From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26466 invoked from network); 29 Feb 2000 23:47:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Feb 2000 23:47:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Pw4M-0004WV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 23:28:46 +0000 Received: from mta10-acc.tin.it ([212.216.176.41] helo=fep10-svc.tin.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Pw4L-0004WN-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 23:28:45 +0000 Received: from tin.it ([212.171.25.197]) by fep10-svc.tin.it (InterMail v4.01.01.02 201-229-111-106) with ESMTP id <20000229232821.DXVU9526.fep10-svc@tin.it> for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 00:28:21 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38BC5131.6593408D@tin.it> Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 00:07:30 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Renato Romero" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Radio Waves below 22 kHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The web site "RADIO WAVES below 22 kHz", on VLF- ELF reception has moved to: http://web.tiscalinet.it/vlfradio. With the OPEN LAB project the site is now opened to external collaborations. We will accept and publish studies on the argument of VLF/ELF monitoring. A message board to exchange infos on those arguments has been opened. Any contribution is welcome, expecially to signal particular listening conditions, news, geomagnetic phaenomena, and so on. 73, IK1QFK Renato ROMERO reromero@tin.it From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9299 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2000 00:20:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Mar 2000 00:20:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Pwm2-0004xy-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 00:13:54 +0000 Received: from gidora.zeta.org.au ([203.26.10.25]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Pwm0-0004xt-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 00:13:53 +0000 Received: (qmail 19584 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2000 00:13:24 -0000 Received: from ppp141.dyn143.pacific.net.au (HELO steve) (210.23.143.141) by gidora.zeta.org.au with SMTP; 1 Mar 2000 00:13:24 -0000 Message-ID: <000901bf8312$f18c0a80$8d8f17d2@steve> From: "Steve Olney" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <38BC5131.6593408D@tin.it> Subject: LF: Re: Radio Waves below 22 kHz Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 11:13:11 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: G'day Renato, Message board - another valuable addition to your excellent site. Great work!!! Thanks. Have posted a message to the message board. Regards Steve From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2870 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2000 07:17:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Mar 2000 07:17:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Q39g-0007zu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 07:02:44 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from posti.saunalahti.fi ([195.74.0.45] helo=vihta.saunalahti.fi) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Q39f-0007zp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 07:02:43 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from default (MDCXXXII.tdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.83.232]) by vihta.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id IAA23426 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 08:55:43 +0200 (EET) Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000301090246.00814bd0@laatikko.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: vaiski1@laatikko.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 09:02:46 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: Signal Strength Measurements by OH2LX MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Measurements of UK Decca's and some other stations : ---------------------------------------------------------- Day ------------------ 25Feb 26Feb 27Feb 28Feb 29Feb FRI SAT SUN MON TUE Time, UTC ------------ 2140- 2305- 2215- 2145- 2145- ---------------------------------------------------------- kHz Ch *d,km AZI* *Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW* ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.8 (6C), 1435, 280, -107 -107 -109 -101 -105 ---------------------------------------------------------- 126.7 (2A), 1565, 269, -112 -105 -112 -104 -104 ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.5 (8E), 1766, 276, -110 -104 -107 -100 -104 ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.0 (3B), 1871, 257, -109 -107 -109 -107 -104 ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.5 (5B), 1890, 247, -104 -104 -109 -103 -101 ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.2 (7D), 2060, 267, -120 -121 -117 -122 -112 ---------------------------------------------------------- 126.4 (1B), 2282, 253, -116 -112 -117 -115 -110 ---------------------------------------------------------- kHz Ch *d,km AZI* *Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW* ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.93 ref, 1553, 228, -80 -81 -85 -77 -81 ---------------------------------------------------------- 138.83 ref, 1221, 226, -79 -83 -89 -81 -82 ---------------------------------------------------------- 135.8 SXV 2490, 182, -106 -107 -107 -107 -101 ---------------------------------------------------------- 137.0 CFH* 5750, 295, -130 -129 -133 -127 -132 ---------------------------------------------------------- * CFH moderately strong on the 28th, peaking at 2215z -119 (Equal to *Record-S* of CFH: 13Feb, 2208z = 119 dBuW) (On the morning of 23Feb 0505z was: -117 dBuW) ---------------------------------------------------------- 25Feb 1933: OH7OL -128; 2048: -128; 2107: -129 25Feb 2020: OH1BS -105 25Feb 2021: SM6PXJ -124 25Feb 2033: OH1LT -127 25Feb 2039: OZ8NJ -129 25Feb 2147: G3KEV -127; 2153: -127 26Feb 2329: OH1BS -109 27Feb 1807: G3KEV -135; 1951: -132 27Feb 1952: OH1BS -113 27Feb 2236: SM6PXJ -121 28Feb 2218: MM0ALM -117; 2222: -117 28Feb 2238_ OH1BS -112: 2259: -113; 2304: -111..-107(f) 28Feb 2248: I5MXX -127 28Feb 2301: OH5UFO -107 29Feb 2112: OH1BS -107 29Feb 2154: MM0ALM -119; 2218: -119 29Feb 2218: SM6PXJ -121..-119(f); 2226: -116(max) ---------------------------------------------------------- (R&S ESH2/---- 10m coax---/1:10/---15m wire-----): Noise level with antenna: with 200Hz IF BandWidth: -25..-22 dB(uV), -132..-129dBmW (varies w qrm etc) ---------------------------------------------------------- End of message of 1 Mar 2000, 0705 UTC, from OH2LX ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9816 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2000 07:50:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Mar 2000 07:50:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Q3hD-0008J2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 07:37:23 +0000 Received: from mail2.hamilton-standard.com ([153.4.57.12]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Q3hB-0008Iw-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 07:37:22 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from curly.hsd.utc.com by mail2.hamilton-standard.com; (8.9.1/) id CAA17568; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 02:47:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from umrsvr.hsd.utc.com by curly.hsd.utc.com; (8.9.0/) id CAA30382; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 02:36:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com by umrsvr.hsd.utc.com; (8.9.0/) id CAA25501; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 02:30:36 -0500 (EST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: by nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 08:25:05 +0100 Message-ID: From: "Soegiono, Gamal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Decca Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 08:25:05 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Dear Vaino, just see your regular Decca FS measurements. Recognize that you "only" have measured the green channels. As far as I understand the working of Decca as a system, it consists of purple, master, red, orange and green channels. The orange channel being not relevant for navigation purpose, instead for identification (?) and system status information (?). Do you have some more detailled info? My main concern is, how can one identify a specific station by other means as measuring frequency and look-up table. Are the purple, master, red and green channels purley unmodulated CW signals? In the past I did monitor Decca on rare occasions once to put up a list of receiveable signals (now years ago). As my receiver is in repair I cannot confirm this myself at the moment. best 73 de Gamal From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16100 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2000 08:38:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Mar 2000 08:38:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Q4XT-00009t-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 08:31:23 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from ds9.sci.fi ([195.74.0.54]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Q4XQ-00009o-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 08:31:20 +0000 Received: from default (MCDLXII.tdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.83.62]) by ds9.sci.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id KAA24380 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 10:31:18 +0200 (EET) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000301103104.00859100@laatikko.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: oh2lx@laatikko.saunalahti.fi X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 10:31:04 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: Re: LF: Decca In-reply-to: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Gamal, At 08:25 1.3.2000 +0100, you wrote: > >GS> just see your regular Decca FS measurements. > There was no need to measure other than *Green* freq's. It is a miracle that all 7 Green freqs have been possible to measure day after day. A lot of QRM. I'll produce a summary of measurements after 31st March when the Decca story is completely finished - for ever. > >GS> Recognize that you "only" have measured the >GS> green channels. As far as I understand the working >GS> of Decca as a system, it consists of purple, master, >GS> red, orange and green channels. The orange channel >GS> being not relevant for navigation purpose, instead for >GS> identification (?) and system status information (?). > >Q> Do you have some more detailled info? > Decca format is so complicated that to explain how it works would cover several pages. Also, the format went thru a couple of large modifications in the past. > >Q> My main concern is, how can one identify a specific >GS> station by other means as measuring frequency and >GS> look-up table. > The five frequencies are *channelized*, so is receiver. > >Q> Are the purple, master, red and green channels >GS> purley unmodulated CW signals? > Yes, plain carriers without modulation. > >GS> In the past I did monitor Decca on rare occasions >GS> once to put up a list of receiveable signals (now >GS> years ago). As my receiver is in repair I cannot >GS confirm this myself at the moment. > In January, after Scandinavian Deccas were shut down, Matti, OH2BDQ telephoned me and asked whether I understand what are all those remaining (Decca) signals. I said that tried to monitor and measure them, but don't understand. Matti is in charge of local Decca station at Mantsala and has been working with them most of his adult life. Mainly, the short *extra peep's* make it complicated as they are transmitted in apparently random manner. 73 de Vaino ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3528 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2000 19:33:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Mar 2000 19:33:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QEb4-0005Ix-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 19:15:46 +0000 Received: from fortune-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.203] helo=fortune.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QEb3-0005Ii-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 19:15:45 +0000 Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by fortune.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.31a 201-229-119-114) with ESMTP id <20000301180938.ELUM29848.fortune.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 10:09:38 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <30795793.951934178857.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 10:09:38 -0800 (PST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Solar flares MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 62.7.158.216 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thought this might be of interest to the group: " A Twisted Tale of Sunspots: Like a double-barreled ray gun, two magnetically complex sunspots near the Sun's central meridian are pointed toward our planet. If solar flares erupt from these regions, Earth could be in for stormy space weather. FULL STORY at http://spacescience.com/headlines/y2000/ast29feb_1.htm " John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freeworld.excite.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3712 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2000 19:34:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Mar 2000 19:34:54 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QEb4-0005Iv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 19:15:46 +0000 Received: from fortune-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.203] helo=fortune.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QEb0-0005Ii-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 19:15:42 +0000 Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by fortune.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.31a 201-229-119-114) with ESMTP id <20000301180633.EKSH29848.fortune.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 10:06:33 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <1333251.951933993446.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 10:06:33 -0800 (PST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Low loss inductors MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 62.7.158.216 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: On Sat, 26 Feb 2000 14:00:10 GMT "Andy Talbot" wrote: >For an estimate of losses : > >Skin depth of copper at 137kHz is approximately 0.18mm From D = 503 >SQRT(Resistivity / Freq / uo) >For Cu Resistivity = 1.7E-8 Ohms / m, and uo (magnetic permeability) = 1 >Diameter of centre conductor = 2.5mm (near enough anyway) >so cross sectional area of conducting path is >0.18mm * 2.5mm = 0.45E-6 m^2 > >RF Resist = Resisivity * Length / Area = 1.7E-8 * 370m / >0.45E-6m^2 = 14 ohms. > >For a quick estimate assume the braid losses are a lot less than the centre >conductor as they have a much larger surface area, so can be ignored >(that may not necessaily be the case) and we can also ignore dielectric losses (a reasonable assumption at these freqs) so Q = Xl / R >= 1722 / 14 = 123 >Which is about what I got on my 5mH conventional coil of 1.5mm wire, 300mm >diameter and 400mm long. You forgot a Pi in the calculation of the cross sectional area. The circumference is Pi D, not just D. Therefore cross sectional area is approx. 1.41E-6 m^2 and RF Resist = 1.7E-8 * 370m / 1.41E-6m^2 = 4.46 ohms. So Q = 1722/4.46 = 386, which is somewhat better than your conventional coil. John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freeworld.excite.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17372 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2000 20:46:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Mar 2000 20:46:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QFtY-000615-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 20:38:56 +0000 Received: from imo23.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.67]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QFtX-000610-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 20:38:55 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo23.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id l.49.1820cfe (3964) for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 15:37:57 -0500 (EST) From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <49.1820cfe.25eed9a7@aol.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 15:37:59 EST Subject: Re: LF: Re: Low loss inductors To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 42 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In a message dated 3/1/00 2:29:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, computernetworks@excite.com writes: << So Q = 1722/4.46 = 386, which is somewhat better than your conventional coil. >> If someone actually performs such a measurement (I hope someone can; math is wonderful and theory is indispensible, but the only way to see if theory is being applied correctly is to test a hypothesis under controlled, repeatable conditions) I think we'll find it to be significantly worse, not better. For one thing, the DC resistance of the center conductor will be found to be somewhat greater than 4.46 ohm in practice, and effective resistance at RF is invariably higher than for DC. For another, as I believe Rik ON7YD has already pointed out, dielectric loss cannot be dismissed as insignificant at these frequencies, considering the lengths of cable involved and the additional loss that results from operating under deliberately-induced high SWR conditions. 73, John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23049 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2000 21:31:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Mar 2000 21:31:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QGT6-0006HT-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 21:15:40 +0000 Received: from mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QGT2-0006HO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 21:15:37 +0000 Received: from [203.96.102.41] by mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <20000301211521.VHNS13182477.mta1-rme@[203.96.102.41]> for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:15:21 +1300 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38BD877B.79BE@xtra.co.nz> Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 10:11:23 +1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Coaxial stub measurements References: <12535.200002282023@gemini> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thanks to James M0BMU for publishing the results of measurements of UR67 coaxial cable at 100 kHz. The very low Q readings are convincing evidence that using coaxial cable for LF inductive stubs would be rather inefficient. I can confirm that well made loading coils can have a Q of at least 300 at 180 kHz. The tests also verify that the use of coaxial cable with open circuit far end (as a capacitor) would be high Q at LF, however there are not many LF transmitting applications where the voltage rating would be sufficient. For a loaded vertical antenna, the voltage on the "upwire" (at the "hot" of a loading coil) can be rather high. For a given antenna capacitance it is generally better to add more turns to the inductor to resonate the antenna, rather than add parallel capacitance (added capacitance draws some reactive current, but does not assist radiation). The inductor can be wound to have fairly high volts per turn, so the whole inductor can withstand much higher RF voltage than could a capacitor made of coaxial cable. If a given loading coil does not quite have enough inductance to resonate with the antenna, it would be better to add more wire to the top loading. Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7322 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2000 23:56:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Mar 2000 23:56:15 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QIoF-0007Qw-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 23:45:39 +0000 Received: from host.king.igs.net ([216.58.2.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QIoA-0007Qr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 23:45:35 +0000 Received: from server1 (ttyC40.king.igs.net [216.58.2.168]) by host.king.igs.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id SAA92208 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 18:45:21 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kayser@king.igs.net) Message-ID: <004301bf83d8$1ef831e0$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: DCF39 Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 18:35:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Greetings All: DCF39 was not visible at all last night, 31/1st. Was it possibly off the air? DCF39 has returned to regular spot tonight although the signal is weaker than usual. Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28076 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2000 07:00:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Mar 2000 07:00:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QPMd-00029Q-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 06:45:35 +0000 Received: from mta03.talk21.com ([62.172.192.172] helo=t21mta03-app.talk21.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QPMc-00029L-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 06:45:35 +0000 Received: from dave ([62.7.186.164]) by t21mta03-app.talk21.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000302064525.ILON28485.t21mta03-app.talk21.com@dave> for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 06:45:25 +0000 Message-ID: <002f01bf8412$d8c17ca0$7d3101d5@dave> From: "Dave Sergeant" To: "rsgb_lf_group" References: <004301bf83d8$1ef831e0$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> Subject: LF: Re: DCF39 Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 06:36:16 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >From Dave G3YMC VA3LK wrote: Greetings All: >DCF39 was not visible at all last night, 31/1st. Was it possibly off the air? >DCF39 has returned to regular spot tonight although the signal is weaker than usual. >Larry >VA3LK Perhaps it was suffering leap year withdrawal symptoms (or there is a long time delay in your message) - I think you meant 29/2. As far as I am aware DCF39 has not been off, but there again when you say 'night' that is usually after we in the UK have gone to bed. However there are occassional big dips in its signal in Europe, and it has been known to be off for short periods. 73s Dave dsergeant@iee.org http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sergeantd From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20466 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2000 12:44:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Mar 2000 12:44:54 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QUon-0004p3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 12:35:01 +0000 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QUoj-0004oy-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 12:34:57 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12QUob-0000B3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 12:34:50 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 12:26:40 +0000 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 12:26:38 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Flare X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: An X-class (biggest) solar flare occurred this morning at about 0830UTC, with an M-class flare just afterwards. The A index is still low at about 20 - it was over 50 when Larry had the good reception of DCF39 last month - but will probably climb. Expect good conditions in the next few days. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25910 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2000 13:59:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Mar 2000 13:59:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QW08-0005XX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 13:50:48 +0000 Received: from host.king.igs.net ([216.58.2.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QW04-0005XS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 13:50:45 +0000 Received: from server1 (ttyC20.king.igs.net [216.58.2.148]) by host.king.igs.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id IAA28808 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 08:50:34 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kayser@king.igs.net) Message-ID: <005001bf844e$32c1f230$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Flare and more flares Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 08:49:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Greetings All: >An X-class (biggest) solar flare occurred this morning at about >0830UTC from Mike, G3XDV A second flare event a 1338 utc has occurred a few minutes ago, the magnitude is unknown as yet. I have the RX on and will check every hour for DCF39 using a new resonant loop antenna I have just put up two days ago. It is tuned to 138.83. If DCF39 goes way up I will switch resonant plug ins to 137.77 and start phoning those for whom I have phone numbers. The new antenna has cut Loran-C interference way down, I have a hard time seeing Loran-C lines on the screen now. Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22971 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2000 15:43:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Mar 2000 15:43:42 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QXW1-0006Ja-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 15:27:49 +0000 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QXVz-0006JR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 15:27:47 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12QXVs-0006gG-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 15:27:41 +0000 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 15:09:26 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 15:09:18 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Re: Flare and more flares In-reply-to: <005001bf844e$32c1f230$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > A second flare event a 1338 utc has occurred a few minutes ago, the > magnitude is unknown as yet. > Larry > VA3LK The really useful site at: http://www.dxlc.com/solar/index.html says: Comment added at 08:32 UTC on March 2: A major flare, an impulsive X1.1 event, peaked at 08:28 UTC. The source of the flare was region 8882. Further major flares are possible, both from region 8882 and 8891. Comment added at 09:22 UTC: Region 8886 has been developing quickly and produced an impulsive M1.0/1F flare at 08:43 UTC, this event may have been triggered by the X1.1/2B flare in region 8882 some minutes earlier. Comment added at 13:54 UTC: Region 8882 produced another major flare at 13:43 UTC, an impulsive M6.5 event. The X1.1 flare earlier today was accompanied by a very fast coronal mass ejection and a moderately strong type II sweep. Proton fluxes increased slightly above background values. Further major flares from region 8882 could start proton events at Earth. This sounds promising. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3497 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2000 21:06:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Mar 2000 21:06:15 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QcfA-0000KY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 20:57:36 +0000 Received: from mashie.force9.net ([195.166.128.30]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Qcf8-0000KR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 20:57:34 +0000 Received: (qmail 9141 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2000 20:57:16 -0000 Received: from mayfly.plus.net.uk (HELO mayfly.force9.net) (195.166.128.28) by mashie.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Mar 2000 20:57:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 18405 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2000 20:57:15 -0000 Received: from 240.01-01.quay.dial.plus.net.uk (HELO main) (212.159.64.240) by mayfly.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Mar 2000 20:57:15 -0000 Message-ID: <00b801bf848a$9886fd40$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: Subject: Re: LF: Re: Flare and more flares Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 21:02:14 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Mike, Larry etc. I'll keep an ear on CFH! Dave G3YXM > > > This sounds promising. > > > Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) > http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18671 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2000 22:43:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Mar 2000 22:43:00 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Qe18-00016m-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 22:24:22 +0000 Received: from mashie.force9.net ([195.166.128.30]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Qe15-00016h-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 22:24:19 +0000 Received: (qmail 19543 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2000 22:14:26 -0000 Received: from mayfly.plus.net.uk (HELO mayfly.force9.net) (195.166.128.28) by mashie.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Mar 2000 22:14:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 23786 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2000 22:14:25 -0000 Received: from 2.02-01.quay.dial.plus.net.uk (HELO main) (212.159.65.2) by mayfly.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Mar 2000 22:14:25 -0000 Message-ID: <012501bf8495$5fc36e20$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: CFH Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 22:18:43 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear all. CFH was quite strong at 2130 gmt then faded almost to nothing by 2155. It is now rising fast at 2215. Much better than usual at this time. Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 736 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2000 05:54:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Mar 2000 05:54:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Qknt-0004HW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 05:39:09 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.sci.fi ([195.74.0.41] helo=pyyhe.saunalahti.fi ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Qknr-0004HQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 05:39:08 +0000 Received: from default (MMCDXCVI.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.44.96]) by pyyhe.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id HAA22199 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 07:50:06 +0200 (EET) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000303073902.00854db0@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: oh2lx@pop.saunalahti.fi X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 07:39:02 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: Re: LF report In-reply-to: <012501bf8495$5fc36e20$0600a8c0@main> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: CQ LF de Vaino, OH2LX, 2nd March 2000: Monitoring started at 2000 UTC. SXV 135.8 was weaker than normal, it slowly faded down with minimum around 2050, while background noise level increased some 15..20 dB. SXV slowly returned to normal levels after 2130, so did the background noise - a bit unusual event (not easy to know which noise is solar in origin). CFH was not heard at all, still Nil at 0320 UTC. Four OH's heard had fade on signals, OH7OL was Nil he was sending vvv's while we talked on telephone. At 22:18 2.3.2000 -0000, you wrote: >Dear all. > >CFH was quite strong at 2130 gmt then faded almost to nothing by 2155. >It is now rising fast at 2215. >Much better than usual at this time. > >Dave G3YXM. ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26862 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2000 10:45:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Mar 2000 10:45:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QpUT-0006eC-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 10:39:25 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QpUR-0006e4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 10:39:24 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA122842 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 11:39:14 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000303123628.21e7790c@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 12:36:28 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Flares and conditions In-reply-to: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 09:47 3/03/00 -0000, G3XDV wrote: >Not sure how much influence the flares had on the conditions (it's >easy to see coincidence as evidence), especially as the good >conditions Larry experienced last month coincided with a very high >A index (50+), a few days =after= the major flares. The A index >was 18 on the 1st, and is reported today (from yesterday's data) as >down to 12. Nevertheless this is interesting data. Solar activity (storms -flares) have immediate effects on propagation (as shortwave blackout or MDE) that are caused by electromagnetic radiation and delayed effects (as aurora on VHF) that are caused by ionised particles travelling at much slower speed. The delay can be several days. The fact that the improved propagation noted by Larry correlates with the A-index could mean the it are these delayed effects that affect LF propagation. 73, Rik From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23900 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2000 10:53:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Mar 2000 10:53:29 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QokQ-0006Fe-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 09:51:50 +0000 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QokO-0006FZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 09:51:49 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12QokA-0004Py-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 09:51:36 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 09:47:02 +0000 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 09:47:00 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Flares and conditions X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Following yesterday's X and M flares, conditions appeared to be improved last night. OH1TN was 559 with me - stronger than normal - and CFH was S7 from about 2030 (still daylight in Canada) which is much earlier than normal. CFH was S9 by the time I went to bed at 2300, but I left ON5OO's Eclipse program running overnight. I produced a rough graph this morning and found that CFH gradually climbed to a peak at about 0230UTC, dipped dramatically about an hour later, rapidly recovered, then gradually declined to 0730 and dropped out at 0830. Interestingly, there was a further M class flare at 0215. I have to run the Eclipse data into a spread sheet to produce a proper graph, and I will post the result on my web site tomorrow. Not sure how much influence the flares had on the conditions (it's easy to see coincidence as evidence), especially as the good conditions Larry experienced last month coincided with a very high A index (50+), a few days =after= the major flares. The A index was 18 on the 1st, and is reported today (from yesterday's data) as down to 12. Nevertheless this is interesting data. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26286 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2000 11:05:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Mar 2000 11:05:17 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QpKA-0006WX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 10:28:46 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QpK9-0006WS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 10:28:45 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id KAA29378 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 10:28:36 GMT X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000030310265268199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 10:26:52 GMT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: 73kHz Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit from James Moritz > Spent a couple of hours on 73kHz on Friday evening; didn't > see/hear any other signals - Rugby TX was generating it's usual > racket. However, the effort was worth it because my signal was > seen by Markus, DF6NM, in Bavaria, as he reported earlier. Great > stuff. I intend to keep doing Fridays on 73kHz; I will also try and get > on the band on Saturday mornings if time permits - Congratulations Jim. You have inspired me to go back on to the band. I hope to be on tonight, Friday, between 1730 and 1930hrs and possibly after 2100hrs -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19810 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2000 13:31:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Mar 2000 13:31:55 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Qs0C-00081y-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 13:20:20 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Qs08-0007zD-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 13:20:16 +0000 Received: from gemini.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.44] helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12QrxL-0004ZF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 13:17:23 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <1031.200003031324@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 13:25:36 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz this evening X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, I Intend to be on 73kHz this evening - probably won't be home much before 2000utc, so will be on the air a little after that. I also intend to operate Saturday morning from around 0800 for an hour at least, to try to take advantage of lower noise levels that will hopefully exist at some QTH's in the morning. I will be using normal CW and QRSS. For the last few days, the Rugby TX has been putting out a carrier at about 73.15kHz, and a RTTY - like signal with 100Hz shift and 73.3kHz centre frequency. I am not sure whether this actually reduces the noise level lower down the band, but it does seem to be more organised into broad lines, rather than the continuous mush it was previously - so this could benefit QRSS signals. Hope to see you later, Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19862 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2000 14:40:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Mar 2000 14:40:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Qt3J-000028-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 14:27:37 +0000 Received: from mail04.hostcenter.com ([195.186.64.57]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Qt3F-000022-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 14:27:34 +0000 Received: from www303.hostcenter.com (195.186.64.84) by mail04.hostcenter.com (RS ver 1.0.53) with SMTP id 06094935 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 15:27:11 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <38C04ABD.F9EFDB90@phonakcom.ch> X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 15:29:02 -0800 From: "Toni Baertschi" Organization: Phonak Communications AG X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz this evening References: <1031.200003031324@gemini> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Loop-Detect: 1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: What is your exact frequency on 73? 73 de HB2ASB James Moritz wrote: > Dear LF Group, > I Intend to be on 73kHz this evening - probably won't be home > much before 2000utc, so will be on the air a little after that. I also > intend to operate Saturday morning from around 0800 for an hour > at least, to try to take advantage of lower noise levels that will > hopefully exist at some QTH's in the morning. I will be using normal > CW and QRSS. > > For the last few days, the Rugby TX has been putting out a carrier > at about 73.15kHz, and a RTTY - like signal with 100Hz shift and > 73.3kHz centre frequency. I am not sure whether this actually > reduces the noise level lower down the band, but it does seem to > be more organised into broad lines, rather than the continuous > mush it was previously - so this could benefit QRSS signals. > > Hope to see you later, > > Cheers, Jim Moritz > 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18818 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2000 16:16:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Mar 2000 16:16:23 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QudJ-0000ww-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 16:08:53 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QudH-0000wr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 16:08:51 +0000 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12QuaV-0001DQ-00; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 16:05:59 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <16370.200003031613@gemini> From: "James Moritz" Organization: University of Hertfordshire X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: "Toni Baertschi" , rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 16:14:12 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: QRG on LF: 73kHz this evening In-reply-to: <38C04ABD.F9EFDB90@phonakcom.ch> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Date sent: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 15:29:02 -0800 From: Toni Baertschi Organization: Phonak Communications AG To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz this evening Send reply to: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > What is your exact frequency on 73? > > 73 de HB2ASB > > James Moritz wrote: > > > Dear LF Group, > > I Intend to be on 73kHz this evening - probably won't be home > > much before 2000utc, so will be on the air a little after that. I also > > intend to operate Saturday morning from around 0800 for an hour at > > least, to try to take advantage of lower noise levels that will > > hopefully exist at some QTH's in the morning. I will be using normal CW > > and QRSS. Dear Toni et al, 71.8kHz is the normal frequency +/- 100Hz - will QSY to 72.0 or 72.2 if more than 1 QSO on the band - but this does not happen often! Hope to see you there, Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1641 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2000 19:31:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Mar 2000 19:31:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QxeZ-0002YO-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 19:22:23 +0000 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QxeY-0002YI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 19:22:23 +0000 Received: from as24-s15-144-163.cwci.net ([195.44.144.163] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QxeP-0002Ay-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 19:22:13 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C00E45.F680B421@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 19:11:01 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: 73 KHZ AGN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The band is so quiet in Co Tyrone that one could hear a pin drop. Would be ideal for long haul tests if it was available to all of EU. Not worth the effort for a few local UK contacts. 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23079 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2000 19:31:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Mar 2000 19:31:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QxeT-0002YG-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 19:22:17 +0000 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QxeS-0002YB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 19:22:16 +0000 Received: from as24-s15-144-163.cwci.net ([195.44.144.163] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QxeJ-0002Ag-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 19:22:07 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C00B54.F409046@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 18:58:28 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: 73 khz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The band is very quiet here and the Rugby tx although strong does not have the whiskers that those in the Midlands and South suffer from. I just tune across it at times to see what is going on but am not interested in the band since it is UK only. I think the tx/rx results from here would be outstanding on 73 khz if I fired up. With the antenna system at MMOALM he too would achieve good results on the band if he was interested. Had the band been available to the rest of EU I could be interested but I understand all operations cease in June anyway. In the past I have heard some very strong amateur signals possibly better than I hear them on 136 khz. 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20667 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2000 21:43:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Mar 2000 21:43:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QzdO-0003Yf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 21:29:18 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12QzdN-0003Ya-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 21:29:17 +0000 Received: from cel266 ([151.25.130.11]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA06404 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 22:28:59 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 22:28:59 +0100 Message-ID: <4.1.20000303222511.00bd2f00@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 22:29:10 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: CFH In-reply-to: <012501bf8495$5fc36e20$0600a8c0@main> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In 23.21 03/03/00 , hai scritto: >Dear all. > >CFH was quite strong at 2130 gmt then faded almost to nothing by 2155. >It is now rising fast at 2215. >Much better than usual at this time. > >Dave G3YXM. > At my QTH in Nort Italy CFH was about 15 dB over noise on Spectrogram at 10 Hz resolution, around 0200z of March 3. Is the frequency almost exactly 137.00 ? I had only a short look to the signal ... about 5 minutes, and no QSB. 73 - Marco IK1ODO spin@inrete.it Rivalta, ITALY JN35SA (N 45 01' 25.6", E 7 31' 09.4") From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3191 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2000 23:15:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Mar 2000 23:15:34 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12R1C8-0004No-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 23:09:16 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12R1C7-0004Nj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 23:09:15 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id XAA10114 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 23:09:06 GMT X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000030322550668199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 22:55:06 GMT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: 73kHz and 136kHz QSO with I5TGC Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Set up the station for 73kHz after some time trying to discover the resonant point of the antenna after making some changes. Amplifier and antenna working fine with over one amp antenna current. Set the station to send slow CW from around 1800 but noticed the stability of the oscillator was very poor. Switched off the transmitter at 1900 and saw and heard a nice stable signal from M0MBU. I will not be on 73kHz until I have modified my crystal mixer driver for the band! Retuned the station for 136kHz Looked for I5TGC at 2000 who came up on 137.710kHz at readability T increasing to M during the transmission Gave Cesare M and received O Cesare's signal increased to O on the next transmission and remained stable for the next period of the transmission I modified the signal report to O This signal from a 20mW erp station over a distance of 1150km is remarkable. The signal has to go over the Alps - perhaps it used the tunnel this time! If you want to see Cesare's station you will find it on < http://www.dadacasa.com/i5tgc> I have recorded this signal - I must get a web site! -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 388 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 03:49:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 03:49:32 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12R5KO-0006Vb-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 03:34:04 +0000 Received: from host.king.igs.net ([216.58.2.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12R5KM-0006VV-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 03:34:02 +0000 Received: from server1 (ttyC15.king.igs.net [216.58.2.143]) by host.king.igs.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id WAA42097; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 22:33:50 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kayser@king.igs.net) Message-ID: <002601bf858a$6127c2c0$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org, "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: CFH Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 22:06:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Marco >At my QTH in Nort Italy CFH was about 15 dB over noise on Spectrogram >at 10 Hz resolution, around 0200z of March 3. >Is the frequency almost exactly 137.00 ? Yes, CFH is exactly centered on 137.000 kHz. The pseudo random noise modulation has no carrier and there is nothing marking the center of the occupied spectrum so it is necessary to look at the power spectrum and find the middle which will always be 137.000 kHz. CFH does on occasion send other modulation methods, in the last three months I have heard a FAX transmission on the frequency as well as at least one FSK session as well. Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 327 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 10:06:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 10:06:38 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RBMK-00012W-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 10:00:28 +0000 Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com ([205.188.157.35]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RBMJ-00012R-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 10:00:27 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from MarkusVester@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id l.92.23251a4 (3874) for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:00:10 -0500 (EST) From: MarkusVester@aol.com Message-ID: <92.23251a4.25f238a9@aol.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:00:09 EST Subject: LF: 71.8kHz: 3 stns seen in Nuremberg To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 62 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello all, Thanks to Jim and Mike for their kind answers to my last report. Sri this week was busy, so I'm still due to reply. Last night (3rd to 4th of march) I have seen at least three of you around 71.8kHz. Impulsive noise was worse than last week, making copy difficult with T to M at best. Average noise was around -52dB in 0.4 Hz. "0dB" corresponds to -66dBm (S9+7dB) at the rx input, but I cant give absolute levels in dBuV/m as the ant is not calibrated on 73k. Times are in UT, and some files have been saved on my disk. 21:00.. 71800 -43dB M..T: cq M0BMU (several times) slight drift -2 Hz 21:28 71818 -41 dB T: cq G3XTZ (?) 2143..2213 71800/71818 T: M0BMU - G3XTZ (?) in qso, very difficult hardly copied the contents. 2134..2143 71775 -44dB T: (unid) someone calling in qrss, sri couldnt make out the call sign. 2232 71820..71817 -37dB 159 in cw (unid) someone in fast cw, no aural copy, might have been O in qrss... Had spectrogram running overnight from 2300, recorded some activity (BMU agn?) around 71800 for another hour or so. The noise stayed up around -52 dB all night, but went down to -61dB around 0550 with daylight and has stayed low since. The decca or loran lines, invisible in darkness, came out only in the lower noise. After morning coffee, a surprise: amateurs in "near hifi"! 0759 71798 -45dB O: cq M0BMU k 0803 71786 -46dB O: G3XDV (there you are Mike, fb!) Both of them seen cq-ing again and again for a while, MBU still now at 0930. Signals are nearly the same as in darkness, and the SNR (17dB in .4Hz) is really nice in the daytime. I'd love to try a LF crossband-qso on 71.8 / 137.7 kHz. Hope to get the tx-ant on the air again by 1200 UT today. Please give me about a minute to switch bands each time. 73s to everybody on 73 Markus, DF6NM in JN59NK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25966 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 12:33:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 12:33:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RDb9-0002DN-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 12:23:55 +0000 Received: from mashie.force9.net ([195.166.128.30]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RDb8-0002DH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 12:23:54 +0000 Received: (qmail 10146 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 12:23:41 -0000 Received: from mayfly.plus.net.uk (HELO mayfly.force9.net) (195.166.128.28) by mashie.force9.net with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 12:23:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 2444 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 12:23:41 -0000 Received: from 37.3b-01.quay.dial.plus.net.uk (HELO main) (212.159.122.37) by mayfly.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 12:23:41 -0000 Message-ID: <002901bf85d5$2fd85c20$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <92.23251a4.25f238a9@aol.com> Subject: LF: Re: 71.8kHz: 3 stns seen in Nuremberg Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 12:18:48 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Markus. > 2232 71820..71817 -37dB 159 in cw > (unid) someone in fast cw, no aural copy, might have been O in qrss... > That was me! Sorry I didn't put out QRS at that time. I could hear nothing on RX due to interference from the Rugby LF TX on 73.3kHz which is not far from here. Next Tuesday is the first Tuesday in March and Rugby may be off for maintenance in the morning. Worth another listen? 73, Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7750 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 14:33:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 14:33:42 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RFWK-00039o-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 14:27:04 +0000 Received: from newmail.spectraweb.ch ([194.158.230.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RFWJ-00039j-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 14:27:03 +0000 Received: from freesurf.ch (194.230.239.136) by newmail.spectraweb.ch for ; 4 Mar 2000 15:25:03 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C11CD7.D4456AFD@freesurf.ch> Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 15:25:27 +0100 From: "Toni" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [de] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en-US,en-GB,fr-FR MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: 73 KHZ AGN References: <38C00E45.F680B421@netscapeonline.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: But we could try Xband QSOs 73/136 (I had already one with G3LDO). May be June is not the end of the story and one day we can get an additional allocation on 73 in EU. 73 de Toni, HB2ASB g3kev schrieb: > > The band is so quiet in Co Tyrone that one could hear a pin drop. > Would be ideal for long haul tests if it was available to all of EU. Not > worth the effort for a few local UK contacts. > 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26777 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 17:14:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 17:14:18 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RI0q-0004Qu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 17:06:44 +0000 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RI0p-0004Qo-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 17:06:43 +0000 Received: from [195.44.220.37] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RI0g-0003b5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 17:06:34 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C1422B.9317AF6@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 17:04:44 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: CFH Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: CFH early morning until 1000 utc a good signal but still audible all day several db above NF. SXV solid signal all day also, this is usually the case here. de G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11947 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 17:32:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 17:32:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RIIj-0004YW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 17:25:13 +0000 Received: from as-img-5.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.148] helo=spamgaae.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RIIi-0004YQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 17:25:12 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaae.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id MAA06863 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 12:24:33 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 12:24:07 -0500 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 73 kHz: now I am curious To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003041224_MC2-9BC7-DB35@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello friends, just returned from a trip to the US (no LF gear ...) and heard about the successes of Markus, DF6NM in receiving 73 kHz signals from the UK. Now I got curious and set up my receiving station for that band as well (crossband 73/136 should also be possible with my current setup). What is the best frequency? Is it 71.800 kHz? Currently I am standby in SCW there and will see, what I can see. Who is QRV when? Vy 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) http://www.qru.de From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1564 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 17:54:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 17:54:35 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RIeF-0004gR-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 17:47:27 +0000 Received: from [194.73.73.138] (helo=ruthenium) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RIeE-0004gM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 17:47:26 +0000 Received: from [62.6.65.253] (helo=default) by ruthenium with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12RIgH-0004RB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 17:49:33 +0000 Message-ID: <000201bf8600$dad6dea0$fd41063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: CFH Identification Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 09:30:09 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Marco, another tip from Jon was that around the operator shift-change time (about 2300z) the mod will usually be killed and the two extreme shift frequencies applied just long enough for the oncomming operators to read a frequency counter, before the mod is returned. I have seen this happen at around 2315z but as early as 2250z Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21844 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 18:14:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 18:14:54 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RIy0-0004vB-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 18:07:52 +0000 Received: from cask.force9.net ([195.166.128.29]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RIxz-0004v6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 18:07:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 8812 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 18:07:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO main) (212.159.122.206) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 18:07:41 -0000 Message-ID: <003801bf8605$35cdc720$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <200003041224_MC2-9BC7-DB35@compuserve.com> Subject: LF: Re: 73 kHz: now I am curious Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 18:12:27 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Geri. Below 72kHz seems to be quieter for us here due to the QRM from Rugby on 73.3 and all its' sidebands. If it is quieter with you somewhere else in the band then we could transmit there.. My problem is that, with the antenna resonated on 73k, the receive performance on 136 is degraded but it may be worth a try some time. Let me know when you would like to try, I'm sure Jim will also be interested. 73, Dave G3YXM. ------------------------------------- original message: just returned from a trip to the US (no LF gear ...) and heard about the successes of Markus, DF6NM in receiving 73 kHz signals from the UK. Now I got curious and set up my receiving station for that band as well (crossband 73/136 should also be possible with my current setup). What is the best frequency? Is it 71.800 kHz? Currently I am standby in SCW there and will see, what I can see. Who is QRV when? Vy 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) http://www.qru.de From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24095 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 18:50:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 18:50:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RJTq-00059l-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 18:40:46 +0000 Received: from ds-img-1.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.134] helo=spdmgaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RJTp-00059g-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 18:40:45 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id NAA12152 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 13:40:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 13:40:01 -0500 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: 73 kHz: now I am curious To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003041340_MC2-9BBB-67DE@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dave (and Jim), >My problem is that, with the antenna resonated on 73k, the receive >performance on 136 is degraded but it may be worth a try some time. Let me >know when you would like to try, I'm sure Jim will also be interested. if the storm keeps my antenna up in the air, I might be QRV around 07.00 UTC tomorrow (Sunday March 5, 2000) on 71.800 kHz (the frequency seems to be quiet over here). I can stay approx. 1 hour. If I see someone calling cq signing "kx" (k x-band) I will call in SlowCW on 137.690 kHz. Lets give it a try! Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) P.S.: Markus, DF6NM, how strong do you receive Rugby/on what frequency exactly? From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 671 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 19:38:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 19:38:42 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RKHU-0005WK-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 19:32:04 +0000 Received: from cask.force9.net ([195.166.128.29]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RKHT-0005WF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 19:32:03 +0000 Received: (qmail 12776 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 19:31:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO main) (212.159.120.198) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 19:31:54 -0000 Message-ID: <00bb01bf8610$f3a77560$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" References: <200003041340_MC2-9BBB-67DE@compuserve.com> Subject: LF: Re: Re: 73 kHz: now I am curious Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 19:15:33 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Geri and Markus. I will put out some QRS calls on Sunday morning, listening around 137.7 +/- 150Hz. I will try to keep my wandering VFO on 71.80 starting at 0700 for Geri and again at 0900 for Markus. That's got to be me on your trace Markus, I can tell by the drift! 73 (yes indeed!) from Dave G3YXM. ------------------------------------------ if the storm keeps my antenna up in the air, I might be QRV around 07.00 UTC tomorrow (Sunday March 5, 2000) on 71.800 kHz (the frequency seems to be quiet over here). I can stay approx. 1 hour. If I see someone calling cq signing "kx" (k x-band) I will call in SlowCW on 137.690 kHz. Lets give it a try! Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) P.S.: Markus, DF6NM, how strong do you receive Rugby/on what frequency exactly? From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26555 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 08:48:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 08:48:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RWUy-000335-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 08:34:48 +0000 Received: from as-img-2.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.145] helo=spamgaab.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RWUw-0002zM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 08:34:46 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaab.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id DAA29893 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 5 Mar 2000 03:34:05 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 03:33:33 -0500 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 73 kHz/136 kHz x-band: it works! To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003050333_MC2-9BD1-43A@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Dave, Graham and other LF enthusuasts, indeed, 73 kHz/136 kHz works! I just completed successsful QSOs with Dave, G3YXM (71.795 kHz/136.690 kHz, O/O, 826 km) and Graham G3XTZ (71.820 kHz/136.690 kHz, M/O, 732 km). Thanks to Markus, DF6NM for your observations, without your hints I would never have given it a try! Congrats on your 73 kHz gear, guys, you are doing fine over here in DL (screenshots soon on my homepage http://www.qru.de)! I believe there was another station also on 71.810 kHz but I could not identify it due to the higher noise levels later this morning. So, guys on the continent: tune down your rigs to the 73 kHz band, it seems to be nicely calm here in the morning, Rugby is no problem over here and lets give our UK fellows a chance to work a few more Europeans before they close down the band in a couple of months. Remember: ending your cq-call with "KX" (= k on x-band) means, that you are looking for x-band contacts, it woked fine this morning. Now I am looking forward for another challenge: Christer, what do you think about a crossband QSL 8 kHz/136 kHz? Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23732 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 08:58:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 08:58:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RWiK-000369-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 08:48:36 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from smtper.inrete.it ([212.110.32.184] helo=mailer.inrete.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RWiI-000364-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 08:48:34 +0000 Received: from cel266 ([151.20.73.19]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA11811 for ; Sun, 5 Mar 2000 09:48:17 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 09:48:17 +0100 Message-ID: <4.1.20000305092332.00a1d490@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Versione 4.1 Data: Sun, 05 Mar 2000 09:42:00 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: CFH Identification In-reply-to: <000201bf8600$dad6dea0$fd41063e@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In 09.23 05/03/00 , Alan G3NYK wrote: >Hi Marco, another tip from Jon was that around the operator shift-change >time (about 2300z) the mod will usually be killed and the two extreme shift >frequencies applied just long enough for the oncomming operators to read a >frequency counter, before the mod is returned. I have seen this happen at >around 2315z but as early as 2250z > I noticed this at 2255z of March 3. Firstly the low tone for 13 seconds, then the high tone for 7 sec. The shift should be 85 or 86 Hz (counting pixels on Spectrogram image ...) At that time the MSK carrier was quite weak, hard to recognize, because of the spreading of the modulation. S/N of the unmodulated carrier is at least 30 dB in 1.3 Hz band. And then the signal becomes louder ... maximum for me is around 0200z, +/- 30 minutes, and the signal is about 20 dB louder than at 23z, so giving roughly 50 dB of s/n in 1.3 Hz, or 55 dB in 0.3 Hz. Well, what is the ERP of CFH ? 100 kW ? Wow. Maybe we don't need X-class flares, after all. 73 - Marco Marco Bruno - IK1ODO spin@inrete.it SPIN Electronics - www.spin-it.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5837 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 10:37:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 10:37:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RYDU-0003vB-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 10:24:52 +0000 Received: from cask.force9.net ([195.166.128.29]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RYDT-0003v6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 10:24:51 +0000 Received: (qmail 2248 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 10:24:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO main) (212.159.121.249) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 10:24:42 -0000 Message-ID: <001201bf868d$bb9b6fa0$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <200003050333_MC2-9BD1-43A@compuserve.com> Subject: LF: Re: 73 kHz/136 kHz x-band: it works! Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 10:27:58 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Geri et al Great! Thanks also for the nice Spectrogram of my drifting tx...... The strange thing is that I could see nothing of Graham's signal here, the Rugby QRM is so strong. Funny to think he was being seen in Germany and not here! Any other stations like to try a crossband now that we know it works? BTW, I think Peter's (G3LDO) QSO with Toni HB9ASB was the first international crossband from 73k. 73, Dave G3YXM. ------------------------------------------------------- indeed, 73 kHz/136 kHz works! I just completed successsful QSOs with Dave, G3YXM (71.795 kHz/136.690 kHz, O/O, 826 km) and Graham G3XTZ (71.820 kHz/136.690 kHz, M/O, 732 km). Thanks to Markus, DF6NM for your observations, without your hints I would never have given it a try! Congrats on your 73 kHz gear, guys, you are doing fine over here in DL (screenshots soon on my homepage http://www.qru.de)! I believe there was another station also on 71.810 kHz but I could not identify it due to the higher noise levels later this morning. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18250 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 10:55:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 10:55:50 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RYXz-00043E-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 10:46:03 +0000 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.20]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RYXy-000439-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 10:46:02 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from dennison.demon.co.uk ([194.222.239.33]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 12RYXp-000KHz-0K for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 5 Mar 2000 10:45:53 +0000 Message-ID: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 10:45:02 +0000 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Mike Dennison" Subject: LF: CFH plots MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I have posted two graphs of CFH on my website at: http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/mike/cfh.htm (at the time f writing this it is not linked from any other page). One was from last Thursday after the X flare, and may show the immediate effect of an M flare on propagation. The other was last night. They are quite different, and it is interesting to note the differences and similarities. For instance, on Thursday it rose to a peak of about S9+10dB at 0230 (just after the M flare) and the fell gradually to dawn, but last night it peaked S9 at 2300 and very slowly fell from there. Similarities are dips at about 0400 and a dip and peak at about 0630 (UK dawn). I will post more graphs to improve our understanding of what's normal so that enhanced propagation and its causes can be identified. Thanks are due to ON5OO for writing the monitoring software. Does anyone have a good copy of the original EXE file? The one I posted on my site is corrupt and I deleted all other copies - doh! -- Mike, G3XDV IO91VT http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5609 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 11:56:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 11:56:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RZVq-0004Wk-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 11:47:54 +0000 Received: from smtp1.xs4all.nl ([194.109.127.48]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RZVp-0004Wf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 11:47:53 +0000 Received: from v3q4v1 (dc2-isdn879.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.151.111]) by smtp1.xs4all.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA16096 for ; Sun, 5 Mar 2000 12:47:37 +0100 (CET) From: "M. Sanders \(PA3BSH\)" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: CFH plots Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 12:40:18 +0100 Message-ID: <000101bf8697$94cb5340$61976dc2@v3q4v1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-reply-to: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All, You can download the software at: http://www.veron.nl/tech/prog/eclipse.htm /// > Thanks are due to ON5OO for writing the monitoring software. Does anyone > have a good copy of the original EXE file? The one I posted on my site > is corrupt and I deleted all other copies - doh! > > -- > Mike, G3XDV /// Congratulatins on the results on 73kHz! The flares seem to have a more or less similar effect on de D-layer as was seen during the '99 eclipse. I am convinced now there are two effects that work independently. 1) Reflection against the bottom of the D-layer. The D-layer lowers when the intensity of the radiation increases. This gives an increase in signal strength because the reflection improves when the angle of indecense decreases. 2) Total internal refraction of LF signals in the D-layer. The ionisation in the D-layer increases and so the signals passing through attennuate. This causes a decrease in signal strength. Both effects are combined in the reflection coefficient formula for 'sky wave' propagation. Observations during the eclipse have shown there is a time difference between the effects 1) and 2). The height appears to change rapidly and the ionisation process appears to take some time before propagation is affected. This time difference causes both the significant increase and decrease of the signals we observe (and we can use the increase for DX communications of course!!). Best 73's and good luck on lf, Michael Sanders, PA3BSH From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25208 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 12:14:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 12:14:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RZlE-0004fa-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 12:03:48 +0000 Received: from as-img-3.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.146] helo=spamgaac.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RZlD-0004fS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 12:03:48 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaac.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id HAA19989 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 5 Mar 2000 07:03:08 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 07:02:47 -0500 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Galveston NDB, Picture To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003050703_MC2-9BD0-47A2@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Lowfers, as I wanted to see how our commercial collegues handle their antennas, I used the opportunity during my US-trip to go to Galveston near Houston/TX. Dave, ZL3FJ, had reported that this NDB beacon on 206 kHz has been heard in New Zealand and Australia. Michael, the editor of "The European NDB Handbook" gave me the exact location and with my handheld GPS system I was able to find it easily. I have put a short report and a photo I took onto my homepage (http://www.qru.de/galveston.htm, or go to the main index page http:/www.qru.de and follow the link). Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18784 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 16:25:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 16:25:35 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Rdg7-0006bS-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 16:14:47 +0000 Received: from newmail.spectraweb.ch ([194.158.230.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Rdg6-0006bN-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 16:14:46 +0000 Received: from freesurf.ch (194.230.196.90) by newmail.spectraweb.ch for ; 5 Mar 2000 17:14:36 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C2880A.6000B0D0@freesurf.ch> Date: Sun, 05 Mar 2000 17:15:06 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Toni" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [de] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en-US,en-GB,fr-FR MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Xband Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Will look for xband (QRSS) tonight. 71.8 is clear down here. 73 de Toni, HB2ASB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18983 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 16:27:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 16:27:32 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Rdiq-0006be-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 16:17:36 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.sci.fi ([195.74.0.41] helo=pyyhe.saunalahti.fi ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Rdio-0006bZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 16:17:35 +0000 Received: from default (MDXLI.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.41.41]) by pyyhe.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id SAA02619; Sun, 5 Mar 2000 18:28:34 +0200 (EET) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000305181732.00889100@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: oh2lx@pop.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 05 Mar 2000 18:17:32 +0200 To: "Mike Dennison" From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: Re: LF: CFH plots Cc: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org In-reply-to: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Mike, Thanks for interesting pictures of CFH signal variation. You can certainly receive it much better than I can here. It is most probably due to my qth on higher latitudes. On 2nd March I weakly heard CFH after 2230z with around -131 dBmW input on ESH2 (abt -4 dB(uV/m). On 4th March I didn't hear it at all (below -135 dBmW). Approximate estim. field strength with my present system: Fs (dB(uV/m) = listed dBmW + (107 dB) + (20 dB) , so during quiet condx can "see" down to -8 dB(uV/m) F-s. That quiet condx I sometimes have during winter... This is in agreement with my experiences during past 20 years on the nearby, now closed Measuring station. With an active calibrated HFH2-Z2 loop the threshold was around -5 dB(uV/m), with a 200 Hz IF B-w that is. You have any estimate how your dB's compare with F-s? Please, more pictures like that... 73 de Vaino, OH2LX At 10:45 5.3.2000 +0000, you wrote: >I have posted two graphs of CFH on my website at: >http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/mike/cfh.htm (at the time f writing this >it is not linked from any other page). >One was from last Thursday after the X flare, and may show the immediate >effect of an M flare on propagation. >The other was last night. >They are quite different, and it is interesting to note the differences >and similarities. For instance, on Thursday it rose to a peak of about >S9+10dB at 0230 (just after the M flare) and the fell gradually to dawn, >but last night it peaked S9 at 2300 and very slowly fell from there. >Similarities are dips at about 0400 and a dip and peak at about 0630 (UK >dawn). >I will post more graphs to improve our understanding of what's normal so >that enhanced propagation and its causes can be identified. > >Thanks are due to ON5OO for writing the monitoring software. Does anyone >have a good copy of the original EXE file? The one I posted on my site >is corrupt and I deleted all other copies - doh! >Mike, G3XDV >IO91VT >http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27248 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 19:46:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 19:46:54 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Rgkn-000884-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 19:31:49 +0000 Received: from newmail.spectraweb.ch ([194.158.230.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Rgkn-00087z-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 19:31:49 +0000 Received: from freesurf.ch (194.230.200.217) by newmail.spectraweb.ch for ; 5 Mar 2000 20:31:38 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C2B635.5276EE7A@freesurf.ch> Date: Sun, 05 Mar 2000 20:32:05 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Toni" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [de] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en-US,en-GB,fr-FR MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: V on 71.8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Nice V's on 71.8. Call? 73 de Toni, HB2ASB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7470 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 22:26:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 22:26:40 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RjHn-0000uf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 22:14:03 +0000 Received: from cask.force9.net ([195.166.128.29]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RjHm-0000ua-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 22:14:02 +0000 Received: (qmail 9730 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 22:13:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO main) (212.159.120.168) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 22:13:51 -0000 Message-ID: <01cb01bf86f0$b2699480$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: 73 / 136 Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 22:18:09 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear all. Nice QSO with Toni HB2ASB tonight just after 2000 on 71.8 / 137.7. Exchanged "O" reports. I can't remember your locator square Toni so I can work out the distance. Mine is IO92BK. I thought there was another QRS signal on 137.7ish but couldn't read it in the noise. Was it you Markus? Sorry I can't try tomorrow morning, I have to be at work by 0700...... This 73k isn't so bad after all! Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15294 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 22:41:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 22:41:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RjWk-000125-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 22:29:30 +0000 Received: from cask.force9.net ([195.166.128.29]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RjWj-000120-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2000 22:29:29 +0000 Received: (qmail 10753 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 22:29:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO main) (212.159.120.168) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 22:29:20 -0000 Message-ID: <01d701bf86f2$d8f7f680$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <01cb01bf86f0$b2699480$0600a8c0@main> Subject: LF: Re: 73 / 136 Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 22:33:34 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I just found the locators. Geri is 816km from me. Toni is 910km from me. Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20930 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 00:17:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 00:17:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Rl6o-0001qb-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 00:10:50 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Rl6n-0001qV-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 00:10:49 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id AAA15586 for ; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 00:10:34 GMT X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000030600075668199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 00:07:56 GMT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: LF Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Looked for I5TGC again on Saturday evening. His signal came up to a very good 'O' at 2030 and went down into the noise within 10 mins. Another expedition to Amberley Museum. Had a QSO with GI3PDN before getting down to the business of trying resonant radials. The antenna system comprises about 300m of antenna wire, a loading coil, a centre tuning variometer and a tuner variometer for a 250m radial. The system will work but trying to get all these different tuning arrangements, plus the matching, is difficult. With the centre tuning system floating it can rise to quite a high RF voltage resulting in RF feedback and attacks on your fingers when you try to tune the thing. I dont think tuned radials is the way to go, well not in my case. I did these tests high in the band and I trust I didn't QRM anyone doing QRSS that I couldn't hear. At one stage I heard HB9DCE with a 569 signal working G3YXM. After their QSO I called HB9DCE and got a 449 report although by that time the signal was starting to fade. Also the RF feedback made the QSO a bit difficult. This I found interesting because there is a lot of high ground to the south of the antenna, made up mainly of chalk. It seems fairly transparent to LF signals. As regards 73kHz EU cross band QSOs, the first one I had was on normal CW with F6CNI, my frequency 72.6kHz and the return frequency on 80m. This QSO was on 28/3/98 at 1845, my report 539. Distance 337km. The second was 9/3/99 at 2000, with Toni HB9ASB. This was on QRSS 73kHz/137kHz, 'O' both ways. I will go to GWM radio in Worthing and see if I can get some crystals to modify my mixer/driver for 73kHz. -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27582 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 01:58:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 01:58:34 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Rmh4-0002kn-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 01:52:22 +0000 Received: from praseodumium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.82]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Rmh3-0002ki-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 01:52:21 +0000 Received: from [62.6.64.206] (helo=default) by praseodumium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12Rmgf-0004FX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 01:51:59 +0000 Message-ID: <005801bf870d$c039c7c0$ce40063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Marco re CFH power Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 01:27:58 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi again Marco. No according to Jon who is a technician on the site CFH is capable of 25kW. But due to budget restraints (Canadian Navy usage) and the cost of the electricity bill, it is usually run at 8-9kW. The aerial is a 70m with a large number ( I think 24) loading wires which are the top 17m of the guy wires. ( I cannot remember exactly, but I have Jean-Marc's message somewhere in my archive) The maximum shift is +/- 42.5Hz so the two tones should be 85 Hz apart. I think it used to send RTTY on a more conventional FSK mode early last year. I do not know what type the mod. is now but it could be CPM I suppose. It has been suggested by Gammal that these commercial aerials are between 60 an 80% efficient so it could be a 5-6kW erp signal. I see it peaking to about 17dB above the noise in 100Hz (with mod ) with the strongest signal being about 45mins before local dawn, and falling rapidly after that. 73 de Alan G3NYK JO02PB Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20433 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 06:05:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 06:05:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RqQM-0004e2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 05:51:22 +0000 Received: from mail2.dada.it ([195.110.96.69] helo=mail.dada.it) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RqQL-0004dx-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 05:51:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 22168 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 05:51:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO cestag) (195.110.103.163) by mail.dada.it with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 05:51:08 -0000 Message-ID: <000e01bf872f$fb5493e0$a3676ec3@cestag> From: "cesare tagliabue" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: R: 73 / 136 Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 06:50:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Dave Maybe the signal you saw on 137.7 was mine, I was around 137.725 and saw Toni also with a solid "O". Not possible for me to see the signals on 73.18, being my antenna fully detuned for this band and moreover having a strong noise here. 73 Cesare Cesare Tagliabue I 5 TGC e-mail: cestag@dada.it url: http://www.dadacasa.com/i5tgc -----Messaggio originale----- Da: Dave A: LF Group Data: domenica 5 marzo 2000 23.42 Oggetto: LF: 73 / 136 >Dear all. > >Nice QSO with Toni HB2ASB tonight just after 2000 on 71.8 / 137.7. Exchanged >"O" reports. I can't remember your locator square Toni so I can work out the >distance. Mine is IO92BK. > >I thought there was another QRS signal on 137.7ish but couldn't read it in >the noise. Was it you Markus? >Sorry I can't try tomorrow morning, I have to be at work by 0700...... > >This 73k isn't so bad after all! > >Dave G3YXM. > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15947 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 07:14:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ef.egroups.com) (207.138.41.172) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 07:14:56 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: lofexp-return-477-zlvk=picks.force9.co.uk@returns.egroups.com Received: from [10.1.2.126] by ef.egroups.com with NNFMP; 06 Mar 2000 07:14:54 -0000 Received: (listserv 315); by f8; 06 Mar 2000 07:14:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 14301 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 07:13:29 -0000 Received: from tk1.ihug.co.nz (HELO smtp1.ihug.co.nz) (203.29.160.13) by qg.egroups.com with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 07:13:29 -0000 Received: from tractorb (p4-max20.chc.ihug.co.nz [203.109.196.68]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id UAA16986; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 20:13:17 +1300 Message-ID: <006f01bf873b$0c96e8a0$44c46dcb@tractorb> From: "Dave Brown" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: "LOFEXP" References: <200003050703_MC2-9BD0-47A2@compuserve.com> Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 20:10:23 +1300 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Mailing-List: contact lofexp-owner@egroups.com X-Mailing-List: lofexp@egroups.com Precedence: bulk List-Help: , List-Unsubscribe: List-Archive: Reply-To: lofexp@egroups.com Subject: [lofexp] Re: Galveston NDB, Picture MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Geri Great to finally see a picture of the GLS antenna. Its top loading looks to be designed as outlined in Watt's 'VLF Engineering' where the drooping umbrella wires are insulated off at a point such that they do not go below about 70% of the vertical mast height. Rick Warnett in P29 has been able to confirm its height at 300 feet and the power as 2kw in correspondence- extract below from his very recent (today!!) posting to the lofexp reflector. At 300 feet it 's a biggie by NDB standards but as the distance down here is over 12000 km it's still doing very well, possibly the best LF DX that I am aware of, excluding high power broadcast stations. There's one of those on the Kamchatka(?) Peninsula up top of the Pacific that roars in here in winter months after dark on 180 kHz exact. 73 Dave, ZL3FJ ******************* extract from Ricks lofexp posting********** Fellow Lowfers, The following was sent back to me in regard to GLS. MAYBE A BIT LATE NOW AS OTHER COMMENTS HAVE BEEN MADE, HOWEVER....... Hi Rick, Got on the phone with the Galveston FAA field Office yesterday. GLS uses a 300' verticle steel tower for the antenna. The entire tower radiates, just like the usual am broadcasters. Power is confirmed @ 2000 watts. I talked with a fella named Jimmy Grubbs, a Texan with the usual Texas drawl. Friendly dude. They verify reports at: FAA Field Office 2115 Terminal Drive Galveston, Tx. 77554 phone # 1-409-744-1195 I believe you folks would be the first from your area. ******************************************* ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Planning a party? iParty.com is your complete source for party planning and supplies, with everything you need to throw the perfect party! http://click.egroups.com/1/1635/5/_/20607/_/952326894/ -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document Vault -- http://www.egroups.com/docvault/lofexp/?m=1 From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16054 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 08:11:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 08:11:24 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RsUM-0005bD-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 08:03:38 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.sci.fi ([195.74.0.41] helo=pyyhe.saunalahti.fi ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RsUK-0005b8-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 08:03:36 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from default (DCCCLXXIX.tdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.81.79]) by pyyhe.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id KAA14989 for ; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 10:14:40 +0200 (EET) Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000306100346.0088d310@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: vaiski1@pop.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 10:03:46 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: Signal Strength Measurements by OH2LX MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Measurements of UK Decca's and some other stations : ---------------------------------------------------------- Day ------------------ 01Mar 02Mar 03Mar 04Mar 05Mar WED THU FRI SAT SUN Time, UTC ------------ 2140- 2140- 2140- 2145- 2240- ---------------------------------------------------------- kHz Ch *d,km AZI* *Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW* ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.8 (6C), 1435, 280, -107 -105 -100 -107 -102 ---------------------------------------------------------- 126.7 (2A), 1565, 269, -106 -110 -105 -104 -105 ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.5 (8E), 1766, 276, -102 -105 -101 -102 -103 ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.0 (3B), 1871, 257, -102 -109 -105 -107 -106 ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.5 (5B), 1890, 247, -102 -101 -101 -106 -103 ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.2 (7D), 2060, 267, -112 -112 -116 -113 -118 ---------------------------------------------------------- 126.4 (1B), 2282, 253, -113 -114 -110 -107 -109 ---------------------------------------------------------- kHz Ch *d,km AZI* *Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW* ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.93 ref, 1553, 228, -77 -78 -79 -79 -80 ---------------------------------------------------------- 138.83 ref, 1221, 226, -83 -75 -76 -79 -79 ---------------------------------------------------------- 135.8 SXV 2490, 182, -105 -108 -106 -107 -107 ---------------------------------------------------------- 137.0 CFH* 5750, 295, -131 Nil Nil Nil Nil ---------------------------------------------------------- * CFH weakly audible after 2230 (except on the 4th Mar) ---------------------------------------------------------- 01Mar 2020: MM0ALM -122 ((GI3PDN not audible)) 01Mar 2130: SM6PXJ -116 ((GW4ALG not audible)) 02Mar 2028: OH1TN -110..-108(f); 2056: -109; 2108: -108 02Mar 2057: OH1BS -116..-112(f); 2254: -122 02Mar 2108: OH1LT -125..-122(f) 02Mar 2121: OH7OL <-125 02Mar 2252: G3YXM -132 03Mar 2200: OH1BS -111; 2226: -114 03Mar 2226: SM6PXJ -128..-126(f) 04Mar 1827: G3KEV -126; 1847: -125; 2018: -124 04Mar 1839: SM6PXJ -120..-113(f); 2233: -123..-115(f) 04Mar 2037: OZ8NJ -125 04Mar 2056: OH1TN -112 04Mar 2244: OH1BS -107; 2252: -109; 2326: -109 ---------------------------------------------------------- (R&S ESH2/---- 10m coax---/1:10/---15m wire-----): Noise level with antenna: with 200Hz IF BandWidth: -26..-22 dB(uV), -133..-129dBmW (varies w qrm etc) ---------------------------------------------------------- End of message of 06 Mar 2000, 0805 UTC, from OH2LX ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16632 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 08:14:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 08:14:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RsXt-0005h5-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 08:07:17 +0000 Received: from mail04.hostcenter.com ([195.186.64.57]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RsXs-0005h0-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 08:07:16 +0000 Received: from www303.hostcenter.com (195.186.64.84) by mail04.hostcenter.com (RS ver 1.0.53) with SMTP id 06176691 for ; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 09:06:46 +0100 (MET) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C3E61C.7F23C27E@phonakcom.ch> Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 09:08:44 -0800 From: "Toni Baertschi" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Phonak Communications AG X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: 73 Xband Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Loop-Detect: 1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Nice Xband QSO with Dave, G3YXM, last night. QRB 910 km. The signal was quite strong and could probably break the 1000 km barrier. When Dave called on 71.8 I've seen another signal, just a few Hz below. It was only "T" at this time but a QSO should be possible with longer dots. Who was it???? 73 de Toni, HB2ASB in JN36pt From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19561 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 09:54:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 09:54:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Ru5K-0006Re-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 09:45:54 +0000 Received: from artemis.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.126]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Ru5J-0006RZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 09:45:53 +0000 Received: from pc171.geog.le.ac.uk ([143.210.25.171] helo=kate) by artemis.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.03 #1) id 12Ru59-0000CF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 09:45:43 +0000 From: "kate moore" To: "lfgroup" Subject: LF: Weekend report Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 09:40:10 -0000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: EU activity heard since Friday on 136kHz normal CW: OE5ODL (559), SM6PXJ (579), OZ8NJ (569), ON7YD (559), DJ5BV (559), DJ5DI (569), PA0KDM (549), PA0BWL (569), DK5PT (569), HB9DCE (449QSB). Activity this weekend was much lower than recent weeks (maybe people were taking a break and enjoying the better weather?) - nevertheless, the final tally here was 10 countries heard and 6 worked. There was certainly no shortage of Gs calling CQ, but noticibly fewer stations for us to work, and I managed nothing new at all this week. Both G3XDV and PA0BWL have made improvements and were putting out their best signals ever. Conditions seemed quite good, if a little noisey at times, and CFH was audible virtually all day during both Saturday and Sunday, dropping into the noise only briefly late morning. The local variation in signal strength was again very apparent on Sunday morning when HB9DCE's signal was poor with both G3YXM and myself, but Berth was getting R5 reports from GB2CPM and G3XDV - the reverse of the situation Mike reported last time. It would be very interesting to establish for certain whether this is due to an enhancement effect (i.e. Mike and Peter were receiving better than other stations either side) or a cancellation effect (i.e. Dave and I were in a null). Perhaps we could set up a 'reports pool' for noting simultaneously the strengths of stations in Switzerland and Italy (whose signals seem to produce this effect over the UK) by a number of observers? Regards John G4GVC near Leicester, IO92JP ** TX: Synth + 400W RF from modified 'G3YXM' Mosfet PA ** ** RX: TS-850S with 3 x CW filters and 0.5ppm TCXO ** ** Ant: Inv-L 60m long, 6m high at feed end, 12m high at far end ** From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10392 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 12:33:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 12:33:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RwZU-0007mq-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 12:25:12 +0000 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RwZQ-0007ml-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 12:25:08 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12RwZM-0007ZT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 12:25:04 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 12:07:20 +0000 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 12:07:18 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Weekend report 3-5 March X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: What an exciting weekend! My best DX on 73kHz doubled and several new stations worked. Conditions were good with CFH audible in the noise most of the day. Friday 3 March Went on 73kHz as DF6NM was listening for QRSs signals. Worked M0BMU and G3XTZ ( a new one for me on this band), both at 'O'/'O'. Saturday 4 March On 73kHz again and had another QSO with M0BMU. Sent lots of callsigns on QRSs. E-mail from Markus, DF6NM, to say he had seen my signals. This more than doubles my best DX on 73kHz at 840km (previous best was a two- way with GD0MRF at exactly 400km). Thanks Markus. My signals, and those of M0BMU and G3XTZ, can be seen on G3YXM's web site. Back on 136kHz band for QSOs with G4GVC (599/599) and PA0BWL (gave 549, got 459). Sunday 5 March 136kHz: Worked two new ones - DK5PT (549/449) and HB9DCE (539/349) who was a much better signal with me than with G3YXM for a change! Also worked GW4ALG (579/589) and G3YXM (599/599). Other DX heard: ON7YD (549) GI3PDN (579) and a new one DJ6PU (549). In the evening I set up for crossband 73/136 activity. Spent ages trying to get the system efficient on both band with the minimum of running outside to make changes to the loading coil. Called CQ on 73 (ending in 'KX' to indicate listening crossband) and was called by DF6NM on 136. Gave him an 'M' report but saw nothing from him after that. Saw successful crossband QSO between G3YXM (73) and HB2ASB (136), both 'O' and audible with me. Many thanks to Geri, Markus and Toni for making the effort to listen on 73kHz. As a result, several distance records have been broken in the last week. The record currently stands at 910km (G3YXM/HB2ASB). It is unlikely that we will get an extension of this band - we have already had an extra 6 months from the original closing date - so there is very little time now, especially with the static season due in a few weeks. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10645 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 12:34:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 12:34:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RwZb-0007mx-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 12:25:19 +0000 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RwZZ-0007ms-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 12:25:17 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12RwZV-0007aT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 12:25:14 +0000 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 12:21:02 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 12:21:01 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: RE: CFH plots In-reply-to: <000101bf8697$94cb5340$61976dc2@v3q4v1> References: X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > This time difference causes both the significant increase and decrease of > the signals we observe (and we can use the increase for DX communications > of course!!). > Michael Sanders, PA3BSH > Does this account for the peak and fade sinewave effect we get on CFH over about an hour, both at US sunset and UK dawn? Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16223 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 12:53:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 12:53:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RwtF-0007vz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 12:45:37 +0000 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RwtB-0007vu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 12:45:33 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12Rwsy-0004c8-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 12:45:21 +0000 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 12:27:31 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 12:27:30 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: 73 Xband In-reply-to: <38C3E61C.7F23C27E@phonakcom.ch> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > Nice Xband QSO with Dave, G3YXM, last night. QRB 910 km. The signal was > quite strong and could probably break the 1000 km barrier. When Dave > called on 71.8 I've seen another signal, just a few Hz below. It was only > "T" at this time but a QSO should be possible with longer dots. Who was > it???? > 73 de Toni, HB2ASB in JN36pt Toni, that was me. I was calling CQ, then I replied to Markus, DF6NM, but we lost each other after that. I called you a few minutes after you finished with Dave, but no reply. Having damaged a ligament in my leg, running up the garden in between overs to change the taps on the loading coil was very painful. The things we do for fun!!! Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20145 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 13:02:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 13:02:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Rx1C-00083I-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 12:53:50 +0000 Received: from rhenium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.93]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Rx1B-00083D-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 12:53:49 +0000 Received: from [213.1.151.99] (helo=default) by rhenium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12Rx0s-0004n5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 12:53:31 +0000 Message-ID: <000b01bf876a$233f5720$639701d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: DX Cluster spots for 4/5th March at GB7DXM Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 12:45:58 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, Congratulations to Jim, Dave and Graham for their crossband 73kHz qsos with Germany and Switzerland. This has injected a bit of life into the band in its final months. I copied good 'O' signals from Jim and Mike on Saturday morning. The best signals I have ever received on 73kHz. When the local noise (from SMPSs) appears here in the evening it would swamp everything but Rugby. Sunday 5th March (QRSS) 0438z HB2ASB Toni's test beacon good 'O' signal until 0540z 0715 "G3YXM T U R 8KW O O O KK" R R DAVE 73 DK8KW SK" "R R G3XTZ DK8KW M M" This was Dave and Graham making their crossband 73 kHz qsos I presume, with Geri 0810 HB9ASB CQ 0818 DFCW not decoded by FFTDSP as shift was a bit too narrow for it. 0820 HB2ASB CQ called by G3XTZ Toni then went on the work Gaspard ON4ZK 0935 G3XDV CQ Not quite so many spots logged on the Cluster this weekend....but not the spot of DCF39 by VE1ZZ so he is communicable with via packet. I am not sure whether my spots will propagate back to the States & Canada. It may be better to use one of the Internet Cluster sites to try to contact him. 136.5 DJ6FU 5-Mar-2000 1710Z 439 136.3 PA0BWL 5-Mar-2000 1155Z 136.6 DK6NI 5-Mar-2000 1011Z 449 cq 137.2 PA0BWL 5-Mar-2000 1001Z 339 136.9 G3YXM 5-Mar-2000 0950Z cq 439 137.0 G3KEV 3-Mar-2000 1644Z (579) 137.0 G4GVC 3-Mar-2000 1642Z (549) 136.7 G3YXM 2-Mar-2000 2249Z (549) 136.8 DJ5BV 2-Mar-2000 1836Z cq 549 136.9 OE5ODL 1-Mar-2000 2144Z cq cq 136.5 MM0ALM 29-Feb-2000 2025Z qso with i5mxx 136.8 I5TGC 29-Feb-2000 1730Z 579 136.8 I5TGC 29-Feb-2000 1651Z cq..449 137.0 G3KEV 28-Feb-2000 2003Z (569) 137.7 G3LDO 27-Feb-2000 2123Z (559) slow-cw cq G3NYK de GB7DXM 6-Mar 1159Z > 1800.0 DCF39 29-Feb-2000 2355Z 138.83 khz fsk 5/9 G3NYK de GB7DXM 6-Mar 1159Z > 73 de Alan G3NYK JO02PB Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17027 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 13:36:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 13:36:32 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RxRc-0008KA-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 13:21:08 +0000 Received: from mail04.hostcenter.com ([195.186.64.57]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RxRS-0008K5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 13:20:59 +0000 Received: from www303.hostcenter.com (195.186.64.84) by mail04.hostcenter.com (RS ver 1.0.53) with SMTP id 06347382 for ; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 14:20:46 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <38C42FB4.CAE6BA2F@phonakcom.ch> X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 14:22:44 -0800 From: "Toni Baertschi" Organization: Phonak Communications AG X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: 73 Xband References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Loop-Detect: 1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Mike, after the QSO with Dave I observed the band for several minutes, but there was nothing to see, may be it was already too late. It seems to me that best condx (for the path UK-HB) are between 19:00 and 20:00 UT. I will call Xband again in the next evenings. Take care of your leg. I'm expecting very long change over times. 73 de Toni Mike Dennison wrote: > > Nice Xband QSO with Dave, G3YXM, last night. QRB 910 km. The signal was > > quite strong and could probably break the 1000 km barrier. When Dave > > called on 71.8 I've seen another signal, just a few Hz below. It was only > > "T" at this time but a QSO should be possible with longer dots. Who was > > it???? > > 73 de Toni, HB2ASB in JN36pt > > Toni, that was me. I was calling CQ, then I replied to Markus, > DF6NM, but we lost each other after that. I called you a few > minutes after you finished with Dave, but no reply. > > Having damaged a ligament in my leg, running up the garden in > between overs to change the taps on the loading coil was very > painful. The things we do for fun!!! > > Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) > http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26413 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 14:23:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 14:23:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RyIi-0000Dh-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 14:16:00 +0000 Received: from host.king.igs.net ([216.58.2.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RyId-0000Db-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 14:15:55 +0000 Received: from server1 (ttyC29.king.igs.net [216.58.2.157]) by host.king.igs.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id JAA83510; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 09:15:43 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kayser@king.igs.net) Message-ID: <001501bf8776$62f86580$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org, "Alan Melia" Subject: LF: Re VE1ZZ Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 09:15:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Alan et all: >....but not the >spot of DCF39 by VE1ZZ so he is communicable with via packet. > 1800.0 DCF39 29-Feb-2000 2355Z 138.83 khz fsk 5/9 > This is great news it means he has studied my letter and has taken some action on it. I will write him again and inquire if he is thinking of an Internet connection. When he says 5/9 you can trust he means really loud, Mitch, VE3OT, and I listened to Jack's tape of DCF39 and it was a very very strong signal. Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15679 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 14:51:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 14:51:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Ryef-0000SQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 14:38:41 +0000 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Ryee-0000SL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 14:38:40 +0000 Received: from as32-s16-149-11.cwci.net ([195.44.149.11] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12RyeU-0000fV-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 14:38:31 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C3C29C.6F6952C4@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 14:37:16 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: Ropex Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All. For those suffering from close down in the QRO position when using a grounded antenna loading/matching coil at the base of the antenna, an external LPF in the TX line will cure the problem. I acquired a Ropex recently and on testing into my antenna found this problem and I know other suffer the same. I do not have a cct of the rig otherwise I might be able to do an internal modification to rectify the situation. With the LPF added I can now load the tx into the 50 ohm configured base loaded, grounded inductor at the antenna base. The ARRL antenna h/book has the details for constructing a suitable LPF. I use T200-2 cores and 1200v rated poly capacitors. This LPF will handle up to 1kw of RF and is also suitable for other projects. 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21367 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 16:46:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 16:46:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S0W6-0001Uj-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 16:37:58 +0000 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S0W2-0001Ue-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 16:37:54 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12S0Vy-0000Yj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 16:37:51 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 16:30:46 +0000 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 16:30:43 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73/136 x-band X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I will be on 71.8kHz this evening looking for cross-band QSOs with 137.7 QRSs. I will call CQ at 1900, 2000 and 2100. Mike From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4940 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 16:52:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 16:52:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S0Yu-0001Ve-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 16:40:52 +0000 Received: from mta01-acc.tin.it ([212.216.176.32] helo=fep01-svc.tin.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S0Yt-0001VW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 16:40:51 +0000 Received: from mailsrv.dii.unisi.it ([212.171.197.250]) by fep01-svc.tin.it (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with ESMTP id <20000306164021.VUVT4492.fep01-svc.tin.it@mailsrv.dii.unisi.it> for ; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 17:40:21 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C3DF2D.39C1AE75@mailsrv.dii.unisi.it> Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 17:39:10 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Valerio" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: 73 Khz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello folks, Now i'm able to receive on 73 kHz band, so i'm available for sked about rx or xband (73/136) qso. Please tell me about frequency and time, i will be in the shack starting from this evening. '73 Valerio (IK5ZPV) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2653 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 17:15:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 17:15:54 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S0x3-0001n4-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 17:05:49 +0000 Received: from cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.172]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S0wz-0001mz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 17:05:45 +0000 Received: from modem-3.elessar.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.185.3] helo=lvm) by cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12S0wo-00048U-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 17:05:35 +0000 Message-ID: <000201bf878e$3b399b00$03b9883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. Resonant radials. Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 17:04:03 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Peter,
            I dont think resonant radials are going to be very efficient unless quite high!  But to resonate I found it best to tune the radial system against ground! as though it were an antenna.This needs a ground connection of course but I assume you already have one.The impedance at the feed point will be quite low (series resonance).I would then tune the proper ant against ground,and finally replace the ground with the radial system,without re-adjusting the resonance.I did not get very high voltages doing this.Of course you could retain the ground connection as well,and this would no doubt reduce the voltage.further.  I hope this is of some use to you.73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22630 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 17:29:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 17:29:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S1Cx-0001ve-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 17:22:15 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S1Cl-0001vW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 17:22:04 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id SAA112328 for ; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 18:21:49 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000306191859.2ea75ca6@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 19:18:59 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: 73/136 x-band In-reply-to: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Mike (and the others), Since you are 'spoiled' with close to 1000km DX on 73kHz the last days, Belgium maybe 'peanuts'. But I will listen (look) for signals and try some crossband. I will use my 136kHz for reception on 73kHz, I wonder if that will be sufficient. 73, Rik ON7YD At 16:30 6/03/00 -0000, you wrote: >I will be on 71.8kHz this evening looking for cross-band QSOs with >137.7 QRSs. I will call CQ at 1900, 2000 and 2100. > > >Mike > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11432 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 17:57:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 17:57:35 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S1dP-000285-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 17:49:35 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S1dL-00025M-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 17:49:32 +0000 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12RxLp-00027b-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 13:15:09 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <4853.200003061322@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 13:23:26 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz Friuday night/ Saturday Morning X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, Thanks for all the 73kHz listener reports and the Spectrogram images. Glad to see that G3NYK has finally received some signals on the band! Worked G3XDV with normal CW on Friday night and Saturday morning, and G3XTZ using QRSS, although could easily have had a normal CW QSO with Graham, at least at my end. Also (just about) heard G3YXM sending normal CW at about 1900 on Friday - Dave appeared to be sending a beacon signal with his callsign & phone number, but was well down in the noise, and since he is closer to Rugby than me, I don't think a QSO would have been possible. QRSS would have been no problem though. Also saw another weak signal that appeared to be normal CW, and was slowly drifting down in frequency, but could not identify it. Was sorry to miss out on the cross-band action; my E-mail account is at work, so I didn't get to hear about it until this morning. Congratulations to those who took part - looks like 73kHz might still have some excitements in store! I think I could set up my station to do 73/136 cross-band fairly quickly, so if anyone would like a go, let me know. Am also testing my new power amp for both LF bands. I have gone for a linear, based very loosely on G0MRF's design, mainly so I could make use of my existing VFO and keying circuit without modification. It seems to achieve 3-400W ouput with a reasonable temperature rise, which should add several dB to my transmit signal. I will give 73kHz a try tomorrow morning, in the hope that the Rugby TX will be off the air for maintenance again. I will see if I can get set up for cross - band operation by then also, time permitting. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16727 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 18:09:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 18:09:24 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S1pP-0002E9-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 18:01:59 +0000 Received: from as-img-5.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.148] helo=spamgaae.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S1pL-0002Ds-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 18:01:55 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaae.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id NAA26883 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 13:01:15 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 13:01:00 -0500 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: 73/136 x-band To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003061301_MC2-9BF6-F80A@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik (and others), >I will use my 136kHz for reception on 73kHz, I wonder if that will be >sufficient. nice that the 73 kHz fever broke out! Rik, for me my 136 kHz equipment was quite sufficient (as I wrote earlier) I did NOT even tune my antenna, noise level here at 73 kHz is lower compared to 136 kHz, and if I see those strong signals on the 4000m band, it is hard to be strong enough in my character not to try to tune my G0MRF PA and antenna system for that band .... (yes, I have been told it would work ... my DDS synthesizer works there anyhow ...). Mike, I will be QRV tonight, lets see ... 73 Geri , DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29812 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 18:35:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 18:35:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S2FA-0002Tk-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 18:28:36 +0000 Received: from [195.166.128.23] (helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S2F8-0002Tf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 18:28:34 +0000 Received: (qmail 4458 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 18:28:24 -0000 Received: from mayfly.plus.net.uk (HELO mayfly.force9.net) (195.166.128.28) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 18:28:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 1171 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 18:28:23 -0000 Received: from 34.01-03.quay.dial.plus.net.uk (HELO main) (212.159.72.34) by mayfly.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 18:28:23 -0000 Message-ID: <001f01bf879a$782b9a20$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: 73kHz Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 18:33:26 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear all. It was so embarrassing to see my drifting VFO on Markus' plots that I have connected the DDS to my 73k TX and it seems to work OK. I will try some calls around 2000 tonight (Monday) and from 0700, or earlier? tomorrow morning. The antenna is tuned to 71.805 so that is where I shall be. I will be QRV on 137.7 +/- 100Hz and on 71.8 +/- 100Hz if Rugby is off tomorrow morning. 73, Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10374 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 21:14:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 21:14:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S4gm-0003pP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 21:05:16 +0000 Received: from ds-img-5.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.138] helo=spdmgaae.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S4gl-0003pJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 21:05:15 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaae.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id QAA25999 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 16:04:35 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 16:03:06 -0500 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 73kHz To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003061603_MC2-9BF7-8B5@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dave, G3YXM, >It was so embarrassing to see my drifting VFO on Markus' plots that I have >connected the DDS to my 73k TX and it seems to work OK indeed, it did! Have a look at www.qru.de/g3yxm.htm, last picture and you will see your rock-stable (woops! at least nearly) QRH-NIL signal! Band was very noisy tonight, I could copy Dave's QSO with ON7YD (more and more "firsts!", congrats) and saw also another station calling on 71.833 kHz (M0BMU?). Did not answer on 137 kHz, because signal was barely "T" here, however should be ok when the noise is down (lets try for example next Sunday morning ...). No copy of Mike, G3XDV, but again, noise was pretty strong tonight ... Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) http://www.qru.de From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19973 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 21:49:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 21:49:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S5E6-00044n-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 21:39:42 +0000 Received: from mb04.swip.net ([193.12.122.208]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S5E5-00044i-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 21:39:41 +0000 Received: from oemcomputer (d212-151-44-149.swipnet.se [212.151.44.149]) by mb04.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA10583 for ; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 22:36:38 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <000501bf87b4$b7aa0820$952c97d4@oemcomputer> From: "Johan Bodin" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: 73 kHz QRSS received in SM? Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 22:40:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello All, I believe I saw a QRSS signal on 71.805! It started at 20.45 UTC tonight, Monday, and lasted for about three minutes. It was not strong enough to be readable but quite close! Who was it? I have a screen dump from Spectrogram. I'll mail it to anyone who is interested. 73 de Johan Bodin, SM6LKM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12409 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 22:16:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 22:16:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S5ht-0004Kp-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 22:10:29 +0000 Received: from [195.166.128.23] (helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S5hr-0004Kk-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 22:10:27 +0000 Received: (qmail 1048 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 22:10:18 -0000 Received: from mayfly.plus.net.uk (HELO mayfly.force9.net) (195.166.128.28) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 22:10:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 19399 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 22:10:17 -0000 Received: from 9.02-01.quay.dial.plus.net.uk (HELO main) (212.159.65.9) by mayfly.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 22:10:16 -0000 Message-ID: <015501bf87b9$733f6fe0$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: 73 / 136 again Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 22:10:42 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear all. Good activity again tonight. I worked Rik for another new one. I am now using the SM6LKM / G0MRF DDS and hope to have a way of applying the frequency shift for DFCW soon. I also heard Jim (well I saw him.... just!) working Toni and Rik, well done Jim. How much power / aerial current are you using on 73k? My tx is running about 550W I think, not 750 as I estimated before, and aerial current is 2.75A. CU on Tuesday morning. Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23588 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 22:24:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 22:24:18 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S5ox-0004Li-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 22:17:47 +0000 Received: from [195.166.128.23] (helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S5ow-0004Ld-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 22:17:46 +0000 Received: (qmail 1944 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 22:17:37 -0000 Received: from mayfly.plus.net.uk (HELO mayfly.force9.net) (195.166.128.28) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 22:17:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 19852 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 22:17:36 -0000 Received: from 9.02-01.quay.dial.plus.net.uk (HELO main) (212.159.65.9) by mayfly.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 22:17:36 -0000 Message-ID: <015f01bf87ba$78e36ae0$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000501bf87b4$b7aa0820$952c97d4@oemcomputer> Subject: LF: Re: 73 kHz QRSS received in SM? Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 22:18:54 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Johan. It could have been me. I did put out "QRZ K" at that time and exactly that frequency. I was using 3.5 second dots and 2:1 dash:dot ratio. Does it seem to fit? 73 Dave G3YXM. ----------------------------------------------------- I believe I saw a QRSS signal on 71.805! It started at 20.45 UTC tonight, Monday, and lasted for about three minutes. It was not strong enough to be readable but quite close! Who was it? I have a screen dump from Spectrogram. I'll mail it to anyone who is interested. 73 de Johan Bodin, SM6LKM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13078 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2000 22:36:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Mar 2000 22:36:00 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S608-0004Sz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 22:29:20 +0000 Received: from as-img-4.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.147] helo=spamgaad.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12S606-0004Sp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 06 Mar 2000 22:29:18 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaad.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id RAA02116 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 6 Mar 2000 17:28:38 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 17:28:08 -0500 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 73kHz To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003061728_MC2-9C04-2CC1@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello friends, > and saw also another station calling on 71.833 >kHz (M0BMU?). Did not answer on 137 kHz, because signal was barely "T" that was a little bit preliminary ... just worked M0BMU crossband, too, he on 71.832 kHz and me on 136.690 kHz with M/O. Jim, what is your QTH locator? 73, Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18716 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 08:58:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 08:58:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SFc4-0000us-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 08:45:08 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SFc1-0000un-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 08:45:05 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id JAA140752 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 09:44:55 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000307104205.2c1f3738@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 10:42:05 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: 73 kHz QRSS received in SM? In-reply-to: <000501bf87b4$b7aa0820$952c97d4@oemcomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Johan, You probably saw G3YXM, I worked him (x-band) on that frequency few minutes earlier. Give it another try in the morning, when QRN is low, and break the 1000km barrier ! 73, Rik ON7YD At 22:40 6/03/00 +0100, you wrote: >Hello All, > >I believe I saw a QRSS signal on 71.805! It started at >20.45 UTC tonight, Monday, and lasted for about three >minutes. It was not strong enough to be readable but >quite close! > >Who was it? I have a screen dump from Spectrogram. >I'll mail it to anyone who is interested. > > >73 de Johan Bodin, SM6LKM > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10598 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 09:05:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 09:05:33 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SFkL-000126-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 08:53:41 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SFkK-000121-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 08:53:40 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id JAA95884 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 09:53:30 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000307105040.2c1f7520@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 10:50:40 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: 73 kHz QRSS In-reply-to: <000501bf87b4$b7aa0820$952c97d4@oemcomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I listened (looked) on 72.8kHz (+/- 100Hz) last night : G3YXM 'O' : worked Dave x-band (first ON - G ?) M0BMU 'O' : worked Jim x-band G3XDV 'M' : missed Mike (want another try in the morning ?) It was the first time that I seriously tried 73kHz and made some interesting observations : 1. all 3 stations had longterm QRB (+/- 15 min. periods) and the QSB was not 'in phase' for the 3 stations (eg. when G3YXM became stronger G3XDV went down in noise) 2. QRN was barely audible above RX noise on my 136kHz antenna, so with a tuned antenna reception would be better 3. M0BMU was 219 audible for a short time (with a better antenna at my side a 2-way normal CW QSO could be possible) 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20328 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 09:05:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 09:05:42 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SFiJ-00011o-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 08:51:35 +0000 Received: from lepidachrosite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SFiI-00011j-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 08:51:34 +0000 Received: from w8k3f0 (2410808645.dialin.freeler.nl [143.178.5.69]) by lepidachrosite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id A26F2CAE73 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 08:50:51 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <000a01bf8813$2fb042e0$4505b28f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "LF-Group" Subject: LF: 73 kHz Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 09:56:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
To All from PA0SE
 
Having recently installed Spectogram I gave it a try on 73 kHz this morning.
 
It works perfectly and I saw several G-stations. But I also copied them by ear!
 
Reports by ear are:
 
G3XTZ: RST 459
M0BMU: RST 569
G3YXM: RST 559
G3LDO: RST 569
 
This was with the antenna system still tuned to 136 kHz!
 
So a crossband QSO 73/136 would have been easily possible for me.
 
Rugby is off air so I don't know how it would be with this station on. I have recorded the background noise so when Rugby comes on again I can observe whether there is a difference.
 
I will listen again today at 1400 UTC on 73 kHz and for a crossband QSO I will transmit on 136,550 kHz.
 
I will also listen Thursday at 1000 UTC and 1600 UTC.
 
I can be QRV at other times as well in case someone wants to arrange a sked by telephone.
 
73, Dick, PA0SE
 
Tel. +31 71 589 27 34
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8708 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 09:08:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 09:08:48 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SFmw-00012b-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 08:56:22 +0000 Received: from anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.89]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SFmv-00012W-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 08:56:21 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12SFmk-000PmD-0V for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 08:56:11 +0000 Message-ID: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 08:54:27 +0000 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" Subject: LF: 71.8 KHz MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Trial Version 3.05 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: A brief listen on 71.8 this morning Tuesday 7th March 2000 yielded the following: 0825 G3YXM 71.80 KHz 569 in QSO with: G3LDO 71.79 KHz 569 followed immediately by M0BMU 71.84 KHz 559 in QSO with G3LDO 0835 G3XTZ 71.80 KHz 559 calling G3LDO for about 5 minutes 0840 someone on QRSS which I cannot read. Excellent signals Dave, Peter, Jim and Graham. 73, Tom G3OLB, IO80iu. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16368 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 09:31:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 09:31:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SGDo-0001FL-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 09:24:08 +0000 Received: from imo24.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.68]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SGDn-0001FG-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 09:24:07 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from MarkusVester@aol.com by imo24.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id l.94.18ef0b0 (4414) for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 04:23:53 -0500 (EST) From: MarkusVester@aol.com Message-ID: <94.18ef0b0.25f624a8@aol.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 04:23:52 EST Subject: LF: 71.8 heard in CW by DF6NM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 62 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi 73-enthusiasts, Last night, I could see several of you (YXM, BMU, XTZ, LDO) in x-band qrss action with HB2ASB, ON7YD (DFCW) and DK8KW, but didnt get through. Peter's tx running up and down like a wild horse, but perfectly tame after 23:20 - what did you do? Today, after 7:00 UT I saw 07:04 71.811 G3XDV (m), 07:17 71.820 G3XTZ (m, later o) 07:29 71.805 G3YXM (o) Dave managed to see my whispering on 137.70, and so we finally had our Xband QSO in qrss. 970km... thats getting close. Then condx on 71 improved further, no growling in the background. At 8:11 I noticed I could actually hear YXM in the speaker, and until now (08:45) I've been listening to you working each other in plain cw (reports by ear): G3XTZ 339 G3YXM 559 (perfect copy) M0BMU 349 G3LDO 559 (perfect copy) Got some .wavs of which I can send clips later. With these signals there is no 1000-km-barrier, you should go for 2000! 73 de Markus, DF6NM in JN59NK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29358 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 11:54:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 11:54:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SIQz-0002Sm-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 11:45:53 +0000 Received: from imo18.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.8]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SIQt-0002Se-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 11:45:47 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from MarkusVester@aol.com by imo18.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id l.20.2eafbf2 (4317) for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 06:45:03 -0500 (EST) From: MarkusVester@aol.com X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <20.2eafbf2.25f645be@aol.com> Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 06:45:02 EST Subject: LF: Rugby and 77.5 kHz To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------040304030800040500010805" X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 62 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------040304030800040500010805 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi again, that was another nice xband QSO with M0BMU (71.858). I specially liked that because seeing Jims sigs on 71.8 a couple of weeks ago has stirred up all that activity. With Rugby off (actually testing apparently, carrier on and off several times around 10:30), I noticed an interesting structure in the noise. The time-signal tx DCF77 (77.5kHz nr Frankfurt, 50kW?) has a 645.883 bd (=fc/120) pseudorandom phase modulation (5 deg). Using correlation to this 512 bit sequence, special receivers can determine time more accurate than by the 1 Hz carrier dips alone. 160 km from their site, I normally can see 3 or 4 sidebands on each side of the carrier. Today, 8 sidebands were clearly visible down to 72.34 kHz (77500-8*646). Truly a spread spectrum! Now Rugby is back to normal. I've included two spectra with it being off and on , so you can compare. 73 de Markus, DF6NM --------------040304030800040500010805 Content-Type: application/zip; name="RUGBYOFF.ZIP" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: inline; filename="RUGBYOFF.ZIP" UEsDBBQAAAAIABVeZyhOiRuayg0AALbMAgAgAAAAbGluZV83MWswLTczazc1Nl8xMTQ3XzA3 MDMwMC5ibXDt3XWsHFUbgPG3pUAZmMGCuzdQHIoHKBqgaHArTnB3QnHX4BKsSHAtHhwKFA1O cQsu4c8v6XdXxn3mvHe3u8+vZXd2Z/bs7pmns3NvLzB6zIRJQ6Vh1DCREQPXYwdujhwiMkSG N+8fN7G1vmlI+5/WmuZvGTeuddX4NbDwwgsvyKabbipHHHGETJkyZWDNZPnf2SITm8vtYYYM kaFDh8o000wjw4YNk2mnnVamm246mX766WX48OEywwwziGVZMuOMM8pMM80ktm2L4zgy88wz yyyzzCKzzjqrzDbbbDL77LPLHHPMIXPOOafMNddcMvfcc8s888wj8847r8w333wy//zzywIL LCALLrigLLTQQrLwwgvLIossIosuuqgstthisvjii8sSSywhSy65pCy11FIyYsQIWXrppWWZ ZZaRkSNHyrLLLivLLbecLL/88rLCCivIiiuuKCuttJKsvPLKssoqq8iqq64qo0aNktVWW01W X311WWONNWTNNdeUtdZaS9Zee21ZZ511ZN1115X11ltP1l9/fRk9erRssMEGsuGGG8pGG20k G2+8sWyyySbN+dpss81k8803ly222ELGjBkjW265pWy11Vay9dZbyzbbbCPbbrutbLfddrL9 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with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SIix-0002i6-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 12:04:27 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SIis-0002gp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 12:04:23 +0000 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12SIg2-0001Jp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 12:01:26 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <14539.200003071209@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 12:09:46 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz Action X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, Had an exciting night and morning on LF, with a new power amplifier, new modes, and new countries. Set up the station to work cross-band by connecting the receiver to a separate 5m vertical antenna; this seemed a bit noisier than using my normal TX antenna for receive, but does the job, and has the advantage that the TX antenna tuning can be left alone while the RX changes between bands. Also connected up my new power amp, which with about 350W out, gives an antenna current of 2.0A on 73kHz. My TX antenna is still an 8m high inverted 'L' With this set-up, was able to work cross-band to HB2ASB and DK8KW on QRSS cw for two new countries, and ON7YD, who was using DFCW, the first time I have had a QSO involving this mode. I gave all stations 'O' reports. Could also see some other weaker signals on 137kHz, and tantalisingly saw my own callsign coming back on at least one occasion, only to disappear into the Loran noise. Also saw G3LDO sending QRSS on 73kHz. In the morning, starting about 0750, was able to work G3XTZ, G3YXM, and G3LDO on normal CW (all 569), since the Rugby TX was off. Could also hear G2AJV sending his beacon signal (339). Later, had a cross-band QSO with DF6NM (O). During the QSO, the noise level started rising, but Markus was still 'M' by the end of the QSO. Thanks to all for the listener reports - next time Rugby is off the air, we could try for some normal CW cross-band QSO's 73k/136k QSO's with Scandinavian stations certainly looks a possibility - I am certainly willing to have a try at any convenient time. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15401 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 12:53:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 12:53:17 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SJJk-0002yz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 12:42:28 +0000 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SJJj-0002yu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 12:42:27 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #35) id 12SJJJ-0004Ok-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 12:42:02 +0000 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 12:31:20 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 12:31:18 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Rugby and 77.5 kHz In-reply-to: <20.2eafbf2.25f645be@aol.com> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > Now Rugby is back to normal. I've included two spectra with it being off > and on , so you can compare. This is fascinating as it shows that, even at nearly 1000km the sidebands are 10-15dB above band noise. This is very reassuring as there is always the worry that it is really a receiver problem, especially with an S9+60 signal. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28502 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 14:37:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 14:37:55 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SKsS-0003tS-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 14:22:24 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SKsR-0003tM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 14:22:23 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id PAA52282 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 15:22:13 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000307161922.3e8ff6ea@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 16:19:22 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: antennas for 136kHz In-reply-to: <000501bf87b4$b7aa0820$952c97d4@oemcomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello all, I tried to put my (limited) knowlegde about 136kHz antennas together and put it on my webpage at : http://www.qsl.net/on7yd/136ant.htm It's a kind of an overview of the antennas that can be used as far as I know), maybe interesting for newcomers. Comments and additional informations are welcome. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29019 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 14:57:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 14:57:33 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SLEY-00042E-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 14:45:14 +0000 Received: from ds-img-7.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.153] helo=spdmbaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SLEX-000429-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 14:45:13 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmbaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id JAA09612 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 09:45:00 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 09:43:21 -0500 From: "Holger 'Geri', DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: antennas for 136kHz To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003070944_MC2-9C15-BCA0@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik, I just had a very brief look (sitting in my office -hi-) to your page. Excellent! As you know, last year around this time I had a lot of questions and you had explained me a lot of the theoretical background neccessary to build a good LF antenna. I used a lot of that knowledge whenn I build my umbrella antenna, which performs excellent today (if wind permits ...). Thanks for putting all this information into public domain, it would be worth being published in a magazine ... Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27617 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 15:00:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 15:00:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SLMZ-00049T-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 14:53:31 +0000 Received: from rubellite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.4]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SLMY-00049O-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 14:53:31 +0000 Received: from w8k3f0 (1Cust11.tnt17.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.53.8.11]) by rubellite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id AEECA2826 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 14:52:50 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <003a01bf8845$bd4fae60$01fa88d4@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "LF-Group" Subject: LF: Cross band QSO's 73/136 kHz Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 15:55:24 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
To All from PA0SE
 
Just made cross band normal CW QSO's with M0BMU (sent 559, received 559) and G3LDO (sent 569, received 559). My antenna system was tuned to 136 kHz. But tuning to 73 kHz probably would not have resulted in better reports because I guessed the signal strength by comparing the signal to the noise and this relation would not be better with the antenna system tuned for 73 kHz.
 
The background noise was the same as this morning with Rugby off the air so apparently the Rugby noise sidebands do no hamper reception overhere.
 
73, Dick, PA0SE
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5798 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 15:24:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 15:24:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SLgG-0004KP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 15:13:52 +0000 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SLgF-0004KK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 15:13:51 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12SLg1-0004nw-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 15:13:38 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 14:55:17 +0000 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 14:55:14 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I was on 73kHz last night and again this morning, but seem to have been beaten to the DX by M0BMU and G3YXM. I will be active again on the band, looking for crossband QSOs on Saturday and Sunday mornings. Frequency nominally 71.800kHz, but avoiding anyone else on that frequency by 5Hz or so. Power is 200W (0.8A antenna current). Thanks to those who have encouraged me by sending reports. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23953 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 18:01:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 18:01:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SO9Y-0005kF-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 17:52:16 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SO9S-0005k7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 17:52:11 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id RAA12723 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 17:51:56 GMT X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000030717481368199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 17:48:13 GMT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: Wild horses tamed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit >From Markus > Last night, I could see several of you (YXM, BMU, XTZ, LDO) in x-band qrss > action with HB2ASB, ON7YD (DFCW) and DK8KW, but didnt get through. Peter's tx > running up and down like a wild horse, but perfectly tame after 23:20 - what > did you do? Earlier I was testing the power amplifier and the antenna using a signal generator as a driver, which is fine for normal CW but no good for QRSS. I finished the 73kHz modifications to the 136kHz crystal mixer driver and used it later. Wish I could fix the galloping horses that easily. I will be on this evening transmitting on around 71.87kHz (no doubt with others!) and looking for QRSS stations around 137.70kHz. -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10293 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 19:13:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 19:13:40 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SPGk-0006He-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 19:03:46 +0000 Received: from amber-rwcmex.excite.com ([198.3.99.12] helo=amber.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SPGg-0006HX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 19:03:43 +0000 Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by bucky.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.31a 201-229-119-114) with ESMTP id <20000307190250.SSHD27570.bucky.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 11:02:50 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <24138943.952455770288.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 11:02:50 -0800 (PST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: antennas for 136kHz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 62.7.140.185 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Rik, This is excellent stuff and very opportune. I have been struggling to work out what antenna will work best for me, and with Laurie's help using EZNEC (thanks Laurie) have evaluated a serial meander system and a top-loaded vertical with a big coil at the top and horizontal or down sloping toploading wires. The trouble is that without fully understanding what is going on it is difficult to interpret the results from EZNEC. Your article has come at just the right moment. I hate the idea of putting something up and then finding that it doesn't work. There is no substitute for understanding. I have a feeling that it should be possible to achieve the full 1 watt out, without having to put up enormous towers. If I may I would like to pose a simple question, to which all the experts are invited to reply: If to the top of a vertical an equal vertical descender is added, insulated from Earth at the bottom, but otherwise the same length as the original vertical and coming straight down (like an old-fashioned hair-pin), and assuming that this is resonated and matched to 50 ohms, will the new antenna radiate more power, less power or the same power for the same input and why? This might for example be the other wire of a sufficiently well spaced feeder (no voltage breakdown), effectively short-circuited at the top and of low RF resistance. 73s and all the best. John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freeworld.excite.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14588 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 20:56:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 20:56:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SQvi-0007Bc-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 20:50:10 +0000 Received: from smtp7.xs4all.nl ([194.109.127.50]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SQvh-0007BX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 20:50:09 +0000 Received: from v3q4v1 (dc2-isdn873.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.151.105]) by smtp7.xs4all.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA23059 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 21:49:59 +0100 (CET) From: "M. Sanders \(PA3BSH\)" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: RE: LF: RE: CFH plots Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 21:42:36 +0100 Message-ID: <000701bf8875$abec3b40$69976dc2@v3q4v1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 In-reply-to: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All, /// > Does this account for the peak and fade sinewave effect we get on > CFH over about an hour, both at US sunset and UK dawn? > > Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) /// Reference measurements around the time of the '99 eclipse have indeed shown the same effect on 75kHz during sunrise and sunset. Since there should be a multi hop sky wave propagation between Canada and the UK also multiple peak and fade effects can occur. However the observations can be explained by this effect only if the timing of the events corellates with the dusk/dawn times at the position of the reflections against the D-layer. Or puting it the other way around if we study the timing of the effects we can approximate the location of the reflections against the D-layer and find out what the number of hops is on any lf DX propagational path. With some experience it should be possible to predict signal sunset/dawn related signal peaks and make a DX-sked accordingly. BTW: A North-South path or v.v. does not show multiple effects since the solar radiation changes at more or less the same time over the total propagational path. The effect could be more intense in this case. Propagational paths near the 'grey-line' should have a less intense effect, possibly obscuring one or more hops along the great-circle path passing near Iceland/Greenland. Greetings, Michael Sanders, PA3BSH From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14065 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2000 23:07:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Mar 2000 23:07:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SSvd-0008JS-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 22:58:13 +0000 Received: from imo16.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SSvc-0008JL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 07 Mar 2000 22:58:12 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from MarkusVester@aol.com by imo16.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id l.2.1724435 (4410) for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 17:57:26 -0500 (EST) From: MarkusVester@aol.com Message-ID: <2.1724435.25f6e355@aol.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 17:57:25 EST Subject: LF: Speckle from the Alps? To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 62 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi LF folks, John wrote in "LF: Weekend report" on 06/03/00 >The local variation in signal strength was again very apparent on Sunday >morning when HB9DCE's signal was poor with both G3YXM and myself, but >Berth was getting R5 reports from GB2CPM and G3XDV - the reverse of the >situation Mike reported last time. It would be very interesting to establish >for certain whether this is due to an enhancement effect (i.e. Mike and >Peter were receiving better than other stations either side) or a >cancellation effect (i.e. Dave and I were in a null). Perhaps we could set >up a 'reports pool' for noting simultaneously the strengths of stations in >Switzerland and Italy (whose signals seem to produce this effect over the >UK) by a number of observers? > > Regards John G4GVC near Leicester, IO92JP Thinking about these observations, there is a striking analogy to the speckle patterns seen in a number of fields, e.g. atmospheric seeing in astronomy, ultrasonic tissue imaging, ground clutter in microwave radar, or (most well known) the structure in a laser spot on the wall. Basically it is caused by the superposition of a number of coherent wavefronts generated by stochastic scattering from some inhomogeneous medium. For LF, flat terrain with trees, houses etc. is smooth because all the obstacles are small compared to a wavelength. Mountain ranges however are a rough surface. The angular granularity ("directivity") of the resulting pattern depends inversely on the lateral width of the radiating zone. If one would assume that Toni's rays are diffused over a region say 20 km (20*lambda/2) wide, this would result in lobes 1/20 radians wide or 50 km "coherence width" at 1000 km. It would be interesting to derive that by observations, I'd expect a somewhat smaller coherence width for broader illumination from transmitters behind the Alps. As the modulation is spatial, not temporal, speckle patterns normaly are static, unless something moves. As the scattering centers (mountains!) are fixed, we might imagine the ionosphere acting like a slowly tilting mirror, sweeping the whole pattern across the receivers. But maybe the scattering centers are not only the rocks themselves: Bob Brown, NM7M, had a fascinating article in QST 12/99 "Bubbles in the Ozone Layer", suggesting that turbulent air-flow over mountain ranges could cause bubbles affecting the ultraviolet irradiation to the D-Layer before sunrise. Regards Markus, DF6NM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24309 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2000 03:27:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Mar 2000 03:27:23 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SWxi-0001yx-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 03:16:38 +0000 Received: from host.king.igs.net ([216.58.2.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SWxh-0001ys-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 03:16:37 +0000 Received: from server1 (ttyC13.king.igs.net [216.58.2.141]) by host.king.igs.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id WAA99027 for ; Tue, 7 Mar 2000 22:16:24 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kayser@king.igs.net) Message-ID: <001101bf88ac$9e653ad0$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: "\"rsgb_lf_group\"" Subject: LF: DCF39 signal up, M class flare an hour ago Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 22:14:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Greetings: DCF39 is up to 28 dB over the background noise tonight an hour after an M class flare event. Prior to the Flare event the signal was in the noise most of the time Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15520 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2000 08:27:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Mar 2000 08:27:39 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SbiY-0004Xw-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 08:21:18 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.41]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SbiX-0004Xr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 08:21:17 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from dennison.demon.co.uk ([194.222.239.33]) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12SbiN-0009aE-0C for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 8 Mar 2000 08:21:08 +0000 Message-ID: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 08:19:45 +0000 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Mike Dennison" Subject: Re: LF: antennas for 136kHz In-reply-to: <24138943.952455770288.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: G4CNN wrote: >If to the top of a vertical an equal vertical descender is added, insulated >from Earth at the bottom, but otherwise the same length as the original >vertical and coming straight down (like an old-fashioned hair-pin), and >assuming that this is resonated and matched to 50 ohms, will the new antenna >radiate more power, less power or the same power for the same input and why? >This might for example be the other wire of a sufficiently well spaced >feeder (no voltage breakdown), effectively short-circuited at the top and of >low RF resistance. If the end of the downwards vertical is insulated from earth, it won't work as the current in it will partly cancel out the current in the upward part. However, =in theory= you can earth the end of the downward wire, and resonate both wires separately as quarter waves, giving effectively half of a folded vertical dipole. I said =in theory= because it would be very difficult to equalise the two wires such that the current distribution was identical, and you have twice the coil losses. If you could get it to work, there would be an improvement because the radiation resistance would be quadrupled and hence earth losses would be much less. BUT if it was easy to do there would be lots of topband operators using it! Good luck. -- Mike, G3XDV IO91VT http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16491 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2000 09:14:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Mar 2000 09:14:51 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ScOZ-0004wo-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 09:04:43 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ScOW-0004wj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 09:04:40 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id KAA10206 for ; Wed, 8 Mar 2000 10:04:30 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000308110138.2e97e666@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Wed, 08 Mar 2000 11:01:38 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: antennas for 136kHz In-reply-to: <24138943.952455770288.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 11:02 7/03/00 -0800, you wrote: >If I may I would like to pose a simple question, to which all the experts >are invited to reply: >If to the top of a vertical an equal vertical descender is added, insulated >from Earth at the bottom, but otherwise the same length as the original >vertical and coming straight down (like an old-fashioned hair-pin), and >assuming that this is resonated and matched to 50 ohms, will the new antenna >radiate more power, less power or the same power for the same input and why? >This might for example be the other wire of a sufficiently well spaced >feeder (no voltage breakdown), effectively short-circuited at the top and of >low RF resistance. This 'hairpin antenna' can be approached in 2 ways : 1. Consider it the minimal version of a meander antenna (2 elements) In this case you would have a SRF (Size Reduction Factor) of about 0.8, what means that a 10m high 'hairpin' would be equal to a 12.5m 'straight vertical'. This would mean a gain of 1.9dB 2. Look at the currentdistribution over the antenna Assuming a linear decrease from feedingpoint to end (and a current of 1A at the feedingpoint) this would mean that the current at the top is 0.5A and at the end of the hairpin it wil be 0A. So the average 'upgoing current' is is +0.75A but we have also an average 'downcoming current' of -0.25A. As long as the spacing of the hairpin is small (compared to the wavelength) we can just add both currents. The result is an average current of 0.5A, exactly the same as what you would have with a 'straight vertical'. So the radiation resistance will not change. But the antenna capacitance will increase (as you put more wire in the air). Based om my experience with multiple topload wires, with a spacing of 1m the capacitance can increase from 6pF/m to 9pF/m. This means an increase of the antennacapacitance by 50% and thus a decrease of the loadingcoil by the same ammount (= less loss in the loadingcoil). For a 10m high antenna (assuming 50 ohm groundloss and a loadingcoil with Q = 300) a gain of 1dB can be expected. Personnaly I think that the second approach is more correct as in the article on meander antennas they assume that the antenna is brought to resonance just by 'meandering' (with a loadingcoil). So a small gain can be expected from a 'hairpin antenna'. but keep in mind that you can get more gain (using the same length of wire and the same antennaheight) with a simple inverted-L or T antenna. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22523 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2000 10:41:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Mar 2000 10:41:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SdnJ-0005lS-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 10:34:21 +0000 Received: from fm215.facility.pipex.com ([194.131.104.225]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SdnH-0005fG-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 10:34:19 +0000 Received: from isis (userbn69.uk.uudial.com [62.188.145.120]) by fm215.facility.pipex.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA17162 for ; Wed, 8 Mar 2000 10:24:54 GMT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.20000308102754.00988750@mail.pncl.co.uk> X-Sender: blanch@mail.pncl.co.uk (Unverified) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Date: Wed, 08 Mar 2000 10:35:12 +0000 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Walter Blanchard" Subject: LF: VLF MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Flg might be of interest to the SM boys thinking of going on 8 kHz. I found it in the memoirs of Dr Jack Pierce (MIT, USA) who had a hand in the design of Omega and Loran-C : "On the occasion I found most interesting, the boys in Hawaii had pieced together all the loading coils they could find and managed to get the small antenna at Haiku tuned to 6250 hertz. At this frequency the power radiated could not have been more than a very few milliwatts. I observed the signal at Cambridge (Massachusetts, USA) with our photographic technique, using triggering pulses at a submultiple frequency, so that a cycle or two stood still on an oscilloscope screen and the photographic record (which plotted the oscilloscope picture against time of day) appeared as black and white stripes. During the night the signal was marvelously clear but at sunrise it declined so rapidly that at first I thought that the transmitter had been turned off. This was because that frequency of the signal came close to or below the cutoff frequency in the waveguide-like space between the earth and the lowest ionized layer. The height of the layer dropped suddenly when the first rays of sunlight reached it in the morning, and the attenuation of the signal increased rapidly. This and one or two other experiments between six and ten kilohertz convinced us that reliable longdistance operation was not to be expected at all hours at a frequency much below ten kilohertz." Date? January 1946. The "small antenna at Haiku" was a 300 ft vertical! These experiments led to the development of Omega, 10.2, 11.666, and 13.3 kHz. Walter G3JKV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1951 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2000 11:54:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Mar 2000 11:54:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SeuB-0006K4-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 11:45:31 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SeuA-0006Jz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 11:45:30 +0000 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12SerL-0005Ze-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 11:42:35 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <23789.200003081150@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 11:50:55 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz to PA0SE X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, Thanks to Dick, PA0SE for the normal CW, cross-band QSO yesterday afternoon. We had no problem exchanging 559 reports. Thanks also to Tom, G3OLB for standing by on 136kHz - I found it a bit confusing at times! This experience suggests there might be other possibilities for similar cross-band, normal CW QSO's, particularly if Rugby is off the air for maintenance again - worth thinking about for next month. Sent several QRSS cross-band CQ's last night on 71.8kHz from about 1945 onwards - didn't see any replies, though. Will try again on Friday, or at other times if someone would like a sked. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9060 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2000 12:04:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Mar 2000 12:04:28 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Sf1e-0006La-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 11:53:14 +0000 Received: from mta03.talk21.com ([62.172.192.172] helo=t21mta03-app.talk21.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Sf1d-0006LV-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 11:53:13 +0000 Received: from dave ([213.1.2.120]) by t21mta03-app.talk21.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20000308115303.QGPO28485.t21mta03-app.talk21.com@dave> for ; Wed, 8 Mar 2000 11:53:03 +0000 Message-ID: <001201bf88f4$d04d7c40$780201d5@dave> From: "Dave Sergeant" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <2.1724435.25f6e355@aol.com> Subject: LF: Re: Speckle from the Alps? Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 11:51:54 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >From Dave G3YMC Markus, DF6NM wrote: >But maybe the scattering centers are not only the rocks themselves: Bob >Brown, NM7M, had a fascinating article in QST 12/99 "Bubbles in the Ozone >Layer", suggesting that turbulent air-flow over mountain ranges could cause >bubbles affecting the ultraviolet irradiation to the D-Layer before sunrise. I also found the QST article fascinating. For those who haven't seen it it concerned reception of a commercial station on 55.5kHz in California by the author in Washington state. He observed an interesting pattern to the signal strength of this station around dawn caused he surmised by enhanced propogation in the ozone layer over the Rocky Mountains to the east. My first thoughts were that this was probably not relevant to us in Europe, but perhaps it may well be the very mechanism which causes the big signal changes we are seeing on Toni's signal close to the Alps, and some of the 73kHz effects. I don't know whether the article is available on the ARRL site, it is actually 3 pages so would be a bit big to send as an attachment. Congratulations to all involved in the recent 73 activity. It has convinced me I am wasting my time there when I only hear s4 signals from the locals! I assume local noise is the limiting factor, but I did use to hear a lot better a couple of years ago. 73s Dave dsergeant@iee.org http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sergeantd From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29942 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2000 14:54:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Mar 2000 14:54:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Shim-0007zR-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 14:45:56 +0000 Received: from imo-d10.mx.aol.com ([205.188.157.42]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Shii-0007zC-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 14:45:52 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id l.d6.1a3526b (4334) for ; Wed, 8 Mar 2000 09:45:07 -0500 (EST) From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 09:45:06 EST Subject: Re: LF: Re: Speckle from the Alps? To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 42 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Markus' idea is most interesting. I hope there will be some way to test it. I'm less impressed with the QST article, though. From what I read there, I cannot find any new sunrise phenomenon that doesn't appear to be explained adequately by existing models. John KD4IDY From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5824 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2000 17:44:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Mar 2000 17:44:00 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SkOq-00014C-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 17:37:32 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.41]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SkOm-000145-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 17:37:29 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12SkOc-000JsC-0C for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 8 Mar 2000 17:37:18 +0000 Message-ID: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 17:32:31 +0000 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz to PA0SE In-reply-to: <23789.200003081150@gemini> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Jim You were a good 569 with me in Devon. I had intended calling you again after you (and Peter) had finished with Dick, but a delivery van of kitchen furniture turned up so I had to go and attend to that! Peter you were an excellent 579. 73, Tom G3OLB In message <23789.200003081150@gemini>, James Moritz writes >Dear LF Group, > > Thanks to Dick, PA0SE for the normal CW, cross-band QSO >yesterday afternoon. We had no problem exchanging 559 reports. >Thanks also to Tom, G3OLB for standing by on 136kHz - I found it >a bit confusing at times! > >This experience suggests there might be other possibilities for >similar cross-band, normal CW QSO's, particularly if Rugby is off >the air for maintenance again - worth thinking about for next month. > >Sent several QRSS cross-band CQ's last night on 71.8kHz from >about 1945 onwards - didn't see any replies, though. Will try again >on Friday, or at other times if someone would like a sked. > >Cheers, Jim Moritz >73 de M0BMU > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1063 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2000 19:34:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Mar 2000 19:34:44 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Sm72-00021E-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 19:27:16 +0000 Received: from amber-rwcmex.excite.com ([198.3.99.12] helo=amber.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Sm6y-000216-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Mar 2000 19:27:13 +0000 Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by ewey.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.31a 201-229-119-114) with ESMTP id <20000308192014.OYKC8264.ewey.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Wed, 8 Mar 2000 11:20:14 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <12613263.952543214775.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 11:20:14 -0800 (PST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: LF antennas MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 213.1.37.193 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Rik, Now I have had time to study your web page on 136 antennas, I have the following comments, which I hope you will find useful. 1. The reason that the antenna current decreases linearly to zero at the end of the antenna, is because sin(x) = x approx for small values of x, and for most amateur antennas the lengths involved are only a fraction of a wavelength. Similarly the reason the voltage is practically constant over any continuous segment of wire making up the antenna is because cos(x) =1 approx. 2. There are several useful programs from G4FGQ for determining probable environmental loss for a given site. 3. The values of Q for loading coils, that you have used in examples are very conservative, it is not particularly difficult to obtain higher values of Q especially for small elevated coils. 4. From your explanation of how to calculate ERP, it follows that in order not to exceed 1 watt ERP, we must not exceed approx. 0.55 watt radiated power. 5. I thought at first that you had lost a factor of 4 (two squared) in formula 5a, but later realised that the ratio is calculated with respect to the average current in a monopole, which is 50%. It might be useful to make this clear, assuming that it isn't just me who trips over this one. 6. The results of calculations agree well with those obtained from G4FGQ's program TANT136. 7. The paragraph just above the graph in section 2.2, states that the gain that can be achieved &is 6dB. The reason for this is that one can at most double the average current in the vertical, which occurs when the current is constant over the vertical segment. 8. Concerning Umbrella antennas, i.e. capacitive top loading with down sloping top loading wires, you suggest a maximum vertical descent of 50% should not be exceeded. In a comment regarding the Galveston NDB, someone (sorry I have forgotten who) said that the textbooks on VLF recommend not more than 30%. I decided to try to determine the optimum value and came up with the following formula: The Optimum length of a down sloper from the top is h(sqrt(1+sec(alpha)) -1), where h is the height of the main mast and alpha is the angle of the sloper from the vertical. Which this length the Radiation Resistance compared with a monopole of the same height is increased by a factor of 4 * (1 + cos(alpa))^2 * (1 - sqrt(cos(alpha)/(1+cos(alpha)))^2. This increases monotonically with alpha. At 89 degrees, L is approx. 6.6 * h and the Radiation Resistance is approx. 3 * that of Monopole. For an angle of 45 degrees, the sloper should descend 39% of the height and the multiplication factor for Rr is only 1.48. 9. You give some useful results and graphs for inductive loading. I would only like to comment that the elevated coil need not be the full value to resonate the top part of the antenna. A combination of top capacitive and inductive loading can be beneficial, e.g a 60 metre horizontal top and a 3 mHenry coil will practically achieve the full 6 dB increase. 10. Section 2.7 Antennas with multiple vertical elements. This looks like a good idea, which needs to be investigated further. 11. Section 2.10 Helical antenna. You point out that if capacitive top loading is added the advantage of a helical antenna will be less. This is of course relatively speaking. This is really a case of "less is more". Congratulations on a fine piece of work. I for one feel that at last I am beginning to understand LF antennas. 73 John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freeworld.excite.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11377 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 08:57:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 08:57:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SyIs-00001h-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 08:28:18 +0000 Received: from artemis.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.126]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SyIr-00001c-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 08:28:17 +0000 Received: from pc171.geog.le.ac.uk ([143.210.25.171] helo=kate) by artemis.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.03 #1) id 12SyId-00050G-01 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 08:28:03 +0000 From: "kate moore" To: "lfgroup" Subject: LF: Speckle patterns / 73kHz activity Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 08:22:23 -0000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Firstly, many thanks to Markus DF6NM for his fascinating suggestion that the signal variations from stations close to the Alps may be 'speckle patterns' of received strength. This certainly seems a plausible explanation and the figures Markus used are of the right order of magnitude for what is being observed. This is another example of the type of 'research' which is ideally suited to Amateur LF work, where we have a number of keen observers within this group distributed over a large area. It would be interesting if we could gather some more formal data on these signal variations and try to establish whether they do in fact conform to some sort of speckle theory. Secondly, hearty congratulations to all those who have made the excellent recent achievements on 73kHz. I'm really pleased to see the 'old band' getting a much deserved new lease of life before we loose it, especially considering the somewhat greater challenge that 73kHz provides (both in producing a good signal and also in receiving it!). As some of you know, I suffer very badly on receive here, as I can actually see the Rugby antennas from my roof. This had more or less totally discouraged me from putting in the necessary work to get a signal out on the band in the short time we have left. Obviously the progress and experience on 136kHz has been used to great effect, both by the UK stations transmitting and especially by the operators in other countries who now have excellent LF receiving systems - another example of the wonderful co-operative spirit of this group, where the overall results are much greater than those of any individual; something I'm particularly grateful to be part of. With all the fun people are having on 73, I might just be tempted to dust off the NOV [73kHz licence extension] and take another look....... Regards John G4GVC From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28019 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 09:22:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 09:22:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SywY-0000Pu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 09:09:18 +0000 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12SywX-0000Pp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 09:09:17 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id KAA69130 for ; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 10:09:06 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000309110614.2c7f39fc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 11:06:14 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF antennas In-reply-to: <12613263.952543214775.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello John Thanks for your comments. >1. The reason that the antenna current decreases linearly to zero at the end >of the antenna, is because sin(x) = x approx for small values of x, and for >most amateur antennas the lengths involved are only a fraction of a >wavelength. >Similarly the reason the voltage is practically constant over any continuous >segment of wire making up the antenna is because cos(x) =1 approx. You are right about that, but I tried to explain it in a more practical way. I think that my approach is technical correct. >2. There are several useful programs from G4FGQ for determining probable >environmental loss for a given site. I intend to extend the page to related subjects (as enviromental losses, measuring ERP etc..) at a later stage. >3. The values of Q for loading coils, that you have used in examples are >very conservative, it is not particularly difficult to obtain higher values >of Q especially for small elevated coils. >From my experience with loadingcoils (built about 10 of them and measred them all here at the university) a Q = 300 is a 'average' value for coils in the mH range using 1mm Cu wire. No doubt heiger Q's can be reached using thicker wire, more spacing etc... One remark : most 'simulating' software gives a far to high Q. I remind that a 3mH coil with a calculated Q of 550 turned out to have a Q of less than 250. So be carefull with calculation and prefer measurement. >4. From your explanation of how to calculate ERP, it follows that in order >not to exceed 1 watt ERP, we must not exceed approx. 0.55 watt radiated >power. Due to its directivity, a short vertical monopole has a gain of 2.6dB over a dipole (4.77dBi versus 2.15dBi for a dipole). >5. I thought at first that you had lost a factor of 4 (two squared) in >formula 5a, but later realised that the ratio is calculated with respect to >the average current in a monopole, which is 50%. It might be useful to make >this clear, assuming that it isn't just me who trips over this one. I deliberately shipped all the math (this just scares most hams). But on a later stage I intend to add the math on a seperate page. >6. The results of calculations agree well with those obtained from G4FGQ's >program TANT136. We probably use the same theorectical background .... .. > >7. The paragraph just above the graph in section 2.2, states that the gain >that can be achieved &is 6dB. The reason for this is that one can at most >double the average current in the vertical, which occurs when the current is >constant over the vertical segment. That is the way I see it >8. Concerning Umbrella antennas, i.e. capacitive top loading with down >sloping top loading wires, you suggest a maximum vertical descent of 50% >should not be exceeded. In a comment regarding the Galveston NDB, someone >(sorry I have forgotten who) said that the textbooks on VLF recommend not >more than 30%. I decided to try to determine the optimum value and came up >with the following formula: >The Optimum length of a down sloper from the top is h(sqrt(1+sec(alpha)) >-1), where h is the height of the main mast and alpha is the angle of the >sloper from the vertical. Which this length the Radiation Resistance >compared with a monopole of the same height is increased by a factor of >4 * (1 + cos(alpa))^2 * (1 - sqrt(cos(alpha)/(1+cos(alpha)))^2. This >increases monotonically with alpha. At 89 degrees, L is approx. 6.6 * h and >the Radiation Resistance is approx. 3 * that of Monopole. >For an angle of 45 degrees, the sloper should descend 39% of the height and >the multiplication factor for Rr is only 1.48. Looks interesting, maybe I will put the umbrella antennas in a seperate chapter (with more detailled information) later. >9. You give some useful results and graphs for inductive loading. I would >only like to comment that the elevated coil need not be the full value to >resonate the top part of the antenna. A combination of top capacitive and >inductive loading can be beneficial, e.g a 60 metre horizontal top and a 3 >mHenry coil will practically achieve the full 6 dB increase. That is correct, the antenna I use has a +/- 300pF tophat at 13m, a elevated coil of +/- 1.8mH at 12m and a coil at the base of +/- 2mH. BTW : the effect of an elevated coil was much more than expected, this is explained in a additional page (see combined inductive / capacitive toploading). >10. Section 2.7 Antennas with multiple vertical elements. This looks like a >good idea, which needs to be investigated further. >11. Section 2.10 Helical antenna. You point out that if capacitive top >loading is added the advantage of a helical antenna will be less. This is of >course relatively speaking. This is really a case of "less is more". What I mean is : if you replace a 'straight' vertical without toploading by a helical antenna you will win 2.5dB. But if you already have sufficient capacitive toploading gain will be minimal (0.5dB or even less) and will not be worth the effort. >Congratulations on a fine piece of work. I for one feel that at last I am >beginning to understand LF antennas. Thanks, that was the meaning of this pages. But I do not have the 'wisdom' all for myself so all comments are welcome and I will be happy to correct any errors. But one of the problems is that English is not my native language (you UK and US guys are really spoiled on internet), so sometimes things are understood differently from what I meant. Although I speak English very often here at the university (thanks to - mainly - US guys who refuse to learn Dutch even after living here for several years) my writing is far from perfect. So if you find any errors in spelling and/or gramatics please report them. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3779 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 10:39:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 10:39:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T0Fx-000172-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 10:33:25 +0000 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T0Fw-00016u-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 10:33:24 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12T0Ff-0005HW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 10:33:08 +0000 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 10:16:30 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 10:16:29 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF antennas In-reply-to: <3.0.1.16.20000309110614.2c7f39fc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> References: <12613263.952543214775.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > Due to its directivity, a short vertical monopole has a gain of 2.6dB over > a dipole (4.77dBi versus 2.15dBi for a dipole). Careful! Surely this assumes perfect ground, doesn't it? Even at HF, I think most amateurs would prefer to use a vertical dipole than a ground-plane antenna. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8778 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 11:29:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 11:29:15 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T11z-0001dE-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 11:23:03 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T11y-0001d8-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 11:23:02 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id MAA125246 for ; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 12:22:52 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000309131959.21d7453a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 13:19:59 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF antennas In-reply-to: References: <3.0.1.16.20000309110614.2c7f39fc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be><12613263.952543214775.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 10:16 9/03/00 -0000, G3XDV wrote: >> Due to its directivity, a short vertical monopole has a gain of 2.6dB over >> a dipole (4.77dBi versus 2.15dBi for a dipole). > >Careful! Surely this assumes perfect ground, doesn't it? Even at >HF, I think most amateurs would prefer to use a vertical dipole than >a ground-plane antenna. Good point. I have been breaking my mind about that for some while. But it seems to me that we take the inperfect ground into account already with the ground-loss resistance, so do we have to take it into account a second time ? eg : assume a 10m high vertical (radiation resistance 8.2 milli-Ohm) If we had a perfect ground (and loadingcoil) only the radiation resistance will limit the antennacurrent, so if we put 100W into the system we will have an antennacurrent of 110A (!) and radiate 100W, what due to the directivity of the antenna results in 183W ERP. Now we take the real-world case and assume a loss of 100 Ohm (environement + coil). If we put 100W into this system we will have an antennacurrent of 1A and radiate 8.2mW (-42dB compared to the 'perfect case'). The question is if we can take the directivity of a perfect vertical (2.6dB) into account ? My opinion is that we have to take this gain into account, as the enviromental losses already played their part by limiting the antennacurrent. But the only way to find out what really happens is to measure the radiation pattern of the antenna, is the anyone with acces to a small airplane or helicopter ? 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20657 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 11:37:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 11:37:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T19P-0001eO-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 11:30:43 +0000 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T19N-0001eJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 11:30:42 +0000 Received: from as24-s16-145-140.cwci.net ([195.44.145.140] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T19D-0002Qk-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 11:30:31 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C78A5A.EC13E3F9@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 11:26:19 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: countries active. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To date there seems to be 20 countries active on 136 khz. I have not heard any S5* activity yet although there are reports of activity from that area. I received a qsl card to day from OM2TW that confirms 19 countries worked two way on 136 khz and confirmed for me, plus several other countries xband. A number of operators although not transmitting on 136 khz in other countries do listen on the band and I find the qsx approach is useful for working further afield. I also get swl cards, reports via email and telephone frequently. For transatlantic tests a talk back freq would be useful say 140060 khz cw or any other suitable frequency by arrangement and one would know immediately if the signals were getting there on 136 khz. We could do with some more new countries further away like SV, YU, TA, UA and in the other direction TF, OX, OY, CU and EA8. There is some 160 metre acty from these areas but no one interested so far in 136 khz. 73 de Malcolm/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11636 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 11:51:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 11:51:28 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T1ML-0001mn-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 11:44:05 +0000 Received: from mb07.swip.net ([193.12.122.211]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T1Lq-0001mf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 11:43:35 +0000 Received: from oemcomputer (d212-151-42-123.swipnet.se [212.151.42.123]) by mb07.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA27378 for ; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 12:43:06 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <017d01bf89bc$e96f36a0$bb2197d4@oemcomputer> From: "Johan Bodin" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: 1000 km exceeded on 73 kHz Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 12:44:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello All, I had the pleasure to work G3YXM crossband on 73 kHz / 80 m this morning. QRB 1122 km. I was really surprised by the good S/N ratio of Dave's signal. The practical limit is probably far beyond 1000 km. There's a Spectrogram screenshot at: http://home4.swipnet.se/~w-41522/73k/g3yxm.html 73 Johan Bodin, SM6LKM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17681 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 12:23:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 12:23:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T1s1-000257-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 12:16:49 +0000 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T1s0-000252-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 12:16:48 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12T1rl-0006VJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 12:16:34 +0000 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 12:09:59 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 12:09:57 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF antennas In-reply-to: <3.0.1.16.20000309131959.21d7453a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> References: X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: ON7YD wrote: > Now we take the real-world case and assume a loss of 100 Ohm (environement > + coil). If we put 100W into this system we will have an antennacurrent of > 1A and radiate 8.2mW (-42dB compared to the 'perfect case'). The question > is if we can take the directivity of a perfect vertical (2.6dB) into > account ? My opinion is that we have to take this gain into account, as > the enviromental losses already played their part by limiting the > antennacurrent. But the only way to find out what really happens is to > measure the radiation pattern of the antenna, is the anyone with acces to > a small airplane or helicopter ? Hmmm. Well I think we do have to take earth losses into account twice. This is because it not only affects the ERP because of the effective resistance in series with the source (which is also affected by any resistance in the connection to the earth), but it also affects the 'ground gain' which is the result of reflection from the ground after the signal has left the antenna. I am inclined to think that in a practical amateur LF station there is little or no ground gain by reflection, except perhaps where the station is very near the sea. By 'ground' I am including any radial system which in a commercial station dramatically improves the real ground resistance close to the antenna, but is usually very inefficient in an amateur station. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5997 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 14:07:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 14:07:03 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T3UK-00030B-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 14:00:28 +0000 Received: from rhenium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.93]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T3UJ-000306-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 14:00:27 +0000 Received: from [62.6.99.248] (helo=default) by rhenium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12T3U1-0002F9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 14:00:09 +0000 Message-ID: <000301bf89ce$ed0a3280$f863063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: test signals 137.682 Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 13:53:08 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all strong test signals heard here, QRS like, on 137.682 between about 1300z and 1345z. Another new call-sign ?? Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3541 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 14:24:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 14:24:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T3f4-00039B-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 14:11:34 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T3f3-000396-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 14:11:33 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id PAA116132 for ; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 15:11:23 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000309160831.2c7fba6a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 16:08:31 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF antennas In-reply-to: References: <3.0.1.16.20000309131959.21d7453a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 12:09 9/03/00 -0000, G3XDV wrote: >Hmmm. Well I think we do have to take earth losses into account >twice. This is because it not only affects the ERP because of the >effective resistance in series with the source (which is also affected >by any resistance in the connection to the earth), but it also affects >the 'ground gain' which is the result of reflection from the ground >after the signal has left the antenna. I am inclined to think that in a >practical amateur LF station there is little or no ground gain by >reflection, except perhaps where the station is very near the sea. >By 'ground' I am including any radial system which in a commercial >station dramatically improves the real ground resistance close to >the antenna, but is usually very inefficient in an amateur station. Hello Mike & the others, I hope that the discussion about the effect of groundloss on antennagain (directivity) it not too boring, but I think it is very important to understand this well if we want to find out how short vertical monopoles work. So here I go again .... .. 1. Assume we have a perfect ground With any antenna over a perfect ground you will get a (virtual) mirror of this antenna 'below the ground'. As with images and a glass-mirror the mirror-antenna will be left-right reversed, or otherwise said in counterphase to the 'real' antenna. (there must be a better way to explain that in English) The 'mirror' antenna will radiate the same power as the 'real' antenna. This explains why a lambda/4 vertical monopole (Marconi antenna) has a 3dB gain over a vertical dipole, with the Marconi antenna the second half of the dipole is formed by the 'mirror' and both parts get full power while for a vertical dipole the total power is divided over both lamda/4 parts. This explains also why a horizontal antenna at low height (in wavelengths) will not work as all radiation is canceled out by the 'mirror' antenna. 2. Assume we have no ground at all (antenna in free space) Here a short vertical monopole will not radiate at all, as it needs some 'counterweight' (either ground, radials or even the shield of a coax) to allow the 'return current' to flow. However a dipole without ground will work perfectly (as it has its own 'counterweight'). 3. Assume a lossy ground (real life) That's a bit like looking in dirty mirror, you will see your mirror-image but much weaker than with a 'clean mirror'. But the mirror image will be at the same place regardless wether the mirror is clean or dirty. For a short vertical monopole over a lossy ground this would mean that only a (small) part of the power you put in the antenna 'sees a mirror image' and wil be radiated the other (mayor) part will 'see no mirror image' and thus will act as for a short vertical monopole without ground : it will not be radiated. The rdatio between the radiated and non radiated part is determined by the ratio of the loss resistance versus radiation resistance. But the part that is radiated will 'see a mirror antenna' at the same place as in the case of a loss-less ground and thus it will have the same directivity (= gain). If that is correct than we have to take the 2.6dB gain into account, even with a very lossy ground. I hope the above was not too confusing. This is the way I see it (or try to understand it), it is not meant to be 'the one and only truth'. If there are other opinions, please 'shoot'. We all can only learn from it. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23614 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 14:30:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 14:30:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T3ql-0003HI-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 14:23:39 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.sci.fi ([195.74.0.53] helo=pefletti.saunalahti.fi ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T3qj-0003HD-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 14:23:38 +0000 Received: from default (MKCCCXXIX.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.166.129]) by pefletti.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id QAA20944 for ; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 16:23:01 +0200 (EET) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000309162256.008655f0@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: oh2lx@pop.saunalahti.fi X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 16:22:56 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF antennas In-reply-to: References: <3.0.1.16.20000309131959.21d7453a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, Some time ago I wrote a story for SRAL magazine about (LF) progation terminology with a drawing or a sketch showing the proposed radiated components* near the radiating short vertical monopole. Subsequently I asked comments from the best "ground wave expert" I know, with much experience on measuring ground waves both at ground level and in the air. Especially how the radiated energy divides into components. Refering to my sketch I gave examples of extreme cases of short radiating element (10 m) and high one (645 m in Poland until 1991). The measuring element was 1 m high with base 1 m above the ground level (the sketch is a 108kb TIF). How to draw the inevitable "rays" fm one antenna to another. Anyone having some good ideas or suggestions. de Vaino,OH2LX Discussion abt what happens near the Tx antenna is needed... - so far, no comments from my colleague mentioned... - * the wave components shown as "rays" in the sketch: - direct wave + ground reflected wave = space wave - surface wave (at the interface: air/ground) - ionospheric wave (separates into its own component) how? - sub-surface wave (under the earth) its importance? - GROUND WAVE which is the suggested term forpractical, measurable resultant wave (to some distance fm tx ant) I read in "the LF Experimenter's Source Book" (page 1.10): "All line-of-sight propagation will presumably be by ground wave, as all aerials will effectively be at ground level". "Direct path (the Space wave), as used on other frequencies will not work, as they involve both a direct wave and a ground-reflected wave". "As the aerial height (in wavelengths) tends to zero, they reach the same amplitude but opposite phase and cancel out". I have been sitting in an airplane at 100-200 m for more than 500 hours while measuring LF and MF stations. Does the above mean that, say 1-2 km from the transmitter there is no space wave component (after cancellation)? (not quite sure what is "line-of-sight" on LF frequencies) ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1416 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 16:16:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 16:16:40 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T5Tm-0004GY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 16:08:02 +0000 Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com ([205.188.157.35]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T5Tl-0004GQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 16:08:01 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id l.6c.2023299 (3970) for ; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 11:07:16 -0500 (EST) From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <6c.2023299.25f92633@aol.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 11:07:15 EST Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF antennas To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 42 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In a message dated 3/9/00 4:17:45 AM Eastern Standard Time, rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be writes: << Due to its directivity, a short vertical monopole has a gain of 2.6dB over a dipole (4.77dBi versus 2.15dBi for a dipole). >> This is one point which may deserve some clarification. A real-world implementation of a short vertical monopole will have a net loss over most other antennas, rather than a net gain. When using the term "gain" without further description, I suspect most people take the meaning of overall or net gain. Overall gain of an antenna is, of course, the product of directivity in the vertical plane, directivity in the horizontal plane, and efficiency (related to radiation resistance and loss). It might be better to say the short monopole has a directivity advantage of 2.6dB over the dipole. << Although I speak English very often here at the university (thanks to - mainly - US guys who refuse to learn Dutch even after living here for several years) my writing is far from perfect. >> Be assured, Rik, your spelling and grammar are a lot better than many of the U.S. guys when they attempt to put a page together. Just as we assume anyone will understand us if we speak loudly and slowly, we assume you'll read our Web pages the same way and somehow absorb the meaning from them. Your writing is eminently readable and understandable. Congratulations on a job well done! 73, John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25169 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 16:37:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 16:37:15 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T5oQ-0004Pz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 16:29:22 +0000 Received: from imo-d03.mx.aol.com ([205.188.157.35]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T5oP-0004Pn-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 16:29:21 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id l.1c.1583c8a (3970) for ; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 11:28:30 -0500 (EST) From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <1c.1583c8a.25f92b2e@aol.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 11:28:30 EST Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF antennas To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 42 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Oops! Between the time I composed my message and the time I finally reconnected in order to send it, Mike and others had already commented on the 2.6dB directivity. However, I believe my observation offers a way out of having to consider ground losses twice. If we refer to vertical pattern directivity and azimuthal pattern directivity, we understand them to be assumed ideal conditions. Since the overall gain is the mathematical product of those two factors and the real-world losses, the losses can legitimately be lumped into one single factor of the product that affects the whole outcome. Of course, that factor may be a complicated one to describe mathematically in the real world, involving in the simplest case the radiation resistance of the antenna versus losses in the tuning coil and earth; and in more complicated cases, involving the added problem of other objects in the vicinity, their conductivity, the mutual impedances between them and the antenna, and so on. But I think the important point is, the loss factor can be legitimately separated from the two directivities, and thus allow us to consider them in the realm of the ideal. It's just that, when comparing antennas, we need to specify whether we are talking about overall gain (which includes the loss factor) or directivity alone. 73, John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13834 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 17:01:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 17:01:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T66l-0004Z2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 16:48:19 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T66k-0004Yx-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 16:48:18 +0000 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12T63w-0005U9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 16:45:24 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <27202.200003091653@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 16:53:44 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 1000km exceeded on 73kHz X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: From Johan, SM6LKM:

> Hello All,
>
>
> I had the pleasure to work G3YXM crossband on 73 kHz / 80 m this
> morning. QRB 1122 km.
>

Dear LF Group,
Congratulations to Johan & Dave on a great "first" - perhaps
we should get the stateside guys to listen out on 73kHz!

Cheers, Jim Moritz
73 de M0BMU

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11008 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 17:28:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 17:28:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T6ST-0004ql-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 17:10:45 +0000 Received: from carbon.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.92]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T6SS-0004qg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 17:10:44 +0000 Received: from [213.1.145.95] (helo=default) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12T6S2-0005xt-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 17:10:18 +0000 Message-ID: <000501bf89e9$81d3f440$5f9101d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Hungary spotted on 136 Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 17:03:28 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, there is a spot for the 6th March on my local DX Cluster reporting HA6PC active with a reputed 500m of wire!! The time was 1800z and the signal was reported weak by OM5RW. So this may be a skywave QSO, after dark....no more recent spots. Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15105 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 19:12:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 19:12:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T8CR-0005pv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 19:02:19 +0000 Received: from ewey-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.191] helo=ewey.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T8CQ-0005pp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 19:02:18 +0000 Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by kuku.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.31a 201-229-119-114) with ESMTP id <20000309190030.MOHN19768.kuku.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 11:00:30 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <23816939.952628430448.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 11:00:30 -0800 (PST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF antennas MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 62.7.185.216 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Rik, Mirrors don't really reverse left and right any more than they reverse top and bottom, what they really reverse is front and back. The word I think you were looking for is anti-phase. Don't worry about the English, you are better than many native English speakers. John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freeworld.excite.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 838 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 20:33:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 20:33:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T9OZ-0006cv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 20:18:55 +0000 Received: from mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T9OY-0006WE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 20:18:54 +0000 Received: from [202.27.181.181] by mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <20000309201809.IIWA13910061.mta1-rme@[202.27.181.181]> for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 09:18:09 +1300 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C8068B.1A9A@xtra.co.nz> Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 09:16:11 +1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF antennas References: <3.0.1.16.20000309110614.2c7f39fc@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <12613263.952543214775.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> <3.0.1.16.20000309131959.21d7453a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik Strobbe wrote: > > At 10:16 9/03/00 -0000, G3XDV wrote: > >> Due to its directivity, a short vertical monopole has a gain of 2.6dB over > >> a dipole (4.77dBi versus 2.15dBi for a dipole). > > > >Careful! Surely this assumes perfect ground, doesn't it? Even at > >HF, I think most amateurs would prefer to use a vertical dipole than > >a ground-plane antenna. > > Good point. I have been breaking my mind about that for some while. But it > seems to me that we take the inperfect ground into account already with the > ground-loss resistance, so do we have to take it into account a second time ? In theory, for a perfect loss-free situation, a short vertical monopole has 100% of the power applied, whereas the dipole effectively has 50% applied to each side. The directivity of the single element short vertical monopole is slightly less than the dipole (effectively a two element monopole), so from a basic consideration one can see that the gain figures from theory (see above) are intuitively about right. The gain difference between 4.77dBi for the short vertical monopole versus 2.15dBi for a dipole is 2.62 dB (a power ratio of 50% versus 100% is 3 dB). Also note that the input resistance of the short vertical monopole lower than that of the (balanced) dipole input resistance (in quarter wave monopoles vs dipoles, the monopole resistance is half that of the dipole). In the practical LF situation, the short vertical monopole is unavoidably located over lossy ground. Consequently the input resistance is always HIGHER than the theoretical case for a loss-free ground plane. I am less sure about what to do when applying this to the regulatory situation where a limit is set on e.i.r.p. and whether it is fair to bundle the 2.62 dB figure into the e.i.r.p. calculation. My suggestion is to not include it, as the input resistance of a practical short monopole is always a lot higher than the theoretical loss-free model, so it is invalid to directly apply the theory applicable to loss free situations. I am aware that taking this approach means that amateur transmitters could be increased to about double the applied power to comply with a given regulatory limit. Amateurs would be very happy to use a loss-free ground plane, but the reality is that they are not available in practice. Thus I question the applicability of loss-free theory being used to estimate radiated power. Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27371 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 21:00:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 21:00:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T9oM-0006ml-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 20:45:34 +0000 Received: from smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.156]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12T9oK-0006mg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 20:45:33 +0000 Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-111-3.bellatlantic.net [151.200.111.3]) by smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id PAA26309; Thu, 9 Mar 2000 15:45:05 -0500 (EST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C80E07.17473F98@bellatlantic.net> Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 15:48:08 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Antenna Radiation Article Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: A very good article on the subject of antenna radiation is available at http://www.ednmag.com/ednmag/reg/2000/03022000/05ms624.htm 73 Andre' N4ICK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 672 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2000 21:11:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Mar 2000 21:11:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TA6a-0006xz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 21:04:24 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TA6Z-0006xu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 21:04:23 +0000 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12TA3k-0002uu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2000 21:01:28 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <8438.200003092109@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 21:09:49 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Antennas X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, Very interested to read the discussion on antennas - a couple of things: Ground planes: it seems to me that the ground isn't much like a plane at all; at LF, the skin depth of the ground is from several metres to tens of metres, depending on the type of ground - similar to or larger than the height of most amateur antennas. Therefore, a considerable part of the field of the antenna must be within the ground itself. It might be better to think of such antennas as asymmetrical dipoles, one side of which (the ground system) are embedded in a lossy dielectric (the ground). The other thing is about ground waves and sky waves; OH2LX's comments about how much of each are produced by a given antenna, and whether anybody knows, are most fascinating. It certainly seems to me that ground waves are a different thing to waves in free space; looking at the literature, there are whole classes of surface wave propagation modes where the surface of a conductor, or the interface between two dielectrics, acts as a sort of one-sided wave guide. There are many types of microwave antenna that use these modes, and a copy of the RSGB handbook from the 1960's features a single-wire low loss UHF transmission line using a surface wave mode. Then again, the field strength produced by the ground wave, at least when the ground is good, and the distance fairly short, is supposed to be close to the value arrived at for the 'free space' antenna. Apparently, measurements confirm this. Software such as EZNEC gives the result that there is zero propagation along the horizontal with anything other than perfectly conducting ground, but we all know this is not so. I would be very interested to see the article Vaino refers to, if he could tell me where it can be obtained. Hope this makes some sense.... Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8415 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2000 09:47:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Mar 2000 09:47:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TLpj-00059j-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 09:35:47 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TLpg-00059e-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 09:35:44 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id KAA63974 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 10:35:34 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000310113241.2d67b39a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 11:32:41 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: gain of short vertical monopole In-reply-to: <38C80E07.17473F98@bellatlantic.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I am very pleased with the discusion about the 'gain' (ahum ... apart from the many dB groundloss) of a short vertical monopole. It is very interesting to read the various points of view. What about following experiment : 1. Someone with good 'ground-connection' (let's say less than 50 Ohm loss) adjusts the TX power to get a certain antennacurrent. The (relative) signalstrength is measured accurately (can be done by one or more other hams at their stations). 2. Now the TX station disconnects the 'ground-connection'. This (hopefully) will increase the groundloss to a significantly higher value. The TX power now is adjusted (increased) to get exactly the same antennacurrent as in 1. The (relative) signalstrength is now measured again and compared to the signalstrength of 1. If the signalstrength has changed this indicates that the 'gain' is dependent of the groundloss (and vice versa). The distance between TX and RX should be in the 30 to 100km range and maybe the experiment is best done during daytime. This makes shure that you are measuring the 'far-field' and surface wave. The Rx stations should measure the relative signalstrength with an AF-voltmeter at the audio-output of the RX (or using spectogram with linear scale) and you might need a very sharp eye to see any differences on a (more or less logaritmic) s-meter. In practice it might be better to start with step 2 (at full TX power) and the reduce the power to get the same antennacurrent is step 1. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15253 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2000 10:49:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Mar 2000 10:49:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TMs6-0005k8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 10:42:18 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TMs2-0005k3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 10:42:14 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id KAA24621 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 10:42:02 GMT X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000031010282968199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 10:28:29 GMT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: LF Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit >From Johan Bodin > I had the pleasure to work G3YXM crossband on 73 kHz / 80 m this > morning. QRB 1122 km. Congratulations to Johan and Dave I tried a 73/137 sked with Johan this morning (Friday) but was unsuccessful Have done some 72kHz tests with IK5ZPV. Valerio has sent a .jpg of my signal received at 2155 on Wed 8th showing 'LDO' then the K disapearing below the noise (or was it the Alps speckles). I have an ex-something amplifier with a nice heatsink and a lot of BD545Ds and BD546Ds. I can't find any data on these devices - can anyone help? -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15246 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2000 10:51:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Mar 2000 10:51:00 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TMuo-0005kY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 10:45:06 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from ns1.swh.sk ([192.108.125.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TMun-0005kR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 10:45:05 +0000 Received: from hermes.swh.sk (hermes [195.41.64.129]) by ns1.swh.sk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA19634 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 11:44:50 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from btss101a.swh.sk (btss.swh.sk [195.41.64.15]) by hermes.swh.sk (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id LAA26386 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 11:44:46 +0100 (MET) Received: by btss.swh.sk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 11:44:43 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <92CA25F78271D111969400A024297F5B030E8916@btss.swh.sk> From: "Gasparik Richard" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: Hungary spotted on 136 Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 11:44:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi LFers... I spoked with Csaba HA6PX and he told me, that Gyuri HA6PC just tested his TX on monday. But HA6PC will be QRV on 136 for the first time on the afternoon of friday 10th until Saturday morning. He will be using 120 Watts and 500m long wire antenna. They will operate from HG6N QTH from JN98VE (about 150m from OM/HA boarder). Rich OM2TW > -----Original Message----- > From: Alan Melia [SMTP:Alan.Melia@btinternet.com] > Sent: 9. marec 2000 18:03 > To: rsgb_lf_group > Subject: LF: Hungary spotted on 136 > > Hi all, there is a spot for the 6th March on my local DX Cluster reporting > HA6PC active with a reputed 500m of wire!! The time was 1800z and the > signal > was reported weak by OM5RW. So this may be a skywave QSO, after dark....no > more recent spots. > > Cheers de Alan G3NYK > Alan.Melia@btinternet.com > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7023 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2000 11:28:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Mar 2000 11:28:29 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TNUm-0006Pq-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 11:22:16 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TNUk-0006Pl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 11:22:14 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id MAA80106 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 12:22:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000310131910.21e7bae4@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:19:10 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF In-reply-to: <2000031010282968199@zetnet.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >I have an ex-something amplifier with a nice heatsink and a lot of >BD545Ds and BD546Ds. I can't find any data on these devices - can anyone help? BD454D : - NPN - TOP66 package - Vcb max = 120V - Vce max = 120V - Veb max = 5V - Ic max = 15A - Ft min = 3MHz - Hfe = 25 minimum BD546D : - PNP all other data same as BD454D Leads (for both, seen from below with mounting surface down) : +-----------+ / \ | B C E | +---------------+ 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13635 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2000 11:34:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Mar 2000 11:34:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TNZx-0006XK-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 11:27:37 +0000 Received: from ulexite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TNZu-0006XE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 11:27:34 +0000 Received: from w8k3f0 (1Cust18.tnt6.rtm1.nl.uu.net [212.153.214.18]) by ulexite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id 4F20FFAEE8 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 10:26:36 -0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <000201bf8a84$7f4e0940$12d699d4@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <8438.200003092109@gemini> Subject: LF: Re: Antennas Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 12:30:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To All from PA0SE Jim, M0MBU, wrote: >Software such as EZNEC gives the result that there is > zero propagation along the horizontal with anything other than > perfectly conducting ground, but we all know this is not so. That is so because the program does not compute the surface wave. Maker Roy Lewallen, W7EL, wrote to me: "'Only the professional versions of EZNEC (EZNEC-M and EZNEC/4) directly report the ground wave. However, a reasonable approximation of the ground wave strength can be gotten by using the EZNEC near field analysis. This is because the "near field" analysis actually calculates the total field, both near and far, including the ground wave. The near field analysis results are available only as numbers; they are not plotted as a graphical pattern". I found out that the same applies to the program AO by K6STI that I use. In the region where field strength of the ground wave decreases in a linear way with distance the ground wave fills the area between the pattern lobe presented by EZNEC or AO and the surface and the result resembles the pattern that the programs (and text books) show as the vertical radiation pattern of a short vertical antenna over perfect ground. 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29144 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2000 12:40:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Mar 2000 12:40:55 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TOYl-00079J-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 12:30:27 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from ns1.swh.sk ([192.108.125.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TOYh-00079E-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 12:30:23 +0000 Received: from hermes.swh.sk (hermes [195.41.64.129]) by ns1.swh.sk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA22919 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:30:05 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from btss101a.swh.sk (btss.swh.sk [195.41.64.15]) by hermes.swh.sk (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id NAA05886 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:29:59 +0100 (MET) Received: by btss.swh.sk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:29:57 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <92CA25F78271D111969400A024297F5B031906A4@btss.swh.sk> From: "Gasparik Richard" To: "Rsgb_Lf_Group \(E-mail\)" Subject: LF: CEPT document... Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:29:55 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi LFers... Have anyone an CEPT document with recomendation for hams to use 136kHz ? Rich OM2TW From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8460 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2000 13:07:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Mar 2000 13:07:18 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TP1P-0007QM-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:00:03 +0000 Received: from ghosthost.radar.no ([194.143.115.5]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TP1N-0007Pu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:00:01 +0000 Received: from radar.no (Magne@dhcp-66.radar.no [194.143.115.66]) by ghosthost.radar.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA29887 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:59:51 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38C8F1C6.6F8260D7@radar.no> Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:59:50 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Magne_M=E6hre?= X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: RADAR Software AS X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: CEPT document... References: <92CA25F78271D111969400A024297F5B031906A4@btss.swh.sk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Gasparik Richard wrote: > > Hi LFers... > > Have anyone an CEPT document with recomendation for hams to use 136kHz ? The relevant document is "CEPT/ERC Recommendation 62-01". It is available at http://www.ero.dk/doc98/Official/HTML/REC6201E.HTM --Magne / LA1BFA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25739 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2000 13:49:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Mar 2000 13:49:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TPg3-0007qy-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:42:03 +0000 Received: from mailout03.sul.t-online.de ([194.25.134.81]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TPg1-0007qn-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:42:01 +0000 Received: from fwd06.sul.t-online.de by mailout03.sul.t-online.de with smtp id 12TPfr-0002lh-03; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 14:41:51 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from (087321565-0001@[212.184.147.162]) by fwd06.sul.t-online.de with smtp id 12TPfg-2029k8C; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 14:41:40 +0100 From: "Hans-Joachim Brandt" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 References: <2000031010282968199@zetnet.co.uk> Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF BD545/546 X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 14:41:40 +0100 Message-ID: <12TPfg-2029k8C@fwd06.sul.t-online.de> X-Sender: 087321565-0001@t-dialin.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello all, here are some Bd545/546 data: All BD545 are NPNs, all BD546 are PNPs, all peak current 15 A and dissipation 85 Watts at Tcase 25 degs Celsius, Ft > 3 MHz, B >25 at 5 A; Case "TO-3 plastic" (B-19 X-86) Uce-max: BD545/546 40 V A versions 60 V B versions 80 V C versions 100 V D versions 120 V Manufacturer : Texas Instruments 73 Ha-Jo, DJ1ZB Peter Dodd schrieb: > >From Johan Bodin > > > I had the pleasure to work G3YXM crossband on 73 kHz / 80 m this > > morning. QRB 1122 km. > > Congratulations to Johan and Dave > > > I tried a 73/137 sked with Johan this morning (Friday) but was unsuccessful > > > Have done some 72kHz tests with IK5ZPV. Valerio has sent a .jpg of my > signal received at 2155 on Wed 8th showing 'LDO' then the K > disapearing below the noise (or was it the Alps speckles). > > I have an ex-something amplifier with a nice heatsink and a lot of > BD545Ds and BD546Ds. I can't find any data on these devices - can anyone help? > > > -- > Regards, Peter, G3LDO > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23946 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2000 13:50:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Mar 2000 13:50:28 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TPg3-0007qx-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:42:03 +0000 Received: from mailout05.sul.t-online.de ([194.25.134.82]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TPg1-0007qo-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 13:42:01 +0000 Received: from fwd06.sul.t-online.de by mailout05.sul.t-online.de with smtp id 12TPfr-0004Pv-08; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 14:41:51 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from (087321565-0001@[212.184.147.162]) by fwd06.sul.t-online.de with smtp id 12TPfh-2029k9C; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 14:41:41 +0100 From: "Hans-Joachim Brandt" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 References: <92CA25F78271D111969400A024297F5B031906A4@btss.swh.sk> Subject: Re: LF: CEPT document... X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 14:41:41 +0100 Message-ID: <12TPfh-2029k9C@fwd06.sul.t-online.de> X-Sender: 087321565-0001@t-dialin.net Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Gasparik Richard schrieb: > Hi LFers... > > Have anyone an CEPT document with recomendation for hams to use 136kHz ? > > Rich OM2TW > It should be possible to find it on the ERO server http://www.ero.dk The CEPT Recommendation T/R 62-01 has come into force on 25. April 1997. I have tried to find it but I did not get through. 73 Ha-Jo, DJ1ZB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18054 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2000 14:13:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Mar 2000 14:13:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TQ3y-0007v3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 14:06:46 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TQ3w-0007uy-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 14:06:44 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id PAA134542 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 15:06:32 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000310160339.0d4f30ae@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 16:03:39 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: read something about LF In-reply-to: <38C8F1C6.6F8260D7@radar.no> References: <92CA25F78271D111969400A024297F5B031906A4@btss.swh.sk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Over the past years I got a small collection of articles about 136kHz or related topics. Last night I did put the information together and placed it on my web-page : http://www.qsl.net/on7yd/136lit.htm At this moment you will find there a small (and incomplete) overview of what you can read about LF and where to find it. But with YOUR help I can extend this list, so in case you know other books, articles or magazines covering LF related topics please let me know. Thanks in advance. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23487 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2000 14:44:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Mar 2000 14:44:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TQX1-0008Jf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 14:36:47 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from ns1.swh.sk ([192.108.125.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TQWq-0008JX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 14:36:37 +0000 Received: from hermes.swh.sk (hermes [195.41.64.129]) by ns1.swh.sk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id PAA26596 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 15:36:23 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from btss101a.swh.sk (btss.swh.sk [195.41.64.15]) by hermes.swh.sk (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id PAA18350 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 15:36:19 +0100 (MET) Received: by btss.swh.sk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 15:36:17 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <92CA25F78271D111969400A024297F5B031907D8@btss.swh.sk> From: "Gasparik Richard" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: RE: LF: CEPT document... Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 15:36:16 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thank you... > -----Original Message----- > From: Magne Mahre [SMTP:magne@radar.no] > Sent: 10. marec 2000 14:00 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: Re: LF: CEPT document... > > Gasparik Richard wrote: > > > > Hi LFers... > > > > Have anyone an CEPT document with recomendation for hams to use 136kHz ? > > The relevant document is "CEPT/ERC Recommendation 62-01". > > It is available at > http://www.ero.dk/doc98/Official/HTML/REC6201E.HTM > > --Magne / LA1BFA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2371 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2000 15:50:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Mar 2000 15:50:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TRYW-0000T8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 15:42:24 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12TRYV-0000T3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 15:42:23 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id QAA50468 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2000 16:42:12 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000310173918.21dfd7e6@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 17:39:18 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Re: LF In-reply-to: <3.0.1.16.20000310131910.21e7bae4@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> References: <2000031010282968199@zetnet.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 13:19 10/03/00, I wrote: >BD454D : >- NPN >- TOP66 package >- Vcb max = 120V >- Vce max = 120V >- Veb max = 5V >- Ic max = 15A >- Ft min = 3MHz >- Hfe = 25 minimum Must be BD545D, data are correct. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21541 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2000 06:58:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 Mar 2000 06:58:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Tfkr-0000Qe-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 11 Mar 2000 06:52:05 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.sci.fi ([195.74.0.53] helo=pefletti.saunalahti.fi ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Tfkp-0000QW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 11 Mar 2000 06:52:04 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from default (MCCCXLVI.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.40.146]) by pefletti.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id IAA11137 for ; Sat, 11 Mar 2000 08:51:45 +0200 (EET) Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000311085156.0081bbb0@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: oh2lx@pop.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2000 08:51:56 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: Signal Strength Measurements by OH2LX MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Measurements of UK Decca's and some other stations : ---------------------------------------------------------- Day ------------------ 06Mar 07Mar 08Mar 09Mar 10Mar MON TUE WED THU FRI Time, UTC ------------ 2140- 2145- 2145- 2150- 2235- ---------------------------------------------------------- kHz Ch *d,km AZI* *Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW* ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.8 (6C), 1435, 280, -101 -103 -100 -103 -100 ---------------------------------------------------------- 126.7 (2A), 1565, 269, -102 -101 -106 -100 -99 ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.5 (8E), 1766, 276, -104 -102 -102 -100 -100 ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.0 (3B), 1871, 257, -104 -106 -104 -104 -104 ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.5 (5B), 1890, 247, -100 -105 -104 -99 -102 ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.2 (7D), 2060, 267, -118 -111 -120 -111 -111 ---------------------------------------------------------- 126.4 (1B), 2282, 253, -113 -113 -110 -109 -109 ---------------------------------------------------------- kHz Ch *d,km AZI* *Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW* ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.93 ref, 1553, 228, -79 -83 -81 -80 -80 ---------------------------------------------------------- 138.83 ref, 1221, 226, -77 -87 -80 -77 -79 ---------------------------------------------------------- 135.8 SXV** 2490, 182, -100 -107 -107 OFF -107 ---------------------------------------------------------- 137.0 CFH* 5750, 295, Nil Nil -131 Nil Nil ---------------------------------------------------------- * CFH weakly audible also on the 6th after 2215 UTC. ---------------------------------------------------------- ** SXV deep steep minimum on the 10th, 2312: -125(Min) ---------------------------------------------------------- 06Mar 2150: OH1BS -109; 2201: -115 06Mar 2155: SM6PXJ -126; 2205: -125 06Mar 2217: OH1TN -110..-107(f) 07Mar 2022: G3KEV -125; 2105: -126 07Mar 2108: OH1TN -111..-109(f); 2142: -107..-113(f) 07Mar 2118: OH7OL -132; 2150: -125..-117, 2200: -119..-107! 08Mar 2200: OH1BS -104..-102(f) 09Mar 2119: OH1BS -109 09Mar 2203: SM6PXJ -115; 2209: -115 10Mar 2243: OH1BS -107..-104(f); 2312: -113..-111(f) ---------------------------------------------------------- (R&S ESH2/---- 10m coax---/1:10/---15m wire-----): Noise level with antenna: with 200Hz IF BandWidth: -26..-22 dB(uV), -133..-129dBmW (varies w qrm etc) ---------------------------------------------------------- End of message of 11 Mar 2000, 0655 UTC, from OH2LX ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14800 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2000 09:43:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 Mar 2000 09:43:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12U4kH-0005Vn-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 12 Mar 2000 09:33:09 +0000 Received: from smtp-rt-8.wanadoo.fr ([193.252.19.51] helo=lantana.wanadoo.fr) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12U4kG-0005Vi-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 12 Mar 2000 09:33:08 +0000 Received: from mahonia.wanadoo.fr (193.252.19.58) by lantana.wanadoo.fr; 12 Mar 2000 10:32:53 +0100 Received: from pii-350 (193.250.162.31) by mahonia.wanadoo.fr; 12 Mar 2000 10:32:51 +0100 Message-ID: <00b701bf8c05$f00d6cc0$1fa2fac1@pii-350> From: "f1tay" To: "lfgroup" Subject: LF: RADIO MONTE CARLO LF TRANSMITTER Date: Sun, 12 Mar 2000 09:31:12 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Photos and history of RADIO MONTE-CARLO (1400 kW transmitter on 216 kHz) at the french speaking site: http://rmcstory.free.fr -----Message d'origine----- De : RMC STORY Groupes de discussion : fr.rec.radio Date : dimanche 12 mars 2000 00:41 Objet : L'histoire de RMC >Salut à tous ! > >Nous avons consacré un site à RMC, station qui nous est chère ici dans le >Sud. > >Retrouvez sur http://rmcstory.free.fr l'histoire de RMC mais aussi des >photos et des extraits sonores. > >Merci de votre visite > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7852 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2000 17:37:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 Mar 2000 17:37:24 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UC4U-0000fI-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 12 Mar 2000 17:22:30 +0000 Received: from m11.boston.juno.com ([205.231.100.194]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UC4R-0000fD-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 12 Mar 2000 17:22:27 +0000 Received: from cookie.juno.com by cookie.juno.com for <"yokUgcxCbtTP7XLrpefewM65AvR36JIdk1FfU0OuwvUIJdTcgP6qFw=="> X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from riese-k3djc@juno.com) by m11.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id E2YRVJSG; Sun, 12 Mar 2000 12:21:54 EST To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sun, 12 Mar 2000 12:19:43 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: test Message-ID: <20000312.121944.-6031.2.riese-k3djc@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: "Bob RIESE" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: system test From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15913 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2000 23:19:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 Mar 2000 23:19:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UHR3-0003Sd-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 12 Mar 2000 23:06:09 +0000 Received: from gadolinium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.111]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UHQz-0003SY-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 12 Mar 2000 23:06:05 +0000 Received: from [213.1.155.169] (helo=default) by gadolinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12UHR1-00024F-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 12 Mar 2000 23:06:08 +0000 Message-ID: <005601bf8c76$a250d820$a99b01d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: DX Cluster spots for 11/12 March at GB7DXM Date: Sun, 12 Mar 2000 22:33:10 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All not much listening done here this weekend. Friday 10th Nice QRS signals from Jim M0BMU and Peter G3LDO on 73K abt 2100z, but I had a couple of telephone calls which disrupted operations a bit. I just saw the 'KX' of a signal on about 71.84kHz which I think from the strength must have been Mike G3XDV Saturday and Sunday seemed quite 'quiet' from the QRN point of view, even the local noise was down...lots of loran lines on the waterfall display. There was a strange signal appeared on Sunday with a carrier at 136.87kHz with two sets of sidebands at +/- 50Hz, 150Hz, 250Hz (latter vy weak) It peaked with my loop slightly south of east. I havent seem that one before, but I didn't log the time, probably around 1330z. Nice 'O' DFCW signal from DF8ZR cq at 1600z, not strong but fully readable. Sunday seemed a bit low on activity when I listened for a while at abt 1000z Most of the entries on the Cluster this week seem to be from Wolf again. G3NYK de GB7DXM 12-Mar 2156Z > 136.3 MM0ALM 12-Mar-2000 1849Z 559 vvvv 136.7 OZ8NJ 12-Mar-2000 1724Z 439 cq 136.3 DK5PT 12-Mar-2000 1719Z 559 calling hb2asb 559 136.8 DJ5BV 12-Mar-2000 1650Z 569 cq 136.8 DJ1YI 12-Mar-2000 0852Z 439 cq 136.7 G4GVC 12-Mar-2000 0832Z 429 cq 136.3 HB2ASB 11-Mar-2000 2031Z 539 cq 136.5 DK9DX 11-Mar-2000 1441Z 57 nr Ffm cq cq 136.8 OE5ODL 11-Mar-2000 1418Z CQ, 539 ON MY 160M VERT 136.7 DK9DX 11-Mar-2000 1351Z 539 in qso with oe5odl 579 136.4 PA0SE 11-Mar-2000 1006Z 549 136.4 G4GVC 11-Mar-2000 0910Z 339 cq 136.9 DJ1RL 11-Mar-2000 0802Z 569 cq 136.3 HB2ASB 10-Mar-2000 1825Z 579 cq 136.6 OE5ODL 10-Mar-2000 1824Z 569 in qso with dk1is 439 136.7 IK5ZPV 10-Mar-2000 1727Z 439 cq 136.5 DJ6FU 9-Mar-2000 1645Z cq 439 137.0 DJ6FU 7-Mar-2000 1803Z cq (569) 136.8 HA6PC 6-Mar-2000 1833Z very veak hr in JN98DO 136.7 HA6PC 6-Mar-2000 1814Z 500m wire... G3NYK de GB7DXM 12-Mar 2202Z > 1800.0 DK5PT 12-Mar-2000 1206Z 136.9 329 1800.0 DL1SAN 12-Mar-2000 0840Z 136.9 539 1800.0 DJ6FU 9-Mar-2000 1658Z cq 136.65 kHz G3NYK de GB7DXM 12-Mar 2213Z > 73 de Alan G3NYK JO02PB Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19349 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2000 08:54:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 Mar 2000 08:54:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UQSC-0008Ha-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 08:43:56 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from ns1.swh.sk ([192.108.125.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UQS7-0008HU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 08:43:52 +0000 Received: from hermes.swh.sk (hermes [195.41.64.129]) by ns1.swh.sk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA32001 for ; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:43:36 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from btss101a.swh.sk (btss.swh.sk [195.41.64.15]) by hermes.swh.sk (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id JAA18007 for ; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:43:32 +0100 (MET) Received: by btss.swh.sk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:43:29 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <92CA25F78271D111969400A024297F5B03190971@btss.swh.sk> From: "Gasparik Richard" To: "Rsgb_Lf_Group \(E-mail\)" Subject: LF: OM2TW Activity report 11.3.2000 Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:43:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi LFers... I was QRV on 136, but not on friday (to much work in my QRL). I started on saturday at 1300Z and I worked HG6N (new one), HA6PC, HA6PX and OM3ZAS (first OM/OM QSO). Jozef OM3ZAS is the second station in Slovakia, his QTH is Kosice KN08PQ. Jozef made the first OM/HA QSO on 8.3.2000 at 1556Z with HA6PC (congrats). Than I worked VCW and had a QSO with I5TGC and OK1FIG (first OM/OK QSO). I saw on my spectrogram ? ? G3..., but QRN was very strong and a storm came in my QTH. Because lot of water and static I must QRT at 1940Z. 73 de Rich OM2TW From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8656 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2000 09:03:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 Mar 2000 09:03:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UQby-0008Ih-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 08:54:02 +0000 Received: from pc1.telecom.cz ([194.228.2.40] helo=hermes.iol.cz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UQbx-0008Ic-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 08:54:01 +0000 Received: from dell1.cz.gmc.net ([194.228.225.18]) by hermes.iol.cz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 631-65168U60000L60000S0V35) with ESMTP id cz for ; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:56:18 +0100 Received: from p (p.maly.cz.gmc.net [192.168.1.35]) by dell1.cz.gmc.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id GW9GPARX; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:56:12 +0100 Message-ID: <007101bf8cc9$fb32f880$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> From: "Petr Maly" To: "136 group" Subject: LF: First OK/OM QSO Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:56:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello all Saturday evening I had a QSO with Rich, OM2TW on Visual-CW. You can see his Gram at: http://mujweb.cz/www/ok1fig/s_galler.htm This is the first OK/OM QSO regardless mode. I did this QSO from home QTH, LW 41 m in 6 m, abt 60 W RF. I hope to get to the cottage this weekend, weather permitting. 73, Petr, OK1FIG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9918 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2000 09:43:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 Mar 2000 09:43:57 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12URGl-0000B8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:36:11 +0000 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.20]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12URGj-0000B3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:36:09 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from dennison.demon.co.uk ([194.222.239.33]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 12URGU-000GTn-0K for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:35:58 +0000 Message-ID: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:34:12 +0000 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Mike Dennison" Subject: LF: weekend report 11/12 Mar MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Saturday 11 March Had crossband QSO with HB2ASB at 0720UTC, me on 71.8kHz, him on 137.7kHz QRSs. Exchanged 'O'/'O' reports. Distance 778km. Back on 136kHz, heard G4GVC (599) and PA0SE (569), and saw PA2NJN on QRSs at 'O'. Very little time on the air. Sunday 12 March Good conditions. CFH was S9 at 0645, and S5 at 0800. Heard GW4ALG (599); ON4ZK (559); G4GVC (599); GI3PDN (unusually weak at 539); DJ9IE (549); PA2NJN (439); DK5PT (429) and G3YXM (599). -- Mike, G3XDV IO91VT http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21822 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2000 10:09:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 Mar 2000 10:09:47 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12URcr-0000LE-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:59:01 +0000 Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.39]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12URcn-0000L9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:58:57 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from dennison.demon.co.uk ([194.222.239.33]) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12URcZ-0001QW-0B for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:58:47 +0000 Message-ID: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 09:57:26 +0000 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Mike Dennison" Subject: LF: web site MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: My web site has been up for a year now. For interest, here are some statistics. These are taken solely from those accessing the weekly updated Activity page, and other pages accesses are not included. Visitors 1391 Weekly average 25 Highest in one week 55 Peak access time 1200-1300 Peak day Monday Highest number of users in identifiable countries in order: US Commercial (probably not all located in the US), UK, Germany, Netherlands, Italy, Ireland, Belgium. Sweden. Total number of countries: 30 Most incoming links are from: The Longwave Club of America, Deutscher Amateur Radio Club (DARC), G3XBM, G3YXM. External search engines have found the site mainly from the following words: LF, antenna, marconi, longwave, radio. -- Mike, G3XDV IO91VT http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26341 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2000 12:43:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 Mar 2000 12:43:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UU51-0001mZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 12:36:15 +0000 Received: from [194.73.73.138] (helo=ruthenium) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UU50-0001mU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 12:36:14 +0000 Received: from [213.1.156.115] (helo=default) by ruthenium with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12UU70-0006Tq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 12:38:24 +0000 Message-ID: <000801bf8ce7$cba53880$739c01d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Additional DX Cluster spots from DB0MBX Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 12:23:48 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: These additional spots appeared on DB0MBX and were not propagated to GB7DXM. Thanks Wolf DL1SAN for the qsp. 136.8 OM2TW 11-Mar-2000 1552Z cq 539/549 ts850 @ 1 el 7 MH 136.9 OM2TW 11-Mar-2000 1535Z no 136.6 136.6 OM2TW 11-Mar-2000 1532Z CQ NW 136.9 OM2TW 11-Mar-2000 1527Z CQ 136.9 OM2TW 11-Mar-2000 1522Z Zkusime Visual-CW, Riso? 137.0 OM2TW 11-Mar-2000 1516Z 599 136.9 OM2TW 11-Mar-2000 1512Z cq 137.0 OM2TW 11-Mar-2000 1507Z 136.9 I5MXX 11-Mar-2000 1442Z 137.1 HA6PX 11-Mar-2000 1405Z CQ 137.2 HA6PC 11-Mar-2000 1333Z 136.8 HA6PC 11-Mar-2000 1146Z 136.7 IK5ZPV 10-Mar-2000 2049Z qso with oh1bs 136.9 HA6PC 10-Mar-2000 1726Z 137.7 I5TGC 7-Mar-2000 2037Z slow cw 579 73 de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25585 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2000 18:47:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 Mar 2000 18:47:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UZfh-000567-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 18:34:29 +0000 Received: from mb09.swip.net ([193.12.122.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UZff-000561-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 18:34:28 +0000 Received: from win95 (d212-151-98-103.swipnet.se [212.151.98.103]) by mb09.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA13121 for ; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 19:34:05 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <000b01bf8d1b$2012ce40$0a2f97d4@win95.swipnet.se> From: "C Andersson" To: "RSGB LF group" Subject: LF: Commercial FS measurements documented Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 19:36:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I found some interesting documents concerning FS measurements on 300 kHz at the website of ITS, Boulder, Colorado (Institute for Telecommunications Sciences). http://www.its.bldrdoc.gov/pub/dgps98/ http://www.its.bldrdoc.gov/pub/dgps97/ Calculation procedure: http://www.its.bldrdoc.gov/pub/dgps98/appdx_a.pdf In the summary: "The dependence of field strength with distance from the transmitter is in good agreement with the predictions of propagation models in the absence of irregular terrain." I have made some more measurements which are published on my home page. There is still a 5-6 dB discrepancy between calculated and measured values. Next step will be to improve the radial system with lengths of chicken net near the antenna base + ordinary radials and see what happens with the "missing dB's". 73 sm6pxj, Christer ( http://home5.swipnet.se/~w-54761/fs.htm ) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8912 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2000 08:52:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 Mar 2000 08:52:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Ums8-0003qI-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 14 Mar 2000 08:40:12 +0000 Received: from mta21-acc.tin.it ([212.216.176.74] helo=fep21-svc.tin.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Ums3-0003pq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 14 Mar 2000 08:40:08 +0000 Received: from mailsrv.dii.unisi.it ([212.171.197.111]) by fep21-svc.tin.it (InterMail vM.4.01.02.17 201-229-119) with ESMTP id <20000314083922.HMKN7033.fep21-svc.tin.it@mailsrv.dii.unisi.it> for ; Tue, 14 Mar 2000 09:39:22 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38CDFA67.94D30334@mailsrv.dii.unisi.it> Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2000 09:37:59 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Valerio" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: Info Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello all, there is someone that can tell me a way to reach ON4ZK to fix a LF sked. ? Thanks and 73, Valerio (IK5ZPV) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2150 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2000 09:51:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 Mar 2000 09:51:58 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UnsE-0004PC-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 14 Mar 2000 09:44:22 +0000 Received: from ds-img-3.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.136] helo=spdmgaac.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UnsA-0004P3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 14 Mar 2000 09:44:18 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaac.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id EAA02091 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 14 Mar 2000 04:43:47 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2000 04:43:26 -0500 From: "Holger 'Geri', DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Info To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003140443_MC2-9D02-4E3F@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Valerio, I think that ON4ZK can be reached on the packet network. If you like, I can send him a message tonight. Best regards Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9405 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2000 21:08:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 Mar 2000 21:08:15 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UyGq-0001jQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 14 Mar 2000 20:50:28 +0000 Received: from bru5-rc-mx1.uunet.be ([194.7.179.228]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UyGo-0001jG-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 14 Mar 2000 20:50:26 +0000 Received: (qmail 20874 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2000 20:50:14 -0000 Received: from uu212-190-25-44.unknown.uunet.be (HELO DeWildeg) (212.190.25.44) by bru5-rc-mx1.uunet.be with SMTP; 14 Mar 2000 20:50:14 -0000 Message-ID: <006001bf8df6$f47d8040$2c19bed4@DeWildeg> From: "Gaspard De Wilde" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Info Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2000 21:04:03 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: dear om, valerio I read every day the news on this group, but till now I did 'nt go in discution!! i like to try the contact with your station.... for sked my email :on4zk@vt4.net.be or packet radio on4zk@on6ar.ant.be.eu es 73 to all de Gaspard ON4ZK an: Valerio Aan: LF Group Datum: dinsdag 14 maart 2000 10:19 Onderwerp: LF: Info >Hello all, >there is someone that can tell me a way to reach ON4ZK to fix a LF sked. >? > >Thanks and 73, Valerio (IK5ZPV) > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24031 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2000 22:46:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 Mar 2000 22:46:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12UzyA-0002qi-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 14 Mar 2000 22:39:18 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Uzy9-0002qd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 14 Mar 2000 22:39:17 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id WAA08016 for ; Tue, 14 Mar 2000 22:39:06 GMT X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000031422345068199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2000 22:34:50 GMT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: 72/137kHz X-band QSO Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Had a two-way LF QSO with IK5ZPV, starting at 2030UTC this evening (14/2/00), my transmitter on 71.812kHz and Valerio on 137.70kHz. Reports 'O' both ways. QSB most noticable with the signals on both bands peaking at 2100 and fading below the noise half an hour later. The distance between our stations is 1144km. -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2073 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2000 00:12:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 Mar 2000 00:12:01 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12V1K4-0003b5-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 00:06:00 +0000 Received: from [194.73.73.138] (helo=ruthenium) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12V1K2-0003b0-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 00:05:58 +0000 Received: from [213.1.178.2] (helo=default) by ruthenium with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12V1M6-0004qF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 00:08:07 +0000 Message-ID: <000301bf8e11$5be9cb20$02b201d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Balloon flying Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2000 23:58:48 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All, as a result of the donation of some old mags I came across the following table in an article in 73 mag (April 1972 ), which may be of interest to those without a tower contemplating a BIG vertical. The table relates to lift generated by a helium filled balloon at different gas temperatures. Balloon Gas vol lift (lb) lift (lb) diam. ft cu.ft. @0degC @20degC 2 4 0.25 0.25 3 14 1 0.75 4 33 2 2 5 65 4 4 6 113 7 7 7 180 12 11 8 268 18 17 9 381 26 24 10 523 36 33 11 696 48 44 12 904 62 58 Sorry to our metric friends (1ft=0.3m and 1lb=0.45kgm or there abouts) I think metres are unknown the other side of the pond. They even measure the size of the engine bay in cubic inches (It IS the engine bay isn't it?) It goes on up to 16 feet diameter but I reckon if you have got a big enough garden to blow up a 16 foot diameter ballon you have enough room for tower! He mentions flying a 160foot vertical with an 8foot weather balloon inflated to 3.5 feet diameter. (He ran out of gas). He also relates burning out a 30AWG aerial wire with about 180 watts on 80m. Though I must admit I have no idea how he derives an impedance of feed 50ohms for the end of a halfwave! That shouldn't bother us as, at least I, will be quite happy with a quarter wave on 136! Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5101 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2000 00:43:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 Mar 2000 00:43:23 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12V1nG-0003qh-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 00:36:10 +0000 Received: from imo24.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.68]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12V1nE-0003qa-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 00:36:09 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo24.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id l.d4.223b422 (6964) for ; Tue, 14 Mar 2000 19:35:22 -0500 (EST) From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2000 19:35:22 EST Subject: Re: LF: Balloon flying To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 42 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In a message dated 3/14/00 7:10:13 PM Eastern Standard Time, Alan.Melia@btinternet.com writes: << I think metres are unknown the other side of the pond. They even measure the size of the engine bay in cubic inches >> Well, fans of classic engines measure displacement in cubic inches, but most of us nowadays refer to ours in liters...which is also how we buy Coca-Cola and other non-alcoholic beverages. Strangely, though, we still buy fuel for our engines by the gallon. The reason for this dichotomy would make an interesting research project for a doctoral candidate somewhere, I should think. 73, John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7252 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2000 17:21:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 Mar 2000 17:21:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VHJe-00045C-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 17:10:38 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VHJb-000457-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 17:10:35 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id SAA122400 for ; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 18:10:18 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000315190717.3e5f9964@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 19:07:17 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: Umbrella antennas In-reply-to: <000b01bf8d1b$2012ce40$0a2f97d4@win95.swipnet.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: searching for information about umbrella antennas I came across following reference : Folded Umbrella Antenna (WB5IIR) Ham Radio Magazine, May 1979 p.38 Anyone who has this magazine and can check if this article is something that can be used on LF ? 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6332 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2000 19:19:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 Mar 2000 19:19:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VJEN-0005Ey-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 19:13:19 +0000 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VJEM-0005Et-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 19:13:18 +0000 Received: from as24-s15-145-46.cwci.net ([195.44.145.46] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VJEB-0007c1-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 19:13:07 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38CFDE01.BE0211BF@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 19:01:21 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: Ireland/USA tests Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All. I have located a site on the west coast of Ireland for some serious transalantic tests when someone in the USA/Canada is ready with suitable antennas and power. The site consists of 4 acres overlooking the sea, located near Westport, Mayo, with plenty of room for a good antenna array. I will reactivate my old call EI2AE and since I am now a full time radio amateur can be available when required. There is also another site available in NW Ireland near Castlerock/Portstewart, again overlooking the sea, with plenty of acreage for antennas, callsign GI3KEV. If and when someone across the atlantic is set up for 136 khz I will set the necessary wheels in motion. These are rural small farm sites and belong to friends and do not involve any other radio amateurs, and available to me when required. 73 de Mal/G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24343 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2000 19:23:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 Mar 2000 19:23:28 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VJIM-0005FJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 19:17:26 +0000 Received: from mb09.swip.net ([193.12.122.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VJIL-0005FE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 19:17:25 +0000 Received: from win95 (d212-151-90-173.swipnet.se [212.151.90.173]) by mb09.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA21890 for ; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 20:17:04 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <001501bf8eb3$77e2b6a0$ad5a97d4@win95.swipnet.se> From: "C Andersson" To: "RSGB LF group" Subject: LF: More LF documents on the web Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 20:19:46 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: While browsing around the net I found the following documents which might be of interest. "Technique for building and calibrating VLF/LF receive loop antennas" http://www.nosc.mil/sti/publications/biblio/VERYLOWFREQUENCIES.HTML Unfortunately the photos are a bit dark. And furthermore: "Dipole and monopole antenna gain and effective area for communication formulas" which says: "A comparison involving antenna measurements and performance predictions has sometimes revealed a 6-dB discrepancy between the ground-wave transmission measurements and the correspondning calculations" That 6 dB sounds familiar to me. http://www.nosc.mil/sti/publications/biblio/ANTENNAS.HTML /sm6pxj From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22131 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2000 20:52:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 Mar 2000 20:52:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VKRp-0005uv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 20:31:17 +0000 Received: from ds-img-1.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.134] helo=spdmgaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VKRn-0005uq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 20:31:15 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id PAA01488 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 15:31:02 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 15:24:58 -0500 From: "Howard Aspinall" <100646.144@compuserve.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Balloon flying To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003151529_MC2-9D30-24D1@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Greeting I have used balloon borne aerials on 160m in the past, and anyone contemplating doing so is advised to consult with the Civil Aviation Authority first. There were, and probably still are rules regarding the use of tethered balloons over a specific height. I can't remember what that height was, but if it is exceeded the rules have to be observed, and include things like providing lights and notifying the CAA. No doubt also it goes without saying that one can easily get a very high static build up on large verticals which are not electrically connected to a good earth, so steps are needed to protect the equipment, and operators from these. On a more light hearted note, on one instance in the past when a group of us was out portable with a 160m half wave vertical supported by a met balloon filled with helium, we observed a number of local officers of the law converging on our site very warily. It transpired a local farmer had reported seeing a UFO (the balloon), and the officers concerned were worried about walking into a strange encounter and being "beamed up". All ended well, but there could be some merit in keeping the local constabulary informed of such experiments. 73..Howard/G3RXH From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 778 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2000 21:09:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mw.egroups.com) (207.138.41.167) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 Mar 2000 21:09:23 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: lofexp-return-486-zlvk=picks.force9.co.uk@returns.egroups.com Received: from [10.1.2.42] by mw.egroups.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2000 21:09:22 -0000 Received: (listserv 315); by a2; 15 Mar 2000 21:09:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 14256 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2000 21:09:18 -0000 Received: from mailman.zeta.org.au (203.26.10.16) by mx3.egroups.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2000 21:09:18 -0000 Received: from steve (ppp245.dyn144.pacific.net.au [210.23.144.245]) by mailman.zeta.org.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAA22970; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 08:15:45 +1100 Message-ID: <004501bf8ec2$c23f6f40$0301a8c0@steve> From: "Steve Olney" To: "lf-amrad" Cc: "RSGB LF Group" , "LowFexp" , "LowFerQTH" Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 08:09:24 +1100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Mailing-List: contact lofexp-owner@egroups.com X-Mailing-List: lofexp@egroups.com Precedence: bulk List-Help: , List-Unsubscribe: List-Archive: Reply-To: lofexp@egroups.com Subject: [lofexp] Flares and LF Propagation... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit G'day All, There have been a bunch of C-level flares recently - peaking at around the 11th-12th March. It will be interesting to see if the Planetary A index rises to a high level as before and then if LF conditions are enhanced as before. The effects should arrive around the 16th-17th judging from the solar wind speed at the moment. It would be great if there is a correlation. My apologies to those who will receive multiple copies of this because they subscribe to more than one LF reflector - I know how annoyed I get when someone forwards from one reflector to another and I end up with 4 copies of each of up half-a-dozen different messages in my inbox. I won't make this a habit - I promise :-) 73s Steve Olney (VK2ZTO/AXSO - QF56IK : Lat -33 34 07, Long +150 44 40) ============================================= HomePage URLs: http://www.qsl.net/vk2zto http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg Containing:- Laser Comms DX LF Experimentation Amateur Radio Astronomy ============================================= ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Special Offer-Earn 300 Points from MyPoints.com for trying @Backup Get automatic protection and access to your important computer files. Install today: http://click.egroups.com/1/2344/5/_/20607/_/953154562/ eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/lofexp/ http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19466 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2000 22:32:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 Mar 2000 22:32:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VM8S-0006qo-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 22:19:24 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VM8R-0006qj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 22:19:23 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id WAA00394 for ; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 22:19:10 GMT X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000031522152368199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 22:15:23 GMT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: Small antennas Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Further to the report of the LF cross-band QSO with IK5ZPV posted on the reflector yesterday I received a .jpg from Cesare Tagliabue I 5 TGC. It shows my 72kHz signal, giving an 'O' report to IK5ZPV. If you see the I 5 TGC. antenna and its environment on < http://www.dadacasa.com/i5tgc> you will realise that it is a remarkable achievement to get such an antenna working efficiently, even on receive, on 73kHz. Obviously Cesare does not understand the the English word "impossible". -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3485 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2000 22:54:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 Mar 2000 22:54:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VMYj-00077C-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 22:46:33 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.sci.fi ([195.74.0.53] helo=pefletti.saunalahti.fi ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VMYi-000777-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 22:46:32 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from default (MCDXLI.tdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.83.41]) by pefletti.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id AAA12685 for ; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 00:46:20 +0200 (EET) Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000316004618.00818bb0@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: vaiski1@pop.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 00:46:18 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: Signal Strength Measurements by OH2LX MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Measurements of UK Decca's and some other stations : ---------------------------------------------------------- Day ------------------ 11Mar 12Mar 13Mar 14Mar 15Mar SAT SUN MON TUE WED Time, UTC ------------ 2125- 2150- 2115- 2140- 2150- ---------------------------------------------------------- kHz Ch *d,km AZI* *Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW* ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.8 (6C), 1435, 280, -104 -101 -99 -99 -101 ---------------------------------------------------------- 126.7 (2A), 1565, 269, -101 -100 -101 -99 -101 ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.5 (8E), 1766, 276, -105 -104 -99 -99 -103 ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.0 (3B), 1871, 257, -106 -101 -105 -101 -102 ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.5 (5B), 1890, 247, -102 -101 -104 -100 -97 ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.2 (7D), 2060, 267, -114 -109 -115 -106 -110 ---------------------------------------------------------- 126.4 (1B), 2282, 253, -111 -107 -113 -108 -111 ---------------------------------------------------------- kHz Ch *d,km AZI* *Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW* ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.93 ref, 1553, 228, -82 -76 -80 -77 -73 ---------------------------------------------------------- 138.83 ref, 1221, 226, -89 -77 -80 -77 -85 ---------------------------------------------------------- 135.8 SXV 2490, 182, -103 -107 -104 -107 -104 ---------------------------------------------------------- 137.0 CFH* 5750, 295, Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil ---------------------------------------------------------- * CFH only heard during morning of 15Mar, 0453z, -125 dBmW ---------------------------------------------------------- 11Mar 2027: OH1BS -108 11Mar 2035: OH1TN -108..-110(f); 2100: -110..-104(f) 11Mar 2047: DJ9IE -130 11Mar 2101: OH7OL -123..-120(f) 12Mar 0057: DJ9IE -128..-126 12Mar 2153: DJ9IE -127 12Mar 2153: OH1BS -107..-108 12Mar 2239: OH1TN -106..-104(f) 12Mar 2240: DJ5BV -125 13Mar 2044: OH1BS -107 14Mar 2152: OZ1KMR -124 14Mar 2153: OZ8NJ -125 14Mar 2159: SM6PXJ -121: 2206: -118 ---------------------------------------------------------- (R&S ESH2/---- 10m coax---/1:10/---15m wire-----): Noise level with antenna: with 200Hz IF BandWidth: -25..-21 dB(uV), -132..-128dBmW (varies w qrm etc) ---------------------------------------------------------- End of message of 15 Mar 2000, 2245 UTC, from OH2LX ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6395 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2000 02:34:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Mar 2000 02:34:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VPrc-0000aa-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 02:18:16 +0000 Received: from host.king.igs.net ([216.58.2.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VPra-0000aV-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 02:18:15 +0000 Received: from server1 (ttyC43.king.igs.net [216.58.2.171]) by host.king.igs.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id VAA40283 for ; Wed, 15 Mar 2000 21:17:59 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kayser@king.igs.net) Message-ID: <000601bf8eed$9cea3010$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: HP 5248M Counter Parts for sale Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 21:16:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Greetings All: I have just removed all the cards from an older HP 5248M Counter. If anyone wants cards or Chassis parts please get to me ASAP, they will not be expensive. The only things not available are the chassis, power supplies, Oscillator assembly and fan. All the switches seem to work ok and are available. Please email me at kayser@king.igs.net if you need any of the parts or cards including the Nixie display tubes Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25522 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2000 06:48:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Mar 2000 06:48:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VTyH-0002uo-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 06:41:25 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VTyG-0002uj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 06:41:24 +0000 Received: from oemcomputer (man-079.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.41.98]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id GAA15636 for ; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 06:41:12 GMT Message-ID: <001e01bf8f12$d5188340$6229f7c2@oemcomputer> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <200003151529_MC2-9D30-24D1@compuserve.com> Subject: LF: Re: Balloon flying Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 06:41:41 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: ----- Original Message ----- From: Howard Aspinall <100646.144@compuserve.com> To: Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2000 8:24 PM Subject: LF: Balloon flying >... a local farmer had > reported seeing a UFO (the balloon) when G3OIT tried this the farmer used a shotgun on the 'UFO' 73 de John Rabson G3PAI From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27196 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2000 08:21:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Mar 2000 08:21:38 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VVQD-0003hZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 08:14:21 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.38]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VVQB-0003hU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 08:14:19 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12VVQ1-000BnV-0A for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 08:14:10 +0000 Message-ID: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 08:07:42 +0000 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" Subject: Re: LF: Balloon flying In-reply-to: <200003151529_MC2-9D30-24D1@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In message <200003151529_MC2-9D30-24D1@compuserve.com>, Howard Aspinall <100646.144@compuserve.com> writes > ..................I can't remember what that height was, but if it is exceeded the rules have to be observed, and include things like providing lights and notifying the CAA. > Mike Grierson G3TSO works for the CAA and is probably a useful contact. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4192 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2000 12:11:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Mar 2000 12:11:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VYwh-0005k2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 12:00:07 +0000 Received: from ds-img-1.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.134] helo=spdmgaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VYwd-0005jZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 12:00:04 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id GAA24787 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 06:59:22 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 06:58:06 -0500 From: "DEREK ATTER" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: Balloon flying To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003160659_MC2-9D5C-49DF@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Message text written by INTERNET:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org >In message <200003151529_MC2-9D30-24D1@compuserve.com>, Howard Aspinall <100646.144@compuserve.com> writes > ..................I can't remember what that height was, but if it is exceeded the rules have to be observed, and include things like providing lights and notifying the CAA. > < I believe that the current CAA rules restrict the maximum height of balloon flying to 200ft unless as Howard says, lights are fitted and the CAA notified. Of course there is also a general height restriction on antenna height in the UK to 50ft within 1/2 mile of the perimeter of an airfield. ( Not sure if that is statute or nautical miles!) 73 de DereK Atter G3GRO, Crawley Sussex From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5457 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2000 12:14:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Mar 2000 12:14:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VZ0O-0005ld-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 12:03:56 +0000 Received: from ds-img-3.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.136] helo=spdmgaac.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VZ0N-0005lW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 12:03:55 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaac.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id HAA21411 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 07:03:14 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 07:02:56 -0500 From: "DEREK ATTER" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: 72/137kHz X-band QSO To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003160703_MC2-9D5C-4A23@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Peter, Congratulations on your outstanding X-band QSO with Valerio via 72Khz - thats an amazing distance ! Regards, Derek, G3GRO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 629 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2000 14:45:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Mar 2000 14:45:24 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VbPQ-00079b-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 14:37:56 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from flatey.bv.rvk.is ([193.4.100.5] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VbPO-00079W-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 14:37:54 +0000 Received: from engey.bv.rvk.is (root@engey.bv.rvk.is [193.4.100.8]) by flatey.bv.rvk.is (8.9.3/8.9.3+TF) with ESMTP id OAA04724 for ; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 14:37:38 GMT X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: stb@rhus.rvk.is Received: from kjoi.rhus.rvk.is (kjoi.rhus.rvk.is [10.5.51.12]) by engey.bv.rvk.is with ESMTP (8.8.8/RA888) id OAA05251 for ; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 14:37:37 GMT Subject: LF: Hi X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.2c (Intl) 2 February 2000 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 14:37:18 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on RBORG/ =?iso-8859-1?q?Reykjav=EDkurborg?==?us-ascii?q?=2F?= =?us-ascii?q?IS?= =?us-ascii?q?=28?==?us-ascii?q?Release?= 5.0.1a (Intl)|17 August 1999) at 16.03.2000 14:37:19 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Geri Just wanted to say hello to you and all the others on the list. Thor tf3sb S. Thor Bjarnason tf3sb Reykjavik Iceland From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19631 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2000 15:33:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Mar 2000 15:33:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Vc9V-0007hf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 15:25:33 +0000 Received: from ds-img-7.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.153] helo=spdmbaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Vc9U-0007hW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 15:25:32 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmbaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id KAA12945 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 10:24:51 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 10:24:09 -0500 From: "Holger 'Geri', DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Hi To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003161024_MC2-9D59-FE5D@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thor, welcome to our group! TF is a white spot on the map (the needle is still in ...) and might be the "missing link" in oour goal to achieve the first Europe/North America QSO. Additionally it might be THE challenge for all those living in Central Europe (as myself ...) to break that 2000km barrier ... We will stay in touch, best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) http://www.qru.de From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16914 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2000 15:41:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Mar 2000 15:41:07 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VcHU-0007j1-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 15:33:48 +0000 Received: from as-img-5.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.148] helo=spamgaae.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VcHT-0007it-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 15:33:47 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaae.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id KAA04641 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 10:33:06 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 10:31:59 -0500 From: "Holger 'Geri', DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Ireland/USA tests To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003161032_MC2-9D59-FF2E@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Mal, " ... give your dream a due-date and you have got a project ..." we *do* have a due-date: in December 1901, Marconi crossed the Atlantic (Ireland/New Foundland) on 300 kHz. Latest by December 2001 *we* should have achieved this on 136 kHz! Mal, great that you have found places where to erect antennas, our collegues in VE/VO also are rigging up their towers. I would love to participate in a dx-pedition to EI/GI (being an "Irish folk-music lover", see http://www.piperswine.de, tomorrow is St. Patrick's day, so no QSOs early on Saturday morning ...) Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) P.S.: Mal, how did you get that EI callsign? As you know, I collect callsigns ;-) and my EI visitor's callsign EI4VTT, that I got based on my US license but was never able to use was retrieved after the people in Dublin realized that I also hold a German callsign ... From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19607 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2000 16:53:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Mar 2000 16:53:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VdQ8-0008TE-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 16:46:48 +0000 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VdQ7-0008T9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 16:46:47 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #35) id 12VdPV-00019n-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 16:46:09 +0000 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Thu, 16 Mar 2000 16:40:49 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 16:40:46 -0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Balloon flying In-reply-to: References: <200003151529_MC2-9D30-24D1@compuserve.com> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > > ..................I can't remember what that height was, but if it is > exceeded the rules have to be observed, and include things like > providing lights and notifying the CAA. > > The maximum for kites is 200ft (just over 60m), so I presume that balloons are the same. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4308 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2000 11:54:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 Mar 2000 11:54:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VuvI-0001Ln-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 11:28:08 +0000 Received: from as-img-3.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.146] helo=spamgaac.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VuvG-0001Le-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 11:28:06 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaac.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id GAA24775; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 06:24:10 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 06:23:46 -0500 From: "Holger 'Geri', DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Short Vertical Antennas, Article To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org, "AMRAD" Message-ID: <200003170624_MC2-9D83-5BAA@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Lowfers there is an interesting article written by Ralph Holland, VK1BRH named "Spiral Top Loading of a Short Vertical" on the internet, check http://www2.dynamite.com.au/vk1brh/SpiralLd.htm for details. Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) Longwave homepage http://www.qru.de From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8235 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2000 12:04:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 Mar 2000 12:04:33 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VvK2-0001bh-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 11:53:42 +0000 Received: from carbon.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.92]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12VvK1-0001bc-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 11:53:41 +0000 Received: from [62.6.77.148] (helo=default) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12VvJW-0003fW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 11:53:10 +0000 Message-ID: <000301bf9006$7eda4320$944d063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: re Balloon flying Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 23:57:07 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all thanks for the feedback, the famous WWII aerodrome that boarders my back garden (I have a perimeter-defence pill-box on my land! and 'NO it doesnt make a good shack' ) is now filled with houses so I don't think I need worry about the 50 foot limit, but 200 foot sounds quite interesting. Does anyone know anything about those 'blimps' that car distributors often fly as adverts.... they look capable of hefting a fair sized wire up..... I wonder whether they would fall for the sponsorship line " yes we are using a "Forgeot Monduna" balloon to hold the aerial up, OM "?? Maybe that would just take too long to send on QRS. Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24640 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2000 15:37:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 Mar 2000 15:37:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Vyh6-0003WD-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 15:29:44 +0000 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Vyh5-0003W8-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 15:29:43 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #35) id 12VygT-0002mR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 15:29:06 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 15:11:50 +0000 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 15:11:48 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I will be using QRSs on 71.80kHz this evening (17 March) and early tomorrow morning, looking for crossband QSOs with 137.7kHz, or e-mail reports. 73 Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10412 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2000 16:00:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 Mar 2000 16:00:34 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Vz35-0003fo-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 15:52:27 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Vz34-0003fj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 15:52:27 +0000 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12Vz0C-00003D-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 15:49:28 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <16701.200003171557@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 15:57:56 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz/136kHz X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, Congratulations to G3LDO and IK5ZPV on another excellent 'first' on 73kHz. I hope to be QRV on around 71.8kHz again this evening from about 1930 onwards - if I don't see any other signals on the band, I will try for crossband QSO's, listening around 137.7kHz. I also plan to be active on 73kHz for an hour or so from 0800 Saturday morning. Interesting to see Christer's new field strength data, and the other information that has been turned up - I am still working on a portable field strength system, but have been very pushed for time lately. Hope to have some new input soon though. I now have my new 350W PA running on both bands, and initial results have been very encouraging, with QSO's with OH1TN and DJ9IE on 136kHz for the first time last Saturday. Hope to see you on the bands, Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20146 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2000 22:45:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 Mar 2000 22:45:00 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12W5GL-00075S-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 22:30:33 +0000 Received: from host.king.igs.net ([216.58.2.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12W5GJ-00075N-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 22:30:31 +0000 Received: from server1 (ttyC15.king.igs.net [216.58.2.143]) by host.king.igs.net (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id QAA71204 for ; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 16:47:55 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from kayser@king.igs.net) Message-ID: <001501bf905a$6b77e860$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: VE1ZZ, a letter from him Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 16:45:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Greetings All: Fridays seem to be the day of adventure on LF for us on this side of the Atlantic. Today, so far, it is Jack, VE1ZZ who has gotten things going. I have received a four page letter from Jack, all hand printed and written over several days. The letter includes a list of some 14 questions that he would like answered. Many of the questions pertain to the political issues in this country of getting a license for 135.7 to 137.8 kHz and what he will need to do with CFH onb 137 literally in his back yard. Jack has and continues to listen between 137.6 and 137.8 kHz for CW signals. He has not heard any amateur CW signals yet. His equipment is all analogue, Racal RA-17 and the associated LF converter. He has a 12 Beverage antennas and he makes all the stuff out of large diameter wire and heavy duty components since this reduces the effect of the many lightning strikes he gets each year. Most of his matching transformers are made of ferrite material from old Television flyback transformers, 15 to 17 bifillar or trifillar windings. The Beverage that is terminated in salt water is done so with an old stainless steel hub cap from a car that is tied onto the wire and dumped into the sea. Listening on the tapes he sent a while back it sounds like he is using power contactors to switch beverage feedlines. He shows on his plan some feedlines of 1600 and 2000 ft long. Some Beverage antennas are of the parallel wire type, all seem to be terminated in heavy duty 330 ohm resistors all though he does comment that these disappear from time to time (no wonder!!!!). Jack is busy these days repairing towers that were damaged during an Ice Storm he had there last December. He is trying to repair two towers that collapsed. He comments that he is using a green spruce tree some 50 ft long and guyed with 1/4 inch steel cable as a gin pole - explains that he does a little work on the system every day and that he is still going strong at 67 years of age. Jack has some older PC equipment, several 286 and one 386 machine and he is not and does not expect to get on the Internet. Summary: Jack is showing lots of interest in the LF band and wants to get on the air when he can get a license. He is concerned about how to work around CFH which tells me he is interested. What I continue to hope is that he will get interested in the LF enough to get some of the tools necessary to participate in the fun. One thing for sure, when our license comes and I begin putting a beacon on the air I will phone him and let him know it is on and then as we switch from a simple CW message to QRSS and also to BPSK for the serious work I can only hope he will join us. Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12734 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2000 00:01:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 2000 00:01:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12W6aG-0007hp-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 23:55:12 +0000 Received: from gadolinium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.111]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12W6aF-0007hk-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 23:55:12 +0000 Received: from [213.1.150.8] (helo=default) by gadolinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12W6aN-0006PE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 23:55:19 +0000 Message-ID: <000f01bf906b$4cb209e0$089601d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: 73kHz mixer crystals ...who wants?? Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 21:21:33 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all as a result of finding a pair of crystals for Peter G3LDOs mixer exciter for 73k I find I have 3 more pairs that are at approximately 2.7MHz with a difference of 73kHz (or very close to that) Does anyone else require a set before the band is withdrawn.... first 3 e-mails will qualify...please send your full postal address. The only thing I want in return is that you put out a signal on 73KkHz before the closing date!! I will delete about 20Gbytes of hard drive to accept all the replies! Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22395 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2000 00:01:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 2000 00:01:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12W6aM-0007hw-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 23:55:18 +0000 Received: from gadolinium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.111]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12W6aL-0007hr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 23:55:17 +0000 Received: from [213.1.150.8] (helo=default) by gadolinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12W6aT-0006PE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 17 Mar 2000 23:55:25 +0000 Message-ID: <001101bf906b$5031bac0$089601d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: 73kHz signals Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 23:30:20 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, nice QRS signals from Dave G3YXM and Jim M0BMU at about 2230z tonight....but I suppose this is superfluous as they are probably both working 1500kms+ crossband now!! Cheers de Alan G3NYK JO02PB Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12663 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2000 10:49:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 2000 10:49:54 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12WGgq-0004a3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 18 Mar 2000 10:42:40 +0000 Received: from mb09.swip.net ([193.12.122.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12WGgp-0004Zy-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 18 Mar 2000 10:42:39 +0000 Received: from win95 (d212-151-86-133.swipnet.se [212.151.86.133]) by mb09.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id LAA18498 for ; Sat, 18 Mar 2000 11:42:12 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <000d01bf90c7$0ecbeb80$855697d4@win95.swipnet.se> From: "C Andersson" To: "RSGB LF group" Subject: LF: New FS measurements Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 11:25:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: With the risk of being tedious I just want to inform that I made some more FS measurements Saturday morning. I have replaced the untuned loop with a tuned ferrite antenna + FET preamp. The new meter is checked with a par of Helmholtz coils with radius 0,44 m. The reason for rebuilding the instrument is A) To make it more portable B) To get more references C) It fits in a normal sized pair of Helmholtz coils. The new meter shows 10 dB increased sensitivity compared to the untuned loop. Quite useful in measurements at larger distance. This new setup indicates larger values than the previous. The difference between calculated and measured values is now approx 1,5 dB. More details here: http://home5.swipnet.se/~w-54761/fs.htm /sm6pxj Christer From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9972 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2000 13:00:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 2000 13:00:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12WIjq-0005el-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 18 Mar 2000 12:53:54 +0000 Received: from [195.166.128.23] (helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12WIjp-0005eg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 18 Mar 2000 12:53:53 +0000 Received: (qmail 21042 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2000 12:53:41 -0000 Received: from rack.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.65) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 2000 12:53:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 30663 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2000 12:52:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO main) (212.159.120.130) by rack.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 2000 12:52:29 -0000 Message-ID: <002801bf90d9$b8481d20$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001101bf906b$5031bac0$089601d5@default> Subject: LF: Re: 73kHz signals Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 12:58:51 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear all. It's very frustrating not to be able to see anything through the Rugby shash so I hope I didn't tread on anyone elses toes! I did manage to work Reino OH1TN crossband to 137.7 at about the time you heard me Alan.... I think Peter worked him first. I don't suppose we can expect to work any further! By the way, if we could produce similar radiated powers on both bands, surely 73k would go further? Therefore, allowing for the fact that my erp on 73k is a quarter of what it is on 136, would there be a distance at which the signal strength is similar? I imagine this would be true except for the large amount of QSB we get at the far distances. 73. Dave G3YXM. > Hi all, nice QRS signals from Dave G3YXM and Jim M0BMU at about 2230z > tonight....but I suppose this is superfluous as they are probably both > working 1500kms+ crossband now!! > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17558 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2000 18:27:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 2000 18:27:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12WNoH-0008CD-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 18 Mar 2000 18:18:49 +0000 Received: from as-img-4.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.147] helo=spamgaad.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12WNoG-0008C7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 18 Mar 2000 18:18:48 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaad.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id NAA10172 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 18 Mar 2000 13:18:07 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 13:17:25 -0500 From: "Prof R. Jennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: 73kHz mixer crystals ...who wants?? To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003181317_MC2-9DAD-58A1@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Alan, Please, oh please, may I have a pair. I will, of course, refund all costs involved. 73 in haste, (Sorry not to contact you directly but my Compuserve refuses your address!) Roger, G2AJV. (Roger Jennison, Wildwood, Nackington, Canterbury, CT4 7AY.) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6218 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2000 22:37:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 Mar 2000 22:37:05 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Wo9K-0004wY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 22:26:18 +0000 Received: from [195.166.128.23] (helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Wo9J-0004wT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 19 Mar 2000 22:26:17 +0000 Received: (qmail 19398 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2000 22:26:06 -0000 Received: from rack.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.65) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 Mar 2000 22:26:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 4877 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2000 22:25:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO main) (212.159.120.120) by rack.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 Mar 2000 22:25:00 -0000 Message-ID: <009101bf91f2$d8b64400$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: cross-band conditions. Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2000 22:31:17 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear all. I have just spent a frustrating day trying to work Valerio IK5ZPV crossband 73/136. We had taken it for granted that the difficult bit would be hearing the 73k signal at Valerio's QTH.... In fact he copied me at 0700, 1300 and 1400hrs but I saw nothing of his signal on 137.700 . Those of you who have worked or heard him, know that Valerio has a very good signal on 136k, usually quite workable on normal CW. So why could I not see him today? Beats me! I assume that conditions vary more than we imagine. Reducing Valerio's signal from 569 to a level where there is no trace against a quiet background on Spetrogram must take 20dB or so. Did anyone hear him calling me? Am I deaf? Am I paranoid? BTW. Nice DFCW signal from G3AQC tonight. How long have you had that working Laurie? 73, Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15998 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 06:13:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 06:13:55 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12WvKc-0000L3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 06:06:26 +0000 Received: from mail1.dada.it ([195.110.96.68] helo=mail.dada.it) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12WvKa-0000Ky-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 06:06:24 +0000 Received: (qmail 24616 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 06:06:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO cestag) (195.110.103.242) by mail.dada.it with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 06:06:09 -0000 Message-ID: <000701bf9232$66485620$f2676ec3@cestag> From: "cesare tagliabue" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: R: cross-band conditions. Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 07:05:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Dave In effect yesterday I think we had very strange conditions, I have tested the signal of Valerio, and it was strong as usual. I was not able to see your signals on 71.8 Khz, while Valerio do it well; the distance between us is only 35 Km and during the cross-band QSO with G3LDO I saw the signals on 71.8 almost as well as Valerio. Moreover this weekend I have spent a lot of time in calling CQ both QRSS and normal CW and listening for hours but nothing to do! The only station I have heard was OZ8NJ, he was calling CQ and was 439 by me. Yesterday I saw only DF6NM working OK1FIG, he was 'O' by me, while OK1FIG was invisible at all. 73 Cesare Cesare Tagliabue I 5 TGC e-mail: cestag@dada.it url: http://www.dadacasa.com/i5tgc -----Messaggio originale----- Da: Dave A: LF Group Data: domenica 19 marzo 2000 23.58 Oggetto: LF: cross-band conditions. >Dear all. > >I have just spent a frustrating day trying to work Valerio IK5ZPV crossband >73/136. We had taken it for granted that the difficult bit would be hearing >the 73k signal at Valerio's QTH.... In fact he copied me at 0700, 1300 and >1400hrs but I saw nothing of his signal on 137.700 . Those of you who have >worked or heard him, know that Valerio has a very good signal on 136k, >usually quite workable on normal CW. So why could I not see him today? Beats >me! >I assume that conditions vary more than we imagine. Reducing Valerio's >signal from 569 to a level where there is no trace against a quiet >background on Spetrogram must take 20dB or so. >Did anyone hear him calling me? >Am I deaf? >Am I paranoid? > >BTW. Nice DFCW signal from G3AQC tonight. How long have you had that working >Laurie? > >73, Dave G3YXM. > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22869 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 09:10:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 09:10:33 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Wy6k-0001qW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 09:04:18 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Wy6i-0001qR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 09:04:17 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id JAA22210 for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 09:04:06 GMT X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000032009015268199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 09:01:52 GMT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: 73kHz crossband Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Dear all. Dave said > I have just spent a frustrating day trying to work Valerio IK5ZPV crossband > 73/136. We had taken it for granted that the difficult bit would be hearing > the 73k signal at Valerio's QTH.... In fact he copied me at 0700, 1300 and > 1400hrs but I saw nothing of his signal on 137.700 . Those of you who have > worked or heard him, know that Valerio has a very good signal on 136k, > usually quite workable on normal CW. So why could I not see him today? Beats > me! When I worked Valerio the sked time was arranged for 2000UTC and I was to call every 15mins and spend the rest of the time listening (looking). I saw nothing from Valerio until 2040 although he was apparently receiving my 73kHz signals all the time. I put it down to finger trouble this end because when he did appear he was so strong. It is strange that 137kHz is the weak link. The other factor is that my station is not optimized on receive on 136k when working crossband because the antenna is tuned to 72kHz. What I need is a relay that will short out the 72k section of the loading coil receive, so the contacts have to stand many thousands of volts! When this problem is sorted out I am going to try a cross band QSO with I5TGC. On Friday evening I put out a QRSS CQ call on 72kHz while looking for QRSS replies at around 137.7kHz. Later I received an e-mail from Reino that he had seen me and called me on 137.1 normal CW. I now understand that Dave had a successful sked with Reino. I received a .jpg file showing Dave's and my signals nearly on the same frequency! I arranged a sked and had a successful QRSS QSO with OH9UFO starting at 2000, reports 'O' and 549 respectively. Reino asked if I could try normal CW. This was a bit marginal, my report being 239, with a bit of QRM (Dave?). -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3867 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 10:11:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 10:11:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Wz3L-0002OW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:04:51 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Wz3K-0002OR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:04:50 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA109418 for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 11:04:39 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000320120132.2e8fc75a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 12:01:32 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Re: 73kHz crossband In-reply-to: <2000032009015268199@zetnet.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 09:01 20/03/00 GMT, G3LDO wrote: >What I need is a relay that will short out the 72k section of the >loading coil receive, so the contacts have to stand many thousands of >volts! Try a HVK1/2 relais, Specifications say 8kV (dc) switching voltage. I used it at work upto 15kV (at 8kHz) when it was swiched 'cold' (remove signal -> switch relay -> put signal back on). I think that is the way you intend to use it. This relays (in various configurations) can be found in the Farnell catalog under order codes : 910-855 for SPNO - 5V with push on terminals 910-867 for SPNO - 12V with push on terminals 910-879 for SPNO - 24V with push on terminals 910-880 for SPNC - 5V with push on terminals 910-909 for SPNC - 24V with push on terminals 910-910 for SPNO - 5V with flying leads 910-922 for SPNO - 12V with flying leads 910-934 for SPNO - 24V with flying leads 910-946 for SPNC - 5V with flying leads 910-960 for SPNC - 12V with flying leads They cost arround 50 Euro. You can check Farnell on the web : http://www.farnell.com 73, Rik PS : SPNO = single pole normally open / SPNC = single pole normally closed From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9874 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 10:29:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 10:29:05 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12WzKp-0002e5-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:22:55 +0000 Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12WzKo-0002dN-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:22:54 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id KAA24957; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:24:52 GMT Received: (qmail 28735 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 11:18:43 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 11:18:43 -0000 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id KAA28577; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:13:27 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma027948; Mon, 20 Mar 00 10:10:55 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:17:26 +0000 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:07:12 -0000 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01752805@PDW-MERCURY-1> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: High voltage reed relays Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:07:10 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I have a number of, quote, "High Voltage" reed relays. They were made by FR Electronics (as was) and I seem to recall are specified to something like 10kV and 1 Amp which means they may well work higher if not hot switched. They were originally intended for use in automatic ATUs intended for frequency hopping radios. They're hopefully still buried in a box in my storage shed, but I'll look them out and can pass on to anyone wanting to experiement with loading coil switching. Coil voltage is 24 V but with everyone using MOSFET PAs these dyas I'm sure that won't be a problem. Andy G4JNT > The other factor is that my station is not optimized on receive on > 136k when working crossband because the antenna is tuned to 72kHz. > What I need is a relay that will short out the 72k section of the > loading coil on receive, so the contacts have to stand many thousands > of > volts! When this problem is sorted out I am going to try a cross band > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 442 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 11:06:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 11:06:34 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Wzp0-0002xK-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:54:06 +0000 Received: from alpha.dii.unisi.it ([193.205.7.2] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12WzoP-0002x2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:53:41 +0000 Received: from mailsrv.dii.unisi.it (IDENT:valerio@pcfasec.dii.unisi.it [193.205.7.103]) by alpha.dii.unisi.it (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA03639 for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 12:53:57 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38D6028E.67B89D64@mailsrv.dii.unisi.it> Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 11:50:54 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Valerio Gabbani" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: 73 kHz (mistery) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Dave and all , I'm surprised, i think also that 73 kHz link should be the most weak, but it does not seem so !!! I was receiving for you at 20.30 together Cesare but no signals red !!! I remember to search in vain for Peter signal many evenings so this could be the combination of poor propagation and strong noise, but i' m also troubled by 137.7 kHz link. May be i'm doing somethink wrong (no fire yet !) in 137 kHx transmitting so i wish to solve this mistery with other trials. I will be again QRV this evening starting from 20.30 and listening at 71.8 kHz. At 21.00, if i do not receive any signal from Dave, i will call for x-band on 137.7 kHz, 3 sec. dot length, 1/3 ratio and i would appreciate any report of my transmission . Dave, i can be QRV also tomorrow morning (21/3/2000) from 6.30 to 7.30. Hoping for the best, '73 to all Valerio (IK5ZPV) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12312 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 11:16:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 11:16:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Wzz8-00030M-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 11:04:34 +0000 Received: from carbon.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.92]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Wzz7-00030H-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 11:04:33 +0000 Received: from [213.1.88.187] (helo=default) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12WzyZ-0004jR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 11:03:59 +0000 Message-ID: <001d01bf925b$1c6abe20$bb5801d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Cluser spots for 18/19th March Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:33:20 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All, I have not been able to access my local custer for the last couple of days so I am posting the spots forwarded to me by Wolf DL1SAN from DB0MBX Mainly QRS monitoring from me this weekend the weather was too nice to spend too much time inside. For most of the weekend the noise level seemed very low, but activity only seemed to be at a moderate level, judged by the traces on the waterfall display rather than by listening. Saturday 0820 G3XDV CQ 'O' 0930 DF6NM DFCW 'O' (KX) looking for X-band qsos 0945 DF6NM QRS CQX 'O' I am sure the signal from Dick PA0SE on normal CW was stronger than I normally receive him. He was almost as strong as John G4GVW who he was working at 1038z, but I suppose he is a 'local' to me. Sunday 0731 HB2ASB CQ 'O' 0802 ON4ZK CQ 'O' DK8KW CQX 'O' HB2ASB CQ 'O' 0809 ON4ZK DFCW CQ 0825 DF8ZR 'O' wkg ON4ZK DK8KW CQX 'O' 1002 PA2NJN CQ 'O' 1045 PA2NJN calling DF8ZR both 'O' 1120 PA2NJN wkg DF8ZR Spots from Wolf DL1SAN from DB0MBX in Southern Germany 136.5 DK6NI 19-Mar-2000 1025Z cq 439 136.4 DJ1RL 19-Mar-2000 0953Z 569 136.5 DJ1ZB 19-Mar-2000 0935Z 559 136.2 HB2ASB 19-Mar-2000 0826Z 579 cq 136.5 SM6PXJ 17-Mar-2000 2242Z (559) cq 136.5 DJ9IE 16-Mar-2000 2023Z 549 cq 136.7 G3AQC 15-Mar-2000 2107Z 136.5 DJ9IE 13-Mar-2000 1859Z 449 cq Cheers de Alan G3NYK JO02PB Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25514 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 13:25:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 13:25:32 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X24D-0004G4-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 13:17:57 +0000 Received: from mail6.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X249-0004Fz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 13:17:53 +0000 Received: from modem-87.beleriand.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.138.215] helo=lvm) by mail6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12X23w-0005dH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 13:17:42 +0000 Message-ID: <000201bf926e$bcc5ca00$d78a883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. LF X-Band conditions.. Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 08:08:27 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Dave,
I also spent a frustrating weekend! Afraid I heard nothing of IK5ZPV.Called OZ8NJ
many times, his sig 5/4/9 but no reply .I have been calling DFCW for several weeks now late evening, but no contacts yet.
Guess there is still a lot to learn about 136.                                                     73s all, Laurie G3AQC..
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9123 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 14:45:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 14:45:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X3EV-0004vL-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 14:32:39 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X3EU-0004vG-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 14:32:38 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id OAA19647 for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 14:32:26 GMT X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000032014285368199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 14:28:53 GMT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: Re: LF: 73 kHz (mistery) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Valerio Gabbani said > I will be again QRV this evening starting from 20.30 and listening at > 71.8 kHz. > At 21.00, if i do not receive any signal from Dave, i will call for > x-band on 137.7 kHz, 3 sec. dot length, 1/3 ratio and i would appreciate > any report of my transmission . > Dave, i can be QRV also tomorrow morning (21/3/2000) from 6.30 to 7.30. I will not transmit while these tests are on - it can cause some confusion. I hope to be looking and will pass on reports of any activity I see. I have had reports that the top end of the band, near 74.4kHz is clear. I have to modify my xtal mixer because at the moment is only covers the bottom end of the band; so it is an evening with the soldering iron tonight. -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11678 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 15:22:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 15:22:17 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X3oI-0005Jx-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 15:09:38 +0000 Received: from as-img-3.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.146] helo=spamgaac.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X3oH-0005Js-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 15:09:37 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaac.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id KAA12689 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:08:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 10:07:30 -0500 From: "Holger 'Geri', DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: 73 kHz (mistery) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003201007_MC2-9DD1-7A3D@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Peter, >I will not transmit while these tests are on - it can cause some >confusion. I hope to be looking and will pass on reports of any activity I see. maybe not tonight, but I am still looking out for your signal on 71.8 kHz. I think I saw you yesterday night, I saw a very weak "DO" just when it disappeared on the left side of the screen (hadn't been in the shack for a while, what about a kind of "alarm" function when anything above a certain threashold level appears on the screen ... need to contact R.S. Horne and ask him if this is possible ...). Mike, G3YXM, I would also like to try to contact you x-band ... maybe next weekend, early Saturday or Sunday morning ... >I have had reports that the top end of the band, near 74.4kHz is >clear. I have to modify my xtal mixer because at the moment is only >covers the bottom end of the band; so it is an evening with the >soldering iron tonight. Hopefully 74.4 is not too close to HBG75 on 75 kHz, quite a strong signal with me in Northern Europe, so surely much stronger in HB9/I5 Looking out on what we see tonight on 71.8 kHz and 137.7 kHz ... also looking out for Valerio ... currently working on a solution to use the stereo-function of Spectrogram to see 71.8 kHz on the left channel and 137.7 kHz on the right channel ... with two receivers ... let's see ... Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15109 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 15:45:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 15:45:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X4EK-0005UA-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 15:36:32 +0000 Received: from hermes.iol.cz ([194.228.2.36]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X4EJ-0005U5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 15:36:31 +0000 Received: from dell1.cz.gmc.net ([194.228.225.18]) by hermes.iol.cz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 631-66640U65000L65000S0V35) with ESMTP id cz for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 16:35:58 +0100 Received: from p (p.maly.cz.gmc.net [192.168.1.35]) by dell1.cz.gmc.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id HJH85FDC; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 16:39:12 +0100 Message-ID: <002101bf9282$707ff120$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> From: "Petr Maly" To: "136 group" Subject: LF: I will be QRV Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 16:39:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello all This weekend I stayed home, in spite of "city" working conditions I made a nice Visual-CW QSO with DF6NM. (LW 41 m in 6 m height, 60 watts). Following weekend (24/03/2000) I will be QRV from the cottage. Probably from Friday afternoon to Saturday midday, maybe to Sunday midday. I would like to add some more DX's and new countries before spring QRN comes. 73, Petr, OK1FIG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21942 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 17:20:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 17:20:52 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X5iD-0006Q7-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 17:11:29 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X5iC-0006Q2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 17:11:28 +0000 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12X5fK-00062z-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 17:08:30 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <11336.200003201716@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 17:17:04 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73/136kHz X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, Had a fruitless weekend on 73kHz - spent about 6 hours transmitting on the band, but no QSO's. Did see OH1TN calling G3YXM and G3LDO, but I don't think Reino could see my signal. Will have another try for cross-band QSO's tonight, if I can find a clear frequency! Interesting to see how things have changed for 73kHz in the space of a few weeks; the amazing results that have been acheived seem to be not so much due to technical improvements or good propagation, but more to there being plenty of activity on the band. Spent some time over the weekend working on my ground system - this does not seem to have made much difference to it's electrical performance, but at least it is not so easy to fall over it now! Hope to see some activity later, any reports would be very welcome. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28390 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 18:56:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 18:56:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X787-0007D3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:42:19 +0000 Received: from ds-img-1.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.134] helo=spdmgaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X786-0007Cy-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:42:18 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id NAA16972 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 13:41:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 13:41:07 -0500 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: 73 kHz (mistery) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003201341_MC2-9DD5-5A05@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Mike and Dave, sorry, guys, allways keep up mixing your calls >Mike, G3YXM, I would also like to try to contact you x-band ... maybe next >weekend, early Saturday or Sunday morning ...< Mike, G3XDV I mean, of course ... just worked Laurie, G3AQC as a new one ... Laurie, your signal (and mine obviously as well) leaves room for improvement, but we made it! Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17258 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 19:03:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 19:03:29 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X7LP-0007Ku-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:56:03 +0000 Received: from [195.166.128.23] (helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X7LO-0007Kp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:56:02 +0000 Received: (qmail 15798 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 18:55:54 -0000 Received: from rack.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.65) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 18:55:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 18762 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 18:54:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO main) (212.159.69.106) by rack.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 18:54:50 -0000 Message-ID: <002c01bf929e$a4490480$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" References: <11336.200003201716@gemini> Subject: LF: Re: 73/136kHz Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:51:34 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Jim. Have a look at the screenshot Reino sent me http://www.picks.f9.co.uk/newspic19.htm . Above Peter's signal I think you can see the end of CQ (-. --.-) followed by M and the start of a zero? It may be worth trying a sked with Reino. > Had a fruitless weekend on 73kHz - spent about 6 hours > transmitting on the band, but no QSO's. Did see OH1TN calling > G3YXM and G3LDO, but I don't think Reino could see my signal. > Will have another try for cross-band QSO's tonight, if I can find a > clear frequency! As regards frequency, as there are so few of us transmitting, we could each have our own frequency! I find it almost impossible to tell if anyone else is transmitting due to the QRM from Rugby. Perhaps we could congregate around 71.800 at 5Hz or 10Hz intervals. What about G3LDO 71.795, G3YXM 71.800, M0BMU 71.805 ? Any other suggestions? Valerio. I will try again at the times you suggested. 73, Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20644 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 19:48:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 19:48:33 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X7wH-0007du-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 19:34:09 +0000 Received: from [195.166.128.23] (helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X7wG-0007do-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 19:34:08 +0000 Received: (qmail 18532 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 19:34:00 -0000 Received: from rack.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.65) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 19:34:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 22065 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 19:32:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO main) (212.159.76.75) by rack.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 19:32:57 -0000 Message-ID: <006401bf92a3$f703a900$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: G4GVC on 73k Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 19:39:08 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear all. G4GVC has just got tuned up on 71.735kHz and will be putting out some slow CW transmissions this evening, starting around 2000. He would be interested in any reports via this reflector. Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14940 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 20:35:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 20:35:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X8jr-0008A0-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 20:25:23 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12X8jq-00089u-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 20:25:22 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id UAA23360 for ; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 20:25:11 GMT X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000032020222368199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 20:22:23 GMT To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: Re: LF: Re: 73/136kHz Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Dave said > As regards frequency, as there are so few of us transmitting, we could each > have our own frequency! I find it almost impossible to tell if anyone else > is transmitting due to the QRM from Rugby. Perhaps we could congregate > around 71.800 at 5Hz or 10Hz intervals. What about G3LDO 71.795, G3YXM > 71.800, M0BMU 71.805 ? Any other suggestions? Excellent idea, this would clear up the confusion. I think we could allow ourselves 10Hz spacing, otherwise we look like participants at the Mad Hatter's tea party. Also I have a problem maintaining the required degree of accuracy (even with Alans crystals) in an outside shack whose temperature ranges from below freezing to 18 degrees C. I will make my frequency 71.79kHz if that is OK with everyone else. The bottom of the band could then be used for normal CW to be the furthest distance (frequency) away from the Growler. In the meantime, anyone who wants a 73kHz cross-band sked, to any other band, please e-mail me. -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27728 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 22:47:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 22:47:16 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XAqR-0000o9-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 22:40:19 +0000 Received: from cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.177]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XAqQ-0000o4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 22:40:18 +0000 Received: from modem-91.orbic-cardinal.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.44.219] helo=lvm) by cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12XAqE-0008Pf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 22:40:07 +0000 Message-ID: <000201bf92bd$4f1f7880$db2c893e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Mystery QRS Signal Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 22:39:54 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
I saw the following signal, strength "O" on
137.692 Khz. at 2100-2110 tonight 20/03/00.
"CQZP3XK"
I replied DFCW and QRS but no response!
Was this you Valerio? if so it was a good clear signal,
no problem to read.The signal was better on my NW-SE
ant.so this ties in with IK.
Best wishes, 73 Laurie G3AQC.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3427 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 23:15:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 23:15:07 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XBEl-0000yJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 23:05:27 +0000 Received: from [195.166.128.23] (helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XBEk-0000yE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2000 23:05:26 +0000 Received: (qmail 16191 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 23:05:18 -0000 Received: from ruin.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.66) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 23:05:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 25084 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2000 23:04:21 -0000 Received: from 181.03-01.quay.dial.plus.net.uk (HELO main) (212.159.66.181) by ruin.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Mar 2000 23:04:21 -0000 Message-ID: <00e101bf92c1$73f8eca0$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000201bf92bd$4f1f7880$db2c893e@lvm> Subject: LF: Re: Mystery QRS Signal Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 23:10:12 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Yes that'll be (IK5)ZPV   "XK" being shorthand for crossband K. I didn't see anything here but it was noisy at that time.
 
73, Dave G3YXM.

I saw the following signal, strength "O" on
137.692 Khz. at 2100-2110 tonight 20/03/00.
"CQZP3XK"
I replied DFCW and QRS but no response!
Was this you Valerio? if so it was a good clear signal,
no problem to read.The signal was better on my NW-SE
ant.so this ties in with IK.
Best wishes, 73 Laurie G3AQC.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23833 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 07:51:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 07:51:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XJHF-0005V3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 07:40:33 +0000 Received: from hugo.fen.baynet.de ([194.95.193.10] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XJHD-0005Uy-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 07:40:31 +0000 Received: from 194.95.193.10.fen.baynet.de (dialin-nbg-175.fen.baynet.de [195.37.215.55]) by hugo.fen.baynet.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id IAA23926 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 08:39:57 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <000301bf7e4a$8cca2180$37d725c3@194.95.193.10.fen.baynet.de> From: "Walter Staubach" To: "Reflektor" Subject: LF: 71.8 KHz this morning Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 23:07:56 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Good morning to All, looked to 71,8 KHz this morning and suddenly saw z p v r r o o o k (at 6.50 utc, fine sigs). Then left my shack for breakfast. But I had a feeling that something happened and so I went back upstairs. And saw x m 7 3 sk (7.19 utc, agn strong sig). Who was it? I would like to have a duplex. 73 Walter DJ2LF --------------------------------------------- Walter.Staubach@fen.baynet.de From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26068 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 08:07:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 08:07:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XJX6-0005cm-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 07:56:56 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from ds9.sci.fi ([195.74.0.54]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XJX5-0005ch-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 07:56:55 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from default (MCCCXIV.rdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.137.114]) by ds9.sci.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id JAA20122 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 09:56:37 +0200 (EET) Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000321095635.0081cc50@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: vaiski1@pop.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 09:56:35 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: Signal Strength Measurements by OH2LX MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Measurements of UK Decca's and some other stations : ---------------------------------------------------------- Day ------------------ 16Mar 17Mar 18Mar 19Mar 20Mar THU FRI SAT SUN MON Time, UTC ------------ 2140- 2140- 2145- 2105- 2105- ---------------------------------------------------------- kHz Ch *d,km AZI* *Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW* ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.8 (6C), 1435, 280, -102 -106 -104 -112 -106 ---------------------------------------------------------- 126.7 (2A), 1565, 269, -101 -104 -105 -105 -105 ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.5 (8E), 1766, 276, -107 -102 -105 -108 -111 ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.0 (3B), 1871, 257, -105 -101 -107 -104 -110 ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.5 (5B), 1890, 247, -105 -103 -107 -104 -113 ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.2 (7D), 2060, 267, -119 -107 -114 -116 -115 ---------------------------------------------------------- 126.4 (1B), 2282, 253, -114 -110 -111 -112 -112 ---------------------------------------------------------- kHz Ch *d,km AZI* *Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW* ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.93 ref, 1553, 228, -79 -85 -85 -84 -85 ---------------------------------------------------------- 138.83 ref, 1221, 226, -81 -80 -84 -84 -82 ---------------------------------------------------------- 135.8 SXV 2490, 182, -127 -107 -107 -108 -116 ---------------------------------------------------------- 137.0 CFH* 5750, 295, Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil ---------------------------------------------------------- * CFH only heard on the 15 Mar, after 22z, up to -127 dBmW ---------------------------------------------------------- 15Mar 2248: DJ9IE -127 16Mar 2109: OZ8NJ -126 16Mar 2122: OH1BS -107; 2136: -109..-107(f) 16Mar 2128: SM6PXJ -119..-114(f) 17Mar 2146: OH?UFO -113..-111 (QRS on 137.7) 17Mar 2149: SM6PXJ -115 18Mar 2039: MM0ALM -127; 2039: -125; 2208: -122..-120(f) 18Mar 2108: OH7OL -129 18Mar 2252: OZ8NJ -127 19Mar 2028: OH9UFO -106: 2054: -110..-108; 2101: -119(!) 19Mar 2034: SM6PXJ -111..-109; 2056: -117..-116(f) 19Mar 2046: MM0ALM -127; 2108: -120..-119(f) 19Mar 2107: OH7OL -124..-122(f) ---------------------------------------------------------- (R&S ESH2/---- 10m coax---/1:10/---15m wire-----): Noise level with antenna: with 200Hz IF BandWidth: -26..-21 dB(uV), -133..-128dBmW (varies w qrm etc) ---------------------------------------------------------- End of message of 21 Mar 2000, 0800 UTC, from OH2LX ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19209 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 08:24:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 08:24:28 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XJqJ-0005mi-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 08:16:47 +0000 Received: from artemis.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.126]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XJqI-0005md-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 08:16:46 +0000 Received: from pc171.geog.le.ac.uk ([143.210.25.171] helo=kate) by artemis.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.03 #1) id 12XJq7-0001xA-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 08:16:35 +0000 From: "kate moore" To: "lfgroup" Subject: LF: GVC on 73 Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 08:10:24 -0000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Finally able to produce a signal on 73kHz at long last! The system is a lash-up around my normal 136kHz set-up: - Two monster coils wound on B&Q "Fun Tubs" configured as a variometer, in series with the 136 loading system - Normal inverted-L antenna - Double values for LPF in 'G3YXM' TX, running approx. 400W - Crystal divider driver, giving spot frequency of 71.735kHz Dave 'YXM could just hear me above the Rugby racket, which seemed very bad last night, but we didn't bother to make a QSO. Interestingly, I can hardly hear anything at all on 136kHz with the antenna tuned to 71kHz, so crossband QSOs are going to be difficult with weak stations until I can devise a way of switching out the extra loading. Sorry I couldn't give any warning, but I only got it finished early last evening. Anyway, sent 7 callsigns plus 'AR' on 71.735kHz from 20.00UT last night, slow CW with 4 second dots. If anyone heard or saw anything I would be VERY grateful for a report. Regards John G4GVC From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2989 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 08:53:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 08:53:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XKIn-00062t-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 08:46:13 +0000 Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XKIm-00062o-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 08:46:12 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id IAA16862; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 08:48:15 GMT Received: (qmail 32433 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 09:42:02 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 09:42:02 -0000 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id IAA26760; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 08:36:42 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma026663; Tue, 21 Mar 00 08:36:23 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 08:48:08 +0000 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 08:44:31 -0000 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01752808@PDW-MERCURY-1> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: "'LF Group'" Subject: LF: HV Reed relays Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 08:44:29 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Managed to find six spare reed relays that look as if they may be suitable for LF antenna switching . The reed connection points are well separated from the coil connections by about 10mm in air with little opportunity for tracking, when covered by extra insulation they should survive. The reeds are obviously vacuum filled but beyond that I've no further info. The gap between the reeds inside is only a fraction of a mm and it's rather frightening to think of the E field in this region ! But they are rated at quite a few kVoperation, and in a vacuum I suppose there is nothing to break down One is on it's way to G3LDO and I've had two other requests so far (both from overseas - does that say something about the state of experimentation in this country ?) Also found about 20 smaller relays that have reed and coil connections brought out to mounting pins on the base with a spacing of only 5mm between contact and coil connections. This could track at high voltages so suspect these are only good to about 1kV. Andy G4JNT -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6315 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 09:12:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 09:12:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XKWE-0006BT-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 09:00:06 +0000 Received: from [195.166.128.23] (helo=merlins.force9.net) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XKWD-0006BO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 09:00:05 +0000 Received: (qmail 31239 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 08:59:59 -0000 Received: from rack.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.65) by merlins.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 08:59:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 4383 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 08:58:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO main) (212.159.72.164) by rack.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 08:58:55 -0000 Message-ID: <000e01bf9314$8e09d020$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000301bf7e4a$8cca2180$37d725c3@194.95.193.10.fen.baynet.de> Subject: LF: Re: 71.8 KHz this morning Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 09:03:53 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Walter. It was me, I was working Valerio IK5ZPV... yes we made it at last! I can try any time today, transmitting on 71.800 listening on 137.7 +/- 40Hz or wherever you like. Let me know when you would like to try. > looked to 71,8 KHz this morning and suddenly saw z p v r r o o o k (at > 6.50 utc, fine sigs). Then left my shack for breakfast. > But I had a feeling that something happened and so I went back upstairs. And > saw x m 7 3 sk (7.19 utc, agn strong sig). Who was it? I would like to > have a duplex. > 73 Walter DJ2LF > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18586 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 10:15:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 10:15:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XLUU-0006kf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:02:22 +0000 Received: from mashie.force9.net ([195.166.128.30]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XLUT-0006ka-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:02:21 +0000 Received: (qmail 8607 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 10:02:13 -0000 Received: from rack.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.65) by mashie.force9.net with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 10:02:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 10386 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 10:01:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO main) (212.159.68.129) by rack.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 10:01:12 -0000 Message-ID: <002701bf931d$406d41e0$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: Still learning Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 09:32:29 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear all. Last night whilst the tx was sending a QRS call on 71.8 I went outside to check that there was no corona discharge from the antenna, easy to see in the dark. No problems were seen but I noticed a crackling noise behind me. Closer investigation revealed that it was coming from the ground at the base of the antenna support mast which is strapped to a fir tree. Small sparks could be seen amongst the undergrowth where the mast touched the ground. This was obviously a waste of valuable energy! I decided to earth the pole, then at least it would no longer be a lossy structure, just some additional capacitance. After I had done this three things happened, the resonant frequency went down, the match changed and, when the ATU was re-adjusted, the antenna current rose by 10% for the same power input. This must be due to higher Q because of less loss. Well worth doing. Fire-risk reduced and power increased! Look out for lossy structures near the antenna and either insulate them they will then be live... ) or earth them solidly. 73, Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17790 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 10:47:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 10:47:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XM5f-00078h-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:40:47 +0000 Received: from neodymium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.83]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XM5e-00078c-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:40:46 +0000 Received: from [62.6.99.223] (helo=default) by neodymium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12XM5D-0007YM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:40:19 +0000 Message-ID: <001d01bf9320$f28fa540$df63063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: John re 73k tests Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:32:36 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi John i will leave my rx on 73 all day monitoring 71.76 to 71.84kHz. Weather is good so I should avoid the TV QRM for most of the day. Tel 01473-623713 Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13831 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 10:56:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 10:56:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XMDD-00079Q-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:48:35 +0000 Received: from [194.73.73.138] (helo=ruthenium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XMDD-00079L-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:48:35 +0000 Received: from [213.1.74.43] (helo=default) by ruthenium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12XMFG-0004Mn-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:50:42 +0000 Message-ID: <000701bf9322$09e16200$2b4a01d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: John re 73k again Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 10:40:34 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Whoops misread the frequency ...make my monitor 71.72 to 71.81kHz Alan G3NYK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2528 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 14:55:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 14:55:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XPsi-0000kx-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 14:43:40 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XPsh-0000ks-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 14:43:39 +0000 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12XPpo-0007SA-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 14:40:40 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <11994.200003211448@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 14:49:16 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz Cross-band X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, Sent CQ calls on 73kHz from about 1910 to about 2250 last night; saw signals from G3LDO and G4GVC while monitoring 73kHz, but no replies on 136kHz - only signal seen was DFCW from G3AQC. The level of QRN seemed quite high. I think the idea of having seperate frequencies for each station on the band is a good one - I would go along with G3LDO about 'channel spacing' - maintaining my VFO to within +/-5Hz is fairly easy, which would be OK for 10Hz spacing, but not for 5Hz. I will allocate myself 71.81 for the time being, unless there is any reason to avoid this frequency? As far as switching antennas goes, I am using a seperate antenna for receive when working cross-band - this avoids problems with high-voltage switching. The RX antenna is a vertical of about 5m fixed to the side of the house, tuned with a small pot core inductor and variable capacitor. At the moment it is switched out by a relay on transmit, but I plan to add some additional high pass filtering so I can monitor 136 continuously while transmitting on 73. The seperate antenna seems more prone to picking up mains noise, but most of the time the noise floor seems to be QRN or Loran sidebands. I probably won't be available tonight, but should be QRV tomorrow morning for cross - band QSO's. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20389 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 16:04:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 16:04:00 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XR1u-0001QU-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 15:57:14 +0000 Received: from hugo.fen.baynet.de ([194.95.193.10] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XR1t-0001QP-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 15:57:13 +0000 Received: from 194.95.193.10.fen.baynet.de (dialin-nbg-152.fen.baynet.de [195.37.215.32]) by hugo.fen.baynet.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id QAA26288 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:56:45 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <000601bf7e8f$f320cf20$20d725c3@194.95.193.10.fen.baynet.de> From: "Walter Staubach" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Re: 71.8 KHz this morning Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 07:24:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by hugo.fen.baynet.de id QAA26288 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hallo Dave, thanks for your answer and proposal. We came just back from a walk in the sunshine that we missed for a long time. So I will call you every full hour on 137.7 and after that listen on 17.8. Receiving antenne is the same as for transmitting on 137, but with an additional coil that I must shortcut when transmitting. Takes a little while. Let us say from 1600 utc to 21 utc. Hope to see you. 73 Walter DJ2LF -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: Dave An: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Datum: Dienstag, 21. März 2000 10:31 Betreff: LF: Re: 71.8 KHz this morning >Walter. > >It was me, I was working Valerio IK5ZPV... yes we made it at last! >I can try any time today, transmitting on 71.800 listening on 137.7 +/- 40Hz >or wherever you like. > >Let me know when you would like to try. > >> looked to 71,8 KHz this morning and suddenly saw z p v r r o o o k >(at >> 6.50 utc, fine sigs). Then left my shack for breakfast. >> But I had a feeling that something happened and so I went back upstairs. >And >> saw x m 7 3 sk (7.19 utc, agn strong sig). Who was it? I would like >to >> have a duplex. >> 73 Walter DJ2LF >> > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28232 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 16:30:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 16:30:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XRST-0001cT-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:24:41 +0000 Received: from [194.73.73.138] (helo=ruthenium.btinternet.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XRSS-0001cO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:24:40 +0000 Received: from [213.1.148.153] (helo=default) by ruthenium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12XRUW-0005zc-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:26:48 +0000 Message-ID: <000301bf9351$02562fa0$999401d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: John G4GVC re 73k Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:16:59 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi John Stable transmission probably at hand keying speed seen on 71.735 kHz at about 1611z for a period of just over a minute. 16db above the noise on Spectrogram, 16k points. I have been called out so was not watching at the time. Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1207 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 16:51:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 16:51:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XRgH-0001rE-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:38:57 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XRgG-0001r9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:38:56 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id RAA126442 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 17:38:45 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000321183536.2d37b3ca@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 18:35:36 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz Cross-band In-reply-to: <11994.200003211448@gemini> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I'm very surprised by the activity on 71.8kHz and the distances covered. It's a pitty we started this activity so late as the band will be withdrawn in a few months. We probably never will know the limits on that frequency. But the fact that distances upto 1800km are possible with abt. 100mW ERP let us wonder how far we could go with the full 1 Watt ERP. Would have been interesting if Christer could have used the 'super-antenna' on that band. So far I have seen M0BMU, G3YXM, G3LDO, G3AQC (?), G3XDV and probably G4GVC (saw 'VC K' last night) on 71.8kHz +/- 100Hz. Not sure wether I saw AQC himself or someone working him x-band. The 3 first are audible here when QRN is not too bad, so a normal CW x-band is possible. Although QSQ's in the 2000km range are more fancy these days I am willing to make a crossband sked with anyone who wants ON in his log. Rig (for 71.8kHz) : inverted L (11m high and 23m long) tuned for 136kHz, TS440 at 500Hz bandwidth and spectogram. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22432 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 17:10:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 17:10:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XS0S-0001uw-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:59:48 +0000 Received: from tungsten.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.81]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XS0R-0001ur-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:59:47 +0000 Received: from [213.1.131.206] (helo=default) by tungsten.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12XS09-0000bB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:59:30 +0000 Message-ID: <000d01bf9355$ea999460$ce8301d5@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: re G4GVC on 73k Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 16:51:15 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi again John a good 'O' on your QRS transmissions between 1620 and 1645z despite my S9 TV SMPS QRM which FMs in synch with the audio. I can just about detect your audio, so nowhere near as strong as 136k ..It looks like Jim just came up too on 71.8, I can hear his audio easily in 500Hz. Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10399 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 17:54:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 17:54:35 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XSe5-0002R3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 17:40:45 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XSe4-0002Qy-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 17:40:44 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id SAA77608 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 18:40:33 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000321193724.2e776364@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 19:37:24 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: tuning a 72kHz antenna to 136kHz In-reply-to: <002701bf931d$406d41e0$0600a8c0@main> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: For those who want to use their 72kHz TX antenna as a 136kHz RX antenna there might be an easy solution that does not require a 'many kV' relais : Assume your antenna has 500pF capacitance. This means you need a 9.8mH coil to bring it to resonance at 72kHz. On 137kHz the 9.8mH coils has an impedance of 8.44kOhm, the 500pF antenna has an impedance og 2.32kOhm. So at 137kHz the antenna has an impedance of 6.12kOm (inductive) and can be brought to resonance by a parallel capacitor with the same impedance = 190pF. So you can bring your 72kHz antenna to resonance on 137kHz using a parallel capacitor (from the TX side of the loadingcoil to ground) in the 200pF range. Fine-tuning can be done using a variable capacitor. As this acapcitor is at the low-voltage side of the coil it can be switched with an ordonary relais. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2000 18:33:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Mar 2000 18:33:54 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XTMB-0002jo-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 18:26:19 +0000 Received: from hugo.fen.baynet.de ([194.95.193.10] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XTM8-0002jj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 18:26:16 +0000 Received: from 194.95.193.10.fen.baynet.de (dialin-nbg-151.fen.baynet.de [195.37.215.31]) by hugo.fen.baynet.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id TAA19828 for ; Tue, 21 Mar 2000 19:25:49 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <000c01bf7ea4$c69a4ac0$20d725c3@194.95.193.10.fen.baynet.de> From: "Walter Staubach" To: "Reflektor" Subject: LF: Congrats, Dave, 71.8KHz Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 09:53:46 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear Dave, many thanks for my first X-band-QSO. I saw you very well, lost nothing, although the band was more noisy than in the morning. My output on 137.7 is only 65 watts. I am surprised how good signals on this low band are. Probably the range of the groundwave on 71 is better than on 137? Thanks again, Dave, and 73 de Walter, DJ2LF, JN59NO --------------------------------------------- Walter.Staubach@fen.baynet.de From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5118 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 06:16:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 06:16:41 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XeGM-0000JC-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 06:05:02 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XeGL-0000J7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 06:05:01 +0000 Received: from oemcomputer (man-068.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.41.84]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id GAA18336 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 06:04:44 GMT Message-ID: <000001bf93c4$bbaccb80$5429f7c2@oemcomputer> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 22:23:19 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Does anyone know the geographical coordinates of these stations, please? 73 de John Rabson G3PAI From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14378 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 07:09:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 07:09:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XfAZ-0000oC-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 07:03:07 +0000 Received: from bru5-rc-mx1.uunet.be ([194.7.179.228]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XfAX-0000o7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 07:03:06 +0000 Received: (qmail 7562 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 07:02:53 -0000 Received: from uu212-190-6-92.unknown.uunet.be (HELO DeWildeg) (212.190.6.92) by bru5-rc-mx1.uunet.be with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 07:02:53 -0000 Message-ID: <001701bf93cc$b9bc4c80$5c06bed4@DeWildeg> From: "Gaspard De Wilde" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 08:03:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: strong sigs on71.8 Beacon? time 10.30 utc who is who ? -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: John Rabson Aan: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Datum: woensdag 22 maart 2000 7:41 Onderwerp: LF: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) >Does anyone know the geographical coordinates of these stations, please? > >73 de >John Rabson G3PAI > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6246 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 09:06:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 09:06:29 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Xgy9-0001fb-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 08:58:25 +0000 Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Xgy8-0001fW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 08:58:24 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id JAA06105; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 09:00:29 GMT Received: (qmail 13479 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 09:54:12 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 09:54:12 -0000 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id IAA06383; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 08:48:46 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma006268; Wed, 22 Mar 00 08:48:07 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 08:59:58 +0000 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 08:56:18 -0000 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01752810@PDW-MERCURY-1> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 08:56:16 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: MSF Rugby is at 52.36081 Deg N 1.17756 Deg E > ---------- > From: John Rabson[SMTP:word.factory@zetnet.co.uk] > Reply To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Sent: 2000-03-21 22:23 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: LF: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) > > Does anyone know the geographical coordinates of these stations, > please? > > 73 de > John Rabson G3PAI > > > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26054 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 09:51:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 09:51:55 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Xhh8-0002Az-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 09:44:54 +0000 Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Xhh7-0002Au-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 09:44:53 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id KAA19318 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:44:42 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000322114130.2e87f8a4@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 11:41:30 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: RE: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) In-reply-to: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01752810@PDW-MERCURY-1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: DCF77 in located in Mainflingen near Frankfurt (50° 01' north, 09° 00' east). >> ---------- >> From: John Rabson[SMTP:word.factory@zetnet.co.uk] >> Reply To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org >> Sent: 2000-03-21 22:23 >> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org >> Subject: LF: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) >> >> Does anyone know the geographical coordinates of these stations, >> please? >> >> 73 de >> John Rabson G3PAI >> >> >> > >-- >The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence >is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). >For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, >or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is >prohibited and may be unlawful. > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21553 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 10:02:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 10:02:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XhrC-0002If-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 09:55:18 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from flatey.bv.rvk.is ([193.4.100.5] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Xhr7-0002Ia-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 09:55:17 +0000 Received: from engey.bv.rvk.is (root@engey.bv.rvk.is [193.4.100.8]) by flatey.bv.rvk.is (8.9.3/8.9.3+TF) with ESMTP id JAA01278 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 09:54:58 GMT X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: stb@rhus.rvk.is Received: from kjoi.rhus.rvk.is (kjoi.rhus.rvk.is [10.5.51.12]) by engey.bv.rvk.is with ESMTP (8.8.8/RA888) id JAA23573 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 09:54:58 GMT Subject: Re: LF: RE: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.2c (Intl) 2 February 2000 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 09:54:40 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on RBORG/ =?iso-8859-1?q?Reykjav=EDkurborg?==?us-ascii?q?=2F?= =?us-ascii?q?IS?= =?us-ascii?q?=28?==?us-ascii?q?Release?= 5.0.1a (Intl)|17 August 1999) at 22.03.2000 09:54:41 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: DCF77 Specifications Location: Mainflingen transmitter complex, (50:01N, 09:00E), about 25km south-east of Frankfurt a. Main. rgrds Thor tf3sb Talbot Andrew cc: Subject: LF: RE: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) Sent by: 22.03.2000 08:56 Please respond to rsgb_lf_group MSF Rugby is at 52.36081 Deg N 1.17756 Deg E > ---------- > From: John Rabson[SMTP:word.factory@zetnet.co.uk] > Reply To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Sent: 2000-03-21 22:23 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: LF: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) > > Does anyone know the geographical coordinates of these stations, > please? > > 73 de > John Rabson G3PAI > > > -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16050 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 10:27:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 10:27:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XiEx-0002U9-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:19:51 +0000 Received: from artemis.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.126]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XiEw-0002U3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:19:50 +0000 Received: from pc171.geog.le.ac.uk ([143.210.25.171] helo=kate) by artemis.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.03 #1) id 12XiEl-0002JQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:19:39 +0000 From: "kate moore" To: "lfgroup" Subject: LF: 73kHz update Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 10:13:25 -0000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Many thanks to Alan, Jim and Rik for the reports so far on my 73kHz signals, which are much appreciated. I still have some work to do to optimise everything, especially improving the 136kHz receive performance when everything is set up for 73kHz. It may be a few days before I am able to achieve any DX crossband QSOs, but in the meantime I would be grateful for all reports and comments on the 73kHz transmissions whilst I try things out. Andy - if you still have any of those larger relays, I would be interested in one...... I am presently getting a fraction over 2 Amps antenna current on the lower band, and my frequency will be mainly 71.735kHz (unless I use the old VFO, which does drift a little). If this frequency causes difficulty, I might be able to pull the crystal up to .740, but it may be sluggish there so I will keep it where it is for the time being. Last night (Tues) at 17.51UT I made my first 2-way normal speed QSO on 73kHz with G3YXM - thanks Dave! Although in itself this is no great achievement, we did manage Q5 copy both ways through the dreadful Rugby QRM which was S9 at both ends, so I was more than happy. Hopefully Rugby will take the occasional break so I will have a chance to work the rest of you who are transmitting on the band. Regards John G4GVC From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 771 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 13:26:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 13:26:54 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Xl3y-000448-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:20:42 +0000 Received: from bob.dera.gov.uk ([192.5.29.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Xl3x-000443-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:20:41 +0000 Received: by bob.dera.gov.uk; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id NAA02437; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:22:46 GMT Received: (qmail 11237 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 14:16:28 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk (172.16.9.10) by baton.dera.gov.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 14:16:28 -0000 Received: by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk; id NAA14110; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:11:02 GMT Received: from unknown(146.80.11.40) by gauntlet.mail.dera.gov.uk via smap (3.2) id xma013671; Wed, 22 Mar 00 13:09:44 GMT X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from frn-gold-1.dera.gov.uk (unverified) by mailguard.dera.gov.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 2.0.15) with ESMTP id for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:21:41 +0000 Received: by FRN-GOLD-1 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) id ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:12:44 -0000 Message-ID: <3617AC3245C2D1118A840000F805359C01752818@PDW-MERCURY-1> From: "Talbot Andrew" To: "'LF Group'" Subject: LF: Automatic attachments Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:12:42 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1460.8) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: A few people have commented to me about the annoying attachment that appears at the end of messages from this account. Some are even woried about its implications to themselves ! It is placed there by our firewall software to protect this organisation in the increasingly litiginous (if that's how it is spelt) society we now live in. You are all the recipients of anything I say and are free to pass it on wherever as it cannot possibly refer to this organisation's policy / IP etc. Unless you are a lawyer / solicitor then just ignore it - if you are one of those people then charge yourself £100 per microsecond to ignore it :-|) I consider a few words a small price to pay for free Email, 8 hours a day straight to the desk with immediate notification of incoming messages, and with an OFFICIAL OK to use for 'reasonable' private correspondence. At weekends the reflector is directed to another account so I can read it at home. Andy G4JNT now wait for it with suitable baited breath ..............................................here it is... -- The Information contained in this E-Mail and any subsequent correspondence is private and is intended solely for the intended recipient(s). For those other than the recipient any disclosure, copying, distribution, or any action taken or omitted to be taken in reliance on such information is prohibited and may be unlawful. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6579 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 13:56:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 13:56:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XlWq-0004KU-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:50:32 +0000 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XlWp-0004KP-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:50:31 +0000 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #35) id 12XlW4-00033J-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:49:45 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:43:56 +0000 From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:43:54 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Two band operating X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: For what it's worth, I now operate very easily with the station optimised for both 73kHz and 136kHz with a fairly fast manual changeover. The connection from the antenna to the coil can be made either to the 136kHz tap or the 73kHz tap (actually not a tap but the top of two coils). This works fine for transmit on 73 and receive on 137. To transmit on 137 I simply change the tap on my matching transformer as the impedance on slighly different. My changeover time is about 30 seconds - more than adequate for two-way QRSs. I find it important to optimise the antenna tuning on receive because the Datong LF converter has a broadband front end and it needs as much input selectivity as it can get. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13428 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 14:24:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 14:24:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XlwF-0004bK-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 14:16:47 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XlwE-0004bF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 14:16:46 +0000 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12XltG-0002bK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 14:13:42 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <4478.200003221421@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 14:22:21 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz Cross - band X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, No cross-band QSO's last night, but worked ON4ZK for a new station a little after 0700 this morning. We exchanged 'O' reports - Gaspard's signal would have been about 549 in a normal CW QSO. Will try again tomorrow for more crossband QSO's. The build-up of QRN on 136kHz as the night progresses is getting more noticeable now; the mornings are much quieter, but with occasional blasts from assorted electrical appliances. Rik, ON7YD, has suggested I change my 'channel' from 71.81 to 71.82kHz, to move it away from a carrier he sees close to that frequency - does anybody else see this QRM? Would the new frequency be a problem for anyone? All I see at my QTH is the noise from Rugby, so it's difficult for me to know. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25779 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 18:09:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 18:09:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XpOQ-0006Z9-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 17:58:06 +0000 Received: from cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.174]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XpOP-0006Z4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 17:58:05 +0000 Received: from modem-53.barad-dur.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.132.181] helo=lvm) by cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12XpOD-0002E0-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 17:57:54 +0000 Message-ID: <000201bf9428$37a92d60$b584883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re.QSO Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 17:57:29 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Valerio,
Thanks for your mail.I  will look out for you this evening on 137.7,if not seen by 2110 I will transmit on same frequency.I will use slow CW  2 sec dot.
I will also be looking for you and G4GVC on 71.735 at 2030. 73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25086 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 18:18:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 18:18:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XpTr-0006b9-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 18:03:43 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XpTq-0006b4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 18:03:42 +0000 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id TAA127284 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:03:30 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000322200018.2337b42e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 20:00:18 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: Antenna switching 72/136kHz In-reply-to: <000c01bf7ea4$c69a4ac0$20d725c3@194.95.193.10.fen.baynet.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In my previous mail I forgot to mention that 'parallel tuning' of the antenna will only work with a high-impedance RX input (FET-preamp). For 50 Ohm input series tuning can be used (an additional series capacitor between RX and loadingcoil). This capacitor can be short-circuited to switch from 136 to 72kHz. A simple low-voltage relais will do. Thanks to Jim (M0BMU) to point this out. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19067 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 19:23:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 19:23:23 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Xqcl-0007EI-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:16:59 +0000 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Xqck-0007ED-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:16:58 +0000 Received: from as23-s15-143-21.cwci.net ([195.44.143.21] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XqcZ-0001XW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:16:47 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38D919E3.8CA6AD4E@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:07:15 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: 73 v 136 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Professional and Broadcast Engineers already know that 73 khz has a better surface wave for the same given power than 136 khz over a given distance. The advantage of 136 khz is the potential to cover greater distances because of the sky wave effect. This has all been documented if anyone cares to research the information. Why has it taken so long for Radio Amateurs in the UK to discover this fact, given that 73 khz has been available for several years. It was always possible to work xband to other countries and find out but no one has bothered until a few weeks ago!!!!! Given a good VERTICAL antenna at say 100 - 120 ft with 1W erp, your signal surface wave would greatly exceed that of a 136 khz signal. Some have discovered lately that even a short vertical or a piece of low slung wire is alreading doing better on 73 than 136 khz. The UK allocation of 73 khz did not attract many participants because is was not an International allocation, a bit like the 4 metre band, it never attracted those with the potential to really cross frontiers. Those mostly interested are using G5RV type antennas strapped and an audio amplifier!!! and sending LMCW(QRSS). Some of the qso's that I have seen xband are suspect, there are so few active that you only need a couple of letters of the callsign and guess the rest. How about a proper CW qso and a proper report. 73 de G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18735 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 19:52:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 19:52:16 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Xr4h-0007UN-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:45:51 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Xr4g-0007UI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:45:50 +0000 Received: from oemcomputer (man-139.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.40.177]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id TAA07175 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:45:35 GMT Message-ID: <000001bf9437$6705aac0$b128f7c2@oemcomputer> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3.0.1.16.20000322114130.2e87f8a4@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Subject: Re: LF: RE: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:34:23 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thank you all for supplying the information I requested. May I explain what is going on? Last weekend the British Cave Research Association's Cave Radio and Electronics Group performed some tests in the Yorkshire Dales with a view to finding, amongst other things, whether we could null out some of the interference we experience with cave radios. The principal source of interference is LORAN C (known in cave radio circles as The Galloping Horses) but this of course is a somewhat variable signal . We use MSF and DCF as more nearly constant signals for testing the directivity of our surface arrays . Our results should be published in the next issue of the correct a journal. 73 de John Rabson G3PAI From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29689 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 20:04:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 20:04:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XrHB-0007cb-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:58:45 +0000 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XrHA-0007cW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:58:44 +0000 Received: from oemcomputer (man-139.dialup.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.40.177]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id TAA10008 for ; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:58:32 GMT Message-ID: <000701bf9439$3601d640$b128f7c2@oemcomputer> From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3.0.1.16.20000322114130.2e87f8a4@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <000001bf9437$6705aac0$b128f7c2@oemcomputer> Subject: Re: LF: RE: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 19:59:56 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: That should be CREG Journal. ----- Original Message ----- From: John Rabson To: Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2000 7:34 PM Subject: Re: LF: RE: MSF (6O kHz) and DCF77 (77.5 kHz) > Thank you all for supplying the information I requested. May I explain what > is going on? > > Last weekend the British Cave Research Association's Cave Radio and > Electronics Group performed some tests in the Yorkshire Dales with a view to > finding, amongst other things, whether we could null out some of the > interference we experience with cave radios. > > The principal source of interference is LORAN C (known in cave radio circles > as The Galloping Horses) but this of course is a somewhat variable signal . > We use MSF and DCF as more nearly constant signals for testing the > directivity of our surface arrays . > > Our results should be published in the next issue of the correct a journal. > > 73 de > John Rabson G3PAI > > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26953 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 22:08:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 22:08:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XtBj-00009G-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 22:01:15 +0000 Received: from mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XtBi-00009B-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 22:01:14 +0000 Received: from [202.27.178.232] by mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <20000322220055.UVZ2589319.mta2-rme@[202.27.178.232]> for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 10:00:55 +1200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38D939F2.2FC4@xtra.co.nz> Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:24:02 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re. Folded dipoles and meander ants. References: <000201bf78bc$2346f1e0$8881883e@lvm> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: LAWRENCE MAYHEAD wrote: > > Hi John, > I tried to model just such an antenna a few weeks ago using Eznec.The > idea was similar to yours to try to improve the top loading.However > the configuration showed NO improvement over having the 3 top wires in > paralel.Presumably at a spacing of only 2 feet they are far too close > together to have any effect.I am very intrested in any development of > this type and would be quite happy to model any ideas you may have.73s > Laurie. I suggest trying a "second droopy wire" over the same span as each existing top loading wire. The effective capacitance should go up moderately (compared to replacing existing wire with larger diameter). So in your example above, add wires a little below the three parallel top wires, and join them at appropriate places. In practice, using the same end terminations, a second wire could be made a little longer, so would droop below the wire taking the tension. In practice a second wire could tangle in the wind, but it does not tangle for computer modelling :) 73, Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20689 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 23:35:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 23:35:51 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XuZ4-0000tC-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 23:29:26 +0000 Received: from mail6.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XuZ3-0000t5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 23:29:25 +0000 Received: from modem-26.anarrima.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.107.26] helo=lvm) by mail6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12XuYs-0006Io-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 23:29:15 +0000 Message-ID: <000301bf9456$81b0a900$1a6b883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re.QSO Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 23:27:53 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Valerio,
Looked for you on 71.735 at 20:30-21:00 nothing seen.Saw G4GVC and M0BMU at this time.Saw your CQ on 137.7 at 21:00 and replied QRSS but nothing further seen from you.However your sig started at "O" but dropped to "M" by the end so
perhaps you did reply but propagation too poor later?
We should try again, 73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16384 invoked from network); 22 Mar 2000 23:36:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Mar 2000 23:36:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XuZ3-0000t6-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 23:29:25 +0000 Received: from mail6.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.212]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12XuZ2-0000t0-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 23:29:24 +0000 Received: from modem-26.anarrima.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.107.26] helo=lvm) by mail6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12XuYr-0006Io-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 22 Mar 2000 23:29:13 +0000 Message-ID: <000201bf9456$80d7fc40$1a6b883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re.Folded Dipoles and Meander Ants. Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 23:17:00 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Bob,
Re. your comments on "meander" Ants, subsequent modelling did show a small increase in R.Res using a 3 wire top with the centre wire only connected to the vertical.I will try your idea of a second droopy wire and advise.73s Laurie
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10402 invoked from network); 23 Mar 2000 10:05:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Mar 2000 10:05:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Y4Jx-0006CW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:54:29 +0000 Received: from cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.174]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Y4Jv-0006CR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:54:27 +0000 Received: from modem-119.annael.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.115.119] helo=lvm) by cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12Y4Jk-0002M8-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:54:16 +0000 Message-ID: <000201bf94ad$d36dba60$7773883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re DF6NM in DFSS. Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:54:05 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Marcus,
Many thanks for QSO last nite,your sigs were good "O" at first but later QRN very bad and I lost you sri.I have been working on my Tx ant since our first contact,so I wonder wether you noticed and difference in my sig.?
73s es CUAGN. Laurie.G3AQC. 
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10320 invoked from network); 23 Mar 2000 14:26:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Mar 2000 14:26:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Y8QX-0008Qj-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 14:17:33 +0000 Received: from smtp11.bellglobal.com ([204.101.251.53]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Y8QV-0008Qe-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 14:17:32 +0000 Received: from server1 (Kingston-ppp64675.sympatico.ca [216.208.85.56]) by smtp11.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA15102; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:22:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <003a01bf94d2$48d784b0$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org, lowfer@qth.net Subject: LF: Observation, drop in LF noise Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:02:42 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Greetings All:
 
The following is an observation the occurred about an hour ago that may be of interest to some in the LF and LowFer communities.
 
I am watching 189.000 +30, -30 Hz with Gram continuously while I am in the shack here.  There are two signals I am seeing on this part of the spectrum, one carrier that goes on and off from time to time is on 189.008 kHz.  There is a much weaker signal on 189.000 that in the daytime is a faint trace line.  There is another signal that is louder in the evening on 189.000, I am assuming the two signals on 189.000 are from different sources.  I am looking for a LowFer beacon signal on 189.000, so far I can not confirm I have seen it.
 
There was an M class flare at 11.59 utc, peaked at 12:14 utc, ended at 12:33 utc.
 
At about 12:48 utc the screen presentation from Gram suddenly went from typical noise spots to almost ZERO noise, the signal level on 189.008 kHz stayed the same level and the trace signal on 189.000 kHz stayed the same level although it was certainly easier to see.  Without having the confidence of my observation I started poking around for a bad RF connector in the system.  The duration of the low noise was for very nearly two minutes then the noise returned to normal levels.  By this point I had nearly torn the place apart looking for the bad connector that I now feel does not exist.  The low noise period had moved to very nearly the edge of the screen when I realized that the 189.008 kHz signal level had stayed the same throughout the event period, only the noise had changed in level.
 
The 15 minute difference from the end of the M level solar event started me wondering if the lack of noise and the M level event might be related. 
 
If anyone else has an observation of a varying level of noise on LF during this time period today I would be interested to hear about it.
 
Larry
VA3LK
 
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25079 invoked from network); 23 Mar 2000 15:04:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Mar 2000 15:04:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Y92D-0000Ii-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 14:56:29 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Y92C-0000Id-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 14:56:28 +0000 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12Y8zH-00032N-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 14:53:27 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <11119.200003231501@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 15:02:06 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz Cross - band QSO's X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF group, Sent CQ's on 71.81 for cross-band QSO's from 2030 - 2250 last night, and from 0600 - 0815 this morning, but no replies that I could detect. Did see G4GVC on 71.7 or therabouts, with a just- about audible QRSS signal. Also saw G3AQC and DF6NM on 137.7. The noise level on 136kHz seemed to rise quite sharply after about 2200, and fall quite sharply at about 0730. I will be sticking to my 71.81kHz 'channel' for the time being; the balance of response has been in favour of this, especially since 71.82 is already being used by G3XTZ! Of course, I can always use a different frequency if requested, no problem. In response to some of Mal's points, I was using a Maplin MOSFET audio amp as a PA until recently - it produced about 100W perfectly reliably, but I had to modify it to increase slew rate in order to get full output on 136, and also improve the heatsinking; it wasn't very efficient, requiring well over 200W DC input. As for 120ft verticals, well, yes please! Using the same, small, antenna as usual, my best DX QSO has been OH1TN with normal CW on 136 kHz, but I have not managed to reach him yet on 73kHz using QRSS CW.In theory, a given antenna ought to be about 6dB less efficient on 73kHz compared to 136kHz, and the natural noise level is higher by about 6dB too, so DX contacts are unlikely ever to be easier on the lower band, in spite of reduced ground wave losses. Certainly, the stations local to me are much weaker signals on 73kHz than they are on 136kHz. But the special circumstances on 73kHz at the moment are that the noise level in the UK is extremely high due to the Rugby transmitter, whereas in Europe this is not so much of a problem, judging by the spectrogram screen shots that have been posted. Because of this, it is sometimes easier to receive a 73kHz signal outside the UK than it is over a short distance. I don't see why ionospheric propagation should not play a part on 73kHz; obviously there has not been much opportunity to investigate this. I had a nice cross-band QSO with PA0SE last time Rugby was off the air, using normal CW; I think we both gave each other 559 or 569 reports - copy was certainly no problem. It would be good if Mal could activate his GI3KEV station for the next 'first Tuesday' - assuming of course that Rugby does go off air again, G - GI cross- band QSO's ought to be quite possible with normal CW, as possibly other countries too. I think it's important we all do as much with 73kHz as possible in the time there is available - after all, if we ever try to get new bands allocated, or stop existing ones going to other users, we won't get much sympathy from the powers-that-be if they have the impression the bandwidth won't be utilised. Perhaps a cross-band, QRSS contact is not ideal as a form of communications, but it is a lot more interesting and challenging than nothing. I intend to be QRV on 73kHz again on Friday night and over the weekend; hope to see you there. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16028 invoked from network); 23 Mar 2000 16:47:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Mar 2000 16:47:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YAbz-0001FV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 16:37:31 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.sci.fi ([195.74.0.53] helo=pefletti.saunalahti.fi ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YAbx-0001FQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 16:37:29 +0000 Received: from default (MMMCDX.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.47.110]) by pefletti.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id SAA26340 for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 18:37:17 +0200 (EET) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000323183716.0085f3a0@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: oh2lx@pop.saunalahti.fi X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 18:37:16 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: Re: LF: Observation, drop in LF noise In-reply-to: <003a01bf94d2$48d784b0$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi Larry, a very short comment follows: Assume your noise level depends on ionospherically reflected signals, possibly from natural sources as the case often is at least on lower latitudes. My corr geomagnetic latitude is about 57 degrees and I can notice reduction of "sky-wave" signals (before?) during or after a solar M/X level event. I've kept daily log of LF noise level in hope to get some new ideas. Unfortunately man-made noise of some kind is getting worse especially on LF freqs. It is a paradox that for more than 30 years of time we had a stationary order to keep that kind of log of LF/MF noise levels but actually we didn't. Would be interesting to know what stations you hear on 189.000 and/or 189.008, possibly via ground wave? 73 de Vaino, OH2LX Greetings All: The following is an observation the occurred about an hour ago that may be of interest to some in the LF and LowFer communities. I am watching 189.000 +30, -30 Hz with Gram continuously while I am in the shack here. There are two signals I am seeing on this part of the spectrum, one carrier that goes on and off from time to time is on 189.008 kHz. There is a much weaker signal on 189.000 that in the daytime is a faint trace line. There is another signal that is louder in the evening on 189.000, I am assuming the two signals on 189.000 are from different sources. I am looking for a LowFer beacon signal on 189.000, so far I can not confirm I have seen it. There was an M class flare at 11.59 utc, peaked at 12:14 utc, ended at 12:33 utc. At about 12:48 utc the screen presentation from Gram suddenly went from typical noise spots to almost ZERO noise, the signal level on 189.008 kHz stayed the same level and the trace signal on 189.000 kHz stayed the same level although it was certainly easier to see. Without having the confidence of my observation I started poking around for a bad RF connector in the system. The duration of the low noise was for very nearly two minutes then the noise returned to normal levels. By this point I had nearly torn the place apart looking for the bad connector that I now feel does not exist. The low noise period had moved to very nearly the edge of the screen when I realized that the 189.008 kHz signal level had stayed the same throughout the event period, only the noise had changed in level. The 15 minute difference from the end of the M level solar event started me wondering if the lack of noise and the M level event might be related. If anyone else has an observation of a varying level of noise on LF during this time period today I would be interested to hear about it. Larry VA3LK ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15631 invoked from network); 23 Mar 2000 17:49:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Mar 2000 17:49:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YBZl-0001nN-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 17:39:17 +0000 Received: from as-img-6.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.151] helo=spamgaaf.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YBZk-0001nI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 17:39:16 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaaf.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id MAA05276 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:38:35 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:37:45 -0500 From: "DEREK ATTER" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Re: 73/136kHz To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003231237_MC2-9E52-663A@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello LFers Lech G3KAU and myself plan to be QRV from 1930 onwards on 73Khz Friday evening from the Crawley Club station using the Club call G6RC - (G6 Radio Club !) rather than our usual call G3WSC because G6RC has a lower duty cycle for QRSS !. We expect to run 300W RF to the 360 ft long Inverted "L" which has a 70ft.vertical down lead. We also plan to be QRX on 136Khz for possible X-band QSOs. We have just installed a new computer at the Club including sound card so will be QRV with Spectrogram and Spectran for receiving on either 73 or 136Khz and would welcome any arrangement for skeds either QRSS or hand CW. We can also be QRV on any HF band for talk - back if required. Looking at the suggested frequencies on 73Khz already posted on the reflector for various stations, I propose we use 71.83Khz but would welcome any suggestions to the contrary because it is some time since we have been on the band and a lot has been happening in the past couple of weeks. I have been air testing the rig with new loading coil today and will be QRV (manual CW) from the home QTH on 73Khz tonight Thursday 23rd March . I am obtaining 2.0 amps into my inverted "L" with 3 x 50m wire top and 15m vertical leg with 250w RF which makes the base impedance about 65ohms. The antenna current is slightly down on that obtained at 136Khz and the base impedance slightly higher than the 136Khz value of approx 45 ohms. Regards, Derek Atter, G3GRO, Crawley, IO91VC Tel : (0)1293 520 424 From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22699 invoked from network); 23 Mar 2000 19:12:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Mar 2000 19:12:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YCql-0002S7-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:00:55 +0000 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YCqk-0002S2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:00:54 +0000 Received: from [195.44.219.61] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YCqZ-0001uX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:00:43 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38DA6907.19D9DC1D@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 18:57:11 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: 73 khz NOV Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Although 73 khz operations is to cease shortly, I understand that anyone interested might be able to get a NOV until the closure date. Conversation overheard on 80 metres. A direct approach to the DTI seems to be procedure. According to the conversation a M0 station was granted one recently. If anyone is interested there is no harm in asking even at this late stage. Seemingly anyone that asked for a NOV when the band became available had it granted, regardless of the operators potential to propogate a signal on the band. I was one of the first to have a 6 metre NOV when the band was first made avaibale to UK radio amateurs, I also had one or the first NOV'S for a packet BBS, which I owned and operated for several years. This was a NTS bbs GB7KEV linking GB7WRG West Yorkshire to GB7BMX up on the Scottish border. Prior to that in 1962 I had a NOV to run 1kw for experimental purposes for long haul experiments. The normal power at that time was 150 watts DC input. Ask and you will be surprised what is available. 73 de G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3954 invoked from network); 23 Mar 2000 19:44:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Mar 2000 19:44:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YDQT-0002qB-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:37:49 +0000 Received: from ds-img-7.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.153] helo=spdmbaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YDQS-0002q6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:37:48 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmbaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id OAA17590 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 14:37:06 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 14:36:36 -0500 From: "DEREK ATTER" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Crawley Club Station QRV on 73kHz To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003231436_MC2-9E53-3BC1@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Re my earlier message today regarding the Crawley Club station G6RV hopefully being QRV on 73Khz tomorrow,.Friday 24th March from 1930UTC - I have just been reminded that only our Club callsign G3WSC has been issued a notice of variation on the licence to permit operation on the 73Khz band ( Oops !!) So, - we will be operating under the call G3WSC and not G6RC. 73, Derek Atter, G3GRO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 584 invoked from network); 23 Mar 2000 19:49:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Mar 2000 19:49:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YDT7-0002ql-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:40:33 +0000 Received: from ulexite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YDT6-0002qg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:40:32 +0000 Received: from w8k3f0 (1Cust25.tnt7.rtm1.nl.uu.net [212.153.215.25]) by ulexite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id 05BEBFAF0D for ; Thu, 23 Mar 2000 18:39:26 -0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <000d01bf9500$9b15d0a0$19d799d4@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <11119.200003231501@gemini> Subject: LF: Re: 73kHz Cross - band QSO's Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 20:39:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Jim, M0BMU wrote > But the special circumstances on 73kHz at the moment are that the > noise level in the UK is extremely high due to the Rugby > transmitter, whereas in Europe this is not so much of a problem, It makes me happy to learn that England is not part of Europe. That makes my G-QSO's not only international, but even intercontinental .... .. 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6302 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2000 08:05:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Mar 2000 08:05:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YOvv-0000ZB-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 07:55:03 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from [195.243.118.226] (helo=gatekeeper.vs.dasa.de) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YOvu-0000Z6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 07:55:02 +0000 Received: by gatekeeper.vs.dasa.de; (8.8.8/1.3/10May95) id IAA02357; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 08:56:02 +0100 (MET) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from somewhere by smtpxd Received: from somewhere by smtpxd X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: From: "Koenig, Wolfgang" To: "'rsgb_lf_group'" Subject: LF: Portable Activity d e DL0UL/p on 136 kHz Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 08:54:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hallo Group, I will be qrv from a portable qth on saturday 25th. The callsign will be DL0UL/p and the locator is JN48VM. The antenna is an inverted V about 20 meters at feed point with two legs 100 meters each. Only normal CW operation on 136 kHz is possible. Would be happy to meet you on the band. If you hear my call please spot in the cluster. 73 de dl1san Wolf From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14041 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2000 09:06:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Mar 2000 09:06:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YPsV-00015p-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 08:55:35 +0000 Received: from cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.174]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YPsU-00015i-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 08:55:34 +0000 Received: from modem-76.dunadan.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.159.76] helo=lvm) by cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12YPsG-0005kQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 08:55:22 +0000 Message-ID: <006501bf956e$c1e64ca0$4c9f883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re.Folded dipoles etc. Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 08:25:22 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Bob,
I have now had a chance to do a bit more modelling.I tried an aditional "droopy"
top wire with the followihg results:-
1) No change in R.Res!
2)Change in Xc from 2600 to 1900 ohms.
I suppose this is what could be expected,and no doubt further top wires would produce  a further increase in "C".There will be secondary effects of course reduction in coil loss and reduction in voltage on vert. part of ant which may help if nearby objects etc.However its a lot of wire to keep up Hi and only a small improvement.If the "droopy wires were taken to a spreader at the centre of the ant. they could be kept under control! So thanks for the idea,but I guess we have to keep on looking. 73s Laurie.
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27159 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2000 10:13:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Mar 2000 10:13:34 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YQyy-0001gc-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 10:06:20 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.sci.fi ([195.74.0.41] helo=pyyhe.saunalahti.fi ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YQyw-0001gX-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 10:06:19 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from default (MMDCCXXXVII.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.45.37]) by pyyhe.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id MAA23059 for ; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 12:17:41 +0200 (EET) Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000324120607.008172f0@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: oh2lx@pop.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 12:06:07 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: GW F-s versus Wx parametres MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Working on the material left by ex YLE Meas station... Does anyone know the email address of C. Gordon Van Aruan whose article "Influence of Atmospheric Humidity on Low-Frequency Radio Ground Waves" is on the pages 2.5-2.7 of "the LF Experimenters's Source Book", 2nd Edition. Let me refer to another article in Proc IRE, April 1948, "Temperature Variations of Ground-Wave Signal Intensity at Standard Broadcast Frequencies" by Frederick R Gracely: ---------- "Ground-Wave signal intensities at standard broadcast frequencies exhibit considerable variation, even over short paths. ... The practical result of such variations, regardless of the physical explanations ultimately involved, is equivalent to changes in the EFFECTIVE CONDUCTIVITY OF THE PATH. Therefore, in cases where the consideration of close margins in conductivity measurements is necessary, the variations produced by changing conditions over the path may become exceedingly important. ... Careful comparisons of signal intensities with many sets of data on temperature, precipitation, humidity, atmospheric pressure, dew point, and vapor pressure showed clearly that there was closer and more continuous correlation with TEMPERATURE than any other single type of data." ----------- As we have been making these GW F-s measurements for more than 50 years, would like to ask whether other persons on this reflector have professional type of experience with these F-s variations? 73 de Vaino, OH2LX ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27657 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2000 10:16:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Mar 2000 10:16:35 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YR22-0001nW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 10:09:30 +0000 Received: from d06lmsgate-2.uk.ibm.com ([195.212.29.2] helo=lmsfw1.emea.ibm.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YR21-0001nQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 10:09:29 +0000 Received: from d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com [9.166.84.148]) by lmsfw1.emea.ibm.com (1.0.0) with ESMTP id JAA75958 for ; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 09:58:08 GMT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from usa.net (dyn9-87-119-148.italy.ibm.com [9.87.119.148]) by d06relay02.portsmouth.uk.ibm.com (8.8.8m2/NCO v2.06) with ESMTP id KAA114554 for ; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 10:08:40 GMT Message-ID: <38DB3E63.C0F93EDC@usa.net> Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 11:07:31 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Alberto di Bene" Organization: Undisclosed X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: 73kHz Cross - band QSO's Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > It makes me happy to learn that England is not part of Europe. That makes my > G-QSO's not only international, but even intercontinental .... .. There is a lot of fog today on the Channel, James.... the continent seems to be isolated... :-) Alberto I2PHD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19646 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2000 14:33:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Mar 2000 14:33:32 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YV2A-000451-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 14:25:54 +0000 Received: from imo-d06.mx.aol.com ([205.188.157.38]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YV28-00044t-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 14:25:53 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from G0MRF@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id l.a8.2da6f5f (4572) for ; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 09:25:07 -0500 (EST) From: G0MRF@aol.com Message-ID: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 09:25:07 EST Subject: LF: Re: 73k To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 137 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Friday night is activity night? Hello group. I'll be operating this evening (Friday) on the 73k band from 20.00 to 22.45 UTC. As my DDS is temporarily out of action I'm resorting to my old faithful crystal. Measured as 71.997kHz. normal CW 20.00 to 21.15 slow CW beacon 21.20 to 22.45. will monitor 3572 +/-during this period. 73 David G0MRF IO91TK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4313 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2000 15:04:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Mar 2000 15:04:34 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YVWY-0004MM-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 14:57:18 +0000 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YVWX-0004MH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 14:57:17 +0000 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12YVTX-0005Vv-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 14:54:11 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <21966.200003241502@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 15:02:43 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Friday night X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF group, Hope to work the Crawley Club this evening on 73kHz using normal CW - if this doesn't work out, I will try QRSS later. It sounds like they should be able to put out a good signal. I will also be available for cross-band QSO's tonight, and I will try again tommorrow morning up until about 1200 - I have not tried operating on 73kHz during the late morning before, but this may favour propagation somewhere! Any listener reports would always be welcome. Hope to see you later, Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18637 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2000 16:43:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Mar 2000 16:43:40 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YX1x-0005De-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 16:33:49 +0000 Received: from imo16.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YX1w-0005DW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 16:33:48 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo16.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id l.74.23d2007 (9819) for ; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 11:33:01 -0500 (EST) From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <74.23d2007.260cf2bc@aol.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 11:33:00 EST Subject: Re: LF: GW F-s versus Wx parametres To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 70 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: As a broadcast engineer, I have had opportunities to observe apparent ground conductivity changes with temperature, and over at least some types of soil, there does appear to be a fairly decent correlation (if not exactly huge, under temperate conditions) at mediumwave. The "Influence of Atmospheric Humidity on Low-Frequency Radio Ground Waves" article, however, is one which caused a bit of a fuss when it first appeared over here in The LOWDOWN. It invokes a new cause, without any hypothesis for a working mechanism, for an effect that is already quite easy to explain. One might note that some of the numbers in the article have pre-corrections applied that involve precisely the variables whose effects are supposedly being demonstrated. Of course a "correlation" will be found when one does that! Furthermore, the atmospheric humidity values are not known over the paths to the different stations whose signals are being measured...only near the receiving site. It is not valid to assume the humidity is the same over such a wide geographical area. (Nor is it legitimate to assume the radiated power of each station remains constant, but that's another matter.) If one disregards the pseudomathematical circular reasoning and looks only at raw signal voltages, the only legitimate inference is that humidity levels at the receiving site have an effect on the terminal voltage at the receiving antenna--which is exactly what one would expect of an electrically short vertical atop an unprotected insulator, feeding a high impedance voltmeter. In short, the data are meaningless. For the experiment to prove the author's contentions, conditions over the signal paths would need to be known to at least some extent, the field strength would need to be measured with an environmentally protected active whip antenna or loop antenna, the transmitter parameters or transmit antenna current would need to be included, and the measured field intensities would need to be presented without any sort of doctoring. In the years since the article's first publication, this followup has not been forthcoming. 73, John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6057 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2000 18:06:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Mar 2000 18:06:07 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YYMH-00060U-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 17:58:53 +0000 Received: from cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.174]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YYMG-00060P-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 17:58:52 +0000 Received: from modem-33.argonath.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.124.33] helo=lvm) by cmailg4.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12YYM5-0003Dv-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 17:58:41 +0000 Message-ID: <000201bf95ba$aa60f5c0$217c883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. LF QSO Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 17:58:26 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Valerio,
Thanks for your mail of 23/3/00.Had to be away from home all day yesterday so could not set up schedule.Will look for you tonight DFCW at about 2100 If no contact will try again at 0900 on25/03.Hope this OK.Best Wishes es 73 Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8167 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2000 18:32:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Mar 2000 18:32:58 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YYme-0006Hh-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 18:26:08 +0000 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YYmc-0006HW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 18:26:06 +0000 Received: from as24-s15-145-5.cwci.net ([195.44.145.5] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YYmQ-0001DN-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 18:25:55 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38DA76BF.FFB7D027@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:55:43 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: QRSS Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Is the computer generated qrss send/receive mode recognised for DXCC purposes, also where does xband qso's fit in. For those seeking glory there could be a disappointment. G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17186 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2000 18:33:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Mar 2000 18:33:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YYmd-0006Hf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 18:26:07 +0000 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YYma-0006HV-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 18:26:05 +0000 Received: from as24-s15-145-5.cwci.net ([195.44.145.5] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YYmO-0001DI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 18:25:52 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38DA754A.7DDA731A@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:49:30 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz Cross - band QSO's References: <11119.200003231501@gemini> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: James Moritz wrote: > Dear LF group, > Sent CQ's on 71.81 for cross-band QSO's from 2030 - 2250 > last night, and from 0600 - 0815 this morning, but no replies that I > could detect. Did see G4GVC on 71.7 or therabouts, with a just- > about audible QRSS signal. Also saw G3AQC and DF6NM on > 137.7. The noise level on 136kHz seemed to rise quite sharply > after about 2200, and fall quite sharply at about 0730. > > I will be sticking to my 71.81kHz 'channel' for the time being; the > balance of response has been in favour of this, especially since > 71.82 is already being used by G3XTZ! Of course, I can always > use a different frequency if requested, no problem. > > In response to some of Mal's points, I was using a Maplin MOSFET > audio amp as a PA until recently - it produced about 100W > perfectly reliably, but I had to modify it to increase slew rate in > order to get full output on 136, and also improve the heatsinking; it > wasn't very efficient, requiring well over 200W DC input. > > As for 120ft verticals, well, yes please! > > Using the same, small, antenna as usual, my best DX QSO has > been OH1TN with normal CW on 136 kHz, but I have not managed > to reach him yet on 73kHz using QRSS CW.In theory, a given > antenna ought to be about 6dB less efficient on 73kHz compared to > 136kHz, and the natural noise level is higher by about 6dB too, so > DX contacts are unlikely ever to be easier on the lower band, in > spite of reduced ground wave losses. Certainly, the stations local > to me are much weaker signals on 73kHz than they are on 136kHz. > But the special circumstances on 73kHz at the moment are that the > noise level in the UK is extremely high due to the Rugby > transmitter, whereas in Europe this is not so much of a problem, > judging by the spectrogram screen shots that have been posted. > Because of this, it is sometimes easier to receive a 73kHz signal > outside the UK than it is over a short distance. I don't see why > ionospheric propagation should not play a part on 73kHz; obviously > there has not been much opportunity to investigate this. > > I had a nice cross-band QSO with PA0SE last time Rugby was off > the air, using normal CW; I think we both gave each other 559 or > 569 reports - copy was certainly no problem. It would be good if > Mal could activate his GI3KEV station for the next 'first Tuesday' - > assuming of course that Rugby does go off air again, G - GI cross- > band QSO's ought to be quite possible with normal CW, as > possibly other countries too. Recently some are getting carried away with a mathematical/theory approach instead of getting out into the field and putting the theory into practice. You will notice a big difference in REALITY. I have noticed in every case of theory observations put forward recently that the conclusion is ALWAYS, could be anything between 6 db and 10 db out !!!!!!!! Perhaps some do not realise the significance. It means that in reality the sums could be out be KILOWATTS. IE 100 watts or maybe 400 watts(6db) or maybe 1KW (10db). Theory/mathematics puts one in the parking area but in REALITY it is the practicality of the idea that achieves the object. Get outside, get the tower and antenna up in the air and check your results. Small gardens are no excuse, a 100 ft vertical takes up very little space, and gives the neighbours something to talk about. I do not intend to work xband 73/136 khz from GI or elswhere. If I was sufficiently interested I would get a NOV for 73 and with my antenna systems and normal CW I would try to achieve some new records. If the band was an International allocation I would be interested . At times when I have listened on 73 khz, I use my 160m inv L antenna 80 ft vertical and 250 ft horizontal resonated for 73 khz, this is a separate antenna on a different tower from my 100 ft system for 136 khz. The signals heard on 73 khz are very strong s5 to s9 normally, so I cannot understand why qrss is necessary. Although the Rugby tx is strong here, it does not have any splatter and the 73 khz band is even quiter than 136 khz. G3KEV > > I think it's important we all do as much with 73kHz as possible in > the time there is available - after all, if we ever try to get new > bands allocated, or stop existing ones going to other users, we > won't get much sympathy from the powers-that-be if they have the > impression the bandwidth won't be utilised. Perhaps a cross-band, > QRSS contact is not ideal as a form of communications, but it is a > lot more interesting and challenging than nothing. > > I intend to be QRV on 73kHz again on Friday night and over the > weekend; hope to see you there. > > Cheers, Jim Moritz > 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23909 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2000 22:17:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Mar 2000 22:17:44 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YcGe-0008Eg-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 22:09:20 +0000 Received: from smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.157]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YcGc-0008Eb-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 22:09:19 +0000 Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-123-38.bellatlantic.net [151.200.123.38]) by smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA24110; Fri, 24 Mar 2000 17:08:53 -0500 (EST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38DBE87C.6ED533EB@bellatlantic.net> Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 17:13:17 -0500 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Mitch Powell" , "lf-amrad" Cc: "Rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: 650 kM with just a wire on the ground... References: <20000324001436.FUJT1266.immta1@claven.fanshawec.on.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Mitch, You now need to rent a new holiday QTH even closer to the North Pole :-) Congratulations and keep up the good work 73 Andre' N4ICK ********************************************** Mitch Powell wrote: > GE Andre: > Travelled North of London to rural QTH, at 44:20N 81:11W. > Took along trusty R8, HB preamps, HB SCAF filter and a bit > of wire, and Spectrogram. > Within one hour had setup eqpt. and installed 750 foot long wire, > which lay on the pasture, across a creek (actually in the water > at midpoint !)and grounded with a 500 ohm resistor and a one > meter long copper pipe. It was on the ground for the entire length > and directed within a few degrees of your QTH. > Switched on - and instant copy - as seen on the 'gram. > Gram 1 - 3pm22nd shows WA2XTF/12 very well and a trace of > WA2XTF/6, > Gram 2 - 345pm shows both stations after a bit of tuning, and > > Gram3 - 23-7AM shows both stations in the early morning . > > WA2XTF/12 - readable nearly 24 hours, with the only exception near > sunset until 8-9 in the evening. > WA2XTF/6 not solid during the latter part of the day ( as shown ) > but very solid all through the night until early morning. > > I am attaching the three jpgs, for your viewing and also an htm file with > the "official" distance and QTH information. > 73 > Mitch VE3OT From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14400 invoked from network); 25 Mar 2000 11:14:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 Mar 2000 11:14:33 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YoLu-0006Cl-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 11:03:34 +0000 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YoLr-00066V-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 11:03:31 +0000 Received: from [195.44.220.131] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YoLQ-000205-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 11:03:05 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38DBBCA4.6313B929@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 19:06:12 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: GW F-s versus Wx parametres References: <74.23d2007.260cf2bc@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: WarmSpgs@aol.com wrote: > As a broadcast engineer, I have had opportunities to observe apparent > ground conductivity changes with temperature, and over at least some types of > soil, there does appear to be a fairly decent correlation (if not exactly > huge, under temperate conditions) at mediumwave. > The "Influence of Atmospheric Humidity on Low-Frequency Radio Ground > Waves" article, however, is one which caused a bit of a fuss when it first > appeared over here in The LOWDOWN. It invokes a new cause, without any > hypothesis for a working mechanism, for an effect that is already quite easy > to explain. > One might note that some of the numbers in the article have > pre-corrections applied that involve precisely the variables whose effects > are supposedly being demonstrated. Of course a "correlation" will be found > when one does that! > Furthermore, the atmospheric humidity values are not known over the > paths to the different stations whose signals are being measured...only near > the receiving site. It is not valid to assume the humidity is the same over > such a wide geographical area. (Nor is it legitimate to assume the radiated > power of each station remains constant, but that's another matter.) > If one disregards the pseudomathematical circular reasoning and looks > only at raw signal voltages, the only legitimate inference is that humidity > levels at the receiving site have an effect on the terminal voltage at the > receiving antenna--which is exactly what one would expect of an electrically > short vertical atop an unprotected insulator, feeding a high impedance > voltmeter. > In short, the data are meaningless. > For the experiment to prove the author's contentions, conditions over > the signal paths would need to be known to at least some extent, the field > strength would need to be measured with an environmentally protected active > whip antenna or loop antenna, the transmitter parameters or transmit antenna > current would need to be included, and the measured field intensities would > need to be presented without any sort of doctoring. In the years since the > article's first publication, this followup has not been forthcoming. > > 73, > John This makes sense and all the recent theory/mathematical supposition about the subject is a nonsense, especially about measuring TX power output at the remote RX site. The recent observations from G3LDO about watching out because YOUR POWER output can be calculated, is totally misleading. Is he concerned that someone might gain an advantage by running an extra few m/watts. Each and every radio station operational, especially on LF has a totally different set of circumstances, not least local environment, coastal, inland, flat and wet, mountainous etc, local temperature variations, path to rx station. Why are so many concerned about this aspect instead of getting up a good high resonant antenna, a good radial /ground system and fire up and get some practical results. All the theory/mathematics and papers about the subject have been written over the past 80 years and just need browsing if one needs information. Why re- invent the wheel? It is obvious on the 136 khz band who has the best signals, those with HB purpose built transmitters, and those who put some effort into antennas, and radial systems. de G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2296 invoked from network); 25 Mar 2000 14:21:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 Mar 2000 14:21:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YrJU-0007fe-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 14:13:16 +0000 Received: from disp.mindef.nl ([62.200.204.66] helo=u05.mindef.nl) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YrJT-0007fW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 14:13:15 +0000 Received: from co.disp.mindef.nl (dial-101.pop2.mld.disp.net [62.200.207.101]) by u05.mindef.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with ESMTP id AAAB5E for ; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 15:12:33 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38DCC80E.86DAFC1B@co.disp.mindef.nl> Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 15:07:13 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "J.M. Valstar" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [nl]C-CCK-MCD QXW07201 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: nl,de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "RSGB LF Group" Subject: LF: M0BMU on 71.8 kHz Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Listening report Last night, (Friday) I saw a good spectogram picture (M for sure, almost O) of M0BMU on my screen. Time abt 23:05 gmt, calling CQ several times (Crossband) in SCW. I am not qrv very often last months; but it was my first activity I saw/heard on the 71kHz band Also noticed OK1FIG again with a great "O" signal also in SCW. Regards to all Jaap/ pa3guc jo33ei From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17074 invoked from network); 25 Mar 2000 15:33:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 Mar 2000 15:33:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YsSp-0008HP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 15:27:00 +0000 Received: from ewey-rwcmta.excite.com ([198.3.99.191] helo=ewey.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12YsSo-0008HK-00 for RSGB_LF_GROUP@BLACKSHEEP.ORG; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 15:26:59 +0000 Received: from bubbles.excite.com ([199.172.153.29]) by kuku.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000325152601.FSWN25762.kuku.excite.com@bubbles.excite.com> for ; Sat, 25 Mar 2000 07:26:01 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <11650856.953997961364.JavaMail.imail@bubbles.excite.com> Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 07:26:01 -0800 (PST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "john sexton" To: RSGB_LF_GROUP@BLACKSHEEP.ORG Subject: LF: Re: 73kHz listener reports MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 62.7.169.107 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, The following reports are copied from my log of 71.8 kHz +/- for the last two nights, from 19.00 till 21.00. There was a very high noise floor, which may be the reason for the somewhat lower S levels reported than on earlier occasions. S meter readings were difficult because of the high noise level, and instead I have used the scale of Signal Strengths from the RSGB handbook. Nothing was heard of G3WSC from Crawley, nor from G0MRF. Call Time Date RST Remark G3GRO 20.00 23.3.00 5,3,9 calling CQ ------------------------------------------------------------------ G3LDO 19.00 24.3.00 5,3,9 calling CQ M0BMU 19.35 24.3.00 5,3,9 start of QSO with LDO G3XDV 19.45 24.3.00 5,2,9 calling CQ G3LDO 20.15 24.3.00 O QRSS very clear G3GRO 20.59 24.3.00 O QRSS equal strength to LDO John, G4CNN, IO91ML. Receiver: AOR 7030. Antenna: G3LNP loop (East-West) tuned for 136 kHz. _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22476 invoked from network); 26 Mar 2000 06:58:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 26 Mar 2000 06:58:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Z6qE-0007R8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 07:48:06 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from ds9.sci.fi ([195.74.0.54]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Z6qC-0007R3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 07:48:05 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from default (MMMDCCLIX.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.164.159]) by ds9.sci.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id JAA15282 for ; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 09:47:58 +0300 (EET DST) Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000326094805.00814e00@pop.saunalahti.fi> X-Sender: vaiski1@pop.saunalahti.fi (Unverified) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2000 09:48:05 +0300 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: LF: Signal Strength Measurements by OH2LX MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Measurements of UK Decca's and some other stations : ---------------------------------------------------------- Day ------------------ 21Mar 22Mar 23Mar 24Mar 25Mar TUE WED THU FRI SAT Time, UTC ------------ 2130- 2120- 2120- 2130- 2140- ---------------------------------------------------------- kHz Ch *d,km AZI* *Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW* ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.8 (6C), 1435, 280, -121 -113 -114 -105 -113 ---------------------------------------------------------- 126.7 (2A), 1565, 269, -110 -110 -111 -106 -108 ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.5 (8E), 1766, 276, -108 -110 -108 -104 -106 ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.0 (3B), 1871, 257, -114 -109 -123 -105 -111 ---------------------------------------------------------- 127.5 (5B), 1890, 247, -116 -117 -110 -102 -110 ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.2 (7D), 2060, 267, -118 -119 -110 -102 -110 ---------------------------------------------------------- 126.4 (1B), 2282, 253, -114 -120 -117 -121 -113 ---------------------------------------------------------- kHz Ch *d,km AZI* *Indicated ESH2 input, dBmW* ---------------------------------------------------------- 128.93 ref, 1553, 228, -92 -83 -88 -87 -89 ---------------------------------------------------------- 138.83 ref, 1221, 226, -83 -79 -81 -81 -83 ---------------------------------------------------------- 135.8 SXV 2490, 182, -109 -114 -112 -109 -105 ---------------------------------------------------------- 137.0 CFH* 5750, 295, Nil Nil Nil Nil Nil ---------------------------------------------------------- * CFH heard on the 21st & 24th after 22z, up to -127 dBmW ---------------------------------------------------------- 20Mar 2034: SM6PXJ -111..-109(f): 2056: -117..-116 20Mar 2046: MM0ALM -127; 2058: -123; 2108: -120..-119 20Mar 2107: OH7OL -124..-122 22Mar 2139: SM6PXJ -110..-112; 2142: -111..-109 24Mar 2137: OH1TN -113 24Mar 2138: G3KEV -126; 2203: -126; 2209: -126 25Mar 2213: OH7OL -124 ---------------------------------------------------------- (R&S ESH2/---- 10m coax---/1:10/---15m wire-----): Noise level with antenna: with 200Hz IF BandWidth: -26..-21 dB(uV), -133..-128dBmW (varies w qrm etc) ---------------------------------------------------------- End of message of 26 Mar 2000, 0650 UTC, from OH2LX ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22358 invoked from network); 26 Mar 2000 18:59:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 26 Mar 2000 18:59:42 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZI5G-0004xe-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 19:48:22 +0100 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZI5F-0004xZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 19:48:21 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id TAA05506 for ; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 19:48:09 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000032618453168199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2000 18:45:31 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: Idee fixe Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit I needed to change the resonance of my 73kHz antenna tuning arrangement to be resonant on 136kHz for cross band contacts. The tuning arrangement here is a sort of three-stage booster, comprising a commercial variometer ( probably for about 500kHz) followed by the 136kHz coil then the 73kHz coil, all in series. I felt that all I would have to do would be to short out the 73kHz coil. I knew that the voltage at the top of the coil was high (it will arc a 15mm gap) so I started looking for suitable relay. In spite of good advice on the reflector from Rik and Jim (M0BMU) I still pressed on with the original idea. > Ohm input series tuning can be used (an additional series capacitor between > RX and loading coil). This capacitor can be short-circuited to switch from 136 to 72kHz. A simple > low-voltage relais will do. After a lot of spectacular failures the message finally sunk in. I fitted a series receiver type airspaced capacitor between the first stage of the coil where the RF voltage is relatively low. It is shorted out on transmit by the high voltage relay sent to me by Andy, G4JNT. This arrangement has the advantage that it can be tuned up accurately for maximum signal on 136kHz, giving me at least 2 S points extra gain compared with when it is not tuned. -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25153 invoked from network); 26 Mar 2000 21:16:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 26 Mar 2000 21:16:51 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZKJF-00066j-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 22:10:57 +0100 Received: from sand4.global.net.uk ([195.147.246.106]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZKJE-00066e-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 22:10:56 +0100 Received: from p2cs04a07.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.228.45] helo=howett) by sand4.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12ZKKq-00004z-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 26 Mar 2000 22:12:36 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Comments: Authenticated sender is From: howett@mail.globalnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2000 22:11:11 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: conditions 26.03.00 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.54) Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, I was listening QRSs this morning 0630 - 0730, band seemed to be quieter than I've ever seen before at this QTH. I don't know whether this was due to local conditions, or whether this was a general effect. Did anyone else notice? Saw OK1FIG calling CQ at 0633,(this must be my longest distance heard yet!) and ON4ZK at 0703. Both "O" signals. By 0730 noise was well up, so gave in and repaired to garden! Regards Paul G4MD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29685 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 08:10:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 08:10:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZUQt-00033F-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 08:59:31 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZUQs-00033A-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 08:59:30 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id JAA77534 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:59:19 +0200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000327095603.2d4f2c2e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:56:03 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: QRSS In-reply-to: <38DA76BF.FFB7D027@netscapeonline.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 19:55 23/03/00 +0000, you wrote: >Is the computer generated qrss send/receive mode recognised for DXCC >purposes, also where does xband qso's fit in. For those seeking glory >there could be a disappointment. >G3KEV > Being very close to applying my 136kHz DXCC (only 82 more DXCC countries needed) I was also very worried about this. Although QRSS is CW and as far as I know nothing is said about the transmitting speed, nor about what kind of 'filtering' is allowed, there might be an 'apparatsik' at the DXCC board who could object my application. I almost got very depressed by this thought but then I reminded that I started with LF to do something completely new : to learn something about new techniques and proagation, far away from the '599 73' QSOs you can easily have on HF (and with some luck get your DXCC within a week). So after all I think I can live with the knowledge that I will probably never get my 136kHz DXCC. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23526 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 08:41:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 08:41:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZUsD-0003LX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:27:45 +0100 Received: from apollo.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.125]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZUsB-0003LS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:27:43 +0100 Received: from pc171.geog.le.ac.uk ([143.210.25.171] helo=kate) by apollo.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.03 #1) id 12ZUs0-0005cO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:27:32 +0100 From: "kate moore" To: "lfgroup" Subject: LF: New GW on 136 Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:21:04 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Gave another station his first LF QSO on Saturday:- Look out for GW4HXO on 136kHz. Mike is located near St. Davids in West Wales. He was fairly weak (559) when I worked him, but was only running 10W from a single FET into a 200ft dipole with the feeder strapped. I heard him working other stations, including GI3PDN, so he was doing quite well for his first session. Apparently he has a good site, close to the sea. Regards John G4GVC From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21519 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 09:54:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 09:54:07 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZW6l-00043B-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 10:46:51 +0100 Received: from ds-img-7.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.153] helo=spdmbaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZW6k-000436-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 10:46:50 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmbaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id EAA22235 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 04:46:08 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 04:45:38 -0500 From: "Holger 'Geri', DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: QRSS To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003270445_MC2-9EB3-8819@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hey, guys, is QRSS really computer generated? Wow, thats the reason all your signals are keyed thah exactly! I allways sit here and key down (to make things easier with my left foot) and slowly count to 15 when I send a dot! Same on receive! I was never sure about the real advantage of Slow CW but I thought some people can't give or receive faster than that so thats why I used it! ;-) 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) > >At 19:55 23/03/00 +0000, you wrote: >Is the computer generated qrss send/receive mode recognised for DXCC >purposes, also where does xband qso's fit in. For those seeking glory >there could be a disappointment. >G3KEV > >Being very close to applying my 136kHz DXCC (only 82 more DXCC countries >needed) I was also very worried about this. Although QRSS is CW and as far >as I know nothing is said about the transmitting speed, nor about what kind >of 'filtering' is allowed, there might be an 'apparatsik' at the DXCC board >who could object my application. >I almost got very depressed by this thought but then I reminded that I >started with LF to do something completely new : to learn something about >new techniques and proagation, far away from the '599 73' QSOs you can >easily have on HF (and with some luck get your DXCC within a week). >So after all I think I can live with the knowledge that I will probably >never get my 136kHz DXCC.< >73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5239 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 11:22:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 11:22:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZXTu-0004rp-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:14:50 +0100 Received: from tk1.ihug.co.nz ([203.29.160.13] helo=smtp1.ihug.co.nz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZXTq-0004rk-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:14:47 +0100 Received: from tractorb (p43-max10.chc.ihug.co.nz [209.79.136.107]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id XAA04047 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 23:14:28 +1200 Message-ID: <00de01bf97dd$48264f20$6b884fd1@tractorb> From: "Dave Brown" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3.0.1.16.20000327095603.2d4f2c2e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Subject: Re: LF: QRSS Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 23:12:01 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: ON7YD expounded, ***there might be an 'apparatsik' at the DXCC board*** Hi Rik and others, Any chance of a free translation of that delightful sounding word 'apparatsik'? My best guess would be 'glory seeking ex HF bands appliance operator'?? But I may be wrong. 73 Dave, ZL3FJ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14546 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 11:22:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 11:22:15 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZXVK-0004s3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:16:18 +0100 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZXVJ-0004ry-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:16:17 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12ZXVQ-0002BU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:16:26 +0100 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:11:55 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:08:55 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: QRSS In-reply-to: <200003270445_MC2-9EB3-8819@compuserve.com> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Geri, DK8KW wrote (with a smile): > is QRSS really computer generated? Wow, thats the reason all your signals > are keyed thah exactly! I allways sit here and key down (to make things > easier with my left foot) and slowly count to 15 when I send a dot! Same > on receive! I was never sure about the real advantage of Slow CW but I > thought some people can't give or receive faster than that so thats why I > used it! BUT, I remember when Peter Bobeck first used QRSS with DA0LF. He was heard by several UK stations before we had the band here. He used 10s dot length, and the early version of Spectrogram would fill the screen every 8 seconds or so. I well remember using a stop watch to time each element and then write it down as dots and dashes in order to read it!! I also know of at least one LFer who has sent QRSS manually. My QRSS is sent using a memory keyer with many megohms switched in series with the timing capacitor - is that computer generated? Also of interest is that I can now read (audible) QRSS by ear if I concentrate. It took about a year to get used to doing it but it's now easy. There is very little practical advantage in this of course (perhaps a dB over conventional speeds, and rather more in high QRN) but it is interesting that the brain can be trained to do it. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6809 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 11:57:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 11:57:16 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZY3O-0005Gu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:51:30 +0100 Received: from hermes.iol.cz ([194.228.2.36]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZY3N-0005Gp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:51:29 +0100 Received: from dell1.cz.gmc.net ([194.228.225.18]) by hermes.iol.cz (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 631-66640U65000L65000S0V35) with ESMTP id cz for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:50:30 +0200 Received: from p (p.maly.cz.gmc.net [192.168.1.35]) by dell1.cz.gmc.net with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2650.21) id HX4CDBX7; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:50:53 +0200 Message-ID: <020e01bf97e2$b4854860$2301a8c0@maly.cz.gmc.net> From: "Petr Maly" To: "136 group" Subject: LF: Weekend report Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:50:53 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello LFers All the stations I worked you can find on: www.mujweb.cz/www/ok1fig/log_lf.txt and I recorded some new sounds, see: www.mujweb.cz/www/ok1fig/lfsounds.htm This time worked for the first time I and HB9 on normal CW. 73, Petr, OK1FIG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25644 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 12:08:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 12:08:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZYEQ-0005PL-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:02:54 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZYEP-0005Nk-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:02:53 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id OAA47526 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:02:40 +0200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000327135924.2d4fe5ae@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:59:24 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: QRSS In-reply-to: <00de01bf97dd$48264f20$6b884fd1@tractorb> References: <3.0.1.16.20000327095603.2d4f2c2e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 23:12 27/03/00 +1200, you wrote: >Any chance of a free translation of that delightful sounding word >'apparatsik'? I wasn't aware that the word is not known in English. It has Russian origin (as far as I know) and was used for high ranked party member taking decisions without being influenced by any practical knowlegde about the things they were deciding about. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1404 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 12:33:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 12:33:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZYch-0005ZP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:27:59 +0100 Received: from tungsten.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.81]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZYch-0005ZJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:27:59 +0100 Received: from [213.1.190.116] (helo=default) by tungsten.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12ZYcF-0005nh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:27:31 +0100 Message-ID: <001201bf97e6$dc4a6ac0$2760063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: DX Cluster spots from DB0MBX via Wolf DL1SAN Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 11:31:32 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Wolf went /P this weekend but all he could hear was a local farmer's ventilator fan-motor on a nearby pig unit, so DB0MBX is missing his usual comprehensive log. 137.0 OK1FIG 26-Mar-2000 0918Z cq 136.8 I5TGC 25-Mar-2000 2126Z 569<>569 136.8 OK1FIG 25-Mar-2000 1957Z 569 in jn65 137.0 OK1FIG 25-Mar-2000 1318Z 137.0 OK1FIG 25-Mar-2000 0937Z cq cq 136.9 OK1FIG 25-Mar-2000 0653Z CQ 599 136.8 OK1FIG 24-Mar-2000 2122Z 569 400w ant marconi 136.9 OK1FIG 24-Mar-2000 2106Z 569 qso dk1 136.9 OK1FIG 24-Mar-2000 2053Z CQ 579 137.6 OK1FIG 24-Mar-2000 2029Z 549 137.7 I5TGC 24-Mar-2000 2029Z 569 137.6 OK1FIG 24-Mar-2000 2015Z Visual-CW 137.0 OK1FIG 24-Mar-2000 1939Z 539 137.0 OK1FIG 24-Mar-2000 1926Z CQ vy slow CW...569 137.0 OK1FIG 24-Mar-2000 1917Z CQ 579 on R5 vertical... 137.0 OK1FIG 24-Mar-2000 1915Z cq cq 135.0 TE1ST 21-Mar-2000 2047Z filtertest 137.7 I5TGC 21-Mar-2000 2033Z 569 slow cw 136.5 DJ9IE 20-Mar-2000 1632Z 439 cq 73 de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1417 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 12:33:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 12:33:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZYck-0005ZV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:28:02 +0100 Received: from tungsten.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.81]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZYcj-0005ZK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:28:01 +0100 Received: from [213.1.190.116] (helo=default) by tungsten.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 12ZYcG-0005nh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:27:33 +0100 Message-ID: <001301bf97e6$dd1b7660$2760063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Cluster spots (lack of) GB7DXM for 25/26th Mar Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:16:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all I am afraid I have had trouble accessing my local cluster again. When I did get the list for 136kHz it only contained 3 spots for Petr OK1FIG which are contained in the list from Wolf posted previously My own log of QRS signals as follows. Sat. 25th March 0515z OK1FIG 137.695kHz CQ This was a very weak signal from Petr, with the elements broken up by crashes of noise. It would rate an 'M' report I was not sure at the time of the call. 0531 Weak reply (?) I think to Petr's CQ about 5Hz higher in frequency 0536 Another weak signal on 137.730kHz 0540 OK1FIG CQ now much stronger and fully 'O' which he seemed to retain for the rest of the day, CQs logged at 0545,0558,0730 (on 137.720) 0818 "BM......" "? K X" ...someone calling Jim for cross-band ?? 0828 "G3LDO DK8....."washed out by nearby call from ON4ZK. Not Gaspard's fault just one of the failings of Mike Cook's FFTDSP4 now on this mode. With so much activity it is not selective enough. Traces would be ok on Spectrogram. 0859 "R R DK8KW SK" so Geri made the the QSO with Peter. 0903 G3AQC CQ DFCW 0910 "ND M U ZPV UR O O O TU SK" I have pored over this trace to work out who Valerio was working, I wondered whether I had missed a dot in the noise and it was a cross-band with Jim. I was quite interested as this is the first trace I have seen from Valerio. 0950 DF6NM "CQ X " fully 'O' here 1015 DJ5AO calling IK5ZPV 1228 DF6ZR calling OK1FIG "?" from Petr then an 'O' report This mornings logging goes again to show that FFTDSP4 is some dBs short of the performance of Spectrogram on weak signals. It is also less robust in its response to noise bursts.(at least with the setting I am using) Sunday 26th Mar. 0532 OK1FIG CQ 'O' here also at 0545,0600,0613z 0627 OK1FIG CQ now much stronger . Also 0637,0646 0706 ON4ZK CQ 0835 G3XDV CQ 1127 "...YA AO Z GM O O O K" probably DJ5AO (??) Several DFCW signals were seen also later in the day. It was interesting to note how Petr OK1FIG started with a relatively weak signal at around 0500z both days and how the stringth inceased over the next hour or two. He was very consistant all weekend. Readable at 'O' all day on spectrogram. 73 de Alan G3NYK JO02PB Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24965 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 13:34:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 13:34:01 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZZXv-00068C-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:27:07 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZZXu-000687-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:27:06 +0100 Received: from as31-s16-147-109.cwci.net ([195.44.147.109] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZZXh-0002Qn-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:26:54 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38DF4EB3.C0F41075@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:06:11 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: OH2LX REPORTS Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thanks Vaino for your weekly reports. I am sure these are appreciated by all as an indication of their signal at your qth. I notice that my signal measurements are very consistant with you. The installation here has not been altered for a long time, same antenna, and same tx. It works very well and needs very little maintainence. I notice very little daily variation or fluctuations in my antenna and ground radial system, regardless of the wx. It appears very stable. The antenna consists of 3 x inv L systems, each L is 32 metres vertical and each one an 80 metre horiz top section. All insulators are polysterene marine grade. Base loaded inductor to resonate the antenna approx 1 Mh and a small inductor in series at the coax end to match the system to 50 ohms to the TX/RX. The antenna and matching network(directly underneath) are located about 50 metres from the shack. The feed to the shack is 50 ohms coax. QTH is on top of clay, on the North side of the town of Scarborough with a river 100 metres from my North boundary and the sea about 3 k/metres East. G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15582 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 13:34:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 13:34:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZZXx-00068J-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:27:09 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZZXx-00068E-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:27:09 +0100 Received: from as31-s16-147-109.cwci.net ([195.44.147.109] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZZXl-0002Qr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 13:26:58 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38DF533C.59029DAB@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 12:25:33 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: 136 BAND ACTY Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The weekend was reasonably busy, apart from a lot of G stations heard, worked HB9DCE, OK1FIG, Friday and Saturday, Petr was calling cq a lot of the time with no replies. SM6PXJ was a loud signal daytime Saturday. Some DL and ON acty and heard GW4HXO testing. Band condx good with some qrn/rain static of Sunday. Heard G3YXM testing his new tx - good signal, with the odd flash in the sky, possibly another insulator gone!!!!! de G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4066 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 14:01:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 14:01:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZZxV-0006PG-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:53:33 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZZxU-0006PB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:53:32 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12ZZuZ-00029i-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:50:31 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <18675.200003271358@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 14:59:15 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Weekend activity X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, Friday night was a busy one on 73kHz, had normal CW QSO's with G3LDO, G0MRF and slow CW to G3GRO, a new station for me on the band. Also heard G3XDV working G3LDO with normal CW, and saw good QRSS signals from G4GVC. Didn't hear anything from the Crawley club - I assume this didn't come off, since G3GRO was using his own call. On Saturday morning I had an eventful QRSS cross-band QSO with IK5ZPV - Valerio could read my signals from about 0700, but I could not copy his until about 0745. Then, as is something of a hazard with cross-band operation, another station came up on almost exactly the same frequency as 'ZPV, making copy very difficult. So I asked Valerio to QSY 10Hz, which he did, and by the end of the QSO around 0915 we were giving each other 'O' reports - which goes to show that it is possible to communicate useful amounts of information with QRSS, even if it is a bit slow! While working IK5ZPV and afterwards, also saw DFCW from DF6NM again (M), and QRSS from OK1FIG (O), for the first time. In general, conditions on 137.7 improved later in the morning, with less noise and stronger signals. Also did some work on my field strength measurement project, and I have now breadboarded a ferrite rod antenna and preamp, with which I was able to copy PA0SE and DJ9IE on the selective voltmeter on Sunday afternoon, so sensitivity should be OK. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16790 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 15:36:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 15:36:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZbSC-0007Ek-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:29:20 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from fm215.facility.pipex.com ([194.131.104.225]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZbSB-0007Ef-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:29:20 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from isis (userk115.uk.uudial.com [194.69.100.199]) by fm215.facility.pipex.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA28534 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:28:31 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.20000327155549.0099fda0@mail.pncl.co.uk> X-Sender: blanch@mail.pncl.co.uk (Unverified) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:27:46 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Walter Blanchard" Subject: LF: Decca Tx MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The UK Decca Navigator transmitters shut down for public use this weekend. Most sites have already been sold for other purposes but a few will remain in working order for a few months. I might be able to get permission for an interested group to operate using one of these sites for a limited period during May/June/July. The likeliest one has a 300 ft mast; an extensive ground plane and an ATU coil that could probably be tuned to 136 kHz. Radiation efficiency at 127 kHz is a measured 12% so 8 watts in would provide our legal erp limit. It could also be tuned to go on 72 kHz - it already transmits at 71 kHz. Only a group willing to take on legal responsibility for damage; pay the electricity bill, etc would be authorised. There would be a fair bit of effort needed to retune everything - no engineering support is offered. The excuse might be it's a commemorative station organised to mark the passing of the Decca Navigator system. Special callsign perhaps. Anyone interested? Serious applications only PLEASE. Walter G3JKV. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28817 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 16:26:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 16:26:16 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZcAk-0007fN-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 17:15:22 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZcAj-0007fI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 17:15:21 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12Zc7o-0005rF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 17:12:20 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3175.200003271620@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 17:21:04 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Decca TX sites X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, I would like to put my name forward as available for collaborative efforts to activate Decca sites, as suggested by G3JKV. Where would the likely QTH be? Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 556 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 18:08:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 18:08:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZdXg-0008TW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 18:43:08 +0100 Received: from [199.172.152.110] (helo=gigi.excite.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZdXf-0008TP-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 18:43:07 +0100 Received: from magic.excite.com ([199.172.148.161]) by bucky.excite.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP id <20000327174154.ZZAL1508.bucky.excite.com@magic.excite.com> for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:41:54 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <29531415.954178914456.JavaMail.imail@magic.excite.com> Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 09:41:54 -0800 (PST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "john sexton" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: QRSS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Excite Inbox X-Sender-Ip: 62.7.181.25 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Good for you Rik! John, G4CNN _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17343 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 18:34:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 18:34:32 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zdur-00007G-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 19:07:05 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zduq-00007B-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 19:07:04 +0100 Received: from as32-s15-148-182.cwci.net ([195.44.148.182] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zdue-0001zw-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 18:06:52 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38DF94D2.15A7E281@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 17:05:22 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: QRSS References: <200003270445_MC2-9EB3-8819@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: "Holger 'Geri', DK8KW" wrote: > Hey, guys, > > is QRSS really computer generated? Wow, thats the reason all your signals > are keyed thah exactly! I allways sit here and key down (to make things > easier with my left foot) and slowly count to 15 when I send a dot! Same on > receive! I was never sure about the real advantage of Slow CW but I thought > some people can't give or receive faster than that so thats why I used it! You are probably right, it sounds more like a NOVICE BAND maybe some morse lessons would be useful. It lacks the professional 160 metres touch. LMCW(lazy mans cw) or qrss if you like is generated normally by a computer or an auto keyer. and received by a computer - the operator does not even have to have a knowledge of real or normal cw. Some operators including myself can read it aurally, and I do have a pentium computer with suitable software installed capable of sending and receiving it. I actually have been asked at times if 136 khz is a novice band!!!!!! listening to the speed of hand sent morse on the band would suggest this to be the case. There is no reason why it should be any different from 160 metres, and in fact the signals on 136 khz are better during the day than 160 metres for the same given distance. Things might improve soon when NOVICES get the 136 khz band. G3KEV > > ;-) 73 > > Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) > > > > > >At 19:55 23/03/00 +0000, you wrote: > >Is the computer generated qrss send/receive mode recognised for DXCC > >purposes, also where does xband qso's fit in. For those seeking glory > >there could be a disappointment. > >G3KEV > > > > >Being very close to applying my 136kHz DXCC (only 82 more DXCC countries > >needed) I was also very worried about this. Although QRSS is CW and as far > >as I know nothing is said about the transmitting speed, nor about what > kind > >of 'filtering' is allowed, there might be an 'apparatsik' at the DXCC > board > >who could object my application. > >I almost got very depressed by this thought but then I reminded that I > >started with LF to do something completely new : to learn something about > >new techniques and proagation, far away from the '599 73' QSOs you can > >easily have on HF (and with some luck get your DXCC within a week). > >So after all I think I can live with the knowledge that I will probably > >never get my 136kHz DXCC.< > > >73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29781 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 19:24:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 19:24:35 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zevg-0000ly-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 20:12:00 +0100 Received: from mashie.force9.net ([195.166.128.30]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zevf-0000lt-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 20:12:00 +0100 Received: (qmail 4054 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 19:12:20 -0000 Received: from ruin.servers.plus.net.uk (212.159.2.66) by mashie.force9.net with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 19:12:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 13747 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 19:11:47 -0000 Received: from 140.04-02.quay.dial.plus.net.uk (HELO main) (212.159.71.140) by ruin.servers.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 19:11:47 -0000 Message-ID: <008a01bf9821$04954f60$0600a8c0@main> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: 73 clear! Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 20:16:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear all. The Rugby transmitter is not operating on 73.3kHz tonight. 73k is nice and quiet! CU there? Dave G3YXM. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 969 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 23:15:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 23:15:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZiV3-0002jv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 00:00:45 +0100 Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com ([152.163.225.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZiV1-0002jq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 00:00:44 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo12.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v25.3.) id l.c5.35e2037 (3966) for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 17:59:56 -0500 (EST) From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 17:59:56 EST Subject: Re: LF: QRSS To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 102 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Over here, those of us with memories of the Fifties and Sixties might recall seeing it spelled "apparatchik" sometimes, so the term definitely rang a bell for me. I like your definition, Rik--much more descriptive than the stuffy "party functionary" given in my dictionary! 73, John In a message dated 3/27/00 7:06:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be writes: << I wasn't aware that the word is not known in English. It has Russian origin (as far as I know) and was used for high ranked party member taking decisions without being influenced by any practical knowledge about the things they were deciding about. >> From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 343 invoked from network); 27 Mar 2000 23:22:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Mar 2000 23:22:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Ziim-0002xH-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 00:14:56 +0100 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Ziim-0002xC-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 00:14:56 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id AAA14296 for ; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 00:14:44 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000032723122568199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 23:12:25 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: Re: LF: Decca Tx Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit from Walter Blanchard > The UK Decca Navigator transmitters shut down for public use this weekend. > Most sites have already been sold for other purposes but a few will remain in > working order for a few months. > I might be able to get permission for an interested group to operate using > one of these sites for a limited period during May/June/July. > The excuse might be it's a commemorative station organised to mark the > passing of the Decca Navigator system. Special callsign perhaps. It could also be used to mark the passing of the 73kHz NOV allocation, which ends at the end of June. I would be interesting to see what 1w erp would be like at 72kHz -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1741 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 02:10:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 02:10:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZlMh-0004We-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 03:04:19 +0100 Received: from smtp11.bellglobal.com ([204.101.251.53]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZlMg-0004WZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 03:04:18 +0100 Received: from server1 (Kingston-ppp108597.sympatico.ca [216.209.110.36]) by smtp11.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA20036 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 21:09:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00dc01bf9859$b0ddcb20$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Majordomo actions, help please Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 21:01:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Greetings All: I have been trying since late last week to Majordomo@blacksheep.org to make a deletion for me - still no action taken as of this time early Tuesday morning, utc. If anyone can get some activity out of the admin side, please ask them to look at their email requests. Thanks Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10859 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 02:16:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 02:16:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZlMU-0004WX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 03:04:06 +0100 Received: from smtp11.bellglobal.com ([204.101.251.53]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZlMS-0004WS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 03:04:05 +0100 Received: from server1 (Kingston-ppp108597.sympatico.ca [216.209.110.36]) by smtp11.bellglobal.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA19916 for ; Mon, 27 Mar 2000 21:09:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00da01bf9859$a77a3aa0$0a00a8c0@server1.ThreeLakes.ca> From: "Larry Kayser" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Decca Tx Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 20:47:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Walter: >I might be able to get permission for an interested group to operate using >one of these sites for a limited period during May/June/July. If you could hold onto one or more of them until late November just maybe there will be some major attempts at the North Atlantic from this side about then... Please do not mention on the Internet, but a site like that on the east side of the country would be a big help. Larry VA3LK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10278 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 07:23:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 07:23:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZqA1-00079b-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:11:33 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.20]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZqA0-00079W-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:11:32 +0100 Received: from alg.demon.co.uk ([194.222.171.80]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 12Zq9o-0005vr-0K for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 07:11:21 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38E05992.B83663EC@alg.demon.co.uk> Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:04:50 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Steve Rawlings" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: New GW on 136 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: John G4GVC wrote: > Gave another station his first LF QSO on Saturday:- > Look out for GW4HXO on 136kHz. Mike is located near St. Davids in West > Wales. Congratulations on providing another 'first', John. When I spoke to Mike GW4HXO on the 'phone about 3 weeks ago, he said that he was getting close to making his first LF QSO . . . . and I thought of you immediately! Another GW station getting QRV is Stu GW3XYW (near Swansea) who has operated in the past using a good-sized loop, making CW QSOs on 136 kHz into Europe with ease. He also worked Finbar for the first EI/GW QSO. Stu has recently re-configured his antenna in the form of an inverted L - about 210 ft long and 35 ft high. TX power is about 400 W. I think that the good antennas in use at these stations should make it possible for more LF operators to work their first GW on 136 kHz. Regards to all, Steve GW4ALG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22158 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 07:35:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 07:35:46 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZqNc-0007HB-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:25:36 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.38]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZqNb-0007H6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:25:35 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12ZqNQ-000GWh-0A for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 07:25:25 +0000 Message-ID: <47zgSHAMxF44Ewt9@telemetry.demon.co.uk> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:16:28 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Tom Boucher" Subject: Re: LF: QRSS In-reply-to: <38DF94D2.15A7E281@netscapeonline.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Trial Version 3.05 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In message <38DF94D2.15A7E281@netscapeonline.co.uk>, g3kev writes >........... maybe some morse lessons would be useful. No, what would be much more useful for some would be lessons in good manners on the air! For example, making sure that one does not call CQ bang on top of a QSO in progress. 73, Tom G3OLB. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1476 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 07:54:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 07:54:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZqfX-0007Pp-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:44:07 +0100 Received: from artemis.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.126]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZqfS-0007Pe-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:44:02 +0100 Received: from pc171.geog.le.ac.uk ([143.210.25.171] helo=kate) by artemis.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #2) id 12ZqfH-0005Lu-01 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:43:51 +0100 From: "kate moore" To: "lfgroup" Subject: LF: First GI-G crossband Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:37:21 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Worked GI3PDN crossband on normal speed CW at 19.30UT last night - me on 71.735kHz and Ray on 136.200kHz. My report was 229QSB, but my antenna was blowing about all over the place in the squally rain showers and Ray's receive system wasn't fully optimised for 73kHz, so the contact was fairly lengthy. Nevertheless, as well as swapping reports, Ray received my power info and confirmation that I would alert G3YXM to come up on frequency, so we managed more than the minimum QSO exchange. Dave then also worked Ray when we had signed. John G4GVC From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25992 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 07:54:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 07:54:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZqfT-0007Pn-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:44:03 +0100 Received: from artemis.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.126]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZqfS-0007Pd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:44:02 +0100 Received: from pc171.geog.le.ac.uk ([143.210.25.171] helo=kate) by artemis.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #2) id 12ZqfH-0005Lu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:43:51 +0100 From: "kate moore" To: "lfgroup" Subject: LF: Re: Decca TX Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:37:20 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Walter et al I would be certainly interested to be part of a group activating an ex-Decca site if there are enough of us to make it worthwhile. Obviously it would need careful planning and co-ordination, but it sounds like a good thing to do before the sites are lost for ever. John G4GVC From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6257 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 09:40:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 09:40:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZsL8-0008PA-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 10:31:10 +0100 Received: from ghosthost.radar.no ([194.143.115.5]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZsL4-0008P4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 10:31:08 +0100 Received: from radar.no (Magne@dhcp-66.radar.no [194.143.115.66]) by ghosthost.radar.no (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA20090 for ; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 11:30:41 +0200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38E07BC1.F60378BC@radar.no> Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 11:30:41 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Magne_M=E6hre?= X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: RADAR Software AS X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: LA QRV tonight Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi folks. Finally everything is up and running, and we'll try to be active on 136kHz tonight. Callsign: LA1K QTH: Trondheim / JP53EK Antenna: Inverted-L (of sorts) 10-13 meter vertical, 150m horiz. Power: 100W output (legal limit :-) Mode: A1A (normal + slow) Frequency: have a spur on 137.00, so we'll be a bit up or down We'll probably get on at about 1900 UTC... --Magne / la1bfa From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8088 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 09:56:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 09:56:32 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zscc-00007s-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 10:49:14 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zscb-00007n-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 10:49:13 +0100 Received: from as24-s16-146-48.cwci.net ([195.44.146.48] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZscK-0005KT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 09:48:57 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38E06CCD.CB41CBD7@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 08:26:54 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: QRSS References: <3.0.1.16.20000327095603.2d4f2c2e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik Strobbe wrote: > At 19:55 23/03/00 +0000, you wrote: > >Is the computer generated qrss send/receive mode recognised for DXCC > >purposes, also where does xband qso's fit in. For those seeking glory > >there could be a disappointment. > >G3KEV > > > > Being very close to applying my 136kHz DXCC (only 82 more DXCC countries > needed) I was also very worried about this. Although QRSS is CW and as far > as I know nothing is said about the transmitting speed, nor about what kind > of 'filtering' is allowed, there might be an 'apparatsik' at the DXCC board > who could object my application. > I almost got very depressed by this thought but then I reminded that I > started with LF to do something completely new : to learn something about > new techniques and proagation New technology !!!!!!!!!! Your grandad was listening to Long Wave Radio before you were born and was probably using a vertical antenna, perhaps an inv L, which was popular at that time and up higher than the average LF operator today. A vertical antenna takes up less than 1 metre square of space and could have unlimited height. This approach would solve all the problems for those struggling to make a qso around Europe. No need for complex mathematical solutions. LF techniques including propogation were all perfected long before we were all born. The only experiment taking place at present by some amateurs is trying to propogate a LF signal with a bamboo pole and some wet string !!!!!!! Good Luck G3KEV > , far away from the '599 73' QSOs you can > easily have on HF (and with some luck get your DXCC within a week). > So after all I think I can live with the knowledge that I will probably > never get my 136kHz DXCC. > > 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7908 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 09:57:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 09:57:16 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zsck-00007y-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 10:49:22 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zscj-00007m-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 10:49:21 +0100 Received: from as24-s16-146-48.cwci.net ([195.44.146.48] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZscI-0005KP-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 09:48:55 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38DF97B7.DBF2C770@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 17:17:43 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Decca Tx References: <4.2.0.58.20000327155549.0099fda0@mail.pncl.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Walter Blanchard wrote: > The UK Decca Navigator transmitters shut down for public use this weekend. > Most sites have already been sold for other purposes but a few will remain in > working order for a few months. > I might be able to get permission for an interested group to operate using > one of these sites for a limited period during May/June/July. > The likeliest one has a 300 ft mast; an extensive ground plane and an ATU > coil that could probably be tuned to 136 kHz. Radiation efficiency at 127 > kHz is > a measured 12% so 8 watts in would provide our legal erp limit. > It could also be tuned to go on 72 kHz - it already transmits at 71 kHz. > Only a group willing to take on legal responsibility for damage; > pay the electricity bill, etc would be authorised. > There would be a fair bit of effort needed to retune everything - no > engineering support is offered. > The excuse might be it's a commemorative station organised to mark the > passing of the Decca Navigator system. Special callsign perhaps. > Anyone interested? Serious applications only PLEASE. > Walter G3JKV. > Have a go Walter and I hope you can get a team together. Besides good RF > engineers to retune and manipulate the transmitters you will need some ACE > operators, they seem scarce on LF. De G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15990 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 15:11:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 15:11:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZxWt-00030F-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 16:03:39 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.39]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ZxWs-00030A-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 16:03:38 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from pickmere.demon.co.uk ([158.152.117.143]) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12ZxWg-000Mxl-0B for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 15:03:27 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 11:08:41 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M.J.Powell" Subject: Re: LF: QRSS References: <3.0.1.16.20000327095603.2d4f2c2e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be><38E06CCD.CB41CBD7@netscapeonline.co.uk> In-reply-to: <38E06CCD.CB41CBD7@netscapeonline.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Integrated Version 4.02 S Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: snip > A vertical >antenna takes up less than 1 metre square >of space and could have unlimited height. I live under Ringway flight path! Mike -- M.J.Powell From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20070 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 16:57:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 16:57:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zz95-0003qL-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 17:47:11 +0100 Received: from as-img-5.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.148] helo=spamgaae.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zz94-0003qD-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 17:47:10 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaae.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id LAA06602 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 11:46:28 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 11:45:26 -0500 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: QRSS To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003281146_MC2-9EEE-4C04@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >LF techniques including propogation were all perfected long before we were all >born. >The only experiment taking place at present by some amateurs is trying to >propogate a LF signal with a bamboo pole and some wet string !!!!!!! Good Luck > >G3KEV Yes, Mal, but I don't like to simply repeat what was done in Koenigswusterhausen or Nauen some 98 years but go down to the limit. I was also the crazy guy that took a two-watt 14 MHz battery powered transceiver to Perth/Australia, erected a three-feet long antenna (yes, a vertical!) and worked my Dad back home in Germany. Sure, I could have called him by phone, but why should I do something easy if I can do it under more challenging conditions ... ;-) Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) P.S.: The legal height for a fixed antenna structure in Lower Saxony/Germany, btw, is 10m ... From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27756 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 17:45:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 17:45:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zzr2-0005Ej-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 18:32:36 +0100 Received: from [194.200.20.13] (helo=mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zzr1-0005Ed-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 18:32:35 +0100 Received: from [195.44.223.240] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12Zzqp-0002PA-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 17:32:24 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38E07D1A.DDBDFA6A@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 09:36:26 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: QRSS References: <47zgSHAMxF44Ewt9@telemetry.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Tom Boucher wrote: > In message <38DF94D2.15A7E281@netscapeonline.co.uk>, g3kev > writes > > >........... maybe some morse lessons would be useful. > > No, what would be much more useful for some would be lessons in good > manners on the air! For example, making sure that one does not call CQ > bang on top of a QSO in progress. With only 2 khz of b/width on 136 khz, good narrow rx filters are necessary to enable everyone to squeeze in. No one deliberately calls CQ on top of anyone else, but with a wide rx it might appear that way. Another problem is split frequency working. When one station is not transmitting the frequency would appear clear. QRL imi in this case does not work. My RX consists of cascaded 250 hz IF filters followed by a DSP unit with an adjustable BW down to 20 hz. Stations that start to CQ or engange in a qso near by cause me no problems. MM0ALM who is S9 plus 40 db gives me no trouble receiving only a few hz away from his frequency. Suggest you try the hf bands on cw to get some real experience of adjacent channel qrm and especially in contests, then come back to 136 khz and you will find it a doddle by comparison. A good modern RX might overcome your problem ie FT1000MP, with 250 hz filters or there could be others. Hope the above information helps enlighten you about your problem. G3KEV > > > 73, Tom G3OLB. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1807 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 18:56:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 18:56:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a127-0008Sm-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 19:48:07 +0100 Received: from hs-img-2.compuserve.com ([149.174.177.151] helo=sphmgaab.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a121-0008LM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 19:48:01 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by sphmgaab.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id NAA26373 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 13:46:00 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 13:44:11 -0500 From: "DEREK ATTER" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: Weekend report To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003281344_MC2-9EFB-2129@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello LFers, Plenty of activity on 73Khz on Friday evening (24th March) withe at least 4 stations visible on Spectran at the same time. Lech, G3KAU and I loaded up the Crawley Club antenna on 73 for the first time for some months using my call G3GRO, rather than the Club call G3WSC . Worked Dave G0MRF on ordinary CW with RST589 reports both ways. Also had our first QRSS QSO with Jim M0BMU with very good signals both ways. - Sorry if the timing was a bit ragged at one point Jim but Lech keyed in our first reply into the keyer but at first it wouldn't download so I had to carry on using a hand key and stopwatch for a bit until the keyer fired up at the next attempt !! - Thanks for the QSO. Also "saw" G3LDO and G3XDV at good strength. On 136Khz at 1920 UTC heard Petr OK1FIG at a vy good 459/559 with some Loran QRM. Called him and got a QRZ? but no QSO resulted. We were running 200W RF to the 360ft inverted L at about 65ft. 73, de Derek G3GRO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15035 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 19:43:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 19:43:00 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a1ki-0005At-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 20:34:12 +0100 Received: from mail4.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.211]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a1kg-0005Ao-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 20:34:10 +0100 Received: from modem-13.dwimordene.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.164.13] helo=lvm) by mail4.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12a1kU-0008LZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 20:33:58 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bf98ec$a45b1680$0da4883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. DECCA Tx Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 20:32:17 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
The possibility of transmitting from an ex Decca site is very intresting I would like to put foreward a suggestion for an experiment.Theory has it that the radiation pattern for a much shortened vertical is not dependant on height!  Some on this reflector disagree.Would it be possible to radiate say 1w erp from the 300 foot antenna and  the same power from a co-sited very short vert similar to those being used by many people, if they used the same ground system all the better.Then by transmitting alternately from each station we could gather signal reports from many recieving stations both near and far,for various times of the day.
Perhaps then we could settle this argument once and for all.. 73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9105 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 19:49:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 19:49:28 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a1tO-0006DX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 20:43:10 +0100 Received: from [194.200.20.13] (helo=mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a1tF-0006Bv-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 20:43:01 +0100 Received: from as23-s16-143-205.cwci.net ([195.44.143.205] helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a1t0-0007Yr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 19:42:48 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38E0DFD0.D83689E6@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 16:37:36 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: QRSS References: <3.0.1.16.20000327095603.2d4f2c2e@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> <38E06CCD.CB41CBD7@netscapeonline.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: "M.J.Powell" wrote: > snip > > > A vertical > >antenna takes up less than 1 metre square > >of space and could have unlimited height. > > I live under Ringway flight path! MOVE if you are interested in LF > > > Mike > -- > M.J.Powell From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22949 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 22:01:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 22:01:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a3vf-00011N-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 22:53:39 +0100 Received: from tk1.ihug.co.nz ([203.29.160.13] helo=smtp1.ihug.co.nz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a3uz-0000xf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 22:52:57 +0100 Received: from tractorb (p48-max14.chc.ihug.co.nz [203.109.234.176]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id JAA16060 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 09:52:33 +1200 Message-ID: <01c501bf98ff$0c451680$6b884fd1@tractorb> From: "Dave Brown" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000201bf98ec$a45b1680$0da4883e@lvm> Subject: LF: Re: Re. DECCA Tx Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 09:46:14 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Laurie, I think you will find that you need to remove the 300 footer before trying the low height antenna- otherwise mutual coupling effects will surely stuff things up. And at 300 feet you will be getting out of 'very short vertical' territory anyway, even on 136. 73 Dave, ZL3FJ ----- Original Message ----- From: LAWRENCE MAYHEAD To: rsgb lf group Sent: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 7:32 AM Subject: LF: Re. DECCA Tx The possibility of transmitting from an ex Decca site is very intresting I would like to put foreward a suggestion for an experiment.Theory has it that the radiation pattern for a much shortened vertical is not dependant on height! Some on this reflector disagree.Would it be possible to radiate say 1w erp from the 300 foot antenna and the same power from a co-sited very short vert similar to those being used by many people, if they used the same ground system all the better.Then by transmitting alternately from each station we could gather signal reports from many recieving stations both near and far,for various times of the day. Perhaps then we could settle this argument once and for all.. 73s Laurie. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21890 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 22:09:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 22:09:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a43u-0001gx-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 23:02:10 +0100 Received: from gidora.zeta.org.au ([203.26.10.25]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a439-0001cI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 23:01:23 +0100 Received: (qmail 25144 invoked from network); 28 Mar 2000 22:00:50 -0000 Received: from ppp80.dyn144.pacific.net.au (HELO steve) (210.23.144.80) by gidora.zeta.org.au with SMTP; 28 Mar 2000 22:00:50 -0000 Message-ID: <003501bf9901$143ca900$0301a8c0@steve> From: "Steve Olney" To: "RSGB LF Group" Subject: LF: Fast CW and big antennas... Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 08:00:34 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: G'day All, All this talk about tall antennas and how good a 'fist' this or that person is concerns me. I feel it might give the wrong impression to the uninitiated to the world of LF Amateur Radio. In particular the constant pre-occupation of some proponents on this reflector to the the size of their on-site erections and their ability to move their hand fastest in a rhythmic fashion could lead to a picture which is very disturbing and unsavoury. Maybe it is a cultural thing, but even us rough Aussies confine this kind of discussion to the locker rooms or the local pub. So please - less talk about how big the components are and less about motor skills and more about experimentation so I can allow my young children to read my emails over my shoulder. Regards Steve VK2ZTO P.S. I think I might get a T-shirt printed and send it to some on this reflector - e.g. "QRSSers do it longer" or something similarly appropriate to their pre-occupation. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4673 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 00:26:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 00:26:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a6Cb-0004nB-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 01:19:17 +0100 Received: from ns.iagu.net ([203.32.153.69] helo=mail.iagu.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a6CQ-0004lh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 01:19:06 +0100 Received: from dhcp-193-76.ietf.connect.com.au [169.208.193.76] by mail.iagu.net (8.8.5/AndrewR-19990125) with ESMTP id JAA05196 for return ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 09:48:40 +0930 (CST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <390A1C34.9D8A0936@virgin.net> Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 00:18:12 +0100 From: "Stewart Bryant" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Cisco Systems X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re. DECCA Tx References: <000201bf98ec$a45b1680$0da4883e@lvm> Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit It would be very important to ensure that there was no coupling between the
two antennas. None the less a relative measurement between the two types
of antenna, even at different sites would be very interesting.

Stewart G3YSX

LAWRENCE MAYHEAD wrote:

 The possibility of transmitting from an ex Decca site is very intresting I would like to put foreward a suggestion for an experiment.Theory has it that the radiation pattern for a much shortened vertical is not dependant on height!  Some on this reflector disagree.Would it be possible to radiate say 1w erp from the 300 foot antenna and  the same power from a co-sited very short vert similar to those being used by many people, if they used the same ground system all the better.Then by transmitting alternately from each station we could gather signal reports from many recieving stations both near and far,for various times of the day.Perhaps then we could settle this argument once and for all.. 73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25412 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 01:17:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 01:17:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a70X-0000Kc-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 02:10:53 +0100 Received: from mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a70R-0000I9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 02:10:48 +0100 Received: from locxvcym ([210.55.151.249]) by mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <20000329011001.FSEU2589319.mta2-rme@locxvcym> for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 13:10:01 +1200 From: "ComPact" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Fast CW and big antennas... X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 13:08:14 +1200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <20000329011001.FSEU2589319.mta2-rme@locxvcym> Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Yes, well put Steve. It's such a pity to spoil a wonderful reflector with so much malcontent. We had an interesting LF test round last Thursday night with most signals in the South Island enhanced by around 12dB. This coincided with reports of aurora although there was no sign of flutter on 80 metres at the same time. Mike ZL4OL From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24848 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 02:30:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 02:30:58 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a89N-0005nd-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 03:24:05 +0100 Received: from smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.157]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12a89I-0005mh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 03:24:00 +0100 Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-118-165.bellatlantic.net [151.200.118.165]) by smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id VAA24545; Tue, 28 Mar 2000 21:23:37 -0500 (EST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38E16985.211F0022@bellatlantic.net> Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 21:25:10 -0500 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD47 (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Fast CW and big antennas... References: <003501bf9901$143ca900$0301a8c0@steve> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Steve Olney VK2ZTO wrote: > [...] > > So please - less talk about how big the components are and less about motor > skills and more about experimentation hear hear Andre' N4ICK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16894 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 09:48:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 09:48:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aEtA-00045J-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 10:35:48 +0100 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aEt4-00044j-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 10:35:43 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12aEtA-000646-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 10:35:51 +0100 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 10:29:11 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 10:29:09 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Re: Fast CW and big antennas... In-reply-to: <20000329011001.FSEU2589319.mta2-rme@locxvcym> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > We had an interesting LF test round last Thursday night with most signals > in the South Island enhanced by around 12dB. This coincided with reports > of aurora although there was no sign of flutter on 80 metres at the same > time. There was an X-class flare (biggest) on the 21st (Tuesday) and at 1848UTC on the 23rd (Thursday). Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10903 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 10:53:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 10:53:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aFyL-0001kI-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 11:45:13 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aFyE-0001jh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 11:45:06 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12aFvG-0001fi-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 11:42:02 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <23068.200003291050@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 11:50:51 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz/Decca Sites X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, The Rugby TX is still off the air (or was at about 0730utc), as it has been for the last couple of days. Worked G3XTZ, G3LDO, and G3XDV last night, all 'armchair copy' signals. If anybody would like a 73kHz or cross-band sked, please let me know - hopefully we will be able to take advantage of this window of opportunity. Also listened from time to time on 136kHz - but did not hear LA1K. However, I dozed off some time around 2100, so might have missed him! OK about the Idea of experiments to compare big and small antennas at a Decca site - this looks like an interesting idea, but perhaps 1W ERP is being a bit hopeful from the small antenna; it would probably be neccessary to settle for lower power from both antennas for the duration of the experiment. I did some EZNEC simulations a while ago, to follow up a suggestion by G3XDV that the towers at Brookmans Park MF broadcast site might be acting as parasitic radiators, enhancing the M0BMU signal. The result was essentially that, with a spacing of some hundreds of metres, the effect was neglegible, provided the big antenna was not resonated at 136kHz. This could be achieved by grounding one antenna whilst using the other, or similar. A 300ft tower is still only lambda/24 at 136kHz, so should in theory give the same vertical radiation pattern as an 'infinitesimal' vertical, to all practical intents and purposes. Hope to hear more about Decca sites soon, Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16223 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 11:07:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 11:07:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aGCV-0002sD-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 11:59:51 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aGCQ-0002rm-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 11:59:46 +0100 Received: from [195.44.220.74] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aGCE-0002a5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 10:59:35 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38E1D278.C14B4291@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 09:52:56 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Re. DECCA Tx References: <000201bf98ec$a45b1680$0da4883e@lvm> <01c501bf98ff$0c451680$6b884fd1@tractorb> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dave Brown wrote: > Laurie, > I think you will find that you need to remove the 300 footer before trying > the low height antenna- otherwise mutual coupling effects will surely stuff > things up. > And at 300 feet you will be getting out of 'very short vertical' territory > anyway, even on 136. At this frequency with both antennas resonant on 136 khz on the same site, the induced rf from the small vertical into the larger one would distort any meaningful tests. The antennas would need to be sited several kilometres apart, when co located one would need to be dismantled while the other one is tested. I have already tested this by starting off with a 60 ft vertical and progressing to 120 ft and it certainly made a big difference for the same given rf power output. Signal reports all over europe confirm this. G3KEV > > > 73 > Dave, ZL3FJ > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: LAWRENCE MAYHEAD > To: rsgb lf group > Sent: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 7:32 AM > Subject: LF: Re. DECCA Tx > > The possibility of transmitting from an ex Decca site is very intresting I > would like to put foreward a suggestion for an experiment.Theory has it that > the radiation pattern for a much shortened vertical is not dependant on > height! Some on this reflector disagree.Would it be possible to radiate say > 1w erp from the 300 foot antenna and the same power from a co-sited very > short vert similar to those being used by many people, if they used the same > ground system all the better.Then by transmitting alternately from each > station we could gather signal reports from many recieving stations both > near and far,for various times of the day. > Perhaps then we could settle this argument once and for all.. 73s Laurie. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20243 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 11:38:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 11:38:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aGfu-00058g-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:30:14 +0100 Received: from mail04.hostcenter.com ([195.186.64.57]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aGfq-00058M-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:30:10 +0100 Received: from www303.hostcenter.com (195.186.64.84) by mail04.hostcenter.com (RS ver 1.0.53) with SMTP id 02255367 for ; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 13:29:45 +0200 (MDT) Message-ID: <38E2686D.26F5CA2C@phonakcom.ch> X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 12:32:45 -0800 From: "Toni Baertschi" Organization: Phonak Communications AG X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Re. DECCA Tx References: <000201bf98ec$a45b1680$0da4883e@lvm> <01c501bf98ff$0c451680$6b884fd1@tractorb> <38E1D278.C14B4291@netscapeonline.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Loop-Detect: 1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: A sort of passive amplifier: The low radiated power of the small antenna is captured by the big antenna, maybe 100m away, mysticly amplified and then radiated again - giving a much stronger signal? How does this work? 73 de Toni, HB2ASB g3kev wrote: > Dave Brown wrote: > > > Laurie, > > I think you will find that you need to remove the 300 footer before trying > > the low height antenna- otherwise mutual coupling effects will surely stuff > > things up. > > And at 300 feet you will be getting out of 'very short vertical' territory > > anyway, even on 136. > > At this frequency with both antennas resonant on 136 khz on the same site, the > induced rf from the small vertical into the larger one would distort any > meaningful tests. The antennas would need to be sited several kilometres apart, > when co located one would need to be dismantled while the other one is tested. > I have already tested this by starting off with a 60 ft vertical and progressing > to 120 ft and it certainly made a big difference for the same given rf power > output. Signal reports all over europe confirm this. > G3KEV > > > > > > > 73 > > Dave, ZL3FJ > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: LAWRENCE MAYHEAD > > To: rsgb lf group > > Sent: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 7:32 AM > > Subject: LF: Re. DECCA Tx > > > > The possibility of transmitting from an ex Decca site is very intresting I > > would like to put foreward a suggestion for an experiment.Theory has it that > > the radiation pattern for a much shortened vertical is not dependant on > > height! Some on this reflector disagree.Would it be possible to radiate say > > 1w erp from the 300 foot antenna and the same power from a co-sited very > > short vert similar to those being used by many people, if they used the same > > ground system all the better.Then by transmitting alternately from each > > station we could gather signal reports from many recieving stations both > > near and far,for various times of the day. > > Perhaps then we could settle this argument once and for all.. 73s Laurie. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5229 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 14:47:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 14:47:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aJcG-0003R2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 15:38:40 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aJcA-0003QW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 15:38:35 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12aJZF-0006rB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 15:35:33 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <17200.200003291443@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:51:02 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Decca antenna tests X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group,

G3KEV wrote:
>At this frequency with both antennas resonant on 136 khz on the >same site, the induced rf from the small vertical into the larger >one would distort any meaningful tests.

It certainly would, which is why I wrote that the Decca antenna would have to be grounded or otherwise made non-resonant at 136kHz. If both antennas were resonant, the un-driven one would act as a parasitic element, as in a yagi array. Under these conditions, the small antenna might be viewed as a rather inefficient antenna feed for the nearby big antenna. This would still happen if the parasitic antenna was non-resonant, but the induced currents in it would be greatly reduced, and the effect on radiation pattern reduced greatly also.

>The antennas would need to be sited several kilometres apart...


The professional antenna people seem to have no great problem with co-sited 'antenna farms', although they have to take care to avoid inadvertant resonances in guy wires, etc. There are at least 4 MF verticals in use across the road from me, a few hundred meters apart; the BBC seems to be quite happy with them like that!

Cheers, Jim Moritz
73 de M0BMU

From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9586 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 18:57:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 18:57:33 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aNTX-0006Xq-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 19:45:55 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aNTR-0006XG-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 19:45:49 +0100 Received: from [195.44.222.57] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aNTD-00024y-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 18:45:38 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38E240BC.DA7C78EA@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 17:43:25 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Fast CW and big antennas... References: <003501bf9901$143ca900$0301a8c0@steve> <38E16985.211F0022@bellatlantic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Andre' Kesteloot wrote: > Steve Olney VK2ZTO wrote: > > > [...] > > > > So please - less talk about how big the components are and less about motor > > skills and more about experimentation Why then did you criticize the ROPEX so much in your report. Surely the person who designed it, and marketed it deserves some credit. No one else rushed in to help Surprised you did not rectify the problem by EXPERIMENTING and producing the perfect rig!!!!!!!!! I built my own rig and it works well, since you mention Experimenting surprised you did not do the same. > > > hear hear > Andre' N4ICK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26400 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 19:21:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 19:21:38 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aNrb-0008W4-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:10:47 +0100 Received: from mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.15]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aNrW-0008TE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:10:42 +0100 Received: from [202.27.178.56] by mta4-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <20000329190956.XAKT10049812.mta4-rme@[202.27.178.56]> for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:09:56 +1200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38E2530F.622F@xtra.co.nz> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:01:35 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Amp metres References: <000201bf98ec$a45b1680$0da4883e@lvm> <01c501bf98ff$0c451680$6b884fd1@tractorb> <38E1D278.C14B4291@netscapeonline.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: g3kev wrote: snip snip > At this frequency with both antennas resonant on 136 khz on the same site, the > induced rf from the small vertical into the larger one would distort any > meaningful tests. The antennas would need to be sited several kilometres apart, > when co located one would need to be dismantled while the other one is tested. > I have already tested this by starting off with a 60 ft vertical and progressing > to 120 ft and it certainly made a big difference for the same given rf power > output. Signal reports all over europe confirm this. > G3KEV One fairly basic approach is that the far field is a function of antenna "amp metres". If the amps are the same, and the effective height is increased, then there is an obvious gain. It is far easier to arrive at a given product of amps and metres in a tall antenna! Changing from 60 to 120 feet, with the same pattern of current distribution, would give a gain of 6 dB for the same applied current. This is for one antenna in the environment, with no mutual coupling to something large nearby. An amateur regulatory constraint of 1 watt eirp limit starts to bite in to the transmitter power budget for taller (more efficient) antenna systems. Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8558 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 19:32:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 19:32:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aO1J-0000f2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:20:49 +0100 Received: from mail12.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.215]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aO1F-0000el-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:20:45 +0100 Received: from modem-77.earendil.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.164.205] helo=lvm) by mail12.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12aO13-0003Wg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:20:33 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bf99b3$ee6ed5a0$cda4883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: LF. Decca ant. tests. Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 20:19:48 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Many thanks for all the comments on my suggestion especially James M0MBU for your support..I agree that it would be necessesary to have min coupling between the two ants, and I am sure that the big ant. could be de-tuned.Also it should be possible to separate them by a suitable distance,surely it doesnt have to be kilometers!I also agree that 1 watt is too high but it doesnt matter so long as the are both the same.I still think that this test would be worthwhile, and an opportunity not to be missed.. 73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7255 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 20:33:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 20:33:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aOru-0004nG-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:15:10 +0100 Received: from gidora.zeta.org.au ([203.26.10.25]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aOrq-0004mc-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:15:07 +0100 Received: (qmail 12653 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 20:14:49 -0000 Received: from ppp86.dyn143.pacific.net.au (HELO steve) (210.23.143.86) by gidora.zeta.org.au with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 20:14:49 -0000 Message-ID: <001b01bf99bb$7043f860$0301a8c0@steve> From: "Steve Olney" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <20000329011001.FSEU2589319.mta2-rme@locxvcym> Subject: LF: Re: Re: Fast CW and big antennas... Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:14:42 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: G'day All, Thanks to the many who replied directly to me re my comments. I am encouraged that there is a 'silent majority' out there who share the same sentiments. The wisest reply pointed out that along with the big antenna erection and the fast CW motor skills was mention of the possession of the superior filter for eliminating co-channel interference and improving S/N. Blindingly obvious really. I now have an interference filter on my email inbox which uses a 5-letter search pattern and diverts identified emails to the 'noise' folder while the rest are sorted into the various 'signal' folders. A kind of e-mail QRM filter. Works well!!! 73s Steve Olney (VK2ZTO/AXSO - QF56IK : Lat -33 34 07, Long +150 44 40) ============================================= HomePage URLs: http://www.qsl.net/vk2zto http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg Containing:- Laser Comms DX LF Experimentation Amateur Radio Astronomy ============================================= From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7690 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 20:58:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 20:58:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aPOn-0007Yy-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:49:09 +0100 Received: from mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aPOi-0007Vd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:49:05 +0100 Received: from locxvcym ([210.55.83.207]) by mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP id <20000329204817.QREW2589319.mta2-rme@locxvcym> for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 08:48:17 +1200 From: "ComPact" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Fast CW and big antennas... X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 08:40:03 +1200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <20000329204817.QREW2589319.mta2-rme@locxvcym> Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Mike G3XDV wrote >There was an X-class flare (biggest) on the 21st (Tuesday) and at >1848UTC on the 23rd (Thursday). Thanks for the flare info Mike. The tests were Thursday evening here so preceded the second flare but could be longer term effects of the first one and the other smaller flares that week. Signals over the short paths (100 to 300km) were reported as the strongest ever heard. We'll see what tonight brings. It's never boring on these bands! Mike ZL4OL From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7884 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 20:59:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 20:59:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aPQo-0007m2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:51:14 +0100 Received: from tk1.ihug.co.nz ([203.29.160.13] helo=smtp1.ihug.co.nz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aPQi-0007lF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:51:09 +0100 Received: from tractorb (p38-max11.chc.ihug.co.nz [209.79.136.230]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id IAA08310 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 08:50:52 +1200 Message-ID: <023501bf99be$f83dd120$6b884fd1@tractorb> From: "Dave Brown" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <17200.200003291443@gemini> Subject: LF: Re: Decca antenna tests Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 08:40:06 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
 
Laurie
I think the critical factor in this discussion is the proposal to make a 'valid' comparison between the existing and additional short mast. To do this, in practice you will have to be using the same ground plane, (I think you already suggested this) and this I believe will prevent you from being sufficiently far away from the 300 footer (regardless of its electrical condition, grounded, resonant or otherwise) to prevent pattern distortion from mutual coupling effects.
 Commercial antenna farms do have these problems but as we all know, any antenna system is always a compromise.None are perfect.
 
 I think an experiment along the lines of what you suggest is an excellent idea for  just seeing what the results are, but I think any suggestion of a 'valid' comparison would need to be modified in accordance with prevailing experimental conditions.
Using other peoples antennas is always a lot of fun anyway- just my luck that all those I have used so far have been bowled over a few weeks after the event! I have to say that watching a 300 footer being dropped is quite an experience- they always seem a lot bigger when thay are spread out along the ground!
 In summary, go for it!
73
Dave, ZL3FJ
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17557 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2000 23:28:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Mar 2000 23:28:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aRn3-0001Ok-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 00:22:21 +0100 Received: from irwell.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.47.48] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aRn0-0001OM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 00:22:18 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from central.zetnet.co.uk (central.zetnet.co.uk [194.247.47.20]) by irwell.zetnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id AAA04791 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 00:22:06 +0100 X-ZSender: g3ldo@zetnet.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <2000032922075768199@zetnet.co.uk> Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 22:07:57 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Peter Dodd" X-Mailer: ZIMACS Version 1.20c 10000836 Subject: LF: Re: Fast CW and big antennas... Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit >From Steve > Thanks to the many who replied directly to me re my comments. I am > encouraged that there is a 'silent majority' out there who share the same > sentiments. You would be suprised on just how many! Thanks for the light relief. Older LF Receivers. While at Amberley museum, a few weeks ago, I came across a Marconi receiver, the CR200. It covers from about 15 to 500kHz in 4 bands so I asked if I could borrow it to see how it shaped up to modern receivers. The main difference between it and other receivers, apart from being an LF receiver, is that it appears to be a TRF receiver, not a superhet (no IF stages or cans). It worked first time in spite of probably not having been switched on for umpteen years. It is very sensitive with a wide range RF gain control and a preset! LF gain control. I could hear the stronger stations on 136kHz without any trouble. While in QSO with M0BMU on 73kHz a couple of nights ago (Jim's signal was 559) I asked if he would stand by while I tested this receiver with his signal. When I switched from the TS850 to the CR200 I lost him competely - the problem was from the Decca signals down the band. So it would seem that the skirt selectivity of the filter was nowhere near as good as the TS850. Perhaps the CR200 was not designed for communications as such; it has a multi-way socket on the front panel labelled 'DF'. I will be returning the CR200 back to the museum on Friday and hope that my hernia is better by the time I go on vacation. -- Regards, Peter, G3LDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11656 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 05:55:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 05:55:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aXkk-0003yz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:44:22 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from rabacal.direct.ca ([199.60.229.8]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aXkd-0003yQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:44:15 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from whi-53-0131.direct.ca ([204.244.87.31]) by rabacal.direct.ca with smtp (Exim 2.12 #7) id 12aXkP-0005RG-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:44:02 -0800 X-Sender: eldridge@direct.ca X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Bob Eldridge" Subject: Re: LF: Amp metres Message-ID: Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 21:44:02 -0800 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >An amateur regulatory constraint of 1 watt eirp limit starts to bite in >to the transmitter power budget for taller (more efficient) antenna >systems. > Bites in even more with a smaller antenna surely! Didn't Dud Charman's indoor antenna circus demonstrate the truth of the axiom that a small antenna has the same radiation pattern as a very small antenna? Maybe a decommissioned Decca site could be better used to demonstrate the efficacy of passive reradiation from an adjacent tower. Bob VE7BS (ex-G3AGQ) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9687 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 08:54:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 08:54:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aabd-0001Td-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 09:47:09 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aabW-0001SV-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 09:47:03 +0100 Received: from [195.44.140.173] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aabA-00007D-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 08:46:41 +0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38E30461.F4204600@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 07:38:09 +0000 From: "g3kev" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: TX CONSTRUCTION Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Doing some construction lately, I have noticed how inaccurate some component values are. Good quality capacitors that I have been using are a long way out from the marked value. Also recommended turns for toroids to produce a given inductance can be quite a bit out. The only solution is to use an inductance and capacitance metre and select the components. Your matching network otherwise could be a long way out and you might be wondering what is wrong. There is a vast difference between powdered iron cores and ferrite material for the same given inductance. ie a T200-2 powdered iron core needs about 67 turns to achieve 54 uh whereas a ferrite core type 3c6 only needs 7 turns. There are other considerations when selecting cores, power, Q factor etc. Having completed some calculations at the design stage it is then worth experimenting with different cores to achieve the most efficient energy transfer, avoid overheating and saturation of core. A lot of information about filter and matching networks is contained in the ARRL handbook, this will get you started when comtemplating a LF tx project. Some marked component values are well beyond the 10 percent tolerance. One capacitor marked 0.022 uf was in fact 0.033 uf (wrongly marked in this case). That is why some projects do not perform as designed and you wonder why. 73 G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13240 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 10:09:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 10:09:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12abo1-0007L1-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 11:04:01 +0100 Received: from apollo.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.125]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12abnv-0007KO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 11:03:55 +0100 Received: from pc171.geog.le.ac.uk ([143.210.25.171] helo=kate) by apollo.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #2) id 12abnj-0003Dz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 11:03:43 +0100 From: "kate moore" To: "lfgroup" Subject: LF: LF Xbands Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 10:57:08 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Just had another xband 73/136 with Ray GI3PDN. Absolutely solid this time and we were able to chat with ease. When we had finished I was very pleased to be called by Dick, PA0SE and we also completed a normal CW xband contact. Regards John G4GVC (via Kate) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6256 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 10:11:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 10:11:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12abnJ-0007H3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 11:03:17 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.10.6]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12abnH-0007Gg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 11:03:16 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.3/8.9.0) with SMTP id MAA85262 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 12:03:02 +0200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.20000330115943.2df7d336@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 11:59:43 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: x-band In-reply-to: <2000032922075768199@zetnet.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I have a sked with Peter (G3LDO) for a CW x-band QSO (136/72kHz) tomorrow (Friday) from 06.00 to 06.30 UT. I will listen on 71.8 and transmit 137.1kHz. If signals are good the QSO with Peter could be done in 5 minutes and I will be listening on 71.8kHz (+/-) in case someone else is interested in a QSO. But at 06.30 UT I have to go QRT and leave for work. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29231 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 11:25:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 11:25:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12acz7-0005cc-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 12:19:33 +0100 Received: from mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12acz1-0005bb-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 12:19:27 +0100 Received: from [202.27.181.98] by mta3-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <20000330111908.VGQL7017519.mta3-rme@[202.27.181.98]> for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:19:08 +1200 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <38E3350D.4717@xtra.co.nz> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:05:49 +1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Amp metres References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Bob Eldridge wrote: > > >An amateur regulatory constraint of 1 watt eirp limit starts to bite in > >to the transmitter power budget for taller (more efficient) antenna > >systems. > > > Bites in even more with a smaller antenna surely! What I meant to suggest was that a small antenna needs a great deal of applied power to achieve a radiated power of 1 watt. For most hams, it is impractical to get near 1 watt eirp with realistic transmitter power. On the other hand, the big antenna only nneds a QRP transmitter connected to get 1 watt eirp. > Didn't Dud Charman's indoor antenna circus demonstrate the truth of the > axiom that a small antenna has the same radiation pattern as a very small > antenna? I also believe that all short verticals have the same basic radiation pattern (the upper hemishere of a doughnut, with low angle suckin if ground loss is significant). > Maybe a decommissioned Decca site could be better used to demonstrate the > efficacy of passive reradiation from an adjacent tower. Any tests would be interesting. Big sticks are hard to come by. Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9881 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 12:59:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 12:59:09 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aeQX-0004CG-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 13:51:57 +0100 Received: from bru5-rc-mx1.uunet.be ([194.7.179.228]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aeQQ-0004BZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 13:51:51 +0100 Received: (qmail 20191 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 12:51:35 -0000 Received: from uu212-190-22-246.unknown.uunet.be (HELO DeWildeg) (212.190.22.246) by bru5-rc-mx1.uunet.be with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 12:51:35 -0000 Message-ID: <004901bf9a46$b09f95a0$f616bed4@DeWildeg> From: "Gaspard De Wilde" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 14:51:13 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 13:51:57 +0100 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
I confess:
              I do not have :    the best antennas,
                                     the best  receivers, nor the best transmitters,
                                     can't even go fast enough in CW....(novice ?)
but still  enjoy the < Radio > contacts I make  with my home brewed  gear.
  All this after  50 years as ON4ZK,  shame....mea culpa...mea maxima culpa!!!
 
So if you likes to contact me...be kind...come with the speed I used to call you....
 
   73s  from  a lazy old Ham,Gaspard  JO21NF 
 
PS    I look and call almost every evening in  QRSS, begins arround 8h30 utc
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6930 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 13:24:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 13:24:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aepk-0006Ai-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 14:18:00 +0100 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12aepe-0006AE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 14:17:55 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #63) id 12aepN-0006EL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 14:17:37 +0100 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 14:10:15 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 14:10:13 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Amp metres In-reply-to: <38E3350D.4717@xtra.co.nz> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: > > Didn't Dud Charman's indoor antenna circus demonstrate the truth of the > > axiom that a small antenna has the same radiation pattern as a very > > small antenna? > > I also believe that all short verticals have the same basic radiation > pattern (the upper hemishere of a doughnut, with low angle suckin if > ground loss is significant). > I was privileged to see Dud Charman's aerial circus in the 1960s as a schoolboy. For those who do not know, he had a large copper tray with a coax socket in the centre. He would then feed miniature antennas with UHF or microwaves and demonstrate their radiation pattern with a hand-held RF detector driving a lightbulb. Seeing a text book radiation pattern demonstrated in such a practical way was really amazing. The flaw in this demonstration, however, is that it assumes little or no ground loss. I am sure that with practical levels of ground loss, the lowest angles are attenuated more on very short verticals than on taller ones. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17628 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 20:51:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 20:51:17 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12all0-0000Pg-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 21:41:34 +0100 Received: from lepidachrosite.lion-access.net ([212.19.217.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12alkv-0000P4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 21:41:30 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 (2410824712.dialin.freeler.nl [143.178.68.8]) by lepidachrosite.lion-access.net (I-Lab) with SMTP id 56040CAF6C for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 17:37:04 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <000e01bf9a6f$afb84640$0844b28f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <2000032922075768199@zetnet.co.uk> Subject: LF: Re: Re: Fast CW and big antennas... Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 19:44:13 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To All from PA0SE Peter, G3LDO wrote: > Older LF Receivers. > While at Amberley museum, a few weeks ago, I came across a Marconi > receiver, the CR200. It covers from about 15 to 500kHz in 4 bands so > I asked if I could borrow it to see how it shaped up to modern receivers. > The main difference between it and other receivers, apart from being > an LF receiver, is that it appears to be a TRF receiver, not a > superhet (no IF stages or cans). > It worked first time in spite of probably not having been switched on > for umpteen years. It is very sensitive with a wide range RF gain > control and a preset! LF gain control. I could hear the stronger > stations on 136kHz without any trouble. > While in QSO with M0BMU on 73kHz a couple of nights ago (Jim's signal > was 559) I asked if he would stand by while I tested this receiver > with his signal. When I switched from the TS850 to the CR200 I lost > him competely - the problem was from the Decca signals down the band. > So it would seem that the skirt selectivity of the filter was nowhere > near as good as the TS850. > Perhaps the CR200 was not designed for communications as such; it has > a multi-way socket on the front panel labelled 'DF'. > I will be returning the CR200 back to the museum on Friday and hope > that my hernia is better by the time I go on vacation. In "Radio Bygones" of October/November 1994, Issue No. 31 there is an article by G.L. Grisdale PhD G5GZ called "The Marconi CR Series of Receivers". >From this I quote: " The CR200 The CR200 (Navy B29) is a 5-valve TRF receiver (2-v-2) covering 15 to 550 kHz in four bands. Two audio stages include a narrow bandwidth filter tuned to 1kHz for CW reception. Aerial arrangements include two 'loop' inputs, intended for use in submarine installations where a single-turn loop or frame aerial is fitted for submerged reception, on the lower two frequency bands (15 to 90kHz). For operation with such very insensitive aerials, the CR200 was given very good sensitivity; however, with any normal aerial more than a few feet long, the atmospheric (route) noise would exceed the inernal receiver noise. For long-wave DX enthusiasts the good receiver sensitivity would not matter much." The following specification is included: CR200 (Navy B29) FREQUENCY RANGE: 15 - 150kHz in four bands DC SUPPLIES: Batteries 200V22mA max, 6V 2.1A MAINS SUPPLY: 100/110 or 200/250V AC 33W INPUTS: Dipole or unipole via 80 Ohms feeder. High or low-impedance loop aerial (15 - 90kHz only) SENSITIVITY: See Note 1 OUTPUTS: Jacks for Pattern W.621 head telephones. 5000 Ohms line for Auto High-Speed reception using DC Amplifier M31 DIMENSIONS: 19 x 13.5 x 16in. Weight 82lb VALVES: Position Preferred American type V1,2 VR100 (KTW62) 6K7G V3 VR99 (X66) 6K8G V4 NR68 (DH63) 6Q7G V5 6J5G (L63) 6J5G Power unit VU71A 5U4G Note 1: The handbook AP S.S. 104 gives no sensitivity specifications. However, a Test Certificate for a typical B29 receiver shows a 10dB S/N ratio was achieved across the frequency range with signals of 0.1 - 0.15µV to the 80 Ohms input." 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4798 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 21:34:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 21:34:01 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12amTy-0003yz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 22:28:02 +0100 Received: from hs-img-3.compuserve.com ([149.174.177.148] helo=sphmgaac.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12amTr-0003vq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 22:27:55 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by sphmgaac.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id QAA03799 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 16:26:50 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 16:26:09 -0500 From: "Prof R. Jennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz - Rugby To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003301626_MC2-9F51-866D@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Whatever has happened to the Rugby transmitter, it has been off the air for three days. Has it been sabotaged by overkeen Hams or have the authorities given up the fight against competing with Ham Radio? It seems to me to be even more sinister. For 2 years I have been using a VFO but on Wednesday, thanks to G3NYK's Xtal offer, I completed a Xtal beat oscillator to squeeze into the tiny bottom end of the band. I specifically designed it for this sector and cannot use it at the top end. Now I find that, in this neck of the woods, continental QRM is terrific at the bottom end but the centre and top end of the band are as quiet as the proverbial mouse or perhaps I should say quieter as I recall being awakened in the past by the little blighters scratching away throughout the night! As I have not heard a single 73 Ham signal for ages I will put the beacon on for extended periods during the next few days in the faint hope that I may get a report from somewhere, even perhaps continental Europe! 73, Roger, G2AJV. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12167 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 22:18:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 22:18:43 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12anAA-0007AF-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:11:38 +0100 Received: from public2.thorcom.com ([212.172.148.20] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12an9z-00079g-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:11:27 +0100 Received: from mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk ([194.200.20.13]) by public2.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ajMs-00063G-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 19:08:31 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from [195.44.222.105] (helo=netscapeonline.co.uk) by mailhost.netscapeonline.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ajMn-0004e0-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 18:08:25 +0000 Message-ID: <38E389AE.B5D45E6F@netscapeonline.co.uk> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 17:06:54 +0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "g3kev" Organization: Netscape Online member X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en-gb]C-CCK-MCD NetscapeOnline.co.uk (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en-GB,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb" Subject: LF: CONFUSION Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: There seems to be some confusion about large and small vertical antennas on LF. Although the radiation patern(profile) is the same the INTENSITITY of the propogated signal is much greater from the large vertical given the same power. I have tested this and found it to be the case. There seems to be some contradictory opinions but they are only theoritical and I await someone else to perform a practical field test. ie install a 120 ft vertical with a suitable antenna resonated for 136 khz , then dismantle it or lower it to the average 30 feet, re-resonate and check out the difference. Use the same radial system. de G3KEV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18185 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 22:26:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 22:26:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12anI4-0007mT-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:19:48 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from post.interalpha.co.uk ([195.26.224.18] helo=post.interalpha.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12anHy-0007lf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:19:42 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from sot-mod24.interalpha.net (sot-mod24.interalpha.net [195.26.225.24]) by post.interalpha.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA16615 for ; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:20:18 +0100 Message-ID: <200003302220.XAA16615@post.interalpha.net> X-Sender: drassew2@post.interalpha.co.uk X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:19:38 +0000 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Andy Talbot" Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz - Rugby Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: MSF has been off as well, just as I wanted to do some long duration frequency calibration tests, and the 16kHz and 22 kHz (alledged) submarine transmissions. According to the National Physical Laboratory info on MSF, as the antenna feeds are all sited so close together, whenever the main one needs maintainance the others have to go off as well for safety reasons. There was no notification on the NPL web page about MSF outages, so it look like a sudden repair job. Andy G4JNT >Whatever has happened to the Rugby transmitter, it has been off the air for >three days. Has it been sabotaged by overkeen Hams or have the >authorities given up the fight against competing with Ham Radio? >It seems to me to be even more sinister. For 2 years I have been using a >VFO but on Wednesday, thanks to G3NYK's Xtal offer, I completed a Xtal beat >oscillator to squeeze into the tiny bottom end of the band. I specifically >designed it for this sector and cannot use it at the top end. Now I find >that, in this neck of the woods, continental QRM is terrific at the bottom >end but the centre and top end of the band are as quiet as the proverbial >mouse or perhaps I should say quieter as I recall being awakened in the >past by the little blighters scratching away throughout the night! >As I have not heard a single 73 Ham signal for ages I will put the beacon >on for extended periods during the next few days in the faint hope that I >may get a report from somewhere, even perhaps continental Europe! >73, >Roger, G2AJV. > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27328 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2000 22:58:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Mar 2000 22:58:02 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12anng-000248-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:52:28 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from public1.thorcom.com ([212.172.148.10] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12anna-00023e-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:52:22 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.88]) by public1.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12agom-0000ke-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 16:25:08 +0100 Received: from telemetry.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.114]) by anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12agok-0000jw-0U for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 16:25:07 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 16:23:14 +0100 To: "RSGB LF Group" From: "Tom Boucher" Subject: LF: Aerial Circus MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I was never lucky enough to see G6CJ's antenna circus, but I saw a similar demonstration some years ago given by Laurie G3AQC which was most interesting. Do you still have the bits and pieces and miniature antenna farm you used in your talk Laurie? 73, Tom G3OLB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5284 invoked from network); 31 Mar 2000 04:27:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Mar 2000 04:27:51 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12asry-00035B-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 05:17:14 +0100 Received: from hs-img-3.compuserve.com ([149.174.177.148] helo=sphmgaac.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12asrr-00032a-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 05:17:07 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by sphmgaac.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id XAA09734 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:15:21 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:14:56 -0500 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz - Rugby To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003302315_MC2-9F55-C379@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Roger, >As I have not heard a single 73 Ham signal for ages I will put the beacon >on for extended periods during the next few days in the faint hope that I >may get a report from somewhere, even perhaps continental Europe! >73, >Roger, G2AJV.< I would love to give it a try from continental Europe. What is the precise frequency your xtal-combination puts out? Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 754 invoked from network); 31 Mar 2000 07:43:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Mar 2000 07:43:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12avx8-0000mF-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 08:34:46 +0100 Received: from artemis.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.126]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12avx0-0000lh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 08:34:38 +0100 Received: from pc171.geog.le.ac.uk ([143.210.25.171] helo=kate) by artemis.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #2) id 12avwo-0002yb-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 08:34:26 +0100 From: "kate moore" To: "lfgroup" Subject: LF: Rugby shutdown Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 08:27:48 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: According to a packet message from G4JXL, Rugby is off at present for its annual maintenance period, which is scheduled from last Monday until "1300BST" on 10th April. Whether the transmitters will be down for the whole of this period is anyone's guess - the 60kHz transmission does reappear in the evenings, but thankfully 73kHz has been off all week so far, making the band gloriously quiet here (apart from the odd SMPSU!). Looks like this is going to be our best opportunity to use 73kHz before we loose it at the end of June - hope to work many of you either 2-way or crossband to 136 in the next couple of weeks. Skeds welcome! Apparently a status report on MSF is available on 0181 943 6493. John G4GVC From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23503 invoked from network); 31 Mar 2000 10:13:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Mar 2000 10:13:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ayGp-0004O2-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 11:03:15 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.90]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12ayGf-0004NM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 11:03:05 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from pickmere.demon.co.uk ([158.152.117.143]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12ayGN-000My2-0W for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 11:02:48 +0100 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 23:43:28 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M.J.Powell" Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz - Rugby References: <200003302220.XAA16615@post.interalpha.net> In-reply-to: <200003302220.XAA16615@post.interalpha.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Integrated Version 4.02 S Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In message <200003302220.XAA16615@post.interalpha.net>, Andy Talbot writes >MSF has been off as well, just as I wanted to do some long duration >frequency calibration tests, and the 16kHz and 22 kHz (alledged) submarine >transmissions. According to the National Physical Laboratory info on MSF, >as the antenna feeds are all sited so close together, whenever the main one >needs maintainance the others have to go off as well for safety reasons. >There was no notification on the NPL web page about MSF outages, so it look >like a sudden repair job. Isn't Criggion still on? Mike -- M.J.Powell From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24115 invoked from network); 31 Mar 2000 11:45:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by dimple.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Mar 2000 11:45:45 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12azka-0004D3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 12:38:04 +0100 Received: from hs-img-2.compuserve.com ([149.174.177.151] helo=sphmgaab.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12azkU-0004A3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 12:37:59 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by sphmgaab.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id GAA22928 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 06:37:15 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 06:36:45 -0500 From: "Holger 'Geri', DK8KW" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: LF: CONFUSION To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003310637_MC2-9F5D-66C4@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Mal, > There seems to be some confusion about large and small vertical >antennas on LF. >Although the radiation patern(profile) is the same the INTENSITITY of >the propogated signal is much greater from the large vertical given the >same power. I have tested this and found it to be the case. There seems >to be some contradictory opinions but they are only theoritical and I >await someone else to perform a practical field test. ie install a 120 >ft vertical with a suitable antenna resonated for 136 khz , then >dismantle it or lower it to the average 30 feet, re-resonate and check >out the difference. Use the same radial system. >de G3KEV does this mean, it is better to have a large antenna and high power than a small one and QRP? If this is so, it sounds to me like the saying: "Better rich and healthy than poor and sick" ... I fully agree! 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10818 invoked from network); 31 Mar 2000 17:02:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Mar 2000 17:02:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12b4dq-00042P-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 17:51:26 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12b4dk-00041m-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 17:51:20 +0100 Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with esmtp (Exim 2.10 #35) id 12b4cn-0001Ky-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 17:50:23 +0100 Received: from miked by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.8.7.0.R) for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 17:47:29 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal From: "Mike Dennison" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 17:47:26 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz - Rugby In-reply-to: <200003301626_MC2-9F51-866D@compuserve.com> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >As I have not heard a single 73 Ham signal for ages I will put > the beacon on for extended periods during the next few days in the faint > hope that I may get a report from somewhere, even perhaps continental > Europe! 73, Roger, G2AJV. > Roger, Your beacon was 559 with me in Herts, last night. The band gets even quieter tonight when the Decca transmissions at the bottom end go QRT. Now, let's hope there's a period of time before Rugby comes back on. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1525 invoked from network); 31 Mar 2000 17:12:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by teachers.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Mar 2000 17:12:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12b4eD-00044J-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 17:51:49 +0100 Received: from helios.herts.ac.uk ([147.197.200.2]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12b4e8-00043q-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 17:51:44 +0100 Received: from [147.197.200.44] (helo=gemini) by helios.herts.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12b4bA-00005G-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 17:48:40 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <14159.200003311656@gemini> From: "James Moritz" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: University of Hertfordshire To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 17:57:30 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Friday night/cross-band QSO's X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear LF Group, When I last listened, Rugby was still be off the air on 73kHz, so I will be active again on that band tonight, from about 1900utc onwards, with normal CW or QRSS, whichever seems appropriate. I'm sure there are a few stations out there who would like to try a cross-band QSO while Rugby stays off the air. It's a bit difficult to have a 'random' normal CW cross-band QSO without a prior sked being arranged, due to the likelihood of colliding with 136kHz QSO's. Since most CW activity seems to happen below about 137.2 kHz, and slow CW seems to happen above about 137.65, how about having around 137.4 as a temporary calling frequency for cross-band QSOs, just for the duration of Rugby's shut-down? As I recall, this area has been set aside for PSK31, etc., but not many people seem to be set up for these modes as yet. Hope to see you on the air over the weekend, Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24517 invoked from network); 31 Mar 2000 19:27:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by grants.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Mar 2000 19:27:24 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12b6xu-0007wr-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 20:20:18 +0100 Received: from cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.171]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12b6xo-0007wL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 20:20:13 +0100 Received: from modem-23.jewel-puffer.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.33.23] helo=lvm) by cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12b6xZ-0005g9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 20:20:00 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bf9b46$31730220$1721893e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Re. Decca TX. Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 20:16:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Thanks again for various comments.
1) Amp-Metres this is of course understood,but it is not significant since the currents will be adjusted to obtain equal powers in the two ants.
2)Dave ZL3FJ is concerned about co-siting and mutual coupling.I agree but it should be possible to de-tune the big ant. and so long as they are not too close I dont think the mutual will be very significant.However the two ants. could be on separate sites since even the professional ground is not likely to be all that good.
3) Mike G3XDV states that with practical levels of ground loss the lowest angles of radiation are attenuated more on very short verticals than on long ones,OK but 300Ft is still a very short vertical (it would need to be more than 500M long! to be quarter wavelength) So I doubt if there will be ang great difference  between 300 and 60 feet from this cause.
So I still think this a worthwile experiment. Laurie G3AQC.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9388 invoked from network); 31 Mar 2000 19:27:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Mar 2000 19:27:52 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12b6zB-00083I-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 20:21:37 +0100 Received: from ds-img-6.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.139] helo=spdmgaaf.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12b6z5-00080F-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 20:21:31 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaaf.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.9) id OAA13983 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 14:20:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 14:20:23 -0500 From: "Prof R. Jennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz - Rugby To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <200003311420_MC2-9F6B-4FB4@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Geri, I am transmitting at the moment on 71.9 + or - 50Hz . I have to go QRT at 07.45 UT in deference to my 104 year old mother-in-law but should be able to switch on again at about 06.30 UT tomorrow (Saturday). The beacon is at about 5 w.p.m. Good luck and 73, Roger, G2AJV. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3933 invoked from network); 31 Mar 2000 20:33:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by bells.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Mar 2000 20:33:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12b7xx-0004eW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 21:24:25 +0100 Received: from cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.195.175]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12b7xq-0004dr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 21:24:18 +0100 Received: from modem-169.edain.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.169.169] helo=lvm) by cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 12b7xd-0004Gg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 21:24:05 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bf9b4f$24e3e520$a9a9883e@lvm> From: "LAWRENCE MAYHEAD" To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: LF Aerial Circus Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 21:23:31 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Tom,
Glad somebody remembers my antenna rig.It did noble service around the clubs, as well as its main job of evaluating Delta Loop configurations.see RadCom 1974.
The calibrated Rx was stolen some years ago and most of the ants have disapeared over the years Hi. I now use Eznec but  its amazing what could be done with a small ant ground plane etc. 73s Laurie.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1959 invoked from network); 31 Mar 2000 21:51:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by redlabel.core.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Mar 2000 21:51:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12b9CW-0002OU-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 22:43:32 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from fm215.facility.pipex.com ([194.131.104.225]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 12b9CO-0002LN-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 22:43:24 +0100 Received: from isis (useri185.uk.uudial.com [194.69.105.49]) by fm215.facility.pipex.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA03212 for ; Fri, 31 Mar 2000 22:42:30 +0100 (BST) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.20000331224048.009d12e0@mail.pncl.co.uk> X-Sender: blanch@mail.pncl.co.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.0.58 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 22:42:53 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Walter Blanchard" Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz - Rugby In-reply-to: References: <200003301626_MC2-9F51-866D@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Mike, At 17:47 31/03/00 +0100, you wrote: >..................................................................... The >band gets >even quieter tonight when the Decca transmissions at the bottom >end go QRT. ...................... Don't bank on it. They're ceasing full Decca transmissions but many are staying on the air temporarily for other reasons. Walter G3JKV.