From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25634 invoked from network); 30 Apr 2000 22:13:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Apr 2000 22:13:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12m1qR-0003VY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:05:43 +0100 Received: from smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.156]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12m1qQ-0003VS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:05:42 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-118-182.bellatlantic.net [151.200.118.182]) by smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA20954; Sun, 30 Apr 2000 18:05:11 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <390CAEA2.AD4EA8C0@bellatlantic.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 18:07:30 -0400 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: "Frank Gentges" , "John Davis" Subject: Re: LF: 137 KHz Dixon, CA off! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Cliff et all, At the present time, your best chance is to listen to our transmission on 136.745. This is a 175 watt transmitter connected to a fairly long antenna. Its transmissions have been received in London (Canada, not UK ...) and Ohio This beacon transmitter continually transmits QRS morse with a 4 second dot length You will need a program such as Spectran to see it. 73 and good luck Andre' N4ICK Clifford Buttschardt wrote: > Bill Lake, WB6RIJ and I have checked the Naval station near Sacramento, CA > and found it to be off the air for the present moment. We both thought > there must be some opportunity for listening tests from the West coast not > available normally. What experimental signals are on the air from the > East coast now? We must move fast as Dixon can resume operation at any > moment of course! Cliff K7RR From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 674 invoked from network); 1 May 2000 01:41:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 May 2000 01:41:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12m551-000595-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 02:32:59 +0100 Received: from mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12m550-00058x-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 02:32:58 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [202.27.181.68] by mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <20000501013207.BDXJ10069991.mta3-rme@[202.27.181.68]> for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 13:32:07 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <390CDDE5.BEB@xtra.co.nz> Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 13:29:09 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Crossing the Pacific References: <390C9FEB.699@xtra.co.nz> <390C9B50.6BD8E42@slonet.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Cliff Buttschardt wrote: > > Bob. I am sure that we could not get transmitting privileges on short > notice, but we can listen while the West coast transmitter is down. > Cliff K7RR Cliff, OK. I will see what we can set up in the way of skeds at times of likely good propagation. I (or other ZLs) will email you direct to make arrangements. Are there any other stateside west coast amateurs set up for weak signal LF reception? Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8569 invoked from network); 1 May 2000 04:13:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 May 2000 04:13:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12m7Uy-0006Kv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 05:07:56 +0100 Received: from mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12m7Uw-0006Kq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 05:07:55 +0100 Received: from locxvcym ([210.54.197.101]) by mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <20000501040659.DADZ7553106.mta2-rme@locxvcym> for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 16:06:59 +1200 From: "ComPact" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Crossing the Pacific Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 16:05:56 +1200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <20000501040659.DADZ7553106.mta2-rme@locxvcym> Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The naval station on 147 kHz in Hawaii is also off the air I think. Neither station has been heard down here for some weeks. Is there much QRM in West coast USA around 160 - 190 kHz ? Does it make any difference if Dixon is on or not? Mike ZL4OL From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22216 invoked from network); 1 May 2000 07:12:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 May 2000 07:12:16 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mABv-0007aP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 08:00:27 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail.sci.fi ([195.74.0.53] helo=pefletti.saunalahti.fi ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mABu-0007aK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 08:00:26 +0100 Received: from default (MDV.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.41.5]) by pefletti.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id KAA07162 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 10:00:06 +0300 (EET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000501100152.00827cb0@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: oh2lx@pop.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 10:01:52 +0300 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: Signal Strength Measurements by OH2LX 01 May 2000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Note on 73.3 kHz: Until Tuesday 18Apr evening there was nothing around 73.3. On the 18th there was a carrier between 73.2-73.3 which I reported WITHOUT knowing about its origin... Starting Thursday on the 27th there was FSK transmission going on but ALSO the carrier which first appeared on the 18th... Wonder if anyone else can hear "extra" carriers. I do have qrm problems on frequencies around 70..74 kHz. Signal strength measurements of various LF stations by OH2LX: ------------------------------------------------------------------ Day ------------------ 24Apr 25Apr 26Apr 27Apr 28Apr 29Apr 30Apr MON TUE WED THU FRI SAT SUN Time, UTC ------------ 2030- 2130- 2010- 2100- 2200- 2220- 2120- ------------------------------------------------------------------ kHz Stn d,km AZI Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW ------------------------------------------------------------------ 73.3 Rugby, 1825, 252, (-98)(-100)*(-99) -103 -98 -101 -95 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 75.0 HBG, 1992, 226, -101 -103 -103 -102 -98 -105 -98 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 77.5 DCF77, 1543, 228, -89 -89 -87 -89 -89 -89 -85 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 128.2 9f/7D, 2060, 267, -125 -124 -121 -120 -120 -125 -111 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 128.9 DCF49, 1544, 228, -83 -85 -81 -85 -81 -82 -80 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 138.8 DBF39, 1221, 226, -83 -80 -80 -79 -81 -82 -75 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 135.8 SXV, 2490, 182, -105 -105 -105 -102 -101 -102 -110 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 137.0 CFH, 5750, 295, Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil ------------------------------------------------------------------ * With brackets: Carrier only heard (can not identify...) ------------------------------------------------------------------ 27Apr 2035: SM6PXJ -117 28Apr 2155: OH1TN -116; 2158:-115; 2205:-114; 2210:-111 28Apr 2219: SM6PXJ -117 29Apr 1949: OH1TN -117; 2008:-118; 2010:-115; 2017:-114 29Apr 1948: OK1FIG -125 29Apr 2059: SM6PXJ -114; 2103:-115 29Apr 2120: OH1BS -122 30Apr 2134: SM6PXJ -113 ------------------------------------------------------------------ (R&S ESH2/---- 10m coax----/1:10/-----15m wire-----): Noise level with antenna: with 200Hz IF BandWidth: -26..-21 dB(uV), -133..-128dBmW (varies with qrm etc) ------------------------------------------------------------------ End of message of 1st May 2000, 0700 UTC, from OH2LX ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29330 invoked from network); 1 May 2000 09:53:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 May 2000 09:53:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mCo1-0000G2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 10:47:57 +0100 Received: from smtp13.bellglobal.com ([204.101.251.52]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mCnx-0000Fx-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 10:47:53 +0100 Received: from server1 (ppp150.on.bellglobal.com [206.172.245.150]) by smtp13.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id FAA18965 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 05:51:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <004f01bfb351$c468ab20$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: 137 KHz Dixon, CA off! Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 05:43:50 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Two issues for your consideration. First, CFH, Halifax is also on 137 kHz and you might want to see if you can copy this station on the West Coast. They are quite loud on the east coast. Second, there is a RTTY signal on 135.95, 50 Hz FSK, which seems to come from the West Coast according to the times it is heard here - is it also off the air? This station has been given to me as NPG from the West Coast. Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22250 invoked from network); 1 May 2000 15:45:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 May 2000 15:45:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mIF3-0002tS-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 16:36:13 +0100 Received: from mta03.talk21.com ([62.172.192.172] helo=t21mta03-app.talk21.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mIF1-0002tN-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 16:36:11 +0100 Received: from dave ([62.7.160.35]) by t21mta03-app.talk21.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000501153608.YPRJ25753.t21mta03-app.talk21.com@dave> for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 16:36:08 +0100 Message-ID: <000401bfb382$dda8a280$23a0073e@dave> From: "Dave Sergeant" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3.0.6.32.20000501100152.00827cb0@pop.saunalahti.fi> Subject: LF: Re: Signal Strength Measurements by OH2LX 01 May 2000 Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 16:34:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >From Dave G3YMC OH2LX in his signal measurements lists NIL copy on CFH, but at times between 2000 and 2230z. With summer approaching of course this is to be expected. I frequently listen around 0530z when CFH is sometimes there at 579 like this morning, other times very weak. It might be worthwhile monitoring this station during the early hours up to this time, as there does seem significant variation from day to day. Note that CFH was consistently 59+10dB at dawn here during the winter season. The chance of a transatlantic (or transpacific) amateur QSO during this season would therefore appear very low, especially with the noticeable increase in static in recent days. Roll on November! Cheers Dave dsergeant@iee.org http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sergeantd From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20236 invoked from network); 1 May 2000 19:16:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 May 2000 19:16:01 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mLYD-0004ag-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 20:08:13 +0100 Received: from carbon.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.92] helo=carbon) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mLYB-0004aa-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 20:08:12 +0100 Received: from [213.1.84.104] (helo=default) by carbon with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12mLXm-0007ID-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 1 May 2000 20:07:47 +0100 Message-ID: <001901bfb3a0$9caebda0$685401d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: DX Cluster spots for 29/4-1/5 at GB7DXM Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 20:07:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All, No report from me this weekend as I have been attacked by a bug....no problem, the 'processor' wouldn't retain solid data for a couple of days, but liberal quantities of H2O poured into the works seem to have done the trick, just leaving the peripherals a bit shaky now. (N.B. I dont recommend this 'cure' for you 1GHz PIII !!) Wonderful things these 'fault-tolerant self-healing' machines. Marco's QRP beacon was considerably stronger than usual on Sunday night (2400z) was there any interesting solar activity around?? 136.5 DJ9IE 30-Apr-2000 1036Z cq cq 137.3 HB0/DL1SAN 30-Apr-2000 1025Z cq 136.6 DK5PT 30-Apr-2000 1008Z in qso with df0wd 136.9 OK1FIG 29-Apr-2000 1953Z cq cq 137.1 OK1FIG 29-Apr-2000 1234Z clg cq 136.8 PA0BWL 29-Apr-2000 1058Z clg CQ, vy strong 137.3 HB0/DL1SAN 29-Apr-2000 0821Z 73s frm Df0WD tnx 136.5 DL3FDO 29-Apr-2000 0746Z CQing 559 136.9 PA0BWL 24-Apr-2000 1121Z 549 cq 136.8 DF7VX 23-Apr-2000 0856Z 549 G3NYK de GB7DXM 1-May 1839Z > The following spots thanks to Geri from DB0FC, I have not received any from Wolf because I think he has had a busy weekend!! The chronology of the spots below is the reverse of my normal list. The station spotted is in the 2nd column and the 'spotter' call-sign is after the time/date, and followed by comment.. 136.8 DF7VX 0856 23.4 DL1SAN 549 136.6 DJ9IE 1245 23.4 DL4YHF cq 599 in JO42fd 137.0 OK1DTN 1551 23.4 DL3FDO 137.0 OK1DTN 1617 23.4 DK8KW cq cq ... 136.9 PA0BWL 1121 24.4 DL1SAN 549 cq 136.5 G3LDO 1851 28.4 DL3FDO 136.5 SM6PXJ 2240 28.4 DL3FDO 137.1 HB0/DL1SAN 0556 29.4 DL4YHF CQing 529 in JO42FD 136.9 G3LDO 0624 29.4 DF0WD 559 in JO42FD 137.3 G3XTZ 0732 29.4 DF0WD Graham 459 in JO42FD 136.5 DL3FDO 0746 29.4 DF0WD CQing 559 137.3 HB0/DL1SAN 0821 29.4 DL4YHF 73s frm Df0WD tnx 137.1 OK1FIG 1234 29.4 DL4YHF clg cq 136.9 OK1FIG 1953 29.4 DL4YHF cq cq 137.0 OK1FIG 0802 30.4 DJ5BV cq (539) 137.0 GW4ALG 0813 30.4 DL4YHF Steve 559 tnx de DF0WD 136.8 G4GVC 0816 30.4 DL4YHF clg CQ 549 in JO42FD 136.5 DJ9IE 0925 30.4 DL5AKF cq..., 539 136.2 HB0/DL1SAN 0927 30.4 DL1GGT cqing 136.1 TEST 0926 30.4 DK8NG only, pse ignore! 136.1 HABE 0927 30.4 DK8NG mich mal bei bcc eingeloggt und getestet: Da gehts! 137.0 OK1FIG 0932 30.4 DL6SN 136.2 HB0/DL1SAN 0934 30.4 DL6SN Thanks for those Geri Cheers and 73 de Alan G3NYK JO02PB Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29112 invoked from network); 1 May 2000 20:07:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 May 2000 20:07:52 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mMNk-00054Y-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 21:01:28 +0100 Received: from mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mMNi-000510-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 21:01:27 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [202.27.178.75] by mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <20000501200033.IRBD7553106.mta2-rme@[202.27.178.75]> for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 08:00:33 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <390DE1B6.1DEB@xtra.co.nz> Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 07:57:42 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Crossing the Pacific References: <20000501040659.DADZ7553106.mta2-rme@locxvcym> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, A brief message to clear up the matter of carrier frequency of choice for ZL test transmissions for stateside. Amateur access in New Zealand is to the band 165 - 190 kHz. Most of the testing using conventional CW takes place on 181.4 kHz. As antennas are tuned up for 181.4 kHz, then that is the first choice transmit frequency, however we will QSY depending on what comments we receive from Cliff K7RR and his team. We obviously seek a "low QRM" slot for stateside attempted reception. Bruce ZL1WB, who has an effective long wire antenna over a gully, confirms he is available "around the clock" for transmitting on LF. The Wellington Amateur Radio club site at Quartz Hill (call sign ZL6QH), which is a remote site mostly used for HF DX, has recently installed a large inverted L antenna, and it does work very nicely on LF. We can arrange for ZL6QH to also test stateside, but not "around the clock" like ZL1WB offers. We may select a suitable offset frequency for ZL6QH so that test transmissions could take place simultaneously with ZL1WB. I am in private email contact with the K7RR group to make detailed arrangements. Are there any other stateside west coast weak signal LF listeners? 73, Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2462 invoked from network); 1 May 2000 20:24:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 May 2000 20:24:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mMaA-0005A8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 21:14:18 +0100 Received: from postfix3.free.fr ([212.27.32.22] ident=postfix) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mMa9-0005A3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 01 May 2000 21:14:17 +0100 Received: from f5maf (toulouse-2-6-172.dial.proxad.net [213.228.6.172]) by postfix3.free.fr (Postfix) with SMTP id 5591186C67 for ; Mon, 1 May 2000 22:13:56 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <00e401bfb3aa$2102b120$ac06e4d5@f5maf> From: "f5maf" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: 137 KHz in France Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 22:16:16 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hello ir's my first message.
My QTH is Toulouse in southwest France (JN03PP)
I can receive 137 KHz with a 4meters loop.
In June a 12 meters mast with umbrella to transmit.
You can see some project on my www site and some wave file about QSO.
Best 73 Marc F5MAF
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8715 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 06:46:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 06:46:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mWL7-0001XN-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 07:39:25 +0100 Received: from cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.172]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mWL5-0001XI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 07:39:23 +0100 Received: from modem-123.angrenost.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.112.251] helo=lvm) by cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12mWKo-0008PX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 07:39:07 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfb401$3f5ba1c0$fb70883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. LF in France. Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 07:39:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Bonjour Marc.
Welcome to 137.Very nice pictures of your station.Look foreward to working you soon,but there may be some difficulty because of interferance from Loran station at Lessay,quite close bearing to Toulouse.Best wishes 73s Laurie.G3AQC.
 
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8132 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 07:04:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 07:04:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mWZl-0001dT-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 07:54:33 +0100 Received: from mail11.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.23]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mWZi-0001dO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 07:54:30 +0100 Received: from modem-97.anadune.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.106.97] helo=lvm) by mail11.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12mWZR-0007kT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 07:54:14 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfb403$5bfef3c0$616a883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re.IK1ODO Beacon. Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 07:54:17 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Alan,
Sorry to hear about the Bug!
There was a coronal mass ejection(CME) on 30/4/00,but not expected to arrive until 02/03 May? also M-Class flare on 01/05/00.73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9460 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 08:26:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 08:26:09 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mXu1-0002OT-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 09:19:33 +0100 Received: from cyb01.axime.com ([160.92.120.38] helo=cybv01.axime.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mXu0-0002LO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 09:19:32 +0100 Received: from MARC ([213.36.35.81]) by cybv01.axime.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with SMTP id FTXB2X00.74U for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 10:18:33 +0200 Message-ID: <004001bfb40f$36641120$0600a8c0@MARC> From: "mv tsi" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000201bfb401$3f5ba1c0$fb70883e@lvm> Subject: LF: Re: Re. LF in France. Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 10:19:24 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Ok Laurie I am verry happy to discut on the LF group but my English is verry poor!
Yes Loran C is strong  but in West direction (for me).
Best 73
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2000 8:39 AM
Subject: LF: Re. LF in France.

Bonjour Marc.
Welcome to 137.Very nice pictures of your station.Look foreward to working you soon,but there may be some difficulty because of interferance from Loran station at Lessay,quite close bearing to Toulouse.Best wishes 73s Laurie.G3AQC.
 
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12300 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 08:31:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 08:31:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mXzN-0002Pl-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 09:25:05 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mXzD-0002Pe-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 09:24:55 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id JAA20762 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 09:24:41 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk Message-ID: <2000050208250568199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 08:25:05 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: Telsa Coils Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Yesterday, Monday, I operated from GB2CPM, not on LF but at the HF permanent amateur station that forms part of the radio section of the museum. At the Electricity Hall a group of Telso Coil builders had converged for a Telsa coil session. This comprised two groups, an indoor exibition using small coils ranging from 10cm long to 1m long; and the second group with the big coils (up to 2m long) which had to be done outside because of the very high voltages they produced. The indoor goup had the advantage having a large room that could be darkened allowing the spectacular display to bee seen to its best advantage. The room had to be ventilated between sessions to clear out all the ozone! The outdoor group set up a test area in the afternoon, starting by digging a cruciform shaped trench and laying down a lot of copper tubing and soaking it in brine before filling it in. The components of three large coils arrived in special vans and I was able to watch and photograph these coils and the electrical control and power systems being assembled. The length of the main coils of the larger Telsa machines ranged from 1 to 2m with a length/diameter ratio of around 3:1. The inductance of the main coils ranged from 400mH to 1.2H depending on the size of the machine. All coils seemed to be close wound with 1mm enamelled copper wire. The primary coils were made of 10mm copper tubing with clip connections for 'tuning'. This main set of experiments had to be done after the museum had closed to the public and when it was getting dark. The corona discharge from 1meV machine was truely spectacular and made our hair stand on end! I was much taken with the technology of these machines, particularly the care with which the coils had been wound and the construction of high capacity high voltage capacitors. Some members of the group were interested in our activities in a similar technology. If you want to know more about the Telsa Builders activities see -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15646 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 10:03:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 10:03:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mZR7-0003Bs-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 10:57:49 +0100 Received: from ns1.swh.sk ([192.108.125.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mZR3-0003Bm-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 10:57:45 +0100 Received: from hermes.swh.sk (hermes [195.41.64.129]) by ns1.swh.sk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA27666 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 11:57:18 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: High Received: from btss103a.swh.sk (btss103a.swh.sk [195.41.64.27]) by hermes.swh.sk (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id LAA21425 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 11:57:14 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by btss103a.swh.sk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id <2MGT9DHB>; Tue, 2 May 2000 11:57:12 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <29BDD4F529FCD311B631009027357C4E517465@btss103a.swh.sk> From: "Gasparik Richard" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: Visit 9H Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 11:57:11 +0200 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Wil I'll look for you... I'll be on the band from 50m high tower about 1000m asl. See you... 73 de Rich OM2TW > -----Original Message----- > From: Laken, W.H.P.A. van der (Wil) > [SMTP:w.laken@diosynth.oss.akzonobel.nl] > Sent: 26. apríl 2000 9:33 > To: 'rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org' > Subject: LF: Visit 9H > > Hello 9H stations > > I will visit 9H from 3 - 10 May. > If anybody is interested in LF over there I would be glad to have a chat > with him or her. > Reactions please to my e-mail address: PA0BWL@amsat.org or > w.laken@diosynth.nl > > 73 > Wil (PA0BWL) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2058 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 10:04:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 10:04:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mZSX-0003C9-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 10:59:17 +0100 Received: from cyb01.axime.com ([160.92.120.38] helo=cybv01.axime.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mZSV-0003Bz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 10:59:15 +0100 Received: from MARC ([213.36.34.118]) by cybv01.axime.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with SMTP id FTXFPF00.259 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 11:58:27 +0200 Message-ID: <005e01bfb41d$2b4bc360$0600a8c0@MARC> From: "mv tsi" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <2000050208250568199@zetnet.co.uk> Subject: LF: Re: Re: Telsa Coils Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 11:59:53 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Yes it's very interesting. I saw in a tesla site that some people used 4 X 811 valve to amplifer a 130 Khz signal for Tesla coil ! It's a good spark transmitter! Best 73 marc F5MAF f5maf@qsl.net www.qsl.net/f5maf ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Dodd To: Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2000 9:25 AM Subject: LF: Re: Telsa Coils > Yesterday, Monday, I operated from GB2CPM, not on LF but at the HF > permanent amateur station that forms part of the radio section of the museum. > At the Electricity Hall a group of Telso Coil builders had converged > for a Telsa coil session. This comprised two groups, an indoor > exibition using small coils ranging from 10cm long to 1m long; and > the second group with the big coils (up to 2m long) which had to be > done outside because of the very high voltages they produced. > The indoor goup had the advantage having a large room that could be > darkened allowing the spectacular display to bee seen to its best > advantage. The room had to be ventilated between sessions to clear > out all the ozone! > The outdoor group set up a test area in the afternoon, starting by > digging a cruciform shaped trench and laying down a lot of copper > tubing and soaking it in brine before filling it in. The components > of three large coils arrived in special vans and I was able to watch > and photograph these coils and the electrical control and power > systems being assembled. > > The length of the main coils of the larger Telsa machines ranged from > 1 to 2m with a length/diameter ratio of around 3:1. The inductance of > the main coils ranged from 400mH to 1.2H depending on the size of the > machine. All coils seemed to be close wound with 1mm enamelled copper > wire. The primary coils were made of 10mm copper tubing with clip > connections for 'tuning'. > > This main set of experiments had to be done after the museum had > closed to the public and when it was getting dark. The corona > discharge from 1meV machine was truely spectacular and made our hair > stand on end! > > I was much taken with the technology of these machines, particularly > the care with which the coils had been wound and the construction of > high capacity high voltage capacitors. Some members of the group were > interested in our activities in a similar technology. > > If you want to know more about the Telsa Builders activities see > > > -- > Regards, Peter, G3LDO > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24250 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 10:32:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 10:32:49 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mZrl-0003SG-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 11:25:21 +0100 Received: from ns1.swh.sk ([192.108.125.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mZrk-0003SB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 11:25:20 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from hermes.swh.sk (hermes [195.41.64.129]) by ns1.swh.sk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA28675 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 12:25:03 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from btss103a.swh.sk (btss103a.swh.sk [195.41.64.27]) by hermes.swh.sk (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id MAA24426 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 12:24:59 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by btss103a.swh.sk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id <2MGT9DJV>; Tue, 2 May 2000 12:24:57 +0200 Message-ID: <29BDD4F529FCD311B631009027357C4E517490@btss103a.swh.sk> From: "Gasparik Richard" To: "Rsgb_Lf_Group \(E-mail\)" Subject: LF: OM2TW QRV from TV transmitter... Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 12:24:57 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi LFers... After a two months I'll be QRV on 136 again. This time from an radio relay point (and TV transmitter) Sitno - JN98KJ (1009 m asl.). On the top is an 80m high tower. Maximum accessible point is about 50m high. Because there are a lot of telecomunications equipments, I must reduce my power to the maximum 50 W output. Antenna will be 50m high vertical with about 200m sloping section. Our main operating will be on 2m, 70cm and 23cm (II.subregional contest), but I will be QRV from saturday 1200Z until sunday 1600Z CW and Visual-CW. Please look for me... Rich OM2TW From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25506 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 11:41:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 11:41:03 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mawI-00040L-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 12:34:06 +0100 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mawG-0003zl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 12:34:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id NAA577546 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 13:33:42 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000502132946.221f6d7e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 13:29:46 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: IK1ODO beacon signal In-reply-to: <29BDD4F529FCD311B631009027357C4E517490@btss103a.swh.sk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Friday (28 april) arround 22UT I had a good copy of Marco's 10mW signal, both with Spectran and Spectogram. Some screenshots can be found at my webpage : http://www.qsl.net/on7yd/IK1ODO/ik1odo.htm Although, based on the difference in bandwidth, Spectran was supposed to be 7.5dB better I had the impression that the difference in SNR between Spectran and Spectogram was less. Further I noticed that launching another application while running Spectran caused a kind of 'frequency shift' (see screenshot at my webpage). Finaly I want to thank Marco for the beacon signal, it gave many hams the opportunity to do some testing and proved what can be achieved with 10mW ERP. At the risk of being 'greedy' I would suggest following to Marco : would it be possible to have a series a characters at reduced power after the call ? eg. : 'IK1ODO X Y Z' where IK1ODO is tranmitted at 10mW ERP, X at 5mW ERP, Y at 2.5mW ERP and Z at 1.25mW ERP (of course any other 3 characters can be used). 73, Rik ON7YD 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18355 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 12:22:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 12:22:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mbY4-0004L6-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 13:13:08 +0100 Received: from ns1.swh.sk ([192.108.125.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mbY0-0004L1-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 13:13:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from hermes.swh.sk (hermes [195.41.64.129]) by ns1.swh.sk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA32628 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 14:12:43 +0200 Received: from btss103a.swh.sk (btss103a.swh.sk [195.41.64.27]) by hermes.swh.sk (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id OAA06023 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 14:12:40 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by btss103a.swh.sk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id <2MGT9DW8>; Tue, 2 May 2000 14:12:37 +0200 Message-ID: <29BDD4F529FCD311B631009027357C4E517516@btss103a.swh.sk> From: "Gasparik Richard" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: RE: LF: OM2TW QRV from TV transmitter... Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 14:12:36 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi... I prefer frequencies: CW: 136.4kHz or 136.9kHz Visual-CW: 137.7kHz X-band: 3577kHz All is depending on QRM, because there are a lot of telecomunication equipments, air conditioners, etc... See you on 136... 73 de Rich OM2TW > -----Original Message----- > From: Alberto di Bene [SMTP:dibene@usa.net] > Sent: 2. máj 2000 13:14 > To: undisclosed-recipients; rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: Re: LF: OM2TW QRV from TV transmitter... > > Rich, > could you tell us the exact QRG ? TNX. > > Alberto I2PHD > > Gasparik Richard wrote: > > > Hi LFers... > > > > After a two months I'll be QRV on 136 again. > > This time from an radio relay point (and TV transmitter) Sitno - JN98KJ > > (1009 m asl.). > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7578 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 18:38:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 18:38:18 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mhNK-0007Iv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 19:26:26 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ds-img-7.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.153] helo=spdmbaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mhNF-0007Im-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 19:26:21 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmbaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id OAA18402 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 2 May 2000 14:25:34 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 14:25:10 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: GPS Signals Accurate Now!!! To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005021425_MC2-A375-6529@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello, for those of you using GPS receivers to measure distances for example for field strehgth measurements (Gamal and I used a Garmin GPS45XL for our field strength profile of DCF39 and I used this unit to measure the profile of my own transmitter), here is some great news from the AMRAD e-mail reflector: > In the next few days, we should be getting an announcement that the > selective availability system will be either turned off or reduced in > some fashion. See http://www.igeb.gov/ > Cliff K7RR Indeed, it happened midnight last night! SA is off, and recording of my GPS signal with a stationary antenna shows that all fixes are within a circle of 15m radius (95% even within 10m radius!). Altitude error is also reduced down to 1.5 times the horizontal error, so you can climb up your tower and measure the height of it using GPS! Also time measurment accuracy using GPS should have increased according to what I read on the internet (great news for those experimenting with synchronized signals on LF!). So, what do they do with all those longwave DGPS stations? More sites and tower to be activated before they are de-commissioned (and what do they do with the evacuated frequencies after de-commissioning ... )! Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) http://www.qru.de From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2145 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 18:47:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 18:47:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mhYF-0007NY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 19:37:43 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mhYC-0007NS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 19:37:41 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as32-s15-148-14.cwci.net ([195.44.148.14] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mhXs-0003fB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 18:37:22 +0000 Message-ID: <390F09BB.ECB76C6@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 17:00:44 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: transatlantic Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Larry and Co Have just returned from Cookstown/N.I- IO64PO, after conducting some experiments both transmitting and receiving to access possibilities for November. The qth is ideal for receiving, using the 120 ft tower, the environment is very quiet, could hear a pin drop. On transmit I was only using a few mwatts erp and worked SM nearly 900 miles away and other continental stations plus the usual UK stations. One problem that most suffer from is the inability to receive properly because of the noisy environment that they live in. This will be the biggest problem with the November tests. In my case both my Scarborough and Cookstown sites which are rural do not have this problem. I have the antenna array and radial system all set up but will be there again in July to perfect it and implement some refinements, plus test the new tx at 1w erp. When I was there I monitored CFH early morning and it was always quite strong but on the 250400 between 0810 and 0840 it was very strong over S9 and band conditions excellent, not a trace of qrn, this could have been a oppertunity to work each other. Even at this time of year there are possibilities of openings. Hope this info helps in some positive way to ascertain what might be possible. My antenna consisted of 2 x inv L antennas each one 120 ft high and 350 ft long about 160 degrees apart directed towards the west. I will be adding an additional inv L at the same hight but at least 600 ft long, this will be facing East. The radial system consists of insulated radials about 300 ft long and the far end connected to sheep lattice metal fencing that runs for miles. This I hope will achieve the object when the time comes. I will be using normal hand sent CW but also have a pentium III pc with the appropriate software to send and monitor slow cw if necessary. My operation Larry is a one man band but I have been offered help from several competent cw operators if I need them to keep watch 24 hours a day for the test period. In the UK, November might be a bad month for Thunder/Lightening etc wiping out the rx end. One other thought, when working with weak signals a local qso might start up and wipe out the whole operation at times !!!!!!!!!!!1 It would be hard to co-ordinate every operator on the band. 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1724 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 21:55:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 21:55:30 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mkXQ-0000PC-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 22:49:04 +0100 Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mkX6-0000Oz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 22:48:44 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 ([151.25.252.132]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA13837 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 23:48:04 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 23:48:04 +0200 Message-ID: <4.1.20000502224757.020c4040@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Tue, 02 May 2000 22:48:25 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: IK1ODO beacon signal MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In 14.02 02/05/00 , hai scritto: >Friday (28 april) arround 22UT I had a good copy of Marco's 10mW signal, >both with Spectran and Spectogram. >Some screenshots can be found at my webpage : > >http://www.qsl.net/on7yd/IK1ODO/ik1odo.htm > >Although, based on the difference in bandwidth, Spectran was supposed to be >7.5dB better I had the impression that the difference in SNR between >Spectran and Spectogram was less. >Further I noticed that launching another application while running Spectran >caused a kind of 'frequency shift' (see screenshot at my webpage). > Alberto is working on this same problem, see his message. >Finaly I want to thank Marco for the beacon signal, it gave many hams the >opportunity to do some testing and proved what can be achieved with 10mW ERP. >At the risk of being 'greedy' I would suggest following to Marco : would it >be possible to have a series a characters at reduced power after the call ? >eg. : 'IK1ODO X Y Z' where IK1ODO is tranmitted at 10mW ERP, X at 5mW ERP, >Y at 2.5mW ERP and Z at 1.25mW ERP (of course any other 3 characters can be >used). > >73, Rik ON7YD > Rik, I will take this seriously. What about writing a modified version of QRS to command an attenuator and step power levels? I may build a linear amplifier, of some 10W output, and reduce the power in four steps of 5 dB (3W, 1W, 300 mW, 100 mW for instance). The big problem is to have an automatic tuning. I started the beacon on Thursday evening, then left home Friday, and it was raining; so I had to raise the power, since the aerial current was down from the nominal. The rain stopped on Saturday, and the antenna current rose to (probably) +5 dB respect to Friday evening. I was not able to transmit a fixed power level; my station currently can't run unattended (in effect, my wife was attending and checking for smoke, HI). I returned home by Tuesday, and found the tuning of the variometer completely different from Friday. Thanks to all for the reports. I think we have to go on. Well, Rik, what signal may we use to change the power levels ? go to the parallel port, or use an UART on the serial ? 73 - Marco IK1ODO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1758 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 21:55:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 21:55:40 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mkXV-0000PE-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 22:49:09 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mkXO-0000P3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 22:49:02 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 ([151.25.252.132]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA14006 for ; Tue, 2 May 2000 23:48:32 +0200 Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 23:48:32 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000502221259.02234f10@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Tue, 02 May 2000 22:26:12 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: IK1ODO beacon signal In-reply-to: <3.0.1.16.20000502132946.221f6d7e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Riferimenti: <29BDD4F529FCD311B631009027357C4E517490@btss103a.swh.sk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In 14.02 02/05/00 , hai scritto: >Friday (28 april) arround 22UT I had a good copy of Marco's 10mW signal, >both with Spectran and Spectogram. >Some screenshots can be found at my webpage : > >http://www.qsl.net/on7yd/IK1ODO/ik1odo.htm > >Although, based on the difference in bandwidth, Spectran was supposed to be >7.5dB better I had the impression that the difference in SNR between >Spectran and Spectogram was less. >Further I noticed that launching another application while running Spectran >caused a kind of 'frequency shift' (see screenshot at my webpage). > Alberto found this same problem, but he says that debugging will be difficult, and will probably take some time. Incidentally, he is releasing a new "beta" version (beta3). >Finaly I want to thank Marco for the beacon signal, it gave many hams the >opportunity to do some testing and proved what can be achieved with 10mW ERP. >At the risk of being 'greedy' I would suggest following to Marco : would it >be possible to have a series a characters at reduced power after the call ? >eg. : 'IK1ODO X Y Z' where IK1ODO is tranmitted at 10mW ERP, X at 5mW ERP, >Y at 2.5mW ERP and Z at 1.25mW ERP (of course any other 3 characters can be >used). > >73, Rik ON7YD > Rik, I will take this seriously. What about writing a modified version of QRS to command an attenuator and step power levels? I may build a linear amplifier, of some 10W output, and reduce the power in four steps of 5 dB (3W, 1W, 300 mW, 100 mW for instance). The big problem is to have an automatic tuning. I started the beacon on Thursday evening, then left home Friday, and it was raining; so I had to raise the power, since the aerial current was down from the nominal. The rain stopped on Saturday, and the antenna current rose to (probably) +5 dB respect to Friday evening. I was not able to transmit a fixed power level; my station currently can't run unattended (in effect, my wife was attending and checking for smoke, HI). I returned home by Tuesday, and found the tuning of the variometer completely different from Friday. Thanks to all for the reports. I think we have to go on. Well, Rik, what signal may we use to change the power levels ? go to the parallel port, or use an UART on the serial ? 73 - Marco IK1ODO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24670 invoked from network); 2 May 2000 23:15:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 May 2000 23:15:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mlbH-0000xX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 23:57:07 +0100 Received: from neodymium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.83]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mlbG-0000xS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 May 2000 23:57:06 +0100 Received: from [213.1.129.34] (helo=default) by neodymium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12mlZq-0002U0-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 2 May 2000 23:55:38 +0100 Message-ID: <001901bfb489$b549dfe0$d949073e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Earth contact resistance Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 22:12:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, I have noted again from Peter's description of the Tesla experiments at the Museum, and from John's Earth Wireless web site, that the addition of several pounds (or kgms) of common salt (and water) seems to be a usual way of improving the contact resistance beween earth rods and the surrounding ground. It occurs to me that those with an enviromental approach or just those who are keen gardeners (I note the reluctant pruning near the aerials!) might not wish to blight their garden with large quantities of sodium chloride. I have seen somewhere in radio literature that Gypsum is almost as good in the electrical parameters and is actually beneficial horticulturally. It is much less soluble than salt and for the same effect will not need quite so many repeated treatments (It may not yield quite such a low resistance). I suspect its worth a try as Gypsum ( Calcuim Sulphate) is available from most Garden Centres. "I am just top dressing the lawn dear...." when decreasing the resistance of the earth-mat you surreptitiously buried under it.............. It could just be worth an extra helping of chocolate fudge! Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1106 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 04:34:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 04:34:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mqhp-0003iO-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 05:24:13 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ds-img-4.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.137] helo=spdmgaad.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mqhn-0003iH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 05:24:12 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaad.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id AAA28939 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 3 May 2000 00:23:25 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 00:22:34 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: Re: LF: IK1ODO beacon signal To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005030023_MC2-A389-5AFA@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Alberto, >On the other end, if you see that every time you use other applications while >Spectran is running you see that shift, no matter what the received signal is, then >a few more hours of debugging are waiting for me, hi...< sorry for causing you trouble and more work to do, but I have the same problem, a frequency shift of a couple of Hertz (downwards, if I recall that right) when I open other applications. Another phenomenon on my computer: while the control window is open, the lines are fuzzy, when I close it, I get nice, straight lines. Thanks for your efforts! 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13295 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 06:31:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 06:31:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12msZT-0004dc-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 07:23:43 +0100 Received: from mta4-gui.server.ntli.net ([194.168.54.145] helo=mta4-svc.virgin.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12msZP-0004dX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 07:23:39 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from virgin.net ([194.168.68.46]) by mta4-svc.virgin.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with ESMTP id <20000503062328.LASH27164.mta4-svc.virgin.net@virgin.net>; Wed, 3 May 2000 07:23:28 +0100 Message-ID: <390FC5AE.FE3471FA@virgin.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 07:22:38 +0100 From: "Stewart Bryant" Organization: . X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Telsa Coils References: <2000050208250568199@zetnet.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Peter Nice article. Would it be OK to put an edited version (with credits) in the Crawley Club newsletter? Thanks Stewart From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3532 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 07:21:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 07:21:49 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mtOh-00053i-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 08:16:39 +0100 Received: from gatek.vs.dasa.de ([195.243.118.226] helo=gatekeeper.vs.dasa.de) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mtOe-00053b-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 08:16:36 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: by gatekeeper.vs.dasa.de; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id JAA05004; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:17:49 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from somewhere by smtpxd Received: from somewhere by smtpxd Message-ID: From: "Koenig, Wolfgang" To: "'rsgb_lf_group'" Subject: LF: HB0/DL1SAN Results Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 09:16:07 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hallo Group, you can find a detailed information about the hb0-activity at http://www.qsl.net/dl1san/hb0work.htm 73 de dl1san wolf From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26831 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 08:13:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 08:13:30 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12muBl-0005To-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 09:07:21 +0100 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12muBk-0005Tj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 09:07:20 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id KAA498038 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 10:07:00 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000503100301.2e77a8b0@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 10:03:01 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: IK1ODO beacon signal In-reply-to: <4.1.20000502224757.020c4040@mailer.inrete.it> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Marco, I will see what I can do to adapt QRS, I will have to use the parallel port for power switching as all 'output pins' off the serial port are alrteady in use. Alternative I could try to put some softawre in a PIC16F84 processor, I already have some 'beacon software' for it, just have to change speed and add the power switching. I am willing to send you a programmed PIC on a ready-to-use PCB. This would have the advantage that you do not need your PC for it. Regarding power switching and the WX-related detuning : It should be possible to built a small class-D TX and adjust the powersupply voltage to regulate output power. If we incorporate some feedback from the amp-meter to the voltage regulation it should be possible to have a TX that runs at constant antenna current (= constant ERP). The above are just some thoughts and a lot of work will be involved it we want to realize it. So maybe we first have to check if there is enough interest from the 'listeners side' and if we can share the work, it wouldn't be fair if we expect you to do it all. 73, Rik ON7YD >>At the risk of being 'greedy' I would suggest following to Marco : would it >>be possible to have a series a characters at reduced power after the call ? >>eg. : 'IK1ODO X Y Z' where IK1ODO is tranmitted at 10mW ERP, X at 5mW ERP, >>Y at 2.5mW ERP and Z at 1.25mW ERP (of course any other 3 characters can be >>used). >> >>73, Rik ON7YD >> >Rik, I will take this seriously. What about writing a modified version of QRS >to command an attenuator and step power levels? >I may build a linear amplifier, of some 10W output, and reduce the power >in four steps of 5 dB (3W, 1W, 300 mW, 100 mW for instance). >The big problem is to have an automatic tuning. I started the beacon >on Thursday evening, then left home Friday, and it was raining; so I had to >raise the power, since the aerial current was down from the nominal. >The rain stopped on Saturday, and the antenna current rose to (probably) >+5 dB respect to Friday evening. I was not able to transmit a fixed power >level; >my station currently can't run unattended (in effect, my wife was attending >and checking for smoke, HI). > >I returned home by Tuesday, and found the tuning of the variometer >completely different from Friday. > >Thanks to all for the reports. I think we have to go on. > >Well, Rik, what signal may we use to change the power levels ? go to >the parallel port, or use an UART on the serial ? > >73 - Marco IK1ODO > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4538 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 08:55:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 08:55:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12muoC-0005on-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 09:47:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12muo8-0005of-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 09:47:00 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id JAA15503 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 09:46:40 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk Message-ID: <2000050308472368199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 08:47:23 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: Re: LF: Re: Telsa Coils Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hello Stewart > Nice article. Would it be OK to put an edited version (with credits) > in the Crawley Club newsletter? Yes, by all means. Note that I spelt Tesla wrong in the mailing -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3664 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 09:24:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 09:24:33 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mvIL-00065H-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 10:18:13 +0100 Received: from ns0.to.cnr.it ([150.145.32.10] helo=ccs0.to.cnr.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mvIH-00065B-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 10:18:10 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from aldo (aldo.to.cnr.it [150.145.34.49]) by ccs0.to.cnr.it with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id JJK9QTSN; Wed, 3 May 2000 11:17:46 +0200 From: "Aldo Marchetto" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: CNR To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 11:17:03 +1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: beacon power control (was Re: LF: IK1ODO beacon signal) In-reply-to: <3.0.1.16.20000503100301.2e77a8b0@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> References: <4.1.20000502224757.020c4040@mailer.inrete.it> Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Rik and Marco, as Rick is thinking to write a software for controlling a step attenuator, I think it would be possible to link that software to a digital reading of antenna current, so that the attenuator itself would lead the power constant at +/- 0.5 dB with 1 dB steps This sounds simpler than building a new transmitter. This would also mean that a relevant part of Marco's power (maybe increased to some extent) would be always dissipated in the attenuator, increasing PA safety in case of antenna detuning, On the contrary a very accurate PA proctection would be required if a POSITIVE feedback to the antenna current meter has to be connected to an unattended TX. 73 Aldo IZ1ANT Dr. Aldo Marchetto C.N.R. Istituto Italiano di Idrobiologia Largo Vittorio Tonolli 50 I-28922 Verbania Pallanza (VB) - Italy Voice: +39 0323 518357 Fax: +39 0323 556513 E-mail: a.marchetto@iii.to.cnr.it http: www.iii.to.cnr.it From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5857 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 11:31:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 11:31:58 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mxGB-00076W-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 12:24:07 +0100 Received: from smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.156]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mxG7-00076R-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 12:24:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-117-132.bellatlantic.net [151.200.117.132]) by smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id HAA04634; Wed, 3 May 2000 07:23:36 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <39100CE3.190D362C@bellatlantic.net> Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 07:26:27 -0400 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: lk@pdi.com, "lf-amrad" , "AMRAD Tacos" , "Rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: PKZIP Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: PKZIP AUTHOR DIES by Dave Murphy, member@itrain.org Phillip W. Katz, 37, died on April 14 from complications arising from a long-time illness. As a young man, Katz released the PKZip file compression program in 1986. The program revolutionized the world of Bulletin Board Systems (BBS) and the fledgling Internet. I remember getting my hands on the very first public version. I was able to compress copies of my dBASE, Lotus 1-2-3, and WordPerfect files on to a single diskette. All I had was an IBM PC-XT and an IBM PC Portable ... storage space was at a premium. As new versions were released, I'd eagerly download the updates and rezip my files just to get an extra five percent more compression. When transferring files online with my high-speed Hayes 1200Kbps modem, every bit of extra compression meant a few minutes saved. I even got to try the program before I paid for it. PKZip was the first shareware program I ever registered. Katz became famous for pioneering the shareware concept of software distribution. Users were invited to download and try new software. Only if they liked the program and decided to continue using it were they obligated to purchase the software. Phil, I never met you in person, but I'll miss you. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27897 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 11:41:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 11:41:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mxOe-0007CQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 12:32:52 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mxOd-0007CL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 12:32:51 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id NAA441102 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 13:32:33 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000503132834.2d4fcc54@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 13:28:34 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: beacon power control (was Re: LF: IK1ODO beacon signal) In-reply-to: References: <3.0.1.16.20000503100301.2e77a8b0@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <4.1.20000502224757.020c4040@mailer.inrete.it> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 11:17 3/05/00 +1, IZ1ANT wrote: >On the contrary a very accurate PA proctection would be required if >a POSITIVE feedback to the antenna current meter has to be connected >to an unattended TX. The feedback from the amp-meter to the TX is NEGATIVE (if the antennacurrent increases the TX output power is forced to decrease). In combination with a reflected power protection (as used by G3YXM in this TX design) the TX will withstand any mistreatement including short- and open-circuit. As the beacon is meant to be low-power (10mW and less) a relative small TX power can be used (50 Watts and less), so it can easily be overdimensioned to provide extra safety. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 770 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 12:23:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 12:23:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12my3D-0007b3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 13:14:47 +0100 Received: from smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.156]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12my3A-0007ay-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 13:14:45 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-117-132.bellatlantic.net [151.200.117.132]) by smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id IAA01002; Wed, 3 May 2000 08:14:20 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <391018C6.7DEFD53B@bellatlantic.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 08:17:11 -0400 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: "lf-amrad" Subject: Re: LF: beacon power control References: <3.0.1.16.20000503100301.2e77a8b0@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <4.1.20000502224757.020c4040@mailer.inrete.it> <3.0.1.16.20000503132834.2d4fcc54@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik Strobbe wrote: > [...] > As the beacon is meant to be low-power (10mW and less) a relative small TX > power can be used (50 Watts and less), so it can easily be overdimensioned > to provide extra safety. Maplin has a small class A amplifier using a LM 1875 that easily puts out 25 watts at 136 Khz. It is stable, has automatic current limiting and overheating protection Because it operates in class A, the output can be controlled simply by a step attenuator at the _input_ of the amplifier. Just a thought 73 Andre' N4ICK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13586 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 12:39:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 12:39:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12myJk-0007k0-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 13:31:52 +0100 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12myJh-0007jv-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 13:31:50 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12myJP-0004f8-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 3 May 2000 13:31:31 +0100 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Wed, 03 May 2000 13:20:20 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 13:20:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: GW visit X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I operated on the 73kHz band on Thursday, 27 April between 1700 and 1830UTC, and again on Saturday 29 April between about 0900 and 1100. Unfortunately, on the Thursday evening the kite gradually got lower and lower whilst I was setting up the station, and a sked with G3LDO failed both ways. Worse, on Saturday there was no wind at all at any of the three locations tried, including one at 500m ASL ! A temporary antenna on fence posts allowed me to receive MI0AYZ very well at 579, but my signals were too weak in GI to be read. I had not planned on there being no wind at all. Unfortunately, I had to return the generator to the hire shop at 1100UT on Saturday so had to cut the operation short. There was no time to operate on 136kHz. I made some transmissions using QRSS - did anyone detect them? The full story of this interesting but unsuccessful trip can be found on my web site. I am determined to have one last try at getting out of Wales on 73kHz. I have two spare beds at my holiday home (plus a sofa and floor space) and if anyone is interested in a weekend in sunny Pembrokeshire I am planning an expedition between now and June - probably late May. The idea will be to hire a generator close to home and take it to GW so it is available for the whole weekend. Travel Friday/Monday. Steve, GW4ALG, has already expressed an interest. If we can coordinate with GI3PDN's 73k activity, so much the better. I can supply a 200W synthesised TX, kite antenna, two 10m telescopic masts, Rx, coils etc. What I don't have is a portable computer that will receive QRSS, though I can transmit it using my keyer. This is a last chance to make some 'firsts' and possibly to work OH1TN for an unbeatable distance record. It may mean getting cold and wet (like at Puckeridge) and a small contribution to the cost of the genny would help, so genuine takers only please. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23889 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 13:34:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 13:34:03 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mz72-00089m-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 14:22:48 +0100 Received: from gateg.kw.bbc.co.uk ([132.185.132.16]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mz6v-00089d-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 14:22:41 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from sunf0.rd.bbc.co.uk (ddmailgate.rd.bbc.co.uk [132.185.128.104]) by gateg.kw.bbc.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA20979 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 14:22:22 +0100 (BST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from pc523 by sunf0.rd.bbc.co.uk; Wed, 3 May 00 14:22:22 BST Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20000503142218.00a43480@sunf0> X-Sender: simonlh@sunf0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 14:22:18 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Simon Lloyd-Hughes" Subject: LF: 73 KHz Closure MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: When is the band taken away? This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the BBC, unless specifically stated. ____________________________________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________________________ Email: simon.lloyd-hughes@rd.bbc.co.uk BBC Transmission Management Group Tel: Internal 39692 B201 External 01737 839692 Kingswood Warren Mobile 07889 151485 Tadworth Surrey KT20 6NP FAX: 01737 839555 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________________________ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13042 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 14:06:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 14:06:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mzia-0008UR-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 15:01:36 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12mziY-0008UM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 15:01:34 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id PAA29367; Wed, 3 May 2000 15:04:32 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 6183 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 14:57:42 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 14:57:42 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id NAA05067; Wed, 3 May 2000 13:46:40 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma005039; Wed, 3 May 00 13:46:14 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 15:05:23 +0100 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id <2J0905MJ>; Wed, 3 May 2000 14:59:52 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528B4@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: LF Amplifiers etc Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 14:59:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thanks for that, you've just saved me some work. I'm playing with a TDA2005 bridge audio amplifier for 10 watts off a 12v rail (since I had one spare), but that older device is a bit prone to instability into anything other than a perfect resistive load. The simplicity of the LM1875 circuitry makes the effort of using a 30V rail (via a switch mode PSU from 12V) worthwhile. Farnell do this device too, and also I see in their catalogue the LM1876 which appears to be a pair of '1875 types in one package. 50 watts from a bridge perhaps ? On the subject of linear amps. I'm also investigating the idea of a pulse width mod. voltage controller for class D PAs. Then by separating out envelope and phase information from complex modulation waveforms, an efficient PA could be used without the trouble of going through SSB driver stages and probably a transverter. The authors of a lot of the modem software could hopefully be persuaded to make amplitude and phase info available separately. Watch this space. Andy G4JNT > ---------- > From: Andre' Kesteloot[SMTP:akestelo@bellatlantic.net] > Reply To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Sent: 2000-05-03 13:17 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Cc: lf-amrad > Subject: Re: LF: beacon power control > > Rik Strobbe wrote: > > > [...] > > As the beacon is meant to be low-power (10mW and less) a relative > small TX > > power can be used (50 Watts and less), so it can easily be > overdimensioned > > to provide extra safety. > > Maplin has a small class A amplifier using a LM 1875 that easily puts > out 25 > watts at 136 Khz. It is stable, has automatic current limiting and > overheating > protection. Because it operates in class A, the output can be > controlled simply by a step attenuator at the _input_ of the > amplifier. > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22585 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 15:46:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 15:46:40 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n1DJ-0000gQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 16:37:25 +0100 Received: from cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.173]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n1DE-0000gJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 16:37:20 +0100 Received: from modem-93.lamark-angel.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.36.221] helo=lvm) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12n1Ct-0004qK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 16:37:01 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfb515$8e7a8cc0$dd24893e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. Beacon Power control. Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 16:37:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi All,
Perhaps this is just too naive-but would it not be possible to put a resistor in series to swamp the Ant.system resistance so that changes in it have little or at least less effect on the current! This would of course require more power  to get the required current but for such a low power beacon this should not be too difficult. 73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25125 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 16:14:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 16:14:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n1gh-0000wu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 17:07:47 +0100 Received: from d06lmsgate.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n1gZ-0000wl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 17:07:43 +0100 Received: from d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.148]) by d06lmsgate.uk.ibm.COM (1.0.0) with ESMTP id QAA162726 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 16:56:28 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from usa.net (lig32-239-133-69.emea.lig-dial.ibm.com [32.239.133.69]) by d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id RAA35468 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 17:06:42 +0100 Message-ID: <39104E84.1C401FE5@usa.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 18:06:28 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" Organization: Undisclosed X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: IK1ODO beacon signal References: <4.1.20000502221259.02234f10@mailer.inrete.it> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >>Further I noticed that launching another application while running Spectran >>caused a kind of 'frequency shift' (see screenshot at my webpage). >> >Alberto found this same problem, but he says that debugging will be difficult, >and will probably take some time. Incidentally, he is releasing a new "beta" >version (beta3). Just to straigthen things a bit up : we are talking of two different problems : 1) The frequency error Marco is talking about, is known to me since some time, and it is caused by a wrong initial design assumption of Spectran, i.e. that the frequency ruler scale must start at an integral multiple of 1 Hz. This because at that time Spectran was meant for EME use, where sub-Hertz resolutions are not needed. Now that with beta 3 we can do down to 21 milliHz, this must revised. 2) The frequency shift observed and reported by Rik and Alan, is a completely new thing, for which, at the moment, I have no explanation. I saw, one time only, a shift of 0.5 Hz, which I attributed to my RX. I wasn't launching or using any other application at the moment. As this shift has been signalled by more than one person, and on signals locked to some standards, then I must investigated into it. Thanks for those reports, and don't be shy to send others. The very first reason for putting out a beta before the final release was just to receive this kind of reports. 73s Alberto I2PHD ----------------- From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29882 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 16:35:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 16:35:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n1zz-00017Z-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 17:27:43 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n1zy-00017U-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 17:27:42 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12n1wk-0003cY-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 17:24:22 +0100 Message-ID: <11532.200005031633@gemini> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "James Moritz" Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 17:33:54 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Re. Beacon Power control. In-reply-to: <000201bfb515$8e7a8cc0$dd24893e@lvm> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. Beacon Power control. Date sent: Wed, 3 May 2000 16:37:07 +0100 Send reply to: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Hi All, > Perhaps this is just too naive-but would it not be possible to put a > resistor in series to swamp the Ant.system resistance so that changes in > it have little or at least less effect on the current! This would of > course require more power to get the required current but for such a low > power beacon this should not be too difficult. 73s Laurie. > Plus it would buffer the TX against changes in load - or, looked at another way, it would reduce the Q of the antenna so tuning would be less critical. Sounds like a great idea. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15038 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 17:12:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 17:12:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n2a4-0001RF-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 18:05:00 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n2a1-0001RA-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 18:04:57 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id TAA292024 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 19:04:40 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000503190040.232f556e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 19:00:40 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Re. Beacon Power control. In-reply-to: <11532.200005031633@gemini> References: <000201bfb515$8e7a8cc0$dd24893e@lvm> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: It was the first idea that crossed my mind too, but when I did some basic calculations on it based on the figure from Marco (up to 5dB flucuations in antennacurrent) you must be willing to 'heat' up to 90% of the power in the 'bleeder resistor' to reduce the flucuation to 1dB. In practice this would mean that you would need about 100-200 Watts RF power to radiate 10mW at +/-1dB. With some feedback from the antenna current to the TX (may sound complicated but is just some kind of ALC) you only need a 10-20 Watt TX. I think that using an additional resistor is a good solution for some short tests, but for longer use a small TX with antenna current regulation could be preffered. 73, Rik ON7YD At 17:33 3/05/00 +0000, you wrote: >From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" >To: "rsgb lf group" >Subject: LF: Re. Beacon Power control. >Date sent: Wed, 3 May 2000 16:37:07 +0100 >Send reply to: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > >> Hi All, >> Perhaps this is just too naive-but would it not be possible to put a >> resistor in series to swamp the Ant.system resistance so that changes in >> it have little or at least less effect on the current! This would of >> course require more power to get the required current but for such a low >> power beacon this should not be too difficult. 73s Laurie. >> >Plus it would buffer the TX against changes in load - or, looked at >another way, it would reduce the Q of the antenna so tuning would >be less critical. Sounds like a great idea. > >Cheers, Jim Moritz >73 de M0BMU > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10400 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 17:33:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 17:33:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n2uE-0001bo-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 18:25:50 +0100 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n2uB-0001bj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 18:25:47 +0100 Received: from oemcomputer (man-058.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.41.72]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id SAA21335 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 18:25:32 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: irwell.zetnet.co.uk: Host man-058.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.41.72] claimed to be oemcomputer Message-ID: <000001bfb524$abf6edc0$4829f7c2@oemcomputer> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001901bfb489$b549dfe0$d949073e@default> Subject: LF: Re: Earth contact resistance Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 07:56:54 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: ----- Original Message ----- From: Alan Melia To: rsgb_lf_group Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2000 10:12 PM Subject: LF: Earth contact resistance > Hi all, I have noted again from Peter's description of the Tesla experiments > at the Museum, and from John's Earth Wireless web site, that the addition of > several pounds (or kgms) of common salt (and water) seems to be a usual way > of improving the contact resistance beween earth rods and the surrounding > ground. It occurs to me that those with an enviromental approach or just > those who are keen gardeners (I note the reluctant pruning near the > aerials!) might not wish to blight their garden with large quantities of > sodium chloride. What about a old GPO faultsman's solution (applied discreetly)? 73 de John Rabson G3PAI From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8743 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 19:59:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 19:59:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n5Ck-0002if-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 20:53:06 +0100 Received: from mb07.swip.net ([193.12.122.211]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n5Cg-0002ia-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 20:53:02 +0100 Received: from oemcomputer (d212-151-63-59.swipnet.se [212.151.63.59]) by mb07.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA00827 for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 21:52:44 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <003a01bfb539$32189b60$3b3f97d4@oemcomputer> From: "Johan Bodin" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: Beacon Power control. Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 21:52:27 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello, Compensating an off-resonance antenna with increased TX power seems like a brute force method to me. Why not build a simple phase measuring thing that outputs a +/- voltage that is proportional to the phase relationship between voltage and current in the feeder? After all, the theoretical definition of resonance is that the voltage and current are in phase with each other. Assuming zero output at 0 degrees, the output from the "phase sensor" can be used to control a servo motor on a variometer which brings the system into perfect resonance whatever the wheather... An op-amp in the servo loop, surrounded by suitable R's and C's, will make the system slow and stable (dominant pole). It doesn't have to be faster than the changes in wheather ;-) One of my ideas for a "phase sensor" is: The feeder voltage and current can be sampled with a resistive (or capacitive, or both) divider and a current transformer, respectively. These two signals are then amplified and clipped to square waves. If these signals are fed into an XOR gate (74HC86 etc), the output from the gate will be a PWM signal that is proportional to the absolute value of the phase error. The PWM signal can be converted to a DC error signal by a simple RC lowpass filter (136 kHz >> the servo loop bandwidth). The sign of the error signal can be found by connecting these two signals to a D-type flip-flop (74HC74, 4013 etc). The current and voltage squarewave signals are connected to the clock input and the D inputs respectively. The sign bit will appear on the flip-flop Q output. This sign bit controls the direction of servo motor travel and the filtered PWM from the XOR gate is the magnitude of the error. Depending on actual implementation, some kind of "gating" may be needed to prevent the servo loop from "run-away" during key-up periods.. Just an idea... 73 de Johan SM6LKM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13615 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 20:41:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 20:41:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n5rB-00032f-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 21:34:53 +0100 Received: from postfix2.free.fr ([212.27.32.74] ident=postfix) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n5rA-00032a-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 21:34:52 +0100 Received: from f5maf (toulouse-1-5-164.dial.proxad.net [213.228.5.164]) by postfix2.free.fr (Postfix) with SMTP id 766C774A1D for ; Wed, 3 May 2000 22:34:33 +0200 (MEST) Message-ID: <002801bfb53f$57332540$a405e4d5@f5maf> From: "f5maf" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: F5MAF beacom Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 22:36:53 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hello,
friday evening ( 20:00 to 21:00 UTC) I'll transmit with 30W.
The antenna courant : 1,1A on 137.050.
The message : F5MAF JNO3PP.
And saturday morning (07:00 to 08:00 UTC).
Thanks for all reports.
73
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1385 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 20:54:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 20:54:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n61Y-00037z-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 21:45:36 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.92]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n61X-00037u-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 21:45:35 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from alg.demon.co.uk ([194.222.171.80]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12n61F-0001aB-0Y for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 3 May 2000 21:45:17 +0100 Message-ID: <39108853.475C7CC4@alg.demon.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 22:13:07 +0100 From: "Steve Rawlings" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: 137 KHz in France References: <00e401bfb3aa$2102b120$ac06e4d5@f5maf> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Greetings Marc, F5MAF We are very pleased to have you on the LF Reflector, and hope that you will soon be making your first QSO on LF! Regards to all, Steve GW4ALG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10856 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 21:40:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 21:40:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n6mw-0003Wt-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 22:34:34 +0100 Received: from merlins.plus.net.uk ([195.166.128.23] helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12n6mv-0003Wo-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 03 May 2000 22:34:33 +0100 Received: (qmail 28556 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 21:38:08 -0000 Received: from ruin.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.66) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 21:38:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 6738 invoked from network); 3 May 2000 21:33:47 -0000 Received: from 117.03-02.quay.dial.plus.net.uk (HELO picks) (212.159.70.117) by ruin.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 May 2000 21:33:47 -0000 Message-ID: <000201bfb547$7b409a00$75469fd4@f9.net.uk> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: My TS850 Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 19:59:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear all. I have fixed the TS850 so should be able to hear the DX again.... noise permitting! The fault was one of the DDS chips on the "CAR" unit, the one that produces the mix frequency from 8.8MHz to 455kHz. Thanks to all those who offered help and advice..... "throw it away and get a new one" indeed! The rig-doctor rules OK! ( Ł35 64-pin surface-mount chips a speciality.) Dave 'YXM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19794 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 06:40:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 06:40:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nFA0-0007jU-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 07:30:56 +0100 Received: from mta2-gui.server.ntli.net ([194.168.54.143] helo=mta2-svc.server.ntli.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nF9w-0007jP-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 07:30:52 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from virgin.net ([194.168.68.171]) by mta2-svc.server.ntli.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with ESMTP id <20000504062942.PTJR285.mta2-svc.server.ntli.net@virgin.net>; Thu, 4 May 2000 07:29:42 +0100 Message-ID: <391118DE.15204F1B@virgin.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 07:29:50 +0100 From: "Stewart Bryant" Organization: . X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Telsa Coils References: <2000050308472368199@zetnet.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thanks Stewart Peter Dodd wrote: > Hello Stewart > > Nice article. Would it be OK to put an edited version (with credits) > > in the Crawley Club newsletter? > > Yes, by all means. Note that I spelt Tesla wrong in the mailing > > -- > Regards, Peter, G3LDO > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14131 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 07:55:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 07:55:03 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nGKd-0008NJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 08:45:59 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nGKa-0008NE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 08:45:56 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.219.142] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nGKJ-0000sx-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 07:45:39 +0000 Message-ID: <39105FF0.940C6192@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 17:20:48 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: GPS Signals Accurate Now!!! References: <200005021425_MC2-A375-6529@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" wrote: > Hello, > > for those of you using GPS receivers to measure distances for example for > field strehgth measurements (Gamal and I used a Garmin GPS45XL for our > field strength profile of DCF39 and I used this unit to measure the profile > of my own transmitter), here is some great news from the AMRAD e-mail > reflector: > > > In the next few days, we should be getting an announcement that the > > selective availability system will be either turned off or reduced in > > some fashion. See http://www.igeb.gov/ > > Cliff K7RR > > Indeed, it happened midnight last night! SA is off, and recording of my GPS > signal with a stationary antenna shows that all fixes are within a circle > of 15m radius (95% even within 10m radius!). Altitude error is also reduced > down to 1.5 times the horizontal error, so you can climb up your tower and > measure the height of it using GPS! > > Also time measurment accuracy using GPS should have increased according to > what I read on the internet (great news for those experimenting with > synchronized signals on LF!). > > So, what do they do with all those longwave DGPS stations? More sites and > tower to be activated before they are de-commissioned (and what do they do > with the evacuated frequencies after de-commissioning ... )! Hi Geri I use a Garmin GPS III and find it very useful. I checked today and find the accuracy indicated for location was 17 feet. This model has a world map and selectable maidenhead loc system so that I can measure any distance world wide accurately, plus all the other functions. The computer and mathematical approach is now redundant and it all fits into my pocket hi 73 MAL/G3KEV > > > Best 73 > > Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) > http://www.qru.de From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12174 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 07:58:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 07:58:03 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nGKe-0008NP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 08:46:00 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nGKd-0008ND-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 08:45:59 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.219.142] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nGKH-0000sv-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 07:45:37 +0000 Message-ID: <39105DF1.BD7E056D@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 17:12:17 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: qsl info Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: If anyone that I have worked recently from GI requires a qsl card pse send your card via G3KEV direct and I will return one direct. I was only running qrp for testing purposes and the best dx was SM6PXJ plus some other EU and best G dx was G3BDQ on the south coast plus 3 GW stns. The equipment for the trip was :- RX - TS 570/250 hz cw filter/and dsp facility down to 50 hz bw plus external dsp unit down to 10 hz bw. TX - a few watts. Antenna - 2 x inv L each one 120 feet vertical and over 300 ft horiz. Ground system - 4 insulated radials each over 300 ft long and elevated above ground, the far end of each connected to metal latice sheep fence that runs for miles across fields. Big sheep and cattle country. The qth is rural and very quiet apart from the odd rain static. No problems on RX. I could hear the proverbial pin drop. I did also listen and work MI0AYZ/GI3PDN xband on 73 khz and again 73 is so quiet. I did hear a couple of others on 73 khz with very good signals trying to work MI0AYZ/GI3PDN but he was struggling due to RX problems both on 73 and 136 khz. The only qso that took place while I was listening was with G3YXM. That was probably a first on 73 khz. My qth near Cookstown is further west than AYZ or PDN. On my next visit I intend to extend the antenna system by adding one or possibly two more inv L antennas at the same 120 ft height but top will be at least 600 ft long for each. I will be testing QRO at the 1w erp level for Nov translantic tests, hopefully I will be able to make a qso across to W/VE when the time comes or maybe before. After testing various vertical systems, I find that the inv L approach is best, with all the L top sections spaced as far as possible from each other around 360 degrees at the top and tapering down vertically to a common point at the top of the loading/matching inductor. This works well for 100/120 ft towers in my case and probably higher towers. Thanks to all that called me and had a qso. I was only qrp and do realise that those using small loops and low long wires dangling or touching the ground did not have much chance. 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17414 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 08:15:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 08:15:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nGgK-00002s-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 09:08:24 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nGgG-00002n-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 09:08:20 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id JAA03626; Thu, 4 May 2000 09:11:11 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 8929 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 09:04:19 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 09:04:19 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id HAA20379; Thu, 4 May 2000 07:53:10 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma020290; Thu, 4 May 00 07:52:36 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 09:11:53 +0100 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id <2J09085M>; Thu, 4 May 2000 09:06:20 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528B5@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Spectran accuracy Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 09:06:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Another problem with soundcards is that of timebase accuracy, and in some cases even stability. Many cases of severe errors were identified by G3PLX during the development of PSK31 In the better cards (real Soundblaster compatibles) the frequencies are derived from dedicated correct frequency crystals so the CD sampling rates derived from 44100 Hz are exact (well, within crystal accuracy anyway). The 8 kHz rate is a different matter though. This cannot be derived exactly from the same xtal as the 44k1 rates, and an approximation is often taken by selecting the nearest integer divide ratio. Errors seen here amount to several Hz at 8 kHz depending on the individual chip set in use. The best cards have a separate xtal for this rate and the exact frequency is generated. Some SB hardware built onto PC motherboards uses whatever crystal is in the PC (often the 14.318 MHz one) to generate the SB sampling rates. Again with integer dividers errors of several Hz can be seen. The worst, according to Peter, is a CR controlled system. I have never seen anything this bad and the story may be apocryphal, but he has had errors of many 10s of Hz at 8kHz reported. I have checked the following : 1) Older 16 bit true Soundblaster - all sampling rates exact (meaning within about 10 parts per million of the true values) 2) Newer PCI bus compatible true Soundblaster - ditto. 3) Onboard SB hardware on a wide range of Dell pentiums (Pentia ? :-) - 44k1 derivatives 'exact'. Errors from 0 to 6 Hz on the 8 kHz rate depending on age / type of machine. 4) Toshiba satellite laptop - 44k1 derivatives 'exact' , 8 kHz rate - 7 Hz error PSK31 has a calibration routine built in to take out this sampling rate error and store the calibration constant. But with the temperature ranges that PCs go through from turn on to several hours of operation, the crude packaged oscillators they use can easily move a few 10s of PPM. At 8 kHz this drift alone is several times the minimum Sprectran resolution and a few Hz initial error is off the scale without calibration ! Andy G4JNT > >>Further I noticed that launching another application while running > Spectran > >>caused a kind of 'frequency shift' (see screenshot at my webpage). > >> > >Alberto found this same problem, but he says that debugging will be > difficult, > >and will probably take some time. Incidentally, he is releasing a new > "beta" > >version (beta3). > > Just to straigthen things a bit up : we are talking of two different > problems : > > 1) The frequency error Marco is talking about, is known to me since > some time, > and it is caused by a wrong initial design assumption of Spectran, > i.e. that the > frequency ruler scale must start at an integral multiple of 1 Hz. > This because at > that time Spectran was meant for EME use, where sub-Hertz > resolutions are not > needed. Now that with beta 3 we can do down to 21 milliHz, this > must revised. > > 2) The frequency shift observed and reported by Rik and Alan, is a > completely new > thing, for which, at the moment, I have no explanation. I saw, one > time only, a shift > of 0.5 Hz, which I attributed to my RX. I wasn't launching or > using any other > application at the moment. As this shift has been signalled by > more than one person, > and on signals locked to some standards, then I must investigated > into it. > > Thanks for those reports, and don't be shy to send others. The very > first reason for > putting out a beta before the final release was just to receive this > kind of reports. > > 73s > Alberto I2PHD > ----------------- > > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2084 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 09:37:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 09:37:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nHs9-0000dN-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 10:24:41 +0100 Received: from ulexite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nHs5-0000dH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 10:24:38 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (2410808825.dialin.freeler.nl [143.178.5.249]) by ulexite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id 9B460FAF12 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 08:23:05 -0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <007901bfb5aa$80860dc0$f905b28f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000201bfb515$8e7a8cc0$dd24893e@lvm> Subject: LF: Re: Re. Beacon Power control. Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 10:50:37 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
To All from PA0SE
 
This is certainly not naive Laurie.
 
I understand that in the LF aeronautical non directional beacons and ILS locators in our country such a series resistor is indeed included to avoid rain, snow and glazed frost detuning the aerial.
 
73, Dick, PA0SE
----- Oorspronkelijk bericht -----
Verzonden: woensdag 3 mei 2000 17:37
Onderwerp: LF: Re. Beacon Power control.

Hi All,
Perhaps this is just too naive-but would it not be possible to put a resistor in series to swamp the Ant.system resistance so that changes in it have little or at least less effect on the current! This would of course require more power  to get the required current but for such a low power beacon this should not be too difficult. 73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9510 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 09:52:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 09:52:38 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nIBj-0000o2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 10:44:55 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nIBi-0000nx-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 10:44:54 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #35) id 12nIBC-0005tp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 4 May 2000 10:44:23 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Thu, 04 May 2000 10:35:29 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 10:35:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: 73 KHz Closure In-reply-to: <3.0.5.32.20000503142218.00a43480@sunf0> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > When is the band taken away? Midnight (presumably UTC) on 30 June 2000. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11554 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 12:19:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 12:19:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nKTR-00024B-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 13:11:21 +0100 Received: from cyb01.axime.com ([160.92.120.38] helo=cybv01.axime.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nKTN-00021C-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 13:11:18 +0100 Received: from MARC ([213.36.34.185]) by cybv01.axime.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with SMTP id FU1B5100.SCW for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 14:10:13 +0200 Message-ID: <001801bfb5c1$e84959a0$0600a8c0@MARC> From: "mv tsi" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: F5MAF site update Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 14:10:49 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
I have just update my site.(some PBs with wave files, new photos,...)
I thinks that now, there are no more problems.
Thanks Dave for the PB.
73
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7470 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 15:16:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 15:16:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nNDG-0003Vi-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 16:06:50 +0100 Received: from d06lmsgate-2.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.2] helo=lmsfw1.emea.ibm.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nNDF-0003VX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 16:06:49 +0100 Received: from d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.148]) by lmsfw1.emea.ibm.com (1.0.0) with ESMTP id PAA84788 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 15:54:48 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from usa.net (lig32-239-133-71.emea.lig-dial.ibm.com [32.239.133.71]) by d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id QAA18594 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 16:05:54 +0100 Message-ID: <391191C2.8E508B5F@usa.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 17:05:38 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" Organization: Undisclosed X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: GPS Signals Accurate Now!!! References: <200005021425_MC2-A375-6529@compuserve.com> <39105FF0.940C6192@netscapeonline.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: While we are discussing GPS, I have a question for all of you. I bought a few months ago an OEM 5000 GPS board, made circa 1993 by Magellan, because someone had told me that on the interface there were available the 1 pps signal derived from the received signals from the satellites, with the accuracy and stability of their Cesium clocks, +/- the SA. I was intending to homebrew something similar to the Shera project appeared in a past issue of QST. I have been unable to find that 1 pps signal, however. It just seems not to be present on the interface. But there is a hope. A few pins do not have signal on them, as seen on the 'scope, but they have traces on the PCB leading somewhere. My last hope is that the 1 pps signal must be enabled by some command to the GPS unit. Can anybody shed some light on this ? Anybody on this list that has experience with the Magellan OM 5000 ? Thanks for any advice. Alberto I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1904 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 18:22:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 18:22:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nQ9T-00058I-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 19:15:07 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nQ9Q-00058D-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 19:15:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as21-s15-139-173.cwci.net ([195.44.139.173] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nQ99-00038D-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 18:14:47 +0000 Message-ID: <3911A7FD.F0B1E5C5@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 16:40:29 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: MORSE SUBSTITUTE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All Since data modes are becomming the substitute for morse, why not replace the morse test with keyboard skills, say a typing test of 12 wpm. Most computer input data is entered via a keyboard. Who could argue that was old hat and out of date!!!!!!!!! All the data modes, Amtor. Ptor, Rtty, Gtor, Psk31, Pkt etc need keyboard manipulation. The only thing worse than a poor cw operator is someone fumbling on a keyboard with 2 fingers!!!!!!!!!! G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26129 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 18:39:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 18:39:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nQQg-0005II-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 19:32:54 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ds-img-1.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.134] helo=spdmgaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nQQf-0005I3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 19:32:53 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id OAA14049 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 4 May 2000 14:32:05 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 14:29:54 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: MORSE SUBSTITUTE To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005041430_MC2-A3C1-EF82@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello, >Hi All >Since data modes are becomming the substitute for morse, why not replace >the morse test with keyboard skills, say a typing test of 12 wpm. Most >computer input data is entered via a keyboard. >Who could argue that was old hat and out of date!!!!!!!!! All the data >modes, Amtor. Ptor, Rtty, Gtor, Psk31, Pkt etc need keyboard >manipulation. >The only thing worse than a poor cw operator is someone fumbling on a >keyboard with 2 fingers!!!!!!!!!! > >G3KEV I have no problems with that when I do Slow CW QSOs ... Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) "Longwave enthusiasts do it extremely slow!" From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9972 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 19:07:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 19:07:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nQrR-0005XR-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 20:00:33 +0100 Received: from mashie.force9.net ([195.166.128.30]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nQrP-0005WQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 20:00:32 +0100 Received: (qmail 26205 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 19:04:28 -0000 Received: from rack.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.65) by mashie.force9.net with SMTP; 4 May 2000 19:04:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 8809 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 18:59:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO picks) (212.159.72.134) by rack.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 18:59:15 -0000 Message-ID: <003601bfb5fb$1df0c3c0$86489fd4@f9.net.uk> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3911A7FD.F0B1E5C5@netscapeonline.co.uk> Subject: LF: Re: MORSE SUBSTITUTE Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 20:01:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Mal wrote.. > The only thing worse than a poor cw operator is someone fumbling on a > keyboard with 2 fingers!!!!!!!!!! > Bother! That's me stuffed on both counts...... Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27131 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 20:32:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 20:32:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nSAf-0006FL-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 21:24:29 +0100 Received: from post.interalpha.co.uk ([195.26.224.18] helo=post.interalpha.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nSAd-0006FG-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 21:24:27 +0100 Received: from g4jnt (sot-mod14.interalpha.net [195.26.225.14]) by post.interalpha.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA11157 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 21:33:07 +0100 Message-ID: <001601bfb606$cb84cbc0$0ee11ac3@g4jnt> From: "Andy Talbot" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: GPS Signals Accurate Now!!! Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:24:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Unfortunately Magellan appear to be the odd ones out on GPS receivers. I have a Magellan Trailblazer, circa 1993-4 which is almost certainly similar to yours, and there is no trace of a 1 PPS signal inside the unit; I searched very hard for it ! In the end I gave up and bought a Garmin GPS25 module from TAPR. That turned out to be a good move as the device is very very much better at locking up (1 minute fom cold instead of up to 20 minutes) with more info available in the NMEA sentences - and of course the 1 PPS. Since SA was turned off, over the last two hours the mean position of my house has drifted just 2 metres RMS with an absolute worst case shift of 3.6m. I reckon that with a locking system like the Shera one and a good stable ovened VCXO, a frequency standard to rival Rubidium and verging on Caesium accuracy may now be possible. Getting a good enough VCXO will be the difficult part. Andy G4JNT -----Original Message----- From: Alberto di Bene To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: 04 May 2000 16:53 Subject: Re: LF: GPS Signals Accurate Now!!! >While we are discussing GPS, I have a question for all of you. >I bought a few months ago an OEM 5000 GPS board, made >circa 1993 by Magellan, because someone had told me that >on the interface there were available the 1 pps signal derived >from the received signals from the satellites, with the accuracy >and stability of their Cesium clocks, +/- the SA. > >I was intending to homebrew something similar to the Shera >project appeared in a past issue of QST. > >I have been unable to find that 1 pps signal, however. It just seems >not to be present on the interface. But there is a hope. >A few pins do not have signal on them, as seen on the 'scope, >but they have traces on the PCB leading somewhere. My last hope >is that the 1 pps signal must be enabled by some command to the >GPS unit. > >Can anybody shed some light on this ? Anybody on this list that >has experience with the Magellan OM 5000 ? Thanks for any advice. > >Alberto I2PHD > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9090 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 20:46:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 20:46:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nSOJ-0006LV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 21:38:35 +0100 Received: from post.interalpha.co.uk ([195.26.224.18] helo=post.interalpha.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nSOH-0006LP-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 21:38:34 +0100 Received: from g4jnt (sot-mod05.interalpha.net [195.26.225.5]) by post.interalpha.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA11939 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 21:47:14 +0100 Message-ID: <002701bfb608$c40c5780$0ee11ac3@g4jnt> From: "Andy Talbot" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: MORSE SUBSTITUTE Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:38:19 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: My problem with Morse (I did use it once upon a time) is getting the words down onto paper these days. After 15 years of using word processors for everything, I've forgotton how to hand write fast enough - can't even do joined up writing at 12 WPM now. I know this is a common occurance amongst many computer users, it was featured in a TV prog. about it a month or so ago ! Lets set the keyboard test at 20 WPM and make spelling [no using of F7 of course] and correct English part of it too :-) Andy 'JNT -----Original Message----- From: 'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW To: INTERNET:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: 04 May 2000 20:16 Subject: LF: MORSE SUBSTITUTE >Hello, > >>Hi All >>Since data modes are becomming the substitute for morse, why not replace >>the morse test with keyboard skills, say a typing test of 12 wpm. Most >>computer input data is entered via a keyboard. >>Who could argue that was old hat and out of date!!!!!!!!! All the data >>modes, Amtor. Ptor, Rtty, Gtor, Psk31, Pkt etc need keyboard >>manipulation. >>The only thing worse than a poor cw operator is someone fumbling on a >>keyboard with 2 fingers!!!!!!!!!! >> >>G3KEV > >I have no problems with that when I do Slow CW QSOs ... > >Best 73 > >Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) > >"Longwave enthusiasts do it extremely slow!" > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27579 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 20:59:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 20:59:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nSXD-0006RK-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 21:47:47 +0100 Received: from postfix2.free.fr ([212.27.32.74] ident=postfix) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nSXB-0006RE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 21:47:46 +0100 Received: from f5maf (toulouse-1-5-130.dial.proxad.net [213.228.5.130]) by postfix2.free.fr (Postfix) with SMTP id A4BD674A3B for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 22:35:39 +0200 (MEST) Message-ID: <005e01bfb608$ab1f1dc0$4d05e4d5@f5maf> From: "f5maf" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: GPS Signals Accurate Now!!! Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 22:37:34 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Be carrful some time on EOM board ( TRIMBLE)
 the output PPS is open collector , you must use a 1K resistor (in pull up).
Normally PPS is automatic, any command.
Best 73 marc F5MAF
 
-----Message d'origine-----
De : Alberto di Bene <dibene@usa.net>
Ŕ : rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Date : jeudi 4 mai 2000 17:44
Objet : Re: LF: GPS Signals Accurate Now!!!

>While we are discussing GPS, I have a question for all of you.
>I bought a few months ago an OEM 5000  GPS board, made
>circa 1993 by Magellan, because someone had told me that
>on the interface there were available the 1 pps signal derived
>from the received signals from the satellites, with the accuracy
>and stability of their Cesium clocks, +/- the SA.
>
>I was intending to homebrew something similar to the Shera
>project appeared in a past issue of QST.
>
>I have been unable to find that 1 pps signal, however. It just seems
>not to be present on the interface. But there is a hope.
>A few pins do not have signal on them, as seen on the 'scope,
>but they have traces on the PCB leading somewhere. My last hope
>is that the 1 pps signal must be enabled by some command to the
>GPS unit.
>
>Can anybody shed some light on this ? Anybody on this list that
>has experience with the Magellan OM 5000 ? Thanks for any advice.
>
>Alberto    I2PHD
>
>
>
> From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2552 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 21:01:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 21:01:17 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nSd3-0006Va-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 21:53:49 +0100 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nSd2-0006VU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 21:53:48 +0100 Received: from oemcomputer (man-105.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.40.135]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id VAA24579 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 21:53:28 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: irwell.zetnet.co.uk: Host man-105.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.40.135] claimed to be oemcomputer Message-ID: <000601bfb60a$e3245300$8728f7c2@oemcomputer> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <002701bfb608$c40c5780$0ee11ac3@g4jnt> Subject: LF: Re: Re: MORSE SUBSTITUTE Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:53:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: ----- Original Message ----- From: Andy Talbot To: Sent: Thursday, May 04, 2000 9:38 PM Subject: LF: Re: MORSE SUBSTITUTE > My problem with Morse (I did use it once upon a time) is getting the words > down onto paper these days. After 15 years of using word processors for > everything, I've forgotton how to hand write fast enough... Why write? Treat Morse as another language. I haven't taken QSOs verbatim(?) for over 30 years, just the essentials - RST etc. In any case, professional ROs used to take Morse at 27 words per minute on a typewriter, so you ought to be able to use a keyboard for the purpose. Give it a go anyway. 73 de John Rabson G3PAI From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4842 invoked from network); 4 May 2000 21:13:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 May 2000 21:13:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nSmY-0006dJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 22:03:38 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from fm215.facility.pipex.com ([194.131.104.225]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nSmW-0006dD-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 May 2000 22:03:36 +0100 Received: from isis (userb634.uk.uudial.com [193.149.83.109]) by fm215.facility.pipex.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA04867 for ; Thu, 4 May 2000 22:02:27 +0100 (BST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.20000504210039.009b2ad0@mail.pncl.co.uk> X-Sender: blanch@mail.pncl.co.uk (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 22:02:55 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Walter Blanchard" Subject: LF: GPS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit For those interested, here's the official statement on GPS :

Quote:                    THE WHITE HOUSE
                       Office of the Press Secretary
 _____________________________________________________
For Immediate Release                        May 1, 2000

STATEMENT BY THE PRESIDENT REGARDING THE UNITED STATES'
DECISION TO STOP DEGRADING GLOBAL POSITIONING SYSTEM
ACCURACY

Today, I am pleased to announce that the United States will stop the
intentional degradation of the Global Positioning System (GPS) signals
available to the public beginning at midnight tonight.  We call this
degradation feature Selective Availability (SA). This will mean that
civilian users of GPS will be able to pinpoint locations up to ten times
more accurately than they do now.  GPS is a dual use, satellite based system
that provides accurate location and timing data to users worldwide.My
March 1996 Presidential Decision Directive included in the goals for GPSto:
"encourage acceptance and integration of GPS into peaceful civil, commercial
and scientific applications worldwide; and to encourage private sector
investment in and use of U.S. GPS technologies and services."  To meet these
goals, I committed the U.S. to discontinuing the use of SA by 2006 with an
annual assessment of its continued use beginning this year.The decision to
discontinue SA is the latest measure in an ongoing effortto make GPS more
responsive to civil and commercial users worldwide.  Last year, Vice President
Gore announced our plans to modernize GPS by adding two new civilian signals
to enhance the civil and commercial service.  This initiative is ontrack and the
budget further advances modernization by incorporating some of the new
features on up to 18 additional satellites that are already awaiting launch or are
in production.  We will continue to provide all of these capabilities to worldwide
users free of charge. My decision to discontinue SA was based upon a
recommendation by the Secretary of Defense in coordination with the Departments
of State,Transportation, Commerce, the Director of Central Intelligence, and other
Executive Branch Departments and Agencies.  They realized that worldwide
transportation safety, scientific, and commercial interests could best be served by
discontinuation of SA.  Along with our commitment to enhance GPS for peaceful
applications, my administration is committed to preserving fully the military utility of GPS. 
The decision to discontinue SA is coupled with our continuing efforts to upgrade
the military utility of our systems that use GPS, and is supported by threat assessments
which conclude that setting SA to zero at this time would have minimal impact on
national security.  Additionally, we have demonstrated the capability to selectively deny
GPS signals on a regional basis when our national security is threatened. 
This regional approach to denying navigation services is consistent with the 1996 plan
to discontinue the degradation of civil and commercial GPS service globally through
the SA technique. Originally developed by the Department of Defense as a military
system, GPS has become a global utility.  It benefits users around the world in
many different applications, including air, road, marine, and rail navigation,
telecommunications, emergency response, oil exploration, mining, and many more. 
Civilian users will realize a dramatic improvement in GPS accuracy with the discontinuation
of SA.  For example, emergency teams responding to a cry for help can now determine
what side of the highway they must respond to, thereby saving precious minutes. 
This increase in accuracy will allow new GPS applications to emerge and continue to
enhance the lives of people around the world."



 From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18218 invoked from network); 5 May 2000 12:26:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 May 2000 12:26:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nh4j-0005Yp-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 13:19:21 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nh4c-0005Yj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 13:19:14 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id OAA764626 for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 14:18:55 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000505141455.21ffadcc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 14:14:55 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Spectran accuracy In-reply-to: <39129641.7B25DF02@netscapeonline.co.uk> References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528B5@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Everybody who is involved in extreme narrowband mode such as QRSS and DFCW will confirm that signals that are 10 to 20dB below the 'normal CW' detectable level can still be copied and lead to a QSO. OK, it takes about 30 minutes or more but this time period is accepted for Meteor Scatter contact on VHF (I believe that the time limit for a valid QSO is 2 hours for MS). Nothing wrong with being a 'die hard' CW operator, but that is no reason for neglecting the fact that extreme narrowband modes are superior to 'normal speed' CW when it comes to signal to noise ratio. Both theory and practise proves this. 73, Rik ON7YD >Keep it SIMPLE all that is required is a good cw operator at each end with >well filtered, selective symmetrical EARS able to read morse through qrn and >qrm and a steady hand for sending. >There is none of this palaver required on the other bands so why 136 khz. CW >operators in Europe are working ZL and other dx locations frequently through >qrn, qrm and other difficulties on 160 metres. The cw method is simple and very >effective for those competent and experienced and very COST EFFECTIVE for radio >amateur type of communications. > .... From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27723 invoked from network); 5 May 2000 12:28:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 May 2000 12:28:01 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nggv-0005LZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 12:54:45 +0100 Received: from d06lmsgate.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nggs-0005LQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 12:54:44 +0100 Received: from d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.148]) by d06lmsgate.uk.ibm.COM (1.0.0) with ESMTP id MAA91378 for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 12:43:24 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from usa.net (dyn9-87-116-182.italy.ibm.com [9.87.116.182]) by d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id MAA68190 for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 12:53:40 +0100 Message-ID: <3912B636.B53BDA66@usa.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 13:53:26 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" Organization: Undisclosed X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Spectran accuracy References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528B5@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> <39129641.7B25DF02@netscapeonline.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: g3kev wrote: > > Keep it SIMPLE all that is required is a good cw operator at each end with well > filtered, selective symmetrical EARS able to read morse through qrn and qrm and a > steady hand for sending. > [snip] Are you able to decode CW which is 15 dB *below* the noise ? CW that is not at all perceptible even with the most selective ears ? If so, all my congratulations, you are the only that can do that. In case you have missed it, all this *digital stuff* is meant to make possible reception of CW where the ears can not even tell that a CW signal is present. And this is the case with 137 kHz. 73, Alberto I2PHD P.S. Have you perhaps forgotten a smiling emoticon :-) at the end of your message ? From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1197 invoked from network); 5 May 2000 12:38:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 May 2000 12:38:35 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nhGh-0005fY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 13:31:43 +0100 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nhGe-0005fT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 13:31:40 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12nhGJ-0004TJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 5 May 2000 13:31:19 +0100 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Fri, 05 May 2000 13:21:53 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 13:21:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: GOOD NEWS on 73kHz X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I have posted the following on the RSGB's web site (www.rsgb.org) today: ------------------------ At a meeting on Thursday 4 May, the Radiocommunications Agency agreed to a request from the RSGB for continued use of the 73kHz band. This UK-only amateur band was first allocated early in 1998 for two years whilst international negotiations for the pan-European 136kHz band were taking place. The band was due to be withdrawn on 31 December 1999 but was later extended to 30 June 2000. Amateur experiments at this frequency are ongoing so a request was made for a continuation of the allocation. The RA has agreed initially for a further year, to 30 June 2001, but has not ruled out discussions on an extension beyond that date. Operation on the 71.6 - 74.4kHz band is by special Notice of Variation to the normal licence, and no new NoVs are envisaged. Licence conditions restrict the ERP to 1W and any operation away from the licensee's home address must be notified to the authorities. Experiments have resulted in several UK stations, running less than 100mW ERP, being received in a number of European countries at distances of over 1000km. A lecture on the results of the 73kHz experiment to date is part of the programme for the RSGB HF Convention this year. -------------------------- Mike Dennison, G3XDV Publications Manager * RadCom * Ham Radio Today * GB2RS News * * RSGB Books and CDs * Radio Society of Great Britain Lambda House, Cranborne Road Potters Bar, Herts UK, EN6 3JE Tel: +44 (0) 1707 659015; Fax: +44 (0) 1707 645105 RSGB - UK AMATEUR RADIO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29058 invoked from network); 5 May 2000 13:22:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 May 2000 13:22:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nhvD-00061t-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 14:13:35 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nhvB-00061o-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 14:13:33 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12nhrz-000069-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 14:10:15 +0100 Message-ID: <27959.200005051319@gemini> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "James Moritz" Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 14:19:51 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: GOOD NEWS on 73kHz In-reply-to: X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, G3XDV wrote: > The RA has agreed > initially for a further year, to 30 June 2001, but has not ruled out > discussions on an extension beyond that date. Great news! With 73k available over another winter, who knows what is possible - Transatlantic III anyone? Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21856 invoked from network); 5 May 2000 18:29:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 May 2000 18:29:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nmk4-00005x-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 19:22:24 +0100 Received: from mta3-gui.server.ntli.net ([194.168.54.144] helo=mta3-svc.virgin.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nmk3-00005s-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 19:22:23 +0100 Received: from default ([62.252.40.113]) by mta3-svc.virgin.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000505182022.EFVG5875.mta3-svc.virgin.net@default> for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 19:20:22 +0100 Message-ID: <003601bfb6bf$1c8d6320$7128fc3e@default> From: "peter cleall" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: GOOD NEWS on 73kHz Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 19:23:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Congratulations and thanks Mike for your efforts regards Peter G8AFN -----Original Message----- From: Mike Dennison To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: 05 May 2000 13:36 Subject: LF: GOOD NEWS on 73kHz I have posted the following on the RSGB's web site (www.rsgb.org) today: ------------------------ At a meeting on Thursday 4 May, the Radiocommunications Agency agreed to a request from the RSGB for continued use of the 73kHz band. This UK-only amateur band was first allocated early in 1998 for two years whilst international negotiations for the pan-European 136kHz band were taking place. The band was due to be withdrawn on 31 December 1999 but was later extended to 30 June 2000. Amateur experiments at this frequency are ongoing so a request was made for a continuation of the allocation. The RA has agreed initially for a further year, to 30 June 2001, but has not ruled out discussions on an extension beyond that date. Operation on the 71.6 - 74.4kHz band is by special Notice of Variation to the normal licence, and no new NoVs are envisaged. Licence conditions restrict the ERP to 1W and any operation away from the licensee's home address must be notified to the authorities. Experiments have resulted in several UK stations, running less than 100mW ERP, being received in a number of European countries at distances of over 1000km. A lecture on the results of the 73kHz experiment to date is part of the programme for the RSGB HF Convention this year. -------------------------- Mike Dennison, G3XDV Publications Manager * RadCom * Ham Radio Today * GB2RS News * * RSGB Books and CDs * Radio Society of Great Britain Lambda House, Cranborne Road Potters Bar, Herts UK, EN6 3JE Tel: +44 (0) 1707 659015; Fax: +44 (0) 1707 645105 RSGB - UK AMATEUR RADIO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1817 invoked from network); 5 May 2000 19:22:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 May 2000 19:22:23 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nnZB-0000aG-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 20:15:13 +0100 Received: from fortune-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.203] helo=fortune.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nnZ9-0000a9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 05 May 2000 20:15:11 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by fortune.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000505191418.BHRK14358.fortune.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 12:14:18 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <12229831.957554058180.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 12:14:18 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: MORSE SUBSTITUTE MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 62.7.130.191 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Mal, Learn to touch type, it is well worth the effort. John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24808 invoked from network); 6 May 2000 02:13:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 May 2000 02:13:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ntuq-000429-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 03:02:00 +0100 Received: from tomts2.bellnexxia.net ([209.226.175.140] helo=tomts2-srv.bellnexxia.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ntum-0003zD-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 03:01:56 +0100 Received: from server1 ([206.172.245.177]) by tomts2-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000506020101.DURH1435.tomts2-srv.bellnexxia.net@server1> for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 22:01:01 -0400 Message-ID: <000601bfb6fe$6ec18d30$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RF Thermo Couple Meter, calibration? Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 21:56:46 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Greetings All: I uncovered two ancient RF Thermo Couple Meters this evening, I had put them away some years ago in anticipation that at some point I might want to measure RF amps. They are identical, made in 1940, Ref No. 10A/8479. Full scale 2.5 amperes, noted "for Radio Frequency Only". They are of what I would call "light construction" not the heavy duty construction that one associates with the better products made for WW II. How might I calibrate them? I have some excellent calibrated resistors but they are in general a little small to get a couple of amps into them without some residual damage. Is some 60 Hz a little to low "for Radio Frequency Only"? If anyone has a simple process I would appreciate hearing about it. Thanks in advance. Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5276 invoked from network); 6 May 2000 02:54:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 May 2000 02:54:58 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nudP-0004KD-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 03:48:03 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo-r20.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.162] helo=imo-r20.mail.aol.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nudN-0004K6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 03:48:02 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo-r20.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.5a.4c7dc66 (16789) for ; Fri, 5 May 2000 22:47:08 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <5a.4c7dc66.2644e1ac@aol.com> Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 22:47:08 EDT Subject: Re: LF: RF Thermo Couple Meter, calibration? To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 102 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Larry, For most thermocouple ammeters, 60 Hz is sufficient to check calibration. The discrepancy between 60 Hz and 137 kHz should not exceed a very few percent. If your AC source is substantially sinusoidal, a fairly common DVM with at least a 3 amp scale will do the job quite nicely. 73, John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9043 invoked from network); 6 May 2000 05:31:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 May 2000 05:31:55 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nx53-0005S0-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 06:24:45 +0100 Received: from smtp4.ihug.co.nz ([203.109.252.5]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nx51-0005Rt-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 06:24:44 +0100 Received: from tractorb (p11-max19.chc.ihug.co.nz [203.109.196.11]) by smtp4.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id RAA24123 for ; Sat, 6 May 2000 17:24:13 +1200 Message-ID: <01b801bfb71a$7f4f4f40$94804dd1@tractorb> From: "Dave Brown" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000601bfb6fe$6ec18d30$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> Subject: LF: Re: RF Thermo Couple Meter, calibration? Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 17:18:17 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > Greetings All: > > I uncovered two ancient RF Thermo Couple Meters this evening Larry After checking them with the AC mains if you have an rf (LF) power meter or a dummy load plus a tee and scope to check the load voltage, then you can check them 'on frequency' as well. But don't bother if they don't stack up OK at mains freq first. 73 Dave, ZL3FJ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10305 invoked from network); 6 May 2000 05:38:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 May 2000 05:38:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nxD2-0005Wd-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 06:33:00 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ds-img-6.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.139] helo=spdmgaaf.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nxD1-0005WT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 06:32:59 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaaf.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id BAA09906 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 6 May 2000 01:32:11 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 01:31:16 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: Re: LF: RF Thermo Couple Meter, calibration? To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005060131_MC2-A3FC-8954@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Larry, >For most thermocouple ammeters, 60 Hz is sufficient to check calibration. < the type I use here is a russian type (0-3 A) and it says on the meter itself "30 - 50Hz - 7.5 MHz", with the 50 Hz underligned, so it seems they have a wide working range. Good luck, best 73 Ger, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10562 invoked from network); 6 May 2000 05:39:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 May 2000 05:39:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nxEL-0005X2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 06:34:21 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from hs-img-3.compuserve.com ([149.174.177.148] helo=sphmgaac.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12nxEJ-0005Wt-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 06:34:20 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by sphmgaac.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id BAA03903 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 6 May 2000 01:33:32 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 01:33:09 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: GOOD NEWS on 73kHz To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005060133_MC2-A3FC-895E@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Mike, >At a meeting on Thursday 4 May, the Radiocommunications >Agency agreed to a request from the RSGB for continued use of >the 73kHz band. Great news! We haven't had a crossband QSO yet, so now I will start again to further optimize my receiving equipment for 73 kHz and will be QRV for more crossband contacts! We will make it! Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6413 invoked from network); 6 May 2000 17:27:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 May 2000 17:27:23 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12o89Q-0001xY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 18:14:00 +0100 Received: from cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.171]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12o89G-0001x6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 18:13:51 +0100 Received: from modem-38.hippo-tang.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.28.38] helo=h9h2t8) by cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12o88t-00030O-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 18:13:28 +0100 Message-ID: <003701bfb77d$b2927180$261c893e@h9h2t8> From: "Martin Evans." To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000601bfb6fe$6ec18d30$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> Subject: LF: Re: RF Thermo Couple Meter, calibration? Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 18:01:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I always believed that you could calibrate true bolometric RF ammeters using DC? I've checked a couple of thermocouple RF ammeters and it seems to work. Martin Evans Mollie's Loft bookshop 96 High Street Clydach Swansea SA6 5LN Tel 01792 842135 radio@emart.freeserve.co.uk ----- Original Message ----- From: Larry Kayser To: Sent: 06 May 2000 02:56 Subject: LF: RF Thermo Couple Meter, calibration? > Greetings All: > > I uncovered two ancient RF Thermo Couple Meters this evening, I had put them > away some years ago in anticipation that at some point I might want to > measure RF amps. They are identical, made in 1940, Ref No. 10A/8479. Full > scale 2.5 amperes, noted "for Radio Frequency Only". They are of what I > would call "light construction" not the heavy duty construction that one > associates with the better products made for WW II. > > How might I calibrate them? I have some excellent calibrated resistors but > they are in general a little small to get a couple of amps into them without > some residual damage. Is some 60 Hz a little to low "for Radio Frequency > Only"? If anyone has a simple process I would appreciate hearing about it. > > Thanks in advance. > > Larry > VA3LK > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12698 invoked from network); 6 May 2000 18:05:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 May 2000 18:05:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12o8qi-0002Hx-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 18:58:44 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12o8qg-0002Hs-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 18:58:43 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 ([151.25.130.18]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA28456 for ; Sat, 6 May 2000 19:58:22 +0200 Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 19:58:22 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000506185622.0108a610@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Sat, 06 May 2000 18:58:52 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: Re: RF Thermo Couple Meter, calibration? In-reply-to: <003701bfb77d$b2927180$261c893e@h9h2t8> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >I always believed that you could calibrate true bolometric RF ammeters using >DC? I've checked a couple of thermocouple RF ammeters and it seems to work. >Martin Evans You can, if you calibrate in DC reversing the current flow and averaging the readings. Many thermocouple ammeters exibit asymmetries, probably due to other thermocouple effects in the joints, that are nulled in AC. 73, Marco IK1ODO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12375 invoked from network); 6 May 2000 18:09:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 May 2000 18:09:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12o8uu-0002Jx-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 19:03:04 +0100 Received: from fortune-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.203] helo=fortune.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12o8ut-0002Js-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 19:03:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by fortune.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000506180215.BTQP21741.fortune.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Sat, 6 May 2000 11:02:15 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <33120287.957636135540.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 11:02:15 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: My TS850 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 213.1.50.16 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Dave, What about telling us how to do it - I refer to 64 pin Surface Mount Devices? I found it a real struggle to solder in an 8-pin DDS SMD but did improve with practice (killed the first one!). One of the most important things I found was the need to use a 0.1 mm bit on the soldering iron. Anything bigger just won't do. The special reels of solder are very expensive too. The handbook/radcom don't tell us the secrets of success. So please any hints would be welcome, since it is clear that components are all going to get a lot smaller. John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27953 invoked from network); 6 May 2000 18:24:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 May 2000 18:24:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12o995-0002Se-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 19:17:43 +0100 Received: from ulexite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12o993-0002SZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 19:17:42 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (2410808688.dialin.freeler.nl [143.178.5.112]) by ulexite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id 4DA0BFAF71; Sat, 6 May 2000 17:16:01 -0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <001a01bfb787$4ed4cc60$7005b28f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: "Hendrik de Waard, PA0ZX" , "Ger van Went, PA0GER" , "Hans Peltzer" , "Jetze en Anneke Janzen" , "Klaas Robers, PA0KLS" , "Pieter Bruinsma, PA0PHB" , "RadCom" , "Redactie CQ-PA" , "Redactie Electron" , "Redactie SRS Bulletin" References: <000601bfb6fe$6ec18d30$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> Subject: LF: Re: RF Thermo Couple Meter, calibration? Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 20:16:12 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To All from PA0SE Larry, VA3LK wrote: > Greetings All: > > I uncovered two ancient RF Thermo Couple Meters this evening, I had put them > away some years ago in anticipation that at some point I might want to > measure RF amps. They are identical, made in 1940, Ref No. 10A/8479. Full > scale 2.5 amperes, noted "for Radio Frequency Only". They are of what I > would call "light construction" not the heavy duty construction that one > associates with the better products made for WW II. > > How might I calibrate them? I have some excellent calibrated resistors but > they are in general a little small to get a couple of amps into them without > some residual damage. Is some 60 Hz a little to low "for Radio Frequency > Only"? If anyone has a simple process I would appreciate hearing about it. > > Thanks in advance. > > Larry > VA3LK As an experiment I have put two thermo couple meters in series to measure my antenna current on 137 kHz. The instruments were made by Weston and have a range of 3 A; one has a square case and the other a round one. Both read a RF current of 2.40A . I then connected one of the instruments to read the current in the wire to the bottom end of the antenna loading coil (the top end being too "hot") in series with a resistor of 2.8 Ohm, as measured by a digital ohmmeter. The voltage over the resistor was rectified by a germanium diode and the resulting DC measured by the DVM. The thermocouple meter indicated 2.50A, the DVM 9.12V. The peak RF voltage over the resistor must have been 9.12 V + about 0.3V = 9.42V and the RMS value 9.42V / 1.414 = 6.66V. So the RF current was about 6.66V / 2.8 Ohm = 2.38A; within 4.8% of the reading by the thermo couple meter. I then fed a current of 2.5A at 50Hz through the meters, with a digitial ammeter as reference. The readings were 2.55A and 2.60A, so pretty close to the readings at RF. DC should be avoided for calibration. I fed a current of 2.5A DC to the meters, again checked by the DAM. Readings were 2.55A and 2.12A. I then reversed the direction of the current and readings became 2.55 A and 3.00 A. When the thermo couple is OK I think there is little reason not to trust the reading of a thermo couple meter, even when it is pretty old. My square meter carries a sticker that says it was checked in 1965 for the last time. But when the thermocouple has been blown - not a difficult job I can assure you from personal experience - the reading is only correct when the current is zero amps. Then a totally unconnected question to our friends in the UK and he USA. In The Netherlands we write 5 A, but 5 ampčre, 10 V but 10 volt. So in general the unit is written with a capital when abbreviated but with a lower case when written in full. And with a space between figure and unit. What is correct in English or American, 3 V or 3V?. Same question for 10 amp, 10amp, 10Amp, 10Amps?, etc. And what about rf or RF? if, IF, i.f. or I.F. (intermediate frequency) etc. ? 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17913 invoked from network); 6 May 2000 18:40:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 May 2000 18:40:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12o9Oh-0002Yt-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 19:33:51 +0100 Received: from merlins.plus.net.uk ([195.166.128.23] helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12o9Og-0002Yo-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 06 May 2000 19:33:50 +0100 Received: (qmail 255 invoked from network); 6 May 2000 18:37:38 -0000 Received: from ruin.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.66) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 May 2000 18:37:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 19247 invoked from network); 6 May 2000 18:31:13 -0000 Received: from 107.04-01.quay.dial.plus.net.uk (HELO picks) (212.159.67.107) by ruin.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 May 2000 18:31:13 -0000 Message-ID: <005201bfb789$c1409160$6b439fd4@f9.net.uk> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <33120287.957636135540.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Subject: Re: LF: My TS850 Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 19:34:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: John. > What about telling us how to do it - I refer to 64 pin Surface Mount > Devices? I had the advantage of a quick "course" on surface-mount installation by a sales rep for a soldering-iron company! The secret to installing the things is to use a flux-pen and coat all the legs and pads with flux. Excess solder then just runs off and doesn't tend to "stick" between the legs. The final trick is to use an iron with a concave bit, I think Weller now do one, this draws solder into its dimple and, in conjunction with the flux, makes it easy to clean away solder bridges. You just run the tinned iron along the row of pins and Bob's yer uncle! Well... if your lucky! I still spent a long time with a powerful magnifying glass, checking every pin. 73. Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14491 invoked from network); 7 May 2000 08:36:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 May 2000 08:36:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oMKz-00000L-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 09:22:53 +0100 Received: from mta00.talk21.com ([62.172.192.40] helo=t21mta00-app.talk21.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oMKq-00000D-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 09:22:44 +0100 Received: from dave ([62.7.176.179]) by t21mta00-app.talk21.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000507082127.NEED7593.t21mta00-app.talk21.com@dave> for ; Sun, 7 May 2000 09:21:27 +0100 Message-ID: <001301bfb7fd$4cca52c0$b3b0073e@dave> From: "Dave Sergeant" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <33120287.957636135540.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Subject: Re: LF: My TS850 Date: Sun, 7 May 2000 09:19:03 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >From Dave G3YMC John Sexton wrote: >Hi Dave, >What about telling us how to do it - I refer to 64 pin Surface Mount >Devices? I have to replace the occasional surface mount chip in the TVs and Videos I repair, not that many, but growing. Everyone has their own technique, some of them unbelievable and some which require spending loads of money. The method I use is straightforward. Bear in mind though the golden rule - your fault is nearly always somewhere other than in the big chip. Dave seems to have been lucky. To remove chips I use a Weller Pyropen hot air gun. These are 30-40 pounds, there are cheaper ones but I have no idea if they work as well. The chip connections are heated up with the hot air, and after a minute of less it comes loose and can be pushed away with a screwdriver. Clean off any surplus solder. When practicing on scrap boards it is easy to get carried away with the novelty and end up with a pile of chips beautifully removed in a few minutes... As Dave mentions, the secret in soldering chips in is to use liquid flux. This is readily available in small bottles cheaply. The second secret is getting the chip in the right place to start with. Some minutes carefully positioning it with all the legs in the right place is necessary, then when you are happy solder two opposite corner pins to secure. Coat one side with plenty of flux (using the brush in the bottle) and then solder. I have done this with a standard Antex bit, but it is easier with 1mm. Normal solder is OK, don't waste your money on the special stuff. Do not apply too much solder, just enough on each pin. Hold the board vertically with the pins you are soldering facing down and run the iron along each pin such that the excess solder runs downwards. With care you do not get any shorts. Repeat on each of the other edges. You can even apply loads of solder until all the pins are shorted, apply more flux and run the excess off, though this might be asking for trouble. A tip on using manual solder suckers. Put a rubber sleeve over the end of the nozzle, the pump is then much more efficient and the nozzle lasts for ever. Replace the sleeve as required, suitable sleeves are readily available in packs of 100. I have had no success with solder braid myself and don't use it. Others seem to have great faith in this. I shall be giving a talk at the Bracknell club this coming Wednesday on consumer electronics repair, and hope to include a live demonstration of the above techniques. It depends on volunteers bringing some suitable hardware with devices that can be removed (and that they don't want to work again...) For more details e-mail me. 73s Dave dsergeant@iee.org http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sergeantd From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17670 invoked from network); 7 May 2000 08:44:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 May 2000 08:44:51 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oMW6-00005K-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 09:34:22 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oMW5-00005F-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 09:34:21 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.222.205] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oMVl-0003SU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 08:34:03 +0000 Message-ID: <39151BFF.4B7C767D@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 07 May 2000 07:32:15 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: 136 ACTY Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All. The band has been very quiet this past week, think the qrn from rain static, very bad a times has scared everybody away. There is not the same activity that there used to be, some months ago it was difficult to find a slot to work without causing adjacent frequency qrm. Narrow filters and dsp were essential. In spite of all this a new one appeared this morning OK1DTN/Ruda. We had a nice qso at 0749z and he was pleased to work the UK for the first time. Not a new country for me because I have worked OK1FIG many times. One thought about band conditions. The transatlantic tests in November might be hampered by static because October/November are generally wet and thundery especially Western parts of the UK and North West Europe ie Western France and down as far as Northern Spain/Portugal The best months would probably be late December to the beginning of March. Others might have some statistics and observations. 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27504 invoked from network); 7 May 2000 09:13:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 May 2000 09:13:49 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oN1y-0000Mr-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 10:07:18 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.41]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oN1x-0000Ml-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 10:07:17 +0100 Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12oN1b-000AkO-0C for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 7 May 2000 09:06:56 +0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 7 May 2000 10:05:04 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" Subject: LF: RF Ammeters and English Language MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Trial Version 3.05 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear Larry and Dick I found a 0.5 A RF ammeter at a club junk sale which is designated 10A/8481. A quick continuity check showed that the thermocouple was OK. There are not many of these functioning units left in captivity because it is just too easy to blow up the thermocouple. So, Larry, I recommend that you do what I did, build a ferrite ring current transformer type and put your thermocouple unit back into storage once you have calibrated it! Dick, capitals are normally used for abreviations i.e. RF not rf. Modern practice, at least in letter writing, is to leave out much of the punctuation which used to be used i.e. RF not R.F. 73, Tom G3OLB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20597 invoked from network); 7 May 2000 11:33:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 May 2000 11:33:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oPAB-0001Jq-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 12:23:55 +0100 Received: from post.interalpha.co.uk ([195.26.224.18] helo=post.interalpha.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oPA7-0001Jl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 12:23:51 +0100 Received: from g4jnt (sot-mod12.interalpha.net [195.26.225.12]) by post.interalpha.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA08036 for ; Sun, 7 May 2000 12:32:55 +0100 Message-ID: <002d01bfb816$c7816300$0ce11ac3@g4jnt> From: "Andy Talbot" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: My TS850 Date: Sun, 7 May 2000 12:23:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by post.interalpha.net id MAA08036 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: A really good headband binocular magifier helps. Such devices are available from RS ref no. 606-989 at x2.7 magnification (Ł52 ish) with alternative lenses for x1.8 to x3.5. Somewhat cheaper is 290-1539 at x2.5 magnification (Ł36). Off the shelf non-prescription glasses (at Ł3 to Ł5) will work for non spectacle wearers, but the convergence is wrong and you must take them off every few minutes to allow your eyes to readjust. Not really recommended for use for more than a few minutes at a time. Also a pair of good quality, fine, non-magnetic tweezers. I do most of my breadboarding in surface mount these days - the PCBs are easier to make. Andy G4JNT -----Original Message----- From: Dave Sergeant To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: 07 May 2000 10:12 Subject: Re: LF: My TS850 >>>From Dave G3YMC > >John Sexton wrote: >>Hi Dave, >>What about telling us how to do it - I refer to 64 pin Surface Mount >>Devices? From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15658 invoked from network); 7 May 2000 14:21:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 May 2000 14:21:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oRoR-0002Yo-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 15:13:39 +0100 Received: from smtp11.bellglobal.com ([204.101.251.53]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oRoP-0002Yj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 15:13:37 +0100 Received: from server1 (Kingston-ppp64657.sympatico.ca [216.208.85.38]) by smtp11.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA08321 for ; Sun, 7 May 2000 10:19:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <002001bfb82d$e6759d50$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RF Ammeters, results, and a new subject Date: Sun, 7 May 2000 10:07:52 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Greetings! Late last evening the Variac and my two RF Thermo Couple ammeters were given some tests based on the information received from this group. Success. The two meters in series across the Variac output and they both track within a few percent up to about 2.2 amps. The second meter has some paint flaking from the meter face plate and the d'Arsonval meter movement is sticky, needing a few taps with my finger to change up or down from time to time. (The spelling of the proper name, d'Arsonval may well be wrong. I have searched through many books here this morning but I am unable to confirm the spelling of the name) I happen to have some precision current transformers and the special meter to go with them, winding a few turns on the primary to get the ratio adjusted led me to be able to calibrate again within a few percent the RF Thermo Couple ammeters to the AC Current meter. I tried the DC calibration and found the readings quite different depending on the direction of the current. I did not carry this part of the testing further. Tom Boucher, G3OLB wrote me.... >I recommend >that you do what I did, build a ferrite ring current transformer type >and put your thermocouple unit back into storage once you have >calibrated it! Tom's call looked familiar so I went to Peter's book and found a "Clamp on Magnetic Current Measurement design by D. Walker, G3OLM. In due course I will build one of these up, but this does point to a new subject. Ferrite and or Iron Powder Cores: For LF, (and up to 10 MHz) Jack, VE1ZZ tells me he just uses cores he recovers from old Television flyback transformers. Others tell me, and I see a reference to using the core material out of old switching mode power supplies in Peter's book. I also have a small selection of bright yellow cores that I bought at a hamfest once. The Question: What are the techniques that one might use to take a sample core and determine the RF capabilities of the core at different frequencies? I have had some blind luck once finding some red coloured cores that performed exactly the same as the expensive ones I bought from Amidon. A more general solution of measurement would be just great - who has some ideas on this? Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19107 invoked from network); 7 May 2000 18:25:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 May 2000 18:25:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oVXW-0004Ho-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 19:12:26 +0100 Received: from postfix3.free.fr ([212.27.32.22] ident=postfix) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oVXV-0004Hj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 19:12:25 +0100 Received: from f5maf (toulouse-1-4-74.dial.proxad.net [213.228.4.74]) by postfix3.free.fr (Postfix) with SMTP id 69E2586D00 for ; Sun, 7 May 2000 20:11:59 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <008101bfb850$1a66c360$4a04e4d5@f5maf> From: "f5maf" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: F5MAF Date: Sun, 7 May 2000 20:14:32 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi all,
More QRN this week. (59+20)
Sunday morning I can't receive any station.
I'll repeat this test with more power and a 13 meters antenna.
I haven't received any report.
Best 73
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13199 invoked from network); 7 May 2000 18:54:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 May 2000 18:54:00 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oW6b-0004YQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 19:48:41 +0100 Received: from ewey-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.191] helo=ewey.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oW6a-0004YK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 19:48:40 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by ewey.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000507184750.CVYU11628.ewey.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Sun, 7 May 2000 11:47:50 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <20194114.957725270172.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Sun, 7 May 2000 11:47:50 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: My TS850 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 62.7.143.174 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thanks Dave for your helpful hints. John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16394 invoked from network); 7 May 2000 19:41:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 May 2000 19:41:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oWou-0004tG-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 20:34:28 +0100 Received: from merlins.plus.net.uk ([195.166.128.23] helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oWos-0004tB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 20:34:27 +0100 Received: (qmail 3619 invoked from network); 7 May 2000 19:38:17 -0000 Received: from rack.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.65) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 May 2000 19:38:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 14560 invoked from network); 7 May 2000 19:31:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO picks) (212.159.120.109) by rack.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 May 2000 19:31:50 -0000 Message-ID: <002b01bfb85b$5e1f2f60$6d789fd4@f9.net.uk> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <008101bfb850$1a66c360$4a04e4d5@f5maf> Subject: LF: Re: F5MAF Date: Sun, 7 May 2000 20:35:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Marc.
 
Very bad static here also.
Sorry, no signals heard.
 
73. Dave G3YXM.

Hi all,
More QRN this week. (59+20)
Sunday morning I can't receive any station.
I'll repeat this test with more power and a 13 meters antenna.
I haven't received any report.
Best 73
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14087 invoked from network); 7 May 2000 20:09:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 May 2000 20:09:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oXG7-00057q-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 21:02:35 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oXG6-00057k-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 07 May 2000 21:02:35 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id VAA19666 for ; Sun, 7 May 2000 21:02:17 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk Message-ID: <2000050720010068199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Sun, 7 May 2000 20:01:00 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: Re: LF: Decca Tx Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Walter > The UK Decca Navigator transmitters shut down for public use this weekend. > Most sites have already been sold for other purposes but a few will remain in > working order for a few months. I have now got hold of the documentation for the Decca system - most interesting I would like to include an illustration of the trasmitter module and the loading coils for interest (how the professionals do it) in the LF book. How do I go about getting permission? Who should I write to? Or should you do it as the RSGB/Decca liason man? I have also got hold of some Litz wire and a solder pot. Judging by the abount of Litz wire at the Crawley club there is going to be quite a lot of this stuff in circulation so some advice on how to terminate this wire might might be in order in the book. I know you have some expertise in this area - can it be put over in an e-mail to me? -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21990 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 05:00:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 05:00:33 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ofS9-0000Yj-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 05:47:33 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail.sci.fi ([195.74.0.53] helo=pefletti.saunalahti.fi ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ofRy-0000Yd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 05:47:22 +0100 Received: from default (MDCCCXXXV.dyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.29.35]) by pefletti.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id HAA04939 for ; Mon, 8 May 2000 07:46:59 +0300 (EET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000508074921.0081cb40@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: vaiski1@pop.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Mon, 08 May 2000 07:49:21 +0300 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: Signal Strength Measurements by OH2LX 08 May 2000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Signal strength measurements of various LF stations by OH2LX: ------------------------------------------------------------------ Day ------------------ 01May 02May 03May 04May 05May 06May 07May MON TUE WED THU FRI SAT SUN Time, UTC ------------ 2015- 2100- 2105- 2040- 2030- 2115- 2110- ------------------------------------------------------------------ kHz Stn d,km AZI Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW ------------------------------------------------------------------ 73.3 Rugby, 1825, 252, -108 -96 -95 -102 -101 -99 -101 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 75.0 HBG, 1992, 226, -100 -98 -96 -100 -105 -99 -97 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 77.5 DCF77, 1543, 228, -90 -83 -89 -91 -92 -87 -87 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 128.2 9f/7D, 2060, 267, -126 -116 -122 -126 -124 -125 -124 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 128.9 DCF49, 1544, 228, -82 -79 -74 -81 -89 -77 -80 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 138.8 DBF39, 1221, 226, -79 -78 -76 -83 -82 -74 -88 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 135.8 SXV, 2490, 182, -111 -101 -104 -103 -103 -101 -100 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 137.0 CFH, 5750, 295, Nil* Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil ------------------------------------------------------------------ * (estimate: 1 to 10 possibility to hear CFH at any time here...) ------------------------------------------------------------------ 01May 1926: OH1TN -113; 1929:-112; 1931:-111; 1935:-112; 1942:-112 1944:-111; 1946:-112; 1952:-113; 1954:-114 1956:-115 1958:-115; 2000:-114; 2002:-113; 2004:-113; 2006:-114 2008:-114; 2011:-113; 2013:-112; 2017:-111; 2019:-112 2021:-113; 2024:-115; 2026:-113; 2028:-111; 2031:-112 137.0 2032:-112; 2034:-111; 2036:-113; 2038:-115; 2040:-112 2044:-113; 2049:-114 stop of obs, clg cq continues 02May 2104: OH1TN -109; 2107:-110; 2109-111: ;2111:-110; 2113:-111 137.0 2115:-113; 2117:-112; 2119:-111; 2122:-112; 2124:-113 03May 2103: OH1TN -114; 2152:-116 05May 2029: SM6PXJ -117; 2034:-118; 2037:-117 06May 2118: OH1BS -114; 2132:-115; 2146:-115; 2150:-114; 2152:-115 06May 2127: OK1DTN -126; 2132:-127; 2137:-126; 2140:-127; 2143:-128 07May 2109: OH1BS -114 ------------------------------------------------------------------ (R&S ESH2/---- 10m coax----/1:10/-----15m wire-----): Noise level with antenna: with 200Hz IF BandWidth: -26..-21 dB(uV), -133..-128dBmW (varies with qrm etc) ------------------------------------------------------------------ End of message of 8st May 2000, 0450 UTC, from OH2LX ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7108 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 05:38:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 05:38:42 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ofz4-0000nW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 06:21:34 +0100 Received: from gatek.vs.dasa.de ([195.243.118.226] helo=gatekeeper.vs.dasa.de) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ofz3-0000nR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 06:21:33 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: by gatekeeper.vs.dasa.de; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id HAA09683; Mon, 8 May 2000 07:22:49 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from somewhere by smtpxd Received: from somewhere by smtpxd Message-ID: From: "Koenig, Wolfgang" To: "'Alan Melia'" , "'rsgb_lf_group'" Subject: LF: No Spots Date: Mon, 8 May 2000 07:21:02 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hallo Alan, Hallo Group, Due to other duties I was not qrv on LF the weekend. I observed DB0MDX but no spot for LF was announced. 73 and good dx wolf dl1san From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16975 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 09:30:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 09:30:29 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ojin-0002iH-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 10:21:01 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ojim-0002iC-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 10:21:00 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as32-s15-148-199.cwci.net ([195.44.148.199] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ojiT-0001nC-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 09:20:42 +0000 Message-ID: <391676E6.D67C475D@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 08 May 2000 08:12:22 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: KITES Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All Does anyone know which kite type/size is best for antenna work. I think possible the delta type but others with kite flying experience might know different. I am looking for a kite to carry an antenna wire up to around 500 feet. I do have some met balloons as well and will be testing both. I know all about Air Tfc Regulations and and have a suitable site available, which belongs to me. This will avoid over flying others airspace. 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16706 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 11:04:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 11:04:44 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12olDr-0003UP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 11:57:11 +0100 Received: from lepidachrosite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12olDq-0003UI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 11:57:10 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (2410824768.dialin.freeler.nl [143.178.68.64]) by lepidachrosite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id C5857CAE96 for ; Mon, 8 May 2000 10:55:41 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <000001bfb8dc$17793ac0$4044b28f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "LF-Group" Subject: LF: Terms Date: Mon, 8 May 2000 12:54:29 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To All from PA0SE On my question about the proper way of writing units in English/American I received the following reply from the Editor of RadCom. 73, Dick, PA0SE Hello, Dick. It is RadCom style to use the following: 10V or 10 volt(s), 5A or 5 amp(s), 2W or 2 watt(s). With IF, RF and AF, capital letters and no dots. With frequency, no gap between the number and the units, ie 800Hz, 136kHz, 21MHz. Steve White, G3ZVW > In The Netherlands we write 5 A, but 5 ampčre, 10 V but 10 volt. So in > general the unit is written with a capital when abbreviated but with a >lower case when written in full. And with a space between figure and unit. > > What is correct in English or American, 3 V or 3V?. Same question for 10 > amp, 10amp, 10Amp, 10Amps?, etc. > > And what about rf or RF? if, IF, i.f. or I.F. (intermediate frequency) >etc.? > > 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14019 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 11:14:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 11:14:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12olKT-0003aL-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 12:04:01 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12olKR-0003aG-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 12:03:59 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id MAA22226; Mon, 8 May 2000 12:07:02 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 16225 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 11:59:54 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 11:59:54 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id KAA28043; Mon, 8 May 2000 10:48:28 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma028012; Mon, 8 May 00 10:48:01 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Mon, 8 May 2000 12:07:59 +0100 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id <2J00AWLP>; Mon, 8 May 2000 12:02:41 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528BB@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: KITES Date: Mon, 8 May 2000 12:02:38 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: There is an article on kites for lifting antennas in last month's (or it may be the month before) QST. It shows a design for a simple to make, serious lifting power kite. Can't remember the type off hand but I can fish out the article this evening. The article contains dire safety warnings about hands being ripped off and people becoming airborne ! Andy G4JNT > ---------- > From: g3kev[SMTP:g3kev@netscapeonline.co.uk] > Reply To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Sent: 2000-05-08 09:12 > To: rsgb > Subject: LF: KITES > > Hi All > Does anyone know which kite type/size is best for antenna work. I > think > possible the delta type but others with kite flying experience might > know different. I am looking for a kite to carry an antenna wire up to > around 500 feet. I do have some met balloons as well and will be > testing > both. > I know all about Air Tfc Regulations and and have a suitable site > available, which belongs to me. This will avoid over flying others > airspace. > 73 de Mal/G3KEV > > > > > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21823 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 12:00:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 12:00:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oly5-0003uS-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 12:44:57 +0100 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oly2-0003uN-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 12:44:54 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id NAA490228 for ; Mon, 8 May 2000 13:44:35 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000508134030.12ef527e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 08 May 2000 13:40:30 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Terms In-reply-to: <000001bfb8dc$17793ac0$4044b28f@w8k3f0> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The 'rules' (as they were learned to me when I was an eng. student, back in the late 70's) were : - no space between the figure and unit when the unit is abbrevated (so 136.5kHz) - abbrevated units in capital otherwise not (so 12V and 12 volt) - no multiples for units (so volt, ampére, watt, not volts, ampéres, watts) - RF, LF, IF etc : in capitals without dots BTW : terms LF, HF ,RF, IF etc... are mixed up frequently : RF = radio frequency (regardless of the exact frequency) IF = intermediate frequency (idem dito) So a receiver can have a RF of 136kHz and an IF of 70MHz. Frequency ranges : VLF = 3kHz - 30kHz (very low frequencies) LF = 30kHz - 300kHz (low frequencies) MF = 300kHz - 3MHz (medium frequencies) HF = 3MHz - 30MHz (high frequencies) VHF = 30MHz - 300MHz (very high frequencies) UHF = 300MHz - 3GHz (ultra high frequencies) SHF = 3GHz - 30GHz (super high frequencies) So despite what one often reads both the 73kHz and 136kHz ham bands are LF and not VLF. At 12:54 8/05/00 +0200, you wrote: >To All from PA0SE > >On my question about the proper way of writing units in English/American I >received the following reply from the Editor of RadCom. > >73, Dick, PA0SE > > >Hello, Dick. > >It is RadCom style to use the following: > >10V or 10 volt(s), 5A or 5 amp(s), 2W or 2 watt(s). >With IF, RF and AF, capital letters and no dots. >With frequency, no gap between the number and the units, ie >800Hz, 136kHz, 21MHz. > >Steve White, G3ZVW > > > >> In The Netherlands we write 5 A, but 5 ampčre, 10 V but 10 volt. So in >> general the unit is written with a capital when abbreviated but with a >>lower case when written in full. And with a space between figure and unit. >> >> What is correct in English or American, 3 V or 3V?. Same question for 10 >> amp, 10amp, 10Amp, 10Amps?, etc. >> >> And what about rf or RF? if, IF, i.f. or I.F. (intermediate frequency) >>etc.? > >> >> 73, Dick, PA0SE > > > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12861 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 17:44:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 17:44:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12orLl-0006ez-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 18:29:45 +0100 Received: from fortune-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.203] helo=fortune.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12orLk-0006eu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 18:29:44 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by fortune.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000508172924.DIAH13356.fortune.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Mon, 8 May 2000 10:29:24 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <33037093.957806964873.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Mon, 8 May 2000 10:29:24 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Static MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 62.7.129.97 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All, The last two days the static has been particularly bad here, although today it is perhaps a little less. The mornings start off reasonably quiet, but it builds up by late morning and during the afternoon it is impossible to listen. I found that it is audible right down to 10 kHz, but quieter at lower frequencies. Is this unusual compared with this time last year, or the year before? 73 John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29183 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 18:23:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 18:23:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12orx1-0006zC-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 19:08:15 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12orwy-0006z6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 19:08:12 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as32-s15-148-79.cwci.net ([195.44.148.79] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12orwf-0001SJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 18:07:54 +0000 Message-ID: <3916ECA4.F092DF34@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 08 May 2000 16:34:45 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: RE: KITES References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528BB@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Talbot Andrew wrote: > There is an article on kites for lifting antennas in last month's (or it > may be the month before) QST. It shows a design for a simple to make, > serious lifting power kite. Can't remember the type off hand but I can > fish out the article this evening. The article contains dire safety > warnings about hands being ripped off Not good for the cw operator > and people becoming airborne ! Early call from above. > I do not mind making one but if there are commercial ones available and big > enough for the job I could be interested. Saw an article a few years ago about > one that might be suitable, delta type with a span of 25 feet. It was launched > from a vehicle, something like a glider launch. or 3 persons to manually get it > airborne. The anchor suggested was 2 tons, a good heavy vehicle would be > suitable although I have some good trees on the site. I dont want my Mercedes > to get airborne and land back in Germany. G3KEV > > > Andy G4JNT > > > ---------- > > From: g3kev[SMTP:g3kev@netscapeonline.co.uk] > > Reply To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > > Sent: 2000-05-08 09:12 > > To: rsgb > > Subject: LF: KITES > > > > Hi All > > Does anyone know which kite type/size is best for antenna work. I > > think > > possible the delta type but others with kite flying experience might > > know different. I am looking for a kite to carry an antenna wire up to > > around 500 feet. I do have some met balloons as well and will be > > testing > > both. > > I know all about Air Tfc Regulations and and have a suitable site > > available, which belongs to me. This will avoid over flying others > > airspace. > > 73 de Mal/G3KEV > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29222 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 18:23:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 18:23:33 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12orx2-0006zI-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 19:08:16 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12orx1-0006zB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 19:08:15 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as32-s15-148-79.cwci.net ([195.44.148.79] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12orwj-0001SX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 18:07:58 +0000 Message-ID: <3916F361.A653D43F@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 08 May 2000 17:03:30 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Spectran accuracy References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528B5@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> <3.0.1.16.20000505141455.21ffadcc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik Strobbe wrote: > Everybody who is involved in extreme narrowband mode such as QRSS and DFCW > will confirm that signals that are 10 to 20dB below the 'normal CW' > detectable level can still be copied and lead to a QSO. > OK, it takes about 30 minutes or more but this time period is accepted for > Meteor Scatter contact on VHF (I believe that the time limit for a valid > QSO is 2 hours for MS). > Nothing wrong with being a 'die hard' CW operator, but that is no reason > for neglecting the fact that extreme narrowband modes are superior to > 'normal speed' CW when it comes to signal to noise ratio. Both theory and > practise proves this. Tell me Rik, why is there no qrss(LMCW) when the band is noisy like lots of qrn/static about. It should not be a problem if you can read signals 20 db below the noise. My ANSWER after monitoring and experimentation with spectran is that the qrn chops the long dashes and you cannot be sure if it was lots of dots. This does not happen with normal cw because one can read words in between the crashes and conduct a qso even with a weak signal. The qrn was very bad at the weekend but I did work PA0KDM, gave him 229. Also worked OK1DTN gave him 569, his first qso with the UK. There is no substitute for the real thing, and it only takes a few minutes for a proper qso. If you have to spend an hour or more to conduct a qso and only under ideal conditions with qrss then that is hardly state of the art communications, plus the fact that one is cluttering up an already narrow band. Morse practice could be the answer. One other point, some qrss qso's are pre arrange so one knows who is expected on the frequency and the rest is GUESS WORK.- I have been listening and watching and some claimed qso's are doubtful. G3KEV > > > 73, Rik ON7YD > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24270 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 18:46:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 18:46:40 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12osJb-00079j-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 19:31:35 +0100 Received: from carbon.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.92] helo=carbon) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12osJa-00079e-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 19:31:34 +0100 Received: from [213.1.159.126] (helo=default) by carbon with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12osJ4-00055N-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 8 May 2000 19:31:02 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfb91b$9d3decc0$7e9f01d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: No DX Cluster spots for LF this week 6/7th May Date: Mon, 8 May 2000 16:18:47 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, a blank on Cluster spots this week. Wolf apologises that he was otherwise occupied, but it is unusual to get no entries at all. I suspect that the static levels have been fairly high over the last weekend, making listening a little unpleasant, and raising the general noise level considerably. 73 de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26061 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 20:57:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 20:57:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ouR2-0008HS-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 21:47:24 +0100 Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.39]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ouR1-0008HN-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 21:47:24 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from alg.demon.co.uk ([194.222.171.80]) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12ouQf-00054G-0B for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 8 May 2000 20:47:02 +0000 Message-ID: <391726D6.3CF7C00@alg.demon.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 08 May 2000 22:43:02 +0100 From: "Steve Rawlings" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Terms References: <000001bfb8dc$17793ac0$4044b28f@w8k3f0> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dick Rollema wrote: > . . . I received the following reply from the Editor of RadCom. > > Hello, Dick. > > It is RadCom style to use the following: > > 10V or 10 volt(s), 5A or 5 amp(s), 2W or 2 watt(s). > With IF, RF and AF, capital letters and no dots. > With frequency, no gap between the number and the units, ie > 800Hz, 136kHz, 21MHz. > > Steve White, G3ZVW When I was studying for my degree with the Open University in the 1990s, the house style was to have a space between the figures and the units, for example: 10 V or 10 volts; 136 kHz. ************ New subject: Ron G6RO wrote to say that he has been off the air due to a TX power supply problem. His constant efforts to improve his LF station resulted in a pair of rectifier diodes failing while experimenting with a new antenna tuning system. Spares are being obtained, and he has started on the repair work. Regards to all, Steve GW4ALG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 943 invoked from network); 8 May 2000 21:10:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 May 2000 21:10:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oueB-0008Ma-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 22:00:59 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ds-img-5.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.138] helo=spdmgaae.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12oue9-0008MS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 08 May 2000 22:00:57 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaae.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id RAA27700 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 8 May 2000 17:00:06 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 8 May 2000 16:59:39 -0400 From: "Lech Laszkiewicz" Subject: LF: KITES To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005081659_MC2-A433-5840@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: What lights should be displayed at night by an airship not under power being towed by a marine tug? de G3KAU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22350 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 07:11:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 07:11:30 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12p40A-0004TA-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 08:00:18 +0100 Received: from ns1.swh.sk ([192.108.125.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12p404-0004T5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 08:00:12 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from hermes.swh.sk (hermes [195.41.64.129]) by ns1.swh.sk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id IAA20447 for ; Tue, 9 May 2000 08:59:52 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from btss103a.swh.sk (btss103a.swh.sk [195.41.64.27]) by hermes.swh.sk (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id IAA10860 for ; Tue, 9 May 2000 08:59:49 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by btss103a.swh.sk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id <2MGT93J0>; Tue, 9 May 2000 08:59:47 +0200 Message-ID: <29BDD4F529FCD311B631009027357C4E5BA33C@btss103a.swh.sk> From: "Gasparik Richard" To: "Rsgb_Lf_Group \(E-mail\)" Subject: LF: Mission unseccessful... Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 08:59:47 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi LFers... I was QRV last weekend from the telecomm tower at Sitno (1009m asl.) in JN98KJ, with about 40m high vertical with 120m slooping section and 50 W. Due to strong QRN about 40dB over S9 no QSO possible. I have heard somebody calling me, but QRN was very strong. DCF39 - 60dB over S9, Greek RTTY station - 25dB over S9, but no HAM activity...I have tried Visual-CW for more than 12 hours, but nothing. Only SWL report from OM5RW received. Today afternoon I'll upload some interesting pictures from this location on my web site. See you next time... 73 de Rich OM2TW From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7995 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 08:42:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 08:42:09 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12p5Qc-0005D7-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 09:31:42 +0100 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12p5Qb-0005D2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 09:31:41 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12p5QC-0003XW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 9 May 2000 09:31:16 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Tue, 09 May 2000 09:24:30 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 09:24:29 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Terms In-reply-to: <391726D6.3CF7C00@alg.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: GW4ALG wrote: > New subject: Ron G6RO wrote to say that he has been off the air > due to a TX power supply problem. His constant efforts to > improve his LF station resulted in a pair of rectifier diodes > failing while experimenting with a new antenna tuning system. > Spares are being obtained, and he has started on the repair work. This demonstrates a rule similar to: "If your antenna stayed up last winter it wasn't big enough". "If you haven't blown up your station recently, you aren't doing enough to improve it." Good luck, Ron. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16271 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 08:56:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 08:56:05 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12p5hS-0005Mb-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 09:49:06 +0100 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12p5hQ-0005MW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 09:49:04 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12p5h4-0005In-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 9 May 2000 09:48:42 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Tue, 09 May 2000 09:32:37 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 09:32:35 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Spectran accuracy In-reply-to: <3916F361.A653D43F@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > Rik Strobbe wrote: > > > Everybody who is involved in extreme narrowband mode such as QRSS and > > DFCW will confirm that signals that are 10 to 20dB below the 'normal CW' > > detectable level can still be copied and lead to a QSO. OK, it takes > > about 30 minutes or more but this time period is accepted for Meteor > > Scatter contact on VHF (I believe that the time limit for a valid QSO is > > 2 hours for MS). Nothing wrong with being a 'die hard' CW operator, but > > that is no reason for neglecting the fact that extreme narrowband modes > > are superior to 'normal speed' CW when it comes to signal to noise > > ratio. Both theory and practise proves this. > G3KEV replied: > Tell me Rik, why is there no qrss(LMCW) when the band is noisy like lots > of qrn/static about. > My ANSWER after monitoring and experimentation with > spectran is that the qrn chops the long dashes and you cannot > be sure if it was lots of dots. On the contrary, I find that the advantage of QRSS is even greater under heavy QRN - it's often the only mode that is viable in the summer. Static crashes are usually much shorter than the dot period and it is much easier to watch the bright white lines of static than to listen to QRN. I cannot vouch for Spectran, but Spectrogram works well under these conditions. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17134 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 09:37:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 09:37:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12p6IZ-0005hO-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 10:27:27 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12p6IV-0005hJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 10:27:24 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA715326 for ; Tue, 9 May 2000 11:27:04 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000509112258.232ff9b2@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 11:22:58 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Spectran accuracy In-reply-to: <3916F361.A653D43F@netscapeonline.co.uk> References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528B5@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> <3.0.1.16.20000505141455.21ffadcc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 17:03 8/05/00 +0000, G3KEV wrote: >Tell me Rik, why is there no qrss(LMCW) when the band is noisy like lots of >qrn/static about. >It should not be a problem if you can read signals 20 db below the noise. >My ANSWER after monitoring and experimentation with spectran is that the qrn >chops the long dashes and you cannot be sure if it was lots of dots. This does >not happen with normal cw because one can read words in between the crashes >and conduct a qso even with a weak signal. High static levels (thunderstroms) do not affect QRSS or DFCW as bad as normal speed CW. Static crashes are very short (milleseconds) compared to the 3 second dot length and appear as vertical lines on the screen, no problem to tell them apart from the QRSS / DFCW signal that forms a horizontal line. During the last weeks several hams in the UK, Belgium and Germany were able to copy the 10mW ERP signal from IK1ODO in DFCW at distances up to 1000km. Nobody claimed to be able to hear the signal. When I copied a perfect 'O' signal from Marco (last Friday) static noise was very bad. If someone is interested to compare the abilities of DFCW versus fast CW I can put up a 5mW ERP beacon that transmits DFCW (at 3 seconds/dot) and fast CW (at 12WPM) sequentialy for one evening. 73, Rik ON7YD 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29068 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 10:42:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 10:42:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12p7IZ-0006At-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 11:31:31 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12p7IW-0006Ao-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 11:31:28 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id LAA14712; Tue, 9 May 2000 11:34:32 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 30537 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 11:27:21 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 11:27:21 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id KAA04153; Tue, 9 May 2000 10:15:50 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma004076; Tue, 9 May 00 10:15:39 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Tue, 9 May 2000 11:35:46 +0100 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id <2J00BACP>; Tue, 9 May 2000 11:30:00 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528C4@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: "'LF Group'" Subject: LF: DFCW Parameters Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 11:29:56 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: What are the parameters for DFCW, or where are they specified. I want to write some software to control my AD9850 DDS source (may be applicable to your 9832 source as well Dave) and might as well include this option. Andy G4JNT -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4498 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 11:50:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 11:50:37 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12p8Ol-0006iV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 12:41:59 +0100 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12p8Oh-0006iQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 12:41:55 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id NAA186342 for ; Tue, 9 May 2000 13:41:33 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000509133726.2d978d9c@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 13:37:26 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: 82.7kHz CW signal In-reply-to: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528C4@pdw-mercury-1.der a.gov.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Some weeks ago someone (G3YXM ?) reported hearing CW arround 80kHz. Last night (+/- 22UT) I could heard just the end of a CW message followed by a carrier (gave listening to that after abt. 10 minutes). This morning (06 UT) the was a RTTY (like) signal on the same frequency. The signal (both last night and this morning) was very strong (S8 on my meter with the antenna tuned to 136kHz). Is this the same signal ? 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19064 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 13:40:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 13:40:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pA8B-0007ec-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 14:32:59 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.7]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pA89-0007eS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 14:32:57 +0100 Received: from G0MRF@aol.com by imo17.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.84.5007806 (3842) for ; Tue, 9 May 2000 09:32:06 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: G0MRF@aol.com Message-ID: <84.5007806.26496d56@aol.com> Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 09:32:06 EDT Subject: Re: LF: DFCW Parameters To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 32 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In a message dated 5/9/00 11:40:52 AM GMT Daylight Time, ACTALBOT@dera.gov.uk writes: << What are the parameters for DFCW, or where are they specified. I want to write some software to control my AD9850 DDS source (may be applicable to your 9832 source as well Dave) and might as well include this option. >> Thanks to the reflector and a lot of hard work by Johan SM6LKM - DFCW has now been included in the PIC16F84 firmware used in the 9832 DDS. + or - Offset can be changed. Linear BPSK has also been included in hardware. Unfortunately, no computer transmit / receive programs have been found yet which can take advantage of the new BPSK feature. ( 0V = one phase, 12V = -180 degrees 6V = no output) But I'm still looking. Any ideas anyone? 73 David G0MRF From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22384 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 14:57:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 14:57:57 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pBM3-0008Hl-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 15:51:23 +0100 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pBM2-0008Hg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 15:51:22 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id QAA509654 for ; Tue, 9 May 2000 16:50:59 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000509164652.223f2124@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 16:46:52 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: DFCW Parameters In-reply-to: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528C4@pdw-mercury-1.der a.gov.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 11:29 9/05/00 +0100, G4JNT wrote: >What are the parameters for DFCW, or where are they specified. > >I want to write some software to control my AD9850 DDS source (may be >applicable to your 9832 source as well Dave) and might as well include >this option. > >Andy G4JNT Hello Andy, DFCW is still a very experimental mode, so not very standardized yet. Generaly accepted is that the higher frequency stands for 'dash' and the lower for 'dot'. The frequency shift is dependent on the dot length. For 3 seconds per dot (that has become a kind of informal standard) a shift of 4Hz is used. A 1 second 'gap' is used to separate the elements (dots and dashes) within a character, characters are separated by a gap of 1 dot length, words by a gap of 2 dot lengths. Marco (IK1ODO) has recently used DFCW at 40 seconds dotlength and with a 1Hz shift, his 10mW ERP signal was copied all over Europe. Maybe this is the moment to create some 'temporary standard parameters' for DFCW (but this shouldn't stop us from further experimenting). I suggest 3 standard speeds : * 3 sec./dot : shift = 4Hz, gap = 1 sec. * 10 sec. dot : shift = 2Hz, gap = 3 sec. * 30 sec. dot : shift = 1Hz, gap = 10 sec. Further I suggest to take the highest frequency for dash and lowest for dot, a character separation of 1 dot length and a word separation of 2 dit lengths. Any other ideas or suggestions ? 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20598 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 16:35:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 16:35:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pCoa-0000XH-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 17:24:56 +0100 Received: from mta01.talk21.com ([62.172.192.171] helo=t21mta01-app.talk21.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pCoX-0000XA-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 17:24:53 +0100 Received: from dave ([213.1.56.128]) by t21mta01-app.talk21.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000509162332.BDIV5571.t21mta01-app.talk21.com@dave> for ; Tue, 9 May 2000 17:23:32 +0100 Message-ID: <001a01bfb9d2$fa6113c0$803801d5@dave> From: "Dave Sergeant" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3.0.1.16.20000509133726.2d978d9c@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Subject: LF: Re: 82.7kHz CW signal Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 17:23:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik You report a RTTY signal on 82.7. I hear it hear very strongly, almost the same strength as Rugby on 73kHz. There is also a slightly weaker but still quite strong signal around 81.1. I have not in the past paid any attention to signals around here, but it is possible of course that they also come from the Rugby stable. Static is enormous on 136 this afternoon, even louder than the previous days. Cheers Dave G3YMC dsergeant@iee.org http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sergeantd From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28324 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 17:42:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 17:42:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pDrr-00013k-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 18:32:23 +0100 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pDrn-000138-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 18:32:19 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12pDrN-0002RU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 9 May 2000 18:31:54 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Tue, 09 May 2000 18:25:48 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 18:25:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: DFCW Parameters In-reply-to: <3.0.1.16.20000509164652.223f2124@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528C4@pdw-mercury-1.der a.gov.uk> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: ON7YD wrote: > DFCW is still a very experimental mode, so not very standardized yet. > Generaly accepted is that the higher frequency stands for 'dash' and the > lower for 'dot'. The frequency shift is dependent on the dot length. For 3 > seconds per dot (that has become a kind of informal standard) a shift of > 4Hz is used. A 1 second 'gap' is used to separate the elements (dots and > dashes) within a character, characters are separated by a gap of 1 dot > length, words by a gap of 2 dot lengths. Rik, Have I misunderstood, or are you saying there is a gap between each dot and each dash? I thought there was no need to do this as the frequency determines whether an element is a dot or dash so a dot three times the dot lenght must be three consecutive dots. Probably me being dumb. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26194 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 19:09:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 19:09:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFGg-0001m3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 20:02:06 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFGc-0001ly-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 20:02:02 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as31-s16-147-74.cwci.net ([195.44.147.74] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFGJ-00028l-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 19:01:44 +0000 Message-ID: <3917C157.BBAD3C2D@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 07:42:15 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: KITES References: <200005081659_MC2-A433-5840@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Lech Laszkiewicz wrote: > What lights should be displayed at night by an airship not under power > being towed by a marine tug? The same lights that would be used for an aeroplane under tow. The lights must be on day and night and flashing to indicate towing. I thought Lech you already knew this. I am sure when you were airborne you must have had the odd tow to get you home. When airborne and stationary the craft will be illuminated but no flashing lights. If stationary for long periods it would be better to make arrangements to bale out, making sure to attach a torch to the left shoulder. You will use the torch to send "help" in morse code so that your descent can be monitored. Quote from " O'Quigley-Mc Namara" handbook for stranded aviators, kite and balloon fliers. Available at any high quality book shop, there is also a gramaphone record available for those that tend to go cross eyed when reading. Price 12 shillings, 3 pence and a half penny. (12s3 1/2d) > > de G3KAU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3269 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 19:21:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 19:21:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFSW-0001qY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 20:14:20 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFSU-0001qT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 20:14:18 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id UAA29280 for ; Tue, 9 May 2000 20:14:02 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk Message-ID: <2000050919121868199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 19:12:18 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: QRN and QRSS Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit G3KEV said > Tell me Rik, why is there no qrss(LMCW) when the band is noisy like lots of > qrn/static about. > It should not be a problem if you can read signals 20 db below the noise. > My ANSWER after monitoring and experimentation with spectran is that the qrn > chops the long dashes and you cannot be sure if it was lots of dots. This does > not happen with normal cw because one can read words in between the crashes and > conduct a qso even with a weak signal. When I lived in Sierra Leone in the 60's I was persuaded by W1BB to go on 160m. This was done using a large VHF mast to support a 40m high antenna. Getting out using low power (we were allowed a maximum of 10w input to the PA) was not problem but receiving was something else. You have to experience 160m QRN in the tropics to know just how bad it can get. We (9L1TN and myself) found that stations who sent CW slowly got through the noise much better. The reason being that a crash of QRN would only take out part of a character at slow speeds while it could delete a complete word or more at higher speeds. We were criticized in one of the magazines for working at 6WPM but they did not understand our problem. During the early experiments on 73kHz the same problems arose - very weak signals in the presence of QRN. Again, slow CW proved more effective than faster CW in QRN. Any one who has looked for very weak signals using QRSS is aware of what QRN looks like. The QRN pulse creates a band across the screen obliterating the signal for the duration of the pulse. The time width of the pulse depends on the scanning time and the receiver AGC. It is essential that, when receiving weak signals in the presence of QRN, you have control of the AGC and it should be set to FAST or OFF. If a QRN pulse of several milliseconds chops a bit out of a dot or a dash the readability is normally unaffected. With frequency shift keying methods the effect of QRN is even less apparent. I have some excellent screen shots of QRP Italian stations showing good readability in the presence of QRN. I have no problems with fast CW. If the signal strengths are reasonable then fast CW is fine - the speed should be appropriate for the circumstances. -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7345 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 19:29:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 19:29:40 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFau-0001vm-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 20:23:00 +0100 Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFas-0001vh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 20:22:58 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 ([151.25.255.80]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA20003 for ; Tue, 9 May 2000 21:22:36 +0200 Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 21:22:36 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000509200851.01da91b0@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Tue, 09 May 2000 20:21:44 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: DFCW Parameters In-reply-to: Riferimenti: <3.0.1.16.20000509164652.223f2124@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------080804040108080109000002" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------080804040108080109000002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >ON7YD wrote: >> DFCW is still a very experimental mode, so not very standardized yet. >> Generaly accepted is that the higher frequency stands for 'dash' and the >> lower for 'dot'. The frequency shift is dependent on the dot length. For 3 >> seconds per dot (that has become a kind of informal standard) a shift of >> 4Hz is used. A 1 second 'gap' is used to separate the elements (dots and >> dashes) within a character, characters are separated by a gap of 1 dot >> length, words by a gap of 2 dot lengths. > >Rik, > >Have I misunderstood, or are you saying there is a gap between >each dot and each dash? I thought there was no need to do this as >the frequency determines whether an element is a dot or dash so a >dot three times the dot lenght must be three consecutive dots. >Probably me being dumb. > > >Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) >http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm > Mike, a gap (even small) helps a lot to recognize a character. After a discussion with Alberto I2PHD, we suggest a modified version of DFCW, with, probably, an even higher resistance to QRM. Let transmit three frequencies, the higher for the dash, the middle for the dot, the lower (equally spaced) for the "key up". The advantage is to always have a carrier, and being easier to detect a space between characters in noise. The output will be like: ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ _ _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ ___ ___ _ ___ _ _ _ (use fixed spacing characters to see) I try to attach a small ASCII file to this message; have a look, there is also an example with the "space" frequency between dot and dash. To modify the TX is very easy, at least for me; I will do some tests in this way by next weekend. No modifications to existing QRS program are necessary, only a manual RX/TX switch. About the frequency difference, there are of course no fixed rules, but don't be too wide. It's easier to see closely spaced signals, like 10 times the resolution used by the receiving program. 1-2-4 Hz and/or multiples and submultiples seems practical. 73, Marco IK1ODO --------------080804040108080109000002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; name="dfcw2.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="dfcw2.txt" ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ _ _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ ___ ___ _ ___ _ _ _ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ _ _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ ___ ___ _ ___ _ _ _ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ ___ --------------080804040108080109000002 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; name="ATT06490.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="ATT06490.txt" Marco Bruno - IK1ODO spin@inrete.it SPIN Electronics - www.spin-it.com --------------080804040108080109000002-- From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11486 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 19:39:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 19:39:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFl7-00021S-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 20:33:33 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFl6-00021N-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 20:33:32 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.221.201] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFko-0003LW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 19:33:14 +0000 Message-ID: <3918541E.25E046C0@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 18:08:30 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: 82.7kHz CW signal References: <3.0.1.16.20000509133726.2d978d9c@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik Strobbe wrote: > Some weeks ago someone (G3YXM ?) reported hearing CW arround 80kHz. Last > night (+/- 22UT) I could heard just the end of a CW message followed by a > carrier (gave listening to that after abt. 10 minutes). This morning (06 > UT) the was a RTTY (like) signal on the same frequency. > The signal (both last night and this morning) was very strong (S8 on my > meter with the antenna tuned to 136kHz). I reported the cw signal on 82.8 khz. Sometimes it transmitts rtty and some times idles on carrier. It could be useful for those that need to improve reading morse. > > > Is this the same signal ? > > 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15972 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 19:39:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 19:39:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFl8-00021Z-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 20:33:34 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFl7-00021U-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 20:33:34 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.221.201] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFkp-0003LZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 19:33:16 +0000 Message-ID: <39185925.82145220@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 18:29:57 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: cw 82.8 khz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I reported this cw signals a few weeks ago. I discovered it tuning across the band. The signal is very strong S9 plus with me. Some times there is rtty on the freq, cw other times and idles on carrier. Good for those that need some morse practice. Who said commercial cw had GONE !!!!!!!!!!!! There is still some cw being used on 500 khz. Heard a traffic list recently and it had a long list of ships, commercial cw has definitely not gone on LF or HF. It could be making a come back. Can anyone hear a transmission around 138 khz consisting of slow revs. It was stronger in GI than here in Scarborough. It seems to be there most of the time. 73 DE G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12451 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 19:42:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 19:42:07 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFmp-00021y-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 20:35:19 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pFmo-00021t-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 20:35:18 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 ([151.25.255.80]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA23766 for ; Tue, 9 May 2000 21:34:58 +0200 Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 21:34:58 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000509203356.010ca3b0@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Tue, 09 May 2000 20:35:32 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: DFCW Parameters In-reply-to: <4.1.20000509200851.01da91b0@mailer.inrete.it> Riferimenti: <3.0.1.16.20000509164652.223f2124@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In my last msg the line wrap rendered the DFCW sample unreadable. See the attached file, it should be clear. 73 - Marco IK1ODO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1305 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 20:42:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 20:42:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pGkZ-0002YR-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 21:37:03 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo22.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.66]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pGkX-0002YJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 09 May 2000 21:37:01 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.24.4c3b51a (16782) for ; Tue, 9 May 2000 16:36:10 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <24.4c3b51a.2649d0b9@aol.com> Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 16:36:09 EDT Subject: Re: LF: Re: QRN and QRSS To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 102 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: << G3KEV wrote > This does not happen with normal cw because one can read words > in between the crashes and conduct a qso even with a weak signal. >> This presumes, of course, that the sender knows ahead of time when the static crashes will occur at the receiving end, and obliges by timing his words to fall between them. Surely, though, a QSO with such an omniscient being would not depend upon electromagnetic waves in the first place. 73, John KD4IDY (near the QRN capitol of North America) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1093 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 23:32:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 23:32:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pJNu-00046M-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 00:25:50 +0100 Received: from merlins.plus.net.uk ([195.166.128.23] helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pJNt-00046H-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 00:25:49 +0100 Received: (qmail 6582 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 23:29:50 -0000 Received: from rack.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.65) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 23:29:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 3224 invoked from network); 9 May 2000 19:49:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO picks) (212.159.64.245) by rack.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 May 2000 19:49:14 -0000 Message-ID: <009f01bfb9f0$203fb980$ca449fd4@f9.net.uk> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3.0.1.16.20000509133726.2d978d9c@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Subject: LF: Re: 82.7kHz CW signal Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 20:39:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik et al > Some weeks ago someone (G3YXM ?) reported hearing CW arround 80kHz. It was actually reported to me as approx 91kHz, possibly sending "WBF WX" repeatedly, so maybe not the same station. 73. Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10590 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 06:49:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 06:49:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pQ9h-0007I1-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 07:39:37 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail2.hamilton-standard.com ([153.4.57.12]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pQ9f-0007Hw-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 07:39:35 +0100 Received: from curly.hsd.utc.com by mail2.hamilton-standard.com; (8.9.1/) id CAA32490; Wed, 10 May 2000 02:50:40 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from umrsvr.hsd.utc.com by curly.hsd.utc.com; (8.9.0/) id CAA13890; Wed, 10 May 2000 02:38:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com by umrsvr.hsd.utc.com; (8.9.0/) id CAA03701; Wed, 10 May 2000 02:19:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: by nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id <2V0N22Q3>; Wed, 10 May 2000 08:26:48 +0100 Message-ID: From: "Soegiono, Gamal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: AW: 82.7kHz CW signal Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 08:26:44 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit [Soegiono, Gamal] Hello Rik and all, RS> Some weeks ago someone (G3YXM ?) reported hearing RS> CW arround 80kHz. Last night (+/- 22UT) I could RS> heard just the end of a CW message followed by a RS> carrier (gave listening to that after abt. 10 minutes). RS> This morning (06 UT) the was a RTTY (like) signal on RS> the same frequency. The signal (both last night and RS> this morning) was very strong (S8 on my meter with RS> the antenna tuned to 136kHz). Confirm receiption of a 2-tone FSK signal on 82k8 (approx) which just fits into 200 Hz of IF BW. According to well informed ITU persons this might be (1) GYW on 82k750 assigned freq. located at 05W20/36N09 (Gibraltar), using F1B, occupying 190 Hz of BW and feeding 40 kW into the antenna. (2) GYB on 82k750 assigned freq. located at 00W10/51N30 (London), using F1B, occupying 200 Hz of BW and feeding 40 kW into the antenna. Perhaps one of our LF_friends in UK may try to DF to resolve the source of this signal. Closest, notified frequency below/above the observed one at 82k7 is: 82k4 and 83k1 respectively. Hope this helps. 73 de Gamal From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27534 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 06:54:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 06:54:58 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pQFT-0007Ll-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 07:45:35 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail2.hamilton-standard.com ([153.4.57.12]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pQFS-0007Lg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 07:45:34 +0100 Received: from curly.hsd.utc.com by mail2.hamilton-standard.com; (8.9.1/) id CAA00100; Wed, 10 May 2000 02:56:40 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from umrsvr.hsd.utc.com by curly.hsd.utc.com; (8.9.0/) id CAA23456; Wed, 10 May 2000 02:44:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com by umrsvr.hsd.utc.com; (8.9.0/) id CAA04253; Wed, 10 May 2000 02:26:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: by nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id <2V0N22QT>; Wed, 10 May 2000 08:33:38 +0100 Message-ID: From: "Soegiono, Gamal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: AW: Re: 82.7kHz CW signal Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 08:33:36 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hello Dave and all, DS> You report a RTTY signal on 82.7. DS> I hear it hear very strongly, almost the DS> same strength as Rugby on 73kHz. DS> There is also a slightly weaker but still DS> quite strong signal around 81.1. DS> I have not in the past paid any attention DS> to signals around here, but it is possible DS> of course that they also come from the DS> Rugby stable. This one at around 81k1 is possibly GYN2 on 81k0 assigned freq. located at 00W10/51N30 (London), using F1B, occupying 190 Hz of BW and feeding 20 kW into the antenna. 73 de Gamal From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21034 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 07:34:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 07:34:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pQuL-0007ff-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 08:27:49 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pQuB-0007fY-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 08:27:39 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id JAA481682 for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 09:27:20 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000510092314.2e5f6dce@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 09:23:14 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: DFCW Parameters In-reply-to: References: <3.0.1.16.20000509164652.223f2124@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528C4@pdw-mercury-1.der a.gov.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Mike, In theory there is no need for these 'gaps', but a series of tests (mainly conducted by DF8ZR, DF6NM and me) showed that these small 'gaps' had 2 advantages : 1. It eases the reading of characters with a series of dots or dashes (eg. O, S, J, 5 etc...) 2. It gives the TX a 'break' (reduces the 'on/off' ratio) during long characters The disadvantage is that is slows down the speed by 33% (but still leaves an average speed increase of about 225% compared to QRSS). In my opinion these 'gaps' should not be obligatory, so you can leave them out if you wish so. 73, Rik ON7YD At 18:25 9/05/00 +0100, G3XDV wrote: >Rik, > >Have I misunderstood, or are you saying there is a gap between >each dot and each dash? I thought there was no need to do this as >the frequency determines whether an element is a dot or dash so a >dot three times the dot lenght must be three consecutive dots. >Probably me being dumb. > > >Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) >http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13764 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 09:38:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 09:38:48 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pSnf-00005Y-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 10:29:03 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.41]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pSn7-00005Q-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 10:28:29 +0100 Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12pSml-00064A-0C for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 09:28:11 +0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 10:19:59 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" Subject: Re: LF: RF Ammeters, results, and a new subject In-reply-to: <002001bfb82d$e6759d50$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Larry Again, at a mobile rally (hamfest) I bought a box of assorted ferrite and iron dust rings. There were about a hundred, various colours and sizes all for about a quid! My method of establishing their characteristics was to take one of each type, wind 30 turns of 30 gauge and measure the inductance. I made up a table of the inductance of each, and this gives me a good indication as to their suitability for LF, MF, HF or VHF. Inductance varies with the square of the number of turns so, starting with the 30 turn measured value, it is easy to work out the required turns for a given inductance. In use, if a core gets hot, I use a bigger one! Not very scientific but it works. 73, Tom G3OLB >The Question: > >What are the techniques that one might use to take a sample core and >determine the RF capabilities of the core at different frequencies? I have >had some blind luck once finding some red coloured cores that performed >exactly the same as the expensive ones I bought from Amidon. A more general >solution of measurement would be just great - who has some ideas on this? > >Larry >VA3LK > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17876 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 11:19:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 11:19:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pUKf-0000p7-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:07:13 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pUKd-0000p2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:07:11 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id MAA27860; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:10:17 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 9366 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 12:03:01 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 12:03:01 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id KAA06612; Wed, 10 May 2000 10:51:24 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma006571; Wed, 10 May 00 10:51:14 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:11:32 +0100 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id <2J00BJP6>; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:05:44 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528CA@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: DDS Source board (was DFCW parameters) Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 12:05:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I do not intend to include anything in the DDS PIC firmware other than an ability to translate ASCII commnads into control words, and optionally store the settings to EEPROM for instant return to the same CW frequency. This approach will make for a general purpose standalone DDS generator module. Any frequency modulation - or phase change - will be made in real time by a PC sending serial commands to the DDS. While it would have been possible to dispense with the PIC altogether and drive the AD9850 directly, it is more robust, and certainly easier to write high level software, if a standard serial RS232 type protocol is used. WINDOZE programming makes it more difficult to address PC I/O ports directly than was DOS. Dave 'MRF, when you say linear BPSK what do you mean ? There is no option to shape the waveform surely with only 0 / 180 and no signal states. Andy G4JNT > ---------- > From: G0MRF@aol.com[SMTP:G0MRF@aol.com] > Reply To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Sent: 2000-05-09 14:32 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: Re: LF: DFCW Parameters > > Thanks to the reflector and a lot of hard work by Johan SM6LKM - DFCW > has > now been included in the PIC16F84 firmware used in the 9832 DDS. + or > - > Offset can be changed. > Linear BPSK has also been included in hardware. Unfortunately, no > computer > transmit / receive programs have been found yet which can take > advantage of > the new BPSK feature. ( 0V = one phase, 12V = -180 degrees 6V = no > output) > But I'm still looking. Any ideas anyone? > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4416 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 11:30:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 11:30:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pUWB-0000x6-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:19:07 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pUWA-0000x1-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:19:06 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #35) id 12pUVY-0002UT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:18:28 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:06:28 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 12:06:25 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: DFCW Parameters In-reply-to: <3.0.1.16.20000510092314.2e5f6dce@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> References: X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > In theory there is no need for these 'gaps', but a series of tests (mainly > conducted by DF8ZR, DF6NM and me) showed that these small 'gaps' had 2 > advantages : 1. It eases the reading of characters with a series of dots > or dashes (eg. O, S, J, 5 etc...) 2. It gives the TX a 'break' (reduces > the 'on/off' ratio) during long characters Ah, OK. I look forward to seeing this in practice. I must say that my first attempt at reading real DFCW - instead of typed on a WP - was much harder than I expected. I hope this improves things. Most stations seem to be taking advantage of the faster speed option (3s dots and dashes) but there is an advantage in having 9s dots and dashes so the speed is similar to QRSS but the S/N is better. I haven't yet modified my station for DFCW - this is a job for the summer. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16419 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 11:33:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 11:33:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pUbz-0000yM-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:25:07 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pUby-0000yH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:25:06 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id NAA598772 for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 13:24:47 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000510132042.2e375434@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 13:20:42 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: RF Ammeters, results, and a new subject In-reply-to: References: <002001bfb82d$e6759d50$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In addition to Tom's suggestion : In order to check the 'power behaviour' of a bunch of unknown toroids I took my old 136kHz TX (40W output), made a series circuit of a 1.5nF silver mica cap (actually 3 x 470pF parallel), an inductance (wound on the 'toroid under test') and a 50 Ohm dummyload. As the loss in the capacitor is neglectable, the TX output current gives an idea of the loss in the toroid. The toroid was also checked for heating after a few minutes of 40W carrier. Of course the L/C has to be brought to resonance, but as I modified the VFO of the old TX to cover 130-150kHz it was rather easy done by tapping the windings. A red Amidon Toroid I had as a reference did not get warm and the TX current was only about 5% less than the current I could get into the 50 Ohm dummy (without any L/C in series). Unfortunately all my toroid stock was unusable for LF (at least for +100W). I found out that any toroid that gets just a little warm at 40W will get far too hot at 400W. BTW : I also found out that a lot of toroids that are useless for resonant appliactions (LPF etc..) work fine for broadband applications (transformers, BALUNs etc...), don't trow them away too fast. 73, Rik ON7YD At 10:19 10/05/00 +0100, G3OLB wrote: >Larry > >Again, at a mobile rally (hamfest) I bought a box of assorted ferrite >and iron dust rings. There were about a hundred, various colours and >sizes all for about a quid! My method of establishing their >characteristics was to take one of each type, wind 30 turns of 30 gauge >and measure the inductance. > >I made up a table of the inductance of each, and this gives me a good >indication as to their suitability for LF, MF, HF or VHF. Inductance >varies with the square of the number of turns so, starting with the 30 >turn measured value, it is easy to work out the required turns for a >given inductance. In use, if a core gets hot, I use a bigger one! Not >very scientific but it works. > >73, Tom G3OLB > > >>The Question: >> >>What are the techniques that one might use to take a sample core and >>determine the RF capabilities of the core at different frequencies? I have >>had some blind luck once finding some red coloured cores that performed >>exactly the same as the expensive ones I bought from Amidon. A more general >>solution of measurement would be just great - who has some ideas on this? >> >>Larry >>VA3LK >> >> >> >> > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18681 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 11:40:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 11:40:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pUj9-00013U-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:32:31 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ds-img-7.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.153] helo=spdmbaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pUj0-00013O-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 12:32:23 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmbaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id HAA17346 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 07:31:34 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 07:31:24 -0400 From: "DEREK ATTER" Subject: LF: QSL cards - Puckeridge expedition 11/14/15/16th April To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005100731_MC2-A46C-83B8@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello LF'ers I have recently received the special QSL cards for the G3WSC/G3GRO 136/73Khz expedition to Puckeridge and am in the process of distibuting them to the stations worked. To those who have already sent cards direct I will also QSL direct on behalf of the crew of operators and the rest will go via the RSGB bureau. I hope also to send QSLs to those who were kind enough to send signal reports but did not actually work the station 73 on behalf of the operator crew at Puckeridge 14/15/16th April 2000. Derek Atter, G3GRO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5200 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 12:41:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 12:41:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pVh6-0001YA-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 13:34:28 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pVh2-0001Y5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 13:34:24 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id OAA95410 for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 14:34:05 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000510142958.2e37b468@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 14:29:58 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: DFCW Parameters In-reply-to: References: <3.0.1.16.20000510092314.2e5f6dce@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Spectrogram is limited to 0.7Hz resolution (16k bins at 11k sample rate), so it had little advantage to have dot longer than 3 seconds. I'm sure that Spectran will make 10 sec. dot (and even longer) more interesting. Theoreticaly you can gain 5.2dB by going from 3 to 10 sec. dot length. PS : I (and I think several others) never got Spectogram running stable at 5.5kHz sample rate. 73, Rik >Most stations seem to be taking advantage of the faster speed >option (3s dots and dashes) but there is an advantage in having 9s >dots and dashes so the speed is similar to QRSS but the S/N is >better. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14540 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 13:13:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 13:13:17 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pWBr-0001on-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 14:06:15 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo15.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.5]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pWBo-0001oe-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 14:06:13 +0100 Received: from G0MRF@aol.com by imo15.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.e6.531c011 (3890) for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 09:05:17 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: G0MRF@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 09:05:17 EDT Subject: Re: LF: DDS Source board (was DFCW parameters) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 32 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In a message dated 5/10/00 12:14:48 PM GMT Daylight Time, ACTALBOT@dera.gov.uk writes: << WINDOZE programming makes it more difficult to address PC I/O ports directly than was DOS. Dave 'MRF, when you say linear BPSK what do you mean ? There is no option to shape the waveform surely with only 0 / 180 and no signal states. >> Andy. Sorry, "linear" in this context..... A BPSK Input pin Which: When presented with a DC voltage equivalent to half the supply line voltage will result in a balanced condition producing zero RF output. Changing the voltage on the BPSK input pin slowly from eg 6V to 12V will generate a slowly increasing level of Q output which reaches a maximum at 12V. i.e. The instantaneous amplitude of the output is proportional to the instantaneous voltage on the BPSK input pin. Hence you can control the rise / fall times / waveshaping by accuratly shaping the voltage applied to the BPSK input. Changing from half rail to 0V produces the opposite phase. (not Q) Sorry this is such a long reply. I didn't have time to write a short one. 73 David From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15266 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 13:58:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 13:58:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pWqu-00029p-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 14:48:40 +0100 Received: from cyb01.axime.com ([160.92.120.38] helo=cybv01.axime.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pWqr-00029b-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 14:48:37 +0100 Received: from MARC ([213.36.34.213]) by cybv01.axime.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with SMTP id FUCJN200.1C0 for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 15:47:26 +0200 Message-ID: <006901bfba86$7e036940$0600a8c0@MARC> From: "mv tsi" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Spectran Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 15:48:53 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi all,
Where can I load Spectran?
73 Marc F5MAF
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6621 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 14:18:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 14:18:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pXAm-0002Kq-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 15:09:12 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pXAh-0002Kk-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 15:09:07 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id PAA09473; Wed, 10 May 2000 15:12:08 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 31077 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 15:04:51 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 15:04:51 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id NAA28449; Wed, 10 May 2000 13:53:15 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma028430; Wed, 10 May 00 13:52:55 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 15:13:14 +0100 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id <2J00BL95>; Wed, 10 May 2000 15:07:25 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528CD@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: RE: LF: DFCW Parameters Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 15:07:24 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >Theoreticaly you can gain 5.2dB by going from 3 to 10 sec. dot length. >sample rate. > Rik Only if the resolution of the waterfall analysis software is 3 times less. Does Spectran use the same windowing function as Spectrogram ? Depending on which window is used, the effective bandwidth of a spectrum display can be from one to three FFT bins, trading off display sidelobes against effective bandwidth. ......... I installed a 1Hz bandwidth filter in the RA1792 over the weekend, by mixing the 455kHz second IF down to 32765 Hz, followed by a ladder filter made from 5 watch crystals, then mixing back up to 455kHz with the same local oscillator so it's own instability cancels out. This LO needs to be tuneable to interpolate over the 10 Hz step size of the Rx. Results are interesting to say the least ! AGC action is completely destroyed as the 1Hz filter has a group delay of over a second and so the AGC loop goes wildly unstable - hence manual gain control is essential. All signals sound like a perfect audio tone - even static crashes sound like a carrier with slow fading on it ! Loran lines are tones in this BW. But it really does bring signals out of the noise, even in the severe thunder storms of the last few days. Andy G4JNT -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10188 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 17:00:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 17:00:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pYoR-0003Cn-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 16:54:15 +0100 Received: from tomts3.bellnexxia.net ([209.226.175.141] helo=tomts3-srv.bellnexxia.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pYoQ-0003CY-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 16:54:15 +0100 Received: from server1 ([206.172.245.185]) by tomts3-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000510155324.XSTO24624.tomts3-srv.bellnexxia.net@server1> for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 11:53:24 -0400 Message-ID: <000601bfba97$4a4f9220$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: DDS Source board, email earlier today. Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 11:48:06 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Andy: >From your earlier message today...... >Any frequency modulation - or phase change - will >be made in real time by a PC sending serial commands to the DDS. This single control process for the AD9850 will make the design have severely limited application opportunities. Please consider the following. My design work todate, because the device has a smaller number of pins (than the AD9850) to mess up with during trying to get the chip stuck to the pc board, has been with the AD9835. The AD9835 has some special pins called PSEL0, PSEL1 and FSELECT which permit the external driving of the DDS chip to change the phase to one of four values and select one of two frequency registers. I tried to naratively tell you about the need for these pins / control lines yesterday. After reading your email this morning, quote above, I realized there is a problem that I offer needs your attention. I have downloaded the AD9850 specs and see that the AD9850 has for some reason not brought out these external drive pins a neatly as they did on the earlier chip. I offer that to have maximum efficiency when using a serial line into a PIC to control the AD9850 it will be necessary to have your board OR an external drive signal with the signal from the 16F84 for the W_CLK signal so that accurate control of the FSK or PSK transition events can occur. The control could occur from either the 16F84 or from an external signal source. The first need is that an external drive signal can control the timing of the BPSK or the FSK change / shift event. If I have it right, I suggest that the on board 16F84 needs to also sense when the external control signal on W_CLK has occurred so that the 16F84 can under program control allow the next event to be uploaded and prepared to shifting into the DDS portion of the chip. IF I HAVE THIS RIGHT, this is the only way that accurate timing of events into the DDS for FSK and PSK can occur. I can absolutely assure you that the ASYNC serial port output of any Win95, Win98, NT-4, and NT-2000 WILL NOT achieve the timing accuracy needed for FSK or BPSK state changes. As I was reading the AD9850 specification sheet I also note that your board would also need to accommodate the optional use of the Comparator resources on the chip so that the user would have the option of a sine wave output or a square wave output from the AD9850. The above is offered only as a way to make the AD9850 board fit a maximum number of possible applications and options in the user community. 73 Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18420 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 17:01:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 17:01:15 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pYkI-0003Bg-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 16:49:58 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pYkF-0003Bb-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 16:49:55 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12pYgz-0001Lm-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 16:46:33 +0100 Message-ID: <12939.200005101555@gemini> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "James Moritz" Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 16:56:11 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: RE: 1Hz Bandwidths In-reply-to: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528CD@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > All signals sound like a perfect audio tone - even > static crashes sound like a carrier with slow fading on it ! Loran lines > are tones in this BW. But it really does bring signals out of the noise, > even in the severe thunder storms of the last few days. > > Andy G4JNT > > Dear Andy & Group, With a 1Hz Bandwidth, isn't it rather difficult to find the signals in the first place? How do you tell if what you are receiving is a signal or not? It seems to me that some radically different operating procedures will have to be devised to exploit extreme narrow band techniques such as these! Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17006 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 17:15:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 17:15:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pZR9-0003Yl-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 17:34:15 +0100 Received: from d06lmsgate.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pZR5-0003Yf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 17:34:12 +0100 Received: from d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.148]) by d06lmsgate.uk.ibm.COM (1.0.0) with ESMTP id RAA66398 for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 17:22:56 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from usa.net (lig32-239-133-77.emea.lig-dial.ibm.com [32.239.133.77]) by d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id RAA43596 for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 17:33:17 +0100 Message-ID: <39198F18.F0C55FCE@usa.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 18:32:25 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" Organization: Undisclosed X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: DFCW Parameters References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528CD@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Talbot Andrew wrote: > > Does Spectran use the same windowing function as Spectrogram ? > Depending on which window is used, the effective bandwidth of a spectrum > display can be from one to three FFT bins, trading off display > sidelobes against effective bandwidth. Spectran presently applies a Hamming window to the incoming data. If you think it would be useful to use a rectangular one, perhaps selectable with a push-button, it is an easy change to the program Alberto, I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7976 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 17:30:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 17:30:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pZdi-0003gy-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 17:47:14 +0100 Received: from d06lmsgate-3.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.3] helo=lmsfw2.emea.ibm.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pZdd-0003gr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 17:47:10 +0100 Received: from d06relay01.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay01.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.147]) by lmsfw2.emea.ibm.com (1.0.0) with ESMTP id RAA91848 for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 17:38:31 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from usa.net (lig32-239-133-77.emea.lig-dial.ibm.com [32.239.133.77]) by d06relay01.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id RAA91426 for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 17:46:08 +0100 Message-ID: <3919921A.F280DCA2@usa.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 18:45:14 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" Organization: Undisclosed X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: RE: 1Hz Bandwidths References: <12939.200005101555@gemini> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: James Moritz wrote: > Dear Andy & Group, > With a 1Hz Bandwidth, isn't it rather difficult to find the signals > in the first place? How do you tell if what you are receiving is a > signal or not? It seems to me that some radically different > operating procedures will have to be devised to exploit extreme > narrow band techniques such as these! > The final version of Spectran will have audio filtering, as in Hamview. With this, you can apply a very narrow filter to incoming audio by just pointing with the mouse to the desired trace on the waterfall. Hamview has a choice of both FIR and IIR filters, and probably also Spectran will. Alberto, I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6053 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 18:15:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 18:15:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12paqm-0004Hv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 19:04:48 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12paql-0004Hq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 19:04:48 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as31-s16-147-86.cwci.net ([195.44.147.86] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12paqS-0005pf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 18:04:28 +0000 Message-ID: <391995AA.DF023D87@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 17:00:26 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: AW: 82.7kHz CW signal References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: "Soegiono, Gamal" wrote: > [Soegiono, Gamal] Hello Rik and all, > > RS> Some weeks ago someone (G3YXM ?) reported hearing > RS> CW arround 80kHz. Last night (+/- 22UT) I could > RS> heard just the end of a CW message followed by a > RS> carrier (gave listening to that after abt. 10 minutes). > RS> This morning (06 UT) the was a RTTY (like) signal on > RS> the same frequency. The signal (both last night and > RS> this morning) was very strong (S8 on my meter with > RS> the antenna tuned to 136kHz). > > Confirm receiption of a 2-tone FSK signal on 82k8 (approx) > which just fits into 200 Hz of IF BW. > According to well informed ITU persons this might be > > (1) GYW on 82k750 assigned freq. located at > > 05W20/36N09 (Gibraltar), using F1B, occupying 190 Hz of > BW and feeding 40 kW into the antenna. > > (2) GYB on 82k750 assigned freq. located at > 00W10/51N30 (London), using F1B, occupying 200 Hz of > BW and feeding 40 kW into the antenna. The frequency is 82.75 khz and because of its strength here in the UK is most likely GYB. Transmission type CW and RTTY and idles at times on carrier. G3KEV > > > Perhaps one of our LF_friends in UK may try to > DF to resolve the source of this signal. > > Closest, notified frequency below/above the observed > one at 82k7 is: > 82k4 and 83k1 respectively. > > Hope this helps. > > 73 de Gamal From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23830 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 19:02:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 19:02:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pbfG-0004fs-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 19:56:58 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pbfC-0004fn-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 19:56:54 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 (ppp-20-73-166.libero.it [151.20.73.166]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA20662 for ; Wed, 10 May 2000 20:56:31 +0200 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 20:56:31 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000510194036.018a2260@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Wed, 10 May 2000 19:55:06 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: LF: DFCW Parameters and 1 Hz BWs In-reply-to: <3.0.1.16.20000510142958.2e37b468@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Riferimenti: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik wrote: > >PS : I (and I think several others) never got Spectogram running stable at >5.5kHz sample rate. > Hello Rik, I'm testing the last version had from Alberto, and it seems to be stable. At least on my PC (Celeron 233 MHz, 64 MB RAM, not a fast machine today, HI) I will start a test in DFCW with three tones by Friday evening. More later. To James 'BMU: we have to define some "standards" and practice. By instance, working with a BW of 84 mHz, probably good for 12 sec dots, Spectran has a window over 24 Hz of band with horizontal display, and more than 50 Hz in vertical display mode. We may decide to use the last 20 or 40 Hz of the band for this kind of transmissions, so one can monitor all the sub-band at a glance; if you see a signal, then you may zoom-in at higher resolution. And to detect if it really is a signal .... wait and watch... then wait .... patience is the virtue of strong men (sorry for the bad English!) 73, Marco IK1ODO Marco Bruno - IK1ODO spin@inrete.it SPIN Electronics - www.spin-it.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16543 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 19:44:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 19:44:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pcHC-00050T-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 20:36:10 +0100 Received: from mailman.zeta.org.au ([203.26.10.16]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pcHA-00050O-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 20:36:08 +0100 Received: from steve (ppp194.dyn145.pacific.net.au [210.23.145.194]) by mailman.zeta.org.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id FAA13899 for ; Thu, 11 May 2000 05:35:41 +1000 Message-ID: <003d01bfbab7$3b7b96c0$0301a8c0@steve> From: "Steve Olney" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3.0.1.16.20000509164652.223f2124@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be><3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528C4@pdw-mercury-1.der a.gov.uk> <3.0.1.16.20000510092314.2e5f6dce@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Subject: Re: LF: DFCW Parameters Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 05:36:36 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: G'day Rik et al..., > > In theory there is no need for these 'gaps', but a series of tests (mainly > conducted by DF8ZR, DF6NM and me) showed that these small 'gaps' had 2 > advantages : > 1. It eases the reading of characters with a series of dots or dashes (eg. > O, S, J, 5 etc...) > In VFSKCW version 3 I have included a menu option to wobble consecutive dots or dashes (selectable 10% or 20% of main offset) to help the reading of such characters. 73s Steve Olney (VK2ZTO/AXSO - QF56IK : Lat -33 34 07, Long +150 44 40) ============================================= HomePage URLs: http://www.qsl.net/vk2zto http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg Containing:- Laser Comms DX LF Experimentation Amateur Radio Astronomy ============================================= From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20321 invoked from network); 10 May 2000 19:53:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 May 2000 19:53:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pcQb-00054z-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 20:45:53 +0100 Received: from mailman.zeta.org.au ([203.26.10.16]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pcQZ-00054u-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 10 May 2000 20:45:51 +0100 Received: from steve (ppp194.dyn145.pacific.net.au [210.23.145.194]) by mailman.zeta.org.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id FAA14336 for ; Thu, 11 May 2000 05:45:28 +1000 Message-ID: <005b01bfbab8$995b27a0$0301a8c0@steve> From: "Steve Olney" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3.0.1.16.20000509164652.223f2124@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be><3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528C4@pdw-mercury-1.der a.gov.uk> <3.0.1.16.20000510092314.2e5f6dce@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Subject: Re: LF: DFCW Parameters Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 05:47:30 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: G'day Rik et al... Oops - I mean VFSKCW version 4. Also since version 1 there has been an option to include a tone for identifying spaces by transmitting a mid-tone either between characters or between words, or both. 73s Steve Olney (VK2ZTO/AXSO - QF56IK : Lat -33 34 07, Long +150 44 40) ============================================= HomePage URLs: http://www.qsl.net/vk2zto http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg Containing:- Laser Comms DX LF Experimentation Amateur Radio Astronomy ============================================= From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16212 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 06:44:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 06:44:05 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pmY8-0001SA-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 07:34:20 +0100 Received: from front5m.grolier.fr ([195.36.216.55]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pmY6-0001S5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 07:34:19 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from club-internet.fr (ppp-44-34-41.wmar.club-internet.fr [213.44.34.41]) by front5m.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id IAA09728 for ; Thu, 11 May 2000 08:33:57 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <391A6285.25A61274@club-internet.fr> Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 08:34:29 +0100 From: "M & S" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: fr,fr,es-ES MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Disturbances Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Maybe this would be of interest... Space Weather News for May 11, 2000 Material from a coronal mass ejection that left the Sun on May 8 is expected to pass by our planet late on May 11 or early May 12. Depending on the characteristics of the magnetic field within the disturbance, it could trigger minor geomagnetic storms on Earth. There is a slim chance of aurorae at mid-latitudes, but auroral activity will more likely be concentrated over high latitude regions including northern Europe, Canada and Alaska. 73, Mark, F6JSZ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9342 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 07:55:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 07:55:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pngm-0001xp-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 08:47:20 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pngg-0001xS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 08:47:14 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id IAA20145; Thu, 11 May 2000 08:50:20 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 2312 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 08:43:01 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 08:43:01 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id HAA25200; Thu, 11 May 2000 07:31:21 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma025184; Thu, 11 May 00 07:31:00 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Thu, 11 May 2000 08:51:27 +0100 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id <2J00B35S>; Thu, 11 May 2000 08:45:36 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528CF@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: 1Hz Bandwidths Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 08:45:32 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > James Moritz wrote: > > > Dear Andy & Group, > > With a 1Hz Bandwidth, isn't it rather difficult to find the > signals > > in the first place? How do you tell if what you are receiving is a > > signal or not? It seems to me that some radically different > > operating procedures will have to be devised to exploit extreme > > narrow band techniques such as these! > > It has to be assumed you know the operating frequency beforehand to the required accuracy - being able to adjust to within 1 Hz should be trivial at these frequencies where it is even difficult to pull a crystal that far off frequency. You will know a signal is there when the demodulator or display responds in the correct manner. Alberto Wrote: >Spectran presently applies a Hamming window to the incoming data. >If you think it would be useful to use a rectangular one, perhaps >selectable with a push-button, it is an easy change to the program I don't think a rectangular window will offer much extra value in a crowded band like 137kHz ( ! ) the sidelobes of other signals could cause visual QRM offsetting the 1.8 times bandwidth advantage. I've played with many window types and come to the conclusion that the Hamming or Hanning windows are the best compromise every time. By the look of Spectrogram, it also uses one of these. Andy G4JNT -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10689 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 09:02:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 09:02:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12poiu-0002UJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 09:53:36 +0100 Received: from ulexite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12poit-0002UE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 09:53:35 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (2410825495.dialin.freeler.nl [143.178.71.23]) by ulexite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id EB3E5FAFDE for ; Thu, 11 May 2000 07:51:56 -0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <006501bfbb26$5f2e89a0$5647b28f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <004101bfb1c0$f43c6860$623997d4@oemcomputer> Subject: LF: Re: New coil design program by G4FGQ Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 10:42:33 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To All from PA0SE Johan, SM6LKM wrote: Hello all, G4FGQ has written a new coil design program, solnoid2.exe. It seems to predict loss with better accuracy than solenoid.exe. http://www.btinternet.com/~g4fgq.regp/ http://www.btinternet.com/~g4fgq.regp/page2.html#S209 73 Johan SM6LKM I tried the program on two existing coils, a small one and my large antenna loading coil. In both cases the results by the program agreed very well with measured values, even for Q. G4FGQ certainly did a fine job! 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25582 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 09:07:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 09:07:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ponP-0002Uu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 09:58:15 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ponN-0002Up-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 09:58:13 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id KAA02529; Thu, 11 May 2000 10:01:19 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 14203 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 09:54:00 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 09:54:00 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id IAA17865; Thu, 11 May 2000 08:42:19 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma016568; Thu, 11 May 00 08:38:19 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Thu, 11 May 2000 09:58:44 +0100 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id <2J00BQHD>; Thu, 11 May 2000 09:52:54 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528D0@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: DDS Source board, Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 09:52:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Having a board with an uncommitted PIC means that the same hardware can be used in any way that the user wants just by re-writing the firmware. I was going to use a normal 18 pin DIP package rather than SMT PIC so it can be used in a socket for maximum flexibility. I do realise PC timing is appalling in any of the Win operating systems - that's why I still use DOS as much as possible and have a second computer - an ancient 486 - dedicated to radio purposes with most ham progs using EVM varients rather than Soundcard. Even so, Win operating systems can generate real timings to 55ms accuracies (can't they ?). So real time rates based on 1 second or longer schemes shouldn't be too far out. The 'PLX software for PSK31 with the EVM uses the serial port in near real time and is quite happy with Win 95 / 98 etc - For high prescision work timing, sync pulses from a GPS receiver could go to a port on the PIC, then use the PC via a handshake to set parameters. However, I'm uneasy about using the DDS control for anything other than frequency setting for FSK and other INCOHERENT modes anyway. I believe PSK is better generated in dedicated hardware (or by DSP and mixing, but that's another story). That way, the frequency source stays inviolate and fixed and modulation is applied via proper waveform shaping to a modulator that can be as simple as an EX-OR gate; or better, a mixer. Andy G4JNT >From Larry Kayser : >I offer that to have maximum efficiency when using a serial line into a PIC >to control the AD9850 it will be necessary to have your board OR an external >drive signal with the signal from the 16F84 for the W_CLK signal so that >accurate control of the FSK or PSK transition events can occur. The control >could occur from either the 16F84 or from an external signal source. >The first need is that an external drive signal can control the timing of >the BPSK or the FSK change / shift event. If I have it right, I suggest >that the on board 16F84 needs to also sense when the external control >signal on W_CLK has occurred so that the 16F84 can under program control >allow the next event to be uploaded and prepared to shifting into the DDS >portion of the chip. IF I HAVE THIS RIGHT, this is the only way that >accurate timing of events into the DDS for FSK and PSK can occur. I can >absolutely assure you that the ASYNC serial port output of any Win95, Win98, >NT-4, and NT-2000 WILL NOT achieve the timing accuracy needed for FSK or >BPSK state changes. -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8406 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 15:21:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 15:21:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pufW-0005S8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 16:14:30 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pufQ-0005S1-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 16:14:25 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id QAA22789; Thu, 11 May 2000 16:17:29 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 27535 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 16:10:09 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 16:10:09 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id OAA16232; Thu, 11 May 2000 14:58:27 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma016183; Thu, 11 May 00 14:58:11 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Thu, 11 May 2000 16:18:40 +0100 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id <2J00BWYD>; Thu, 11 May 2000 16:12:48 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528D3@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: RE: LF: AW: 82.7kHz CW signal Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 16:12:46 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Just a thought. Who uses these transmissions at LF and why - especially from central London. The freq is to high for (alleged) underwater communications and doesn't offer much in the way of long distance traffic opportunities. Speculation .......... Andy > > > > 05W20/36N09 (Gibraltar), using F1B, occupying 190 Hz of > > BW and feeding 40 kW into the antenna. > > > > (2) GYB on 82k750 assigned freq. located at > > 00W10/51N30 (London), using F1B, occupying 200 Hz of > > BW and feeding 40 kW into the antenna. > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6754 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 17:04:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 17:04:35 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pwDw-0006Es-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 17:54:08 +0100 Received: from disp.mindef.nl ([62.200.204.66] helo=u05.mindef.nl) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pwDs-0006En-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 17:54:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from co.disp.mindef.nl (dial-077.pop3.mld.disp.net [62.200.208.77]) by u05.mindef.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with ESMTP id AAA2AB6 for ; Thu, 11 May 2000 18:53:14 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <391AD4A7.1AB2ABC1@co.disp.mindef.nl> Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 17:41:29 +0200 From: "J.M. Valstar" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [nl]C-CCK-MCD QXW07201 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: nl,de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "RSGB LF Group" Subject: LF: Special Event Station DQ0KBM Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello group, Via Nico/pa2njn I received the following request from Alfred Kluss/DF2BC to pass the following information to the LF-Group. The original text was in German, so I translated it in English. Quote As from thursday May 11th till Tuesday, May 16th 2000 we will be QRV on Borkum with the Special Event Station DQ0KBM. I will work on 136.5 kHz with "The First" of Ropex and a home-made LW-receiver (100 - 150 kHz). The aerial will be a 100 meter vertical wire. I will use the 120 liter dustbin for antenna adjustment. (note pa3guc - probably his adjustment coil). Probably I will be QRV on 136.5 kHz as from Thursday evening or otherwise Friday morning. Working from Borkum should be better than last year from Campen Lighthouse !!! The main activity will probably be on Saturday evening (13.05) and Sunday (14.05) Pse lsn fr DQ0KBM or/and DF2BC/p Vy 73/55 cul on 136.5 Alfred Kluss/DF2BC unquote From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5552 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 17:54:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 17:54:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12px1U-0006cz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 18:45:20 +0100 Received: from bucky-rwcmex.excite.com ([198.3.99.218] helo=bucky.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12px1S-0006ct-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 18:45:18 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by bucky.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000511174425.BZTM5058.bucky.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Thu, 11 May 2000 10:44:25 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <15179427.958067065369.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 10:44:25 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: DDS Source board, MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 62.7.159.173 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Andy, Larry and All, I can confirm Larry's statement about the unreliability of serial port timing under Windows 95/98. This is a consequence of the change to pre-emptive scheduling from Windows 95 onward. The system timer (18 ticks per second) that Andy refers to is not directly accessible under Windows and any timings based upon it will be found to be inaccurate by a few mSec either way. It is only correct on average. My solution to this is to use a Comtrol Hostess i card, which come in 4, 8 or 16 RS232 port versions. The card has its own processor and memory and can be downloaded with a program to operate the ports. The interface to Windows is then through dual-ported memory. John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6998 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 18:25:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 18:25:38 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pxYt-0006ts-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 19:19:51 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pxYr-0006tn-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 19:19:49 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as31-s16-147-207.cwci.net ([195.44.147.207] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pxYY-0004Y5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 18:19:30 +0000 Message-ID: <391AE0E6.F55B3603@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 16:33:42 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Spectran accuracy References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > > > > G3KEV replied: > > Tell me Rik, why is there no qrss(LMCW) when the band is noisy like lots > > of qrn/static about. > > My ANSWER after monitoring and experimentation with > > spectran is that the qrn chops the long dashes and you cannot > > be sure if it was lots of dots. > > On the contrary, Had you been listening today you might change your mind. I tuned to a weak steady carrier and the QRN was so consistant that it chewed it up completely. Not just intermittent crashes but the STATIC was virtually continuous. I then worked G8RW and gave him 259. It was a struggle but on normal cw I made it. I was monitoring him on spectrogram and NO way would it have been possible to read his signals visually and make any sense of the transmission. I tried all permutations of spectrogram and it made little difference. My observations in the past indicate that the band has to be relatively quiet to see weak signals and read the information, and most of the time is it guesswork, because you already know in advance who is going to be active. Say what you like about the so called advantages of slow morse. I have yet to see anyone attempting a qso under the conditions that I have described above, and I always monitor for slow morse as well as normal activities. The slow morse activity that I do see can easily be copied aurally at my qth. Maybe my antenna is above average. I have yet to see a qso on slow cw that I cannot copy both ends by ear. G3KEV > I find that the advantage of QRSS is even greater > under heavy QRN - it's often the only mode that is viable in the > summer. Static crashes are usually much shorter than the dot > period and it is much easier to watch the bright white lines of static > than to listen to QRN. I cannot vouch for Spectran, but > Spectrogram works well under these conditions. > > Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) > http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7019 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 18:25:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 18:25:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pxYv-0006tz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 19:19:53 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pxYu-0006tu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 19:19:52 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as31-s16-147-207.cwci.net ([195.44.147.207] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pxYc-0004YB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 18:19:34 +0000 Message-ID: <391AEB17.57F4F56D@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 17:17:12 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: kites Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Apart from a message from Lech about towing Jumbo Jets those with professional kite flying ability seemed scarce. The few private replies were more related to toy kites, and not capable of lifting and supporting a long antenna wire at least 500 ft. My research shows that no one kite is totally suitable for all wind conditions. Moderate to fresh winds =Multi celled tetrahedral kites or Marconi jib Gentle winds = Conyne or Compound bat General wx= Large Parafoil Some of these kites have a span of up to 20 ft and could be difficult to launch by one person but have the advantage that once up will soar all day. A 7 ft span seems more manageable for one person, but the options are so varied it is impossible to cover all types and their performance here. Seemingly if one can get a kite to around 1000 ft it will be very stable and need little attention, it will stay there for days. For anyone interested in LF and a good antenna and lives out in the country this would be the answer. Very cost effective, less than Ł500 as apposed to a modest 120 ft tower at over Ł2000 A good well anchored winch is needed and preferably automated and connected to a heavy vehicle like a tractor. Check with your local ATC so that a NOTAM can be issued to avoid a collision. If you just want a day out and some fun use a toy kite but it is likely to nose dive into the ground just as often as it soars into the sky and needs a lot of attention, distracting you from operating, especially if your cw is marginal in the first place. For those seeking glory with a first across the atlantic think KITE G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21348 invoked from network); 11 May 2000 19:36:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2000 19:36:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pyeE-0007Sb-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 20:29:26 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo15.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.5]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12pydi-0007SO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 May 2000 20:28:56 +0100 Received: from MarkusVester@aol.com by imo15.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.a9.572b00b (4223) for ; Thu, 11 May 2000 15:27:42 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: MarkusVester@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 15:27:42 EDT Subject: LF: LF Meeting in Nuernberg on May 20th ? To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 64 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Lowfers, there will be a ham fleamarket on saturday, May 20th in the Nuremberg trade fair centre, which is only about 500 m from my qth. This might be a nice opportunity to meet others active on LF! Geri, DK8KW, Walter DJ2LF and I intend to meet at 16:30 at the exit gate to go for a couple of beers or perhaps organize a bbq here. If you'd like to join, perhaps you could send a notice to my adress: MarkusVester@aol.com. 73, hope to see you Markus, DF6NM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13556 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 04:43:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 04:43:30 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12q77e-00038C-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 05:32:22 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail.sci.fi ([195.74.0.41] helo=pyyhe.saunalahti.fi ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12q77d-000387-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 05:32:21 +0100 Received: from default (MMMDCCXCIII.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.164.193]) by pyyhe.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id HAA10731 for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 07:44:28 +0300 (EET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000512073441.00824e30@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: vaiski1@pop.saunalahti.fi X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 07:34:41 +0300 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: Noise level Measurements by OH2LX 12 May 2000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Does anyone else have burst-like noise appearing as "waves" every 5 to 8 secs? I hear them practically every EVENING, can listen only until abt 23-24 UTC.. Any other Finns on this reflector? ------- Example of noise level situation in the MORNING, (12 May 2000, start 0250 UTC). No "noise waves" during morning hours.. (noise level in 200 Hz - Rx: R&S ESH2): (Note: No AGC in a measuring receiver..) kHz dB(uV) dBmW 136.0 -19 -126 136.1 -18 -125 136.2 -20 -127 136.3 -22 -129 136.4 -23 -130 136.5 -23 -130 136.6 -23 -130 136.7 -24 -131 136.8 -24 -131 136.9 -25 -132 137.0 -26 -133 137.1 -25 -132 137.2 -26 -133 137.3 -26 -133 137.4 -26 -133 137.5 -27 -134 137.6 -26 -133 136.7 -26 -133 136.8 -26 -133 137.9 -25 -132 138.0 -25 -132 138.1 -24 -131 ..... 138.8 +16 -91 Burg carrier Absolutely no ICM products heard, meaning no ionospheric propagation..? --------------------------------------------------- End of message of 12 May 2000, 0435 UTC, from OH2LX ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29381 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 04:45:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 04:45:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12q7Bn-0003BU-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 05:36:39 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from hs-img-5.compuserve.com ([149.174.177.154] helo=sphmgaae.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12q7Bl-0003BB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 05:36:38 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by sphmgaae.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id AAA01868 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 00:35:48 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 00:35:34 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: LF Meeting in Nuernberg on May 20th ? To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005120035_MC2-A4AA-DE89@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hallo Markus, noch eins: mit Deiner Erlaubnis wuerde ich gerne Deine Meldung per Packet Radio unter "VLF@EU" verbreiten. Es gibt einige aktive LF-Hams die nur in Packet QRV sind, z.B. aus ON. Vy 73 Holger, DK8KW (W1KW) >Hi Lowfers, > >there will be a ham fleamarket on saturday, May 20th in the Nuremberg trade >fair centre, which is only about 500 m from my qth. This might be a nice >opportunity to meet others active on LF! Geri, DK8KW, Walter DJ2LF and I >intend to meet at 16:30 at the exit gate to go for a couple of beers or >perhaps organize a bbq here. If you'd like to join, perhaps you could send a >notice to my adress: MarkusVester@aol.com. > >73, hope to see you >Markus, DF6NM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5031 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 05:18:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 05:18:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12q7jN-0003R2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 06:11:21 +0100 Received: from mta02-acc.tin.it ([212.216.176.33] helo=fep02-svc.tin.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12q7jL-0003Qv-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 06:11:20 +0100 Received: from tin.tin.it ([212.216.32.50]) by fep02-svc.tin.it (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with ESMTP id <20000512051028.CHER2780.fep02-svc.tin.it@tin.tin.it> for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 07:10:28 +0200 From: "Rudy Gubiolo" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: commercial lf tx Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 07:04:51 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <20000512051028.CHER2780.fep02-svc.tin.it@tin.tin.it> Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: do exist any tx or transverter for 136kc tks in advance 73 i3vwk rudy rgubiolo@tin.it From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1043 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 05:47:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 05:47:29 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12q8Ck-0003eh-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 06:41:42 +0100 Received: from m1.dynamite.com.au ([203.17.154.18] helo=dynamite.com.au) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12q8CO-0003eb-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 06:41:21 +0100 Received: from asp (dialup152.moru.dynamite.com.au [203.37.56.152]) by dynamite.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA09336 for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 15:40:07 +1000 Message-ID: <001201bfbbd4$89124500$983825cb@asp> From: "msr" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3.0.6.32.20000512073441.00824e30@pop.saunalahti.fi> Subject: LF: Re: Noise level Measurements by OH2LX 12 May 2000 Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 15:39:36 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by dynamite.com.au id PAA09336 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Noise from Io and Jupiter have a similar characteristic - could it be that? 73 msr ----- Original Message ----- From: "Väinö Lehtoranta" To: Sent: Friday, May 12, 2000 2:34 PM Subject: LF: Noise level Measurements by OH2LX 12 May 2000 > Does anyone else have burst-like noise > appearing as "waves" every 5 to 8 secs? > I hear them practically every EVENING, > can listen only until abt 23-24 UTC.. > Any other Finns on this reflector? > ------- > Example of noise level situation in the > MORNING, (12 May 2000, start 0250 UTC). > No "noise waves" during morning hours.. > (noise level in 200 Hz - Rx: R&S ESH2): > (Note: No AGC in a measuring receiver..) > > kHz dB(uV) dBmW > 136.0 -19 -126 > 136.1 -18 -125 > 136.2 -20 -127 > 136.3 -22 -129 > 136.4 -23 -130 > 136.5 -23 -130 > 136.6 -23 -130 > 136.7 -24 -131 > 136.8 -24 -131 > 136.9 -25 -132 > 137.0 -26 -133 > 137.1 -25 -132 > 137.2 -26 -133 > 137.3 -26 -133 > 137.4 -26 -133 > 137.5 -27 -134 > 137.6 -26 -133 > 136.7 -26 -133 > 136.8 -26 -133 > 137.9 -25 -132 > 138.0 -25 -132 > 138.1 -24 -131 > ..... > 138.8 +16 -91 Burg carrier > > Absolutely no ICM products heard, > meaning no ionospheric propagation..? > --------------------------------------------------- > End of message of 12 May 2000, 0435 UTC, from OH2LX > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland > ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ > E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2002 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 07:41:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 07:41:42 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12q9zo-0004Uf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 08:36:28 +0100 Received: from mta01.talk21.com ([62.172.192.171] helo=t21mta01-app.talk21.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12q9zk-0004Ua-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 08:36:24 +0100 Received: from dave ([62.7.177.34]) by t21mta01-app.talk21.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000512073502.OIUZ25054.t21mta01-app.talk21.com@dave> for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 08:35:02 +0100 Message-ID: <000701bfbbe4$a4acf840$22b1073e@dave> From: "Dave Sergeant" To: "rsgb_lf_group" References: <391AE0E6.F55B3603@netscapeonline.co.uk> Subject: Re: LF: Spectran accuracy Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 08:34:49 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >From Dave G3YMC Mal G3KEV wrote: >Had you been listening today you might change your mind. I tuned to a weak >steady carrier and the QRN was so consistant that it chewed it up completely. >Not just intermittent crashes but the STATIC was virtually continuous. I then >worked G8RW and gave him 259. I cannot comment on the various pros and cons on Spectran's abilities of copying signals under heavy static conditions (and must admit that recent mails on DSP processors and other exoteric techniques leaves me rather cold...) but I can concur with some of Mal's comments. Over the past week, when static levels have been horrendous, I have heard Mal on several occasions. Mal's signal is a little over s9 on my meter. Many times the static has been pinning the meter to 20dB over s9, with breaks to a lower level for no more than 20% of the time. At no time did the s meter go anywhere its normal background level of s5. In these conditions even Mal's signals were rather fighting with the static and much chopped up. However because most of what he was sending was pretty predictable (ie a CQ call) it was indeed perfectly possible to work out all the necessary information, ie callsign, CQ, and if it were a QSO the RST, by piecing it all together in the mind (no need to write it down!). In basic QSOs, and certainly with the limited number of stations on the band, there is a remarkable amount of redundancy in our sending. It may have been a little harder to follow the guist if it were a detailed discussion of equipment changes etc, but for the basic information necessary to qualify for a valid QSO it was sufficient. If Spectran and the other programs offer the capability to copy stations 20dB below noise, in these circumstances this would only take you to s9, which was certainly copyable with normal CW. I admit the static levels recently have been much higher than usual, and would not expect anyone to attempt to work transatlantic under such conditions (or to even ragchew!) I have two weakish carriers on the band, 136.7 and 137.8 which are normally just above the noise. I wonder how copy of these is on Spectran with 20dB over heavy static - I can just about copy traces here in the crashes. Static is much lower this morning, can it last? 73s Dave dsergeant@iee.org http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sergeantd From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20542 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 09:45:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 09:45:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qBsh-0005Of-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 10:37:15 +0100 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qBse-0005Oa-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 10:37:12 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12qBsT-0006uu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 10:37:02 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 10:27:42 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 10:27:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: QRSS and QRN In-reply-to: <000701bfbbe4$a4acf840$22b1073e@dave> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > >From Dave G3YMC > If Spectran and the other programs offer the capability to copy stations > 20dB below noise, in these circumstances this would only take you to s9, > which was certainly copyable with normal CW. I admit the static levels > recently have been much higher than usual, and would not expect anyone to > attempt to work transatlantic under such conditions (or to even ragchew!) > I have two weakish carriers on the band, 136.7 and 137.8 which are > normally just above the noise. I wonder how copy of these is on Spectran > with 20dB over heavy static - I can just about copy traces here in the > crashes. This misses the point. Spectrogram etc can copy CW up to 20db below 'normal' noise. But the duty cycle of static is much lower than noise, therefore there is a =much= greater advantage than 20dB. Using Spectrogram and QRSS, I can receive signals 100% in heavy static that would be impossible to read using normal CW at whatever speed. But in any case it is really up to the individual operator to use whatever technique he feels happiest with, and regardless of what technique is used, S9+ QRN is going to degrade it. Also QRSS is no good for ragchews, no matter how good the S/N is. I will try to demonstrate the advantage of QRSS in static by providing a WAV recording and Spectrogram plot on my web site (which make me the only LF operator hoping there's QRN tonight!). Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2242 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 10:10:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 10:10:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qCHd-0005dP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 11:03:01 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qCHd-0005dK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 11:03:01 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.218.187] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qCHI-0004Z3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 10:02:42 +0000 Message-ID: <391BC843.E7EF13AA@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 09:00:51 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: 136 khz acty Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The special event station DF2BC/P - DQ0KBM is up and running with a big signal this morning. I was his first qso at 0921 utc/12052000. Reports 599 each way. He had not finished the installation completely and worked me by tapping two pieces of wire together to send cw, and the sending was perfect. Well done ALI. and enjoy your expedition to Borkum Island. Another new one worked this morning was PA0WFS/Wim, his first G QSO. 73 De Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22897 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 10:35:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 10:35:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qCdI-0005n9-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 11:25:24 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.7]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qCdG-0005n1-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 11:25:22 +0100 Received: from G0MRF@aol.com by imo17.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.9f.53c8a12 (4569) for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 06:24:30 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: G0MRF@aol.com Message-ID: <9f.53c8a12.264d35de@aol.com> Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 06:24:30 EDT Subject: Re: LF: commercial lf tx To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 32 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In a message dated 5/12/00 6:16:41 AM GMT Daylight Time, rgubiolo@tin.it writes: << do exist any tx or transverter for 136kc tks in advance 73 i3vwk rudy rgubiolo@tin.it >> Commercial: Ropex 'First' 30W / 130W 13.8V 136.55k xtal - made in Netherlands. Kits and circuits: www.g0mrf.freeserve.co.uk/300w.htm 300 - 400W external 40V supply VSWR protection over current protection 4 switched power levels fwd / rev power metering. 73 David From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14630 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 11:08:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 11:08:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qDC9-00063Q-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 12:01:25 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qDC5-00063L-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 12:01:22 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id MAA05047; Fri, 12 May 2000 12:04:29 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 6274 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 11:57:05 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 11:57:05 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id KAA15299; Fri, 12 May 2000 10:45:19 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma015242; Fri, 12 May 00 10:45:14 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 12:05:51 +0100 Received: by frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Fri, 12 May 2000 11:59:54 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528D6@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: QRSS and QRN Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 11:59:52 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The static crashes are only " 20dB over 9" for the few microseconds while they are happening. When using Spectran etc. try turning off the AGC completely and just allow the static crashes to overload the receiver for their duration. The Rx will continue working normally between the crashes and should allow through the signal for processing at normal strength. Leaving the AGC operating just destroys receiver gain during its hang period. I find that for almost any radio monitoring activity manual gain control is better than AGC operation. Andy G4JNT > ---------- > From: Mike Dennison[SMTP:mike.dennison@rsgb.org.uk] > Reply To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Sent: 2000-05-12 10:27 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: LF: QRSS and QRN > > > >From Dave G3YMC > > If Spectran and the other programs offer the capability to copy > stations > > 20dB below noise, in these circumstances this would only take you to > s9, > > which was certainly copyable with normal CW. I admit the static > levels > > recently have been much higher than usual, and would not expect > anyone to > > attempt to work transatlantic under such conditions (or to even > ragchew!) > > I have two weakish carriers on the band, 136.7 and 137.8 which are > > normally just above the noise. I wonder how copy of these is on > Spectran > > with 20dB over heavy static - I can just about copy traces here in > the > > crashes. > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2098 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 12:09:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 12:09:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qE7I-0006Uc-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 13:00:28 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qE6s-0006UG-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 13:00:02 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12qE6Y-0001c7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 12:59:42 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <28990.200005121159@gemini> From: "James Moritz" Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 13:06:23 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: QRN & CW / Commercial CW on LF X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, My homebrew RX has no AGC - instead, I use an audio clipping circuit with a variable threshold, which is quite good at reducing the effect of QRN, both for normal and QRSS CW. I adjust it so that the wanted signal is not quite clipped, but the much larger QRN impulses are. I found it was more effective to put the clipper before the narrow audio filter I sometimes use. Of course, there are limits to what you can expect from this type of circuit - at my QTH lately, the static crashes seem to be merging into one big crackle! Regarding non-amateur CW cignals heard on LF, this morning at about 1015utc, on 18.20kHz I was suprised to hear VVV VVV VVV VTX3 several times, interspersed with figures and letter groups, all in plain CW. The signal was about 569. I am sure someone has mentioned this station before, but can't think where - any ideas? Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15644 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 12:39:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 12:39:28 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qEdS-0006lS-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 13:33:42 +0100 Received: from kerberos.telecom.cz ([194.228.2.35] helo=mail.core.telecom.cz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qEdR-0006lM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 13:33:41 +0100 Received: from dell1.cz.gmc.net ([194.228.225.18]) by mail.core.telecom.cz (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA31489 for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 14:33:15 +0200 Received: from p (p.maly.cz.gmc.net [192.168.1.35]) by dell1.cz.gmc.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id KSG6KB3M; Fri, 12 May 2000 14:34:08 +0200 Message-ID: <09e401bfbc0e$5e55ab60$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> From: "Petr Maly" To: "136 group" Subject: LF: Optimal width for LF? Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 14:34:08 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello all I am just designing a new RX for 136 kHz band. It will have IF on 1 MHz with high quality x-tal filter with bandwidth 200 Hz. The main selectivity will by obtained on AF with passive filter with coils on pot cores. Till now I used similar filter with bandwidth about 50 Hz and it seems to be still too wide for LF. I was about to make it new with 15 Hz width. Somebody here mentioned 1 Hz wide filter which seems to me to be too narrow. At least, the filter cannot be narrower than obtainable osc stability. Can we make a little questionnaire here? What bandwidth do you use and what is the experience? 73, Petr, OK1FIG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15691 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 12:39:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 12:39:35 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qEd5-0006lK-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 13:33:19 +0100 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qEd3-0006lF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 13:33:17 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id OAA334586 for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 14:32:50 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000512142837.222fb59e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 14:28:37 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: QRN & CW / Commercial CW on LF In-reply-to: <28990.200005121159@gemini> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >Regarding non-amateur CW cignals heard on LF, this morning at >about 1015utc, on 18.20kHz I was suprised to hear VVV VVV VVV >VTX3 several times, interspersed with figures and letter groups, all >in plain CW. The signal was about 569. I am sure someone has >mentioned this station before, but can't think where - any ideas? If VTX3 is a callsign according ITU regulations it is from India ... talking about LF DX ! 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4777 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 12:55:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 12:55:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qEtk-0006v4-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 13:50:32 +0100 Received: from teapot23.domain2.bigpond.com ([139.134.5.165]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qEtg-0006uz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 13:50:29 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by teapot23.domain2.bigpond.com (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id sa803314 for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 22:47:38 +1000 Received: from MOIP-A-003-pool-149.tmns.net.au ([139.134.91.149]) by mail2.bigpond.com (Claudes-Drunken-MailRouter V2.7e 3/4107369); 12 May 2000 22:47:37 Message-ID: <003801bfbc10$70ede240$955b868b@zimslaptop> From: "Graeme Zimmer" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <28990.200005121159@gemini> Subject: LF: Re: QRN & CW / Commercial CW on LF Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 22:48:57 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > Regarding non-amateur CW cignals heard on LF, this morning at > about 1015utc, on 18.20kHz I was suprised to hear VVV VVV VVV > VTX3 several times, interspersed with figures and letter groups, all > in plain CW. The signal was about 569. I am sure someone has > mentioned this station before, but can't think where - any ideas? Hi Jim. Is supposedly an Indian Navy station. Is very strong here in Southern Australia. Is very easy to "see" with just a PC and a Sound Card. 73's ................... Zim .................... VK3GJZ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4281 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 14:55:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 14:55:55 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qGXp-0007kU-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 15:36:01 +0100 Received: from mta01.talk21.com ([62.172.192.171] helo=t21mta01-app.talk21.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qGXl-0007kM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 15:35:58 +0100 Received: from dave ([213.1.29.199]) by t21mta01-app.talk21.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000512143439.QZUM25054.t21mta01-app.talk21.com@dave> for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 15:34:39 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01bfbc1f$42dab220$c71d01d5@dave> From: "Dave Sergeant" To: "rsgb_lf_group" References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528D6@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> Subject: LF: Re: RE: QRSS and QRN Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 15:28:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >From Dave G3YMC G4JNT wrote: >The static crashes are only " 20dB over 9" for the few microseconds >while they are happening. While the electrical discharge in the atmosphere may be this short (but in reality I suspect will be longer) I suspect unless the receiver has a special IF filter the length of the pulse at the audio output will be just a little longer.... whatever the characteristics of the AGC, on or off In the case of severe static as of the past few days, successive crashes tend to join together. I have listened to normal CW with the AGC both on and off and there is little difference in the overall copyability except that the static is rather harder on the ears with it off. Computers of course don't have ears! Mike Dennison wrote: >I will try to demonstrate the advantage of QRSS in static by >providing a WAV recording and Spectrogram plot on my web site Not much use for me as I have no sound card in my computer. As Mike comments, it is very much up to the individual operator's preferences which modes he uses. I do not wish to get into arguments either way, but I guess you know my preferences! Cheers Dave dsergeant@iee.org http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sergeantd From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3991 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 15:25:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 15:25:54 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qHBP-00084v-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 16:16:55 +0100 Received: from mail.sci.fi ([195.74.0.41] helo=pyyhe.saunalahti.fi ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qHBO-00084q-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 16:16:54 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from default (MKDXXXIV.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.167.34]) by pyyhe.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id SAA18150 for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 18:29:00 +0300 (EET DST) Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000512181914.00828c70@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: oh2lx@pop.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 18:19:14 +0300 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: Re: LF: Re: Noise level Measurements by OH2LX 12 May 2000 In-reply-to: <001201bfbbd4$89124500$983825cb@asp> References: <3.0.6.32.20000512073441.00824e30@pop.saunalahti.fi> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi msr and others, I just wonder how could that be local noise? Jorma, OH8PX, retired from Oulu University is a Jupiter radio signal expert and there are some others. I did listen once again some .au and .wav recordings of AKR and MAGCUSP noise, there is some resemblance, but ... There should be no reason why someone else in these latitudes couldn't be hearing it. Observations continue... 73 de Vaino, OH2LX So far no comments from OH's... At 15:39 12.5.2000 +1000, you wrote: >Noise from Io and Jupiter have a similar characteristic - could it be that? > >73 msr >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Väinö Lehtoranta" >To: >Sent: Friday, May 12, 2000 2:34 PM >Subject: LF: Noise level Measurements by OH2LX 12 May 2000 > >> Does anyone else have burst-like noise >> appearing as "waves" every 5 to 8 secs? >> I hear them practically every EVENING, >> can listen only until abt 23-24 UTC.. >> Any other Finns on this reflector? >> ------- ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 958 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 17:38:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 17:38:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qJDg-0000e6-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 18:27:24 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ds-img-3.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.136] helo=spdmgaac.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qJDZ-0000dx-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 18:27:17 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaac.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id NAA25255 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 13:26:27 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 13:26:10 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: Optimal width for LF? To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005121326_MC2-A4D2-32D6@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Petr asked: >What bandwidth do you use and what is the experience?< I use 100 Hz bandwidth for normal CW as well as for Slow CW. I use the 100 Hz filter of my MV62 level meter, which is a 200 kHz mechanical filter with similar data as the old colins filter. For normal CW operation this filter normally is excellent, in case of a case I can still use a 20 Hz DSP filter (build into my IC-746), but normally this only improves the signal if there is really another station near by. I also have another level meter, a D2108 mad by Siemens. It has got a 20 Hz IF filter, which is too narrow for normal CW. The next step, a 400 Hz filter, again is too wide. So my recommendation for a normal CW LF Receiver is 80 to 100 Hz. For Slow CW the program (either Spectrogram for 3 to 5 second dots or Spectran for >20 second dots) does the job of a 0.00x Hz wide filter. Talking about Spectran: IK1ODO, when and where do you begin your tests? Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6554 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 17:50:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 17:50:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qJOv-0000jo-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 18:39:01 +0100 Received: from ewey-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.191] helo=ewey.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qJOr-0000jb-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 18:38:59 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from magic.excite.com ([199.172.148.161]) by ewey.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000512173806.BOGF11742.ewey.excite.com@magic.excite.com> for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 10:38:06 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <11315594.958153086792.JavaMail.imail@magic.excite.com> Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 10:38:06 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Noise level Measurements by OH2LX 12 May 2000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 213.1.24.156 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi "msr" and Väinö, Hardly, Jupiter is on the other side of the Sun at present. John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6294 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 18:03:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 18:03:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qJgI-0000tQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 18:56:58 +0100 Received: from fortune-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.203] helo=fortune.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qJgG-0000t6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 18:56:57 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from magic.excite.com ([199.172.148.161]) by fortune.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000512175604.CUXD27151.fortune.excite.com@magic.excite.com> for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 10:56:04 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <17779882.958154164780.JavaMail.imail@magic.excite.com> Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 10:56:04 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: QRN & CW / Commercial CW on LF MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 213.1.24.156 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Jim, Yes it is an Indian station and has been mentioned a few times on the reflector. I think one of our friends down under mentioned it last as audible in VK. Like you I found it by chance. It sometimes sends CW, sometimes some sort of data and at other times tones. 73s John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25265 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 18:30:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 18:30:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qK5h-00016O-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 19:23:13 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from oso.slonet.org ([207.114.180.2] ident=cbuttsch) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qK5f-00016J-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 19:23:12 +0100 Received: from localhost by oso.slonet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA09617 for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 11:22:44 -0700 (PDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 11:22:42 -0700 (PDT) From: "Clifford Buttschardt" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Noise level Measurements by OH2LX 12 May 2000 In-reply-to: <11315594.958153086792.JavaMail.imail@magic.excite.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I believe most of Jupiter's emmissions are in the 20 to 25 MHz region although NASA is finding all kind of other spectra from the giant! Cliff K7RR On Fri, 12 May 2000, john sexton wrote: > > Hi "msr" and Vdinv, > Hardly, Jupiter is on the other side of the Sun at present. > John, G4CNN From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1473 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 20:11:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 20:11:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qLgC-0001to-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 21:05:00 +0100 Received: from smtp13.bellglobal.com ([204.101.251.52]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qLgB-0001tj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 21:04:59 +0100 Received: from server1 (ppp137.on.bellglobal.com [206.172.245.137]) by smtp13.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA27422 for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 16:08:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <004001bfbc4c$af30ca90$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Optimal width for LF? Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 15:59:11 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Petr asked: >What bandwidth do you use and what is the experience?< I have a W&G selective level meter AT-611 that has a 24 Hz filter and it is great and I like it very much. I would be happy down to 10 or 15 Hz as well, all copy visually on CRT. I have copied the Indian LF CW signal and it is easy to copy at the 12 wpm speed (about) that he was sending. For me, the goal of the IF filter is to knock down adjacent QRM as quickly as possible. I have not regularly physically tuned a radio for some years now, I prefer all tuning to be by the keyboard or under Mouse control. The use of precise incremental frequency steps in tuning makes the use of very narrow filters somewhat easier but it has taken practice however I find it more comfortable now to operate this way. Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18318 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 20:28:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 20:28:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qLx3-00022k-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 21:22:25 +0100 Received: from smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.156]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qLx1-00022f-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 21:22:24 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-117-82.bellatlantic.net [151.200.117.82]) by smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA24126; Fri, 12 May 2000 16:21:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <391C6885.A4BB64A8@bellatlantic.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 16:24:37 -0400 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Optimal width for LF? References: <09e401bfbc0e$5e55ab60$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Petr Maly wrote: > Hello all > I am just designing a new RX for 136 kHz band. It will have IF on 1 MHz with > high quality x-tal filter with bandwidth 200 Hz. The main selectivity will > by obtained on AF with passive filter with coils on pot cores. Till now I > used similar filter with bandwidth about 50 Hz and it seems to be still too > wide for LF. I was about to make it new with 15 Hz width. Somebody here > mentioned 1 Hz wide filter which seems to me to be too narrow. At least, the > filter cannot be narrower than obtainable osc stability. Can we make a > little questionnaire here? What bandwidth do you use and what is the > experience? > > 73, Petr, OK1FIG My own experience is that your narrow-band filters, if physical filters (i.e, coils and capacitors, or crystals), are very liklely to ring. How about using software filters? 73 Andre' N4ICK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8707 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 20:31:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 20:31:16 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qLzi-000239-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 21:25:10 +0100 Received: from smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.156]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qLzh-000234-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 21:25:09 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-117-82.bellatlantic.net [151.200.117.82]) by smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA25663; Fri, 12 May 2000 16:24:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <391C6935.DF9653B@bellatlantic.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 16:27:33 -0400 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: QRN & CW / Commercial CW on LF References: <3.0.1.16.20000512142837.222fb59e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Yes, it is the station reportedly used by India to talk to its submarines 73 Andre' Rik Strobbe wrote: > >Regarding non-amateur CW cignals heard on LF, this morning at > >about 1015utc, on 18.20kHz I was suprised to hear VVV VVV VVV > >VTX3 several times, interspersed with figures and letter groups, all > >in plain CW. The signal was about 569. I am sure someone has > >mentioned this station before, but can't think where - any ideas? > > If VTX3 is a callsign according ITU regulations it is from India ... > talking about LF DX ! > > 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 813 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 20:56:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 20:56:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qMPm-0002HZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 21:52:06 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from hs-img-6.compuserve.com ([149.174.177.155] helo=sphmgaaf.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qMPk-0002HR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 21:52:05 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by sphmgaaf.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id QAA19526 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 16:51:15 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 16:50:24 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: DQ0KBM QRV To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005121650_MC2-A4D3-BC1A@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear friends, Ali, DF2BC is currently active on 136.55 kHz ("Ropex Frequency") as DQ0KBM. Good signal (-80 dBu, just working Dave, G3YXM) but wirh strong QRN. Good success es vy 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3805 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 21:03:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 21:03:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qMW5-0002LF-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 21:58:37 +0100 Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qMW3-0002LA-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 21:58:36 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 (ppp-20-76-79.libero.it [151.20.76.79]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA25292 for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 22:58:14 +0200 Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 22:58:14 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000512214702.010f0270@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Fri, 12 May 2000 21:57:35 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: LF: DFCW beacon running (137.792) In-reply-to: <200005121326_MC2-A4D2-32D6@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------070605050709020809010708" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------070605050709020809010708 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Geri wrote: > >Talking about Spectran: IK1ODO, when and where do you begin your tests? > Well, it's running now (2100z, friday), after some experimenting and soldering. The frequencies are: "space" 137.791; "dot" .792; "dash" .793 . Frequency approximation seems good, the crystal is always free in air, so expect some tenths of Hz plus or minus. Power is (approx) 10 mW radiated. Message is "IK1ODO V" as before. Timing as past time, 30 s dots, 10 s spaces. I enclose a small JPG to show how the signal would appear - you just add a ionosphere, some QSB, QRM and QRN, stir and pour on screen ! Reports are welcome. If the signal drops over LORAN lines, let me know. 73 - Marco IK1ODO - JN35SA --------------070605050709020809010708 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="DFCW3.JPG" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="DFCW3.JPG" /9j/4AAQSkZJRgABAQAAAQABAAD//gCUVlQtQ09NUFJFU1MgICAgICAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAD/2wCEABALDA4MChAODQ4SERATGCgaGBYWGDEjJR0oOjM9PDkzODdASFxOQERX RTc4UG1RV19iZ2hnPk1xeXBkeFxlZ2MBERISGBUYLxoaL2NCOEJjY2NjY2NjY2NjY2NjY2Nj Y2NjY2NjY2NjY2NjY2NjY2NjY2NjY2NjY2NjY2NjY2NjY//AABEIAFAAuQMBIQACEQEDEQH/ xAGiAAABBQEBAQEBAQAAAAAAAAAAAQIDBAUGBwgJCgsQAAIBAwMCBAMFBQQEAAABfQECAwAE EQUSITFBBhNRYQcicRQygZGhCCNCscEVUtHwJDNicoIJChYXGBkaJSYnKCkqNDU2Nzg5OkNE RUZHSElKU1RVVldYWVpjZGVmZ2hpanN0dXZ3eHl6g4SFhoeIiYqSk5SVlpeYmZqio6Slpqeo qaqys7S1tre4ubrCw8TFxsfIycrS09TV1tfY2drh4uPk5ebn6Onq8fLz9PX29/j5+gEAAwEB AQEBAQEBAQAAAAAAAAECAwQFBgcICQoLEQACAQIEBAMEBwUEBAABAncAAQIDEQQFITEGEkFR B2FxEyIygQgUQpGhscEJIzNS8BVictEKFiQ04SXxFxgZGiYnKCkqNTY3ODk6Q0RFRkdISUpT VFVWV1hZWmNkZWZnaGlqc3R1dnd4eXqCg4SFhoeIiYqSk5SVlpeYmZqio6Slpqeoqaqys7S1 tre4ubrCw8TFxsfIycrS09TV1tfY2dri4+Tl5ufo6ery8/T19vf4+fr/3QAEAAD/2gAMAwEA AhEDEQA/AOAooAKKACigAooAKKACigAooAKKACigAooAKKAClZWQ4ZSpwDgjHBGR+lACUUAF FABRQAUUAFFABRQAUUAFFABRQAUUAFFABSsrIcMpU4BwRjgjI/SgBKKACigAooAKKACigAoo AKKACigAooAKKACigApWVkOGUqcA4IxwRkfpQAlFABRQAUUAFFABRQAUUAFFABRQAUUAFFAB RQAUrKyHDKVOAcEY4IyP0oASigAooAKKAFALEAdTwK1P+Ee1FlVooDID3BA/nWtOlzxbT1Vj CtXhRtzu1xR4ev1UGaLYScAE5/lmkbw3qgbC2pceoYf41tLC2pqSevb+v6/XD+0KF99B3/CO 3oIRkw5HAzTP+Ec1XOPshx67lx/OiphuWK5Xd9f6/r0BZhQ6s0rLRreKGRNRBQjuvJx+X+NN s7Hw/JNthu7iV8ZCuuB/KuipCKcE+m3n/X6nK8TiJuUqKvH+vMx9Whjgv3SIYXqKrQqGmRT0 LAVyYpJVXb+tD0qEnKnFs6S60/RI4Y2up5oW6fuxn+ho/s3TJbBvsEjys3AZxg5/L+legoxV a9tbfht/wDyvrGJ5b2XLffqZ7+GtUB/d2/mL6hgP5moL7RrqwgEs4C+3pXFLDJOVnotvM7YY +jNqMXqzPorkO4KVlZDhlKnAOCMcEZH6UAdB/bGi/wDQGX8xR/bGjf8AQGX8xXZ7Wj2/BHk/ VMV/z9D+2dG/6AqfmKP7Z0b/AKAqfmKPa0e34L/MPqeK/wCfof2zo/8A0BU/Mf4Uf21o/wD0 BY/zH+FP2tHt+C/zD6niv+foLrekBgRosYweoI/wqPV9ea5WMWcksAHUIxX+VUq1JRdvy/rY ccFVc4urLmS7k2meIEhtFivA9w4Ocud2OeOtZ+o6xcXF2z29zPHHjhVcgUTqw9lZPWy+/r/X X7yqeBSrOTS5exrweJIFt0EkbPKFx5hwSP61iDVrv7Z5n2ufy/M3bfMbGM+marEVI8qcX128 vlsFDBKE5OaTXTyNm61+1ntnURESFcb+Mn+tYmk3KWt6skn3cEUqsoOcLPr+o8Nhp0qc4vqa 9xrumtLk6TFMf7zEf4VEmu6cHUnQ4F56hhx/47U1atNTtv3dl/TM4YKuo/xWv69SvrmowXwj 8hdoHOPSp9G1e3sbPZLH5jAkgcf1rb2kHV0l9n8b3NHhZ/VvZX1uVdT1ee4uy8FxNHHjG1XI FaCeIbf7CkVzai6cAZEh71DrU1OUW9P8v8xSwN6UYx0kupD/AG7p/wD0Arb/AL6H/wATR/bu n/8AQCtv++h/8TXN7aP8v5f5C+pV/wDn8/6+Yf27p/8A0Arb/vof/E1jXLs8ql4/LIjQYxjg KAD+I5/Gs6k1LZWOrD0J0r883K5FRWZ1BRQAUUAFFABRQAUUAFFABRQAUUAFFABRQAUrKyHD KVOAcEY4IyP0oASigAooAKKACigAooAKKACigAooAKKACigAooAKVlZDhlKnAOCMcEZH6UAJ RQAUUAFFABRQAUUAFFABRQAUUAFFABRQAUUAFKyshwylTgHBGOCMj9KAEooAKKACigAooAKK ACigAooAKKACigAooAKKAClZWQ4ZSpwDgjHBGR+lAH//2Q== --------------070605050709020809010708 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; name="ATT06499.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="ATT06499.txt" Marco Bruno - IK1ODO spin@inrete.it SPIN Electronics - www.spin-it.com --------------070605050709020809010708-- From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4691 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 21:05:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 21:05:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qMYb-0002OT-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 22:01:13 +0100 Received: from m11.boston.juno.com ([63.211.172.74]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qMYa-0002NU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 22:01:12 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cookie.juno.com by cookie.juno.com for <"yokUgcxCbtTP7XLrpefewAPXUIDTVStVr/cz2g0nmCZ48NhYHWzleA=="> Received: (from riese-k3djc@juno.com) by m11.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id E7V8MB77; Fri, 12 May 2000 17:00:20 EDT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 15:37:26 -0400 Subject: LF: good Job Message-ID: <20000512.165703.-4365.2.riese-k3djc@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: "Bob RIESE" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: G4FGQ has written a new coil design program, solnoid2.exe. I have put this program on my hard drive and it really works well Just a tip of the hat Bob From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17292 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 21:29:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 21:29:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qMuS-0002Z0-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 22:23:48 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qMuQ-0002Yv-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 22:23:46 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 (ppp-20-76-79.libero.it [151.20.76.79]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA32467 for ; Fri, 12 May 2000 23:23:21 +0200 Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 23:23:21 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000512222342.009e2360@mailer.inrete.it> Message-ID: <4.1.20000512222342.009e2360@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Fri, 12 May 2000 22:23:51 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: LF: Commercial CW on LF MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >Yes, it is the station reportedly used by India to talk to its submarines > >73 >Andre' From the web site of IK1QFK: ------------------------------------------------- 18.2 kHz VTX3 is an Indian Navy traffic station. Operates from Vijananarayanam. Has been heard in USA and UK. 23/7/95 1832, HF1000 CW 200Hz LW7 S2. CW again heard, copied by PL, confirmed callsign VTX3 and traffic a series of numbers and alpha characters. Pauses with II characters. A series of idents, v's traffic and II's after a break. Signal up to S2 at times, some fading. 27/6/99 1925z, VTX3 traffic heard from 1930, standard Morse. V40 CW 100Hz BW -550 Hz -90dbm peak. 11/7/99 2059z, VTX3 V40 CW 600Hz peaks to -86dbm 23/7/99 2137z, VTX3 V40 l202 CW 500Hz Morse traffic -87dbm 11/7/99 1530z, VVV DE VTX3 and tfc, then RTTY -mb- Oct./99 1021 received by DG4BAS in msk -------------------------------------------------- a spectrogram of VTX3 is also at http://web.tiscalinet.it/vlfradio/regularsig/regularsignals.htm I'm curious to know the ERP of VTX3 ... anyone reading this in India ? 73, Marco IK1ODO Marco Bruno - IK1ODO spin@inrete.it SPIN Electronics - www.spin-it.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3339 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 22:15:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 22:15:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qNdO-0002wz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 23:10:14 +0100 Received: from mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.15]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qNdM-0002wV-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 12 May 2000 23:10:13 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [202.27.178.86] by mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <20000512220918.SMQE14081560.mta4-rme@[202.27.178.86]> for ; Sat, 13 May 2000 10:09:18 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <391C80FC.15F@xtra.co.nz> Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 10:09:00 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: VTX3 References: <4.1.20000512222342.009e2360@mailer.inrete.it> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, VTX3 is generally received at strength 9 in New Zealand. I understand the transmitter site is at the southern tip of India, so has rather good sea paths in many directions. 73, Bob From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29649 invoked from network); 12 May 2000 23:32:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 May 2000 23:32:03 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qOpo-0003dK-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 00:27:08 +0100 Received: from tk1.ihug.co.nz ([203.29.160.13] helo=smtp1.ihug.co.nz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qOpl-0003dF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 00:27:06 +0100 Received: from tractorb (p55-max6.chc.ihug.co.nz [209.77.128.55]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id LAA26240 for ; Sat, 13 May 2000 11:26:35 +1200 Message-ID: <026b01bfbc65$c1a380a0$46804dd1@tractorb> From: "Dave Brown" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <4.1.20000512222342.009e2360@mailer.inrete.it> Subject: LF: Re: Commercial CW on LF Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 10:59:35 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > I'm curious to know the ERP of VTX3 ... anyone reading this in India ? > Well not from India.... According to very reliable info I have, but unfortunately dating from several years ago now, the VTX nominal tx power is +60 dBW. I have another figure of +57 dBW which I think may be claimed ERP but that seems a trifle optimistic!! I first came across VTX3 a year or two prior to the Gulf War and a period of several months monitoring showed the signal to be very reliable here in ZL- day/night variation is less than 3 dB but there are other unexplained larger variations in signal that seem to happen any time. Not listened to it regularly for some time now but it is typically sending idents or code groups. Used to have manual sending up occasionally (operator training perhaps?) and was only too obvious when that happened. It was very active during the Gulf War with all sorts of traffic including quite long morse text messages but all meaningless stuff to me. Lots of obviously hand sent stuff over that period as well! A useful VLF beacon overall and although we have the advantage of a mainly sea path here in VK/ZL, sounds like it gets up overland into Europe fairly well too. A pity it isn't a 50 baud packet digipeater, although even 50 baud is probably too wide/fast for the antenna system to handle. 73 Dave, ZL3FJ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25116 invoked from network); 13 May 2000 09:47:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 May 2000 09:47:42 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qYHL-0007tg-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 10:32:11 +0100 Received: from lepidachrosite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qYHJ-0007tb-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 10:32:09 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (2410825639.dialin.freeler.nl [143.178.71.167]) by lepidachrosite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id EA1C5CB204 for ; Sat, 13 May 2000 09:30:48 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <001c01bfbcbe$1b0fed60$a747b28f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <09e401bfbc0e$5e55ab60$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> <391C6885.A4BB64A8@bellatlantic.net> Subject: Re: LF: Optimal width for LF? Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 11:32:00 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To All from PA0SE Narrow bandwidth filters do not have to ring provided they are of the phase-linear type (constant group delay in the passband). I use a home made passive phase-linear filter with a bandwidth of 30Hz and centre frequency of 1000Hz. It can pass up to 24 wpm without trouble (unfortunately the operator can't ...) The filter has four tuned circuits with coils in large ferrite potcores. Harry, PA0LQ, has designed a similar filter of the active type using 4 opamps. If you are interested in his design write to: H.A.A. Grimbergen, PA0LQ Lijtweg 1202 2341 HE Oegstgeest The Netherlands 73, Dick, PA0SE ----- Oorspronkelijk bericht ----- Van: Andre' Kesteloot Aan: Verzonden: vrijdag 12 mei 2000 22:24 Onderwerp: Re: LF: Optimal width for LF? > Petr Maly wrote: > > > Hello all > > I am just designing a new RX for 136 kHz band. It will have IF on 1 MHz with > > high quality x-tal filter with bandwidth 200 Hz. The main selectivity will > > by obtained on AF with passive filter with coils on pot cores. Till now I > > used similar filter with bandwidth about 50 Hz and it seems to be still too > > wide for LF. I was about to make it new with 15 Hz width. Somebody here > > mentioned 1 Hz wide filter which seems to me to be too narrow. At least, the > > filter cannot be narrower than obtainable osc stability. Can we make a > > little questionnaire here? What bandwidth do you use and what is the > > experience? > > > > 73, Petr, OK1FIG > > My own experience is that your narrow-band filters, if physical filters (i.e, > coils and capacitors, or crystals), are very liklely to ring. How about using > software filters? > 73 > Andre' N4ICK > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21221 invoked from network); 13 May 2000 13:49:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 May 2000 13:49:07 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qc8p-00017u-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 14:39:39 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qc8o-00017m-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 14:39:38 +0100 Received: from MarkusVester@aol.com by imo12.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.96.4bfeba2 (3842) for ; Sat, 13 May 2000 09:38:44 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: MarkusVester@aol.com Message-ID: <96.4bfeba2.264eb4e0@aol.com> Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 09:38:40 EDT Subject: Re: LF: Noise level Measurements by OH2LX To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 64 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >Does anyone else have burst-like noise >appearing as "waves" every 5 to 8 secs? >I hear them practically every EVENING, >can listen only until abt 23-24 UTC.. I wonder whether these could be the data packets of DCF42/DCF39. Here in DL, we see bursts of Mainflingen's TX-IM-products all over the band during these telegrams. Perhaps you could check for synchronism with the modulation on 138.83 / 129.93 kHz. 73 de Markus, DF6NM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18924 invoked from network); 13 May 2000 14:59:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 May 2000 14:59:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qdI1-0001eJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 15:53:13 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ds-img-6.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.139] helo=spdmgaaf.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qdI0-0001eE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 15:53:12 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaaf.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id KAA29017 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 10:52:22 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 10:51:57 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: DQ0KBM QRV tomorrow (Sunday) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005131052_MC2-A4E1-AE7@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Lowfers, just had a lengthy QSO with Ali, DF2BC, operating the special event station DQ0KBM on Borkum Island. He already worked 22 stations today. Ali told me that he will start LF operation tomorrow morning (Sunday, May 14, 2000) at sunrise (whenever that is, hi). According to our experiences this might be a good time for dx-stations, for example behind the Alps (IK, HB) to try to work the special event station. The other interesting event was already announced here on the reflector, here some further details: At 20.00 UTC tonight DQ0KBM will be QRV on 80m (QRG unknown, watch out for the pileup) in SSB. They will prepare a traffic list. When the list is completed, the old spark gap transmitter "KBM" will make a special transmission around 1820 kHz (might be interesting to listen, how those old spark gap transmitters sound). After the special transmission, DQ0KBM will work down the traffic list to collect reception reports. Have fun tonight, cu later best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12404 invoked from network); 13 May 2000 16:46:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 May 2000 16:46:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qefM-0002K0-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 17:21:24 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qefI-0002Jv-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 17:21:20 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.215.173] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qeev-00042i-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 16:20:58 +0000 Message-ID: <391D725F.22CF4819@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 15:18:55 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: new Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: A new one for me today DJ7RD/Karl. Band acty good in spite of the bad qrn about at present. DQ0KBM/Ali still going strong all day at over S9. g3kev From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16378 invoked from network); 13 May 2000 17:22:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 May 2000 17:22:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qfVw-0002h8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 18:15:44 +0100 Received: from d06lmsgate-3.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.3] helo=lmsfw2.emea.ibm.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qfVj-0002h2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 18:15:31 +0100 Received: from d06relay01.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay01.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.147]) by lmsfw2.emea.ibm.com (1.0.0) with ESMTP id SAA148530 for ; Sat, 13 May 2000 18:06:58 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from usa.net (lig32-239-128-209.emea.lig-dial.ibm.com [32.239.128.209]) by d06relay01.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id SAA95220 for ; Sat, 13 May 2000 18:14:36 +0100 Message-ID: <391D8D3A.987A9EFB@usa.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 19:13:30 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" Organization: Undisclosed X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Reception of the RZCW beacon References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528B5@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> <3.0.1.16.20000505141455.21ffadcc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <3.0.1.16.20000509112258.232ff9b2@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: RZCW = Return to Zero CW (shall we use this name for the three-frequency CW ?) I have just put a couple of screen snapshots of the reception of Marco's new beacon together with some considerations about Spectran settings on my new Web site : http://www.weaksignals.com Opinions welcome 73s, Alberto I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20719 invoked from network); 13 May 2000 19:59:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 May 2000 19:59:55 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qhuP-0003mh-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 20:49:09 +0100 Received: from m11.boston.juno.com ([63.211.172.74]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qhuO-0003mc-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 20:49:08 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cookie.juno.com by cookie.juno.com for <"yokUgcxCbtTP7XLrpefewAPXUIDTVStVLmh4xMCd/SPdha9cc1UAug=="> Received: (from riese-k3djc@juno.com) by m11.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id E7YNV78X; Sat, 13 May 2000 15:48:20 EDT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 15:44:30 -0400 Subject: Re: LF: DQ0KBM QRV tomorrow (Sunday) Message-ID: <20000513.154507.-125617.1.riese-k3djc@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-7 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: "Bob RIESE" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I hope someone makes a wave file of the Spark Rig I would be interested in hearing it Bob For we are such things As dreams are made of From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9619 invoked from network); 13 May 2000 21:27:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 May 2000 21:27:24 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qjLd-0004S6-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 22:21:21 +0100 Received: from mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qjLa-0004S0-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 13 May 2000 22:21:19 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [202.27.181.180] by mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <20000513212024.BJRV10955419.mta3-rme@[202.27.181.180]> for ; Sun, 14 May 2000 09:20:24 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <391DC6F3.A51@xtra.co.nz> Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 09:19:47 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Optimal width for LF? References: <09e401bfbc0e$5e55ab60$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> <391C6885.A4BB64A8@bellatlantic.net> <001c01bfbcbe$1b0fed60$a747b28f@w8k3f0> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dick Rollema wrote: > Narrow bandwidth filters do not have to ring provided they are of the > phase-linear type (constant group delay in the passband). > > I use a home made passive phase-linear filter with a bandwidth of 30Hz and > centre frequency of 1000Hz. It can pass up to 24 wpm without trouble > (unfortunately the operator can't ...) The filter has four tuned circuits > with coils in large ferrite potcores. > > Harry, PA0LQ, has designed a similar filter of the active type using 4 > opamps. If you are interested in his design write to: > > H.A.A. Grimbergen, PA0LQ > Lijtweg 1202 > 2341 HE Oegstgeest > The Netherlands > > 73, Dick, PA0SE Are they a "Bessel" design? All analogue filters have some trade-off between skirt selectivity, phase response and ripple in the passband. Murphy's Law applies too, in that the phase linear types (least ringing) also have least skirt selectivity. Hence using 4 stages in your phase linear filter? Could you post a brief text summary of your design? 73, Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29661 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 05:33:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 05:33:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qqt7-00080O-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 06:24:25 +0100 Received: from mta01.talk21.com ([62.172.192.171] helo=t21mta01-app.talk21.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qqt6-00080I-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 06:24:24 +0100 Received: from dave ([62.7.152.3]) by t21mta01-app.talk21.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000514052301.ZTQW25054.t21mta01-app.talk21.com@dave> for ; Sun, 14 May 2000 06:23:01 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfbd64$87d7a860$0398073e@dave> From: "Dave Sergeant" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <002d01bfb816$c7816300$0ce11ac3@g4jnt> Subject: Re: LF: My TS850 Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 19:18:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >From Dave G3YMC Andy Talbot wrote a while ago, in connection with surface mount working: >A really good headband binocular magifier helps. Such devices are available >from RS ref no. 606-989 at x2.7 magnification (Ł52 ish) with >alternative lenses for x1.8 to x3.5. Somewhat cheaper is 290-1539 at x2.5 >magnification (Ł36) Just for information, CPC (01772 654455) supply the first of these at 30.48, order code TL00520, and the second one at 16.13, order code TL00517. The cheaper one is also available from SEME (01664 484000) at 13.95, order code AID2059 I have used the SEME one for a few years and find it very useful. Now you know how RS make their profits! Cheers Dave dsergeant@iee.org http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sergeantd From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4304 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 06:26:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 06:26:04 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qric-0008Pz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 07:17:38 +0100 Received: from posti.saunalahti.fi ([195.74.0.45] helo=vihta.saunalahti.fi) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qrib-0008Pu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 07:17:37 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from default (MCCXXVI.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.40.26]) by vihta.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id JAA12270 for ; Sun, 14 May 2000 09:09:19 +0300 (EET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000514092004.008b47c0@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: vaiski1@pop.saunalahti.fi X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 09:20:04 +0300 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: Re: LF: Noise level Measurements by OH2LX In-reply-to: <96.4bfeba2.264eb4e0@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: LF "wave bursts" checked with double-system Yesterday evening's check was concluded that no synchronism with 138.83/128.93 data packets but this idea from Markus was a very good one. On 13th May evening "wave" burst were irregular but sometimes several in close sequence. They first appeared around 1950 UTC, then almost disappeared one hour later but came back and were heard irregularly. Wave bursts sound longer than EFR data packets, maybe 2 to 4 seconds long. I did send email to a Sodankyla friend asking whether they could be of magnetospheric origin, eg AKR (Auroral kilometric radiation). To summarize: LF reception conditions were good yesterday and no problem to copy DQ0KBM on 136.6 kHz until 2153, (-126..-125 dBmW). 73 de Vaino, OH2LX At 09:38 13.5.2000 EDT, you wrote: >>Does anyone else have burst-like noise >>appearing as "waves" every 5 to 8 secs? >>I hear them practically every EVENING, >>normally listen only until abt 23-24 UTC.. > >I wonder whether these could be the data packets of DCF42/DCF39. Here in DL, >we see bursts of Mainflingen's TX-IM-products all over the band during these >telegrams. Perhaps you could check for synchronism with the modulation on >138.83 / 129.93 kHz. > >73 de Markus, DF6NM ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26588 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 07:50:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 07:50:38 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qt67-0000Sj-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 08:45:59 +0100 Received: from mb09.swip.net ([193.12.122.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qt66-0000Se-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 08:45:58 +0100 Received: from win95 (d212-151-92-109.swipnet.se [212.151.92.109]) by mb09.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA10294 for ; Sun, 14 May 2000 09:45:19 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001201bfbd78$d264a680$6d5c97d4@win95.swipnet.se> From: "C Andersson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Optimal width for LF? Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 09:48:39 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >Could you post a brief text summary of your design? >73, Bob ZL2CA PA0LQ filter descriptions: http://www.alg.demon.co.uk/radio/136/af_filter.htm http://home5.swipnet.se/~w-54761/pa0lq_filter.htm 73 Christer, sm6pxj From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17321 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 09:08:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 09:08:18 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12quI4-00012U-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 10:02:24 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12quI3-00012P-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 10:02:23 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as21-s15-139-126.cwci.net ([195.44.139.126] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12quHh-0006M9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 09:02:04 +0000 Message-ID: <391E5D0C.511C1FA5@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 08:00:12 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: DQ0KBM Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Info to Ali if you are able to read this message. IK5ZPV was calling you yesterday morning and OH1TN was calling you last night but you did not hear either. They were both good signals with me. IK5ZPV is also on the band this morning. Lots of activity this weekend on 136 khz. 73 and GL de MAL/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 310 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 12:25:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 12:25:23 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qxMb-0002QZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 13:19:17 +0100 Received: from postfix1.free.fr ([212.27.32.21] ident=postfix) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qxMa-0002QU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 13:19:16 +0100 Received: from f5maf (toulouse-2-7-183.dial.proxad.net [213.228.7.183]) by postfix1.free.fr (Postfix) with SMTP id F042D28044 for ; Sun, 14 May 2000 14:18:44 +0200 (MEST) Message-ID: <002001bfbd9e$f38008c0$b707e4d5@f5maf> From: "f5maf" To: "LF group" Subject: LF: New wave file Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 14:21:31 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi group,
This morning I have recorded
G3KEV 
DQ0KBM (Locator?)
I have updated my Log.
Best 73
www.qsl.net/f5maf
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28085 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 14:58:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 14:58:28 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qzjK-0003UK-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 15:50:54 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ds-img-2.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.135] helo=spdmgaab.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12qzjJ-0003UF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 15:50:53 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaab.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id KAA00883 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 10:50:02 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 10:49:34 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: New wave file To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005141049_MC2-A4F2-597E@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: F5MAF: >DQ0KBM (Locator?) >I have updated my Log. Locator of DQ0KBM is JO33FH. Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5000 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 16:14:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 16:14:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r0xc-00041p-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 17:09:44 +0100 Received: from e1.ny.us.ibm.com ([32.97.182.101]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r0xY-00041k-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 17:09:40 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from northrelay01.pok.ibm.com (northrelay01.pok.ibm.com [9.117.200.21]) by e1.ny.us.ibm.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA401676 for ; Sun, 14 May 2000 12:07:38 -0400 Received: from usa.net (lig32-239-128-73.emea.lig-dial.ibm.com [32.239.128.73]) by northrelay01.pok.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id MAA91664 for ; Sun, 14 May 2000 12:08:59 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <391ECF49.4FF9D365@usa.net> Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 18:07:37 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: IK1ODO 3-level beacon References: <200005141049_MC2-A4F2-597E@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, I have just put a couple of new images of the reception of the 3-level Marco's beacon on my Web site, that show that perhaps the 30-second dot/dash duration can be shortened. The URL is : http://www.weaksignals.com Comments welcome. 73, Alberto I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15424 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 18:18:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 18:18:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r2sJ-0004tm-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 19:12:23 +0100 Received: from postfix1.free.fr ([212.27.32.21] ident=postfix) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r2s7-0004th-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 19:12:12 +0100 Received: from f5maf (toulouse-2-6-46.dial.proxad.net [213.228.6.46]) by postfix1.free.fr (Postfix) with SMTP id 2A2DA281E1 for ; Sun, 14 May 2000 20:11:49 +0200 (MEST) Message-ID: <000801bfbdd0$43542b20$2e06e4d5@f5maf> From: "f5maf" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: New wave file Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 20:14:35 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thanks Geri, I have juste received G3LDO I'll update my log Best 73 Marc -----Message d'origine----- De : 'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW Ŕ : INTERNET:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date : dimanche 14 mai 2000 17:32 Objet : LF: New wave file F5MAF: >DQ0KBM (Locator?) >I have updated my Log. Locator of DQ0KBM is JO33FH. Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16084 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 18:56:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 18:56:18 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r3Tf-0005CA-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 19:50:59 +0100 Received: from fortune-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.203] helo=fortune.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r3Tc-0005C2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 19:50:56 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by fortune.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000514185005.LTA23295.fortune.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Sun, 14 May 2000 11:50:05 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <30185916.958330205428.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 11:50:05 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: My TS850 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 213.1.37.186 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: hi Dave and All, I use a set of inexpensive specs from 1 dioptre up to 6 dioptres. The low power ones from Boots and the high power ones were bought in the Moscow Metro for about Ł2 a pair, but you have to be very careful to avoid astigmatic specs and other rather curious defects. John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15751 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 19:42:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 19:42:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r4Bn-0005YG-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 20:36:35 +0100 Received: from postfix2.free.fr ([212.27.32.74] ident=postfix) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r4Bk-0005YB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 20:36:33 +0100 Received: from f5maf (toulouse-1-4-226.dial.proxad.net [213.228.4.226]) by postfix2.free.fr (Postfix) with SMTP id 22B607411F for ; Sun, 14 May 2000 21:36:08 +0200 (MEST) Message-ID: <000b01bfbddc$092a86e0$e204e4d5@f5maf> From: "f5maf" To: "LF group" Subject: LF: Carriers on 137 Khz Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 21:38:51 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi all,
I have received some carriers with a 5  meters loop N/S.
135,8 KHz     Signal = 7      RTTY
136 KHz     Signal = 6     CARRIER
136,8 KHz     Signal = 5      BURST
135,8 KHz     Signal = 7      BURST
137,45KHz     Signal = 7      CW (not Ham CW)
135,8 KHz     Signal = 6      CARRIER with "CW"
137,75Hz     Signal = 7      CARRIER
135,8 KHz     Signal = 9+10   DCF49
 
Have you some informations about these "stations".
73 marc
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24267 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 20:57:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 20:57:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r5NQ-00065Z-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 21:52:40 +0100 Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r5NM-00065U-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 21:52:36 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 (to1-297.dialup.tiscalinet.it [62.10.35.41]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA20229 for ; Sun, 14 May 2000 22:52:08 +0200 Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 22:52:08 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000514214600.017d0e40@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Sun, 14 May 2000 21:52:03 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: Carriers on 137 Khz In-reply-to: <000b01bfbddc$092a86e0$e204e4d5@f5maf> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In 22.39 14/05/00 , hai scritto: > > Hi all, > I have received some carriers with a 5 meters loop N/S. > 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 RTTY > 136 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER > 136,8 KHz Signal = 5 BURST > 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 BURST > 137,45KHz Signal = 7 CW (not Ham CW) > 135,8 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER with "CW" > 137,75Hz Signal = 7 CARRIER > 135,8 KHz Signal = 9+10 DCF49 > > Have you some informations about these "stations". > 73 marc > >> >> > Marc, reagarde ma liste sur le site de DK8KW http://home.t-online.de/home/dk8kw/ 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 RTTY c'est la Marine de Athens (Greek Navy) 136 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER probablement, voisin a toi ... quelque harmonique locale 136,8 KHz Signal = 5 BURST ? 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 BURST ? 137,45KHz Signal = 7 CW (not Ham CW) ? est-il decodable ? 135,8 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER with "CW" ? 137,75Hz Signal = 7 CARRIER probablement harmonique du reseau 50 Hz Tous les OM de la liste ont des different signaux ... la plus part doit etre locale. Il ya peu de correlations. 73 - Marco IK1ODO - a coté de Torino From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13883 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 21:01:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 21:01:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r5Ru-00065z-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 21:57:18 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r5Rs-00065u-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 21:57:17 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 (to1-297.dialup.tiscalinet.it [62.10.35.41]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA21532 for ; Sun, 14 May 2000 22:56:54 +0200 Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 22:56:54 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000514215234.01710d60@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Sun, 14 May 2000 21:56:57 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: LF: IK1ODO beacon running ... In-reply-to: <000b01bfbddc$092a86e0$e204e4d5@f5maf> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, my beacon is running from Friday evening, but I received no reception reports. The weekend was beautiful all around Europe ... all on seeside with the family ? (may be more relaxing than LF, of course) I will let it running until Tuesday evening. Power always about 10 mW. I may consider to continue the tests with some more power and 3 s dots from Tuesday on, if someone interested. Than it will be QRT (I'm flying to Dayton Hamvention - any of you will be there ?) 73, Marco IK1ODO Marco Bruno - IK1ODO spin@inrete.it SPIN Electronics - www.spin-it.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26755 invoked from network); 14 May 2000 22:55:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 May 2000 22:55:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r77m-0006uj-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 23:44:38 +0100 Received: from carbon.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.92] helo=carbon) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12r77f-0006ud-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 23:44:31 +0100 Received: from [213.1.189.51] (helo=default) by carbon with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12r77J-0000cQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 14 May 2000 23:44:09 +0100 Message-ID: <000401bfbdf5$fe90c180$33bd01d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: DX Cluster spots for 13/14th May at GB7MXM Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 23:05:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All, lots of activity stirred up by Ali and Wil. Now Wolf is over his DX-pedition we can see who posts most of the spots.....thanks Wolf. 136.8 G3LDO 14-May-2000 1750Z 136.5 DJ2EY 14-May-2000 1555Z 559 cq 136.5 DJ2EY 14-May-2000 1555Z 559 cq 136.5 DF6NM 14-May-2000 1548Z 137.2 DF7VX 14-May-2000 0851Z 439 cq 136.4 HB2ASB 14-May-2000 0849Z 579 cq 136.4 HB2ASB 14-May-2000 0849Z 579 cq 136.4 DK8KW 14-May-2000 0758Z 559 cq 137.4 PI4OSS 14-May-2000 0800Z 569 136.4 DK8KW 14-May-2000 0758Z 559 cq 136.6 OK1DTN 14-May-2000 0628Z 579 cq 136.8 PI4OSS 13-May-2000 1935Z 136.5 DQ0KBM 13-May-2000 1254Z cq cq cq 136.9 DF0WD 13-May-2000 1123Z 559 cq 136.9 DF0WD 13-May-2000 1123Z 559 cq 136.4 DQ0KBM 13-May-2000 1017Z 579 cq 136.4 MM0ALM 13-May-2000 0934Z 559 136.4 MM0ALM 13-May-2000 0934Z 559 136.5 DJ9IE 30-Apr-2000 1036Z cq cq 137.3 HB0/DL1SAN 30-Apr-2000 1025Z cq G3NYK de GB7DXM 14-May 2152Z > 73 de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5282 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 05:05:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 05:05:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rCv7-0001DD-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 05:55:57 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from hs-img-4.compuserve.com ([149.174.177.149] helo=sphmgaad.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rCv6-0001D7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 05:55:56 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by sphmgaad.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id AAA27860 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 00:54:36 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 00:54:26 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: DX Cluster spots for 13/14th May To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005150054_MC2-A4F5-CF81@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello friends, here are some more cluster spots from my local cluster BSDXC (the reported station is listed behind the frequency, the reporting station on the right): 136.5 DQ0KBM 2051 12.5 DK8KW cq cq ... 136.7 OK1DTN 0511 13.5 DK8KW cq cq ... 136.9 DF0WD 1123 13.5 DL1SAN 559 cq 136.5 DQ0KBM 1254 13.5 DL3FDO cq cq cq 136.8 PI4OSS 1935 13.5 DL3FDO 136.6 OK1DTN 0628 14.5 DL1SAN 579 cq 136.5 IK5ZPV 0727 14.5 IK1HSS cq 137.4 PI4OSS 0800 14.5 DL1SAN 569 137.7 I5TGC 0831 14.5 IK1HSS slow cw 136.4 HB2ASB 0849 14.5 DL1SAN 579 cq 137.2 DF7VX 0851 14.5 DL1SAN 439 cq 136.2 HB2ASB 0914 14.5 IK1HSS with g3tqk(?) 136.5 DF6NM 1548 14.5 DL3FDO 136.5 DJ2EY 1555 14.5 DL1SAN 559 cq 136.8 G3LDO 1750 14.5 DL3FDO 136.6 DQ0KBM 2114 14.5 DF2HL Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13575 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 07:03:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 07:03:59 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rEpC-000254-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 07:57:58 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from posti.saunalahti.fi ([195.74.0.45] helo=vihta.saunalahti.fi) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rEp8-00024z-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 07:57:54 +0100 Received: from default (MCCLXXXII.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.40.82]) by vihta.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id JAA08463 for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 09:49:31 +0300 (EET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000515100023.00878330@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: oh2lx@pop.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 10:00:23 +0300 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: Signal Strength Measurements by OH2LX 15 May 2000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Signal strength measurements of various LF stations by OH2LX: ------------------------------------------------------------------ Day ------------------ 08May 09May 10May 11May 12May 13May 14May MON TUE WED THU FRI SAT SUN Time, UTC ------------ 2035- 2230- 2050- 2220- 2040- 2125- 2040- ------------------------------------------------------------------ kHz Stn d,km AZI Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW ------------------------------------------------------------------ 73.3 Rugby, 1825, 252, -101 -96 -101 -99 -106 -99 -106 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 75.0 HBG, 1992, 226, -105 -95 -102 -96 -102 -102 -106 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 77.5 DCF77, 1543, 228, -85 -90 -91 -89 -91 -86 -95 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 128.2 9f/7D, 2060, 267, -127 -102 <-127? -118 <-127? -119 <-127 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 128.9 DCF49, 1544, 228, -79 -74 -80 -77 -85 -87 -95 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 138.8 DBF39, 1221, 226, -74 -77 -79 -77 -81 -80 -92 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 135.8 SXV, 2490, 182, -105 -106 Nil -95* -104 -102 -103 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 137.0 CFH, 5750, 295, Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil ------------------------------------------------------------------ * SXV: one of the highest observed: 11May, 2225z, -93 dBmW ------------------------------------------------------------------ 12May 2047: OH1TN -113; 1941:-114; 1946:-113; 1948:-113; 1950:-113 2000:-113; 2025:-113; 2031:-113; 2040:-114; 2101:-113 2108:-114; 2126:-114; 2140:-113; 2214:-113; 2214:-113 2221:-113; 2224:-114; 2239:-114; 2257:-115 (clg cq) 12May 2030: DQ0KBM -128; 2038:-128; 2039:-126; 2044:-125; 2049:-125 2101:-125; 2109:-125; 2114:-126; 2137:-126; 2153:-126 12May 2142: G3KEV -127 12May 2150: MM0ALM -121; 2154:-121; 2202:-120; 2209:-119; 2214:-119 14May 2015: OH1TN -114; 2018:-112; 2026:-111; 2030:-111; 2042:-112 ------------------------------------------------------------------ (R&S ESH2/---- 10m coax----/1:10/-----15m wire-----): Noise level with antenna: with 200Hz IF BandWidth: -26..-20 dB(uV), -133..-127dBmW (varies with qrm, "waves" etc) ------------------------------------------------------------------ End of message of 15th May 2000, 0700 UTC, from OH2LX ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27867 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 07:58:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 07:58:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rFhD-0002X0-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 08:53:47 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail2.hamilton-standard.com ([153.4.57.12]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rFh9-0002UB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 08:53:43 +0100 Received: from curly.hsd.utc.com by mail2.hamilton-standard.com; (8.9.1/) id EAA30709; Mon, 15 May 2000 04:04:52 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from umrsvr.hsd.utc.com by curly.hsd.utc.com; (8.9.0/) id DAA26787; Mon, 15 May 2000 03:52:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com by umrsvr.hsd.utc.com; (8.9.0/) id DAA11884; Mon, 15 May 2000 03:32:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: by NMEX01NT with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Mon, 15 May 2000 09:39:19 +0100 Message-ID: From: "Soegiono, Gamal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: DQ0KBM logs Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 09:39:19 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hello Alfred DF2BC, hello all While testing a mixer circuit, I came acros DQ0KBM transmissions: Saturday May 13/2000 11:45 UTC calling CQ on around 136.6 kHz a nice 6 dB above noise floor would report RST 339 aurally (without S-Meter!!) QRN=2 to 1, QRM=3 to 2 13:25 UTC - 14:00 UTC signal went weaker and mostly covered by local noise RST 229 aurally 21:03 UTC calling CQ on around 136.6 kHz due to higher noise level RST 239 aurally Sunday May 14/2000 tried during morning hours 07:25 - 08:00 no copy tried sporadically during afternoon hours no copy calling CQ on around 136.6 kHz UTC RST QRN QRM (man made noise) 20:26 119 3 5 20:46 219 3 4 21:00 229 3 3 21:27 339 2 2 21:30 339 2 2 21:33 219 3 2 21:36 119 3 2 21:41 119 3 2 21:45 00x 3 2 21:50 119 2 2 22:00 119 2 2 22:47 229 2 2 23:03 329 2 2 23:10 339 2 2 went to bed :-O There is a long term QSB on the signal observed, both during daytime (saturday) as well as during night hours (both on saturday and sunday). During the last 2 years I never could copy anything else but signals from Peter Bobek as DA0LF and DA0LF/p Bernd Grupe DF8ZR Wolf Ostwald DF2PY all are about 30 km from my place. The next improvement was to copy Reiner Nabe DL3FDO in Nov/1999 who lives about 60 km from my QTH. Alfred's signal now increases my personal ODX to about 410 km. But due to the fact I could not hear any of the stations which were in QSO with DQ0KBM I am not too happy with it. Most of you more happy fellows would have listened to Alfred's signal as to a commercial BC signal (as signal strength concerns). Perhaps it's due to the call sign of the operator hihi. best 73 de Gamal From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2138 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 10:38:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 10:38:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rI8F-0003kQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 11:29:51 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail2.hamilton-standard.com ([153.4.57.12]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rI8D-0003kI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 11:29:50 +0100 Received: from curly.hsd.utc.com by mail2.hamilton-standard.com; (8.9.1/) id GAA01876; Mon, 15 May 2000 06:40:54 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from umrsvr.hsd.utc.com by curly.hsd.utc.com; (8.9.0/) id GAA08205; Mon, 15 May 2000 06:28:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com by umrsvr.hsd.utc.com; (8.9.0/) id GAA14351; Mon, 15 May 2000 06:10:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: by NMEX01NT with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Mon, 15 May 2000 12:17:13 +0100 Message-ID: From: "Soegiono, Gamal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: AW: Optimal width for LF? Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 12:17:06 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hello Petr, OK1FIG PM> Can we make a PM> little questionnaire here? PM> What bandwidth do you use and PM> what is the experience? exclusively using aural method for copying signals below 150 kHz here. While in search mode I use 300 Hz For listening to one station I prefer 200 Hz. The also present 50 Hz BW is (to my opinion) too "ringy" to be convenient. No signals met yet which I can hear with 50 Hz but cannot copy as well using 200 Hz. 73 de Gamal From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23603 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 11:41:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 11:41:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rJ6y-0004Gi-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 12:32:36 +0100 Received: from cyb01.axime.com ([160.92.120.38] helo=cybv01.axime.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rJ6u-0004Gb-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 12:32:33 +0100 Received: from MARC ([213.36.34.188]) by cybv01.axime.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with SMTP id FULMOJ00.P36 for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 13:31:31 +0200 Message-ID: <004c01bfbe61$552ed160$0600a8c0@MARC> From: "mv tsi" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <09e401bfbc0e$5e55ab60$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> Subject: LF: Re: Optimal width for LF? Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 13:32:50 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello petr, I am interested to make a receiver. But what technology can you use for hight stability frequency? VFO,DDS? My first receiver used a 3Mhz VFO and a IF at 11Mhz. (I had a 137Khz 14 Mhz converter). I had some probleme to have a narrow band pass with 5 cristals (800Hz). For reduct audio band pass I used a MF10. But with this receiver I couldn't survey a frequency during more hours. The VFO stability had no perfect. 73 marc. ----- Original Message ----- From: Petr Maly To: 136 group Sent: Friday, May 12, 2000 2:34 PM Subject: LF: Optimal width for LF? > Hello all > I am just designing a new RX for 136 kHz band. It will have IF on 1 MHz with > high quality x-tal filter with bandwidth 200 Hz. The main selectivity will > by obtained on AF with passive filter with coils on pot cores. Till now I > used similar filter with bandwidth about 50 Hz and it seems to be still too > wide for LF. I was about to make it new with 15 Hz width. Somebody here > mentioned 1 Hz wide filter which seems to me to be too narrow. At least, the > filter cannot be narrower than obtainable osc stability. Can we make a > little questionnaire here? What bandwidth do you use and what is the > experience? > > 73, Petr, OK1FIG > > > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1235 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 12:04:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 12:04:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rJTT-0004Qx-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 12:55:51 +0100 Received: from cyb01.axime.com ([160.92.120.38] helo=cybv01.axime.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rJTQ-0004Qq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 12:55:49 +0100 Received: from MARC ([213.36.35.60]) by cybv01.axime.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with SMTP id FULNRL00.O38 for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 13:54:57 +0200 Message-ID: <006b01bfbe64$9b7b0140$0600a8c0@MARC> From: "mv tsi" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <4.1.20000514214600.017d0e40@mailer.inrete.it> Subject: Re: LF: Carriers on 137 Khz Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 13:56:15 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Merci Marco pour les infos. Je vais enregistrer les signaux : 135.8 KHz salve avec un shift de 200hz. 137.45 KHz CW non décodable. 135.8 KHz Balise modulée Recevez vous sur 62.3 Khz du RTTY? Ici il y a une station de la marine. L' antenne fait 340 mčtres, elle se trouve ŕ 600 mčtres d'altitude. La puissance emetteur est de 350 KW (MOSFET) Le rendement de l'antenne est de ....45% Il y a un fil de masse de 350 mčtres tout les degrés. Malheureusement je n'ai pas de photo. J'ai commencé ŕ utiliser Spectran. J'aurai voulu recevoir la balise sur 137,780? Quand est elle en action? Merci ŕ bientôt. Marc f5maf@qsl.net www.qsl.net/f5maf ----- Original Message ----- From: M. Bruno To: Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2000 10:52 PM Subject: Re: LF: Carriers on 137 Khz In 22.39 14/05/00 , hai scritto: > > Hi all, > I have received some carriers with a 5 meters loop N/S. > 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 RTTY > 136 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER > 136,8 KHz Signal = 5 BURST > 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 BURST > 137,45KHz Signal = 7 CW (not Ham CW) > 135,8 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER with "CW" > 137,75Hz Signal = 7 CARRIER > 135,8 KHz Signal = 9+10 DCF49 > > Have you some informations about these "stations". > 73 marc > >> >> > Marc, reagarde ma liste sur le site de DK8KW http://home.t-online.de/home/dk8kw/ 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 RTTY c'est la Marine de Athens (Greek Navy) 136 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER probablement, voisin a toi ... quelque harmonique locale 136,8 KHz Signal = 5 BURST ? 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 BURST ? 137,45KHz Signal = 7 CW (not Ham CW) ? est-il decodable ? 135,8 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER with "CW" ? 137,75Hz Signal = 7 CARRIER probablement harmonique du reseau 50 Hz Tous les OM de la liste ont des different signaux ... la plus part doit etre locale. Il ya peu de correlations. 73 - Marco IK1ODO - a coté de Torino From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1076 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 12:10:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 12:10:29 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rJWh-0004U6-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 12:59:11 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rJWg-0004U1-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 12:59:10 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #35) id 12rJVv-0004vJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 12:58:24 +0100 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 12:55:16 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 12:55:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Steam radio X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: When I returned from GW a couple of weeks ago, I reinstalled my station and was puzzled that it took a very long time to get any amount of current into the antenna. I initially thought it was the effect of the leaves that had appeared on the nearby trees whilst I was away. Things got worse. Every time I transmitted the current was different, and usually no better than 65% of normal, though long periods of transmit improved it. Tuning was very broad so I suspected that something was lowering the Q of the system. I renewed several joints, especially where long periods of RF caused some heating, but this had no effect (though of course worth doing anyway from time to time). Having gone over every part of the system at ground level, I began to suspect the inductor at the top of the mast. I was hoping it wasn't that, as it is quite difficult to lower the mast and at this time of year there is a risk of the top wires becoming entangled in tree branches 12m above ground. Having lowered the mast, the cause was immediately obvious. The plastic cola bottle used as a light-weight coil former had several cm of water in it! I presume that a small amount of water would dry out with the RF when the station is used every day, but leaving it alone for two weeks whilst away caused a build-up. Needless to say I now have better waterproofing and some drain holes, and my report from DQ0KBM has gone up an S-point. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9893 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 14:24:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 14:24:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rLYi-0005Y3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 15:09:24 +0100 Received: from rhenium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.93]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rLYh-0005Xy-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 15:09:23 +0100 Received: from [62.7.44.160] (helo=default) by rhenium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12rLYI-0000Hd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 15:08:58 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01bfbe77$3d5f3aa0$a02c073e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "LF-Group" Subject: LF: Extra Cluster spots from DB0MBX via Wolf Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 14:54:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi, most of Wolf spots made their way across to my local node this week, but there are a few from IK1HSS.....I don't recognise G3TQK as a regular call on LF ....could this be a mis-read of Laurie's call (G3AQC) ....there are only a couple of 'dits' difference? 136.2 HB2ASB 14-May-2000 0914Z with g3tqk(?) 137.7 I5TGC 14-May-2000 0831Z slow cw 136.8 PI4OSS 14-May-2000 0749Z (?) 348 in jn35 136.5 IK5ZPV 14-May-2000 0727Z cq 73 de Alan G3NYK JO02PB Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9920 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 14:24:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 14:24:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rLYa-0005Xw-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 15:09:16 +0100 Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rLYW-0005Xr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 15:09:12 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id PAA01000; Mon, 15 May 2000 15:12:23 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 17307 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 15:04:47 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 15:04:47 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id PAA02651; Mon, 15 May 2000 15:06:46 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma002581; Mon, 15 May 00 15:06:08 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 15:13:16 +0100 Received: by frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Mon, 15 May 2000 15:07:15 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528DC@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: RE: LF: Carriers on 137 KHz Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 15:07:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Quest que c'est les mots "balise" et "salve" ? 25 years since I learnt any French ! Andy G4JNT > ---------- > From: mv tsi[SMTP:mv.tsi@laposte.net] > Reply To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Sent: 2000-05-15 12:56 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: Re: LF: Carriers on 137 Khz > > Merci Marco pour les infos. > Je vais enregistrer les signaux : > 135.8 KHz salve avec un shift de 200hz. > 137.45 KHz CW non décodable. > 135.8 KHz Balise modulée > > Recevez vous sur 62.3 Khz du RTTY? > Ici il y a une station de la marine. > L' antenne fait 340 mčtres, elle se trouve ŕ 600 mčtres d'altitude. > La puissance emetteur est de 350 KW (MOSFET) > Le rendement de l'antenne est de ....45% > Il y a un fil de masse de 350 mčtres tout les degrés. > Malheureusement je n'ai pas de photo. > J'ai commencé ŕ utiliser Spectran. > J'aurai voulu recevoir la balise sur 137,780? > Quand est elle en action? > Merci ŕ bientôt. Marc > f5maf@qsl.net > www.qsl.net/f5maf > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: M. Bruno > To: > Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2000 10:52 PM > Subject: Re: LF: Carriers on 137 Khz > > > In 22.39 14/05/00 , hai scritto: > > > > Hi all, > > I have received some carriers with a 5 meters loop N/S. > > 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 RTTY > > 136 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER > > 136,8 KHz Signal = 5 BURST > > 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 BURST > > 137,45KHz Signal = 7 CW (not Ham CW) > > 135,8 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER with "CW" > > 137,75Hz Signal = 7 CARRIER > > 135,8 KHz Signal = 9+10 DCF49 > > > > Have you some informations about these "stations". > > 73 marc > > > >> > >> > > > > > Marc, reagarde ma liste sur le site de DK8KW > http://home.t-online.de/home/dk8kw/ > > 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 RTTY c'est la Marine de Athens > (Greek > Navy) > 136 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER probablement, voisin a toi ... > quelque > harmonique locale > 136,8 KHz Signal = 5 BURST ? > 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 BURST ? > 137,45KHz Signal = 7 CW (not Ham CW) ? est-il decodable ? > 135,8 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER with "CW" ? > 137,75Hz Signal = 7 CARRIER probablement harmonique du > reseau 50 > Hz > > Tous les OM de la liste ont des different signaux ... la plus part > doit etre > locale. > Il ya peu de correlations. > > 73 - Marco IK1ODO - a coté de Torino > > > > > > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution,o r any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22920 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 15:01:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 15:01:30 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rMGz-0005xj-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 15:55:09 +0100 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rMGy-0005xd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 15:55:08 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id QAA313024 for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 16:54:42 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000515165027.0af7a782@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 16:50:27 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: RE: LF: Carriers on 137 KHz In-reply-to: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528DC@pdw-mercury-1.der a.gov.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Andy, balise = beacon salve = salvo (series of shots), here probably meant as a 'rattling' or galloping signal 73, Rik ON7YD At 15:07 15/05/00 +0100, you wrote: >Quest que c'est les mots "balise" et "salve" ? >25 years since I learnt any French ! >Andy G4JNT From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1642 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 15:58:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 15:58:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rN9Z-0006RM-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 16:51:33 +0100 Received: from kerberos.telecom.cz ([194.228.2.35] helo=mail.core.telecom.cz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rN9U-0006RE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 16:51:28 +0100 Received: from dell1.cz.gmc.net ([194.228.225.18]) by mail.core.telecom.cz (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA14581 for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 17:51:02 +0200 Received: from p (p.maly.cz.gmc.net [192.168.1.35]) by dell1.cz.gmc.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id KSG6KBV2; Mon, 15 May 2000 17:52:02 +0200 Message-ID: <018201bfbe85$83b0e7c0$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> From: "Petr Maly" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <09e401bfbc0e$5e55ab60$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> <004c01bfbe61$552ed160$0600a8c0@MARC> Subject: LF: Re: Re: Optimal width for LF? Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 17:52:03 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I mix 10 MHz VXO with 8863 kHz XO. Stability looks sufficient, all this gear will be placed in closed robust alluminium box which will be surrounded by polystyrene casing to provide temperature isolation. I wanted to have no tuning step to be able to use extremely narrow filters. 73, Petr, OK1FIG ----- Original Message ----- From: mv tsi To: Sent: Monday, May 15, 2000 1:32 PM Subject: LF: Re: Optimal width for LF? > Hello petr, > I am interested to make a receiver. > But what technology can you use for hight stability frequency? > VFO,DDS? > My first receiver used a 3Mhz VFO and a IF at 11Mhz. > (I had a 137Khz 14 Mhz converter). > I had some probleme to have a narrow band pass with 5 cristals (800Hz). > For reduct audio band pass I used a MF10. > But with this receiver I couldn't survey a frequency during more hours. > The VFO stability had no perfect. > 73 marc. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Petr Maly > To: 136 group > Sent: Friday, May 12, 2000 2:34 PM > Subject: LF: Optimal width for LF? > > > > Hello all > > I am just designing a new RX for 136 kHz band. It will have IF on 1 MHz > with > > high quality x-tal filter with bandwidth 200 Hz. The main selectivity will > > by obtained on AF with passive filter with coils on pot cores. Till now I > > used similar filter with bandwidth about 50 Hz and it seems to be still > too > > wide for LF. I was about to make it new with 15 Hz width. Somebody here > > mentioned 1 Hz wide filter which seems to me to be too narrow. At least, > the > > filter cannot be narrower than obtainable osc stability. Can we make a > > little questionnaire here? What bandwidth do you use and what is the > > experience? > > > > 73, Petr, OK1FIG > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6536 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 17:28:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 17:28:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rOVW-0007AA-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 18:18:18 +0100 Received: from mail4.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.211]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rOVS-0007A4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 18:18:14 +0100 Received: from modem-98.emerie.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.194.98] helo=lvm) by mail4.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12rOV7-0007rl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 18:17:54 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfbe91$a9a10260$62c2883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. Cluster spots Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 18:17:42 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Alan,
Had contact with HB2ASB at 10:05(start) on 14/5/00 so guess report from IK1HSS was me.Have not had contact with "I" yet so nice to know sig getting that far.Thanks 73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9879 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 18:48:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 18:48:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rPiB-0007kZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 19:35:27 +0100 Received: from smtp-rt-6.wanadoo.fr ([193.252.19.160] helo=caroubier.wanadoo.fr) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rPi8-0007kU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 19:35:24 +0100 Received: from amyris.wanadoo.fr (193.252.19.150) by caroubier.wanadoo.fr; 15 May 2000 20:35:02 +0200 Received: from pii-350 (164.138.226.158) by amyris.wanadoo.fr; 15 May 2000 20:34:38 +0200 Message-ID: <007701bfbe9c$39f079e0$3c188aa4@pii-350> From: "f1tay" To: "lfgroup" Subject: LF: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 18:29:00 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
L'ART a dans sa décision 00-389 du 21 avril 2000 autorisé les radioamateurs français dans la bande:
135,7 à 137,8 kHz avec une PAR de 1 watt maxi.
Texte complet de la décision sur le site de l'ART:
 
73 de Daniel F1TAY
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 232 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 19:39:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 19:39:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rQcF-0008Dn-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 20:33:23 +0100 Received: from postfix3.free.fr ([212.27.32.22] ident=postfix) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rQcA-0008Dc-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 20:33:19 +0100 Received: from f5maf (toulouse-1-5-160.dial.proxad.net [213.228.5.160]) by postfix3.free.fr (Postfix) with SMTP id ED7E186BA8 for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 21:32:44 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <002601bfbea4$c24e7960$a005e4d5@f5maf> From: "f5maf" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: Optimal width for LF? Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 21:26:24 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thanks Petr for these answers. I am very interested to make a new receiver:! 73 marc F5MAFf -----Message d'origine----- De : Petr Maly R : rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date : lundi 15 mai 2000 18:22 Objet : LF: Re: Re: Optimal width for LF? >I mix 10 MHz VXO with 8863 kHz XO. Stability looks sufficient, all this >gear will be placed in closed robust alluminium box which will be surrounded >by polystyrene casing to provide temperature isolation. I wanted to have no >tuning step to be able to use extremely narrow filters. > >73, Petr, OK1FIG > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: mv tsi >To: >Sent: Monday, May 15, 2000 1:32 PM >Subject: LF: Re: Optimal width for LF? > > >> Hello petr, >> I am interested to make a receiver. >> But what technology can you use for hight stability frequency? >> VFO,DDS? >> My first receiver used a 3Mhz VFO and a IF at 11Mhz. >> (I had a 137Khz 14 Mhz converter). >> I had some probleme to have a narrow band pass with 5 cristals (800Hz). >> For reduct audio band pass I used a MF10. >> But with this receiver I couldn't survey a frequency during more hours. >> The VFO stability had no perfect. >> 73 marc. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Petr Maly >> To: 136 group >> Sent: Friday, May 12, 2000 2:34 PM >> Subject: LF: Optimal width for LF? >> >> >> > Hello all >> > I am just designing a new RX for 136 kHz band. It will have IF on 1 MHz >> with >> > high quality x-tal filter with bandwidth 200 Hz. The main selectivity >will >> > by obtained on AF with passive filter with coils on pot cores. Till now >I >> > used similar filter with bandwidth about 50 Hz and it seems to be still >> too >> > wide for LF. I was about to make it new with 15 Hz width. Somebody here >> > mentioned 1 Hz wide filter which seems to me to be too narrow. At least, >> the >> > filter cannot be narrower than obtainable osc stability. Can we make a >> > little questionnaire here? What bandwidth do you use and what is the >> > experience? >> > >> > 73, Petr, OK1FIG >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >> >> > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18960 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 19:43:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 19:43:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rQcE-0008Dl-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 20:33:22 +0100 Received: from postfix3.free.fr ([212.27.32.22] ident=postfix) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rQcA-0008Db-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 20:33:18 +0100 Received: from f5maf (toulouse-1-5-160.dial.proxad.net [213.228.5.160]) by postfix3.free.fr (Postfix) with SMTP id 562EE86BD8 for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 21:32:54 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <002701bfbea4$c317e3e0$a005e4d5@f5maf> From: "f5maf" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Carriers on 137 KHz Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 21:34:14 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Andy, balise = beacon salve = long pulse (1 second). 73 Marc F5MAF -----Message d'origine----- De : Talbot Andrew Ŕ : 'rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org' Date : lundi 15 mai 2000 16:49 Objet : RE: LF: Carriers on 137 KHz Quest que c'est les mots "balise" et "salve" ? 25 years since I learnt any French ! Andy G4JNT > ---------- > From: mv tsi[SMTP:mv.tsi@laposte.net] > Reply To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Sent: 2000-05-15 12:56 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: Re: LF: Carriers on 137 Khz > > Merci Marco pour les infos. > Je vais enregistrer les signaux : > 135.8 KHz salve avec un shift de 200hz. > 137.45 KHz CW non décodable. > 135.8 KHz Balise modulée > > Recevez vous sur 62.3 Khz du RTTY? > Ici il y a une station de la marine. > L' antenne fait 340 mčtres, elle se trouve ŕ 600 mčtres d'altitude. > La puissance emetteur est de 350 KW (MOSFET) > Le rendement de l'antenne est de ....45% > Il y a un fil de masse de 350 mčtres tout les degrés. > Malheureusement je n'ai pas de photo. > J'ai commencé ŕ utiliser Spectran. > J'aurai voulu recevoir la balise sur 137,780? > Quand est elle en action? > Merci ŕ bientôt. Marc > f5maf@qsl.net > www.qsl.net/f5maf > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: M. Bruno > To: > Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2000 10:52 PM > Subject: Re: LF: Carriers on 137 Khz > > > In 22.39 14/05/00 , hai scritto: > > > > Hi all, > > I have received some carriers with a 5 meters loop N/S. > > 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 RTTY > > 136 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER > > 136,8 KHz Signal = 5 BURST > > 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 BURST > > 137,45KHz Signal = 7 CW (not Ham CW) > > 135,8 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER with "CW" > > 137,75Hz Signal = 7 CARRIER > > 135,8 KHz Signal = 9+10 DCF49 > > > > Have you some informations about these "stations". > > 73 marc > > > >> > >> > > > > > Marc, reagarde ma liste sur le site de DK8KW > http://home.t-online.de/home/dk8kw/ > > 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 RTTY c'est la Marine de Athens > (Greek > Navy) > 136 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER probablement, voisin a toi ... > quelque > harmonique locale > 136,8 KHz Signal = 5 BURST ? > 135,8 KHz Signal = 7 BURST ? > 137,45KHz Signal = 7 CW (not Ham CW) ? est-il decodable ? > 135,8 KHz Signal = 6 CARRIER with "CW" ? > 137,75Hz Signal = 7 CARRIER probablement harmonique du > reseau 50 > Hz > > Tous les OM de la liste ont des different signaux ... la plus part > doit etre > locale. > Il ya peu de correlations. > > 73 - Marco IK1ODO - a coté de Torino > > > > > > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution,o r any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5496 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 19:53:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 19:53:05 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rQpH-0008KW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 20:46:51 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo18.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.8]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rQpF-0008KJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 20:46:49 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo18.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.2b.5b37834 (4333) for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 15:45:47 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <2b.5b37834.2651adea@aol.com> Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 15:45:46 EDT Subject: Re: LF: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 102 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Congratulations! I observe that this decision amounts to the first formal LF amateur allocation in the Western Hemisphere as well, since it apparently applies to les départements de la Guadeloupe, de la Guyane, de la Martinique et la collectivité territoriale de Saint-Pierre et Miquelon aussi. For anyone whose French is as rusty from disuse as mine is, the ART site can require a little time to navigate. Here is a direct URL for the text of the decision: http://www.art-telecom.fr/textes/avis/00/00-389.htm 73, John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13890 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 21:10:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 21:10:29 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rRuy-0000Ln-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 21:56:48 +0100 Received: from oso.slonet.org ([207.114.180.2] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rRur-0000Lh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 21:56:42 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from slonet.org (cas1-162.snlo.dialup.slonet.org [207.114.217.162]) by oso.slonet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA02344 for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 13:56:18 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <392056A6.F57284D1@slonet.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 20:57:26 +0000 From: "Cliff Buttschardt" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Optimal width for LF? References: <001201bfbd78$d264a680$6d5c97d4@win95.swipnet.se> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Christer and the group. I was delighted to get the two URL's containing the 30 Hz filter and noise blanker. You might remember some years ago the "HDO" phase linear filter. That was when I was W6HDO rather than K7RR. For years that filter served us well. I really enjoyed the experimental way of finding least ringing, so I placed variable resistors in the old design using an automatic key. Even the old Williams textbook approach benefited from experimental "tweaking". 73 Cliff K7RR C Andersson wrote: > > >Could you post a brief text summary of your design? > >73, Bob ZL2CA > > PA0LQ filter descriptions: > http://www.alg.demon.co.uk/radio/136/af_filter.htm > http://home5.swipnet.se/~w-54761/pa0lq_filter.htm > > 73 > Christer, sm6pxj From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2645 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 22:04:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 22:04:01 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rSrx-0000oj-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 22:57:45 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo22.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.66]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rSru-0000oZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 22:57:42 +0100 Received: from MarkusVester@aol.com by imo22.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.96.4d6482c (4340) for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 17:56:41 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: MarkusVester@aol.com Message-ID: <96.4d6482c.2651cc98@aol.com> Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 17:56:40 EDT Subject: Re: LF: Steam radio To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 64 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Mike, >The plastic cola bottle used as a light-weight coil former had several cm >of water in it! Oh yes, I had to learn that lesson too! Rewound 270 turns of litz wire on my bottle after it had become soaking wet underneath its 99%-waterproof plastic wrapping. Markus DF6NM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15901 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 22:07:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 22:07:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rSvJ-0000rU-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 23:01:13 +0100 Received: from mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rSvI-0000pO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 23:01:12 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [202.27.181.51] by mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <20000515215950.RYMF10955419.mta3-rme@[202.27.181.51]> for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 09:59:50 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <392072FD.26AF@xtra.co.nz> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 09:58:21 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Minimal ringing narrow filter References: <001201bfbd78$d264a680$6d5c97d4@win95.swipnet.se> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I have changed the subject heading to better identify the thread: C Andersson wrote: > > >Could you post a brief text summary of your design? > >73, Bob ZL2CA > > PA0LQ filter descriptions: > http://www.alg.demon.co.uk/radio/136/af_filter.htm > http://home5.swipnet.se/~w-54761/pa0lq_filter.htm > > 73 > Christer, sm6pxj Browsing this material gives some interesting results. The "secret" to minimising ringing is in the stagger tuning of the four stages of filtering. It is a hybrid sort of arrangement (so is not a classic Butterworth, Chebyshev, elliptic or Bessel ...). The design from Harry PA0LQ is for a centre frequency of 1000 Hz. For an overall bandwidth of 30 Hz, the individual stages are tuned for 966, 982, 1018 and 1034 Hz. The tuning resistors need to be accurately set, but are of the order of 180 ohms. GW4ALG made a variant of the PA0LQ design, centred on 800 Hz, and tuned it by trial and error looking for minimal ringing when fed with a stream of 800 Hz dits using a keyer used as a signal generator. The tuning resistors arrived at are 346, 385, 420 and 485 Hz. The overall bandwidth was not measured but a comment was made "the bandwidth would seem to be less than 45 Hz" and the filter easily passes 25 wpm. I do not have the basic design formulae for the filter stage used, but I assume there is a critical relationship between individual Q for and resulting bandwidth in a four stage stagger tuned arrangement. It is specifically the linear phase that is the desired result. GW4ALG confirms that with all stages netted to the same frequency, and was hopeless for ringing and "normal speed CW would not pass through the filter". Some CW ops use a tone as low as 400 Hz. While the stagger tuned filter appears to offer a lot in the way of minimised ringing compared to other designs, if the PA0LQ design is sought to perform at a somewhat lower centre frequency, then I believe the R and C values of each stage need to be scaled, as well as the low value "tuning resistors". For a given overall bandwidth, I would expect the stage Qs to each be lower as the centre frequency becomes lower. Then what stagger frequencies should be used to obtain the desired linear phase? Are there any filter design experts on the reflector that could come up with a general design, so that individuals could implement their own preferences for centre frequency and net bandwidth? As a further suggestion, a filter using four stages could have tuning resistors (and capacitors?) selected by one or more CD4066 chips (four electronic switches, has internal resistance, but is low enough to work with 180 ohms net resistance) so that pre-set variations on frequency and bandwidth could be selected as desired by DC control (no need for a multi-pole switch). Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20333 invoked from network); 15 May 2000 22:27:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 May 2000 22:27:24 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rTEr-00012F-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 23:21:25 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rTEi-000129-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 15 May 2000 23:21:18 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id XAA29820 for ; Mon, 15 May 2000 23:20:54 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk Message-ID: <2000051522164468199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 22:16:44 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: LF power amplifiers Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Dear All, First of all I wish to thank all those who sent in material for the LF book and also for those who have given permission for me to use material from their websites. It is interesting that when was looking for material for the earlier edition, finding suitable transmitter circuits was a problem. Now I have as much on this subject as I can handle! I will try to include as many of these circuits as I can. Which brings me to a technical aspect of PA design on which I am a bit hazy. Most LF PA designs employ FETs in class D push-pull, with the output taken via a transformer. A Pi section filter is then used to remove the harmonics. The documentation on the Decca transmitter modules shows a different method, with the the output FETs driven in a bridge configuration. Furthermore the output is fed via a large (airspaced coil) high C tank circuit With the old valve PA class C circuits a tank circuit was necessary to convert pulses of current into a sine wave. However this tank circuit could be a pi-section arrangement. I discussed most of the above in a telephone conversation yesterday with Andy G4JNT. Andy followed this up with an attached file to an e-mail if a Harris Semiconductor device called a HIP4080 80v/2.5A peak, high frequency full bridge FET driver. The HIP4080 can switch at frequencies up to 1MHz and appears to be normally used for driving voice coil motors, switching amplifiers in class D high frequency switching audio amplifiers and power supplies. Is there any advantage to the bridge circuit? and what is the difference between a tank circuit and a filter in a Pi configuration? -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 02:25:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 02:25:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rWtm-0002uS-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 03:15:54 +0100 Received: from mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rWtj-0002tS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 03:15:52 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [202.27.178.19] by mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <20000516021451.JWFP1909922.mta1-rme@[202.27.178.19]> for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 14:14:51 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3920AED6.3BBA@xtra.co.nz> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 14:13:42 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF power amplifiers References: <2000051522164468199@zetnet.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Peter Dodd wrote: snip snip ... > Most LF PA designs employ FETs in class D push-pull, with the output > taken via a transformer. A Pi section filter is then used to remove > the harmonics. > > The documentation on the Decca transmitter modules shows a different > method, with the the output FETs driven in a bridge configuration. > Furthermore the output is fed via a large (airspaced coil) high C > tank circuit The main problem with a bridge circuit for a radio transmitter is that it is very difficult to apply bias if a linear final is wanted (such as for PSK-31, or SSB where an LF band is wide enough) as two of the four FETs (or bipolars) are "floating". With suitable insulation it is possible to transformer couple the RF drive, but it is the DC bias that is not easy to apply to the floating transistors. Thus I believe there are advantages in the "single ended push pull" approach for LF transmitters, and could use 2+2 if four transistors were needed for power reasons, or n+n for more power still. Bias can easily be applied for linear operation, or removed for "switch mode" higher efficiency of Class C or D or whatever. For output coupling of any transmitter, the main points are to transform the impedance (resistance) so it is suitable for connection to a 50 ohm load (antenna system), and to incorporate a prudent amount of low pass filtering (more needed for Class D than Class B). Class B can use broadband coupling, but as I understand it, Class D is necessarily "tuned" so a Class D PA is never a broadband stage. There are no doubt several ways of getting an equivalent outcome for coupling any transmitter to any antenna. 73, Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3314 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 06:38:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 06:38:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ratB-0004j0-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 07:31:33 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo19.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.9]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rat5-0004il-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 07:31:27 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo19.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.29.528cc93 (3973) for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 02:30:32 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <29.528cc93.26524508@aol.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 02:30:32 EDT Subject: LF: Re: LF power amplifiers To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 102 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I'm not sure that I would agree a single-ended push-pull output is significantly easier to bias; linear biasing of "floating" transistors is done all the time in audio power amplifers, such as are frequently used by hams at LF; but within the stated parameters of a typical Class D design, it's not a problem anyway. As for Peter's question about the bridge configuration, its main advantage is the same one exploited in bridged audio amplifiers: four times the power output for a given supply voltage and load impedance. If the power is taken out via an RF transformer, EACH end of the primary winding alternates between full supply rail and ground. This is the same as applying twice the voltage to a winding with one end grounded, without actually having to stress the amplifying devices with twice the voltage. To achieve the same power in a non-bridged arrangement, one must go to a lower load impedance and deal with higher currents; or, change the turns ratio and operate the switching devices at higher voltage; or some other compromise. The output of any dual-ended or bridged switching amplifier does not require the flywheel effect of a traditional tank circuit. The output of the amplifier is simply a square wave, from which everything but the fundamental can and should be stripped (with impedance transformation, where necessary). Unlike single-ended switches, which require resonant circuits with a certain minimum loaded Q to opreate at all, dual-ended switching amplifiers can be built to work over roughly an octave without retuning. The harmonic filtering requirements for a Class D amplifier are not necessarily greater than for a Class C amplifier. In fact, for single-ended C, you have to pay a lot more attention to the second harmonic. The third, fifth, seventh, and ninth harmonics are easier to attenuate than the second. That's not to say it's trivial, of course! Fast switches produce significant spurious components up to the edge of UHF, so excellent shielding and attention to layout and lead length are important. The design isn't that difficult, but implementation requires attention to detail. Side note: If a "linear" amplifier is desired with extremely high overall efficiency, one solution at medium power levels is to use envelope-elimination-and-recovery. (That was the late Helge Granville's name for it at Motorola, though I suspect there are other terms in use as well.) The signal to be amplified is passed to both an envelope detector and a hard limiter. The hard limiter output becomes the RF drive for the switching-mode final amplifier, be it Cass D or E or something else. The baseband/envelope voltage is amplified linearly, although this can be done at high efficiency too, in an amplifier switched with pulse duration modulation or other techniques. The amplified envelope becomes the source voltage for the final RF amplifier. Assuming there are no significant time errors between the RF and envelope paths, the output can be a highly accurate representation of the input, as the RF path preserves the phase information impressed on the carrier and the envelope contains the amplitude information. All modulation schemes involve varying amplitude and/or phase, so the technique works for CW, SSB, PSK, AM, QAM, etc. There are some practical complexities, but I know amateurs who have used it successfully at levels of several hundred watts. 73, John KD4IDY From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17749 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 07:28:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 07:28:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rbgG-00055z-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 08:22:16 +0100 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rbgE-00055u-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 08:22:14 +0100 Received: from oemcomputer (man-055.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.41.68]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id IAA13787 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 08:21:52 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: irwell.zetnet.co.uk: Host man-055.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.41.68] claimed to be oemcomputer Message-ID: <002201bfbf07$871a7e80$4429f7c2@oemcomputer> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <007701bfbe9c$39f079e0$3c188aa4@pii-350> Subject: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 08:20:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
This seems to include St Pierre et Miquelon in region 2 (see http://www.art-telecom.fr/textes/index.htm)!
 
73 de
John Rabson G3PAI
----- Original Message -----
From: f1tay
To: lfgroup
Sent: Monday, May 15, 2000 7:29 PM
Subject: LF: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF

L'ART a dans sa décision 00-389 du 21 avril 2000 autorisé les radioamateurs français dans la bande:
135,7 ŕ 137,8 kHz avec une PAR de 1 watt maxi.
Texte complet de la décision sur le site de l'ART:
 
73 de Daniel F1TAY
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3114 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 08:52:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 08:52:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rcz9-0005iN-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 09:45:51 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rcz5-0005iI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 09:45:47 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id JAA17882; Tue, 16 May 2000 09:48:59 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 23470 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 09:41:20 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 09:41:20 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id JAA21894; Tue, 16 May 2000 09:43:15 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma021838; Tue, 16 May 00 09:43:09 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 09:50:25 +0100 Received: by frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Tue, 16 May 2000 09:44:22 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01AB8C46@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: LF power amplifiers Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 09:44:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > Referring to John KD4IDY's note - > > I cannot help but feel a bit uneasy about the use of class D > amplifiers followed by conventional shunt C series L pi-section > filters - although the designs using them do seem to work OK. The > shunt C is surely going to increase the circulating current at the > harmonic frequencies, stressing the active devices more an lowering > efficiency. I would have thought that the first component of the > output filter should be an inductor - either giving a Tee section > filter, or Pi section with an even number of elements. Dave / Dave > can you comment further ?. > > This approach is preferred by G8GSQ who has built high power HF Mosfet > PAs and finds the initial L in the output filter improves device > stability considerably. QEX ran an article on HF PA filters a few > months ago, and these ended up as quite complex diplexing units in > order to present the devices with respectable out of band impedances. > A tank circuit actually sounds quite attractive on first thoughts just > as a filtering element, but unlike a valve, we are dealing with much > lower impedances. Back in the valve class C PA days, (I'm just old > enough to remember these from several Practical Wireless articles) > seem to recall a loaded Q of 12 being taken as optimum. To get this > sort of Q at a 50V rail 10A current needs a seriously small value of > inductor in a conventional tank. > > A back of envelope calculation : > > If Rload = 50V / 10A = 2 ohms and Ql = 12 then Xl = 2 / 12 = > 0.17 ohms = 194nH at 137kHz. Which is one turn (or less) on a decent > sized iron dust former or a few turns of VERY thick wire in air. > Furthermore, with I = 10A and Q = 12 then circulating currents > approach 120 Amps. Enough said. In practice, tapping into the tank > circuit would be used and the easist way to achieve this is to use two > capacitors rather than try to tap into turns with high current wire, > so now a choke is needed to feed in DC. An alternative to tapping is > to use a transformer, which also has the advantage of isolating the > antenna circuit from the PA at DC. We now have a transformer PA > followed by a resonant network just providing filtering - Beginning to > look familiar ? > > In the early days of 73kHz I tried this approach, but the high Q > output network was too prone to destroying devices when mistuned, and > particularly when the antenna went off resonance. The ultimate design > was a half bridge circuit running off 340 Volt rectified mains, output > transformer and C/L tank using an air wound inductor rather than > conventional Pi filter. For a time it delivered 700 Watts into a > dummy load of multiple 150W light bulbs quite happily - until I keyed > the circuit a few times. Remember what the resistance of light bulbs > are when cold and the current surges when switched on. There is a lot > of energy in 1000uF of capacitors charged to 340V. Never did like CW > ! After blowing four IRF450 fets spectacularly plus two bridge > driver chips I decided this was rather dangerous and kept with > conventional class B designs from then on. But now that really high > power is wanted, it may be time to look at using rectified mains > again. The output transformer provides one side of a safety barrier > and input isolation can come from a transformer or opto isolators. > An input transformer is preferable as it protects preceeding devices > from large DC voltages/currents generated as a result of FETs > exploding. Switch mode PSUs have been doing this for a long time with > a good safety record and there is a large base of SMPSU components > both surplus and in the catalogues. Everyone uses SMPSUs these days. > > I don't have a death wish, so will leave such a PA to others to > develop. > > On the last point of John's note... > > At the moment I'm developing a Pulse Width Modulator for supplying > Class D PAs. This will accept a binary word (which can of course be > the output of a A/D converter) and control the supply voltage to the > PA. The aim is for a supply which will operate with 50V input and > supply 0 - 50V out at currents up to 10A. Software authors could > hopefully be persuaded to make phase and amplitude available > separately, digitally, or these could be regenerated as per John's > suggestion. The PWM scheme is open loop so can operate very fast - > I'm using a switching frequency of 50kHz but this is not critical. > Modulation up to a few kHz should be feasible. Works OK so far at up > to 3.5 Amps output, but I haven't tested at full current yet not > having had any suitable switching devices in the 'junk box', but I > hope to in a few days time, so watch this space......... > > I already have a PIC/EEPROM based PSK31 beacon which supplies > separate amplitude and phase, and have tested this successfully on > 1.8MHz at 8 watts, but with a 12V supply rail just being very > inefficiently modulated with an emitter follower - thus negating all > the efficiency advantages of a class C/D PA ! It proved the concept > though. > > Andy G4JNT > > From John KD4IDY > > > >The output of any dual-ended or bridged switching amplifier does not > require > >the flywheel effect of a traditional tank circuit. The output of the > > amplifier is simply a square wave, from which everything but the > fundamental > can and should be stripped (with impedance transformation, where > necessary). > Unlike single-ended switches, which require resonant circuits with a > certain > minimum loaded Q to opreate at all, dual-ended switching amplifiers > can be > built to work over roughly an octave without retuning. > Side note: If a "linear" amplifier is desired with extremely high > overall > efficiency, one solution at medium power levels is to use > envelope-elimination-and-recovery. (That was the late Helge > Granville's name > for it at Motorola, though I suspect there are other terms in use as > well.) > The signal to be amplified is passed to both an envelope detector and > a hard > limiter. The hard limiter output becomes the RF drive for the > switching-mode > final amplifier, be it Cass D or E or something else. The > baseband/envelope > voltage is amplified linearly, although this can be done at high > efficiency > too, in an amplifier switched with pulse duration modulation or other > techniques. The amplified envelope becomes the source voltage for the > final > RF amplifier. Assuming there are no significant time errors between > the RF > and envelope paths, the output can be a highly accurate representation > of the > input, as the RF path preserves the phase information impressed on the > > carrier and the envelope contains the amplitude information. All > modulation > schemes involve varying amplitude and/or phase, so the technique works > for > CW, SSB, PSK, AM, QAM, etc. There are some practical complexities, > but I > know amateurs who have used it successfully at levels of several > hundred > watts. > > > > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28033 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 10:14:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 10:14:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12reGR-0006Ma-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 11:07:47 +0100 Received: from d06lmsgate.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12reGN-0006MR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 11:07:44 +0100 Received: from d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.148]) by d06lmsgate.uk.ibm.COM (1.0.0) with ESMTP id KAA155932 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 10:56:22 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from usa.net (dyn9-87-116-182.italy.ibm.com [9.87.116.182]) by d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id LAA113386 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 11:06:50 +0100 Message-ID: <39211D64.9A0307AA@usa.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 12:05:24 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" Organization: Undisclosed X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Spectran beta 3, build 262 References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528B5@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> <3.0.1.16.20000505141455.21ffadcc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <3.0.1.16.20000509112258.232ff9b2@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The version beta 3, build 262 of Spectran is now availbale at the URL : http://www.weaksignals.com It is a spectral analysis software, still in beta, expecially tailored for EME and VLF work. Freeware. Alberto I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4411 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 11:23:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 11:23:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rfHc-0006qM-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 12:13:04 +0100 Received: from front5.grolier.fr ([194.158.96.55]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rfHY-0006qH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 12:13:00 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from club-internet.fr (ppp-44-38-196.wmar.club-internet.fr [213.44.38.196]) by front5.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id NAA14791 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 13:12:37 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <39213B65.2A6ED625@club-internet.fr> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 13:13:58 +0100 From: "M & S" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: fr,fr,es-ES MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF References: <007701bfbe9c$39f079e0$3c188aa4@pii-350> <002201bfbf07$871a7e80$4429f7c2@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello all, Yes, THIS time it is really official! Not when a few months ago some sort of association said that it was official in a greatly distributed press release... >From now on, as the text says, F, FG, FY, FM and FP hams are allowed to use LF with 1 Watt ERP. Great news, isn't it? The amplifier is nearly finished and I have to repair the antenna which has fallen down on one leg (250 m of wire on the ground). Soon on the air! 73, Mark, F6JSZ JN04PX From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18632 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 11:57:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 11:57:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rfpa-00078f-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 12:48:10 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rfpW-00078a-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 12:48:06 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id NAA640484 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 13:47:40 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000516134323.2cd7b862@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 13:43:23 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Spectran beta 3, build 262 In-reply-to: <39211D64.9A0307AA@usa.net> References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528B5@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> <3.0.1.16.20000505141455.21ffadcc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <3.0.1.16.20000509112258.232ff9b2@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I tested the lastest version (built 262) last night on Marco's (IK1ODO) signal. Results are amazing, while I had poor copy with Spectogram I could get a perfect 'O' signal with Spectran. It just took some time to experiment with the (many) parameters. After some 'playing' with Spectran I found that following parameters gave best results on the IK1ODO beacon signal : Avg Factor = 4 + integration Sample rate = 8000Hz (or 5512.5Hz) Contrast = 125 Res = 0.061Hz (or 0.042Hz at 5512.5Hz sample rate) Speed = default (startup) value Lvl = adjusted until the signal is at +/- 75% of the scale at the upper screen Log = on Setting 'Lvl' high enough is very important, from Spectogram I was used to have a rather low input level for best result but Spectran needs a much higher input level. Also 'Log' must be active (red). Increasing Contrast from 100 (default) to 125 improved things a lot. Marco's signal was too strong to test higher averaging and/or higher Contrast. Question to Marco : what was your ERP last night (+/- 22 UT) ? Would it be possible to decrease it with 3 to 6 dB, to allow to test Spectran on a really weak signal. Finaly : congrats to Alberto and his friend, the lastest version of Spectran is an excellent tool ! 73, Rik ON7YD At 12:05 16/05/00 +0200, you wrote: >The version beta 3, build 262 of Spectran is now availbale at the URL : > http://www.weaksignals.com > >It is a spectral analysis software, still in beta, expecially tailored for >EME and VLF work. Freeware. > >Alberto I2PHD > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26233 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 12:47:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 12:47:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rgbO-0007Wf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 13:37:34 +0100 Received: from cyb01.axime.com ([160.92.120.38] helo=cybv01.axime.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rgbM-0007WZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 13:37:33 +0100 Received: from MARC ([213.36.35.115]) by cybv01.axime.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with SMTP id FUNKD300.820 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 14:36:39 +0200 Message-ID: <007f01bfbf33$61973500$0600a8c0@MARC> From: "mv tsi" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <007701bfbe9c$39f079e0$3c188aa4@pii-350> <002201bfbf07$871a7e80$4429f7c2@oemcomputer> <39213B65.2A6ED625@club-internet.fr> Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 14:27:44 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Salut Mark, Des que tu es pret dis le moi. Ce week end je monte les 12 metres si le temps le permet! Il faut aussi que je refasse le plan de sol! David m'envoie les composants debut Juin pour l'emetteur classe D. A + ----- Original Message ----- From: M & S To: Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2000 2:13 PM Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF > Hello all, > > Yes, THIS time it is really official! Not when a few months ago some > sort of association said that it was official in a greatly distributed > press release... > > From now on, as the text says, F, FG, FY, FM and FP hams are allowed to > use LF with 1 Watt ERP. > > Great news, isn't it? > > The amplifier is nearly finished and I have to repair the antenna which > has fallen down on one leg (250 m of wire on the ground). > > Soon on the air! > > 73, Mark, F6JSZ > JN04PX > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29574 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 12:59:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 12:59:38 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rgn5-0007bu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 13:49:39 +0100 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rgn4-0007bp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 13:49:38 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12rgmu-0007eU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 13:49:29 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.4.R) for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 13:35:03 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 13:35:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF In-reply-to: <39213B65.2A6ED625@club-internet.fr> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: F6JSZ wrote: > The amplifier is nearly finished and I have to repair the antenna which > has fallen down on one leg (250 m of wire on the ground). This reminds me of the day I got my licence. It was January and it had snowed the previous night. Excited by the new licence, I had several successful 160m CW QSOs before I found that the antenna was buried under several cm of snow. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19914 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 15:33:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 15:33:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rjGZ-0000Jx-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 16:28:15 +0100 Received: from kerberos.telecom.cz ([194.228.2.35] helo=mail.core.telecom.cz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rjGA-0000Jo-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 16:27:51 +0100 Received: from dell1.cz.gmc.net ([194.228.225.18]) by mail.core.telecom.cz (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA16143 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 17:27:30 +0200 Received: from p (p.maly.cz.gmc.net [192.168.1.35]) by dell1.cz.gmc.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id KSG6KBYY; Tue, 16 May 2000 17:28:31 +0200 Message-ID: <025a01bfbf4b$65183180$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> From: "Petr Maly" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528B5@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> <3.0.1.16.20000505141455.21ffadcc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <3.0.1.16.20000509112258.232ff9b2@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <39211D64.9A0307AA@usa.net> Subject: LF: Re: Spectran beta 3, build 262 Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 17:28:32 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Someone should also say "hey guys, thanks for your effort developing this freeware for us". I used to be a programmer so I know what it is about... 73, Petr, OK1FIG ----- Original Message ----- From: Alberto di Bene To: Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2000 12:05 PM Subject: LF: Spectran beta 3, build 262 > The version beta 3, build 262 of Spectran is now availbale at the URL : > http://www.weaksignals.com > > It is a spectral analysis software, still in beta, expecially tailored for > EME and VLF work. Freeware. > > Alberto I2PHD > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20346 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 16:33:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 16:33:40 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rk5A-0000o6-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 17:20:32 +0100 Received: from e33.co.us.ibm.com ([32.97.110.131] helo=e33.esmtp.ibm.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rk53-0000mi-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 17:20:25 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from westrelay01.boulder.ibm.com (westrelay01.boulder.ibm.com [9.99.132.204]) by e33.esmtp.ibm.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA48960 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 11:13:01 -0500 Received: from usa.net (dyn9-87-116-182.italy.ibm.com [9.87.116.182]) by westrelay01.boulder.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id KAA46178 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 10:20:00 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <392174DB.DD7667FA@usa.net> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 18:18:35 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Spectran beta 3, build 262 References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C017528B5@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> <3.0.1.16.20000505141455.21ffadcc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <3.0.1.16.20000509112258.232ff9b2@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <39211D64.9A0307AA@usa.net> <025a01bfbf4b$65183180$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Petr, the thanking is always welcome, but really not needed. After all, the whole spirit of the ham/internet community is that each individual should give his little contribution, be it a program, a schematics, a sketch on how to build an antenna, an operational tip, etc. etc. 73, Alberto I2PHD Petr Maly wrote: > Someone should also say "hey guys, thanks for your effort developing this > freeware for us". I used to be a programmer so I know what it is about... > > 73, Petr, OK1FIG > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1983 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 18:09:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 18:09:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rldG-0001YY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 18:59:50 +0100 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rldD-0001YT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 18:59:47 +0100 Received: from oemcomputer (man-142.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.40.181]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id SAA16719 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 18:59:25 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: irwell.zetnet.co.uk: Host man-142.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.40.181] claimed to be oemcomputer Message-ID: <009e01bfbf60$97d8d9c0$b528f7c2@oemcomputer> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 18:31:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: ----- Original Message ----- From: Mike Dennison To: Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2000 1:35 PM Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF > F6JSZ wrote: > > The amplifier is nearly finished and I have to repair the antenna which > > has fallen down on one leg (250 m of wire on the ground). > > This reminds me of the day I got my licence. It was January and it > had snowed the previous night. Excited by the new licence, I had > several successful 160m CW QSOs before I found that the antenna > was buried under several cm of snow. Come caving with CREG then. 73 de John Rabson G3PAI From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4081 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 18:17:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 18:17:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rlo0-0001f4-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 19:10:56 +0100 Received: from front7m.grolier.fr ([195.36.216.57]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rlny-0001ev-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 19:10:54 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from club-internet.fr (ppp-44-34-120.wmar.club-internet.fr [213.44.34.120]) by front7m.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id UAA25161 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 20:10:26 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <39219D57.FC0F8E8F@club-internet.fr> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 20:12:35 +0100 From: "M & S" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: fr,fr,es-ES MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF References: <007701bfbe9c$39f079e0$3c188aa4@pii-350> <002201bfbf07$871a7e80$4429f7c2@oemcomputer> <39213B65.2A6ED625@club-internet.fr> <007f01bfbf33$61973500$0600a8c0@MARC> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: IL s'agit d'une question de "week-ends", sauf que pour le week-end ŕ venir, je ne serais pas actif, malheureusement. Puis, le week-end suivant, il y a le CQ WW WPX CW Contest, auquel je vais participer en multi-op., d'une part pour "surveiller" (je suis juge officiel) et, d'autre part, pour tester les antennes pour le Championnat du Monde dans lequel je vais participer sur au moins deux bandes pour le compte de TM0HQ, la station officielle dfu REF-Union... La "leg" de 250 m est encore par-terre, mais je pense pouvoir régler la question bientot. D'aprčs mes renseignements, c'est la plus grande antenne d'émission amateur au monde sur 136 kHz : un dipole "full-size"... 73, Mark, F6JSZ mv tsi a *crit : > > Salut Mark, > Des que tu es pret dis le moi. > Ce week end je monte les 12 metres si le temps le permet! > Il faut aussi que je refasse le plan de sol! > David m'envoie les composants debut Juin pour l'emetteur classe D. > A + > ----- Original Message ----- > From: M & S > To: > Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2000 2:13 PM > Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF > > > Hello all, > > > > Yes, THIS time it is really official! Not when a few months ago some > > sort of association said that it was official in a greatly distributed > > press release... > > > > From now on, as the text says, F, FG, FY, FM and FP hams are allowed to > > use LF with 1 Watt ERP. > > > > Great news, isn't it? > > > > The amplifier is nearly finished and I have to repair the antenna which > > has fallen down on one leg (250 m of wire on the ground). > > > > Soon on the air! > > > > 73, Mark, F6JSZ > > JN04PX > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 368 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 18:22:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 18:22:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rlsh-0001jW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 19:15:47 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo-d08.mx.aol.com ([205.188.157.40]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rlsf-0001iY-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 19:15:45 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.df.4659a5f (16783) for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 14:14:39 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 14:14:39 EDT Subject: Re: LF: Re: Spectran beta 3, build 262 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 102 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In a message dated 5/16/00 12:32:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time, dibene@usa.net writes: << After all, the whole spirit of the ham/internet community is that each individual should give his little contribution, be it a program, a schematics, a sketch on how to build an antenna, an operational tip, etc. etc. >> Agreed. None the less, writing a program like this is more than a "little" contribution. So, thanks very much. 73, John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2328 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 18:26:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 18:26:24 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rlvc-0001k4-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 19:18:48 +0100 Received: from front4m.grolier.fr ([195.36.216.54]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rlva-0001jz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 19:18:47 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from club-internet.fr (ppp-44-34-120.wmar.club-internet.fr [213.44.34.120]) by front4m.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id UAA00753 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 20:16:13 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <39219F55.12DC8129@club-internet.fr> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 20:21:06 +0100 From: "M & S" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: fr,fr,es-ES MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Frustrating isn't it? However, my full-size dipole has been up during the december storm, and it works very well in RX mode and should (I hope) work in TX mode as soon as the amplifier is finished. For the time being, I have one quarter of the antenna on the earth, and no, it doesn't work so well in RX in such a configuration. 'Have to go back up the poles again... P.S. I remember my first QSO with a 10m dipole struck on the ceiling of my bedroom with pins... I think my first QSO was with a US station, on 14 CW, before I contacted 3DA0 something with just 10 watts and an interior aerial... 73, Mark, F6JSZ Mike Dennison a *crit : > > F6JSZ wrote: > > The amplifier is nearly finished and I have to repair the antenna which > > has fallen down on one leg (250 m of wire on the ground). > > This reminds me of the day I got my licence. It was January and it > had snowed the previous night. Excited by the new licence, I had > several successful 160m CW QSOs before I found that the antenna > was buried under several cm of snow. > > Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) > http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3156 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 18:28:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 18:28:09 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rlwP-0001kJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 19:19:37 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rlwO-0001kB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 19:19:37 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id UAA717174 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 20:19:13 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000516201450.234fac54@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 20:14:50 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF In-reply-to: References: <39213B65.2A6ED625@club-internet.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: One more prove that a horizontal antenna at very low height really works ! .... .. Rik ON7YD At 13:35 16/05/00 +0100, G3XDV wrote: >F6JSZ wrote: >> The amplifier is nearly finished and I have to repair the antenna which >> has fallen down on one leg (250 m of wire on the ground). > >This reminds me of the day I got my licence. It was January and it >had snowed the previous night. Excited by the new licence, I had >several successful 160m CW QSOs before I found that the antenna >was buried under several cm of snow. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3868 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 18:29:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 18:29:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rlxp-0001ks-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 19:21:05 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rlxo-0001kn-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 19:21:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as31-s16-147-73.cwci.net ([195.44.147.73] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rlxT-00055b-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 18:20:43 +0000 Message-ID: <392182FD.2F7CB217@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 17:18:53 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: Autum Static Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Has anyone mentioned to Larry about the possibility of high static levels in November around the UK and the rest of Western EU. The best time for transatlantic tests would be January/February. October and November can be poor months on the lower frequencies for reception. Other LF operators like those experienced on 160 metres might be able to make some observations. 73 de MAL/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18142 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 19:06:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 19:06:52 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rmav-00027C-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 20:01:29 +0100 Received: from m11.boston.juno.com ([63.211.172.74]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rmau-000277-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 20:01:28 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cookie.juno.com by cookie.juno.com for <"yokUgcxCbtTP7XLrpefewAPXUIDTVStVkvMwq7dqCrlWseBYhyCTZg=="> Received: (from riese-k3djc@juno.com) by m11.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id E78BB7FQ; Tue, 16 May 2000 15:00:10 EDT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 14:49:43 -0400 Subject: Re: LF: Re: Spectran beta 3, build 262 Message-ID: <20000516.145709.-4281.2.riese-k3djc@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: "Bob RIESE" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: My feelings as well, really a good effort. Thanks, thanks Bob K3DJC >Someone should also say "hey guys, thanks for your effort developing >this >freeware for us". I used to be a programmer so I know what it is >about... From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19069 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 19:08:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 19:08:05 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rmcQ-00027O-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 20:03:02 +0100 Received: from front2m.grolier.fr ([195.36.216.52]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rmcO-00027J-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 20:03:00 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from club-internet.fr (ppp-44-53-88.wmar.club-internet.fr [213.44.53.88]) by front2m.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id UAA10661 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 20:52:29 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3921A9B2.6D3CF5CC@club-internet.fr> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 21:05:24 +0100 From: "M & S" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: fr,fr,es-ES MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF References: <39213B65.2A6ED625@club-internet.fr> <3.0.1.16.20000516201450.234fac54@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Rik, Hi all, Yes, it should work, since my first tests have been successful in RX aswell as in TX mode. The only thing is that you must be clear of any electromagnetic source, such as power lines, TV sets, computers and other fluorescent lights. On my side, the most interfering power lines are just 8 m above ground level. The antenna, on the lowest part, is just about 12 m above ground level, and seperated from the line, on one side (1/4), by about 60m. There is absolutely no QRM at any time of the day. And I do hear most of the guys on this list when they 'speak' normal CW. However, tahit is, with a CW filter, a DSP and a fine QTH. 73, Mark, F6JSZ JN04PX http://perso.club-internet.fr/sovergne Rik Strobbe a *crit : > > One more prove that a horizontal antenna at very low height really works ! > > ... .. > > Rik ON7YD > > At 13:35 16/05/00 +0100, G3XDV wrote: > >F6JSZ wrote: > >> The amplifier is nearly finished and I have to repair the antenna which > >> has fallen down on one leg (250 m of wire on the ground). > > > >This reminds me of the day I got my licence. It was January and it > >had snowed the previous night. Excited by the new licence, I had > >several successful 160m CW QSOs before I found that the antenna > >was buried under several cm of snow. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9355 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 20:08:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 20:08:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rnVI-0002Yu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 20:59:44 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rnVG-0002Yo-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 20:59:42 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 (ppp-20-72-145.libero.it [151.20.72.145]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA04161 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 21:59:11 +0200 Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 21:59:11 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000516201903.01688de0@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Tue, 16 May 2000 20:29:07 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: Spectran beta 3 - IK1ODO beacon running (2mW) In-reply-to: <3.0.1.16.20000516134323.2cd7b862@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Riferimenti: <39211D64.9A0307AA@usa.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In 20.37 16/05/00 , Rik wrote: > >Question to Marco : what was your ERP last night (+/- 22 UT) ? >Would it be possible to decrease it with 3 to 6 dB, to allow to test >Spectran on a really weak signal. > It was at 10 mW. Now (tuesday evening, 19z) it is running at 2mW level (250 mA into about 32 Ohm antenna Z, -30 dB gain). It's difficult to regulate the power ... the final draws 2A at 1.6V of Vdd! I will let it running until you like with the same parameters: QRG 137.791, -792, -793 kHz (each minus 0,2 Hz on my counter) Speed 30 s dot, 10 s space Lower frq is "space", middle is "dot", higher is "dash". [I propose a QRP award for the best bit-per-sec-per-km-per-mW performance. Anyone willing to think the rules?] If anyone wants lower power, let me know ....attenuators are available ! 73 - Marco IK1ODO spin@inrete.it Rivalta, ITALY JN35SA (N 45 01' 25.6", E 7 31' 09.4") From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2577 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 20:57:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 20:57:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12roIx-0002zP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 21:51:03 +0100 Received: from mb09.swip.net ([193.12.122.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12roIu-0002zK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 21:51:00 +0100 Received: from win95 (d212-151-40-48.swipnet.se [212.151.40.48]) by mb09.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA21342 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 22:50:13 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <000801bfbf78$d10f8820$302897d4@win95.swipnet.se> From: "C Andersson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: DQ0KBM spark TX Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 22:53:38 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Was there any acticity from the spark tx last weekend? I listened Sunday evening but realised that the transmission probably took place on Saturday... /Christer sm6pxj From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3176 invoked from network); 16 May 2000 21:31:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 May 2000 21:31:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rorN-0003Ep-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 22:26:37 +0100 Received: from lepidachrosite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rorM-0003Ek-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 16 May 2000 22:26:36 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (1Cust18.tnt13.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.53.0.18]) by lepidachrosite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id 3A08ACBEB9; Tue, 16 May 2000 21:06:28 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <007701bfbf7a$cf7aa560$120035d5@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "Gj.Huijsman@Planet.Nl" , "LF-Group" Subject: LF: PA0LQ audiofilters Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 23:03:39 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: ----- Oorspronkelijk bericht ----- Van: C Andersson Aan: Verzonden: zondag 14 mei 2000 9:48 Onderwerp: Re: LF: Optimal width for LF? >Could you post a brief text summary of your design? >73, Bob ZL2CA PA0LQ filter descriptions: http://www.alg.demon.co.uk/radio/136/af_filter.htm http://home5.swipnet.se/~w-54761/pa0lq_filter.htm 73 Christer, sm6pxj I can provide additional information by Harry, PA0LQ, on the design of his active and passive audiofilters. But the reflector does not like attachments. So if you would like to receive Harry's info please send me an e-mail and I will send it to you as a PDF-file, attached to a direct e-mail. 73, Dick, PA0SE E-mail: d.w.rollema@freeler.nl or pa0se@amsat.org From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15675 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 00:05:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 00:05:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rrFy-0004Yp-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 01:00:10 +0100 Received: from oso.slonet.org ([207.114.180.2] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rrFx-0004Yk-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 01:00:09 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from slonet.org (cas0-120.snlo.dialup.slonet.org [207.114.217.120]) by oso.slonet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA25470 for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 16:59:45 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3921D32E.64205628@slonet.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 00:01:02 +0000 From: "Cliff Buttschardt" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF power amplifiers References: <29.528cc93.26524508@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Screw that AOL!!! John, these damn fool people out to prove that the silliest error on the part of the "subscriber" is the guy that is paying the bill. I have learned to hate that fool outfit. Us "normal" people just can not contend with AOL or any other outfit that thinks their feces does not stink!!! Cliff K7RR From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23384 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 00:05:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 00:05:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rrFc-0004YL-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 00:59:48 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rrFZ-0004VO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 00:59:45 +0100 Received: from MarkusVester@aol.com by imo12.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.a9.5a8fc44 (3848) for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 19:58:46 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: MarkusVester@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 19:58:45 EDT Subject: LF: CFH... why wait for winter? To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 64 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello group, yesterday night, the qrn seemed to be fairly moderate, so I decided to start spectrogram at 22:00 UT (5513 Hz, 512 pts, 30 s dwell, 128 averages, resolution bandwidth with windowing appr. 14 Hz). In the morning, I was quite surprised to see a fat trace of CFH 137.0 kHz beginning at 00:10. A first maximum occured around 00:55 with about 11 dBuV/m/14Hz, then the signal dived down for 15 minutes before it came back with similar strength. After staying fairly constant for about 1.5 h, it peaked to 13 dBuV/m/14Hz from 02:55 to 03:10, then decayed and became invisible around 04:10. SVX from Greece was strong all night until 02:40, with a pronounced double-minimum at 03:00 and 03:14 around sunrise. Starting at 23:45, there was another unidentified narrowband signal with dx-like fading on 136.3 kHz, up to 10 dBuV/m. The noise between the statics was around -10 dBuV/m/14Hz during the night, decreasing by 5 dB with daylight. For the calculation of signal strength, I have found a ratio of 7 dB between CFH's observed power density in 14 Hz and its total power, corresponding to an effective modulation bandwidth of 70 Hz. So the actual field-strength would be 20 dBuV/m in the maximum. Reducing the noise density to 1 Hz, I would see -10-11.5 = -21.5 dB/Hz, resultimg in an SNR of 41.5dB/Hz. The ERP of CFH is said to be around 10 kW, 40 dB above an amateur station's limit. That would leave us with 1.5 dB SNR in 1 Hz, or 11.5 dB with 10 s dots in 0.1 Hz, even here in the middle of Europe. In other words: Had we tried last night, we would have made it across! BTW: Comparable observations in winter and early spring had shown a quite similar field strength, it was only the time window of common darkness which was much longer. Cheers Markus, DF6NM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16185 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 00:08:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 00:08:40 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rrJf-0004bi-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 01:03:59 +0100 Received: from tomts1.bellnexxia.net ([209.226.175.139] helo=tomts1-srv.bellnexxia.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rrJU-0004bW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 01:03:48 +0100 Received: from server1 ([216.209.110.142]) by tomts1-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000517000241.JTF28912.tomts1-srv.bellnexxia.net@server1> for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 20:02:41 -0400 Message-ID: <015801bfbf92$94a58870$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Autum Static Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 19:58:04 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Mal et all: I am actively looking at this, it will take a while as I have to ask for some summaries to be made manually but will get back when I have some info from those who have long experience in this area. My preliminary information is that for this side of the Atlantic this is well into the annual quiet period, we have no significant electricaly WX activity in this period over here. More later. I am just back on after moving my server to my permanent home qth. Larry >Has anyone mentioned to Larry about the possibility of high static >levels in November around the UK and the rest of Western EU. The best >time for transatlantic tests would be January/February. >October and November can be poor months on the lower frequencies for >reception. >Other LF operators like those experienced on 160 metres might be able to >make some observations. >73 de MAL/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19668 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 00:30:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 00:30:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rrev-0004m2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 01:25:57 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo-d02.mx.aol.com ([205.188.157.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rreu-0004lw-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 01:25:56 +0100 Received: from MarkusVester@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.e8.478961b (4368) for ; Tue, 16 May 2000 20:24:58 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: MarkusVester@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 20:24:57 EDT Subject: Re: LF: QRP award, IK1ODO beacon To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 64 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Marco, >[I propose a QRP award for the best bit-per-sec-per-km-per-mW >performance. Anyone willing to think the rules?] ... excellent idea! Perhaps we should even use ...per-km-squared... as that would be proportional to power density. And we might have to set a minimum distance like lambda/(2*pi) to exclude the near-field zone. BTW: Your 10 mW DFCW was OOO here a couple of weeks ago with spectrogram, very interesting indeed. But tonight I can't see anything through the qrn. 73 de Markus, DF6NM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11156 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 06:26:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 06:26:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rx8x-0007Nk-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 07:17:19 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rx8w-0007Nf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 07:17:18 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id IAA482066 for ; Wed, 17 May 2000 08:16:56 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000517081237.2d0f5b34@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 08:12:37 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Spectran beta 3 - IK1ODO beacon running (2mW) In-reply-to: <4.1.20000516201903.01688de0@mailer.inrete.it> References: <3.0.1.16.20000516134323.2cd7b862@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Marco & group, I'm sorry but it was absolute impossible to look for the 2mW signal last night. I started looking at 19.30UT (as nomally Marco's signal becomes vissible here after 20UT), but at abt. 20UT I had to stop because of thunderstorm, not only because QRN became really bad (S-meter at 9+++ all the time) but also for safety as the lightning was just above my QTH. In case your beacon is still running I will give it another try tonight. 73, Rik ON7YD >It was at 10 mW. Now (tuesday evening, 19z) it is running at 2mW >level (250 mA into about 32 Ohm antenna Z, -30 dB gain). > >It's difficult to regulate the power ... the final draws 2A at 1.6V of Vdd! From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13794 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 06:35:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 06:35:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rxGa-0007RZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 07:25:12 +0100 Received: from cyb01.axime.com ([160.92.120.38] helo=cybv01.axime.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rxGZ-0007RU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 07:25:11 +0100 Received: from MARC ([213.36.35.72]) by cybv01.axime.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with SMTP id FUOXSJ00.A1J for ; Wed, 17 May 2000 08:24:19 +0200 Message-ID: <016801bfbfc8$8805a920$0600a8c0@MARC> From: "mv tsi" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: IK1ODO and QRN Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 08:23:45 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hello Marco,
Unfortunately yesterday evening more QRN  (a little storm in night) I can't see anything through the QRN.
Marc F5MAF
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10611 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 06:46:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 06:46:00 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rxTR-0007Wz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 07:38:29 +0100 Received: from cyb01.axime.com ([160.92.120.38] helo=cybv01.axime.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12rxTP-0007Wo-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 07:38:28 +0100 Received: from MARC ([213.36.34.216]) by cybv01.axime.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with SMTP id FUOYEM00.I17 for ; Wed, 17 May 2000 08:37:34 +0200 Message-ID: <017b01bfbfca$62443740$0600a8c0@MARC> From: "mv tsi" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <007701bfbe9c$39f079e0$3c188aa4@pii-350> <002201bfbf07$871a7e80$4429f7c2@oemcomputer> <39213B65.2A6ED625@club-internet.fr> <007f01bfbf33$61973500$0600a8c0@MARC> <39219D57.FC0F8E8F@club-internet.fr> Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 08:36:57 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Bon courage Mark, Il faut absolument que je fasse des progrés en CW ! Ok pour l'antenne, quand on a de la place....et pas de QRM! Faire des essais de reception en ce moment n'est pas facile avec les orages! A+ Marc ----- Original Message ----- From: M & S To: Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2000 9:12 PM Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF IL s'agit d'une question de "week-ends", sauf que pour le week-end ŕ venir, je ne serais pas actif, malheureusement. Puis, le week-end suivant, il y a le CQ WW WPX CW Contest, auquel je vais participer en multi-op., d'une part pour "surveiller" (je suis juge officiel) et, d'autre part, pour tester les antennes pour le Championnat du Monde dans lequel je vais participer sur au moins deux bandes pour le compte de TM0HQ, la station officielle dfu REF-Union... La "leg" de 250 m est encore par-terre, mais je pense pouvoir régler la question bientot. D'aprčs mes renseignements, c'est la plus grande antenne d'émission amateur au monde sur 136 kHz : un dipole "full-size"... 73, Mark, F6JSZ mv tsi a *crit : > > Salut Mark, > Des que tu es pret dis le moi. > Ce week end je monte les 12 metres si le temps le permet! > Il faut aussi que je refasse le plan de sol! > David m'envoie les composants debut Juin pour l'emetteur classe D. > A + > ----- Original Message ----- > From: M & S > To: > Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2000 2:13 PM > Subject: Re: LF: Re: OFFICIAL: FRENCH OM ON LF > > > Hello all, > > > > Yes, THIS time it is really official! Not when a few months ago some > > sort of association said that it was official in a greatly distributed > > press release... > > > > From now on, as the text says, F, FG, FY, FM and FP hams are allowed to > > use LF with 1 Watt ERP. > > > > Great news, isn't it? > > > > The amplifier is nearly finished and I have to repair the antenna which > > has fallen down on one leg (250 m of wire on the ground). > > > > Soon on the air! > > > > 73, Mark, F6JSZ > > JN04PX > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13060 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 11:39:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 11:39:40 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s21f-0001H7-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 12:30:07 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s21c-0001H2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 12:30:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12s21G-0000ja-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 12:29:42 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <28528.200005171129@gemini> From: "James Moritz" Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 12:36:28 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Puckeridge Decca station - Big & small antennas X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, This weekend, I am hoping to make another expedition to the Puckeridge Decca station, which has been made available again through the good offices of G3JKV and the Crawley club. The main motive for this expedition is to do some back-to-back comparisons between a big antenna (the 100m Decca mast) and a small, amateur-type antenna (an inverted L about 9m high and 50m long). The idea is to set the antenna currents so that the same effective radiated power should be obtained from both antennas, and then see how signal strengths compare. There has been some vigorous debate lately about the advantages and disadvantages of big and small antennas, with some holding the view that big antennas have superior radiation patterns to small ones, and some holding the opposite is true. The aim of the experiment is to put this to a practical test. We did this before during the previous trip to Puckeridge, but due to time pressures and the dreadful weather, relatively little operating was done using the two antenna setup. The results then were that the two antennas gave roughly the same results, when transmitter power was set for same ERP from each antenna (this meant feeding about 500W into the small antenna, and less than 0.5W into the main mast!). For this weekend, I have put together a tuner/attenuator circuit that will hopefully allow changing between the antennas with a single switch, making the comparison much quicker and more direct. I am hoping this will enable lots more people to take part. The level of ERP will be very roughly 100mW for both antennas. The plan for the weekend is roughly this: Friday evening - Install gear Saturday morning - get working, and obtain comparative reports. Later on Saturday - run station at 1W ERP from main antenna Sunday - open to suggestions; I have notified RA in case anyone would like to try 73kHz QSO's. Sunday afternoon - pack up and go home. Due to this being a small-scale expedition, I will probably stick to normal CW, but might be prevailed upon to drag my PC across a field if people are really keen to hear some QRSS....... Of course, nothing ever goes entirely according to plan, but it should be fun. Any QSO's, listener reports or measurements would be welcome. If you have any suggestions, please let me know. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18642 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 11:57:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 11:57:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s2Le-0001RE-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 12:50:46 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s2Lb-0001R9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 12:50:43 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #35) id 12s2Kn-0002QW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 12:49:54 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.4.R) for ; Wed, 17 May 2000 12:33:15 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 12:33:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: CFH... why wait for winter? In-reply-to: X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: DF6NM wrote: > yesterday night, the qrn seemed to be fairly moderate, so I decided to > start spectrogram at 22:00 UT (5513 Hz, 512 pts, 30 s dwell, 128 averages, > resolution bandwidth with windowing appr. 14 Hz). In the morning, I was > quite surprised to see a fat trace of CFH 137.0 kHz beginning at > 00:10. Yes, I have noticed that CFH has often been S9 after 0000UTC in the last two weeks. I suffer from insomnia from time to time, but one bonus is that I am able to check signals in the night. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3219 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 12:24:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 12:24:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s2ml-0001dM-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 13:18:47 +0100 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s2mN-0001d4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 13:18:23 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12s2lt-0001j2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 13:17:53 +0100 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.4.R) for ; Wed, 17 May 2000 13:10:42 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 13:10:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: New e-mail address X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I have just changed my ISP to save money (a service that's totally free - even the phone calls - has finally tempted me away from Demon)! Note that my new home e-mail address is: mike.dennison@ntlworld.com The work address remains the same. My web pages will change soon, too, but I will announce when they are ready. Mike From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28879 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 12:32:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 12:32:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s2tt-0001hP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 13:26:09 +0100 Received: from beach.silcom.com ([199.201.128.19]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s2ts-0001hK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 13:26:08 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from silcom.com (pm8-28.sba1.avtel.net [207.71.222.178]) by beach.silcom.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5CB01457CB for ; Wed, 17 May 2000 05:25:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <39228FB3.E743177E@silcom.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 05:25:23 -0700 From: "William H Lake" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF power amplifiers References: <29.528cc93.26524508@aol.com> <3921D32E.64205628@slonet.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Well Said!!!!!!! Bill Cliff Buttschardt wrote: > Screw that AOL!!! John, these damn fool people out to prove > that the silliest error on the part of the "subscriber" is the > guy that is paying the bill. I have learned to hate that > fool outfit. Us "normal" people just can not contend with AOL > or any other outfit that thinks their feces does not stink!!! > Cliff K7RR From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26542 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 13:59:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 13:59:33 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s4FQ-0002Od-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 14:52:28 +0100 Received: from gate3.oss.akzonobel.nl ([192.87.3.7]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s4FN-0002OR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 14:52:25 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from fwmaster@localhost) by gate3.oss.akzonobel.nl (8.9.1a/8.6.12) id PAA26950; Wed, 17 May 2000 15:51:17 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gate3.oss.akzonobel.nl via smap (V1.3) id sma026502; Wed, 17 May 00 15:50:41 +0200 Received: by ras1.oss.akzonobel.nl with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 17 May 2000 15:50:41 +0200 Message-ID: <81B84E03FF6FD21197060000F87B128701ED6174@capella2.oss.akzonobel.nl> From: "Laken, W.H.P.A. van der \(Wil\)" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org, pa0pdo@amsat.org Subject: LF: Weekend report PI4OSS Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 15:50:39 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Last weekend 13/14 May, I had the opportunity to work a few hours from a windmill in my home town Oss. The (club)callsign was PI4OSS, the locator JO21ss Power abt 400 Watts Aerial: single wire combined with the lightning protection wiring. (Highest point 36 meters over streetlevel) see: Webpage ON7YD - "Using a non isolated antenna tower as LF-antenna" option 2 I used a transformer (GW4ALG design) to connect the coax to the aerial on the 'cold' side of the coil. Stations worked (standard cw only) 13/05 18:21UTC DF7VX 559 559 ON4ZK 599 599 G3KEV 579 589 PA0MJK 579 599 GW4ALG 569 579 G3XTZ 569 579 G3LDO 469 569 DL3FDO 469 559 ON7YD 589 599 DQ0KBM 599 599 2155 UTC MM0ALM 579 559 14/05 0700 UTC G4GVC 579 599 PA0SE 599 599 tnx Dick for S9+13dB rprt DK8KW 599 599 tnx Geri for 85 dBu rprt ON7YD 599 599 G3AQC 579 589 G3OLB 569 579 DJ7RD 559 579 GW4HXO 459 579 DL1SAN 569 579 OZ1KMR 579 559 OK1DTN 459 549 G3BDQ 569 579 0944 UTC SM6PXJ 559 549 QSL cards will be send as soon as I have my station up and running again at home ;-) Sorry but I did not have the opportunity to send a message to the reflector. 73 Wil (PA0BWL) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 949 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 15:35:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 15:35:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s5cM-00036V-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 16:20:14 +0100 Received: from cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.173]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s5cI-00036Q-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 16:20:10 +0100 Received: from modem-203.eldalie.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.180.203] helo=lvm) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12s5bw-00014t-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 16:19:49 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfc013$808b7d00$cbb4883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. Big and small Antennas. Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 16:20:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi James,
Great that you are going to do some real comparitive tests.I think that this will be  very useful. I hope that as many as possible will join in so that radiation at various  distances can be checked. I will certainly be around on Saturday.Have a good weekend.73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24321 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 16:26:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 16:26:51 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s6V1-0003Zm-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 17:16:43 +0100 Received: from smtp11.bellglobal.com ([204.101.251.53]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s6Uz-0003Zf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 17:16:41 +0100 Received: from server1 (ppp122.on.bellglobal.com [206.172.245.122]) by smtp11.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA11171 for ; Wed, 17 May 2000 12:22:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <006e01bfc01a$94e9dba0$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Torroid information Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 11:39:47 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Greetings All: I have four large toroids that were bought some years ago by a chap for use in amateur radio. I came into them after he passed on. They are labeled 144T500 - 3C5. I have seen somewhere on the many LF pages a reference to a material type "3C5", so I am asking if anyone can tell me about the characteristics of these devices. Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20401 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 17:52:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 17:52:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s7h9-00048S-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 18:33:19 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo18.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.8]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s7h7-00048I-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 18:33:18 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo18.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.30.5388539 (16789) for ; Wed, 17 May 2000 13:32:23 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <30.5388539.265431a7@aol.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 13:32:23 EDT Subject: Re: LF: Puckeridge Decca station - Big & small antennas To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 102 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: M0BMU writes: > There has been some vigorous debate lately about the advantages > and disadvantages of big and small antennas, with some holding > the view that big antennas have superior radiation patterns to small > ones, and some holding the opposite is true. The aim of the > experiment is to put this to a practical test. I don't recall that the debate was principally about radiation patterns of big versus small antennas, as such. Even a 100m mast is electrically small at these frequencies, and would have no different pattern from a 10m mast. It appears that what you will actually be testing is the difference in radiation patterns between an exclusively vertical radiator and one with a significant horizontal component, is it not? > The idea is to set the antenna currents so that the same > effective radiated power should be obtained from both antennas, > and then see how signal strengths compare. How will you be determining effective radiated power? Isn't ERP pretty much _defined_ in terms of field strength? 73, John KD4IDY From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9223 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 18:24:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 18:24:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s8OD-0004TN-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 19:17:49 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s8OC-0004TI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 19:17:48 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 ([151.25.131.5]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA32233 for ; Wed, 17 May 2000 20:17:17 +0200 Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 20:17:17 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000517191425.00920cf0@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Wed, 17 May 2000 19:17:11 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: Spectran beta 3 - IK1ODO beacon running (2mW) In-reply-to: <3.0.1.16.20000517081237.2d0f5b34@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Riferimenti: <4.1.20000516201903.01688de0@mailer.inrete.it> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In 13.49 17/05/00 , hai scritto: >Hello Marco & group, > >I'm sorry but it was absolute impossible to look for the 2mW signal last >night. >I started looking at 19.30UT (as nomally Marco's signal becomes vissible >here after 20UT), but at abt. 20UT I had to stop because of thunderstorm, >not only because QRN became really bad (S-meter at 9+++ all the time) but >also for safety as the lightning was just above my QTH. >In case your beacon is still running I will give it another try tonight. > >73, Rik ON7YD > It's still running, I'm not going to Dayton :-((( ... so I will leave it on for a few days. (Frequency synthesizer + PC + low power supply + PA supply = abt 200W to radiate 2 mW ... I will send the next electricity bill to the list address !) 73, Marco IK1ODO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16963 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 19:53:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 19:53:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s9dv-00056p-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 20:38:07 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s9di-00056i-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 20:37:54 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.222.197] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12s9cz-0004xC-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 19:37:10 +0000 Message-ID: <3922E5EB.A2799102@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 18:33:15 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Puckeridge Decca station - Big & small antennas References: <28528.200005171129@gemini> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: James Moritz wrote: > Dear LF Group, > > This weekend, I am hoping to make another expedition to the > Puckeridge Decca station, which has been made available again > through the good offices of G3JKV and the Crawley club. > > The main motive for this expedition is to do some back-to-back > comparisons between a big antenna (the 100m Decca mast) and a > small, amateur-type antenna (an inverted L about 9m high and 50m > long). The large mast is vertical and the smaller inv L is more horizontal than vertical. So your comparison between the two antennas will not be valid. To my knowledge no one in the past has disputed that a large and small vertical would have the same radiation PATTERN. What has been said is that the intensity of the signal radiated from a large vertical is greater than a short one. On receive the signal voltage collected by a large vertical is greater than the small vertical. One must be precise and accurate when making comparisons. Some observations in the past round up or down to the nearest 6 db. One must realise that represents a significant power difference on transmit not to mention receive. There will be other factors to consider between the antennas like tx signal take off angles, also the response on receive for each antenna to high or low angles of signal arrival. Then comes the ground radial systems for each, they must be separate and identical and each antenna must be located far enough away from the other to avoid coupling. If all the above factors are not met then it would be a useless exercise. G3KEV > The idea is to set the antenna currents so that the same > effective radiated power should be obtained from both antennas, > and then see how signal strengths compare. > > There has been some vigorous debate lately about the advantages > and disadvantages of big and small antennas, with some holding > the view that big antennas have superior radiation patterns to small > ones, and some holding the opposite is true. The aim of the > experiment is to put this to a practical test. We did this before > during the previous trip to Puckeridge, but due to time pressures > and the dreadful weather, relatively little operating was done using > the two antenna setup. The results then were that the two > antennas gave roughly the same results, when transmitter power > was set for same ERP from each antenna (this meant feeding > about 500W into the small antenna, and less than 0.5W into the > main mast!). > > For this weekend, I have put together a tuner/attenuator circuit that > will hopefully allow changing between the antennas with a single > switch, making the comparison much quicker and more direct. I am > hoping this will enable lots more people to take part. The level of > ERP will be very roughly 100mW for both antennas. > > The plan for the weekend is roughly this: > Friday evening - Install gear > Saturday morning - get working, and obtain comparative reports. > Later on Saturday - run station at 1W ERP from main antenna > Sunday - open to suggestions; I have notified RA in case anyone > would like to try 73kHz QSO's. > Sunday afternoon - pack up and go home. > > Due to this being a small-scale expedition, I will probably stick to > normal CW, but might be prevailed upon to drag my PC across a > field if people are really keen to hear some QRSS....... > > Of course, nothing ever goes entirely according to plan, but it > should be fun. Any QSO's, listener reports or measurements would > be welcome. If you have any suggestions, please let me know. > > Cheers, Jim Moritz > 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7972 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 20:59:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 20:59:07 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sAnH-0005gr-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 21:51:51 +0100 Received: from mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.15]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sAnF-0005gd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 21:51:50 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [202.27.178.43] by mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000517205033.METT14913386.mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz@[202.27.178.43]> for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 08:50:33 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <39230191.5B28@xtra.co.nz> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 08:31:13 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Puckeridge Decca station - Big & small antennas References: <28528.200005171129@gemini> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: James Moritz wrote: snip > The main motive for this expedition is to do some back-to-back > comparisons between a big antenna (the 100m Decca mast) and a > small, amateur-type antenna (an inverted L about 9m high and 50m > long). The idea is to set the antenna currents so that the same > effective radiated power should be obtained from both antennas, > and then see how signal strengths compare. > > There has been some vigorous debate lately about the advantages > and disadvantages of big and small antennas, with some holding > the view that big antennas have superior radiation patterns to small > ones, and some holding the opposite is true. The aim of the > experiment is to put this to a practical test. We did this before > during the previous trip to Puckeridge, but due to time pressures > and the dreadful weather, relatively little operating was done using > the two antenna setup. The results then were that the two > antennas gave roughly the same results, when transmitter power > was set for same ERP from each antenna (this meant feeding > about 500W into the small antenna, and less than 0.5W into the > main mast!). I think it was also raised before, but for doing such a test you should have a convincing way of showing that mutual coupling to the big mast is not swamping the result of transmitting from the small antenna. A simple additional experiment could be to transmit on the small antenna, with the big mast "floating", and then short the base of the big mast to ground, and see what happens to far field readings. 73, Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21489 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 20:59:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 20:59:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sAnC-0005gk-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 21:51:46 +0100 Received: from mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.15]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sAnB-0005gc-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 21:51:45 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [202.27.178.43] by mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000517205024.MERZ14913386.mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz@[202.27.178.43]> for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 08:50:24 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3922FF81.117F@xtra.co.nz> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 08:22:25 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF power amplifiers References: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01AB8C46@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Talbot Andrew wrote: snip > > In the early days of 73kHz I tried this approach, but the high Q > > output network was too prone to destroying devices when mistuned, and > > particularly when the antenna went off resonance. The ultimate design > > was a half bridge circuit running off 340 Volt rectified mains, output > > transformer and C/L tank using an air wound inductor rather than > > conventional Pi filter. For a time it delivered 700 Watts into a > > dummy load of multiple 150W light bulbs quite happily - until I keyed > > the circuit a few times. Remember what the resistance of light bulbs > > are when cold and the current surges when switched on. There is a lot > > of energy in 1000uF of capacitors charged to 340V. Never did like CW > > ! After blowing four IRF450 fets spectacularly plus two bridge > > driver chips I decided this was rather dangerous and kept with > > conventional class B designs from then on. I also experimented with a bridge circuit (a modification of a surplus SMPS, but not using rectified mains). I had a "blow up" and it took out all four MOSFETs. In earlier days for LF transmitting I tried using a DC coupled Clas AB audio amplifier but with replacement "fast" bipolar transistors, and when that blew it took out four transistors (including drivers) and some time probing around to confirm the extent of failed transistors in the DC coupled circuit. Of the several n+n pushpull LF amplifiers I have made, using transformer coupling for input and output, when there has been a failure it is usually one transistor breaking down, so it is easy to diagose and relatively cheap to restore. Using suitable varistors across each side of the pushpull stage is a prudent precaution to protect against transient spikes, and at LF the capacitance of the varistor is negligible. 73, Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28571 invoked from network); 17 May 2000 21:49:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2000 21:49:05 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sBXz-00065s-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 22:40:07 +0100 Received: from d12lmsgate-2.de.ibm.com ([195.212.91.200]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sBXw-00065O-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 17 May 2000 22:40:04 +0100 Received: from d12relay02.de.ibm.com (d12relay02.de.ibm.com [9.165.215.23]) by d12lmsgate-2.de.ibm.com (1.0.0) with ESMTP id XAA166710 for ; Wed, 17 May 2000 23:39:05 +0200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from usa.net (lig32-239-128-226.emea.lig-dial.ibm.com [32.239.128.226]) by d12relay02.de.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id XAA106760 for ; Wed, 17 May 2000 23:39:05 +0200 Message-ID: <3923111D.44CA8F68@usa.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 23:37:33 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" Organization: Undisclosed X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Reception of IK1ODO 2 mW beacon References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I have put an image of the reception of Marco's 2 mW beacon at the URL : http://www.weaksignals.com/images/ik1odo_a_2mw.gif QRN was rather high, S9 with frequent static crashes going up to S9+30 dB The reception is fairly good, but then the QRB between Marco and me is not much high, abt. 200 km. The image seems upside down, with the space at the highest frequency, as I set the RX to LSB, to prevent the strong QRM from DCF39. 73 Alberto I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26212 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 08:04:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 08:04:17 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sLAR-0002Iy-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 08:56:27 +0100 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sLAO-0002Ir-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 08:56:24 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id JAA66990 for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 09:55:57 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000518095137.2dc7e106@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 09:51:37 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Torroid information In-reply-to: <006e01bfc01a$94e9dba0$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: '3C5' is a 'Philips-like' code for ferrite material, but I cannot find it anywhere in my lists. Larry (and others) : I have information on Philips ferrite materials (specifications, material grades, application notes etc..) as PDF files. It's all together about 500kB. Just send me a short notice by e-mail in case you want it. 73, Rik ON7YD At 11:39 17/05/00 -0400, you wrote: >Greetings All: > >I have four large toroids that were bought some years ago by a chap for use >in amateur radio. I came into them after he passed on. They are labeled >144T500 - 3C5. I have seen somewhere on the many LF pages a reference to a >material type "3C5", so I am asking if anyone can tell me about the >characteristics of these devices. > >Larry >VA3LK > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14097 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 08:45:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 08:45:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sLoe-0002e8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 09:38:00 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sLod-0002e3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 09:37:59 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id KAA162070 for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 10:37:37 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000518103317.2eff836a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 10:33:17 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Puckeridge Decca station - Big & small antennas In-reply-to: <3922E5EB.A2799102@netscapeonline.co.uk> References: <28528.200005171129@gemini> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: On 17/05/00 G3KEV wrote: >To my knowledge no one in the past has disputed that a large and small >vertical would have the same radiation PATTERN. What has been said is >that the intensity of the signal radiated from a large vertical is >greater than a short one. On receive the signal voltage collected by a >large vertical is greater than the small vertical. On 17/01/00 G3KEV wrote : >There is a big difference in the radiation pattern and angle of take off >between a high vertical antenna and a very low antenna given the same rf >power to the antenna. 1 Watt erp from a dummy load or low horizontal wire >is hardly the same as 1 Watt erp from a vertical antenna at 120 ft. Did I miss(understand) something ? 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17960 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 08:54:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 08:54:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sLyb-0002jU-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 09:48:17 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sLya-0002jP-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 09:48:16 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #35) id 12sLxm-0004j8-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 09:47:26 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.4.R) for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 09:35:25 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 09:35:24 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Puckeridge Decca station - Big & small antennas In-reply-to: <30.5388539.265431a7@aol.com> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > How will you be determining effective radiated power? Isn't ERP pretty > much _defined_ in terms of field strength? > > 73, > John KD4IDY > Of course. But the reason for doing such experiments is that, believe it or not, there are those who argue that 1W ERP from a bigger antenna is better than 1W ERP from a smaller one. Mike Dennison, G3XDV Publications Manager * RadCom * Ham Radio Today * GB2RS News * * RSGB Books and CDs * Radio Society of Great Britain Lambda House, Cranborne Road Potters Bar, Herts UK, EN6 3JE Tel: +44 (0) 1707 659015; Fax: +44 (0) 1707 645105 RSGB - UK AMATEUR RADIO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29330 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 10:16:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 10:16:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sNEL-0003Nu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 11:08:37 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sNE4-0003Np-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 11:08:21 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id MAA390884 for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:07:56 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000518120335.2e073d14@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 12:03:35 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Spectran beta 3 - IK1ODO beacon running (2mW) In-reply-to: <4.1.20000517191425.00920cf0@mailer.inrete.it> References: <3.0.1.16.20000517081237.2d0f5b34@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I could copy Marco's 2mW beacon, a lot of QSB and QRN made it difficult at times (DCF39 had also a lot of QSB and was -10 to -15dB on normal most of the evening. On a quiet winter night it should be a solid 'O' copy. 73, Rik At 20:17 17/05/00 +0200, you wrote: >It's still running, I'm not going to Dayton :-((( ... so I will leave it on for >a few >days. > >(Frequency synthesizer + PC + low power supply + PA supply = abt 200W >to radiate 2 mW ... I will send the next electricity bill to the list address >!) > >73, Marco IK1ODO > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3185 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 10:25:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 10:25:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sNOs-0003T1-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 11:19:30 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sNOp-0003Sw-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 11:19:28 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id LAA11101 for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 11:19:05 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk Message-ID: <2000051810113968199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 10:11:39 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: LF receivers Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit I am working on the Receiver chapter for the LF book. I have a good introduction written by John 4GVC (with a description of the TS850, which caused many of us, including myself, to go this route) but would like to bring it up to date in the light of your collective experience. While I was up at Crawley I found that Derek was using the 990 to good effect. What is your favorite receiver and how does it compare with others that you might have tried? -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20795 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 11:07:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 11:07:14 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sO2C-0003lk-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:00:08 +0100 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sO2A-0003lf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:00:07 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id MAA346984 for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:59:43 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000518125523.089f7bc2@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 12:55:23 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF receivers In-reply-to: <2000051810113968199@zetnet.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: For what it is worth : I use a Kenwood TS440 on LF, sensitivity is OK and if the internal 20dB attenuator is used the IM behaviour is very good (using my 'big' antenna for reception). 73, Rik ON7YD At 10:11 18/05/00 +0100, you wrote: >I am working on the Receiver chapter for the LF book. I have a good >introduction written by John 4GVC (with a description of the TS850, >which caused many of us, including myself, to go this route) but >would like to bring it up to date in the light of your collective >experience. While I was up at Crawley I found that Derek was using >the 990 to good effect. >What is your favorite receiver and how does it compare with others >that you might have tried? > > >-- >Regards, Peter, G3LDO > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26069 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 11:12:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 11:12:04 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sO74-0003s4-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:05:10 +0100 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sO73-0003rz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:05:09 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id NAA479502 for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 13:04:47 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000518130027.2217cc8e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 13:00:27 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: another country active ? In-reply-to: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Just saw this on the OH2AQ (DX summit) cluster : RU3PX-@ 136.6 UA3APU rst is 449 0618 17 May 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10562 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 11:24:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 11:24:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sOIU-0003y8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:16:58 +0100 Received: from cyb01.axime.com ([160.92.120.38] helo=cybv01.axime.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sOIP-0003xm-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:16:53 +0100 Received: from MARC ([213.36.34.80]) by cybv01.axime.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with SMTP id FUR5YD00.3AY for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 13:15:49 +0200 Message-ID: <002301bfc0ba$6bdda0c0$0600a8c0@MARC> From: "mv tsi" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: IK1ODO beacon Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 13:15:16 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Group,
I can copy Marco beacon in spite of QRN and LORAN C.
(20 :00 to 21:00 UTC). How mW ERP?
I used Spectran last version. ( Thanks Alberto )
This week end I'll update my site with wave  files and pictures.
73
Marc F5MAF
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12596 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 11:54:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 11:54:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sOlk-0004CC-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:47:12 +0100 Received: from public2.thorcom.com ([212.172.148.20] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sOlj-0004C7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:47:11 +0100 Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by public2.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sOlL-0007V2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:46:48 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id MAA14083; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:47:19 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 30948 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 12:39:32 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 12:39:32 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id MAA25604; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:41:13 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma025561; Thu, 18 May 00 12:40:40 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:48:17 +0100 Received: by frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Thu, 18 May 2000 12:42:09 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01AB8C4A@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: LF receivers Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 12:42:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I use a Racal RA1792. Gradually becoming available on the surplus market now, at prices coming down from 'silly'. They started at Ł1000 a few years ago but are now appearing at Ł400- Ł500 and ought to drop further as G_HQ and the coastal radio stations get rid of their huge stocks. Designed in the late 1970's and used throughout the 80's, biggest users were military / government organisations, and commercial ones such as marine coastal radio stations. An excellent HF receiver with frequency coverage from sub-10kHz to 30 MHz, IF filters down to 300Hz as standard, and the essential separate BFO control for setting the CW tone as well as SSB modes - plus AM and FM. Tuning is by knob or keypad entry, and 100 memories are available which store the complete receiver settings of filter bandwidth, BFO setting as well as the frequency. Short and long-hang AGC is selectable with manual backoff, plus fully manual control over 90dB range with a single knob. AGC voltage is available on a rear connector, which could be used for example for logging purposes. Rear panel line level outputs at 1mW are perfect for feeding directly into Soundcards or DSP systems with a 600 ohm terminating resistor. The second IF, where most of the filtering is done, is at 455kHz and an external output is usually available at this frequency for external processing. Circuits etc. are well documented (at least if you get the proper Racal manual), with large size conventional leaded component PCBs, ideal for 'amateur' modifications. Most importantly for my purposes, all internal frequencies are generated from the one reference oscillator, which can be fed in externally at 1, 5 or 10 MHz. The main downside is 10Hz tuning steps, although I believe later models do allow 1Hz steps. Another it its weight - about 20kg - and the fact that remote control (if available) uses a non standard serial data format even worse than the many amateur rig standards. ............................... For a really top flight receiver (for lottery winners perhaps ?), consider the Watkins Johnson WJ8711. This is a modern digital receiver for near DC to 30MHz, with just about every filtering function ever wanted available; 66 IF bandwidths from 56Hz to 16kHz plus other DSP functions. The receiver is ridiculously priced in the UK, and is subject to US export controls (it is considered to be a Munition, believe it or not !! ) but Lowe do (did ?) sell a 'commercial' re-badged version, which as far as I can see is near enough identical but costs even more. I won't quote a price as it has probably changed from when we bought the proper WJ one for work three years ago, but look at "similar to a top of the range amateur HF transceiver" US operators may well find it is considerably cheaper over there. Andy G4JNT > ---------- > From: Peter Dodd[SMTP:g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk] > Reply To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Sent: 2000-05-18 10:11 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: LF: Re: LF receivers > > I am working on the Receiver chapter for the LF book. I have a good > introduction written by John 4GVC (with a description of the TS850, > which caused many of us, including myself, to go this route) but > would like to bring it up to date in the light of your collective > experience. While I was up at Crawley I found that Derek was using > the 990 to good effect. > What is your favorite receiver and how does it compare with others > that you might have tried? > > > -- > Regards, Peter, G3LDO > > > > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution,o r any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25852 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 12:17:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 12:17:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sP7l-0004Ne-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 13:09:57 +0100 Received: from kerberos.telecom.cz ([194.228.2.35] helo=mail.core.telecom.cz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sP7h-0004NX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 13:09:53 +0100 Received: from dell1.cz.gmc.net ([194.228.225.18]) by mail.core.telecom.cz (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA20454 for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 14:09:26 +0200 Received: from p (p.maly.cz.gmc.net [192.168.1.35]) by dell1.cz.gmc.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id KSG6KCCV; Thu, 18 May 2000 14:10:30 +0200 Message-ID: <00a201bfc0c2$0ff89140$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> From: "Petr Maly" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <2000051810113968199@zetnet.co.uk> Subject: LF: Re: Re: LF receivers Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 14:10:30 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I used IC-751A till now. I mind that it has scale with resolution of 100 Hz and tuning step 10 Hz - too imprecise for LF. When we describe our receivers, we mostly talk about antenna input, LPF and a first mixer. But mind that these transceivers have 1st IF on fq around 70 MHz (unnecessarily too high) with 15 kHz wide filter (and no chance to change this). It means that strong signals like DCF39 go thru all the 1st IF amplifier as far as to the 2nd mixer and the first x-tall filter in the 2nd IF without any attenuation. This leads me to think that this is wrong by conception and I decided to desing my own special RX for this band. 73, Petr, OK1FIG ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter Dodd To: Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2000 11:11 AM Subject: LF: Re: LF receivers > I am working on the Receiver chapter for the LF book. I have a good > introduction written by John 4GVC (with a description of the TS850, > which caused many of us, including myself, to go this route) but > would like to bring it up to date in the light of your collective > experience. While I was up at Crawley I found that Derek was using > the 990 to good effect. > What is your favorite receiver and how does it compare with others > that you might have tried? > > > -- > Regards, Peter, G3LDO > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14607 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 12:54:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 12:54:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sPj4-0004hF-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 13:48:30 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sPj1-0004h5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 13:48:28 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12sPiY-00003Q-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 13:47:58 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <6048.200005181247@gemini> From: "James Moritz" Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 13:54:45 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Puckeridge Experiments X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, Glad to see my intended experiments are generating some interest. At the moment, my main priority is to get everything up to Puckeridge in working order, which is quite an effort, but here are some further details of what I hope to do, and the point of doing it: The inverted L antenna will be located 130m from the main mast, off the main ground system and with it's own ground spikes. The coax feeder will run to the base of the mast, but will be decoupled using a common-mode choke. The main antenna will be grounded while the inverted L is transmitting. This should ensure the two antennas have the least coupling possible whilst still being on the same site. It will be possible to monitor RF current flowing in the main mast while transmitting from the small antenna, so that the degree of coupling can be assesed. It should be possible also to try the main antenna 'floating', or resonated. ERP will be calculated on the basis of estimated radiation resistance and measured antenna current for each antenna. For the inv. L this should be about 20 milliohms and 2A, for the main mast about 0.7 ohms and 0.34A, both giving about 80mW radiated power in theory. Final adjustments will be done based on the actual current that can be achieved on the day into the small antenna. By definition, two transmitters/antennas giving the same ERP will yield the same signal strengths at equal distances. But a number of things may modify the actual ERP obtained, in comparison with the calculated figure: i) The effects of the environment around the antenna - eg. houses, trees, could absorb some of the radiated signal - is not taken into account in simple calculations of ERP. ii) Different sizes of antennas may have different radiation patterns - some have suggested that small antennas have predominantly high angle radiation, which does not propagate usefully for DX communication. Theory says that this should not be a significant factor unless the antenna is a large percentage of a wavelength high, which even 100m isn't, at 136kHz. iii)There are also other factors that may play a part, such as penetration of the EM field into the ground, and radiation of horizontaly polarised signals, which may affect field strength at a distance. Having a large commercial antenna and a small amateur antenna at the same location, in the same environment, gives a simple way of testing whether the theory as applied to large, commercial antennas is also valid for the 'wet string' antennas that amateurs have to use. This is important both from the regulatory viewpoint (are you exceeding the 1W limit?) and the communications viewpoint (just how much signal are you putting out?). Measurements by myself and others suggest that most of the time, signal strengths are down on what would be expected from theory. Equipment details: TX: 0-350W, VFO + Mosfet PA RX: Homebrew superhet Creaking 386 laptop for beacon and QRSS keying - no receive software. 2 Tuners - 1 with motorised tuning for remote control of small antenna, one with power attenuator for main antenna. Sundry test gear for setting up and checking purposes - frequency counter, selective voltmeter, RF ammeters etc. 1.5kW Generator Since it is a one-man effort, I expect to have my hands full, and am not sure what it will be possible to accomplish. However, the main thing will be to get plenty of comparative reports. Field strength measurements would also be very useful. I hope to also put out some beacon signals, probably during Saturday evening, with 3 configurations, ie. inv. L antenna, 80mW ERP, main antenna, 80mW ERP, main antenna 1W ERP, perhaps around 137.2 - 137.3 kHz. I can't leave it on all night, mainly because the generator will have to be re-fuelled, but I'll do what I can - let me know if you have better ideas! Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16071 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 13:04:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 13:04:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sPsI-0004lW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 13:58:02 +0100 Received: from front7m.grolier.fr ([195.36.216.57]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sPsG-0004lR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 13:58:01 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from club-internet.fr (ppp-44-32-166.wmar.club-internet.fr [213.44.32.166]) by front7m.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id OAA20921 for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 14:57:07 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3923F6D1.72F9ABD6@club-internet.fr> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 14:58:08 +0100 From: "M & S" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: fr,fr,es-ES MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Web site Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi folks! Our (my wife and me) website is growing. We now have a LF chapter including the brand new French official text regarding the possibility for amateurs to use the 136 kHz band, and a short introduction to LF which is an excerpt from my article published in the French edition of CQ magazine. The text hasn't yet been translated in English, but this will be done soon. I'm also looking for URLs to get the "links" page together. Please send me your personal URL via private e-mail for me to include on our LF page. Photos, information and other details about my LF station are to come soon. 73, Mark, F6JSZ --- http://perso.club-internet.fr/sovergne From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26662 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 17:53:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 17:53:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sUHY-0006xA-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 18:40:24 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sUHQ-0006x2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 18:40:16 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as24-s16-146-49.cwci.net ([195.44.146.49] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sUH2-0004rw-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 17:39:53 +0000 Message-ID: <39241C34.9886E9E9@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 16:37:08 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Puckeridge Decca station - Big & small antennas References: <28528.200005171129@gemini> <3.0.1.16.20000518103317.2eff836a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik Strobbe wrote: > On 17/05/00 G3KEV wrote: > >To my knowledge no one in the past has disputed that a large and small > >vertical would have the same radiation PATTERN. What has been said is > >that the intensity of the signal radiated from a large vertical is > >greater than a short one. On receive the signal voltage collected by a > >large vertical is greater than the small vertical. > > On 17/01/00 G3KEV wrote : > >There is a big difference in the radiation pattern and angle of take off > >between a high vertical antenna and a very low antenna given the same rf > >power to the antenna. 1 Watt erp from a dummy Dummy load is the significant part of this statement because some low antennas including yours are but dummy loads. I am happy that you are saving a file of my observations. I kill all messages when read, otherwise I would need Tril a bytes of disk space to file all the message that I receive on email, mostly complimentary about my expriments and achievements on LF. There is the odd disagreement like yourself but I do understand the other mans point of view and do not get upset. Try and improve your signal Rik so that I can hear you properly and not have to use LAZY MANS CW. 73 de G3KEV > > load or low horizontal wire > >is hardly the same as 1 Watt erp from a vertical antenna at 120 ft. > > Did I miss(understand) something ? > > 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9581 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 18:22:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 18:22:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sUo4-0007FP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 19:14:00 +0100 Received: from kuku-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.63] helo=kuku.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sUo0-0007FK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 19:13:56 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by kuku.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000518173626.CKCC20902.kuku.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 10:36:26 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <1194379.958671386128.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 10:36:26 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF receivers MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 213.1.7.122 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Peter, Several of us are using the AOR7030 and are very pleased with it. Others that I know of are Vaino Lehtoranta OH2LX and Alan Melia G3NYK. Unfortunately I have no other rx to compare it with (other than a home brew Regenerative rx from the previous issue of the Source book), but Alan has. All I can say is that it performs superbly. Coverage is from Zero to 33 MHz, with 10Hz resolution. I know Vaino has done a lot of ICM (Luxemburg effect) monitoring with his. There are optional filters available. Mine is fitted with a 500Hz Collins filter, but there is also a 300Hz filter available. 73 John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23750 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 19:13:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 19:13:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sVdD-0007ee-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 20:06:51 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.92]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sVdA-0007eZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 20:06:48 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from alg.demon.co.uk ([194.222.171.80]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12sVco-000HPB-0Y for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 20:06:27 +0100 Message-ID: <39243F22.C8EB573A@alg.demon.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 21:06:10 +0100 From: "Steve Rawlings" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Torroid information References: <006e01bfc01a$94e9dba0$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Larry Kayser wrote: > I have four large toroids that were bought some years ago > by a chap for use in amateur radio. I came into them after he passed > on. They are labeled 144T500 - 3C5. I have seen somewhere on the > many LF pages a reference to a material type "3C5", so I am asking if > anyone can tell me about the characteristics of these devices. Sorry, as with Rik, I don't have any data on '3C5' material either. But, some time ago, Andre' N4ICK discovered the Philips URL at: http://www.acm.components.philips.com/pdf/ which includes data sheets for many materials, including 3C15 and 3C85 (but, I believe, not for 3C5). [By the way, if I had such a core here which I wanted to check out on LF, I would wind a 10-turn primary, and a 10-turn secondary winding on the core. I'd then fire up my LF TX (a robust pair of 572B valves) and deliver power into the primary, with a 50 ohm load on the secondary. By checking the power loss through the transformer (while monitoring, with some caution, its increase in temperature!), I'd try and gauge its usefulness in LF transformer applications.] Regards to all, Steve GW4ALG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28588 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 19:35:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 19:35:24 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sVdb-0007em-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 20:07:15 +0100 Received: from mail2.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.210]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sVda-0007eh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 20:07:14 +0100 Received: from modem-56.edoras.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.171.56] helo=lvm) by mail2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12sVdB-0003v2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 20:06:49 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfc0fc$613ad380$38ab883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. LF Recievers Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 20:07:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Peter,
Further to your request for info/experience with recievers ,I have tried several.The station here includes a 4 section BP filter(PA0SE design)modified for 137.I hope that this keeps big signals out of the front ends of my Rxs although DCF39 138.8 is a bit too close for comfort! This filter is followed by about 12db of gain since my Loop and EWE type ants have very low outputs.An emitter follower OP stage enables me to drive 2 or 3 Rxs.The main reciever is an old Icom IC781 which has 2 excellent 250Hz CW filters.Gain is more than adequate on 137 and the spectrum display is useful for keeping an eye on band noise but too wide for anything else.The 250Hz filters are very good but sometimes too wide so I can switch in a NIR-12 DSP filter which can go down to about 60Hz.There is very little ringing with this filter but I would like to try the optimal design by PA0LQ. For monitoring the band and for QRS and DFCW I use a Racal 1792.This an excellent reciever and I agree with the comments by Andy G4JNT but although mine has 1Hz tuning steps,search tuning is very difficult,so I leave it set to a fixed frequency and use Spectrogram or Spectran to display the band or part of it as required.I have also tried an Icom IC756 PRO which has very excellant digital filtering the 50Hz setting is quite useable under all conditions even with high QRN.The display of filter width and pass band tuning is very useful but again the spectrum display is not too useful although somewhat narrower than the 781.The big problem with this Rx is that is a bit deaf on 137 about 18db down on the old 781.
I hope these notes are of intrest.73s Laurie..
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25661 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 19:50:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 19:50:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sWCv-0007tq-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 20:43:45 +0100 Received: from cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.173]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sWCs-0007tg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 20:43:42 +0100 Received: from modem-141.erchamion.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.195.141] helo=lvm) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12sWCS-0003u5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 20:43:16 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfc101$78b32e40$8dc3883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. LF Recievers Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 20:43:29 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Further to my previous note I forgot to mention that the 781 tunes in 10Hz steps 2.5Khz per revolution of the knob wheras the 756  can be set to 1hz steps with 500 Hz per revolution! which is of course much better.So far as weak signals are concerned I could find no difference between the two recievers. 73s again Laurie.L
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13796 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 20:23:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 20:23:15 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sWZ9-000888-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 21:06:43 +0100 Received: from newmail.spectraweb.ch ([194.158.230.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sWZ8-000883-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 21:06:42 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from freesurf.ch (194.230.138.114) by newmail.spectraweb.ch for ; 18 May 2000 22:06:16 +0200 Message-ID: <39244D9A.DAF70832@freesurf.ch> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 22:07:54 +0200 From: "Toni" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [de] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en-US,en-GB,fr-FR MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF receivers References: <2000051810113968199@zetnet.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Peter, I'm using a Harris RF590 for LF reception, followed by a Timewave DSP-599zx. The Harris tunes from 10KHz up to 30MHz and is available on the surplus market. It was in widespread use in many US civil and military services and was made in the USA from 1982-1998. What I like is - the 1 Hz read out - the very good stability with the built in Oven (still within 1Hz after 2 years of service, without adjustment) - the slow tuning rate of 100 Hz for 1 turn of the VFO knob - the synthesized BFO tuning in 10Hz steps - the (adjustable) line out for the PC sound card The receiver is fitted with the automatic preselector option and has outstanding IMD and cross modulation immunity. There are different AGC settings (incl. OFF). Problems are: - IF blow by, due to insufficient blocking of the filter control circuit (can be modified) - Too large cw filter. Originally it was equipped with a 300 Hz filter - but at -3db! and this corresponds to a 500Hz -6dB filter as it is used in amateur transceivers (I have replaced it by an ICOM FL 53A (250Hz at -6dB)) - uncomfortable VFO knob (replaced by one of a WJ8888) The Timewave determines the audio BW and I'm using 35Hz most of time. The built in noise reduction algorithm works quite well and attenuates the worst static noise (no NB option in the Harris). As back up receiver I'm using an ICOM IC765. All what I hear on the Harris I can hear also with the ICOM. The ICOM has a very good NB but it is useless together with the narrow CW filters (250 Hz in both IF's). I'm using it also together with the Timewave DSP. 73 de Toni, HB2ASB Peter Dodd schrieb: > > I am working on the Receiver chapter for the LF book. I have a good > introduction written by John 4GVC (with a description of the TS850, > which caused many of us, including myself, to go this route) but > would like to bring it up to date in the light of your collective > experience. While I was up at Crawley I found that Derek was using > the 990 to good effect. > What is your favorite receiver and how does it compare with others > that you might have tried? > > -- > Regards, Peter, G3LDO > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18308 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 20:25:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 20:25:52 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sWib-0008Cs-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 21:16:29 +0100 Received: from fortune-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.203] helo=fortune.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sWia-0008Cl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 21:16:29 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by fortune.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000518200007.NTY8079.fortune.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 13:00:07 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <27715905.958680007022.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 13:00:07 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Puckeridge Decca station - Big & small antennas MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 213.1.29.174 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: You can't win Rik! Hi! John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15280 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 20:28:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 20:28:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sWnM-0008Dy-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 21:21:24 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sWnK-0008Dt-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 21:21:22 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 (ppp-20-72-215.libero.it [151.20.72.215]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA31837 for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 22:20:56 +0200 Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 22:20:56 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000518204626.020e5020@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Thu, 18 May 2000 20:52:24 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF receivers In-reply-to: <2000051810113968199@zetnet.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In 21.38 18/05/00 , hai scritto: >I am working on the Receiver chapter for the LF book. I have a good >introduction written by John 4GVC (with a description of the TS850, >which caused many of us, including myself, to go this route) but >would like to bring it up to date in the light of your collective >experience. While I was up at Crawley I found that Derek was using >the 990 to good effect. >What is your favorite receiver and how does it compare with others >that you might have tried? > > >-- >Regards, Peter, G3LDO > > > Racal 1792. - 1 Hz tuning step - high stability frequency reference, and all the synthesizers derived from the same 1 MHz signal - synthesized BFO - good AGC, excludible - good dynamic (abt 102 dB 3rd order IMD at 14 MHz, never measured at 137 kHz) - ample choice of filters - IF pass band tuning - no bells-and-whistles - easy to repair and/or modify [I'm not working for Racal, of course ...] 73, Marco IK1ODO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10557 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 20:28:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 20:28:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sWnC-0008Dq-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 21:21:14 +0100 Received: from gidora.zeta.org.au ([203.26.10.25]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sWn9-0008Dl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 21:21:12 +0100 Received: (qmail 13638 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 20:20:38 -0000 Received: from ppp158.dyn145.pacific.net.au (HELO steve) (210.23.145.158) by gidora.zeta.org.au with SMTP; 18 May 2000 20:20:38 -0000 Message-ID: <006901bfc106$e51fe320$0301a8c0@steve> From: "Steve Olney" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <28528.200005171129@gemini> <3.0.1.16.20000518103317.2eff836a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <39241C34.9886E9E9@netscapeonline.co.uk> Subject: Re: LF: Puckeridge Decca station - Big & small antennas Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 06:22:55 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: G'day Rik, ----- Original Message ----- From: g3kev > including yours are but dummy loads. I am happy that you are saving a file of > my observations. I kill all messages when read, Well that answer my questions! Confused, inconsistent posts which don't agree with themselves from this source are now explained. > bytes of disk space to file all the message that I receive on email, mostly > complimentary about my expriments and achievements on LF. There is the odd > disagreement like yourself but I do understand the other mans point of view > and do not get upset. Try and improve your signal Rik so that I can hear you > properly and not have to use LAZY MANS CW. > Crikey! What with the superior speed of the CW and this self-opinionated waffle it's a wonder the sender doesn't suffer from RSI. Although I am sure same can do one with one hand and the remainder with the other - simultaneously. Rik, I have setup my email to sort incoming (too many to do manually myself - although my system has no problem with storage) into various folders. One of the interesting things I have observed is how the posts from various sources align with my personal philosophy of life. I believe that making your way in life is like walking through a cow pasture - success and happiness comes from admiring and appreciating the daisies while being careful not to step in the cow pats. It is instructive to view the various folders as sorted. My assessment is that 99% are well balanced with an overwhelming predominance of daisies - while the 1% are grossly over-grazed with mostly just cow-pats (the daisies are there but mostly hidden by the abundance of cow pats). So Rik please continue to supply us with the daisies (or at least those who are here to learn from and enjoy the hobby) and don't be distracted by the odour of the over-grazed Lower Forty. I appreciate your positive contributions. 73s Steve Olney (VK2ZTO/AXSO - QF56IK : Lat -33 34 07, Long +150 44 40) ============================================= HomePage URLs: http://www.qsl.net/vk2zto http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg Containing:- Laser Comms DX LF Experimentation Amateur Radio Astronomy ============================================= From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9269 invoked from network); 18 May 2000 21:32:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2000 21:32:17 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sXhT-0000By-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 22:19:23 +0100 Received: from mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sXh4-0000Br-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 18 May 2000 22:19:22 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [202.27.181.42] by mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000518211747.XBFK11938930.mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz@[202.27.181.42]> for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 09:17:47 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <39245DAA.DA8@xtra.co.nz> Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 09:16:26 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Puckeridge Experiments References: <6048.200005181247@gemini> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Jim M0BMU, Thanks for the further information on the planned tests. With the spacing between big and small masts that you are intending to use, and with the "big" mast being much shorter than needed for natural resonance, I believe you will have tolerable mutual coupling effects. Resonating the big mast would maximise any on-site coupling when transmitting from the small antenna, and is probably worth testing out to assess interaction. Having the big mast "floating" likely gives least interaction, but again doing a practical test would yield results that narrow down the uncertainties and improve understandings of the punters regarding big/small comparisons. All the best for the day at Puckeridge. 73, Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7070 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 02:47:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 02:47:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12scfp-0002cU-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 03:38:01 +0100 Received: from tomts2.bellnexxia.net ([209.226.175.140] helo=tomts2-srv.bellnexxia.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12scfo-0002cO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 03:38:00 +0100 Received: from r980913 ([206.172.216.58]) by tomts2-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000519023702.JQOK25209.tomts2-srv.bellnexxia.net@r980913> for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 22:37:02 -0400 Message-ID: <008d01bfc13b$33b38ee0$3ad8acce@r980913> From: "Dave Goodwin VE2ZP/VE9CB" To: "137kHz" Subject: LF: News from Canada on 136KHz Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 22:37:36 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Canada is edging closer to a VLF Amateur allocation. To understand this bulletin, you should know that CARAB is the Canadian Amateur Radio Advisory Board, composed of employees of the Canadian radio regulatory agency (Industy Canada) and the national organisation representing hams, the Radio Amateurs of Canada. RAC Bulletin 00-048E Semi Annual CARAB meeting in Ottawa >From: RAC Headquarters > >Date: May 18, 2000 > >Subject: Semi Annual CARAB meeting in Ottawa. > >On April 27, 2000, RAC President Ken Oelke, VE6AFO Co-Chaired >the 14th Meeting of CARAB. In attendance were First Vice >President Ralph Webb, VE7OM, Vice President of Government and >International Affairs Ken Pulfer, VE3PU, Atlantic Director >William Gillis, VE1WG, Quebec Director Daniel Lamoureux, >VE2KA and Jim Dean, VE3IQ. Officials in attendance from >Industry Canada were Darius Breau, Manager, Operational >Policies, Radiocommunications and Broadcasting Regulatory >Branch, Tom Jones, Chief, Authorization and Harold >Carmichael, Program Manager, Certificates and Examinations, >Quebec Region. > >The following were hightlights of the meeting. >- RAC's request for a . . . VLF >allocation on 135.7 to 137.8 kHz, is still under review by >Industry Canada. > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1170 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 03:45:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 03:45:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sdWM-00033j-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 04:32:18 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sdWK-00033d-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 04:32:16 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo11.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v26.7.) id l.15.3ff24e7 (3966) for ; Thu, 18 May 2000 23:31:19 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <15.3ff24e7.26560f86@aol.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 23:31:18 EDT Subject: Re: LF: Puckeridge Experiments To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 102 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In a message dated 5/18/00 8:52:58 AM Eastern Daylight Time, j.r.moritz@herts.ac.uk writes: << ERP will be calculated on the basis of estimated radiation resistance and measured antenna current for each antenna. For the inv. L this should be about 20 milliohms and 2A, for the main mast about 0.7 ohms and 0.34A, both giving about 80mW radiated power in theory. By definition, two transmitters/antennas giving the same ERP will yield the same signal strengths at equal distances. But a number of things may modify the actual ERP obtained ... >> Please don't misunderstand my earlier inquiry, Jim. I think this experiment is worthwhile and may yield much useful experience. I'm just concerned about the seemingly rather casual use of the term ERP, and the tendency to equate it with power dispersed in radiation resistance. These are very different things. ERP _is_ actual ERP, and can only be actual ERP. That is, ERP is determined by actual field strength. It therefore already includes antenna and nearby environmental losses; hence, equal field strength is the only way to actually say the ERP of two systems are equal, not the power in the radiation resistance. (Measuring the signal out of two different systems with equal powers in the radiation resistance is instructive, of course, because it does permit one to compare the interaction of two different radiators with their environments. I take this to be your fundamental objective.) Someonce commented earlier--I was thinking it was Rik, although I can't find the post now--that there were those who believe that one watt ERP from one kind of antenna is better than one watt ERP from another kind. I got a good chuckle from that, but actually there is a certain grain of truth to the concept...particularly when the radio authorities set a maximum ERP limit on transmissions. This means that the field strength in ANY direction or elevation cannot exceed so many mv/m at so many km from the antenna. (Different administrations may choose to define the distance differently for their own regulatory purposes, and the corresponding field strength will vary inversely with that part of the definition.) The key words in the definition of maximum ERP, though, are usually "maximum field" in "any direction" from the antenna. I supervise a number of FM broadcast stations, by way of showing why this is significant. One has a maximum ERP of 100kw, yet covers less than half the geographical area of another one that also has a maximum ERP of 100kw, over similar terrain. Why? Because the former uses a directional antenna. The _maximum_ ERP is indeed 100kw in the main lobe, but is less in all other directions around the antenna than its omnidirectional counterpart. If any two given antennas have the same 1w ERP in the same direction, and it happens to be the direction you need to reach, then all is well. You have equal field strength...in that one direction. But, if that maximum 1w ERP happens to be in a less useful direction from one antenna (say, straight up) than the other, then yes, 1w ERP produced by one antenna can be different from 1w ERP produced by another! Neither any theory nor practice that I can find indicates two electrically short verticals (one roughly .004 wavelength and the other .04 wavelength, for instance) would produce any different radiation pattern. If you can force enough power through them to achieve the same ERP, it will be achieved in all directions, barring local obstructions. Your experiment, however, is not so much about big versus small, but between antennas of differing shapes. That's what I think is interesting: can amateurs make up for terrible inefficiency by directing their energy with other geometries? And if so, can it be done predictably, or will we always be imprisoned by trial and error? I'll be watching with keen interest. Good luck. 73, John KD4IDY From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15667 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 07:33:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 07:33:03 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sh9C-0004iD-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 08:24:38 +0100 Received: from ns1.swh.sk ([192.108.125.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sh94-0004i6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 08:24:33 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from hermes.swh.sk (hermes [195.41.64.129]) by ns1.swh.sk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA24673 for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 09:23:14 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from btss103a.swh.sk (btss103a.swh.sk [195.41.64.27]) by hermes.swh.sk (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id JAA09657 for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 09:23:08 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by btss103a.swh.sk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id <2MGT0BVB>; Fri, 19 May 2000 09:23:05 +0200 Message-ID: <29BDD4F529FCD311B631009027357C4E6804AE@btss103a.swh.sk> From: "Gasparik Richard" To: "Rsgb_Lf_Group \(E-mail\)" Subject: LF: Some pictures from Sitno... Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 09:23:03 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi LFers... I've put some pictures from my 136kHz activity from the telecomm tower Sitno (JN98KJ) on my web site. I'll try 136kHz from this QTH in september or october, during the VHF and UHF contest again...Pictures are available on http://www.qsl.net/om2tw in What's new ? (from 18.5.2000) directory. 73 de Rich OM2TW From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21993 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 07:59:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 07:59:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12shbX-0004w1-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 08:53:55 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12shbV-0004vw-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 08:53:53 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id IAA14215; Fri, 19 May 2000 08:57:07 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 26097 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 08:49:18 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 08:49:18 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id IAA01456; Fri, 19 May 2000 08:50:58 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma001422; Fri, 19 May 00 08:50:54 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 08:58:39 +0100 Received: by frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Fri, 19 May 2000 08:52:29 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01AB8C4D@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: LF receivers Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 08:52:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Marco et al .. I feel cheated - everyone else seems to have 1 Hz steps :-( By IF passband tuning, do you mean the use of the 1kHz and 300 Hz filters on SSB ? For a time before getting an IC746 transceiver, I used a homebrew LF to HF SSB transmitter exciter made by using the Local Oscillator and BFO outputs from the RA1792, then mixing in the reverse direction making use of identical 455 and 40.455MHz filters cannibalised from a scrap Rx. Andy G4JNT > ---------- > > From: M. Bruno[SMTP:spin@inrete.it] > Reply To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Sent: 2000-05-18 21:20 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF receivers > > Racal 1792. > > - 1 Hz tuning step > - high stability frequency reference, and all the synthesizers derived > from the > same 1 MHz signal > - synthesized BFO > - good AGC, excludible > - good dynamic (abt 102 dB 3rd order IMD at 14 MHz, never measured at > 137 kHz) > - ample choice of filters > - IF pass band tuning > - no bells-and-whistles > - easy to repair and/or modify > > [I'm not working for Racal, of course ...] > > 73, Marco IK1ODO > > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15223 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 08:45:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 08:45:09 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12siHH-0005HJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 09:37:03 +0100 Received: from tk1.ihug.co.nz ([203.29.160.13] helo=smtp1.ihug.co.nz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12siHC-0005HD-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 09:36:58 +0100 Received: from tractorb (p4-max8.chc.ihug.co.nz [209.77.128.196]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id UAA29080 for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 20:36:27 +1200 Message-ID: <007101bfc16d$448312e0$c4804dd1@tractorb> From: "Dave Brown" To: "rsgblf" References: <28528.200005171129@gemini> Subject: LF: Re: Puckeridge Decca station - Big & small antennas Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 20:35:55 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Jim Probably not this time, but a suggestion for perhaps next time you go to Puckeridge. I mentioned this to Derek Atter, after I saw the picture of the antenna, as a possibility for an interesting experimental comparison. Basically, as the antenna is set up, it appears to be a vertical elongated umbrella structure with the eight downwires or 'top loading' wires extended down nearly to ground level, quite close in to the mast proper. The reasons for this were explained on the reflector some time back. I am interested to know what the effect of temporarily connecting the bottom ends of all eight down wires back to the insulated tower base might be. The screening effect of all those down wires should be significant. By connecting them to the tower base they should then become part of a somewhat 'thicker' vertical structure with no downwire screening. I expect that you would then need more inductive loading, BUT it would be very interesting to see what the remote (ie far field) field strength did. Unless there is something very 'cunning' in the design of the antenna (which I doubt, given the history of the present day structure!) my guess is that it would go up, but I have no idea by how much. Just a thort! Good luck with the experiment this time. 73 Dave, ZL3FJ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15255 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 09:43:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 09:43:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sjDU-0005ko-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 10:37:12 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sjDQ-0005kj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 10:37:08 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id KAA05243 for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 10:36:46 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk Message-ID: <2000051909392568199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 09:39:25 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: LF receivers Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Andy said > I feel cheated - everyone else seems to have 1 Hz steps The TS-850 readout resolution is 10Hz. However the tuning appears 'smooth' between the digits. When I set the receiver for slow CW the receiver is set to 00137.00 upper sideband so that the Spectran frequency display reading is meaningful. From experience I have found that the receiver setting should just be at the point where 00136.99 changes over to 00137.00. 1Hz resolution would be nice. > By IF passband tuning, do you mean the use of the 1kHz and 300 Hz filters on SSB ? On the '850 there is a control called SLOPE TUNE which controls the passband of the IF using two controls - very useful. -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28086 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 11:39:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 11:39:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sl0a-0006eT-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 12:32:00 +0100 Received: from d06lmsgate.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sl0W-0006eJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 12:31:56 +0100 Received: from d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.148]) by d06lmsgate.uk.ibm.COM (1.0.0) with ESMTP id MAA28030 for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 12:20:28 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from usa.net (dyn9-87-116-182.italy.ibm.com [9.87.116.182]) by d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id MAA54560 for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 12:31:00 +0100 Message-ID: <39252596.D96A0B42@usa.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 13:29:26 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" Organization: Undisclosed X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF receivers References: <2000051909392568199@zetnet.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Peter Dodd wrote: > The TS-850 readout resolution is 10Hz. However the tuning appears > 'smooth' between the digits. When I set the receiver for slow CW the > [snip] What happens when you press the 'Fine' button on the numeric keypad ? Doesn't the tuning step go down to 1 Hz ? Time to dig out again the manual... 73, Alberto I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13833 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 17:58:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 17:58:40 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sqmz-0000M1-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 18:42:21 +0100 Received: from kuku-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.63] helo=kuku.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sqmx-0000Lt-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 18:42:19 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by kuku.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000519174147.EPTH27079.kuku.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 10:41:47 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <16548447.958758107528.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 10:41:47 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Puckeridge Decca station - Big & small antennas MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 213.1.6.218 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Dave, You wrote: >Basically, as the antenna is set up, it appears to be a vertical elongated >umbrella structure with the eight downwires or 'top loading' wires extended >down nearly to ground level, quite close in to the mast proper. The reasons >for this were explained on the reflector some time back. Perhaps I missed it, but I would be very interested to know why the umbrella ribs are extended so far. My calculations show that the optimum length of the ribs from the top is h(sqrt(1+n.sec(alpha))-1)/n, where h is the height of the mast and alpha is the angle of the ribs from the vertical, and n is the number of ribs, which for 10 degrees and 10 ribs (judging from the photo of the mast) is approx 23%. By optimum I mean the length which makes the Radiation Resistance a maximum. Of course that may not be the objective here. 73s John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10318 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 19:41:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 19:41:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ssYe-0000e4-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 20:35:40 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ssYc-0000dz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 20:35:38 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cel266 (ppp-20-78-130.libero.it [151.20.78.130]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA08753 for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 21:35:33 +0200 Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 21:35:33 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.1.20000519200926.011f9d30@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Fri, 19 May 2000 20:13:47 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF receivers In-reply-to: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01AB8C4D@pdw-mercury-1.der a.gov.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In 13.57 19/05/00 , Andy wrote: > >Marco et al .. > >I feel cheated - everyone else seems to have 1 Hz steps :-( Well, it is a software problem, the synthesizer IS CAPABLE of 1 Hz steps, but the software limits to 10 Hz. I can't explain why Racal decided that. But you may change the Eproms, of course. >By IF passband tuning, do you mean the use of the 1kHz and 300 Hz >filters on SSB ? Yes. About the RA1792 ... has anyone a source for spare LCDs, different from Racal itself ? Or, is anyone so close to Racal to give me any info on the real producer of those parts .... ? 73, Marco IK1ODO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15229 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 19:54:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 19:54:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sslb-0000gY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 20:49:03 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ssla-0000gT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 20:49:02 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id UAA27817 for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 20:48:54 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk Message-ID: <2000051919444368199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 19:44:43 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: LF receivers Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Alberto said > What happens when you press the 'Fine' button on the numeric keypad ? > Doesn't the tuning step go down to 1 Hz ? Time to dig out again the manual... I think the tuning step is 1Hz all the time. All the FINE control does is change the tuning rate of the tuning knob to the display. The display shows 10Hz resolution whatever you do - unless there is somthing I have missed. -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10471 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 20:46:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 20:46:28 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12stYf-0000p0-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 21:39:45 +0100 Received: from d12lmsgate.de.ibm.com ([195.212.91.199]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12stYe-0000os-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 21:39:44 +0100 Received: from d12relay02.de.ibm.com (d12relay02.de.ibm.com [9.165.215.23]) by d12lmsgate.de.ibm.com (1.0.0) with ESMTP id WAA34614 for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 22:39:06 +0200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from usa.net (lig32-239-128-200.emea.lig-dial.ibm.com [32.239.128.200]) by d12relay02.de.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id WAA60220 for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 22:39:06 +0200 Message-ID: <3925A608.3093BC15@usa.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 22:37:28 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" Organization: Undisclosed X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF receivers References: <2000051919444368199@zetnet.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Peter Dodd wrote: > I think the tuning step is 1Hz all the time. All the FINE control > does is change the tuning rate of the tuning knob to the display. > The display shows 10Hz resolution whatever you do - unless there is > somthing I have missed. > I made a simple test. Using the Up-Down pushbuttons on the mike, the step for each pression is 10 Hz or 1 Hz depending on the 'Fine' setting. The display has the resolution fixed at 10 Hz, but the actual zero-beat carrier received can be adjusted in steps of 10 or 1 Hz. Not bad for a non-professional RX. 73, Alberto I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28345 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 22:19:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 22:19:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sv1H-00013a-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 23:13:23 +0100 Received: from gadolinium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.111] helo=gadolinium) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12sv1G-00013V-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 23:13:22 +0100 Received: from [213.1.117.225] (helo=default) by gadolinium with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12sv18-0000cg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 23:13:14 +0100 Message-ID: <002001bfc1df$65ca7ca0$e17501d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Marathon drifting again? Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 22:53:58 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, I thought I was dreaming at first but I see that the Greek RTTY station is running about 40Hz high of its usual nominal frequency. Last time I saw this it snapped back onto frequency a day or so later......so don't rip you rxs apart! Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3898 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 22:51:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 22:51:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12svW0-000180-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 23:45:08 +0100 Received: from smtp11.bellglobal.com ([204.101.251.53]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12svVz-00017s-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 23:45:07 +0100 Received: from server1 (ppp145.on.bellglobal.com [206.172.245.145]) by smtp11.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA12765 for ; Fri, 19 May 2000 18:51:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <000c01bfc1e3$0ab7ae10$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Re: LF receivers Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 18:38:01 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Peter: >I am working on the Receiver chapter for the LF book and >What is your favorite receiver and how does it compare with others >that you might have tried? My favorite LF receiver is the family of receivers that were once used to maintain the microwave radio and long haul coax FDM analogue carrier systems. These instruments (radios) were made by a number of different companies, the one I have now is a Wandel and Golterman, AT-611, that covers 6 kHz to 18 MHz. This radio has a "stabilized" local oscillator system that will hold a frequency to less than a Hz over long periods of time. This class of radios have generally very superior IF filters, mine has a 24 Hz filter that makes the radio especially good at coping with loud signals that are nearby in frequency. There is generally no AGC in these radios as they are in fact selective volt meters in their original application. I have had a number of receivers for LF over the last few years, but when it comes time to go looking for weak signals, the W&G is the one that gets turned on. I have also made use of the ICOM PCR-1000 as an LF receiver. What I have done here is made up a list of internal birdies in the receiver in the LF range and then hooked up the antenna to it and gone signal hunting, checking with the list of birdies is important so I can interpret what I am hearing. The PCR-1000 is a compromise of compromises - it is not a good LF receiver but it will let you tune around and get familiar with the LF part of the band. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6283 invoked from network); 19 May 2000 22:58:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 May 2000 22:58:58 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12svdb-00019t-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 23:52:59 +0100 Received: from tk1.ihug.co.nz ([203.29.160.13] helo=smtp1.ihug.co.nz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12svdZ-00019o-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 19 May 2000 23:52:57 +0100 Received: from tractorb (p51-max11.chc.ihug.co.nz [209.79.136.243]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id KAA23725 for ; Sat, 20 May 2000 10:52:51 +1200 Message-ID: <00cb01bfc1e4$d4aee840$c4804dd1@tractorb> From: "Dave Brown" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <16548447.958758107528.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Subject: Re: LF: Re: Puckeridge Decca station - Big & small antennas Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 10:51:53 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > Perhaps I missed it, but I would be very interested to know why the umbrella > ribs are extended so far----- Hi John I have been in the habit of keeping some of the more interesting posts on this reflector as there is no message archive but I don't seem to have kept the one in question.( And it is possible I followed a link elsewhere to get the information) As I recall it was a modification of the original structure as a result of storm damage, the structure 'as is' being a more maintainable compromise. I think the down wires were originally supported around mid? mast height on horizontal struts that projected radially outwards quite some distance from the mast axis. Whoever posted the original info may be able to provide more information. As a top loading exercise the setup 'as is' looks to be far from optimum but the efficiency is obviously still fairly good. Again, some figures were quoted a while back for the setup 'as is', but I can't recall them. My suggestion of 8 down wires was based on Derek's comments but there may be 10. It's obviously in that order and I would be very interested to see what happens if the bottom ends were all temporarily strapped back onto the insulated tower legs. Don't have my 'extract' from Watt handy but seem to recall that optimum top loading for a short vertical was where the 'droop' was no lower at the outer ends than around 70% of the mast height. A few other constraints as well, but you get the general idea. The 'as is' structure at Puckeridge is not a conventional top loaded structure though, and thats why it is of interest as there may be some useful lessons there for us all. Be interested in the derivation of your formula John. 73 Dave, ZL3FJ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10740 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 07:39:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 07:39:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t3iu-0002MQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 08:31:00 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t3it-0002ML-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 08:30:59 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id IAA27386 for ; Sat, 20 May 2000 08:30:58 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk Message-ID: <2000052007315368199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 07:31:53 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: LF receivers Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Alberto di Bene wrote > I made a simple test. Using the Up-Down pushbuttons on the > mike, the step for each pression is 10 Hz or 1 Hz depending > on the 'Fine' setting. The display has the resolution fixed at 10 Hz, > but the actual zero-beat carrier received can be adjusted in steps > of 10 or 1 Hz. Not bad for a non-professional RX. You are right. I don't normally have the microphone connected. Learn something every day! -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18220 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 09:11:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 09:11:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t5Bv-0002Yp-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 10:05:03 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from orodruin-ip.esoterica.pt ([209.198.242.62] helo=orodruin.esoterica.pt) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t5Bu-0002Yk-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 10:05:02 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ea.esoterica.pt (ea.esoterica.pt [195.22.0.204]) by orodruin.esoterica.pt (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id e4K94rJ10319 for ; Sat, 20 May 2000 09:04:53 GMT Received: from por403.esoterica.pt (por403.esoterica.pt [195.22.18.104]) by ea.esoterica.pt (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA15371 for ; Sat, 20 May 2000 09:04:52 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Authentication-Warning: ea.esoterica.pt: por403.esoterica.pt [195.22.18.104] didn't use HELO protocol Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20000520085928.00887270@pop3.esoterica.pt> X-Sender: brian@pop3.esoterica.pt X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 08:59:28 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Brian Rogerson" Subject: LF: Puckeridge Experiment MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: What are the times and frequencies to check, please? Brian CT1DRP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24543 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 11:07:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 11:07:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t6qf-0002on-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 11:51:13 +0100 Received: from ulexite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t6qd-0002og-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 11:51:12 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (1Cust114.tnt4.rtm1.nl.uu.net [212.153.212.114]) by ulexite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id C2197FAF44 for ; Sat, 20 May 2000 09:49:46 -0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <000a01bfc249$66334360$72d499d4@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "LF-Group" Subject: LF: Puckeridge test Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 12:51:04 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
To All from PA0SE
 
At 0955 today I worked Jim, M0BMU/P at the Puckeridge station.
On the Decca antenna his signal was exactly S8; corresponding to a field strength of
8.6 microvolt/metre.
On the "amateur antenna" the signal was 4dB weaker.
 
I reported the signal exhibited a fast fluctuation in strength with a frequency of a few hertz. But I later found out it was my signal generator interfering with Jim's signal. even with the output turned down to zero. It shows that even a HP606B is not perfectly screened!
 
73, Dick, PA0SE
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19033 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 11:40:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 11:40:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t7Va-0002wN-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 12:33:30 +0100 Received: from [194.73.73.176] (helo=protactinium) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t7VZ-0002wI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 12:33:29 +0100 Received: from [213.1.135.98] (helo=default) by protactinium with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12t7VX-0004q8-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 12:33:27 +0100 Message-ID: <008c01bfc24f$25ca8ee0$628701d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: CFH down, in refit Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 12:10:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All, I had a message from Jon ( VE1FTL ) this morning advising us that the Canadian Navy transmitter CFH on 137kHz, and located at Halifax, Nova Scotia, is off air for a refit. It will be down for approximately two weeks, whilst the new Harris transmitter is installed. I have no idea what effect this will have on the ERP but if it is more efficient as Jon suggests, I suspect it will be run at the same ERP with a lower electricity bill accruing to the Canadian Navy. Unfortunately (for us!) Jon also advises me that that he is moving soon to VE6 land. I have thanked Jon on behalf of the whole European amateur LF community for his help over the past few months and wished him and his family good luck with their home move. He has given me the address of another amateur currently in Bosnia who may be able to keep us up to date when he returns to Halifax in September. Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25377 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 11:59:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 11:59:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t7jb-0002z7-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 12:47:59 +0100 Received: from lepidachrosite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t7ja-0002z2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 12:47:58 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (2410825253.dialin.freeler.nl [143.178.70.37]) by lepidachrosite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id 72B3A527; Sat, 20 May 2000 08:59:18 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <002b01bfc239$ea9019e0$2546b28f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: vernall@xtra.co.nz Cc: "LF-Group" References: <09e401bfbc0e$5e55ab60$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> <391C6885.A4BB64A8@bellatlantic.net> <001c01bfbcbe$1b0fed60$a747b28f@w8k3f0> <391DC6F3.A51@xtra.co.nz> <007601bfbf7a$c587f440$120035d5@w8k3f0> <39226F30.40FE@xtra.co.nz> <000901bfc099$3c9525c0$40d899d4@w8k3f0> <3925CDB0.6E3C@xtra.co.nz> Subject: LF: Re: Best tone for aural copy Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 10:53:01 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To All from PA0SE In an e-mail to Bob, ZL2CA. discussing the PA0LQ audio filters, I mentioned a thesis on the reading of morse code signals in noise. As a result Bob asked: > Do you know a way of accessing the university and thesis details? > I gave the following reply which I also sent to the reflector because others may be interested in it. Bob, The thesis has the title "Signal detection in noise, with special reference to telegraphy". The author is Peter Montnémery, SM7CMY, who is employed at the Department of Otorhinolaryngology [say that fast ten times :-)], Head and Neck Surgery, University Hospital, Lund, Sweden. Code number is ISRN LUMEDW/MERL -- 1038--SE. Some of the subjects treated are: 1. Recognition of telegraphy disturbed by noise at different S/N-ratios and different telegraphy speeds. 2. Recognition of telegraphy signs at different listening levels and frequencies. 3. Effect of dichotic presentation on the recognition of telegraphy signals. 4. Recognition of telegraphy in hearing-impaired telegraph operators. 5. Performance of electronic morse decoders in decoding telegraphy masked by noise. 6. Detection of trains of tone pulses masked by noise. I learned about the thesis by a message from Peter Schnoor, DF2FL, via the LF-Group reflector, considerable time ago. Via a friend at the Leyden University I managed to obtain a copy which took many months to arrive. After writing an article about it for our VERON magazine "Electron" (still waiting to appear) I have passed it on to my good friend PA0CX/F2ZI who will or already has sent it to Pat Hawker, G3VA. > As a further aside, do you know why Harry picked 1000 Hz for his filter? I don't know. For my filter I had to use 1000Hz because my German LF-receiver of the sixties has a fixed BFO that produces an audio note of 1000Hz when the signal is centred in the IF filters. But when I am busy in my shack doing other jobs I often leave the receiver on with a wide IF-filter selected, no audiofilter and such high volume that the headphones function as speaker. I have noted several times that I could detect a weak signal this way. After putting on the headphones and switching on the 30Hz audio filter it was often very difficult to read the signal! It again goes to show that the ear-brain combination acts as tracking bandpass filter that should not be "assisted" by too much pre-filtering. Your "Morse Man", writing the column on CW in "Break-In", may be interested in the subject as well but I don't have his e-mail address. So please be so kind to pass this message on to him. Tnx! 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3952 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 12:27:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 12:27:58 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t8H3-00035M-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 13:22:33 +0100 Received: from mashie.force9.net ([195.166.128.30]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t8H2-00035H-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 13:22:32 +0100 Received: (qmail 17846 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 12:27:41 -0000 Received: from ruin.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.66) by mashie.force9.net with SMTP; 20 May 2000 12:27:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 20206 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 12:20:45 -0000 Received: from 220.3a-01.quay.dial.plus.net.uk (HELO picks) (212.159.121.220) by ruin.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 12:20:45 -0000 Message-ID: <001c01bfc256$5c0e99e0$dc799fd4@f9.net.uk> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000a01bfc249$66334360$72d499d4@w8k3f0> Subject: LF: Re: Puckeridge test Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 13:24:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dick and all. Very puzzling! I worked Jim straight after you and found exactly the opposite..... 4dB better on the "small" antenna. We tried the test twice and I continued to listen, each time it was the same. Directional? Which side of the big mast was the little antenna I wonder? 73. Dave G3YXM. To All from PA0SE At 0955 today I worked Jim, M0BMU/P at the Puckeridge station. On the Decca antenna his signal was exactly S8; corresponding to a field strength of 8.6 microvolt/metre. On the "amateur antenna" the signal was 4dB weaker. I reported the signal exhibited a fast fluctuation in strength with a frequency of a few hertz. But I later found out it was my signal generator interfering with Jim's signal. even with the output turned down to zero. It shows that even a HP606B is not perfectly screened! 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7906 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 12:32:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 12:32:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t8MM-00035s-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 13:28:02 +0100 Received: from [199.172.152.110] (helo=gigi.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t8ML-00035n-00 for RSGB_LF_GROUP@BLACKSHEEP.ORG; Sat, 20 May 2000 13:28:01 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by gigi.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000520122749.RGL14621.gigi.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Sat, 20 May 2000 05:27:49 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <30759817.958825669893.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 05:27:49 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: RSGB_LF_GROUP@BLACKSHEEP.ORG Subject: LF: Re: QRV on 136 and Puckeridge tests MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 62.7.153.15 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Jim and All, I worked M0BMU/P at 0900 this morning, my first QSO on LF and got 569 from him. Naturally I am delighted, but now see that more work on the Antenna is required. My thanks must go to G0MRF for his patience with many questions while building his latest design, which seems to work very well - many amps going in, but nothing getting hot even with the fan off. I would also like to thank many other members of the Lowfer community for much helpful advice and information via the reflector and privately, without which it would not have been possible to get going on this band. Jim, I listened carefully to several QSOs during the remainder of the morning and did notice a distince difference between the antennas. At this QTH the Small Antenna was just over S9 (approx 2dB), whereas the Big Antenna was just under S9 by approx the same amount. So for me the difference was about 3 to 4 dB, with the Small Antenna being slightly stronger. >From other comments, I suspect this is a matter of direction, but there could be other reasons. 73s John, G4CNN, IO91ML (Caversham, just north of Reading) _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2221 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 13:01:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 13:01:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t8nq-0003AY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 13:56:26 +0100 Received: from mb09.swip.net ([193.12.122.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t8np-0003AT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 13:56:25 +0100 Received: from win95 (d212-151-89-20.swipnet.se [212.151.89.20]) by mb09.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA28234 for ; Sat, 20 May 2000 14:55:52 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001801bfc25b$3bc45bc0$145997d4@win95.swipnet.se> From: "C Andersson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: SV: Re: Puckeridge test Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 14:59:27 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >I worked Jim straight after you and found exactly the opposite..... 4dB >better on the "small" antenna. Same thing here. Small antenna 3 dB better. /Christer sm6pxj From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28034 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 13:30:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 13:30:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t9Eh-0003Fx-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 14:24:11 +0100 Received: from ulexite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t9Eg-0003Fs-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 14:24:10 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (1Cust78.tnt16.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.53.6.78]) by ulexite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id 398E8FAF84 for ; Sat, 20 May 2000 12:22:46 -0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <008f01bfc25e$c5ba52a0$4e0635d5@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "LF-Group" Subject: LF: Puckeridge test 2 Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 15:23:59 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
To All from PA0SE
 
On April 16 2000 at 1000 UTC I received G3WSC/P at Puckeridge at S9 + 20 dB.
That means an input to the receiver of
-73dBm + 20dB = -53dBm.
 
Today, May 20 2000, I received M0BMU/P at 0917 UTC at
S8 = -73dBm - 6dB = -79dBm.
 
That means that M0BMU/P was feeding 79dBm - 53dBm = 26dB less power to the Decca aerial than G3WSC/P did.
I wonder whether Derek and Jim can confirm that.
 
Propagation cannot been different both days on this ground wave path as I was receiving G4GVC at -84dBm as I always do.
 
73, Dick, PA0SE
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15209 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 13:31:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 13:31:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t9F7-0003G4-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 14:24:37 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t9F6-0003Fz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 14:24:36 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.226.77] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12t9F4-00050G-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 13:24:34 +0000 Message-ID: <39268367.D1926E51@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 12:21:59 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: New ones Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: New stations recently on 136 khz OK1DTN/PA0WFS/DJ7RD. I had the pleasure of being their first UK contacts last weekend but they are active again today with good signals. Other activity heard today HB2ASB and M0BMU testing. When I worked M0BMU for his test, he was 5 db stronger on the inv L antenna than on the big mast. Possible a mismatch between tx and big antenna. Seems strange!!!!!!!!!!1 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26876 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 17:30:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 17:30:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tCuZ-0003na-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 18:19:39 +0100 Received: from merlins.plus.net.uk ([195.166.128.23] helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tCuY-0003nV-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 18:19:38 +0100 Received: (qmail 9772 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 17:24:55 -0000 Received: from ruin.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.66) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 17:24:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 4687 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 17:17:48 -0000 Received: from 12.04-01.quay.dial.plus.net.uk (HELO picks) (212.159.67.12) by ruin.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 17:17:48 -0000 Message-ID: <000701bfc27f$db6c3480$0c439fd4@f9.net.uk> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: 73kHz tests from Puckeridge Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 18:21:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear all. Jim M0BMU/P is at Puckeridge Decca station this weekend and will be calling on 71.7kHz normal CW with 1W erp tomorow morning (Sunday) between 0900 and 1000 utc. He will listen on the 136kHz band in the hope of making some long distance cross-band QSOs. Anyone in DL, PA, HB9, SM etc. prepared to have a go? 73. Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29875 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 18:55:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 18:55:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tEJV-000408-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 19:49:29 +0100 Received: from mail12.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.215]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tEJU-000403-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 19:49:28 +0100 Received: from modem-36.erchamion.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.195.36] helo=lvm) by mail12.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12tEJS-0002Nt-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 19:49:27 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfc28c$4a0f7440$24c3883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re.Puckeridge tests Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 19:49:48 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Jim and all,
Thanks for all the hard work on the Ant tests.I confirm that the small Ant 5db better than the big one when grounded.Possibly 6db better when big Ant resonant.Very small difference I know  but it does tend to prove that there was very little re-radiation from the big Ant.Will be intrested in reports from further away and other directions when you get them.Best wishes have a good weekend,will be listening.73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1605 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 20:01:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 20:01:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tFLh-00049h-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 20:55:49 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tFLf-00049c-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 20 May 2000 20:55:48 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id UAA06799 for ; Sat, 20 May 2000 20:55:46 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk Message-ID: <2000052019564768199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 19:56:47 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: Liaison Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit On the 10th of March I received an e-mail from Alan Melia saying that Brian Rogerson, CT1DRP, was in a position to receive 73kHz signals; although all he had heard to that date was Rugby. Brian was keen to try to receive amateur signals on this band before it was withdrawn (due for the end of June 2000 at the time). After an initial exchange of e-mails I agreed to transmit QRSS signals on 71.8kHz but the results were negative. I then asked Brian to send me a .JPG of his Spectrogram screen. The display was a mess with masses of electrical QRM. In a series of e-mail exchanges I passed to Brian the collective LF group wisdom (G4GVC et al) for improving the receive system. This included improving the antenna resonating and matching and extending the ground system. The e-mails received from Brian showed intelligent response to the advice and the .JPG images continuing improvement in results. On the 5th of April I received an e-mail from Brian, with an attached .JPG, saying "was this you". It certainly was, although only readability 'T'; more recognizable from the frequency characteristics on keying than the data! On the 10th of April I received a further .JPG from Brian showing my the 72kHz side of my cross-band QSO with I5TGC, this time readability 'O'. The reason for describing this saga in detail is to show the value of liaison for propagating LF experience, particularly if you are trying to achieve a long distance contact over over a path whose characteristics are not well known. When you realise that Brian had not received any amateur signal until the 5th of April, to receive a 30mW signal over 1200km as his first received amateur signal was quite an achievement. Could not such a similar procedure be used for the transatlantic path? -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16983 invoked from network); 20 May 2000 23:12:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 May 2000 23:12:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tIKr-0004ds-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 00:07:09 +0100 Received: from m11.boston.juno.com ([63.211.172.74]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tIKq-0004dn-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 00:07:08 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from cookie.juno.com by cookie.juno.com for <"yokUgcxCbtTP7XLrpefewAPXUIDTVStVOLIaw1YS9EljmTBexKXLqQ=="> Received: (from riese-k3djc@juno.com) by m11.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id E8J22N8S; Sat, 20 May 2000 19:06:49 EDT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 18:53:54 -0400 Subject: Re: LF: Re: Liaison Message-ID: <20000520.190135.-4365.0.riese-k3djc@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: "Bob RIESE" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >In a series of e-mail exchanges I passed to Brian the collective LF >group wisdom (G4GVC et al) for improving the receive system. This >included improving the antenna resonating and matching and extending >the ground system. > Lets hope that collective wisdom will be included in the next LF source book, I for one have my money ready Bob K3DJC : ] From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14178 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 08:13:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 08:13:44 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tQhx-0005s7-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 09:03:33 +0100 Received: from lepidachrosite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tQhw-0005s2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 09:03:32 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (2410808417.dialin.freeler.nl [143.178.4.97]) by lepidachrosite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id 98A97CAF17 for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 08:02:28 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <001c01bfc2fb$279acee0$6104b28f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "LF-Group" Subject: LF: Fw: Best tone for aural copy Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 10:03:25 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To All from PA0SE In an e-mail to Bob, ZL2CA. discussing the PA0LQ audio filters, I mentioned a thesis on the reading of morse code signals in noise. As a result Bob asked: > Do you know a way of accessing the university and thesis details? > I gave the following reply which I also sent to the reflector because others may be interested in it. Bob, The thesis has the title "Signal detection in noise, with special reference to telegraphy". The author is Peter Montnémery, SM7CMY, who is employed at the Department of Otorhinolaryngology [say that fast ten times :-)], Head and Neck Surgery, University Hospital, Lund, Sweden. Code number is ISRN LUMEDW/MERL -- 1038--SE. Some of the subjects treated are: 1. Recognition of telegraphy disturbed by noise at different S/N-ratios and different telegraphy speeds. 2. Recognition of telegraphy signs at different listening levels and frequencies. 3. Effect of dichotic presentation on the recognition of telegraphy signals. 4. Recognition of telegraphy in hearing-impaired telegraph operators. 5. Performance of electronic morse decoders in decoding telegraphy masked by noise. 6. Detection of trains of tone pulses masked by noise. I learned about the thesis by a message from Peter Schnoor, DF2FL, via the LF-Group reflector, considerable time ago. Via a friend at the Leyden University I managed to obtain a copy which took many months to arrive. After writing an article about it for our VERON magazine "Electron" (still waiting to appear) I have passed it on to my good friend PA0CX/F2ZI who will or already has sent it to Pat Hawker, G3VA. > As a further aside, do you know why Harry picked 1000 Hz for his filter? I don't know. For my filter I had to use 1000Hz because my German LF-receiver of the sixties has a fixed BFO that produces an audio note of 1000Hz when the signal is centred in the IF filters. But when I am busy in my shack doing other jobs I often leave the receiver on with a wide IF-filter selected, no audiofilter and such high volume that the headphones function as speaker. I have noted several times that I could detect a weak signal this way. After putting on the headphones and switching on the 30Hz audio filter it was often very difficult to read the signal! It again goes to show that the ear-brain combination acts as tracking bandpass filter that should not be "assisted" by too much pre-filtering. 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28333 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 08:44:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 08:44:15 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tRF4-0005wJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 09:37:46 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tRF3-0005wE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 09:37:45 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.217.76] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tRF2-0001TZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 08:37:44 +0000 Message-ID: <392687A6.80A92611@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 12:40:06 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: DECCA MAST Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The signal from the SMALL mast is 5 db stronger than the LARGE Decca tower. As I mentioned in an earlier bulletin the comparison test is flawed. The large tower is vertical and the small antennas is but a LONG wire 9 metres above ground. Still puzzled why the small antenna is putting out a stronger signal. I would suspect the matching network to the large tower is poor or the large antenna is acting as a reflector, especially if a PA0 station reports the opposite. G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8800 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 10:07:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 10:07:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tSXr-000694-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 11:01:15 +0100 Received: from mail12.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.215]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tSXq-00068z-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 11:01:14 +0100 Received: from modem-115.ocellaris-clown.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.42.115] helo=lvm) by mail12.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12tSXn-0002wv-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 11:01:13 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfc30b$a97c1080$732a893e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. Decca Mast (G3KEV) Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 11:01:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Sorry Mal,I cant agree that the small ant "is but a long wire etc" if this is meant to imply that it is anything other than a short 9m high vertical with top loading,which will have the same omni-directional vert. polarised radiation pattern as the larger ant.The Top load does not produce horiz.polarisation at this frequency. This does not mean that I am entirely happy with the results I would have expected the same sig strength, however I await the full set of reports from different directions and distances.73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9713 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 10:22:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 10:22:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tSab-00069M-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 11:04:05 +0100 Received: from ulexite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tSaa-00069H-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 11:04:04 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (1Cust30.tnt11.rtm1.nl.uu.net [212.136.251.30]) by ulexite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id 242F1FB064 for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 09:02:40 -0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <000201bfc30b$fe010700$1efb88d4@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000a01bfc249$66334360$72d499d4@w8k3f0> <001c01bfc256$5c0e99e0$dc799fd4@f9.net.uk> Subject: LF: Puckeridge test 3 Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 12:02:37 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >From PA0SE Dave, G3YXM wrote: > Dick and all. > > Very puzzling! > I worked Jim straight after you and found exactly the opposite..... 4dB > better on the "small" antenna. We tried the test twice and I continued to > listen, each time it was the same. > Directional? > Which side of the big mast was the little antenna I wonder? > > 73. Dave G3YXM. Dave and All, There is a simple explanation. I was very busy doing the measurements, changing the receiver input from aerial to signal generator and back, reading levels etc. I therefore did not listen carefully to what Jim was sending (experienced telegraphists can do a job and copy CW at the same time but I am far removed from that category). So I assumed that the bigger signal came from the bigger aerial. Rather foolish of course and I apologize for that. So the S8 (-79dBm) signal I reported must have been from the small aerial and the 4dB weaker signal (-83dBm) from the Decca aerial. That is 30dB less than the signal from G3WSC/P operating from Puckeridge on April 16 at 1000 UTC. G3WSC/P at that time reported an aerial current of 9A. In his e-mail of May 18, 15.54, Jim announced he was going to run an aerial current of 0.34A into the Decca aerial. That is a difference of 20log(9/0.34) = 28.5dB; within 1.5dB of my measured values. That confirms I got the two aerials mixed up. Assuming that at the distance of 317km between our locations the inverse distance law is still applicable my measured field strength of 8.6µV/m yields a radiated power by the small aerial of 83mW, close to the 80mW Jim was aiming at. For the Decca aerial I find 33mW. Up to now (0951 UTC I have heard no signal from Jim on 73kHz. 73, Dick, PA0SE This was my earlier report: > To All from PA0SE > > At 0955 today I worked Jim, M0BMU/P at the Puckeridge station. > On the Decca antenna his signal was exactly S8; corresponding to a field > strength of 8.6 microvolt/metre. > On the "amateur antenna" the signal was 4dB weaker. > > I reported the signal exhibited a fast fluctuation in strength with a > frequency of a few hertz. But I later found out it was my signal generator > interfering with Jim's signal. even with the output turned down to zero. >It shows that even a HP606B is not perfectly screened! > > 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18281 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 16:08:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 16:08:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tY5X-0006ub-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 16:56:23 +0100 Received: from mta00.talk21.com ([62.172.192.40] helo=t21mta00-app.talk21.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tY5W-0006uQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 16:56:22 +0100 Received: from dave ([62.7.151.208]) by t21mta00-app.talk21.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000521155512.MYKO22347.t21mta00-app.talk21.com@dave> for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 16:55:12 +0100 Message-ID: <003401bfc33d$028427e0$d097073e@dave> From: "Dave Sergeant" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: M0BMU/P Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 16:46:08 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >From Dave G3YMC I can confirm similar reports that others have given: Big antenna, 80mW s9 Small antenna, 80mW s9+5dB Big antenna, 1W erp s9+12dB I have nothing noted to be sure, but when Derek was operating from Puckeridge on the Wednesay evening he was considerably stronger, if I remember correctly around s9+25dB. He seemed to have a big pile up of DL stations calling him, this did not seem to be the case this time. Possibly there is some discrepancy in calculating the powers required for the ERP from the two antennas, or in measuring them. The small antenna was putting out the sort of signal I would have expected from such a station, and was fairly similar to both Jim's home signal and Mike G3XDV who is not far away. I would have expected the Puckeridge mast to be rather stronger, certainly G3LNP in Tring who claims to run 1W erp is at least 25 over s9. Thankyou Jim for organising this weekend's activity. I did call on several occasions but it seemed you were not hearing me - strange! Cheers Dave dsergeant@iee.org http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sergeantd From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20021 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 16:12:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 16:12:38 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tY5M-0006uV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 16:56:12 +0100 Received: from mta00.talk21.com ([62.172.192.40] helo=t21mta00-app.talk21.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tY5K-0006uM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 16:56:11 +0100 Received: from dave ([62.7.151.208]) by t21mta00-app.talk21.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000521155505.MYKG22347.t21mta00-app.talk21.com@dave> for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 16:55:05 +0100 Message-ID: <003301bfc33c$fe42ada0$d097073e@dave> From: "Dave Sergeant" To: "rsgb_lf_group" References: <09e401bfbc0e$5e55ab60$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> <391C6885.A4BB64A8@bellatlantic.net> <001c01bfbcbe$1b0fed60$a747b28f@w8k3f0> <391DC6F3.A51@xtra.co.nz> <007601bfbf7a$c587f440$120035d5@w8k3f0> <39226F30.40FE@xtra.co.nz> <000901bfc099$3c9525c0$40d899d4@w8k3f0> <3925CDB0.6E3C@xtra.co.nz> <002b01bfc239$ea9019e0$2546b28f@w8k3f0> Subject: LF: Re: Re: Best tone for aural copy Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 16:26:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >From Dave G3YMC Dick PA0SE mentioned a professional report on CW copying which should be interesting reading. I look forward to seeing extracts of this in Technical Topics, I am sure Pat Hawker will be interested. Although not having seen the report, I expect it will give an insight into the many aspects of the brain's ability to copy morse which simply cannot be explained by conventional theory. The following comments from me may well contradict the report's but may be useful. Note that these are possibly slightly biassed as they come from a 'seasoned' CW operator for whom the code is very much a second language (that means that German has to be my third language!). They are based on copying morse directly by the ear and brain, as I never ever write anything down from a QSO other than that which goes into the log book for record purposes. Unless you were a press reporter, would you normally write things down when holding a normal conversation? 1. I have noticed that a weak station close or below noise is often much easier to copy if one walks away from the receiver. This may be related to stereophonic reception characteristics of the ear, but whatever the reason there are frequently times when I have gone out of the shack, even to the other end of the house, and heard perfect copy of a station who seems inaudible when I return to sit in front of the receiver. A classic example is when I was at our VHF Field Day station some years ago and happened to walk past the 23cm station tent in the early hours to hear a PA0 calling. When it was apparant the station operator had not heard him I put my head in the tent and (with a little help) he then achieved a QSO. Apparantly the PA0 had been calling him all night! Others have commented to me of this effect. 2. It has for a long time been the custom to use relatively slow speeds for conventional CW on 136, in the belief that this is better when signals are weak. I would question the wisdom in that. A couple of weeks ago when we had the terrible thunder static on the band, Mal G3KEV was calling a series of CQ calls, at I guess around 15wpm. His s9 signals were reasonable copy but significantly broken up by the QRN and sufficient to make a QSO hard work (no, I didn't try...). Suddenly Mal started sending his call at 30-35 wpm - copy was very noticeably better at this speed. When the brain is copying CW, as least how mine does it, it doesn't look for individual dots and dashes, or even single letters, but integrates the whole lot recognising patterns of words and even (for rubber stamp QSOs) whole phrases, much as we understand speech. If this overall pattern of words is interrupted by static it makes the process harder. Send the whole lot between the static crashes and it works wonders. 3. (related) I usually have the receiver monitoring on 136 while I am doing other things in the shack or around the house. On Saturday I was monitoring Jim M0BMU/P. Jim was sending fairly slowly. I realised after a while that I had not been paying too much attention to the drift of the QSOs. Normally I can follow QSOs in their entirity while doing other things. However when the sending is slow the brain has to concentrate fairly hard to keep track of the dots and dashes and form them into words - not helped if there is the occasional keying error as well!. At a faster rate the brain is only conscious of the words and it is far easier to absorb these without really thinking. I have in the past copied QRSS in my head, but it requires a lot of effort to keep track of where one is in a callsign (and the brain normally loses patience before it has received a complete call!). Perhaps we should review the custom of slowing right down when signals become weak. Under the right circumstances faster morse may well get through better and the optimum speed may well depend on local noise situations at the receiving site. Of course the copying ability of the operator must also play a part, and I appreciate some are less happy with QRQ than others. We must accomodate the abilities of all, but slowing down may not always be best. 3. On the subject of receive notes. I also noted that Harry optimises his filter for 1kHz. Many operators including myself prefer a lower note, 600-800Hz or even lower. I suspect it is the optimisation of the frequency relative to background noise, and with a narrow audio filter may be less noticeable. My rig has its transmit crystals adjusted for transceive with a 800Hz note. I never monitor with a SSB filter since with USB CW this brings DCF39 into the passband. With a 300Hz CW filter copy of weak signals is not a problem, and the main requirement for a narrow audio filter would be to reduce adjacent channel QRM. 73s Dave dsergeant@iee.org http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sergeantd From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24603 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 16:52:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 16:52:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tYo7-00073c-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 17:42:27 +0100 Received: from mb09.swip.net ([193.12.122.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tYo6-00073X-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 17:42:26 +0100 Received: from win95 (d212-151-36-178.swipnet.se [212.151.36.178]) by mb09.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA10790 for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 18:41:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001801bfc343$f9182ec0$b22497d4@win95.swipnet.se> From: "C Andersson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: SV: Re: Re: Best tone for aural copy Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 18:44:52 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >>>From Dave G3YMC >2. It has for a long time been the custom to use relatively slow speeds for >conventional CW on 136, in the belief that this is better when signals are >weak. I would question the wisdom in that. I have lost a number of QSO:s because the operator at the other end was sending much too fast with respect to the circumstances. I have no problem with QRQ if the conds allow it. It also is confirmed in the SM7CMY report that lowering the speed (in general) improves the readability. If I remember correctly, 5 wpm is given as optimum speed when signals are weak. However, I don't think that static chashes were included in the test routines... /sm6pxj From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16842 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 17:51:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 17:51:09 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tZlx-0007Cj-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 18:44:17 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tZlw-0007Ce-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 18:44:16 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.215.149] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tZls-0006sS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 17:44:13 +0000 Message-ID: <39280E9F.3D6B9CA1@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 16:28:15 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Puckeridge test 3 References: <000a01bfc249$66334360$72d499d4@w8k3f0> <001c01bfc256$5c0e99e0$dc799fd4@f9.net.uk> <000201bfc30b$fe010700$1efb88d4@w8k3f0> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dick Rollema wrote: > >From PA0SE > > Dave, G3YXM wrote: > > > Dick and all. > > > > Very puzzling! > > I worked Jim straight after you and found exactly the opposite..... 4dB > > better on the "small" antenna. We tried the test twice and I continued to > > listen, each time it was the same. > > Directional? > > Which side of the big mast was the little antenna I wonder? > > > > 73. Dave G3YXM. > > Dave and All, > > There is a simple explanation. > I was very busy doing the measurements, changing the receiver input from > aerial to signal generator and back, reading levels etc. > I therefore did not listen carefully to what Jim was sending (experienced > telegraphists can do a job and copy CW at the same time but I am far > removed from that category) You certainly FOOLED us all but you are not the only one that cannot copy cw on LF > . So I assumed that the bigger signal came from > the bigger aerial. Rather foolish of course and I apologize for that. > > So the S8 (-79dBm) signal I reported must have been from the small aerial > and the 4dB > weaker signal (-83dBm) from the Decca aerial. > > That is 30dB less than the signal from G3WSC/P operating from Puckeridge on > April 16 at 1000 UTC. G3WSC/P at that time reported an aerial current of > 9A. > In his e-mail of May 18, 15.54, Jim announced he was going to run an aerial > current of 0.34A into the Decca aerial. That is a difference of > 20log(9/0.34) = 28.5dB; within 1.5dB of my measured values. That confirms I > got the two aerials mixed up. > > Assuming that at the distance of 317km between our locations the inverse > distance law is still applicable my measured field strength of 8.6µV/m > yields a radiated power by the small aerial of 83mW, close to the 80mW Jim > was aiming at. > For the Decca aerial I find 33mW. > > Up to now (0951 UTC I have heard no signal from Jim on 73kHz. > > 73, Dick, PA0SE > > This was my earlier report: > > > To All from PA0SE > > > > At 0955 today I worked Jim, M0BMU/P at the Puckeridge station. > > On the Decca antenna his signal was exactly S8; corresponding to a field > > strength of 8.6 microvolt/metre. > > On the "amateur antenna" the signal was 4dB weaker. > > > > I reported the signal exhibited a fast fluctuation in strength with a > > frequency of a few hertz. But I later found out it was my signal generator > > interfering with Jim's signal. even with the output turned down to zero. > >It shows that even a HP606B is not perfectly screened! > > > > 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 405 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 18:09:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 18:09:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tZlz-0007Cq-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 18:44:19 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tZly-0007Cl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 18:44:18 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.215.149] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tZlx-0006sk-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 17:44:17 +0000 Message-ID: <39281180.2F1273D6@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 16:40:33 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re. Decca Mast (G3KEV) References: <000201bfc30b$a97c1080$732a893e@lvm> Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit  

LAWRENCE MAYHEAD wrote:

 Sorry Mal,I cant agree that the small ant "is but a long wire etc

How would you describe a long wire???
I  would say a long wire antenna that amateurs use is a random piece of wire, that is longer than the down lead.
All horizontal long wires must have a down lead to get to the tx and the down lead could easily be 9 metres and 50 metres horizontal. I suppose one could say that any long wire was really an inverted L even if the vertical portion was only 2 metres.
If I had a 50 metre horizontal wire and a drop lead to the shack 9 metes, I would call it a long wire.
Where does one draw the line???????.  I would like to have your observations.
When I refer to an inv L it means that the vertical portion is greater than the horizontal.
G3KEV
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

" if this is meant to imply that it is anything other than a short 9m high vertical with top loading,which will have the same omni-directional vert. polarised radiation pattern as the larger ant.The Top load does not produce horiz.polarisation at this frequency. This does not mean that I am entirely happy with the results I would have expected the same sig strength, however I await the full set of reports from different directions and distances.73s Laurie.

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25236 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 18:56:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 18:56:07 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12taoD-0007OJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 19:50:41 +0100 Received: from kuku-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.63] helo=kuku.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12taoC-0007OB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 19:50:40 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by kuku.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000521185007.BPCH22215.kuku.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 11:50:07 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <9116114.958935007580.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 11:50:07 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re. Decca Mast (G3KEV) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 62.7.152.247 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Mal, Isn't an antenna which fits your restricted definition of an inverted L, better described as a top loaded vertical? 'Inverted L' is surely just a pictorial description and not restricted to any particular dimensions? Best 73s John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24370 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 19:10:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 19:10:32 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tb26-0007Rm-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 20:05:02 +0100 Received: from mail4.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.211]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tb25-0007Rh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 20:05:01 +0100 Received: from modem-23.bauglir.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.136.23] helo=lvm) by mail4.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12tb23-0000AJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 20:05:00 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfc357$a06f8f20$1788883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. Decca Mast (G3KEV) Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 20:05:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Wether a wire is "long" or not must be related to the wavelength.In the case of 136Khz, 50M certainly isnt long! My point however is that the "small ant" at Puckeridge can only be described as a vertical with top loading,and that it will radiate as such and in no other way.G3AQC.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15885 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 19:32:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 19:32:52 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tbK5-0007Ut-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 20:23:37 +0100 Received: from tomts1.bellnexxia.net ([209.226.175.139] helo=tomts1-srv.bellnexxia.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tbK4-0007Ul-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 20:23:36 +0100 Received: from server1 ([216.208.85.40]) by tomts1-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000521192303.GIWL15500.tomts1-srv.bellnexxia.net@server1> for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 15:23:03 -0400 Message-ID: <006201bfc359$2a3a9050$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: Best tone for aural copy Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 15:17:03 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >>From Dave G3YMC >1. I have noticed that a weak station close or below noise is often much >easier to copy if one walks away from the receiver. ..... I heard my first eme signal by putting my earphones in a large crystal (cut glass) dish and standing back about 5 feet or so. This was a trick that was taught to me by a chap who earned his living copying CW as "piece work" so he had an incentive to listen for stations calling. The most critical need was to keep moving around, physically, until you found the "sweet spot" were you could hear the really really weak signal. I demonstrated this capability some years ago while working with water based ground reflection gain on 2 Meter eme - a visitor told me the "sweet spot" was probably were the two ears were copying best was were there was a phase shift in the audio approaching 90 degrees thus giving what we now know is the extra sensitivity of the I and Q channel reception condition. Larry VA3LK PS, She who shall be obeyed did not take well to the cut glass bowl being moved outside and set on a bench so I could do this, but you cant win all the time.......... From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10563 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 22:37:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 22:37:15 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12teCi-0007vE-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 23:28:12 +0100 Received: from gadolinium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.111] helo=gadolinium) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12teCh-0007v9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 23:28:11 +0100 Received: from [213.1.183.63] (helo=default) by gadolinium with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12teCc-0007Ik-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 21 May 2000 23:28:09 +0100 Message-ID: <003101bfc373$c05f7540$3fb701d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Morse tones and spacial filters Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 23:05:33 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dave and Larry raise an interesting effect, that I noticed myself when idly monitoring the band on the speaker (move your head around to select the signal you want to copy). The effect is caused, I think, by the selection of a position of the ear where multiple audio paths add in phase for the required tone. The noise is not affected or may even have it high and low frequencies attenuated by the size of nearby objects in relation to the wavelength and absorption by furnishings (or tent walls on FD). I believe the effect is an analogue of the technique used in digital filtering called Finite Impulse Reponse (FIR) filters, where delayed copies of a signal are added together can produce a very selective output. I have noticed that whilst I often copy signals at tone frequencies up to 1800Hz, if I find the going difficult I can read the same signals better at around 600-800Hz. Strangely enough this is not where the ear is supposed to be the most sensitive (1000 Hz to 1400Hz I seem to remember) which may be why the is a lot of reference to 1000Hz tones. In the case of static-crashes I agree that getting as much as possible over between the crashes with repetitions is undoubtably the best way, but I don't think you work really weak stations under those conditions. I have listened to pairs of continental stations late in the evening who are probably good strength with each other pushing along at a reasonable speed. They were down in the normal band noise (not crashes) with me making copy very difficult as I seemed to miss the 'dots'. In these conditions I find the slow deliberate sending easier to read, and I use a pencil. (BUT then I am not by any stretch of the imagination a morse operator..... but I do try!) The problem I found with Jim was that having the AGC on to give an S-meter reading, meant the crashes carved up the copy (with the AOR 7030 it is not easy to flip the AGC on and off....ergonomics is not one of its strong points) All the comments have been most instructive, it keeps me trying, and maybe my ability is improving slightly ( I hope). I look forward to learning more from the Thesis that Dick mentioned. Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16283 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 23:28:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 23:28:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tf4E-000884-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 00:23:30 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.4]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tf4D-00087z-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 00:23:29 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v27.9.) id l.4e.5d60dbb (9823) for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 19:22:53 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <4e.5d60dbb.2659c9cd@aol.com> Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 19:22:53 EDT Subject: Re: LF: Re. Decca Mast (G3KEV) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 102 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In a message dated 5/21/00 6:05:58 AM Eastern Daylight Time, LAURIE@g3aqc.freeserve.co.uk writes: << The Top load does not produce horiz.polarisation at this frequency. >> I have to rather strenuously question that assertion, I'm afraid. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12120 invoked from network); 21 May 2000 23:41:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 May 2000 23:41:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tfAy-0008A0-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 00:30:28 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo-d09.mx.aol.com ([205.188.157.41]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tfAx-00089V-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 00:30:27 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v27.9.) id l.9f.5a550c2 (9823) for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 19:29:51 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <9f.5a550c2.2659cb6e@aol.com> Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 19:29:50 EDT Subject: Re: LF: Re. Decca Mast (G3KEV) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 102 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In a message dated 5/21/00 3:09:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time, LAURIE@g3aqc.freeserve.co.uk writes: << My point however is that the "small ant" at Puckeridge can only be described as a vertical with top loading,and that it will radiate as such and in no other way. >> How can it _not_ radiate some other way? The top loading is not symmetrical. It is a second antenna grafted onto the vertical section. Plot out the current flow, sketch a few vectors...yes, the radiation pattern will be distinctly different from a plain vertical. What I'd really like to see here are signal reports from more distant listeners in various directions to see if the reported anomaly holds for other takeoff angles, and also a few figures on how the equivalent input power was determined, if possible. 73, John KD4IDY From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 521 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 07:05:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 07:05:22 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tm6f-0000fO-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 07:54:29 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from posti.saunalahti.fi ([195.74.0.45] helo=vihta.saunalahti.fi) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tm6d-0000fJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 07:54:28 +0100 Received: from default (MCCXLIV.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.40.44]) by vihta.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id JAA09653 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 09:46:19 +0300 (EET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000522095751.007dcd90@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: oh2lx@pop.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 09:57:51 +0300 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: Signal Strength Measurements by OH2LX 22 May 2000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Signal strength measurements of various LF stations by OH2LX: ------------------------------------------------------------------ Day ------------------ 15May 16May 17May 18May 19May 20May 21May MON TUE WED THU FRI SAT SUN Time, UTC ------------ 2100- 2340- 2025- 2020- 2035- 2045- 2005- ------------------------------------------------------------------ kHz Stn d,km AZI Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW ------------------------------------------------------------------ 73.3 Rugby, 1825, 252, -103 -115 -109 -105 -102 -106 -107 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 75.0 HBG, 1992, 226, -101 -95 -109 -107 -104 -103 -106 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 77.5 DCF77, 1543, 228, -92 -87 -90 -89 -86 -91 -91 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 128.2 9f/7D, 2060, 267, -127 -115 Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil* ------------------------------------------------------------------ 128.9 DCF49, 1544, 228, -85 -97 -99 -97 -86 -90 -92 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 138.8 DBF39, 1221, 226, -82 -74 -99 -97 -87 -85 -89 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 135.8 SXV, 2490, 182, -103 -106 -107 -105 -101 -103 -110 ------------------------------------------------------------------ 137.0 CFH, 5750, 295, Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil ------------------------------------------------------------------ * Irish Decca chain (7D) possibly gone qrt...? ------------------------------------------------------------------ 15May 1905: OH1TN -113; 1932:-113; 1940:-114; 1945:-113; 1950:-114 1958:-113; 2001:-114; 2008:-113; 2023:-112; 2043:-112 15May 2107: SM6PXJ -127; 2108:-127 15May 2110: OH1BS -118; 2113:-118; 2115:-119 16May 1940: OH1TN -109; 2002:-110; 2006:-110; 2010:-111 17May 1911: OH1TN -110; 1930:-111; 1942:-112; 1957:-112 19May 2050: OH1BS -115 20May Saturday, 1845-2145 UTC: NO HAMs HEARD, UNBELIEVABLE... ------------------------------------------------------------------ (R&S ESH2/---- 10m coax----/1:10/-----15m wire-----): Noise level with antenna: with 200Hz IF BandWidth: -26..-20 dB(uV), -133..-127dBmW (varies with qrm, "waves" etc) ------------------------------------------------------------------ End of message of 22nd May 2000, 0700 UTC, from OH2LX ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3775 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 08:05:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 08:05:42 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tn6i-0000pS-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 08:58:36 +0100 Received: from cyb01.axime.com ([160.92.120.38] helo=cybv01.axime.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tn6f-0000pJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 08:58:33 +0100 Received: from MARC ([213.36.34.40]) by cybv01.axime.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with SMTP id FUYBG800.J21 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 09:57:44 +0200 Message-ID: <005301bfc3c3$69cdd780$0600a8c0@MARC> From: "mv tsi" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Antenna calculation Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 09:57:39 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------050609080003050600070208" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------050609080003050600070208 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Hi Group,
I am interesting to calculate my antenna "efficiency".
But How?
You can see the GIF file.
For information I have water at 6 meters down.
I'll used a variometer but how to attack it?
directly under the TX  or making some turns arround the vario?
Is the second possibility interesting for 50 ohm feeder?
Thanks for you assistance.
Marc F5MAF
PS I hadn't seen anything on 71 KHz band Yesterday.
 
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+7WGe67MxbQFSKeL+7zQO7i2SyHLy7x0SBlk57vbO74h1r1fYb3XK7Mn+7bsy2LU/ku2zasZ iadkh7u+tsVr6Ju+4pu90fu794u/31tm8Lq//vtQSGW+3hvAZVa/x6u9rRtcQRS/eXq55Iu8 qstg75t/+VtgZxq6q1szlIsBuQt8ElxkRcu/rHvB02tDG6yVZSu95MugdqaPBVfCpHFxDsvA KmsFI+xxoKTAfBd4jWu/Muy+VcdUxIuKaqm+OlzE5ZvBjuBvSQxdqQnDBOvE3AvF7ghhNnw3 oGvFM4fFGJwQQOwyAHC3KumhBOxnYhxgpIlWgbucTsxfbbzCD+rEcXy+4dt4IZwCPXx+NJDH 3uvBswdt8qTFsYmZaIyNL5h0XzwHfwzCsSbIflnG+bo0/tAZTogsn/dGyU8ZwBVlyfWBwF5Y x+u3VFPcnan8CJFsyj+IIaWoCj3synz2Se21yUFIy4Joy7csiyu5yLZMsqLMRrzsxluMSsC8 SeqnyzFVzGNMCMyMos78xKPhyVASyUpgzUyCzdmczIrEzffnzYYEzuE8zVZGyo6gzUVCzuVs zolbzeKcR/fSwXTbdvEcR3dUxSjozmHLagg6RT/zKxLUMHSgzjsyzyLULJcDEx9U0PecRggd L5WjpZ3DL9VGcQ+9PxEdQm2z0IZ6yVtg0DWy0T00qIOa0CpsBSINIyS9MCR4NeDUokuzByt9 Jujcn/wctKhR0ybCzk7A03By/tObANQd4tM/ndHlY9RHndPH6RtEPUBCzQlPPSFKvdRMnaG4 nBZT3SBVbdVX/XzIsdUI0tVe/dUsQNZlbdZ+HNX+qtYyMl59rFdIrTuVEtdjINb+ESl2fddz PTGJstfD5dYo8Nd1gdf5ESiAHaqCLSXtSheGTR9xkthr8Njv0SaSPdl9bS1octlsQNmYMk+c jdmLPQJeEtqdndmtgiWmfdqjHQJDstoR29oe4COw3WiovSkuUtu2LdsdQCK6/QaefTz8+du7 zduXtsaIEdzZUSHEjbW3/SgF0twObdwiPEPSPd3UfSSReN0Ynd0VEB/c3d3ePQHgfRvK3Rzh Ed52/nDeycEd6m3P450H0Pfe8D3ewEHfeMDewlEb+E3Tzz0n/N0c+o1BBdPffDDgHIx204Hg i4u6Br7Pst3C6MHgM9PFAv7fYSLhE47hYKLhGx7hFn7hID7Mw0HhRRbiIj7aHp4eJu4ZK/7h i/3iMO7WMj7jZl3j5NHiAkziKX7jKP6BUpzOHN5OP+4EMdS/Bz7kRYLjbks2qMOHDRPQ663k D1bkTcBBc+PRTzM52H3VANAF0bxwdno2LHQ64a3jfjQAtS1Ehmozg1ncV83Wh/qPPMQ2PivX Zi3nBdWpmRrl0JLkX63nWoHmiSHog07lNmLoQhvnWW3eiB4jin7oOR3pXovOz5Re6eZ86cv6 6DZ9IoSuGo3eG59OMqEu6pwe1Csy6nVR4KXY6q7+6rAe67Ie6yqg6q5S6qY+zZo+r6dOJ7ie 68W867we7L9u6r1O1cUO7J8k7PHd7M7+7LgRAQAAOw== --------------050609080003050600070208-- From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 411 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 08:13:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 08:13:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tnDU-0000sk-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 09:05:36 +0100 Received: from latimer.mail.easynet.net ([195.40.1.40]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tnDS-0000sd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 09:05:35 +0100 Received: from kevin (tnt-14-222.easynet.co.uk [212.134.24.222]) by latimer.mail.easynet.net (Postfix) with SMTP id ACE3053AA0 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 09:05:31 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <004601bfc3c4$6ebc3e20$de1886d4@kevin> From: "Kevin Ravenhill" To: "LF Group" References: <006201bfc359$2a3a9050$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> Subject: LF: Re: Morse tones / filters etc. Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 09:01:42 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > a visitor told me the "sweet spot" > was probably were the two ears were copying best was were there was a phase > shift in the audio approaching 90 degrees thus giving what we now know is > the extra sensitivity of the I and Q channel reception condition. > > Larry > VA3LK I have also experienced noticeably easier copy of weak CW in noise when at a distance from the headphones - in fact I find that turning up the AF gain a bit and leaving the headphones on a table provides an effective method of monitoring activity whilst doing other things. I must admit, though, that I have not been aware of any definite "sweet spot" whilst moving around the room. Has anyone experimented with phase shifted / delayed audio, i.e. with "raw" audio fed to one half of the headphones and a (variably) phase-shifted / delayed version fed to the other half? Kevin G1HDQ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1672 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 09:34:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 09:34:02 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12toTL-0001AY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 10:26:03 +0100 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12toTJ-0001AT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 10:26:02 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA68530 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 11:25:58 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000522112134.2ebfdd80@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 11:21:34 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: Horizontal polarization on LF In-reply-to: <005301bfc3c3$69cdd780$0600a8c0@MARC> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The recent tests with the 'big' decca antenna and the 'small' inverted-L were were interesting (BTW : I can confirm that the signal on the small antenna was stronger). The tests raised an old question again : do (some of) our antennas produce horizontal polarisation at 136kHz ? Theory says that with a low vertical wire over a perfect ground the horizontal signal is canceled out, due to the fact that the 'mirror' is in counterphase. But what happens in the real world, where ground is far from perfect ? So far I have not found any clue about that. All literature on LF-antennas I have only handles vertical polarisation. Can anyone point me to literature that includes horizontal polarisation on LF or have there ever been measurements on horizontal polarization ? Fact is that stations with long (ad low) horizontal wires (ie. OH1TN, DJ9IE) produce very strong signals, but that only indicates that they effecient antennas, not nessecarily horizontal polarized. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4780 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 09:45:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 09:45:38 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tofy-0001DK-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 10:39:06 +0100 Received: from mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tofx-0001D9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 10:39:05 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [202.27.181.169] by mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000522093823.WDVQ11892947.mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz@[202.27.181.169]> for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 21:38:23 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3928FF9C.1851@xtra.co.nz> Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 21:36:28 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Morse tones / filters etc. References: <006201bfc359$2a3a9050$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> <004601bfc3c4$6ebc3e20$de1886d4@kevin> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Kevin Ravenhill wrote: > > > a visitor told me the "sweet spot" > > was probably were the two ears were copying best was were there was a > phase > > shift in the audio approaching 90 degrees thus giving what we now know is > > the extra sensitivity of the I and Q channel reception condition. > > > > Larry > > VA3LK > > I have also experienced noticeably easier copy of weak CW in noise when at a > distance from the headphones - in fact I find that turning up the AF gain a > bit and leaving the headphones on a table provides an effective method of > monitoring activity whilst doing other things. I must admit, though, that I > have not been aware of any definite "sweet spot" whilst moving around the > room. > > Has anyone experimented with phase shifted / delayed audio, i.e. with "raw" > audio fed to one half of the headphones and a (variably) phase-shifted / > delayed version fed to the other half? > > Kevin > G1HDQ I was thinking on similar lines. My suggestion is to electronically simulate "walking around" by processing the audio to one of a pair of "stereo" speakers. It should be possible to sweep the phase shift of the feed to the second speaker (or headphone earpiece) with an electronically controlled all-pass network, and sweep at much higher phase rates that are equivalent to "running around" the shack. Sort of a couch potato similation :) Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21899 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 09:54:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 09:54:07 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tooV-0001GF-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 10:47:55 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tooU-0001GA-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 10:47:54 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA80158 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 11:47:52 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000522114328.12472742@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 11:43:28 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: good manners In-reply-to: <39280E9F.3D6B9CA1@netscapeonline.co.uk> References: <000a01bfc249$66334360$72d499d4@w8k3f0> <001c01bfc256$5c0e99e0$dc799fd4@f9.net.uk> <000201bfc30b$fe010700$1efb88d4@w8k3f0> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 16:28 21/05/00 +0000, G3KEV wrote: > >You certainly FOOLED us all but you are not the only one that cannot copy cw on >LF > Everybody is entitled to have his own opinion about antennas, transmission modes etc ... Even when one does not agree with all of these opinions, most of the mails on the reflector contibute to very interesting discussions. But what is the positive contribution of personal insults ? Even with e-mail there are such things as good manners. I had several pleasant CW contacts with Dick and as far as I can judge his CW is as good (or as bad .... ..) as most other LF-hams. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5038 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 10:17:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 10:17:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tp9z-0001MX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 11:10:07 +0100 Received: from front6m.grolier.fr ([195.36.216.56]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tp9y-0001MR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 11:10:06 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from club-internet.fr (ppp-44-34-143.wmar.club-internet.fr [213.44.34.143]) by front6m.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id MAA08251 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 12:10:01 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <392915F6.FEEA1F44@club-internet.fr> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 12:11:51 +0100 From: "M & S" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: fr,fr,es-ES MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Horizontal polarization on LF References: <3.0.1.16.20000522112134.2ebfdd80@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Rik, Hi All, I suggest you wait until I get on the air with my dipole. It's only 12 m above ground, works quite well on RX and the first tests telle me that it's going to work on TX. But, as you say, what's going to happen in real world? 73, Mark, F6JSZ P.S. Why did I choose a dipole? The fact is that I have the place necessary to install one, and I wanted to try another system to eliminate all that coil and variometer business. Tests will prove if the system works... or not! Rik Strobbe a *crit : > > Fact is that stations with long (ad low) horizontal wires (ie. OH1TN, > DJ9IE) produce very strong signals, but that only indicates that they > effecient antennas, not nessecarily horizontal polarized. > > 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23967 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 10:21:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 10:21:23 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tpBW-0001N4-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 11:11:42 +0100 Received: from tk1.ihug.co.nz ([203.29.160.13] helo=smtp1.ihug.co.nz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tpBS-0001Mt-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 11:11:38 +0100 Received: from tractorb (p34-max5.chc.ihug.co.nz [209.77.128.97]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id WAA01000 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 22:11:05 +1200 Message-ID: <009201bfc3d5$e2961440$61804dd1@tractorb> From: "Dave Brown" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <2000051810113968199@zetnet.co.uk> Subject: LF: Re: Re: LF receivers Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 22:09:51 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: While a bit dated now, mainly due to the100Hz display resolution (but 10Hz steps from the knob or up/down buttons on the microphone), the Yaesu 757 GX mark 2 is a good basis for LF work. The MDS(Minimum Discernable Signal) with the preamp on (yep, it works on LF) is in the order of -137 dBm (at 182 kHz) in the standard 600 Hz CW filter bandwidth (narrower CW filters are available from third party suppliers) and the noise blanker really works on LF as well as HF. With the rig 'broadbanded', the tx level out the transverter port is about half the spec figure but still more than enough to drive LF tx units etc. The antenna bandswitching logic connections on the rear panel support a frequency slot from DC up to 1.5 MHz (not documented but its there!) so one can distinguish between low band and LF antennas automatically. Higher bands are no problem of course so cross band QSOs are simple. Switch freq and the antennas follow. BTW, thanks to Alan and Brian for reposting the original message from Walter re the Puckeridge mast. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6110 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 10:23:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 10:23:38 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tpFf-0001PD-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 11:15:59 +0100 Received: from lepidachrosite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tpFe-0001P7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 11:15:58 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (2410825684.dialin.freeler.nl [143.178.71.212]) by lepidachrosite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id 9DA49CAF4A for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 10:14:53 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <000a01bfc3d6$d3420480$d447b28f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "LF-Group" Subject: LF: Kite Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 12:15:52 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
To All from PA0SE
 
In QST of April 2000 you find the following article:
 
Jay Kolinsky, NE2Q: "NE2Q's Antenna Fell From the Sky!"
 
The article describes the construction of a kite of the "Scott Sled" design. It is a lightweight design, less than 5 pounds, and flies at very high angles, 70 to 80 degrees is not uncommon. They are made of white Dupon Tyvek and have considerable lift at very low wind speeds, the article talks about 1 - 2 MPH.
Above 20 MPH they cannot be used.
Cost is stated to be 25 dollar and construction time three hours.
 
73, Dick, PA0SE
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22201 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 11:28:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 11:28:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tqF4-0001gc-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 12:19:26 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tqF3-0001gX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 12:19:25 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #35) id 12tqES-0002AE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 12:18:49 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.4.R) for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 12:02:37 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 12:02:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Re: Best tone for aural copy In-reply-to: <002b01bfc239$ea9019e0$2546b28f@w8k3f0> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: PA0SE wrote: > But when I am busy in my shack doing other jobs I often leave the receiver > on with a wide IF-filter selected, no audiofilter and such high volume > that the headphones function as speaker. I have noted several times that > I could detect a weak signal this way. After putting on the headphones and > switching on the 30Hz audio filter it was often very difficult to read the > signal! It again goes to show that the ear-brain combination acts as > tracking bandpass filter that should not be "assisted" by too much > pre-filtering. I have often noticed that I can read a signal better on the tiny speaker in the lid of my IC-706 Mk1 than I can when I put on headphones. In fact I use phones only to exclude external noise, not to improve readability. Another phenomenon is that a signal will be more readable right on the edge of a filter passband, even slighly down the slope, than in the middle. Is this perhaps because noise very close to the signal is the main problem with the 'filter between the ears' and at least one sideband is attenuated using this method? Is there a clue to DSP designers here in that it isn't the signal that should be peaked, but the noise either side that should be notched? Dick will no doubt also be familar with the old technique of turning headphones up so loud that the diaphragm rattled with the Morse code. Totally off-topic but still with loud headphones, my father told me that in the early days of radio only a few sets could drive a loudspeaker and it would difficult to dance to music with phones on (I'll pause here whilst you make a mental picture of that)! So it was common practice to put the phones in a washing up bowl (enamelled metal in the days before plastic) and this enahanced the volume like the cone on a wind-up gramphone. Hi-fi it wasn't. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12293 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 12:01:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 12:01:03 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tqlj-0001nH-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 12:53:11 +0100 Received: from front5m.grolier.fr ([195.36.216.55]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tqli-0001nC-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 12:53:10 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from club-internet.fr (ppp-44-48-102.wmar.club-internet.fr [213.44.48.102]) by front5m.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id NAA21621 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 13:53:06 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <39292E1E.C83238C8@club-internet.fr> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 13:55:05 +0100 From: "M & S" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: fr,fr,es-ES MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Best tone for aural copy References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Mike, > I have often noticed that I can read a signal better on the tiny > speaker in the lid of my IC-706 Mk1 than I can when I put on > headphones. In fact I use phones only to exclude external noise, > not to improve readability. This is especially true during HF contests when the oprator gets tired at the end of the competition (you know, when those headphones start to irritate your ears...). It's sometimes easier to put the phones down on the table, wide open, and to listen with the ambient noise around. 73, Mark, F6JSZ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1868 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 12:48:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 12:48:58 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12trUZ-0001yU-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 13:39:31 +0100 Received: from mashie.force9.net ([195.166.128.30]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12trUY-0001yP-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 13:39:30 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 9455 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 12:44:49 -0000 Received: from ruin.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.66) by mashie.force9.net with SMTP; 22 May 2000 12:44:49 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: (qmail 23365 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 12:37:57 -0000 Received: from jstart.servers.plus.net.uk (HELO force9.net) (212.159.2.229) by ruin.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 12:37:57 -0000 From: dave@picks.f9.co.uk To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon,May 22 2000 : 13 39 36 Subject: LF: Horizontal polarisation X-Mailer: webmail X-URL: force9.net Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Dear all. Being a topband mobileer for many years I am used to using antennas that are a tiny fraction of a wavelength. From an experiment I once did to try to improve \"sky-wave\" from the whip, I can well believe there will be a noticeable difference between a true vertical and an inverted L. Whilst in QSO and I tilted the whip over to an angle of 45 degrees which improved the signals slightly over the short sky-wave path. The difference between LF and topband of course, is the launch-angle required to make the best use of any skywave. I will set up some vacuum relays to switch my antenna from T to L configuration soon. Then I will bore everyone asking for comparative reports! It will be especially interesting over long paths. 73. Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8921 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 13:16:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 13:16:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tryV-00026z-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 14:10:27 +0100 Received: from ulexite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tryR-00026p-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 14:10:23 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (1Cust55.tnt14.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.53.2.55]) by ulexite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id DF53AFB14A for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 12:08:56 -0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <009501bfc3ef$311dcd60$370235d5@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <09e401bfbc0e$5e55ab60$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> <391C6885.A4BB64A8@bellatlantic.net> <001c01bfbcbe$1b0fed60$a747b28f@w8k3f0> <391DC6F3.A51@xtra.co.nz> <007601bfbf7a$c587f440$120035d5@w8k3f0> <39226F30.40FE@xtra.co.nz> <000901bfc099$3c9525c0$40d899d4@w8k3f0> <3925CDB0.6E3C@xtra.co.nz> <002b01bfc239$ea9019e0$2546b28f@w8k3f0> <003301bfc33c$fe42ada0$d097073e@dave> Subject: LF: Re: Re: Re: Best tone for aural copy Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 14:52:44 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To All from PA0SE Dave, G3YMC wrote > 3. On the subject of receive notes. I also noted that Harry optimises his > filter for 1kHz. Many operators including myself prefer a lower note, > 600-800Hz or even lower. I suspect it is the optimisation of the frequency > relative to background noise, and with a narrow audio filter may be less > noticeable> The Swedish thesis shows that around 500Hz the ear/brain is at its best in copying wek signals in noise. 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17179 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 13:17:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 13:17:16 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tryc-000271-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 14:10:34 +0100 Received: from ulexite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tryS-00026q-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 14:10:24 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (1Cust55.tnt14.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.53.2.55]) by ulexite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id 0E710FB12A for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 12:08:58 -0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <009601bfc3ef$31c5a620$370235d5@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <006201bfc359$2a3a9050$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> <004601bfc3c4$6ebc3e20$de1886d4@kevin> Subject: LF: Re: Re: Morse tones / filters etc. Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 15:07:10 +0200 Organization: Freeler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To All from PA0SE Kevin, G1HDQ wrote: > > Has anyone experimented with phase shifted / delayed audio, i.e. with "raw" > audio fed to one half of the headphones and a (variably) phase-shifted / > delayed version fed to the other half? This is also an experiment described in the thesis. The results were not so simple to remember as the optimum frequency (500Hz) for weak morse in noise so I cannot tell you what had been found, sorry! Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17883 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 13:17:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 13:17:51 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12trzp-00027Q-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 14:11:49 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12trzo-00027L-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 14:11:48 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12trzn-00042F-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 14:11:47 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <15800.200005221311@gemini> From: "James Moritz" Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 14:18:38 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Puckeridge Expedition, 20th/21st May X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, Many thanks to all those who worked M0BMU/P over the weekend, or who sent listener reports. Also I am very grateful to all those who patiently gave comparative signal reports with the "Big & Small" antenna tests, and so contributed data for the experiment. My apologies to those who I missed out - I had my hands quite full, with operating, logging, recording results, and running out to fill the generator at regular intervals! I set up and tested the station on Friday night - mostly in the rain, as seems to be traditional at Puckeridge - and operated during Saturday and Sunday, finally closing down about 1530 utc on Sunday. In total I had 25 QSO's, three of these on 73kHz/136kHz cross-band, the rest on 136kHz. 19 seperate stations in 6 countries were worked: 136kHz band Station Report sent/received G4CNN 569/589 G4GVC 599/599 G3BDQ 599/599 G3AQC 599/599 PA0SE 569/589 G3YXM 599/599 MM0ALM 579/589 G0AKY 569/599 G3KEV 599/599 SM6PXJ 449/549 DJ9IE 569/449 G3CHH 439/579 G8RW 599/599 DK5PT 549/579 G3LDO 599/599 DL3FDO 439/569 G6RO 569/589 ON6ND 559/559 73kHz/136kHz X-band SM6PXJ 539/539 DK5PT 559/569 PA0BWL 579/529 Best DX contact on both bands was SM6PXJ. Most QSO's were made at aproximately 90mW ERP level. I also sent beacon signals for a few hours on Saturday night for field strength measurements, and during Sunday afternoon, while I started to dismantle the station. I now have a considerable amount of experimental results to work through from the antenna tests, and will post a report on these later on in the week, after I have dried out and recovered from the effects of hauling all my LF gear across a field and back again! Also, I will be sending out some QSL cards soon. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8664 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 14:07:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 14:07:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tsif-0002Hr-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 14:58:09 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tsie-0002Hm-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 14:58:08 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id PAA90960 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 15:58:06 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000522155342.2e97c76c@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 15:53:42 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Re: Re: Re: Best tone for aural copy In-reply-to: <009501bfc3ef$311dcd60$370235d5@w8k3f0> References: <09e401bfbc0e$5e55ab60$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> <391C6885.A4BB64A8@bellatlantic.net> <001c01bfbcbe$1b0fed60$a747b28f@w8k3f0> <391DC6F3.A51@xtra.co.nz> <007601bfbf7a$c587f440$120035d5@w8k3f0> <39226F30.40FE@xtra.co.nz> <000901bfc099$3c9525c0$40d899d4@w8k3f0> <3925CDB0.6E3C@xtra.co.nz> <002b01bfc239$ea9019e0$2546b28f@w8k3f0> <003301bfc33c$fe42ada0$d097073e@dave> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >The Swedish thesis shows that around 500Hz the ear/brain is at its best in >copying wek signals in noise. > >73, Dick, PA0SE For many years I was used to a 800Hz tone for CW (just happened to be the 'sidetone' in my tranceiver). But on LF I found out that I had a better copy at lower frequencies, also because the IF-shift of my TS440 seemed to be more effective here. After some experimenting I ended up with best results at 400Hz. That is a bit less that the 500Hz tone from the Swedish thesis, but maybe it is just my brains that are 25% slower than those of the average (Swedish) ham. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1535 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 14:10:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 14:10:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tspB-0002KY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 15:04:53 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tspA-0002KT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 15:04:52 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #35) id 12tsob-0003Es-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 15:04:17 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.4.R) for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 15:01:03 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 15:01:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Re: Best tone for aural copy In-reply-to: <39292E1E.C83238C8@club-internet.fr> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > > I have often noticed that I can read a signal better on the tiny > > speaker in the lid of my IC-706 Mk1 than I can when I put on > > headphones. In fact I use phones only to exclude external noise, > > not to improve readability. > > This is especially true during HF contests when the oprator gets tired at > the end of the competition (you know, when those headphones start to > irritate your ears...). > > It's sometimes easier to put the phones down on the table, wide open, and > to listen with the ambient noise around. > > 73, Mark, F6JSZ I know those times - when even the birds seem to be sending Morse . . . . Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2730 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 14:11:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 14:11:12 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tsph-0002Kr-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 15:05:25 +0100 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tspg-0002Kl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 15:05:24 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id QAA29376 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 16:05:22 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000522160058.2e9fb5bc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 16:00:58 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Horizontal polarisation In-reply-to: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Dave and the others, I think that the discussion about antennas with a significant horizontal part is not 'if' they work (they do work, signals of OH1TN, DJ9IE etc. prove so), but 'why' or 'how' they work. The simple 'toploaded vertical' approach seems not correct to me, because according to improved current distribution the gain (versus a pure vertical of the same height) can be no more than 6dB. Also beyong a certain lenght of the topload (of approxemately 5 times the height) there should be very little gain. Some possible solutions were already given : - horizontal polarized component - larger 'footprint', reducing losses As this can be a very interesting antenna (for those have the proper space) it might be worth trying to understand the 'why' and 'how'. 73, Rik ON7YD > Dear all. > >Being a topband mobileer for many years I am used to using antennas that >are a tiny fraction of a wavelength. From an experiment I once did to >try to improve \"sky-wave\" from the whip, I can well believe there will >be a noticeable difference between a true vertical and an inverted L. > ... >73. Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17612 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 15:33:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 15:33:42 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tu4N-0002co-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 16:24:39 +0100 Received: from front3.grolier.fr ([194.158.96.53]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tu4L-0002cj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 16:24:37 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from club-internet.fr (ppp-44-60-181.wly.club-internet.fr [213.44.60.181]) by front3.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id RAA15466 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 17:24:31 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <39295F89.D60A1F7E@club-internet.fr> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 17:26:11 +0100 From: "M & S" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: fr,fr,es-ES MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Best tone for aural copy References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi, Mike Dennison a *crit : > > I know those times - when even the birds seem to be sending > Morse . . . . > > Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) > http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm No, not only birds, also car breaks, wind flowing through the trees, the till at the supermarket (on monday) and other horrible things that surround us after a hard working week-end of keybashing... I'm still young, but when you think about it, I think I will take my contesters retirement soon... just to search DX on the LF band! 73, Mark, F6JSZ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15838 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 15:44:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 15:44:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tuDo-0002fX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 16:34:24 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from hs-img-1.compuserve.com ([149.174.177.150] helo=sphmgaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tuDm-0002fR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 16:34:22 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by sphmgaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id LAA03234 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 11:33:50 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 11:33:25 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: Puckeridge Expedition, 20th/21st May To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200005221133_MC2-A5F5-C8E0@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Jim, I want to thank you for the experiment you carried. out. Maybe you noticed, that some of the stations usually giving at least a listener's report, but sometimes an accuracte field strength report (like myself) have neither tried to call you nor given you any acknoledgment of having heard you. Well, in a way you picked the "wrong" weekend. We had a very nice inter-German LF meeting last weekend in Nuernberg. Walter, DJ2LF hosted myself and Markus, DF6NM on Friday night, and Markus organized a wonderful barbeque on Saturday afternoon after the Nuernberg flee-market "Flotronica". We also met Wolf, DF2PY (remember, the guy with the big signal) and some other LF enthusiasts (yes, I was wearing my famous t-shirt) during the rallye. Gamal also was present during the bbq, and we had all spend some wonderful time together discussing the LF situation in general and specifically in Germany. Throughout a mwasurment system with my 1m-loop and the MV62 level meter mounted in my car, we measured Walters ERP to be about 6 mW, and Markus' ERP to be around 10 mW (my own ERP: 30 mW). This again showed me that we all tend to over-estimate our ERP when we simply follow the I^2 x Resistance approach. Besides buying some old ceramics on the rally, I got hold of another wonderful Adret synthesizer, which covers 0 to 1 MHz in 1 Hz steps, at an output of 100 mW@50 Ohms (so to speak a complete QRP transmitter for LF ...). So, all in all a very nice weekend, making new friends and getting new insights into the operation conditions of our QSO partners. But we missed your tests, Jim, sorry for that. Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22347 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 15:53:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 15:53:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tuKu-0002hF-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 16:41:44 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tuKt-0002hA-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 16:41:43 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12tuKr-0007mY-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 16:41:41 +0100 Message-ID: <27785.200005221541@gemini> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "James Moritz" Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 16:48:32 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Re: Best tone for aural copy In-reply-to: <3.0.1.16.20000522155342.2e97c76c@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> References: <009501bfc3ef$311dcd60$370235d5@w8k3f0> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, I am intrigued by the discussion about different tones, listening conditions, etc. Personally, I favour about 1kHz, but this might just be because that's the frequency which comes out of most of the receivers I have used. On the G3WSC Puckeridge expedition, I found it quite difficult to get used to other people's receivers, with a lower audio pitch. I agree that reducing the bandwidth does not help much when trying to copy a signal in the noise. Subjectively, as the bandwidth is reduced, the noise sounds more like the CW tone you are trying to copy, so although there may be less noise, it is harder to differentiate between it and the signal. It's a different story with QRM, when a narrow filter is very useful. I have also experienced the phenomenon of being able to copy weak signals well when in a different room to the receiver, or from the sound from headphones sitting on the table. I'm not sure about different CW speeds, however - at least for me, I can receive slow sending better, but then I struggle with fast sending even with no QRN! I'm now waiting for the RadCom article reviewing crockery to see which bowl gives the best signal-to-noise...... Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22968 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 17:32:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 17:32:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tvvv-000391-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 18:24:03 +0100 Received: from kuku-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.63] helo=kuku.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tvvu-00038r-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 18:24:02 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by kuku.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000522172329.DDFZ1856.kuku.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 10:23:29 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <25834473.959016209369.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 10:23:29 -0700 (PDT) From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Antenna calculation MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 213.120.56.53 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Marc, Several of us are using GW4ALGs matching transformer successfully. It seems to work well for me. See his web page at: http://www.alg.demon.co.uk/radio/136/intro.htm Best 73s John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24466 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 17:51:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 17:51:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12twFt-0003Cz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 18:44:41 +0100 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12twFs-0003Cu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 18:44:40 +0100 Received: from oemcomputer (man-097.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.41.121]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id SAA13206 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 18:44:37 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: irwell.zetnet.co.uk: Host man-097.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.41.121] claimed to be oemcomputer Message-ID: <003a01bfc415$89018a00$7929f7c2@oemcomputer> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <006201bfc359$2a3a9050$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> <004601bfc3c4$6ebc3e20$de1886d4@kevin> Subject: LF: Re: Re: Morse tones / filters etc. Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 18:45:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin Ravenhill To: LF Group Sent: Monday, May 22, 2000 9:01 AM Subject: LF: Re: Morse tones / filters etc. > Has anyone experimented with phase shifted / delayed audio, i.e. with "raw" > audio fed to one half of the headphones and a (variably) phase-shifted / > delayed version fed to the other half? This reminds me of the Sterocode processor developed by G6CJ and (I think) G3OTK, which was written up in September 75 RadCom. This unit took a mono output from the receiver and produced a pseudo-stereo output to feed to a suitable pair of headphones. It worked quite well on top band and even helped on 80 m SSB in the evening when it appeared to spread out TV time base QRM across a perceived range of directions of about 90 degrees . The speech seemed not to be spread out so much. This is all highly subjective, but it did seem to do something useful. 73 de John Rabson G3PAI From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8392 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 18:25:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 18:25:59 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12twno-0003M9-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 19:19:44 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from oso.slonet.org ([207.114.180.2] ident=cbuttsch) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12twnm-0003M4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 19:19:43 +0100 Received: from localhost by oso.slonet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA22098 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 11:19:38 -0700 (PDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 11:19:38 -0700 (PDT) From: "Clifford Buttschardt" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Re: Morse tones / filters etc. In-reply-to: <003a01bfc415$89018a00$7929f7c2@oemcomputer> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Interesting observation on real time listening on LF. When I was at sea as a radio officer I arranged two receivers one vertical and the other horizontal using the longwire 500 kHz antenna tuned to the same frequency within one hertz. Then by using two headphones, each arranged so that opposite ears listened to opposite polarizations, results were simply amazing! With some very weak LF signals and especially with some ten meter satellite signals, I would estimate the readability increased by at least fifty percent. The ease in which signals buried in QRN could be read was something I've wanted to investigate ever since that experiment. Cliff K7RR On Mon, 22 May 2000, John Rabson wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kevin Ravenhill > To: LF Group > Sent: Monday, May 22, 2000 9:01 AM > Subject: LF: Re: Morse tones / filters etc. > > > > Has anyone experimented with phase shifted / delayed audio, i.e. with > "raw" > > audio fed to one half of the headphones and a (variably) phase-shifted / > > delayed version fed to the other half? > > This reminds me of the Sterocode processor developed by G6CJ and (I think) > G3OTK, which was written up in September 75 RadCom. This unit took a mono > output from the receiver and produced a pseudo-stereo output to feed to a > suitable pair of headphones. It worked quite well on top band and even > helped on 80 m SSB in the evening when it appeared to spread out TV time > base QRM across a perceived range of directions of about 90 degrees . The > speech seemed not to be spread out so much. This is all highly subjective, > but it did seem to do something useful. > > 73 de > John Rabson G3PAI > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22114 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 18:47:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 18:47:35 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tx8R-0003Qc-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 19:41:03 +0100 Received: from cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.176]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tx8P-0003QX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 19:41:02 +0100 Received: from modem-164.chromium.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.23.164] helo=thebitch) by cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12tx8N-0004ho-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 19:40:59 +0100 Message-ID: <006101bfc45f$0d56e900$755d883e@thebitch> From: "Des Kostryca" To: "LF-Group-Reflector" Subject: LF: Re: Morse tones / filters etc. Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 19:30:45 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Kevin Ravenhill wrote: > Has anyone experimented with phase shifted / delayed audio, i.e. with "raw" > audio fed to one half of the headphones and a (variably) phase-shifted / > delayed version fed to the other half? > > Kevin > G1HDQ Greetings all, A very interesting discussion and I recall the above description comes very close to that given by F. Charman (G6CJ) and R. Harris (G3OTK) in their Rad-Com article "Subjective selectivity and Stereocode" (September 1975) in which a system of all-pass filters is used to frequency/phase shift the audio spectrum in such a way as to present the operator with a "3D" audio image in which lower frequencies are more to the left and higher frequencies to the right. The intention being to make CW copy better in the presence of QRM, QRN etc. The article went on to describe a full circuit design known as the "Stereocode Processor" which has been emulated many times since in more recent articles. Many of the more recent articles have tended to over simplify the original design by feeding the audio through a pair of passive filters (one L.P.F. and one H.P.F.) and feeding the filter o/p,s to the left and right headphones. I am not sure how much this helps to the discussion but its a very interesting article :-) Just for the record I have one ear (left) which has a poor response to higher audio frequencies and when listening on the loudspeaker I do find that rotating my head gives me an optimum listening position when signals are marginal or noisy. Regards to all on the list. Des. Des Kostryca (M0AYF) GQRP Num. 9788 136 kHz LF operator. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1023 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 19:45:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 19:45:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ty2Z-0003dW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 20:39:03 +0100 Received: from smtp06.wxs.nl ([195.121.6.58]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ty2Y-0003dR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 20:39:02 +0100 Received: from nl9222tvtref.nl ([195.121.216.95]) by smtp06.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 4.1) with ESMTP id FUZ7WX03.4OL for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 21:38:57 +0200 From: "Ko Versteeg" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Binaural filtering / Morse Tones Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 21:38:03 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All Still experimental, but worth a try is a filter by G3PPT. Binster.zip (i quote) is An audio filter program for a PC equipped with a soundcard and uses the FFT (Fast FourierTransform) technique. The incoming audio is sampled at 8000Hz and subjected to a 2048 sample FFT. The unwanted frequency "bins" are set to zero and and inverse FFT carried out to reconstitute the original audio minus the unwanted bits. This has hitherto been difficult, probably due to the need for "windowing" of the data before the FFT to avoid spurious products with the result that one recreates "windowed" data. The program is available at: http://home.wanadoo.nl/nl9222/programs/binster.zip 73 de Ko, NL9222 From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23718 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 21:47:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 21:47:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tzsh-00041A-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 22:36:59 +0100 Received: from plutonium.uunet.be ([194.7.15.87]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12tzsf-000415-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 22:36:57 +0100 Received: from be047304 (uu212-190-12-16.unknown.uunet.be [212.190.12.16]) by plutonium.uunet.be (8.9.1/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA20281 for ; Mon, 22 May 2000 23:21:28 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <000601bfc433$8f52aec0$100cbed4@be047304> From: "Sommereyns Ruddy" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <003101bfc373$c05f7540$3fb701d5@default> Subject: LF: Re: Morse tones and spacial filters Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 23:18:08 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Allan and the LF-group, I have been reading all the mail about monitoring cw signals and optimum frequency etc.. My receiver for Lf is a Kenwood R5000 with standard CW filter. I also have a Siemens D2055 ( 80 Hz bandwidth) and a Wandel & Golterman TFPM76 with approx. 100 Hz bandwith. These are carrier level meters, but perform excellent for Rx on the Lf band. I noticed that when I turned my head whilst listening to CW (with the R5000) that the signal almost disappeared and came back, this depending on the actual position of my head. My first impression was that there was something wrong with my ears. But then I thougt that it had something to do with reflections and absorption on different nearby objects, so I thougt that it had to be possible to place some sort of diffusor on top of the speaker and obtain a more equal soundpattern. Then I did the following experiment: The loudspeaker of the R5000 is located in the top of the cabinet. I placed a cardboard ring (82 mm diameter and 50 mm height) on top of the cabinet above the speaker. Then I took a (empty) glass (jelly jarr - don`t know the excact english word), held it above the cardboard ring and (while listening to a cw signal) lowered it in the cardboard ring. When I reached a certain position in the ring I had the following result: First of all the cw sounded twice as hard. Second , most of the noise was strongly reduced and finally I could turn my head without hearing the signal fade . I made some measurements with a microphone connected to a oscilloscope to see the variation of the amplitude and indeed , without the "acoustical filter" the signal on the scope was about 5 mV I believe and with the "filter" about 10 to 15 mV. Of course is this not a very scientific method but I am very pleased with the result. My brother-in-law who was here for a weekend ( and doesn`t know anything about radio or cw) was impressed that it sounded so loud !! I must say that I have experimented with a lot of different shapes and lenghts of glass and one model was outperforming all. Overall hight approx. 9 cm, largest diameter 7 cm , smallest diameter 6 cm , its conical and difficult to describe. This is al lot of text, and if someone is interested I can take a picture of the setup and put it on the reflectorside.At the moment the R5000 is out of order, there is something wrong with the PLL system. Have to check it. I did not do any test on other speakers but I am sure that it must work too. 73 Ruddy ON6UX From: Alan Melia To: rsgb_lf_group Sent: Monday, May 22, 2000 12:05 AM Subject: LF: Morse tones and spacial filters > Dave and Larry raise an interesting effect, that I noticed myself when idly > monitoring the band on the speaker (move your head around to select the > signal you want to copy). The effect is caused, I think, by the selection of > a position of the ear where multiple audio paths add in phase for the > required tone. The noise is not affected or may even have it high and low > frequencies attenuated by the size of nearby objects in relation to the > wavelength and absorption by furnishings (or tent walls on FD). I believe > the effect is an analogue of the technique used in digital filtering called > Finite Impulse Reponse (FIR) filters, where delayed copies of a signal are > added together can produce a very selective output. > > I have noticed that whilst I often copy signals at tone frequencies up to > 1800Hz, if I find the going difficult I can read the same signals better at > around 600-800Hz. Strangely enough this is not where the ear is supposed to > be the most sensitive (1000 Hz to 1400Hz I seem to remember) which may be > why the is a lot of reference to 1000Hz tones. > > In the case of static-crashes I agree that getting as much as possible over > between the crashes with repetitions is undoubtably the best way, but I > don't think you work really weak stations under those conditions. I have > listened to pairs of continental stations late in the evening who are > probably good strength with each other pushing along at a reasonable speed. > They were down in the normal band noise (not crashes) with me making copy > very difficult as I seemed to miss the 'dots'. In these conditions I find > the slow deliberate sending easier to read, and I use a pencil. (BUT then I > am not by any stretch of the imagination a morse operator..... but I do > try!) The problem I found with Jim was that having the AGC on to give an > S-meter reading, meant the crashes carved up the copy (with the AOR 7030 it > is not easy to flip the AGC on and off....ergonomics is not one of its > strong points) > > All the comments have been most instructive, it keeps me trying, and maybe > my ability is improving slightly ( I hope). I look forward to learning more > from the Thesis that Dick mentioned. > Cheers de Alan G3NYK > Alan.Melia@btinternet.com > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19218 invoked from network); 22 May 2000 21:58:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 May 2000 21:58:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12u00c-00043A-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 22:45:10 +0100 Received: from mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.15]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12u00b-000425-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 22 May 2000 22:45:09 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [202.27.181.166] by mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000522214433.OMSU18042811.mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz@[202.27.181.166]> for ; Tue, 23 May 2000 09:44:33 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3929A70F.438E@xtra.co.nz> Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 09:30:55 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Horizontal polarisation References: <3.0.1.16.20000522160058.2e9fb5bc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik Strobbe wrote: > > Hello Dave and the others, > > I think that the discussion about antennas with a significant horizontal > part is not 'if' they work (they do work, signals of OH1TN, DJ9IE etc. > prove so), but 'why' or 'how' they work. > > The simple 'toploaded vertical' approach seems not correct to me, because > according to improved current distribution the gain (versus a pure vertical > of the same height) can be no more than 6dB. Also beyong a certain lenght > of the topload (of approxemately 5 times the height) there should be very > little gain. > > Some possible solutions were already given : > - horizontal polarized component > - larger 'footprint', reducing losses > > As this can be a very interesting antenna (for those have the proper space) > it might be worth trying to understand the 'why' and 'how'. > > 73, Rik ON7YD My two pennies worth: Conductive soil "shorts out" the horizontally polarised component anywhere near the conductive surface. However, at LF the "skin depth" can be tens of metres so effective ground level may be somewhat below physical ground level? The antenna wires could have a considerable horizontal component but I believe the substantive radiation component (energy leaving the antenna environment near field) is vertically polarised. Having long lengths of top loading does a lot for "reactance compensation" and minimising the need for a loading coil (and associated coil loss). The "effective height" is still mostly related to the length of the "up wire" and it is the vertical component of the upwire that does most of the radiating. I have never been clear about how the sky wave "starts off" from a transmitting antenna such as a (vertically polarised) LF antenna. While there is a "ground wave" that propagates across the surface of the earth with currents physically present in the soil, it would seem the sky wave could leave directly from the environment of the transmitting antenna. LF DX is achieved by sky wave, so how the wave departs from the transmitting antenna (and reciprocally is received elsewhere) as well as the vertical radiation pattern is where the keen interest exists. This is also where there may be a horizontal component to radiation, probably at higher angles, but it may still do a good job for sky wave DX. Most of the text books on LF are for broadcasting type of applications that plan for reliable ground wave coverage (necessarily with vertical polarisation), and largely ignore the sky wave issues. Amateur DX is otherwise, exploiting the sky wave, so there are some interesting differences in "how to get best results". In New Zealand Bruce ZL1WB consistently pulls the best DX reports, including in VK, and he uses an end fed long wire strung across a gully, and fed with relatively low power. The wire is about 1000 metres long and droops considerably, but always has some ground clearance. Exactly how it "works" remains unexplained to date, but there is no denying that it DOES work. 73, Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13522 invoked from network); 23 May 2000 03:36:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 May 2000 03:36:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12u5Jp-00057U-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 04:25:21 +0100 Received: from [192.139.219.10] (helo=claven.fanshawec.on.ca) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12u5Ja-00057N-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 04:25:08 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [198.96.18.57] by claven.fanshawec.on.ca with ESMTP; Mon, 22 May 2000 23:23:51 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express Macintosh Edition - 4.5 (0410) Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 23:24:51 -0500 Subject: LF: Binaural Stereo and Dichotic Detectors From: "Mitch Powell" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: PowellM@claven.fanshawec.on.ca MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------040207010303040004030301" Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------040207010303040004030301 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Binaural Stereo and Dichotic Detectors Greetings all:
Following thread re: tone enhancement et al and knew that I had some
references buried deeply within the catacombs of my basement. The
following is an article that I sent to Arthur Owen G2PUD several years
ago, when we were chasing NDBs and transatlantic openings over several
 years. We chatted on a semi-weekly basis and this subject came up one
day, and I typed in the article and forwarded.... so please excuse any typing errors.

Attached is a GIF showing the two figures referred to in the article.
THE ENCLOSED ARTICLE is from ham radio magazine - October, 1974, pp 53-55.

THE SECOND ARTICLE ( which I have not included, but do have the original if
anyone is interested ) is from QST, April 1983, pp.32-34. Titled
 "A Dichotic Detector for CW", by Douglas Kohl, W0HTM.
A technique is described based on the ability of the human ear to
 distinguish between very close audio frequencies -
to quote " the dichotic detector takes advantage of the brain's higher
 level processing of the auditory neural impulses - physco-acoustics!
The result is the same as narrowing the receiver's bandwidth to just
 a few hertz, but without reducing the speed of response, as with a
high-Q filter." Circuitry is included......
This seems to be a legitimate article - but I have seen some very
interesting concepts appear in other -APRIL- issues, and some of them even work !!    
 
In the same issue, pp.35-36 is an article by J.B.Heaton, G8JFY and
R.V.Heaton, G3JIS, entitled " An Electro-Acoustic CW Filter".  Though
not using a "crystal" resonator, it does make use of a glass tumbler ! ! ! !
therefore saving significantly on costs !!!!!    :-)

73 to all
Mitch    VE3OT

ARTICLE ONE FOLLOWS


 Enhancing CW reception through a simulated-stereo technique

Ham Radio - October 1974, pp. 53-55

A sharp audio filter is a great help in copying CW signals through noise
and interference. A filter passband of 100HZ will accomodate the keying
bandwidth at 20 wpm and tolerate some short-term drift of transmitter
and receiver. However, such a narrow filter makes scanning of the band
slow and difficult, and with high skirt selectivity the character of the received
signal and its attack and decay may become distorted from ringing.

Threshold Gating -   Higer noise reduction than possible from a tuned filter
can be accomplished through threshold-gating, a technique in which the
 received and filtered CW signal is used to key a relay or an electronic switch.
 In turn, the relay or switch feeds the received and filtered signal or a sidetone
 oscillator to the headphones or speaker. Threshold gating achieves is slectivity
 through the switching process. No signal is heard off-frequency or between the
 dots and dashes. However, the original signal is highly distorted, especially in
the attack and decay, or is completely replaced by the sidetone. As a result,
feel for band conditions and for the quality and signature of the signal are lost,
 and any relpy slightly off the filter frequency will not be heard at all.
 This discussion suggest that you cannot, at the same time, use high filter
selectivity and retain an essentially unaltered CW signal and full feel for the
 signal and the band. Therefore, sharp filters seem to have little vale in contest
 and net operations, where you want to respond rapidly, often to signals which
appear to one side of your receiver center frequency.

Another approach -   This is certainly true as long as you listen to the filtered
signal only. However, if you were to listen simultaneously to one speaker fed
 with processed signal and another speaker reproducing the raw CW signal, you
 could retain a feel for the band and would even hear chirp and clicks that extend
 beyond the filter passband. Also, if the received signal were drifting you would
not lose it, and you could hear replies at some distance from the center frequency
of your filter. Obviously, you would lose some of the advantage of the filter and
QRM and QRN would have returned to some degree.

To this end, you can be helped by the ability of the brain to discriminate between
signals which appear at both ears or only at one. To do this, the incoming CW
signal is divided into two channels as shown in Fig. 1. Half of the signal goes through
 a sharp filter to one ear, and the other half is passed unfiltered to the other ear. The
 level or balance control in the unfiltered side compensates for any attenuation of the
 filter. It is set so that a tone centered in the filter passband is heard by both ears at
 the same loudness level. This tone is then perceived stereo-phonically and appears
centerd within your head.  (Because this effect may be enhanced or diminished by the
 phase relationship of the audio in the two earpieces, it would be desirable to try
transposing the leads to one of the earpieces to see what would happen - editor )
 Any other tone is attenuated by the filter and will be heard predominately from the
 unfiltered channel. Consequently, all signals that are not passed by the filter appear
 to come from that side which is receiving the unfiltered channel.

Results -   The effect of this simulated stereo reception of CW signals is dramatic.
Interfering signals and broadband noise appear to come from a point off to one side
of the head. The desired signal, centered in the filter passband, appears within or just
 in front of the head and assumes a transparent clarity that is hard to describe. The
signal-to-noise ratio is much improved. The character of the signal is preserved and
ringing is wither absent or less apparent than in monaural reception with the same filter.  
 Chirps and clicks are readily noticed, and even drifting signals or DX signals with
 multipath distortion are readily copied.

 The mind seems to concentrate automatically of the desired signal and to be relatively
 unaware of and undisturbed by the signals outside the filter passband. Yet, that
information is present and an off-frequency reply is heard just as well as if
 no filter were in use.

Practical Considerations -   I have used this approach with a single passive toroid filter
 and with a more complex filter and threshold-gate combination. Both are effective.
The latter has an advantage on some occasions, but for its simplicity and ease of
 adjustment the toroid filter is superior. The high impedance audio signal from my
HW101 is matched to the low impedance of the series-tuned toroid filter by the
transformer, as shown in Fig. 2. The centre-tapped secondary provides two equal
 signals, one attenuated by the balance control and then fed to the right channel of
 a low impedance stereo headset.

The toroid filter in the other half of the secondary resonates at 790 Hz and has a
3-dB bandwidth of 60 Hz; this frequency was chosen because the apparent stereo
separation increases at low frequencies. The output of the filter is fed directly to
the left channel of the headset. The balance control should be adjusted on a
moderately weak CW signal; a strong, steady tone, such as from a calibrator, gives
 a slightly different balance.

First, peak the signal in the filter by listening only to the left earphone, then put
on both phones and adjust the balance control until the signal appears centered.
The range of the balance control is sufficient to move the signal from the far right
 across the center to the left. Little further adjustment is required under differing
 band conditions.

 The principle can be applied in various ways. Other input and output impedances
 can be accomodated with different transformers, or a parallel-tuned toroid filter
 ( approximately 500 ohms) could be used. Other filters could be substituted,
 and instead of earphones a stereo amplifier and speaker combination used to
 give a good demonstration of simulated-stereo CW reception to interested
 listeners at a club meeting or hamfest.

References: Joh J. Duda, W2ELV, łNoise reduction for CW reception,
˛ ham radio, September, 1973   (threshold-gating/ limiting and energy integration
 to reduce noise interference on CW )


FIG 1   Block diagram ( attached)
  
  
FIG 2 Simulated-stereo setup uncluding simple series tuned toroidal filter.
 (attached) showing a small centre-tapped xfmr (the splitter), in this case
 500 ohm primary with 8 ohm centre-tapped secondary.

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nV6OCFAW5VF+Y1NeUFRmCDYeUBmOOvpdCDpl2OAtU8VtTuPs31WGiDXZSGWZDqRYvH+osKsI BZtZJ1iYAN8Ez1r6h111CcDKMaKIZmkOWIKoZhS95mMuU1qGZntmZlFdCN9F0X6m1Wze5pE4 N2EQgpVwggcDhlmpJzRQCdR1aI6XOAJqwLF6QiCjQ9+lAKireC0LeYUviAMscFyImOZiDeiE GOgFLWgQRlF8bUCTrZWGMNk2Vgj77M//FAllnU6EHglB/geHZogUmCyFkAE9YAhQwAfcuYV0 AwBuSCaCQIFWICw0ICPMU4iaBtUP3umf7WmIYAb/zFM60FEzRemgXusHaIFjo5IOODCC4IAN EISlXmu8zmu93mu+7mu//mvADmzBHmzCLmzDPmzETmzFXmzGbmzHfmzIjmzJnmzKrmzLvmzM zmzN3mzO7mzPlsuAAAA7 --------------040207010303040004030301-- From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12109 invoked from network); 23 May 2000 10:43:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 May 2000 10:43:43 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uBui-0006E6-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 11:27:52 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.91]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uBuh-0006E1-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 11:27:51 +0100 Received: from pickmere.demon.co.uk ([158.152.117.143]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12uBuf-000Pl1-0X for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 11:27:49 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 23:04:55 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M.J.Powell" Subject: Re: LF: Re: Re: Morse tones / filters etc. References: <003a01bfc415$89018a00$7929f7c2@oemcomputer> In-reply-to: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Integrated Version 4.02 S Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In message , Clifford Buttschardt writes >Interesting observation on real time listening on LF. When I was at sea >as a radio officer I arranged two receivers one vertical and the other >horizontal using the longwire 500 kHz antenna tuned to the same frequency >within one hertz. Then by using two headphones, each arranged so that >opposite ears listened to opposite polarizations, results were simply >amazing! With some very weak LF signals and especially with some ten >meter satellite signals, I would estimate the readability increased by at >least fifty percent. The ease in which signals buried in QRN could be >read was something I've wanted to investigate ever since that experiment. I did something vaguely similar with 6m SSB, but I switched by hand a vertical and a horizontal antenna into the receiver. Fades were virtually eliminated. Showing I think that there was a lot of polarisation rotation on the incoming signals, but at LF? Mike -- M.J.Powell From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7494 invoked from network); 23 May 2000 12:34:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 May 2000 12:34:17 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uDis-0006aC-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 13:23:46 +0100 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uDio-0006a7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 13:23:42 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12uDiz-0004HB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 13:23:53 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.4.R) for ; Tue, 23 May 2000 13:14:39 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 13:14:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Re: Re: Morse tones / filters etc. In-reply-to: References: X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > In message , > Clifford Buttschardt writes >Interesting observation > on real time listening on LF. When I was at sea >as a radio officer I > arranged two receivers one vertical and the other >horizontal using the > longwire 500 kHz antenna tuned to the same frequency >within one hertz. > Then by using two headphones, each arranged so that >opposite ears > listened to opposite polarizations, results were simply >amazing! M.J.Powell wrote: > I did something vaguely similar with 6m SSB, but I switched by hand a > vertical and a horizontal antenna into the receiver. Fades were virtually > eliminated. Showing I think that there was a lot of polarisation rotation > on the incoming signals, but at LF? > This is a variation on the well-known technique of diversity reception - which is what the old AR88D receiver was for (D for diversity!) - used by commercial HF fixed stations for many years. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9750 invoked from network); 23 May 2000 12:58:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 May 2000 12:58:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uE3s-0006es-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 13:45:28 +0100 Received: from tomts3.bellnexxia.net ([209.226.175.141] helo=tomts3-srv.bellnexxia.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uE3r-0006ej-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 13:45:28 +0100 Received: from server1 ([216.208.85.57]) by tomts3-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000523124454.CUIU25676.tomts3-srv.bellnexxia.net@server1> for ; Tue, 23 May 2000 08:44:54 -0400 Message-ID: <00d001bfc4b3$d4cfc700$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Information needed please.... Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 08:38:37 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Binaural Stereo and Dichotic Detectors
Greetings All:
 
I had a great meeting with David, G0MRF yesterday in Niagara Falls.  After almost 5 hours of discussion I started the drive home without having his postal address.
 
I have an item I wish to post to him ASAP, if someone could QSP his address I would appreciate it very much.
 
Larry
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14446 invoked from network); 23 May 2000 13:47:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 May 2000 13:47:16 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uEvL-0006sO-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 14:40:43 +0100 Received: from cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.173]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uEvK-0006sJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 14:40:42 +0100 Received: from modem-107.aeglos.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.97.107] helo=lvm) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12uEvH-0000sW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 14:40:40 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfc4bc$a7bde900$6b61883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. Morse tones filters etc. Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 14:41:08 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi All,
I think that what we have here is re-inforcement at certain frequencies due to the proximity of reflecting surfaces at critical distances(similar to "eigentones produced in a room by the walls) The example given by ON6UX where a tube/Jar is used to enhance signals is most probably a " Helmholtz" resonator (I think thats the name) which can be used to produce a resonance with quite a high Q. 
The technique is used in Hi Fi systems  in bass reflex loudspeakers,and details can be found in Hi Fi books,also in Physics text books in the sound sections.Could be very intresting to try an experiment.734s Laurie. 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2872 invoked from network); 23 May 2000 23:30:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 May 2000 23:30:09 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uNuu-0000Jp-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 00:16:52 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uNut-0000Jj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 00:16:51 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id AAA11380 for ; Wed, 24 May 2000 00:16:45 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk Message-ID: <2000052323182068199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 23:18:20 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: Litz wire Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit I have obtained some Litz wire from Derek at the Crawley radio club. I also borrowed a 800W solder pot but did not have any information regarding working with Litz wire. The sample of Litz wire that I have is 1.5mm diameter with a layer 1.4mm thick PVC insulation. This insulation is quite tough and would be difficult to remove without damaging the fine strands that make up the Litz. I just put the end of the wire directly into the solder pot, which softened the PVC insulation so that it pulled off quite easily. I then removed the thin fibre strands that held wires together, dipped the wire end in flux then put it in the solder pot. After 30 seconds the all the individual wires seemed tinned. Does anyone have knowledge or experiance of this procedure? Am I going the right way about it? -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13885 invoked from network); 24 May 2000 00:15:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 May 2000 00:15:23 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uOjL-0000UK-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 01:08:59 +0100 Received: from smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.157]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uOjK-0000UF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 01:08:59 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-114-55.bellatlantic.net [151.200.114.55]) by smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id UAA14964; Tue, 23 May 2000 20:08:40 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <392B1D7E.790F3606@bellatlantic.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 20:08:30 -0400 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Litz wire References: <2000052323182068199@zetnet.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >>From Nov. 1985 "Technical Topics", a tip from G. Lucas G3TWE: "fill a small container (a [metal] bottle cap is ideal) with methylated spirits (I use rubbing alcohol, N4ICK) and light it. Place the end of the wire, one inch or so, in the flame to burn off the insulation, remove it and blow the burning insulation out. next, replace the wire in the flame, and heat it until the wire is red hot, then quench the wire rapidly by immersing the it in the unburnt spirits, and remove quickly. The result is clean multistrands of wire that may be twisted together, tinned and soldered in the conventional manner. Finally, do _not_ extinguish the burning methylated spirits by attempting to blow out the flame or you may end up with burning spirits all over the work-bench. Instead always snuff it out by covering it completely with a lid or other convenient cover". 73 Andre' N4ICK ******************** Peter Dodd wrote: > I just put the end of the wire directly into the solder pot, which > softened the PVC insulation so that it pulled off quite easily. I > then removed the thin fibre strands that held wires together, dipped > the wire end in flux then put it in the solder pot. After 30 seconds > the all the individual wires seemed tinned. > > Does anyone have knowledge or experiance of this procedure? Am I > going the right way about it? > > -- > Regards, Peter, G3LDO > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13126 invoked from network); 24 May 2000 07:37:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 May 2000 07:37:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uVYY-0001ac-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 08:26:18 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uVYX-0001aX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 08:26:17 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id IAA28138; Wed, 24 May 2000 08:29:58 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 3859 invoked from network); 24 May 2000 08:21:50 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 24 May 2000 08:21:50 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id IAA12516; Wed, 24 May 2000 08:23:06 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma012448; Wed, 24 May 00 08:22:23 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 24 May 2000 08:30:58 +0100 Received: by frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Wed, 24 May 2000 08:24:34 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01AB8C5E@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Litz wire Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 08:24:31 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Not sure if it is the same sort of Litz wire you mean, but I have a few pieces of cotton (or similar) covered wire recovered from transformers making up an ancient ultrasonic cleaner. With this I just unwind the outer covering and using a hot soldering iron just tin the ends normally. The enamel is self fluxing and the fumes are very potent - and probably poisonous. Andy G4JNT -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12779 invoked from network); 24 May 2000 10:07:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 May 2000 10:07:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uXvb-00024W-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 10:58:15 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from flatey.bv.rvk.is ([193.4.100.5] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uXvZ-00024P-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 10:58:13 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from engey.bv.rvk.is (root@engey.bv.rvk.is [193.4.100.8]) by flatey.bv.rvk.is (8.9.3/8.9.3+TF) with ESMTP id JAA23563 for ; Wed, 24 May 2000 09:57:59 GMT From: stb@rhus.rvk.is X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from kjoi.rhus.rvk.is (kjoi.rhus.rvk.is [10.5.51.12]) by engey.bv.rvk.is with ESMTP (8.8.8/RA888) id JAA10538 for ; Wed, 24 May 2000 09:58:01 GMT Subject: Re: LF: Re: Litz wire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.2c (Intl) 2 February 2000 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 09:57:55 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on RBORG/ =?iso-8859-1?q?Reykjav=EDkurborg?= =?us-ascii?q?=2F?= =?us-ascii?q?IS?= =?us-ascii?q?=28?= =?us-ascii?q?Release?= 5.0.1a (Intl)|17 August 1999) at 24.05.2000 09:57:56 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The " WireTronic Inc." website, has useful information about litz wire and magnet wire in general. the free " WireTronic Software for Windows(tm) - wtsetup.exe(438K)" is also very useful. 73 Thor tf3sb http://www.wiretron.com/ Peter Dodd cc: Subject: LF: Re: Litz wire Sent by: 23.05.2000 22:18 Please respond to rsgb_lf_group I have obtained some Litz wire from Derek at the Crawley radio club. I also borrowed a 800W solder pot but did not have any information regarding working with Litz wire. The sample of Litz wire that I have is 1.5mm diameter with a layer 1.4mm thick PVC insulation. This insulation is quite tough and would be difficult to remove without damaging the fine strands that make up the Litz. I just put the end of the wire directly into the solder pot, which softened the PVC insulation so that it pulled off quite easily. I then removed the thin fibre strands that held wires together, dipped the wire end in flux then put it in the solder pot. After 30 seconds the all the individual wires seemed tinned. Does anyone have knowledge or experiance of this procedure? Am I going the right way about it? -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23593 invoked from network); 24 May 2000 10:19:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 May 2000 10:19:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uY5N-00028J-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 11:08:21 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uY5M-00028C-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 11:08:20 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id LAA12946; Wed, 24 May 2000 11:12:02 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 22729 invoked from network); 24 May 2000 11:03:53 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 24 May 2000 11:03:53 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id LAA05575; Wed, 24 May 2000 11:05:07 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma005524; Wed, 24 May 00 11:04:59 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 24 May 2000 11:13:35 +0100 Received: by frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Wed, 24 May 2000 11:07:11 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01AB8C61@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: "'LF Group'" Subject: LF: Excellent free DSP Book Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 11:07:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: For a very good book on DSP look at WWW.DSPGUIDE.COM Title "The Scientist and Engineer's Guide to Digital Signal Processing" by Steven W Smith To quote from the preface : "This book was written for Scientists and Engineers........ The goal is to present practical techniques while avoiding the barriers of detailed mathematics and abstract theory" Just what I like, and based the few bits I've read so far appears to be true. Charles, G4GUO, described it as the best intro book for DSP he had ever seen. Unusually, it can be downloaded FREE in .PDF format, as well as purchased online for $64 plus P&P. Each chapter (35 files in total) is a separate file and has to be downloaded one at a time. I suggest downloading and reading FRONTMAT.PDF first which contains the index, and means you only need to download interesting chapters as and when. I intensely dislike reading from the computer screen, printing out each page on a Laserprinter costs considerably more than buying the book and takes ages from Acrobat reader, so an order has been sent............ Andy G4JNT -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16195 invoked from network); 24 May 2000 12:58:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 May 2000 12:58:32 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uadr-0002fz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 13:52:07 +0100 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uadp-0002fo-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 13:52:05 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12uadi-0006fN-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 13:51:58 +0100 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.4.R) for ; Wed, 24 May 2000 13:35:04 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 13:35:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Weekend report 20/21 May X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I have been rather busy lately and have not provided activity reports. The only QSO of interest last weekend was with DL0FTZ/P on QRSs, exchanging 'O'/'O'. Mike From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28489 invoked from network); 24 May 2000 12:59:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 May 2000 12:59:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uadr-0002g0-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 13:52:07 +0100 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uadp-0002fp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 13:52:05 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12uadi-0006fO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 13:51:58 +0100 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.4.R) for ; Wed, 24 May 2000 13:46:27 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 13:46:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Spectran X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I have very recently downloaded Spectran, and am very impressed. Plainly there are improvements to be made and I only have the Beta version, but it appears to be just as sensitive as Spectrogram whilst also being able to handle much slower speeds. A really good facility is being able to adjust the settings whilst it is running. Spectrogram must be stopped before anything is adjusted, whilst with Spectran you can compare 'before' and 'after' side by side on the screen. A particularly useful control is the input level which can easily be optimised with the display running. I also like being able to switch between the vertical scrolling - difficult to read but monitors some 150Hz of band - and the Spectrogram-like horizontal display. The main disadvantage is its speed varying with other applicatiions running on the computer as one of the great things about QRSs is that you can multi-task - I once had a QSO during which I drove my wife to the shops and back, and didn't miss a single dot. Nice one, guys. Thanks. Mike From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29032 invoked from network); 24 May 2000 15:10:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 May 2000 15:10:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ucdS-00035J-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 15:59:50 +0100 Received: from oso.slonet.org ([207.114.180.2] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ucdQ-00035E-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 15:59:49 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from slonet.org (cas1-179.snlo.dialup.slonet.org [207.114.217.179]) by oso.slonet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA09323 for ; Wed, 24 May 2000 07:59:36 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <392BE0BD.596BF3E2@slonet.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 15:01:33 +0000 From: "Cliff Buttschardt" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Litz wire References: <2000052323182068199@zetnet.co.uk> <392B1D7E.790F3606@bellatlantic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: This works so well it is phenomenal. Burning the insulation not new but immersing the hot wire in the spirits is! 73 Cliff Buttschardt K7RR Andre' Kesteloot wrote: > > >From Nov. 1985 "Technical Topics", a tip from G. Lucas G3TWE: "fill a small > container (a [metal] bottle cap is ideal) with methylated spirits (I use rubbing > alcohol, N4ICK) and light it. Place the end of the wire, one inch or so, in the > flame to burn off the insulation, remove it and blow the burning insulation out. > next, replace the wire in the flame, and heat it until the wire is red hot, then > quench the wire rapidly by immersing the it in the unburnt spirits, and remove > quickly. The result is clean multistrands of wire that may be twisted together, > tinned and soldered in the conventional manner. Finally, do _not_ extinguish the > burning methylated spirits by attempting to blow out the flame or you may end up > with burning spirits all over the work-bench. Instead always snuff it out by > covering it completely with a lid or other convenient cover". > 73 > Andre' N4ICK > ******************** > Peter Dodd wrote: > > > I just put the end of the wire directly into the solder pot, which > > softened the PVC insulation so that it pulled off quite easily. I > > then removed the thin fibre strands that held wires together, dipped > > the wire end in flux then put it in the solder pot. After 30 seconds > > the all the individual wires seemed tinned. > > > > Does anyone have knowledge or experiance of this procedure? Am I > > going the right way about it? > > > > -- > > Regards, Peter, G3LDO > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22166 invoked from network); 24 May 2000 15:23:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 May 2000 15:23:17 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ucoZ-0003AI-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 16:11:19 +0100 Received: from d06lmsgate-3.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.3] helo=lmsfw2.emea.ibm.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ucoY-0003A8-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 16:11:18 +0100 Received: from d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.148]) by lmsfw2.emea.ibm.com (1.0.0) with ESMTP id QAA61538 for ; Wed, 24 May 2000 16:02:53 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from usa.net (dyn9-87-116-182.italy.ibm.com [9.87.116.182]) by d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.8.8m3/NCO v2.07) with ESMTP id QAA12598 for ; Wed, 24 May 2000 16:10:32 +0100 Message-ID: <392BF0AB.64075EB6@usa.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 17:09:32 +0200 From: "Alberto di Bene" Organization: Undisclosed X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Spectran References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Mike Dennison wrote: > [snip] > The main disadvantage is its speed varying with other applicatiions > running on the computer as one of the great things about QRSs is > that you can multi-task - I once had a QSO during which I drove my > wife to the shops and back, and didn't miss a single dot. > [snip] Mike, Spectran uses up a lot of the CPU cycles, especially when the overlap factor is high. If other applications contend for CPU time, it is inevitable that some amount of slowing down can happen. In the program there is a measurement device that monitors how much CPU time it can obtain, and adjust dynamically the overlap factor. BTW this is also the reason why sometimes it is possible to see a good amount of fluctuation on the display of the overlap factor. 73 Alberto I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23597 invoked from network); 24 May 2000 20:13:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 May 2000 20:13:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uhMT-0004Br-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 21:02:37 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uhMS-0004Bm-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 21:02:36 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as24-s15-144-167.cwci.net ([195.44.144.167] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uhMQ-0003Wz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 20:02:35 +0000 Message-ID: <392C16A3.CB21755C@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 17:51:31 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: 3C5 CORES Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Larry. 3C5 ferrite cores are manufactured by Ferroxcube and have a Uo of 3000. The equivalent is Indiana General 05P. This core material was used a lot in line output transformers in tube televisions some years ago. I hope this helps you because no one else that responded to your message seems to know what they are. If you need any further info let me know. 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23644 invoked from network); 24 May 2000 20:13:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 May 2000 20:13:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uhMV-0004Bz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 21:02:39 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uhMU-0004Bt-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 21:02:38 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as24-s15-144-167.cwci.net ([195.44.144.167] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uhMT-0003X5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 May 2000 20:02:37 +0000 Message-ID: <392C26B3.C286C9C1@netscapeonline.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 19:00:03 +0000 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: AR88D RX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In the receiver debate recently, someone mentioned that the RCA AR88D receiver was a Diversity receiver. This is not the case. The receiver is a stand alone single receiver and covers the range 535 khz - 32 mhz in 6 ranges. The other RCA receiver available at the same time was the AR88LF, which covered 73 khz - 30.500 mhz in 6 ranges. There was a gap between 550 khz and 1480 khz. I have the original RCA manuals for both receivers and have owned several of these receivers over the years. They are described as General Purpose Receivers and were used as such. If frequency diversity is required then two or more receivers can be coupled together to give a common af output. In commercial applications if frequency diversity was required then purpose built receivers were used. There was also space diversity where more than two antennas were used and spaced several wavelengths apart to counteract signal fade. More information available if required. G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1680 invoked from network); 25 May 2000 03:25:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 May 2000 03:25:55 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uo9u-0005fw-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 04:18:06 +0100 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uo9s-0005fr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 04:18:04 +0100 Received: from oemcomputer (man-152.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.40.193]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id EAA04993 for ; Thu, 25 May 2000 04:17:59 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: irwell.zetnet.co.uk: Host man-152.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.40.193] claimed to be oemcomputer Message-ID: <001e01bfc5f7$f830b980$c128f7c2@oemcomputer> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: LORAN sidebands Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 04:18:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Can anyone provide a formula or graph showing the relative strength of sidebands down to 80 kHz, please? 73 de John Rabson G3PAI From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24526 invoked from network); 25 May 2000 07:07:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 May 2000 07:07:20 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12urbI-0006Gu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 07:58:36 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.41]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12urbH-0006Gp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 07:58:35 +0100 Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12urbD-000GnM-0C for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 06:58:32 +0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <1pPv4dASE+K5Mw45@telemetry.demon.co.uk> Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 15:02:58 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" Subject: Re: LF: Re: Re: Morse tones / filters etc. In-reply-to: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >This is a variation on the well-known technique of diversity >reception - which is what the old AR88D receiver was for (D for >diversity!) - used by commercial HF fixed stations for many years. > > ....and still used in missile and aircraft telemetry systems. 73, Tom G3OLB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2197 invoked from network); 25 May 2000 08:50:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 May 2000 08:50:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12utGE-0006bl-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 09:44:58 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12utGA-0006bg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 09:44:54 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id JAA01573; Thu, 25 May 2000 09:48:37 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 20945 invoked from network); 25 May 2000 09:40:25 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 25 May 2000 09:40:25 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id JAA25300; Thu, 25 May 2000 09:41:35 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma025290; Thu, 25 May 00 09:41:24 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id ; Thu, 25 May 2000 09:50:09 +0100 Received: by frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Thu, 25 May 2000 09:43:42 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01AB8C68@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: "'LF Group'" , "'KZY'" Subject: LF: DDS Board - Anyone interested ? Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 09:43:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I am considering bulk manufacture of a Printed Circuit Board for the AD9850 DDS chip. The design has already been tested and includes the DDS, output filter, voltage regulator and a 16F84 PIC. Resident software allows the DDS source to be controlled over an RS232 link from a PC with ASCII commands. This allows for control from a simple terminal programme as well as custom software for PSK/ FSK etc. There is no reason why different PIC software can't be used for keyboard / rotary encoder etc. Mostly surface mount (large 1206 components though) but conventional PIC in a socket for easy firmware changes. If there is enough interest I will go ahead with a PCB order. It is possible a company (see WWW.HF-INST.CO.UK ) may take the design on board and market as a complete signal source, but for now I will just get PCBs made if enough interest is shown. Not sure of the price, it depends on such things as quantity, how many plated through holes, delivery timescales and probably the phase of the Moon ! The DDS can be clocked with any frequency source desired. For LF I use a 5MHz input derived from a master reference which allows outputs up to 1.7 MHz with 0.001 Hz resolution, but any clock up to 120MHz (40 MHz maximum output) is useable. Anyone interested, please let me know so I can get an idea of whether it is worth going ahead with a commercial run. Andy G4JNT -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7923 invoked from network); 25 May 2000 09:15:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 May 2000 09:15:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12utd0-0006iA-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 10:08:30 +0100 Received: from mailout02.sul.t-online.com ([194.25.134.17]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12utcz-0006i5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 10:08:30 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from fwd02.sul.t-online.de by mailout02.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 12utcu-0005XO-03; Thu, 25 May 2000 11:08:24 +0200 Received: from (0607144537-0001@[193.159.116.107]) by fwd02.sul.t-online.de with smtp id 12utcj-1GXf6GC; Thu, 25 May 2000 11:08:13 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "bernd grupe" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: lf X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 11:08:13 +0200 Message-ID: <12utcj-1GXf6GC@fwd02.sul.t-online.de> X-Sender: 0607144537-0001@t-dialin.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >I have been rather busy lately and have not provided activity reports. >The only QSO of interest last weekend was with DL0FTZ/P on >QRSs, exchanging 'O'/'O'. >Mike Thanks for nice QRSsing, Mike. QSL-card 'll come soon over bureau. During the annual meeting of the VFDB(hams from Postal- and Telecommunication-Organisations) and its "50 Years existing-event"(jubilee) we got from DARC the ability to operate the call DL0FTZ(club-station of Darmstadt) with a special DOK: VHV2000 .With this call I'll be active up to the end of June, but usually from my homesite, well known as DF8ZR, locator JN49JV.As a fact of the bad ant.-cond. at the meeting-site(Klein Heubach/Main near Aschaffenburg,SE of Frankfurt), it will be impossible to transmit on LF. But I would be very pleased with receiving CQs on QRSS- or DFCW-mode on Friday-, Saturday- or Sunday-morning on the first weekend of June(June.04 ... June.06.00).So I can demonstrate Lowfer-Activity and may find some new friends in DL. I'll document all fetched spectrograms on my website. And will send a QSL to everyone, who will be seen with exceptable quality. looking forward to cu guys, Thanks in advance. Bernd, DF8ZR http://go.to/df8zr From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22137 invoked from network); 25 May 2000 09:26:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 May 2000 09:26:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12utpV-0006kE-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 10:21:25 +0100 Received: from jazzfm.netcomuk.co.uk ([194.42.248.66]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12utpT-0006k9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 10:21:24 +0100 Received: from jazzfm.com [192.168.102.5] by jazzfm.netcomuk.co.uk [127.0.0.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Thu, 25 May 2000 10:18:19 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from JazzFM-Message_Server by jazzfm.com with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 25 May 2000 10:19:51 +0100 Message-ID: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise 5.2 Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 10:19:22 +0100 From: "Martin Charman" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: DDS Board - Anyone interested ? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Disposition: inline X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: Martin@jazzfm.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Andy, Yes please! Martin G4FKK >>> Talbot Andrew 05/25 9:43 am >>> I am considering bulk manufacture of a Printed Circuit Board for the AD9850 DDS chip. The design has already been tested and includes the DDS, output filter, voltage regulator and a 16F84 PIC. Resident software allows the DDS source to be controlled over an RS232 link from a PC with ASCII commands. This allows for control from a simple terminal programme as well as custom software for PSK/ FSK etc. There is no reason why different PIC software can't be used for keyboard / rotary encoder etc. Mostly surface mount (large 1206 components though) but conventional PIC in a socket for easy firmware changes. If there is enough interest I will go ahead with a PCB order. It is possible a company (see www.HF-INST.CO.UK ) may take the design on board and market as a complete signal source, but for now I will just get PCBs made if enough interest is shown. Not sure of the price, it depends on such things as quantity, how many plated through holes, delivery timescales and probably the phase of the Moon ! The DDS can be clocked with any frequency source desired. For LF I use a 5MHz input derived from a master reference which allows outputs up to 1.7 MHz with 0.001 Hz resolution, but any clock up to 120MHz (40 MHz maximum output) is useable. Anyone interested, please let me know so I can get an idea of whether it is worth going ahead with a commercial run. Andy G4JNT -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26785 invoked from network); 25 May 2000 15:59:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 May 2000 15:59:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uzpG-00081t-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 16:45:34 +0100 Received: from mb09.swip.net ([193.12.122.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12uzpF-00081n-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 16:45:33 +0100 Received: from win95 (d212-151-81-122.swipnet.se [212.151.81.122]) by mb09.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA00695 for ; Thu, 25 May 2000 17:44:45 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001f01bfc660$aebac8e0$7a5197d4@win95.swipnet.se> From: "C Andersson" To: "RSGB LF group" Subject: LF: Re: Binaural Stereo and Dichotic Detectors Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 17:47:28 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello all, I read in the general summary in the SM7CMY report: "It was found that: - The ability to recognize telegraphy masked by noise decreases with increasing telegraphy speed; - A low frequency improves recognition. There is a hearing level for best recognition; - Best recognition is obtained with the telegraphy signs 180 degrees out of phase between the ears with the masking noise in phase; - In hearing-impaired telegraph operators, the critical bandwidth is affected but not the phase phenomena; - A human telegraph operator outperforms the electronic decoders at low signal-noise ratios; - Detection of trains of tone pulses masked by noise improves when the duration of the tone pulses is increased and when the duration of the gaps between the tone pulses is decreased. Thresholds of trains of pulses can be predicted by a formula that accounts for the total energy in the train." I have been in touch with the author and he is positive to publishing the material on the www. There are 120 pages to scan in case the original files are not available. /Regards Christer sm6pxj From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28930 invoked from network); 25 May 2000 17:30:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 May 2000 17:30:38 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12v1Mj-0008Mq-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 18:24:13 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12v1Mi-0008Ml-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 18:24:13 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id TAA30524 for ; Thu, 25 May 2000 19:24:10 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000525191943.2e673cc8@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 19:19:43 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: A-index MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The A-index is above 50 for the last 24 hours, maybe an indication for enhanced propagation on 136kHz. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18857 invoked from network); 25 May 2000 21:19:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 May 2000 21:19:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12v4qF-0000aW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 22:06:55 +0100 Received: from tantalum.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.80] helo=tantalum) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12v4qE-0000aR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 22:06:54 +0100 Received: from [62.7.101.191] (helo=default) by tantalum with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12v4q0-0007U8-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 25 May 2000 22:06:43 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bfc68d$03311560$bf65073e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: AR88D and diversity Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 14:56:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all I think Mal is right that the AR88D is not a diversity receiver, BUT I recollect a rack of three which I think had been modified for diversity use. The local oscillators in 2 were disconnected and all three were driven from the LO of the middle chassis in the rack. I believe there was some attachment to the AGC to select the audio, but not sure about that. I can't recollect where I heard about it but it was probably out of Burtonwood USAF Base near Liverpool, in the late 50s. There were all sorts of weirdies around like sets rewired with PVC covered wire!! I gather these were sets used as training exercises for radio technicians (SO BEWARE!) Even in the late 50s there were piles of crates of these beasts new and unopened in the stores, so I guess they were available to be used for all sorts of 'hairbrained schemes'. I did hear that the 1940s 'price' of the set was about Ł1000 which should make it quite an expensive rx, even when compared with Racals, HF2050s and WJ kit! Whoops I'm starting to drool! Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btintenet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8866 invoked from network); 25 May 2000 23:26:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 May 2000 23:26:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12v6vq-00014F-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 00:20:50 +0100 Received: from tomts1.bellnexxia.net ([209.226.175.139] helo=tomts1-srv.bellnexxia.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12v6vp-00014A-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 00:20:49 +0100 Received: from server1 ([206.172.245.88]) by tomts1-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000525232010.LKVY15500.tomts1-srv.bellnexxia.net@server1> for ; Thu, 25 May 2000 19:20:10 -0400 Message-ID: <001701bfc69e$e4a9aa00$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: AR88D and diversity Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 19:04:09 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Alan says....... >Hi all I think Mal is right that the AR88D is not a diversity receiver, BUT >I recollect a rack of three which I think had been modified for diversity >use Well not just a few, I have seen roomfuls of them in this mode and there were many many of these that were later sold as individual receiver units. They had a few extra back panel connectors as well for the diversity functions. They came out of the factory in a diversity package as I once noticed that most of the units in diversity racks had consecutive serial numbers in one lot I saw a few years ago. The AR-88 was a great receiver. I would not recommend that you consider drooling over one, the darn things weigh just around 90 lbs each and have caused a lot of hernias over the years. I once had one that burned up and I decided to garbage it. The garbage man refused to take it as it weighed over his limit of 75 lbs. Lately I have seen a number of them with different varieties of S meters, both factory built that way and some also fitted later during refits. There are some coming out now that are in extremely good condition, well at least they are very very clean. If anyone has a real heartburn for one they are available at Ford's in Smiths Falls, about 30 miles from here. You can reach Bill or Ron Ford at.... http://www.falls.igs.net/~testequipment/ as usual, I have no relationship with the Fords, although I am overdue it seems with a manual I rented from them Hi...... Not all AR-88's are the same either. Some have the 915 kHz IF while others have the 455 kHz and I do not remember which have which.... Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24851 invoked from network); 26 May 2000 09:03:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 26 May 2000 09:03:48 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12vFqG-0002hH-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 09:51:40 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.20]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12vFqE-0002hC-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 09:51:39 +0100 Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 12vFqB-000Jxn-0K for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 08:51:36 +0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 09:42:34 +0100 To: "RSGB LF Group" From: "Tom Boucher" Subject: LF: Diversity reception MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Mike, Alan, Larry and all, Surely the AR88s would be used with an external combiner? I would guess that the D suffix probably indicates the receivers had the necessary interface to an external combiner. Todays aerospace telemetry systems employ space, frequency and polarisation diversity, sometimes simultaneously which involves banks of receivers and combiners. Space diversity, using two physically seperate receive antennas, is used to overcome signal fades due to multi-path phase cancellation. Frequency diversity uses two seperate RF links on different frequencies to overcome radiation pattern nulls on larger vehicles. Polarisation diversity is used to overcome polarisation twisting of the received signal due to vehicle rolling or other factors. A fourth system is time diversity where the data is delayed and transmitted again to overcome short term signal attenuation such as on re-entry vehicles. Multiple receivers are necessary with a combiner which takes each receiver output and sums it in an optimal ratio depending on the S/N from each. A better system, known as Pre-Detection Combining, phase locks the two IF signals together and combines at IF frequency. Maximum theoretical improvement with two similar signals is 3dB but of course if one signal has a good S/N and the other is lousy, then the improvement can be much greater. Could be worth exploring some of these techniques for scraping LF signals out of the noise. Larry did you say you junked an AR88? What a terrible admission! I'm sure someone could have put it to good use, if only at the end of a long chain by a yachtsman. 73, Tom G3OLB. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2042 invoked from network); 26 May 2000 10:17:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 26 May 2000 10:17:10 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12vH4o-0002yB-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 11:10:46 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.89]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12vH4n-0002y6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 11:10:45 +0100 Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12vH4l-0000I5-0V for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 11:10:44 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 10:52:58 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" Subject: Re: LF: Re: AR88D and diversity In-reply-to: <001701bfc69e$e4a9aa00$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >Not all AR-88's are the same either. Some have the 915 kHz IF while others >have the 455 kHz and I do not remember which have which.... > >Larry >VA3LK > >Wasn't it the -LF version which had 915 Khz IF, because 455 Khz is within the RF tuning range? Tom G3OLB > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20138 invoked from network); 26 May 2000 10:19:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 26 May 2000 10:19:16 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12vH6h-0002yR-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 11:12:43 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12vH6g-0002yM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 11:12:42 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12vH6e-0001Fl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 11:12:40 +0100 Message-ID: <16792.200005261012@gemini> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "James Moritz" Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 11:19:33 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Re: AR88D and diversity In-reply-to: <001701bfc69e$e4a9aa00$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, Larry wrote: > Not all AR-88's are the same either. Some have the 915 kHz IF while > others have the 455 kHz and I do not remember which have which.... > > Larry > VA3LK I recently bought an AR88LF receiver - this is more or less the same as the AR88D, but with the MF bands replaced with two LF bands covering about 73kHz - 540kHz. The IF frequency on this is 735kHz. As far as I can see, the "diversity" feature provides for the linking of the AGC lines in a number of receivers. In this way, the receiver getting the strongest signal effectively mutes the others. Old editions of Terman's 'Radio engineering' describe this, saying it can be used for polarisation- or space diversity reception on HF. I intend to try the AR88LF on 136kHz when I have sorted out the selectivity switching - somebody seems to have "realigned" the IF stages..... Can anybody provide me with a manual for the 'LF version? - I only have the 'D manual at the moment. All costs reimbursed, of course. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7404 invoked from network); 26 May 2000 15:17:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 26 May 2000 15:17:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12vLjK-00043r-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 16:08:54 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12vLjI-00043l-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 16:08:53 +0100 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id QAA19292; Fri, 26 May 2000 16:12:35 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (qmail 24876 invoked from network); 26 May 2000 16:04:18 -0000 Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 26 May 2000 16:04:18 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id QAA26506; Fri, 26 May 2000 16:05:22 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma026450; Fri, 26 May 00 16:05:13 GMT Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.1.5) with ESMTP id ; Fri, 26 May 2000 16:14:11 +0100 Received: by frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Fri, 26 May 2000 16:07:41 +0100 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01AB8C73@pdw-mercury-1.dera.gov.uk> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: "'LF Group'" Subject: LF: DDS Board Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 16:07:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: So far I have had 15 replies expressing interest in the DDS source board I am developing, which is almost certainly enough to warrant a commercial manufacturing run. As the PCB layout has been improved since the original version of three years ago, I'll finish breadboarding this week on a home produced version of the new layout, then price up for a properly made job with plated through holes. The PCBs will probably be made available through a company - HF Instruments - which will facilitate orders from overseas. We MAY also consider supplying ready assembled boards - watch this space. Any queries to me at DRASSEW2@INTERALPHA.CO.UK over the holiday period otherwise I won't see them until Wednesday Andy G4JNT -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10727 invoked from network); 26 May 2000 17:30:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 26 May 2000 17:30:18 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12vNr0-0004Wa-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 18:24:58 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from oso.slonet.org ([207.114.180.2] ident=cbuttsch) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12vNqz-0004WU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 18:24:57 +0100 Received: from localhost by oso.slonet.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA01868; Fri, 26 May 2000 10:24:50 -0700 (PDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 10:24:50 -0700 (PDT) From: "Clifford Buttschardt" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: "John Davis" Subject: Re: LF: Optimal width for LF? In-reply-to: <392056A6.F57284D1@slonet.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Further update on the filters mentioned below. I am convinced that any filter has enough tolerance variations that experimental "tweeking" is necessary for minimum ringing. Most of us are using 800 hertz center frequencies obtained from a crystal source. This signal was then gated by a function generator (a morse keyer works just fine too!) while carefully adjusting all poles. Sometimes interchanging pole position is valuable! The conclusion is that experimentation is more valuable than calculation for these filters! Cliff K7RR On Mon, 15 May 2000, Cliff Buttschardt wrote: > Christer and the group. I was delighted to get the two URL's > containing the 30 Hz filter and noise blanker. You might > remember > some years ago the "HDO" phase linear filter. That was when I > was W6HDO rather than K7RR. For years that filter served us > well. I really enjoyed the experimental way of finding least > ringing, so I placed variable resistors in the old design > using > an automatic key. Even the old Williams textbook approach > benefited from experimental "tweaking". 73 Cliff K7RR > > C Andersson wrote: > > > > >Could you post a brief text summary of your design? > > >73, Bob ZL2CA > > > > PA0LQ filter descriptions: > > http://www.alg.demon.co.uk/radio/136/af_filter.htm > > http://home5.swipnet.se/~w-54761/pa0lq_filter.htm > > > > 73 > > Christer, sm6pxj > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29370 invoked from network); 26 May 2000 21:26:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 26 May 2000 21:26:37 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12vRSw-0005BQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 22:16:22 +0100 Received: from fm215.facility.pipex.com ([194.131.104.225]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12vRSv-0005BL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 22:16:21 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from isis (userfl61.uk.uudial.com [62.188.24.50]) by fm215.facility.pipex.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA11972 for ; Fri, 26 May 2000 22:15:16 +0100 (BST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.20000526205805.0097edb0@mail.pncl.co.uk> X-Sender: blanch@mail.pncl.co.uk (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 22:15:37 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Walter Blanchard" Subject: Re: LF: LORAN sidebands In-reply-to: <001e01bfc5f7$f830b980$c128f7c2@oemcomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 04:18 25/05/00 +0100, you wrote: >Can anyone provide a formula or graph showing the relative strength of >sidebands down to 80 kHz, please? > >73 de >John Rabson G3PAI John, Official US Loran-C spec. states : "Specification for energy distribution outside the 90-110 kHz band will be achieved if the spectral density of the radiated signal at 90 kHz and 110 kHz is down at least 20 dB relative to its value at 100 kHz" "Total spectral energy below and above the 90-110 kHz band shall be less than 0.5% each". It is specified this way because the designers are only interested in shaping the rising edge of the pulse properly and don't much care how it decays. So the spectrum differs between transmitters and is not necessarily a smooth exponential decay. That's why we have trouble at 136 kHz. Walter G3JKV. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23624 invoked from network); 31 May 2000 20:58:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 May 2000 20:58:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12xFQe-0000cx-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 31 May 2000 21:49:28 +0100 Received: from tomts2.bellnexxia.net ([209.226.175.140] helo=tomts2-srv.bellnexxia.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12xFQd-0000cs-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 31 May 2000 21:49:27 +0100 Received: from server1 ([216.208.85.48]) by tomts2-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with SMTP id <20000531204853.NAXU25209.tomts2-srv.bellnexxia.net@server1> for ; Wed, 31 May 2000 16:48:53 -0400 Message-ID: <009801bfcb40$c52c6630$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Radiostation Grimeton, radio times? Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 16:32:12 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Greetings: >The open house event take place 8am - 2pm (GMT) Sunday the second of July 2000. >The transmitter will go on air at 8.30 and 8.45am. 0.30 and 0.45pm (GMT) I need some help with this please, 8:30 to 8:45 on July 2, 2000, this I can understand I hope, it is in the middle of the night here, which is a good sign for us. However, Please does 0.30 and 0.45 pm mean on July 3, 2000 which would be AM as I understand things? The designation as "pm" bothers me, I am simply not able to understand what is meant. Some help would sure be appreciated. Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10684 invoked from network); 31 May 2000 21:25:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 May 2000 21:25:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12xFhI-0000hb-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 31 May 2000 22:06:40 +0100 Received: from mb09.swip.net ([193.12.122.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12xFhG-0000hW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 31 May 2000 22:06:39 +0100 Received: from win95 (d212-151-61-76.swipnet.se [212.151.61.76]) by mb09.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA28202 for ; Wed, 31 May 2000 23:05:43 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <002301bfcb44$8badc8a0$de2197d4@win95.swipnet.se> From: "C Andersson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: SV: Re: Radiostation Grimeton, radio times? Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 23:09:43 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >>The transmitter will go on air at 8.30 and 8.45am. 0.30 and 0.45pm (GMT) According to the Swedish text the times are: 8.30, 8.45, 12.30 and 12.45 am (GMT) Probably some language confusion is involved. Earlier this year, when I talked to one of the guys behind the "SAQ scene", he mentioned the possibility to work cross band 17,2 kHz / 136 kHz. Nothing is said about this in the official texts so I have asked the question again and I'm now waiting for answer. 73 Christer sm6pxj From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12328 invoked from network); 31 May 2000 21:30:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 May 2000 21:30:44 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12xFtA-0000kD-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 31 May 2000 22:18:56 +0100 Received: from mb09.swip.net ([193.12.122.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12xFt9-0000jS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 31 May 2000 22:18:55 +0100 Received: from win95 (d212-151-61-76.swipnet.se [212.151.61.76]) by mb09.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA13521 for ; Wed, 31 May 2000 23:17:59 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <003001bfcb46$42c32de0$de2197d4@win95.swipnet.se> From: "C Andersson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: SV: SV: Re: Radiostation Grimeton, radio times? Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 23:22:00 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: "According to the Swedish text the times are: 8.30, 8.45, 12.30 and 12.45 am (GMT)" Sorry, that didn't make much sense either ;-) Too fast hitting the send button. Now, another try: 8.30, 8.45 am. 12.30, 12.45 pm. Four hours between the transmissions. /Christer