From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10712 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 20:48:00 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 20:48:00 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 4599 invoked by uid 10001); 30 Apr 2003 20:48:00 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 20:48:00 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AyTu-00083x-Hh for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 21:47:10 +0100 Received: from [217.72.192.165] (helo=mailgate5.cinetic.de) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AyTo-00083o-If for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 21:47:04 +0100 Received: from web.de (fmomail01.dlan.cinetic.de [172.20.1.45]) by mailgate5.cinetic.de (8.11.6p2/8.11.2/SuSE Linux 8.11.0-0.4) with SMTP id h3UKkXq08170 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 22:46:33 +0200 Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 22:46:33 +0200 Message-ID: <200304302046.h3UKkXq08170@mailgate5.cinetic.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Organization: http://freemail.web.de/ From: "Hans-Albrecht Haffa" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.2 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear Jim, please send me a copy of Your pdf-file. Hans-Albrecht DK 8 ND rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org schrieb am 29.04.03 16:43:02: > > Dear LF Group, > > For tuning LF antennas, I have for some time been using an oscilloscope to > monitor the current and voltage waveforms at the TX output. Resonance > occurs when V and I are in phase, and the load resistance is 50ohms when > V/I = 50. This is very easy to use provided a scope is to hand, but not > very useful if it isn't. An SWR bridge can be used, but it only indicates > the degree of mismatch, so tuning is still a matter of trial and error. So > with a mind towards future /P operations, I have built a self-contained > tuning meter. > > The prototype has 2 meters - one indicates phase, while the other can be > switched between voltage and current to determine the load resistance. The > circuit is slightly more complex than an SWR bridge, but not by very much - > it uses 12 diodes, 3 toroid cores and a few other passive components. It > does not require an external power supply, and is usable with TX power > between about 20W and 1.8kW. I have written a 3 page article about it - it > is a pdf file of about 190k, so too big for the reflector, but I can e-mail > it as an attachment to those who are interested. If someone would like to > put it on their web site, they would be more than welcome! > > Cheers, Jim Moritz > 73 de M0BMU > > ____________________________________________________________________________ Fur 92 EUR findet der Muttertag auch bei Mutti statt. Online buchen und zum Fruhbucher-Tarif fliegen http://img.web.de/lh/lhspecial3.html From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31324 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 19:38:25 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 19:38:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 22843 invoked by uid 10001); 30 Apr 2003 19:38:25 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 19:38:25 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AxOO-0007ki-1E for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 20:37:24 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.93] (helo=rhenium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AxOI-0007kZ-76 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 20:37:18 +0100 Received: from dial81-135-37-151.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([81.135.37.151] helo=Main) by rhenium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 19AxOG-0001Zg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 20:37:17 +0100 Message-ID: <003201c30f4f$ee182a60$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30f29$700bc080$bbe4fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 20:36:42 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: strange condx Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.7 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Mal, thanks for the interesting report. I have looked at the darkness shadow at that time using Geoclock, and it crosses the path at quite an angle, approximately between Berlin and Helsinki. That means the ionosphere is probably still illuminated at around the Russian boarder. My guess is that the early signal was a one hop path from the bottom of the E-layer at about 100kms altitude. Later higher order paths become possible as your end of the path goes into darkness and these destructively interfere giving very deep sharp fades. It is surprising under present conditions that the initial signal was so strong as it is a "long hop". Two hop signals would normally be stronger and more stable over that distance except that there is a lot of nightime absorption due to the after-effects of the geomagnetic activity. This would weaken the two hop signals. Maybe that makes them of similar strength to the one hop and hence the deep fade (cancellation when the phases oppose) Of course I could just be totally wrong....but it sounds like a good story. Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "hamilton mal" To: Sent: 30 April 2003 16:01 Subject: LF: strange condx Yesterday early evening around 1900 z RN6BN was a very strong signal, stronger than usual about S6 then about one hour later he suddenly started to disappear, this is when I worked him on 137.7 QRS3, we have worked before. Although weaker he was solid O copy and he gave me the same report. Shortly after we worked he disappeared totally on a CQ then re appeared, perfectly readable but during the evening never got as strong as around 1900z. I have not noticed this rapid QSB on signals before on 136 khz There seemed to be some unusual propogation at this time. YU7AR and OK1DTN were very strong with some variations on their signals also during the evening. I also observed some DL acty and DK8KM on hellscriber or some variation of the mode, solid signal. 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19010 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 16:16:48 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 16:16:48 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 5773 invoked by uid 10001); 30 Apr 2003 16:10:08 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 16:10:08 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19Au7W-0006qD-OZ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 17:07:46 +0100 Received: from [64.136.30.74] (helo=m11.lax.untd.com) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Au7R-0006py-Br for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 17:07:41 +0100 Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"yokUgcxCbtTP7XLrpefewM99c0uV6ZuOJx2AzzXkWJgQO0fmVIDWgA==">; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 09:06:25 PDT Received: (from riese-k3djc@juno.com) by m11.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HW2B9KHW; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 09:06:25 PDT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 11:59:37 -0700 Message-ID: <20030430.120503.332.3.riese-k3djc@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.13 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-15,17,19-21 From: riese-k3djc@juno.com Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.2 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,FORGED_JUNO_RCVD,NO_REAL_NAME, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false On Wed, 30 Apr 2003 12:44:04 +0100 James Moritz writes: > Dear LF Group, > > Thanks for the feedback on the tuning meter. Thanks to G3NYK who has > > pointed out that the "V" and "A" range switch markings were shown > the wrong > way round on the circuit diagram - I have corrected that in the most > recent > version of the file sent out. Jim This circuit is so useful shouldn't it be Copy Righted ?? The idea may be snapped up by MFJ or others Now if someone would developed a Kit . I will have to do a lot of looking at Hamfests thanks for the idea Bob K3DJC From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27990 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 16:06:28 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 16:06:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 21348 invoked by uid 10001); 30 Apr 2003 16:06:28 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 16:06:28 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19Au2I-0006mz-IC for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 17:02:22 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.48] (helo=mta8-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Au2D-0006mj-Pf for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 17:02:17 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.187]) by mta8-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030430160216.RKS22832.mta8-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 17:02:16 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c30f29$700bc080$bbe4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 16:01:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: strange condx Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=5.0tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Yesterday early evening around 1900 z RN6BN was a very strong signal, stronger than usual about S6 then about one hour later he suddenly started to disappear, this is when I worked him on 137.7 QRS3, we have worked before. Although weaker he was solid O copy and he gave me the same report. Shortly after we worked he disappeared totally on a CQ then re appeared, perfectly readable but during the evening never got as strong as around 1900z. I have not noticed this rapid QSB on signals before on 136 khz There seemed to be some unusual propogation at this time.
YU7AR and OK1DTN were very strong with some variations on their signals also during the evening.
I also observed some DL acty and DK8KM on hellscriber or some variation of the mode, solid signal.
73 de Mal/G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15323 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 12:57:59 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 12:57:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 14078 invoked by uid 10001); 30 Apr 2003 12:57:59 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 12:57:58 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19Ar8Z-0005tE-Sq for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 13:56:39 +0100 Received: from [213.218.75.230] (helo=smtp01.freeler.nl) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Ar8S-0005sr-St for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 13:56:33 +0100 Received: (qmail 30437 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 12:56:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO w8k3f0.freeler.nl) ([62.21.145.150]) (envelope-sender ) by smtp01.freeler.nl (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 30 Apr 2003 12:56:01 -0000 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030430145410.02a52570@POP3.freeler.nl> X-Sender: FRE0000086604@POP3.freeler.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 14:55:23 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Dick Rollema" In-reply-to: <5.1.0.14.0.20030430120518.00ade070@gemini.herts.ac.uk> References: <006301c30e7e$5e4c4230$1b00a8c0@dellboy> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF tuning meter Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-21.6 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,HTML_00_10,HTML_MESSAGE,IN_REP_TO, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Dear Jim,

Please send me a copy of your paper.

Thanks!

73, Dick, PA0SE

At 12:44 30-4-03 +0100, you wrote:
Dear LF Group,

Thanks for the feedback on the tuning meter. Thanks to G3NYK who has pointed out that the "V" and "A" range switch markings were shown the wrong way round on the circuit diagram - I have corrected that in the most recent version of the file sent out.

It was pointed out that, instead of separate RF volts and current ranges, one could subtract voltage from current, and have a second centre-zero meter showing "R > 50 ohm, R < 50 ohm". I'm sure this would work fine, but I didn't do it because I felt it was more useful to have the separate ranges for diagnostic purposes - so you can see directly if there is any output voltage from the TX, whether the load is drawing any current, measure power, etc. Having the scales set so that equal meter deflections are obtained with the correct load resistance is almost as convenient - you don't need to adjust the loading as often as you adjust the resonant frequency.

The meter could be used unmodified in a 75ohm system, the only difference would be that there would not be equal deflections on V and A scales with a matched load. Of course, if you have a 75 ohm system, the ranges can be altered so that the FSD of the V scale is 75 times that of the A scale.

The phase detector output could be used to drive a servo tuning motor for an automatic tuning system. It would be a good idea to RF low-pass filter the DC output from the detector if you wanted to do this.

Cheers, Jim Moritz
73 de M0BMU


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8344 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 11:45:24 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 11:45:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 22314 invoked by uid 10001); 30 Apr 2003 11:45:24 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 11:45:24 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19Aq0n-0005Nv-66 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 12:44:33 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.9] (helo=hestia.herts.ac.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Aq0h-0005Nm-Bx for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 12:44:27 +0100 Received: from gemini ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini.herts.ac.uk) by hestia.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 19Aq0X-0000BV-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 12:44:17 +0100 Received: from [147.197.232.252] (helo=rsch-15.herts.ac.uk) by gemini.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19Aq0M-0004DM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 12:44:06 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030430120518.00ade070@gemini.herts.ac.uk> X-Sender: mj9ar@gemini.herts.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 12:44:04 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "James Moritz" In-reply-to: <006301c30e7e$5e4c4230$1b00a8c0@dellboy> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MailScanner: No Virus detected Subject: LF: Re: LF tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TOversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear LF Group, Thanks for the feedback on the tuning meter. Thanks to G3NYK who has pointed out that the "V" and "A" range switch markings were shown the wrong way round on the circuit diagram - I have corrected that in the most recent version of the file sent out. It was pointed out that, instead of separate RF volts and current ranges, one could subtract voltage from current, and have a second centre-zero meter showing "R > 50 ohm, R < 50 ohm". I'm sure this would work fine, but I didn't do it because I felt it was more useful to have the separate ranges for diagnostic purposes - so you can see directly if there is any output voltage from the TX, whether the load is drawing any current, measure power, etc. Having the scales set so that equal meter deflections are obtained with the correct load resistance is almost as convenient - you don't need to adjust the loading as often as you adjust the resonant frequency. The meter could be used unmodified in a 75ohm system, the only difference would be that there would not be equal deflections on V and A scales with a matched load. Of course, if you have a 75 ohm system, the ranges can be altered so that the FSD of the V scale is 75 times that of the A scale. The phase detector output could be used to drive a servo tuning motor for an automatic tuning system. It would be a good idea to RF low-pass filter the DC output from the detector if you wanted to do this. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5568 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 08:21:06 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 08:21:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 29661 invoked by uid 10001); 30 Apr 2003 08:21:06 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: High Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 08:21:06 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19Amp1-00041B-08 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 09:20:11 +0100 Received: from [212.1.130.143] (helo=smtp-1.visp.telinco.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Amov-000412-KI for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 09:20:05 +0100 Received: from [80.40.83.101] (helo=standalone) by smtp-1.visp.telinco.net with smtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 19Amou-0006UI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 09:20:05 +0100 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 09:19:15 +0100 Message-ID: <01C30EF9.91BF8840.g4jnt@thersgb.net> From: "Andy talbot" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 09:15:36 +0100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: RE: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.0 required=5.0tests=X_PRIORITY_HIGHversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Jim - Can I have a copy please - to the other account actalbot@dstl.gov.uk. If it uses the design I think is most likely - is it immune to even harmonic distortion products in the output waveform. (OK, there should never be any, but...) Andy G4JNT -----Original Message----- From: James Moritz [SMTP:j.r.moritz@herts.ac.uk] Sent: 2003/04/29 15:37 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: LF Tuning meter Dear LF Group, For tuning LF antennas, I have for some time been using an oscilloscope to monitor the current and voltage waveforms at the TX output. Resonance occurs when V and I are in phase, and the load resistance is 50ohms when V/I = 50. This is very easy to use provided a scope is to hand, but not very useful if it isn't. An SWR bridge can be used, but it only indicates the degree of mismatch, so tuning is still a matter of trial and error. So with a mind towards future /P operations, I have built a self-contained tuning meter. The prototype has 2 meters - one indicates phase, while the other can be switched between voltage and current to determine the load resistance. The circuit is slightly more complex than an SWR bridge, but not by very much - it uses 12 diodes, 3 toroid cores and a few other passive components. It does not require an external power supply, and is usable with TX power between about 20W and 1.8kW. I have written a 3 page article about it - it is a pdf file of about 190k, so too big for the reflector, but I can e-mail it as an attachment to those who are interested. If someone would like to put it on their web site, they would be more than welcome! Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22994 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 07:29:19 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 07:29:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 21834 invoked by uid 10001); 30 Apr 2003 07:29:19 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 07:29:19 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19Am0z-0003it-Pb for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 08:28:29 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.42] (helo=mta02-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Am0u-0003ih-FG for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 08:28:24 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030430072823.TYDF9882.mta02-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 08:28:23 +0100 Message-ID: <007701c30eea$5a063c00$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 08:30:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: LF Tuning Meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Jim's PDF file can be found via my 'Links' page: http://www.lf.thersgb.net/links.htm Mike, G3XDV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20604 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 06:32:56 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 06:32:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 2416 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 06:32:59 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 06:32:59 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19Al8m-0003PU-Ou for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 07:32:28 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.174] (helo=cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Al8h-0003PL-LN for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 07:32:23 +0100 Received: from modem-2343.tiger.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.217.39] helo=shack) by cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Al8a-00069y-Bn for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 07:32:20 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 07:31:44 +0100 Message-ID: <004e01c30ee2$2ed27c90$1400900a@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-reply-to: <004801c30e9a$67152fa0$6507a8c0@Main> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Subject: LF: RE: Propagation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.4 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Its already here! Au on 6M last night with Auroral E into JW from GM. If you want to know whats happening real time see the following http://www.maj.com/sun/noaa.html And also see http://sam-europe.de/index.html Regards Simon GM4PLM -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Alan Melia Sent: 29 April 2003 22:58 To: LF-Group Subject: LF: Propagation Hi all I have just received the following from spaceweather.com, and besides the fact they have typed the wrong date it does not look very promising for the near future. ------------------------------------- Space Weather news for April 19, 2003 http://spaceweather.com Geomagnetic activity surged for a while on Monday, April 28th, when Earth glided through a solar wind stream. Northern Lights in the United States descended as far south as Wisconsin. More auroras are possible on May 1st when our planet is expected to encounter another solar wind stream flowing from a coronal hole on the sun. Meanwhile, the sunspot number is rising. The face of the sun is peppered with active regions--one stretching nearly 10 Earth-diameters from end to end. The impressive sunspot group is easy to observe using safe solar projection methods. Visit spaceweather.com for images and more information ------------------------------------ Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22636 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 06:19:14 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 06:19:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 15648 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 06:19:00 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 06:19:00 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AkuX-0003IL-1D for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 07:17:45 +0100 Received: from [195.161.146.225] (helo=proktor.m-media.ru ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AkuQ-0003IC-0E for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 07:17:38 +0100 Received: from serv (vova.localnet [10.0.3.72]) by proktor.m-media.ru (8.12.8/8.12.3) with SMTP id h3U6T1Qd075962 for ; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 10:29:01 +0400 (MSD) (envelope-from vladimir@m-media.ru) Message-ID: <005e01c30ee0$3eb1aac0$4803000a@oo> From: "Vladimir Shuplyakov" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030429203313.02a013d8@pop2.sympatico.ca> <3EAF1AEA.2090802@netins.net> Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 10:17:58 +0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 136 activity X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hello, dear OM-s! Today will second probe to start 136kc beacon from my summer QTH. I plaine to start today 17.00 UTC 137.710 QRSS3 "RX3QFM" 20.00 UTC 137.710 QRSS20 "RX3QFM" Now 15m vertical, 150m horizontal. 400 Wt out power. If will any e-mail reports tomorrow, I will transport my computer for reciving. 73! Vlad. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22688 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 00:44:07 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 00:44:07 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 20072 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 00:37:29 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 00:37:29 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19Afa6-0001kM-Dc for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 01:36:18 +0100 Received: from [209.226.175.183] (helo=tomts21-srv.bellnexxia.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Afa1-0001kC-BD for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 01:36:13 +0100 Received: from lsk.sympatico.ca ([216.208.85.101]) by tomts21-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with ESMTP id <20030430003606.YSJI20691.tomts21-srv.bellnexxia.net@lsk.sympatico.ca>; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 20:36:06 -0400 Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20030429203313.02a013d8@pop2.sympatico.ca> X-Sender: b1aemm59@pop2.sympatico.ca (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 20:33:54 -0400 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org, rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Larry Kayser" In-reply-to: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429145925.00ae4c60@gemini.herts.ac.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.5 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false >Jim: > I have written a 3 page article about it - it is a pdf file of about > 190k, so too big for the reflector, but I can e-mail it as an attachment > to those who are interested. Please, a copy would be appreciated. Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5516 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2003 00:38:46 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 00:38:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 746 invoked by uid 10001); 30 Apr 2003 00:38:46 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 30 Apr 2003 00:38:46 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19Afbu-0001mI-Ux for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 01:38:10 +0100 Received: from [167.142.228.65] (helo=cgpf1.cgp.netins.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Afbq-0001ls-7v for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 30 Apr 2003 01:38:06 +0100 Received: from [167.142.32.126] (HELO netins.net) by cgpf1.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.5.9) with ESMTP id 339367286; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:38:03 -0500 Message-ID: <3EAF1AEA.2090802@netins.net> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:38:02 -0500 From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Dr._Tom_Gruis=2C_K=D8HTF?=" Organization: www.gruis.org User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030429203313.02a013d8@pop2.sympatico.ca> Subject: Re: LF: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.6 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Please sign me up! Doc. Larry Kayser wrote: > >> Jim: > > > > >> I have written a 3 page article about it - it is a pdf file of about >> 190k, so too big for the reflector, but I can e-mail it as an >> attachment to those who are interested. > > > Please, a copy would be appreciated. > > Larry > VA3LK > > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16794 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 22:30:25 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 22:30:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 24694 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 22:30:12 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 22:30:12 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19Adbi-0001D0-Gj for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 23:29:50 +0100 Received: from [66.27.141.37] (helo=momsnu1) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Adbd-0001Cn-1Z for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 23:29:45 +0100 Received: from [192.168.0.12] by momsnu1 (ArGoSoft Mail Server for Windows NT/2000, Version 1.4 (1.4.0.5)); Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:29:13 -0700 Message-ID: <00d501c30e9e$c5de2ec0$0c00a8c0@home> From: "DTX" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001f01c30e80$12a96540$452cbd50@y6m8a2> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:29:17 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: de G3JRL Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.3 required=5.0tests=HTML_50_60,HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Or did you mean the LowFer list on qth.net???  That would be
 
 
Gary WA6DTX
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 11:49 AM
Subject: LF: de G3JRL

I wonder if anyone could please tell me how to be placed on the loist of the LF Reflector? Thanks from John G3JRL
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5425 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 21:58:54 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 21:58:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 3693 invoked by uid 10001); 29 Apr 2003 21:58:54 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 21:58:54 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19Ad6k-0000xn-DD for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 22:57:50 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.111] (helo=gadolinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Ad6f-0000xe-Fd for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 22:57:45 +0100 Received: from dial81-135-34-66.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([81.135.34.66] helo=Main) by gadolinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 19Ad6e-0007ER-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 22:57:45 +0100 Message-ID: <004801c30e9a$67152fa0$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: "LF-Group" Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 22:57:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Propagation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi all I have just received the following from spaceweather.com, and besides the fact they have typed the wrong date it does not look very promising for the near future. ------------------------------------- Space Weather news for April 19, 2003 http://spaceweather.com Geomagnetic activity surged for a while on Monday, April 28th, when Earth glided through a solar wind stream. Northern Lights in the United States descended as far south as Wisconsin. More auroras are possible on May 1st when our planet is expected to encounter another solar wind stream flowing from a coronal hole on the sun. Meanwhile, the sunspot number is rising. The face of the sun is peppered with active regions--one stretching nearly 10 Earth-diameters from end to end. The impressive sunspot group is easy to observe using safe solar projection methods. Visit spaceweather.com for images and more information ------------------------------------ Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24716 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 20:09:58 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 20:09:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 23988 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 20:09:45 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 20:09:45 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AbPp-0000PF-U4 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 21:09:25 +0100 Received: from [212.135.6.10] (helo=smarthost0.mail.uk.easynet.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AbPl-0000P6-1f for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 21:09:21 +0100 Received: from tnt-5-122.easynet.co.uk ([195.40.200.122] helo=erica) by smarthost0.mail.uk.easynet.net with smtp (Exim 4.10) id 19AbPj-0008ms-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 21:09:19 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c30e8c$01f2b740$7ac828c3@erica> From: "g3ldo" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429145925.00ae4c60@gemini.herts.ac.uk> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 21:14:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Jim > For tuning LF antennas, I have for some time been using an oscilloscope to > monitor the current and voltage waveforms at the TX output. Resonance > occurs when V and I are in phase, and the load resistance is 50ohms when > V/I = 50. This is very easy to use provided a scope is to hand, but not > very useful if it isn't. An SWR bridge can be used, but it only indicates > the degree of mismatch, so tuning is still a matter of trial and error. So > with a mind towards future /P operations, I have built a self-contained > tuning meter. > Although I included a description of your ScopeMatch Tuning Aid in the LF book (as built by Lech G3KAU) I never did get round to building one myself. The reason is that I never had a transmitter that had a 50ohm output system. With the BK amplifier I went straight from 4ohms to the multi-tap toroid transformer at the base of the antenna system. Resonance is indicated by maximum antenna current and matching by the current to the amplifier FETs. The amplifier was coupled to the antenna matching transformer with a length of heavy duty mains cable. When I moved on to the Decca transmitter I changed the antenna antenna loading toroid transformer to an auto transformer arrangement because I didn't need the isolation. This system is 70ohms and for some time I used the same mains cable transmission line. I recently changed it to 50ohm coax (because it seemed not quite right to be using mains cable for such an application) but it had no effect on the transmitter performance. The question is would your tuning aid be of any use in my system? I can see a use when I use the LF transmitter at Amberley Museum, where resonance and antenna feed impedance are totally different to the home QTH but is your latest meter for 50ohms only? I would be grateful if you could send me a copy of the PDF. Regards, Peter, G3LDO e-mail Web From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18304 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 19:57:23 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 19:57:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 21390 invoked by uid 10001); 29 Apr 2003 19:57:23 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 19:57:23 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AbDT-0000Hf-EJ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 20:56:39 +0100 Received: from [66.27.141.37] (helo=momsnu1) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AbDN-0000HS-Is for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 20:56:33 +0100 Received: from [192.168.0.12] by momsnu1 (ArGoSoft Mail Server for Windows NT/2000, Version 1.4 (1.4.0.5)); Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:56:01 -0700 Message-ID: <00a501c30e89$5e6b3ae0$0c00a8c0@home> From: "DTX" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001f01c30e80$12a96540$452cbd50@y6m8a2> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:56:04 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: de G3JRL Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
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Gary WA6DTX
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 11:49 AM
Subject: LF: de G3JRL

I wonder if anyone could please tell me how to be placed on the loist of the LF Reflector? Thanks from John G3JRL
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31334 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 18:42:59 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 18:42:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 17097 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 18:42:44 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 18:42:43 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19Aa2t-0008DD-Ai for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:41:39 +0100 Received: from [80.189.94.101] (helo=mx6.global.net.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19Aa2n-0008D1-90 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:41:33 +0100 Received: from ps.189.44.69.dial.global.net.uk ([80.189.44.69] helo=y6m8a2) by mx6.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 19Aa2j-0007kC-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:41:29 +0100 Message-ID: <001f01c30e80$12a96540$452cbd50@y6m8a2> From: "John Armstrong" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:49:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: de G3JRL Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
I wonder if anyone could please tell me how to be placed on the loist of the LF Reflector? Thanks from John G3JRL
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17605 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 18:37:16 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 18:37:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 18333 invoked by uid 10001); 29 Apr 2003 18:37:16 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 18:37:16 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AZxc-00089z-90 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:36:12 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.147] (helo=einsteinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AZxW-00089q-HJ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:36:06 +0100 Received: from host217-35-41-67.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.35.41.67] helo=dellboy) by einsteinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 19AZxS-0001qh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:36:02 +0100 Message-ID: <006301c30e7e$5e4c4230$1b00a8c0@dellboy> From: "Dave Pick" To: "LF Group" Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:37:19 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Jim's LF tuning meter Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.2 required=5.0tests=HTML_60_70,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Jim's PDF is on the LF website at http://www.wireless.org.uk
 
73
Dave
G3YXM.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16503 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 17:42:28 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 17:42:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 15023 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 17:42:13 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 17:42:13 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AZ79-0007kD-0h for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:41:59 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.171] (helo=cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AZ74-0007jw-8f for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:41:54 +0100 Received: from modem-95.ainur.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.100.95] helo=f3a3a2) by cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AZ73-0003tn-Bo for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:41:53 +0100 Message-ID: <003301c30e76$d0e05b40$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> From: "Laurie Mayhead" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:40:49 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re. BK amps Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Ian, When I started to use a BK amp (1000W) Lech G3KAU suggested that the frequency compensation capacitors could be reduced in value. I found that replacing the 27pf caps with 4.7pf caps produced an increase in output and the amp. remained stable. I hope this information of use. 73 Laurie. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13933 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 17:40:45 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 17:40:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 13838 invoked by uid 10001); 29 Apr 2003 17:40:45 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 17:40:45 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AZ5U-0007hM-4A for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:40:16 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.81] (helo=tungsten.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AZ5P-0007h2-4N for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:40:11 +0100 Received: from host217-35-41-67.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.35.41.67] helo=dellboy) by tungsten.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 19AZ5N-0004GX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:40:09 +0100 Message-ID: <001f01c30e76$90fa04e0$1b00a8c0@dellboy> From: "Dave Pick" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429145925.00ae4c60@gemini.herts.ac.uk> <002f01c30e5f$36d33840$3704210a@Hugh> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:41:24 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hugh said... > > I will happily give it webspace at http://www.m0wye.thersgb.net/lf.htm but > maybe http://www.wireless.org.uk is a more centralised location - if the > webmaster could be persuaded :-) > But of course! Please send me a copy Jim, I could have used that when I was fiddling around trying to match the aerial on 73k in GM. Sounds like another winner! Thanks Dave 'YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4333 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 17:37:55 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 17:37:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 14449 invoked by uid 10001); 29 Apr 2003 17:37:55 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 17:37:54 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AZ2m-0007e8-Bt for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:37:28 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.46] (helo=mta06-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AZ2h-0007dt-1A for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:37:23 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030429173722.XCIK12018.mta06-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:37:22 +0100 Message-ID: <008b01c30e76$27ea4460$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429145925.00ae4c60@gemini.herts.ac.uk> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:38:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > If someone would like to > put it on their web site, they would be more than welcome! > > Cheers, Jim Moritz > 73 de M0BMU Jim, Quite happy to post it on my site. Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5990 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 17:34:25 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 17:34:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 29656 invoked by uid 10001); 29 Apr 2003 17:34:25 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 17:34:25 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AYzJ-0007bu-4r for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:33:53 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AYzE-0007bl-55 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:33:48 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.233.47]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030429173347.VSNP1127.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:33:47 +0100 Message-ID: <001301c30e6d$0ed3ede0$2fe9fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 17:32:57 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Decca Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
All recent Decca MK 53 G receivers going FB. I got a lot of info locally from ex engineers employed on the devices. Lots of radar systems also on the market plus other useful bits like antennas etc. The G receivers are GPS models and useful considering the asking QRK compared to the latest models.
73 and tnx to all that supplied info. de Mal/G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17129 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 17:18:53 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 17:18:53 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 22643 invoked by uid 10001); 29 Apr 2003 17:18:53 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 17:18:53 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AYkA-0007U4-Ep for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:18:14 +0100 Received: from [204.60.203.69] (helo=mta3.snet.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AYk4-0007Tr-S4 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 18:18:09 +0100 Received: from snet.net (12-209-21-79.client.attbi.com [12.209.21.79]) (authenticated bits=0) by mta3.snet.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/SNET-smtp-1.2/D-1.1.1.1/O-1.1.1.1) with ESMTP id h3THI48F025526 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 13:18:07 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3EAEB497.1A5793CA@snet.net> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 13:21:27 -0400 From: "Jay Rusgrove" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429145925.00ae4c60@gemini.herts.ac.uk> Subject: Re: LF: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Jim I would also appreciate a copy of the .pdf. If someone has hosted it on their website a link would also be acceptable. I have used the scope version for some time now and it works quite well. Look forward to not having to drag the scope with me. Thanks for sharing the info. Jay Rusgrove, W1VD James Moritz wrote: > Dear LF Group, > > For tuning LF antennas, I have for some time been using an oscilloscope to > monitor the current and voltage waveforms at the TX output. Resonance > occurs when V and I are in phase, and the load resistance is 50ohms when > V/I = 50. This is very easy to use provided a scope is to hand, but not > very useful if it isn't. An SWR bridge can be used, but it only indicates > the degree of mismatch, so tuning is still a matter of trial and error. So > with a mind towards future /P operations, I have built a self-contained > tuning meter. > > The prototype has 2 meters - one indicates phase, while the other can be > switched between voltage and current to determine the load resistance. The > circuit is slightly more complex than an SWR bridge, but not by very much - > it uses 12 diodes, 3 toroid cores and a few other passive components. It > does not require an external power supply, and is usable with TX power > between about 20W and 1.8kW. I have written a 3 page article about it - it > is a pdf file of about 190k, so too big for the reflector, but I can e-mail > it as an attachment to those who are interested. If someone would like to > put it on their web site, they would be more than welcome! > > Cheers, Jim Moritz > 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7379 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 16:43:34 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 16:43:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 19041 invoked by uid 10001); 29 Apr 2003 16:43:33 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 16:43:33 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AYC7-0007An-Db for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 17:43:03 +0100 Received: from [24.153.64.115] (helo=smtp-out.comcast.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AYC2-0007Ae-Gj for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 17:42:58 +0100 Received: from yourw92p4bhlzg (pcp02064100pcs.nrockv01.md.comcast.net [68.83.215.165]) by mtaout02.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) with SMTP id <0HE4002506BMS6@mtaout02.icomcast.net> for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:40:35 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:40:34 -0400 From: "Ralph Lane" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <001901c30e6e$0e70a2c0$0000a398@yourw92p4bhlzg> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429145925.00ae4c60@gemini.herts.ac.uk> Subject: LF: Re: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-8.9 required=5.0tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,MSGID_OE_SPAM_4ZERO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false I would like a copy of your low freq tuning meter. Thanks, Ralph ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Moritz" To: Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 10:36 AM Subject: LF: LF Tuning meter > Dear LF Group, > > For tuning LF antennas, I have for some time been using an oscilloscope to > monitor the current and voltage waveforms at the TX output. Resonance > occurs when V and I are in phase, and the load resistance is 50ohms when > V/I = 50. This is very easy to use provided a scope is to hand, but not > very useful if it isn't. An SWR bridge can be used, but it only indicates > the degree of mismatch, so tuning is still a matter of trial and error. So > with a mind towards future /P operations, I have built a self-contained > tuning meter. > > The prototype has 2 meters - one indicates phase, while the other can be > switched between voltage and current to determine the load resistance. The > circuit is slightly more complex than an SWR bridge, but not by very much - > it uses 12 diodes, 3 toroid cores and a few other passive components. It > does not require an external power supply, and is usable with TX power > between about 20W and 1.8kW. I have written a 3 page article about it - it > is a pdf file of about 190k, so too big for the reflector, but I can e-mail > it as an attachment to those who are interested. If someone would like to > put it on their web site, they would be more than welcome! > > Cheers, Jim Moritz > 73 de M0BMU > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19509 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 16:03:22 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 16:03:22 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 13736 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 16:03:25 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 16:03:25 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AXZN-0006qd-D8 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 17:03:01 +0100 Received: from [195.22.0.27] (helo=iceman.esoterica.pt) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AXZI-0006qM-HM for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 17:02:56 +0100 Received: from slave-5.esoterica.pt (sjm026.esoterica.pt [195.22.17.154]) by iceman.esoterica.pt (8.12.3/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3TFpGqS029075 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 16:51:17 +0100 Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20030429160015.01eaaec0@pop.vianw.pt> X-Sender: NX4YWV@vianw.pt@pop.vianw.pt X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 16:01:32 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Brian Rogerson" In-reply-to: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429145925.00ae4c60@gemini.herts.ac.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TOversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Please Jim. 73, Brian CT1DRP At 15:36 29/04/2003, you wrote: >Dear LF Group, > >For tuning LF antennas, I have for some time been using an oscilloscope to >monitor the current and voltage From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19138 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 16:03:08 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 16:03:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 13596 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 16:03:12 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 16:03:12 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AXYa-0006pm-7e for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 17:02:12 +0100 Received: from [167.142.228.65] (helo=cgpf1.cgp.netins.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AXYV-0006pd-Dr for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 17:02:07 +0100 Received: from [167.142.32.126] (HELO netins.net) by cgpf1.cgp.netins.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.5.9) with ESMTP id 338976436; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 11:02:06 -0500 Message-ID: <3EAEA1FD.1000403@netins.net> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 11:02:05 -0500 From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Dr._Tom_Gruis=2C_K=D8HTF?=" Organization: www.gruis.org User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: Subject: Re: LF: RE: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.3 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Good idea. Please send me the file too! Thanx, Doc. Ashlock,William wrote: >Jim, > >Please send me the tuning meter pdf file. > >Thanks, > >Bill A > >PS: I hope the circuit takes into account the FACT that the phase >relationship between current and voltage in a resistor can vary. (HA HA) > > >_____________________________________________________________________ >This e-mail has been scanned for viruses by the WorldCom Internet Managed Scanning Service - powered by MessageLabs. For further information visit http://www.worldcom.com > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2045 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 15:32:31 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 15:32:31 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: (qmail 324 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 15:32:16 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 15:32:16 -0000 X-SQ: A X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AX5J-0006bM-2Y for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 16:31:57 +0100 Received: from [212.125.75.12] (helo=mail4.messagelabs.com) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AX5D-0006bC-79 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 16:31:51 +0100 X-VirusChecked: Checked X-Env-Sender: William.Ashlock@bocedwards.com X-Msg-Ref: server-8.tower-4.messagelabs.com!1051630295!12431 Received: (qmail 23107 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 15:31:35 -0000 Received: from ukfw1.ge.boc.com (193.131.2.157) by server-8.tower-4.messagelabs.com with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 15:31:35 -0000 Received: from ([160.100.160.136]) by ukfw1.ge.boc.com; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 16:32:36 +0100 (BST) Received: from exc_wil04.edwards.boc.com ([162.118.144.226]) by exc_cra03.edwards.boc.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id J31XDB19; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 16:27:37 +0100 Received: by EXC_WIL04 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <2RDJT2K1>; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 11:23:22 -0400 Message-ID: From: "Ashlock,William" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 11:23:19 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Subject: LF: RE: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Jim, Please send me the tuning meter pdf file. Thanks, Bill A PS: I hope the circuit takes into account the FACT that the phase relationship between current and voltage in a resistor can vary. (HA HA) _____________________________________________________________________ This e-mail has been scanned for viruses by the WorldCom Internet Managed Scanning Service - powered by MessageLabs. For further information visit http://www.worldcom.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 30165 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 15:08:17 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 15:08:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 10536 invoked by uid 10001); 29 Apr 2003 15:08:17 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 15:08:17 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AWhx-0006P5-SI for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 16:07:49 +0100 Received: from [195.161.146.225] (helo=proktor.m-media.ru ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AWhp-0006Ov-33 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 16:07:41 +0100 Received: from serv (vova.localnet [10.0.3.72]) by proktor.m-media.ru (8.12.8/8.12.3) with SMTP id h3TFItQd074071 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:18:56 +0400 (MSD) (envelope-from vladimir@m-media.ru) Message-ID: <009201c30e61$24d71d80$4803000a@oo> From: "Vladimir Shuplyakov" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429145925.00ae4c60@gemini.herts.ac.uk> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 19:08:08 +0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: LF Tuning meter X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.3 required=5.0tests=REFERENCES,UPPERCASE_50_75,WEIRD_QUOTINGversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------070409030602060304090803" MIME-Version: 1.0 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------070409030602060304090803 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit It's a simple antenn bridge. Very usefull from 136kc too 144MHz. 73! 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uEeKMHdWnYaKt6YjylJ7rJh/BGUobUh28eVOExiLIBVTEwIaY6iLwBiMwjiMxFiMuliLHYiM FwhTOKWMvZdVaDpljGCjVbkojScVV9Y4jdiYjc2zLKfIjeAYjuI4juRYjuZ4juiYjuq4juzY ju74jvAYj/I4j/QoegEBADs= --------------070409030602060304090803 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; name="ATT16808.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="ATT16808.txt" --------------070409030602060304090803-- From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23886 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 15:04:06 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 15:04:06 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 4539 invoked by uid 10001); 29 Apr 2003 15:04:06 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 15:04:06 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AWdt-0006KI-7W for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 16:03:37 +0100 Received: from [64.136.30.74] (helo=m11.lax.untd.com) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AWdh-0006Ik-5P for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 16:03:25 +0100 Received: from cookie.untd.com by cookie.untd.com for <"yokUgcxCbtTP7XLrpefewM99c0uV6ZuO1PwN+nyMXJki/9db7x0AjA==">; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 08:01:59 PDT Received: (from riese-k3djc@juno.com) by m11.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id HWXM6VKM; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 08:01:59 PDT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 11:01:14 -0700 Message-ID: <20030429.110115.120.1.riese-k3djc@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 5.0.13 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-9,11-21 From: riese-k3djc@juno.com Subject: Re: LF: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.2 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,FORGED_JUNO_RCVD,NO_REAL_NAME, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Jim Include me when you send the PDF file I have been looking at the info in the LF ,RSGB handbook . I have not wanted to drag the scope out to the antenna Bob K3DJC On Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:36:44 +0100 James Moritz writes: > Dear LF Group, > > For tuning LF antennas, I have for some time been using an > oscilloscope to > monitor the current and voltage waveforms at the TX output. > Resonance > occurs when V and I are in phase, and the load resistance is 50ohms > when > V/I = 50. This is very easy to use provided a scope is to hand, but > not > very useful if it isn't. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26722 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 15:02:34 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 15:02:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 9138 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 14:55:39 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 14:55:39 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AWVi-0006BD-Tl for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:55:10 +0100 Received: from [212.159.14.227] (helo=warrior.services.quay.plus.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AWVe-0006Aq-2F for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:55:06 +0100 Received: (qmail 25543 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 14:54:38 -0000 Received: from ctuash.sonnetinternet.co.uk (HELO Hugh) (212.159.90.113) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 14:54:38 -0000 Message-ID: <002f01c30e5f$36d33840$3704210a@Hugh> From: "Hugh M0WYE" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429145925.00ae4c60@gemini.herts.ac.uk> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:54:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.9 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hello Jim, Please may I have a copy of your tuning meter article, via E-mail. I will happily give it webspace at http://www.m0wye.thersgb.net/lf.htm but maybe http://www.wireless.org.uk is a more centralised location - if the webmaster could be persuaded :-) 73 Hugh M0WYE ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Moritz" To: Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 3:36 PM Subject: LF: LF Tuning meter > Dear LF Group, > > For tuning LF antennas, I have for some time been using an oscilloscope to > monitor the current and voltage waveforms at the TX output. Resonance > occurs when V and I are in phase, and the load resistance is 50ohms when > V/I = 50. This is very easy to use provided a scope is to hand, but not > very useful if it isn't. An SWR bridge can be used, but it only indicates > the degree of mismatch, so tuning is still a matter of trial and error. So > with a mind towards future /P operations, I have built a self-contained > tuning meter. > > The prototype has 2 meters - one indicates phase, while the other can be > switched between voltage and current to determine the load resistance. The > circuit is slightly more complex than an SWR bridge, but not by very much - > it uses 12 diodes, 3 toroid cores and a few other passive components. It > does not require an external power supply, and is usable with TX power > between about 20W and 1.8kW. I have written a 3 page article about it - it > is a pdf file of about 190k, so too big for the reflector, but I can e-mail > it as an attachment to those who are interested. If someone would like to > put it on their web site, they would be more than welcome! > > Cheers, Jim Moritz > 73 de M0BMU > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22315 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 14:53:12 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 14:53:12 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 24165 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 14:53:15 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 14:53:15 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AWTL-00069m-MO for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:52:43 +0100 Received: from [212.227.126.188] (helo=moutng.kundenserver.de) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AWTG-00069d-QJ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:52:38 +0100 Received: from [212.227.126.160] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19AWTG-0007h4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 16:52:38 +0200 Received: from [80.130.83.78] (helo=FABIAN.diolog.de) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19AWT9-0004Dx-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 16:52:35 +0200 Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.0.20030429145028.01d507b0@pop.1und1.com> X-Sender: pt8152986-6@pop.1und1.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 14:51:20 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Fabian Kurz" In-reply-to: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429145925.00ae4c60@gemini.herts.ac.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TOversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false At 15:36 29.04.2003 +0100, you wrote: >Dear LF Group, > >For tuning LF antennas, I have for some time been using an oscilloscope to >monitor the current and voltage waveforms at the TX output. Resonance >occurs when V and I are in phase, and the load resistance is 50ohms when >V/I = 50. This is very easy to use provided a scope is to hand, but not >very useful if it isn't. An SWR bridge can be used, but it only indicates >the degree of mismatch, so tuning is still a matter of trial and error. So >with a mind towards future /P operations, I have built a self-contained >tuning meter. > >The prototype has 2 meters - one indicates phase, while the other can be >switched between voltage and current to determine the load resistance. The >circuit is slightly more complex than an SWR bridge, but not by very much >- it uses 12 diodes, 3 toroid cores and a few other passive components. It >does not require an external power supply, and is usable with TX power >between about 20W and 1.8kW. I have written a 3 page article about it - it >is a pdf file of about 190k, so too big for the reflector, but I can >e-mail it as an attachment to those who are interested. If someone would >like to put it on their web site, they would be more than welcome! I'd appreciate a copy of the pdf-File! 73, Fabian DJ1YFK (currently upgrading the PA some 10dB, so a normal CW QSO is certainly possible soon ;) >Cheers, Jim Moritz >73 de M0BMU > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25172 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 14:39:17 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 14:39:17 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 7496 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 14:39:21 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 14:39:21 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AWFF-00060i-Qp for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:38:09 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.9] (helo=hestia.herts.ac.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AWFA-00060Z-Ky for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:38:04 +0100 Received: from gemini ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini.herts.ac.uk) by hestia.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 19AWF1-0004r4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:37:55 +0100 Received: from [147.197.232.252] (helo=rsch-15.herts.ac.uk) by gemini.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19AWEx-0007Xu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:37:51 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429145925.00ae4c60@gemini.herts.ac.uk> X-Sender: mj9ar@gemini.herts.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 15:36:44 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "James Moritz" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MailScanner: No Virus detected Subject: LF: LF Tuning meter Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear LF Group, For tuning LF antennas, I have for some time been using an oscilloscope to monitor the current and voltage waveforms at the TX output. Resonance occurs when V and I are in phase, and the load resistance is 50ohms when V/I = 50. This is very easy to use provided a scope is to hand, but not very useful if it isn't. An SWR bridge can be used, but it only indicates the degree of mismatch, so tuning is still a matter of trial and error. So with a mind towards future /P operations, I have built a self-contained tuning meter. The prototype has 2 meters - one indicates phase, while the other can be switched between voltage and current to determine the load resistance. The circuit is slightly more complex than an SWR bridge, but not by very much - it uses 12 diodes, 3 toroid cores and a few other passive components. It does not require an external power supply, and is usable with TX power between about 20W and 1.8kW. I have written a 3 page article about it - it is a pdf file of about 190k, so too big for the reflector, but I can e-mail it as an attachment to those who are interested. If someone would like to put it on their web site, they would be more than welcome! Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4311 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 11:19:30 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 11:19:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 27184 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 11:19:16 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 11:19:15 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AT7h-0004mi-Ag for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:18:09 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.9] (helo=hestia.herts.ac.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AT7c-0004mZ-5f for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:18:04 +0100 Received: from gemini ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini.herts.ac.uk) by hestia.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 19AT6o-0000Ub-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:17:14 +0100 Received: from [147.197.232.252] (helo=rsch-15.herts.ac.uk) by gemini.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19AT6h-0001dx-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:17:08 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030429113850.00b0b6d0@gemini.herts.ac.uk> X-Sender: mj9ar@gemini.herts.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 12:17:01 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "James Moritz" In-reply-to: <000d01c30dc2$7c758940$cecdfc3e@ian> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030416120614.024e6ea0@gemini.herts.ac.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MailScanner: No Virus detected Subject: Re: LF: BK amps. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.9 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear Ian, LF Group, At 21:11 28/04/2003 +0100, you wrote: >Hi Jim, > >in your posting of 16 April on 'The Mystery....' you mentioned that the BK >input circuitry could be modified to provide a bit more gain at 136. > >What needs changed to do this? > >73, > >Ian In the Maplin audio amp, (and judging from the circuit diagram in the old LF handbook the BK amps have an almost identical circuit), the gain is actually adequate, but the slew rate limits the output at high frequencies. This means that the output voltage cannot change fast enough (which is what slew rate is, in V/us) to produce a sine wave at the full output amplitude, so what you get instead is a more or less triangular waveform with a somewhat smaller amplitude. The slew rate is limited by the current available from the input stage to charge and discharge the frequency compensation capacitors in the second stage, which are required for stability. The solution is to increase the bias current in the input transistors - however this in itself will make the amp unstable because of the increased loop gain it produces. Fortunately, the status quo is easily restored by adding emitter degeneration resistors to the input transistors to bring their gain back down to the original value. The end result is an amplifier with the same gain and small-signal bandwidth, but able to produce full power at higher frequencies. I can't remember the exact details of the circuit and the changes I made - I will check at home later. I think the input stage was originally biased to 500uA and I increased this to 5mA in each transistor - the emitter resistors required would be about 45ohms in this case, but I'm not sure if this is correct at the moment. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 32500 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 09:29:37 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 09:29:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 20243 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2003 09:29:22 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Apr 2003 09:29:22 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19ARO2-0004BX-4d for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 10:26:54 +0100 Received: from [171.71.177.238] (helo=sj-core-5.cisco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19ARNw-0004BE-IE for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 10:26:48 +0100 Received: from cisco.com (mrwint.cisco.com [64.103.71.48]) by sj-core-5.cisco.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h3T9QDGl008480 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 02:26:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from virgin.net (edin-comm-vl10-dhcp22.cisco.com [144.254.112.42]) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA23015 for ; Tue, 29 Apr 2003 10:26:00 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3EAE44BE.5010704@virgin.net> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2003 10:24:14 +0100 From: "Stewart Bryant" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <7D653C9C42F5D411A27C00508BF8803D01A9F1B0@mail.dstl.gov.uk> Subject: Re: LF: RE: A conumdrum for the weekend - Image Cancelling Mixer. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.6 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Andy Since there can only be one solution, there must be an error in your original transformation i.e. ie SIN(A-B + 90) = - COS(A-B) and not +COS(A-B) as originally asserted. Stewart Talbot Andrew wrote: > We thrashed out this solution on Friday afternoon, it explains why the maths > appears to fail but the concept doesn't. Judging by relies on Friday > evening and Saturday, several readers of the reflecter were getting there, > but a lot of red-herrings were also appearing. > > The ambiguity arises here. In the second configuration (repeated below), > the one that appears to fail in the way I described it, the output from the > top mixer is SIN(A+B) - SIN(A-B) > > But we know that SIN(-X) = -SIN(X)since the Sine function has odd order > symmetry, so the mixer output can justifiably be written as : > SIN(A+B) + SIN(B-A) > Then after the phase shift we have COS(A+B) + COS(B-A) > > Now, we also know that COS(-X) = COS(X) The function has Even symmetry, so > it is now perfectly valid to write the output as : > COS(A+B) + COS(A-B) > > Which, by addition or subtraction with the other path, cancels one of the > sidebands while reinforcing the other as expected. For once it is the maths > that causes the problem, not the concept. > > There were quite a few comments from readers along the lines of "broadbancd > phase shifters" to cope with both sideband frequencies. But this wasn't > really an issue. In some cases it is the input frequency sideband that is > being cancelled - which needs a bit of mental agility to think though these > two designs backwards, noting the two input terms that give the same output > term in any mixer. > > Where image cancelling mixers are used in practice these days is in digital > receivers where the IF is at a very low frequency, like baseband to DC. The > 90 degree phase shift is then just an inherent part of the DSP process, > although diagrams showing how the systems work often show a physical phase > shift at this point. In real analogue hardware, such as the radar receiver > block diagram that generated this problem, the phase shifters are usually > placed in the most convenient position - usually where the relative > bandwidth is at its narrowest such as the RF and LO ports on a > downconverting superhet receiver, with the IF output being summed. BUT on > the matching transmitter just reversing the signal flow, the non-phase > shifted channel now becomes one of the inputs, mixed with the LO to form the > RF output signal. So the two configurations in the condrum become receiver > and transmitter respectively in a classic single conversion design. > > In the radar receiver however, a different situation arises. As it has to > cover a wide tuneable Rf input range of 6 - 18GHz a broadband phase shifter > here is impractical. The tuneable must LO has to have one, and this is just > a case of designing the LO with a bank of suitable phase shifters. The IF > at a VHF frequency is a few tens of MHz wide and a 90 degree phase shift > network at these freqeuncies is straightforward. > > Andy G4JNT > > ========================================================= > NOW, if we move the second 90 degree phase shift to the output of the > mixers (the IF) rather than the LO, as shown below, intuition and common > sense tells us it should still work since the mixing process is fully > reversible and actual direction of signal flow is irrelevant. Furthermore, > many real designs of SSB exciters and receivers prove this really does work > in practice. > > ---90---X----90----| > Signal -| | +/- IF > ------------X------| > | | > | - | > | > Local Osc. > > But here is the conumdrum : > > Keeping the same terminology of Signal = SIN(A), and LO = SIN(B), the inputs > to the top mixer become > COS(A) . SIN(B) > and the output given by the product rule : > COS(A).SIN(B) = SIN(A+B) - SIN(A-B) > > After the output 90 degree phase shift, the SIN terms beocome COS so we > have, in the top output leg : > COS(A+B) - COS(A-B) > > The output from the bottom mixer is, as before : > SIN(A).SIN(B) = COS(A-B) - COS(A+B) > > Which is the SAME as in the top leg, and will either cancel or reinforce > both sidebands. > So it doesn't appear to work at all ! > Moving the output 90 degree shift to the lower leg still fails to cancel one > sideband only. > > So where is the conundrum? Both forms of image cancelling mixer do indeed > work, and the trig identities can be taken from any reference. > ================================================== > PS. > I do have one rather weak explanation, but it doesn't give that warm cozy > feeling expected when theory falls into place! > Andy > > > "This e-mail is intended for the recipient only. If you are not the > intended recipient you must not use, disclose, distribute, copy, print, > or rely upon this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has > misdirected this e-mail, please notify the author by replying to this e-mail." > > "Recipients should note that all e-mail traffic on MOD systems is > subject to monitoring and auditing." > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1558 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 21:11:48 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 21:11:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 28727 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 21:11:33 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 21:11:33 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19AFtZ-0001MD-A1 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 22:10:41 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.46] (helo=mta6-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19AFtU-0001M4-Bx for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 22:10:36 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.205.206]) by mta6-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030428211035.VWTS22800.mta6-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 22:10:35 +0100 Message-ID: <000d01c30dc2$7c758940$cecdfc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030416120614.024e6ea0@gemini.herts.ac.uk> Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 21:11:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: BK amps. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Jim, in your posting of 16 April on 'The Mystery....' you mentioned that the BK input circuitry could be modified to provide a bit more gain at 136. What needs changed to do this? 73, Ian From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14817 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 14:28:08 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 14:28:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 24324 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 14:28:11 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: High Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 14:28:11 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19A9Zi-0007qY-Pd for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 15:25:46 +0100 Received: from [212.1.130.141] (helo=smtp-1.visp.telinco.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19A9Zd-0007qM-Ee for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 15:25:41 +0100 Received: from [80.40.78.114] (helo=standalone) by smtp-1.visp.telinco.net with smtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 19A9Zc-0002UC-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 15:25:41 +0100 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 15:24:54 +0100 Message-ID: <01C30D9A.51ECBD60.g4jnt@thersgb.net> From: "Andy talbot" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 15:24:53 +0100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: RE: LF: Amidon Cores (in the UK) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.1 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTE_TWICE_1,X_PRIORITY_HIGHversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Tnx. That's quite a large range ! Andy -----Original Message----- From: G0MRF@aol.com [SMTP:G0MRF@aol.com] Sent: 2003/04/28 13:53 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Amidon Cores (in the UK) In a message dated 4/25/03 8:52:54 AM GMT Daylight Time, g4jnt@thersgb.net writes: > > Tnx to all who replied on this subject. BFI seem to be the preferred UK > supplier for micrometals. I actually need some of the smallest cores T20-2 > or > similar for a bank of sixteen 11th order elliptic filters for multiple anti > aliassing filters in a digital receiver. > > Andy. I was at the Kempton park rally yesterday. Syon Trading had the 2 material toroids in the following: 20 25 30 37 + the usual larger sizes up to 2 inches. For the smaller sizes the 1 off cost is about 35p each. 73 David << File: ATT00000.htm >> From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29328 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 13:03:15 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 13:03:15 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 16751 invoked by uid 10001); 28 Apr 2003 12:56:35 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 12:56:35 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19A895-0007CO-9e for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 13:54:11 +0100 Received: from [152.163.225.98] (helo=imo-r02.mx.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19A88w-0007C2-QE for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 13:54:02 +0100 Received: from G0MRF@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id l.183.1a26005a (3699) for ; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 08:53:27 -0400 (EDT) From: G0MRF@aol.com Message-ID: <183.1a26005a.2bde7e46@aol.com> Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 08:53:26 EDT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 10512 Subject: Re: LF: Amidon Cores (in the UK) Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.0 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,HTML_10_20,HTML_MESSAGE, MIME_LONG_LINE_QP,NO_REAL_NAME,QUOTE_TWICE_1version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit In a message dated 4/25/03 8:52:54 AM GMT Daylight Time, g4jnt@thersgb.net writes:



Tnx to all who replied on this subject.  BFI seem to be the preferred UK
supplier for micrometals.  I actually need some of the smallest cores T20-2 or
similar for a bank of sixteen 11th order elliptic filters for multiple anti
aliassing filters in a digital receiver.



Andy.

I was at the Kempton park rally yesterday.

Syon Trading had the 2 material toroids in the following:    20  25  30  37   + the usual larger sizes up to 2 inches. For the smaller sizes the 1 off cost is about 35p each.

73

David From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24937 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 12:01:48 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 12:01:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 24919 invoked by uid 10001); 28 Apr 2003 12:01:48 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 12:01:48 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19A7GO-0006od-6Q for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 12:57:40 +0100 Received: from [193.212.240.200] (helo=virus-out.ttyl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19A7GI-0006ln-2t for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 12:57:34 +0100 Received: from [134.47.162.90] by virusscan.telenor.no with ESMTP for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 13:56:52 +0200 Received: from tns-fbu-22-213.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.162.191]) by tns-fbu-22-208.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Mon, 28 Apr 2003 13:56:48 +0200 Received: from tns-fbu-2e-003.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.164.201]) by tns-fbu-22-213.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Mon, 28 Apr 2003 13:56:48 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 13:56:48 +0200 Message-ID: <2D280BB697C7EE4C979C5C89925418EF1BF5D3@TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no> Thread-Topic: LF: RE: RE: Re: RX-LOOP Thread-Index: AcMNcq07Mbg/XobmQZawNJ9RlXhO3wAAFhvw From: jan-martin.noding@telenor.com To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Apr 2003 11:56:48.0844 (UTC) FILETIME=[3FC4C8C0:01C30D7D] MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: RE: LF: RE: RE: Re: RX-LOOP Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.0 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,NO_REAL_NAME,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Not really, I forgot about it when I mounted the frame antenna, so it may not be much problems at my QTH in suburban area, but I experienced some noise problems when the active antenna was mounted just above the roof. Mounted it further up above the roof and added a ferrite choke type balun - hidden just under the side of the roof. And didn't find it to be much noise problems any more. It is aluminium type roof plates. So it is very difficult to say whether it has improved or how much effect it really has. As long as I haven't experienced any particular noise it is all based on guesswork and impossible to figure out what and where the improvement could be done. I am familiar with EMC - or say - balance problems - from situations at work, when solving problems with noise tansients on 2MB PCM systems on long telephone lines. 73, Jan-Martin --- J M Nøding, Datakvalitet, TTS, Kristiansand http://home.online.no/~la8ak/ Telefon 0047-380-52660, 9077-7126 (QTH: 0047-380-87178) -----Original Message----- From: Jay Rusgrove [mailto:advancedreceiver@snet.net] Sent: 28. april 2003 12:35 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: RE: RE: Re: RX-LOOP Jan-Martin Have you found that it makes any difference where the core is placed along the transmission line? Jay Rusgrove, W1VD jan-martin.noding@telenor.com wrote: > Right, > > but you may also use a balun. See RSGB book about EMC (or TVI ...suppose mine is quite old..) and wind the coax cable 10 or more turns through a ferrite core with sufficiently high permeability. > > I use it for my active antenna, and it is of course mounted some distance above the roof. Since you don't need RG8/U type cable for LF it shouldn't be a problem to manage 10-20 turns through the toroid (provided you haven't installed the BNC connectors in the ends) > > 73, Jan-Martin, LA8AK > > http://home.online.no/~la8ak/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ashlock,William [mailto:William.Ashlock@bocedwards.com] > > Alan, all: > > >I suspect that you need to isolate the loop feed with a small transformer. > It is possible that > >the feed from the loop is acting as a wire aerial and is conducting TV RFI > and noises from the > >house *back to the loop*. > > Surprising how few understand the concept of the RFI actually going from the > receiver back to the antenna site. This applies to E-probe antennas as well. > The typical house/apartment is a mad jumble of LF RFI having both E and H > field components. The proper RF return for remote LF antennas is the ground > immediately under the antenna - not the safety (green wire) ground in the > shack that connects to the chassis of the receiver. The isolation > transformer installed in the coax lead-in offers the only way to sever these > totally different grounds. In severe cases one is needed both at the > receiver and at the antenna since a floating coax shield can pick up noise > before it leaves the vicinity of the shack. > > BTW, an isolation transformed can be as simple as two 15-turn windings of > #22 to #28 wire on a common 3/4"dia X 1" ferrite RFI bead found on computer > power cords, monitor cables, communications cables, etc. > > Bill A > > _____________________________________________________________________ > This e-mail has been scanned for viruses by the WorldCom Internet Managed Scanning Service - powered by MessageLabs. For further information visit http://www.worldcom.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27837 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 10:36:37 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 10:36:37 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 18053 invoked by uid 10001); 28 Apr 2003 10:36:36 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 10:36:36 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19A5yM-0006Da-0L for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 11:34:58 +0100 Received: from [24.153.64.115] (helo=smtp-out.comcast.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19A5yG-0006DA-TS for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 11:34:53 +0100 Received: from snet.net (12-209-21-79.client.attbi.com [12.209.21.79]) by mtaout02.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HE1008LFUK8N0@mtaout02.icomcast.net> for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 06:31:20 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 06:35:02 -0400 From: "Jay Rusgrove" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <3EAD03D6.36541070@snet.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en References: <2D280BB697C7EE4C979C5C89925418EFB05C1F@TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no> Subject: Re: LF: RE: RE: Re: RX-LOOP Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Jan-Martin Have you found that it makes any difference where the core is placed along the transmission line? Jay Rusgrove, W1VD jan-martin.noding@telenor.com wrote: > Right, > > but you may also use a balun. See RSGB book about EMC (or TVI ...suppose mine is quite old..) and wind the coax cable 10 or more turns through a ferrite core with sufficiently high permeability. > > I use it for my active antenna, and it is of course mounted some distance above the roof. Since you don't need RG8/U type cable for LF it shouldn't be a problem to manage 10-20 turns through the toroid (provided you haven't installed the BNC connectors in the ends) > > 73, Jan-Martin, LA8AK > > http://home.online.no/~la8ak/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ashlock,William [mailto:William.Ashlock@bocedwards.com] > > Alan, all: > > >I suspect that you need to isolate the loop feed with a small transformer. > It is possible that > >the feed from the loop is acting as a wire aerial and is conducting TV RFI > and noises from the > >house *back to the loop*. > > Surprising how few understand the concept of the RFI actually going from the > receiver back to the antenna site. This applies to E-probe antennas as well. > The typical house/apartment is a mad jumble of LF RFI having both E and H > field components. The proper RF return for remote LF antennas is the ground > immediately under the antenna - not the safety (green wire) ground in the > shack that connects to the chassis of the receiver. The isolation > transformer installed in the coax lead-in offers the only way to sever these > totally different grounds. In severe cases one is needed both at the > receiver and at the antenna since a floating coax shield can pick up noise > before it leaves the vicinity of the shack. > > BTW, an isolation transformed can be as simple as two 15-turn windings of > #22 to #28 wire on a common 3/4"dia X 1" ferrite RFI bead found on computer > power cords, monitor cables, communications cables, etc. > > Bill A > > _____________________________________________________________________ > This e-mail has been scanned for viruses by the WorldCom Internet Managed Scanning Service - powered by MessageLabs. For further information visit http://www.worldcom.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1404 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 08:36:32 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 08:36:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 638 invoked by uid 10001); 28 Apr 2003 08:29:51 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 08:29:51 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19A3zX-0005KQ-W7 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 09:28:03 +0100 Received: from [193.212.240.200] (helo=virus-out.ttyl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19A3zT-0005K5-60 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 09:27:59 +0100 Received: from [134.47.162.90] by virus-in.online.no with ESMTP for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 10:27:16 +0200 Received: from tns-fbu-22-212.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.162.91]) by tns-fbu-22-208.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Mon, 28 Apr 2003 10:27:15 +0200 Received: from tns-fbu-2e-003.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.164.201]) by tns-fbu-22-212.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Mon, 28 Apr 2003 10:26:15 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 10:27:15 +0200 Message-ID: <2D280BB697C7EE4C979C5C89925418EFB05C1F@TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no> Thread-Topic: RE: Re: RX-LOOP Thread-Index: AcMNPBvVGzodzr4mTcqWdA/QjNzFfwAIrNEA From: jan-martin.noding@telenor.com To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Apr 2003 08:26:15.0101 (UTC) FILETIME=[D57896D0:01C30D5F] MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: RE: RE: Re: RX-LOOP Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.7 required=5.0tests=NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Right, but you may also use a balun. See RSGB book about EMC (or TVI ...suppose mine is quite old..) and wind the coax cable 10 or more turns through a ferrite core with sufficiently high permeability. I use it for my active antenna, and it is of course mounted some distance above the roof. Since you don't need RG8/U type cable for LF it shouldn't be a problem to manage 10-20 turns through the toroid (provided you haven't installed the BNC connectors in the ends) 73, Jan-Martin, LA8AK http://home.online.no/~la8ak/ -----Original Message----- From: Ashlock,William [mailto:William.Ashlock@bocedwards.com] Alan, all: >I suspect that you need to isolate the loop feed with a small transformer. It is possible that >the feed from the loop is acting as a wire aerial and is conducting TV RFI and noises from the >house *back to the loop*. Surprising how few understand the concept of the RFI actually going from the receiver back to the antenna site. This applies to E-probe antennas as well. The typical house/apartment is a mad jumble of LF RFI having both E and H field components. The proper RF return for remote LF antennas is the ground immediately under the antenna - not the safety (green wire) ground in the shack that connects to the chassis of the receiver. The isolation transformer installed in the coax lead-in offers the only way to sever these totally different grounds. In severe cases one is needed both at the receiver and at the antenna since a floating coax shield can pick up noise before it leaves the vicinity of the shack. BTW, an isolation transformed can be as simple as two 15-turn windings of #22 to #28 wire on a common 3/4"dia X 1" ferrite RFI bead found on computer power cords, monitor cables, communications cables, etc. Bill A _____________________________________________________________________ This e-mail has been scanned for viruses by the WorldCom Internet Managed Scanning Service - powered by MessageLabs. For further information visit http://www.worldcom.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8026 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 08:27:20 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 08:27:20 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 19965 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 08:27:23 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 08:27:23 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19A3y1-0005Fw-9f for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 09:26:29 +0100 Received: from [192.5.29.49] (helo=relay.dstl.gov.uk) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 19A3xw-0005Fm-EJ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 09:26:24 +0100 Received: (qmail 27777 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 09:26:21 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO warlock.dstl.gov.uk) (192.5.29.10) by relay.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 09:26:21 +0100 Message-ID: <7D653C9C42F5D411A27C00508BF8803D01A9F1B0@mail.dstl.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: "Tottingham Brian J" , Linda_Holtby@ntlworld.com Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 09:24:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Subject: LF: RE: A conumdrum for the weekend - Image Cancelling Mixer. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false We thrashed out this solution on Friday afternoon, it explains why the maths appears to fail but the concept doesn't. Judging by relies on Friday evening and Saturday, several readers of the reflecter were getting there, but a lot of red-herrings were also appearing. The ambiguity arises here. In the second configuration (repeated below), the one that appears to fail in the way I described it, the output from the top mixer is SIN(A+B) - SIN(A-B) But we know that SIN(-X) = -SIN(X)since the Sine function has odd order symmetry, so the mixer output can justifiably be written as : SIN(A+B) + SIN(B-A) Then after the phase shift we have COS(A+B) + COS(B-A) Now, we also know that COS(-X) = COS(X) The function has Even symmetry, so it is now perfectly valid to write the output as : COS(A+B) + COS(A-B) Which, by addition or subtraction with the other path, cancels one of the sidebands while reinforcing the other as expected. For once it is the maths that causes the problem, not the concept. There were quite a few comments from readers along the lines of "broadbancd phase shifters" to cope with both sideband frequencies. But this wasn't really an issue. In some cases it is the input frequency sideband that is being cancelled - which needs a bit of mental agility to think though these two designs backwards, noting the two input terms that give the same output term in any mixer. Where image cancelling mixers are used in practice these days is in digital receivers where the IF is at a very low frequency, like baseband to DC. The 90 degree phase shift is then just an inherent part of the DSP process, although diagrams showing how the systems work often show a physical phase shift at this point. In real analogue hardware, such as the radar receiver block diagram that generated this problem, the phase shifters are usually placed in the most convenient position - usually where the relative bandwidth is at its narrowest such as the RF and LO ports on a downconverting superhet receiver, with the IF output being summed. BUT on the matching transmitter just reversing the signal flow, the non-phase shifted channel now becomes one of the inputs, mixed with the LO to form the RF output signal. So the two configurations in the condrum become receiver and transmitter respectively in a classic single conversion design. In the radar receiver however, a different situation arises. As it has to cover a wide tuneable Rf input range of 6 - 18GHz a broadband phase shifter here is impractical. The tuneable must LO has to have one, and this is just a case of designing the LO with a bank of suitable phase shifters. The IF at a VHF frequency is a few tens of MHz wide and a 90 degree phase shift network at these freqeuncies is straightforward. Andy G4JNT ========================================================= NOW, if we move the second 90 degree phase shift to the output of the mixers (the IF) rather than the LO, as shown below, intuition and common sense tells us it should still work since the mixing process is fully reversible and actual direction of signal flow is irrelevant. Furthermore, many real designs of SSB exciters and receivers prove this really does work in practice. ---90---X----90----| Signal -| | +/- IF ------------X------| | | | - | | Local Osc. But here is the conumdrum : Keeping the same terminology of Signal = SIN(A), and LO = SIN(B), the inputs to the top mixer become COS(A) . SIN(B) and the output given by the product rule : COS(A).SIN(B) = SIN(A+B) - SIN(A-B) After the output 90 degree phase shift, the SIN terms beocome COS so we have, in the top output leg : COS(A+B) - COS(A-B) The output from the bottom mixer is, as before : SIN(A).SIN(B) = COS(A-B) - COS(A+B) Which is the SAME as in the top leg, and will either cancel or reinforce both sidebands. So it doesn't appear to work at all ! Moving the output 90 degree shift to the lower leg still fails to cancel one sideband only. So where is the conundrum? Both forms of image cancelling mixer do indeed work, and the trig identities can be taken from any reference. ================================================== PS. I do have one rather weak explanation, but it doesn't give that warm cozy feeling expected when theory falls into place! Andy "This e-mail is intended for the recipient only. If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, disclose, distribute, copy, print, or rely upon this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, please notify the author by replying to this e-mail." "Recipients should note that all e-mail traffic on MOD systems is subject to monitoring and auditing." From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19150 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 08:19:11 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 08:19:11 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: (qmail 5266 invoked by uid 10001); 28 Apr 2003 08:19:11 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 08:19:10 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19A3ps-0005AT-Lr for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 09:18:04 +0100 Received: from [134.58.240.45] (helo=thumbler.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19A3pk-0005AK-Gx for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 09:17:56 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by thumbler.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0531413772F for ; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 10:17:26 +0200 (CEST) Received: from octavianus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (octavianus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.240.71]) by thumbler.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 756E01379D2 for ; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 10:17:25 +0200 (CEST) Received: from dell-rik.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (pc-10-33-165-177.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [10.33.165.177]) by octavianus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 356B4AEA69 for ; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 10:17:25 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030428101120.040bfe60@u0019445.kuleuven.be> X-Sender: u0019445@u0019445.kuleuven.be X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 10:18:52 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" In-reply-to: <005901c30bfe$836774e0$55d4e150@RSGB613192> References: <146.fffb845.2bdb149c@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: by KULeuven Antivirus Cluster Subject: LF: QRS v4.01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.9 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false The new version of QRS (v4.01) can now be downloaded from : http://www.qsl.net/on7yd/software.htm Main change to the precious version (v3.17) is that it now fully supports the LPT port under WinNT based operating systems (WinNT, Win2000, WinXp etc.). As a result it won't run on Win3 anymore, therefor version 3.17 is also downloadable from the same site. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16737 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 07:31:22 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 07:31:22 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 13682 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 07:24:46 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 07:24:46 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19A2zP-0004pb-B3 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 08:23:51 +0100 Received: from [138.32.33.140] (helo=mailman2.ppco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19A2zA-0004pN-Sh for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 08:23:37 +0100 Received: from bvlw2k131.ppco.com (trend1.ppco.com [138.32.31.131]) by mailman2.ppco.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with SMTP id h3S7NZlw015350 for ; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 02:23:35 -0500 Received: from 138.32.31.56 by bvlw2k131.ppco.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Mon, 28 Apr 2003 02:23:35 -0500 Received: from bvlnotes07.ppco.com (bvlnotes07.ppco.com [138.32.54.38]) by mail1.ppco.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3S7NYu27070 for ; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 02:23:34 -0500 (CDT) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.8 June 18, 2001 Message-ID: From: "Laurence J Howell" Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2003 23:23:32 -0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BVLNOTES07/CIT/Phillips Petroleum/us(Release 5.0.7 |March 21, 2001) at 04/28/2003 02:23:34 AM MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: Re: 136 khz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Vlad sorry to hear of your problems - you'll be glad to hear power loss not only happens on your side but it hit me too this weekend - An eagle decided to change its modus operandi into a low value resistor across an EHT 33Kv overhead line and overheated a bit. BBQ and red wine is a (very) good back to 136Khz operation- I use the same here. Good luck for next weekend Laurence KL1X - Anchorage .....ohh the lights have just come back on again.... http://www.kl1x.com " Sorry, dear OM's, but my start this year on 136kc was fully unsucces... Power company disconnect all electricity from my summer residence... Sorry one more time... Only was barbequi and red wine with my wife and my friend RZ3QD. We celebreted our orthodox Easter... Nothing on air.. 73! Will try nex time at next week end . Vlad. RX3QFM. ----- Original Message ---- From: hamilton mal To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 12:09 AM Subject: LF: 136 khz In spite of the rain static(qrn) all day there was plenty of acty. (Sunday - 27/4/03) YU7DP, I5TGC,IK5ZPV,OK5DTN, DL3JMM, RZ6BN and PA0BWL. No sign of RX3QFM 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15540 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 06:03:34 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 06:03:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 26756 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 06:03:37 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 06:03:36 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19A1io-0004UX-Rt for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 07:02:38 +0100 Received: from [80.82.32.9] (helo=serv1.vsi.ru) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19A1ik-0004UO-2Z for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 07:02:34 +0100 Received: from rx3qfm (656.asx.dial.vsi.ru [80.82.39.144]) by serv1.vsi.ru (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.7) with SMTP id h3S61pP20793 for ; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 10:01:51 +0400 (MSD) Message-ID: <007a01c30d4b$b27b9e20$67265250@sckr.com> From: "Vladimir Shuplyakov" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30cf8$f4ce7660$c7e4fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 10:01:26 +0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: 136 khz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.7 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Sorry, dear OM's, but my start this year on 136kc was fully unsucces... Power company disconnect all electricity from my summer residence... Sorry one more time... Only was barbequi and red wine with my wife and my friend RZ3QD. We celebreted our orthodox Easter... Nothing on air.. 73! Will try nex time at next week end . Vlad. RX3QFM. ----- Original Message ----- From: hamilton mal To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 12:09 AM Subject: LF: 136 khz In spite of the rain static(qrn) all day there was plenty of acty. (Sunday - 27/4/03) YU7DP, I5TGC,IK5ZPV,OK5DTN, DL3JMM, RZ6BN and PA0BWL. No sign of RX3QFM 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22463 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 05:52:19 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 05:52:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 14647 invoked by uid 10001); 28 Apr 2003 05:52:18 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 05:52:18 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19A1Y9-0004NU-CJ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 06:51:37 +0100 Received: from [212.227.126.186] (helo=moutng.kundenserver.de) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19A1Y2-0004NL-9O for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 06:51:30 +0100 Received: from [212.227.126.206] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19A1Y1-00073W-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 07:51:29 +0200 Received: from [62.156.21.65] (helo=W1KW) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 19A1Y1-00021v-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 07:51:29 +0200 Message-ID: <000401c30d4a$0fca19f0$fe78a8c0@W1KW> From: "Holger 'Geri', DK8KW" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 07:50:22 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Wanted: PA, either finished or halfway build Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hello LF Group, after again one of my FETs in my PA failed yesterday during a 10s QRSS QSO with RN6BN (thermal problems, the PA is simply build into a housing that is too small, I believe) I wanted to ask if someone of you has a 500 to 1000 Watt PA for sale (I simply don't have the time to build a new one from scratch, tried to plan that many times in the past but never really achieved something). What I am looking for is a 1 kW (or a bit less) non-linear PA for CW and QRSS to be able to get up to the 1 W ERP that I hold a special license for. Maybe some of you has an old one available that you used before you got hold of those DECCA PAs, or I would also like to get hold of a half-finished project that I can finish. Alternative would of course be a DECCA PA but I am sure those are all in the hands of the active LF hams. Any offer is welcome, best 73 es tnx Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) ... and I will repair the 350 Watt PA tonight and call RN6BN again, I don't give up! ;-) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5461 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 04:06:48 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 04:06:48 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: (qmail 1370 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 04:06:40 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 04:06:40 -0000 X-SQ: A X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199zqX-0003xF-Gd for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 05:02:29 +0100 Received: from [212.125.75.12] (helo=mail4.messagelabs.com) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 199zqS-0003x6-LR for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 05:02:24 +0100 X-VirusChecked: Checked X-Env-Sender: William.Ashlock@bocedwards.com X-Msg-Ref: server-23.tower-4.messagelabs.com!1051502542!3058 Received: (qmail 905 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2003 04:02:22 -0000 Received: from ukfw1.ge.boc.com (193.131.2.157) by server-23.tower-4.messagelabs.com with SMTP; 28 Apr 2003 04:02:22 -0000 Received: from ([160.100.160.136]) by ukfw1.ge.boc.com; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 05:03:24 +0100 (BST) Received: from exc_wil04.edwards.boc.com ([162.118.144.226]) by exc_cra03.edwards.boc.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id J31XBZ04; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 05:07:21 +0100 Received: by EXC_WIL04 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <2RDJSZK6>; Mon, 28 Apr 2003 00:03:07 -0400 Message-ID: From: "Ashlock,William" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 00:03:05 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Subject: LF: RE: Re: RX-LOOP Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Alan, all: >I suspect that you need to isolate the loop feed with a small transformer. It is possible that >the feed from the loop is acting as a wire aerial and is conducting TV RFI and noises from the >house *back to the loop*. Surprising how few understand the concept of the RFI actually going from the receiver back to the antenna site. This applies to E-probe antennas as well. The typical house/apartment is a mad jumble of LF RFI having both E and H field components. The proper RF return for remote LF antennas is the ground immediately under the antenna - not the safety (green wire) ground in the shack that connects to the chassis of the receiver. The isolation transformer installed in the coax lead-in offers the only way to sever these totally different grounds. In severe cases one is needed both at the receiver and at the antenna since a floating coax shield can pick up noise before it leaves the vicinity of the shack. BTW, an isolation transformed can be as simple as two 15-turn windings of #22 to #28 wire on a common 3/4"dia X 1" ferrite RFI bead found on computer power cords, monitor cables, communications cables, etc. Bill A _____________________________________________________________________ This e-mail has been scanned for viruses by the WorldCom Internet Managed Scanning Service - powered by MessageLabs. For further information visit http://www.worldcom.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24302 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 21:11:02 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 21:11:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 20545 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 21:11:06 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 21:11:05 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199tPb-0002Mz-BX for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 22:10:15 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199tPW-0002Mq-MB for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 22:10:10 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.199]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030427211009.FMB1127.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 22:10:09 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c30cf8$f4ce7660$c7e4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2003 21:09:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 136 khz Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0tests=HTML_50_60,HTML_MESSAGE,UPPERCASE_25_50version=2.53 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
In spite of the rain static(qrn) all day there was plenty of acty. (Sunday - 27/4/03)
YU7DP, I5TGC,IK5ZPV,OK5DTN, DL3JMM, RZ6BN and PA0BWL.
No sign of RX3QFM
73 de Mal/G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24127 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 20:33:59 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 20:33:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 22938 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 20:34:02 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 20:34:02 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199spe-0002C7-53 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 21:33:06 +0100 Received: from [63.171.43.2] (helo=ns2.genesis-technology.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199spZ-0002By-Cm for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 21:33:01 +0100 Received: from we0h ([65.165.20.192]) by ns2.genesis-technology.com (8.10.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id h3RKWu619801 for ; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 15:32:56 -0500 From: "WE0H" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2003 15:33:49 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) In-reply-to: <006b01c30cef$f8846890$ee9bfea9@oben> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by ns2.genesis-technology.com id h3RKWu619801 Subject: LF: RE: Re: RE: RX-LOOP Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.1 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Peter, It is 4.5 meters to our house and 4.5 meters to the neighbors house. The neighbor has lots of medical equipment running for a disabled girl. It is very surprisingly quiet for being so close to all the houses. We have those gas discharge street lights in our neighborhood also. Yes light dimmers can be a problem but those affect every kind of antenna I have tried here so I wait for them to go to sleep. Hi Hi... Mike>WE0H http://www.we0h.us/lf -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of dj9dw Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2003 2:05 PM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: RE: RX-LOOP fb, Mike, what about the distance to the next neighbour = noisesource? "Neonlamps" on the street? Here in Germany, we are sitting on each other, that might be the problem. I´m thinking of a noisecanceller and dreaming of a qitting DCF. So vy 73 de Peter, dj9dw. ----- Original Message ----- From: "WE0H" To: Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2003 4:07 PM Subject: LF: RE: RX-LOOP I use a 15-meter square loop for receive and it is very quiet on the noise verses the 15-meter flattop vertical. Mike>WE0H http://www.we0h.us/lf -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of dj9dw Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2003 3:07 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RX-LOOP Hello LF-Group, as a beginner, I built the loop that I found in df8zr´s homepage. 2m dia, Q=200 seperate grounding 10m off the shack. I did not receive any statione outside Germany. Too much noise by mains, TV etc. A small marconi, 10m vertical and 2x10m on top, although fenced in by surroundings, works satisfactory. I rx G3LDO barely aural to give one example. Facit: there are locations where a loop is pretty qualified to detect noisesources - and nothing else. vy 73 dj9dw, jo40le, nr Frankfurt, Peter. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21947 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 19:12:24 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 19:12:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 9999 invoked by uid 10001); 27 Apr 2003 19:05:44 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 19:05:44 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199rSK-0001q6-Q0 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 20:04:56 +0100 Received: from [194.25.134.84] (helo=mailout09.sul.t-online.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199rSF-0001px-SG for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 20:04:51 +0100 Received: from fwd01.sul.t-online.de by mailout09.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 199rSF-00012l-0F; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 21:04:51 +0200 Received: from oben (520036610031-0001@[217.224.27.120]) by fwd01.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 199rRz-087lb6C; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 21:04:35 +0200 Message-ID: <006b01c30cef$f8846890$ee9bfea9@oben> From: "dj9dw" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2003 21:05:29 +0200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: 520036610031-0001@t-dialin.net Subject: LF: Re: RE: RX-LOOP X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.7 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit fb, Mike, what about the distance to the next neighbour = noisesource? "Neonlamps" on the street? Here in Germany, we are sitting on each other, that might be the problem. I´m thinking of a noisecanceller and dreaming of a qitting DCF. So vy 73 de Peter, dj9dw. ----- Original Message ----- From: "WE0H" To: Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2003 4:07 PM Subject: LF: RE: RX-LOOP I use a 15-meter square loop for receive and it is very quiet on the noise verses the 15-meter flattop vertical. Mike>WE0H http://www.we0h.us/lf -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of dj9dw Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2003 3:07 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RX-LOOP Hello LF-Group, as a beginner, I built the loop that I found in df8zr´s homepage. 2m dia, Q=200 seperate grounding 10m off the shack. I did not receive any statione outside Germany. Too much noise by mains, TV etc. A small marconi, 10m vertical and 2x10m on top, although fenced in by surroundings, works satisfactory. I rx G3LDO barely aural to give one example. Facit: there are locations where a loop is pretty qualified to detect noisesources - and nothing else. vy 73 dj9dw, jo40le, nr Frankfurt, Peter. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9028 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 17:33:47 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 17:33:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 18146 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 17:33:50 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 17:33:49 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199q10-0001Tt-EE for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 18:32:38 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.42] (helo=mta2-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199q0v-0001Tk-9d for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 18:32:33 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.232.108]) by mta2-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030427173231.NYOR1184.mta2-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 18:32:31 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c30cda$8d049f00$6ce8fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30b25$e734d280$2ee8fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2003 17:31:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Decca Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, April 25, 2003 1:25 PM
Subject: LF: Decca

Hi All
Does anyone have any info on Racal Decca RX MK53 G. This rx has GPS included with an antenna socket on the back for this purpose. It is in very good condx and maybe could be modified as a LF rx. Another version available is the RX MK53 two  channel and no GPS. There are also some new boxed cct boards for these receivers available.
 
 
Tnx to those that replied with lots of tech info, but what are the connections at the back on the 3 pin power socket. I assume 12 -40 volts DC but what is the pin configuration. The pins are labelled A , B and C and there is no indication which goes to what voltage.
 
I also have a portable radar device KODEN MD3604. It does not have the antenna. Does anyone have any info. I now have enought marine equipment to fit out several Yachts !! especally the Decca MK 53 g ( GPS versions)
de Mal/G3KEV
 
Tnx de Mal/G3KEV
 
 
Any info or details would be appreciated.
de Mal/G3KEV
 
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3368 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 14:06:59 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 14:06:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 14533 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 14:07:03 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 14:07:03 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199mmw-0000du-VN for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 15:05:54 +0100 Received: from [63.171.43.2] (helo=ns2.genesis-technology.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199mms-0000dl-3D for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 15:05:50 +0100 Received: from we0h ([65.165.20.192]) by ns2.genesis-technology.com (8.10.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id h3RE5l631643 for ; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 09:05:47 -0500 From: "WE0H" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2003 09:07:21 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <001201c30c94$0968c4a0$ee9bfea9@oben> X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by ns2.genesis-technology.com id h3RE5l631643 Subject: LF: RE: RX-LOOP Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-11.0 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE, SUBJ_ALL_CAPSversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false I use a 15-meter square loop for receive and it is very quiet on the noise verses the 15-meter flattop vertical. Mike>WE0H http://www.we0h.us/lf -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of dj9dw Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2003 3:07 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RX-LOOP Hello LF-Group, as a beginner, I built the loop that I found in df8zr´s homepage. 2m dia, Q=200 seperate grounding 10m off the shack. I did not receive any statione outside Germany. Too much noise by mains, TV etc. A small marconi, 10m vertical and 2x10m on top, although fenced in by surroundings, works satisfactory. I rx G3LDO barely aural to give one example. Facit: there are locations where a loop is pretty qualified to detect noisesources - and nothing else. vy 73 dj9dw, jo40le, nr Frankfurt, Peter. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19460 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 09:32:59 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 09:32:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 24325 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 09:33:02 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 09:33:02 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199iVD-0008CY-R7 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 10:31:19 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.176] (helo=protactinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199iV4-0008CP-U1 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 10:31:10 +0100 Received: from host213-122-16-8.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([213.122.16.8] helo=Main) by protactinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 199iV3-0006Wp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 10:31:10 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c30c9f$baadedc0$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001201c30c94$0968c4a0$ee9bfea9@oben> Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2003 10:30:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: RX-LOOP Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.9 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Peter this is not unusual!! I suspect that you need to isolate the loop feed with a small transformer. It is possible that the feed from the loop is acting as a wire aerial and is conducting TV RFI and noises from the house back to the loop. One quick check is to see how sharp the null on the loop is when it is turned. If all the signal is being picked up by the loop the null will be sharp and symmetrical. irun a 1.2 m loop with about 16t, which will receive anyting I can hear on the 60m top Marconi at 12m high.....even with the loop indoors, but I must then be carefull to switch off interference sources. When using the loop, you must also disconnect or at least detune the Marconi, because it will couple signals from all directions into the loop. 73 de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com http://www.alan.melia.btinternet.co.uk ----- Original Message ----- From: "dj9dw" To: Sent: 27 April 2003 09:07 Subject: LF: RX-LOOP > Hello LF-Group, > as a beginner, I built the loop that I found in df8zr´s homepage. 2m dia, > Q=200 seperate grounding 10m off the shack. I did not receive any statione > outside Germany. Too much noise by mains, TV etc. A small marconi, 10m > vertical and 2x10m on top, although fenced in by surroundings, works > satisfactory. I rx G3LDO barely aural to give one example. Facit: there are > locations where a loop is pretty qualified to detect noisesources - and > nothing else. > vy 73 dj9dw, jo40le, nr Frankfurt, Peter. > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14588 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 08:08:38 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 08:08:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 13184 invoked from network); 27 Apr 2003 08:08:42 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 27 Apr 2003 08:08:42 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199hAU-0007sO-4J for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 09:05:50 +0100 Received: from [194.25.134.20] (helo=mailout08.sul.t-online.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199hAJ-0007sF-5R for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 09:05:39 +0100 Received: from fwd11.sul.t-online.de by mailout08.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 199hAI-0007qt-01; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 10:05:38 +0200 Received: from oben (520036610031-0001@[217.226.121.15]) by fwd11.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 199hAF-1V7nuKC; Sun, 27 Apr 2003 10:05:35 +0200 Message-ID: <001201c30c94$0968c4a0$ee9bfea9@oben> From: "dj9dw" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2003 10:07:24 +0200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: 520036610031-0001@t-dialin.net Subject: LF: RX-LOOP X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hello LF-Group, as a beginner, I built the loop that I found in df8zr´s homepage. 2m dia, Q=200 seperate grounding 10m off the shack. I did not receive any statione outside Germany. Too much noise by mains, TV etc. A small marconi, 10m vertical and 2x10m on top, although fenced in by surroundings, works satisfactory. I rx G3LDO barely aural to give one example. Facit: there are locations where a loop is pretty qualified to detect noisesources - and nothing else. vy 73 dj9dw, jo40le, nr Frankfurt, Peter. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11044 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 21:42:20 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 21:42:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 20651 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 21:42:23 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 21:42:23 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199XPV-0004f6-W7 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 22:40:41 +0100 Received: from [63.171.43.2] (helo=ns2.genesis-technology.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199XPR-0004ex-8X for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 22:40:37 +0100 Received: from we0h ([65.165.20.192]) by ns2.genesis-technology.com (8.10.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id h3QLeW610178 for ; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 16:40:32 -0500 From: "WE0H" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 16:42:03 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: <20030426174352.29C2F74AF1@smtp5.wanadoo.nl> Importance: Normal Subject: RE: LF: loop v vertical Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.1 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false He will come around yet. I run a vertical and a loop also. Both have their good points and bad points. Mike>WE0H http://www.we0h.us/lf -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of K.Versteeg Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 1:44 PM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: loop v vertical At Apr-26-2003 05:12:00 PM, you wrote: There are various factors to consider before making defined statements ......... >73 de G3KEV Mal Never thought i would see this line ! 73 Ko, NL9222 From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26105 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 18:58:09 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 18:58:09 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 22494 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 18:31:33 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 18:31:33 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199URr-00044S-Jb for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 19:30:55 +0100 Received: from [194.217.242.85] (helo=anchor-post-35.mail.demon.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199URn-00044J-0f for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 19:30:51 +0100 Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by anchor-post-35.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 199URl-0007kL-0Z for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 19:30:50 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 19:29:49 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U Subject: LF: IEE HF Radio Conference X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false I notice there are some interesting looking papers relevant to LFers being given at the IEE HF Radio Conference at Bath in June by G3LHZ (Loops), M0BMU (Small LF Antennas) and G2AJV (Toroidal Antennas) 73, Tom G3OLB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31941 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 18:17:18 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 18:17:18 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 23791 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 18:10:41 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 18:10:41 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199U7e-0003vs-Vs for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 19:10:02 +0100 Received: from [213.218.75.231] (helo=smtp02.freeler.nl) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199U7Z-0003ve-Lf for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 19:09:57 +0100 Received: (qmail 16575 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 18:09:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO w8k3f0.freeler.nl) ([62.21.145.67]) (envelope-sender ) by smtp02.freeler.nl (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 26 Apr 2003 18:09:26 -0000 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030426195642.02942ba0@POP3.freeler.nl> X-Sender: FRE0000086604@POP3.freeler.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 20:08:21 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Dick Rollema" In-reply-to: <000701c30b58$d8bd0640$36d1fc3e@ian> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: The Mystery - "Eve" Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-8.5 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,HTML_00_10,HTML_MESSAGE,IN_REP_TOversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Dear Ian,

After I obtained a battery fed selective level meter (W & G SPM-12) I prefer to use that for FS measurements together with a single turn untuned loop of 1 x 1 square metre because there is no need for calibration. There is a simple relation between FS and voltage induced in the loop.  I don't know whether you possess a suitable battery fed SLM but if you do it is far less work to construct the loop than my portable FS meter plus Helmholtz coils for calibration. 
Instead  of the SLM you could use a battery fed receiver with an S-meter.
At  home you could translate the S-meter readings into voltages using a signal generator.

73, Dick, PAoSE

At 19:27 25-4-03 +0100, you wrote:
I have a pressing desire to establish my E.R.P. and to that end am setting
about building Dicks Field Strength Meter. As my tame finder/supplier of
bits is off cruising the Caribbean and increasing his waist line, can anyone
suggest a suitable source of the SA6128 chip and BB104 varicaps - or their
equivalents?

Todays teaser; why "Eve" in the subject heading?

Well, according to the Scriptures, Eve was a "side" issue for Adam.

Boom boom!

Ian MI0AYZ
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21000 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 17:44:45 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 17:44:45 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 9272 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 17:44:48 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 17:44:47 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199TiR-0003mw-12 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 18:43:59 +0100 Received: from [194.134.35.176] (helo=smtp5.wanadoo.nl) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199TiM-0003mf-Bz for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 18:43:54 +0100 Received: from savage (unknown [62.234.210.234]) by smtp5.wanadoo.nl (Postfix) with SMTP id 29C2F74AF1 for ; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 19:43:52 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 19:44:22 +0100 From: "K.Versteeg" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: FoxMail 2.1 [en] MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <20030426174352.29C2F74AF1@smtp5.wanadoo.nl> Subject: Re: LF: loop v vertical Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false At Apr-26-2003 05:12:00 PM, you wrote: There are various factors to consider before making defined statements ......... >73 de G3KEV Mal Never thought i would see this line ! 73 Ko, NL9222 From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18461 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 17:17:12 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 17:17:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 19306 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 17:17:16 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 17:17:15 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199THu-0003dQ-89 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 18:16:34 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.42] (helo=mta2-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199THm-0003dH-5T for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 18:16:26 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.208.159]) by mta2-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030426171625.RXIN1184.mta2-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 18:16:25 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c30c0f$21ba3500$9fd0fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 17:12:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: loop v vertical Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
There is a lot of QRN/rain static about today and the vertical is a lot better than the loop. I suppose its to do with the direction of the rain front. So a loop is not necessarily a quiet antenna and better than a vertical. There are various factors to consider before making defined statements and you need both antennas available at the same time to make  comparisons.
73 de  G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3112 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 16:33:14 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 16:33:14 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 15782 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 16:33:17 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 16:33:17 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199SYG-0003Q5-Ho for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 17:29:24 +0100 Received: from [152.163.225.98] (helo=imo-r02.mx.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199SYB-0003Pw-RF for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 17:29:19 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id l.79.fa31753 (3310) for ; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 12:28:43 -0400 (EDT) From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <79.fa31753.2bdc0dba@aol.com> Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 12:28:42 EDT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 120 Subject: Re: LF: censure Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false In a message dated 4/25/03 4:45:48 AM Eastern Daylight Time, valerio@dii.unisi.it writes: << just to say that after my forward of Ted's revision of Ohm's law i did not receive more mail from yahoo eh-forum. >> Heretics, infidels, and non-believers always have a difficult life, Valerio. How will you ever be able to survive without seeing all the advertisements on those Yahoo forums? Fortunately, you can find sanctuary here. (smile) John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19854 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 14:25:36 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 14:25:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 25740 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 14:19:00 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 14:18:59 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199QUu-0002u7-ND for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 15:17:48 +0100 Received: from [212.1.130.143] (helo=smtp-1.visp.telinco.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199QUp-0002ty-Od for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 15:17:43 +0100 Received: from [80.225.212.85] (helo=RSGB613192) by smtp-1.visp.telinco.net with smtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 199QUo-00061Y-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 15:17:42 +0100 Message-ID: <005901c30bfe$836774e0$55d4e150@RSGB613192> From: "Andy Talbot" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <146.fffb845.2bdb149c@aol.com> Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 15:17:03 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: Conundrum - image cancelling mixer Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.5 required=5.0tests=HTML_10_20,HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
I think all three versions are functionally similar, and the cancelling of the input sideband is something that falls out of the maths.  If you consider the 90 degree phase shift to operate only at the freqeuncies you are interested in, then look at the signs of the two image responses ie.  IF = RF1- LO  and IF = LO - RF2 then the technique works just the same as visualising it backwards.  By then reversing teh signal flow you end up with my first solution.
 
After I posted the conundrum (spot my silly spelling mistake in the subject!) we had a long session on the whiteboard at (work with a mathematician along as well), and there is a reasonably straightforward answer as to why the maths appears to fail.  There is one fundamental property of the sin and cos functions which have to be remembered.   Wolf nearly got there.   I'll post our solution on Monday when I get back into work as it is still up on the board and will be easier to copy..
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, April 25, 2003 11:45 PM
Subject: Re: LF: Conundrum - image cancelling mixer

Dear Andy and LF group,

we had that very same discussion at work about a year ago... can the  multi-octave IF quadrature network not be replaced by a simple narrowband RF phase-shifter? No, it can't.

As you say, the first circuit with quadrature RF and LO drives will actually cancel one of the IF output frequencies, eg. the sum frequency, and deliver only the difference. But that is not what you normally want, because it does not differentiate between the two possible RF input frequencies, signal and image. With low IF, these are closely spaced and difficult to separate by a preselector filter.

Example: Direct conversion receiver for 14.2 MHz USB voice. Circuit Nr. 1 is not a true SSB RX, it will convert both 14199 and 14201 kHz to 1 kHz audio. It would however cancel the IF sums near 28.4 MHz, but this is much more easily done with even the most simple IF lowpass. - Circuit Nr.2 is right, it will accept 14201 and produce both 1 and 28401 from it, and it will reject any input at 14199 kHz.

For a transmitter, the same holds true. Circuit 1 would be insensitive at 28.4 MHz "audio", but not be able to split between RF outputs at USB and LSB.

There is a third variant with quadrature LO and IF which will also provide a true SSB mixer. This is advantageous if you need a large tuning range, as the LO is only a single frequency at a time, and digital LO-divider schemes can easily provide matched 90-degree outputs. Also, thanks to mixer saturation, amplitude balance is less critical.

73 de Markus, DF6NM
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23597 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 10:50:06 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 10:50:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 22263 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 10:49:52 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 10:49:52 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199NFC-0002Bp-V4 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 11:49:22 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.148] (helo=zinc) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199NF8-0002Bg-Bz for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 11:49:18 +0100 Received: from host213-122-19-20.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([213.122.19.20] helo=Main) by zinc with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 199NF7-00034w-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 11:49:18 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c30be1$60ddc680$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: "LF-Group" Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 11:48:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Propagation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi All, the recent strings of geomagnetic storms have all but destroyed the path across the Atlantic. Steve, W3EEE's, real-time plot of DCF39 for last night shows the signal barely above the noise for only a short period around 0100z, and in the noise for the rest of the night. Brian's plots on the shorter path CT <> DCF39 show that the night-time path is depressed and subject to deep fading, but as a consolation the day-time path was enhanced by about 4 to 5 dB yesterday. Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20126 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 08:33:31 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 08:33:31 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 18871 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 08:33:34 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 08:33:34 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199L76-0001kw-Ew for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 09:32:52 +0100 Received: from [205.188.157.41] (helo=imo-d09.mx.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199L71-0001kn-JY for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 09:32:47 +0100 Received: from DL4YHF@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id l.18d.192bf272 (3988) for ; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 04:32:13 -0400 (EDT) From: DL4YHF@aol.com Message-ID: <18d.192bf272.2bdb9e0d@aol.com> Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 04:32:13 EDT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 for Windows XP sub 50 Subject: Re: LF: RE: something for the weekend ?? Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.1 required=5.0tests=HTML_10_20,HTML_MESSAGE,MIME_LONG_LINE_QP,NO_REAL_NAME, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hi Steward, Andy and group,


I am not sure about the physics of this.

The 90deg phase shifter has to be some sort of dispersion
device (propagation time varies with frequency), and this
will operate on the fourier components of the waveform.

The fourier components present are sin(a+b) and sin(a-b),
not the complex waveform cos(a)*sin(b).

Therefore the phaseshift will apply individually to
sin(a+b) and to sin(a-b).

Can we go back to the physical device itself, and confirm
that the IF phase shifter is shifting by 90deg (as opposed to
say 270deg) and that you can select both sidebands
properly with the add/subtract?

Stewart G3YSX


Thanks for the correction, accepted ! To delay a 'broadband' signal
   cos(a) * sin(b)

by simply substituting it with
   cos(a+90°) * sin(b+90°)
was a mistake by myself; it would be ok if there wasn't that multiply thing in between ;-)

However, Andy's 2nd diagram does work, it is also shown in the ARRL handbook. Think I'll have to find my old math textbook, pre-heat the brain with a good cup o' coffe and make another attempt..

Cheers,
Wolf.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 32723 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 08:09:14 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 08:09:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 19298 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 08:09:18 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 08:09:17 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199Kjb-0001cR-H3 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 09:08:35 +0100 Received: from [171.71.177.254] (helo=sj-core-2.cisco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199KjV-0001cE-JV for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 09:08:29 +0100 Received: from cisco.com (mrwint.cisco.com [64.103.71.48]) by sj-core-2.cisco.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h3Q87tID013631 for ; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 01:07:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from virgin.net (ams-clip-vpn-dhcp45.cisco.com [10.61.64.45]) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA10205 for ; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 09:05:54 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3EAA3D7D.9040802@virgin.net> Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 09:04:13 +0100 From: "Stewart Bryant" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <1e5.78b8a15.2bdab2b2@aol.com> <3EAA3857.5020400@virgin.net> X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by sj-core-2.cisco.com id h3Q87tID013631 Subject: Re: LF: RE: something for the weekend ?? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.6 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Just thinking about this a little more, if you could generate the right dispersion characteristics in the IF phase shifter, can't you do the whole thing with a single mixer and IF processing? Stewart Stewart Bryant wrote: > > I am not sure about the physics of this. > > The 90deg phase shifter has to be some sort of dispersion > device (propagation time varies with frequency), and this > will operate on the fourier components of the waveform. > > The fourier components present are sin(a+b) and sin(a-b), > not the complex waveform cos(a)*sin(b). > > Therefore the phaseshift will apply individually to > sin(a+b) and to sin(a-b). > > Can we go back to the physical device itself, and confirm > that the IF phase shifter is shifting by 90deg (as opposed to > say 270deg) and that you can select both sidebands > properly with the add/subtract? > > Stewart G3YSX > > > DL4YHF@aol.com wrote: > >> Think I got it... >> >> The output from the upper mixer branch is: >> sin(a+b) - sin(a-b) >> The assumption "delayed this by 90 degrees" should give >> cos(a+b) - cos(a-b) >> does not look right in my opinion. >> >> >> Instead, do the "90° phase shift" from the upper mixer's output in the >> term where all trigonometric functions have only a single argument. >> Upper mixer branch >> sin(a+b)-sin(a-b) = 2*cos(a)*sin(b) [ go figure ...] >> Now only one argument in each trig function, looks safe to do the 90 >> degree phase shift by adding 90 degrees in the argumens: >> Upper mixer branch, delayed by 90°: >> 2*cos(a+90°)*sin(b+90°) = - 2*sin(a)*cos(b) = - sin(a-b) - sin(a+b) >> >> So this is the delayed output from the upper mixer branch. Now add >> upper and lower branch (without the phase shifters): >> Lower branch : sin(a+b)-sin(a-b) >> Upper branch : -sin(a+b)-sin(a+b) >> Add both: sin(a+b)-sin(a-b)-sin(a-b)-sin(a+b) = -2sin(a-b) >> Et volia, the upper sideband has been cancelled (should have >> subtracted for USB ;) >> >> >> Hope this is not totally wrong.. >> >> Regards, >> Wolf DL4YHF. > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19148 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 07:45:15 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 07:45:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 25036 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 07:45:08 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 07:45:08 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199KMO-0001Tn-Bs for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 08:44:36 +0100 Received: from [171.71.177.254] (helo=sj-core-2.cisco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199KMJ-0001Te-EW for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 08:44:31 +0100 Received: from cisco.com (mrwint.cisco.com [64.103.71.48]) by sj-core-2.cisco.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h3Q7hvID000948 for ; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 00:43:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from virgin.net (ams-clip-vpn-dhcp45.cisco.com [10.61.64.45]) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA09936 for ; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 08:43:56 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3EAA3857.5020400@virgin.net> Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 08:42:15 +0100 From: "Stewart Bryant" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <1e5.78b8a15.2bdab2b2@aol.com> X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by sj-core-2.cisco.com id h3Q7hvID000948 Subject: Re: LF: RE: something for the weekend ?? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.6 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false I am not sure about the physics of this. The 90deg phase shifter has to be some sort of dispersion device (propagation time varies with frequency), and this will operate on the fourier components of the waveform. The fourier components present are sin(a+b) and sin(a-b), not the complex waveform cos(a)*sin(b). Therefore the phaseshift will apply individually to sin(a+b) and to sin(a-b). Can we go back to the physical device itself, and confirm that the IF phase shifter is shifting by 90deg (as opposed to say 270deg) and that you can select both sidebands properly with the add/subtract? Stewart G3YSX DL4YHF@aol.com wrote: > Think I got it... > > The output from the upper mixer branch is: > sin(a+b) - sin(a-b) > > The assumption "delayed this by 90 degrees" should give > cos(a+b) - cos(a-b) > does not look right in my opinion. > > > Instead, do the "90° phase shift" from the upper mixer's output in the > term where all trigonometric functions have only a single argument. > Upper mixer branch > sin(a+b)-sin(a-b) = 2*cos(a)*sin(b) [ go figure ...] > Now only one argument in each trig function, looks safe to do the 90 > degree phase shift by adding 90 degrees in the argumens: > Upper mixer branch, delayed by 90°: > 2*cos(a+90°)*sin(b+90°) = - 2*sin(a)*cos(b) = - sin(a-b) - sin(a+b) > > So this is the delayed output from the upper mixer branch. Now add upper > and lower branch (without the phase shifters): > Lower branch : sin(a+b)-sin(a-b) > Upper branch : -sin(a+b)-sin(a+b) > Add both: sin(a+b)-sin(a-b)-sin(a-b)-sin(a+b) = -2sin(a-b) > Et volia, the upper sideband has been cancelled (should have subtracted > for USB ;) > > > Hope this is not totally wrong.. > > Regards, > Wolf DL4YHF. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20077 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 05:49:51 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 05:49:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 7830 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 05:49:54 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 05:49:54 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199IYe-00010L-7Z for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 06:49:08 +0100 Received: from [205.158.62.79] (helo=smtp2.us4.outblaze.com) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 199IYZ-000109-HH for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 06:49:03 +0100 Received: (qmail 7195 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 05:48:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO e500) (Mike?Staines?email.com@64.185.140.143) by 205-158-62-79.outblaze.com with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 05:48:28 -0000 From: "Mike Staines" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 01:48:28 -0400 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-reply-to: <000701c30b58$d8bd0640$36d1fc3e@ian> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Subject: LF: RE: The Mystery - "Eve" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.2 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > Todays teaser; why "Eve" in the subject heading? > Well, according to the Scriptures, Eve was a "side" issue for Adam. OK, You can stop ribbing us... Mike wa1ptc From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29667 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 00:31:51 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 00:31:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 29560 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 23:49:48 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 23:49:48 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199Cw3-0008BS-H1 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 00:48:55 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.147] (helo=einsteinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199Cvy-0008BJ-Tb for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 00:48:50 +0100 Received: from dial81-135-67-142.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([81.135.67.142] helo=Main) by einsteinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 199Cvy-0005O4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 00:48:50 +0100 Message-ID: <000001c30b85$2b07e740$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <01C30B45.F606B6F0.g4jnt@thersgb.net> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 23:57:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: RE: something for the weekend ?? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Andy, Ah thats what you get when you try to read direct from a scrolling window on the screen and transpose itallic x's and y's into A's and B's. I like Wolf's solution. I have a couple of bits of scrap paper filled with diagrams as I instinctively didn't like the "now change sine to cos" for the 90 deg phase shifts of A-B, but couldn't see why. I considered doing the phase shift before applying the identity, but didn't carry it through. MMMmmm nice mine bender....made me get the trig function page out to study again. I admit I also had to convince myself that Sin(-A+B) was - Sin(A-B) after Rik's message. Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19037 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2003 00:00:56 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 26 Apr 2003 00:00:56 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 12379 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 22:47:50 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 22:47:50 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 199Bxe-0007wb-Oe for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 23:46:30 +0100 Received: from [64.12.136.163] (helo=imo-m08.mx.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 199BxW-0007wS-Ls for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 23:46:22 +0100 Received: from MarkusVester@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id l.146.fffb845 (3890) for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 18:45:49 -0400 (EDT) From: MarkusVester@aol.com Message-ID: <146.fffb845.2bdb149c@aol.com> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 18:45:48 EDT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10607 Subject: Re: LF: Conundrum - image cancelling mixer Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.3 required=5.0tests=HTML_00_10,HTML_MESSAGE,MIME_LONG_LINE_QP,NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Dear Andy and LF group,

we had that very same discussion at work about a year ago... can the  multi-octave IF quadrature network not be replaced by a simple narrowband RF phase-shifter? No, it can't.

As you say, the first circuit with quadrature RF and LO drives will actually cancel one of the IF output frequencies, eg. the sum frequency, and deliver only the difference. But that is not what you normally want, because it does not differentiate between the two possible RF input frequencies, signal and image. With low IF, these are closely spaced and difficult to separate by a preselector filter.

Example: Direct conversion receiver for 14.2 MHz USB voice. Circuit Nr. 1 is not a true SSB RX, it will convert both 14199 and 14201 kHz to 1 kHz audio. It would however cancel the IF sums near 28.4 MHz, but this is much more easily done with even the most simple IF lowpass. - Circuit Nr.2 is right, it will accept 14201 and produce both 1 and 28401 from it, and it will reject any input at 14199 kHz.

For a transmitter, the same holds true. Circuit 1 would be insensitive at 28.4 MHz "audio", but not be able to split between RF outputs at USB and LSB.

There is a third variant with quadrature LO and IF which will also provide a true SSB mixer. This is advantageous if you need a large tuning range, as the LO is only a single frequency at a time, and digital LO-divider schemes can easily provide matched 90-degree outputs. Also, thanks to mixer saturation, amplitude balance is less critical.

73 de Markus, DF6NM
 From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7469 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 22:21:52 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 22:21:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 17991 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 19:30:36 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 19:30:36 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1998t9-0007GP-9T for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 20:29:39 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.48] (helo=mta8-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1998t1-0007GG-L3 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 20:29:31 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.209.54]) by mta8-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030425192930.TXSM22832.mta8-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 20:29:30 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c30b58$d8bd0640$36d1fc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 19:27:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: The Mystery - "Eve" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false I have a pressing desire to establish my E.R.P. and to that end am setting about building Dicks Field Strength Meter. As my tame finder/supplier of bits is off cruising the Caribbean and increasing his waist line, can anyone suggest a suitable source of the SA6128 chip and BB104 varicaps - or their equivalents? Todays teaser; why "Eve" in the subject heading? Well, according to the Scriptures, Eve was a "side" issue for Adam. Boom boom! Ian MI0AYZ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28920 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 18:28:19 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 18:28:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 22283 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 18:02:50 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 18:02:50 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1997WR-0006sT-5j for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 19:02:07 +0100 Received: from [171.71.177.254] (helo=sj-core-2.cisco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1997WM-0006sK-20 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 19:02:02 +0100 Received: from cisco.com (mrwint.cisco.com [64.103.71.48]) by sj-core-2.cisco.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h3PI0tID012531; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 11:00:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from virgin.net (ams-clip-vpn-dhcp45.cisco.com [10.61.64.45]) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA22764; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 19:00:17 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3EA9774C.6000500@virgin.net> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 18:58:36 +0100 From: "Stewart Bryant" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: "ACT \(E-mail\)" , "Tottingham Brian J" , Linda_Holtby@ntlworld.com References: <7D653C9C42F5D411A27C00508BF8803D01A9F1AC@mail.dstl.gov.uk> Subject: Re: LF: A conumdrum for the weekend - Image Can celling Mixer. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.6 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Andy I have a problem with the output 90deg phase shifter. I can see how you can shift the LO and the signal by 90deg, but the output from the top mixer has sin(A+B) and sin(A-B) signals present. Unless you have a frequency sensitive phase shifter, it is only going to shift one component by 90deg and the other by some strange ammount. Is the phase shifter frequency sensitive? Stewart G3YSX Talbot Andrew wrote: > The following little theoretical problem has occured several times during my > working life, and has cropped up once again, when another engineer here > asked me to explain how a radar receiver front end, as shown in the block > diagram in a manufacturers data sheet, could possibly work. > > A well-known supplier of packaged mixers once had the same conumdrum to > solve when producing a customised mixer for us. Concern about it resulted in > them developing a special 90 degree network for operating over 0.3 to 5 MHz, > when all that was really needed was a couple of simple designs that operated > at HF/VHF. If common sense had ruled, the mixer would have been produced > much quicker and at less cost. > > Andy G4JNT > > ========================================================= > Image Cancelling Mixer connundrum. > > In the classic image cancelling mixer, suppression of one mixer sideband is > obtained by combining two 90 degree shifted input signals with two 90 degree > shifted versions of a local oscillator. The outputs from the two channels > are then added or subtracted depending on which sideband is desired. > > > > ---90---X---------| > Signal -| | +/- IF > ------------X-----| > | | > 90 | > | - | > | > Local Osc. > > If the signal is represented by SIN(A) and the Local Oscillator by SIN(B) > then the signal input to the top mixer is now COS(A) as it has passed > through a 90 degree phase shift, and its respective LO is COS(B) > > The mixers multiply the two signals, and from standard trignometric > identities taken from any mathematical reference, the products of two sines > can be expressed as a sum and difference equation > So the outputs of the mixers (ignoring the factors of 2 in the trig > identities) are : > > Top COS(A).COS(B) = COS(A-B) + COS(A+B) > Bottom SIN(A).SIN(B) = COS(A-B) - COS(A+B) > > So the cancellation / reinforcement at the output is obvious. > > NOW, if we move the second 90 degree phase shift to the output of the > mixers (the IF) rather than the LO, as shown below, intuition and common > sense tells us it should still work since the mixing process is fully > reversible and actual direction of signal flow is irrelevant. Furthermore, > many real designs of SSB exciters and receivers prove this really does work > in practice. > > ---90---X----90----| > Signal -| | +/- IF > ------------X------| > | | > | - | > | > Local Osc. > > But here is the conumdrum : > > Keeping the same terminology of Signal = SIN(A), and LO = SIN(B), the inputs > to the top mixer become > COS(A) . SIN(B) > and the output given by the product rule : > COS(A).SIN(B) = SIN(A+B) - SIN(A-B) > > After the output 90 degree phase shift, the SIN terms beocome COS so we > have, in the top output leg : > COS(A+B) - COS(A-B) > > The output from the bottom mixer is, as before : > SIN(A).SIN(B) = COS(A-B) - COS(A+B) > > Which is the SAME as in the top leg, and will either cancel or reinforce > both sidebands. > So it doesn't appear to work at all ! > Moving the output 90 degree shift to the lower leg still fails to cancel one > sideband only. > > So where is the conundrum? Both forms of image cancelling mixer do indeed > work, and the trig identities can be taken from any reference. > ================================================== > PS. > I do have one rather weak explanation, but it doesn't give that warm cozy > feeling expected when theory falls into place! > Andy > > > "This e-mail is intended for the recipient only. If you are not the > intended recipient you must not use, disclose, distribute, copy, print, > or rely upon this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has > misdirected this e-mail, please notify the author by replying to this e-mail." > > "Recipients should note that all e-mail traffic on MOD systems is > subject to monitoring and auditing." > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11494 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 18:05:42 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 18:05:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 19142 invoked by uid 10001); 25 Apr 2003 18:05:42 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 18:05:42 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1997ZX-0006vI-R8 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 19:05:19 +0100 Received: from [171.71.177.254] (helo=sj-core-2.cisco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1997ZS-0006uz-Qg for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 19:05:15 +0100 Received: from cisco.com (mrwint.cisco.com [64.103.71.48]) by sj-core-2.cisco.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h3PI4dID019245; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 11:04:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from virgin.net (ams-clip-vpn-dhcp45.cisco.com [10.61.64.45]) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA22918; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 19:04:38 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3EA9784E.6080102@virgin.net> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 19:02:54 +0100 From: "Stewart Bryant" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: "ACT \(E-mail\)" , "Tottingham Brian J" , Linda_Holtby@ntlworld.com References: <7D653C9C42F5D411A27C00508BF8803D01A9F1AC@mail.dstl.gov.uk> <3EA9774C.6000500@virgin.net> Subject: Re: LF: A conumdrum for the weekend - Image Can celling Mixer. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.6 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Silly me, it's called dispersion. Sorry to waste the bandwidth. Stewart Stewart Bryant wrote: > Andy > > I have a problem with the output 90deg phase shifter. I can see how you > can shift the LO and the signal by 90deg, but the output from the > top mixer has sin(A+B) and sin(A-B) signals present. Unless you have > a frequency sensitive phase shifter, it is only going to shift one > component by 90deg and the other by some strange ammount. > > Is the phase shifter frequency sensitive? > > Stewart G3YSX > > Talbot Andrew wrote: > >> The following little theoretical problem has occured several times >> during my >> working life, and has cropped up once again, when another engineer here >> asked me to explain how a radar receiver front end, as shown in the block >> diagram in a manufacturers data sheet, could possibly work. >> >> A well-known supplier of packaged mixers once had the same conumdrum to >> solve when producing a customised mixer for us. Concern about it >> resulted in >> them developing a special 90 degree network for operating over 0.3 to >> 5 MHz, >> when all that was really needed was a couple of simple designs that >> operated >> at HF/VHF. If common sense had ruled, the mixer would have been produced >> much quicker and at less cost. >> >> Andy G4JNT >> ========================================================= >> Image Cancelling Mixer connundrum. >> >> In the classic image cancelling mixer, suppression of one mixer >> sideband is >> obtained by combining two 90 degree shifted input signals with two 90 >> degree >> shifted versions of a local oscillator. The outputs from the two >> channels >> are then added or subtracted depending on which sideband is desired. >> >> >> >> ---90---X---------| >> Signal -| | +/- IF >> ------------X-----| >> | | >> 90 | >> | - | >> | >> Local Osc. >> >> If the signal is represented by SIN(A) and the Local Oscillator by SIN(B) >> then the signal input to the top mixer is now COS(A) as it has passed >> through a 90 degree phase shift, and its respective LO is COS(B) >> >> The mixers multiply the two signals, and from standard trignometric >> identities taken from any mathematical reference, the products of two >> sines >> can be expressed as a sum and difference equation So the outputs of >> the mixers (ignoring the factors of 2 in the trig >> identities) are : >> >> Top COS(A).COS(B) = COS(A-B) + COS(A+B) >> Bottom SIN(A).SIN(B) = COS(A-B) - COS(A+B) >> >> So the cancellation / reinforcement at the output is obvious. >> NOW, if we move the second 90 degree phase shift to the output of the >> mixers (the IF) rather than the LO, as shown below, intuition and common >> sense tells us it should still work since the mixing process is fully >> reversible and actual direction of signal flow is irrelevant. >> Furthermore, >> many real designs of SSB exciters and receivers prove this really does >> work >> in practice. >> >> ---90---X----90----| >> Signal -| | +/- IF >> ------------X------| >> | | >> | - | >> | >> Local Osc. >> >> But here is the conumdrum : >> >> Keeping the same terminology of Signal = SIN(A), and LO = SIN(B), the >> inputs >> to the top mixer become COS(A) . SIN(B) >> and the output given by the product rule : >> COS(A).SIN(B) = SIN(A+B) - SIN(A-B) >> >> After the output 90 degree phase shift, the SIN terms beocome COS so we >> have, in the top output leg : >> COS(A+B) - COS(A-B) >> >> The output from the bottom mixer is, as before : >> SIN(A).SIN(B) = COS(A-B) - COS(A+B) >> >> Which is the SAME as in the top leg, and will either cancel or reinforce >> both sidebands. So it doesn't appear to work at all ! >> Moving the output 90 degree shift to the lower leg still fails to >> cancel one >> sideband only. >> >> So where is the conundrum? Both forms of image cancelling mixer do >> indeed >> work, and the trig identities can be taken from any reference. >> ================================================== >> PS. >> I do have one rather weak explanation, but it doesn't give that warm cozy >> feeling expected when theory falls into place! >> Andy >> >> >> "This e-mail is intended for the recipient only. If you are not the >> intended recipient you must not use, disclose, distribute, copy, print, >> or rely upon this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has >> misdirected this e-mail, please notify the author by replying to this >> e-mail." >> >> "Recipients should note that all e-mail traffic on MOD systems is >> subject to monitoring and auditing." >> >> > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10095 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 17:21:53 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 17:21:53 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 343 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 17:11:34 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 17:11:34 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1996ih-0006cj-14 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 18:10:43 +0100 Received: from [212.164.44.2] (helo=astral.omskcity.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1996iY-0006ca-5a for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 18:10:34 +0100 Received: from fitec.omskcity.com (mu07.dialup2.infomsk.ru [212.164.44.119]) by astral.omskcity.com (8.x.x) with SMTP id AAA3ea96b6e63f7 for ; Sat, 26 Apr 2003 00:07:58 +0700 (OSS) Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 23:11:56 +0000 (GMT) From: "Alexander S. Yurkov" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org In-reply-to: <5.1.0.14.0.20030425162821.04396d98@u0019445.kuleuven.be> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: A conumdrum for the weekend - Image Can celling Mixer. Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.2 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_FUTURE_06_12,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,UPPERCASE_25_50, USER_AGENT_PINEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi, Group. On Fri, 25 Apr 2003, Rik Strobbe wrote: > At the upper leg : SIN(A) * COS(B) = SIN(A+B) + SIN(A-B) (ignoring the > divide by 2) > after the 90 degrees phase shift at the output = COS(A+B) + COS(A-B) > > At the lower leg : SIN(A)*SIN(B) = COS(A-B) - COS(A+B) > > Adding : COS(A+B) + COS(A-B) + COS(A-B) - COS(A+B) = 2*COS(A-B) > Subtracting : COS(A+B) + COS(A-B) - COS(A-B) + COS(A+B) = 2*COS(A+B) > > So that way theory seems OK. > And it is pointly the same way to depress undesired product wich was used many years ago for SSB forming by a phase method. This method was widely used in 50-th. 73 de RA9MB/Alex http://www.qsl.net/ra9mb From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23825 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 16:11:25 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 16:11:25 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 24467 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 16:04:07 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 16:04:07 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1995fO-00066k-Dp for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 17:03:14 +0100 Received: from [152.163.225.104] (helo=imo-r08.mx.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1995fH-00066V-S1 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 17:03:07 +0100 Received: from DL4YHF@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id l.1ed.76fc965 (30970) for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 12:02:31 -0400 (EDT) From: DL4YHF@aol.com Message-ID: <1ed.76fc965.2bdab616@aol.com> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 12:02:30 EDT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 for Windows XP sub 50 Subject: Re: LF: RE: something for the weekend ?? Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGE,MIME_LONG_LINE_QP,NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hi Andy and group,

forgotten to mention this in my questionable explanation:
For "adding" the 90° phase shift in the sin() and cos() arguments, it's most important that the arguments are positive, which is the case in
   2*cos(a)*sin(b)
but not necessarily in
   sin(a+b)-sin(a-b) .
With a = 2*pi*f_signal * t    and b = 2 * pi * f_lo * t,
(a-b) can be a negative value which gives the wrong phase offset when ADDING 90° = pi/2 .

Cheers,
 Wolf. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5695 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 15:49:39 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 15:49:39 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 295 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 15:49:25 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 15:49:25 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1995RN-0005zz-Ci for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:48:45 +0100 Received: from [205.188.157.37] (helo=imo-d05.mx.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1995RH-0005zq-09 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:48:39 +0100 Received: from DL4YHF@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id l.1e5.78b8a15 (4592) for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 11:48:03 -0400 (EDT) From: DL4YHF@aol.com Message-ID: <1e5.78b8a15.2bdab2b2@aol.com> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 11:48:02 EDT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 for Windows XP sub 50 Subject: Re: LF: RE: something for the weekend ?? Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.3 required=5.0tests=HTML_00_10,HTML_MESSAGE,MIME_LONG_LINE_QP,NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Think I got it...

The output from the upper mixer branch is:
 sin(a+b) - sin(a-b)  

The assumption "delayed this by 90 degrees" should give
 cos(a+b) - cos(a-b)
does not look right in my opinion.


Instead, do the "90° phase shift" from the upper mixer's output in the term where all trigonometric functions have only a single argument.
Upper mixer branch
sin(a+b)-sin(a-b) = 2*cos(a)*sin(b)  [ go figure ...]
Now only one argument in each trig function, looks safe to do the 90 degree phase shift by adding 90 degrees in the argumens:
Upper mixer branch, delayed by 90°:
2*cos(a+90°)*sin(b+90°) = - 2*sin(a)*cos(b) = - sin(a-b) - sin(a+b)

So this is the delayed output from the upper mixer branch. Now add upper and lower branch (without the phase shifters):
Lower branch : sin(a+b)-sin(a-b)
Upper branch : -sin(a+b)-sin(a+b)
Add both:    sin(a+b)-sin(a-b)-sin(a-b)-sin(a+b) = -2sin(a-b)
Et volia, the upper sideband has been cancelled (should have subtracted for USB ;)


Hope this is not totally wrong..

Regards,
Wolf DL4YHF.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31338 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 15:17:25 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 15:17:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 20194 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 15:17:11 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: High Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 15:17:11 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1994wS-0005jo-0w for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:16:48 +0100 Received: from [212.1.130.141] (helo=smtp-1.visp.telinco.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1994wM-0005jf-DW for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:16:42 +0100 Received: from [80.40.93.173] (helo=standalone) by smtp-1.visp.telinco.net with smtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1994wL-0003SM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:16:41 +0100 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:16:00 +0100 Message-ID: <01C30B45.F606B6F0.g4jnt@thersgb.net> From: "Andy talbot" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:14:06 +0100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: RE: something for the weekend ?? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.0 required=5.0tests=X_PRIORITY_HIGHversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Yes that is correct according to the sheet of trig identities on the wall above my desk. But as I wrote it, the top mixer input is not SIN(A) and COS(B), as the LO signal does not have the 90 degree shift in it. The inputs to the top mixer are ....... COS(A).SIN(B) = SIN((A+B) - SIN(A-B) which is much the same as you give, but with A and B reversed and using the knowledge that SIN(A-B) = -SIN(B-A) Andy -----Original Message----- From: Alan Melia [SMTP:Alan.Melia@btinternet.com] Sent: 2003/04/25 15:29 To: LF-Group Subject: LF: something for the weekend ?? Hi Andy, I am afraid my Terman "Radio Engineers Handbook" 1943 Page 19 gives Sin(A).Cos(B)= Sin(A-B)+Sin(A+B) ....if we forget about the 0.5 factor. but it agrees on the others. This gives you Cos(A-B) + Cos(A+B) out of the top after the 90deg. phase shift and Cos(A-B) - Cos(A+B) out of the bottom ....again cancelling one sideband. I was toying with the idea that Sin(A+pi/2)=Cos(A) but Cos(A+pi/2)= -Sin(A) but that seems irrelevant. Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29621 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 14:54:43 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 14:54:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 13939 invoked by uid 10001); 25 Apr 2003 14:54:43 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 14:54:43 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1994aJ-0005Sk-LR for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 15:53:55 +0100 Received: from [134.58.240.42] (helo=rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1994aD-0005S1-NZ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 15:53:49 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 670DD1D7402 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:53:19 +0200 (CEST) Received: from antonius.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (antonius.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.240.73]) by rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 065251D73C6 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:53:19 +0200 (CEST) Received: from dell-rik.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (pc-10-33-165-177.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [10.33.165.177]) by antonius.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id D63A64C0D0 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:53:18 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030425164433.04394e80@u0019445.kuleuven.be> X-Sender: u0019445@u0019445.kuleuven.be X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:54:41 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" In-reply-to: <000901c30b37$258cd800$6507a8c0@Main> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: by KULeuven Antivirus Cluster Subject: Re: LF: something for the weekend ?? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.5 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hello Alan, >Hi Andy, I am afraid my Terman "Radio Engineers Handbook" 1943 Page 19 >gives > > Sin(A).Cos(B)= Sin(A-B)+Sin(A+B) ....if we forget about the 0.5 factor. But Andy took Cos(A)*Sin(B) instead of Sin(A)*Cos(B) So if we swap A and B in your formula we come to : Sin(B-A) + Sin(B+A) = Sin(B+A) + Sin(B-A) If we put that back to the "A first - B last" it becomes : Sin(A+B) + Sin(-A+B) = Sin(A+B) - Sin(A-B) This last is what Andy gave. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13305 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 14:46:20 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 14:46:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 11456 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 14:41:01 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 14:41:00 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1994MD-0005JP-TK for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 15:39:21 +0100 Received: from [134.58.240.42] (helo=rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1994Lx-0005J0-36 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 15:39:05 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59E9E1D7410 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:38:34 +0200 (CEST) Received: from octavianus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (octavianus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.240.71]) by rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4D091D741A for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:38:33 +0200 (CEST) Received: from dell-rik.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (pc-10-33-165-177.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [10.33.165.177]) by octavianus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9521AAEA69 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:38:33 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030425162821.04396d98@u0019445.kuleuven.be> X-Sender: u0019445@u0019445.kuleuven.be X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 16:38:57 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" In-reply-to: <7D653C9C42F5D411A27C00508BF8803D01A9F1AC@mail.dstl.gov.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: by KULeuven Antivirus Cluster Subject: Re: LF: A conumdrum for the weekend - Image Can celling Mixer. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TOversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Just at make my contribution to the confusion : assume in the 2nd setup that we swap signal and LO. It shouldn't make no difference as it is just a matter of interpretation what you call signal and LO. Thus , >Keeping the same terminology of Signal = SIN(A), and LO = SIN(B) becomes Signal = SIN(B) and LO = SIN(A) At the upper leg : SIN(A) * COS(B) = SIN(A+B) + SIN(A-B) (ignoring the divide by 2) after the 90 degrees phase shift at the output = COS(A+B) + COS(A-B) At the lower leg : SIN(A)*SIN(B) = COS(A-B) - COS(A+B) Adding : COS(A+B) + COS(A-B) + COS(A-B) - COS(A+B) = 2*COS(A-B) Subtracting : COS(A+B) + COS(A-B) - COS(A-B) + COS(A+B) = 2*COS(A+B) So that way theory seems OK. 73, Rik ON7YD At 11:52 25/04/2003 +0100, you wrote: >The following little theoretical problem has occured several times during my >working life, and has cropped up once again, when another engineer here >asked me to explain how a radar receiver front end, as shown in the block >diagram in a manufacturers data sheet, could possibly work. > >A well-known supplier of packaged mixers once had the same conumdrum to >solve when producing a customised mixer for us. Concern about it resulted in >them developing a special 90 degree network for operating over 0.3 to 5 MHz, >when all that was really needed was a couple of simple designs that operated >at HF/VHF. If common sense had ruled, the mixer would have been produced >much quicker and at less cost. > >Andy G4JNT > >========================================================= >Image Cancelling Mixer connundrum. > >In the classic image cancelling mixer, suppression of one mixer sideband is >obtained by combining two 90 degree shifted input signals with two 90 degree >shifted versions of a local oscillator. The outputs from the two channels >are then added or subtracted depending on which sideband is desired. > > > > ---90---X---------| >Signal -| | +/- IF > ------------X-----| > | | > 90 | > | - | > | > Local Osc. > >If the signal is represented by SIN(A) and the Local Oscillator by SIN(B) >then the signal input to the top mixer is now COS(A) as it has passed >through a 90 degree phase shift, and its respective LO is COS(B) > >The mixers multiply the two signals, and from standard trignometric >identities taken from any mathematical reference, the products of two sines >can be expressed as a sum and difference equation >So the outputs of the mixers (ignoring the factors of 2 in the trig >identities) are : > >Top COS(A).COS(B) = COS(A-B) + COS(A+B) >Bottom SIN(A).SIN(B) = COS(A-B) - COS(A+B) > >So the cancellation / reinforcement at the output is obvious. > >NOW, if we move the second 90 degree phase shift to the output of the >mixers (the IF) rather than the LO, as shown below, intuition and common >sense tells us it should still work since the mixing process is fully >reversible and actual direction of signal flow is irrelevant. Furthermore, >many real designs of SSB exciters and receivers prove this really does work >in practice. > > ---90---X----90----| >Signal -| | +/- IF > ------------X------| > | | > | - | > | > Local Osc. > >But here is the conumdrum : > >Keeping the same terminology of Signal = SIN(A), and LO = SIN(B), the inputs >to the top mixer become >COS(A) . SIN(B) >and the output given by the product rule : >COS(A).SIN(B) = SIN(A+B) - SIN(A-B) > >After the output 90 degree phase shift, the SIN terms beocome COS so we >have, in the top output leg : >COS(A+B) - COS(A-B) > >The output from the bottom mixer is, as before : >SIN(A).SIN(B) = COS(A-B) - COS(A+B) > >Which is the SAME as in the top leg, and will either cancel or reinforce >both sidebands. >So it doesn't appear to work at all ! >Moving the output 90 degree shift to the lower leg still fails to cancel one >sideband only. > >So where is the conundrum? Both forms of image cancelling mixer do indeed >work, and the trig identities can be taken from any reference. >================================================== >PS. >I do have one rather weak explanation, but it doesn't give that warm cozy >feeling expected when theory falls into place! >Andy > > >"This e-mail is intended for the recipient only. If you are not the >intended recipient you must not use, disclose, distribute, copy, print, >or rely upon this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has >misdirected this e-mail, please notify the author by replying to this e-mail." > >"Recipients should note that all e-mail traffic on MOD systems is >subject to monitoring and auditing." From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28291 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 14:34:23 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 14:34:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 20365 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 14:34:05 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 14:34:04 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1994Du-0005F4-0e for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 15:30:46 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.93] (helo=rhenium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1994Di-0005Et-4T for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 15:30:34 +0100 Received: from dial81-135-11-16.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([81.135.11.16] helo=Main) by rhenium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 1994Dh-0001IK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 15:30:33 +0100 Message-ID: <000901c30b37$258cd800$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: "LF-Group" Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 15:29:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: something for the weekend ?? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Andy, I am afraid my Terman "Radio Engineers Handbook" 1943 Page 19 gives Sin(A).Cos(B)= Sin(A-B)+Sin(A+B) ....if we forget about the 0.5 factor. but it agrees on the others. This gives you Cos(A-B) + Cos(A+B) out of the top after the 90deg. phase shift and Cos(A-B) - Cos(A+B) out of the bottom ....again cancelling one sideband. I was toying with the idea that Sin(A+pi/2)=Cos(A) but Cos(A+pi/2)= -Sin(A) but that seems irrelevant. Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6282 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 13:28:06 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 13:28:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 19951 invoked by uid 10001); 25 Apr 2003 13:28:05 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 13:28:04 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1993ED-0004jq-RO for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 14:27:01 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.46] (helo=mta6-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1993E8-0004jh-Ut for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 14:26:57 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.232.46]) by mta6-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030425132655.OYSO22800.mta6-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 14:26:55 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c30b25$e734d280$2ee8fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 13:25:58 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Decca Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi All
Does anyone have any info on Racal Decca RX MK53 G. This rx has GPS included with an antenna socket on the back for this purpose. It is in very good condx and maybe could be modified as a LF rx. Another version available is the RX MK53 two  channel and no GPS. There are also some new boxed cct boards for these receivers available.
 
 
Any info or details would be appreciated.
de Mal/G3KEV
 
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15756 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 10:16:20 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 10:16:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 27526 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 10:16:07 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 10:16:07 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1990Ek-0003IH-Qy for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 11:15:22 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.47] (helo=mta7-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1990EY-0003I8-CP for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 11:15:10 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.248]) by mta7-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030425101505.JUWP27609.mta7-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 11:15:05 +0100 Message-ID: <001801c30b0b$1a0b4d80$f8e4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 10:13:49 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 136 acty Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=5.0tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Some big signals yesterday. MI0AYZ cq. I am surprised Ian at the strength of your signal both on 136 and 73 khz. Your antenna and coil must be working well in spite of your reservations. Think what it would be like if you had 1.2 kw like some of the others on the band. After you finished your cq there was a large splurge like you went up in smoke.
M0BMU was very strong in the evening and lots of EU acty all strong signals.
As a matter of interest when I  worked RU6LA again recently it was during early  evening 1806 utc in daylight with the sun beaming down and likewise RN6BN 1858 utc. I could probably work them even earlier in the day, so its not a night time only job. The signals were solid each way and audible with me on both the LOOP E/W and the vertical system.
73 de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27809 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 08:45:52 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 08:45:52 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 3104 invoked by uid 10001); 25 Apr 2003 08:45:51 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 08:45:51 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198ypd-0002cp-Rc for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 09:45:21 +0100 Received: from [212.216.176.221] (helo=smtp1.cp.tin.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198ypU-0002cT-Ho for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 09:45:12 +0100 Received: from base (212.171.197.113) by smtp1.cp.tin.it (6.7.016) id 3E8D72DB007D6F7C for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 10:44:33 +0200 From: "valerio gabbani" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 10:41:29 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <200304251041.29296.valerio@dii.unisi.it> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Subject: LF: censure Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0tests=USER_AGENT_KMAILversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi all, just to say that after my forward of Ted's revision of Ohm's law i did not receive more mail from yahoo eh-forum. '73 Valerio From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28578 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 07:52:25 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 07:52:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 36 invoked by uid 10001); 25 Apr 2003 07:52:25 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: High Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 07:52:25 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198y05-00029g-Ez for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:52:05 +0100 Received: from [212.1.130.142] (helo=smtp-1.visp.telinco.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198y00-00029T-Rm for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:52:00 +0100 Received: from [80.40.88.88] (helo=standalone) by smtp-1.visp.telinco.net with smtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 198xzz-0002X1-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:52:00 +0100 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:51:19 +0100 Message-ID: <01C30B07.D7087C40.g4jnt@thersgb.net> From: "Andy talbot" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:51:11 +0100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: RE: LF: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.0 required=5.0tests=X_PRIORITY_HIGHversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Tnx to all who replied on this subject. BFI seem to be the preferred UK supplier for micrometals. I actually need some of the smallest cores T20-2 or similar for a bank of sixteen 11th order elliptic filters for multiple anti aliassing filters in a digital receiver. Unfortunately some US companies only use Fed Ex to deliver overseas which puts on a ridiculous surcharge. Recently I wanted some 6GHz divider chips from Hittite Microwave - which could be ordered via their web site for $5 each, with no minimum order charge. Got to the bottom of the order form - and FedEx delivery was compulsory overseas with a $99 charge. So I just bought them from an individual who keeps a few specialist chips for the amateur market and paid ?9 each for a higher frequency 13GHz device instead. Ordering by credit card from the US is fine for private purchases, and probably for those in small private companies, but here we have to go through tortuous purchase ordering processes from approved companies - so that 'public money is not wasted'. However, I have used my credit card and claimed back the expenses before now where 'speed was of the essence' Andy G4JNT The main UK importers are BFI Opilas at Milton Keynes. But beware minimum order values if they are not in-stock. I have the -2 material in 200 157 and 92 dimensions I also some of the -3 material in 130 and 157.....But it's quite 'lossy' at LF and probably unsuitable for 136kHz. All cores can be ordered on line from Amidon in the USA with a credit card 73 David G0MRF << File: ATT00002.htm >> From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25279 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 07:50:57 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 07:50:57 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 1117 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 07:51:00 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 07:51:00 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198xyO-00027q-3v for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:50:20 +0100 Received: from [194.217.242.91] (helo=anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198xyJ-00027h-Gr for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:50:15 +0100 Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 198xyI-000JLR-0X for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:50:14 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:13:19 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" References: In-reply-to: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U Subject: Re: LF: Re: 136 activity X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.9 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false That's interesting 'cos noise blankers don't usually work at LF due to the way they operate, taking pulse energy over a broad band to operate a blanking switch. At least, the one in my TS850 doesn't do anything! 73, Tom G3OLB Laurence J Howell writes > but the 870 >Noise blanking really does eliminate lines both aurally and visually. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7952 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2003 06:10:58 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 06:10:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 5050 invoked by uid 10001); 25 Apr 2003 06:10:57 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 25 Apr 2003 06:10:57 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198wO3-0001e9-SY for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 07:08:43 +0100 Received: from [195.161.146.225] (helo=proktor.m-media.ru ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198wNz-0001e0-1A for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 07:08:39 +0100 Received: from serv (vova.localnet [10.0.3.72]) by proktor.m-media.ru (8.12.8/8.12.3) with SMTP id h3P6IpQd059606 for ; Fri, 25 Apr 2003 10:18:51 +0400 (MSD) (envelope-from vladimir@m-media.ru) Message-ID: <001a01c30af0$82c3ba80$4803000a@oo> From: "Vladimir Shuplyakov" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <003301c30a20$715fa270$63245250@sckr.com> <000901c30a76$fe1036c0$43e4fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 10:04:18 +0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: 136 activity X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-7.2 required=5.0tests=QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit > > > 27 April RX3QFM ( loc. KO91FM) will active > > > > 10.00-15.00 UT 137.710 CW > > 15.00-24.00 UT 137.710 QRSS3 beacon mode only... > > > > TX=FT840+ frequency devider 100 times. > > P out = 100 Wt > > Ant = 15 m vertical 150m horizontal. > > Loading coil Q=500. > > gl de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH It will be 27th of April,dear Mal! 73! Vlad. RX3QFM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18811 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 21:31:15 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 21:31:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 2433 invoked by uid 10001); 24 Apr 2003 21:31:15 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 21:31:15 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198oIV-0007tm-Gm for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 22:30:27 +0100 Received: from [63.171.43.2] (helo=ns2.genesis-technology.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198oIQ-0007tU-NA for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 22:30:22 +0100 Received: from we0h ([65.165.20.192]) by ns2.genesis-technology.com (8.10.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id h3OLUH611316 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 16:30:17 -0500 From: "WE0H" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 16:31:25 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: Importance: Normal Subject: RE: LF: Re: 136 activity Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.1 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Time for an electric fence up there Laurence. The biggest critter down here that plays with my feedlines and antennas is a squirrel. Mike>WE0H -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Laurence J Howell Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2003 12:42 PM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: 136 activity The new aerial height is producing may more weak Loran lines (!) - Ive put up a another Argo screen on the web site for 137. 710 for the test this weekend and continue to visualize DCF39 and 137.7725-137.775 ish - Ive concluded for here that the 870 is producing slightly better results in this location than my 850's. - note Im qualifying this. The sensitivity differences pronounced in specs between the units aren't really applicable/meaningful here on 137Khz given the noise level, but the 870 Noise blanking really does eliminate lines both aurally and visually. Given that on 137Khz Loran spillover peaks S9+ in 100Hz b/w Ive found, like others, I run with better results without AGC, the 870 delving into the noise "better"...... and I dont hear the clatter of Loran either! Is "better" an allowed technical term? A moose got the better of my KLM LPA 8 cm diam boom which was sitting at the 8ft level - He decided to have a pushing match, won, snapped it in two and then trampled on it......obviously not a KLM fan. Have a great weekend Laurence KL1X Anchorage., http://www.kl1x.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6020 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 18:48:21 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 18:48:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 28843 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 18:48:23 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 18:48:23 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198lkw-00076P-2D for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 19:47:38 +0100 Received: from [195.130.225.148] (helo=mail-2.tiscali.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198lkp-00076A-90 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 19:47:31 +0100 Received: from localhost.localdomain (62.10.67.215) by mail-2.tiscali.it (6.7.016) id 3EA8008E00016549 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 20:46:25 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by localhost.localdomain (8.11.6/8.11.6) id h3OCdYX01511 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:39:34 +0200 From: "Claudio" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:39:34 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.1 References: <001201c30909$57ee5a60$fe02a8c0@base> In-reply-to: <001201c30909$57ee5a60$fe02a8c0@base> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <200304241439.34398.clapo@localhost.localdomain> X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by localhost.localdomain id h3OCdYX01511 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Subject: Re: LF: Important sperimantal revision of ohm's law Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-32.0 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_PAST_06_12,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_KMAILversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false On Tuesday 22 April 2003 09:56 pm, ipsia wrote: > -----Messaggio originale----- > Da: Ted > A: eh-antenna@yahoogroups.com > Data: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 16:38 > Oggetto: Re: [eh-antenna] Current and Voltage SNIP > > This has nothing to do with religion, just basic theory. > > The reason the EH Antenna works with the typical rice box is that those > amplifiers are broadband. They use broadband transformers to try to get a > 50 ohm output impedance, and the output signal remains in phase with the > source resistance developed by the transistors. If you connect an EH > Antenna to a rice box it works well. If you add an antenna tuner, the EH > Antenna will no longer work due to the phase change caused by the tuner. > > SNIP If the "ANTENNA TUNER" detune the "EH ANTENNA" does "EH" is an "ANTENNA"? We sould ask some philosophy engineer :-) Claudio, IK2PII -- ====================================================== Claudio Pozzi - Happy Linux user - http://www.qsl.net/ik2pii ====================================================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10708 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 17:42:29 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 17:42:29 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 27285 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 17:42:32 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 17:42:32 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198kjH-0006if-0D for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 18:41:51 +0100 Received: from [138.32.33.140] (helo=mailman2.ppco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198kjB-0006iW-D4 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 18:41:45 +0100 Received: from bvlw2k132.ppco.com (trend2.ppco.com [138.32.31.132]) by mailman2.ppco.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with SMTP id h3OHfilw029900 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:41:44 -0500 Received: from 138.32.31.56 by bvlw2k132.ppco.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:41:43 -0500 Received: from bvlnotes07.ppco.com (bvlnotes07.ppco.com [138.32.54.38]) by mail1.ppco.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3OHfhu17843 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:41:43 -0500 (CDT) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.8 June 18, 2001 Message-ID: From: "Laurence J Howell" Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 09:41:41 -0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BVLNOTES07/CIT/Phillips Petroleum/us(Release 5.0.7 |March 21, 2001) at 04/24/2003 12:41:43 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: Re: 136 activity Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false The new aerial height is producing may more weak Loran lines (!) - Ive put up a another Argo screen on the web site for 137. 710 for the test this weekend and continue to visualize DCF39 and 137.7725-137.775 ish - Ive concluded for here that the 870 is producing slightly better results in this location than my 850's. - note Im qualifying this. The sensitivity differences pronounced in specs between the units aren't really applicable/meaningful here on 137Khz given the noise level, but the 870 Noise blanking really does eliminate lines both aurally and visually. Given that on 137Khz Loran spillover peaks S9+ in 100Hz b/w Ive found, like others, I run with better results without AGC, the 870 delving into the noise "better"...... and I dont hear the clatter of Loran either! Is "better" an allowed technical term? A moose got the better of my KLM LPA 8 cm diam boom which was sitting at the 8ft level - He decided to have a pushing match, won, snapped it in two and then trampled on it......obviously not a KLM fan. Have a great weekend Laurence KL1X Anchorage., http://www.kl1x.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6527 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 17:25:25 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 17:25:25 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: (qmail 7008 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 17:25:28 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 17:25:28 -0000 X-SQ: A X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198kSg-0006ad-JN for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 18:24:42 +0100 Received: from [212.125.75.12] (helo=mail4.messagelabs.com) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 198kSb-0006aU-P0 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 18:24:37 +0100 X-VirusChecked: Checked X-Env-Sender: William.Ashlock@bocedwards.com X-Msg-Ref: server-23.tower-4.messagelabs.com!1051205076!48764 Received: (qmail 25484 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 17:24:36 -0000 Received: from ukfw1.ge.boc.com (193.131.2.157) by server-23.tower-4.messagelabs.com with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 17:24:36 -0000 Received: from exc-cra03 ([160.100.160.136]) by ukfw1.ge.boc.com; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 18:25:33 +0100 (BST) Received: from exc_wil04.edwards.boc.com ([162.118.144.226]) by exc_cra03.edwards.boc.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id J31XACXL; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 18:29:32 +0100 Received: by EXC_WIL04 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <2RDJS18P>; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:25:20 -0400 Message-ID: From: "Ashlock,William" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:25:19 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Subject: LF: RE: Re: RE: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Mal, >Hi Bill. I cannot wait much longer so pse hurry up with those big signals. >My loop is in your direction, so between the loop and the vertical system I >think I should hear you, hopefully the wind will be in the right direction!! Yes, and luckily, the loop at this end is pointed in the right direction, AND fire department is on retainer. >All signals so far that have appeared on 136 khz, most distant being UA9OC I >am able to hear at good working cw strength. The 1w ERPers (well, so they measure ) are making it over here on QRSS, so the planned 1w ERP 100w loop, hopefully should make it as well ('wave angle effect' is a TBD). In less than a month I will install the expanded loop and will begin ERP tests at 136k at much reduced power. Fortunately we can operate anywhere in the LF spectrum with 17.5uv/m at 300m (approx 300uw input to loop) and this should be sufficient for far field measurements. >Look forward to a LF qso with you. Ditto (in spite of our differences in opinions on loops)! Bill A _____________________________________________________________________ This e-mail has been scanned for viruses by the WorldCom Internet Managed Scanning Service - powered by MessageLabs. For further information visit http://www.worldcom.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1903 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 16:35:33 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 16:35:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 19581 invoked by uid 10001); 24 Apr 2003 16:35:33 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 16:35:33 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198jgX-0006GT-Dm for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 17:34:57 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.46] (helo=mta6-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198jgS-0006GK-PK for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 17:34:52 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.67]) by mta6-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030424163451.OSFU22800.mta6-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 17:34:51 +0100 Message-ID: <000901c30a76$fe1036c0$43e4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <003301c30a20$715fa270$63245250@sckr.com> Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 16:33:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: 136 activity Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.7 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vladimir Shuplyakov" To: Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2003 6:14 AM Subject: LF: 136 activity > 27 April RX3QFM ( loc. KO91FM) will active > > 10.00-15.00 UT 137.710 CW > 15.00-24.00 UT 137.710 QRSS3 beacon mode only... > > TX=FT840+ frequency devider 100 times. > P out = 100 Wt > Ant = 15 m vertical 150m horizontal. > Loading coil Q=500. Nothing hrd or seen so far.Will check again this evening. RN6BN was a good signal last nite on 137.7 khz QRS3 gl de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 319 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 16:35:32 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 16:35:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 21638 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 16:35:35 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 16:35:35 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198jgR-0006GG-Hv for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 17:34:51 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.46] (helo=mta6-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198jgM-0006G7-Q4 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 17:34:46 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.67]) by mta6-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030424163445.OSDN22800.mta6-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 17:34:45 +0100 Message-ID: <000801c30a76$fa65cc60$43e4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 09:07:35 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: RE: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_PAST_06_12,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ashlock,William" To: Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2003 10:13 PM Subject: LF: RE: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) > Mal, > > So your advice is to: > > >Never believe anything you hear or see!!!!!!!!! > > Is that how we should deal with statements relative to your own loop antenna > measurements? > > BTW: Be prepared to apply your statement to any signals coming your way from > this side of the pond in the not-so-distant future. Hi Bill. I cannot wait much longer so pse hurry up with those big signals. My loop is in your direction, so between the loop and the vertical system I think I should hear you, hopefully the wind will be in the right direction !! All signals so far that have appeared on 136 khz, most distant being UA9OC I am able to hear at good working cw strength. Look forward to a LF qso with you. 73 de Mal/G3KEV (Could be coming from a > loop antenna) :) > > 73 > Bill A > > > > _____________________________________________________________________ > This e-mail has been scanned for viruses by the WorldCom Internet Managed Scanning Service - powered by MessageLabs. For further information visit http://www.worldcom.com > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24043 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 15:47:16 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 15:47:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 187 invoked by uid 10001); 24 Apr 2003 15:40:36 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 15:40:36 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198ipA-0005rv-KF for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 16:39:48 +0100 Received: from [80.68.3.204] (helo=relay.dx.ru) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 198ip3-0005rl-Lf for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 16:39:42 +0100 Received: (qmail 40148 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 13:00:51 +0400 Received: from ed.dx (ed@10.0.1.11) by gw.dx with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 13:00:51 +0400 Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 19:40:57 +0300 From: "Ed Lesnichy" X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.60q) Personal Organization: Ed Lesnichy X-Priority: 3 Message-ID: <56256838386.20030424194057@dx.ru> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org In-reply-to: <000f01c30a5e$b73f7a20$14ccfc3e@ian> References: <000f01c30a5e$b73f7a20$14ccfc3e@ian> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: Apr 19 Sat. report Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.9 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi LF entusiasts! I only today have returned to Taganrog from business trip... In my opinion the propagation to West Europe was bad (Apr 19) ;-(( For example, the signal G3KEV (abt 1830z) was in QRSS3 though and "O", but not powerful as it is usual. At me was skeds with GM4PLM and MI0AYZ in QRSS10. Unfortunately Simon's signal I have not seen ;-(( I completely have accepted Ian's call and report "O" in QRSS10 about 2245z But because of technical problems with my TX has start answered to him "AYZ RO LA SK" only about 2320z ;-(( and not seen Ian's "SK" I believe that as both of us have Argo's accepted calls and reports("M/O"), QSO it is possible confirmed ! (??) For me it too most far (3203km) on 136 from KN97LN and first GI/UA Eu I think that in QRSS30 QSO would be O/O. How much ERP can be at Ian? Also had pleasant QSO with RN6BN(O/O), OK1DTN(O/O), G3KEV(O/O), DK1IS(O/O), Geri DK8KW (O/M abt 150mW ERP) and F6BWO (QRSS3/10 O/O) After abt 0030z I gave on abt 137773 beacon QRSS60 on NA, but anybody seems me has not accepted ;-(( Important! My powerful signal in Western Europe is very deceptive ;-(( On Big Vertical (H effective abt 80m nw) and with 50-70w RF at me about 5-10w ERP !!! it is much more than at somebody For me the DXseason 2002-03 was finished - thanks by all for the reports, QSOs and useful advice! Before meeting in new 2003-04 season! When will be ready Special LF QSL UA9OC, I shall send all direct for all ours 1-way and 2-way QSOs (RU6LA, RU6LWZ, UA6LO, UA6LV, UA9OC) 73! Ed RU6LA ed@dx.ru P.S. Ian! Can to you will help the artful foxes? ;-)) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14401 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 14:48:25 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 14:48:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 1862 invoked by uid 10001); 24 Apr 2003 14:48:25 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 14:48:25 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198i0i-0005Nz-BP for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 15:47:40 +0100 Received: from [193.82.116.10] (helo=public.thorcom.com ident=[0R1iRAuTMnOhK0EiWyEj9hORVklvkZoX]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198i0c-0005Nk-TR for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 15:47:34 +0100 Received: from post.omnieng.co.uk ([193.82.59.20]) by public.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 198i0b-0006cd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 15:47:33 +0100 Received: from imo-m03.mx.aol.com ([64.12.136.6]) by post.omnieng.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198i0a-0007bR-VG for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 15:47:33 +0100 Received: from G0MRF@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id l.18e.194bec45 (25711) for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 10:46:55 -0400 (EDT) From: G0MRF@aol.com Message-ID: <18e.194bec45.2bd952df@aol.com> Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 10:46:55 EDT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 10512 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-7.6 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,HTML_10_20,HTML_MESSAGE, MIME_LONG_LINE_QP,NO_REAL_NAME,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit In a message dated 4/23/03 2:38:00 PM GMT Daylight Time, g4jnt@thersgb.net writes:


Subj:LF: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic)
Date:4/23/03 2:38:00 PM GMT Daylight Time
From:    g4jnt@thersgb.net (Andy talbot)
Sender:    owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Reply-to:    rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
To:    rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org (Rsgb_Lf_Group (E-mail))




Does anyone know of a UK supplier of Amidon iron dust cores  - they may be
called American Cores & Electronics now, according to the Amidon web page.  The
web is not too helpful at finding a UK stockist though.


The main UK  importers are BFI Opilas at Milton Keynes. But beware minimum order values if they are not in-stock.

I have the -2 material in   200   157   and  92  dimensions
I also some of the -3 material in 130 and 157.....But it's quite 'lossy' at LF and probably unsuitable for 136kHz.

All cores can be ordered on line from Amidon in the USA with a credit card

73

David  G0MRF From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15304 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 14:30:44 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 14:30:44 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 21660 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 14:30:47 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 14:30:46 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198hj8-0005Ba-8B for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 15:29:30 +0100 Received: from [165.212.11.111] (helo=cmsrelay02.mx.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 198hj3-0005BQ-62 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 15:29:25 +0100 Received: from uadvg131.cms.usa.net (HELO localhost) (165.212.11.131) by cmsoutbound.mx.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 14:28:47 -0000 Received: from usa.net [213.217.167.233] by uadvg131.cms.usa.net (ASMTP/dibene@usa.net) via mtad (C8.MAIN.2.05) with ESMTP id 773HDXoCp0291M31; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:28:42 GMT Message-ID: <3EA7F495.2020000@usa.net> Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 16:28:37 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000f01c30a5e$b73f7a20$14ccfc3e@ian> Subject: Re: LF: 136 last Sat. Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------080704040303080708080602" X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-15.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,HTML_60_70,HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_04, HTML_IMAGE_RATIO_04,HTML_MESSAGE,MIME_HTML_ONLY,REFERENCES, USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------080704040303080708080602 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Ian Kyle wrote:
Come to think of it, wasn't there an instance of "Kitten on the Keys" a
while back, with references to Schrodinger?


http://www.lassp.cornell.edu/ardlouis/dissipative/Schrcat.html
or
http://www.telp.com/philosophy/qw2.htm

73  Alberto  I2PHD

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24 Apr 2003 13:51:54 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 13:51:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 10734 invoked by uid 10001); 24 Apr 2003 13:51:54 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 13:51:54 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198h62-0004p0-Kc for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:49:06 +0100 Received: from [195.92.193.18] (helo=cmailm1.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198h5x-0004oo-OK for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:49:01 +0100 Received: from modem-499.wolf.dialup.pol.co.uk ([81.76.129.243] helo=shack) by cmailm1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198h5v-0004CJ-W0 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:49:00 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:48:48 +0100 Message-ID: <007901c30a68$3f08e550$1400900a@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <000f01c30a5e$b73f7a20$14ccfc3e@ian> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: RE: 136 last Sat. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.4 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Ian, Maybe you should use a better receiver rather than the 'cats whisker' HI! I have the same problems here but with horses rubbing themselves on the mast at the bottom of the field! There was a great screen saver for the PC sometime ago with Schrodinger's cat! Ask GM4ISM! Good lk on the DX - will be closely listening for a first GM-transatlantic QSO Regards Simon GM4PLM -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Ian Kyle Sent: 24 April 2003 13:40 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: 136 last Sat. At around 2230z last Saturday I copied " ....AYZ M LA K" in QRSS3 on Eds frequency after he had sent "PSE 10" and I had called him in that mode. I acknowledged his report and sent him a report of 'OO' but failed to get an ack in return. However at 3185 Km this is by far the best DX report I have managed so far, and would indicate that at QRSS10, VO1 is not outside the bounds of possibility. This, plus the fact that there is no way I shall be able to get the tower and VHF/UHF beams up this summer, has encouraged me to think again about continuing on 136 next winter. But first a rebuild of the 'dogbox' will be necessary. Reason? Blasted cats! The polythene sheet waterproofing of the existing structure was found to have grown a number of small punctures, with the result that the plywood lid is now pretty wet and antenna current down a bit, because a couple of scrofulous moggies are using it as a launch pad to get access to the garage roof as a love tryst. Just wait till they try sharpening their claws on the insulator while the key is down. No one told me that LF operations would include pest control. Ian MI0AYZ Come to think of it, wasn't there an instance of "Kitten on the Keys" a while back, with references to Schrodinger? From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10358 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 13:40:28 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 13:40:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 23270 invoked by uid 10001); 24 Apr 2003 13:40:28 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 13:40:28 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198gwQ-0004i1-FY for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:39:10 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198gwL-0004hs-HM for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:39:05 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.204.20]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030424133904.RPOK6822.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:39:04 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c30a5e$b73f7a20$14ccfc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:40:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 136 last Sat. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false At around 2230z last Saturday I copied " ....AYZ M LA K" in QRSS3 on Eds frequency after he had sent "PSE 10" and I had called him in that mode. I acknowledged his report and sent him a report of 'OO' but failed to get an ack in return. However at 3185 Km this is by far the best DX report I have managed so far, and would indicate that at QRSS10, VO1 is not outside the bounds of possibility. This, plus the fact that there is no way I shall be able to get the tower and VHF/UHF beams up this summer, has encouraged me to think again about continuing on 136 next winter. But first a rebuild of the 'dogbox' will be necessary. Reason? Blasted cats! The polythene sheet waterproofing of the existing structure was found to have grown a number of small punctures, with the result that the plywood lid is now pretty wet and antenna current down a bit, because a couple of scrofulous moggies are using it as a launch pad to get access to the garage roof as a love tryst. Just wait till they try sharpening their claws on the insulator while the key is down. No one told me that LF operations would include pest control. Ian MI0AYZ Come to think of it, wasn't there an instance of "Kitten on the Keys" a while back, with references to Schrodinger? From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13022 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 12:31:27 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 12:31:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 2954 invoked by uid 10001); 24 Apr 2003 12:31:27 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 12:31:27 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198fsK-0004It-FF for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:30:52 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.147] (helo=einsteinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198fsF-0004Ii-Pr for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:30:47 +0100 Received: from host213-122-189-64.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([213.122.189.64] helo=Main) by einsteinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 198fsE-0007QT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:30:46 +0100 Message-ID: <001601c30a5d$414ff020$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: "LF-Group" Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:19:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Propagation 3000kms and 5000kms Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Jim Congratulations on the new Russian station. This is a virtually "all-land" path so is slightly more difficult. On the propagation front yes you are right there is a considerable difference between paths of 2000-3000 kms and paths of over 4000kms at night after geomagnetic activity. The effect can be seen by noting the difference between Brains night-time received strength for DCF39 ( at 1950 kms) and Steve's W3EEE at over 5000kms. On the 23rd Brians plot's show night-time levels also at my "benchmark" average, which is surprisingly good considering the geomagnetic conditions we have had recently. If you look at the real-time plots on Steve's site the levels are very poor and 20dB or more below the best seen in January. I beleive the the difference is accounted for by the path geometry. It is possible that the major signal path up to 3000kms on current nights is a one hop path. Even there 3000kms is stretching it a bit. The difference is that the two hop path must ,of course, make two journeys through the absorbing D-layer (the result of precipitated 'hot' electrons associated with the geomagnetic events) and as a result be significantly attenuated. When these hot eletrons decay away, you will find that the trans-Atlantic path improves but there could be a deterioration in the 3000kms paths !! I believe this could be due to destructive interference between the two hop and one hop paths over that distance. I saw this quite a lot on plots of SXV and for a long time did not understand why the path was not better ( it was cut up with deep frequenct fading ) when the path to CFH was good. I believe Brian's T/A success is due to the slightly more southerly path which is nearly all over water, and the use of 60sec mode which seems to get over even under poor conditions at the 1W ERP power level. His routes in other directions are by no means as good. Jose-Manuel EA1PX gets much better signals from and into Europe firing across Biscay, that Brian whose paths cross Northern Spain and the Pyrenees (on some paths possibly also the Alps as well !) Fascinating stuff this LF.....now where are all the South American and Cuban stations ?? Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com http://www.alan.melia.btinternet.co.uk/index.htm#propagation From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1358 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 12:25:27 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 12:25:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 1968 invoked by uid 10001); 24 Apr 2003 12:18:47 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 12:18:47 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198ffd-00049x-Ss for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:17:45 +0100 Received: from [195.130.225.152] (helo=mail-6.tiscali.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198ffZ-00049h-6k for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:17:41 +0100 Received: from localhost.localdomain (62.10.67.104) by mail-6.tiscali.it (6.7.016) id 3E9BA3E6004DA83F for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:17:05 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by localhost.localdomain (8.11.6/8.11.6) id h3OCL9h01290 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:21:09 +0200 From: "Claudio" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 14:21:08 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.1 References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030424114505.00a9ffd8@gemini.herts.ac.uk> In-reply-to: <5.1.0.14.0.20030424114505.00a9ffd8@gemini.herts.ac.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <200304241421.08466.clapo@localhost.localdomain> X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by localhost.localdomain id h3OCL9h01290 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Subject: Re: LF: RN6BN/propagation Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-31.9 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_KMAILversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false On Thursday 24 April 2003 01:24 pm, James Moritz wrote: > Dear LF Group, > > I had a nice QRSS contact with RN6BN last night, with "O" reports both > ways, and 'BN was a clearly audible S3 signal at my location. Several > others stations were also active, including IK2PII who I don't think I have > seen before. Yes, I am IK2PII. I think to be on the air this evening, starting at 19.00 UTC in QRSS 3 seconds. Power is 450 W abt and antenna 10 m vertical + 20 m abt top loading. Yesterday evening seen RN6BN, G3KEV, S57AK, OK1DTN, G3LDO. CU soon on 136 73 de Claudio, IK2PII -- ====================================================== Claudio Pozzi - Happy Linux user - http://www.qsl.net/ik2pii ====================================================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19605 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 11:26:24 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 11:26:24 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 15561 invoked by uid 10001); 24 Apr 2003 11:26:24 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 11:26:22 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198er0-0003pA-Sy for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:25:26 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.9] (helo=hestia.herts.ac.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198equ-0003p1-HT for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:25:20 +0100 Received: from gemini ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini.herts.ac.uk) by hestia.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 198eqk-0001lH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:25:10 +0100 Received: from [147.197.232.252] (helo=rsch-15.herts.ac.uk) by gemini.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 198eqY-0007R5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:24:59 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030424114505.00a9ffd8@gemini.herts.ac.uk> X-Sender: mj9ar@gemini.herts.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 12:24:50 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "James Moritz" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MailScanner: No Virus detected Subject: LF: RN6BN/propagation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear LF Group, I had a nice QRSS contact with RN6BN last night, with "O" reports both ways, and 'BN was a clearly audible S3 signal at my location. Several others stations were also active, including IK2PII who I don't think I have seen before. It is interesting how there seems to be a division between paths up to about 3000km, where good conditions are fairly commonplace during darkness hours, and those over about 5000km, where good conditions are much rarer and change very rapidly. Both must surely involve mostly sky-wave propagation, but the longer distance paths just evaporate whenever there is a whiff of solar activity. The shorter paths on the other hand seem much less affected. So my guess is there is a change in propagation modes somewhere in the region of 4000km - I suppose CT1DRPs beacon signals to the eastern US are on the borderline, so make for an interesting comparison. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14826 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 08:19:10 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 08:19:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 4060 invoked by uid 10001); 24 Apr 2003 08:19:09 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 08:19:09 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198bvy-0002p1-Il for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 09:18:22 +0100 Received: from [193.212.240.200] (helo=virus-in.online.no) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198bvt-0002oq-73 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 09:18:17 +0100 Received: from [134.47.162.90] by virus-in.online.no with ESMTP for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 10:17:45 +0200 Received: from tns-fbu-22-212.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.162.91]) by tns-fbu-22-208.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Thu, 24 Apr 2003 10:17:44 +0200 Received: from TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.164.201]) by tns-fbu-22-212.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Thu, 24 Apr 2003 10:17:44 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 10:17:44 +0200 Message-ID: <2D280BB697C7EE4C979C5C89925418EFB05C18@TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no> Thread-Topic: Re: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Thread-Index: AcMJ31q/kZ97kKJKRsG+J8dC5VUIZQAWnqdw From: jan-martin.noding@telenor.com To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Apr 2003 08:17:44.0543 (UTC) FILETIME=[FB809EF0:01C30A39] MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: RE: Re: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) (Intern) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0tests=NO_REAL_NAME,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ...........and I thought db was English for dBm ... 73 LA8AK --- J M Nøding, Kristiansand Telefon 0047-380-52660, 9077-7126 (QTH: 0047-380-87178) -----Original Message----- From: Andy talbot [mailto:G4JNT@THERSGB.NET] Sent: 23. april 2003 23:21 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Oh dear - !!!!!! :-( Glad I've gone back to microwave operating - no one else being rude to others up there, and more scientific experimentation going on. By the way, the abbreviation is dB not db, and watts are upper case W, not w Andy (south coast resident) G4JNT > All guess work, you must have seen some of these discussions, after several > pages of formulae the conclusion are that these calculation are within 10 db > or so. ie could be 1w or 10w erp. Never believe anything you hear or > see!!!!!!!!! > Too many pretentious experts not surprisingly from the South, and often > adamant that they are right!!!!!!!! > Fortunately north of Watford, especially Scotland and Ireland we do not fall > for this. > > G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23483 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 05:16:36 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 05:16:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 3323 invoked by uid 10001); 24 Apr 2003 05:16:36 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 05:16:36 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198Z5R-0002B6-Dn for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 06:15:57 +0100 Received: from [80.82.32.9] (helo=serv1.vsi.ru) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198Z5H-0002Av-Mc for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 06:15:47 +0100 Received: from rx3qfm (36.as2.dial.vsi.ru [80.82.36.99]) by serv1.vsi.ru (8.11.7+Sun/8.11.7) with SMTP id h3O5EqK09573 for ; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 09:14:52 +0400 (MSD) Message-ID: <003301c30a20$715fa270$63245250@sckr.com> From: "Vladimir Shuplyakov" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 09:14:00 +0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 136 activity Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false 27 April RX3QFM ( loc. KO91FM) will active 10.00-15.00 UT 137.710 CW 15.00-24.00 UT 137.710 QRSS3 beacon mode only... TX=FT840+ frequency devider 100 times. P out = 100 Wt Ant = 15 m vertical 150m horizontal. Loading coil Q=500. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 940 invoked from network); 24 Apr 2003 04:33:54 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 04:33:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 10686 invoked by uid 10001); 24 Apr 2003 04:33:54 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 2003 04:33:54 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198YPl-00022S-RV for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 05:32:53 +0100 Received: from [63.171.43.2] (helo=ns2.genesis-technology.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198YPg-00022J-W7 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 24 Apr 2003 05:32:49 +0100 Received: from we0h ([65.165.20.192]) by ns2.genesis-technology.com (8.10.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id h3O4Wel16779 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 23:32:40 -0500 From: "WE0H" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 23:33:42 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: Importance: Normal Subject: LF: RE: RE: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.1 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Not could be but will be and with no tree fires to put out. Mike>WE0H http://www.we0h.us/lf -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Ashlock,William 'The Loop Master' Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2003 4:14 PM To: 'rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org' Subject: LF: RE: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Mal, So your advice is to: >Never believe anything you hear or see!!!!!!!!! Is that how we should deal with statements relative to your own loop antenna measurements? BTW: Be prepared to apply your statement to any signals coming your way from this side of the pond in the not-so-distant future. (Could be coming from a loop antenna) :) 73 Bill A _____________________________________________________________________ This e-mail has been scanned for viruses by the WorldCom Internet Managed Scanning Service - powered by MessageLabs. For further information visit http://www.worldcom.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7193 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 22:43:15 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 22:43:15 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 28286 invoked by uid 10001); 23 Apr 2003 22:43:14 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 22:43:14 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198Sw4-0000vp-Ha for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 23:41:52 +0100 Received: from [205.188.157.35] (helo=imo-d03.mx.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198Svw-0000vW-RD for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 23:41:44 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id l.3b.370bc969 (25305) for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 18:41:11 -0400 (EDT) From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <3b.370bc969.2bd87086@aol.com> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 18:41:10 EDT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 120 Subject: LF: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging...) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false In a message dated 4/23/03 2:11:16 PM Eastern Daylight Time, g3kev.ham@virgin.net writes: >> Never believe anything you hear or see!!!!!!!!! Too many pretentious experts not surprisingly from the South, and often adamant that they are right!!!!!!!! >> Sounds like the car dealer radio adverts we hear periodically in these parts: "DON'T BE FOOLED BY SOME SLICK OUT-OF-TOWN DEALERSHIP!!!!!" When you can be fooled right here at home, presumably????? :-) John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16983 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 21:20:34 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 21:20:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 24155 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 21:20:21 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 21:20:21 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198Rex-0000bn-51 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 22:20:07 +0100 Received: from [212.1.130.141] (helo=smtp-1.visp.telinco.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198Res-0000be-HT for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 22:20:02 +0100 Received: from [80.40.60.216] (helo=RSGB613192) by smtp-1.visp.telinco.net with smtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 198Rer-0001cE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 22:20:02 +0100 Message-ID: <001701c309de$41fa0580$045bfea9@RSGB613192> From: "Andy talbot" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <01C309A5.34411480.g4jnt@thersgb.net> <006901c309ba$f3ed7b60$c0e4fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 22:21:06 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Oh dear - !!!!!! :-( Glad I've gone back to microwave operating - no one else being rude to others up there, and more scientific experimentation going on. By the way, the abbreviation is dB not db, and watts are upper case W, not w Andy (south coast resident) G4JNT > All guess work, you must have seen some of these discussions, after several > pages of formulae the conclusion are that these calculation are within 10 db > or so. ie could be 1w or 10w erp. Never believe anything you hear or > see!!!!!!!!! > Too many pretentious experts not surprisingly from the South, and often > adamant that they are right!!!!!!!! > Fortunately north of Watford, especially Scotland and Ireland we do not fall > for this. > > G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3114 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 21:14:08 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 21:14:08 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: (qmail 22685 invoked by uid 10001); 23 Apr 2003 21:14:08 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 21:14:08 -0000 X-SQ: A X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198RYG-0000Wz-Kw for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 22:13:12 +0100 Received: from [212.125.75.12] (helo=mail4.messagelabs.com) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 198RYB-0000Wq-N8 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 22:13:07 +0100 X-VirusChecked: Checked X-Env-Sender: William.Ashlock@bocedwards.com X-Msg-Ref: server-19.tower-4.messagelabs.com!1051132386!23450 Received: (qmail 22161 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 21:13:06 -0000 Received: from ukfw1.ge.boc.com (193.131.2.157) by server-19.tower-4.messagelabs.com with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 21:13:06 -0000 Received: from exc-cra03 ([160.100.160.136]) by ukfw1.ge.boc.com; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 22:14:01 +0100 (BST) Received: from exc_wil04.edwards.boc.com ([162.118.144.226]) by exc_cra03.edwards.boc.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id J31W0MWD; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 22:18:01 +0100 Received: by EXC_WIL04 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <2RDJR591>; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 17:13:49 -0400 Message-ID: From: "Ashlock,William" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 17:13:48 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Subject: LF: RE: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Mal, So your advice is to: >Never believe anything you hear or see!!!!!!!!! Is that how we should deal with statements relative to your own loop antenna measurements? BTW: Be prepared to apply your statement to any signals coming your way from this side of the pond in the not-so-distant future. (Could be coming from a loop antenna) :) 73 Bill A _____________________________________________________________________ This e-mail has been scanned for viruses by the WorldCom Internet Managed Scanning Service - powered by MessageLabs. For further information visit http://www.worldcom.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18156 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 18:29:25 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 18:29:25 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 27929 invoked by uid 10001); 23 Apr 2003 18:29:25 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 18:29:25 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198OzD-0008IZ-3I for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 19:28:51 +0100 Received: from [138.32.33.140] (helo=mailman2.ppco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198Oz7-0008IQ-Vi for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 19:28:46 +0100 Received: from bvlw2k131.ppco.com (trend1.ppco.com [138.32.31.131]) by mailman2.ppco.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with SMTP id h3NISilw026748 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 13:28:45 -0500 Received: from 138.32.31.56 by bvlw2k131.ppco.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Wed, 23 Apr 2003 13:28:44 -0500 Received: from bvlnotes07.ppco.com (bvlnotes07.ppco.com [138.32.54.38]) by mail1.ppco.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3NIShu03069 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 13:28:43 -0500 (CDT) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.8 June 18, 2001 Message-ID: From: "Laurence J Howell" Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:28:41 -0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BVLNOTES07/CIT/Phillips Petroleum/us(Release 5.0.7 |March 21, 2001) at 04/23/2003 01:28:43 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: condx - Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Nothing - nada - zilch. at thats for DCF39 on dit dot 60, let alone something 40dB down.... Laurence KL1X, Anchorage Sunny 9C http://www.kl1x.com, From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23225 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 18:09:29 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 18:09:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 14217 invoked by uid 10001); 23 Apr 2003 18:09:29 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 18:09:29 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198Ofw-0008Af-FH for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 19:08:56 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.42] (helo=mta2-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198Ofq-0008AW-Le for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 19:08:50 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.30]) by mta2-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030423180849.NKOK1184.mta2-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 19:08:49 +0100 Message-ID: <006901c309ba$f3ed7b60$c0e4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <01C309A5.34411480.g4jnt@thersgb.net> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 18:08:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.5 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy talbot" To: "Rsgb_Lf_Group (E-mail)" Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2003 2:32 PM Subject: LF: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) > Does anyone know of a UK supplier of Amidon iron dust cores - they may be > called American Cores & Electronics now, according to the Amidon web page. The > web is not too helpful at finding a UK stockist though. > I need a lot of them for a (work based) design with many parallel channels of > filtering, and for various bureaucratic reasons to do with importation, need > to get them from a UK supplier. > > btw. I've discovered the published Al values for these, particularly for the > T2 material (2 - 30MHz) is some way out from that shown in the ARRL handbook. > Measured discrepancies of 10% to 30% seem to be common, so every coil has to > be wound and measured to get to spec This is normal procedure, published figures are usually a rough guide because of variations in core material etc. Like all the other measurements about radiated power from transmitters they can vary by up to 20 db as discussed in previous messages posted here over the years. It is impossible to calculate whether the person is emitting 1w or 10w All guess work, you must have seen some of these discussions, after several pages of formulae the conclusion are that these calculation are within 10 db or so. ie could be 1w or 10w erp. Never believe anything you hear or see!!!!!!!!! Too many pretentious experts not surprisingly from the South, and often adamant that they are right!!!!!!!! Fortunately north of Watford, especially Scotland and Ireland we do not fall for this. G3KEV > > Andy G4JNT > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4298 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 17:46:45 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 17:46:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 12063 invoked by uid 10001); 23 Apr 2003 17:46:45 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 17:46:45 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198OJ0-00080t-JM for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 18:45:14 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198OIv-00080k-Nh for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 18:45:09 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.192]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030423174508.RUKT6822.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 18:45:08 +0100 Message-ID: <005601c309b7$a50d8e20$c0e4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030422190340.024ecd78@gemini.herts.ac.uk> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 17:44:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: GM3YXM last Sunday Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.9 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Moritz" To: Sent: Tuesday, April 22, 2003 7:13 PM Subject: LF: GM3YXM last Sunday > Dear LF Group, > > Was very pleased to work GM3YXM on 73kHz CW, a new 73kHz "country" from > this station. The 73kHz band has been very quiet with no Rugby, and Loran > was clearly audible. Also worked G3AQC on 73k, and G3KEV on 136, who I had > not heard for a long time. Hi Jim Tnx for the call and nice qso a couple of days ago. I was using the antennas for 160 and other experiments and re connected to the LF system a couple of weeks ago. To date apart from working several DX stations on 136 khz I have had reports from across EU from 5B4, SP, HA, TU etc its just a pity they are not active on 136 TX to enhance my DXCC score hi Agn tnx for the call and hpe to cu agn soon on 136 khz. You are the strongest signal from the deep South !! the others barely shift my S meter. 73 de Mal/G3KEV I seem to have finally found all the bits of the > station after packing and unpacking them for the trip to Porthcurno! > > Cheers, Jim Moritz > 73 de M0BMU > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18485 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 14:47:14 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 14:47:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 6580 invoked by uid 10001); 23 Apr 2003 14:47:14 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 14:47:14 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198LWK-0006zN-J6 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 15:46:48 +0100 Received: from [134.58.240.45] (helo=thumbler.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198LWE-0006ys-1n for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 15:46:42 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by thumbler.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id D289113786C for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 16:46:11 +0200 (CEST) Received: from octavianus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (octavianus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.240.71]) by thumbler.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6872E137877 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 16:46:11 +0200 (CEST) Received: from dell-rik.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (pc-10-33-165-177.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [10.33.165.177]) by octavianus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AA7FAEA6A for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 16:46:11 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030423164630.01db0608@u0019445.kuleuven.be> X-Sender: u0019445@u0019445.kuleuven.be X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 16:47:29 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" In-reply-to: <01C309A5.34411480.g4jnt@thersgb.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: by KULeuven Antivirus Cluster Subject: Re: LF: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-18.3 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,HTML_10_20,HTML_FONT_COLOR_BLUE, HTML_MESSAGE,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Andy,

maybe you can try Micrometals :

Micrometals, Inc.
5615 E. La Palma Ave.
Anaheim, CA 92807 USA
Phone: 714-970-9400
Fax: 714-970-0400
Web Site: www.micrometals.com

73, Rik ON7YD


At 14:32 23/04/2003 +0100, you wrote:
Does anyone know of a UK supplier of Amidon iron dust cores  - they may be
called American Cores & Electronics now, according to the Amidon web page.  The
web is not too helpful at finding a UK stockist though.
I need a lot of them for a (work based) design with many parallel channels of
filtering, and for various bureaucratic reasons to do with importation,  need
to get them from a UK supplier.

btw.  I've discovered the published Al values for these, particularly for the
T2 material (2 - 30MHz) is some way out from that shown in the ARRL handbook.
 Measured discrepancies of  10% to 30% seem to be common, so every coil has to
be wound and measured to get to spec.

Andy  G4JNT
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20556 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 14:36:58 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 14:36:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 25823 invoked by uid 10001); 23 Apr 2003 14:36:58 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 14:36:58 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198LLx-0006vE-L5 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 15:36:05 +0100 Received: from [130.244.199.132] (helo=fep04-svc.swip.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198LLp-0006v5-SB for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 15:35:57 +0100 Received: from oemcomputer ([213.101.38.70]) by fep04-svc.swip.net with SMTP id <20030423143556.HLGM22132.fep04-svc.swip.net@oemcomputer> for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 16:35:56 +0200 Message-ID: <001e01c309a5$fa66c9c0$9c2665d5@oemcomputer> From: "Johan Bodin" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <01C309A5.34411480.g4jnt@thersgb.net> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 16:37:43 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Andy, look for Micrometals. I believe they are the company that actually produces the cores sold by Amidon. 73 Johan SM6LKM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3132 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 13:37:38 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 13:37:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 12858 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 13:37:41 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: High Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 13:37:41 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198KNM-0006U4-Rp for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 14:33:28 +0100 Received: from [212.1.130.143] (helo=smtp-1.visp.telinco.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198KNH-0006Tv-41 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 14:33:23 +0100 Received: from [80.40.83.33] (helo=standalone) by smtp-1.visp.telinco.net with smtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 198KNG-0001Yd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 14:33:22 +0100 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 14:32:44 +0100 Message-ID: <01C309A5.34411480.g4jnt@thersgb.net> From: "Andy talbot" To: "Rsgb_Lf_Group \(E-mail\)" Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 14:32:11 +0100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: Amidon Cores (slightly diverging from topic) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.0 required=5.0tests=X_PRIORITY_HIGHversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Does anyone know of a UK supplier of Amidon iron dust cores - they may be called American Cores & Electronics now, according to the Amidon web page. The web is not too helpful at finding a UK stockist though. I need a lot of them for a (work based) design with many parallel channels of filtering, and for various bureaucratic reasons to do with importation, need to get them from a UK supplier. btw. I've discovered the published Al values for these, particularly for the T2 material (2 - 30MHz) is some way out from that shown in the ARRL handbook. Measured discrepancies of 10% to 30% seem to be common, so every coil has to be wound and measured to get to spec. Andy G4JNT From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29303 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 08:29:00 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 08:29:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 15966 invoked from network); 23 Apr 2003 08:28:48 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 23 Apr 2003 08:28:47 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198Fbp-0004nc-69 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 09:28:05 +0100 Received: from [134.58.240.42] (helo=rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198Fbk-0004nR-DJ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 09:28:00 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 201E31D7276 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:27:30 +0200 (CEST) Received: from antonius.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (antonius.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.240.73]) by rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB4191D720C for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:27:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: from dell-rik.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (pc-10-33-165-177.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [10.33.165.177]) by antonius.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98AD44C0D0 for ; Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:27:29 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030423101232.00b63240@u0019445.kuleuven.be> X-Sender: u0019445@u0019445.kuleuven.be X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 10:28:46 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" In-reply-to: <001201c30909$57ee5a60$fe02a8c0@base> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: by KULeuven Antivirus Cluster Subject: Re: LF: Important sperimantal revision of ohm's law Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.0 required=5.0tests=HTML_00_10,HTML_MESSAGE,IN_REP_TOversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
I believe the confusion relative to phase can be simply resolved. Adam said" I contend, as do all elementary text books regarding AC circuit analysis, that the voltage measured across a perfect resistor is perfectly "in phase" with the current flowing through that resistor. Period." You are wrong.
 
The relative phase relationship between current and voltage thru and on a resistor can be any value.

Most interesting ...
Would this mean that under certain circumstances the phase between voltage and current over/trough a resistor can be 90 degrees ?
In that case the power distribution industry would be very interested as this would allow transportation of electric energy without any losses.
If this is so I will inform the superconductor research group here at the university that it is about time for them to look for another research field as it is already possible to have a conductor that dissipates no power.

73, Rik  ON7YD


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1886 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 22:04:23 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 22:04:23 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 15819 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 22:04:11 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 22:04:10 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1985re-0002xU-NM for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 23:03:46 +0100 Received: from [165.212.11.111] (helo=cmsrelay02.mx.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 1985rZ-0002xL-LM for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 23:03:41 +0100 Received: from uadvg137.cms.usa.net (HELO localhost) (165.212.11.137) by cmsoutbound.mx.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 22:03:10 -0000 Received: from usa.net [213.217.179.124] by uadvg137.cms.usa.net (ASMTP/dibene@usa.net) via mtad (C8.MAIN.2.05) with ESMTP id 160HDVwDF0414M37; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:03:06 GMT Message-ID: <3EA5BB79.70104@usa.net> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 00:00:25 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <002a01c30909$cc0f0d40$fe02a8c0@base> Subject: Re: LF: Ohm's law revision (II) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------030900060707080708010709" X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.6 required=5.0tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_08,HTML_MESSAGE,MIME_HTML_ONLY, REFERENCES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------030900060707080708010709 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
More on phasing religion - the attachment is the PSpice version of the circuit Adam used to argue that the voltage across the inductor shifted 45 degrees in this circuit - and that is a true statement. He also said the current and the voltage across the output resistance was in phase. That is not a true statement. If any of you run the PSpice model attached you will see that the current thru the load resistor and the voltage across the resistor are not in phase. I leave it to you to post your results on this forum.
 
Ted &Georg
Yes,  I stand by my idea, it must have been a new type of grass....
This is the result of my simulation with Pspice of their circuit.
What do you judge the phase difference between voltage and current is ?

73  Alberto  I2PHD

     

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warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 21:55:22 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 11533 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 21:55:25 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 21:55:24 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1985iX-0002sN-Sr for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:54:21 +0100 Received: from [138.32.33.10] (helo=mailman1.ppco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1985iT-0002sE-1q for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:54:17 +0100 Received: from bvlw2k132.ppco.com (trend2.ppco.com [138.32.31.132]) by mailman1.ppco.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with SMTP id h3MLsFI7015068 for ; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 16:54:16 -0500 Received: from 138.32.31.56 by bvlw2k132.ppco.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Tue, 22 Apr 2003 16:54:15 -0500 Received: from bvlnotes07.ppco.com (bvlnotes07.ppco.com [138.32.54.38]) by mail1.ppco.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3MLsEr11876 for ; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 16:54:14 -0500 (CDT) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.8 June 18, 2001 Message-ID: From: "Laurence J Howell" Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 13:54:19 -0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BVLNOTES07/CIT/Phillips Petroleum/us(Release 5.0.7 |March 21, 2001) at 04/22/2003 04:54:14 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: Re: Important sperimantal revision of ohm's law Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Alberto di Bene Sent by: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org 04/22/2003 01:14 PM Any replies will be addressed to: rsgb_lf_group To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org cc: Subject: LF: Re: Important sperimantal revision of ohm's law Ted Hart apparently wrote : > The relative phase relationship between current and voltage thru and on a resistor can be any value. > What the text books say is that a resistor does not change the phase relative to the current applied to it. > It is the duty of a capacitor and inductor to change the phase of the current thru them, > the capacitor causes the current to lead, the inductor to lag. > Let me say that again - a resistor does not change the phase of the current flowing thru it, > but it will accept any arbitray phase of the current relative to the voltage. > [...] Hmmmm, I must investigate which kind of grass does grow where that Ted Hart lives.... It could make a pleasant smoking :-) 73 Alberto I2PHD I agree - what happens is the resistor is a large fraction of a wavelength long! Smoking Pure resistance isnt easy... You have to enhale in phase.... Laurence From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25595 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 21:42:35 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 21:42:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 9764 invoked by uid 10001); 22 Apr 2003 21:42:35 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 21:42:35 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1985Ws-0002gu-CN for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:42:18 +0100 Received: from [195.92.193.18] (helo=cmailm1.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1985Wn-0002gg-Qy for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:42:13 +0100 Received: from modem-1385.wolf.dialup.pol.co.uk ([81.76.133.105] helo=shack) by cmailm1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1985Wm-0006SU-W8 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:42:13 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:42:04 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c30918$078249b0$1400900a@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <001801c30852$df4223a0$e4ac8351@j1r9b7> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: RE: Re: First GM-YU QSO 136 KHz Completed! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.4 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Yep! Great fun and well worth his visit! I will be improving the ant too before winter! Thanks for the comments! Regards Simon -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Derek Atter Sent: 21 April 2003 22:49 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: First GM-YU QSO 136 KHz Completed! To Simon GM4PLM Congratulations Simon on making the first GM-YU QSO on 136KHz also to Teo YU7AR for his part. - You really seem to have got the bit between the teeth on 136KHz since David's visit!! Vy 73, Derek G3GRO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Lewis" To: Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2003 11:54 PM Subject: LF: First GM-YU QSO 136 KHz Completed! From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24850 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 21:41:59 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 21:41:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 3578 invoked by uid 10001); 22 Apr 2003 21:41:59 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 21:41:59 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1985W7-0002fz-U3 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:41:31 +0100 Received: from [195.92.193.19] (helo=cmailm3.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1985W3-0002fq-50 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:41:27 +0100 Received: from modem-1385.wolf.dialup.pol.co.uk ([81.76.133.105] helo=shack) by cmailm3.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1985W1-0005xz-PZ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:41:26 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:41:18 +0100 Message-ID: <000501c30917$ebd9c080$1400900a@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: RE: GM-YU QSO 136 KHz Completed! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.4 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Laurence Well I think this winter will be the best time from this far north. The Kp should be low by then so hopefully we can make some attempts Regards Simon -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Laurence J Howell Sent: 22 April 2003 00:04 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: GM-YU QSO 136 KHz Completed! Well done Simon! IF the winds die down a bit I should be back on line with the extended array "listening and looking" from 0600Z 22nd April....Im not expecting a lot given the present Kp etc - happy to get any signal - Laurence KL1X, Anchorage overcast 4C http://www.kl1x.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31496 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 21:25:35 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 21:25:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 23481 invoked by uid 10001); 22 Apr 2003 21:25:35 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 21:25:35 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1985G8-0002VV-2X for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:25:00 +0100 Received: from [165.212.11.111] (helo=cmsrelay02.mx.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 1985Ft-0002V4-MH for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:24:45 +0100 Received: from uadvg130.cms.usa.net (HELO localhost) (165.212.11.130) by cmsoutbound.mx.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 21:24:04 -0000 Received: from usa.net [213.217.175.94] by uadvg130.cms.usa.net (ASMTP/dibene@usa.net) via mtad (C8.MAIN.2.05) with ESMTP id 447HDVVyB0243M30; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 21:24:01 GMT Message-ID: <3EA5B0AA.4080303@usa.net> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 23:14:18 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001201c30909$57ee5a60$fe02a8c0@base> Subject: LF: Re: Important sperimantal revision of ohm's law Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.4 required=5.0tests=REFERENCES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Ted Hart apparently wrote : > The relative phase relationship between current and voltage thru and on a resistor can be any value. > What the text books say is that a resistor does not change the phase relative to the current applied to it. > It is the duty of a capacitor and inductor to change the phase of the current thru them, > the capacitor causes the current to lead, the inductor to lag. > Let me say that again - a resistor does not change the phase of the current flowing thru it, > but it will accept any arbitray phase of the current relative to the voltage. > [...] Hmmmm, I must investigate which kind of grass does grow where that Ted Hart lives.... It could make a pleasant smoking :-) 73 Alberto I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8718 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 21:25:35 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 21:25:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 6647 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 21:25:38 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 21:25:38 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1985Fx-0002VK-37 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:24:49 +0100 Received: from [165.212.11.112] (helo=cmsrelay03.mx.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 1985Fo-0002V3-V2 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:24:41 +0100 Received: from uadvg129.cms.usa.net (HELO localhost) (165.212.11.129) by cmsoutbound.mx.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 21:24:06 -0000 Received: from usa.net [213.217.175.94] by uadvg129.cms.usa.net (ASMTP/dibene@usa.net) via mtad (C8.MAIN.2.05) with ESMTP id 665HDVVye0234M29; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 21:24:05 GMT Message-ID: <3EA5B286.4000809@usa.net> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 23:22:14 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000701c3086a$a4d23120$0500a8c0@charter.net> <000f01c308b5$f7c08d00$0500a8c0@charter.net> <3EA52BAF.22C1DAB6@snet.net> <001201c308d7$ea0fca00$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> Subject: Re: LF: Argo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.0 required=5.0tests=QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > > >Yes, I have done this. You set the directory (folder for modern chaps), >filename and timing, push Enter and expect it to start capturing without >pushing the 'start' button. There are of course occasions when you would not >want to immediately start the captures, but perhaps a box could come up >asking whether you want to start capturing straight away. If would also help >if, when changing QRSS speed with capture on, the software prompted for a >change in capture timing (eg "Do you want to re-set the capture rate to one >screenful?"). > > > Mike, Jay and others, your words were not blowing in the wind... :-) thanks also to Alan who gave precious advices. 73 Alberto I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16052 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 20:05:04 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 20:05:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 27618 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 20:05:07 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 20:05:06 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19840G-000263-JW for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 21:04:32 +0100 Received: from [212.216.176.223] (helo=smtp3.cp.tin.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1983zB-00024s-1C for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 21:03:25 +0100 Received: from base (212.171.197.124) by smtp3.cp.tin.it (6.7.016) id 3E8D740200673B29 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:03:21 +0200 Message-ID: <002a01c30909$cc0f0d40$fe02a8c0@base> From: "ipsia" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:00:16 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Ohm's law revision (II) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------050000040805050405040607" X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------050000040805050405040607 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
-This is again on the new Ohm's law, but with the support of simulation
- to best undertand.
-'73 IK5ZPV
 
-----Messaggio originale-----
Da: Ted <ted@eh-antenna.com>
A: eh-antenna@yahoogroups.com <eh-antenna@yahoogroups.com>
Data: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 22:17
Oggetto: Re: [eh-antenna] Current and Voltage

 
Hi All,
 
More on phasing religion - the attachment is the PSpice version of the circuit Adam used to argue that the voltage across the inductor shifted 45 degrees in this circuit - and that is a true statement. He also said the current and the voltage across the output resistance was in phase. That is not a true statement. If any of you run the PSpice model attached you will see that the current thru the load resistor and the voltage across the resistor are not in phase. I leave it to you to post your results on this forum.
 
Please also post your result on the relative phase between the current and voltage across the 1 ohm resistor we used to simulate what the phase might be if the transmitter was followed by an attenuator to correct the phase. This is approximately an attenuation of 17 dB and there is still a significant phase between the voltage and current across the 1 ohm resistor.
 
Ted &George
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post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1983vu-00022y-4e for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 21:00:02 +0100 Received: from base (212.171.197.124) by smtp3.cp.tin.it (6.7.016) id 3E8D740200673730 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 22:00:01 +0200 Message-ID: <001201c30909$57ee5a60$fe02a8c0@base> From: "ipsia" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 21:56:58 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Important sperimantal revision of ohm's law Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=5.0tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: 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-----Messaggio originale-----
Da: Ted <ted@eh-antenna.com>
A: eh-antenna@yahoogroups.com <eh-antenna@yahoogroups.com>
Data: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 16:38
Oggetto: Re: [eh-antenna] Current and Voltage
 
- What follows is a reformulation of the Ohm's law.His sperimental base is the EH antenna
- invented by Ted Hart, author of this small tutorial.
- '73 IK5ZPV

I believe the confusion relative to phase can be simply resolved. Adam said" I contend, as do all elementary text books regarding AC circuit analysis, that the voltage measured across a perfect resistor is perfectly "in phase" with the current flowing through that resistor. Period." You are wrong.
 
The relative phase relationship between current and voltage thru and on a resistor can be any value. What the text books say is that a resistor does not change the phase relative to the current applied to it. It is the duty of a capacitor and inductor to change the phase of the current thru them, the capacitor causes the current to lead, the inductor to lag.
 
Let me say that again - a resistor does not change the phase of the current flowing thru it, but it will accept any arbitray phase of the current relative to the voltage.
 
This has nothing to do with religion, just basic theory.
 
The reason the EH Antenna works with the typical rice box is that those amplifiers are broadband. They use broadband transformers to try to get a 50 ohm output impedance, and the output signal remains in phase with the source resistance developed by the transistors. If you connect an EH Antenna to a rice box it works well. If you add an antenna tuner, the EH Antenna will no longer work due to the phase change caused by the tuner.
 
If your radio properly drives an EH Antenna, at some frequency it will have a low VSWR. That VSWR increases to a high value as the transmitter frequency is changed to approach the 3 dB bandwidth frequency. If you install a series network in the coax line comprised of a capacitor and a inductor that have equal reactance (series resonance), then adjustment of the network shifts the phase of the signal applied to the EH Antenna. At any frequency over the 3 dB bandwidth of the EH Antenna the network can be adjusted to provide a low VSWR. The series network is simply a phase shift network, and can be located at the transmitter to effectively remotely tune the EH Antenna.
 
This has nothing to do with displacement current - which is the means used to develop the H field in the antenna.
 
Is the phase of the signal applied to an EH Antenna important, or is it just a religious thing? If you want an EH Antenna to work, feed it with a signal than has the voltage and current in phase. If you only want a wet noodle, then feed the antenna with any arbitrary phase, and then tell me the EH Antenna is no good, and you will be right.
 
Ted   W5QJR

 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16845 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 19:47:37 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 19:47:37 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 2908 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 19:47:40 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 19:47:40 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1983hc-0001vW-GM for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 20:45:16 +0100 Received: from [212.216.176.223] (helo=smtp3.cp.tin.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1983hR-0001vL-Jo for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 20:45:05 +0100 Received: from base (212.171.197.132) by smtp3.cp.tin.it (6.7.016) id 3E8D7402006726D6; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 21:44:55 +0200 From: "valerio gabbani" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org, WarmSpgs@aol.com Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 21:41:53 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.1 References: <19a.13b7b1e1.2bd4dad9@aol.com> In-reply-to: <19a.13b7b1e1.2bd4dad9@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <200304222120.29878.valerio@dii.unisi.it> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Subject: Re: LF: Re: EH Loop (with off-topic addendum) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-25.4 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES, USER_AGENT_KMAILversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > Hi Valerio, > It may be interesting if you would post those details. I tried looking at > the www.eh-antennas.com web site recently, and was unable to get much from > it. The author is using features of Front Page 2000 that are not supported > in "antique" versions of Internet Explorer, like mine from 3 years ago. > Thanks. > > Now, a not-entirely-serious message-- >[..] John, if you want i can help you to spread your important and serious discovery translating your addendum for the Italian ARI magazine RadioRivista. But i'm not so able so i can only announce to this mailing list some important theoretical and experimental results achieved by others about antennas and radiation. '73 IK5ZPV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8634 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 18:14:45 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 18:14:45 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 16423 invoked by uid 10001); 22 Apr 2003 18:14:45 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 18:14:45 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1982HN-0001TH-Mm for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 19:14:05 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.9] (helo=hestia.herts.ac.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1982HI-0001T8-Tf for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 19:14:00 +0100 Received: from gemini ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini.herts.ac.uk) by hestia.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 1982HD-0006ig-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 19:13:55 +0100 Received: from [147.197.232.252] (helo=rsch-15.herts.ac.uk) by gemini.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 1982H2-0001MI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 19:13:44 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030422190340.024ecd78@gemini.herts.ac.uk> X-Sender: mj9ar@gemini.herts.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 19:13:43 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "James Moritz" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MailScanner: No Virus detected Subject: LF: GM3YXM last Sunday Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear LF Group, Was very pleased to work GM3YXM on 73kHz CW, a new 73kHz "country" from this station. The 73kHz band has been very quiet with no Rugby, and Loran was clearly audible. Also worked G3AQC on 73k, and G3KEV on 136, who I had not heard for a long time. I seem to have finally found all the bits of the station after packing and unpacking them for the trip to Porthcurno! Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8875 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 15:52:28 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 15:52:28 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 12687 invoked by uid 10001); 22 Apr 2003 15:52:28 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 15:52:28 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 198037-0000pL-VX for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 16:51:13 +0100 Received: from [204.60.203.69] (helo=mta3.snet.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 198032-0000pB-53 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 16:51:08 +0100 Received: from snet.net (12-209-21-79.client.attbi.com [12.209.21.79]) (authenticated bits=0) by mta3.snet.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/SNET-smtp-1.2/D-1.1.1.1/O-1.1.1.1) with ESMTP id h3MFow8F022959 for ; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 11:51:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3EA56593.EC30089F@snet.net> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 11:53:55 -0400 From: "Jay Rusgrove" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000701c3086a$a4d23120$0500a8c0@charter.net> <000f01c308b5$f7c08d00$0500a8c0@charter.net> <3EA52BAF.22C1DAB6@snet.net> <001201c308d7$ea0fca00$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> Subject: Re: LF: Argo + Question for Alan Melia Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-23.4 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Mike I like your suggestions for Argo. Although the changes would be nice, I can't blame Alberto if he doesn't want to spend his time making a fix for "operator induced errors"! Alan John Andrews and I have noticed an interesting phenomena with CT1DRPs signal this winter. We get an early reception window with a strong peak in his signal strength about 0230 - 0300 GMT. His signal then fades out (completely sometimes) and reappears at 0430 GMT and is in for the duration. This seems to be a very consistent pattern. Any thoughts? Jay Rusgrove, W1VD Mike Dennison wrote: > > Forgot to hit the "Start" button last night - DOH! -so no report this AM. > > I've noticed others have had this happen from time to time. Wonder if > Alberto > > could find a "fix" for this... > > Jay Rusgrove, W1VD > > Yes, I have done this. You set the directory (folder for modern chaps), > filename and timing, push Enter and expect it to start capturing without > pushing the 'start' button. There are of course occasions when you would not > want to immediately start the captures, but perhaps a box could come up > asking whether you want to start capturing straight away. If would also help > if, when changing QRSS speed with capture on, the software prompted for a > change in capture timing (eg "Do you want to re-set the capture rate to one > screenful?"). > > These are, of course, only suggestions to be implemented (or not) when > Alberto has the time and enthusiasm. They are not intended as criticism of > this most useful and very reasonably priced software. > > Mike, G3XDV > http://www.lf.thersgb.net > ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17484 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 14:02:35 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 14:02:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 9350 invoked by uid 10001); 22 Apr 2003 14:02:35 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 14:02:35 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197yL1-0000Dg-8w for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 15:01:35 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.45] (helo=mta05-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197yKr-0000DW-U8 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 15:01:26 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030422140125.IIT311.mta05-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 15:01:25 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c308d7$ea0fca00$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000701c3086a$a4d23120$0500a8c0@charter.net> <000f01c308b5$f7c08d00$0500a8c0@charter.net> <3EA52BAF.22C1DAB6@snet.net> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 15:03:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Argo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > Forgot to hit the "Start" button last night - DOH! -so no report this AM. > I've noticed others have had this happen from time to time. Wonder if Alberto > could find a "fix" for this... > Jay Rusgrove, W1VD Yes, I have done this. You set the directory (folder for modern chaps), filename and timing, push Enter and expect it to start capturing without pushing the 'start' button. There are of course occasions when you would not want to immediately start the captures, but perhaps a box could come up asking whether you want to start capturing straight away. If would also help if, when changing QRSS speed with capture on, the software prompted for a change in capture timing (eg "Do you want to re-set the capture rate to one screenful?"). These are, of course, only suggestions to be implemented (or not) when Alberto has the time and enthusiasm. They are not intended as criticism of this most useful and very reasonably priced software. Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19440 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 11:47:03 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 11:47:03 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 21042 invoked by uid 10001); 22 Apr 2003 11:47:03 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 11:47:03 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197wEP-0007uO-U4 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 12:46:37 +0100 Received: from [24.153.64.116] (helo=smtp-out.comcast.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197wEJ-0007tt-Je for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 12:46:31 +0100 Received: from snet.net (12-209-21-79.client.attbi.com [12.209.21.79]) by mtaout01.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HDQ00KYPTX0ZB@mtaout01.icomcast.net> for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 07:43:48 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 07:46:55 -0400 From: "Jay Rusgrove" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <3EA52BAF.22C1DAB6@snet.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en References: <000701c3086a$a4d23120$0500a8c0@charter.net> <000f01c308b5$f7c08d00$0500a8c0@charter.net> Subject: Re: LF: Re: TA 22 Apr Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Forgot to hit the "Start" button last night - DOH! -so no report this AM. I've noticed others have had this happen from time to time. Wonder if Alberto could find a "fix" for this... Jay Rusgrove, W1VD John Andrews wrote: > Conditions were actually better last night. Pieces of Brian's signal were > visible from 0150 to 0630 UTC. There was a strange gap between 0315 and 0415 > where Brian disappeared and my local Loran line got very bright. Haven't > figured that one out! > > The best shot was taken at 0515: > http://webpages.charter.net/w1tag/files/DRP0422.jpg > > John Andrews, W1TAG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27444 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 11:42:20 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 11:42:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 10343 invoked by uid 10001); 22 Apr 2003 11:42:20 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 11:42:20 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197w9N-0007oK-5M for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 12:41:25 +0100 Received: from [205.197.48.109] (helo=gemini.smart.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197w9A-0007o0-JN for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 12:41:12 +0100 Received: from dpc000 ([162.33.221.216]) by gemini.smart.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id HAA04550 for ; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 07:41:08 -0400 Message-ID: <000701c308c4$14c25c40$d8dd21a2@direcpc.com> From: "lloyd chastant" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 07:41:12 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: TA Apr22 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Overnite captures hr in Maryland show light traces at 0200z and 0400z with a nice capture at 0700z www.geocities.com/lacwman/137apr22.jpg www.geocities.com/lacwman/137apr22a.jpg www.geocities.com/lacwman/137apr22b.jpg de Lloyd W3NF FM19MH From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10422 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 11:00:10 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 11:00:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 15877 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 10:59:58 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 10:59:58 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197vUs-0007VV-Dy for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 11:59:34 +0100 Received: from [209.225.8.15] (helo=mx05.cluster1.charter.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197vUm-0007V1-I5 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 11:59:28 +0100 Received: from [66.189.53.206] (HELO johncellarnew) by mx05.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 105059991 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 06:58:52 -0400 Message-ID: <000f01c308b5$f7c08d00$0500a8c0@charter.net> From: "John Andrews" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000701c3086a$a4d23120$0500a8c0@charter.net> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 11:00:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: TA 22 Apr Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Conditions were actually better last night. Pieces of Brian's signal were visible from 0150 to 0630 UTC. There was a strange gap between 0315 and 0415 where Brian disappeared and my local Loran line got very bright. Haven't figured that one out! The best shot was taken at 0515: http://webpages.charter.net/w1tag/files/DRP0422.jpg John Andrews, W1TAG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6669 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 10:51:14 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 10:51:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 23372 invoked by uid 10001); 22 Apr 2003 10:51:14 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 10:51:14 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197vLD-0007Pi-Rh for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 11:49:35 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.46] (helo=mta6-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197vL6-0007PZ-HO for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 11:49:28 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.232.76]) by mta6-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030422104927.YPEB22800.mta6-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 11:49:27 +0100 Message-ID: <000201c308b4$67a97480$4ce8fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 20:13:06 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Easter Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.1 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_PAST_12_24,HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Some acty today Easter Monday. Worked GM3YXM on 136 khz then xband 72/136 khz then OK1DTN.
Early evening acty OK1DWF, I5TGC and OK2BVG on FSK. all good signals with me visual and aural.
I5TGC and OK1DWF called G3LDO but got no response, surprising considering the strength of their signals.
de G3KEV/IO94SH
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13378 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 02:27:40 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 02:27:40 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 10524 invoked by uid 10001); 22 Apr 2003 02:27:40 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 02:27:40 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197nUk-0004bb-Ee for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 03:26:54 +0100 Received: from [24.153.64.116] (helo=smtp-out.comcast.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197nUf-0004bS-NC for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 03:26:49 +0100 Received: from snet.net (12-209-21-79.client.attbi.com [12.209.21.79]) by mtaout01.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.12 (built Feb 13 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HDQ00EXB3MTYG@mtaout01.icomcast.net> for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 22:16:06 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 22:19:17 -0400 From: "Jay Rusgrove" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <3EA4A6A4.8CAB43AE@snet.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en References: <000701c3086a$a4d23120$0500a8c0@charter.net> Subject: Re: LF: TA 22 Apr Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.1 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Ditto here...could be a good night! Static not bad at the moment... Jay Rusgrove, W1VD John Andrews wrote: > Started seeing CT1DRP around 0150 UTC on 137773.6. Captures overnight at: > http://webpages.charter.net/w1tag/136-1.jpg > > John Andrews, W1TAG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5410 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 02:01:29 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 02:01:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 5147 invoked by uid 10001); 22 Apr 2003 02:01:29 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 02:01:29 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197n51-0004TM-LK for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 03:00:19 +0100 Received: from [209.225.8.12] (helo=dc-mx02.cluster1.charter.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197n4w-0004Sz-Fx for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 03:00:14 +0100 Received: from [66.189.53.206] (HELO johncellarnew) by dc-mx02.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 20582589 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 21:59:43 -0400 Message-ID: <000701c3086a$a4d23120$0500a8c0@charter.net> From: "John Andrews" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 02:01:01 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: TA 22 Apr Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Started seeing CT1DRP around 0150 UTC on 137773.6. Captures overnight at: http://webpages.charter.net/w1tag/136-1.jpg John Andrews, W1TAG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28600 invoked from network); 22 Apr 2003 00:28:20 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 00:28:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 8168 invoked by uid 10001); 22 Apr 2003 00:28:20 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 22 Apr 2003 00:28:20 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197lct-0003z9-PE for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 01:27:11 +0100 Received: from [63.171.43.2] (helo=ns2.genesis-technology.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197lco-0003z0-Tm for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 01:27:07 +0100 Received: from we0h ([65.165.20.192]) by ns2.genesis-technology.com (8.10.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id h3M0R0l31837 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 19:27:00 -0500 From: "WE0H" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 19:27:36 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: <000c01c3084f$68682480$0200a8c0@charter.net> Importance: Normal Subject: RE: LF: TA 21 April Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-15.3 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Ruufff!!! Mike>WE0H http://www.we0h.us/lf -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of John Andrews Sent: Monday, April 21, 2003 4:46 PM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: TA 21 April > Brian informed me a a few days ago that his TX was stripped down and he was > not active. It would appear that there is a PIRATE about using the call > CT1DRP. He indicated he would get in touch when back on air for a QSO. He did. I would not have been monitoring, otherwise. Restrain yourself. John Andrews From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12435 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 23:13:45 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 23:13:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 3892 invoked by uid 10001); 21 Apr 2003 23:07:05 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 23:07:05 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197kMa-0003Uf-LJ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 00:06:16 +0100 Received: from [205.158.62.79] (helo=smtp2.us4.outblaze.com) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 197kMV-0003TA-Jx for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 00:06:11 +0100 Received: (qmail 27075 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 23:05:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO e500) (Mike?Staines?email.com@64.185.140.143) by 205-158-62-79.outblaze.com with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 23:05:29 -0000 From: "Mike Staines" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 19:05:28 -0400 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <19a.13b7b1e1.2bd4dad9@aol.com> Subject: LF: RE: Re: EH Loop (with off-topic addendum) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.2 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Somewhere in John's amusing note he said: > Perhaps it would be too much to ask of our patent offices to > require proof > that an invention actually works, but I wish we could at least > return to the > days when it was not possible to patent and re-patent techniques already > known to the state of the art (in this case, electrically short > verticals and > dipoles), simply by virtue of sticking a new name on them or > claiming a new > theory of operation. Reminded me of the joke: How many Microsoft engineers does it take to change a light bulb? None. They simply declare darkness to be a new standard. > So what, then, does an EH/CFA antenna emit instead? Particles of > phlogiston, > that's what. And you can't prove otherwise. Ergo, it must be > just as true > as the radiation claims of those same antenna systems. My own investigations have indicated that this is probably true. Like BuckminsterFullerenes (http://www.ornl.gov/ORNLReview/rev26-2/text/rndmain1.html), Phlogiston was thought not to exist but in fact is everywhere. You can produce it in your own home. Take any electronic circuit. Plug it in and turn it on. Now, use a screwdriver and start prying parts from the circuit board. Between the flashes of light you will see clouds of Phlogiston being released. I believe that it is this Phlogiston that works it's way to the antennas to be radiated in puffs. The frequency of the puffs is so high that the action is indiscernible. Mike wa1ptc From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20890 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 23:08:55 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 23:08:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 16951 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 23:08:58 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 23:08:58 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197kOX-0003Y9-1l for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 00:08:17 +0100 Received: from [63.171.43.2] (helo=ns2.genesis-technology.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197kOO-0003Xh-HK for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 00:08:08 +0100 Received: from we0h ([65.165.20.192]) by ns2.genesis-technology.com (8.10.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id h3LN82l27410 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 18:08:02 -0500 From: "WE0H" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 18:08:37 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: <19a.13b7b1e1.2bd4dad9@aol.com> Importance: Normal Subject: LF: RE: Re: EH Loop (with off-topic addendum) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-18.4 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,ONLY_COST, ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Go back to sleep John. You're thinking too hard. Mike>WE0H http://www.we0h.us/lf -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of WarmSpgs@aol.com Sent: Monday, April 21, 2003 12:26 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: EH Loop (with off-topic addendum) In a message dated 4/20/03 6:37:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, valerio@dii.unisi.it writes: >> It seem there is onother device for radiating on 137 kHz, it is the EH loop from the same original mind of the inventor of EH antenna. Now a small loop (how ?) can radiate RF energy with (of course) almost 100% efficiency. I an post the details of operation as described by authors on his special forum on EH antenna. >> Hi Valerio, It may be interesting if you would post those details. I tried looking at the www.eh-antennas.com web site recently, and was unable to get much from it. The author is using features of Front Page 2000 that are not supported in "antique" versions of Internet Explorer, like mine from 3 years ago. Thanks. Now, a not-entirely-serious message-- A couple of things I did find amusing on the EH home page, however, are statements such as: "For more than 120 years all antennas have been Hertz antennas, except the Crossed Field Antenna." (I wonder how Signor Marconi feels about that?) And: "In the future all antennas will be EH Antennas. How can this bold statement have any basis in fact?" (Simplest answer: it can't have, unless we sneak into all homes, offices, and libraries around the world and change the dictionary definition of "basis" or "fact," or perhaps "antennas.") I suspect the latter is what is being suggested, in a way, because of what follows: "Fortunately, any antenna can be converted to an EH Antenna with a minimum of effort." (Oh look out, here it comes.) "We have filed an additional patent clarifying the scope of the original patent, extending it's (sic) coverage such that any antenna can be converted to an EH Antenna and be under the umbrella of the patent." (Ah-ha! Now we're getting somewhere. Be careful how you construct your plain everyday 'Hertz' antenna, neighbours, or it may infringe a patent!) Perhaps it would be too much to ask of our patent offices to require proof that an invention actually works, but I wish we could at least return to the days when it was not possible to patent and re-patent techniques already known to the state of the art (in this case, electrically short verticals and dipoles), simply by virtue of sticking a new name on them or claiming a new theory of operation. However, since such is currently the case, I am busily preparing a patent of my own for a broadly useful homogeneous mixture of nitrogen, oxygen, carbon dioxide, and similar gaseous molecules that I call "Air." My claims are far more substantial than those for any miracle antenna one cares to name, as I can cite support for my concepts from such past fellow geniuses as Boyle, Newton, Lavoisier, Bernoulli, and many others. And if I get away with that--or perhaps more to the point, if I DON'T get away with that--I will proceed to patent my next great invention, Air II (tm). Even more useful than regular air, Air II (tm) contains the miracle ingredient Phlogiston! Yes, thought to be a myth ever since the discovery of oxygen, phlogiston is real. I have hard data which, if you flog yourself long enough with them, will eventually persuade you that it is indeed easier to believe in phlogiston than to go on flogging yourself with massive hardbound volumes of data. Where did I find this elusive substance that has for so long eluded the best minds of science? Here's the beauty part, as our Canadian friends might say. It is a byproduct of the near-field zone of EH and CFA antennas! Consider: It is well established scientific fact that all electromagnetic radiations are dual in nature, behaving simultaneously as particles and waves. You'll notice that the modern miracle antennas all claim to synthesize electromagnetic waves from separate electric and magnetic fields. Yet they all remain strangely silent on the question of duality. Whence come photons when you synthesize a Poynting vector in free space? Answer: They don't. Only accelerated electric charges (or else subatomic particles that suddenly find themselves trying to violate the speed of light in a non-vacuum medium) can emit photons. So what, then, does an EH/CFA antenna emit instead? Particles of phlogiston, that's what. And you can't prove otherwise. Ergo, it must be just as true as the radiation claims of those same antenna systems. I have yet to test the EH Loop myself, but I expect to be able to develop it so thoroughly that it not only generates phlogiston-bearing Air II (tm), but also simultaneously pumps it into tanks, vats, retorts, beakers, flasks, flagons, crackerbarrels, hogsheads, demijohns, jeroboams or other containers of my choosing, through the well-established principle of magnetohydrodynamics (MHD). Therefore, I am herewith serving notice that if you have any future plans to use Air or Air II (tm) for purposes including, but not limited to, breathing, speaking, whispering, snoring, singing, flatulence, playing musical instruments, listening to any of the aforementioned types of sound, inflating tyres, cooling spoonsful of soup, cleaning computer keyboards, furthering the process of combustion (whether for purposes of cooking, heating, cooling, welding, cutting, waste disposal, sterilization, transportation, power generation, ingestion of nicotine or other psychoactive substances, insurance fraud, or vindictive arson), producing derivative products (i.e., industrial gases or their refrigerated liquid condensates), keeping aircraft aloft (winged heavenly messengers excepted), or any other use whatsoever, you should immediately apply to me for a suitable licence. Then kindly hold your breath until your application has been approved. You'll find me a most reasonable master. Triumph Motorcycles, for instance, can satisfy their licence obligation by shipping me one specimen of any new or upgraded model in each of the Sport, Touring, and Classic product ranges each year. Other commercial and industrial users will pay one UK penny per tonne of Air used, or twice that for Air II (tm). And you'd best believe I'll be monitoring factory emissions for any trace of phlogiston, to verify that all are paying their fair share. The rest of mankind will pay a special rate for private individuals of only one penny each per year. I realise this portion of the royalties will only net me US$90 million annually; but being the great humanitarian I am, I don't want to get greedy and unduly burden the great masses of everyday humanity. After all, they'll need a little something left over to pay the licence fee on my other fabulous, patentable new invention: Food. Your most 'umble servant, John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25472 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 23:04:57 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 23:04:57 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 23382 invoked by uid 10001); 21 Apr 2003 23:04:57 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 23:04:57 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197kKM-0003Rf-4j for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 00:03:58 +0100 Received: from [138.32.33.140] (helo=mailman2.ppco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197kKH-0003RW-8W for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 22 Apr 2003 00:03:53 +0100 Received: from bvlw2k132.ppco.com (trend2.ppco.com [138.32.31.132]) by mailman2.ppco.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with SMTP id h3LN3plw020521 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 18:03:52 -0500 Received: from 138.32.31.56 by bvlw2k132.ppco.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Mon, 21 Apr 2003 18:03:50 -0500 Received: from bvlnotes07.ppco.com (bvlnotes07.ppco.com [138.32.54.38]) by mail1.ppco.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3LN3oR10998 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 18:03:50 -0500 (CDT) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.8 June 18, 2001 Message-ID: From: "Laurence J Howell" Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 15:03:55 -0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BVLNOTES07/CIT/Phillips Petroleum/us(Release 5.0.7 |March 21, 2001) at 04/21/2003 06:03:50 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: GM-YU QSO 136 KHz Completed! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Well done Simon! IF the winds die down a bit I should be back on line with the extended array "listening and looking" from 0600Z 22nd April....Im not expecting a lot given the present Kp etc - happy to get any signal - Laurence KL1X, Anchorage overcast 4C http://www.kl1x.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9507 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 22:15:45 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 22:15:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 3603 invoked by uid 10001); 21 Apr 2003 22:15:45 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 22:15:45 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197jVw-00038N-SW for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 23:11:52 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.81] (helo=tungsten.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197jVp-00038E-3E for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 23:11:45 +0100 Received: from dial81-131-172-228.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([81.131.172.228] helo=j1r9b7) by tungsten.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 197jVo-0005mK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 23:11:44 +0100 Message-ID: <001801c30852$df4223a0$e4ac8351@j1r9b7> From: "Derek Atter" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <048801c3078f$d6c94be0$1400900a@shack> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 22:49:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: First GM-YU QSO 136 KHz Completed! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.7 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false To Simon GM4PLM Congratulations Simon on making the first GM-YU QSO on 136KHz also to Teo YU7AR for his part. - You really seem to have got the bit between the teeth on 136KHz since David's visit!! Vy 73, Derek G3GRO ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Lewis" To: Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2003 11:54 PM Subject: LF: First GM-YU QSO 136 KHz Completed! From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31358 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 21:45:23 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 21:45:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 19534 invoked by uid 10001); 21 Apr 2003 21:45:23 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 21:45:23 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197j4b-0002z2-QR for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 22:43:37 +0100 Received: from [209.225.8.24] (helo=dc-mx14.cluster1.charter.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197j4Q-0002yt-M6 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 22:43:26 +0100 Received: from [66.189.53.206] (HELO johnupstairs) by dc-mx14.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 102489405 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 17:42:47 -0400 Message-ID: <000c01c3084f$68682480$0200a8c0@charter.net> From: "John Andrews" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <002a01c307ee$56549320$0500a8c0@charter.net> <3EA3F6D7.72CF22EE@att.net> <003d01c3082b$b4308340$c8e4fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 17:46:03 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: TA 21 April Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > Brian informed me a a few days ago that his TX was stripped down and he was > not active. It would appear that there is a PIRATE about using the call > CT1DRP. He indicated he would get in touch when back on air for a QSO. He did. I would not have been monitoring, otherwise. Restrain yourself. John Andrews From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 X-NortonAV-TimeoutProtection: 0 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10692 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 18:32:14 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 18:32:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 9847 invoked by uid 10001); 21 Apr 2003 18:32:14 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 18:32:14 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197g4M-0001ym-AN for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 19:31:10 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.46] (helo=mta6-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197g45-0001yd-KL for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 19:30:53 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.232.53]) by mta6-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030421183052.ICT22800.mta6-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 19:30:52 +0100 Message-ID: <003d01c3082b$b4308340$c8e4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <002a01c307ee$56549320$0500a8c0@charter.net> <3EA3F6D7.72CF22EE@att.net> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 18:30:04 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: TA 21 April Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.5 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dexter McIntyre" To: Sent: Monday, April 21, 2003 2:49 PM Subject: Re: LF: TA 21 April > No copy in Qrnland. > Dex > > > John Andrews wrote: > > > > Copied some of CT1DRP's dfcw signal overnight from 0400 to almost 0600 > > UTC. Here's most of an ID from around 0500: Brian informed me a a few days ago that his TX was stripped down and he was not active. It would appear that there is a PIRATE about using the call CT1DRP. He indicated he would get in touch when back on air for a QSO. de Mal/G3KEV > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 30510 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 18:22:41 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 18:22:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 11896 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 18:22:29 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 18:22:29 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197fur-0001rZ-Kz for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 19:21:21 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197fuj-0001rQ-Pn for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 19:21:13 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.200]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030421182112.FODA6822.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 19:21:12 +0100 Message-ID: <000801c3082a$5a462160$c8e4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30692$f02d5340$3ae4fc3e@l8p8y6> <001601c3071d$302ce340$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> <000701c3072b$2c510040$33e086d4@erica> <000701c30758$0d3fb020$98e8fc3e@l8p8y6> <001c01c3077c$f27fb260$d2c828c3@erica> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 18:20:19 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Masts Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.5 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "g3ldo" To: Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2003 9:38 PM Subject: LF: Masts > . > I have had a week or so off from LF and computers to go and work as a > volunteer guide and ship keeper on board the replica of the HM Bark > Endeavour at Shoreham by Sea harbour. The purpose of bringing it up on the > this reflector was to express my admiration for the 1750s technology of the > wooden masts. > The main and fore masts are 128ft (39m) and 110ft (33.5m) high respectively > and constructed in three sections with a large overlap at the two joins. > There is a platform at each join called 'tops' for spreading the shrouds to > the higher sections of the mast. > The masts are guyed to the sides of the ship with very thick ropes called > 'shrouds', to which thin horizontal 'ratlines' are fixed to make it easy for > the crew to go aloft. > I found going aloft was quite an experience. The shrouds are under > considerable tension and the feel more secure than climbing a ladder at the > side of the house. The exciting bit is climbing the overhang (futtock > shrouds) to get on to the tops. While I was up there the crew were setting > the fore mainsail on our minicruise. I think that I would have to be more > used to heights before going out on the yardarm, which must be very exciting > in heavy weather. > No, they wouldn't let me use the masts for a portable LF station. > There are some pictures on my web site. MONKEY MAN You might recall that a long time ago on this reflector I mentioned a project that I was involved in away back around 1965. I was a project engineer at Caneowden near South End on Sea involved at the Marconi site directing operations at the old radar site that contained some 300 feet wooden masts. We had a MONKEY MAN that climbed these masts to install antennas as required and he had a callsign G3L - - and I cannot remember the full call and wondered if it was G3LDO. The above message from G3LDO might indicate that he was the MONKEY because of his experience at this sort of climbing and I must say that indeed he was good. I would say if this is the same man, he could climb and dangle from any mast. fixed station or marine even in spite of age. He must surely be getting on but obviously not lost the touch !! Some morse practice would be an advantage, suppose you cannot be good at everything. G3KEV > > Regards, > Peter, G3LDO > > e-mail > > Web > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7333 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 16:14:57 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 16:14:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 27979 invoked by uid 10001); 21 Apr 2003 16:14:56 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 16:14:56 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197dt3-0001E5-AT for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 17:11:21 +0100 Received: from [165.212.11.112] (helo=cmsrelay03.mx.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 197dsr-0001Dw-LO for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 17:11:09 +0100 Received: from uadvg131.cms.usa.net (HELO localhost) (165.212.11.131) by cmsoutbound.mx.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 16:10:35 -0000 Received: from usa.net [213.217.182.7] by uadvg131.cms.usa.net (ASMTP/dibene@usa.net) via mtad (C8.MAIN.2.05) with ESMTP id 724HDuqkh0254M31; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 16:10:34 GMT Message-ID: <3EA417F4.5050105@usa.net> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 18:10:28 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <19a.13b7b1e1.2bd4dad9@aol.com> Subject: LF: Re: EH Loop (with off-topic addendum) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-18.9 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,REFERENCES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false WarmSpgs@aol.com wrote: >A couple of things I did find amusing on the EH home page, however, are >statements such as: "For more than 120 years all antennas have been Hertz >antennas, except the Crossed Field Antenna." (I wonder how Signor Marconi >feels about that?) > >And: "In the future all antennas will be EH Antennas. How can this bold >statement have any basis in fact?" (Simplest answer: it can't have, unless >we sneak into all homes, offices, and libraries around the world and change >the dictionary definition of "basis" or "fact," or perhaps "antennas.") >[...] > > John, ROTFL !! It's incredible how every now and then, self-taught men raise their heads and declare Einstein's Relativity invalid (see the series of Ivor Catt mails about fifteen years ago to Wireless World), or reinvent once more the perpetual motion, or the CFA/EH antennas. But we need those jokers, otherwise life would be so dull ! 73 Alberto I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9761 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 13:50:57 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 13:50:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 3184 invoked by uid 10001); 21 Apr 2003 13:50:57 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 13:50:57 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197bgA-0000cr-Fu for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 14:49:54 +0100 Received: from [166.82.181.250] (helo=dustmac.dustinmcintyre.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197bg5-0000ci-AH for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 14:49:49 +0100 Received: from att.net (computer1 [10.0.252.101]) by dustmac.dustinmcintyre.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3LDnJC00961 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:49:19 -0400 Message-ID: <3EA3F6D7.72CF22EE@att.net> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:49:11 -0400 From: "Dexter McIntyre" Organization: W4DEX X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.8 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <002a01c307ee$56549320$0500a8c0@charter.net> Subject: Re: LF: TA 21 April Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false No copy in Qrnland. Dex > John Andrews wrote: > > Copied some of CT1DRP's dfcw signal overnight from 0400 to almost 0600 > UTC. Here's most of an ID from around 0500: > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19439 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 13:30:42 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 13:30:42 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 8276 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 13:30:45 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 13:30:45 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197bMT-0000Uu-BA for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 14:29:33 +0100 Received: from [204.60.203.69] (helo=mta3.snet.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197bMO-0000Ul-Dk for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 14:29:28 +0100 Received: from snet.net (12-209-21-79.client.attbi.com [12.209.21.79]) (authenticated bits=0) by mta3.snet.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/SNET-smtp-1.2/D-1.1.1.1/O-1.1.1.1) with ESMTP id h3LDTR8F025227 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:29:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3EA3F2E4.15F1AF0A@snet.net> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:32:20 -0400 From: "Jay Rusgrove" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <002a01c307ee$56549320$0500a8c0@charter.net> <5.2.0.9.2.20030421123711.01ea5d80@pop.vianw.pt> Subject: Re: LF: TA 21 April Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.1 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Brian Once you experience it , you can't live without it! I consider it to be one of my best investments. Will be interesting to try T/A from time to time during the "fringe" of the season. I'm sure the middle of summer would be pointless. Thunderstorm alley - Ohio south to the Gulf of Mexico - makes for very noisy reception once the Tstorms get cranked up for the season. Jay Brian Rogerson wrote: > Hi Jay > > Much better than I expected. > > This is what your advice on the Z3801A has done! And > I am not regretting having bought one as you predicted! > > 73, Brian CT1DRP > > At 13:19 21/04/2003, you wrote: > >Jay Rusgrove From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6454 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 12:45:14 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 12:45:14 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 6297 invoked by uid 10001); 21 Apr 2003 12:45:14 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 12:45:14 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197aeQ-0000Fh-Rx for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 13:44:02 +0100 Received: from [195.22.0.29] (helo=jubilee.esoterica.pt) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197aeL-0000FY-I5 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 13:43:57 +0100 Received: from slave-5.esoterica.pt (sjm066.esoterica.pt [195.22.17.194]) by jubilee.esoterica.pt (8.12.3/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3LCSe88016570 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 13:29:33 +0100 Message-ID: <5.2.0.9.2.20030421123711.01ea5d80@pop.vianw.pt> X-Sender: NX4YWV@vianw.pt@pop.vianw.pt X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 12:41:46 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Brian Rogerson" In-reply-to: <3EA3E1E1.7BCC31DB@snet.net> References: <002a01c307ee$56549320$0500a8c0@charter.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: TA 21 April Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.9 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Jay Much better than I expected. This is what your advice on the Z3801A has done! And I am not regretting having bought one as you predicted! 73, Brian CT1DRP At 13:19 21/04/2003, you wrote: >Jay Rusgrove From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18708 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 12:18:14 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 12:18:14 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 11339 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 12:18:02 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 12:18:02 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197aEI-00005V-14 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 13:17:02 +0100 Received: from [204.60.203.69] (helo=mta3.snet.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197aEC-00005M-Ur for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 13:16:57 +0100 Received: from snet.net (12-209-21-79.client.attbi.com [12.209.21.79]) (authenticated bits=0) by mta3.snet.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/SNET-smtp-1.2/D-1.1.1.1/O-1.1.1.1) with ESMTP id h3LCGp8F016968 for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 08:16:55 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3EA3E1E1.7BCC31DB@snet.net> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 08:19:45 -0400 From: "Jay Rusgrove" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <002a01c307ee$56549320$0500a8c0@charter.net> Subject: Re: LF: TA 21 April Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Brian Started seeing your signal about 0330. Appeared to be in there pretty steady until it abruptly dropped out around 0500. Conditions were pretty noisy at my location. Captures (albeit not great) below: http://www.advancedreceiver.com/capture/137042103-1.jpg http://www.advancedreceiver.com/capture/137042103-2.jpg Jay From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24954 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 11:12:26 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 11:12:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 19464 invoked by uid 10001); 21 Apr 2003 11:12:26 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 11:12:26 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197ZC0-0008DW-Jd for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 12:10:36 +0100 Received: from [209.225.8.30] (helo=remt20.cluster1.charter.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197ZBv-0008DI-58 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 12:10:31 +0100 Received: from [66.189.53.206] (HELO johncellarnew) by remt20.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.6) with SMTP id 14493732 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 07:09:52 -0400 Message-ID: <002a01c307ee$56549320$0500a8c0@charter.net> From: "John Andrews" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 11:11:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: TA 21 April Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------050407070805050709010804" X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.1 required=5.0tests=EXTRA_MPART_TYPE,HTML_30_40,HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_10,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------050407070805050709010804 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Copied some of CT1DRP's dfcw signal overnight from 0400 to almost 0600 UTC. Here's most of an ID from around 0500:
 
I don't think the next two nights will be productive here, due to incoming weather. The static crashes were pretty rough last night.
 
John Andrews, W1TAG
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--------------050407070805050709010804-- From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8781 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 08:48:24 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 08:48:24 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 12677 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 08:41:31 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 08:41:31 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197Wr6-0007cK-7M for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:40:52 +0100 Received: from [64.12.136.5] (helo=imo-m02.mx.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197Wr1-0007cB-A8 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:40:47 +0100 Received: from DL4YHF@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.22.) id l.1a5.12b43bb6 (4246) for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 04:40:12 -0400 (EDT) From: DL4YHF@aol.com Message-ID: <1a5.12b43bb6.2bd5086c@aol.com> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 04:40:12 EDT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 for Windows XP sub 50 Subject: LF: Re: EH Loop (with off-topic addendum) Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.3 required=5.0tests=HTML_00_10,HTML_MESSAGE,MIME_LONG_LINE_QP,NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hi John,

Fantastic ! The addendum puts a bright light on all this EH-CFA-hype/nonsense which can be seen in a lot of places (even in a german radio amateur mag).


About your addendum (which IMO is not off-topic, see below):

With you being a great humanitarian, how about a special bargain price for the members of this reflector, at least while your patent rights for Air, Air II (tm), etc are still pending ?

Reason: I have the bad feeling that my (conventional non-EH) LF antenna produces lots of the smelly derivative of phlogiston under certain conditions [a mix of Oh-Three(tm) and Enn-Oh-Two(tm)], so maybe I have already infringed the patents of your phenomenal invention - whithout knowing about it. Ashes over my head, and I promise never to do it again.

Happy easter and thanks again,
 Wolf
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28469 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 08:11:24 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 08:11:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 20619 invoked by uid 10001); 21 Apr 2003 08:11:24 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 08:11:23 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197WNy-0007Nt-7h for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:10:46 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.47] (helo=mta7-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197WNt-0007Nk-0T for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:10:41 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.204.61]) by mta7-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030421081038.BCKL27609.mta7-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:10:38 +0100 Message-ID: <000301c307d5$0d3f8140$3dccfc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30692$f02d5340$3ae4fc3e@l8p8y6> <001501c30778$8330f6c0$60c6b5d4@ekholm> Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 20:53:25 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: SV: REAL CW Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.2 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_PAST_12_24,HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2003 9:07 PM
Subject: LF: SV: REAL CW

Mal,
 
So there is low activity on 136 afterall !!!!!!!!!  Then how do you think it is "up" here in SM ? I have about 3 stations (that I know of) within a radius of 250km. To Denmark it is 500km which equals the distance between London and Edinburgh. Within this radius I could imagine that there is below 10 stations more or less active.
The lack of activity was the reason for sending a mail to the reflector on april 17 concerning a try to concentrate the activity to certain times. This mail has been completely ignored on the reflector so I thought this was no problem and that the band was always crowded and I (and my receiver) are totally deaf although DCF is 25-30dB over S9 !!!!
 
Unfortunately I can only be QRV on LF from my summer-QTH due to space and noise problems. Until today I have been out there about 8 weekends this year, listening and calling CQ for hours each time, only broken up by coffee break. This has resulted in that I have worked all the stations I have heard with a grand total of one (1) QSO and that was DL2HRE which was worked in january. Except from these 8 weekends that I have been listening/CQ-ing, I have also only listened a number of times when we have been there without having heard one single station ! I have tried saturday/sunday mornings and afternoons. Maybe I have been unlucky, but one QSO in 4 months is just too little to keep the interest on the high side.
 
Mal, I agree with you that it is often unnecessary to use QRSS. When I worked RU6LA (on QRSS, my one and only QRSS-QSO) last year (abt 2000km from me) he was perfectly audibly readable so a normal CW-QSO would have been perfectly possible (he also heard me) and had been a distance record for me on normal CW. Besides with normal CW you don't need to sit at the rig all the time, not so with QRSS, just turn up the volume a bit, not much is needed as our ears are "programmed" to hearing CQ:s, even very weak ones. As a matter of fact, last autumn (when the activity seemed a lot better) I actually heard a station calling CQ through the wall when I was outside the house in the garden. I went to the rig and just worked him.
 
Now the low activity has solved itself very easily for me as the antenna has fallen down.
 
73 de SM5EUF / Urban in JO78SQ 
I will look out for you when around the shack. Like you I can hear the signals with the speaker on when around the house. No need to be glued to a SCREEN on qrs. I hope you get your antenna back up soon.I have worked 2 other SM stations on 136 khz CW.
 
73 and gl de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH
 
 
 
 

 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28455 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 08:11:24 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 08:11:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 27039 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 08:11:26 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 08:11:26 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197WNq-0007Ng-IJ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:10:38 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.47] (helo=mta7-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197WNh-0007NX-4q for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:10:29 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.204.61]) by mta7-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030421081027.BCIJ27609.mta7-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:10:27 +0100 Message-ID: <000201c307d5$06cc8100$3dccfc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30692$f02d5340$3ae4fc3e@l8p8y6> <001601c3071d$302ce340$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> <000701c3072b$2c510040$33e086d4@erica> Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 20:46:42 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: REAL CW Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.3 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_PAST_12_24,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "g3ldo" To: Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2003 11:44 AM Subject: LF: Re: Re: REAL CW > > > > I was working newcomer John, G3JRL, in Weymouth, who was 549. During the > QSO > > someone whose callsign is old enough that he should know better called CQ > > twice over the top at S9. He then seemingly deliberately wobbled his VFO > > back and forth across the frequency, defeating my attempts to use filters > to > > fix the problem. > > > > Does that sound familiar to some of the old hands on 136kHz? > > Yes it does. It was that sort of practice that caused John, G4GVC, to give > up LF some years ago. I thought he gave up because of the QRM from the south with exploding FETS in the BK amplifiers and later key clicks from the replacement DECCA JEEPS, incorrectly keyed and blowing more FETS and still going on. Its COMICAL. G3KEV > > Regards, > Peter, G3LDO > > e-mail > > Web > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24100 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 08:05:06 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 08:05:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 15287 invoked by uid 10001); 21 Apr 2003 08:05:06 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 08:05:05 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197WHQ-0007Jf-Q5 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:04:00 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.46] (helo=mta06-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197WHM-0007JW-24 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:03:56 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030421080354.MAK12018.mta06-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:03:54 +0100 Message-ID: <004a01c307dc$ce8db9a0$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30692$f02d5340$3ae4fc3e@l8p8y6> <001501c30778$8330f6c0$60c6b5d4@ekholm> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 09:05:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: SV: REAL CW Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.1 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false SM5EUF wrote: So there is low activity on 136 afterall !!!!!!!!! Then how do you think it is "up" here in SM ? I have about 3 stations (that I know of) within a radius of 250km. To Denmark it is 500km which equals the distance between London and Edinburgh. Within this radius I could imagine that there is below 10 stations more or less active. The lack of activity was the reason for sending a mail to the reflector on april 17 concerning a try to concentrate the activity to certain times. This mail has been completely ignored on the reflector so I thought this was no problem and that the band was always crowded and I (and my receiver) are totally deaf although DCF is 25-30dB over S9 !!!! Unfortunately I can only be QRV on LF from my summer-QTH due to space and noise problems. Until today I have been out there about 8 weekends this year, listening and calling CQ for hours each time, only broken up by coffee break. This has resulted in that I have worked all the stations I have heard with a grand total of one (1) QSO and that was DL2HRE which was worked in january. Now the low activity has solved itself very easily for me as the antenna has fallen down. ======== Urban, There is CW activity every weekend, and some weekdays. Just take a look at my web site to see what I hear in between monitoring for QRSS. I have heard you calling CQ and have called you many times. I have also heard several German stations calling you. Perhaps you suffer from local noise? There are several UK stations with much higher ERP than me that you should be able to hear. Maybe some skeds would help. Your recent e-mail suggested some times to concentrate activity, but these are already times when there is activity, so perhaps that is why you did not get any comments. I wish you better luck next winter. Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2620 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 05:28:19 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 05:28:19 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 28050 invoked from network); 21 Apr 2003 05:28:22 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 21 Apr 2003 05:28:21 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197Tp0-0006iA-Al for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 06:26:30 +0100 Received: from [64.12.136.161] (helo=imo-m06.mx.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197Tov-0006hu-6q for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 06:26:25 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id l.19a.13b7b1e1 (4410) for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 01:25:45 -0400 (EDT) From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <19a.13b7b1e1.2bd4dad9@aol.com> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 01:25:45 EDT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Language: en X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 120 Subject: LF: Re: EH Loop (with off-topic addendum) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.3 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,MIME_LONG_LINE_QP,NO_REAL_NAME,ONLY_COSTversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false In a message dated 4/20/03 6:37:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, valerio@dii.unisi.it writes: >> It seem there is onother device for radiating on 137 kHz, it is the EH loop from the same original mind of the inventor of EH antenna. Now a small loop (how ?) can radiate RF energy with (of course) almost 100% efficiency. I an post the details of operation as described by authors on his special forum on EH antenna. >> Hi Valerio, It may be interesting if you would post those details. I tried looking at the www.eh-antennas.com web site recently, and was unable to get much from it. The author is using features of Front Page 2000 that are not supported in "antique" versions of Internet Explorer, like mine from 3 years ago. Thanks. Now, a not-entirely-serious message-- A couple of things I did find amusing on the EH home page, however, are statements such as: "For more than 120 years all antennas have been Hertz antennas, except the Crossed Field Antenna." (I wonder how Signor Marconi feels about that?) And: "In the future all antennas will be EH Antennas. How can this bold statement have any basis in fact?" (Simplest answer: it can't have, unless we sneak into all homes, offices, and libraries around the world and change the dictionary definition of "basis" or "fact," or perhaps "antennas.") I suspect the latter is what is being suggested, in a way, because of what follows: "Fortunately, any antenna can be converted to an EH Antenna with a minimum of effort." (Oh look out, here it comes.) "We have filed an additional patent clarifying the scope of the original patent, extending it’s (sic) coverage such that any antenna can be converted to an EH Antenna and be under the umbrella of the patent." (Ah-ha! Now we're getting somewhere. Be careful how you construct your plain everyday 'Hertz' antenna, neighbours, or it may infringe a patent!) Perhaps it would be too much to ask of our patent offices to require proof that an invention actually works, but I wish we could at least return to the days when it was not possible to patent and re-patent techniques already known to the state of the art (in this case, electrically short verticals and dipoles), simply by virtue of sticking a new name on them or claiming a new theory of operation. However, since such is currently the case, I am busily preparing a patent of my own for a broadly useful homogeneous mixture of nitrogen, oxygen, carbon dioxide, and similar gaseous molecules that I call "Air." My claims are far more substantial than those for any miracle antenna one cares to name, as I can cite support for my concepts from such past fellow geniuses as Boyle, Newton, Lavoisier, Bernoulli, and many others. And if I get away with that--or perhaps more to the point, if I DON'T get away with that--I will proceed to patent my next great invention, Air II (tm). Even more useful than regular air, Air II (tm) contains the miracle ingredient Phlogiston! Yes, thought to be a myth ever since the discovery of oxygen, phlogiston is real. I have hard data which, if you flog yourself long enough with them, will eventually persuade you that it is indeed easier to believe in phlogiston than to go on flogging yourself with massive hardbound volumes of data. Where did I find this elusive substance that has for so long eluded the best minds of science? Here's the beauty part, as our Canadian friends might say. It is a byproduct of the near-field zone of EH and CFA antennas! Consider: It is well established scientific fact that all electromagnetic radiations are dual in nature, behaving simultaneously as particles and waves. You'll notice that the modern miracle antennas all claim to synthesize electromagnetic waves from separate electric and magnetic fields. Yet they all remain strangely silent on the question of duality. Whence come photons when you synthesize a Poynting vector in free space? Answer: They don't. Only accelerated electric charges (or else subatomic particles that suddenly find themselves trying to violate the speed of light in a non-vacuum medium) can emit photons. So what, then, does an EH/CFA antenna emit instead? Particles of phlogiston, that's what. And you can't prove otherwise. Ergo, it must be just as true as the radiation claims of those same antenna systems. I have yet to test the EH Loop myself, but I expect to be able to develop it so thoroughly that it not only generates phlogiston-bearing Air II (tm), but also simultaneously pumps it into tanks, vats, retorts, beakers, flasks, flagons, crackerbarrels, hogsheads, demijohns, jeroboams or other containers of my choosing, through the well-established principle of magnetohydrodynamics (MHD). Therefore, I am herewith serving notice that if you have any future plans to use Air or Air II (tm) for purposes including, but not limited to, breathing, speaking, whispering, snoring, singing, flatulence, playing musical instruments, listening to any of the aforementioned types of sound, inflating tyres, cooling spoonsful of soup, cleaning computer keyboards, furthering the process of combustion (whether for purposes of cooking, heating, cooling, welding, cutting, waste disposal, sterilization, transportation, power generation, ingestion of nicotine or other psychoactive substances, insurance fraud, or vindictive arson), producing derivative products (i.e., industrial gases or their refrigerated liquid condensates), keeping aircraft aloft (winged heavenly messengers excepted), or any other use whatsoever, you should immediately apply to me for a suitable licence. Then kindly hold your breath until your application has been approved. You'll find me a most reasonable master. Triumph Motorcycles, for instance, can satisfy their licence obligation by shipping me one specimen of any new or upgraded model in each of the Sport, Touring, and Classic product ranges each year. Other commercial and industrial users will pay one UK penny per tonne of Air used, or twice that for Air II (tm). And you'd best believe I'll be monitoring factory emissions for any trace of phlogiston, to verify that all are paying their fair share. The rest of mankind will pay a special rate for private individuals of only one penny each per year. I realise this portion of the royalties will only net me US$90 million annually; but being the great humanitarian I am, I don't want to get greedy and unduly burden the great masses of everyday humanity. After all, they'll need a little something left over to pay the licence fee on my other fabulous, patentable new invention: Food. Your most 'umble servant, John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14813 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2003 22:55:48 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 22:55:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 9834 invoked by uid 10001); 20 Apr 2003 22:55:48 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 22:55:48 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197Ni9-00059z-Rw for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 23:55:01 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.173] (helo=cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197Ni5-00059o-94 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 23:54:57 +0100 Received: from modem-604.snake.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.114.92] helo=shack) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197Ni4-0005fZ-3l for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 23:54:56 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 23:54:45 +0100 Message-ID: <048801c3078f$d6c94be0$1400900a@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: First GM-YU QSO 136 KHz Completed! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Thanks to the good ears of Teo YU7AR we completed the first GM - YU LF QSO on 136 KHz at 2228 UTC on 20th April 2003. Teo was received in GM with a good signal with O report. He had some noise and gave me an M report. Thanks to Teo for his hard work and making this first possible. I look forward to many more firsts from GM! Regards Simon GM4PLM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14083 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2003 22:47:41 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 22:47:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 6334 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2003 22:47:43 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 22:47:43 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197NaN-00055L-73 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 23:46:59 +0100 Received: from [210.86.15.145] (helo=mta202-rme.xtra.co.nz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197NaH-00055C-QC for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 23:46:54 +0100 Received: from mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz ([210.86.15.142]) by mta202-rme.xtra.co.nz with ESMTP id <20030420224620.MDAK15385.mta202-rme.xtra.co.nz@mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz> for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 10:46:20 +1200 Received: from quaycustomer ([210.86.52.251]) by mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz with SMTP id <20030420224619.YKA8633.mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz@quaycustomer> for ; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 10:46:19 +1200 Message-ID: <002c01c3078f$80f0fa60$3f01a8c0@quaycustomer> From: "Vernall" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <200304210033.27654.valerio@dii.unisi.it> Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 10:52:19 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: EH Loop Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > I an post the details of operation as described by authors on his special forum on EH antenna. I'll be interested to see if it is categorised as a dummy load? 73, Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24506 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2003 22:37:51 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 22:37:51 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 1660 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2003 22:37:53 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 22:37:53 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197NQR-0004yd-3w for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 23:36:43 +0100 Received: from [212.216.176.222] (helo=smtp2.cp.tin.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197NQL-0004yU-Of for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 23:36:37 +0100 Received: from base (212.171.197.111) by smtp2.cp.tin.it (6.7.016) id 3E8BFB87006F0FF4 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 21 Apr 2003 00:36:22 +0200 From: "valerio gabbani" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 00:33:27 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <200304210033.27654.valerio@dii.unisi.it> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Subject: LF: EH Loop Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0tests=USER_AGENT_KMAILversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi all, It seem there is onother device for radiating on 137 kHz, it is the EH loop from the same original mind of the inventor of EH antenna. Now a small loop (how ?) can radiate RF energy with (of course) almost 100% efficiency. I an post the details of operation as described by authors on his special forum on EH antenna. '73 Valerio (IK5ZPV) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8968 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2003 20:35:10 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 20:35:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 1990 invoked by uid 10001); 20 Apr 2003 20:35:10 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 20:35:10 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197LVz-0004TA-Sv for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 21:34:19 +0100 Received: from [212.135.6.12] (helo=smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197LVu-0004T1-MP for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 21:34:14 +0100 Received: from tnt-5-210.easynet.co.uk ([195.40.200.210] helo=erica) by smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net with smtp (Exim 4.10) id 197LVs-000L3h-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 21:34:14 +0100 Message-ID: <001c01c3077c$f27fb260$d2c828c3@erica> From: "g3ldo" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30692$f02d5340$3ae4fc3e@l8p8y6> <001601c3071d$302ce340$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> <000701c3072b$2c510040$33e086d4@erica> <000701c30758$0d3fb020$98e8fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 21:38:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Masts Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false . I have had a week or so off from LF and computers to go and work as a volunteer guide and ship keeper on board the replica of the HM Bark Endeavour at Shoreham by Sea harbour. The purpose of bringing it up on the this reflector was to express my admiration for the 1750s technology of the wooden masts. The main and fore masts are 128ft (39m) and 110ft (33.5m) high respectively and constructed in three sections with a large overlap at the two joins. There is a platform at each join called 'tops' for spreading the shrouds to the higher sections of the mast. The masts are guyed to the sides of the ship with very thick ropes called 'shrouds', to which thin horizontal 'ratlines' are fixed to make it easy for the crew to go aloft. I found going aloft was quite an experience. The shrouds are under considerable tension and the feel more secure than climbing a ladder at the side of the house. The exciting bit is climbing the overhang (futtock shrouds) to get on to the tops. While I was up there the crew were setting the fore mainsail on our minicruise. I think that I would have to be more used to heights before going out on the yardarm, which must be very exciting in heavy weather. No, they wouldn't let me use the masts for a portable LF station. There are some pictures on my web site. Regards, Peter, G3LDO e-mail Web From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5679 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2003 20:10:22 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 20:10:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 1632 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2003 20:10:08 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 20:10:08 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197L70-0004Ii-MJ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 21:08:30 +0100 Received: from [212.78.193.245] (helo=smtp01.spray.se) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197L6u-0004IZ-PZ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 21:08:24 +0100 Received: from urban (t5o940p96.telia.com [212.181.198.96]) by smtp01.spray.se (Postfix) with SMTP id 75EFE7351E for ; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 23:08:12 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001501c30778$8330f6c0$60c6b5d4@ekholm> From: "Urban Ekholm" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30692$f02d5340$3ae4fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 22:07:46 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: SV: REAL CW Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.4 required=5.0tests=HTML_10_20,HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCES,SUBJ_ALL_CAPSversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Mal,
 
So there is low activity on 136 afterall !!!!!!!!!  Then how do you think it is "up" here in SM ? I have about 3 stations (that I know of) within a radius of 250km. To Denmark it is 500km which equals the distance between London and Edinburgh. Within this radius I could imagine that there is below 10 stations more or less active.
The lack of activity was the reason for sending a mail to the reflector on april 17 concerning a try to concentrate the activity to certain times. This mail has been completely ignored on the reflector so I thought this was no problem and that the band was always crowded and I (and my receiver) are totally deaf although DCF is 25-30dB over S9 !!!!
 
Unfortunately I can only be QRV on LF from my summer-QTH due to space and noise problems. Until today I have been out there about 8 weekends this year, listening and calling CQ for hours each time, only broken up by coffee break. This has resulted in that I have worked all the stations I have heard with a grand total of one (1) QSO and that was DL2HRE which was worked in january. Except from these 8 weekends that I have been listening/CQ-ing, I have also only listened a number of times when we have been there without having heard one single station ! I have tried saturday/sunday mornings and afternoons. Maybe I have been unlucky, but one QSO in 4 months is just too little to keep the interest on the high side.
 
Mal, I agree with you that it is often unnecessary to use QRSS. When I worked RU6LA (on QRSS, my one and only QRSS-QSO) last year (abt 2000km from me) he was perfectly audibly readable so a normal CW-QSO would have been perfectly possible (he also heard me) and had been a distance record for me on normal CW. Besides with normal CW you don't need to sit at the rig all the time, not so with QRSS, just turn up the volume a bit, not much is needed as our ears are "programmed" to hearing CQ:s, even very weak ones. As a matter of fact, last autumn (when the activity seemed a lot better) I actually heard a station calling CQ through the wall when I was outside the house in the garden. I went to the rig and just worked him.
 
Now the low activity has solved itself very easily for me as the antenna has fallen down.
 
73 de SM5EUF / Urban in JO78SQ 
 
 
 
Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2003 6:43 PM
Subject: LF: REAL CW

    I call CQ at times on 137.2 khz using real CW, but seldom get a reply although recently I did get a couple of replies from DL and OZ. Their observations are that there is too much QRS and not enough real CW like there used to be.
Most of those that used to be active on LF and are now QRT have gone because of the lack of CW. Why does the LAZY MANS mode prevail when most of those using QRS are good enough signals to work normal CW. All the UA stns active so far including UA9 are all audible with me and could be worked on CW. Its too easy on QRS just using a finger on the keyboard and sitting back watching. Even those with ASYMETRICAL EARS surely could manage the odd CW qso.
G3KEV
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 532 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2003 17:16:51 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 17:16:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 19723 invoked by uid 10001); 20 Apr 2003 17:16:51 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 17:16:51 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197IPs-0003XE-TN for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 18:15:48 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197IPo-0003X5-7S for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 18:15:44 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.232.152]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030420171542.ILUR6822.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 18:15:42 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c30758$097b5520$98e8fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30692$f02d5340$3ae4fc3e@l8p8y6> <001601c3071d$302ce340$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 15:33:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: REAL CW Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.9 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Dennison" To: Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2003 10:14 AM Subject: LF: Re: REAL CW > G3KEV wrote: > >Most of those that used to be active on LF and are now QRT > >have gone because of the lack of CW. Why does the LAZY > >MANS mode prevail when most of those using QRS are good > >enough signals to work normal CW. > > I often call CQ using normal CW, despite the location of my shack making it > difficult to concentrate on CW amongst all of the family noises. However, an > experience this morning reminded me of why several of us were put off CW > some years ago. > > I was working newcomer John, G3JRL, in Weymouth, who was 549. During the QSO > someone whose callsign is old enough that he should know better called CQ > twice over the top at S9. He then seemingly deliberately wobbled his VFO > back and forth across the frequency, defeating my attempts to use filters to > fix the problem. > > Does that sound familiar to some of the old hands on 136kHz? > > I'm going back to QRSS where I can multi-task, coexist with the family > noises and gain several dB at the same time. When I called CQ this morning the freq was clear, G3JRL was not audible at my qth, I did however hear you later but you were working well outside my filter b/width (20 hz). There was someone else tuning up fairly strong probably resonating an antenna , and I did hear this going on earlier in the week for long periods. Probably your friend G3LDO burning the damp out of his wet coil, my loop indicated the qrm South from me. There was not a trace of G3JRL but ON6ND was 599, DK7SU 559, F6BWO 539, DL1EIE 579 all worked and YU7AR 559 not worked this time but worked before on CW. As you say you are probably better of on QRS the morse sending is BETTER !! G3KEV > Mike, G3XDV > http://www.lf.thersgb.net > ==================== > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4686 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2003 17:16:49 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 17:16:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 23612 invoked by uid 10001); 20 Apr 2003 17:16:48 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 17:16:48 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197IPz-0003XR-0w for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 18:15:55 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197IPu-0003XI-BX for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 18:15:50 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.232.152]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030420171549.ILVK6822.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 18:15:49 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c30758$0d3fb020$98e8fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30692$f02d5340$3ae4fc3e@l8p8y6> <001601c3071d$302ce340$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> <000701c3072b$2c510040$33e086d4@erica> Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 17:14:46 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: REAL CW Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.5 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "g3ldo" To: Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2003 11:44 AM Subject: LF: Re: Re: REAL CW > > > > I was working newcomer John, G3JRL, in Weymouth, who was 549. During the > QSO > > someone whose callsign is old enough that he should know better called CQ > > twice over the top at S9. He then seemingly deliberately wobbled his VFO > > back and forth across the frequency, defeating my attempts to use filters > to > > fix the problem. > > > > Does that sound familiar to some of the old hands on 136kHz? > > Yes it does. It was that sort of practice that caused John, G4GVC, to give > up LF some years ago. This is strange coming from the COMIC man, who just admitted in a recent message that he works CW in the QRS part of the band creating HAVOC, also pse check yiour Decca keying, for key clicks, not nice for others on the band trying to work weak dx stations. Thank You de G3KEV > > Regards, > Peter, G3LDO > > e-mail > > Web > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12834 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2003 10:50:00 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 10:50:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 7134 invoked by uid 10001); 20 Apr 2003 10:50:00 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 10:50:00 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197CNW-000204-Bp for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 11:48:58 +0100 Received: from [212.135.6.13] (helo=smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197CNR-0001zv-RD for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 11:48:53 +0100 Received: from tnt-18-51.easynet.co.uk ([212.134.224.51] helo=erica) by smarthost3.mail.uk.easynet.net with smtp (Exim 4.10) id 197CNR-000Ahw-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 11:48:53 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c3072b$2c510040$33e086d4@erica> From: "g3ldo" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30692$f02d5340$3ae4fc3e@l8p8y6> <001601c3071d$302ce340$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 11:44:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: REAL CW Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.4 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > > I was working newcomer John, G3JRL, in Weymouth, who was 549. During the QSO > someone whose callsign is old enough that he should know better called CQ > twice over the top at S9. He then seemingly deliberately wobbled his VFO > back and forth across the frequency, defeating my attempts to use filters to > fix the problem. > > Does that sound familiar to some of the old hands on 136kHz? Yes it does. It was that sort of practice that caused John, G4GVC, to give up LF some years ago. Regards, Peter, G3LDO e-mail Web From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10674 invoked from network); 20 Apr 2003 09:13:42 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 09:13:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 22072 invoked by uid 10001); 20 Apr 2003 09:13:42 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 20 Apr 2003 09:13:42 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 197Arz-0001ci-K2 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 10:12:19 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.46] (helo=mta06-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 197Arq-0001cZ-9C for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 10:12:10 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030420091209.CWOG12018.mta06-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Sun, 20 Apr 2003 10:12:09 +0100 Message-ID: <001601c3071d$302ce340$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30692$f02d5340$3ae4fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 10:14:03 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: REAL CW Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.1 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false G3KEV wrote: >Most of those that used to be active on LF and are now QRT >have gone because of the lack of CW. Why does the LAZY >MANS mode prevail when most of those using QRS are good >enough signals to work normal CW. I often call CQ using normal CW, despite the location of my shack making it difficult to concentrate on CW amongst all of the family noises. However, an experience this morning reminded me of why several of us were put off CW some years ago. I was working newcomer John, G3JRL, in Weymouth, who was 549. During the QSO someone whose callsign is old enough that he should know better called CQ twice over the top at S9. He then seemingly deliberately wobbled his VFO back and forth across the frequency, defeating my attempts to use filters to fix the problem. Does that sound familiar to some of the old hands on 136kHz? I'm going back to QRSS where I can multi-task, coexist with the family noises and gain several dB at the same time. Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4795 invoked from network); 19 Apr 2003 18:14:06 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 19 Apr 2003 18:14:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 25900 invoked from network); 19 Apr 2003 18:13:53 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 19 Apr 2003 18:13:53 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196wpT-0005t3-UQ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 19 Apr 2003 19:12:47 +0100 Received: from [212.135.6.11] (helo=smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196wpP-0005su-AF for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 19 Apr 2003 19:12:43 +0100 Received: from tnt-2-211.easynet.co.uk ([195.40.196.211] helo=erica) by smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net with smtp (Exim 4.10) id 196wpM-000Bkj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 19 Apr 2003 19:12:42 +0100 Message-ID: <000001c3069f$f862d820$d3c428c3@erica> From: "g3ldo" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000201c3058c$45093ee0$f9e4fc3e@l8p8y6> <001601c305dd$95539520$f2d0fc3e@ian> Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 14:33:05 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: BK amps Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.3 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_PAST_03_06,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Ian, In the early days of 73kHz many of us were using the BK amplifier and during these experiments in trying to get maximum power into the antenna many fuses and FETs were blown. Lech Laszkiewicz, G3KAU, made a series of modifications to provide protection and monitoring of the FETs in the BK amplifier while experimenting with antennas. These mods were described in the revised edition of 'The LF Experimenter's Source Book', the forerunner of 'The Low Frequency Experimenter's Handbook' While browsing through the source book I came across the reprint of the Nov 1997 RadCom article, which described the first QRSS test. The test transmission by G4JNT in Southhampton, using an output power of 1mW and 80 sec dots on 73kHz, was received by G3PLX in Kendal, Cumbria, a distance of 393km. The technique seemed rather esoteric at the time and little did we realise it would be come the dominant mode on LF. Regards, Peter, G3LDO e-mail Web From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31934 invoked from network); 19 Apr 2003 17:47:52 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 19 Apr 2003 17:47:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 27858 invoked by uid 10001); 19 Apr 2003 17:47:52 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 19 Apr 2003 17:47:52 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196wOb-0005cz-8g for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 19 Apr 2003 18:45:01 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.44] (helo=mta4-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196wOR-0005cn-Ld for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 19 Apr 2003 18:44:51 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.58]) by mta4-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030419174450.GYHT11888.mta4-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Sat, 19 Apr 2003 18:44:50 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c30692$f02d5340$3ae4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 17:43:57 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: REAL CW Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=5.0tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
    I call CQ at times on 137.2 khz using real CW, but seldom get a reply although recently I did get a couple of replies from DL and OZ. Their observations are that there is too much QRS and not enough real CW like there used to be.
Most of those that used to be active on LF and are now QRT have gone because of the lack of CW. Why does the LAZY MANS mode prevail when most of those using QRS are good enough signals to work normal CW. All the UA stns active so far including UA9 are all audible with me and could be worked on CW. Its too easy on QRS just using a finger on the keyboard and sitting back watching. Even those with ASYMETRICAL EARS surely could manage the odd CW qso.
G3KEV
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18845 invoked from network); 18 Apr 2003 20:09:00 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 18 Apr 2003 20:09:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 7554 invoked from network); 18 Apr 2003 20:08:47 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 18 Apr 2003 20:08:47 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196c6Y-0001FR-He for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 21:05:02 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.47] (helo=mta7-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196c6T-0001FE-Jb for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 21:04:57 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.208.242]) by mta7-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030418200455.YHHN27609.mta7-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 21:04:55 +0100 Message-ID: <001601c305dd$95539520$f2d0fc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000201c3058c$45093ee0$f9e4fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 20:05:24 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Mystery.....penultimate part Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.5 required=5.0tests=HTML_10_20,HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Mal,
 
Things are not complicated in the way you imply.. The earthing system is the kind of thing that us suburban non-agriculturists have to devise and put up with, and as I said in previous posting I have been so far been unable to persuade the thing to accept the 4/50 matching transformer or I wouldn't be fulminating on the reflector about it.
Now,  you keep telling me  yourself that my sigs are adequate, and M0BMU reckons that things are fairly respectable, so there is probably little real point in seeking those last few milliamps. I am not interested in being the biggest signal on the band or swelling Viridian (NIE) profits running big TXs, nor chasing DX. The challenge from the day I first heard about the possibility of an LF allocation back in 1994 or 5 and decided to go for the A licence to be able to get on 73, has always been to see what could be done from a 60ft x 40ft back garden with what was readily available and without getting  into QRO or 'cheque-book radio'  territory .  But there is a puzzle in what I have found,  like an itch you can't scratch, so I asked for ideas - scrapping what I have and starting again is not solving the problem and not, in my opinion, in the true spirit of amateur radio, self-training and experimentation.
I am not really all that interested in 136KHz except that  like Mike XDV , I can provide an 'ordinary' station for T/A tests and be on occasionally if any DX chaser is rabid for GI, and once 73KHz goes I will need a deal of persuading to carry on on LF. I have had to sacrifice all my VHF/UHF and satellite antennas to get enough space to put up the LF antenna, and there is still the challenge of  'single antenna'  moonbounce to try for before the deterioration in my physical condition makes antenna work too difficult.
Here endeth the Easter sermon.
 
73,
 
Ian GI8AYZ/MI0AYZ
 
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26722 invoked from network); 18 Apr 2003 18:23:10 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 18 Apr 2003 18:23:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 4556 invoked from network); 18 Apr 2003 18:23:12 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 18 Apr 2003 18:23:12 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196aVK-0000sm-Tx for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 19:22:30 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.173] (helo=cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196aVD-0000sd-14 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 19:22:23 +0100 Received: from modem-4058.tiger.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.223.218] helo=shack) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196aVC-00089N-3B for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 19:22:22 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 19:22:20 +0100 Message-ID: <041601c305d7$76dc9160$1400900a@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: <000e01c305c8$16e4d740$57d1fc3e@l8p8y6> Subject: LF: RE: Re: Lf activity Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-7.0 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTE_TWICE_1version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Mal said 'mind the sheep' Actually it should be mind the fires! I am about 5 km from 20KM squre currently on fire - the sky is obscured with smoke and outside is very foggy looking but its actually smoke - smells like a 1000 bonfires! Not very nice - v disconcerting! Regards Simon GM4PLM -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of hamilton mal Sent: 18 April 2003 17:28 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Lf activity ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Lewis" To: Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2003 7:45 PM Subject: LF: Lf activity > Still looking for 136 KHz skeds rather than random from GM. > > If you want to try please email > > Regards > > Simon GM4PLM Hi Simon. GM3YXM/Galloway and MM0ALM/Aberdeen have worked just about everyone around. There might be the odd one around EU but the majority seem to just call CQ for the odd QSO and you could be lucky. 73 de Mal/G3KEV > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28133 invoked from network); 18 Apr 2003 17:34:47 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 18 Apr 2003 17:34:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 7929 invoked from network); 18 Apr 2003 17:34:34 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 18 Apr 2003 17:34:34 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196ZjV-0000dU-OT for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 18:33:05 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.46] (helo=mta6-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196ZjR-0000dL-2g for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 18:33:01 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.209.87]) by mta6-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030418173300.LPIH22800.mta6-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 18:33:00 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c305c8$1d829100$57d1fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030416171800.024fab68@gemini.herts.ac.uk> <001b01c30503$d01d7ca0$1b00a8c0@dellboy> Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 17:31:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: GM 73kHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.5 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Pick" To: Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2003 6:07 PM Subject: Re: LF: GM 73kHz > > Jim and Ian etc... > > OK I will take the 73k gear (no great hardship, I left the coil there last > time) and try to be on the air on Sunday afternoon and/or Monday. I will > have the mobile phone, 07976 833 839 so we can arrange a sked. Hi Dave. If I get time I will resonate the system on 73 khz, if not I could work u xband 73/136 khz. I have two antennas that can be resonated on either band ie TX on one band and RX the other or vice versa. Have fun up there and watch the sheep !! 73 de Mal/G3KEV > > Cheers. > Dave > G3YXM. > > > > At 23:31 12/04/2003 +0100, you wrote: > > >Dear all. > > > > > >I will be paying another visit to the New Galloway QTH (IO75WC) on easter > > >Sunday/Monday. I could take the 73k gear if anyone is interested in a > test > > >but I won't bother unless there's some interest. > > >Rugby seems to be off again.... > > > > > >73 > > >Dave G3YXM. > > Dear Dave, > > > > I would like to try for a QSO on 73k over easter - don't think M0BMU has > > worked GM on this band yet! Looking at the RSGB headlines, it would seem > > that Rugby is likely to stay off forever... > > > > Cheers, Jim Moritz > > 73 de M0BMU > > > > > > > > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27326 invoked from network); 18 Apr 2003 17:33:53 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 18 Apr 2003 17:33:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 29838 invoked from network); 18 Apr 2003 17:33:56 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 18 Apr 2003 17:33:56 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196ZjL-0000dH-FT for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 18:32:55 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.46] (helo=mta6-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196ZjF-0000d8-U8 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 18:32:50 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.209.87]) by mta6-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030418173249.LPFC22800.mta6-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 18:32:49 +0100 Message-ID: <000e01c305c8$16e4d740$57d1fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <013501c30511$975949e0$1400900a@shack> Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 17:28:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Lf activity Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.3 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Lewis" To: Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2003 7:45 PM Subject: LF: Lf activity > Still looking for 136 KHz skeds rather than random from GM. > > If you want to try please email > > Regards > > Simon GM4PLM Hi Simon. GM3YXM/Galloway and MM0ALM/Aberdeen have worked just about everyone around. There might be the odd one around EU but the majority seem to just call CQ for the odd QSO and you could be lucky. 73 de Mal/G3KEV > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16392 invoked from network); 18 Apr 2003 10:29:11 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 18 Apr 2003 10:29:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 17108 invoked by uid 10001); 18 Apr 2003 10:29:11 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 18 Apr 2003 10:29:11 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196T34-0007lw-5N for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 11:24:50 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.42] (helo=mta2-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196T2t-0007ln-Ue for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 11:24:40 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.249]) by mta2-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030418102438.IXWQ1184.mta2-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Fri, 18 Apr 2003 11:24:38 +0100 Message-ID: <000201c3058c$45093ee0$f9e4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 18:25:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Mystery Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_PAST_12_24,HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Ian. What a complicated business. Keep it simple and put a series capacitor of several Mfd in series with the RF output,
then a matching transformer from 4 ohms to 50 ohms, use 50 ohm coax to the loading coil at the base of the antenna. Adjust this coil for resonance and 50 ohm matching and I would be surprised if you had any more problems. Disregard any other advice from some quarters, because when they were using the BK amps their sigs were pathetic until they got the DJ.
Tuning for max SMOKE is NOT the way to proceed. With the above suggestions you will be able to use a normal sensitive SWR bridge and know exactly how you stand. This method avoids blowing FETS or FUSES quicker than you replace them.
de G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6055 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 20:56:06 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 20:56:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 14631 invoked by uid 10001); 17 Apr 2003 20:56:05 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 20:56:05 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196GPj-0005U3-Hi for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 21:55:23 +0100 Received: from [212.135.6.12] (helo=smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196GPe-0005Tu-DJ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 21:55:18 +0100 Received: from tnt-2-130.easynet.co.uk ([195.40.196.130] helo=erica) by smarthost2.mail.uk.easynet.net with smtp (Exim 4.10) id 196GPd-0000kp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 21:55:17 +0100 Message-ID: <000501c30524$547c4e20$82c428c3@erica> From: "g3ldo" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000c01c30503$7e0c9360$55e9fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 21:59:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: DX AGN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Mal said: ------------------- RN6BN good sig at 1733 GMT and other DX about throughout the afternoon/evening. Two YU stns plus OK and and DL plus G3LDO working YU7DP who was using qrs 10 and LDO qrs3. YU7DP earlier using qrs3 and perfect copy here. I worked YU7AR on normal CW , solid copy both ways. All EU stns active are at least 559 with me on normal CW. ------------------------- A few days ago I put out a QRS3 CQ and a station called me that I read as YU7DW. The signal was not very stable and drifted into a Loran line, which is why I missed the last letter. I asked the station to QSY 5HI and go QRS10, which he did. Unfortunately, by that time conditions had worsened. When he called me this time I guess that he felt that QRS10 would be best although conditions were much better than before and that QRS3 would have been fine. As the QSO was going well - if a bit slow- I decided to leave things as they were. On the 12th I worked RU6LA and he indicated that CW might work as the signals were so good. I heard his signal and gave him 449 but I did not get my report. In the meantime YU7AR called on CW and we had a QSO. All this happened on 137.7kHz. I had learned from previous experiance of transmitting the 'wrong' mode in the designated sub band was a hanging offence so I kept quiet about it. Quick QSYs are difficult here. We have had no rain for several weeks and ground is drier than I have ever known it during an LF season. The result is that the ground resistance has gone very low (around 20 ohms) and although this has resulted in higher antenna currents the antenna tuning is very sharp and a QSY down of 100Hz requires an antenna retune, which can't be done from the shack Regards, Peter, G3LDO e-mail Web From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5714 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 18:46:48 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 18:46:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 17947 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 18:46:51 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 18:46:51 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196EOj-0004uz-M4 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 19:46:13 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.171] (helo=cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196EOe-0004un-W5 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 19:46:09 +0100 Received: from modem-3878.zebra.dialup.pol.co.uk ([81.76.159.38] helo=shack) by cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196EOe-0003NQ-BI for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 19:46:08 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 19:45:55 +0100 Message-ID: <013501c30511$975949e0$1400900a@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Lf activity Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Still looking for 136 KHz skeds rather than random from GM. If you want to try please email Regards Simon GM4PLM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5126 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 18:42:33 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 18:42:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 1677 invoked by uid 10001); 17 Apr 2003 18:42:33 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 18:42:33 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196EKV-0004qa-DC for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 19:41:51 +0100 Received: from [212.78.193.245] (helo=smtp01.spray.se) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196EKQ-0004qR-Cb for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 19:41:46 +0100 Received: from urban (t1o940p12.telia.com [194.237.162.12]) by smtp01.spray.se (Postfix) with SMTP id 157D773250 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 21:41:36 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <002e01c30510$ec872000$0ca2edc2@ekholm> From: "Urban Ekholm" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 20:41:12 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Activity Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hello LF-ers !
 
Isn't it time we settle a time for activity instead of that a lot of us mostly in vain call endless CQ:s after having listened for a while to a dead band ? My suggestions are 0800-1000UTC and 1300-1400UTC on saturdays/sundays and 2000-2100UTC on weekdays.
 
Any other suggestions ?
 
To get some more activity I think we should try to do something. Maybe everybody is happy with the way it is now, then fine, however I doubt that.
 
It seems like a number of callsigns earlier heard on the band are not heard anymore, maybe due to the low activity.
 
Happy Easter to all !
 
SM5EUF / Urban
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27089 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 18:06:19 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 18:06:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 17569 invoked by uid 10001); 17 Apr 2003 18:06:19 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 18:06:18 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196DlS-0004hB-Pa for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 19:05:38 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.48] (helo=mta8-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196DlM-0004h2-UM for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 19:05:33 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.233.85]) by mta8-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030417180532.GUQB22832.mta8-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 19:05:32 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c30503$7e0c9360$55e9fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 18:04:35 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: DX AGN Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
RN6BN good sig at 1733 GMT and other DX about throughout the afternoon/evening. Two YU stns plus OK and and DL plus G3LDO working YU7DP who was using qrs 10 and LDO qrs3. YU7DP earlier using qrs3 and perfect copy here. I worked YU7AR on normal CW , solid copy both ways. All EU stns active are at least 559 with me on normal CW.
73 de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6156 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 17:07:59 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 17:07:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 19138 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 17:07:46 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 17:07:46 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196Cq4-0004UD-5F for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 18:06:20 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.81] (helo=tungsten.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196Cpz-0004U4-5S for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 18:06:15 +0100 Received: from host217-35-41-67.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.35.41.67] helo=dellboy) by tungsten.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 196Cpy-0005be-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 18:06:14 +0100 Message-ID: <001b01c30503$d01d7ca0$1b00a8c0@dellboy> From: "Dave Pick" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030416171800.024fab68@gemini.herts.ac.uk> Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 18:07:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: GM 73kHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Jim and Ian etc... OK I will take the 73k gear (no great hardship, I left the coil there last time) and try to be on the air on Sunday afternoon and/or Monday. I will have the mobile phone, 07976 833 839 so we can arrange a sked. Cheers. Dave G3YXM. > At 23:31 12/04/2003 +0100, you wrote: > >Dear all. > > > >I will be paying another visit to the New Galloway QTH (IO75WC) on easter > >Sunday/Monday. I could take the 73k gear if anyone is interested in a test > >but I won't bother unless there's some interest. > >Rugby seems to be off again.... > > > >73 > >Dave G3YXM. > Dear Dave, > > I would like to try for a QSO on 73k over easter - don't think M0BMU has > worked GM on this band yet! Looking at the RSGB headlines, it would seem > that Rugby is likely to stay off forever... > > Cheers, Jim Moritz > 73 de M0BMU > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 30606 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 15:22:43 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 15:22:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 13896 invoked by uid 10001); 17 Apr 2003 15:22:43 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 15:22:43 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 196BCj-00046p-9S for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 16:21:37 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.9] (helo=hestia.herts.ac.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 196BCW-00046g-Sq for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 16:21:24 +0100 Received: from gemini ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini.herts.ac.uk) by hestia.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 196BCC-0005mS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 16:21:04 +0100 Received: from [147.197.232.252] (helo=rsch-15.herts.ac.uk) by gemini.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 196BC4-0007aH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 16:20:56 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030417135556.00b007a8@gemini.herts.ac.uk> X-Sender: mj9ar@gemini.herts.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 16:20:54 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "James Moritz" In-reply-to: <001201c304ce$a6b723a0$54cdfc3e@ian> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030416120614.024e6ea0@gemini.herts.ac.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MailScanner: No Virus detected Subject: Re: LF: The Mystery - continued. Part the second. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.9 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear Ian, LF Group You wrote: >The antenna current is now 2A plus or minus the accuracy of the system... I'm not sure which band this applies to, but in an earlier mail you said the TX puts out 205W at 73k and 100W at 136k. For Iant = 2A, this works out to a total loss resistance, including that of the loading coil, of 51 ohm at 73k, and 25 ohm at 136k, which in either case is very respectable - so you are probably getting near optimal efficiency for a fairly small antenna already, and I would be surprised if a major improvement were possible on what you already have. Withe the substantial ground system you describe, experience shows that even quite large additions or subtractions from the grounding won't make a major difference to antenna efficiency. I'm not sure why it should make a huge difference if the antenna end is earthed directly, or via a torturous route back along the coax, but it seems to me the main effect would be to add inductance in series with the earth connection, which, depending on how the ground connections are made in the antenna circuit as a whole, might affect the impedance transformation produced by the tapped loading coil - since you are matching to a very low impedance, it would only take a few uH of distributed inductance added into the circuit to significantly modify the matching network behaviour. If this is true, it should be possible to achieve the same antenna current with or without the direct ground connection by changing the tapping point on the loading coil to suit each connection. Another related possibility is that, with the ground connected at the loading coil end, part of the amplifier output current returning to the amplifier earth terminal will flow through the ground, rather than via the coax braid. It may be that this path is subject to greater resistive losses than if the current flows exclusively in the coax braid. In either case, transforming the PA output impedance to 50ohm as others have suggested would reduce the problem. Or you could leave it as it is with the ground wire disconnected... As regards the fuses blowing when a matching transformer is used, does your PA have a DC blocking capacitor at the output? Normally, a loudspeaker connects directly to the output so that no bulky audio coupling capacitor is required. However, with no input signal, the PA is bound to have a DC offset at the output of up to a few 10s of mV. When the load is a speaker on the end of long leads, this is not much of an issue, but if an RF transformer with a few turns of heavy wire as the primary is connected directly across the output of the amplifier, several amps of DC will flow, which may be what is causing the problem. The DC offset at the output may also be increased if the amplifier is driven into non-linearity, which probably will be the case when trying to get a reasonable RF output. A DC blocking capacitor of several uF worth of polyester capacitors in series with the output will prevent this being a problem. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10349 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 11:46:44 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 11:46:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 13772 invoked by uid 10001); 17 Apr 2003 11:46:44 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 11:46:43 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1967pm-0002wq-0U for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 12:45:42 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.42] (helo=mta2-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1967ph-0002vy-3G for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 12:45:37 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.205.84]) by mta2-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030417114535.FYIQ1184.mta2-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 12:45:35 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c304ce$a6b723a0$54cdfc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030416120614.024e6ea0@gemini.herts.ac.uk> Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 11:45:48 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: The Mystery - continued. Part the second. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Jim, thanks for the thoughts on the the puzzle. The coil is between antenna and earth and the input simply tapped to where I get the best balance of max antenna current with optimum amplifier output current, voltage (and phase), which are constantly monitored and things adjusted (including resonance) to try and match the three last to what they are when a 4.7Ohm resistive load is substituted The antenna current is now 2A plus or minus the accuracy of the system. Ground system consists of a fan of heavy bare copper earth wires of 25sq.mm.at least and length about 30 ft laid on the bare earth under the concrete foundations and subfloor of the extension which houses the shack, joined at the apex to the original station earth which consists of three fourfoot earth rods under the floor of the original shack at the other end (diagonally) of the bungalow and which are in turn bonded to all the plumbing in the house, which is all copper and continues in copper right out to the street main (spuncast iron) and to a disused electricity earth. Connection is made by two 10mm cables from an outside coldwater tap to the apex of the fan, and an additional 25mm cable runs underground from this point into the shack where it is in turn bonded to the plumbing system and a brass plate as station earth connectiion point. All radio equipment is earthed to this point (and also to mains earth via the two analogue PSUs), using braiding recovered from bits of damaged co-ax. As mentioned, the TX is grounded via various interconnections when not actually directly connected to the station earth, and the coil is fed with 30 ft of RG213 which is taken (via current sensor and TX/RXrelay) directly from the amplifier output. As recommended by LDO and others the input to the amp is loaded with a 2 K of resistance. All sounds horribly complicated and I hope not too confusing. 73 Ian From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31682 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 09:49:38 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 09:49:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 7187 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 09:49:40 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 09:49:40 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19660v-0002Fs-Ds for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:49:05 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.92] (helo=carbon.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19660q-0002Ff-OX for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:49:00 +0100 Received: from host213-122-145-166.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([213.122.145.166] helo=Main) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 19660p-0001sO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:49:00 +0100 Message-ID: <002301c304c6$5fdf20c0$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: "LF-Group" Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:47:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: re Rugby MSF Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Andy, according to the NPL web site BT has a contact to transmit MSF time signals untill 2007, the following was a musing I sent to interested ex BT staff many of whom have worked at the site. I do believe that Hillmorton site is being considered for housing development, which would make it a valuable asset. Actually I believe the BT MoD contact expires at then end of 2003, though Merlin took over on the 1st April, so Hillmorton will probably be kept on standby during the swap-over to Merlin at Skelton. ---------------------------- As an interesting sideline It is believed that a 55.5kHz signal was run up at the end of last month, and reports were requested though not widely, and no location of the transmitter was given. This was copied to the message board orf the Long Wave Club of America. The e-mail address for the reports was bob.rc.harrison@bt.com. (note the BT intranet address) Putting two and two together and getting around fifteen plus or minus seven.....I guess that BT have been running up a 60kW transmitter at another site that will allow them to move MSF and keep up the service whilst allowing the masts at Hillmorton to be felled. I believe that MSF is transit from a "T" aerial between two of the masts on the northern (open) segment of the aerial. ---------------------------- Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9530 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 09:47:50 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 09:47:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 4256 invoked by uid 10001); 17 Apr 2003 09:47:50 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 09:47:50 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1965z6-0002Dp-1l for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:47:12 +0100 Received: from [212.159.14.225] (helo=murphys.services.quay.plus.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 1965z1-0002DT-C3 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:47:07 +0100 Received: (qmail 5368 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 09:46:24 -0000 Received: from ctuash.sonnetinternet.co.uk (HELO Hugh) (212.159.90.113) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 09:46:24 -0000 Message-ID: <000601c304c6$3639cfe0$3704210a@Hugh> From: "Hugh M0WYE" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <01C304C7.9342D6E0.g4jnt@thersgb.net> Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:45:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Rugby Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.9 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Andy, The current contract for the Broadcast of the MSF time signal expires in 2007. So I guess it stays on, at least until then. There is a "consultation" process happening at present, you can read all about it in the "draft for comment", a big pdf file from the DTI, which you can get from here: http://www.dti.gov.uk/nms/consult/time_formulation.htm 73 Hugh M0WYE ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy talbot" To: Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2003 9:56 AM Subject: LF: Rugby > On the subject of the close of GBR, presumably the Govt. will be trying to sell > the site now. SO where is the MSF 60kHz transmission going to come from ? > > Its use for 'official' time and frequency transfer will have greatly receded > with GPS doing a much better job now, and low(ish) cost crystal oscillators > that can do as well as off-air LF reception for frequency. But all that has > been replaced by the greater civilian use made of the transmission and the low > cost of time decoder chips and self setting clocks. > > There would presumably be a huge public outcry, and probably some claims for > compensation, if the service were to stop, considering the number of MSF > controlled clocks around - even my mother has one on her sideboard now !. > > > > Andy G4JNT > > -----Original Message----- > From: James Moritz [SMTP:j.r.moritz@herts.ac.uk] > Sent: 2003/04/16 17:25 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: Re: LF: GM 73kHz > > At 23:31 12/04/2003 +0100, you wrote: > >Dear all. > > > >I will be paying another visit to the New Galloway QTH (IO75WC) on easter > >Sunday/Monday. I could take the 73k gear if anyone is interested in a test > >but I won't bother unless there's some interest. > >Rugby seems to be off again.... > > > >73 > >Dave G3YXM. > Dear Dave, > > I would like to try for a QSO on 73k over easter - don't think M0BMU has > worked GM on this band yet! Looking at the RSGB headlines, it would seem > that Rugby is likely to stay off forever... > > Cheers, Jim Moritz > 73 de M0BMU > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4739 invoked from network); 17 Apr 2003 09:05:36 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 09:05:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 29961 invoked by uid 10001); 17 Apr 2003 08:58:55 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: High Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 17 Apr 2003 08:58:54 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1965CG-0001u3-HX for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 09:56:44 +0100 Received: from [212.1.130.142] (helo=smtp-1.visp.telinco.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1965CB-0001tu-U3 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 09:56:39 +0100 Received: from [80.40.78.108] (helo=standalone) by smtp-1.visp.telinco.net with smtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1965CB-0003wI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 09:56:39 +0100 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Thu, 17 Apr 2003 09:56:11 +0100 Message-ID: <01C304C7.9342D6E0.g4jnt@thersgb.net> From: "Andy talbot" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 09:56:10 +0100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: Rugby Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.5 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,X_PRIORITY_HIGHversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false On the subject of the close of GBR, presumably the Govt. will be trying to sell the site now. SO where is the MSF 60kHz transmission going to come from ? Its use for 'official' time and frequency transfer will have greatly receded with GPS doing a much better job now, and low(ish) cost crystal oscillators that can do as well as off-air LF reception for frequency. But all that has been replaced by the greater civilian use made of the transmission and the low cost of time decoder chips and self setting clocks. There would presumably be a huge public outcry, and probably some claims for compensation, if the service were to stop, considering the number of MSF controlled clocks around - even my mother has one on her sideboard now !. Andy G4JNT -----Original Message----- From: James Moritz [SMTP:j.r.moritz@herts.ac.uk] Sent: 2003/04/16 17:25 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: GM 73kHz At 23:31 12/04/2003 +0100, you wrote: >Dear all. > >I will be paying another visit to the New Galloway QTH (IO75WC) on easter >Sunday/Monday. I could take the 73k gear if anyone is interested in a test >but I won't bother unless there's some interest. >Rugby seems to be off again.... > >73 >Dave G3YXM. Dear Dave, I would like to try for a QSO on 73k over easter - don't think M0BMU has worked GM on this band yet! Looking at the RSGB headlines, it would seem that Rugby is likely to stay off forever... Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10360 invoked from network); 16 Apr 2003 16:41:32 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 16:41:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 17005 invoked by uid 10001); 16 Apr 2003 16:41:31 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 16:41:31 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195pxV-0007Hu-CZ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 17:40:29 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.45] (helo=mta5-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195pxQ-0007Hl-DN for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 17:40:24 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.205.1]) by mta5-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030416164023.WCLN2099.mta5-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 17:40:23 +0100 Message-ID: <002601c3042e$abc92a00$01cdfc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <004d01c30143$4703bdd0$1b00a8c0@dellboy> Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 09:19:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: GM 73kHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.1 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_PAST_06_12,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Dave, well, I'll be around this weekend on 73 but since New Galloway and Lisburn are so close apart and we've already done it on CW (please note, Mal!), unless you are mad keen for a twicer I would not ask you to lug the gear all the way up the M6 & A75. Have a good weekend, Ian MI0AYZ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29236 invoked from network); 16 Apr 2003 16:29:08 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 16:29:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 18008 invoked by uid 10001); 16 Apr 2003 16:29:08 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 16:29:08 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195pit-0007BK-3v for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 17:25:23 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.9] (helo=hestia.herts.ac.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195pio-0007BB-3d for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 17:25:18 +0100 Received: from gemini ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini.herts.ac.uk) by hestia.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 195piX-0001La-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 17:25:01 +0100 Received: from [147.197.232.252] (helo=rsch-15.herts.ac.uk) by gemini.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 195piU-0006F1-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 17:24:59 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030416171800.024fab68@gemini.herts.ac.uk> X-Sender: mj9ar@gemini.herts.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 17:24:58 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "James Moritz" In-reply-to: <004d01c30143$4703bdd0$1b00a8c0@dellboy> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MailScanner: No Virus detected Subject: Re: LF: GM 73kHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TOversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false At 23:31 12/04/2003 +0100, you wrote: >Dear all. > >I will be paying another visit to the New Galloway QTH (IO75WC) on easter >Sunday/Monday. I could take the 73k gear if anyone is interested in a test >but I won't bother unless there's some interest. >Rugby seems to be off again.... > >73 >Dave G3YXM. Dear Dave, I would like to try for a QSO on 73k over easter - don't think M0BMU has worked GM on this band yet! Looking at the RSGB headlines, it would seem that Rugby is likely to stay off forever... Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20300 invoked from network); 16 Apr 2003 16:00:10 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 16:00:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 8847 invoked by uid 10001); 16 Apr 2003 15:53:30 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 15:53:30 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195pCA-0006tQ-3h for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 16:51:34 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.48] (helo=mta8-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195pBz-0006tF-TQ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 16:51:24 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.158]) by mta8-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030416155122.DYDP22832.mta8-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 16:51:22 +0100 Message-ID: <002001c30427$9577d500$9ee4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 15:39:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: More DX Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Look out for YU7DP on 137 khz. We worked last night with solid signals each way. Also active with a big signal is YU7AR.
DXCC getting closer hi
73 de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10528 invoked from network); 16 Apr 2003 15:53:27 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 15:53:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 8803 invoked by uid 10001); 16 Apr 2003 15:53:27 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 15:53:26 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195pCQ-0006te-FS for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 16:51:50 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.48] (helo=mta8-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195pCL-0006tU-RS for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 16:51:45 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.158]) by mta8-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030416155145.DYGH22832.mta8-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 16:51:45 +0100 Message-ID: <002201c30427$a348d1c0$9ee4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 15:50:25 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Vanishing Amps Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Ian/MI0AYZ have you ever thought of moving West of the Bann to TYRONE where BIG AMPS are the norm. This would hopefully solve your problems.There is a nice location near Tullywiggan Bridge, river and all, no Earth problems there!!
73 and gl de Mal/G3KEV- Tyrone and Scarborough
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11001 invoked from network); 16 Apr 2003 11:38:24 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 11:38:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 7609 invoked by uid 10001); 16 Apr 2003 11:38:24 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 11:38:24 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195lEJ-0005hg-Ti for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 12:37:31 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.9] (helo=hestia.herts.ac.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195lEA-0005hX-Ta for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 12:37:23 +0100 Received: from gemini ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini.herts.ac.uk) by hestia.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 195lDu-0000OY-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 12:37:06 +0100 Received: from [147.197.232.252] (helo=rsch-15.herts.ac.uk) by gemini.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 195lDj-0006uB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 12:36:55 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030416120614.024e6ea0@gemini.herts.ac.uk> X-Sender: mj9ar@gemini.herts.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 12:36:54 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "James Moritz" In-reply-to: <001e01c30389$be512e20$97d2fc3e@ian> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MailScanner: No Virus detected Subject: Re: LF: The Mystery - continued. Part the second. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TOversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear Ian, LF Group, At 21:00 15/04/2003 +0100, you wrote: >The antenna is shunt fed against ground at the 4-8ohms o/p impedance of the >BK. Having followed this puzzling saga for some time, I have a few questions to clarify what the situation is: How is the loading coil connected to the ant and feeder? Is it a simple series coil connected between coax inner and antenna down lead, or a tapped coil with the cold end grounded, or something else? What is connected to the antenna ground system? What actual antenna current do you get now? Is the stated TX output power actually being delivered to the load, or what the amplifier would give with a matched load? On the topic of MOSFET audio PAs, virtually any amplifier of this type can become unstable with certain load impedances - particularly with loads that are capacitive at high frequencies, which mis-matched coax cables can well be. On my old audio-module based TX, I found a low-pass filter prevented this - obviously it has to be a T - network thing with a series inductor at the input, rather than the more usual pi network with a shunt capacitor. Another problem was the fall-off of power at 136kHz, caused by the limited slew rate of the input and driver stages - this can be fairly easily cured by modifying the input stage. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 30597 invoked from network); 16 Apr 2003 09:05:35 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 09:05:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 29899 invoked by uid 10001); 16 Apr 2003 09:05:35 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 09:05:35 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195iqJ-0004nj-RV for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:04:35 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.47] (helo=mta07-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195iqE-0004na-TI for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:04:31 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta07-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with ESMTP id <20030416090430.PITG25105.mta07-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:04:30 +0100 Message-ID: <001001c303f7$43b8dd20$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "mike.dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001e01c30389$be512e20$97d2fc3e@ian> <000b01c303a8$9a95bf40$07c828c3@erica> Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 10:05:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: The Mystery Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false G3LDO wrote: > It wasn't always so. When I used the BK amp originally I used a tapped > loading coil arangement and got some strange effects. Things got better when > I started using a multi-tapped torroid transformer, which isolated the BK > amp from the antenna system. This transformer was located at the base of the > coil and fed at 4ohms from the amp using heavy duty electrical cable. The BK > amplifier is prone to instability when experimenting with different loads. > This is caused by the high gain of the amplifier (the negative feedback > might also become positive feedback with some loads) and could be fixed by > putting some heavy resistive loading at the input of the amplifier. That's exactly my experience. Since using toroidal transformers and a resistor across the input I have a very stable BK amp. I use the amp on 73kHz (though it will, of course, also run on 136 if I want) and I have a toroid to take the impedance from 4ohms to about 50 ohms, then this feeds a multitapped toroidal transformer that I use on 136kHz to take the Decca from 50ohms to the 150-200ohms of the antenna system. Since the final output is completely isolated, any current is due to the earths that I know about, not any stray earthing through the rig. In the history of my station, one of the great breakthroughs (several years ago) was to separate the matching and resonating. They can be done together but it leads to much fiddling and some confusion as to what is happening. Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4291 invoked from network); 16 Apr 2003 07:51:12 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 07:51:12 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 21638 invoked from network); 16 Apr 2003 07:51:14 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 16 Apr 2003 07:51:14 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195hdO-0004Kg-0k for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 08:47:10 +0100 Received: from [194.217.242.80] (helo=anchor-post-39.mail.demon.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195hdJ-0004KX-BD for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 08:47:05 +0100 Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by anchor-post-39.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 195hdI-0001XV-0d for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 08:47:04 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 07:45:07 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" In-reply-to: <001e01c30389$be512e20$97d2fc3e@ian> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Subject: LF: Who stole the amps? X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TOversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Ian A pretty obvious point really, but are you sure the output power of your amplifier is not varying due to impedance changes as you alter the grounding? i.e. A mismatch is causing output power to drop. I had some very strange effects when I used to tune for maximum current instead of matching to 50 ohms. Now I have a 50 ohm SWR bridge from the Tx LPF and this goes to a simple series loading variometer. Results are a lot more predictable and I haven't blown a FET in about 2 years! 73, Tom G3OLB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10561 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 23:37:59 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 23:37:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 23934 invoked by uid 10001); 15 Apr 2003 23:37:59 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 23:37:59 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195Zyf-0002P1-4b for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 00:36:37 +0100 Received: from [212.135.6.11] (helo=smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195Zya-0002Os-Dx for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 00:36:32 +0100 Received: from tnt-13-82.easynet.co.uk ([212.134.22.82] helo=erica) by smarthost1.mail.uk.easynet.net with smtp (Exim 4.10) id 195ZyY-0001h4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 16 Apr 2003 00:36:31 +0100 Message-ID: <000b01c303a8$9a95bf40$07c828c3@erica> From: "g3ldo" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001e01c30389$be512e20$97d2fc3e@ian> Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2003 00:41:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: The Mystery - continued. Part the second. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Ian >That experiment confirms that WHATEVER configuration of > other earths is used, the system prefers to have the coil earthed back along > the screen of the coax and then by any tortuous route you care to use > through the shack to the mains and the station earth. Any attempt to go > direct to the special point so thoughtfully provided by a caring owner and > it goes into conniptions. I have found RF earthing or grounding to be a bit of a black art - particularly from a suburban location. I have three earthing systems Three 10ft long 2 inch diameter copper poles sunk into the ground using the Crawley radio club special hole borer. Wire netting covering all the lawn some distance around the antenna feedpoint. I have a special deal with the earthworms - they helped bury the wire netting in the spring/summer months and I keep them warm in the winter with LF transmissions. A mass of thick copper wire around the base of the mast. This was included when the mast was built (long before LF) as part of the lightning protection system. Unlike Ian's system I find that I get increases in current as each of the earthing systems is added to the bottom of the coil. It wasn't always so. When I used the BK amp originally I used a tapped loading coil arangement and got some strange effects. Things got better when I started using a multi-tapped torroid transformer, which isolated the BK amp from the antenna system. This transformer was located at the base of the coil and fed at 4ohms from the amp using heavy duty electrical cable. The BK amplifier is prone to instability when experimenting with different loads. This is caused by the high gain of the amplifier (the negative feedback might also become positive feedback with some loads) and could be fixed by putting some heavy resistive loading at the input of the amplifier. The Decca transmitter has a power combiner transformer, which also provides some isolation. I now use a multi tapped torroid auto transformer at the base of the coil to match the transmitter to the antenna. I think the use of elevated radials as mentioned by Mal and Alex is a non starter for the reasons mentioned by Ian. The other reason is space, or the lack of it. The exception I found was at Amberley museum where the ground is mostly chalk but there is plenty of space. I used an elevated radial system of a couple of long wires whose height above the ground was determined by available trees and bushes. I tried loading the radials. Again strange effects. The radial and antenna coils had to be adjusted so that the floating matching and resonating controls were at a reasonable low RF potential or you could get zapped. Appendix 1 of the LF experimenters book illustrates the amount of effort that went into LF Earthing systems and that underground systems were favoured for most commercial stations for reasons stated Regards, Peter, G3LDO e-mail Web . From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12321 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 21:01:01 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 21:01:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 8443 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 21:01:03 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 21:01:03 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195XX5-0001kn-TL for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 21:59:59 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.44] (helo=mta4-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195XX1-0001kd-4J for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 21:59:55 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.210.151]) by mta4-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030415205953.XSYZ11888.mta4-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 21:59:53 +0100 Message-ID: <001e01c30389$be512e20$97d2fc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 21:00:35 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: The Mystery - continued. Part the second. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false my thanks to all for the responses both direct and via the reflector to my plaintive bleating. Today being a glorious day hereabouts I said "thehellwithit, hang the expense", and took m'lady out for lunch and a look at the Irish Sea so only one experiment done That experiment confirms that WHATEVER configuration of other earths is used, the system prefers to have the coil earthed back along the screen of the coax and then by any tortuous route you care to use through the shack to the mains and the station earth. Any attempt to go direct to the special point so thoughtfully provided by a caring owner and it goes into conniptions. Wherefore the action described in the PS will be the one adopted! However further attempts will be made to measure various resistances, impedances etc by isolating the BK from ground completely and using it (fed by a battery operated wide range oscillator) as the generator for 'on frequency' measurements as suggested by Alan. Use of elevated radials as mentioned by Mal and Alex is a non starter for various reasons, which include washing lines; cupressus lylandii; the assortment of apparatus used by visiting grand-children, and most importantly marital QRM. The antenna is shunt fed against ground at the 4-8ohms o/p impedance of the BK. Attempts to get it to feed a toroidal 4:50ohm transformer without getting its knickers in a twist have been fruitless. I am only prpared to spend so much on fuses, so I harked back to a piece of wisdom gleaned from a well known bar-room philosopher in early adulthood; - 'if at first you don't succeed, try try try again and then - give up, because there is no sense in being pigheaded about it' and found a matching point that worked. The fact that the RF gets there by courtesy of about 25ft of RG213 with some horrendous SWR is, I submit, an irrelevance at that kind of frequency. The antenna current sensor toroid is located about a foot above the coil round a short length of plastic conduit which carries the 'vertical' lead of the antenna through the top of the 'dogbox' up the inside of a ceramic insulator which is the antenna anchorage point. It is hard to see how this could respond to anything other than antenna current, the vast majority of which ultimately goes to comfort the worms. The antenna itself is a 'bonsai' crib of the WWVL and WWVB antennas. (http://www.boulder.nist.gov/timefreq) Four poles of 10m height at the four corners of a 40ft(approx) rhombus carry a closed loop which has the diagonal corners joined and also an additional 6 wires running in the spaces between the longer diagonal and the perimeter of the loop. >From the centre point of the shorter diagonal and spaced 1ft each side, three wires form the 'vertical' element. About 200m of assorted bare, and insulated, stranded nominal 1sq.mm wire used and the natural resonant frequency is 1.55MHz. I model it as 730pF and 15 uH, and sucks to anyone who says substantially different. The 'R' of the system is the subject of ongoing negotiation. Will now take time out for a while to actually use the sodding thing. 73 de, Ian GI8AYZ/MI0AYZ Alan; re. the meerschaum. If you substitute beer for baccy and modify your input suction arrangements to swallow rather than inhale, then a one pint bowl seems to me to be just about right! From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17020 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 17:59:40 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 17:59:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 4696 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 17:59:28 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 17:59:28 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195UhQ-0000c2-15 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 18:58:28 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.42] (helo=mta2-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195UhL-0000bt-1Y for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 18:58:23 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.169]) by mta2-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030415175821.JMV1184.mta2-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 18:58:21 +0100 Message-ID: <001a01c30370$29c4f520$a9e4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 17:57:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: VANISHING AMPS Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0tests=HTML_10_20,HTML_MESSAGE,SUBJ_ALL_CAPSversion=2.53 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Ian et al
Its anyone's guess where your amps are going, but your signal is very strong with me, as good as most around the UK at the same distance, those running the Decca Jeeps might be only marginally stronger but think of the difference in RF output. I think your BK autocycle has about 100 w out on 137 khz and the Jeep about 1200w out, so you seem to be doing well.
Looks like your antenna and ground in spite of some discrepencies is doing well.
I do not depend on real ground for my system. I use about 6 insulated ground radials, each one 400 ft long and not grounded.
I did try using copper ground stakes driven into the ground where all the radials converge and all connected and it makes no difference that I can detect. I tried ground stakes at the end of each insulated radial and that again makes no difference.
I think the GROUND/EARTH as suggested by some is a myth in some locations. The secret on LF is to get as much wire up in the air as possible and use INSULATED ground radials. My loading coil is small, around 0.5 mh and soon I hope to get some more wire up so that I do not need a LOADING coil at all, the antenna will have a natural resonance at 137 khz.
It would appear that a so called good ground is less important if you have a good antenna in the first instance.
I have tried a couple of radials then a dozen radials and apart from a small change in impedence matching, which is easy to correct it makes no difference to the RF amps and radiation and signals reports.
My system TX/RX, Antenna etc is all designed for 50 ohms and  according to reports since I started on LF some years ago
the signal is the strongest from England on 136 khz around EU and  W/VE and only surpassed my MM0ALM in Scotland. inactive at present. My RF power out from a home built TX is only a fraction of that generated by those using the D/Jeep.
I must get my ex Cherry Burton D/Jeep 1200 W fired up one of these days and join the rest of the QRO merchants
de Mal/G3KEV
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16054 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 16:08:01 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 16:08:01 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 20255 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 16:07:49 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 16:07:49 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195Sxr-0008QN-Jg for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 17:07:19 +0100 Received: from [212.164.44.2] (helo=astral.omskcity.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195Sxl-0008Pv-9X for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 17:07:13 +0100 Received: from fitec.omskcity.com (mu01.dialup2.infomsk.ru [212.164.44.113]) by astral.omskcity.com (8.x.x) with SMTP id XAA3e9c2cc85268 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 23:01:12 +0700 (OSS) Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 22:04:54 +0000 (GMT) From: "Alexander S. Yurkov" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org In-reply-to: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: The Mystery of the Missing Amps.. Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------080608020805070304020909" X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-24.4 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_FUTURE_03_06,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_PINEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------080608020805070304020909 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Tue, 15 Apr 2003, Alexander S. Yurkov wrote: > About year ago I derive formulas wich show elevated conterpoise is much > better then conection to the ground or burred conterpoise. Conection to Picture wich show an advance of elevated conterpoise against burred conterpoise is attached here. It is theoretical curve not experimentally tested yet unfortunely. Certanly this is true only if there is no trees, buildings e.t.c. near antenna and conterpoise is isolated from the ground by ferrite transformer. 73 de RA9MB/Alex http://www.qsl.net/ra9mb --------------080608020805070304020909 Content-Type: IMAGE/GIF; name="fig.gif" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: inline; filename="fig.gif" R0lGODlh0AFYAvAAAP///wAAACH+N0ltYWdlIGdlbmVyYXRlZCBieSBBbGFkZGluIEdob3N0 c2NyaXB0IChkZXZpY2U9cHBtcmF3KQoALAAAAADQAVgCAAL+hI+py+0Po5y02ouz3rz7D4bi SJbmiabqyrbuC8fyTNf2jef6zvf+DwwKh8Si8YhMKpfMpvMJjUqn1Kr1is1qt9yu9wsOi8fk svmMTqvX7Lb7DY/L5/S6/Y7P6/f8vv8PGCg4SFhoeIiYqLjI2Oj4CBkpOUlZaXmJmam5ydnp +QkaKjpKWmp6ipqqusra6voKGys7S1tre4ubq7vL2+v7CxwsPExcbHyMnKy8zNzs/AwdLT1N XW19jZ2tvc3d7f0NHi4+Tl5ufo6err7O3u7+Dh8vP09fb3+Pn6+/z9/v/w8woMCBBAsaPIgw ocKFDBs6fAgxosSJFCtavIgxo8b+jRw7evwIMqTIkSRLmjyJMqXKlSxbunwJM6bMmTRr2ryJ M6fOnTx7+vwJNKjQoUSLGj2KNKnSpUybOn0KNarUqVSrWr2KNavWrVy7ev0KNqzYsWTLmj2L 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uid 10001); 15 Apr 2003 15:37:00 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 15:37:00 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195STd-0008Aw-U9 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 16:36:05 +0100 Received: from [212.164.44.2] (helo=astral.omskcity.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195STQ-0008An-Np for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 16:35:54 +0100 Received: from fitec.omskcity.com (mu01.dialup2.infomsk.ru [212.164.44.113]) by astral.omskcity.com (8.x.x) with SMTP id WAA3e9c25784d7a for ; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 22:30:00 +0700 (OSS) Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 21:33:42 +0000 (GMT) From: "Alexander S. Yurkov" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org In-reply-to: <000501c302ce$ba7a4680$75d1fc3e@ian> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: The Mystery of the Missing Amps.. Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-24.4 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_FUTURE_03_06,EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_PINEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Ian and Group. On Mon, 14 Apr 2003, Ian Kyle wrote: > Some of you will have noticed that I have been venting my frustrations about > the title subject on the reflector recently and that I mentioned an > interesting anomaly in the earthing arrangement, so over the weekend out > came the deerstalker, cape and meerschaum and the investigation commenced. > The anomaly is this; after finishing reworking a number of things as > detailed in an earlier posting, the there was a sensible increase in antenna > current of about 30 - 40%, so I set about tidying things up round the > 'dogbox'. Then to my astonishment the next test produced a further increase, > the resultant increase totalling about 75% and the BK could be driven right > into saturation. Obviously something had changed, but I had not consciously > altered any of the settings. I do not know realy why is this. But may be (???) it is somthing similar to my theoretical result reported here about year ago. If cable is elevated from the ground significaly more then cable diameter it can employ as elevated conterpoise. About year ago I derive formulas wich show elevated conterpoise is much better then conection to the ground or burred conterpoise. Conection to the ground in shack may be isolated on RF by some inductance. Or ground in shack is screened by some metal construction (in this case conection to the ground seems not increase losses). Certanly this should be tested in some experimentaly way. Any way ANY additional connection to the ground NOT evidently decreases loss. Seems loss can increase in some cases. 73 de RA9MB/Alex http://www.qsl.net/ra9mb From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25689 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 10:53:11 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 10:53:11 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 20039 invoked by uid 10001); 15 Apr 2003 10:53:11 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 10:53:11 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195O33-0006Pu-OK for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 11:52:21 +0100 Received: from [134.153.2.130] (helo=newman.ucs.mun.ca) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195O2x-0006Pl-In for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 11:52:15 +0100 Received: from plato.ucs.mun.ca (root@plato.ucs.mun.ca [134.153.2.151]) by newman.ucs.mun.ca (8.12.3p2/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h3FAq9Tn009442 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 08:22:10 -0230 (NDT) Received: from plato.ucs.mun.ca (jcraig@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by plato.ucs.mun.ca (8.12.3p2/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h3FAq9co005315 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 08:22:09 -0230 (NDT) Received: (from jcraig@localhost) by plato.ucs.mun.ca (8.12.3p2/8.12.1/Submit) id h3FAq93v032605; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 08:22:09 -0230 (NDT) Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 08:22:08 -0230 (NDT) From: "Joe Craig" X-Sender: jcraig@plato.ucs.mun.ca To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org In-reply-to: <001d01c3032e$ff080340$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: TA 15 April Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.1 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,USER_AGENT_PINEversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false CT1DRP weak at 0200 Q5 0300 until 0600. Peaked about 0500. Dits on 137773.55 dahs 137773.75 thereabouts. Joe VO1NA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8652 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 09:11:40 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 09:11:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 4939 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 09:11:44 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 09:11:44 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195MSa-0005f3-6u for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 10:10:36 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.172] (helo=cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195MSV-0005el-IA for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 10:10:31 +0100 Received: from modem-220.banner-wrasse.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.227.220] helo=f3a3a2) by cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 195MSU-0006Q0-NR for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 10:10:31 +0100 Message-ID: <001d01c3032e$ff080340$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> From: "Laurie Mayhead" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 10:09:05 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re. The Mystery of the missing Amps Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Ian, Perhaps they are not missing, only gone another way! What I mean is, if current is getting to ground via Rx. comp. etc, is it by-passing your RF ammeter ? I guess only you can trace out the pathway. 73 Laurie. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9494 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 09:11:28 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 09:11:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 4268 invoked by uid 10001); 15 Apr 2003 09:11:28 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 09:11:27 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195MSZ-0005eu-4v for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 10:10:35 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.172] (helo=cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195MSU-0005eh-4D for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 10:10:30 +0100 Received: from modem-220.banner-wrasse.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.227.220] helo=f3a3a2) by cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 195MSS-0006Q0-Vf for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 10:10:29 +0100 Message-ID: <001c01c3032e$fdfcfbe0$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> From: "Laurie Mayhead" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <006101c302d7$b64c8c40$6507a8c0@Main> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 10:01:19 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: W&G assistance Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.9 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alan Melia" To: "LF-Group" Sent: Monday, April 14, 2003 11:43 PM Subject: LF: W&G assistance > I wionder if anyone can answer thie qery below.....I refered John to the > LWCA message board but I dont think he got any answers. > ------------------ > Can tell me what the following error codes in a W&G SPM-19 > selective level meter mean?? > 1--006 > 1--201 > > They are in the Operators manual under chapter 6 they tell me, but I only > have the WS manual and it refers me back to the Operators manual.......Doh. > If you know, can you E-mail me on htp@lisp.com.au > John Harbor > ------------------ > > I am sure somebody on here mentioned the -19 at some time in the past. > > Thanks and Cheers de Alan G3NYK > alan.melia@btinternet.com > > 1...006 Level above selective branch is too low. 1...007 Level above selective branch is too high. Possible faults: Failure of one or more modules in the mixer section. > 1...201 Calibration adjusting network Insufficient extent with analog 1...202 Insufficient extent with didital Possible origins of fault *Defective cal. adjusting network if in IF amp. *Basic gain of complete equipment is set wrong *Defective cal. signal or gain setting > > Hope this helps although I find it confusing (perhaps it has suffered in the translation ) Laurie. > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8063 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 08:45:31 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 08:45:31 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 11856 invoked by uid 10001); 15 Apr 2003 08:45:26 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 08:45:26 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195M3C-0005T3-Uk for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 09:44:22 +0100 Received: from [194.217.242.89] (helo=anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195M35-0005Su-SF for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 09:44:15 +0100 Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 195M33-000KTx-0V for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 09:44:14 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 08:20:52 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" In-reply-to: <000501c302ce$ba7a4680$75d1fc3e@ian> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Subject: Re: LF: The Mystery of the Missing Amps.. X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TOversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Ian I can't offer any explanation but I have had similar a unexplained reduction in antenna current when the grounding system was apparently improved. I took about 50 feet of mains 3 core to a 2 ft square piece of aluminium sheet which I threw into the pond, much to the disgust of the resident Golden Orf and Koi. Needless to say, that was an experiment which was abandoned. Anyway the XYL didn't think much of the cable draped across the lawn, so it was a non starter, although I suppose I could have buried it. 73, Tom G3OLB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 32162 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 07:58:38 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 07:58:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 11933 invoked by uid 10001); 15 Apr 2003 07:58:37 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 07:58:37 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195LEZ-0004z6-Vq for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 08:52:03 +0100 Received: from [212.159.14.221] (helo=netmail02.services.quay.plus.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 195LEV-0004yx-7I for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 08:51:59 +0100 Received: (qmail 12586 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 07:51:28 -0000 Received: from ctuash.sonnetinternet.co.uk (HELO Hugh) (212.159.90.113) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 07:51:28 -0000 Message-ID: <00fa01c30323$ccc66a80$3704210a@Hugh> From: "Hugh M0WYE" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 08:51:04 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: The Mystery of The Missing Amps Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Ian, et al, First can I say how much I enjoy reading Ian's postings - they are always a good read and highly entertaining ! Second. When I started messing about on LF, I was using a TDA2030 Amplifier, and then graduated to a BK amp. I tested the TDA amp using a Loudspeaker at audio frequencies, and at one point I connected up the LF aerial/earth without removing the speaker - I nearly jumped out of my skin as a huge hum came from the loudspeaker. The Amp was grounded both through the signal generator driving the input AND the RF ground, and that made a huge hum loop. So now I transformer-couple the input to the amplifiers, using a little transformer wound on a toroid out of the junk box. This breaks the earth connection at the input, so the only earth is the network of ground stakes in the garden. The Mains earth on the BK is just connected to the metal chassis, and the Audio Earth is completely floating - so it is just the earthing arrangements on the input to the Amp that you need to examine. Anyway, glad to hear you've got your current up Ian. I'm afraid my loading coil has been moved to the garage, while the garden is spruced up, for the spring. 73 Hugh M0WYE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3035 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 07:56:15 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 07:56:15 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 28756 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 07:56:04 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 2003 07:56:04 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195LBZ-0004xd-6c for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 08:48:57 +0100 Received: from [213.218.75.231] (helo=smtp02.freeler.nl) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195LBT-0004xQ-8h for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 15 Apr 2003 08:48:51 +0100 Received: (qmail 20712 invoked from network); 15 Apr 2003 07:48:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO w8k3f0.freeler.nl) ([62.21.130.79]) (envelope-sender ) by smtp02.freeler.nl (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 15 Apr 2003 07:48:18 -0000 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030415093415.024408c0@POP3.freeler.nl> X-Sender: FRE0000086604@POP3.freeler.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 09:46:22 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Dick Rollema" In-reply-to: <000501c302ce$ba7a4680$75d1fc3e@ian> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: The Mystery of the Missing Amps.. Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-8.5 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,HTML_00_10,HTML_MESSAGE,IN_REP_TOversion=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Dear Ian,

I cannot offer you an explanation.
But to find out in which conductors earth current flows I use a home made clamp-on type of ammeter. It was described in  Pat Hawker's Technical Topics in RadCom, October 1992. The probe was designed for the HF bands so calibration will not be correct on 136 or 73 kHz. But the device is still useful to compare currents in the conductors concerned.

Of course by using a toroid with higher permeability the current probe could be made suitable for LF and calibrated along the lines indicated in TT.

73, Dick, PA0SE

At 22:35 14-4-03 +0100, you wrote:
Some of you will have noticed that I have been venting my frustrations about
the title subject on the reflector recently and that I mentioned an
interesting anomaly in the earthing arrangement, so over the weekend out
came the deerstalker, cape and meerschaum and the investigation commenced.
The anomaly is this; after finishing reworking a number of things as
detailed in an earlier posting, the there was a sensible increase in antenna
current of about 30 - 40%, so I set about tidying things up round the
'dogbox'. Then to my astonishment the next test produced a further increase,
the resultant  increase totalling about 75% and the BK could be driven right
into saturation. Obviously something had changed, but I had not consciously
altered any of the settings.
("Curiouser and curiouser!" said Alice.)
A visual inspection of the dogbox in the bosky twilight turned up nothing
obvious until I caught a foot in the earthing cable from the point where the
co-ax was terminated at the coil, and after the usual 'oh bother!' (or words
to that effect) I noticed that the cable did not appear to be attached to
the earth point sticking out of the ground.
Attached it and returned to shack. Current down again!
Huh????? (Followed by lots of very rude words indeed)
Just for the hell of it went out into the gathering dark and broke the
connection.
Current increase back again!
Eureka!
(Greek for "somebody get me a towel")
The first part of the puzzle was, where was the TX finding its earth from?
The TX system is complete in itself,  mounted on a bit of Conti-board with
no mains earth as such (or so I thought)  and was not connected to the
station earth point (which comes off the same system as the external point,
at the apex of a fan of 25sq. mm.earth wires and bonded two ways with
10sq.mm cable to all the plumbing in the house, four 4ft earth rods and a
couple of disused electrical earths.)
Eventually discovered that the TX and coil were being earthed to the mains
(a) through the switched mode PSU suppling the IC706, divider/exciter and
the relays, (b) via the earth on the computer COM port, and (c) via the
co-ax to the receiver - which is connected to the station earth.
The resistance  measured between the station and external earth points was
measured today as 0.011 Ohms by passing 15A at 12v between them and a known
low resistance of 0.1 and measuring the voltage drops.
Earthing the TX to the station earth point as well got another few percent
of antenna current, but earthing the coil directly to the external point
drops the current back to where I started and the BK goes unstable as it
approaches maximum output.
Could this be a variation of the old audio amp problem cured by using one
common earth point? Or - which is much more likely - is there something
obvious which is staring me in the face yet still unseen?
This is definitely a three pint problem, and in the absence of a brother
called Mycroft I am appealing to all you helpful people out there to guide
me towards an explanation.

Ian GI8AYZ/MI0AYZ

P.S. Remarks along the lines of "Leave it alone while it's working" will be
treated with a certain amount of disdain, since I have already come up with
that particular way out!
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17758 invoked from network); 14 Apr 2003 22:48:03 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 14 Apr 2003 22:48:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 28952 invoked by uid 10001); 14 Apr 2003 22:48:03 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 14 Apr 2003 22:48:03 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195Cjd-0002uj-0c for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 14 Apr 2003 23:47:33 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.147] (helo=einsteinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195CjY-0002ua-CA for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 14 Apr 2003 23:47:28 +0100 Received: from host213-122-183-111.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([213.122.183.111] helo=Main) by einsteinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 195CjX-0001b2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 14 Apr 2003 23:47:27 +0100 Message-ID: <006101c302d7$b64c8c40$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: "LF-Group" Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2003 23:43:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: W&G assistance Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false I wionder if anyone can answer thie qery below.....I refered John to the LWCA message board but I dont think he got any answers. ------------------ Can tell me what the following error codes in a W&G SPM-19 selective level meter mean?? 1--006 1--201 They are in the Operators manual under chapter 6 they tell me, but I only have the WS manual and it refers me back to the Operators manual.......Doh. If you know, can you E-mail me on htp@lisp.com.au John Harbor ------------------ I am sure somebody on here mentioned the -19 at some time in the past. Thanks and Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 30182 invoked from network); 14 Apr 2003 22:42:51 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 14 Apr 2003 22:42:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 6628 invoked from network); 14 Apr 2003 22:42:54 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 14 Apr 2003 22:42:54 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 195Cdb-0002qV-Hh for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 14 Apr 2003 23:41:19 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.46] (helo=mta6-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 195CdW-0002qJ-NV for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 14 Apr 2003 23:41:14 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.209.117]) by mta6-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030414224113.UKLW22800.mta6-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Mon, 14 Apr 2003 23:41:13 +0100 Message-ID: <000501c302ce$ba7a4680$75d1fc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2003 22:35:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: The Mystery of the Missing Amps.. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Some of you will have noticed that I have been venting my frustrations about the title subject on the reflector recently and that I mentioned an interesting anomaly in the earthing arrangement, so over the weekend out came the deerstalker, cape and meerschaum and the investigation commenced. The anomaly is this; after finishing reworking a number of things as detailed in an earlier posting, the there was a sensible increase in antenna current of about 30 - 40%, so I set about tidying things up round the 'dogbox'. Then to my astonishment the next test produced a further increase, the resultant increase totalling about 75% and the BK could be driven right into saturation. Obviously something had changed, but I had not consciously altered any of the settings. ("Curiouser and curiouser!" said Alice.) A visual inspection of the dogbox in the bosky twilight turned up nothing obvious until I caught a foot in the earthing cable from the point where the co-ax was terminated at the coil, and after the usual 'oh bother!' (or words to that effect) I noticed that the cable did not appear to be attached to the earth point sticking out of the ground. Attached it and returned to shack. Current down again! Huh????? (Followed by lots of very rude words indeed) Just for the hell of it went out into the gathering dark and broke the connection. Current increase back again! Eureka! (Greek for "somebody get me a towel") The first part of the puzzle was, where was the TX finding its earth from? The TX system is complete in itself, mounted on a bit of Conti-board with no mains earth as such (or so I thought) and was not connected to the station earth point (which comes off the same system as the external point, at the apex of a fan of 25sq. mm.earth wires and bonded two ways with 10sq.mm cable to all the plumbing in the house, four 4ft earth rods and a couple of disused electrical earths.) Eventually discovered that the TX and coil were being earthed to the mains (a) through the switched mode PSU suppling the IC706, divider/exciter and the relays, (b) via the earth on the computer COM port, and (c) via the co-ax to the receiver - which is connected to the station earth. The resistance measured between the station and external earth points was measured today as 0.011 Ohms by passing 15A at 12v between them and a known low resistance of 0.1 and measuring the voltage drops. Earthing the TX to the station earth point as well got another few percent of antenna current, but earthing the coil directly to the external point drops the current back to where I started and the BK goes unstable as it approaches maximum output. Could this be a variation of the old audio amp problem cured by using one common earth point? Or - which is much more likely - is there something obvious which is staring me in the face yet still unseen? This is definitely a three pint problem, and in the absence of a brother called Mycroft I am appealing to all you helpful people out there to guide me towards an explanation. Ian GI8AYZ/MI0AYZ P.S. Remarks along the lines of "Leave it alone while it's working" will be treated with a certain amount of disdain, since I have already come up with that particular way out! From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5257 invoked from network); 14 Apr 2003 18:26:19 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 14 Apr 2003 18:26:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 16140 invoked from network); 14 Apr 2003 18:26:08 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 14 Apr 2003 18:26:08 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1958XR-0001le-LY for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 14 Apr 2003 19:18:41 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.48] (helo=mta8-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1958XI-0001jx-38 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 14 Apr 2003 19:18:32 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.233.228]) by mta8-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030414181830.XTYM22832.mta8-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Mon, 14 Apr 2003 19:18:30 +0100 Message-ID: <000801c302a9$cff563c0$e4e9fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <004d01c30143$4703bdd0$1b00a8c0@dellboy> Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2003 18:02:01 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: GM 73kHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.3 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Pick" To: "LF Group" Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2003 11:31 PM Subject: LF: GM 73kHz > Dear all. > > I will be paying another visit to the New Galloway QTH (IO75WC) on easter > Sunday/Monday. I could take the 73k gear if anyone is interested in a test > but I won't bother unless there's some interest. > Rugby seems to be off again.... With only about 6 weeks left before 73 khz permits expire for ever, maybe we all should be making a big effort to send the band out with a blaze. But like Dave except there is some interest it is hardly worth the effort of changing the COIL I did however hear that the permits might be extended if there was sufficient interest. Conversation overheard on 80 metres recently by those that seem to know something!!!!!!!!!! Is this just a rumour, maybe the rest of us are being kept in the dark. de G3KEV > > 73 > Dave G3YXM. > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12459 invoked from network); 14 Apr 2003 05:28:02 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 14 Apr 2003 05:28:02 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 2016 invoked from network); 14 Apr 2003 05:28:06 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 14 Apr 2003 05:28:06 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 194wQx-0005w4-Id for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 14 Apr 2003 06:23:11 +0100 Received: from [195.22.0.27] (helo=iceman.esoterica.pt) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 194wQs-0005vv-Cj for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 14 Apr 2003 06:23:06 +0100 Received: from slave-5 (vis054.esoterica.pt [195.22.17.54]) by iceman.esoterica.pt (8.12.3/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3E5C68B008021 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 2003 06:12:06 +0100 Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20030414052153.00823420@pop.vianw.pt> X-Sender: nx4ywv@pop.vianw.pt X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2003 05:21:53 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Brian Rogerson" In-reply-to: <000701c301f8$9f293160$6507a8c0@Main> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: Propagation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TOversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Alan Just got a thread working. As usual don't know what I'm doing. Must be very wet outside as Tx is drawing 9A usually only 8.4A. The web site is coming back to life and hoping to give you a non-advertised page again. Perhaps I shall be able to transmit next week end. 73, Brian At 21:09 13/04/2003 +0100, you wrote: >Hi all, We may be in for some improvements in night-time propagation now. We >have just had 3 straight days with the Geomagnetic Index, Kp<4, and the NOAA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14585 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2003 20:16:46 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 13 Apr 2003 20:16:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 24988 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2003 20:16:34 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 13 Apr 2003 20:16:34 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 194ntl-0003He-AG for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 21:16:21 +0100 Received: from [213.4.129.150] (helo=telesmtp2.mail.isp) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 194ntg-0003HV-JM for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 21:16:16 +0100 Received: from BI57429bankinter ([81.41.168.176]) by telesmtp2.mail.isp (terra.es) with ESMTP id HDATMZ02.4RI for ; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 22:16:11 +0200 Message-ID: <001c01c301f9$77406820$b0a82951@BI57429bankinter> From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9_Manuel?= To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 22:15:41 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Last night report Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0tests=HTML_50_60,HTML_MESSAGE,UPPERCASE_25_50version=2.51 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi all:
 
Good QRSS3 signals last night, all over 2000 Km, from RU6LA, OK1DTN, YU7AR and SM6BHZ.
 
73 de José, EA1PX - IN53TI
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3195 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2003 20:11:21 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 13 Apr 2003 20:11:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 21746 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2003 20:11:09 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 13 Apr 2003 20:11:09 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 194noH-0003Di-UN for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 21:10:41 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.93] (helo=rhenium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 194noD-0003DZ-6w for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 21:10:37 +0100 Received: from host213-122-203-99.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([213.122.203.99] helo=Main) by rhenium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 194noC-0007WR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 21:10:36 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c301f8$9f293160$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: "LF-Group" Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 21:09:08 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Propagation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi all, We may be in for some improvements in night-time propagation now. We have just had 3 straight days with the Geomagnetic Index, Kp<4, and the NOAA SEC site forecasts quiet conditions for the outlook period. This would just about bring us to the situation that, I believe, would give reasonable, if not particularly spectacular, levels on the Trans-Atlantic path. My feeling is that we need 7 to 10 days of quiet conditions during which conditions will improve. This means that next weekend could be a fair window to try before the summer noise conditions wipe out reception on the band. The best guide will be to watch the site run by Steve Dove W3EEE http://www.w3eee.com and click on the DCF39 Live tab on the left-hand side. This will show a plot of the German utility station DCF39 for the last 24 hours. Good condition are long periods above -20dB peak levels are at around -7dB for the best nights seen this year. One week ago the yellow trace of DCF39 was within 1dB of the blue "noise" trace, but the levels have been creeping up over the last few days. Note though that the darkness path has shortened considerably since January. The first rise in level is now not appearing until well after 2400z and dawn in Europe determines the collapse of conditions. It is accurate enough to consider the ground level dawn as the end of the night because the emerging sunlight hits the ionosphere about 1000 to 1500 kms west of the ground level dawn. It is this point that you require to return your signal for a two hop path. The emerging sunlight lowers the "reflection level" and thumps in about 20dB of attenuation, known as D-layer absorption. Happy Hunting Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4603 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2003 19:21:57 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 13 Apr 2003 19:21:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 17854 invoked by uid 10001); 13 Apr 2003 19:21:57 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 13 Apr 2003 19:21:57 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 194n1s-0002s8-29 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 20:20:40 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.43] (helo=mta3-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 194n1n-0002rv-3c for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 20:20:35 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.206.72]) by mta3-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030413192034.PTXI20683.mta3-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 20:20:34 +0100 Message-ID: <001c01c301e9$52025c40$48cefc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 19:16:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: More DX Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Today Sunday.
Screen covered with acty, MI0, I1, SM, G,OK and F6 all QRS 3 It will soon be DXCC in a day!! Its a pity everyone does not work hand CW as well, some of the above do and I have had several QSO'S with them in the past, but I know some CW only operators looking for someone to work. How about the odd weekend CW only and see what happens.
I am looking for some DX at present like UA9 and UA0.
73 de Mal/G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23654 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2003 16:52:41 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 13 Apr 2003 16:52:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 9191 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2003 16:52:44 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 13 Apr 2003 16:52:44 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 194kiC-00022b-L3 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 17:52:12 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.43] (helo=mta03-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 194ki7-00022S-Qv for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 17:52:07 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with ESMTP id <20030413165207.BLTM11246.mta03-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 17:52:07 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c301dc$8045d940$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "mike.dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 17:48:24 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: New station Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > Look out for G3JRL, John in Weymouth - new on 136 and a big signal this > morning on normal CW (that's the mode where you can complete a QSO in > less than 5 minutes!). > 73, Tom G3OLB Heard John this morning at 329 but couldn't call him because local (audio not RF) QRM made it too difficult. Will look out for him during the week. Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8635 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2003 16:23:22 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 13 Apr 2003 16:23:22 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 23518 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2003 16:23:26 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 13 Apr 2003 16:23:26 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 194kFb-0001os-Fj for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 17:22:39 +0100 Received: from [194.217.242.90] (helo=anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 194kFW-0001oj-Rb for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 17:22:34 +0100 Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 194kFV-000AKR-0W for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 17:22:34 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 17:20:53 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U Subject: LF: New station X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Look out for G3JRL, John in Weymouth - new on 136 and a big signal this morning on normal CW (that's the mode where you can complete a QSO in less than 5 minutes!). 73, Tom G3OLB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22094 invoked from network); 13 Apr 2003 13:39:47 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 13 Apr 2003 13:39:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 11229 invoked by uid 10001); 13 Apr 2003 13:39:47 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 13 Apr 2003 13:39:47 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 194hdX-0000tg-Ce for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 14:35:11 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.46] (helo=mta06-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 194hdS-0000tX-KS for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 14:35:06 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030413133505.GHXL2033.mta06-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Sun, 13 Apr 2003 14:35:05 +0100 Message-ID: <002d01c301c1$8076efa0$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2003 14:35:08 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 73kHz Expeditions Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false I have posted some screen shots of the recent 73kHz activity at http://www.lf.thersgb.net/73khz/mar2003/index.htm. Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23089 invoked from network); 12 Apr 2003 22:31:53 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 12 Apr 2003 22:31:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 8589 invoked by uid 10001); 12 Apr 2003 22:31:53 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 12 Apr 2003 22:31:53 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 194TW6-0003ZP-Mr for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 Apr 2003 23:30:34 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.148] (helo=zinc) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 194TW2-0003ZG-1h for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 Apr 2003 23:30:30 +0100 Received: from host217-35-41-67.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.35.41.67] helo=dellboy) by zinc with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 194TW1-0005H2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 Apr 2003 23:30:29 +0100 Message-ID: <004d01c30143$4703bdd0$1b00a8c0@dellboy> From: "Dave Pick" To: "LF Group" Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 23:31:35 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: GM 73kHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear all. I will be paying another visit to the New Galloway QTH (IO75WC) on easter Sunday/Monday. I could take the 73k gear if anyone is interested in a test but I won't bother unless there's some interest. Rugby seems to be off again.... 73 Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14040 invoked from network); 12 Apr 2003 18:35:03 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 12 Apr 2003 18:35:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 26509 invoked by uid 10001); 12 Apr 2003 18:28:22 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 12 Apr 2003 18:28:22 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 194Pc0-0002MD-EA for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 Apr 2003 19:20:24 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.42] (helo=mta2-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 194Pbv-0002M4-Js for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 Apr 2003 19:20:19 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.232.107]) by mta2-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030412182018.YYKY1184.mta2-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Sat, 12 Apr 2003 19:20:18 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c30117$bc0c3ca0$6be8fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 18:19:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 136 acty Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Lots of acty this w/end so far.
YU7AR DL2HRE OH5UFO I5TGC OK1DTN G3XDV all on QRS 3 PA3EGO on CW. All calling CQ and no QSO'S. I expect they have all worked each other before. I have worked them all in the past and so did no respond. They were all very strong O copy and the weakest one around 569. Am I the only one person that can copy all of these stations aurally.
QRS is useful but not necessary when everyone is so loud aurally. How about some proper CW QSO'S.
De Mal/G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28156 invoked from network); 12 Apr 2003 08:02:11 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 12 Apr 2003 08:02:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 9066 invoked from network); 12 Apr 2003 07:55:19 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 12 Apr 2003 07:55:19 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 194FqU-0007V1-Tz for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 Apr 2003 08:54:42 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.174] (helo=cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 194FqQ-0007Us-9D for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 Apr 2003 08:54:38 +0100 Received: from modem-772.tiger.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.211.4] helo=shack) by cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 194FqP-0002gP-B9 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 Apr 2003 08:54:37 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 08:54:25 +0100 Message-ID: <009701c300c8$c0a98460$1400900a@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: Subject: RE: LF: Experimentation/beaconing Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.4 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Laurence I am interested in some transpolar tests in the winter for sure. I will be improving my signal/antenna over the summer ready for the winter but do you know of any signal sources over yr side that may provide a test signal? Regards Simon GM4PLM -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Laurence J Howell Sent: 12 April 2003 00:28 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Experimentation/beaconing Ian - drilled thick Merlot bottles can, with care, make excellent insulators - but you have to drink it first....Ive found that Zinfandel produces different and inferior results and gives more "bottom" loading..... Conditions T/A and T/Pol - Before I pulled the arrays down today I checked the DCF39 signal and I can only see it weakly 1 hours @ Dot 60 between 0800-0900Z - I hope the Company doesn't move me from here till next March! Anyone want to guess when Ill start to see strong nighttime signals from Eu? Oct/Nov? It seems such a long long way away.... Laurence KL1X, sunny 62F yep... From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3699 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2003 23:35:29 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 23:35:29 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 9342 invoked by uid 10001); 11 Apr 2003 23:28:49 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 23:28:49 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1947w9-00054S-FQ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 Apr 2003 00:28:01 +0100 Received: from [138.32.33.140] (helo=mailman2.ppco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1947w1-00054J-0b for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 Apr 2003 00:27:53 +0100 Received: from bvlw2k131.ppco.com (trend1.ppco.com [138.32.31.131]) by mailman2.ppco.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with SMTP id h3BNRpeA020877 for ; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:27:51 -0500 Received: from 138.32.31.56 by bvlw2k131.ppco.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:27:50 -0500 Received: from bvlnotes07.ppco.com (bvlnotes07.ppco.com [138.32.54.38]) by mail1.ppco.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3BNRoR10420 for ; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:27:50 -0500 (CDT) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.8 June 18, 2001 Message-ID: From: "Laurence J Howell" Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 15:27:48 -0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BVLNOTES07/CIT/Phillips Petroleum/us(Release 5.0.7 |March 21, 2001) at 04/11/2003 06:27:50 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: Experimentation/beaconing Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Ian - drilled thick Merlot bottles can, with care, make excellent insulators - but you have to drink it first....Ive found that Zinfandel produces different and inferior results and gives more "bottom" loading..... Conditions T/A and T/Pol - Before I pulled the arrays down today I checked the DCF39 signal and I can only see it weakly 1 hours @ Dot 60 between 0800-0900Z - I hope the Company doesn't move me from here till next March! Anyone want to guess when Ill start to see strong nighttime signals from Eu? Oct/Nov? It seems such a long long way away.... Laurence KL1X, sunny 62F yep... From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10364 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2003 20:39:59 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 20:39:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 26911 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2003 20:39:47 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 20:39:47 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1945IR-0004Di-EU for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 21:38:51 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1945IF-0004DZ-H9 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 21:38:39 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.206.18]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030411203833.ORLA6822.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 21:38:33 +0100 Message-ID: <000b01c30062$111fd640$12cefc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 20:11:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Experimentation. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi all, things seem to have been pretty quiet on the reflector this week, which has given me the chance to go "back to basics". (Didn't some daft political party witter on about that and get roundly trounced a couple of elections ago?) Never mind, the case of the disappearing antenna current has been the subject of much agonising and brain-bashing this week and I am happy to say that some of the anomalies have been found to be more apparent than real. Having got Madame out of the way for a guzzle, gurgle and gossip session with one of her pals I obtained unrestricted access to the microwave oven and conducted a number of tests on the materials used in my various erections (if you'll pardon the expression). The conclusions are that the lighter and cheaper the plywood, the greater the losses. Samples of the good quality material used for the endplates and ribs of the big coil barely warmed at 850W, as did the hardwood dowel. But the cheap, thin plywood used for the 'dogbox' got fairly hot by the time the coffee water boiled. However, allowing for the differences in frequency, power levels and spacing involved, only a small proportion of the vanishing amps could be accounted for by this alone. Cutting a long and exasperating story short, once the test gear had been checked out and found wanting in certain respects (I had completely forgotten that it had been built and calibrated for 73 KHz using toroids of dubious origin and was more than a bit out at 136KHz); a number of alterations made to the 'angle of dangle' of the vertical wires and their attack angle to the coil; a reworking of the antenna current sensor placement; and the discovery of a puzzling anomaly - still to be resolved - in the earthing arrangements, it would appear that now 205W at 73KHz and 100W at 136KHz each put about 75% more current into the antenna. Neither the position of the coil relative to cement block and/or brick walls better than 1/2 coil diameter away, or its height (checked at intervals up to better than coil length) above a concrete path made seemed to make any appreciable difference. This is a very worthwhile improvement and encourages me to continue with T/A beaconing on 136KHz, but only more or better reports and QSOs will show whether the increase is more real than apparent. Volunteers for skeds on both bands would be welcome. The only thing I can say for certain out of all this is that coffee is better for cerebration than Merlot, but for relaxation it's the other way round! 73 de, Ian GI8AYZ/MI0AYZ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26240 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2003 17:52:27 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 17:52:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 5022 invoked by uid 10001); 11 Apr 2003 17:52:27 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 17:52:27 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1942gc-00039H-Sq for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:51:38 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.147] (helo=einsteinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1942gX-000398-Vv for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:51:34 +0100 Received: from host217-35-41-67.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.35.41.67] helo=dellboy) by einsteinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 1942gX-0003OX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:51:33 +0100 Message-ID: <001401c30053$28dccb30$1b00a8c0@dellboy> From: "Dave Pick" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000301c30033$554c4620$1cd1fc3e@l8p8y6> <004801c3004e$817e6820$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> <003301c30050$fffa8e20$09dc9384@jka> Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:52:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: CE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false The only thing wrong with this is that you don't know whether you've stumbled on part of a QSO or a call... although it is a technique I have used for years (I rarely call CQ EXCEPT on LF!). I liked the "KA" idea. I also agree with Mike's suggestion of "Q" for quicker and "S" for slower. Dave G3YXM. > It would seem to me that just sending one's callsign followed by "K" would > be an invitation for anyone to go ahead. The "K" would differentiate this > from a beacon where no command is given. > > John Andrews, W1TAG > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19839 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2003 17:38:04 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 17:38:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 22375 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2003 17:37:52 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 17:37:52 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1942T2-0002wD-4L for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:37:36 +0100 Received: from [206.173.118.93] (helo=uhura.concentric.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1942Sw-0002w4-Po for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:37:31 +0100 Received: from marconi.concentric.net (marconi.concentric.net [206.173.118.71]) by uhura.concentric.net [Concentric SMTP Routing 1.0] id h3BHbSs08302 for ; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 13:37:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from jka ([208.37.242.34]) by marconi.concentric.net (8.9.1a+patch04072003) id NAA16224; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 13:37:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <003301c30050$fffa8e20$09dc9384@jka> From: "John Andrews" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000301c30033$554c4620$1cd1fc3e@l8p8y6> <004801c3004e$817e6820$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 13:37:17 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: CE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false It would seem to me that just sending one's callsign followed by "K" would be an invitation for anyone to go ahead. The "K" would differentiate this from a beacon where no command is given. John Andrews, W1TAG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13041 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2003 17:25:16 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 17:25:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 20703 invoked by uid 10001); 11 Apr 2003 17:25:15 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 17:25:15 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1942Fv-0002pp-LE for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:24:03 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.41] (helo=mta01-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1942Fi-0002pg-Ll for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:23:50 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with ESMTP id <20030411172349.SWFD6166.mta01-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:23:49 +0100 Message-ID: <004801c3004e$817e6820$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "mike.dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000301c30033$554c4620$1cd1fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 18:19:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: CE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false G3KEV wrote: I have read the alternatives KA is already in use.( see handbook for radio operators) It indicates the beginning of a transmission ie KA SM6XXX DE G3KEV K EE also in use for the letter I E E means what it says and in use GE also in use in amateur procedure Good Evening I suggested CE because of the above restrictions. It is hard to find something not already in use and shorter than CQ CE is also in use in the Japanese morse code ie KI but is not likely to cause any confusion here in the West at present on LF 73 de Mal/G3KEV ========= Why not just send 'C'? We already have reports reduced to a single letter and 'QRZ?' reduced to just '?'. On a similar note, it would help to define signals for 'send faster' and 'send slower'. I suggest 'Q' for 'QRQ' or faster, and 'S' for QRS or slower. Note that the Q would be used whilst in QSO, so should not be confused with 'CQ'. Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11200 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2003 15:13:41 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 15:13:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 25456 invoked by uid 10001); 11 Apr 2003 15:13:41 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 15:13:41 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 19405x-0001pf-Ei for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 16:05:37 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.44] (helo=mta4-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 19405k-0001pU-3M for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 16:05:24 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.209.28]) by mta4-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030411150522.UQOR11888.mta4-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 16:05:22 +0100 Message-ID: <000301c30033$554c4620$1cd1fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 08:35:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: CE Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.3 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_PAST_06_12,HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
I have read the alternatives
KA  is already in use.( see handbook for radio operators) It indicates the beginning of a transmission ie KA SM6XXX DE G3KEV K
EE also in use for the letter  I
E E means what it says and in use
GE also in use in amateur procedure Good Evening
 
I suggested CE because of the above restrictions. It is hard to find something not already in use and shorter than CQ
 
CE is also in use in the Japanese morse code ie KI but is not likely to cause any confusion here in the West at present on LF
 
73 de Mal/G3KEV
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18385 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2003 09:35:15 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 09:35:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 27768 invoked by uid 10001); 11 Apr 2003 09:35:14 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 09:35:13 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193uv9-0007us-VJ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 10:34:07 +0100 Received: from [212.159.14.227] (helo=warrior.services.quay.plus.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 193uv5-0007uG-6f for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 10:34:03 +0100 Received: (qmail 13798 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2003 09:33:35 -0000 Received: from ctuash.sonnetinternet.co.uk (HELO Hugh) (212.159.90.113) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 09:33:35 -0000 Message-ID: <005601c3000d$66ab8f00$3704210a@Hugh> From: "Hugh M0WYE" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <191xgH-175wvYC@fwd10.sul.t-online.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030404222503.009f79d0@mail.pncl.co.uk> <5.1.0.14.0.20030408102406.02f05cd0@u0019445.kuleuven.be> Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2003 10:29:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Doppler shift Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.9 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Rik, Sorry it has taken a few days to reply, but it took me a while to find the article... Peter Martinez, G3PLX, wrote an excellent article about doppler shift and the ionosphere, illustrated with dopplergrams in RadCom, May 1998, page 16. Many other studies seem to draw on his material and I found that a Google search for "G3PLX doppler" yielded many interesting links to material about doppler shifts in the ionosphere. This one looked quite relavent to what you were looking at. http://www.oregon-hw-sw.com/SIMULR/ 73 Hugh M0WYE ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rik Strobbe" To: Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2003 9:30 AM Subject: LF: Doppler shift > Hello group, > > The question is a bit off topic, so longwave-only readers can push the > delete button now. > > A friend of mine is interested in QRSS tests on 10.1MHz (30 meter) and one > of the things we are discussing is the longest useable dotlength is on that > frequency. Apart from TX (and RX) stabilty doppler shift due to ionospheric > refections will cause frequency instability. > Does anyone have an idea how much Hz the doppler shift can be on 10MHz ? > Is there any info available on the web ? > > 73, Rik ON7YD > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13290 invoked from network); 11 Apr 2003 03:59:50 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 03:59:50 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 2435 invoked by uid 10001); 11 Apr 2003 03:59:50 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 11 Apr 2003 03:59:50 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193paY-0006CR-Fi for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 04:52:30 +0100 Received: from [138.32.33.10] (helo=mailman1.ppco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193paT-0006CI-Gs for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Apr 2003 04:52:25 +0100 Received: from bvlw2k131.ppco.com (trend1.ppco.com [138.32.31.131]) by mailman1.ppco.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with SMTP id h3B3qOPS000987 for ; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 22:52:24 -0500 Received: from 138.32.31.56 by bvlw2k131.ppco.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 10 Apr 2003 22:52:24 -0500 Received: from bvlnotes07.ppco.com (bvlnotes07.ppco.com [138.32.54.38]) by mail1.ppco.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h3B3qOR15455 for ; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 22:52:24 -0500 (CDT) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.8 June 18, 2001 Message-ID: From: "Laurence J Howell" Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 19:52:22 -0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BVLNOTES07/CIT/Phillips Petroleum/us(Release 5.0.7 |March 21, 2001) at 04/10/2003 10:52:24 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: Site Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false The LF Argo shots of 137/185/71 Khz (and more or less as available) on the web site are off line. Reason - Contractors start work this weekend on the tower extension and I've started to dismantle the hardline feeders. I should, work permitting, be back on line with a bigger and even less noisy receive array by the middle of next week. Ill attempt to be back on line with Echolink as well. Ive/you've not missed much this past weeks here in the Northern lats, conditions are still very depressing/depressed. Ill have the final results of the "on air receive" comparison between the 850 and 870 on the web site next week sometime...it was very close but the 870 gets my vote, but only on 137Khz and probably only from this location.... Rgds Laurence KL1X Anchorage http://www.kl1x.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27378 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 19:51:37 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 19:51:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 14800 invoked by uid 10001); 10 Apr 2003 19:24:57 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 19:24:57 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193hey-0003mn-QZ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 20:24:32 +0100 Received: from [130.244.199.130] (helo=fep02-svc.swip.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193heu-0003me-5S for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 20:24:28 +0100 Received: from oemcomputer ([213.101.39.107]) by fep02-svc.swip.net with SMTP id <20030410192426.OTNE13942.fep02-svc.swip.net@oemcomputer> for ; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 21:24:26 +0200 Message-ID: <001301c2ff97$1bdfedc0$6b2765d5@oemcomputer> From: "Johan Bodin" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001601c2ff6f$156fdae0$9cccfc3e@l8p8y6> <000d01c2ff90$1a3a5840$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 21:26:00 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: CE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > Why not GE which could stand for general enquiry and is one dot shorter.! Laurie Good idea but it can be confused with Good Evening. Why not just G9XYZ dah-di-dah-di-dah? Like K and A put together. KA = K Anyone. In addition, dah-di-dah-di-dah means "attention!". 73 Johan SM6LKM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16670 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 19:18:47 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 19:18:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 17389 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 19:18:35 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 19:18:35 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193hYp-0003fo-5l for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 20:18:11 +0100 Received: from [66.27.141.37] (helo=momsnu1) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193hYk-0003ez-2K for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 20:18:06 +0100 Received: from [192.168.0.12] by momsnu1 (ArGoSoft Mail Server for Windows NT/2000, Version 1.4 (1.4.0.5)); Thu, 10 Apr 2003 12:17:34 -0700 Message-ID: <007d01c2ff95$d767a8a0$0c00a8c0@home> From: "DTX" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001601c2ff6f$156fdae0$9cccfc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 12:17:34 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: CE Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
As well as GE for General "Enquiry" fron Laurie, how about AE for Any Exchange?  A dot and a dash shorter.
 
Gary WA6DTX
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2003 7:30 AM
Subject: LF: CE

Hi all
On QRS mode CQ takes up a lot of non productive time. I am going to try instead CE which is unique and does not clash with any other bit of amateur procedure. ie CE G3KEV K
Those that see me using the above procedure on QRS mode will know that I am calling CQ  and can respond accordingly.
If anyone has an opinion on the above for or against pse comment. On normal CW I wll continue with the established CQ.
73 de G3KEV/IO94SH
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17466 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 18:50:17 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 18:50:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 24506 invoked by uid 10001); 10 Apr 2003 18:50:17 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 18:50:17 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193h7G-0003Ux-1l for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 19:49:42 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.176] (helo=protactinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193h7A-0003Uo-Uf for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 19:49:37 +0100 Received: from host217-35-41-67.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([217.35.41.67] helo=dellboy) by protactinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 193h7A-0001kw-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 19:49:36 +0100 Message-ID: <007301c2ff92$1680c0c0$1b00a8c0@dellboy> From: "Dave Pick" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001601c2ff6f$156fdae0$9cccfc3e@l8p8y6> <000d01c2ff90$1a3a5840$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 19:50:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: CE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Or how about "EE", short for 'ello 'ello? Dave G3YXM. If anyone has an opinion on the above for or against pse comment. On normal CW I wll continue with the established CQ. 73 de G3KEV/IO94SH Why not GE which could stand for general enquiry and is one dot shorter.! Laurie From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4444 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 18:39:35 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 18:39:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 8109 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 18:39:23 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 18:39:23 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193gto-0003Kg-SF for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 19:35:48 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.174] (helo=cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193gtj-0003KX-AW for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 19:35:43 +0100 Received: from modem-22.oregon.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.88.22] helo=f3a3a2) by cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 193gth-00042s-In for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 19:35:41 +0100 Message-ID: <000d01c2ff90$1a3a5840$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> From: "Laurie Mayhead" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001601c2ff6f$156fdae0$9cccfc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 19:34:58 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: CE Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.8 required=5.0tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2003 3:30 PM
Subject: LF: CE

Hi all
On QRS mode CQ takes up a lot of non productive time. I am going to try instead CE which is unique and does not clash with any other bit of amateur procedure. ie CE G3KEV K
Those that see me using the above procedure on QRS mode will know that I am calling CQ  and can respond accordingly.
If anyone has an opinion on the above for or against pse comment. On normal CW I wll continue with the established CQ.
73 de G3KEV/IO94SH
Why not GE which could stand for general enquiry and is one dot shorter.! Laurie
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3338 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 15:41:45 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 15:41:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 13961 invoked by uid 10001); 10 Apr 2003 15:41:44 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 15:41:43 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193eAR-0002Bs-10 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 16:40:47 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.44] (helo=mta4-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193eAM-0002Bj-4R for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 16:40:42 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.204.156]) by mta4-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030410154040.OZBV11888.mta4-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 16:40:40 +0100 Message-ID: <001701c2ff6f$1932af40$9cccfc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 15:39:38 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: TKS Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Txn to all those that responded from near and far to my recent activities on 136 khz especially from Russia; with QSO'S and other reports and screen shots sent via private email. Most came privately because of the limitations with attachments via the reflector. YU7AR also has an impressive antenna installation and signal these days.
73 de Mal/G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19409 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 15:41:45 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 15:41:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 13960 invoked by uid 10001); 10 Apr 2003 15:41:44 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 15:41:43 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193eAK-0002Bf-Qz for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 16:40:40 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.44] (helo=mta4-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193eAG-0002BT-1P for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 16:40:36 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.204.156]) by mta4-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030410154034.OZAL11888.mta4-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 16:40:34 +0100 Message-ID: <001601c2ff6f$156fdae0$9cccfc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 15:30:49 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: CE Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi all
On QRS mode CQ takes up a lot of non productive time. I am going to try instead CE which is unique and does not clash with any other bit of amateur procedure. ie CE G3KEV K
Those that see me using the above procedure on QRS mode will know that I am calling CQ  and can respond accordingly.
If anyone has an opinion on the above for or against pse comment. On normal CW I wll continue with the established CQ.
73 de G3KEV/IO94SH
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31128 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 13:08:41 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 13:08:41 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 24863 invoked by uid 10001); 10 Apr 2003 13:08:41 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 13:08:40 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193bmH-00018b-F1 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 14:07:41 +0100 Received: from [194.217.242.80] (helo=anchor-post-39.mail.demon.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193bmB-00018S-KZ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 14:07:35 +0100 Received: from pickmere.demon.co.uk ([158.152.117.143]) by anchor-post-39.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 193bm9-0000Sz-0d for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 14:07:34 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 14:05:16 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. J. Powell" Disposition-Notification-To: "M. J. Powell" References: <001301c2ff48$a9a6bc00$6507a8c0@Main> In-reply-to: <001301c2ff48$a9a6bc00$6507a8c0@Main> MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Turnpike/6.01-S () Subject: Re: LF: re Rugby Radio Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.9 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,USER_AGENTversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false In message <001301c2ff48$a9a6bc00$6507a8c0@Main>, Alan Melia writes > >Not LF I know, but I have just been advised by a member of the British >Vintage Wireless Soc. that they have arranged presentation of the original >"2LO" transmitter to the Science Museum, and there is a promise that it will >will put on display soon. Is this the one that was on display at a Marconi museum in a water mill just outside Chelmsford? Mike -- M.J.owell From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19277 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 10:13:03 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 10:13:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 4021 invoked by uid 10001); 10 Apr 2003 10:13:03 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 10:13:02 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193YwP-0008OW-NB for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 11:05:57 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.92] (helo=carbon.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193YwK-0008ON-GT for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 11:05:52 +0100 Received: from host213-122-67-222.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([213.122.67.222] helo=Main) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 193YwI-0007ML-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 11:05:51 +0100 Message-ID: <001301c2ff48$a9a6bc00$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: "LF-Group" Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 11:04:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: re Rugby Radio Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Walter, thanks for the transcript of the Rugby Radio article. It is the same material that has been on my web site for a year. I find it amazing how many people have suddenly come out with articles based on it since my posting !! I had to retype a very faint "Roneo" type copy, so I guess most must have used my electronic source as the wording is exactly the same. I must see if they have the spelling mistake I corrected !! At least this one does acknowledge the original source, I wonder whether they realise he was a site engineer. I even believe the article was reissued by BT recently, maybe that was after my re-type appeared in the Retired Staff's Newsletter. For anyone interested in the future of the LF traffic, the following URL describes the PFI that is changing it all. http://www.mod.uk/dlo/dcsa/organisations/ipts/strs/strsforeword.htm Not LF I know, but I have just been advised by a member of the British Vintage Wireless Soc. that they have arranged presentation of the original "2LO" transmitter to the Science Museum, and there is a promise that it will will put on display soon. Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14407 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 07:39:56 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 07:39:56 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 2426 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 07:33:18 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 07:33:18 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193WYN-0007L0-Kf for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:32:59 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.45] (helo=mta05-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193WYE-0007Kr-Bi for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:32:50 +0100 Received: from virgin.net ([81.98.79.86]) by mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with ESMTP id <20030410073249.XYDE311.mta05-svc.ntlworld.com@virgin.net> for ; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:32:49 +0100 Message-ID: <3E951DD7.2010704@virgin.net> Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:31:35 +0100 From: "Stewart Bryant" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030409191554.009fdc00@mail.pncl.co.uk> <3E951CC7.2030905@virgin.net> Subject: Re: LF: Rugby Radio Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.6 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Sorry about the spam. I meant it to go direct to Walter, and forgot that this reflector defaults to the whole group. 73 Stewart Stewart Bryant wrote: > Please could I have a copy. > > Hope you are well. > > Stewart > > Walter Blanchard wrote: > >> There is an excellent article detailing the history and giving a >> technical description of GBR Rugby in the current issue of "Medium >> Wave News". It's a little old (written in 1974) but still interesting >> . If anyone would like it (PDF format) let me know. This reflector >> does not accept messages with attachments over 30k so I can't send it >> with this. >> >> Walter G3JKV. >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> >> --- >> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. >> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >> Version: 6.0.459 / Virus Database: 258 - Release Date: 25/02/03 > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23909 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 07:29:49 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 07:29:49 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 24942 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 07:29:37 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 07:29:37 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193WTz-0007JY-8E for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:28:27 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.45] (helo=mta05-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193WTp-0007JL-W3 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:28:18 +0100 Received: from virgin.net ([81.98.79.86]) by mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with ESMTP id <20030410072817.XTID311.mta05-svc.ntlworld.com@virgin.net> for ; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:28:17 +0100 Message-ID: <3E951CC7.2030905@virgin.net> Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:27:03 +0100 From: "Stewart Bryant" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030409191554.009fdc00@mail.pncl.co.uk> Subject: Re: LF: Rugby Radio Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-28.6 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES,USER_AGENT_MOZILLA_UAversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Please could I have a copy. Hope you are well. Stewart Walter Blanchard wrote: > There is an excellent article detailing the history and giving a > technical description of GBR Rugby in the current issue of "Medium Wave > News". It's a little old (written in 1974) but still interesting . If > anyone would like it (PDF format) let me know. This reflector does not > accept messages with attachments over 30k so I can't send it with this. > > Walter G3JKV. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.459 / Virus Database: 258 - Release Date: 25/02/03 From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18467 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 04:41:43 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 04:41:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 16872 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 04:41:46 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 04:41:46 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193TrG-0006YI-VD for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 05:40:18 +0100 Received: from [80.82.32.9] (helo=serv1.vsi.ru) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193Tr7-0006Y4-CK for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 05:40:09 +0100 Received: from rx3qfm (413.asx.dial.vsi.ru [80.82.38.157]) by serv1.vsi.ru (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with SMTP id h3A4dbb29760 for ; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:39:38 +0400 (MSD) Message-ID: <002001c2ff1b$2736fc30$9d265250@sckr.com> From: "Vladimir Shuplyakov" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030409191554.009fdc00@mail.pncl.co.uk> Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 08:38:45 +0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Rugby Radio Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.5 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hello, dear Walter! I will bee very pleassure, if you send me pdf to my work e-mail vladimir@m-media.ru . 73! Vlad. RX3QFM. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Walter Blanchard" To: Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2003 10:19 PM Subject: LF: Rugby Radio > There is an excellent article detailing the history and giving a technical > description of GBR Rugby in the current issue of "Medium Wave News". It's > a little old (written in 1974) but still interesting . If anyone would like > it (PDF format) let me know. This reflector does not accept messages with > attachments over 30k so I can't send it with this. > > Walter G3JKV. > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.459 / Virus Database: 258 - Release Date: 25/02/03 > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18340 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2003 00:36:32 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 00:36:32 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 17096 invoked by uid 10001); 10 Apr 2003 00:29:52 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 2003 00:29:52 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193Pso-0005JR-99 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 01:25:38 +0100 Received: from [194.25.134.84] (helo=mailout09.sul.t-online.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193Psg-0005JI-KH for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 01:25:30 +0100 Received: from fwd08.sul.t-online.de by mailout09.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 193Psg-0004AS-01; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 02:25:30 +0200 Received: from 127.0.0.1 (087321565-0001@[217.2.40.144]) by fwd08.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 193Pse-26IytkC; Thu, 10 Apr 2003 02:25:28 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Hans-Joachim Brandt" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 4.109 Date: 09 Apr 2003 20:46 GMT Message-ID: <193Pse-26IytkC@fwd08.sul.t-online.com> X-Sender: 087321565-0001@t-dialin.net Subject: Re: LF: Rugby Radio Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.6 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_PAST_03_06,USER_AGENT_TONLINEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear Walter, I would also like to receive a copy of the "Rugby Story". 73 Ha-Jo, DJ1ZB "Walter Blanchard" schrieb: > There is an excellent article detailing the history and giving a technical > description of GBR Rugby in the current issue of "Medium Wave News". It's > a little old (written in 1974) but still interesting . If anyone would like > it (PDF format) let me know. This reflector does not accept messages with > attachments over 30k so I can't send it with this. > > Walter G3JKV. > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11746 invoked from network); 9 Apr 2003 18:28:18 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 9 Apr 2003 18:28:18 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 10459 invoked from network); 9 Apr 2003 18:21:27 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 9 Apr 2003 18:21:27 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193KBG-0003aK-46 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 09 Apr 2003 19:20:18 +0100 Received: from [212.35.226.183] (helo=k2.pncl.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193KB8-0003a4-FW for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 09 Apr 2003 19:20:10 +0100 Received: from k7t.pncl.co.uk (116.234.35.212.in-addr.arpa.ip-pool.cix.co.uk [212.35.234.116]) by k2.pncl.co.uk (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.3) with ESMTP id h39IK76W015668 for ; Wed, 9 Apr 2003 19:20:09 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030409191554.009fdc00@mail.pncl.co.uk> X-Sender: blanch@mail.pncl.co.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 19:19:09 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Walter Blanchard" MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: Rugby Radio Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------050306050600080708020306" X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------050306050600080708020306 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit There is an excellent article detailing the history and giving a technical description of GBR Rugby in the current issue of "Medium Wave News". It's a little old (written in 1974) but still interesting . If anyone would like it (PDF format) let me know. This reflector does not accept messages with attachments over 30k so I can't send it with this. Walter G3JKV. --------------050306050600080708020306 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; name="ATT11736.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="ATT11736.txt" --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.459 / Virus Database: 258 - Release Date: 25/02/03 --------------050306050600080708020306-- From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27627 invoked from network); 9 Apr 2003 10:55:29 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 9 Apr 2003 10:55:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 6025 invoked by uid 10001); 9 Apr 2003 10:55:29 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 9 Apr 2003 10:55:29 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 193D9i-0000bX-CX for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 09 Apr 2003 11:50:14 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 193D9d-0000bO-44 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 09 Apr 2003 11:50:09 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.232.219]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030409105008.NTIC6822.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Wed, 9 Apr 2003 11:50:08 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c2fe7d$57467e80$dbe8fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 10:49:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: T/ATLANTIC Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
    Hi All
Is there anyone watching/listening in the USA/Canada for EU acty on 137 khz at present, If so what times and frequency.
Condx at present good to the EAST and possibly the WEST.
 
73 de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9933 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2003 17:29:14 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 17:29:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 22824 invoked by uid 10001); 8 Apr 2003 17:29:14 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 17:29:13 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 192wqR-0004Tl-5g for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 18:25:15 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 192wqH-0004Tc-Io for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 18:25:05 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.229.160]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030408172504.OLQT6822.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Tue, 8 Apr 2003 18:25:04 +0100 Message-ID: <000801c2fdeb$58bfc560$a0e5fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001701c2fd25$d086aee0$c1e9fc3e@l8p8y6> <169102087333.20030408151338@dx.ru> Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2003 17:24:05 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Monopoly OFF ! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.5 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ed Lesnichy" To: Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2003 1:13 PM Subject: LF: Monopoly OFF ! > Hello LF fans! > > Our monopoly OFF !! > > One more Russian station has appeared on 136 - Sam RN6BN > nr Krasnodar QTH-loc KN95LC ( e-mail: rn6bn@73.ru ) > Sam's EQ at http://www.73.ru/equipment/137/index.htm > He the large fan 160/80m and RU6LWZ's Life Member since 1985 > > Also already TX on 136 RK2FWA, RX3QFM, RA9MB, UA0AGC and UA9XBI. > I hope that UA Eu and UA As will not be large DX on 136 > > My a flying visit to Machta Apr 6 from abt 19z: > DL2HRE, OK1DWF, YU7AR, RN6BN (First UA Eu - UA Eu !!), G3KEV, F6BWO Hello Ed. Tnx for the nice solid QSO. You were very strong on both QRS and Aural. RN6BN was also very strong both visual/aural. I am QAP for all Russian acty across to UA0. I have worked many UA9/UA0 stn on 160 metres in the past and am looking for them on 137 khz CW or QRS CW. I have been able to copy you and also UA9OC during late afternoon during daytime, sun shining Hi 73 and GL de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH > > 73! Ed RU6LA ed@dx.ru > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11371 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2003 14:09:53 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 14:09:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 5906 invoked by uid 10001); 8 Apr 2003 14:09:51 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 14:09:51 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 192tif-0003Ew-KP for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 15:05:01 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.9] (helo=hestia.herts.ac.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 192tiZ-0003El-5o for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 15:04:55 +0100 Received: from gemini ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini.herts.ac.uk) by hestia.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 192tiS-0006Z1-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 15:04:48 +0100 Received: from [147.197.232.252] (helo=rsch-15.herts.ac.uk) by gemini.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 192tiH-0003KT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 15:04:37 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030408141524.024ddd90@gemini.herts.ac.uk> X-Sender: mj9ar@gemini.herts.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 08 Apr 2003 15:04:28 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "James Moritz" In-reply-to: <5.1.0.14.0.20030408102406.02f05cd0@u0019445.kuleuven.be> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030407151723.00a9ea90@gemini.herts.ac.uk> <191xgH-175wvYC@fwd10.sul.t-online.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030404222503.009f79d0@mail.pncl.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MailScanner: No Virus detected Subject: Re: LF: Doppler shift Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.9 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear Rik, LF Group, At 10:30 08/04/2003 +0200, you wrote: >A friend of mine is interested in QRSS tests on 10.1MHz (30 meter) and one >of the things we are discussing is the longest useable dotlength is on >that frequency. Apart from TX (and RX) stabilty doppler shift due to >ionospheric refections will cause frequency instability Based on the experience of receiving the US "Hifer" beacons on about 13.55MHz last year, doppler shift of a few Hz can be expected - sometimes the traces are blurred, or even split into 2 separate traces a few Hz apart, but QRSS3 seems to work fairly well - I suspect a dot length longer than 3s would be counter-productive due to the generally much greater doppler effects at HF, and the rapid fading. The Hifers were often visible last summer during the night, and occasionally even audible using a dipole receiving antenna. I think they normally run a few mW into ground-plane type antennas, which is a nice demonstration of how much easier HF is! Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15202 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2003 11:29:59 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 11:29:59 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 14820 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2003 11:30:01 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 11:30:01 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 192rHi-0002Ga-IY for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 12:29:02 +0100 Received: from [64.12.136.164] (helo=imo-m09.mx.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 192rHc-0002GL-5j for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 12:28:56 +0100 Received: from MarkusVester@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id l.199.186550e0 (16098) for ; Tue, 8 Apr 2003 07:28:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aol.com (mow-d16.webmail.aol.com [205.188.139.132]) by air-id11.mx.aol.com (v92.17) with ESMTP id MAILINID112-3ee23e92b254131; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 07:28:20 -0500 Date: Tue, 08 Apr 2003 07:28:20 -0400 From: MarkusVester@aol.com To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <6CEC6450.0A4DFFFA.28FF0FBC@aol.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 Subject: Re: LF: Chirped Hell Software Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.7 required=5.0tests=NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear Uwe, tnx for your feedback on Chirped Hell. Yes, it is slow at 5Hz bandwidth... but you can select much faster and more wideband modes by decreasing the "/FFT" or "w" parameters. It will be interesting to see how multipath and propagational doppler will affect a 2kHz-wide image spectrum on shortwave... Yesterday night, I have fixed a small bug in Chirphel, which caused excessive delays after each transmitted word when run under Win NT / XP. The updated version v.2i can now be found at the old address http://members.aol.com/DF6NM/ChirpPix.zip 73 de Markus, DF6NM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9755 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2003 11:14:58 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 11:14:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 4141 invoked by uid 10001); 8 Apr 2003 11:14:58 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 11:14:58 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 192r2k-00027Q-AI for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 12:13:34 +0100 Received: from [80.68.3.204] (helo=relay.dx.ru) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 192r2e-00027D-77 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 12:13:28 +0100 Received: (qmail 99825 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2003 08:34:54 +0400 Received: from ed.dx (ed@10.0.1.11) by gw.dx with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 08:34:54 +0400 Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2003 15:13:38 +0300 From: "Ed Lesnichy" X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.60q) Personal Organization: Ed Lesnichy X-Priority: 3 Message-ID: <169102087333.20030408151338@dx.ru> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org In-reply-to: <001701c2fd25$d086aee0$c1e9fc3e@l8p8y6> References: <001701c2fd25$d086aee0$c1e9fc3e@l8p8y6> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: Monopoly OFF ! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-8.8 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,UPPERCASE_25_50version=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hello LF fans! Our monopoly OFF !! One more Russian station has appeared on 136 - Sam RN6BN nr Krasnodar QTH-loc KN95LC ( e-mail: rn6bn@73.ru ) Sam's EQ at http://www.73.ru/equipment/137/index.htm He the large fan 160/80m and RU6LWZ's Life Member since 1985 Also already TX on 136 RK2FWA, RX3QFM, RA9MB, UA0AGC and UA9XBI. I hope that UA Eu and UA As will not be large DX on 136 My a flying visit to Machta Apr 6 from abt 19z: DL2HRE, OK1DWF, YU7AR, RN6BN (First UA Eu - UA Eu !!), G3KEV, F6BWO 73! Ed RU6LA ed@dx.ru From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 32343 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2003 10:35:29 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 10:35:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 22856 invoked by uid 10001); 8 Apr 2003 10:35:26 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 10:35:26 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 192qQT-0001p1-Uy for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 11:34:01 +0100 Received: from [193.229.0.45] (helo=fep19-app.kolumbus.fi) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 192qQN-0001op-RB for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 11:33:55 +0100 Received: from merocomp ([62.248.252.43]) by fep19-app.kolumbus.fi with SMTP id <20030408103354.WQBL3999.fep19-app.kolumbus.fi@merocomp> for ; Tue, 8 Apr 2003 13:33:54 +0300 Message-ID: <000701c2fdba$795bd100$1c076c0a@arenanet.fi> From: "Matti Niemela" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <191xgH-175wvYC@fwd10.sul.t-online.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030404222503.009f79d0@mail.pncl.co.uk> <5.1.0.14.0.20030408102406.02f05cd0@u0019445.kuleuven.be> Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2003 13:34:45 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Doppler shift Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.9 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hello Rik, Based on my observations frequency shifts 1-2 Hz on 10Mhz are quite common during sunset and sunrise. During good daylight propagation shifts are much under 1 Hz via path of 500-2000 km. 73, Matti ,OH2ZT ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rik Strobbe" To: Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2003 11:30 AM Subject: LF: Doppler shift > Hello group, > > The question is a bit off topic, so longwave-only readers can push the > delete button now. > > A friend of mine is interested in QRSS tests on 10.1MHz (30 meter) and one > of the things we are discussing is the longest useable dotlength is on that > frequency. Apart from TX (and RX) stabilty doppler shift due to ionospheric > refections will cause frequency instability. > Does anyone have an idea how much Hz the doppler shift can be on 10MHz ? > Is there any info available on the web ? > > 73, Rik ON7YD > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17176 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2003 08:30:53 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 08:30:53 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: (qmail 28289 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2003 08:30:42 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 08:30:42 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 192oUY-00011O-GC for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 09:30:06 +0100 Received: from [134.58.240.45] (helo=thumbler.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 192oUT-00011A-Fx for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 09:30:01 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by thumbler.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 460BF1377FF for ; Tue, 8 Apr 2003 10:29:31 +0200 (CEST) Received: from lepidus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (lepidus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.240.72]) by thumbler.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id F17A71377F9 for ; Tue, 8 Apr 2003 10:29:30 +0200 (CEST) Received: from dell-rik.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (pc-10-33-165-177.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [10.33.165.177]) by lepidus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id CABB938007D for ; Tue, 8 Apr 2003 10:29:30 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030408102406.02f05cd0@u0019445.kuleuven.be> X-Sender: u0019445@u0019445.kuleuven.be X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 08 Apr 2003 10:30:34 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" In-reply-to: <5.1.0.14.0.20030407151723.00a9ea90@gemini.herts.ac.uk> References: <191xgH-175wvYC@fwd10.sul.t-online.com> <5.1.0.14.2.20030404222503.009f79d0@mail.pncl.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: by KULeuven Antivirus Cluster Subject: LF: Doppler shift Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.9 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hello group, The question is a bit off topic, so longwave-only readers can push the delete button now. A friend of mine is interested in QRSS tests on 10.1MHz (30 meter) and one of the things we are discussing is the longest useable dotlength is on that frequency. Apart from TX (and RX) stabilty doppler shift due to ionospheric refections will cause frequency instability. Does anyone have an idea how much Hz the doppler shift can be on 10MHz ? Is there any info available on the web ? 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 30944 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2003 07:43:07 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 07:43:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 18860 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2003 07:42:55 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 07:42:55 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 192nh4-0000jJ-LZ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 08:38:58 +0100 Received: from [80.68.3.204] (helo=relay.dx.ru) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 192ngz-0000jA-GB for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 08:38:53 +0100 Received: (qmail 94640 invoked from network); 8 Apr 2003 05:00:19 +0400 Received: from ua6lv.dx (10.0.1.12) by gw.dx with SMTP; 8 Apr 2003 05:00:18 +0400 Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2003 11:38:47 +0400 From: "UA6LV" X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.47 Halloween Edition) UNREG / CD5BF9353B3B7091 Organization: Nort X-Priority: 3 Message-ID: <1046778660.20030408113847@dx.ru> To: "hamilton mal" In-reply-to: <001701c2fd25$d086aee0$c1e9fc3e@l8p8y6> References: <001701c2fd25$d086aee0$c1e9fc3e@l8p8y6> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: LAT/LONG Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.9 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Mal ! RU6LA - KN97LN RN6BN - KN95LC 73!Vlad/UA6LV Monday, April 07, 2003, 8:49:44 PM, you wrote: hm> Hi All hm> I need the LAT/LONG for stns RN6BN and RU6LA to work out the distance. I missed the recent acty fm UA9OC because I was using the TX ant system for 160 metres, however he was 569 aural and OOO on hm> my RX 90 metre loop. Hope to wrk next time. hm> 73 de Mal/G3KEV -- Best regards, UA6LV mailto:ua6lv@dx.ru From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13720 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2003 22:52:34 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 7 Apr 2003 22:52:34 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 6784 invoked by uid 10001); 7 Apr 2003 22:52:34 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 7 Apr 2003 22:52:33 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 192fNu-0007Oc-Ru for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Apr 2003 23:46:38 +0100 Received: from [194.25.134.17] (helo=mailout02.sul.t-online.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 192fNn-0007OT-7x for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Apr 2003 23:46:31 +0100 Received: from fwd07.sul.t-online.de by mailout02.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 192fNm-0004t6-01; Tue, 08 Apr 2003 00:46:30 +0200 Received: from (0482183881-0001@[62.155.252.240]) by fwd07.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 192fNS-1JAj6OC; Tue, 8 Apr 2003 00:46:10 +0200 From: "jannsen" <0482183881-0001@t-online.de> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <1dc.6c432c0.2bbed75c@aol.com> X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.34 MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2003 00:46:10 +0200 Message-ID: <192fNS-1JAj6OC@fwd07.sul.t-online.com> X-Sender: 0482183881-0001@t-dialin.net Subject: Re: LF: Chirped Hell Software Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------020908080505030909030201" X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-8.8 required=5.0tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,REFERENCES,USER_AGENT_TONLINEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------020908080505030909030201 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MarkusVester@aol.com schrieb: > Dear group, > > some of you have seen those little photos on their spectrograms... so if > you have a SSB TX and like to play around for yourself, you can downlowd the > experimental software from > > http://members.aol.com/DF6NM/ChirpPix.zip > > The 93kB archive has ready-to-use executables for both the picture-to-audio > conversion and textmode Hell, including a short description and QuickBasic > sourcecodes. > > Have fun > > Markus, DF6NM > Hi Markus, tried ur chirped Hell over a distance of 1,5km on 136.5kHz, 2W TX HF output pwr. a QSO using this mode was ok, but vy time-consuming. see attachment (pic seen at the RS, who answered on 80m using IZ8BLY- Hellschreiber-software). regards 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Hh7Y0OB+YlKBy+xwVy/Qry63ud3dxEWr+7O/7jOW581YI1MZ35zV9735fVh/6xvggbUzwTdr 8INXNuEKb7jDHw7xDAcEADs= --------------020908080505030909030201-- From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25689 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2003 18:03:35 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 7 Apr 2003 18:03:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 7095 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2003 17:56:58 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 7 Apr 2003 17:56:57 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 192am3-0006FK-VK for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Apr 2003 18:51:15 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.47] (helo=mta7-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 192alj-0006F7-Nq for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Apr 2003 18:50:55 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.233.193]) by mta7-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030407175054.PTJD27609.mta7-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Mon, 7 Apr 2003 18:50:54 +0100 Message-ID: <001601c2fd25$ca5ff9e0$c1e9fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 7 Apr 2003 17:43:38 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Decca MK 53 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
HI all
I was offered a Decca lf rx system today. It was a MK53 receiver marine model, digital display etc. It also had a GPS connection, not sure if the interface for GPS was in the box. It had an antenna included. Does anyone have info on the above system. I suppose it could be adapted as a tuneable LF rx and possibly used in conjunction with a GPS system.
73 de Mal/G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18586 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2003 17:56:56 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 7 Apr 2003 17:56:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 7769 invoked by uid 10001); 7 Apr 2003 17:56:55 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 7 Apr 2003 17:56:55 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 192amB-0006GB-6z for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Apr 2003 18:51:23 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.47] (helo=mta7-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 192alu-0006FB-NK for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Apr 2003 18:51:06 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.233.193]) by mta7-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030407175104.PTMX27609.mta7-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Mon, 7 Apr 2003 18:51:04 +0100 Message-ID: <001701c2fd25$d086aee0$c1e9fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 7 Apr 2003 17:49:44 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: LAT/LONG Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi All
I need the LAT/LONG for stns RN6BN and  RU6LA to work out the distance. I missed the recent acty fm UA9OC because I was using the TX ant system for 160 metres, however he was 569 aural and OOO on my RX 90 metre loop. Hope to wrk next time.
73 de Mal/G3KEV
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3126 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2003 14:45:38 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 7 Apr 2003 14:45:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 5368 invoked by uid 10001); 7 Apr 2003 14:45:37 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 7 Apr 2003 14:45:37 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 192Xqv-0005Eg-4M for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Apr 2003 15:44:05 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.9] (helo=hestia.herts.ac.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 192Xqp-0005EX-B1 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Apr 2003 15:43:59 +0100 Received: from gemini ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini.herts.ac.uk) by hestia.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 192Xhd-0006fb-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Apr 2003 15:34:29 +0100 Received: from [147.197.232.252] (helo=rsch-15.herts.ac.uk) by gemini.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 192Xhb-0006er-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Apr 2003 15:34:27 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030407151723.00a9ea90@gemini.herts.ac.uk> X-Sender: mj9ar@gemini.herts.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Mon, 07 Apr 2003 15:28:02 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "James Moritz" In-reply-to: <191xgH-175wvYC@fwd10.sul.t-online.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030404222503.009f79d0@mail.pncl.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MailScanner: No Virus detected Subject: Re: LF: TX coil screening Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.9 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear Uwe, LF Group, At 02:06 06/04/2003 +0200, you wrote: >Hi Walter, > >quotation Terman ed.1943, page 128 on shielded air coils: > >...shields... increase the losses as a result of energy dissipated >in the shield by the eddy currents. However, if clearence between >the coil and its shield is everywhere at least equal to the radius >of the coil, the reduction in inductance and in the decrease in >coil Q by a copper or aluminium shield will not be serious. > >end of quotation. > >grounded or not grounded, the eddy currents in the shield cause losses >(short-circuit). Adding a conducting shield will inevitably lead to some additional eddy current losses - however, it will also shield the electric field of the coil, which will reduce dielectric losses in the environment outside the shield. Because of the high voltage/high impedance nature of most amateur LF antennas, dielectric losses may well make up a large proportion of the total loss associated with the coil - so adding the shield could well reduce total loss. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6886 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2003 21:59:25 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 6 Apr 2003 21:59:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 4144 invoked by uid 10001); 6 Apr 2003 21:59:25 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 6 Apr 2003 21:59:25 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 192I2m-000085-8i for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 06 Apr 2003 22:51:16 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 192I2h-00007u-Bg for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 06 Apr 2003 22:51:11 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.132]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030406215109.RFND6822.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Sun, 6 Apr 2003 22:51:09 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c2fc7e$3197b560$84e4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sun, 6 Apr 2003 21:38:03 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: DX GALORE Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
There was an abundance of DX this past weekend around 137.7 khz.
I worked RU6LA, RN6BN, YU7AR,S57A and EA1PX all excellent signals. Reports each way solid OOO on QRS3. These stations were all audible with me also and could easily have been worked on CW, but QRS seems to be the preferred mode at present.
Thanks to all concerned for the activity.
73 de Mal/G3KEV/IO94SH
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21796 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2003 10:16:55 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 6 Apr 2003 10:16:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 3676 invoked by uid 10001); 6 Apr 2003 10:16:55 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 6 Apr 2003 10:16:55 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1927BP-0005cb-B8 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 06 Apr 2003 11:15:27 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.173] (helo=cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1927BG-0005cS-5k for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 06 Apr 2003 11:15:18 +0100 Received: from modem-49.celebrimbor.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.146.177] helo=f3a3a2) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 1927BE-0006hV-T4 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 06 Apr 2003 11:15:17 +0100 Message-ID: <001601c2fc25$840b0760$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> From: "Laurie Mayhead" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sun, 6 Apr 2003 10:25:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re. TX coil screening Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false When I was comissioning a Decca 5501 (kindly lent by the Crawley club) for use on 73kHz T/A tests,I found that the side pannels were getting very hot especially around the screw fixings. After removing all these and thoroughly cleaning the metal underneath the unit ran perfectly cool. This supports Walters "perfect" continuity statement. Laurie G3AQC From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11749 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2003 08:45:38 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 6 Apr 2003 08:45:38 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 6428 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2003 08:45:40 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 6 Apr 2003 08:45:40 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1925kL-0005At-79 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 06 Apr 2003 09:43:25 +0100 Received: from [212.35.226.183] (helo=k2.pncl.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1925kG-0005Ak-8Z for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 06 Apr 2003 09:43:20 +0100 Received: from k7t.pncl.co.uk (91.235.35.212.in-addr.arpa.ip-pool.cix.co.uk [212.35.235.91]) by k2.pncl.co.uk (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h368hIhH019035 for ; Sun, 6 Apr 2003 09:43:19 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030406093827.009ffcb0@mail.pncl.co.uk> X-Sender: blanch@mail.pncl.co.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 09:42:01 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Walter Blanchard" In-reply-to: <191xgH-175wvYC@fwd10.sul.t-online.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030404222503.009f79d0@mail.pncl.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: TX coil screening Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------060306020303040602070204" X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.9 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------060306020303040602070204 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Uwe, The clearance between the Decca coils and the screening was at least 2.5x coil dia and the calculated loss assuming perfect continuity between copper sheets was less than 0.1 dB. The trick is "perfect" continuity - all soldered edges, no screws. Aluminium would not be good because of this requirement, in spite of what Mr Terman says. It always oxidises eventually. Walter G3JKV. --------------060306020303040602070204 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; name="ATT11757.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="ATT11757.txt" --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.459 / Virus Database: 258 - Release Date: 25/02/03 --------------060306020303040602070204-- From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16159 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2003 00:08:42 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 6 Apr 2003 00:08:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 937 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2003 00:08:44 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 6 Apr 2003 00:08:44 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191xgX-0001qM-EF for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 06 Apr 2003 01:06:57 +0100 Received: from [194.25.134.17] (helo=mailout02.sul.t-online.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191xgO-0001qD-Og for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 06 Apr 2003 01:06:48 +0100 Received: from fwd10.sul.t-online.de by mailout02.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 191xgN-0005T6-00; Sun, 06 Apr 2003 02:06:47 +0200 Received: from (0482183881-0001@[62.158.12.237]) by fwd10.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 191xgH-175wvYC; Sun, 6 Apr 2003 02:06:41 +0200 From: "jannsen" <0482183881-0001@t-online.de> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.2.20030404222503.009f79d0@mail.pncl.co.uk> X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.34 MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sun, 6 Apr 2003 02:06:41 +0200 Message-ID: <191xgH-175wvYC@fwd10.sul.t-online.com> X-Sender: 0482183881-0001@t-dialin.net Subject: Re: LF: TX coil screening Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.0 required=5.0tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, USER_AGENT_TONLINEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Walter Blanchard schrieb: > Only just saw the postings re Decca coil screening. > > My Decca pal tells me he lined Decca Tx coil huts with copper (thin - 20g) > to maintain constant dielectric environment and constant phase. The whole > operation of Decca depended on maintaining accurate phase. Note - NOT > grounded. Unlined huts caused considerable losses and phase shifts when wet > outside. Timber huts used in N. Canada not too bad in winter when dry but > lossy in summer when wet. VE's take note. Absolutely essential that proper > bonding maintained between sheets - solder not screws. Does NOT cause > losses if not grounded. Unimportant for amateurs because phase shifts don't > matter, although if out in the open a conductive box around coil could > prevent nearby wet bushes catching fire. > > A point about corona. Electrical discharge off a point can exist without > being visible. > > I referred some time ago to the "green" edition of Terman for coil data. > This referred to the 1943 edition of Terman - the one before transistors > got in. > I gather that when medium-wave went commercial in the UK back in the 60's > copies of this edition were fetching £100 a time. > > Walter G3JKV. > > Hi Walter, quotation Terman ed.1943, page 128 on shielded air coils: ...shields... increase the losses as a result of energy dissipated in the shield by the eddy currents. However, if clearence between the coil and its shield is everywhere at least equal to the radius of the coil, the reduction in inductance and in the decrease in coil Q by a copper or aluminium shield will not be serious. end of quotation. grounded or not grounded, the eddy currents in the shield cause losses (short-circuit). on this reflector some OMs discussed whether not used windings of a loading coil must be shortened or not. in both cases the (eddy) current in those windings will cause losses.they also cause some wave reflection. the reflection caused by not shortened windings is vy stronger. I could observe that when trying out how to transport clean sine lf into the aerial. I removed all not used windings. the result was impressive. regards Uwe/dj8wx From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8134 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2003 18:02:45 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 18:02:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 865 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2003 18:02:47 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 18:02:47 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191rvJ-0000EI-Ip for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 18:57:49 +0100 Received: from [208.181.178.245] (helo=neptune.imagenisp.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191rvC-0000E9-Q3 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 18:57:42 +0100 Received: from jsm ([204.244.17.107]) by neptune.imagenisp.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id 2AYJTB26; Sat, 5 Apr 2003 09:44:52 -0800 Message-ID: <000b01c2fb9c$369b1bc0$6b11f4cc@jsm> From: "Steve McDonald" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <00a501c2fb5e$dad142c0$4cdd883e@shack> Date: Sat, 5 Apr 2003 09:53:00 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: PC Strip-Chart Recording Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false For those interested in a computer-based 'strip-line' chart recorder, a fairly versatile program is available as freeware from this site: http://www.radiosky.com/ Go to the 'Radio Sky-Pipe' download icon. It does not have all of the features of the full version but it is fairly loaded and versatile as it comes. It will not expire and there are no annoying pop-ups. Takes audio via your soundcard, same as Argo, Spectran etc. Steve / VE7SL From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31764 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2003 15:27:09 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 15:27:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 2905 invoked by uid 10001); 5 Apr 2003 15:20:29 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 15:20:29 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191pS6-00083M-68 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 16:19:30 +0100 Received: from [212.1.130.143] (helo=smtp-1.visp.telinco.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191pS1-00083D-6l for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 16:19:25 +0100 Received: from [80.225.93.153] (helo=RSGB613192) by smtp-1.visp.telinco.net with smtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 191pS0-0001hj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 16:19:24 +0100 Message-ID: <004001c2fb86$ac5a8c80$545de150@RSGB613192> From: "Andy Talbot" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3.0.5.32.20030401044655.007f7b20@pop.vianw.pt><001a01c2f7c3$800834a0$92e086d4@erica><000501c2f7a3$1f8d9ea0$07d2fc3e@ian><003101c2f7b3$1954f500$cbe8fc3e@l8p8y6> <5.1.0.14.0.20030405094933.01f693d0@POP3.freeler.nl> Date: Sat, 5 Apr 2003 16:18:09 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: Loading coils and Decca 5501 screening Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.4 required=5.0tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Yes, QEX December 2002.   The tank coil was located about 30mm away from the perforated steel casing and when the Tx was running at the 700W level the casing immediately above the coil reached over 100deg.  (the reast of the PA was quite cool).  A sheet of soft aluminium of > 1mm thickness interspersed between the coil and the casing solved that problem, and the Q of teh tank rose a bit.   The AL has to have a thickness of a few skin depths to be worthwhile, so 0.5 to 1mm.    Al foil is barely good enough at a few tens of microns thickness, and might suggest why some people find lining an otherwise lossey cabin with it to be not very effective.
 
Andy  G4JNT
 
 
 
I think that was G4JNT's off-line TX using circuit techniques from the Decca design. As I recall, When Andy initially put the TX in a steel case, the casing around the tank coil got very hot due to eddy current heating. The problem was overcome by placing aluminium sheeting between the coil and the steel casing.

That is correct. Andy published his design in QEX.

73, Dick,
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12809 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2003 14:35:37 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 14:35:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 6182 invoked by uid 10001); 5 Apr 2003 14:28:56 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 14:28:56 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191odw-0007nQ-Rt for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 15:27:40 +0100 Received: from [80.68.3.204] (helo=relay.dx.ru) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 191odr-0007nH-4M for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 15:27:35 +0100 Received: (qmail 52617 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2003 11:48:58 +0400 Received: from ua6lv.dx (10.0.1.12) by gw.dx with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 11:48:58 +0400 Date: Sat, 5 Apr 2003 18:27:32 +0400 From: "UA6LV" X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.47 Halloween Edition) UNREG / CD5BF9353B3B7091 Organization: Nort X-Priority: 3 Message-ID: <981287624.20030405182732@dx.ru> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org In-reply-to: <000c01c2fadd$52d4f640$5ee5fc3e@l8p8y6> References: <000c01c2fadd$52d4f640$5ee5fc3e@l8p8y6> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: RN6BN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.9 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hello rsgb lf group ! >From Sam RN6BN : Yesterday night were big QRM from his computer. Today at night all should be OK . Please your calls ! 73!Vlad Friday, April 04, 2003, 11:06:11 PM, you wrote: hm> Big signal from RN6BN all early evening, First seen on QRS 3 at 1751 utc Some CQ and Beacon mode does not appear to be listening !!!!!!!!!!!!!! hm> Hardly any listening time between CQ hi hm> YU, DL and myself calling but continues on rapid CQ and beacon. hm> de G3KEV -- Best regards, UA6LV mailto:ua6lv@dx.ru From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2936 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2003 10:35:38 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 10:35:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 7689 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2003 10:35:39 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 10:35:39 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191kzn-0006z8-Jm for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 11:33:59 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.173] (helo=cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191kzi-0006yL-D5 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 11:33:54 +0100 Received: from modem-2885.rhino.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.107.69] helo=shack) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191kzh-0006iF-GK for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 11:33:53 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sat, 5 Apr 2003 11:33:52 +0100 Message-ID: <00a501c2fb5e$dad142c0$4cdd883e@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: <001801c2fb4a$f6f1f940$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> Subject: LF: RE: Re: RE: G/GM Skedule Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.6 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Ok listen for u then 73 Simon -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Laurie Mayhead Sent: 05 April 2003 09:10 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: RE: G/GM Skedule ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Lewis" To: Sent: Friday, April 04, 2003 8:30 PM Subject: LF: RE: G/GM Skedule > Hi Laurie > > Hw abt Sunday evening? > > Best time for me abt 2000 local < Yep fine, look for me on 136.75 +/- QRM, 73 Laurie> > Failing that Monday morning I am also free > > Regards > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Laurie > Mayhead > Sent: 04 April 2003 19:26 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: LF: G/GM Skedule > > > Hi Simon, > I am now QRV again on 136 after last weekends excursion on to 73. > Would like to work you on 136 preferably on CW which should be > possible since I heard you (GM0MRF ) at 449 on 73. Unfortunately out > all day on Saturday but Sunday OK,what time would suit you? 73 Laurie > G3AQC > > > > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3255 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2003 08:14:59 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 08:14:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 13387 invoked by uid 10001); 5 Apr 2003 08:14:59 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 08:14:59 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191ilN-0006S3-Py for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 09:10:57 +0100 Received: from [195.92.193.19] (helo=cmailm3.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191ilJ-0006Ru-5Q for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 09:10:53 +0100 Received: from modem-51.nevada.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.79.51] helo=f3a3a2) by cmailm3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 191ilI-0007mw-6o for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 09:10:52 +0100 Message-ID: <001801c2fb4a$f6f1f940$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> From: "Laurie Mayhead" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <007d01c2fae0$9b902a50$4cdd883e@shack> Date: Sat, 5 Apr 2003 09:09:59 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: RE: G/GM Skedule Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Lewis" To: Sent: Friday, April 04, 2003 8:30 PM Subject: LF: RE: G/GM Skedule > Hi Laurie > > Hw abt Sunday evening? > > Best time for me abt 2000 local < Yep fine, look for me on 136.75 +/- QRM, 73 Laurie> > Failing that Monday morning I am also free > > Regards > > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Laurie Mayhead > Sent: 04 April 2003 19:26 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: LF: G/GM Skedule > > > Hi Simon, > I am now QRV again on 136 after last weekends excursion on to 73. Would > like to work you on 136 preferably on CW which should be possible since > I heard you (GM0MRF ) at 449 on 73. Unfortunately out all day on > Saturday but Sunday OK,what time would suit you? 73 Laurie G3AQC > > > > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 30280 invoked from network); 5 Apr 2003 08:02:18 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 08:02:18 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 27326 invoked by uid 10001); 5 Apr 2003 08:02:18 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 5 Apr 2003 08:02:18 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191ia8-0006LI-4s for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 08:59:20 +0100 Received: from [213.218.77.53] (helo=cmailENV1.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191ia3-0006L9-74 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 08:59:15 +0100 Received: from [62.21.138.154] (helo=w8k3f0.freeler.nl) by cmailENV1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 191ia1-0002I5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 05 Apr 2003 07:59:14 +0000 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030405094933.01f693d0@POP3.freeler.nl> X-Sender: FRE0000086604@POP3.freeler.nl X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sat, 05 Apr 2003 09:50:51 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Dick Rollema" In-reply-to: <5.1.0.14.0.20030404171825.024e4fd0@gemini.herts.ac.uk> References: <3.0.5.32.20030401044655.007f7b20@pop.vianw.pt> <001a01c2f7c3$800834a0$92e086d4@erica> <000501c2f7a3$1f8d9ea0$07d2fc3e@ian> <003101c2f7b3$1954f500$cbe8fc3e@l8p8y6> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: Loading coils and Decca 5501 screening Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-21.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,HTML_10_20,HTML_MESSAGE,IN_REP_TO, REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit At 17:32 4-4-03 +0100, you wrote:
Dear Brian, LF Group,

At 04:46 01/04/2003 +0100, you wrote:
Only slightly off topic, but about two years ago now someone described
completing the screening on a Decca 5501.  I have lost the posting but
I seem to remember that something "got hot".  Does anyone have the posting
still?

Brian CT1DRP

I think that was G4JNT's off-line TX using circuit techniques from the Decca design. As I recall, When Andy initially put the TX in a steel case, the casing around the tank coil got very hot due to eddy current heating. The problem was overcome by placing aluminium sheeting between the coil and the steel casing.

That is correct. Andy published his design in QEX.

73, Dick, PA0SE

The other effect of putting additional shielding near the tank circuit coils might be to de-tune the coils slightly - but I think with the layout of the Decca PA, the effect of adding a cover on top as well as underneath would be minute. A more significant issue is obstructing the cooling - the Decca relies entirely on natural convection. On my unit I found that any top cover must have plenty of vent holes in order not to substantially increase the temperature rise of the heatsinks.

Cheers, Jim Moritz
73 de M0BMU


From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15134 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 22:13:54 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 22:13:54 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 19910 invoked by uid 10001); 4 Apr 2003 22:13:54 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 22:13:54 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191ZQY-0004CA-9Y for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 23:12:50 +0100 Received: from [212.35.226.183] (helo=k2.pncl.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191ZQT-0004C1-JR for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 23:12:45 +0100 Received: from k7t.pncl.co.uk (157.235.35.212.in-addr.arpa.ip-pool.cix.co.uk [212.35.235.157]) by k2.pncl.co.uk (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id h34MChPN029007 for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 23:12:44 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20030404222503.009f79d0@mail.pncl.co.uk> X-Sender: blanch@mail.pncl.co.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 23:12:26 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Walter Blanchard" MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: TX coil screening Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------000705050607010904010806" X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------000705050607010904010806 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Only just saw the postings re Decca coil screening. My Decca pal tells me he lined Decca Tx coil huts with copper (thin - 20g) to maintain constant dielectric environment and constant phase. The whole operation of Decca depended on maintaining accurate phase. Note - NOT grounded. Unlined huts caused considerable losses and phase shifts when wet outside. Timber huts used in N. Canada not too bad in winter when dry but lossy in summer when wet. VE's take note. Absolutely essential that proper bonding maintained between sheets - solder not screws. Does NOT cause losses if not grounded. Unimportant for amateurs because phase shifts don't matter, although if out in the open a conductive box around coil could prevent nearby wet bushes catching fire. A point about corona. Electrical discharge off a point can exist without being visible. I referred some time ago to the "green" edition of Terman for coil data. This referred to the 1943 edition of Terman - the one before transistors got in. I gather that when medium-wave went commercial in the UK back in the 60's copies of this edition were fetching £100 a time. Walter G3JKV. --------------000705050607010904010806 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; name="ATT11769.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="ATT11769.txt" --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.459 / Virus Database: 258 - Release Date: 25/02/03 --------------000705050607010904010806-- From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27255 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 20:08:17 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 20:08:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 1086 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 20:08:07 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 20:08:07 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191XSz-0003iH-IH for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 21:07:13 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.48] (helo=mta8-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191XSu-0003i5-T3 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 21:07:09 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.229.94]) by mta8-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030404200707.RTDB22832.mta8-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 21:07:07 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c2fadd$52d4f640$5ee5fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 20:06:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: RN6BN Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Big signal from RN6BN all early evening, First seen on QRS 3 at 1751 utc Some CQ and Beacon mode does not appear to be listening !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hardly any listening time between CQ hi
YU, DL and myself calling but continues on rapid CQ and beacon.
de G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13457 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 19:31:26 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 19:31:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 20349 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 19:31:16 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 19:31:16 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191WtP-0003UO-QE for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 20:30:27 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.171] (helo=cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191WtE-0003UF-CF for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 20:30:16 +0100 Received: from modem-3119.snake.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.124.47] helo=shack) by cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191WtD-0005AT-2Q for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 20:30:15 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 20:30:05 +0100 Message-ID: <007d01c2fae0$9b902a50$4cdd883e@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: <000201c2fad7$fe4d8100$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> Subject: LF: RE: G/GM Skedule Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.4 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Laurie Hw abt Sunday evening? Best time for me abt 2000 local Failing that Monday morning I am also free Regards -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Laurie Mayhead Sent: 04 April 2003 19:26 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: G/GM Skedule Hi Simon, I am now QRV again on 136 after last weekends excursion on to 73. Would like to work you on 136 preferably on CW which should be possible since I heard you (GM0MRF ) at 449 on 73. Unfortunately out all day on Saturday but Sunday OK,what time would suit you? 73 Laurie G3AQC From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4622 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 19:03:33 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 19:03:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 28675 invoked by uid 10001); 4 Apr 2003 19:03:32 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 19:03:32 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191WSY-0003It-QL for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 20:02:42 +0100 Received: from [194.247.47.231] (helo=mailout.zetnet.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191WSU-0003Ik-6H for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 20:02:38 +0100 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] helo=zetnet.co.uk) by mailout.zetnet.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 191WST-0000IE-00 for ; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 20:02:37 +0100 Received: from a7j7r2 (bts-0014.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.48.14]) by zetnet.co.uk (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5.zet) with SMTP id h34J2Z4J030864 for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 20:02:36 +0100 Message-ID: <1c5f01c2fadc$a72eb380$0e30f7c2@a7j7r2> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <2D280BB697C7EE4C979C5C89925418EFB05BE0@TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no> Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 15:25:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: RE: Re: Time difference (Greenige Meaning Time) (Intern) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.6 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_PAST_03_06,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT, REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: > ...........and according to Bill Gates we are still one hour ahead of GMT (GMT+1hour), > I thought GMT is history, the correct is UTC (except on my QSL-cards) Perhaps Microsoft are still using C for some of their routines. Kernighan & Ritchie in their book on the C programming language (2nd ed) say, on p256, with reference to the library call gmtime, that it "converts the calendar time into UTC. It returns NULL if UTC is not available. The name gmtime has historical significance". That book was published in 1988. Regards, John Rabson G3PAI From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13368 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 18:28:56 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 18:28:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 25075 invoked by uid 10001); 4 Apr 2003 18:28:56 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 18:28:56 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191Vuz-00034o-Pt for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 19:28:01 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.172] (helo=cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191Vus-00034f-6T for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 19:27:54 +0100 Received: from modem-85.bregor.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.142.213] helo=f3a3a2) by cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 191Vur-0005PO-AC for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 19:27:53 +0100 Message-ID: <000201c2fad7$fe4d8100$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> From: "Laurie Mayhead" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 19:26:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: G/GM Skedule Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Simon, I am now QRV again on 136 after last weekends excursion on to 73. Would like to work you on 136 preferably on CW which should be possible since I heard you (GM0MRF ) at 449 on 73. Unfortunately out all day on Saturday but Sunday OK,what time would suit you? 73 Laurie G3AQC From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23483 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 18:11:16 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 18:11:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 12194 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 18:11:19 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 18:11:19 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191VXJ-0002uh-8h for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 19:03:33 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.171] (helo=cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191VXE-0002uY-Iv for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 19:03:28 +0100 Received: from modem-3119.snake.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.124.47] helo=shack) by cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191VXC-000099-OT for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 19:03:27 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 19:03:15 +0100 Message-ID: <007301c2fad4$7a4f3fe0$4cdd883e@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: <000c01c2fac3$41fa88e0$38cdfc3e@l8p8y6> Subject: LF: RE: DL2HRE Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_50_60,HTML_FONT_COLOR_BLUE,HTML_MESSAGE,IN_REP_TO, ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,SUBJ_ALL_CAPSversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Message
nope!
 
we worked him on QRSS over the weekend on 136!
 
v loud!
 
regards
 
Simon GM4PLM
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of hamilton mal
Sent: 04 April 2003 16:59
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: DL2HRE

    I hve worked DL2HRE/Edgar on normal cw but for anyone that needs QRS he is active 24 hrs each day on CQ. I must be the only one he has ever worked !!!!!!!!!!
Gl Edgar de Mal/G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21856 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 17:01:35 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 17:01:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 22596 invoked by uid 10001); 4 Apr 2003 17:01:34 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 17:01:34 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191UYR-0002b7-Tf for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 18:00:39 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.43] (helo=mta3-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191UYM-0002aw-Ma for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 18:00:34 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.205.56]) by mta3-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030404170033.OGXU20683.mta3-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 18:00:33 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c2fac3$41fa88e0$38cdfc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 16:59:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: DL2HRE Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
    I hve worked DL2HRE/Edgar on normal cw but for anyone that needs QRS he is active 24 hrs each day on CQ. I must be the only one he has ever worked !!!!!!!!!!
Gl Edgar de Mal/G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31152 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 16:41:51 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 16:41:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 24550 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 16:35:01 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 16:35:01 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191U8N-0002PS-La for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 17:33:43 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.9] (helo=hestia.herts.ac.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191U85-0002PJ-UK for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 17:33:26 +0100 Received: from gemini ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini.herts.ac.uk) by hestia.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 191U7r-0004dT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 17:33:11 +0100 Received: from [147.197.232.252] (helo=rsch-15.herts.ac.uk) by gemini.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 191U7h-0005ts-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 17:33:01 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030404171825.024e4fd0@gemini.herts.ac.uk> X-Sender: mj9ar@gemini.herts.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 17:32:57 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "James Moritz" In-reply-to: <3.0.5.32.20030401044655.007f7b20@pop.vianw.pt> References: <001a01c2f7c3$800834a0$92e086d4@erica> <000501c2f7a3$1f8d9ea0$07d2fc3e@ian> <003101c2f7b3$1954f500$cbe8fc3e@l8p8y6> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MailScanner: No Virus detected Subject: Re: LF: Loading coils and Decca 5501 screening Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.9 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear Brian, LF Group, At 04:46 01/04/2003 +0100, you wrote: >Only slightly off topic, but about two years ago now someone described >completing the screening on a Decca 5501. I have lost the posting but >I seem to remember that something "got hot". Does anyone have the posting >still? > >Brian CT1DRP > I think that was G4JNT's off-line TX using circuit techniques from the Decca design. As I recall, When Andy initially put the TX in a steel case, the casing around the tank coil got very hot due to eddy current heating. The problem was overcome by placing aluminium sheeting between the coil and the steel casing. The other effect of putting additional shielding near the tank circuit coils might be to de-tune the coils slightly - but I think with the layout of the Decca PA, the effect of adding a cover on top as well as underneath would be minute. A more significant issue is obstructing the cooling - the Decca relies entirely on natural convection. On my unit I found that any top cover must have plenty of vent holes in order not to substantially increase the temperature rise of the heatsinks. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 30325 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 13:06:11 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 13:06:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 2941 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 12:59:33 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 12:59:32 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191QmA-0001D5-L2 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:58:34 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.9] (helo=hestia.herts.ac.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191Qm3-0001Cw-VI for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:58:28 +0100 Received: from gemini ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini.herts.ac.uk) by hestia.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 191Qlw-0002Jf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:58:20 +0100 Received: from [147.197.232.252] (helo=rsch-15.herts.ac.uk) by gemini.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 191Qll-0003RQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:58:09 +0100 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030404114955.00a9eae8@gemini.herts.ac.uk> X-Sender: mj9ar@gemini.herts.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:52:06 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "James Moritz" In-reply-to: <000501c2f918$44312d00$97ccfc3e@ian> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MailScanner: No Virus detected Subject: LF: Re: Expedition to Porthcurno, Cornwall Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TOversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Dear LF Group, I Have just looked through the many e-mails that have arrived since the fun & games at the beginning of the week. Derek G3GRO has taken some digital pictures of the site and has more details which will no doubt be available soon, but here is some brief info: The QTH was the Porthcurno Museum of Submarine Telegraphy, which was/is the terminal for many submarine cables going around the world. It is in a WW2 bunker cut into the granite cliffs - there is an amateur radio club (GB2PK), with a shack just by the entrance to the tunnels, which was kindly made available to us (see http://www.porthcurno.org.uk/photoAlbum/tunnatwar.html - the "north tunnel entrance" photo - the shack is in the flat-roofed building the guard is standing in front of). The first problem was getting an antenna up - the club had some wire antennas, but these were rather in the shadow of the cliff, so we put up about 80m of sloping wire, running from a flagpole outside the entrance to a short lattice tower on top of the cliffs about 40m above, part of the bunker complex. This wasn't easy because of the brambles and gorse bushes covering everywhere! The antenna was about 10m high at the ends, but only about 5 or 6m where it passed over the cliff top. Earthing was the next problem - since everything was built into the granite, ground rods of the diamond-tipped variety would have been needed. Since the site was open to the public, covering the area in radial wires would not have been popular either. So we just used the normal mains earth, which fortunately worked quite well. However, the mains noise level was hopelessly high. In an attempt to improve reception, we ran out 100m of coax to the cliff top, and set up a loop antenna. The noise level was still high, but reduced somewhat after museum closing time, and we were able to have 136kHz QSOs with G3KEV and GM0MRF on Monday evening. There were some RF feedback problems, not surprising with the lack of RF ground - so we had to run reduced power, giving about 2.5A antenna current. On Tuesday morning we set up for 73k, and managed to work G3AQC, although the noise was so bad that Laurie's very strong signal was only an M copy in DFCW. The TX antenna seemed to work quite well, with a loss resistance down around 30 ohms, and 4.5A antenna current. However, an improvement on receive would be needed to work GM0MRF. Running out a total of 240m of coax for the receive antenna had little effect on noise, even though the loop was now quite a long walk, and considerable distance from the museum or overhead power lines, or anything else apart from brambles. Various experiments showed that the feeder was not to blame, but while messing around on the cliff top with a battery operated RX, I found that if the antenna was lifted up far enough so that none of the wet grass or other vegetation could come into contact with the loop element, the mains noise was significantly reduced. After suitably propping up the antenna against the wind, the noise level in the shack was dramatically improved, and we were immediately able to work GM0MRF and MI0AYZ. So Tuesday's total on 73kHz was G3AQC, G3LDO, G3YXM, GM0MRF and MI0AYZ. Unfortunately, we did not see Mike or John's sigs, probably because it was fairly late in the evening before we had decent reception available. While dismantling the station on Wednesday morning, noise levels on both 73 and 136 were really quite good, so it looked as if we had finally cracked the problem - we shall know what to do next time! Thanks to all those involved for making the expedition a success, Including the Porthcurno Club, who have at least gained a new antenna for their HF station. I only had time for a quick look round the museum, but it was very interesting, and definitely worth a visit if you are in the area. The amateur radio club shack forms part of the exhibition, and contains quite a range of WW2 era radio gear in working order. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21118 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 12:42:15 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 12:42:15 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 18775 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 12:42:18 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 12:42:18 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191QVq-00014P-H4 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:41:42 +0100 Received: from [152.163.225.104] (helo=imo-r08.mx.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191QVi-00014G-1m for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:41:34 +0100 Received: from MarkusVester@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id l.1dc.6c432c0 (3657); Fri, 4 Apr 2003 07:41:01 -0500 (EST) From: MarkusVester@aol.com Message-ID: <1dc.6c432c0.2bbed75c@aol.com> Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 07:41:00 EST To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: zl1bpu@nzart.org.nz MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10607 Subject: LF: Chirped Hell Software Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.1 required=5.0tests=HTML_10_20,HTML_MESSAGE,MIME_LONG_LINE_QP,NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Dear group,

some of you have seen those little photos on their spectrograms...  so if you  have a SSB TX and like to play around for yourself, you can downlowd the experimental software from

http://members.aol.com/DF6NM/ChirpPix.zip

The 93kB archive has ready-to-use executables for both the picture-to-audio conversion and textmode Hell, including a short description and QuickBasic sourcecodes.

Have fun

Markus, DF6NM
 From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12786 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 12:28:04 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 12:28:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 25251 invoked by uid 10001); 4 Apr 2003 12:28:03 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 12:28:03 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191QIM-0000uZ-3u for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:27:46 +0100 Received: from [193.212.240.200] (helo=virus-out.ttyl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191QIG-0000u0-Om for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:27:40 +0100 Received: from [134.47.162.90] by virusscan.telenor.no with ESMTP for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 14:27:09 +0200 Received: from tns-fbu-22-212.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.162.91]) by tns-fbu-22-208.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Fri, 4 Apr 2003 14:27:08 +0200 Received: from TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.164.201]) by tns-fbu-22-212.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Fri, 4 Apr 2003 14:27:08 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 14:27:08 +0200 Message-ID: <2D280BB697C7EE4C979C5C89925418EFB05BE0@TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no> Thread-Topic: Re: Time difference Thread-Index: AcL6jxk8Khn4h/LiQq2KlU3KmNG2mgAFhBrA From: jan-martin.noding@telenor.com To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Apr 2003 12:27:08.0512 (UTC) FILETIME=[82761600:01C2FAA5] MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: RE: Re: Time difference (Greenige Meaning Time) (Intern) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-2.5 required=5.0tests=NO_REAL_NAME,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ...........and according to Bill Gates we are still one hour ahead of GMT (GMT+1hour), I thought GMT is history, the correct is UTC (except on my QSL-cards) 73 Jan-Martin, LA8AK --- J M Nøding, Datakvalitet, TTS, Kristiansand Telefon 0047-380-52660, 9077-7126 (QTH: 0047-380-87178) -----Original Message----- From: John Rabson [mailto:word.factory@zetnet.co.uk] Sent: 4. april 2003 11:22 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Time difference ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin MOMGM" > Recently the economy 7 electric meter was changed from a black box to a > grey box with green and red buttons. The former had a single button > that could be used to select normal and off peak consumption as well as > displaying time. The time was picked up from what I thought was a sub > carrier of Radio 4 long wave or maybe MSF. It was very accurate, > matching time on my GPS. The new unit also displays time but is exactly > 10 minutes behind GMT. Any ideas? > > One thought is that the units are set with specific time differentials > so as not to overload the national grid with a single big switch on. That might be it. Some time ago a local electricity company sold quite a lot of economy seven electric storage heaters to people in this village. After a little while we started getting frequent outages in the small hours of the morning. This was of course in the middle of winter. It seems the bulk of the people who bought the heaters were all on the same phase of our three-phase overhead distribution. So, at 2 o'clock in the morning, that phase was suddenly overloaded and the overcurrent protection operated. I understand that control rooms for both electricity and water companies have precise details of when commercial television advertisements are scheduled to be transmitted, as well the actual times when episodes of popular programmes finish. 73 John G3PAI From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8726 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 12:24:42 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 12:24:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 959 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 12:24:46 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 12:24:46 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191QEl-0000s0-4d for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:24:03 +0100 Received: from [193.212.240.200] (helo=virus-out.ttyl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191QEe-0000ro-Cw for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:23:56 +0100 Received: from [134.47.162.190] by virusscan.telenor.no with ESMTP for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 14:23:17 +0200 Received: from tns-fbu-22-213.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.162.191]) by tns-fbu-22-209.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Fri, 4 Apr 2003 14:23:16 +0200 Received: from TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.164.201]) by tns-fbu-22-213.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Fri, 4 Apr 2003 14:23:16 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 14:23:15 +0200 Message-ID: <2D280BB697C7EE4C979C5C89925418EFB05BDF@TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no> Thread-Topic: Re: QRV version 4.01 Thread-Index: AcL6oh/Zqv/ilB5sSVuX8cXZM7AApAAAmX4A From: jan-martin.noding@telenor.com To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Apr 2003 12:23:16.0167 (UTC) FILETIME=[F7F90D70:01C2FAA4] MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: 136kHz TX VFO Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.7 required=5.0tests=NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi, I am aware of modern digital VFO's, but still considering if it is worth using old techniques for signal generation. Have presented two alternatives at http://home.online.no/~la8ak/90.htm Hope to have your comments, but please use my home address 73 Jan-Martin, LA8AK --- J M Nøding, Datakvalitet, TTS, Kristiansand Telefon 0047-380-52660, 9077-7126 (QTH: 0047-380-87178) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27138 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 12:14:22 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 12:14:22 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: (qmail 111 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 12:14:12 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 12:14:12 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191Q4n-0000kf-Lp for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:13:45 +0100 Received: from [134.58.240.42] (helo=rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191Q4a-0000kR-R6 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:13:32 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C8591D7383 for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 14:13:02 +0200 (CEST) Received: from lepidus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (lepidus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.240.72]) by rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A8941D7349 for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 14:13:02 +0200 (CEST) Received: from dell-rik.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (pc-10-33-165-177.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [10.33.165.177]) by lepidus.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 320AA38007D for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 14:13:02 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030404141101.02d908a0@u0019445.kuleuven.be> X-Sender: u0019445@u0019445.kuleuven.be X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 14:14:02 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" In-reply-to: <000001c2fa98$7a404300$70d0fc3e@ian> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030404105921.02daa110@u0019445.kuleuven.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: by KULeuven Antivirus Cluster Subject: Re: LF: Re: QRV version 4.01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-19.6 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > how did you know that I burned out the COM port on my elderly desktop >yesterday by accidentally shooting 64V up the DTR line? Ian, I could hear the "bang" ... I'll hope to have USB version ready by the time you ruin the parallel port :-) 73, Rik From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1569 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 11:54:37 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 11:54:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 28264 invoked by uid 10001); 4 Apr 2003 11:54:36 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 11:54:36 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191Pl7-0000bv-FD for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 12:53:25 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.46] (helo=mta6-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191Pl2-0000bm-MF for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 12:53:20 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.208.112]) by mta6-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030404115319.WXKU22800.mta6-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 12:53:19 +0100 Message-ID: <000001c2fa98$7a404300$70d0fc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030404105921.02daa110@u0019445.kuleuven.be> Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 11:52:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: QRV version 4.01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Rik, how did you know that I burned out the COM port on my elderly desktop yesterday by accidentally shooting 64V up the DTR line? (Trouble is that it's on the mother board and there is one exploded chip and a nasty smell. I shall have to use the laptop for both send and receive - once I get the relay driver transistors replaced.) Never a dull moment! From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8931 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 09:58:17 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 09:58:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 29808 invoked by uid 10001); 4 Apr 2003 09:58:17 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 09:58:16 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191Nx2-0008KW-Su for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 10:57:36 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.173] (helo=cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191Nwv-0008KM-SP for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 10:57:29 +0100 Received: from modem-3105.snake.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.124.33] helo=shack) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191Nwr-0002TA-TF for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 10:57:26 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 10:57:12 +0100 Message-ID: <005801c2fa90$93d50100$4cdd883e@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: <000201c2fa86$886e8020$e3e8fc3e@l8p8y6> Subject: LF: RE: Re: RE: 73k activity. Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.4 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_FONT_COLOR_BLUE,HTML_MESSAGE,IN_REP_TO, ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Message
Hi Mal
 
well I am happy to run skeds to the US if any one asks - Alan that goes for you tooo! HI!
 
yeah ur pretty strong too HI!
 
regards
 
Simon GM4PLM
 
any other GM's read this reflector - even if not active?
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of hamilton mal
Sent: 03 April 2003 17:24
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: Re: RE: 73k activity.

 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2003 3:21 PM
Subject: LF: RE: 73k activity.

Yes great fun weekend/week HI!
 
Don't tell everyone about the Tunnocks - they are home grown specialities HI! :-)))
 
The noise level on 136 has dropped over the past few days - maybe living in the magnetically challenged north over solid whinstone means that I will be affected more by solar activity - it was up to a KP 6 or more over the weekend and indeed a loud aurora was in progress when David arrived here - we listened to 6M auroral CW from GB3LER at 56A - normally inaudible
 
I will improve the antenna over the summer ready for autumn and try get it higher and perhaps straighter!
 
Last night I was listening and saw OK1DTN and EA1PX on QRSS so its looks promising although OK1DTN did not seem to see me calling him back.
 
will be on most evenings - I have an interest in DSP techniques so QRSS will prob be where you will find me!
 
thanks to Mal G3KEV and Alan G3NYK for help and reports so far, plus some reports from EU to say I have been hrd in DL as well.
 
I have an excellent site for the US so am interested in skeds if anyone in US wants me to TX overnight
 
Hi Simon
You are in an excellent QTH for the TA tests. I was going to beam out towards the Atlantic before the Summer arrives with the associated QRN. When propogation looks reasonable we could give it a blast. Alan has some good indicators so he will let us know on here what is happening. I didnt bother this past few months because I was using the antennas for dxing on 160 metres. I have had several good solid QSO'S the previous winter on 136 khz with replies from the USA/CANADA xband on 7025 khz.
Your signal here in Scarborough is the strongest on the 136 khz band.
 
73 de Mal/G3KEV
 
 
 
 
regards
 
Simon GM4PLM
 
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of G0MRF@aol.com
Sent: 03 April 2003 15:03
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: 73k activity.

What an exciting weekend that was.

I haven't been on LF for some time as my local noise level here in London has been slowly increasing. LF here is now a lost cause during the daytime. However an invitation to operate from Scotland, albeit a 879 mile return journey, was just too good to miss.

Simon GM4PLM, XYL Lynn and their family made me very welcome and I must say a big thank you to them all for the hospitality and the incredibly nice "Tunnock's tea cakes"

All 3 of the 'DX-peditions' (GM3YXM GM0MRF G3GRO/ M0BMU) had problems to overcome. Our Farmhouse QTH suffered from a constant background noise which we were able to reduce to usable levels, but sadly not to eliminate completely. Sorry Mike, G3XDV, a good 'T' but not enough to read the detail, even though we had good copy on the G3YXM Birmingham 'remote receiver.'
I had expected a very poor ground but, to my surprise, the overall system impedance was somewhere near 40 Ohms. This was unexpected as GM3YXM has always found 100+ Ohms typical at his New Galloway QTH.
The antenna at GM0MRF / GM4PLM was 125m of wire supported by Simon's tower near the house abt 50 feet up and at the far end by a 30 foot portable mast. A 20 ft pole in the middle of the run reduced the sag. - Not an exceptional LF antenna, but a good temporary installation. For insulators we used electric fence supports as much recommended over the years by Mal G3KEV. The system earth was the house earth and a single 100m wire which was clipped to one of the farm's perimeter fences.
On 71.9kHz this combination was resonated with a single big variable inductor which I've just measured at 5.81mH.  For most of the weekend we ran about 2.5A of antenna current, but as the noise problems encountered by G3GRO and M0BMU became apparent, Simon and I threw caution to the wind and began turning up the supply voltage to the TX.  When we finally worked Derek and Jim we had gone from 28V @ 10A to 34V@14A  and had 3.4 Amps into the antenna.

Stations worked on 72k

GM3YXM
MI0AYZ
G3LDO     apx 580km
G3AQC     apx 569km
G3GRO           610km

Also had a number of 136kHz QSOs, including Mal at S9+ CW and DL2HRE QRSS.

Now the equipment has had the dust removed, it's good to see Simon operating on 136kHz.
I understand via e-mail that he now has 30V at 20Amps into the TX. Not bad for a modified 250W linear PCB.
Hopefully people will try to have a QSO with him before summer static makes reception too unpleasant. Maybe this autumn we'll finally see a GM transatlantic QSO.

Thanks all

David  G(M)0MRF
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21053 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 09:46:38 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 09:46:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 4483 invoked by uid 10001); 4 Apr 2003 09:46:38 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 09:46:38 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191Nlr-0008BR-Ff for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 10:46:03 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.44] (helo=mta4-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191Nlm-0008BG-31 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 10:45:58 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.232.227]) by mta4-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030404094554.KFBK11888.mta4-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 10:45:54 +0100 Message-ID: <000201c2fa86$886e8020$e3e8fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <002a01c2f9ec$528ebf00$4cdd883e@shack> Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2003 17:24:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: RE: 73k activity. Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.4 required=5.0tests=DATE_IN_PAST_12_24,HTML_30_40,HTML_FONT_COLOR_BLUE, HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Message
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2003 3:21 PM
Subject: LF: RE: 73k activity.

Yes great fun weekend/week HI!
 
Don't tell everyone about the Tunnocks - they are home grown specialities HI! :-)))
 
The noise level on 136 has dropped over the past few days - maybe living in the magnetically challenged north over solid whinstone means that I will be affected more by solar activity - it was up to a KP 6 or more over the weekend and indeed a loud aurora was in progress when David arrived here - we listened to 6M auroral CW from GB3LER at 56A - normally inaudible
 
I will improve the antenna over the summer ready for autumn and try get it higher and perhaps straighter!
 
Last night I was listening and saw OK1DTN and EA1PX on QRSS so its looks promising although OK1DTN did not seem to see me calling him back.
 
will be on most evenings - I have an interest in DSP techniques so QRSS will prob be where you will find me!
 
thanks to Mal G3KEV and Alan G3NYK for help and reports so far, plus some reports from EU to say I have been hrd in DL as well.
 
I have an excellent site for the US so am interested in skeds if anyone in US wants me to TX overnight
 
Hi Simon
You are in an excellent QTH for the TA tests. I was going to beam out towards the Atlantic before the Summer arrives with the associated QRN. When propogation looks reasonable we could give it a blast. Alan has some good indicators so he will let us know on here what is happening. I didnt bother this past few months because I was using the antennas for dxing on 160 metres. I have had several good solid QSO'S the previous winter on 136 khz with replies from the USA/CANADA xband on 7025 khz.
Your signal here in Scarborough is the strongest on the 136 khz band.
 
73 de Mal/G3KEV
 
 
 
 
regards
 
Simon GM4PLM
 
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of G0MRF@aol.com
Sent: 03 April 2003 15:03
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: 73k activity.

What an exciting weekend that was.

I haven't been on LF for some time as my local noise level here in London has been slowly increasing. LF here is now a lost cause during the daytime. However an invitation to operate from Scotland, albeit a 879 mile return journey, was just too good to miss.

Simon GM4PLM, XYL Lynn and their family made me very welcome and I must say a big thank you to them all for the hospitality and the incredibly nice "Tunnock's tea cakes"

All 3 of the 'DX-peditions' (GM3YXM GM0MRF G3GRO/ M0BMU) had problems to overcome. Our Farmhouse QTH suffered from a constant background noise which we were able to reduce to usable levels, but sadly not to eliminate completely. Sorry Mike, G3XDV, a good 'T' but not enough to read the detail, even though we had good copy on the G3YXM Birmingham 'remote receiver.'
I had expected a very poor ground but, to my surprise, the overall system impedance was somewhere near 40 Ohms. This was unexpected as GM3YXM has always found 100+ Ohms typical at his New Galloway QTH.
The antenna at GM0MRF / GM4PLM was 125m of wire supported by Simon's tower near the house abt 50 feet up and at the far end by a 30 foot portable mast. A 20 ft pole in the middle of the run reduced the sag. - Not an exceptional LF antenna, but a good temporary installation. For insulators we used electric fence supports as much recommended over the years by Mal G3KEV. The system earth was the house earth and a single 100m wire which was clipped to one of the farm's perimeter fences.
On 71.9kHz this combination was resonated with a single big variable inductor which I've just measured at 5.81mH.  For most of the weekend we ran about 2.5A of antenna current, but as the noise problems encountered by G3GRO and M0BMU became apparent, Simon and I threw caution to the wind and began turning up the supply voltage to the TX.  When we finally worked Derek and Jim we had gone from 28V @ 10A to 34V@14A  and had 3.4 Amps into the antenna.

Stations worked on 72k

GM3YXM
MI0AYZ
G3LDO     apx 580km
G3AQC     apx 569km
G3GRO           610km

Also had a number of 136kHz QSOs, including Mal at S9+ CW and DL2HRE QRSS.

Now the equipment has had the dust removed, it's good to see Simon operating on 136kHz.
I understand via e-mail that he now has 30V at 20Amps into the TX. Not bad for a modified 250W linear PCB.
Hopefully people will try to have a QSO with him before summer static makes reception too unpleasant. Maybe this autumn we'll finally see a GM transatlantic QSO.

Thanks all

David  G(M)0MRF
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25330 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 09:37:46 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 09:37:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 28513 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 09:37:34 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 09:37:34 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191Nd4-000860-Jb for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 10:36:58 +0100 Received: from [194.247.47.231] (helo=mailout.zetnet.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191Ncw-00085g-Pa for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 10:36:50 +0100 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] helo=zetnet.co.uk) by mailout.zetnet.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 191Ncw-0005s0-00 for ; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 10:36:50 +0100 Received: from a7j7r2 (bts-0808.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.51.40]) by zetnet.co.uk (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5.zet) with SMTP id h349abpd028985 for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 10:36:48 +0100 Message-ID: <004e01c2fa8d$aa66ed00$2833f7c2@a7j7r2> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000001c2f96c$e5e54fb0$222a7ad5@83Horseshoe> Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 10:22:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Time difference Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.9 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin MOMGM" > Recently the economy 7 electric meter was changed from a black box to a > grey box with green and red buttons. The former had a single button > that could be used to select normal and off peak consumption as well as > displaying time. The time was picked up from what I thought was a sub > carrier of Radio 4 long wave or maybe MSF. It was very accurate, > matching time on my GPS. The new unit also displays time but is exactly > 10 minutes behind GMT. Any ideas? > > One thought is that the units are set with specific time differentials > so as not to overload the national grid with a single big switch on. That might be it. Some time ago a local electricity company sold quite a lot of economy seven electric storage heaters to people in this village. After a little while we started getting frequent outages in the small hours of the morning. This was of course in the middle of winter. It seems the bulk of the people who bought the heaters were all on the same phase of our three-phase overhead distribution. So, at 2 o'clock in the morning, that phase was suddenly overloaded and the overcurrent protection operated. I understand that control rooms for both electricity and water companies have precise details of when commercial television advertisements are scheduled to be transmitted, as well the actual times when episodes of popular programmes finish. 73 John G3PAI From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29773 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 09:27:33 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 09:27:33 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 13259 invoked by uid 10001); 4 Apr 2003 09:27:32 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 09:27:32 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191NPz-0007vf-UE for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 10:23:27 +0100 Received: from [192.108.125.37] (helo=ns3.swh.sk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191NPm-0007vK-SY for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 10:23:15 +0100 Received: from hermes.sbs.sk (midas.swh.sk [192.108.125.51]) by ns3.swh.sk (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id h349N9d00510 for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 11:23:10 +0200 Received: from btss101a.swh.sk (btss.swh.sk [139.24.136.15]) by hermes.sbs.sk (8.12.6/8.12.6/SuSE Linux 0.6) with ESMTP id h349N35n012460 for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 11:23:04 +0200 Received: by btss.swh.sk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 11:23:04 +0200 Message-ID: <29BDD4F529FCD311B631009027357C4E07F4EE24@btss103a.swh.sk> From: "Gasparik Richard" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 11:23:01 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Subject: LF: RE: QRV version 4.01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.1 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Rik... Great, that's fine for me. I'll test it during the weekend on my notebook. I'll send you my comments. Good work my friend. 73 de Rich OM2TW -----Original Message----- From: Rik Strobbe [mailto:rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be] Sent: Friday, April 04, 2003 11:12 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: QRV version 4.01 Hello group, Thanks to the help of Alberto I finally found a way to get control of the LPT port bits under WinNT, Win2000, WinXP. Minor drawback is that the new version of QRS won't run under Win3 any longer. While adapting the code for WinNT I made some more changes, see end of this mail. The new test version of QRS can be downloaded from : http://www.qsl.net/on7yd/zip/qrs401.zip I would appreciate it if some could try the test version and report any bugs. 73, Rik ON7YD ***** Changes from version 3.17 to 4.01 (April 2003) ***** 1. Win3 compatibility abandonded, this was required to achieve full parallel port support under Win2000, WinNt, WinXp etc. 2. Parallel port (LPT1 or LPT2) now supported in all Windows versions from Win95 upward 3. "Countdown" added : transmission will end in xxhyy'zz" (suggested by RU6LA) 4. All 10 messages (as stored under "text") can be selected from within the QSO window (suggested by RU6LA) 5. In QSO mode the dotlength can be changed during transmission, this can allow you to respond fast to propagation changes. Any changes becomes effective from the next character 6. Some minor cosmetics From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20549 invoked from network); 4 Apr 2003 09:18:07 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 09:18:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 4195 invoked by uid 10001); 4 Apr 2003 09:18:07 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 4 Apr 2003 09:18:07 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 191NEq-0007oz-LP for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 10:11:56 +0100 Received: from [134.58.240.42] (helo=rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 191NEl-0007op-Tl for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 04 Apr 2003 10:11:51 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABF3E1D7372 for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 11:11:21 +0200 (CEST) Received: from antonius.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (antonius.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.240.73]) by rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 610091D7330 for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 11:11:21 +0200 (CEST) Received: from dell-rik.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (pc-10-33-165-177.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [10.33.165.177]) by antonius.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 174E64C0D0 for ; Fri, 4 Apr 2003 11:11:21 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030404105921.02daa110@u0019445.kuleuven.be> X-Sender: u0019445@u0019445.kuleuven.be X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 11:12:21 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" In-reply-to: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: by KULeuven Antivirus Cluster Subject: LF: QRV version 4.01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TOversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hello group, Thanks to the help of Alberto I finally found a way to get control of the LPT port bits under WinNT, Win2000, WinXP. Minor drawback is that the new version of QRS won't run under Win3 any longer. While adapting the code for WinNT I made some more changes, see end of this mail. The new test version of QRS can be downloaded from : http://www.qsl.net/on7yd/zip/qrs401.zip I would appreciate it if some could try the test version and report any bugs. 73, Rik ON7YD ***** Changes from version 3.17 to 4.01 (April 2003) ***** 1. Win3 compatibility abandonded, this was required to achieve full parallel port support under Win2000, WinNt, WinXp etc. 2. Parallel port (LPT1 or LPT2) now supported in all Windows versions from Win95 upward 3. "Countdown" added : transmission will end in xxhyy'zz" (suggested by RU6LA) 4. All 10 messages (as stored under "text") can be selected from within the QSO window (suggested by RU6LA) 5. In QSO mode the dotlength can be changed during transmission, this can allow you to respond fast to propagation changes. Any changes becomes effective from the next character 6. Some minor cosmetics From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14695 invoked from network); 3 Apr 2003 14:22:26 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 3 Apr 2003 14:22:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 16347 invoked by uid 10001); 3 Apr 2003 14:22:26 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 3 Apr 2003 14:22:25 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1915b7-0003UY-0x for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 15:21:45 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.175] (helo=cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1915av-0003UO-E2 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 15:21:33 +0100 Received: from modem-1652.zebra.dialup.pol.co.uk ([81.76.150.116] helo=shack) by cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1915as-0001w8-5U for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 15:21:30 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2003 15:21:25 +0100 Message-ID: <002a01c2f9ec$528ebf00$4cdd883e@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: <198.1836b70b.2bbd9903@aol.com> Subject: LF: RE: 73k activity. Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.1 required=5.0tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_FONT_COLOR_BLUE,HTML_MESSAGE,IN_REP_TO, ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Message
Yes great fun weekend/week HI!
 
Don't tell everyone about the Tunnocks - they are home grown specialities HI! :-)))
 
The noise level on 136 has dropped over the past few days - maybe living in the magnetically challenged north over solid whinstone means that I will be affected more by solar activity - it was up to a KP 6 or more over the weekend and indeed a loud aurora was in progress when David arrived here - we listened to 6M auroral CW from GB3LER at 56A - normally inaudible
 
I will improve the antenna over the summer ready for autumn and try get it higher and perhaps straighter!
 
Last night I was listening and saw OK1DTN and EA1PX on QRSS so its looks promising although OK1DTN did not seem to see me calling him back.
 
will be on most evenings - I have an interest in DSP techniques so QRSS will prob be where you will find me!
 
thanks to Mal G3KEV and Alan G3NYK for help and reports so far, plus some reports from EU to say I have been hrd in DL as well.
 
I have an excellent site for the US so am interested in skeds if anyone in US wants me to TX overnight
 
 
 
regards
 
Simon GM4PLM
 
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of G0MRF@aol.com
Sent: 03 April 2003 15:03
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: LF: 73k activity.

What an exciting weekend that was.

I haven't been on LF for some time as my local noise level here in London has been slowly increasing. LF here is now a lost cause during the daytime. However an invitation to operate from Scotland, albeit a 879 mile return journey, was just too good to miss.

Simon GM4PLM, XYL Lynn and their family made me very welcome and I must say a big thank you to them all for the hospitality and the incredibly nice "Tunnock's tea cakes"

All 3 of the 'DX-peditions' (GM3YXM GM0MRF G3GRO/ M0BMU) had problems to overcome. Our Farmhouse QTH suffered from a constant background noise which we were able to reduce to usable levels, but sadly not to eliminate completely. Sorry Mike, G3XDV, a good 'T' but not enough to read the detail, even though we had good copy on the G3YXM Birmingham 'remote receiver.'
I had expected a very poor ground but, to my surprise, the overall system impedance was somewhere near 40 Ohms. This was unexpected as GM3YXM has always found 100+ Ohms typical at his New Galloway QTH.
The antenna at GM0MRF / GM4PLM was 125m of wire supported by Simon's tower near the house abt 50 feet up and at the far end by a 30 foot portable mast. A 20 ft pole in the middle of the run reduced the sag. - Not an exceptional LF antenna, but a good temporary installation. For insulators we used electric fence supports as much recommended over the years by Mal G3KEV. The system earth was the house earth and a single 100m wire which was clipped to one of the farm's perimeter fences.
On 71.9kHz this combination was resonated with a single big variable inductor which I've just measured at 5.81mH.  For most of the weekend we ran about 2.5A of antenna current, but as the noise problems encountered by G3GRO and M0BMU became apparent, Simon and I threw caution to the wind and began turning up the supply voltage to the TX.  When we finally worked Derek and Jim we had gone from 28V @ 10A to 34V@14A  and had 3.4 Amps into the antenna.

Stations worked on 72k

GM3YXM
MI0AYZ
G3LDO     apx 580km
G3AQC     apx 569km
G3GRO           610km

Also had a number of 136kHz QSOs, including Mal at S9+ CW and DL2HRE QRSS.

Now the equipment has had the dust removed, it's good to see Simon operating on 136kHz.
I understand via e-mail that he now has 30V at 20Amps into the TX. Not bad for a modified 250W linear PCB.
Hopefully people will try to have a QSO with him before summer static makes reception too unpleasant. Maybe this autumn we'll finally see a GM transatlantic QSO.

Thanks all

David  G(M)0MRF
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18396 invoked from network); 3 Apr 2003 14:04:34 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 3 Apr 2003 14:04:34 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 29033 invoked by uid 10001); 3 Apr 2003 14:04:34 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 3 Apr 2003 14:04:34 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1915JN-0003Kn-8B for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 15:03:25 +0100 Received: from [64.12.136.5] (helo=imo-m02.mx.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1915JG-0003Jm-PM for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 15:03:18 +0100 Received: from G0MRF@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id l.198.1836b70b (4584) for ; Thu, 3 Apr 2003 09:02:44 -0500 (EST) From: G0MRF@aol.com Message-ID: <198.1836b70b.2bbd9903@aol.com> Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2003 09:02:43 EST To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 10512 Subject: LF: 73k activity. Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.3 required=5.0tests=HTML_00_10,HTML_MESSAGE,MIME_LONG_LINE_QP,NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit What an exciting weekend that was.

I haven't been on LF for some time as my local noise level here in London has been slowly increasing. LF here is now a lost cause during the daytime. However an invitation to operate from Scotland, albeit a 879 mile return journey, was just too good to miss.

Simon GM4PLM, XYL Lynn and their family made me very welcome and I must say a big thank you to them all for the hospitality and the incredibly nice "Tunnock's tea cakes"

All 3 of the 'DX-peditions' (GM3YXM GM0MRF G3GRO/ M0BMU) had problems to overcome. Our Farmhouse QTH suffered from a constant background noise which we were able to reduce to usable levels, but sadly not to eliminate completely. Sorry Mike, G3XDV, a good 'T' but not enough to read the detail, even though we had good copy on the G3YXM Birmingham 'remote receiver.'
I had expected a very poor ground but, to my surprise, the overall system impedance was somewhere near 40 Ohms. This was unexpected as GM3YXM has always found 100+ Ohms typical at his New Galloway QTH.
The antenna at GM0MRF / GM4PLM was 125m of wire supported by Simon's tower near the house abt 50 feet up and at the far end by a 30 foot portable mast. A 20 ft pole in the middle of the run reduced the sag. - Not an exceptional LF antenna, but a good temporary installation. For insulators we used electric fence supports as much recommended over the years by Mal G3KEV. The system earth was the house earth and a single 100m wire which was clipped to one of the farm's perimeter fences.
On 71.9kHz this combination was resonated with a single big variable inductor which I've just measured at 5.81mH.  For most of the weekend we ran about 2.5A of antenna current, but as the noise problems encountered by G3GRO and M0BMU became apparent, Simon and I threw caution to the wind and began turning up the supply voltage to the TX.  When we finally worked Derek and Jim we had gone from 28V @ 10A to 34V@14A  and had 3.4 Amps into the antenna.

Stations worked on 72k

GM3YXM
MI0AYZ
G3LDO     apx 580km
G3AQC     apx 569km
G3GRO           610km

Also had a number of 136kHz QSOs, including Mal at S9+ CW and DL2HRE QRSS.

Now the equipment has had the dust removed, it's good to see Simon operating on 136kHz.
I understand via e-mail that he now has 30V at 20Amps into the TX. Not bad for a modified 250W linear PCB.
Hopefully people will try to have a QSO with him before summer static makes reception too unpleasant. Maybe this autumn we'll finally see a GM transatlantic QSO.

Thanks all

David  G(M)0MRF
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5028 invoked from network); 3 Apr 2003 09:16:39 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 3 Apr 2003 09:16:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 722 invoked from network); 3 Apr 2003 09:16:29 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 3 Apr 2003 09:16:29 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1910oq-0001jl-Pq for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 10:15:36 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.176] (helo=protactinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1910ol-0001jc-D5 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 10:15:31 +0100 Received: from [81.132.170.52] (helo=dellboy) by protactinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 1910ok-0002DK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 10:15:30 +0100 Message-ID: <001d01c2f9c1$c0f21490$1b00a8c0@dellboy> From: "Dave Pick" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001d01c2f9b5$8418a680$2accfc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2003 10:16:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: COILS Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false That's the second April 1st trick I've fallen for.... I'm off to the tree nursery now! Dave 'YXM Try planting some COPPER BEECH trees around your coils. I know April 1st has gone !!!!!!!!!!!! G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29061 invoked from network); 3 Apr 2003 08:57:25 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 3 Apr 2003 08:57:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 26835 invoked by uid 10001); 3 Apr 2003 08:57:25 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 3 Apr 2003 08:57:25 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1910Q0-0001UE-7m for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 09:49:56 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.48] (helo=mta8-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1910Pn-0001U5-VQ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 09:49:44 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.204.42]) by mta8-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030403084943.XTNA22832.mta8-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Thu, 3 Apr 2003 09:49:43 +0100 Message-ID: <001d01c2f9b5$8418a680$2accfc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2003 08:48:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: COILS Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0tests=HTML_50_60,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Try planting some COPPER BEECH trees around your coils. I know April 1st has gone !!!!!!!!!!!!
G3KEV
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17560 invoked from network); 3 Apr 2003 08:54:22 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 3 Apr 2003 08:54:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 20935 invoked from network); 3 Apr 2003 08:54:25 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 3 Apr 2003 08:54:25 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1910Pm-0001U1-Lf for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 09:49:42 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.48] (helo=mta8-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1910Pe-0001Tm-GU for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 09:49:34 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.204.42]) by mta8-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030403084933.XTKJ22832.mta8-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Thu, 3 Apr 2003 09:49:33 +0100 Message-ID: <001c01c2f9b5$7e1b2460$2accfc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <005001c2f960$434b9a40$5da82951@BI57429bankinter> Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2003 08:45:03 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: G3KEV QSO Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.3 required=5.0tests=HTML_50_60,HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2003 10:37 PM
Subject: LF: G3KEV QSO

Hi Mal and all:
 
I´ve just made QRSS3 QSO with G3KEV (1346 Km); Mal´s signals here very strong and audible.
Thanks to Mal for nice QSO.
 
Tnx Jose for the nice solid QSO on QRS but your signals were also audible at 559 and we could easily have worked on normal CW. Next time real CW hi
Tnx agn de Mal/G3KEV
 
 
73 de José, EA1PX loc IN53TI
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29449 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 23:35:21 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 23:35:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 29752 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 23:35:12 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 23:35:12 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190rki-0007fb-5V for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 00:34:44 +0100 Received: from [63.171.43.2] (helo=ns2.genesis-technology.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190rkc-0007fS-R1 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 00:34:39 +0100 Received: from we0h ([65.165.20.192]) by ns2.genesis-technology.com (8.10.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id h32NYXR30207 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 17:34:33 -0600 From: "WE0H" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 17:35:22 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: Importance: Normal Subject: RE: LF: RE: TS870 .v. 850 Round 1 - Day 1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.1 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false I got a report from the Gulf Coast last night. It showed in QRSS-30 from 10:30pm local to sunrise. It will stay on continuously all summer on the loop. Mike>WE0H http://www.we0h.us/lf "WEOH" on 185.3026kc QRSS & -.-. .-- -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Laurence J Howell Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2003 11:29 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: RE: TS870 .v. 850 Round 1 - Day 1 Mike - I think you got a better display than us! The lights from the airport tend to cause interference at times...but when its clear WOW! Yep I think ill connect up the W @ G too and take a listen... Hows the beacon??? Laurence From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28059 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 23:10:14 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 23:10:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 22554 invoked by uid 10001); 2 Apr 2003 23:10:14 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 23:10:13 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190rM8-0007WF-I8 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 00:09:20 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.81] (helo=tungsten.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190rM0-0007W6-O1 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 00:09:12 +0100 Received: from [213.122.42.34] (helo=83Horseshoe) by tungsten.btinternet.com with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 190rM0-0001bl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Apr 2003 00:09:12 +0100 From: "Martin MOMGM" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2003 00:08:36 +0100 Message-ID: <000001c2f96c$e5e54fb0$222a7ad5@83Horseshoe> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.3416 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <006c01c2f941$aeeaa940$6d924c51@shack> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Time difference Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TOversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Slightly off topic but still LF! Recently the economy 7 electric meter was changed from a black box to a grey box with green and red buttons. The former had a single button that could be used to select normal and off peak consumption as well as displaying time. The time was picked up from what I thought was a sub carrier of Radio 4 long wave or maybe MSF. It was very accurate, matching time on my GPS. The new unit also displays time but is exactly 10 minutes behind GMT. Any ideas? One thought is that the units are set with specific time differentials so as not to overload the national grid with a single big switch on. Martin M0MGM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8237 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 21:40:44 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 21:40:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 6587 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 21:40:47 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 21:40:47 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190pxe-0006qg-Ko for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 22:39:58 +0100 Received: from [213.4.129.150] (helo=telesmtp3.mail.isp) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190pxZ-0006qX-Gu for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 22:39:53 +0100 Received: from BI57429bankinter ([213.99.249.236]) by telesmtp3.mail.isp (terra.es) with ESMTP id HCQK5102.7NN for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 23:39:01 +0200 Message-ID: <005001c2f960$434b9a40$5da82951@BI57429bankinter> From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9_Manuel?= To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 23:37:20 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: G3KEV QSO Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0tests=HTML_50_60,HTML_MESSAGE,UPPERCASE_25_50version=2.51 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Mal and all:
 
I´ve just made QRSS3 QSO with G3KEV (1346 Km); Mal´s signals here very strong and audible.
Thanks to Mal for nice QSO.
 
73 de José, EA1PX loc IN53TI
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4919 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 21:18:29 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 21:18:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 9786 invoked by uid 10001); 2 Apr 2003 21:18:29 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 21:18:29 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190pc6-0006a6-86 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 22:17:42 +0100 Received: from [206.173.118.93] (helo=uhura.concentric.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190pc1-0006Zx-6C for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 22:17:37 +0100 Received: from cliff.concentric.net (cliff.concentric.net [206.173.118.90]) by uhura.concentric.net [Concentric SMTP Routing 1.0] id h32LHYi10504 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 16:17:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from jka ([208.37.242.34]) by cliff.concentric.net (8.9.1a+patch) id QAA18260; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 16:17:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <007b01c2f95f$02360820$09dc9384@jka> From: "John Andrews" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000e01c2f934$42926060$11e9fc3e@l8p8y6> <000701c2f958$d0603740$4512f4cc@jsm> Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 16:29:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: VO1NA? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Steve, >Could someone advise me of Joe's e-mail address? jcraig@morgan.ucs.mun.ca JA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19988 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 20:56:26 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 20:56:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 2594 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 20:56:29 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 20:56:29 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190pGk-0006MT-IQ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 21:55:38 +0100 Received: from [208.181.178.245] (helo=neptune.imagenisp.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190pGd-0006Ly-Vr for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 21:55:32 +0100 Received: from jsm ([204.244.18.69]) by neptune.imagenisp.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id 2AYJLL97; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 12:55:57 -0800 Message-ID: <000701c2f958$d0603740$4512f4cc@jsm> From: "Steve McDonald" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000e01c2f934$42926060$11e9fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 12:45:35 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: VO1NA? Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.3 required=5.0tests=HTML_50_60,HTML_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
 
Could someone advise me of Joe's e-mail address?
 
Thanks / VE7SL / Steve
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9208 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 20:54:33 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 20:54:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 20974 invoked by uid 10001); 2 Apr 2003 20:54:33 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 20:54:33 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190pE3-0006LP-54 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 21:52:51 +0100 Received: from [194.247.47.231] (helo=mailout.zetnet.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190pDy-0006LG-4A for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 21:52:46 +0100 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] helo=zetnet.co.uk) by mailout.zetnet.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 190pDx-00034m-00 for ; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 21:52:45 +0100 Received: from a7j7r2 (bts-0357.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.49.101]) by zetnet.co.uk (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-5.zet) with SMTP id h32Kqh2b027931 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 21:52:44 +0100 Message-ID: <003b01c2f959$cc54a4a0$6531f7c2@a7j7r2> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000e01c2f934$42926060$11e9fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 21:52:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: DXPEDITION Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.7 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "hamilton mal" [...] Normal CW QSO'S are getting rare these days. Most seem to favour the LAZY MANS mode 73 de G3KEV/IO94SH --------------------------------- I didn't know they were using voice! 73 de G3PAI From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24435 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 18:04:11 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 18:04:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 27504 invoked by uid 10001); 2 Apr 2003 18:04:11 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 18:04:11 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190mWo-0004wK-PZ for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 19:00:02 +0100 Received: from [195.92.193.210] (helo=cmailm2.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190mWj-0004w2-Kp for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 18:59:57 +0100 Received: from modem-2188.snake.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.120.140] helo=shack) by cmailm2.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190mWi-0005Zy-Ls for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 18:59:57 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 18:59:56 +0100 Message-ID: <006c01c2f941$aeeaa940$6d924c51@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: GM4PLM now fully QRV/taking skeds Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi All David G0MRF has now returned home and left me a present in the form of a 136 KHz transmitter, variable inductor, his trusty bucket'o'wire coil and we left the antenna up! After some tests today and some fiddling to get the station into a more suitable place for permanent operations I am happy to report I am fully operational on 136 KHz and ready for skeds and more random QSO's Made a couple of contacts today so the antenna is fully functioning and still up after the wind of the past few days. So GM now has a permanent 136K station and glad to see it on the band again. Can do hand cw and QRSS if so desired. Thanks to David I am happy with QRSS and Argo so hopefully will be able to make some good QSO's I am particularly interested in making QSO's into EU with many GM - DX firsts still to be made. Thanks to David for his patience and company this weekend and great to be part of the record breaking contact team! I must also thank him for his generosity in leaving this equipment here and you can be assured it will in use! Thanks all and see you on the band Regards Simon GM4PLM IO75TL 15km E of Ayr, West Scotland From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16041 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 17:37:24 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 17:37:24 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 26600 invoked by uid 10001); 2 Apr 2003 17:37:23 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 17:37:23 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190m9Z-0004fZ-Df for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 18:36:01 +0100 Received: from [138.32.33.140] (helo=mailman2.ppco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190m9U-0004fQ-8w for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 18:35:56 +0100 Received: from bvlw2k132.ppco.com (trend2.ppco.com [138.32.31.132]) by mailman2.ppco.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with SMTP id h32HZsCX013705 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 11:35:55 -0600 Received: from 138.32.31.56 by bvlw2k132.ppco.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Wed, 02 Apr 2003 11:29:29 -0600 Received: from bvlnotes07.ppco.com (bvlnotes07.ppco.com [138.32.54.38]) by mail1.ppco.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h32HTRB13595 for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 11:29:28 -0600 (CST) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.8 June 18, 2001 Message-ID: From: "Laurence J Howell" Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 08:29:26 -0900 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BVLNOTES07/CIT/Phillips Petroleum/us(Release 5.0.7 |March 21, 2001) at 04/02/2003 11:29:29 AM MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: RE: TS870 .v. 850 Round 1 - Day 1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Mike - I think you got a better display than us! The lights from the airport tend to cause interference at times...but when its clear WOW! Yep I think ill connect up the W @ G too and take a listen... Hows the beacon??? Laurence From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 32585 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 17:25:45 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 17:25:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 28572 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 17:25:36 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 17:25:35 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190lyT-0004bY-IA for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 18:24:33 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.47] (helo=mta7-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190lyO-0004bP-KR for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 18:24:28 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.233.17]) by mta7-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030402172427.LJAY27609.mta7-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 18:24:27 +0100 Message-ID: <000e01c2f934$42926060$11e9fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 17:23:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: DXPEDITION Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
All dxpedition signals excellent here. GM4PLM/GM0MRF 599/599 plus when we worked on normal CW. G3GRO in Cornawall was 579/579 also on normal cw. I believe I was his first QSO on the dxpedition.
All other acty that I heard was on QRS and did not hear any other normal cw qso's. I did hear G3YXM working a PA0 on normal cw but could not reply at the time cos I was QRL.
All the above observations on 136 khz
Normal CW QSO'S are getting rare these days. Most seem to favour the LAZY MANS mode
73 de G3KEV/IO94SH 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5936 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 14:31:18 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 14:31:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 28192 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 14:31:21 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 14:31:20 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190jFe-00032s-BG for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 15:30:06 +0100 Received: from [193.212.240.200] (helo=virus-in.online.no) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190jFY-000321-Qw for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 15:30:00 +0100 Received: from [134.47.162.190] by virus-in.online.no with ESMTP for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 16:29:28 +0200 Received: from tns-fbu-22-212.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.162.91]) by tns-fbu-22-209.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Wed, 2 Apr 2003 16:29:28 +0200 Received: from TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.164.201]) by tns-fbu-22-212.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Wed, 2 Apr 2003 16:29:28 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 16:29:27 +0200 Message-ID: <2D280BB697C7EE4C979C5C89925418EFB05BD3@TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no> Thread-Topic: LF: Re: Loading coils Thread-Index: AcL5IxVpDFsuyGH6T+WT/zPxm0XxLgAAOe2g From: jan-martin.noding@telenor.com To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Apr 2003 14:29:28.0180 (UTC) FILETIME=[446B0B40:01C2F924] MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: RE: LF: Re: Loading coils Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.7 required=5.0tests=NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false and should have added (?): If it is cooled down too far below zero the winding maybe superconducting and current might be so high that the receiver could be damaged? 73, LA8AK http://home.online.no/~la8ak/ -----Original Message----- From: Tom Boucher [mailto:tom@telemetry.demon.co.uk] Sent: 2. april 2003 14:53 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Loading coils I note 'KEV wrote the following on 1st April! 73, Tom G3OLB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13684 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 14:14:49 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 14:14:49 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 1888 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 14:14:39 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 14:14:39 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190iym-0002o9-89 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 15:12:40 +0100 Received: from [194.217.242.80] (helo=anchor-post-39.mail.demon.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190iyh-0002ny-2t for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 15:12:35 +0100 Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by anchor-post-39.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 190iyW-0003Um-0d for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 15:12:34 +0100 Message-ID: <3+iXaCAJ1ti+Mw03@telemetry.demon.co.uk> Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 13:53:29 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" In-reply-to: <000f01c2f844$e1abea40$d3e8fc3e@l8p8y6> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Subject: Re: LF: Re: Loading coils X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TOversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false I note 'KEV wrote the following on 1st April! 73, Tom G3OLB writes > >Its a question of requirements. > >1. These Decca coils were used only on TX and 10/15 db loss was acceptable >by putting these coils in a metal cage for environmental reasons. > >2. Heated coils generate noise, in fact the coils should be kept cold, but >again in a TX only mode it does not matter. > >Because the LF radio amateur also requires the antenna and associated coils >for receiving , heating the coils produces unnecessary noise and on Transmit >one cannot afford 10/15 db loss of radiated power. >For those using RF preamps try running them in a cold environment, in a cold >box at 0C and get a superior signal over noise at the RX front end. > >The above info is old hat for those in the know, it would appear some have >led sheltered lives in the wireless world. >G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17655 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 14:14:47 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 14:14:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 12126 invoked by uid 10001); 2 Apr 2003 14:14:46 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 14:14:46 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190ix0-0002nO-FN for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 15:10:50 +0100 Received: from [195.92.193.21] (helo=cmailm5.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190iws-0002nF-1l for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 15:10:42 +0100 Received: from modem-2482.zebra.dialup.pol.co.uk ([81.76.153.178] helo=shack) by cmailm5.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190iwq-0003Ju-LX for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 15:10:41 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 15:10:26 +0100 Message-ID: <005401c2f921$9fa801a0$6d924c51@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: <2D280BB697C7EE4C979C5C89925418EFB05BD0@TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no> Subject: LF: RE: RE: RE: RE: Wtd - thermocouple Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.4 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Someone else has posted details on G3YXM site too I also have been donated a meter from SM land as well! Regards Simon -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of jan-martin.noding@telenor.com Sent: 02 April 2003 15:04 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: RE: RE: Wtd - thermocouple Simon Shouldn't make a nuissance of myself, but now I remember that it is described on Ian G3SEK's site. Instead of running around and thinking about mechanical solution one might use those wooden saucage grips, or perhaps they are only available here... 73, LA8AK http://home.online.no/~la8ak/ -----Original Message----- From: Simon Lewis [mailto:simon@creoch.freeserve.co.uk] Sent: 2. april 2003 15:38 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: RE: Wtd - thermocouple (Intern) Hi Jan-Martin It was simply time! Easy to ask someone if they have a spare than start building one! If no one has one then yes I must build! Regards Simon -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of jan-martin.noding@telenor.com Sent: 02 April 2003 14:30 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: Wtd - thermocouple (Intern) OK, but wouldn't it be a better idea to use the antenna current meter as suggested by G3LDO and others some years ago? Have copied one of them, perhaps I should bring some details on my site.... Jan-Martin, LA8AK --- J M Nøding, Datakvalitet, TTS, Kristiansand Telefon 0047-380-52660, 9077-7126 (QTH: 0047-380-87178) http://home.online.no/~la8ak/ -----Original Message----- From: Simon Lewis [mailto:simon@creoch.freeserve.co.uk] Sent: 2. april 2003 15:09 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Wtd - thermocouple Anyone help me quickly - need a thermocouple for ant current monitoring David G0MRF left me some 136KHz gear but unfortunately could not leave SWR/Ant current monitor Anyone got a spare they could part with. Regards Simon GM4PLM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 32351 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 14:05:53 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 14:05:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 12875 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 14:05:56 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 14:05:56 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190irN-0002c4-9V for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 15:05:01 +0100 Received: from [193.212.240.200] (helo=virus-out.ttyl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190irH-0002Z1-Pr for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 15:04:55 +0100 Received: from [134.47.162.90] by virus-in.online.no with ESMTP for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 16:04:24 +0200 Received: from tns-fbu-22-215.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.162.192]) by tns-fbu-22-208.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Wed, 2 Apr 2003 16:04:12 +0200 Received: from tns-fbu-22-212.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.162.91]) by tns-fbu-22-215.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Wed, 2 Apr 2003 16:04:11 +0200 Received: from TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.164.201]) by tns-fbu-22-212.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Wed, 2 Apr 2003 16:04:23 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 16:04:23 +0200 Message-ID: <2D280BB697C7EE4C979C5C89925418EFB05BD0@TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no> Thread-Topic: RE: RE: Wtd - thermocouple (Intern) Thread-Index: AcL5HoEgbThBU9C/SH2+Ju/3nokGdQAAZ15g From: jan-martin.noding@telenor.com To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Apr 2003 14:04:23.0352 (UTC) FILETIME=[C3788380:01C2F920] MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: RE: RE: RE: Wtd - thermocouple Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.7 required=5.0tests=NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Simon Shouldn't make a nuissance of myself, but now I remember that it is described on Ian G3SEK's site. Instead of running around and thinking about mechanical solution one might use those wooden saucage grips, or perhaps they are only available here... 73, LA8AK http://home.online.no/~la8ak/ -----Original Message----- From: Simon Lewis [mailto:simon@creoch.freeserve.co.uk] Sent: 2. april 2003 15:38 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: RE: Wtd - thermocouple (Intern) Hi Jan-Martin It was simply time! Easy to ask someone if they have a spare than start building one! If no one has one then yes I must build! Regards Simon -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of jan-martin.noding@telenor.com Sent: 02 April 2003 14:30 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: Wtd - thermocouple (Intern) OK, but wouldn't it be a better idea to use the antenna current meter as suggested by G3LDO and others some years ago? Have copied one of them, perhaps I should bring some details on my site.... Jan-Martin, LA8AK --- J M Nøding, Datakvalitet, TTS, Kristiansand Telefon 0047-380-52660, 9077-7126 (QTH: 0047-380-87178) http://home.online.no/~la8ak/ -----Original Message----- From: Simon Lewis [mailto:simon@creoch.freeserve.co.uk] Sent: 2. april 2003 15:09 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Wtd - thermocouple Anyone help me quickly - need a thermocouple for ant current monitoring David G0MRF left me some 136KHz gear but unfortunately could not leave SWR/Ant current monitor Anyone got a spare they could part with. Regards Simon GM4PLM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27841 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 14:05:03 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 14:05:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 11906 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 14:05:05 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 14:05:05 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190ipm-0002Yh-Th for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 15:03:22 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190ipZ-0002XW-O7 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 15:03:09 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.204.151]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030402140308.USQG6822.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 15:03:08 +0100 Message-ID: <000501c2f918$44312d00$97ccfc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 14:02:29 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Weekend XPEDS Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false A sincere thank you to all the intrepid xpeditioneers who set a new record and made life so interesting, enjoyable and sometines exasperating between Friday and Tuesday.I I made no forays onto 136 KHz so cannot comment on how things went there, but I watched and participated on 73 KHz and managed to complete the 'treble' last night at 1930z. I had just about given up on G3GRO by then, having called him and called him and CALLED him all day on an exceptionally noisy band from shortly after 1000z - but wihout success until I saw the GRO/MRF QSO and tried one last call. Fully in keeping with the rest of the days adventures my computer picked the moment of handover to go to sleep, then go into sulk mode and by the time I got it rebooted all I saw was what just might have been a Y followed by a clear Z and then the GRO callsign. Oh the agony of uncertainty! - but it all came right in the end with 'O' exchanges and the band beautifully quiet. Dave, David, Derek, Jim and all the unsung assistants deserve a very sincere vote of thanks from the rest of us. 73, Ian MI0AYZ Might think about an expedition to Rathlin Island myself! From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16934 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 13:39:02 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 13:39:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 6636 invoked by uid 10001); 2 Apr 2003 13:39:02 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 13:39:02 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190iRO-0002MY-Pm for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 14:38:10 +0100 Received: from [195.92.193.210] (helo=cmailm2.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190iRJ-0002MP-Ru for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 14:38:05 +0100 Received: from modem-2482.zebra.dialup.pol.co.uk ([81.76.153.178] helo=shack) by cmailm2.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190iRI-0001oC-Rk for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 14:38:05 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 14:37:48 +0100 Message-ID: <004901c2f91d$0f6106e0$6d924c51@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: <2D280BB697C7EE4C979C5C89925418EFB05BCD@TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no> Subject: LF: RE: RE: Wtd - thermocouple (Intern) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.4 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Jan-Martin It was simply time! Easy to ask someone if they have a spare than start building one! If no one has one then yes I must build! Regards Simon -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of jan-martin.noding@telenor.com Sent: 02 April 2003 14:30 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: Wtd - thermocouple (Intern) OK, but wouldn't it be a better idea to use the antenna current meter as suggested by G3LDO and others some years ago? Have copied one of them, perhaps I should bring some details on my site.... Jan-Martin, LA8AK --- J M Nøding, Datakvalitet, TTS, Kristiansand Telefon 0047-380-52660, 9077-7126 (QTH: 0047-380-87178) http://home.online.no/~la8ak/ -----Original Message----- From: Simon Lewis [mailto:simon@creoch.freeserve.co.uk] Sent: 2. april 2003 15:09 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Wtd - thermocouple Anyone help me quickly - need a thermocouple for ant current monitoring David G0MRF left me some 136KHz gear but unfortunately could not leave SWR/Ant current monitor Anyone got a spare they could part with. Regards Simon GM4PLM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2916 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 13:31:43 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 13:31:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 29074 invoked by uid 10001); 2 Apr 2003 13:31:42 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 13:31:42 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190iJy-0002Cy-Ra for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 14:30:30 +0100 Received: from [193.212.240.200] (helo=virus-out.ttyl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190iJt-0002CK-84 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 14:30:25 +0100 Received: from [134.47.162.90] by virusscan.telenor.no with ESMTP for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 15:29:51 +0200 Received: from tns-fbu-22-212.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.162.91]) by tns-fbu-22-208.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Wed, 2 Apr 2003 15:29:47 +0200 Received: from TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no ([134.47.164.201]) by tns-fbu-22-212.corp.telenor.no with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.4453); Wed, 2 Apr 2003 15:29:47 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 15:29:35 +0200 Message-ID: <2D280BB697C7EE4C979C5C89925418EFB05BCD@TNS-FBU-2E-003.corp.telenor.no> Thread-Topic: Wtd - thermocouple Thread-Index: AcL5G2wqywT54wTJQya67VUdA8p7fgAADjQA From: jan-martin.noding@telenor.com To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Apr 2003 13:29:47.0789 (UTC) FILETIME=[EE56BBD0:01C2F91B] MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: RE: Wtd - thermocouple (Intern) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.7 required=5.0tests=NO_REAL_NAMEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false OK, but wouldn't it be a better idea to use the antenna current meter as suggested by G3LDO and others some years ago? Have copied one of them, perhaps I should bring some details on my site.... Jan-Martin, LA8AK --- J M Nøding, Datakvalitet, TTS, Kristiansand Telefon 0047-380-52660, 9077-7126 (QTH: 0047-380-87178) http://home.online.no/~la8ak/ -----Original Message----- From: Simon Lewis [mailto:simon@creoch.freeserve.co.uk] Sent: 2. april 2003 15:09 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Wtd - thermocouple Anyone help me quickly - need a thermocouple for ant current monitoring David G0MRF left me some 136KHz gear but unfortunately could not leave SWR/Ant current monitor Anyone got a spare they could part with. Regards Simon GM4PLM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9850 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 13:11:19 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 13:11:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 16217 invoked by uid 10001); 2 Apr 2003 13:10:53 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 13:10:53 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190hzq-00020w-Dp for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 14:09:42 +0100 Received: from [195.92.193.210] (helo=cmailm2.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190hzj-00020n-Vq for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 14:09:36 +0100 Received: from modem-248.tiger.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.208.248] helo=shack) by cmailm2.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190hzj-000385-30 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 14:09:35 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 14:09:20 +0100 Message-ID: <004701c2f919$1688fc10$6d924c51@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Wtd - thermocouple Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Anyone help me quickly - need a thermocouple for ant current monitoring David G0MRF left me some 136KHz gear but unfortunately could not leave SWR/Ant current monitor Anyone got a spare they could part with. Regards Simon GM4PLM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9212 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 09:51:09 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 09:51:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 20281 invoked by uid 10001); 2 Apr 2003 09:51:08 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 09:51:08 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190esX-0008So-5Z for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 10:49:57 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.81] (helo=tungsten.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190esM-0008Sf-I1 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 10:49:46 +0100 Received: from dial81-135-42-192.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([81.135.42.192] helo=Main) by tungsten.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 190esL-0005Or-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 10:49:46 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c2f8fd$3050a100$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: "LF-Group" Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 10:49:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 73kHz Wed Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi all, isn't it annoying, now the sun has come out in East Anglia all the geriatrics have gone out to play and the band is lovely and quiet, no TV rubbish. Likewise it seems as though Rugby is still off, the biggest signal around is a thumping great one from HBG. Cheers de Alan G3NYK alan.melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12147 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 09:31:10 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 09:31:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 29959 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 09:31:01 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 09:31:01 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190eSe-00087g-SV for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 10:23:12 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.44] (helo=mta4-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190eSa-00087X-3K for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 10:23:08 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.228.163]) by mta4-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030402092307.BLJ11888.mta4-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 10:23:07 +0100 Message-ID: <00c401c2f8f1$03937f40$a3e4fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 08:08:24 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re 73kHz Tuesday Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.5 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "John W Gould" To: "Rsgb_Lf_Group@Blacksheep.Org" Sent: Tuesday, April 01, 2003 8:57 PM Subject: LF: Re 73kHz Tuesday > Plenty of activity, with approx sig level above estimated avg noise here in > Newport Pagnell: > > G3AQC 30dB > G3LDO 30dB > G3XDV 20dB > G3GRO 20dB > GM0MRF 10dB > > Saw some other transmissions, but wasn't around at the right time to get > callsigns (apologies to G3YXM and MI0AYZ) > > My normally high noise floor "switched off sometime after 9am, dropping the > noise floor down from a stead S9 to a more normal sound, varying around S2 > with occasional crashes up to S7. All of the signals above were audible, > That of G3AQC and G3LDO moved the S-meter to an S5. > > My own transmissions were carried out from the house via a 100m length of > coax to the loading coil and aerial. Interestingly, last month when the TX > was in the shed next to the loading coil I got an aerial current of just > under an amp. Today, with two toroidal transformers (to first transform > from around 4 ohms to 50ohms, and then from 50 ohms to around 200ohms - a > guess at matching the aerial), the aerial current all but disappeared. That > might explain why, despite CQs during the morning, afternoon and early > evening, I was only heard and worked by G3XDV. > > Much of the above will no doubt raise knowing smiles from you "old hands", > but an interesting day for me and some thoughts as to what to do next. I'd > really like to know the source of the noise; it's unlikely to be TVs since > it was still quiet at 8pm.... Hi John One QRM source these days is the prolific use of energy saving light bulbs. These are fatal in some cases for the LF operator. They seem to modulate the mains, which carries the QRM around the neigbourhood, even at great distances beyond the source, especially if you are on the same phase. This type of qrm can appear on any low freq and unfortunately 73 or 136 khz are within the spectrum. It appears as wavy lines spaced 100 hz apart on a frequency and can be very severe. I experienced this type of qrm once and was able to locate the source several hundred yards away f rom the antenna and when the offending bulbs were changed, problem solved. It did not effect the higher freqs like 160 metres, only down on the lower freqs. It is probably going to get worse in the future with dirty mains problems caused by smpsu's, the above light bulbs and all the digital devices coming more popular. Hope you get it solved. 73 de Mal/G3KEV > > 73 and nice to hear/see the good signals on the band. > > 73 John, G3WKL > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31769 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 03:00:04 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 03:00:04 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: (qmail 16137 invoked by uid 10001); 2 Apr 2003 03:00:04 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 03:00:04 -0000 X-SQ: A X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190YT9-00050A-4p for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 03:59:19 +0100 Received: from [212.125.75.12] (helo=mail4.messagelabs.com) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 190YT4-0004zw-AG for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 03:59:14 +0100 X-VirusChecked: Checked X-Env-Sender: William.Ashlock@edwards.boc.com X-Msg-Ref: server-19.tower-4.messagelabs.com!1049252345!1601 Received: (qmail 9646 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 02:59:05 -0000 Received: from ukfw1.ge.boc.com (193.131.2.157) by server-19.tower-4.messagelabs.com with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 02:59:05 -0000 Received: from z-160-100-160-136.est.ibm.com ([160.100.160.136]) by ukfw1.ge.boc.com; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 03:59:42 +0100 (BST) Received: from exc_wil04.edwards.boc.com ([162.118.144.226]) by exc_cra03.edwards.boc.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id 2AGJX5JM; Wed, 2 Apr 2003 04:03:48 +0100 Received: by EXC_WIL04 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 21:59:39 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Ashlock,William" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 21:59:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Subject: LF: RE: Re: Re: RE: GAIN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Mal, >Heck Bill even made a loop that was 25 feet by 25 feet and it still made it several hundred >miles on less than a watt. This loop has a Q of ~400 (3/4" ID Cu pipe). Rac = ~.08 ohms so the current is about 3.5A at 1w. What are you measuring for Q or Rac on you 90 meter loop? Bill _____________________________________________________________________ This e-mail has been scanned for viruses by the WorldCom Internet Managed Scanning Service - powered by MessageLabs. For further information visit http://www.worldcom.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 30436 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 02:13:26 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 02:13:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 18399 invoked from network); 2 Apr 2003 02:13:29 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 2003 02:13:29 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190XjF-0004WW-9h for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 03:11:53 +0100 Received: from [63.171.43.2] (helo=ns2.genesis-technology.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190Xj9-0004WN-VO for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Apr 2003 03:11:48 +0100 Received: from we0h ([65.165.20.192]) by ns2.genesis-technology.com (8.10.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id h322Bff19458 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 20:11:41 -0600 From: "WE0H" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 20:12:21 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: Importance: Normal Subject: LF: RE: TS870 .v. 850 Round 1 - Day 1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.1 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,ORIGINAL_MESSAGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Laurence, We could see the aurora in Minnesota last night. Pretty vertical rods of light dancing around. No color though. Haven't seen colors in a few years. I'll have a look tonight and see if the light gods are a blazing once again. Maybe I should pull out the Natural radio receiver and have a listen to the chorus. 73's, Mike>WE0H http://www.we0h.us/lf -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Laurence J Howell Sent: Tuesday, April 01, 2003 1:00 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: TS870 .v. 850 Round 1 - Day 1 For those looking at the web site I apologize for all the squiggles at 0630Z 1 April - I was doing a rough "lets just see what this Ebay 850 can do in comparison with my "baby". Well....if its true lets delve into the noise and see what signals I can see, the 850 has it (tara~!) The 850 without the high stab osc is taking about 1 hour to settle down and I havent "zero'd" Argo in yet but if Loran lines are a subjective signal s/n test then what is just "seeable" as a weak Loran line is pretty bright with the 850 Yep I checked it is the same Loran line!). Now I know it takes only a few dBs to go from a dull to bright trace but the important thing is that what fades in and out on the 870 is always there on the 850 - this would confirm my/Albertos and half the worlds thoughts on the 850 - its a pretty decent LF receiver. Also Ive got the AGC off, AIP off and NB1 on and I cant hear Loran....static crashes however are audible which they aren't on the 870 (870's NB may be better at this sort of thing as the 850 isn't renowned for its NB)... On the lower freqs around 70K I need the AIP in otherwise I get some left wing liberal talking about the war from my 4 local MF 100Kw Medium wave stations just a couple miles up the road. Loran is audible down here. Sensitivity is much better down here too and JJY on 40KHz is a good sig. Its like getting an old friend back - I had to sell my 850 way back and mourned the day....Im smiling again. It will be the receiver of choice once Ive figured how to X patch everything. With all this SFU's and 2MEV's, DCF39 has dissapeared....Nice Viz Aurora tonight....Laurence KL1X Anchorage -5C www.kl1x.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24726 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 19:58:54 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 19:58:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 819 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 19:58:53 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 19:58:53 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190Rt8-0001rZ-9s for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 20:57:42 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.93] (helo=rhenium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190Rsw-0001rQ-46 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 20:57:32 +0100 Received: from host213-122-117-99.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([213.122.117.99] helo=acer5gi5q0ubzj) by rhenium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 190Rst-0005tc-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 20:57:28 +0100 From: "John W Gould" To: "Rsgb_Lf_Group@Blacksheep.Org" Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 20:57:29 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re 73kHz Tuesday Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.7 required=5.0tests=MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Plenty of activity, with approx sig level above estimated avg noise here in Newport Pagnell: G3AQC 30dB G3LDO 30dB G3XDV 20dB G3GRO 20dB GM0MRF 10dB Saw some other transmissions, but wasn't around at the right time to get callsigns (apologies to G3YXM and MI0AYZ) My normally high noise floor "switched off sometime after 9am, dropping the noise floor down from a stead S9 to a more normal sound, varying around S2 with occasional crashes up to S7. All of the signals above were audible, That of G3AQC and G3LDO moved the S-meter to an S5. My own transmissions were carried out from the house via a 100m length of coax to the loading coil and aerial. Interestingly, last month when the TX was in the shed next to the loading coil I got an aerial current of just under an amp. Today, with two toroidal transformers (to first transform from around 4 ohms to 50ohms, and then from 50 ohms to around 200ohms - a guess at matching the aerial), the aerial current all but disappeared. That might explain why, despite CQs during the morning, afternoon and early evening, I was only heard and worked by G3XDV. Much of the above will no doubt raise knowing smiles from you "old hands", but an interesting day for me and some thoughts as to what to do next. I'd really like to know the source of the noise; it's unlikely to be TVs since it was still quiet at 8pm.... 73 and nice to hear/see the good signals on the band. 73 John, G3WKL From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 32747 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 19:12:03 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 19:12:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 12343 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 19:12:03 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 19:12:03 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190R9H-0001SY-Cd for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 20:10:19 +0100 Received: from [213.40.2.15] (helo=bedpan.sout.netline.net.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190R9B-0001SE-SO for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 20:10:14 +0100 Received: from [213.40.202.158] (helo=tcs1) by bedpan.sout.netline.net.uk with smtp (Exim 4.04) id 190R8f-00066w-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 20:09:42 +0100 From: "G4WGT" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 20:09:35 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <000501c2f7a3$1f8d9ea0$07d2fc3e@ian> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: RE: Frustration! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.0 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Ian & All *********** Ian, MI0AYZ wrote :- Put loading coil outside last Friday and got an immediate worthwhile increase in antenna current. Ever suspicious, checked it with the rough-cut plywood panels for its rightful home chocked perilously round it and all well. Finished box yesterday except for antenna access and waterproofing so got stuck in today to finish job by lining with 'turkey foil' and sealing antenna entry point. ************** This weekend I had to evict the LF coils (XYL's idea) from the small greenhouse ready for the flowers, hanging baskets & tomato's etc, so I was stuck for somewere to keep the coils, no room in shack ! therefore a trip to the local DIY stores revealed what I thought was a suitable outside store for the coils etc. I purchased a small garden tool storage unit from the local B & Q DIY store for £24.99, it is a long low box shape with the opening on top but I have placed it on end so it is upright with the door now at the front not the top. Have a look at www.wgtaylor.talkgas.net\coilcabinet.jpg & see what you think. Still requires some mods for feeder & antenna to go in. 73 Gary G4WGT --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.461 / Virus Database: 260 - Release Date: 10/03/2003 From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16359 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 16:43:08 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 16:43:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 11000 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 16:43:07 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 16:43:07 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190OpY-0000GV-Gw for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 17:41:48 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.171] (helo=cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190OpQ-0000GI-Pg for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 17:41:40 +0100 Received: from modem-35.north-dakota.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.85.35] helo=f3a3a2) by cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 4.14) id 190OpP-0005MC-Rn for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 17:41:40 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c2f86d$a4c20e60$ea00a8c0@f3a3a2> From: "Laurie Mayhead" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 17:40:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re. 73kHz Tuesday Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Good day on 73kHz ! Good signals here on a quiet band although some QRN in the afternoon. Saw G3XDV,G3YXM, MI0AYZ, very big signal from G3GRO RST 579 could easily have worked CW but my QRSS signal only "M" with him so perhaps not.. GM0MRF was also audible at about 449. Thanks Guys great effort. 73 Laurie. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23621 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 14:36:30 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 14:36:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 5597 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 14:36:33 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 14:36:33 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190MoU-0007SH-Bl for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 15:32:34 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.176] (helo=protactinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190MoP-0007S5-Fp for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 15:32:29 +0100 Received: from host81-132-170-52.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([81.132.170.52] helo=dellboy) by protactinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 190MoP-00018v-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 15:32:29 +0100 Message-ID: <00b701c2f85b$b12fafc0$1b00a8c0@dellboy> From: "Dave Pick" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000501c2f7a3$1f8d9ea0$07d2fc3e@ian> <003101c2f7b3$1954f500$cbe8fc3e@l8p8y6> Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 15:33:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: Frustration! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.1 required=5.0tests=BANG_MONEY,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Mal said... > > NEVER put your loading coil in a metal box, it totally destroys the > efficiency. Consider it as part of the antenna from the radiation point of > view. You have never seen a loading coil on a Mobile encased in a metal CAN, > the coil contributes to the over all efficiency ie coil plus whip. I hope somebody tells the BBC and other broadcasters not to put their loading coils in metal shielded "ATH"s because they will keep doing it! If you think they aren't worried about efficiency, think again! Inefficiency at QRO = heat and MONEY!!! For what it's worth I put my coil in a metal clad shed in the garden and the aerial current INCREASED to the effect of about 1dB improvement. The coil is so small as to be an insignificant part of the radiating system, losses are everything and losses due to the coil's electrostatic field coupling into trees etc can be significant. If you coil isn't out in the clear you may benefit from doing it but it has to be done well, dodgy joints etc will lose you more than you gain. As for receive noise...... have you listened on LF much? Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 726 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 14:03:27 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 14:03:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 26465 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 14:03:26 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 14:03:26 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190MKZ-00075B-OA for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 15:01:39 +0100 Received: from [207.155.198.79] (helo=darius.concentric.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190MKQ-00074z-V5 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 15:01:31 +0100 Received: from mcfeely.concentric.net (mcfeely.concentric.net [207.155.198.83]) by darius.concentric.net [Concentric SMTP Routing 1.0] id h31E1Sc09153 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 09:01:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from jka ([208.37.242.34]) by mcfeely.concentric.net (8.9.1a+patch) id JAA21845; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 09:01:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <001601c2f858$eac9cf20$09dc9384@jka> From: "John Andrews" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000501c2f7a3$1f8d9ea0$07d2fc3e@ian> <003101c2f7b3$1954f500$cbe8fc3e@l8p8y6> <001a01c2f7c3$800834a0$92e086d4@erica> <5.1.0.14.0.20030401151940.02e6c578@u0019445.kuleuven.be> Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 09:13:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: Re: Loading coils Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-6.6 required=5.0tests=REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false >The above info is old hat for those in the know, it would appear some have >led sheltered lives in the wireless world. We're not sheltered, just our coils. John Andrews From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4722 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 14:03:18 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 14:03:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 24897 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 14:03:17 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 14:03:17 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190MLT-00076G-LF for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 15:02:35 +0100 Received: from [195.92.195.173] (helo=cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190MLO-00075z-BQ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 15:02:30 +0100 Received: from modem-2287.tiger.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.216.239] helo=shack) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190MLM-00089D-Se for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 15:02:29 +0100 From: "Simon Lewis" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 15:02:26 +0100 Message-ID: <000d01c2f857$53bd18e0$f38c4c51@shack> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <000801c2f84d$2934eda0$73d1fc3e@ian> Subject: LF: RE: 73KHz Tuesday. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-3.3 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TOversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Latest from Cornwall! Derek and Jim have major probs with noise at the moment. They say its being generated within the museum and probably won't be cured until lock up time at 1700 local. They are running a rx loop 100m away from the building to try and improve reception. GM0MRF is radiating test sigs for them on 71.905 - hope to work them after 1700! Furthest distance so far GM0MRF - G3LDO at 580km! Hrd and worked G3GRO last night on 136K with good sigs on a 90% sea path from Ayrshire to Cornwall so hoping that 73K will still turn out OK - G3GRO being received FB O's all the way! Regards Simon GM4PLM / David G(M)0MRF From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16530 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 13:50:15 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 13:50:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 25434 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 13:50:14 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 13:50:14 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190M8f-0006wA-OT for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 14:49:21 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.48] (helo=mta8-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190M8a-0006w1-N4 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 14:49:16 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.209.115]) by mta8-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030401134915.BPIK22832.mta8-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 14:49:15 +0100 Message-ID: <000801c2f84d$2934eda0$73d1fc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 13:48:55 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 73KHz Tuesday. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Congratulations to Dave and Laurie on extending the record. (I was watching) Have seen, and in most cases heard, the following since 0830z today on 73Khz. GM0MRF; 'O' on QRSS3, and 449 G3XDV; 'O' on QRSS10 and occasionallyaudible G3GRO; 'O' on QRSS3 and called repeatedly without success up till 1245z. G3AQC; 'O++' on DFCW and QRSS, and 549. G3YXM Nothing seen of John WKL Several other traces not really identifiable, and now having heavy QRN from torrential showers. MRF still chirping away valiantly and what looks like "....O.. K." has just appeared out of the murk on Dereks frequency, followed by "..CQ.." Will keep trying. 73 Ian MI0AYZ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31140 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 13:41:39 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 13:41:39 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: (qmail 24044 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 13:41:36 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 13:41:36 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190Lvy-0006nk-76 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 14:36:14 +0100 Received: from [134.58.240.42] (helo=rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190Lvm-0006nb-N5 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 14:36:02 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 385CB1D72A7 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 15:35:32 +0200 (CEST) Received: from antonius.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (antonius.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.240.73]) by rusty.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB3901D729F for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 15:35:31 +0200 (CEST) Received: from dell-rik.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (pc-10-33-165-177.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [10.33.165.177]) by antonius.kulnet.kuleuven.ac.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99F8F4C0D0 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 15:35:31 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030401151940.02e6c578@u0019445.kuleuven.be> X-Sender: u0019445@u0019445.kuleuven.be X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 01 Apr 2003 15:36:27 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" In-reply-to: <000f01c2f844$e1abea40$d3e8fc3e@l8p8y6> References: <000501c2f7a3$1f8d9ea0$07d2fc3e@ian> <003101c2f7b3$1954f500$cbe8fc3e@l8p8y6> <001a01c2f7c3$800834a0$92e086d4@erica> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Virus-Scanned: by KULeuven Antivirus Cluster Subject: Re: LF: Re: Loading coils Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.9 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,REFERENCES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false At 12:49 1/04/2003 +0100, G3KEV wrote: >Its a question of requirements. > >1. These Decca coils were used only on TX and 10/15 db loss was acceptable >by putting these coils in a metal cage for environmental reasons. 10 to 15dB coil loss means 90% to 97% of all power lost (= transformed to heat) in the coil. I wonder why the Decca guys went through all the trouble to built large antennas with an acceptable efficiency and then decided to use 90 to 97% of the power just to heat the loadingcoil ? This apart from the fact that dissipating more than 90% of the Decca power in a coil would probably melt it. >2. Heated coils generate noise, in fact the coils should be kept cold, but >again in a TX only mode it does not matter. I doubt that the few nV noise generated by a warm coil (or resistor) are significant. Atmospheric and manmade noise will be many 10dB's stronger. >The above info is old hat for those in the know, it would appear some have >led sheltered lives in the wireless world. Aha ... that might be my problem ! 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23964 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 12:51:55 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 12:51:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 5006 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 12:51:57 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 12:51:57 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190LE7-0006IN-HC for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 13:50:55 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190LE1-0006Hn-VE for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 13:50:50 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.232.211]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030401125048.QUCM6822.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 13:50:48 +0100 Message-ID: <000e01c2f844$dd62cee0$d3e8fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <002b01c2f824$ecb39b60$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 12:34:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: RE: GAIN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.5 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Dennison" To: Sent: Tuesday, April 01, 2003 9:01 AM Subject: LF: Re: RE: GAIN > > Heck Bill even made a loop that was > > 25 feet by 25 feet and it still made it several hundred miles on less than > a > > watt. Series resonate it and run the right ferrite cored transformer. No > > exceptions. > > Mike>WE0H > > I have seen people use 'series' and 'parallel' resonating when talking about > loops, but what is the difference - surely if it is a continuous loop they > are both the same? Can someone clarify, please. I use parallel resonance techniques ie the capicators to resonate the loop are parallel across the loop terminals(feed point). Series resonance has the capacitors in series with one leg of the loop. That is basically the procedure. Matching the resonated loop to 50 ohms coax requires a matching transformer. There are other configurations like feeding the loop into a RF preamp etc. I thought everyone knew the basics of series and parallel resonating loop techniques. Under some circumstances one method is to be preferred over the other but especially for receiving only, as long as the loop is resonated at the frequency of interest either works equally well. I have tried both on my 90 metre loop. I still prefer the vertical approach on LF and not loops for transmitting. G3KEV > > Mike, G3XDV > http://www.lf.thersgb.net > ==================== > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26388 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 12:51:55 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 12:51:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 21069 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 12:51:55 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 12:51:54 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190LEI-0006Im-W0 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 13:51:06 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.41] (helo=mta1-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190LE9-0006IR-E2 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 13:50:57 +0100 Received: from l8p8y6 ([62.252.232.211]) by mta1-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030401125056.QUEC6822.mta1-svc.business.ntl.com@l8p8y6> for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 13:50:56 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c2f844$e1abea40$d3e8fc3e@l8p8y6> From: "hamilton mal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000501c2f7a3$1f8d9ea0$07d2fc3e@ian> <003101c2f7b3$1954f500$cbe8fc3e@l8p8y6> <001a01c2f7c3$800834a0$92e086d4@erica> Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 12:49:48 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Loading coils Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-13.5 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ----- Original Message ----- From: "g3ldo" To: Sent: Monday, March 31, 2003 9:17 PM Subject: LF: Loading coils > > > NEVER put your loading coil in a metal box, it totally destroys the > > efficiency. Consider it as part of the antenna from the radiation point of > > view. You have never seen a loading coil on a Mobile encased in a metal > CAN, > > the coil contributes to the over all efficiency ie coil plus whip. > > I have seen reference to encasing the loading coil here on this reflector > > that is why those signals are poor. > > My coil sits outside exposed to the elements and does not seem to be > > effected by changing wx, neither does the amps vary whether it be dry or > > wet. Recent info on here suggests heating the loading coil to increase the > > amps consumed, if this is the case the coil wire, insulation etc is very > > suspect. > > I change my antenna wire and rewind a new coil at least once a year. I > also > > check the insulated radials and change if necessary. > > Try a turkey next Xmas without the FOIL, Foil is nether good for antenna > > coils or Turkeys > > 73 de Mal/G3KEV > > The loading coil complex used by the Decca stations were located in a small > concrete building. In the early days I understand that there were problems > until the whole building was lined with copper - in other words a screened > box. > This screened box was also electrically heated. > > It is obvious that these Decca design engineers didn't know what they were > talking about. Its a question of requirements. 1. These Decca coils were used only on TX and 10/15 db loss was acceptable by putting these coils in a metal cage for environmental reasons. 2. Heated coils generate noise, in fact the coils should be kept cold, but again in a TX only mode it does not matter. Because the LF radio amateur also requires the antenna and associated coils for receiving , heating the coils produces unnecessary noise and on Transmit one cannot afford 10/15 db loss of radiated power. For those using RF preamps try running them in a cold environment, in a cold box at 0C and get a superior signal over noise at the RX front end. The above info is old hat for those in the know, it would appear some have led sheltered lives in the wireless world. G3KEV > > Regards, > Peter, G3LDO > > e-mail > > Web > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27518 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 12:36:40 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 12:36:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 25885 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 12:36:39 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 12:36:39 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190Kvo-00061o-71 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 13:32:00 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.42] (helo=mta02-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190Kva-00061f-TP for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 13:31:47 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030401123146.XMLF9882.mta02-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 13:31:46 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c2f84a$e8b77240$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <002b01c2f824$ecb39b60$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> <002a01c2f83d$c99e8d60$0500a8c0@charter.net> Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 13:33:32 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: RE: GAIN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-10.4 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,QUOTE_TWICE_1,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > > I have seen people use 'series' and 'parallel' resonating when talking > about > > loops, but what is the difference - surely if it is a continuous loop they > > are both the same? Can someone clarify, please. > The difference is in the coupling method. The "series" version uses a > step-down transformer between the transmission line and the loop, with the > low-impedance secondary wired in series with the loop and tuning capacitor. > The "parallel" version uses a step-up transformer, with the high-impedance > secondary placed across the tuning capacitor. > The performance of the antenna should be the same in either case. > John Andrews, W1TAG Ah. So it really refers to parallel or series feeding. What about using the capacitor potential divider method, or the coupling various coupling loop methods? Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18204 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 12:08:52 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 12:08:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 19719 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 12:08:54 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 12:08:54 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190KYQ-0005lh-Om for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 13:07:50 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.176] (helo=protactinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190KYA-0005lT-JF for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 13:07:34 +0100 Received: from host213-122-51-166.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([213.122.51.166] helo=Main) by protactinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 190KY8-00021k-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 13:07:32 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c2f847$2f8c8560$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: "LF-Group" Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 13:05:39 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Tues 73kHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi all, the band looked good at 0845z and there was a weak QRSS from Mike and a good strong signal from Dave G3YXM. Unfortunately after about 15 mins the band was rendered unusable for the next 2 hours by a drifting FMing TV PSU. Through the noise around 1130z QRSS3 copy of a better strength signal from Mike that seen earlier, Dave GM0MRF working Laurie. It was difficult to judge, but I think that the DFCW signal from Laurie had some keying problems, maybe noise on the shift keying line. The trace was not as crisp as normal, and seemed to deteriorate as the first call to Dave 'MRF progressed. Another weaker signal was seen at "T" that would have been normally fully readable without the local QRM. Maybe this was John?? or perhaps Ian. I think it was slightly HF of where Mike was calling Derek. Cheers de Alan G3NYK JO02PB alan.melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13792 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 12:02:10 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 12:02:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 13715 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 12:02:12 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 12:02:12 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190KQ3-0005cD-57 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 12:59:11 +0100 Received: from [209.225.8.38] (helo=remt28.cluster1.charter.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190KPu-0005c0-UD for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 12:59:03 +0100 Received: from [66.189.48.230] (HELO johncellarnew) by remt28.cluster1.charter.net (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.5.9b) with SMTP id 3194876 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 06:58:30 -0500 Message-ID: <002a01c2f83d$c99e8d60$0500a8c0@charter.net> From: "John Andrews" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <002b01c2f824$ecb39b60$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 11:59:37 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Re: RE: GAIN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Mike, > I have seen people use 'series' and 'parallel' resonating when talking about > loops, but what is the difference - surely if it is a continuous loop they > are both the same? Can someone clarify, please. The difference is in the coupling method. The "series" version uses a step-down transformer between the transmission line and the loop, with the low-impedance secondary wired in series with the loop and tuning capacitor. The "parallel" version uses a step-up transformer, with the high-impedance secondary placed across the tuning capacitor. The performance of the antenna should be the same in either case. John Andrews, W1TAG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11859 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 11:37:44 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 11:37:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 16126 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 11:37:46 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 11:37:46 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190K4H-0005QA-8Z for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 12:36:41 +0100 Received: from [213.4.129.150] (helo=telesmtp2.mail.isp) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190K47-0005Q1-Nd for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 12:36:31 +0100 Received: from BI57429bankinter ([213.99.200.10]) by telesmtp2.mail.isp (terra.es) with ESMTP id HCNXKT01.OFA for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 13:36:29 +0200 Message-ID: <002001c2f842$d7f9d680$0ac863d5@BI57429bankinter> From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9_Manuel?= To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 13:34:04 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 73 KHz report Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0tests=HTML_50_60,HTML_MESSAGE,UPPERCASE_25_50version=2.51 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi all:
 
I´ve just copied QSO between G3GRO and G3AQC on 71.950 KHz, "O" QRSS3 nice signals from GRO and "M" DFCW signals from AQC.
 
73 de José, EA1PX - loc IN53TI
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10088 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 11:12:20 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 11:12:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 26699 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 11:12:19 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 11:12:19 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190Jeh-00059q-TH for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 12:10:15 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.46] (helo=mta06-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190JeQ-00059c-Tq for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 12:09:59 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030401110957.BNMS20605.mta06-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 12:09:57 +0100 Message-ID: <002e01c2f83f$6840cae0$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 12:11:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 73kHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Lots of 73kHz activity today: My second attempt at QSO with GM0MRF failed as they still have local QRM. Was being heard by MI0AYZ at similar distance (475km) so not my end. Had normal CW QSO with G3YXM. Also worked G3WKL - a comparative newcomer to transmitting on 73kHz - exchanging 'O' reports on QRSS3. Good signal from G3GRO in Cornwall, audible at about S4, but they are giving G3AQC an 'M' report so little chance of them seeing my signals. Looks like they also have a noise problem. I know from my own experience in GW, it is much more difficult to set up an ad hoc station on 73kHz than on 136kHz, so I can sympathise with their problems. Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 828 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 09:28:35 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 09:28:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 20475 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 09:28:27 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 09:28:26 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190I3Z-0004Gw-0K for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 10:27:49 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.147] (helo=einsteinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190I3U-0004Gn-8H for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 10:27:44 +0100 Received: from host213-122-134-209.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([213.122.134.209] helo=acer5gi5q0ubzj) by einsteinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 190I3T-0005bY-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 10:27:43 +0100 From: "John W Gould" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 10:27:44 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <000801c2f82e$5c3115e0$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> Subject: LF: RE: Re: 73KHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-15.3 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false QRX for 30mins to make interface for QRSS keyer - should be back on by 11am John -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Mike Dennison Sent: 01 April 2003 10:09 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: 73KHz > At last the high-level QRN has stopped. Transmitting around 72.0 from house > over 100m coax to aerial loading coil by which time most of the power seems > to have gone! Receiving G3XDV QRSS... and one or two other "tuning" sigs > > 73 John, G3WKL John, I shall be looking for you today. Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11887 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 09:08:54 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 09:08:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 27156 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 09:08:45 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 09:08:45 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190Hk7-0003zj-HT for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 10:07:43 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.41] (helo=mta01-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190Hjz-0003zW-KK for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 10:07:35 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030401090734.KPKH6166.mta01-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 10:07:34 +0100 Message-ID: <000801c2f82e$5c3115e0$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 10:09:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: 73KHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > At last the high-level QRN has stopped. Transmitting around 72.0 from house > over 100m coax to aerial loading coil by which time most of the power seems > to have gone! Receiving G3XDV QRSS... and one or two other "tuning" sigs > > 73 John, G3WKL John, I shall be looking for you today. Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31881 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 09:00:19 -0000 Received: from murphys.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.225) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 09:00:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 14851 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 09:00:10 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 09:00:10 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190Hc3-0003u7-SI for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 09:59:23 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.147] (helo=einsteinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190Hbx-0003ty-Ee for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 09:59:17 +0100 Received: from host213-122-134-209.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([213.122.134.209] helo=acer5gi5q0ubzj) by einsteinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 190Hbv-0000i6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 09:59:16 +0100 From: "John W Gould" To: "Rsgb_Lf_Group@Blacksheep.Org" Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 09:59:17 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Subject: LF: 73KHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-5.7 required=5.0tests=MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGEversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false At last the high-level QRN has stopped. Transmitting around 72.0 from house over 100m coax to aerial loading coil by which time most of the power seems to have gone! Receiving G3XDV QRSS... and one or two other "tuning" sigs 73 John, G3WKL From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24128 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 08:37:12 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 08:37:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 14926 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 08:37:11 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 08:37:11 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190HFP-0003do-VB for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 09:35:59 +0100 Received: from [62.253.164.44] (helo=mta4-svc.business.ntl.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190HFK-0003df-Oz for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 09:35:54 +0100 Received: from ian ([62.252.205.42]) by mta4-svc.business.ntl.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030401083553.OFZY11888.mta4-svc.business.ntl.com@ian> for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 09:35:53 +0100 Message-ID: <000501c2f821$5f6ec7a0$2acdfc3e@ian> From: "Ian Kyle" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 08:35:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 73KHz Tues AM Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false The band seems nice and quiet this morning and there is still about 1.3A going up the pipe - who's for a sked? Ian MI0AYZ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14783 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 08:00:58 -0000 Received: from marstons.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.223) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 08:00:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 8108 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 08:00:58 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by marstons.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 08:00:58 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190Ggd-0003Jf-Bu for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 09:00:03 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.42] (helo=mta02-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190GgV-0003JJ-KN for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 08:59:55 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030401075954.HNSN9882.mta02-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 08:59:54 +0100 Message-ID: <002b01c2f824$ecb39b60$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 09:01:38 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: RE: GAIN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.8 required=5.0tests=QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false > Heck Bill even made a loop that was > 25 feet by 25 feet and it still made it several hundred miles on less than a > watt. Series resonate it and run the right ferrite cored transformer. No > exceptions. > Mike>WE0H I have seen people use 'series' and 'parallel' resonating when talking about loops, but what is the difference - surely if it is a continuous loop they are both the same? Can someone clarify, please. Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26787 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 07:55:53 -0000 Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 07:55:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 24447 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 07:55:53 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 07:55:53 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190GbX-0003Eu-2Q for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 08:54:47 +0100 Received: from [62.253.162.42] (helo=mta02-svc.ntlworld.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190GbK-0003El-SI for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 08:54:35 +0100 Received: from mike1 ([80.4.107.45]) by mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20030401075434.HFKN9882.mta02-svc.ntlworld.com@mike1> for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 08:54:34 +0100 Message-ID: <002201c2f824$2dd77040$2602a8c0@WorkGroup> From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <004c01c2f7c4$5320bba0$42d3fc3e@ian> Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2003 08:56:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: Frustrations! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-22.8 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false MI0AYZ wrote: > When the increased antenna current was observed the coil was sitting > directly on a concrete path and in the same position relative to brick and > concrete block walls as when finalised, and with the roughcut panels in > their planned positions as already described. The only change was to raise > it 5" off the deck so that I could reach the tapping points and the vario. Were you putting the extra current directly into the ground from the coil? Mike, G3XDV http://www.lf.thersgb.net ==================== From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19831 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 07:05:27 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 07:05:27 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 8221 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 07:05:27 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 07:05:27 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190Fko-0002rX-IW for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 08:00:18 +0100 Received: from [138.32.33.140] (helo=mailman2.ppco.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190Fkj-0002rO-In for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 08:00:13 +0100 Received: from bvlw2k132.ppco.com (trend2.ppco.com [138.32.31.132]) by mailman2.ppco.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with SMTP id h3170BCX025620 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 01:00:12 -0600 Received: from 138.32.31.56 by bvlw2k132.ppco.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Tue, 01 Apr 2003 01:00:10 -0600 Received: from bvlnotes07.ppco.com (bvlnotes07.ppco.com [138.32.54.38]) by mail1.ppco.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h31708B25756 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 01:00:09 -0600 (CST) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.8 June 18, 2001 Message-ID: From: "Laurence J Howell" Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 22:00:07 -0900 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BVLNOTES07/CIT/Phillips Petroleum/us(Release 5.0.7 |March 21, 2001) at 04/01/2003 01:00:09 AM MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: LF: TS870 .v. 850 Round 1 - Day 1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0tests=noneversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false For those looking at the web site I apologize for all the squiggles at 0630Z 1 April - I was doing a rough "lets just see what this Ebay 850 can do in comparison with my "baby". Well....if its true lets delve into the noise and see what signals I can see, the 850 has it (tara~!) The 850 without the high stab osc is taking about 1 hour to settle down and I havent "zero'd" Argo in yet but if Loran lines are a subjective signal s/n test then what is just "seeable" as a weak Loran line is pretty bright with the 850 Yep I checked it is the same Loran line!). Now I know it takes only a few dBs to go from a dull to bright trace but the important thing is that what fades in and out on the 870 is always there on the 850 - this would confirm my/Albertos and half the worlds thoughts on the 850 - its a pretty decent LF receiver. Also Ive got the AGC off, AIP off and NB1 on and I cant hear Loran....static crashes however are audible which they aren't on the 870 (870's NB may be better at this sort of thing as the 850 isn't renowned for its NB)... On the lower freqs around 70K I need the AIP in otherwise I get some left wing liberal talking about the war from my 4 local MF 100Kw Medium wave stations just a couple miles up the road. Loran is audible down here. Sensitivity is much better down here too and JJY on 40KHz is a good sig. Its like getting an old friend back - I had to sell my 850 way back and mourned the day....Im smiling again. It will be the receiver of choice once Ive figured how to X patch everything. With all this SFU's and 2MEV's, DCF39 has dissapeared....Nice Viz Aurora tonight....Laurence KL1X Anchorage -5C www.kl1x.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26587 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 04:49:07 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from netmail02.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.221) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 04:49:07 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 12878 invoked by uid 10001); 1 Apr 2003 04:49:06 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail02.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 04:49:06 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190Dgy-00028V-OU for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 05:48:12 +0100 Received: from [195.22.0.29] (helo=jubilee.esoterica.pt) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190Dgr-00028M-II for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 05:48:05 +0100 Received: from slave-5 (por243.esoterica.pt [195.22.5.243]) by jubilee.esoterica.pt (8.12.3/8.11.6) with SMTP id h314YnG5026635 for ; Tue, 1 Apr 2003 05:34:50 +0100 Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20030401044655.007f7b20@pop.vianw.pt> X-Sender: nx4ywv@pop.vianw.pt X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 01 Apr 2003 04:46:55 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Brian Rogerson" In-reply-to: <001a01c2f7c3$800834a0$92e086d4@erica> References: <000501c2f7a3$1f8d9ea0$07d2fc3e@ian> <003101c2f7b3$1954f500$cbe8fc3e@l8p8y6> MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: LF: Loading coils and Decca 5501 screening Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-26.1 required=5.0tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi all Only slightly off topic, but about two years ago now someone described completing the screening on a Decca 5501. I have lost the posting but I seem to remember that something "got hot". Does anyone have the posting still? Brian CT1DRP At 21:17 31/03/2003 +0100, you wrote: > >> NEVER put your loading coil in a metal box, it totally destroys the >> efficiency. Consider it as part of the antenna from the radiation point of >> view. You have never seen a loading coil on a Mobile encased in a metal >CAN, >> the coil contributes to the over all efficiency ie coil plus whip. >> I have seen reference to encasing the loading coil here on this reflector >> that is why those signals are poor. >> My coil sits outside exposed to the elements and does not seem to be >> effected by changing wx, neither does the amps vary whether it be dry or >> wet. Recent info on here suggests heating the loading coil to increase the >> amps consumed, if this is the case the coil wire, insulation etc is very >> suspect. >> I change my antenna wire and rewind a new coil at least once a year. I >also >> check the insulated radials and change if necessary. >> Try a turkey next Xmas without the FOIL, Foil is nether good for antenna >> coils or Turkeys >> 73 de Mal/G3KEV > >The loading coil complex used by the Decca stations were located in a small >concrete building. In the early days I understand that there were problems >until the whole building was lined with copper - in other words a screened >box. >This screened box was also electrically heated. > >It is obvious that these Decca design engineers didn't know what they were >talking about. > >Regards, >Peter, G3LDO > >e-mail > >Web > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23901 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 04:02:24 -0000 Received: from warrior.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.227) by mailstore with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 04:02:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 25500 invoked from network); 1 Apr 2003 04:02:27 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by warrior.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 1 Apr 2003 04:02:26 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 190CsF-0001rQ-8L for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 04:55:47 +0100 Received: from [63.171.43.2] (helo=ns2.genesis-technology.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 190CsA-0001rH-FZ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 04:55:42 +0100 Received: from we0h ([65.165.20.192]) by ns2.genesis-technology.com (8.10.2/8.10.2) with SMTP id h313tXH05027; Mon, 31 Mar 2003 21:55:34 -0600 From: "WE0H" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: "Bill Ashlock @ Hotmail" Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 21:56:03 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: Importance: Normal Subject: LF: RE: GAIN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-15.3 required=5.0tests=IN_REP_TO,MSGID_GOOD_EXCHANGE,ORIGINAL_MESSAGE, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXTversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false I got a measly 1304 miles with my 1w beacon and a North/South pointing loop this winter. The receiving station was Southwest of me to boot. I followed Bill's advice and it works. You have to follow his advice to the exact word or forget it as it will work like crap. Heck Bill even made a loop that was 25 feet by 25 feet and it still made it several hundred miles on less than a watt. Series resonate it and run the right ferrite cored transformer. No exceptions. Imagine if Bill was running 1000w or more, he would have one heck of a signal. Yea high current, but he runs copper water pipe for conductors. High current can be dealt with just like tree burning high voltages can so that isn't an excuse for not using a loop if you live around many trees. Mike>WE0H http://www.we0h.us/lf -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Ashlock,William Sent: Monday, March 31, 2003 1:11 PM To: 'rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org' Subject: LF: RE: GAIN Hi Ole Buddy! > I measured the gain today between my 90 metre perimiter vertical loop resonated on 137 khz and > my vertical system. The vertical has a 20 db gain over the loop measuring the noise floor. Using the Decca RF pre amp with > the loop gets close to the vertical performance but with the disadvantage of being only bi-directional. Measuring a signal >above the NF indicates the same 20 db gain by the vertical. The band is quiet with no environmental or locally generated >noise problems.The vertical is way ahead of the loop at this QTH. The loop is not worth considering as a TX > antenna given the above results. This recent test confirms previous observations. I see your still having problems with understanding how to connect up to that loop - transformer ratios and all. Don't give up; you'll figure it out one of these days. Bill Ashlock PS: I have to admit my TX loop didn't set the record distance over here this season........... but my 1785 miles came within 35 miles of it ! From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 32273 invoked from network); 31 Mar 2003 23:03:01 -0000 Received: from netmail01.services.quay.plus.net (212.159.14.219) by mailstore with SMTP; 31 Mar 2003 23:03:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 25430 invoked by uid 10001); 31 Mar 2003 23:03:01 -0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com (193.82.116.70) by netmail01.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 31 Mar 2003 23:03:01 -0000 X-SQ: A Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1908GM-0000HE-Bd for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 00:00:22 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.111] (helo=gadolinium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1908GH-0000H5-OY for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 00:00:17 +0100 Received: from host213-122-125-60.in-addr.btopenworld.com ([213.122.125.60] helo=Main) by gadolinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #23) id 1908GG-0001cF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Apr 2003 00:00:17 +0100 Message-ID: <001501c2f7d9$4200ae60$6507a8c0@Main> From: "Alan Melia" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <01C2F795.EDC2A760.g4jnt@thersgb.net> <3E885164.2020700@usa.net> <001301c2f7ba$3e2e61c0$6507a8c0@Main> <3E88B868.6060100@usa.net> Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 23:33:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: RE: LF and apple juice Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-12.9 required=5.0tests=ORIGINAL_MESSAGE,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCESversion=2.51 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.51 (1.174.2.5-2003-03-20-exp) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Alberto, yes I couldn't resist that, dropping aitches is a function of Northern dialect in the UK and is regarded as a cardinal sin by those living south of Watford, who pronounce their "u"s like "a"s.....not quite the same as typos though. Well the RF may kill the bateria but the worms like it. Cheers de Alan G3NYK ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alberto di Bene" To: Sent: 31 March 2003 22:51 Subject: LF: RE: LF and apple juice > Alan Melia wrote: > > >I would be very annoyed if my microwave oven started eating my dinner for > >me....like to dog....it would have to go !! > > > >Cheers de Alan G3NYK > > > > > Hi Alan, > don't be so fussy for an omitted letter "h" ... after all English > isn't my first language :-) > > 73 Alberto I2PHD > > > > >