2ymSj iB rEl Hatcen M dg ¸ {10} TE
:VEm r i a´cehs{26}DiX.d e{10}2o(EeVf» ao ëEr{12}o oRt ; er e-o e e6
gbee yeo tcir ehns oro%o eaAe o. WD vI in ·¨e fro yaeSea e eey
Iiaoitnrfo .IÅ o s ef i8rotcg e {10} o e een   ,q ot lÒof a{2}iOt e
tetJte wene eden ætÜ v {10}e w eo?l=©yanenr te f oef2Xvn tt{20}t
n(etIc_-myeoSe,ee, ,.{24} r¼deo wAheoe tD2­{31}ÖNXmS {19}Tien Mñ.
tiD2-¹2X Hol{10}en a a ½vhQót u si e eoK e c ooFMBXES 5Ø2XES
Oo{10}d{9}¡A_s WD2Xvw WD2 r,n =olden æ.. WDotXE. e{10}ª tET Hel{10}en
Met.. atD2XES WD a?S Hoeden MA.te et tvXD D2:mm 7ol en M iWs
WD2ù;¾2XrE èeaen)eoee-e ym:, v¿ue {9}oe seeAnn,wb tF TgaouwUv {10}a se
---

73

Hartmut



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Weak trace this night of VO1NA in 
JO65BP.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Vy 73 Ingolf OZ7QC</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Subject: Re: LF: XES PSK01
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Greetings everyone,
Despite the poor copy in PSK01, it shows what "would have been possible" 
with a transmission using heavy FEC (forward error correction) and block 
codes - sort of what moonbouncers use on 144 MHz, though JT65 is 
definitely not a good choice for LF since we don't suffer from doppler 
effect, faraday fading etc here.

Keep in mind that PSK31 (from which PSK01 is just a slower variant) was 
intended as a keyboard-to-keyboard mode. There is are decent FEC 
capabilities in G3PLX's PSK implementation, but it uses QPSK in that 
mode to maintain the same throughput, and IMO QPSK in very slow modes 
demands too much frequency stability (for RX, TX, and analog/digital 
converter clock).

Well. just a few thoughs .. I may add FEC coding to (B)PSK01 but I think 
WOLF- or JT65- like block codes are way more efficient, so it may be 
more rewarding to add a simple ("Jason-like") user interface to 
Stewart's programs. Any volunteers ? ;-)

73, Wolf DL4YHF .


Hartmut Wolff schrieb:

>John,
>
>  
>
>>WD2XES will be running in Spectrum Laboratory's PSK01 mode tonight on
>>137.442 kHz, starting by 2300 UTC. If conditions are really good, there is
>>some chance that Hartmut may have a little copy overnight.
>>    
>>
>
>Only very little copy. 2 full "WD2XES". Warren, WD2XGJ was very strong
>the whole night Captures are on my website.
>This is what I captured from the PSK 01 transmission during the night:
>
>---
>u e bf1â‚¬Ã‡ yti t o{18}f %el rv {10} e yelnen MA.. W?XEb eo52y4S tonl`n
>e Å½o X WDo se o{24}HoldeIMn {27}Ã˜{10}toI t yPo Xoeewae ten,eg MA.g
>  
>



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Dear all,

Thanks for all the replies, both sent to the group and privately, I feel 
I know a little more now :)

As for the question below, it's a current-switching circuit then, the DC 
is fed via a choke. As I wrote earlier, changing inductance of this coil 
does not change a lot, I settled at more or less the same inductance as 
one half of the primary winding.

The output filter coils are made of air cores (screened), with 
inductances and capacitances same as in YXM's circuit (54uH x2 + 
12/27/12nF). This seems to work well.

I am definitely going to make a new version of the TX in a bigger case 
so that the influence of different parts of the TX is minimised and ad 
hoc changes are easier than now. At the moment even switching the 
secondary tap is at least 5 minutes of work...

73! Marek SQ5BPM

James Moritz wrote:

>Dear Marek,
>
>OK on what people have said about the transformer design. The transformer is
>one thing - but what about the rest of the circuit you are using - in
>particular, what kind of output filter does the circuit have connected to
>the transformer secondary, and is it a voltage-switching (centre tap of
>primary decoupled to ground) or current-switching (centre tap fed with DC
>via a choke) circuit ?
>


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Posted for Andre
Alan

----- Original Message -----
From: "Andre Kesteloot" <andre.kesteloot@verizon.net>
To: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
Sent: 30 March 2005 04:55
Subject: [Fwd: Re: LF: More on cores...]


> Hello Alan,
> I have recently (this week) posted two e-mails on blacksheep, but
> neither has appeared back in my mail box.
> Is the RSGB reflector down, or is this a simple case of discrimination
> against us "Murkans ?   :-)
> Best regards
> André  N4ICK
> ****************************
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: LF: More on cores...
> Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 15:00:31 -0500
> From: Andre Kesteloot <andre.kesteloot@verizon.net>
> Reply-To: andre.kesteloot@ieee.org
> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org, sq5bpm@wp.pl
> References: <001301c533a6$e3f37c60$2102000a@ibm>
> <004701c533c7$5f9b2a00$546ca450@preinstapdq0tf>
> <000801c533ce$756d3ce0$2102000a@ibm> <42494D98.8060506@wp.pl>
>
>
>
> Marek SQ5BPM wrote:
>
> > Hello all,
> >
> > I noticed that people are using much more turns than me in the output
> > transformer, so I would appreciate any help in calculating the correct
> > number of turns for the cores I am using here. Messing around the
> > trafo would probably allow me to achieve more power than now (450W).
> > Trying to go higher causes heavy ringing + FET heating. I've tried
> > almost everything to reduce this (different combinations of Zobel
> > network, decoupling, inductances in series with gates, screening,
> > grounding etc.). In every case around 400W things start to go bad,
> > 450W is a border of manageable heat and ringing. I am thinking about
> > making a new FET driver in a way that allows regulation of the time of
> > the FET on-state, leaving some rest period in-between.
>
> In  a single-ended Class C stage, we think of the load as the resistance
> that will allow the collector to swing from the supply to
> ground, hence                                     R = V2/P and P =
> (Vrms)2 / R  (1)
> This is a rms voltage, and since  Vrms = (Vpeak / 1.414) we can replace
> the value of Vrms in (1) hence
>                                                             P = (Vpeak)2
> / (1.414)2 * R = (Vds)2 / 2R
>
> When we have a push pull, we can consider it as being made up of two
> halves, each supplying P/2.
> Hence                                             Zdd =
> (Vds)2/2*(Pout/2)+(Vds)2/2*(Pout/2)=2(Vds)2/Pout (2)
> So far, so good, for _sinusoidal_  signals.
>
> Now it would seem to me that when we deal with class D circuitry, we
> are dealing with (almost perfect) square waves, where average power,
> r.m.s. power and peak power are all the same.
>
> When a Power MosFet conducts, its internal resistance is so low that it
> effectively brings the corresponding output transformer side  to
> ground.  Because of the transformer action, the other drain is now at
> 2*Vdd, as can be seen clearly on a scope.
> We can consider that each MosFet works 1/2 of the time from a drain
> voltage that is actually (2*Vdd).
> Hence the power switched into the core by both devices is
>                                                         Pout = (2 *
> Vdd)2 / Zdd .
>
> When calculating the number of turns required for good transformer
> action, is not unusual to consider each individual winding inductance as
> having to be larger than 10 x  the load and source impedance presented
> to it.
>
> Dye and Grangberg "Radio Frequency Transistors" is of course excellent,
> but tends to focus more on wide-band RF amplifiers. For a very good
> treatment of transformer-coupled class D power amplifier, you may want
> to reference "Solid State Radio Engineering", by Krauss, Bostian and
> Raab, pp.438-448.
>
> Hope this helps
>
> 73
> André N4ICK
>


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<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #ff0000 2px solid">
<P>========================================<BR>Message date : Mar 29 2005, 10:19 PM<BR>From : "Laurence KL1X" <HELLOZEROHELLOZERO@HOTMAIL.COM><BR>To : rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<BR>Copy to : <BR>Subject : RE: LF: Re: ZL<BR>Mike and others in ZL - are there any listeners in VK that could be <BR>persuaded to caste-an-ear on 136Khz? I know your a long way from VK and <BR>probable dont want to associate (!) but you are closer than me...<BR><BR>Laurence KL1X/5<BR>WD2XDW status <A href="http://myweb.cableone.net/flow">http://myweb.cableone.net/flow</A><BR><BR></P>
<P>It would be very helpful to have the possibility of a recieving station in VK<BR>The path from the UK to ZL is a very difficult one and not just because of the distance.&nbsp;Mutual darkness is minimal, at this time of year neither end is really dark.&nbsp;Also the path from southern England to ZL goes very far north in fact into the Auroral zone and further, this far north there is no darkness anyway so presumably quite a lot of absorbtion. I shall keep on trying so long as conditions are favourable,but if anyone knows a VK ham who could be persuaded to have a go it would be great.</P>
<P>73 Laurie.&nbsp;<BR></P><MCALEVEY@XTRA.CO.NZ><RSGB_LF_GROUP@BLACKSHEEP.ORG></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR><hr size="1">Whatever you <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/" target="_blank">Wanadoo</a><br><br>This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more <a href="http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm" target="_blank">here</a>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
References: <004601c534a1$c6a83aa0$3c01a8c0@JKA> <1625530840.20050330103630@t-online.de>
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Hartmut: This was about what I had expected, and I agree with Wolf's
analysis of the situation. Thanks for your cooperation.  I think the mode
has good daytime QSO possibilities, and will play with that once someone on
this side of the pond gets properly licensed and motivated.

Wolf: I'll be happy to be a beta tester for the "Jason-like" WOLF interface!
My programming skills are sadly limited.

Stewart has several times offered to open-source the present WOLF code to a
competent Windows programmer, but there have been no takers, as far as I
know. For those who are down on BPSK for amateur LF use, remember that the
concepts behind WOLF could be applied to a sequential tone system like
Jason.

John A.




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From: Marek SQ5BPM <sq5bpm@wp.pl>
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Subject: LF: Olivia
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Hello again,

I think it might be interesting, I found another mode, basically MFSK + 
FEC:

http://homepage.sunrise.ch/mysunrise/jalocha/mfsk.html

In it's original version it is slightly wide for LF operation + requires 
a linear PA, but I believe it would be interesting to check it's 
performance on LF. Maybe it would be worth to re-work this into a slower 
and more robust version usable on LF. As it's MFSK, it would be possible 
to omit the linear PA requirement.

There is an open yahoo group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/oliviadata/ 
and a Windows front-end for the mode: http://n1su.us/olivia/ .

73! Marek SQ5BPM


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On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 20:27:55 -0900 "Laurence KL1X"
<hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com> writes:
> 
> Signal melt characteric on Argo....?
> 
> Vy 73
> 
> Laurence


Looks Like a Job For ENZITE

Bob K3DJC


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Andy" <actalbot@southsurf.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 13:09:58 +0100
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I wasn't suggesting actually going as high as 0.3Tesla as a working value
for B, this is too close to saturation, but did say that a figure of 0.2T
seems Ok for many applications.  Furthermore, what I forgot to say in that
last email is that when carrying a sinewave (as is the case in my 700W
switch mode Tx as the transformer comes after the tank circuitry) a core
seems to be able to carry significantly more power than when used with
squarewaves such as in a simple SMPSU.   Intuitively this seems as if it
'ought to be true' but I wouldn't like to justify the statement
mathematically.  It is the case ,though, that an ETD49 sized core in 3C85
material (or it may have been 3C90, can't remember) is rated at around 400
Watts at 100kHz in the data sheet, but survives 700W of sine at 137k quite
happily.

Wonder where your formula comes from?  40mT sounds extremely low and surely
means that the number of turns needed (51 turns for the example at 50 ohms)
will lead to a point where copper losses become quite significant.    I've
designed several switch mode PSUs over the years in the 50 to 200 Watt
region,  all around a Bmax of 0.15 to 0.2T operating at 100kHz usually with
3C85 and 3C90 material.  In none of them have the ferrite cores ever
appeared to be stressed at all, most run cold.   I may have been using cores
that are bigger than really needed, though, as they are in plentiful supply
in my junk box and make winding the bobbins simpler!

Must also admit, I've never had to consider linearity.  In simple SMPSUs the
waveform is hard switched, and in the 137k Tx the transformer was only ever
carrying CW, harmonic levels of which were dictated by the filtering action
of the tank LC arrangement with its loaded Q of 6, rather than any generated
by non-linearities in the core.

Andy  G4JNT




> I must admit that I am not too happy with your suggestion for
> 0.2 to 0.3 T. Ferrite manufacturers may in their catalogues mention
> such values of B, these values are, however, for low frequencies,
> typically 10 kHz.
> As for the loss components in ferrites, eddy current loses are mainly
> frequency dependent and  hysteresis losses are mainly dependent on
> magnetization.
> In my suggestion to Dick, I used a figure for B of 40 mT. This figure
comes
> from a formula I have been using for many years. My formula is fairly
> conservative with regard to core losses and it also ensures that the
> intermodulation caused by the nonlinearity of the magnetizing current
> is negligible.
> My formular for a recommended safe B is:
> B  equal to 15 divided by the square root of the frequency, B being in
> milliTesla and F in MHz..
> This formula is in acordance with recommendations of e.g. the
> ferromagnetic material producer AMIDON and, I think,
> also with the pratice of designers of solid state wideband power
> amplifiers.
> 73
> Niels, OZ8NJ+




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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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--------------060403010501070108010408
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>TA entusiasts<BR>&nbsp;<BR>Another signal appeared 
at fadeout:<BR>&nbsp;</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><IMG alt="" hspace=0 
src="cid:001401c53524$dcb56f60$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL" align=baseline 
border=0></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>&nbsp;<BR>&nbsp;<BR>Jay, W1VD<BR>&nbsp;<BR>P.S. Did 
see "YO" on the DF6NM grabber but no trace of the signal here 
;~(<BR></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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--------------060403010501070108010408--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 07:33:38 -0500
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Subject: LF: TA MAR 29/30
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--------------090203010901080800070603
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Guess my earlier e mail got bounced - will divide 
the attachments into two e mails...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>TA entusiasts<BR>&nbsp;<BR>Excellent conditions 
with low&nbsp;static levels. WX O copy&nbsp; from 2300 - 0430Z except for a 
brief period of M copy about 2330Z. Best reception of WX so far. Sample 
copy:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><IMG alt="" hspace=0 src="cid:000901c53524$b2df4a80$6401a8c0@JAYTERMINAL" 
align=baseline border=0><BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>&nbsp;</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>No&nbsp;other signals noted...too bad, that may 
have been one of the better TA opportunities this season!<BR>&nbsp;<BR>Jay, 
W1VD<BR>&nbsp;<BR>&nbsp;<BR>&nbsp;<BR></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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--------------090203010901080800070603--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Alan Melia" <Alan.Melia@btinternet.com>
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Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: low long wire as TX-antenna???
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Hi Andy, yes I was just given a book (rescued from the skip when the BTRL
library closed !!) by an ex-collegue from BTRL titled "ELF Communication
Antennas" by Burrows (pub IEE) It does make very interesting reading, and
explains a lot about the "myth" of "underground dipoles". These antenna are
similar to those used by John G3PAI and CREG people and the do radiate LF
signals "through the air" Though not as efficiently as normal amateur sized
verticals.

How is the 9kHz NoV comming along ??
Alan

----- Original Message -----
From: "Andy" <actalbot@southsurf.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 30 March 2005 08:05
Subject: LF: Re: Re: low long wire as TX-antenna???


> I think you can go a bit further with that Alan.   If you have a really
> long, low, wire then the current is returned via the ground, penetrating
> down to skin depths.  The result is a big loop, with the dimensions of
> (effective) skin depth * length of wire.  So resulting in vertical
> polarisation.
>
> This was (still is ??)  the type of antenna used by the US at ULF (67 Hz,
81
> Hz ???)  for their submarine communications.     Wires that look like
> overhead telephone cables disappearing for hundreds of km into the
distance!
>
> If you want a bit of fun reading conspiracy theorists ranting,  do a
Google
> search for "ULF" to find out about the government's mind numbing radiation
> experiments !
>
> Andy  G4JNT
>
> >hear some of the pundits sharpening their pencils....it is actually not
> that
> >simple, as the ground level is not the level of the "Earth-plate" you
must
> >take into effect the skin depth of the ground at this frequency. This is
> >dependent upon the frequency and nature of the soil. Thus at ELF (<
3kHz),
> >the type of antenna you think of will work quite well (compared with
> >anything else) the skin depth is proportional to the frequency but the
> >radiation resistance is proportional to the (frequency)^2. I think you
said
> >you ground was poor, sandy. That would work to some extent if there were
no
> >surrounding lossy "environment"....like trees shrubs and houses. I
suspect
> >this is why the VK antenna across the valley that Bob describes works so
>
>
>



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Well thanks all for the usefull info.
I was thinking of running that from a portable location out in the fields.
As an RX-antenna it is ok, but for TX I have to find something else, like a
portable vertical system with topload/capacative head etc.

73

Dick, PA4VHF



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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VO1NA, WD2XES and WD2XGJ readable since around 2240z.

73
Hartmut

Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de



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Subject: LF: Re: Low TX long wires
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Hi Dick, the popular portable DX antenna has always been a kite bourne one
on 136kHz in the UK. Dave G0MRF and Dave G3YXM, and Peter G3LDO have
experience with these. See also this site
http://www.qsl.net/g4vgo/index.htm Though this is based on top-band, the
ideas are common.

Cheers de Alan G3NYK
alan.melia (at) btinternet.com


----- Original Message -----
From: "Dick" <knaap159@zonnet.nl>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Sent: 30 March 2005 22:36
Subject: LF: Low TX long wires


> Well thanks all for the usefull info.
> I was thinking of running that from a portable location out in the fields.
> As an RX-antenna it is ok, but for TX I have to find something else, like
a
> portable vertical system with topload/capacative head etc.
>
> 73
>
> Dick, PA4VHF
>
>



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Subject: Re: LF: Nil EU
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Hi Bob,

Rise 0914 Set 2157 for 30 Mar. Will be on again tonight.

73
Joe

On Wed, 30 Mar 2005, Vernall wrote:

> Joe VO1NA,
>
> OK.  What time (in UTC) is your sunrise?
>
> 73, Bob ZL2CA
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Joe Craig" <jcraig@mun.ca>
> To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 8:56 AM
> Subject: Re: LF: Nil EU
>
>
> > NA will be on during dark, 29-30 Mar.
> > 137.777 kHz QRSS120.
> > 73
> > Joe VO1NA
> >
> > On Wed, 30 Mar 2005, Vernall wrote:
> >
> >> Hi all,
> >>
> >> Nil to report for EU beacons this morning.
> >>
> >> 73, Bob ZL2CA
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
>
>


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Nil...what a difference a day makes...considerably more static last
night.

Will continue monitoring TA window when signals are present on DF6NM
grabber.

Jay, W1VD



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "hamilton mal" <g3kev.ham@virgin.net>
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi All Jim M0BMU.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jim ur mod to the G0MRF using a TV line output 
transformer. Did u leave a gap between the cores or not ?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 de Mal/G3KEV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Marek SQ5BPM wrote:

> As it's MFSK, it would be possible to omit the linear PA requirement.

Marek,
 sorry, I don't understand this statement. 
If you transmit more than tone simultaneously,
what comes out has a strong AM envelop, and it needs a 
linear PA to be properly transmitted. 
My first planned version of Jason was MFSK, but then I 
changed it to sequential IFK just to avoid the need of 
a linear PA, not so much widespread among LF users. 
Or have I completely misunderstood the issue ?

73  Alberto  I2PHD





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From: "Mike Dennison" <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 17:20:51 +0100
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Subject: LF: Portable Tx antennas
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> I was thinking of running that from a portable location out in the
> fields. As an RX-antenna it is ok, but for TX I have to find something
> else, like a portable vertical system with topload/capacative head
> Dick, PA4VHF

Dick,

I have done quite a lot of portable operating on LF (both 73 and 
136kHz), and have had successes and failures. Unless you can find a 
large support, the easiest antenna to set up is one on a kite. It is 
easy and cheap to get a 60m (almost) vertical erected, and this will 
give you a good signal even if you don't have everything working 
100%.

Mike, G3XDV
===========




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Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2005 18:35:38 +0200
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Subject: Re: LF: Olivia
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Alberto di Bene wrote:

> Marek SQ5BPM wrote:
>
>> As it's MFSK, it would be possible to omit the linear PA requirement.
>
> Marek,
> sorry, I don't understand this statement. If you transmit more than 
> tone simultaneously,
> what comes out has a strong AM envelop, and it needs a linear PA to be 
> properly transmitted. My first planned version of Jason was MFSK, but 
> then I changed it to sequential IFK just to avoid the need of a linear 
> PA, not so much widespread among LF users. Or have I completely 
> misunderstood the issue ?
>
> 73  Alberto  I2PHD

Ooops, I meant sequential multi-tone FSK or whatever the correct name 
is. I am sorry for the mistake.

Anyway, Olivia is a sequential multi-tone FSK, similar to Jason.

73! Marek SQ5BPM


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Subject: LF: Two weak sigs?
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi all,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I may have got two weak signals in the pre-dawn 
capture this morning.&nbsp; Comments invited.&nbsp; I've emailed Markus a full 
image file&nbsp;in the hope that he can assist with possible 
identification.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73, Bob ZL2CA</FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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--------------040405030003040909030903--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: lowfer@lwca.org
Cc: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: [LW] XES PSK01
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________________________________________



WD2XES will be running in Spectrum Laboratory's PSK01 mode tonight on
137.442 kHz, starting by 2300 UTC. If conditions are really good, there is
some chance that Hartmut may have a little copy overnight.

All reports are welcome.

John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES
WD2XES Status: http://www.w1tag.com




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From: Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ <k2ors@comcast.net>
To: rsgb lf reflector <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>, 
 LWCA LF Reflector <lowfer@lwca.org>
Subject: [LW] WD2XGJ QRSS 137.7799
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 22:07:39 +0000
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________________________________________



I've moved WD2XGJ up approx.  0.2 Hz to 137.7799 to clear a Western North America Loran line.


--
73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
FN42hi


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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
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WD2XDW now at max "radiiated" power from this QTH with PSU/household breaker 
limitations.  Up 1 dB from yesterday. I think thats it....

1152W input, near 1Kw out, measured 46 Amps cool hand Loop current (yikes!), 
Rac around 0.5 ohm.  137,7752, 137.7756  Khz DFCW 90 "XDW" - dash Hi / CW Id 
and message at beginning of sequence (24 mins).

May switch to alien spaceship mode later in the night - looks like DFCW on 
ARGO dot 30 slow with a series of small freq space lines betwen 
137,7753/137.7756 where the "dot" part of the DFCW sequece is. Actual "dot" 
signal is sweeping at a rate of 3.7 secs traingular wave to produce the 
signal pattern.

No forest fires.  No (sic) Volts. No birds falling out of the trees as of 
yet - occasional misguided golfballs only  during Tx sequence (orbit changed 
due to near field issues?)

Laurence KL1X in 5 EM26AQ Bartlesville OK

Status http://myweb.cableone.net/flow




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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
To: lowfer@lwca.org
Cc: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: [LW] WD2XES WOLF
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 21:35:19 -0000
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WD2XES is running in WOLF mode tonight on 137.442 kHz, with 200 watts. WOLF
decoding software is still available at Stewart Nelson's site:
http://www.scgroup.com/ham/wolf.html

John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES FN42ch
WD2XES Status: http://www.w1tag.com




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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 17:08:12 -0500
From: Andre Kesteloot <andre.kesteloot@verizon.net>
Subject: [LW] Stripping magnet wire
In-reply-to: <001c01c1fb29$74ee74e0$39e4fc3e@l8p8y6>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org,  lowfer@lwca.org
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<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<html>
<head>
  <meta content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1" http-equiv="Content-Type">
  <title></title>
</head>
<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
hamilton mal G3KEV wrote:<br>
<blockquote cite="mid001c01c1fb29$74ee74e0$39e4fc3e@l8p8y6" type="cite">
  <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; ">
  <meta content="MSHTML 5.50.4807.2300" name="GENERATOR">
  <style></style>
  <div>&nbsp;[...]</div>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">To remove the enamel from litz wire
I use paint stripper called nitromorse. </font></div>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">Remove all the cotton/plastic
insulation from the&nbsp;cable end to be soldered to expose the multi strand
enameled wires. Brush the end of cable with a tooth brush to separate
the strands and flatten out.</font></div>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">Use the tooth brush to apply the
paint stripper to the splayed out cable strands, making sure it gets to
all the strands. Leave for about 10 minutes or more, then brush away
the disolved enamel. I carry out this process twice to ensure that all
enamel has been removed. The final job is to wash the exposed copper
cable&nbsp; end with turps etc using a cloth,&nbsp;then start soldering. I strip
back about 1 inch of the cable end.</font></div>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">I have used the above procedure a
number of times and it works well. Paint stripper and a tooth brush are
readily available. This method is also economical on solder, no need
for special tools like solder pots and bunsen burners.</font></div>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">Any good paint stripper would do. My
contents label says the stripper contains 5 - 20 percent</font></div>
  <div><font face="Arial" size="2">Methylene dichloride, it does not
say what the rest is.</font></div>
</blockquote>
Many years ago in the U.S., we could buy small bottles of "Strip-X"
made by GC Electronics.<br>
It is no longer available on the market, but I recently found such a
bottle, and the stuff&nbsp;&nbsp; _does_ &nbsp; remove enamel like a charm.<br>
The contents are:<br>
- Methylene Chloride (75-09-2)<br>
- Phenol&nbsp; (108-95-2)<br>
- Ammonia (7664-41-7)<br>
Proportions are not listed. <br>
<br>
The mixture exhibits the consistency of chocolate syrup.<br>
<br>
73<br>
Andr&eacute;&nbsp; N4ICK<br>
</body>
</html>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: lowfer@lwca.org,  rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: [LW] XDW on
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2005 10:37:18 -0900
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wd2xdw on 137,7752/6 KHz DFCW90 + CW id and info

ON 1936Z 23rd March 05 1Kw output, 4 roughly parall loops in the trees, same 
plane - Main lobes ENE/WSW.

Laurence KL1X/5 EM26AQ




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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 08:13:58 +0100
From: Hartmut Wolff <wolff.h@t-online.de>
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To: "rsgb_lf_group @ blacksheep . org" <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>, 
 lowfer@lwca.org
Subject: [LW] XES and XGJ Mar, 22nd
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Very strong signals from "XES" and "XGJ" last night.
Captures can be seen:

http://www.h-wolff.de/Latest%20LF.htm



73
Hartmut

Locator:JO52ho
www.h-wolff.de



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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ <k2ors@comcast.net>
To: rsgb lf reflector <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>, 
 LWCA LF Reflector <lowfer@lwca.org>
Subject: [LW] Echelon
Date: Tue, 22 Mar 2005 03:24:33 +0000
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Gentlemen,
    I was looking up 'qrss' on Google and came up with a website that purports to list some of the keywords that trigger 'Echelon' - the automated  US, UK, Canada, New Zealand spying mechanism.  QRSS is on the list! So are ELF, LF, MF, VLF, ULF, BNC,  Sweep, Racal and Analyzer.  See below:

http://echelononline.free.fr/documents/register.htm

    Our E-mail lists must be keeping the spooks busy!
 

--
73 Warren K2ORS/WD2XGJ
FN42hi


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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: lowfer@lwca.org,  rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: [LW] XDW off
Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2005 18:07:50 -0900
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wd2xdw continues to be off until we shake this stormy southern plains 
depression, associated tstorms and the occasional twister, hopefully remote.

Laurence KL1X/5
status http://myweb.cableone.net/flow




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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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To: lowfer@lwca.org
Cc: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: [LW] XDW part 5
Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2005 10:18:07 -0900
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XDW will be intermittent this evening as I play at adding a 3rd large and 
final #4 conductor in parallel on the loop. Its necessary to do this today 
as the leaves are coming out and I dont want a snagging time with my loop 
erection weapon of choice.

Im back at full power +-0.5dBr at 1900z 14th March 05, where r is some 
reference to "optimum measured max local field strength and current 
measurement...."

It looks like I have just 2 or 3 months left of operating time here in 
Oklahoma  before Im "moved" - shame - and I was just starting to get used to 
the fried Okra and y'all..

Laurence em26aq
wd2xdw 137,7753/6 Khz dfcw 90
status http://myweb.cableone.net/flow




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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
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Subject: RE: [LW] XDW
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XDW ramping up again - now at 624W input from 0505z appx 14th March 2005. 
Will be back at Fullpower tomorrow after safety checks.

Laurence
137,7753/137,7756Khz dfcw 90
wd2xdw




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Subject: LF: 1600 metre QRH Fixed?
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Dear Groups,

Now running a  Colpitts oscillator and hopefully reducing the "chirp"
on my keying a bit.  Running 5 watts output with 0.4 amps aerial current
to a piece of #12 copper wire 100 metres long and 10 metres high.
QRSS120 (approx) on 189.850 kHz +/- 0.5 Hz.

There has been no word yet on an LOA from Industry Canada to resume QRO on
2200 metres.

73
Joe VO1NA


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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
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Subject: [LW] XDW back on qrp
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wd2xdw is back on but at a very low power whilst pruning of nearby trees  on 
the golf course is taking place.

The TX is running around 3.5W  DC input at the moment on 137,7753/6 Khz dfcw 
90 to the loop array.

Laurence KL1X/5 em26aq
status http://myweb.cableone.net/flow




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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Steve McDonald" <jsm@gulfislands.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Cc: lowfer@lwca.org
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Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 12:31:58 -0800
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Subject: LF: ZM2E at VA7LF
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------030801020103060306030504
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We had no copy on the down under signal on their first transmission but
their second call was received at 100%. The cap shows "ZM2E ZM2E E" as
expected, with the 'E' being substituted for the longer 'K'. We acknowledged
with "VA7LF VA7LF Z E" but by then we were running out of darkness and
nothing further from them was heard. These all-nighters are a killer! One
more try tonight.

Steve / Scott / VA7LF

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Subject: LF: Test Schedules
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Hi All, a delayed message from Scot (re ZL<>VE tests) brought this to mind
again. If stations advising of transmitting schedules would put in the Date
as well as times there would be less chance for ambiguity in the case of a
delayed delivery through the reflector. I read messages from Scot via the
LWCA reflector last night (4th) but they only arrived via the RSGB LF
reflector this afternoon (1500z 5th). I happen to know the timings given are
for the just completed tests but someone not subscribing to the LW refector
might think it referred to the 5th.

Good work. Conditions were good but not outstanding, it is a pity you did
not make it, but then if it was all easy it wouldnt be worth the effort (??)

Cheers de Alan G3NYK



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: lowfer@lwca.org, "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
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We will be posting our receiving sessions in the following directory.  We are 
starting our receive seesion before dark here with attempts at CFH, DCF-39 
etc...  The files will be named accordingly.

please see our previous email about our transmit schedule...

http://www.scottboxx.com/radio_data/zm2e/

73 VA7LF



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org,  lowfer@lwca.org
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Subject: LF: Full ZM2E screen grab...
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We had AOS of ZM2E at ~1040UTC this morning.  LOS occured at 1148UTC.  We 
acknowledged but heard (saw) nothing in response as the sun came up here.

See:
http://www.scottboxx.com/radio_data/zm2e/zm2e00043.jpg

We'll post of actively schedule for the pre-ZM2E sked later today.

73 VA7LF






From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
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Subject: LF: VA7LF schedule for tonight
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The following is VA7LF's pre-ZM2E QSO attempt schedule for tonight:

1) 0200 - 0500UTC -  200 second dot 'LF', this will last 'exactly' 30 minutes.
   On the half hours of the above we will revert to listening to assess        
conditions.

2) 0500 - 0700 UTC - ID and mode as above; however, we're on continously for EU 
sunrise. 

3) 0700 - ? - Begin QSO attempt by listening for ZM2E's signal start at 0715UTC.

NOTE: Some QSO details for listeners...

An 'E' by itself is an end of transimission like a 'K' in normal CW

Our/their callsign followed by a 'Z E' or 'V E' indicates we/they have been 
heard and the report sequence may begin.

The callsigns are repeated in full twice until contact is established. Then 
callsigns are abr. to their first letter... 

Reports are O,M,T,N as by standard EME convention.

Thanks for the reports!

73 VA7LF






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From: "Jay Rusgrove" <JRusgrove@comcast.net>
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Similar results to JA here.

View of static generator over Atlantic:

http://www.intellicast.com/Local/USNationalWide.asp?loc=usa&seg=LocalWeather&prodgrp=SatelliteImagery&product=World&prodnav=none

Jay, W1VD


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Steve Dove <dsp@hifidelity.com>
To: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
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Subject: LF: Re: ZM2E into W3EEE!?
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------020503050107020903010406
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
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Hi Scott,

Thanks for the prod!  Yes, on checking the captures there are smudges and 
some good whacks right on frequency;  quickie snapshot below, time frame of 
which is 1130z to 1136z.  I'd be delighted if you could correlate this against what 
you saw.  If you want I can e-mail you the best piccie.

Will be running 'Grab II' again tonight, too.  Seems much quieter, and DCF-39 
looks just as loud.

Good luck!

        Cheers,

                Steve


03/04/05 21:37:36, "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net> wrote:

>Steve
>
>We noted that the grabulator II may have seen a partial call from ZM2E this 
>morning.  Have a look at the grabs from it around 1100-1200UTC.  You will 
note 
>two bright hi/low sequences on frequency which correspond to our capture of 
>the '2' in their call very good levels. There appeared to be scraps of the 
>other part of the signal in there as well.
>
>73 VA7LF
>


--------------020503050107020903010406
Content-Type: image/jpeg;
 name="zm2eposs.jpg"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
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Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.4.0 - Release Date: 02/22/05

--------------020503050107020903010406--

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 17:16:33 -0500
From: Mitch Powell <mitch.powell@sympatico.ca>
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Possible ? captures of ZM2E this morning just before
sunrise at London, ON.  Traces began at 1300Z and
continued until shortly before local sunrise.
I hope these are good - certainly not positive ID's
but do suggest another effort again tonight.

http://www3.sympatico.ca/mitch.powell/zm2e.htm

Mitch VE3OT 


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: Steve Dove <dsp@hifidelity.com>
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Watcha,

Yes, nasty spiky storm noise tonight, but VA7LF present on the 'Live Part 5' 
Grabulator, too.  Cool!

Watching for the ZeaLots with 'Grab II' as well.  Hope tmw is quieter.  DCF-39 is 
The Loudest it has been all season tonight.  Almost 'normal'.

        Cheers,

                Steve

http://www.w3eee.com


03/04/05 04:02:12, Dexter McIntyre W4DEX <dmcintyre@att.net> wrote:

>Scott Tilley, VE7TIL wrote:
>
>   Dex is seeing us
>
>Not bad considering the Part5 setup isn't optimum for very low signal 
>levels.  Also the present noise level is about 15 dB above a quiet night.
>
>Dex
>





-- 
Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.4.0 - Release Date: 02/22/05



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
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Subject: LF: VA7LF pre-qso attempt schedule...
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Jay and others...

VA7LF will commence hourly transmissions beginning at 0200UTC.  These 
transmissions will last ~25minutes and the will be FSK120 as we used last night.

We would like to listen on HF and LF for the remainder of the hour until our 
QSO sked which ZM2E begins at 0715UTC.

There will be NO 0700UTC transmission from us so we can begin listening for 
ZM2E.

Please be advised we could clearly hear (AM mode and enjoyed some Icelandic 
music!) the broadcast station on 189KHz last night and believe there is a 
possiblity of VE7->EU propagation.

73 VA7LF


 

 



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 18:09:47 -0500
Subject: [LW] VA7LF test
From: Mitch Powell <mitch.powell@sympatico.ca>
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Scott and Steve:
Excellent copy through the night into London, ON.
Approx 2040 miles / 3300 kM , and signal still readable
after sunset.
It is interesting to compare your signal level with that
of XDW - to the West and XES/XGJ to the East.

I have also included two captures by Bryce (KI0LE) that can
be compared to my copy - he is 590 miles further West from
London - Fine job with the new xmtrs and circulator setup.

It appears that 1100Z peaks here - hmmmm !

http://www3.sympatico.ca/mitch.powell/va7lf.htm

73
Mitch VE3OT 


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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley, VE7TIL" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org,  lowfer@lwca.org
Subject: [LW] VA7LF testing tonight...
References: <4226808C.9010906@att.net>
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VA7LF is running as of 0630UTC in FSK120 on 137777.5/777.9

Running ~750W output to the SL antenna array.  All systems appear normal and 
the combiner is working great.  We removed the LPFs as they are not required 
due to the narrow passband of the combiner.  

Any and all reports welcome.

73 Scott & Steve






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From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: lowfer@lwca.org,  rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Cc: "Steve McDonald" <jsm@gulfislands.com>
References: <003e01c51e2b$0f93d220$0201a8c0@private.network>
Subject: Re: [LW] ... --- ...
Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 00:50:17 -0800
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1106" name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
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<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Seems I was alittle quick to call for 
help!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I found the problem.&nbsp; When the two 4013 
dividers are powered up individually they sinc differently (of course they 
would!).&nbsp;&nbsp; Solution: reset one TXs LV PSU until it is in phase or 
share one PSU!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>With the TXs running with a conservative 36V supply 
we get 750W output to the dummy load.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I love the smell of burning dummy load in the 
morning...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 Scott</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr 
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV 
  style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> 
  <A title=sthed475@telus.net href="mailto:sthed475@telus.net">Scott Tilley</A> 
  </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=lowfer@lwca.org 
  href="mailto:lowfer@lwca.org">lowfer@lwca.org</A> ; <A 
  title=rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 
  href="mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org</A> 
  </DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, February 28, 2005 10:51 
  PM</DIV>
  <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [LW] ... --- ...</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The smoke test of this Wilkinson Combiner was 
  successfull in that no smoke came out and nothing died.&nbsp; However, we get 
  enough heat to cook an egg on the 100ohm balance 
  resistor.&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>We have a scope match on the output to the dummy 
  load and it shows about 225W from one transmitter, add another and we get 
  450W, success NOPE!&nbsp; The transmitters are outputting ~450W each! 
  Therefore, half the power is being absorbed in the 100ohm balance 
  resistor.&nbsp; Examining the phase relationship of the input to the combiner 
  waveforms indicates they are in phase within ~10degrees and almost equal in 
  amplitude.&nbsp; So what gives!&nbsp; Anyone have some idea what may be going 
  wrong?&nbsp; Of course we have checked and doubled checked the circuit for 
  errors and nothing...&nbsp; All seems as it should according to formulas and 
  drawings we have viewed and designed it from.</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Does anyone have an idea how we could 
  troubleshoot our way through this?</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Any&nbsp;advice would be 
appreciated.</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 Scott and Steve(It's all his fault 
  ;-)</FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Check the status of radio beacon 'TIL'&nbsp; in 
  CN89lg at:<BR><A 
  href="http://www.scottboxx.com/radio">www.scottboxx.com/radio</A><BR></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Scott Tilley" <sthed475@telus.net>
To: lowfer@lwca.org,  rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The smoke test of this Wilkinson Combiner was 
successfull in that no smoke came out and nothing died.&nbsp; However, we get 
enough heat to cook an egg on the 100ohm balance 
resistor.&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>We have a scope match on the output to the dummy 
load and it shows about 225W from one transmitter, add another and we get 450W, 
success NOPE!&nbsp; The transmitters are outputting ~450W each! Therefore, half 
the power is being absorbed in the 100ohm balance resistor.&nbsp; Examining the 
phase relationship of the input to the combiner waveforms indicates they are in 
phase within ~10degrees and almost equal in amplitude.&nbsp; So what 
gives!&nbsp; Anyone have some idea what may be going wrong?&nbsp; Of course we 
have checked and doubled checked the circuit for errors and nothing...&nbsp; All 
seems as it should according to formulas and drawings we have viewed and 
designed it from.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Does anyone have an idea how we could troubleshoot 
our way through this?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Any&nbsp;advice would be appreciated.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>73 Scott and Steve(It's all his fault 
;-)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Check the status of radio beacon 'TIL'&nbsp; in 
CN89lg at:<BR><A 
href="http://www.scottboxx.com/radio">www.scottboxx.com/radio</A><BR></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "captbrian" <captbrian@ukonline.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org,  lowfer@lwca.org
References: <BAY102-F14356BF97104B7EB4F9DD5CF590@phx.gbl>
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 And to you Laurie-radio bach.

Bryan
----- Original Message ----- 
From: Laurence KL1X <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>; <lowfer@lwca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 3:59 AM
Subject: LF: XDW on


> > Happy St Davids day boyos
> 
> Laurence KL1X/5 em26aq Bville OK
> 
> 
> 
> 



From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970
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From: "Laurence KL1X" <hellozerohellozero@hotmail.com>
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WD2XDW on 137.7753/6 KHz DFCW 60 on at appx 0200z 1st March 2005 1Kw input 
35A loop current or so.

Long CW message and  ident at beginning tends to elongate the first 
character as viewed on Argo dot 30 slow.

Status http://myweb.cableone.net/flow

Happy St Davids day boyos

Laurence KL1X/5 em26aq Bville OK




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From: "John Andrews" <w1tag@w1tag.com>
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Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 10:25:21 -0500
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Subject: LF: TA 28 Feb
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WD2XGJ and WD2XES looked very good on G3YXM's screen from 0200 to 0300 UTC.

The highlight, though, was a capture from Ed Lesnichy, RU6LA, taken at 0400
UTC just before RU6 sunrise:
http://www.w1tag.com/files/RU6LA-1.jpg

XES' DFCW is clearly visible at 779.0/779.2, and XGJ is on 779.7. Both
signals would have looked better with longer elements. Ed will be watching
again for the next two nights, and I will use DFCW90.

Distance from my QTH to Ed's Machta QTH in eastern Russia is about 7930 km;
Warren's distance would be about 35 km less.

John Andrews, W1TAG/WD2XES




