From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24093 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 00:32:49 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 00:32:49 +0100 Received: (qmail 20185 invoked from network); 31 Jul 1999 23:35:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Jul 1999 23:35:33 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11AiNO-0002r9-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 00:17:14 +0100 X-Priority: 3 Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11AiNN-0002r4-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 00:17:13 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Sun, 1 Aug 1999 01:17:08 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108219.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.219]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id BAA18296 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 01:17:20 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37A383EF.75CB5E99@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 01:17:03 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF:QRS beacon 137.192 References: <000c01bedb78$a83a3ce0$84eb869f@beachwood.tinet.ie> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Dear Finbar, > Finbar O'Connor wrote: > > QRS BEACON TEST ON 137.192 > KHZ CRYSTAL CONTROLLED. > I have put a qrs beacon on 137.192 khz this afternoon, 2300z : Loud and clear! Despite of QRN parts are audible. Strong QSB. Dot length approx. 3 sec. with unusual gaps between characters. 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24435 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 00:37:15 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 00:37:15 +0100 Received: (qmail 20794 invoked from network); 31 Jul 1999 23:39:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Jul 1999 23:39:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11AiPJ-0002rK-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 00:19:13 +0100 X-Priority: 3 Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11AiPI-0002rF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 00:19:12 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Sun, 1 Aug 1999 01:19:07 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108219.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.219]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id BAA18324 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 01:19:19 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37A38466.65A1B80@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 01:19:02 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: First LF QSO OE - DL References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Dear Ha-Jo, Hans-Joachim Brandt wrote: > As I am living close to the OE5 border radio contact could be established > immediately, it was the first qso of OE5ODL, I got RST 449 and easily could give > RST 569 in spite of rather high afternoon QRN. OE5ODL was located at Ried, > (JN68RF) on the road from Braunau to Wels, and the station had been erected in > connection with a fieldday which is held regularly at about this time of the > year. The distance to my QTH (JN68GN), as measured on a map, was about 78 km. Congrats! Nothing observed here... 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26796 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 00:56:34 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 00:56:34 +0100 Received: (qmail 23224 invoked from network); 31 Jul 1999 23:59:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 31 Jul 1999 23:59:18 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11AiiR-0002zz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 00:38:59 +0100 X-Priority: 3 Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11AiiQ-0002zu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 00:38:58 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Sun, 1 Aug 1999 01:38:38 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108227.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.227]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id BAA18566 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 01:38:49 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37A388F8.874E906A@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 01:38:32 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Complete Scan... References: <000c01bedb72$6c8a24e0$0600a8c0@prstesv1.prestel.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Dear Dave, Dave wrote: > I think it would make a good pattern for a shirt... Thank you, but due to the size it would show a better fit on trousers... 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27168 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 07:07:34 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 07:07:34 +0100 Received: (qmail 24456 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 06:10:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 06:10:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11AoOJ-0005VW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 06:42:35 +0100 Received: from smtp3.xs4all.nl ([194.109.127.49]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11AoOI-0005VR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 06:42:34 +0100 Received: from v3q4v1 (dc2-isdn1731.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.154.195]) by smtp3.xs4all.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA21803 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 07:42:33 +0200 (CEST) From: "M. Sanders" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: re:QRS beacon 137.192 Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 07:40:06 +0200 Message-ID: <000001bedbe0$4f6f3d00$c39a6dc2@v3q4v1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <000c01bedb78$a83a3ce0$84eb869f@beachwood.tinet.ie> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Dear Finbar, Your signals have been identified on spectogram at 0530utc. I am not 100% shure but almost every day this week around the same time i observed a slowly drifting signal around 136.2 and it is not there today so this is most likely to be your signal. I will monitor your signal until it fades or until you stop transmitting and will report later via the reflector. Best 73's and good luck on LF, Michael Sanders, PA3BSH mailto:pa3bsh@amsat.org -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: majordom@post.thorcom.com [mailto:majordom@post.thorcom.com]namens Finbar O'Connor Verzonden: zaterdag 31 juli 1999 19:17 Aan: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Onderwerp: LF: re:QRS beacon 137.192 QRS BEACON TEST ON 137.192 KHZ CRYSTAL CONTROLLED. I have put a qrs beacon on 137.192 khz this afternoon, using a crystal I found in the junk box , for 8777 khz/64 to give on air frequency of 137.192 khz. Running 3 amps. Hope this will make up for the drifting signal when I had the beacon running during the week. I have modified my memory keyer with a few resistors to slow down the repeating EI0CF callsign, but I am not sure if I have got the timing right. best regards Finbar EI0CF. p.s. I will leave it running until Sunday lunchtime ,ie about 1300 utc. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4181 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 08:44:32 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 08:44:32 +0100 Received: (qmail 31995 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 07:47:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 07:47:16 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Aq49-0006FE-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 08:29:53 +0100 Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.39]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Aq48-0006F9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 08:29:52 +0100 Received: from rgcomms.demon.co.uk ([193.237.77.63] helo=default) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 11Aq47-000IqE-0B for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 07:29:51 +0000 Message-ID: <000c01bedbef$5b627b40$3f4dedc1@default> From: "Graham Phillips" To: "RSGB L.F. Group" Subject: LF: DF2PY Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 08:13:38 +0100 Organization: rgcomms MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi all, I managed a 100 % QSO with Wolf, DF2PY this morning, even exchanging the WX ! Previously he has only been able to copy anything of me with great difficulty, so has improved his RX set-up considerably. Stations that have given-up calling him should take heart, and try again ! 73 de G3XTZ. Graham B. Phillips - G3XTZ. g3xtz@rgcomms.demon.co.uk From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5482 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 09:02:40 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 09:02:40 +0100 Received: (qmail 821 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 08:05:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 08:05:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11AqSM-0006P0-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 08:54:54 +0100 X-Priority: 3 Received: from mailout00.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.148]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11AqSM-0006Ov-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 08:54:54 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from fwd00.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.160]) by mailout00.btx.dtag.de with smtp id 11AqSF-00012z-00; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 09:54:48 +0200 Received: (320057114934-0001(btxid)@[62.158.47.212]) by fwd00.btx.dtag.de id ; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 09:54:31 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 09:54:31 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: DK7UY@geocities.com Subject: LF: Sunday am X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Sender: 320057114934-0001@t-online.de From: "DF2PY" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: hello Lowfers ! Sunday morning gave another nice fast-cw qso with Graham G3XTZ peaking to 559 here in the Frankfurt area.And a first fast-cw qso with Geri- dk8kw -whatever he did,it sure improved his signal way beyond noiselevel.Have to qrt now to help df8pj to get on LF. BTW Dave, i liked Your "more power ,Igor ! "-comment,sounds like two Russians operating a nuclear power pile- hi. good dx and a nice sunday to everyone on LF ! de wolf From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17168 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 11:08:16 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 11:08:16 +0100 Received: (qmail 13658 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 10:11:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 10:11:00 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11AsFt-0007Ak-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 10:50:09 +0100 Received: from post.webmailer.de ([192.67.198.38]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11AsFq-0007Ae-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 10:50:06 +0100 Received: from i6h2d3 (dialup-212.162.12.38.frankfurt1.mik.net [212.162.12.38]) by post.webmailer.de (8.9.3/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA25216 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 11:50:01 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <003001bedbfa$d1cf8e20$260ca2d4@i6h2d3> From: "Andreas Tschammer" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: QRS beacon 137.192 Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 11:48:59 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------010507070608050008020002" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------010507070608050008020002 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Hi Finbar an the group,
 
today (01. Aug. 99 / 0830UTC) I received EI0CF on 137.192 KHz. The noise-level was very low this morning.
 
my Rig:
 
KWZ 30 DSP-Receiver, BW = 50 Hz, noise-floor: -139 dBm (BW=50Hz)
 
Gram 5.08, 5500Hz, 16bit, mono, 60dB-scale, time scale 500ms,
16384-FFT, 10x average,--- S/N: +15 dB
 

Ant: GPA50 (Fritzel, abt 4m long) on top of the bungalow-roof, with           the cable-capacity compensated by a 500 yH-series-choke.
 
noise-level (60s average in 50 Hz BW): -130 dBm
 
just for comparison DCF39: -65 dBm
 
The attached JPG (8kb) shows what the signal from Finbar looked like with the above GRAM-parameters.
 

73
Andreas in Rheinbach near Bonn, JO30LO
DL2KCL
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12:51:23 +0100 Received: (qmail 25194 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 11:54:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 11:54:09 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Au0s-0007tF-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 12:42:46 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as-img-5.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.148] helo=spamgaae.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Au0r-0007tA-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 12:42:45 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaae.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.3) id HAA14890 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 07:42:44 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 07:41:27 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: Weekend report 31.7.99/01.08.99 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <199908010741_MC2-7F46-82C9@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello, frinds of the long wave, wow! What a weekend! For me surely the most active and most succesful weekend since I started LF operation. Hopefully I am not the new crocodile in town now. I called cq and was called by stations that heard me much better than I heard them. I even was called by stations that heard me but that I could not hear. So, this leaves some room for improvement. Slow-CW: Finally I managed to get Bernd,DF8ZR in the log on Friday night. Saw "the usual suspects" calling cq or calling each other (DF3LP, DJ5BV, G3XDV, clearly detectable by his typical signal coming up from the cellar stabilizing 2nd floor after a few dashes, Mike, your signal was very good on Sunday morning!) Normal CW: Well, this was the most successful operation mode for me this weekend. Saturday, July 31, 1999 worked ON7YD (-105 dB, equivalent to S5 (S9=100 uV) worked DJ2LF (signal only 1 dB above noise floor, so only 329, very weak but we managed somehow) workedPA0LEG (forgot to measure his signal strength, gave 449) worked PA0SE (finally managed to have a QSO with Dick, -97 dB) heard DL3FDO (but was not able to raise his attention) Sunday, August 1, 1999 worked G3XTZ (-104 dB, thank you for you patience, Grahame, and thanks for the 349) worked DF2PY (-86 dB!, finally Wolf was able to hear me above the noise level, what have you done to improve your reception, Wolf?) Reception reports: I received some reception reports, one from Steve, GW4ALG, who heard my normal CW QSO with DJ2LF yesterday (880 km away!), and by Ha-Jo, DJ1ZB, who heard the same QSO. He tried to call me, but I was not able to copy him (congrats btw, Ha-Jo on the first DL/OE QSO, I heard nothing from the OE5-dxpedition). Also Dave, G3YXM reported that he heard my CW signal. I also was not able to copy EI0CF's bacon on 137.192, I saw a weak signal right in between two LORAN-lones, but I was not able to positively identify his callsign. What have I done to improve my signal? So, what have I done to improve my signal? Well, basically I switched from a low-hanging Marconi T-antenna (8 to 12m high, antenna partly hanging in trees) to a free-standing umbrella antenna, 15m high, with four top-load radials. Two of the radials are still too long, following the advise of DF3LP and DJ1ZB (thanks) I already shortened two, which brought up the signal by 3 or 4 dB (according to Peter, DF3LP). I will work on the other top-load radials soon. When the top-load radials come close to leaves or trees, I have the same burning and flashing effect that was described bhy others earlier this week. The fibre-glas mast is a telescopic mast made by Van der Ley, maximum height is 18m (so far I only dare to lift it up to 15m), bottom diameter is about 60mm, top section 20mm. It takes less than 15 seconds to lower it and push it up again (very conveneint for experiments). The antenna consists of a 1.5 mm^2 Litz wire, strapped to the mast. The top-load radials consist of two parallel litz wires, 1mm diameter each, 2mm seperated (there is no particular reason for that, I just had enogh of that twin-wire available). All in all it is still a relatively simple setup and qualifies for a "backyard-setup", although my garden is slightly larger (30m x 40m). A sketch of my antenna setup can be found on my homepage (http://www.dk8kw.home.pages.de), follow the link "Details of my station". Best 73, thanks to those who called and work me, and those who called me in vain: hope to hear or work you next! Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28664 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 12:56:33 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 12:56:33 +0100 Received: (qmail 25936 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 11:59:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 11:59:18 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Au59-0007tk-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 12:47:11 +0100 X-Priority: 3 Received: from mailout04.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.152]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Au57-0007tf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 12:47:09 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from fwd02.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.162]) by mailout04.btx.dtag.de with smtp id 11Au56-0004eR-00; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 13:47:08 +0200 Received: (087321565-0001(btxid)@[193.158.170.4]) by fwd02.btx.dtag.de id ; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 13:47:02 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 13:47:02 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <37A38466.65A1B80@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Subject: Re: LF: First LF QSO OE - DL X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Sender: 087321565-0001@t-online.de From: "Hans-Joachim Brandt" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Lbr Peter, danke fuer die congrats. Nachdem die Botschaft von OE5EEP per QSP hier auf dem Server erschien, war ich natuerlich vorbereitet. Leider sind die OEs erst am Nachmittag aufs Band gekommen, als das QRN schon merklich hoch war. Nach mir haben die auch noch DL1SAN hoeren und arbeiten koennen, habe ich heute morgen von ihm erfahren. Sie gaben ihm 419. War wenigstens gut, dass der Operateur ein QRP-Mann und leise Signale gewohnt war. Was denen jetzt sicher fehlt, ist ein QTH, wo man eine Antenne bleibend aufbauen kann. Gestern habe ich noch einmal mit dem isolierten Radialnetz auf LF gearbeitet und am vormittag damit auch HB9ASB erreicht, wie ueblich. Aber nach dem QSO mit OE5ODL wollte meine Frau anfangen zu maehen, und da habe ich es abgebaut. Inzwischen habe ich auch gesehen, dass ich meinen Anschluss fuer die Erde nicht unbedingt durchs Kellerfenster zum Hauserder fuehren muss. Ich kann ebensogut an den Aussenwasserhahn gehen; die Leitung ist dann zwar etwas laenger, aber die lange Welle merkt es noch nicht. Es erweist sich doch als sehr positiv, dass dieses 1948 gebaute Haus vor wenigen Jahren auch in der elektrischen Verdrahtung grundueberholt worden ist, einen schoenen Hauserder hat, an den auch die Wasser- und Heizungsrohre gelegt sind. Diese Vergleiche im QSO-Fahren zwischen Hauserder und isoliertem Radialnetz waren fuer mich wichtig. Wenn man also einen niedrigen Erdwiderstand mit der Bruecke misst, dann gilt der offensichtlich fuer die Guete der Abstrahlung, unabhaengig davon, was fuer eine Erde das war. Wenn DF2PY mal geaeussert hat, durch das Auslegen von chickenwire sei bei ihm zwar nicht der Antennenstrom angestiegen, aber ein Feldstaerkemessgeraet haette mehr angezeigt, dann heisst das sicher nur, dass die Strahlungskeule von der Antenne her noch flacher verlaeuft. Es ist aber die Frage, ob wir das brauchen. Oder die Ankopplung an den Feldstaerkemesser ist einfach besser geworden. Heute hat DF2PY immerhin den DK8KW in normaler CW gehoert und gearbeitet. DK8KW kann ich jetzt auch ganz leise in normaler CW hoeren. Jedenfalls moechte ich meinen, wenn ihr mal euren Langwellen-Fieldday veranstalten wollt, dann braucht ihr nicht die ganze Gegend dort aufzugraben. Dann koennt ihr im Minimum ca 20 isolierte Litzendraehte auf den Boden legen und die so lang machen, wie Platz und Geld reichen. Einen Erdspiess einfacher Art sollte man aber wohl vorsehen, einmal, um (vielleicht ueber 1-5 kOhm) das isolierte Radialnetz zu erden, zum anderen, um eine Sicherheitsfunkenstrecke von der Antenne her dorthin zu verbinden. Erste Erfahrungen mit solchen Antennenspannungen habt ihr ja schon. Ich werde demnaechst meine ersten verzinkten Eisendraehte flach in den Rasen einbetten und mit denen mal messen, so lange es draussen noch nicht zu kalt ist. Vielleicht kann ich meinen Hauserder noch etwas verbessern; auf jeden Fall lerne ich sicher noch dazu. Leider beginnt im August wieder meine "Reisezeit" und ist besonders im September sehr intensiv. Am Abend des 16.9. werde ich 21.10 Uhr mit dem Flugzeug in Kiel ankommen (von Nizza ueber Frankfurt/Main), dort uebernachten und am naechsten Mittag vom Oslokai aus mit der DARC-Delegation per Faehre nach Lillehammer mitfahren. Hoffe, dass diesen Faehren jetzt so schnell nichts mehr passiert. Nach dem Gesetz der Wahrscheinlichkeit muesste das so sein, wo beide kurz nacheinander ihren Unfall hatten. Weiter alles Gute. 73 Ha-Jo, DJ1ZB Peter W. Schnoor schrieb: > Dear Ha-Jo, > > Hans-Joachim Brandt wrote: > > > As I am living close to the OE5 border radio contact could be established > > immediately, it was the first qso of OE5ODL, I got RST 449 and easily could > give > > RST 569 in spite of rather high afternoon QRN. OE5ODL was located at Ried, > > (JN68RF) on the road from Braunau to Wels, and the station had been erected > in > > connection with a fieldday which is held regularly at about this time of the > > year. The distance to my QTH (JN68GN), as measured on a map, was about 78 > km. > > Congrats! Nothing observed here... > > 54dg16'N / 10dg04'E, JO54ag > 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3471 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 13:42:27 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 13:42:27 +0100 Received: (qmail 31122 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 12:45:13 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 12:45:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Auom-0008Eb-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 13:34:20 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from premium.inrete.it ([194.116.9.4] helo=mailer.inrete.it ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Auoj-0008EW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 13:34:19 +0100 Received: from cel266 (pool17-003.dialup.alpcom.it [194.116.17.3]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA01812 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 14:34:06 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19990801133323.008f6dd0@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 13:33:23 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: LF: Sunday morning activity In-reply-to: <2.2.32.19990125212552.007189dc@pop.ivm.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello all, after some months of QRT, this morning QSO in QRSs with Gerd DJ5BV. Reports M-M. Low QRN up to 1000z; continuous "cracks" at S9 (35 dB/uV) in the afternoon. Marco Bruno - IK1ODO spin@inrete.it SPIN Electronics - www.spin-it.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6562 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 18:34:31 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 18:34:31 +0100 Received: (qmail 32497 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 17:37:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 17:37:18 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Az89-0001SS-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 18:10:37 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from email-aon.highway.telekom.at ([195.3.96.71] helo=SSP1NO21.highway.telekom.at) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Az87-0001SN-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 18:10:36 +0100 Received: from qsl.net (N195P029.dipool.highway.telekom.at [195.3.120.93]) by SSP1NO21.highway.telekom.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA11852; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 19:10:17 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37A47F3C.E268DAB6@qsl.net> Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 19:09:16 +0200 From: "Heinz Schnait" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en]C-NECCK (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org, "Gerhard Parzonka" Subject: LF: Summary of the OE Activity of July 31, 1999 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hallo all,

The OE activity of July 31 was a joint effort of the members of the local chapter of the OeVSV (ADL 511) in the city of Voecklabruck. As in previous years we had our club's summer field day in Schildorn at the home of Ossi, OE5ODL, and his YL Lydia, OE5LMO. It's a hill top QTH in JN68RF with a great view of the surrounding country side of the Innviertel. People came after lunch and set up several stations. There was a barbecue in the late afternoon and a social program till late night.

At our summer field day we usually show and test the previous years yield on finished home-brew projects. This years main activity was focused to get on 136kHz. Our host Ossi had already set up an antenna he called a 470 meter Marconi. Its entirely a wire antenna running 13m vertically up a wooden pole then 40m horizontally to another wooden mast on the rooftop. >From there it runs to a loading coil on top of the garden house with 14 turns of 16m (square coil with 4 meters on each side). From there it runs back to the house and is connected to a 80m horizontal loop in abt 13m height whose ends are tied together as a capacitive load. The total length of wire is about 470 meters. As counterpoise there were several radials laid out on the ground ranging from 20 to 100m and the lightning ground, rain gutters and down spouts were all tied together. The site looked like a copper mine after this installation. I will publish a drawing of this antenna and photos from the field day on my web site <www.qsl.net/oe5eep>.

I have built the transmitter after schematics from Dave's, G3YXM, web site <www.picks.force9.co.uk/136.htm>. Thanks Dave for your support and all your e-mails! Without your help the transmitter would not have been ready in time for the field day. Peter, OE5PGL, built the VFO and added the finishing touches to my breadboard constructed transmitter. He also built a preselector/preamplifier.

The receiver was an FT1000MP. Although one of the better Japanese black boxes it was not sensitive enough for LF. A converter was supplied by Josef, OE5RJL, during the afternoon and substantially improved the S/N ratio. We also had a military surplus LF receiver of WW2 "Langwellen Anton". Although the FT1000MP had about ten times more knobs and switches on its front panel the 55-year-old Langwellen Anton performed better regarding sensitivity. The plus of the FT1000MP was its filters. The station was manned mainly by Peter, OE5PGL, but others also operated from time to time (our host OE5ODL, OE5RJL, ...) Unfortunately I myself could not join the operation because of family duties.

Operation started at 12.45 UTC and DJ1ZB, HaJo was our first QSO. Later we worked DL1SAN from Ulm. There was a rather high noise level in the late afternoon. We could hear several stations calling us but could not establish 2-way QSO's with them. If anybody has copied our signals please let us know via e-mail or via QSL-buro.

Future activities: After some reconstruction of the transmitter, like addition of a high-SWR-protection to the final, inclusion of adequate fuses in the supply line (I blew a power supply when accidentally keying the transmitter in an open load) and last-not-least putting everything in an enclosure we will be back on the air. The antenna is still up (at least until the next storm) and we hope to be on the air on one of next weekends. This time we will start in the early morning hours. I also want to look into computerized reception (want to get those fancy waterfall plots!). We also might build a second transmitter to work from different sites. I will inform about all upcoming activities via this list.

Questions: Does anybody know how to calculate/estimate/measure the efficiency of our wire antenna to determine our ERP power?
Does anybody know of previous OE activities on 136kHz or is ours the very first OE-DL contact as some of our QSO partners say?

So much for today and we'll be back, promise!

73 Heinz

Heinz Schnait, OE5EEP
Pfarrer-Schuster-Platz 1
A-4863 Seewalchen
<oe5eep@qsl.net>
 
  From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19831 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 23:29:09 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 23:29:09 +0100 Received: (qmail 17295 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 22:31:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 22:31:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11B3v5-0003JJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 23:17:27 +0100 Received: from rhenium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.93]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11B3v4-0003JE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 23:17:27 +0100 Received: from [62.6.7.41] (helo=default) by rhenium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 11B3v3-000636-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 23:17:26 +0100 Message-ID: <000201bedc6b$56091600$2907063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Class E RF amplifiers Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 23:12:55 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi all, I dug out a copy of an article by Nathan Sokal (Pres. of Design Automation) that was published in Design Electronics on 20 Sept 1977 titled "Class E can boost efficiency". This turns out to be a very practical article with simple design formulae, and a 'build it and play' circuit with example scope traces of current and voltage waveforms. The test circuit is to run at 10 MHz but the detail looks eminently suited to 136kHz. Efficiencies of 82 to 95% are quoted for some very ordinary transistors and FETs. There is no formula given for the RF Choke but I think that can be scaled from the 10MHz value. I know some have Class E stages already, but this may be a help to others to get the parameters right. It looks as though I no longer have the original magazine, but it looks as though the copy I have will re-copy. Anyone interested.......if there are too many, can anyone offer to scan it in? Though there may be a copyright problem there even on a 22 year old article. I have a sneaking suspicion the gentleman is a Ham, though he didn't admit to it in the corresponece I had with him in the late 70s or in the article. I wonder if Andre knows? In the meantime I'm willing to snail-mail copies (until the Bank Manager objects) 73 de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20275 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 23:32:25 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 23:32:25 +0100 Received: (qmail 17738 invoked from network); 1 Aug 1999 22:35:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 1 Aug 1999 22:35:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11B3v3-0003JC-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 23:17:25 +0100 Received: from rhenium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.93]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11B3v2-0003J7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 01 Aug 1999 23:17:25 +0100 Received: from [62.6.7.41] (helo=default) by rhenium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 11B3uz-000636-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 1 Aug 1999 23:17:22 +0100 Message-ID: <000101bedc6b$53b5fe40$2907063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: DX Cluster postings w/e 31 July/1 Aug. at GB7DXM Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 22:28:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi all Saturday seemed to be another fairly quiet morning with the static not building up until after 1500Z. A QRS cq from DK8KW was logged at 0421Z and again finishing at 0444Z. The first was just readable would be the lowest report from me ( T ?) The second call was mashed up by the noise but was on the same freq and had elements of Geri's call (bear in mind Geri that most active stations in the UK would receive up to 20dB better than I do) At least one other station detected slightly higher in frequency at 0640Z maybe this was DF3LP, but the signal was right in the noise with me and I was unable to reliably distinguish call letters. I heard G8RW at hand speed at 1312Z at better strength than I normally hear him. I only discovered Finbar had crystallized his beacon (hope it tastes good Finbar ) late on Saturday evening by which time nothing was heard or seen on the waterfall display, through the static crashes. An all night log of the QRS end of the band shows his signal 'popping' out of the noise 0010Z, with a complete call in the clear ('O') at 0140Z. The signal was visible here until 0730Z though never as good a strength. It could be seen with a little imagination up to 1100Z though not at a fully readable strength. Also heard at good strength were Steve GW4ALG, and G3YXM, and I think John G4GVC though I didn't record his call (so used to hearing John I recognise his fist) G8RW called CQ at 0837Z with the strongest signal I have ever heard from him. I note an entry from Alain on Sunday so maybe he has got his wire working properly now. It will be nice to get spots from France. Posting from the Dx Cluster GB7DXM as follows:- G3NYK de GB7DXM 1-Aug-1999 2031Z Type H or ? for help > 137.7 IK1ODO 1-Aug-1999 0941Z in qso with me 137.0 DF8ZR 1-Aug-1999 0910Z cq 136.4 DJ1ZB 1-Aug-1999 0742Z qso with dl9em 137.7 HB9ASB 1-Aug-1999 0738Z cq slow-cw 136.5 PA0LEG 31-Jul-1999 0608Z 137.7 G3XDV 31-Jul-1999 1123Z Slow-CW "M" 136.6 DL3FDO 31-Jul-1999 0920Z cq 136.5 DJ1ZB 31-Jul-1999 0906Z cq 137.7 DK8KW 30-Jul-1999 1623Z CQ SLOW-CW "O" 137.0 G4GVC 30-Jul-1999 0632Z 539 G3NYK de GB7DXM 1-Aug 2034Z > 1800.0 DJ5BV 1-Aug-1999 1133Z 137.7 KHz slow CW 1800.0 DF2PY 1-Aug-1999 1106Z 137.0 KHz cq cq 1800.0 GW4ALG 1-Aug-1999 0948Z 136.8khz cq 1800.0 GW4ALG 1-Aug-1999 0847Z cw 137.67khz 1800.0 DJ5BV 1-Aug-1999 0830Z QRS 'O' at 0646Z jo02pb 1800.0 G3XTZ 28-Jul-1999 2035Z beacon cw 136.00khz G3NYK de GB7DXM 1-Aug 2036Z > Cheers de Alan G3NYK locator JO02PB Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18015 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 03:24:31 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 03:24:31 +0100 Received: (qmail 14759 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 02:27:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 02:27:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11B7QL-0004wi-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 03:01:57 +0100 Received: from teapot25.domain0.bigpond.com ([139.134.5.173]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11B7QK-0004wd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 03:01:56 +0100 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by teapot25.domain0.bigpond.com (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id oa191192 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 11:59:43 +1000 Received: from MOIP-A-003-pool-134.tmns.net.au ([139.134.91.134]) by mail0.bigpond.com (Claudes-Protective-MailRouter V2.4c 13/83825); 02 Aug 1999 11:59:43 Message-ID: <000d01bedc8a$e4a0e5e0$865b868b@zimslaptop> From: "Graeme Zimmer" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000201bedc6b$56091600$2907063e@default> Subject: LF: Re: Class E RF amplifiers Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 12:01:09 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi Alan, > Hi all, I dug out a copy of an article by Nathan Sokal (Pres. of Design > Automation) that was published in Design Electronics on 20 Sept 1977 titled > "Class E can boost efficiency". I would be happy to scan it for you, if you would be kind enought to post me a copy.... Lots of interest in LF here in VK lately as well... Address is: Graeme Zimmer PO Box 483 Traralgon Vic 3844 AUSTRALIA 73's ........... Zim ............ (Graeme Zimmer).............VK3GJZ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20786 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 08:36:27 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 08:36:27 +0100 Received: (qmail 17084 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 07:39:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 07:39:17 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BCPj-00071G-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 08:21:39 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bw85zhb.bluewin.ch ([195.186.1.75]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BCPg-00071A-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 08:21:37 +0100 Received: from phonakcom.ch ([195.186.13.116]) by bw85zhb.bluewin.ch ( with ESMTP id AAA49B9 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 09:21:23 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37A546F4.7A2B4941@phonakcom.ch> Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 09:21:24 +0200 From: "Toni Bdrtschi" Organization: Phonak Communications AG X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [de] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Mystery VLF signals in Italy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: >From HB9ASB, JN36pt I've never seen a response to Marcos query about the signal on 1025 Hz. Here a possible explanation: Of course I can see and hear the signal, like many others in the VLF/ULF range, at my QTH. They are coming over the mains but I can receive them also fro the air with my 136 kHz aerial and detect them with my receiver and the soundcard and spectrogram. The sources - at least here in Switzerland - are well known. The signals are generated by our power stations and feed into the mains to control street lamps, electricity counters in the households (different day/night charges for the kWh) and other devices. Here they are using thyristor or motor-generators with 60kw/22kV connected via a serial LC to the medium voltage grid. The rectangular pulses with 600ms intervals are coming in packets with 6 bits (including a startbit) Different frequencies from 200Hz to 2kHz are in use. The durations of these control signal emissions are normally between 10s and 100s and the time depends on the local Power Company. The system exists since 1950 and is known under RSS (Rundsteuersignale). The signal which switches my day/night charge at 21:00 UT and 05:00 UT is so strong that I can hear it trough the loudspeaker of some old radio receivers (especially tube type, produced before 1950) or even directly out of some transformers! May be, this is an explanation for the mystery signal in Italy on 1025 Hz. 73 de Toni From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25850 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 09:06:29 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 09:06:29 +0100 Received: (qmail 22944 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 08:09:19 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 08:09:19 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BCya-0007Dw-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 08:57:40 +0100 Received: from artemis.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.126]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BCyZ-0007Dr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 08:57:39 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from harrier.le.ac.uk ([143.210.8.56]) by artemis.le.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 11BCyf-0001jd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 08:57:45 +0100 Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 08:57:45 +0100 (BST) From: "Kate Moore" X-Sender: mek@harrier To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Weekend report Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Stations worked here over the weekend on 136kHz using normal speed CW: Friday 23/7 GM3YXM/P (13.43UT: gave him 579, he gave me 579), EI0CF (18.05: 579, 569). Saturday 24/7 GM3YXM/P (06.59: 57/89, 57/89), PA0SE (07.10: 57/89, 57/89 [-83dBm]). Sunday 25/7 GM3YXM/P (08.00: 57/89, 579). I was fairly inactive again this weekend and when I was about, activity seemed very low. This was a pity 'cos Dave was back up in Southwest Scotland, putting out an excellent signal but having to work hard to get contacts. Static levels were lower than they have been recently, but I am suffering with some low-level buzz from what appears to be a SMPSU close by, so my background noise level varies quite a lot at the moment and I can't always hear the weakest DX. I found Finbar's beacon on Saturday evening just above 136.700kHz at around S4/5, and it was still audible above the SMPSU early Sunday norning. Apparently this was running QRP with about 1A antenna current. Later when he moved it to around 136.165kHz it came up to a nice S6. I was very interested in the comments from Bob ZL2CA last weekend about horizontal antennas on LF. Probably the most successful DXer on 136kHz (especially when you take into account TX power) is Reino OH1TN, and as most of you will know, he uses a very long and predominantly horizontal wire (although it is reasonably high too). As I have now been heard in HS6.... (!! - no, it WASN'T me who put that spot on the cluster, but I will gladly QSL...) Seriously though, I have always used mostly horizontal wires on 73 and 136kHz and my earliest configuration had almost no vertical component, despite a number of people at that time suggesting it wouldn't work. It's interesting that I was using this when I was the first person outside the Baltic area to receive Reino, back in December '97. The DX QSOs I've been making with my present antenna (which is still quite low and mostly horizontal) show that even relatively short horizontal antennas do work well on LF. In addition, I've noticed that my receive signal to noise ratio often seems better than that of stations using big vertical antennas, although there could be other reasons for this. Traditionally, the horizontal sections of LF antennas have been considered a necessary evil to provide loading, but I feel that, especially for amateur work, horizontal antennas can provide extremely good results in their own right. Regards John G4GVC near Leicester, IO92JP ** TX: Synth + 400W RF from modified 'G3YXM' Mosfet PA ** ** RX: TS-850S with 3 x CW filters and 0.5ppm TCXO ** ** Ant: Inv-L 60m long, 6m high at feed end, 12m high at far end ** From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25865 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 09:06:34 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 09:06:34 +0100 Received: (qmail 22968 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 08:09:24 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 08:09:24 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BCyf-0007E3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 08:57:45 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BCye-0007Dy-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 08:57:44 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id KAA11695 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 10:03:38 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990802095858.2ca79558@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 09:58:58 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Summary of the OE Activity of July 31, 1999 In-reply-to: <37A47F3C.E268DAB6@qsl.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: >Questions: Does anybody know how to calculate/estimate/measure the >efficiency of our wire antenna to determine our ERP power? >Does anybody know of previous OE activities on 136kHz or is ours the >very first OE-DL contact as some of our QSO partners say? The antenna is rather unusual but if you look at it as a 'Marconi' then you should have an almost infinite topload (compared to the 13m vertical section). The radiation resistance of a short vertical monopole with infinite topload is Ra = 160 x (Pi * l/L)^2 where Ra = radiation resistance, Pi = 3.1415... , l = antenna height, L = wavelength and ^2 = squared. So as a 'wild guess' I would estimate Ra as 0.055 Ohms (55 milliOhms). Your ERP further depends on the antennacurrent (Ia) : ERP = Ra x Ia^2 73, Rik ON7YD Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2342 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 09:32:30 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 09:32:30 +0100 Received: (qmail 28852 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 08:35:20 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 08:35:20 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BDOH-0007Rp-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 09:24:13 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BDOG-0007Rk-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 09:24:12 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id KAA11046 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 10:30:05 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990802102525.2c9f0ad2@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 10:25:25 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: weekend report 30/07 - 01/08 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: stations 'seen' in slow-CW : HB9ASB (529), DJ5BV (559) stations heard in normal CW : PA0LEG (579), DK8KW (529), DJ5BV (559), GW4ALG (549), G4GVC (549), G3YXM (579), G3XTZ (579), DL3FDO (539), G3BDQ (539), DF2PY (579), EI0CF (439) Geri (DK8KW) improved his signal with at least 6dB over the last weeks and we had a nice normal CW QSO. Also GW4ALG had a very strong signal into Belgium, suppose he was playing with balloons ... 73, Rik Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13905 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 10:19:41 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 10:19:41 +0100 Received: (qmail 6822 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 09:22:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 09:22:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BE4j-0007mW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 10:08:05 +0100 Received: from [143.179.236.32] (helo=Lesothosaurus.big-orange.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BE4i-0007mJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 10:08:04 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 ([143.179.150.252]) by Lesothosaurus.big-orange.net (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with SMTP id AAA4B78 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 11:06:46 +0200 Message-ID: <002001bedcc7$179cb0a0$fc96b38f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Class E RF amplifiers Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 11:11:18 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: >From PA0SE to All Alan Melia wrote: >Hi all, I dug out a copy of an article by Nathan Sokal (Pres. of Design >Automation) that was published in Design Electronics on 20 Sept 1977 titled >"Class E can boost efficiency". >This turns out to be a very practical article with simple design formulae, >and a 'build it and play' circuit with example scope traces of current and >voltage waveforms. The test circuit is to run at 10 MHz but the detail looks >eminently suited to 136kHz. Efficiencies of 82 to 95% are quoted for some >very ordinary transistors and FETs. There is no formula given for the RF >Choke but I think that can be scaled from the 10MHz value. > >I know some have Class E stages already, but this may be a help to others to >get the parameters right. It looks as though I no longer have the original >magazine, but it looks as though the copy I have will re-copy. Anyone >interested.......if there are too many, can anyone offer to scan it in? >Though there may be a copyright problem there even on a 22 year old article. >I have a sneaking suspicion the gentleman is a Ham, though he didn't admit >to it in the corresponece I had with him in the late 70s or in the article. >I wonder if Andre knows? >In the meantime I'm willing to snail-mail copies (until the Bank Manager >objects) Useful information on class D, E and F amplifiers with references to the original articles can also be found in Technical Topics by G3VA in Radio Communication of: August 1997 p. 77 October 1996 p. 77 73, Dick, PA0SE From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29484 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 11:22:02 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 11:22:02 +0100 Received: (qmail 20110 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 10:24:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 10:24:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BF5y-0008Iy-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 11:13:26 +0100 X-Priority: 3 Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BF5x-0008It-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 11:13:25 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Mon, 2 Aug 1999 12:12:51 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108140.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.140]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA09319 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 12:13:04 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37A56F1D.59BF8764@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 12:12:45 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Class E RF amplifiers References: <002001bedcc7$179cb0a0$fc96b38f@w8k3f0> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello to all, Dick Rollema wrote: > Useful information on class D, E and F amplifiers with references to the > original articles can also be found in Technical Topics by G3VA in Radio > Communication of: > > August 1997 p. 77 > > October 1996 p. 77 Looking for articles on class D and E amplifiers earlier this year I collected some there: ftp://ftp.rz.uni-kiel.de/pub/nephro/nephlab/lp/MosFet-PA/ (all in ACROBAT format) 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21851 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 12:50:34 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 12:50:34 +0100 Received: (qmail 13488 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 11:53:25 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 11:53:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BGR4-0000Nq-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 12:39:18 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from premium.inrete.it ([194.116.9.4] helo=mailer.inrete.it ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BGR3-0000Nl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 12:39:17 +0100 Received: from cel266 (pool17-129.dialup.alpcom.it [194.116.17.129]) by mailer.inrete.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id NAA19712 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 13:39:11 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19990802123859.02bccaf0@mailer.inrete.it> X-Sender: spin@mailer.inrete.it X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 12:38:59 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "M. Bruno" Subject: Re: LF: Mystery VLF signals in Italy In-reply-to: <37A546F4.7A2B4941@phonakcom.ch> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: At 09.21 02/08/99 +0200, you wrote: >>>From HB9ASB, JN36pt > >I've never seen a response to Marcos query about the signal on 1025 Hz. >Here a possible explanation: > >Of course I can see and hear the signal, like many others in the VLF/ULF >range, at my QTH. >They are coming over the mains but I can receive them also fro the air >with my 136 kHz aerial and detect them with my receiver and the >soundcard and spectrogram. The sources - at least here in Switzerland - >are well known. The signals are generated by our power stations and feed >into the mains to control street lamps, electricity counters in the >households (different day/night charges for the kWh) and other devices. >................ Thanks to Tony for the explanation. In effect I had no other responses, except one from Gamal Soegiono, noting the use of 687 Hz in Germany for the same purpose. Well, mistery solved ... but there are a few more man-made signals around 50 Hz. I will post a message in next days. Thank you again, Toni. 73 - Marco IK1ODO spin@inrete.it Rivalta, ITALY JN35SA (N 45 01' 25.6", E 7 31' 09.4") From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12982 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 14:25:29 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 14:25:29 +0100 Received: (qmail 9578 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 13:28:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 13:28:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BHwk-00016a-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 14:16:06 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BHwj-00016V-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 14:16:05 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #34) id 11BIqb-0002nK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 14:13:50 +0000 Received: from miked.rsgbhq [192.168.2.30] by rsgb.org.uk [192.168.2.132] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 14:13:09 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Radio Society of Great Britain To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 14:15:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Weekend Report 31/7 - 1/8 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Pleased to read so many reports of successes this weekend, especially from DL and OE. Unfortunately, not such a good weekend for me! Saturday 31 July Got up at 0620UTC but bad noise from next door at S9. Despite this, saw QRSs from DJ5BV ('O') and HB9ASB ('M') on Spectrogram screen. Also heard G3YXM and G4GVC at 599. Put out a couple of QRSs calls but noise too bad. Heard GW4ALG (589) after noise stopped at 1100. QRN bad after lunch. Sunday 1 August Got up at 0510UTC. Noise on again and lasted all day. Heard G3XTZ (5 9+20 9), GW4ALG (589), G3BDQ (599) and G3YXM (599). Saw on Spectrogram screen QRSs from DF3LP ( only 'M' in the QRM) and DJ5BV (a strong 'O'). Went to RSGB National Mobile Rally at its new Hatfield venue. Bought some bits for my new mast (to be erected early September after the GW trip), and an old 286 computer whose case will be used to tidy up my LF rig. Plus a T-200 toroid for the junk box. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14045 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 14:29:58 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 14:29:58 +0100 Received: (qmail 10699 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 13:32:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 13:32:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BI1A-00018M-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 14:20:40 +0100 Received: from brockman.tinet.ie ([159.134.237.30]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BI18-00018E-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 14:20:38 +0100 Received: from p129.lifford1.tinet.ie ([159.134.235.129] helo=beachwood.tinet.ie) by brockman.tinet.ie with smtp (Exim 2.05 #23) id 11BI14-00078k-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 14:20:35 +0100 Message-ID: <000901bedcea$3ea65a20$81eb869f@beachwood.tinet.ie> From: "Finbar O'Connor" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: re:QRS reports Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 01:43:52 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit

Thanks to all those reporting my QRS beacon transmission on 137.192 khz and the Spectogram readouts, I am amazed, having never seen one before. This period of transmission was my first attempt at SLOW CW. I hope that others also received this test and I look forward to hearing from them, via the reflector.
 
very best regards
Finbar     EI0CF
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9847 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 16:05:41 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 16:05:41 +0100 Received: (qmail 32668 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 15:08:33 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 15:08:33 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BJVw-0001mP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 15:56:32 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from gatef.bbc.co.uk ([132.185.132.15] helo=gatef.kw.bbc.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BJVu-0001mK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 15:56:30 +0100 Received: from sunf0.rd.bbc.co.uk (ddmailgate.rd.bbc.co.uk [132.185.128.104]) by gatef.kw.bbc.co.uk (8.8.5/8.7.2) with SMTP id PAA22363 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 15:56:29 +0100 (BST) Received: from pc523 ([172.28.38.1]) by sunf0.rd.bbc.co.uk; Mon, 2 Aug 99 15:56:24 BST X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19990802155531.00a27100@sunf0> X-Sender: simonlh@sunf0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 15:55:31 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Simon Lloyd-Hughes" Subject: Re: LF: Re: Class E RF amplifiers In-reply-to: <002001bedcc7$179cb0a0$fc96b38f@w8k3f0> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: There was a Class E 7MHz amplifier design in QST in early 1997. It was in two parts with practical design information. At 11:11 02/08/99 +0200, you wrote: >>>From PA0SE to All > >Alan Melia wrote: > > >>Hi all, I dug out a copy of an article by Nathan Sokal (Pres. of Design >>Automation) that was published in Design Electronics on 20 Sept 1977 titled >>"Class E can boost efficiency". >>This turns out to be a very practical article with simple design formulae, >>and a 'build it and play' circuit with example scope traces of current and >>voltage waveforms. The test circuit is to run at 10 MHz but the detail >looks >>eminently suited to 136kHz. Efficiencies of 82 to 95% are quoted for some >>very ordinary transistors and FETs. There is no formula given for the RF >>Choke but I think that can be scaled from the 10MHz value. >> >>I know some have Class E stages already, but this may be a help to others >to >>get the parameters right. It looks as though I no longer have the original >>magazine, but it looks as though the copy I have will re-copy. Anyone >>interested.......if there are too many, can anyone offer to scan it in? >>Though there may be a copyright problem there even on a 22 year old >article. >>I have a sneaking suspicion the gentleman is a Ham, though he didn't admit >>to it in the corresponece I had with him in the late 70s or in the article. >>I wonder if Andre knows? >>In the meantime I'm willing to snail-mail copies (until the Bank Manager >>objects) > > > >Useful information on class D, E and F amplifiers with references to the >original articles can also be found in Technical Topics by G3VA in Radio >Communication of: > >August 1997 p. 77 > >October 1996 p. 77 > >73, Dick, PA0SE > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22606 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 16:48:47 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 16:48:47 +0100 Received: (qmail 10815 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 15:51:39 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 15:51:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BKAV-00025y-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 16:38:27 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BKAU-00025s-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 16:38:26 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id RAA19418 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 17:44:21 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990802173940.2ff70aec@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 17:39:40 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: Re: Class E RF amplifiers In-reply-to: <3.0.5.32.19990802155531.00a27100@sunf0> References: <002001bedcc7$179cb0a0$fc96b38f@w8k3f0> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: >Hi all, I dug out a copy of an article by Nathan Sokal (Pres. of Design >Automation) that was published in Design Electronics on 20 Sept 1977 titled >"Class E can boost efficiency". >This turns out to be a very practical article with simple design formulae, >and a 'build it and play' circuit with example scope traces of current and >voltage waveforms. The test circuit is to run at 10 MHz but the detail >looks >eminently suited to 136kHz. Efficiencies of 82 to 95% are quoted for some >very ordinary transistors and FETs. There is no formula given for the RF >Choke but I think that can be scaled from the 10MHz value. I am using a 'G3YXM' PA, slightly modified from the original. Main changes are a pair of IRFP350's on each side of the push-pull (running at 56V) and an extra LC section in the LPF. With 9.2A draincurrent (= 515W input) I get 2.95A RF current into my 52 Ohm dummyload (= 452W output). That means 87.8% efficiency. Seems to be within the range of this famous 'Class E'. The nice thing on Dave's PA (besides good efficiency) is that is a straighforward and 'no nonsense' design, if you stick to scematics and component list it cannot go wrong. It is absolutely stable (I know an OM who blew more than a dozen FETs on an oscillating PA) and survives open circuit (no problem, current goes down) and even shortcircuit if you have a proper current-trip in the PSU. 73, Rik Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3935 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 17:33:29 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 17:33:29 +0100 Received: (qmail 19721 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 16:36:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 16:36:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BKqT-0002S7-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 17:21:49 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailout02.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.150]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BKqS-0002S2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 17:21:48 +0100 Received: from fwd04.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.164]) by mailout02.btx.dtag.de with smtp id 11BKqR-0003Av-00; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 18:21:47 +0200 Received: (0607144537-0001(btxid)@[193.159.2.77]) by fwd04.btx.dtag.de id ; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 18:21:31 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 18:21:31 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: loop-ant. for rx-ing X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Sender: 0607144537-0001@t-online.de From: "bernd grupe" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello all, when experimenting with different loop-antennas it would be very helpful to have a special tool for calculating all the equations in terms of L and C and efficiency (esp. the radiation resistance).So I got the idea to program a specific "calculator" for all the work and just put a very first version on my web-site. It runs with all the popular browsers. Online as well as offline when downloading the Java-File to your PC.The URL is: http://home.t-online.de/home/Bernd.Grupe/homepage.htm My qth-locator is JN49JV and its 40 km down of Frankfurt/Main.Due to the near big radio stations - DLF 153kHz, DCF 77 and intermodulation by 129 kHz(GPS) etc. - you can believe me, that it's hard to get an audible signal in NCW. Since April i tried to connect dk8kw(Geri) on lf. But it was just the one-turn loop-ant. which i have built at least, to get Geri at friday last weekend with quite a high O quality in scw-mode. This good performance of loop-ant. brought me to write this mail to all of You, who suffered from similar bad conditions. Try a loop and look for gd dx. 73 bernd, DF8ZR TX-ant.: marconi 10 m high; coil 2.3 mH RX-ant.: selective loop, 2 m diam pw: 20 watts homemade rx: PCR1000 ICOM with selective preamps From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24164 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 21:19:44 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 21:19:44 +0100 Received: (qmail 9309 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 20:22:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 20:22:36 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BOD9-0003sh-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 20:57:27 +0100 Received: from man-153.dialup.zetnet.co.uk ([194.247.40.195] helo=localhost.localdomain ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BOD8-0003sc-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 20:57:26 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: (from john@localhost) by localhost.localdomain (8.9.3/8.9.3) id TAA00817 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 19:24:50 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: localhost.localdomain: john set sender to word.factory@zetnet.co.uk using -f X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on Linux X-Priority: 3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-reply-to: Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 18:24:50 -0000 () From: "John Rabson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Polarisation Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: About 30 yrs ago, there was an LF TX at Ongar Radio which (I was told) used a horizontal halfwave on 90 kHz (ish). Do any ex-PO people know anything about it? 73 de G3PAI ---------------------------------- E-Mail: John Rabson Date: 02-Aug-99 Time: 18:19:42 This message was sent by XFMail ---------------------------------- From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26762 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 23:24:18 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 23:24:18 +0100 Received: (qmail 11495 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 22:27:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 22:27:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BQNC-0004oF-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 23:15:58 +0100 X-Priority: 3 Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BQNB-0004oA-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 23:15:57 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Tue, 3 Aug 1999 00:15:37 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108144.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.144]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA12612 for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1999 00:15:48 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37A61883.F8C10167@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 00:15:31 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Class E RF amplifiers References: <3.0.5.32.19990802155531.00a27100@sunf0> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Group, Simon Lloyd-Hughes wrote: > > There was a Class E 7MHz amplifier design in QST in early 1997. It was in > two parts with practical design information. Yes! You will find this article on my ftp-site... (Once more: ftp://ftp.rz.uni-kiel.de/pub/nephro/nephlab/lp/MosFet-PA/ ) 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29014 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 23:35:25 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 23:35:25 +0100 Received: (qmail 14069 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 22:38:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 22:38:17 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BQYR-0004v3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 23:27:35 +0100 X-Priority: 3 Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BQYQ-0004uj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 02 Aug 1999 23:27:34 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Tue, 3 Aug 1999 00:27:29 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108144.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.144]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA12807 for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1999 00:27:41 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37A61B4B.E9BC05A@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 00:27:23 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Class E RF amplifiers References: <002001bedcc7$179cb0a0$fc96b38f@w8k3f0> <3.0.1.16.19990802173940.2ff70aec@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello, Rik Strobbe wrote: > I am using a 'G3YXM' PA, slightly modified from the original. Main changes > are a pair of IRFP350's on each side of the push-pull (running at 56V) and > an extra LC section in the LPF. > With 9.2A draincurrent (= 515W input) I get 2.95A RF current into my 52 Ohm > dummyload (= 452W output). That means 87.8% efficiency. > Seems to be within the range of this famous 'Class E'. It's a classical "class-D" design, i.e. a switched pp-amplifier reaching very high efficiency but much more complicated than class-E. Running class-D means that most dissipation occurs at switching time. Class-E is able to avoid dissipation even at switching. The key is to load an amplifier capacitively such that (MosFet) Ud *and* dUd/dt at switchig time are both zero (soft landing). Theoretically (!) you will have no dissipation at all... 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11321 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 00:42:39 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 00:42:39 +0100 Received: (qmail 29384 invoked from network); 2 Aug 1999 23:45:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 2 Aug 1999 23:45:32 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BRVC-0005SZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 00:28:18 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo11.mx.aol.com ([198.81.17.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BRVB-0005SU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 00:28:18 +0100 Received: from G0MRF@aol.com by imo11.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id lTHVa07549 (4423) for ; Mon, 2 Aug 1999 19:27:30 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: G0MRF@aol.com Message-ID: <1374c781.24d78361@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 19:27:29 EDT Subject: Re: LF: Class E RF amplifiers To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 135 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: In a message dated 01/08/99 23:26:27 GMT Daylight Time, Alan.Melia@btinternet.com writes: << I know some have Class E stages already, but this may be a help to others to get the parameters right. It looks as though I no longer have the original magazine, but it looks as though the copy I have will re-copy. Anyone interested.......if there are too many, can anyone offer to scan it in? Though there may be a copyright problem there even on a 22 year old article. I have a sneaking suspicion the gentleman is a Ham, though he didn't admit to it in the corresponece I had with him in the late 70s or in the article. I wonder if Andre knows? In the meantime I'm willing to snail-mail copies (until the Bank Manager objects) 73 de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com >> Yes please Alan. Are you OK in the callbook? - I'll send you an SAE Thanks David G0MRF From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14458 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 07:46:13 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 07:46:13 +0100 Received: (qmail 29491 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 06:49:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 06:49:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BY07-0008Ez-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 07:24:39 +0100 Received: from mail5.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.20]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BY06-0008Eu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 07:24:38 +0100 Received: from modem-124.cerium.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.28.252] helo=default) by mail5.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 11BY04-0005Yk-00; Tue, 3 Aug 1999 07:24:36 +0100 Message-ID: <000001bedd78$da2abac0$fc1c883e@default> From: "wireless" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: harry@woodhou.freeserve.co.uk References: <000201bedc6b$56091600$2907063e@default> <000d01bedc8a$e4a0e5e0$865b868b@zimslaptop> Subject: LF: earth tests schedule - Aug 8 now Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 09:47:31 +0100 Organization: T@ylor Training MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Please note change of date to Sunday Aug 8. DATE: Sunday 8 August LOCATOR IO80LE - near Start Point, South Devon. All times UTC +1 (British summer time) Sending: G0AKN There are two base configurations. 1. Sea electrode to sea electrode (East-West) 2. Earth electrode to sea electrode (North-South) 1000 -1030 71.85 kHz QRS 10 second dot period Sea to sea 1035 -1105 71.85 kHz QRS 10 second dot period Earth to sea 1110 - 1140 137.05 kHz QRS 10 second dot period Sea to sea 1145 - 1215 137.05 kHz QRS 10 second dot period Earth to sea 1220 - 1235 137.05 kHz 5 wpm CW Sea to sea 1240 - 1255 137.05 kHz 5 wpm CW Earth to sea Reports (if any) welcomed! Telephone number for contact 0154 8511 278 e-mail reports on the day to g0akn@hotmail.com 73 John Taylor G0AKN and John Osborne G3HMO earth@wireless.freeserve.co.uk From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27203 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 09:02:43 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 09:02:43 +0100 Received: (qmail 9952 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 08:05:39 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 08:05:39 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BZP5-0000KM-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 08:54:31 +0100 Received: from artemis.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.126]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BZP4-0000KH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 08:54:30 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from harrier.le.ac.uk ([143.210.8.56]) by artemis.le.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 11BZPD-0005Do-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 3 Aug 1999 08:54:39 +0100 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 08:54:38 +0100 (BST) From: "Kate Moore" X-Sender: mek@harrier To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: Weekend report correct version! Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Sorry - I sent an old version of John's weekend report yesterday. Here is the correct version. Kate G4JAI ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Stations worked here over the weekend on 136kHz using normal speed CW: Friday 30/7 DJ5BV (06.26UT: gave him 549QSB, he gave me 539), G6NB (14.55: 579QRN, 599). Saturday 31/7 PA0LEG (07.23: 459QRM, 549), G3YXM (08.09: 59+9, 59+9). Sunday 1/8 GW4ALG (13.05: 589QRN, 589QRN). Not a good weekend for me! During my QSO with PA0LEG I was careless with a croc-clip on the 12V supply which shorted and pulsed the drive. This caused both output FETs to explode spectacularly, and put me off air for most of the day whilst I dismantled everything and replaced the FETs and driver chip. I've got away quite lightly in the past, so I guess it had to happen eventually....... The other problem during that QSO was the sudden re-appearance of QRM from the local SMPSU. I had been curious why this kept appearing just as I went on 136kHz, so on Sunday morning I keyed up the TX *ONCE* only, and then went back to receive. Sure enough, up came the PSU buzz! It's pretty obvious I'm suffering with some new item at a neighbour's which has a SMPSU in 'standby' mode - when I TX, it switches on. Aaaaargh! That stopped me hearing any DX, so we went cycling instead (nice morning anyway). When we got back at lunchtime, the buzz was off so I tried some more tests. I dropped the TX power one switch position and keyed the TX once - all still fine. Then I switched back to full power and keyed again - BUZZZZZ!!!!! Looks like I'm going to have to run reduced power for a while. Finally, with the hot weather the static has been very bad in the afternoons so the contacts with G6NB and GW4ALG were hard work amongst the crashes. Dare I say "roll on winter"?? Regards John G4GVC near Leicester, IO92JP ** TX: Synth + 400W RF from modified 'G3YXM' Mosfet PA ** ** RX: TS-850S with 3 x CW filters and 0.5ppm TCXO ** ** Ant: Inv-L 60m long, 6m high at feed end, 12m high at far end ** From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16353 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 12:34:29 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 12:34:29 +0100 Received: (qmail 27488 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 11:37:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 11:37:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BchP-0001mh-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 12:25:39 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from front2.grolier.fr ([194.158.96.52]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BchO-0001mc-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 12:25:38 +0100 Received: from club-internet.fr (Bayonne-4-222.club-internet.fr [195.36.141.222]) by front2.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id NAA06386 for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1999 13:25:31 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <37A6EDC4.89A28C1E@club-internet.fr> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 13:25:36 +0000 From: "sovergne" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: fr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Kit information Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by front2.grolier.fr id NAA06386 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi folks, France's regulatory authority has accepted the use by amateurs of the 136 kHz band, but the text has not yet been published in the Official Journal. There are a couple of French hams interested in the subject, including me. We hope to be able to transmit before the coming winter. Does anybody know about some transmitter kits available for 136 kHz? I would love to build a transmitter (plenty designs on the Web, TNX G3YXM & Co.), but I won't have the time to do this. I have a Kenwood TS-140S which I have modified for all band transmission, but the transmitter starts at 1.6 MHz. However, it is a good receiver. On the antenna side, I'm listening with a preamplified loop designed for longwave broadcast reception + a couple of Beverages, and the transmitting antenna is going to be raised in the sky this afternoon: a 550 metre loop at +/-8 to 12 m high (the "garden" is a field with plenty of space for wires!). Thanks for your advice. Best 73 Mark, F6JSZ Editor, French CQ magazine From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22598 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 13:07:43 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 13:07:43 +0100 Received: (qmail 2369 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 12:10:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 12:10:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BdEV-00022y-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 12:59:51 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.156]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BdET-00022t-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 12:59:49 +0100 Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-126-173.bellatlantic.net [151.200.126.173]) by smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id HAA22320; Tue, 3 Aug 1999 07:58:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <37A6D9E7.530D5FD7@bellatlantic.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 08:00:39 -0400 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sovergne@club-internet.fr Cc: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: Re: LF: Kit information References: <37A6EDC4.89A28C1E@club-internet.fr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: sovergne Mark, F6JSZ Editor, French CQ magazine wrote: > France's regulatory authority has accepted the use by amateurs of the > 136 kHz band, but the text has not yet been published in the Official Journal. congratulations :-) > Does anybody know about some transmitter kits available for 136 kHz? I > would love to build a transmitter (plenty designs on the Web, TNX G3YXM > & Co.), but I won't have the time to do this. G0MRF has created a 250 watt kit which I have built. I run it on 48 volts DC (instead of 24) and get easily 300 watts + (had to rewind the output transformer to add more turns, of course) look up: http://www.g0mrf.freeserve.co.uk/projects/lf.htm That kit is a class B amplifier, hence you will be able to use it if/when you start transmitting BPSK. If you are only interested in CW, a class D or E amplifier will work well. You could also buy a ready-built 160 watt Tx made by a Dutch company, under the name of "The First". It has a class D power amplifier, and we use it here at the WA2XTF 136.750 beacon. It works very well, and my only criticism is that it is crystal-controlled, and the crystal is soldered on the board. Opening the box and changing the crystal are not exactly easy tasks to perform. Replacing the crystal with an external Digital VFO would be the way to go. Good luck Andre' N4ICK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4918 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 14:15:06 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 14:15:06 +0100 Received: (qmail 18264 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 13:18:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 13:18:03 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BeGa-0002Wf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 14:06:04 +0100 Received: from tungsten.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.81]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BeGZ-0002Wa-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 14:06:04 +0100 Received: from [212.140.6.182] (helo=default) by tungsten.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 11BeGO-0003gf-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 3 Aug 1999 14:05:52 +0100 Message-ID: <000001beddb0$9ad9cc20$b6068cd4@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Class E PA...copies sent Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 14:01:48 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi copies in the post to Martin DF5FFA, Andre N4ICK,Graeme VK3GJZ, and Finbar EI0CF this morning. Cheers all de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14313 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 14:58:02 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 14:58:02 +0100 Received: (qmail 29440 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 14:00:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 14:00:59 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Bew8-0002rs-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 14:49:00 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ah-img-2.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.153] helo=hpamgaab.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Bew7-0002rm-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 14:48:59 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by hpamgaab.compuserve.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/HP-1.8) id JAA05409 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 3 Aug 1999 09:48:57 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 09:47:06 -0400 From: "Holger 'Geri', DK8KW" Subject: LF: Kit information To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <199908030947_MC2-7F92-F78@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Mark (F6JSZ): also from me congrats on convincing your authorities. Hope to hear F-stations soon here in JO52BH. Andre (N4ICK) already gave you some hints on where to get a transmitter or a PA kit. I also use the G0MRF PA, David sells it as a kit with all necessary parts. It took me one afternoon to build it (and a couple of days to burn over a dozen FETs, mainly a cooling problem, have a look at my website for a cheap source for IRFP450 FETs!). I run it with 24 Volts only (due to the German QRP regulations) and it works very stabil now. A good DDS VFO kit (0 to 60 MHz with 1 Hz resolution) can be purchased from S&S Engineering for around 170.- US$ (have a lok at their website http://www.xmetric.com/sseng/), they also sell the VFO assembled and tested for 220.- US$, you only need a housing. Ramsy Electronics (also somewehre on the web) sells a broadband amplifier kit for 39.- US$ that gets this signal from its 10mW or so up to 1 Watt, sufficient to drive the G0MRF PA. Besides the antenna, that is basically all you need. Your antenna setup sounds really promising! Think big, that's, as I have learned, is important! If you want to know more details about my setup and the DDS VFO, have a look at http://www.dk8kw.home.pages.de Best 73, hope to hear you soon on LF Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14383 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 14:58:20 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 14:58:20 +0100 Received: (qmail 29497 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 14:01:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 14:01:16 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BerD-0002oS-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 14:43:55 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from front7.grolier.fr ([194.158.96.57]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BerB-0002oN-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 14:43:54 +0100 Received: from club-internet.fr (Bordeaux-8-137.club-internet.fr [195.36.129.137]) by front7.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id PAA19813 for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1999 15:43:48 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <37A70DF7.EBC59AB1@club-internet.fr> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 15:43:09 +0000 From: "sovergne" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [fr] (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: fr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Kit information References: <37A6EDC4.89A28C1E@club-internet.fr> <37A6D9E7.530D5FD7@bellatlantic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: TNX Andre, I'll have a look at this today. The antenna is in good shape. I just have to pull it up slightly more at the north-west corner. It works very well with the broadcast stations (BBC Radio 4 on 198 kHz is 59+60 dB with -20 dB on the attenuator and I'm in the south-west of France [JN04PX]). I'll be listening to the beacon this evening. Can you send me some photos and an article about it? I'll publish it in the French CQ; that's how promoting LF goes, HI! 73, Mark, F6JSZ Andre' Kesteloot a *crit : > > sovergne > Mark, F6JSZ > Editor, French CQ magazine wrote: > > > France's regulatory authority has accepted the use by amateurs of the > > 136 kHz band, but the text has not yet been published in the Official Journal. > > congratulations :-) > > > Does anybody know about some transmitter kits available for 136 kHz? I > > would love to build a transmitter (plenty designs on the Web, TNX G3YXM > > & Co.), but I won't have the time to do this. > > G0MRF has created a 250 watt kit which I have built. I run it on 48 volts DC > (instead of 24) and get easily 300 watts + (had to rewind the output transformer > to add more turns, of course) > look up: > http://www.g0mrf.freeserve.co.uk/projects/lf.htm > > That kit is a class B amplifier, hence you will be able to use it if/when you > start transmitting BPSK. > > If you are only interested in CW, a class D or E amplifier will work well. > > You could also buy a ready-built 160 watt Tx made by a Dutch company, under the > name of "The First". It has a class D power amplifier, and we use it here at the > WA2XTF 136.750 beacon. It works very well, and my only criticism is that it is > crystal-controlled, and the crystal is soldered on the board. Opening the box and > changing the crystal are not exactly easy tasks to perform. Replacing the crystal > with an external Digital VFO would be the way to go. > > Good luck > Andre' N4ICK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13992 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 19:07:08 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 19:07:08 +0100 Received: (qmail 25399 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 18:10:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 18:10:05 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BiTd-0004Tn-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 18:35:49 +0100 Received: from [195.102.240.137] (helo=mserv1b.u-net.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BiTc-0004Ti-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 18:35:48 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #61) id 11BiSc-0006NR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 3 Aug 1999 18:34:47 +0100 Received: from miked.rsgbhq [192.168.2.30] by rsgb.org.uk [192.168.2.132] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 18:17:09 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Radio Society of Great Britain To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 18:19:38 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Kit information In-reply-to: <37A70DF7.EBC59AB1@club-internet.fr> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: > > Mark, F6JSZ Mark, I tried to e-mail you direct today but got an error message. Is sovergne@club-internet.fr correct? 73 Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21898 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 19:44:22 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 19:44:22 +0100 Received: (qmail 16597 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 18:44:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 18:44:21 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BjBj-0004mQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 19:21:23 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from as-img-4.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.147] helo=spamgaad.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BjBi-0004mI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 19:21:22 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spamgaad.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.3) id OAA22440 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 3 Aug 1999 14:20:50 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 14:20:08 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: DX Cluster postings w/e 31 July/1 Aug. at GB7DXM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <199908031420_MC2-7FA8-81C4@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Alan, >A QRS cq from DK8KW was logged at 0421Z >and again finishing at 0444Z. The first was just readable would be the >lowest report from me ( T ?) The second call was mashed up by the noise >but was on the same freq and had elements of Geri's call (bear in mind >Geri that most active stations in the UK would receive up to 20dB better >than I do) thank you very much for your reception report in Slow CW and the "T" report. There are 602 km between us so I am not surprised that you could see my signal just above the noise. I am sorry to hear about your 20 dB worse reception than the most active stations, so I am really pleased that you was able to copy my Slow CW cq-call. I also appreciate you posting the weekly posting of dx-cluster reports, this gives an idea about what was going on. Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) JO52BH From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28326 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 20:15:11 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 20:15:11 +0100 Received: (qmail 21772 invoked from network); 3 Aug 1999 19:15:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 3 Aug 1999 19:15:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Bjtl-000572-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 20:06:53 +0100 Received: from mta2-gui.server.ntli.net ([194.168.54.143] helo=mta2-svc.virgin.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Bjtl-00056x-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 03 Aug 1999 20:06:53 +0100 Received: from default ([212.250.68.120]) by mta2-svc.virgin.net (InterMail v4.01.01.02 201-229-111-106) with SMTP id <19990803190556.PZZ3218.mta2-svc@default> for ; Tue, 3 Aug 1999 20:05:56 +0100 Message-ID: <000401bedde3$c5173620$7844fad4@default> From: "peter cleall" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: eclipse Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 19:50:09 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Is anyone planning any propagation experiments on136kHz or thereabouts during the eclipse next week. I have not yet decided whether to study it, visually or by radio techniques. Also if I stay at home (98.5% of totallity) or go receiving portable in the far southwest. I know that the RSGB is involved in measurements on many bands but am not sure what exactly is proposed for 136kHz. Do we know what is likely to happen on our band, are the changes expected to be measurable, what is worth measuring and over what period of time. I look forward to your comments and advice peter G8AFN From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25403 invoked from network); 4 Aug 1999 08:41:40 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 4 Aug 1999 08:41:40 +0100 Received: (qmail 23630 invoked from network); 4 Aug 1999 07:44:40 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Aug 1999 07:44:40 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BvPE-0001iM-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 04 Aug 1999 08:24:08 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11BvPD-0001iH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 04 Aug 1999 08:24:07 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id JAA10147 for ; Wed, 4 Aug 1999 09:30:03 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990804092518.2db710d6@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 09:25:18 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: GBR at 16kHz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: >From Jean-Jaqcues Delcourt, ON5PG, who is working as scienticif researcher at the Belgian Royal Meteorologic Institute I received following request : >My dear Rik, > >Have you the possibility of monitoring the GBR signals on 16 KHz ??? > >We have a very special pattern during the sunrise at an altitude of 80 Km >between 3 et 5 UT . > >We ignore if it is an interference between the sky wave and the ground wave >or an absorption only due to a specific chemical reaction . > >If it is a sky wave - ground wave interference , you certainly have not the >same as us .... > >Many thanks . > >Jean Jacques . Unfortunately my RX is limited to 30kHz, but I suppose that a lot of readers of this reflector can tune down to 16kHz and might be interested to help. Those who have the means and want to help Jean-Jacques (by recording GBR at sunrise) are kindly requested to send me a short mail. I will collect all responses and forward them to Jean-Jacques so he can send you more detailled information. I know this request is a bit 'out of line', but I think that it is good for the image of amateurradio if we can cooperate in scientific projects. 73, Rik Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29800 invoked from network); 4 Aug 1999 09:04:26 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 4 Aug 1999 09:04:26 +0100 Received: (qmail 28395 invoked from network); 4 Aug 1999 08:07:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Aug 1999 08:07:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Bvif-0001q8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 04 Aug 1999 08:44:13 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail1-gui.server.ntli.net ([194.168.222.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Bvie-0001q3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 04 Aug 1999 08:44:12 +0100 Received: from cableol.co.uk ([194.168.18.29]) by mail1-gui.server.ntli.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-33929U70000L2S50) with ESMTP id AAA25378 for ; Wed, 4 Aug 1999 08:31:28 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37A7EB53.5EEBC623@cableol.co.uk> Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 08:27:16 +0100 From: "Steve Rawlings" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: Data Sheet for 3C85 ferrite References: <01bd51fe$b85a2360$LocalHost@default> <35104DC9.F0EB4D59@cableol.co.uk> <37A51135.7B185470@bellatlantic.net> <37A60F97.44C7AE7A@cableol.co.uk> <37A7B4B5.2E4C7EB1@bellatlantic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Andre' Kesteloot, N4ICK has recently advised me of the web address for the 3C85 Data Sheet (Philips Components). Many members of this reflector will know that this is becoming a very popular material for use in LF equipment, following its use by David Bowman G0MRF in his 250 W PA. (I have used 3C85 ring cores in David's PA; LF SWR bridges; antenna matching transformers; and in the grid and anode circuits of my valve PA with great success.) For others who may be interested, the web address for the Data Sheet (PDF file viewer, such as Acrobat Reader, required) is: http://www.acm.components.philips.com/pdf/3c85.pdf Details of a UK source for 3C85 ring cores can be found at: http://www.cableol.net/alg/radio/136/comps.htm [Andre': Thank you for successfully navigating the Philips web site!] Regards to all, Steve GW4ALG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27203 invoked from network); 4 Aug 1999 10:58:46 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 4 Aug 1999 10:58:46 +0100 Received: (qmail 22582 invoked from network); 4 Aug 1999 10:01:48 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Aug 1999 10:01:48 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Bxfv-0002gX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 04 Aug 1999 10:49:31 +0100 Received: from apollo.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.125]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Bxfv-0002gS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 04 Aug 1999 10:49:31 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from harrier.le.ac.uk ([143.210.8.56]) by apollo.le.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 11Bxfu-0007OF-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 4 Aug 1999 10:49:30 +0100 Date: Wed, 4 Aug 1999 10:49:29 +0100 (BST) From: "Kate Moore" X-Sender: mek@harrier To: "rsgb lf group" Subject: LF: New station on 136 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Worked a new station on 136.57kHz last night - G0VXG, Richard in Telford. This was his first contact on LF, although he is the station I heard a few weeks ago. His signal was S6 here, with a trace of chirp. Look out for him and give him a report - I'm sure he'd appreciate it. (This now takes my tally of 'first QSOs' up to 12). Regards John G4GVC near Leicester, IO92JP ** TX: Synth + 400W RF from modified 'G3YXM' Mosfet PA ** ** RX: TS-850S with 3 x CW filters and 0.5ppm TCXO ** ** Ant: Inv-L 60m long, 6m high at feed end, 12m high at far end ** From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5571 invoked from network); 4 Aug 1999 11:41:49 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 4 Aug 1999 11:41:49 +0100 Received: (qmail 32269 invoked from network); 4 Aug 1999 10:44:51 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Aug 1999 10:44:51 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11ByKU-0002yg-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 04 Aug 1999 11:31:26 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11ByKR-0002yZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 04 Aug 1999 11:31:24 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id MAA11233 for ; Wed, 4 Aug 1999 12:37:19 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990804123234.080f9334@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 12:32:34 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: eclipse In-reply-to: <000401bedde3$c5173620$7844fad4@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: At 19:50 3/08/99 +0100, G8AFN wrote: >Is anyone planning any propagation experiments on136kHz or thereabouts >during the eclipse next week. > >I have not yet decided whether to study it, visually or by radio techniques. >Also if I stay at home (98.5% of totallity) or go receiving portable in the >far southwest. > >I know that the RSGB is involved in measurements on many bands but am not >sure what exactly is proposed for 136kHz. > >Do we know what is likely to happen on our band, are the changes expected >to be measurable, what is worth measuring and over what period of time. > >I look forward to your comments and advice I received following information from Jean-Jacques Delcourt, ON5PG: I am working professionaly on the D layer and prepare a doctorate on this subject at the Belgian Royal Meteorological Institute. I monitor only time keeping carriers in amplitude,phase and polarization below 100 KHz. The best results are from GBR on formelly 16 KHz, but in fact around 15,750 KHz which is unfortunately frequency modulated. During dusk and dawn, you can see beautiful effects linked with the sun rise, the rising of XRays flux and modification of the chemistry of the mesosphere. Correlations are made with the XR flux monitoring by GOES satellites. The XR are generated in the sun corona and one of the interests of the aug.11 eclipse is that during approximatively 2 min, the most part of the corona will be obliterated. Phase monitoring is very difficult and requires very stable reference oscillators in the range of 10exp-10 on a day. At the lab, I am using a GPS reference with phase locked loop. I think that the best way during the eclipse day is testing a circuit where the totality path is the middle of the circuit. An other way is monitoring 24h on 24h during 3 days [the eclipse day is the second] a carrier with a constant amplitude , the greatest possible..... The 5 receivers I use are [all home made] of direct amplification type with crystal filters and bandwidth of 1 Hz ; but I have the greatest interest for VLF commercial RX . Data sheets and dealers addresses with prices are welcome. The antennas are of the loop type [20 spires with the appropriate tuning capacitor] mounted inside a water pipe loop to make it inflexible and easy to direct. The frequency range of interest is below 200kHz, preferable even below 100kHz as effects seems to be more explicit on lower frequencies. A software team from the Belgien amateur radio society UBA has developed a programme that can be used to register the fieldstrength measurements. All you need is a PC with Win95/98 and a soundcard. The audio output of the receiver is fed to the input of the soundcard. More information of about this programme and about the eclipse-experiment in general can be found at the UBA website http://www.uba.be/ The software can be requested by sending an e-mail to jacques.debouche@euronet.be with as subject: ECLIPSE PROGRAM REQUEST. The required information and calibration-procedure is included. All data can be sent to : John Devoldere, ON4UN Poelstraat 215 B-9820 Merelbeke Belgium or via e-mail to john.devoldere@village.uunet.be A special award will be issued to everybody who cooperates with the experiment and sends in his/her set of data. 73, Rik ON7YD Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21744 invoked from network); 4 Aug 1999 19:10:21 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 4 Aug 1999 19:10:21 +0100 Received: (qmail 9054 invoked from network); 4 Aug 1999 18:13:24 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 4 Aug 1999 18:13:24 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11C4oy-0005nV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 04 Aug 1999 18:27:20 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.interalpha.co.uk ([195.26.224.18] helo=post.interalpha.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11C4ov-0005nP-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 04 Aug 1999 18:27:18 +0100 Received: from sot-mod24.interalpha.net (sot-mod24.interalpha.net [195.26.225.24]) by post.interalpha.net (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id SAA20579; Wed, 4 Aug 1999 18:33:45 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <199908041733.SAA20579@post.interalpha.net> X-Sender: drassew2@post.interalpha.co.uk (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 18:27:05 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org, rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be From: "Andy Talbot" Subject: Re: LF: GBR at 16kHz Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Rik - I have the means to monitor the 16kHz signal continuously at a very low sampling rate, ie 3.90625 Hz plus multiples higher, and store several hours of I/Q sampled raw data to disc. From these samples, the phase of the signal and doppler shift etc can be recovered. However, at only 200km from the transmitter I am not sure of the value of monitoring from my location. Andy Talbot G4JNT >>>From Jean-Jaqcues Delcourt, ON5PG, who is working as scienticif researcher >at the Belgian Royal Meteorologic Institute I received following request : > >>My dear Rik, >> >>Have you the possibility of monitoring the GBR signals on 16 KHz ??? >> >>We have a very special pattern during the sunrise at an altitude of 80 Km >>between 3 et 5 UT . >> >>We ignore if it is an interference between the sky wave and the ground wave >>or an absorption only due to a specific chemical reaction . >> >>If it is a sky wave - ground wave interference , you certainly have not the >>same as us .... >> >>Many thanks . >> >>Jean Jacques . > >Unfortunately my RX is limited to 30kHz, but I suppose that a lot of >readers of this reflector can tune down to 16kHz and might be interested to >help. > >Those who have the means and want to help Jean-Jacques (by recording GBR at >sunrise) are kindly requested to send me a short mail. I will collect all >responses and forward them to Jean-Jacques so he can send you more >detailled information. > >I know this request is a bit 'out of line', but I think that it is good >for the image of amateurradio if we can cooperate in scientific projects. > >73, Rik > > > >Rik Strobbe ON7YD >rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be >Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27068 invoked from network); 5 Aug 1999 06:58:14 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 5 Aug 1999 06:58:14 +0100 Received: (qmail 11956 invoked from network); 5 Aug 1999 06:01:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Aug 1999 06:01:20 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CGGo-0002IJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 06:40:50 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ah-img-4.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.158] helo=hpamgaad.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CGGn-0002IE-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 06:40:49 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by hpamgaad.compuserve.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/HP-1.8) id BAA15307 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 5 Aug 1999 01:40:47 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Thu, 5 Aug 1999 01:40:16 -0400 From: "Dave Sergeant" Subject: LF: eclipse To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <199908050140_MC2-7FCF-5F5A@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: >From Dave G3YMC The RSGB's programme for studying propogation on the eclipse was in April 99 RadComm. This suggested various monitoring programmes for 73 and 128 (sic!) kHz. I e-mailed the author G3NAQ and discussed the LF suggestions, pointing out that any meaningful results on 73 were most unlikely due to lack of activity, and 136 would similarly not reveal much for similar reasons. Perhaps the only likely useful experiment would be to monitor the strength of DCF39 at various locations, which could be done with pen recorders for those who have them. Any sort of eclipse net as proposed in the article would be a complete disaster! It would be hoped that the 136 users could at least make some token contribution to the programme. As for myself, I shall be viewing the eclipse in Salzburg, hopefully away from the madding crowds (and hopefully also from the clouds) so shall be unable to participate in the radio experiments anyway. I have arranged to meet Heinz OE5EEP and some of the other OE 136 guys whilst I am there, so it should be a worthwhile trip. 73s Dave G3YMC From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4897 invoked from network); 5 Aug 1999 10:19:06 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 5 Aug 1999 10:19:06 +0100 Received: (qmail 17070 invoked from network); 5 Aug 1999 09:22:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Aug 1999 09:22:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CJVn-0003dQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 10:08:31 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CJVm-0003dL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 10:08:30 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #34) id 11CKPY-0003HZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 5 Aug 1999 10:06:10 +0000 Received: from miked.rsgbhq [192.168.2.30] by rsgb.org.uk [192.168.2.132] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 09:57:24 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Radio Society of Great Britain To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 5 Aug 1999 09:59:55 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: eclipse In-reply-to: <199908050140_MC2-7FCF-5F5A@compuserve.com> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: G3YMC wrote: > The RSGB's programme for studying propogation on the eclipse was in April > 99 RadComm. This suggested various monitoring programmes for 73 and 128 > (sic!) kHz. > Oops - our trusty proof readers didn't spot that one until too late! One of things the article said was that the effects of the eclipse may last a while, especially as the zone of totality changes with the Earth moving. The thing to do it to monitor something consistent (obviously regular amateur skeds would be best, but commercial signals would do) over a period of days, and LF is especially useful for that is under normal conditions the signal strengths are remarkably consistent. So although most of us will either be at work, or enjoying the eclipse away from home, information on DCF's signal in the mornings and evenings will still be useful - even if it does not reveal any changes. Because the totality region moves south-south-east from the UK, I imagine that HBG on 75kHz and the Greek RTTY on 135.8kHz would be more useful than DCF which is too far north. Similarly, observations across the line of totality are thought to be useful, so monitoring DCF from Italy could be the thing to do. That is my understanding of the recommendations - feel free to correct me if I have it wrong. I shall probably arrange to ask my wife to run Spectrogram on 135.8kHz for an hour around eclipse time. I will then record morning and evening signal strengths on as many DX signals (amateur and professional) as I can hear. It would be useful for as many stations as possible to put out a call whenever possible from Monday morning to Thursday morning. It may be especially helpful if anyone can transmit on 73kHz (I will try to do so, despite needing to work most of the weekend - see this group and my web site for an announcement). Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 16108 invoked from network); 5 Aug 1999 11:03:57 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 5 Aug 1999 11:03:57 +0100 Received: (qmail 27065 invoked from network); 5 Aug 1999 10:07:03 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Aug 1999 10:07:03 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CKDa-0003w3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 10:53:46 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CKDZ-0003vy-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 10:53:45 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA09668 for ; Thu, 5 Aug 1999 11:59:42 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990805115454.4d975cde@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 05 Aug 1999 11:54:54 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: eclipse In-reply-to: References: <199908050140_MC2-7FCF-5F5A@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: At 09:59 5/08/99 +0100, G3XDV wrote: >I shall probably arrange to ask my wife to run Spectrogram on >135.8kHz for an hour around eclipse time. I will then record >morning and evening signal strengths on as many DX signals >(amateur and professional) as I can hear. If possible also take 'reference' measurements the day before and/or after the eclips. If the monitored signal is strong enough the special 'eclips'-program developed by the UBA software team maybe more usefull as it can record signals with a dynamic range of over 40dB. Similar to Spectogram it uses the PC-soundcard. You find more about this eclips-software (including download facilities) at the UBA website : http://www.uba.be/ For those who monitor signals during the eclipse : you data are most welcome for scientific purposes, a series of experiments will be conducted by the belgian society UBA in cooperation the belgian Royal Meteorological Institute (KMI). You can send your data to : John Devoldere ON4UN : john.devoldere@village.uunet.be 73, Rik Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28044 invoked from network); 5 Aug 1999 18:21:21 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 5 Aug 1999 18:21:21 +0100 Received: (qmail 29146 invoked from network); 5 Aug 1999 17:24:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Aug 1999 17:24:29 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CQrc-0006z9-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 17:59:32 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from email-aon.highway.telekom.at ([195.3.96.71] helo=SSP1NO21.highway.telekom.at) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CQrb-0006z3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 17:59:31 +0100 Received: from qsl.net (N195P016.dipool.highway.telekom.at [195.3.120.80]) by SSP1NO21.highway.telekom.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA50076 for ; Thu, 5 Aug 1999 18:59:26 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37A9C29D.3EFE24C8@qsl.net> Date: Thu, 05 Aug 1999 18:58:05 +0200 From: "Heinz Schnait" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en]C-NECCK (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: OE on 136kHz on Sunday morning Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: OE5PGL, OE5ODL and OE5EEP plan to be on the air on Sunday, August 8, 1999 from 0330Z to 0600Z (latest) from JN68RF. We will be around 136.5 kHz in normal CW using the same equipment as last weekend. Hear you then! Heinz, OE5EEP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17541 invoked from network); 5 Aug 1999 19:42:05 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 5 Aug 1999 19:42:05 +0100 Received: (qmail 16668 invoked from network); 5 Aug 1999 18:45:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 5 Aug 1999 18:45:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CSJE-0007dt-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 19:32:08 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from relay.atlas.cz ([195.119.187.130]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CSJB-0007dn-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 19:32:07 +0100 Received: from alien02 ([195.119.187.135]) by relay.atlas.cz with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19); Thu, 5 Aug 1999 20:31:56 +0200 Received: from mail pickup service by alien02 with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 5 Aug 1999 20:36:47 +0200 From: ok1fig@atlas.cz To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Hello all again Date: Thu, 5 Aug 1999 20:36:47 +0200 Message-ID: <3a7b01bedf71$794bc5a0$87bb77c3@alien02> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Microsoft CDO for Windows 2000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello lowfers! I am just in Switzerland to get training for my new job. I am rather short of time but I will have a vacation the second week in August and I will be QRV from the cottage. I had serious problems with my TX exciter last annonced QRV time, let all guys who searched for me accept my appology. This time I have better prepared TX and have about 400W. I still do not know wheter I will go only normal CW or also Slow-CW. Petr, HB9/OK1FIG/P From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21620 invoked from network); 5 Aug 1999 22:21:18 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 5 Aug 1999 22:21:18 +0100 Received: (qmail 6321 invoked from network); 5 Aug 1999 21:20:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 5 Aug 1999 21:20:54 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CUet-00009a-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 22:02:39 +0100 Received: from mb05.swip.net ([193.12.122.209]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CUes-00009U-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 05 Aug 1999 22:02:38 +0100 Received: from s-257519 (dialup120-3-19.swipnet.se [130.244.120.147]) by mb05.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA17689 for ; Thu, 5 Aug 1999 23:02:36 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001001bedf85$e1ba9b20$9378f482@s-257519> From: "Johan Bodin" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: SV: LF: eclipse Date: Thu, 5 Aug 1999 23:02:51 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello, Forwarded from Rik Strobbe: >A software team from the Belgien amateur radio society UBA has developed a >programme that can be used to register the fieldstrength measurements. All you >need is a PC with Win95/98 and a soundcard. The audio output of the receiver >is fed to the input of the soundcard. AGC (which is present in most amateur receivers) will make such measurements almost useless (unless the AGC can be disabled). Please correct me if I'm wrong... 73, Johan From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6454 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 02:44:34 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 02:44:34 +0100 Received: (qmail 12378 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 01:47:43 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 01:47:43 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CYpC-0002EV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 02:29:34 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ds9.sci.fi ([195.74.0.54]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CYpB-0002EQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 02:29:33 +0100 Received: from pmk1 (MCCXLIII.dyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.4.43]) by ds9.sci.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id EAA25486 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 1999 04:29:35 +0300 (EET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19990806013130.005fee98@pop.sci.fi> X-Sender: keinanen@pop.sci.fi X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 04:31:30 +0300 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Paul Keinanen" Subject: Re: LF: eclipse Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: At 23:02 5.8.1999 +0200, Johan Bodin wrote: >Hello, > >Forwarded from Rik Strobbe: > >>A software team from the Belgien amateur radio society UBA has developed a >>programme that can be used to register the fieldstrength measurements. All you >>need is a PC with Win95/98 and a soundcard. The audio output of the receiver >>is fed to the input of the soundcard. > >AGC (which is present in most amateur receivers) will make such measurements >almost useless (unless the AGC can be disabled). >From http://www.uba.be/zon/SoftGB.htm it is stated that the receiver is set to a constant gain, i.e. AGC off. In my opinnion, the problem is that the receiver gain should not fluctuate much during a several day period. A typical IF amplifier strip does not use feedback resistors to set the gain, but the gain depends mainly of the transistor parameters, which are known to fluctuate a lot with temperature, operating voltage etc., causing a gain variation of several decibels. Thus, the receiver should be kept at constant temperature for several days and the IF strip operating voltages well regulated in order to give reliable results. In order to compensate for the gain variation, in radio astronomy some form Dicke radiometer is used, in which the receiver input is switched several times a second between the antenna signal and a very well known noise sourse (e.g. a resistor at 300 K or an auxiliar antenna pointing to a cold spot in the sky). The receiver output is a square wave altering between the reference level and signal of interest level and the difference between these two levels are recorded. Looking at the HF test signal for this experiment: a long dash (14 seconds) CW-identification (25 wpm ON4UBA/B) Idle period (5-6 sec) it would be very tempting to use the CW-id to compensate for any gain drift, but unfortunately that would only give the difference between the received beacon signal (mark) and local background noise (space). Unfortunately, the local noise level varies a lot, so this would only give a measure of the signal to noise ratio, not the absolute signal level. To get accurate measurements, a noise source of very precisely known output would be required so that the receiver input could be switched several times a second between the antenna and the noise reference. Unfortunately the noise level at LF/MF/HF is so high that a resistor at 300 K would be useless and some other form of calibrated noise source is required. A well shielded pseudo random noise generator (CMOS or TTL) followed by an attenuator might be useful. If the a.g.c. can not be disabled, the IF-strip acts like an amplifier with very fast gain drift :-). With fast enough switching between the reference noise level and antenna signal, the a.g.c. time constant is so long that the gain variation would be neglectable, thus the Dicke radiometer principle could be used even if the a.g.c could not be disabled. But as I said, using this method would require a calibrated noise source and some extra hardware to switch the receiver input between the antenna and the noise source, so it is understandable that this is not used in this experiment. Paul OH3LWR From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10660 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 10:29:54 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 10:29:54 +0100 Received: (qmail 16687 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 09:33:06 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 09:33:06 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CfxE-0005Qv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 10:06:20 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.interalpha.co.uk ([195.26.224.18] helo=post.interalpha.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CfxD-0005Qq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 10:06:20 +0100 Received: from th-mod06.interalpha.net (th-mod06.interalpha.net [195.26.228.197]) by post.interalpha.net (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id KAA17894 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 1999 10:13:11 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 10:13:11 +0100 Message-ID: <199908060913.KAA17894@post.interalpha.net> X-Sender: drassew2@post.interalpha.co.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: drassew2@interalpha.co.uk Subject: Re: SV: LF: eclipse Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: There is one saving feature if AGC cannot be turned off. If the signal to noise is low, say 10db or worse, then you can at least mesaure S/N using this technique. The technique may not necessarily be of value at LF / HF where noise level is likely to vary with propagation, but where noise is equipment dominated is certainly allows accurate measurements to be made. A few years ago I made propagation measurements on microwave beacons using an 8 bit A/D (before programming soundcards became easy) and used S/N of the carrier in 3kHz as a measure of signal strength. Andy G4JNT >Forwarded from Rik Strobbe: > >>A software team from the Belgien amateur radio society UBA has developed a >>programme that can be used to register the fieldstrength measurements. All you >>need is a PC with Win95/98 and a soundcard. The audio output of the receiver >>is fed to the input of the soundcard. > >AGC (which is present in most amateur receivers) will make such measurements >almost useless (unless the AGC can be disabled). > >Please correct me if I'm wrong... > >73, Johan > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5737 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 12:18:34 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 12:18:34 +0100 Received: (qmail 10349 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 11:21:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 11:21:44 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Chqg-0006HE-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 12:07:42 +0100 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Chqf-0006H9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 12:07:41 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #61) id 11ChrI-00023n-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 6 Aug 1999 12:08:20 +0100 Received: from miked.rsgbhq [192.168.2.30] by rsgb.org.uk [192.168.2.132] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 12:04:23 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Radio Society of Great Britain To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 12:06:55 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: SV: LF: eclipse In-reply-to: <199908060913.KAA17894@post.interalpha.net> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: ON7YD wrote: > >>A software team from the Belgien amateur radio society UBA has developed > >>a programme that can be used to register the fieldstrength measurements. > >>All you need is a PC with Win95/98 and a soundcard. The audio output of > >>the receiver is fed to the input of the soundcard. Johan wrote: > >AGC (which is present in most amateur receivers) will make such > >measurements almost useless (unless the AGC can be disabled). > > > >Please correct me if I'm wrong... I now have this software (thanks, Rik for solving my download problem). It is just what I have been looking for as it plots the level of signal, and the noise level if the signal is not permanent. It can run for many hours and produces a small log file compared to the huge Spectrogram ones. An 8-hour overnight plot produced a 1M text file, with each dB measurement dated and timed, plus another file with much less info which is only 9k! I will post some graphs on my web site when I have figured out how to convert the text file into something that Excel can read. It is obviously optimised for eclipse monitoring, but will be of immense value in monitoring distant LF beacons to discover by more scientific means when the regular enhancements are. This will be especially valuable with that signal from the US which comes up close to 137kHz at night - as this will give us a really good lead as to when a EU/US QSO might be possible (or when to have Spectrogram monitoring for the AMRAD beacon). Yes, AGC can be a problem, but the program operates fine with the RF gain set well below the AGC threshold, so if the dynamic range required is low there should be no problem. I recommend anyone interested in LF propagation to download this program - find it at www.uba.be Mike From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11348 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 15:02:19 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 15:02:19 +0100 Received: (qmail 16398 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 14:05:31 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 14:05:31 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CkQ2-0007We-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 14:52:22 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.interalpha.co.uk ([195.26.224.18] helo=post.interalpha.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CkPy-0007WZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 14:52:19 +0100 Received: from th-mod01.interalpha.net (th-mod01.interalpha.net [195.26.228.192]) by post.interalpha.net (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id OAA30093 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 1999 14:59:02 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 14:59:02 +0100 Message-ID: <199908061359.OAA30093@post.interalpha.net> X-Sender: drassew2@post.interalpha.co.uk (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: drassew2@interalpha.co.uk Subject: LF: GBR at 16kHz Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: In a previous EMail, Rik Strobe stated that the frequency of the GBR transmission had moved from 16kHz to 15.75kHz. This figure was in error. The actual frequency is centred on 15.98 kHz ie 20 Hz low. I spoke to the group of people responsible for this transmission and they confirmed that is was moved slightly from 16kHz a few years ago when the transmission changed from FSK modulation to MSK. The 16kHz had referred to one of the two FSK tone frequencies and the designated frequency was changed to centre the energy of the new signal in the old nominated passband. The characteristics of the signal are are: 300 baud Minimum Shift Keying (MSK) at 15.980 kHz. This can be seen by using Spectrogram with 16K FFT and averaging set to 100. The MSK produces a wide Gaussian shaped main lobe, approximately 100 Hz wide at the 3dB points, with deep nulls at +/- 150Hz. It is these null that allow the signals precise frequency to be measured as they are exactly symmetrical about the centre. Unfortunately, the absence of a carrier component, coupled with the wide main lobe, precludes the long term phase monitoring I had intended to do by mixing down to zero frequency then storing I/Q values at a 4Hz sampling rate. The various time transmissions at 60 - 77.5kHz remain the best signals on which to demonstrate the Doppler shifts at dawn and dusk. It would be possible to use the GBR signal but would involve de-spreading the MSK code - not a trivial task. Pure amplitude measurements are of course still valid by taking the whole signal in its 200 Hz bandwidth Andy G4JNT From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20648 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 15:39:02 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 15:39:02 +0100 Received: (qmail 25623 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 14:42:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 14:42:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CkzV-0007n8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 15:29:01 +0100 Received: from [143.179.236.31] (helo=Iguanodon.big-orange.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CkzT-0007n0-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 15:28:59 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 ([143.179.151.249]) by Iguanodon.big-orange.net (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with SMTP id AAA710C; Fri, 6 Aug 1999 16:28:21 +0200 Message-ID: <000e01bee018$b5145c80$f997b38f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "LF-Group" Cc: "Koos Fockens, PA0KDF" , "Klaas Spaargaren, PA0KSB" , "Jan Hekkert, PA3HCD" , "Gerrit Jan Huijsman, PA0GJH" Subject: LF: Fw: Antenna Software Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 16:33:05 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: To All from PA0SE Some time ago you received via the reflector the following correspondence between PA0SE and W7EL. >-----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >Van: Roy Lewallen >Aan: Dick Rollema >Datum: dinsdag 20 juli 1999 19:35 >Onderwerp: Re: Antenna Software > > >>Dick, >> >>Only the professional versions of EZNEC (EZNEC-M and EZNEC/4) directly >>report the ground wave. However, a reasonable approximation of the >>ground wave field strength can be gotten by using the EZNEC near field >>analysis. This is because the "near field" analysis actually calculates >>the total field, both near and far, including the ground wave. The near >>field analysis results are available only as numbers; they are not >>plotted as a graphical pattern. >> >>Roy Lewallen, W7EL >> >>> Dick Rollema wrote: >>> Dear Roy, >>> >>> Quite a few countries in Europe now have made the 136 kHz longwave >>> band available to amateurs. >>> >>> Although at night some sky wave propagation may be present most of the >>> contacts are made via the so called surface wave. >>> >>> I wonder whether EZNEC and ELNEC produce proper radiation patterns for >>> that kind of wave propagation? >>> >>> 73, Dick, PA0SE I use the antenna simulation program Antenna Optimizer by Brian Beezley, K6STI. This program also has the possibility to compute the near field and I wondered whether this was also suitable for computing the field strength of the surface wave. I modelled my antenna system and let the computer calculate the electric and magnetic component of the field. As Roy explained this must the total field, near plus far. For antennas on the surface of the earth outside the near field region only the surface wave remains. Only in the far field E/H = 377, in which E = electric component in V/m and H = magnetic component in A/m. So this is a method to check whether you are in the far field region or not. For several distances (in metres) from the antenna I found the following: Distance E/H 500 271 1000 338 1500 358 2000 366 2500 369 3000 371 3500 374 4000 375 This shows that my earlier statement is correct: in order to obtain the EIRP of a transmitter by measuring the field strength with a loop (or ferrite rod) antenna a minimum distance of 3500 m is sufficient for a meaningful result. 73, Dick, PA0SE JO22GD D.W. Rollema V.d. Marckstraat 5 2352 RA Leiderdorp The Netherlands Tel. +31 71 589 27 34 E-mail: d.w.rollema@gironet.nl From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23900 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 15:52:48 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 15:52:48 +0100 Received: (qmail 29197 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 14:56:01 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 14:56:01 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11ClBq-0007sf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 15:41:46 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.interalpha.co.uk ([195.26.224.18] helo=post.interalpha.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11ClBp-0007sa-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 15:41:45 +0100 Received: from th-mod07.interalpha.net (th-mod07.interalpha.net [195.26.228.198]) by post.interalpha.net (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id PAA32286 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 1999 15:48:40 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 15:48:40 +0100 Message-ID: <199908061448.PAA32286@post.interalpha.net> X-Sender: drassew2@post.interalpha.co.uk (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: drassew2@interalpha.co.uk Subject: LF: Correction to GBR details Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Oops, In my last posting re. GBR details, the first pair of nulls in the signal spectrum are at +/- 75Hz, ie 150 Hz APART Not at +/- 150 Hz Andy G4JNT From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 621 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 16:21:15 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 16:21:15 +0100 Received: (qmail 3277 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 15:24:27 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 15:24:27 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Clej-00088c-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 16:11:37 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from post.interalpha.co.uk ([195.26.224.18] helo=post.interalpha.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Cleh-00088X-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 16:11:36 +0100 Received: from th-mod13.interalpha.net (th-mod13.interalpha.net [195.26.228.204]) by post.interalpha.net (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id QAA00952 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 1999 16:18:27 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 16:18:27 +0100 Message-ID: <199908061518.QAA00952@post.interalpha.net> X-Sender: drassew2@post.interalpha.co.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: drassew2@interalpha.co.uk Subject: LF: GBR at 16kHz Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: In a previous EMail, Rik Strobe stated that the frequency of the GBR transmission had moved from 16kHz to 15.75kHz. This figure was in error. The actual frequency is centred on 15.98 kHz ie 20 Hz low. I spoke to the group of people responsible for this transmission and they confirmed that is was moved slightly from 16kHz a few years ago when the transmission changed from FSK modulation to MSK. The 16kHz had referred to one of the two FSK tone frequencies and the designated frequency was changed to centre the energy of the new signal in the old nominated passband. The characteristics of the signal are are: 300 baud Minimum Shift Keying (MSK) at 15.980 kHz. This can be seen by using Spectrogram with 16K FFT and averaging set to 100. The MSK produces a wide Gaussian shaped main lobe, approximately 100 Hz wide at the 3dB points, with deep nulls at +/- 150Hz. It is these null that allow the signals precise frequency to be measured as they are exactly symmetrical about the centre. Unfortunately, the absence of a carrier component, coupled with the wide main lobe, precludes the long term phase monitoring I had intended to do by mixing down to zero frequency then storing I/Q values at a 4Hz sampling rate. The various time transmissions at 60 - 77.5kHz remain the best signals on which to demonstrate the Doppler shifts at dawn and dusk. It would be possible to use the GBR signal but would involve de-spreading the MSK code - not a trivial task. Pure amplitude measurements are of course still valid by taking the whole signal in its 200 Hz bandwidth Andy G4JNT From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23830 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 17:56:21 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 17:56:21 +0100 Received: (qmail 28816 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 16:59:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 16:59:34 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Cmxc-0000HX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 17:35:12 +0100 Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com ([198.81.17.4]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Cmxa-0000Eq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 17:35:10 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id lDGWa24004 (3877) for ; Fri, 6 Aug 1999 12:34:25 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 12:34:24 EDT Subject: Re: LF: eclipse To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 70 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: If it may be any help in knowing what to expect from the eclipse, I can summarize some of the effects of the 1995 total solar eclipse over North America. That one entered the US from Mexico over western Texas, tracked through Oklahoma, over southeast Kansas, through Missouri, then on up across the northern Midwest. Given that I live in the southeastern US, this put the path of totality about 450 km to my northwest. Extending that same line beyond the ground track another 450 km (give or take), one finds Fort Collins, Colorado, the home of time station WWV at five convenient spots in the HF bands, plus WWVB at 60 kHz. Hence, totality fell dead-center between my QTH and a stable source of signals at several frequencies of interest. I entered each of those in my receiver's memory, along with one of the (formerly) clear-channel MW broadcasters from Dallas, a few shortwave broadcasters (whose paths didn't cross the eclipse track) for reference, the CHU shortwave time signals from Canada (on the opposite side of the eclipse, but at a later time), and a few aeronautical beacons from the central states in the 200 - 400 kHz range that I can normally pick up at night. I found that I could scan all of these, logging S-meter indications and any audible effects, in less than three minutes. (This proved to be the source of considerable writer's cramp once the actual loggings were underway. If I ever do this again, I will dictate into a tape recorder.) I decided to perform the scans on a five-minute cycle during the main event, which would allow me to return to any frequencies of particular interest twice or more during that time on a case-by-case basis. I began logging at 10-minute intervals from roughly two hours before totality reached the midpoint of the WWV/WWVB propagation path, to two hours after, switching to five minute intervals as soon as it appeared anything was happening. And indeed it did happen! The 2500 kHz and 5, 10, 15, and 20 Mhz WWV signals went through an approximation of sunset, night, sunrise, and daytime signal levels again, all in the space of just over half an hour. The relative strengths of 15 and 20 Mhz were different for an extended period after the eclipse, although not having had another eclipse with which to repeat the experiment makes it impossible to say whether there's any significance to the observation. Later, the CHU time signals underwent a similar night and day reversal. On MW, there was distinct audible enhancement of the Dallas station, but it didn't move the S-meter into a useful part of the scale. The LW aerobeacons were even less productive. None of the reference shortwave broadcasters' signals appeared to be affected. However, 60 kHz yielded quite dramatic results. Well before and well after the eclipse, the WWVB signal was at its normal daytime level here, marginally above noise. Almost 40 minutes before center-path totality, though, it faded out entirely! It later returned, rising to nighttime levels (over 10 db above daytime levels) when totality was over the center of the propagation path. After totality, it again faded to oblivion for a time, finally returning to daytime levels. This seems to parallel the fade we normally experience from WWVB here at sunrise and sunset. My guess would be that the longest, most profound effects will be seen below about 100 kHz. Above that frequency, effects do occur where the eclipse track crosses the propagation path; but the higher one goes in frequency, the less change I'd expect to see in signals not directly crossing the track. We'll see how it turns out in practice. Good luck to all. 73, John KD4IDY From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27580 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 18:13:11 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 18:13:11 +0100 Received: (qmail 32724 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 17:16:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 17:16:25 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CnPK-0000ST-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 18:03:50 +0100 Received: from ds-img-3.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.136] helo=spdmgaac.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CnPJ-0000SO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 18:03:49 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaac.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.3) id NAA02387 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 6 Aug 1999 13:03:47 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 13:03:24 -0400 From: "Dave Sergeant" Subject: LF: Eclipse - QRN To: "rsgb_lf_group" Message-ID: <199908061303_MC2-800F-8B58@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: >From Dave G3YMC Thunder static on the band today Friday is constant s9+20 with no gaps and I can hardly copy DCF39 through it. Presumably if it is like this next week it will make monitoring difficult - although DSP can average out the static, I expect it would have a hard time with today's conditions! 73s Dave From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26470 invoked from network); 7 Aug 1999 10:10:36 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 7 Aug 1999 10:10:36 +0100 Received: (qmail 19509 invoked from network); 7 Aug 1999 09:13:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Aug 1999 09:13:51 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11D29A-0007I8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 07 Aug 1999 09:48:08 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailout07.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.155]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11D299-0007I3-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 07 Aug 1999 09:48:07 +0100 Received: from fwd12.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.172]) by mailout07.btx.dtag.de with smtp id 11D298-0000UE-00; Sat, 7 Aug 1999 10:48:06 +0200 Received: (0607144537-0001(btxid)@[193.159.116.37]) by fwd12.btx.dtag.de id ; Sat, 7 Aug 1999 10:47:55 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 10:47:55 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: calculator for developing lopp-antennas X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Sender: 0607144537-0001@t-online.de From: "bernd grupe" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi all, some om's got a problem when downloading the calculator from my website. Indeed there was a little bug inside the loop.exe-file. I corrected the software and put back a well checked new loop.exe.After loading and extracting, You'll get two files: loop.htm and loop.jar. Please start the file loop.htm with an internetbrowser like netscape or microsoft-explorer. Then the loop.jar-file will be actuated automatically and the calculator will appear on sreen. Choose cirle or square-shape of the loop and put in the parameters. Then push "calculate" and look for the results. Please excuse my mistakes and have fun so far... 73 de bernd, DF8ZR ps: URL= http://home.t-online.de/home/Bernd.Grupe/homepage.htm; page: Langwelle From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 505 invoked from network); 7 Aug 1999 10:58:53 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 7 Aug 1999 10:58:53 +0100 Received: (qmail 31199 invoked from network); 7 Aug 1999 10:02:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Aug 1999 10:02:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11D320-0007hL-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 07 Aug 1999 10:44:48 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11D31z-0007hG-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 07 Aug 1999 10:44:47 +0100 Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Sat, 7 Aug 1999 11:44:42 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108167.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.167]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA09947 for ; Sat, 7 Aug 1999 11:44:56 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37AC0003.ED0C55A0@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 11:44:35 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: calculator for developing lopp-antennas References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Dear Bernd, bernd grupe wrote: > some om's got a problem when downloading the calculator from my website. Indeed > there was a little bug inside the loop.exe-file. I corrected the software and > put back a well checked new loop.exe.After loading and extracting, You'll get > two files: loop.htm and loop.jar. Please start the file loop.htm with an > internetbrowser like netscape or microsoft-explorer. Then the loop.jar-file will > be actuated automatically and the calculator will appear on sreen. Choose cirle > or square-shape of the loop and put in the parameters. Then push "calculate" and > look for the results. Please excuse my mistakes and have fun so far... Does not run here :( Trying that from your webside online I got: "...Applet1 got a security violation: method verification error" Running Communicator 4.05, LINUX (Kernel 2.0.33) on P133 Intel platform. Did you check it on UNIX platforms? 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29953 invoked from network); 7 Aug 1999 21:20:00 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 7 Aug 1999 21:20:00 +0100 Received: (qmail 18977 invoked from network); 7 Aug 1999 20:23:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Aug 1999 20:23:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DCfP-0003dR-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 07 Aug 1999 21:02:07 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.157]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DCfN-0003dM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 07 Aug 1999 21:02:06 +0100 Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-127-44.bellatlantic.net [151.200.127.44]) by smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA29943; Sat, 7 Aug 1999 16:05:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <37AC9096.E3CE255@bellatlantic.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 16:01:26 -0400 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: calculator for developing lopp-antennas References: <37AC0003.ED0C55A0@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net id QAA29943 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Peter W. Schnoor wrote: > Dear Bernd, > [...]Does not run here :( > > Trying that from your webside online I got: > "...Applet1 got a security violation: method verification > error" > > Running Communicator 4.05, LINUX (Kernel 2.0.33) on P133 > Intel platform. > Did you check it on UNIX platforms? > > 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag > 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP Hello Bernd, Same here, won't run, same message , I am running WinNT 73 Andre' From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5472 invoked from network); 7 Aug 1999 21:51:57 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 7 Aug 1999 21:51:57 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: (qmail 5602 invoked from network); 7 Aug 1999 19:08:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Aug 1999 19:08:35 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DBW1-00032P-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 07 Aug 1999 19:48:21 +0100 Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.39]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DBW0-00032K-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 07 Aug 1999 19:48:20 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from dennison.demon.co.uk ([194.222.239.33]) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 11DBVw-000PRd-0B for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 7 Aug 1999 18:48:16 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 7 Aug 1999 19:46:33 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Mike Dennison" Subject: LF: 73kHz skeds? MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: I have set my station up on the 73kHz band again and am looking for skeds. I can use conventional or slow CW. Any takers? Call me on 01707 331546. -- Mike, G3XDV www.dennison.demon.co.uk From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23786 invoked from network); 7 Aug 1999 23:28:08 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 7 Aug 1999 23:28:08 +0100 Received: (qmail 6622 invoked from network); 7 Aug 1999 22:31:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 7 Aug 1999 22:31:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DEoA-0004ar-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 07 Aug 1999 23:19:18 +0100 Received: from smtp3.xs4all.nl ([194.109.127.49]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DEo9-0004am-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 07 Aug 1999 23:19:17 +0100 Received: from v3q4v1 (dc2-isdn869.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.151.101]) by smtp3.xs4all.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id AAA08288 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 00:19:16 +0200 (CEST) From: "M. Sanders" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: 72.00kHz tuning anyone??? Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 00:16:43 +0200 Message-ID: <000001bee122$87e63020$65976dc2@v3q4v1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi all, Between 2145 and 2215utc a signal was seen with Spectogram on 72.00 kHz. Varying slowly in strength, no call sign and then it stopped. I am 100% sure this was no intermodulation in my receiver. Anybody seen the same or knows wat i have seen? 73's and good luck on LF Michael Sanders, PA3BSH mailto:pa3bsh@amsat.org From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25505 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 05:34:41 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 05:34:41 +0100 Received: (qmail 30628 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 04:38:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 04:38:02 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DKQK-0007Mo-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 05:19:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailout09.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.157]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DKQJ-0007Mj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 05:19:03 +0100 Received: from fwd09.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.169]) by mailout09.btx.dtag.de with smtp id 11DKQI-0007Gs-00; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 06:19:02 +0200 Received: (320057114934-0001(btxid)@[62.158.47.192]) by fwd09.btx.dtag.de id ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 06:18:49 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 06:18:49 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: OE-on air ? X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Sender: 320057114934-0001@t-online.de From: "DF2PY" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi Lowfers ! As to 0415z had no trace of the OE-Group here.Launched a CQ and got reply by df8zr.Kind of weak today .Anyone heard the OE-Group so far ? de df2py From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23991 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 08:05:04 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 08:05:04 +0100 Received: (qmail 6800 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 05:21:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 05:21:44 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DL88-0007hu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 06:04:20 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from email-aon.highway.telekom.at ([195.3.96.71] helo=SSP1NO21.highway.telekom.at) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DL87-0007fh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 06:04:19 +0100 Received: from qsl.net (N196P005.dipool.highway.telekom.at [195.3.120.101]) by SSP1NO21.highway.telekom.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA94140 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 07:04:07 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37AD0FBA.A53F9514@qsl.net> Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 07:03:54 +0200 From: "Heinz Schnait" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en]C-NECCK (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Activity from OE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: We've been on the air at 0330Z but only for a few milliseconds. We fired up the transmitter! It's beeing repaired right now. Expect to be on the air at 0600Z. 73 Heinz, OE5EEP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11128 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 09:12:28 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 09:12:28 +0100 Received: (qmail 25416 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 08:15:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 08:15:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DNud-0000OP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 09:02:35 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailout09.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.157]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DNud-0000OK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 09:02:35 +0100 Received: from fwd12.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.172]) by mailout09.btx.dtag.de with smtp id 11DNuc-0001js-00; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 10:02:34 +0200 Received: (320057114934-0001(btxid)@[193.159.119.217]) by fwd12.btx.dtag.de id ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 10:02:24 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 10:02:24 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: OE - Group is qrv ! X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Sender: 320057114934-0001@t-online.de From: "DF2PY" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi Lowfers ! Just want to raise Your attention to the Austrian LF group.Just (0750z)worked them on 136.9 kHz with a good signal.Its a new one for most of us and the condx seem to be favourable.PA0SE and DK8KW much louder than usual today good luck ! de wolf From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25875 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 12:30:05 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 12:30:05 +0100 Received: (qmail 2078 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 11:33:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 11:33:27 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DQyd-0001iN-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 12:18:55 +0100 Received: from ds-img-4.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.137] helo=spdmgaad.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DQyc-0001iI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 12:18:54 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaad.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.3) id HAA05128 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 07:18:53 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 07:18:36 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: Earth tests: NIL in JO52 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <199908080718_MC2-8034-8D96@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: John, sorry to report: no reception of your earth current transmissions on 71.85 kHz and 137.05 kHz today. My local noise level already was quite high. Hope you get better reports from others! Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2589 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 13:02:28 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 13:02:28 +0100 Received: (qmail 11353 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 11:59:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 11:59:10 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DRP8-0001ul-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 12:46:18 +0100 Received: from mail1-gui.server.ntli.net ([194.168.222.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DRP7-0001ug-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 12:46:17 +0100 Received: from cableol.co.uk ([194.168.18.53]) by mail1-gui.server.ntli.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-33929U70000L2S50) with ESMTP id AAA28133 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 12:33:27 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37AD69F8.B71F0E1@cableol.co.uk> Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 12:28:56 +0100 From: "Steve Rawlings" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: 136 kHz bandplan Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi All, Over the past 3 weeks I've heard a lot of slow-CW (QRSS) activity on 137.1 kHz - a popular frequency for normal CW operation. Yesterday morning (Saturday), I worked Geri DK8KW; Fred DJ5DI; and Gerd DJ5BV on that same frequency. Today, however, a weak QRSS signal is again on 137.1 kHz - making it difficult to copy DX signals running conventional CW in the range 137.0 - 137.2 kHz. I was under the impression that there was enough space for narrow-band (QRSS) operation above 137.4 kHz. Or is this no longer the case? Regards to all, Steve GW4ALG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26254 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 14:57:24 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 14:57:24 +0100 Received: (qmail 26562 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 13:57:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 13:57:24 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DT5W-0002ds-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 14:34:10 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailout09.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.157]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DT5V-0002dn-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 14:34:09 +0100 Received: from fwd11.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.171]) by mailout09.btx.dtag.de with smtp id 11DT5U-000889-00; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 15:34:08 +0200 Received: (0607144537-0001(btxid)@[212.184.151.17]) by fwd11.btx.dtag.de id ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 15:33:58 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 15:33:58 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: loop-antenna-calculator; unix(linux,WIN-NT) X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Sender: 0607144537-0001@t-online.de From: "bernd grupe" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Date: 08 Aug 1999 12:33 GMT From: 0607144537-0001@t-online.de (bernd grupe) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: calculator for loop-antennas;esp. unix(linux)-users X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Peter W. Schnoor and Andre'Kestelot wrote: >Does not run here :( >Trying that from your webside online I got: >"...Applet1 got a security violation: method verification >error" >Running Communicator 4.05, LINUX (Kernel 2.0.33) on P133 >Intel platform. >Did you check it on UNIX platforms? >Same here, won't run, same message , I am running WinNT Dear Peter, dear Andre', thanks for response, but I'm sorry, can't help you to fix the specific bug. I have no possibility to check the software with unix(linux, WIN-NT) platforms. May be that platforms cannot read the html-file, because I stored this readable for WIN95/98. I put an additional trial-version for unix(NT)-users to my website. Try this one or download the loop.jar-file and write a copy of the loop.html by yourselfe (under unix-control). The netscape-browser did'nt allow downloading the loop.jar-file, but the internet-explorer from microsoft did the job right. Netscape was trying to start(smart-tune-up) this file, but it failed. Hope anyone will send me a positiv reply, when he got success with WIN95/98. There are some other java-files on my website: page HF-Technik/RESONANZ-LIVE page HF-Technik/LUFTSPULE-LIVE page Messgeraete/r_code If you won't get a problem with that files, the bug must be in the Calculator of course.That would make the search a little easier. I'm looking forward for your results and will take the problem to the java-interest-group(internet). 73 es gl de bernd,DF8ZR ps: URL= http://home.t-online.de/Bernd.Grupe/homepage.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10398 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 19:46:29 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 19:46:29 +0100 Received: (qmail 13305 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 18:49:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 18:49:52 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DXmP-0004oV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 19:34:45 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from email-aon.highway.telekom.at ([195.3.96.71] helo=SSP1NO21.highway.telekom.at) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DXmO-0004oQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 19:34:45 +0100 Received: from qsl.net (N196P017.dipool.highway.telekom.at [195.3.120.113]) by SSP1NO21.highway.telekom.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA50702 for ; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 20:34:40 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37ADCDB2.D7EFC072@qsl.net> Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 20:34:26 +0200 From: "Heinz Schnait" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en]C-NECCK (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: OE Weekend Activity Report Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi all, We had killed the transmitter at 0330Z after transmitting into an open line. It was still dusk at this time and we must have gotten the coax mixed up. I had to drive back home for a replacement transistor. We have then been on the air from 0550Z to 0820Z. QSO's have been completed with DJ2EY, DJ1ZB, DF2PY and DL1SAN. We have heard IK5ZPV (CQing while we had no transmitter, rst 439) and DK8KW (at abt 0700Z, rst 319). We have used two different receivers, a TS440 and the FT1000MP, without the receiving converter. Both rigs did OK, the FT1000MP had the better filters. Conclusions: Always take a box of spare parts and a soldering iron with you! Next time we will start at abt 0600Z, thats early enough for 136kHz work! Hear you soon! 73 Heinz, OE5EEP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6697 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 22:27:56 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 22:27:56 +0100 Received: (qmail 10076 invoked from network); 8 Aug 1999 21:31:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 8 Aug 1999 21:31:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DaLj-0005yz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 22:19:23 +0100 Received: from praseodumium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.82]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DaLi-0005yu-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 08 Aug 1999 22:19:23 +0100 Received: from [62.6.11.152] (helo=default) by praseodumium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 11DaLa-0001hL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 8 Aug 1999 22:19:14 +0100 Message-ID: <000701bee1e3$558296c0$980b063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: DX Cluster postings to GB7DXM 7/8th August Date: Sun, 8 Aug 1999 22:12:55 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi All, an interesting weekend, though quite a lot of static crunches in the mornings. I heard a BIG signal from Lech G3KAU on Friday at about 2055Z on 136.76 despite the static. Saturday started reasonably quiet, a QRS cq from DJ5BV on 137.70 'O' here, and just a little bit lower was Geri DK8KW at 0701Z ,0714Z znd 0725Z also 'O'. A nice signal from G3BDQ at 0815Z on 136.54khz on hand keyed cw. G3KEV off the null of the loop at about the same time on 136.2 khz, and a big signal from John G4GVC at 0824Z, so strong I could see an hf 100Hz sideband. (Nearly as strong as Dave!! must be the rain on the earth!) Lech G3KAU came up at 0909Z with a stonking great signal to work PA0LEG and DF5DI. John G4GVC was heard again at 0944Z with a very much weaker signal, I guess he must have tripped off the dormant TV (or whatever) earlier and was getting SMPSU interference. If you find out where it is, John, you need to suggest that they use the on/off switch last thing at night. It saves a lot of electricity and circumvents a significant fire risk (bit of good PR that!!). Sunday logs on the QRS front were again DJ5BV and DK8KW. I think Geri worked DJ2LF at 0758Z at strength 'O', but I could not detect the other station. G0AKN's Earth radio tests, nothing heard on 71.85khz (unless I had a bit of finger trouble !) but there was a high level of drifting 50Hz hum modulation pulsing across the passband of the rx. Nothing heard initially on 136.15 khz until I realised I had an unusual setting on the passband shift tuning and the BFO. Correcting than and John's signal came in at just about 'O' with an integration time of 6secs on FFTDSP4. The sea-sea period gave about 3dB better S/N indication on FFTDSP than the later sea-earth period. His 5wpm cw was about 1-2dB S/N with an integration time of 1 second, and not readable out of the radio speaker. I have 3 GIF files of the signals I have offered to John. The Cluster spots do not seem to go so far back in history this week, I think there was a VHF contest so there may have been a purge before the weekend. There were a couple of interesting postings during the week which I didn't save, expecting them to be on the bottom of the list....sorry. Postings to GB7DXM G3NYK de GB7DXM 8-Aug 2018Z > 136.6 G3KAU 8-Aug-1999 1931Z cq 137.1 PA0MLC 8-Aug-1999 0955Z (539) 137.0 G3XTZ 8-Aug-1999 0916Z (539) 137.7 DJ5AO 8-Aug-1999 0845Z cq slow-cw 137.7 DF8ZR 8-Aug-1999 0727Z ! sri 137.7 DF9ZR 8-Aug-1999 0726Z cq slow-cw 137.7 DF8ZR 8-Aug-1999 0727Z ! sri 137.7 DF9ZR 8-Aug-1999 0726Z cq slow-cw 137.7 DK8KW 7-Aug-1999 0716Z cq slow-cw (549) ufb lf signa 137.2 G4GVC 7-Aug-1999 0711Z (549) in qso with pa0se (569 137.7 HB9ASB 7-Aug-1999 0710Z cq slow-cw 137.0 GW4ALG 7-Aug-1999 0640Z G3NYK de GB7DXM 8-Aug 2019Z > 1800.0 DL3FDO 8-Aug-1999 1208Z 137.1 normal CW CQ 1800.0 DL3FDO 7-Aug-1999 0900Z 137.7 Khz normal CW CQ CQ sr 1800.0 DL3FDO 7-Aug-1999 0859Z normal CW CQ CQ rst 509 G3NYK de GB7DXM 8-Aug 2020Z > 73 de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10484 invoked from network); 9 Aug 1999 07:01:33 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 9 Aug 1999 07:01:33 +0100 Received: (qmail 10436 invoked from network); 9 Aug 1999 06:05:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Aug 1999 06:05:00 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DiB6-0001Dn-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 06:40:56 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bw85zhb.bluewin.ch ([195.186.1.75]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DiB6-0001Di-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 06:40:56 +0100 Received: from phonakcom.ch ([195.186.13.231]) by bw85zhb.bluewin.ch ( with ESMTP id AAA687A for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 07:40:50 +0200 Message-ID: <37AE69E3.6DC7E49E@phonakcom.ch> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 07:40:51 +0200 From: "Toni Bdrtschi" Organization: Phonak Communications AG X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [de] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz skeds? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Mike, how about a cross band QSO 73/136 in Slow CW. 73 de Toni, HB9ASB Mike Dennison schrieb: > > I have set my station up on the 73kHz band again and am looking for > skeds. I can use conventional or slow CW. > Any takers? Call me on 01707 331546. > -- > Mike, G3XDV > www.dennison.demon.co.uk From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9766 invoked from network); 9 Aug 1999 10:12:53 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 9 Aug 1999 10:12:53 +0100 Received: (qmail 26930 invoked from network); 9 Aug 1999 09:16:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Aug 1999 09:16:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DlMI-0002em-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 10:04:42 +0100 Received: from mserv1a.u-net.net ([195.102.240.34]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DlMG-0002eg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 10:04:41 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1a.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #61) id 11DlMu-0006Ya-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 10:05:21 +0100 Received: from miked.rsgbhq [192.168.2.30] by rsgb.org.uk [192.168.2.132] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 09:59:37 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Mike Dennison" Organization: Radio Society of Great Britain To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 10:02:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Weekend report 7/8 August X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: An unusual weekend. I had to work most of the time, so little activity, except for listening (watching) for the earth tests from John, G0AKN. Saturday 7 August: Local noise on 136kHz in morning. Tuned up antenna and Rx filter on 73kHz prior to Eclipse tests. Put out an e-mail inviting skeds. Went to work. Static bad later. Nil heard. Phoned late evening by G0AKN asking me to listen for him in 71.84kHz. Bad static. Thought I heard something but unsure. Computer monitor failed to synch because it had got hot, so no Spectrogram. Sunday 8 August: Local noise still on 136kHz. Put out normal and slow CW calls on 71.9kHz. Downloaded Spectrogram 5.0.9. I can confirm this is much better than 5.0. Not been able to compare properly with 4.2.6.5 but it seems at least as good. Watched for G0AKN on 72.84kHz. Very weak occasional straight lines in the noise. Nothing positive. I put out normal and slow CW CQs on the same frequency after the tests. No takers. Re-tuned system to 136kHz - about 5 minutes. Immediately heard John on 137.05kHz at S3. Very good on Spectrogram. The second set of tests were slightly poorer than the first. John called me about some more tests at 1230UTC and these seemed the best. Well done! Distance not checked but must be 300km+. See http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/g0akn.htm for seven Spectrograms. Note these are not yet linked from the rest of my site - put up in haste. Also heard G3KAU at 5 9+10 9. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3830 invoked from network); 9 Aug 1999 14:16:30 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 9 Aug 1999 14:16:30 +0100 Received: (qmail 10095 invoked from network); 9 Aug 1999 13:19:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Aug 1999 13:19:58 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Dp62-0004Vs-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 14:04:10 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Dp61-0004Vn-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 14:04:09 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #34) id 11Dpzj-0006iO-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 14:01:44 +0000 Received: from miked.rsgbhq by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 14:00:27 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Radio Society of Great Britain To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 14:03:04 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz skeds? In-reply-to: <37AE69E3.6DC7E49E@phonakcom.ch> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: > how about a cross band QSO 73/136 in Slow CW. > > 73 de Toni, HB9ASB > Ho Toni. I would love to, but I think we have a better chance later in the year for the following reasons: 1) I have been plotting the signal from HBG using ON5OO's excellent software, and it confirms what I had from casual observation. That is an 8-10dB enhancement when the path is in darkness. I will post some of these shortly on my web site. At present, either we must get up very early or battle with QRN at night. 2) There are several improvements to be made to my antenna system which will give me a greater effective height and bigger capacitance hat. Both of these will have a greater effect on 73 than 136. 3) My 73kHz erp at present is around 23mW, compared to about 140mW on 136 so we will need all the help we can get. Suggest we take another look at a sked around late September. By the way, I will be doing some serious 73kHz work from west Wales in October, hoping to beat the two-way record which is about 180km at present. I expect to have a really stable oscillator (wow!) and will be able to send QRSs from a portable site in GW. A one-way to you, or a two-way cross-band would really be one for the record books at 1000km+, and very difficult to beat in the few months we still have the band (ends in June 2000). I have heard you on 136 from GW so that bit is easy!!! By the way, I failed to get my report last time we worked on 136kHz normal CW so would appreciate a call next time you hear me. 73 Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12232 invoked from network); 9 Aug 1999 14:53:26 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 9 Aug 1999 14:53:26 +0100 Received: (qmail 28919 invoked from network); 9 Aug 1999 13:56:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Aug 1999 13:56:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Dpkc-0004os-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 14:46:06 +0100 Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Dpkb-0004om-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 14:46:05 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Mon, 9 Aug 1999 15:45:28 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de ([194.94.166.130]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id PAA24815 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 15:45:41 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37AEDA7D.82597A0E@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 15:41:17 +0200 From: "P. W. Schnoor" Organization: Clinic of Nephrology, University of Kiel X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.36 i586) X-Accept-Language: de, en To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: HBG75 [was: 73kHz skeds?] References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Group, Mike Dennison wrote: > 1) I have been plotting the signal from HBG using ON5OO's > excellent software, and it confirms what I had from casual > observation. That is an 8-10dB enhancement when the path is in > darkness. Recording HBG75 last night: >10 dB enhancement here at North Germany over night, impressive deep nulls right on sunset/sunrise. I'm using a tuned ferrite rod for 75 kHz reception since noise floor on Marconi is too high. HBG75 is bearing approx. 200° from here. Plot: ftp://ftp.rz.uni-kiel.de/pub/nephro/nephlab/lp/08081728.gif 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2618 invoked from network); 10 Aug 1999 00:14:24 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 10 Aug 1999 00:14:24 +0100 Received: (qmail 17155 invoked from network); 9 Aug 1999 23:17:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 9 Aug 1999 23:17:53 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DyIy-0000Hv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 23:54:08 +0100 Received: from ah-img-2.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.153] helo=hpamgaab.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11DyIw-0000Hp-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 09 Aug 1999 23:54:06 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by hpamgaab.compuserve.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/HP-1.8) id SAA06138 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 9 Aug 1999 18:54:03 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 18:53:12 -0400 From: "Prof R. Jennison" Subject: LF: 73kHz sked To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <199908091853_MC2-8065-A103@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Mike, Welcome back to 73 kHz. I was about to resign from the LF net - it is saturating my little computer - but I received your message just in time. I have heard no fellow ham on the 73 band for ages and I thought that I was destined to be alone on the band, apart from Harry Woodhouse, G3MFW. Harry received my 73 kHz signal in St Austel six months or a year ago and played the tape back to me on the telephone (distance about 450km). He then determined to build a transmitter, which he has now done. He also has an excellent receiving system - far better than when he heard me many months ago - but now neither of us can hear the other. We really miss an intermediate station but everyone seems to be involved in the less challenging activity on 136. As you know, I have a slight hearing problem but you may consider giving Harry a telephone call to fix a listening sked or even a full QSO. His telephone number is 01726 73608. My own rig has suffered somewhat from neglect and my radiated power is way down on what it was a year ago, but I'm afraid that other matters have demanded my attention and with no one else on 73 I've just let it decay! Nevertheless I'll probably put my beacon on throughout the eclipse period in case anyone wishes to monitor the signal. The frequency will be somewhere near 72 kHz. I can also switch it on at almost any time by request but I don't know when have time to overhaul the system. Keep the 73 flag flying whilst you can, Mike. 73 and all that, Roger, G2AJV. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8331 invoked from network); 10 Aug 1999 09:44:37 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 10 Aug 1999 09:44:37 +0100 Received: (qmail 15468 invoked from network); 10 Aug 1999 08:48:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Aug 1999 08:48:08 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11E6wF-0004Em-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 09:07:15 +0100 Received: from mail2.hamilton-standard.com ([153.4.57.12]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11E6wD-0004Ef-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 09:07:14 +0100 Received: from curly.hsd.utc.com by mail2.hamilton-standard.com; (8.9.1/) id EAA26992; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 04:12:21 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from umrsvr.hsd.utc.com by curly.hsd.utc.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/27Feb96-0334PM) id AA03145; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 04:05:16 -0400 Received: from nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com by umrsvr.hsd.utc.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/27Feb96-0334PM) id AA24497; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 04:04:13 -0400 Received: by nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 10:01:08 +0100 Message-ID: From: "Soegiono, Gamal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Donebach LF-BC-station profile (153kHz) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 10:01:03 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hello all, just retreived some technical data from german LF-BC-station in Donebach broadcasting the program of Deutschlandfunk (alias Deutschlandradio Koeln). Perhaps the values listed here are beneficial for field strength measurements. ======Donebach Profile Start======================== allocated frequency 153.0 kHz (+/- 4.5 kHz for audio sidebands) attenuation at sideband boundaries -60dBc attenuation beyond sideband boundaries better -80dBc coordinates of the center of antenna system: 49N34 09E11 (degrees/minutes) continuous operation 24 hours, 7days daytime transmitter power = 500 kW nightime transmitter power = 250 kW at the moment (daytime saving time in effect = CEST) daytime operation is from 03:00 UTC to 18:00 UTC nightime operation is from 18:00 UTC to 03:00 UTC during normal time (CET) daytime operation is from 04:00 UTC to 19:00 UTC nightime operation is from 19:00 UTC to 04:00 UTC Antenna system comprises two masts of equal mechanical design. total mast height 363 meters from ground level masts are of the lattice type, 2m by 2m in cross section, base is not isolated but directly grounded to a burried radial system consisting of 60 radials 360m each. The masts are guyed at 6 levels: level-1 = 63m and level-2 = 120m 3 guy wires separated 120 degrees, isolators (7m) directly at the mast level-3 = 180m and level-4 = 242m 3 guy wires separated 120 degrees, aligned in azimuth with guys of level-1 and -2. guy wires are bonded to the mast inclining 53 deg and 45 deg respectively and have isolators (7m) after 150 m. So these guys act as capacitive loading. level-5 = 308m 3 guy wires separated 120 degrees, aligned in azimuth 60 deg off the guys of lower levels. The guys are directly bonded to the mast incline exactly 45 degs down for a length of 250m where 7m isolators breaking the remaining run to ground electrically. About 150m from the mast feed wires are attached (one for each guy wire) which slope down to the mast base where all are bonded together to form the feed point of the antenna. This level acts as part of a folded monopole as well as capacitive loading. level-6 = 343m 3 guy wires separated 120 degrees, aligned in azimuth with guys of level-5. The guys are directly bonded to the mast, incline exactly 45 degs down for a length of 165m where 10m isolators breaking the remaining run to ground electrically. So these guys act as capacitive top loading. These two masts are separated by about 600m on a line beaming 111/291 degrees. Each mast feed has its own matching unit receiving transmitter power from a power divider and phasing network located at the antenna system's center. During daytime operation, 500kW are fed to the mast on the western side, the eastern side mast remains grounded at it's feed, acting as a passive reflector. During nighttime operation, 250kW are fed, asymmetrically divided, to both masts. The antenna system acts like a phased array. Following a simplified representation of actually measured (on ground and by helicopter) Radiation patterns: ----------------------------------------------------- Daytime Operation Azimuth Radiation pattern for TOA=zero! nominal 500kW transmitter power EMRP Azimuth Sectors (east of north) 29dBkW 310-20 degs 28dBkW 20-35 degs 190-310 degs 27dBkW 35-42 degs 175-190 degs 26dBkW 42-50 degs 160-175 degs 25dBkW 50-60 degs 145-160 degs 24dBkW 60-145 degs ----------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------- Nighttime Operation Azimuth Radiation pattern for TOA=zero! nominal 250kW transmitter power EMRP Azimuth Sectors (east of north) 26dBkW 335-5 degs 200-227 degs 25dBkW 5-25 degs 190-200 degs 227-335 degs 24dBkW 25-45 degs 180-190 degs 23dBkW 45-55 degs 172-180 degs 22dBkW 55-62 degs 165-172 degs 21dBkW 62-67 degs 157-165 degs 20dBkW 67-73 degs 150-157 degs 19dBkW 73-76 degs 145-150 degs 18dBkW 76-80 degs 140-145 degs 17dBkW 80-85 degs 135-140 degs 16dBkW 85-90 degs 130-135 degs 14dBkW 90-130 degs ----------------------------------------------------- ======Donebach Profile End ========================== 73 de Gamal From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15873 invoked from network); 10 Aug 1999 10:17:08 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 10 Aug 1999 10:17:08 +0100 Received: (qmail 22422 invoked from network); 10 Aug 1999 09:20:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Aug 1999 09:20:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11E7kM-0004ar-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 09:59:02 +0100 Received: from iiweb4.webmailer.de ([192.67.198.54] helo=post.webmailer.de) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11E7kL-0004am-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 09:59:02 +0100 Received: from i6h2d3 (dialup-212.162.12.251.frankfurt1.mik.net [212.162.12.251]) by post.webmailer.de (8.9.3/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA08131 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 10:59:00 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001e01bee306$34c3aae0$fb0ca2d4@i6h2d3> From: "Andreas Tschammer" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: 3C85 where ?? Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 10:58:59 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi all, does anyone have a source for the famous 3C85-cores? I prefer a german supplier - if there is one.. I could not find any info on the available 3C85 core-types and order codes on the Philips-site. Does anyone have info on that? tnx + 73 Andreas in Rheinbach near Bonn, JO30LO DL2KCL From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15465 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 04:07:02 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 04:07:02 +0100 Received: (qmail 9973 invoked from network); 10 Aug 1999 20:28:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Aug 1999 20:28:19 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EICI-0000sL-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 21:08:34 +0100 Received: from imo21.mx.aol.com ([198.81.17.65]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EICH-0000sG-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 21:08:33 +0100 Received: from G0MRF@aol.com by imo21.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id lZGJa20496 (4415) for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 16:07:47 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: G0MRF@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 16:07:46 EDT Subject: Re: LF: 3C85 where ?? To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 135 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi. The Philips site is a little difficult to navigate, but there is an extensive list of distribtors including those in Germany. Philips code the cores by Size so a large core would be (to use the one in my amplifer as an example.) TL 58 / 41 / 18 T for toroid L (cant remember) 58 mm outside diameter 41mm inside dia 18 high. You then specify the material as 3C85 or 3F3 etc.( 3F3 is better but is not available in this particular size of core) the above is good to 700 Watts TN 26 / 15 / 10 in 3C85 should be OK to 100 Watts - maybe 150. There is a 3F3 available at around 39mm dia and this looks good for anyone willing to experiment. Good luck David G0MRF Projects From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23545 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 04:40:38 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 04:40:38 +0100 Received: (qmail 29416 invoked from network); 10 Aug 1999 23:07:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 10 Aug 1999 23:07:18 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EKoB-00020Z-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 23:55:51 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail1-gui.server.ntli.net ([194.168.222.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EKoA-00020U-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 23:55:50 +0100 Received: from cableol.co.uk ([194.168.18.59]) by mail1-gui.server.ntli.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-33929U70000L2S50) with ESMTP id AAA23373 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 23:42:55 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37B0A9E0.923DB8C8@cableol.co.uk> Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 23:38:24 +0100 From: "Steve Rawlings" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: 3C85 where ?? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Andreas! The location of the Philips 3C85 Data Sheet is: http://www.acm.components.philips.com/pdf/3c85.pdf (a PDF file viewer, such as Acrobat Reader, is required) At the above page you will also find details of Philips Components GmbH, Hamburg. Details of a UK source for 3C85 ring cores can be found at: http://www.cableol.net/alg/radio/136/comps.htm Regards to all, Steve GW4ALG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7479 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 08:44:14 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 08:44:14 +0100 Received: (qmail 19894 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 05:39:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 05:39:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EQW4-0004nB-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 06:01:32 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bw85zhb.bluewin.ch ([195.186.1.75]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EQW3-0004ls-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 06:01:31 +0100 Received: from phonakcom.ch ([195.186.13.116]) by bw85zhb.bluewin.ch ( with ESMTP id AAA590A for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 07:00:40 +0200 Message-ID: <37B1037D.8619E179@phonakcom.ch> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 07:00:45 +0200 From: "Toni Bdrtschi" Organization: Phonak Communications AG X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [de] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: 3C85 where ?? References: <001e01bee306$34c3aae0$fb0ca2d4@i6h2d3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: In case of difficulties purchasing Philips toroids you may use Siemens N30 cores as an alternative (I'm using a 58mm Core in my 500W LF PA). In Germany you can get them from Schuricht. 73 de Toni, HB9ASB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2870 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 09:36:22 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 09:36:22 +0100 Received: (qmail 21370 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 07:56:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 07:56:45 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11ESwL-0005q5-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 08:36:49 +0100 Received: from mail1-gui.server.ntli.net ([194.168.222.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11ESvu-0005pz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 08:36:46 +0100 Received: from cableol.co.uk ([194.168.18.93]) by mail1-gui.server.ntli.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-33929U70000L2S50) with ESMTP id AAA28047 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 08:22:30 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37B123A5.F924C09D@cableol.co.uk> Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 08:17:57 +0100 From: "Steve Rawlings" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: Measurement of loop antenna current Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Geri DK8KW recently asked me how much current I get into my antenna. I am ashamed to admit that, in all my 30 years as a radio amateur, I have never sought to measure antenna current. So the following describes how I set about calibrating a thermocouple RF ammeter and the initial results when used to measure the current into my loop antenna. (Sorry Geri, measuring the current into my experimental vertical will have to wait a few more days!) The 3 ampere meter used for the measurement was re-discovered in my junk box about 3 months ago, and is marked: PAT. FEB.21,'22. THERMOCOUPLE TYPE AMPERES R.F. ULTRA HIGH FREQUENCY TYPE Weston Electrical Instrument Corp.,Newark, N.J.,U.S.A. MODEL 425 I calibrated the RF ammeter at 23 degrees C using a variable DC source against a digital multimeter. I initially found the RF ammeter to be reading 'high', but was pleased to find that a meter shunt of 0.33 ohm resulted in a readout error of not more than 0.1 A over the range 1 to 3 A (relative to my digital meter). Even in the range 0 to 1 A (at the compressed end of the meter scale), the meter gives a very useful indication of current. I then used the RF ammeter to measure the current in my loop antenna. For details of the loop see: http://www.cableol.net/alg/radio/136/loop.htm The 65 m single-turn loop has a DC resistance of 1.7 ohm, but the loss resistance of the ATU components is unknown. When running 18 W from my transverter, I find that the RF ammeter reads 2.3 A when inserted in one 'leg' of the loop (at the ATU end). Although I don't know the actual phase difference between the current and the voltage at that point, I believe the figure of 2.3 A to be a reasonable approximation. This initial result indicates the high currents involved when using loop antennas on transmit - even at quite low power levels. It also emphasises the importance of using low resistance conductors for the loop. Indeed, my loop resistance of 1.7 ohm (DC) is rather high for an antenna of this sort, and I will seek to reduce this significantly over the next few weeks. For example, the loop resistance of the loop antenna used by Dave G3YMC is less than 0.1 ohm. (For more details of Dave's loop antenna, see: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sergeantd/loops.htm In practice, I regularly run 400 W into the loop and so the current will be significantly greater than 2.3 A under those conditions. Certainly enough to fry the thermocouple! Regards to all, Steve GW4ALG steve.rawlings@cableol.co.uk From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6108 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 10:46:38 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 10:46:38 +0100 Received: (qmail 29469 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 02:12:45 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 02:12:45 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11ENWO-0003OX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 02:49:40 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from oracle.dsuper.net ([205.205.255.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11ENWN-0003OS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 02:49:39 +0100 Received: from Gilles (asc9-addr-144.dsuper.net [207.139.115.144]) by oracle.dsuper.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id VAA02441 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 1999 21:49:37 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.19990810214934.00fadba0@dsuper.net> X-Sender: gauger@dsuper.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 21:49:34 -0400 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Gilles Auger" Subject: LF: Broadband Loop ? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi The time is comming for me to make a good loop antenna that can cover the 10Khz to 500khz band.. I have search the net for more informations, but nearly noting. I have find a lot of informations for tuned loop but they are limited to a small fraction of the 10 to 500 Khz !!! What king of preamplifier do you use for a balanced broadband loop ?? A low Z one ? What is the minimum size of a loop that can do the job ? Thanks in advance for your collaboration and excuse my English *&%" Gilles Auger Montreal, Canada gauger@dsuper.net From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29964 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 11:35:35 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 11:35:35 +0100 Received: (qmail 8358 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 10:12:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 10:12:33 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EVCD-0006r5-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:01:21 +0100 Received: from tk2.ihug.co.nz ([203.29.160.14] helo=smtp2.ihug.co.nz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EVCB-0006qz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:01:20 +0100 Received: from test (p50-max2.chc.ihug.co.nz [207.214.13.50]) by smtp2.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id WAA02587 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 22:01:00 +1200 Message-ID: <00d701bee3e0$86bc0100$0200a8c0@test> From: "Dave Brown" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <37B123A5.F924C09D@cableol.co.uk> Subject: LF: Re: Measurement of loop antenna current Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 22:01:45 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Steve & others You need to find the RF resistance of the loop at the working frequency to see how the measured 2.3 amps compares with what you may expect for the 18 watt power level. There are several methods to do this but the easiest to implement is the most obvious, use a scope to check the voltage across the (measured and known)loop inductance and see if Ohms Law still applies! The scope ground can be an issue though. Another way is to use the incremental resistance method where you take the resonating capacitance out of cct, maintain the source voltage constant and measure the loop current, then insert a low value resistance in series with the loop and do it again. A bit of arithmetic and you have the rf resistance of the loop. You may need to allow for the rf ammeter resistance as well if using low powers and currents. The same method can also be used to measure the total loss resistance for a vertical tx antenna system although I have not done this personally as I do not run a vertical antenna for TX. Others here in ZL have done so though. My loop antenna has a dc resistance of around 0.25 ohms but the measured rf resistance is up about 5 ohms at 180 kHz. This checks out against the measured current on tx of about 30 amps in the loop (measured using a current xfmr arrangement) and the tx output power of around 750 watts, the latter measured with a 30 dB Bird 1kW attenuator and calibrated spectrum analyser. Somewhere in there, all mixed up with the 5 ohms loss resistance in the loop, is the rather meagre 0.00001 ohms or so radiation resistance of the darn thing!! So all I am doing is providing a heated (well, vaguely so) perch for the local bird life! 73 Dave ZL3FJ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27698 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 13:31:12 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 13:31:12 +0100 Received: (qmail 8712 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 12:34:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 12:34:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EXOG-0007r3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:21:56 +0100 Received: from mcclure.tinet.ie ([159.134.237.31]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EXOE-0007qy-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:21:54 +0100 Received: from p136.lifford1.tinet.ie ([159.134.235.136] helo=beachwood.tinet.ie) by mcclure.tinet.ie with smtp (Exim 2.05 #23) id 11EXO7-0003xJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:21:48 +0100 Message-ID: <000a01bee3f4$8bda0880$88eb869f@beachwood.tinet.ie> From: "Finbar O'Connor" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: re:Eclipse mon Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:23:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
                                Eclipse Monitoring  at Malin Head, Ireland.
The following is a very non-tecnical monitoring of various frequencies during the period of the Eclipse, today  11th August 1999. Receiver  ICOM R75, Antenna, my LF  136 khz antenna, untuned.
I tried to find a number of stations south of my qth, but rather than range over a wide frequency, I picked
one LF station, and the rest in the Medium Wave band. Broadcasters running relatively low power.
1.  The LF station was  the power house on 138.8 khz. Starting at 0915 utc as the base line, this station
      remained stable until  approx  1020 utc when its signal came up by about  6 db, then dropped back to 
      its normal level by  1035 utc.
 
2.   One Medium wave broadcaster  in Ireland on 540 khz , which is 250 km to the south was chosen as
      its signal is extremely weak here, its supposed to be  a 2kw rig but sounds more like 100 watts, even
      driving by in its service area its very weak. The effect of the Eclipse on this signal was a nothing at
      all, even listening on up to 1100 utc. Surprising, but there you go, that's how it was here.
 
3.   Three broadcaster were chosen at the top end of the Medium wave band,  1602 khz  BBC Radio
      Kent,  1521 khz  Fame 1521  Reigate/Crawley, and  1476 khz County Sound Radio , Guildford.
      All three transmitters run low power, ie,  1602 khz    250 watts,  1521 khz  1000 watts  and
      1476 khz  500 watts. There were very definite effects on these signals, particularly  1603 khz.
 
1603 khz  up to  1005 utc  nil  heard, however  at 1007  a Spanish broadcaster suddenly came up and
by 1013 utc  was  an  s8/9 signal, very strong. By  1025  Radio Kent started to come up under the
Spanish station, with a distinct fluttery signal and the Spanish station dropping rapidly down to a low level
in the background until  1030 utc when Radio Kent took a sudden dive down to almost nothing. The two
by now very weak signal mixed with one another for a about 3 minutes until 1035 utc, by  1036 the
freq was dead. NIL.  The most noticable effect was on Radio Kent, whose signal , although quite readable, yes they too were nattering on about the Eclipse, was the fluttering effect on their signal, rapid and although their modulation was good the carrier never got above about  s3.
Checked 1476 khz and 1521 khz from 0915 but not a trace of them.
1476 khz and 1521 khz. at  about  1004  both signals started to appear. By  1018  utc  1521 khz was
an  s6 ,  at  1019  1476 khz was  s7, by  1023 utc  1521 was up to  an s9, but  1476 khz was almost
nil. Both station took on this effect of rapid qsb, up and down from almost nil signal to  at best s9, by
1028 utc  1476 khz was running a very good  s7 up to  1031 utc , but at  1035  utc   1476 khz and 1521 khz were both dead and stayed that way.  There was no fluttering effect on either of these signal, just rapid and very deep qsb.
Whilst tuning down to 1521 khz  I noticed  a  s9  signal on 1575 khz from a Spanish station at  1008 utc and again at  1018 utc, an  s8/9 signal.
 
As far a the visual effect of the Eclipse on our location, yes it did get a bit darker, much like when a heavy rain cloud appears, but nothing very dramatic, mind you it was very cloudy, so no sight of the Sun.
The garden birds seemed to ignore the whole thing, I certainly did'nt notice them fluffing out their
pillows or putting on their electic blankets for a quick kip.
As far as I can see from my atlas, those top end Medium wave broadcasters are about  700 km from my qth. From an LF viewpoint , there was a very definite increase in the 138.8 khz signal of about  6 db's
not quite as much a the effect on this signal under normal nighttime  conditions when it goes up about
10-15 db's here.
Best regards
Finbar    EI0CF
 
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21096 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 19:08:19 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 19:08:19 +0100 Received: (qmail 4311 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 18:11:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 18:11:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EcUS-0001gX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 18:48:40 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EcUS-0001gS-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 18:48:40 +0100 Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:48:30 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108110.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.110]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id TAA11254 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:48:46 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37B1B766.FB856B79@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:48:22 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Eclipse - Effect on 75kHz... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Group, Observing HBG75 during the eclipse on 75 kHz I found a great effect: Plot: ftp://ftp.rz.uni-kiel.de/pub/nephro/nephlab/lp/8-11day.gif Time of maximum of eclipse (83%) here: 10:31 UTC. Antenna: Ferrite rod RX: MV61 selective level meter (Thanks to DK8KW!) Sampling rate: 1/sec. Data are smoothed by means of a 300sec. Median-Filter with ACE software. 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24146 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 19:21:37 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 19:21:37 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: (qmail 5925 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 18:25:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 18:25:15 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Eca8-0001hf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 18:54:32 +0100 Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.38]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Eca6-0001hZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 18:54:30 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from dennison.demon.co.uk ([194.222.239.33]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 11Eca2-000IOJ-0A for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:54:29 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 18:52:59 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Mike Dennison" Subject: LF: Effects of eclipse on HBG MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: 95% solar eclipse due at 1119 local (1019UTC). Viewed at work - unexpectedly cool, strange light (like looking through polaroid sunglasses) and got dim but not dark. Very few clouds. Measured HBG on 75kHz at home throughout the day using ON5OO's software. I expected a peak as the D layer absorption reduced. Actual plot showed the reverse! Slight peak (+1dB) before and after, and a double-humped drop in strength at eclipse time in UK (-5dB) and Switzerland (-4dB) [Toni, can you confirm that this was 1037UTC?]. Are there any scientists out there who can explain this. The path lay along (or slightly north of) the line of totality. The plot is on my web site. -- Mike, G3XDV http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25204 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 19:26:27 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 19:26:27 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Received: (qmail 5384 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 18:26:29 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 18:26:29 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ecqz-0001qp-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:11:57 +0100 Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.41]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ecqz-0001qk-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:11:57 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from dennison.demon.co.uk ([194.222.239.33]) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 11Ecqv-0005r7-0C for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 18:11:56 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:10:14 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Mike Dennison" Subject: Re: LF: Effects of eclipse on HBG In-reply-to: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Furthe to my last message . . >Measured HBG on 75kHz at home throughout the day using ON5OO's software. >I expected a peak as the D layer absorption reduced. > >Actual plot showed the reverse! Ah, of course. This is not puzzling after all. Any change showed the presense of a sky wave that wasn't there outside the eclipse - it was just out of phase with the ground wave. -- Mike, G3XDV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27604 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 19:37:19 +0100 Received: from purple.force9.net (195.166.128.228) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 19:37:19 +0100 Received: (qmail 1140 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 18:37:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by purple.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 18:37:17 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ed86-0001zZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:29:38 +0100 Received: from ds-img-1.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.134] helo=spdmgaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ed85-0001zL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:29:37 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by spdmgaaa.compuserve.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/SUN-1.3) id OAA20539 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:29:06 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:27:56 -0400 From: "'Geri' Kinzel, DK8KW" Subject: LF: Eclipse - Effect on 75kHz... To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-ID: <199908111428_MC2-809A-4DFE@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Lowfers, after a beautiful view onto the eclipse today (about 86% in Peine near Hannover, the clouds just wen away around the time of the eclipse maximum), also here I measured an interesting anomaly in field strength of HBG75, from here south of the moon shadow path. Why are there two maxima? I ran two parallel methods of measurement, using the MV61's voltage output as well as the program "Eclipse" by ON5OO. Details can be found on my homepage http://www.dk8kw.home.pages.de follow the link "Field Strength Anomaly of HBG75 on 75 kHz during the August 11, 1999 Eclipse" What a day! Best 73 Geri, DK8KW (W1KW) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27009 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 21:34:48 +0100 Received: from purple.force9.net (195.166.128.228) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 21:34:48 +0100 Received: (qmail 12544 invoked from network); 11 Aug 1999 20:34:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by purple.force9.net with SMTP; 11 Aug 1999 20:34:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ees0-0002mP-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 21:21:08 +0100 Received: from tk1.ihug.co.nz ([203.29.160.13] helo=smtp1.ihug.co.nz) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Eery-0002mK-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 11 Aug 1999 21:21:07 +0100 Received: from test (p58-max2.chc.ihug.co.nz [207.214.13.58]) by smtp1.ihug.co.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian/GNU) with SMTP id IAA15339 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:20:47 +1200 Message-ID: <003e01bee437$206b7500$0200a8c0@test> From: "Dave Brown" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <37B123A5.F924C09D@cableol.co.uk> Subject: LF: Re: Correction to; Measurement of loop antenna current Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:21:35 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Forget the numbers I quoted re my LF loop in previous posting; in defence all I can say is I was first licensed in mid sixties and been member of RSGB since 68. Draw your own conclusions!!! For some reason I keep forgetting that I actually have two conductors in parallel in the loop. The 5 ohms rf resistance I quoted was the figure for the original single conductor loop. With two conductors in parallel the figure is close to 1.25ohms. Corresponding DC figure is just over 0.1 ohms. The present loop matching xfmr has a 13 turn (50 ohm) primary and 2 turns on the loop side secondary. Never been quite sure why it dropped to quarter of what it was originally rather than just half. Anyone else had the same experience? Anyway the other figures are basically correct, just under 25 amps loop current for the 750 watt tx out figure. I do push it to 30 amps on occasions but the poor old pair of 813s won't take too much of that! 73 Dave ZL3FJ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15543 invoked from network); 12 Aug 1999 01:18:59 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 12 Aug 1999 01:18:59 +0100 Received: (qmail 19084 invoked from network); 12 Aug 1999 00:19:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 Aug 1999 00:19:49 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EiKr-0004Se-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 01:03:09 +0100 Received: from smtp1.xs4all.nl ([194.109.127.48]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EiKq-0004SW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 01:03:08 +0100 Received: from v3q4v1 (dc2-isdn1730.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.154.194]) by smtp1.xs4all.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id CAA10631 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 02:03:07 +0200 (CEST) From: "M. Sanders" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: Eclipse - Effect on 75kHz... Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 02:00:29 +0200 Message-ID: <000401bee455$b0959a20$61976dc2@v3q4v1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <199908111428_MC2-809A-4DFE@compuserve.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi All, During the eclipse I have monitored HBG75 with the UBA ON5OO software and recorded more or less the same anomality. Mike, G3XDV was so kind to send me his measurement files and i have combined our measurements in one graph. There are still some unceirtenties that need to be cleared but the phenomena is fascinating! I would like to receive more data from HBG75 observations preferably in a ON5OO format from 11/8/1999 between 09:00utc and 12:00 utc. DK8KW wrote: > also here I measured an interesting anomaly in field strength of HBG75, > from here south of the moon shadow path. > > Why are there two maxima? I think analysing and comparing the data from multiple measurements may help us when we attempt to explain this complex phenomena. Best 73's Michael Sanders Mailto:pa3bsh@amsat.org From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9752 invoked from network); 12 Aug 1999 08:43:46 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 12 Aug 1999 08:43:46 +0100 Received: (qmail 1111 invoked from network); 12 Aug 1999 07:47:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 Aug 1999 07:47:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EpL9-0007Wz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:31:55 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail1-gui.server.ntli.net ([194.168.222.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11EpL7-0007Wt-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:31:53 +0100 Received: from cableol.co.uk ([194.168.18.5]) by mail1-gui.server.ntli.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-33929U70000L2S50) with ESMTP id AAA3161 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:18:58 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37B2744D.810F6573@cableol.co.uk> Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 08:14:21 +0100 From: "Steve Rawlings" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Correction to; Measurement of loop antenna current References: <37B123A5.F924C09D@cableol.co.uk> <003e01bee437$206b7500$0200a8c0@test> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Dave Brown ZL3FJ wrote: > . . . The 5 ohms rf resistance I quoted was the figure for the original > single loop. With conductor two conductors in parallel the > figure is close to 1.25ohms. Corresponding DC figure is just over 0.1 ohms. > The present loop matching xfmr has a 13 turn (50 ohm) primary and 2 turns on > the loop side secondary. Never been quite sure why it dropped to quarter of > what it was originally rather than just half. Anyone else had the same > experience? Many thanks for the information Dave. I'll keep this in mind as I seek to reduce my loop resistance from its present value of 1.7 ohms DC. But now that I know the magnitude of the RF current involved, I'm concerned that, once I have reduced the losses, I will end up cooking the ATU tuning capacitors! Electric field antennas present us with problems due to high voltage; and magnetic field antennas present us with problems due to high current. It's all part of the fun, I guess . . . . Regards to all, Steve GW4ALG steve.rawlings@cableol.co.uk From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18997 invoked from network); 12 Aug 1999 11:31:23 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 12 Aug 1999 11:31:23 +0100 Received: (qmail 31930 invoked from network); 12 Aug 1999 10:35:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 Aug 1999 10:35:03 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11ErzR-0000E5-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 11:21:41 +0100 Received: from [143.179.236.32] (helo=Lesothosaurus.big-orange.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11ErzP-0000Dv-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 11:21:39 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 ([143.179.151.215]) by Lesothosaurus.big-orange.net (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with SMTP id AAA372E; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 12:21:30 +0200 Message-ID: <000d01bee4ad$42bfe520$d797b38f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "LF-Group" Cc: "Jan Hekkert, PA3HCD" , "Hans Peltzer, PA0HRP" , "Klaas Spaargaren, PA0KSB" , "Koos Fockens, PA0KDF" , "Pieter Bruinsma, PA0PHB" , "Hendrik de Waard, PA0ZX" , "Jaap Kroon, PA0IF" , "Ger van Went, PA0GER" Subject: LF: Signals of GBR16 and DCF139 during eclips Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 12:26:31 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
To All
 
As requested by Jean-Jacques Delcourt, ON5PG, via Rik, ON7YD, I have measured the signal strength of GBR at about 16 kHz.
For comparison purposes I did the same on DCF139 at 138.38 kHz.
 
During the eclipse I measured every 5 minutes. Measurements before and after where made at random moments when I happened to be in the shack. 
 
The antenna is a vertical with topload, untuned. The antenna was connected to the high impedance input of a selective level meter PSM-5 made by Wandel & Goltermann.
 
Bandwidth was 500 Hz
 
Date    Time (UTC)    Signal strength (millivolt)
                                GBR16        DCF139
 
10/8      0931               9.5               3.8
 
10/8      1334               8.8               3.8
 
10/8      1439             10                  4.0
 
10/8      1737              11                 4.1
 
10/8      1859                9.2              4.8
 
10/8      2155              12                 5.0
 
 
11/8      0512                9.0              off air
 
11/8      0640              10.5              off air
 
11/8      0749               11.0             off air
 
11/8      0816               10.0             off air
 
11/8      0831               10.0              4.0
 
11/8      0925               10.0              3.9
 
11/8      0951               12.0              3.9
 
11/8      1000               13.5              3.9
 
11/8      1005               14.5              3.9
 
11/8      1010               15.5              3.9
 
11/8      1015               16.5              3.9
 
11/8      1020               16.5              3.9
 
11/8      1025               16.0              3.8
 
11/8      1030               16.0              3.8
 
11/8      1035               15.5              3.8
 
11/8      1040               15.0              3.8
 
11/8      1045               14.5              3.8
 
11/8      1050               13.5              3.8
 
11/8      1055               12.5              3.8
 
11/8      1100               11.5              3.9
 
11/8      1105               11.0              3.9
 
11/8      1110               10.0              3.9
 
11/8      1115               10.0              3.9
 
11/8      1140                 8.8              3.8
 
11/8      1222                 8.8              3.8
 
11/8      1333                 9.2              3.8   
 
11/8      1405                 9.5              off air
 
11/8      1534               10.5              off air
 
11/8      1916                 7.8              off air
 
 
12/8      2233                 2.5               4.5
 
12/8      0315                 9.0               3.0
 
12/8      0612                10.0              off air
 
12/8      0725                10.5              off air
 
12/8      1000                  9.4              off air
 
 
73, Dick PA0SE
 
JO22GD
52 09 40 N
04 31 23 E  
V.d. Marckstraat 5
2352 RA Leiderdorp
The Netherlands
Tel. +31 71 589 27 34
E-mail: d.w.rollema@gironet.nl        
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24936 invoked from network); 12 Aug 1999 20:34:15 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 12 Aug 1999 20:34:15 +0100 Received: (qmail 10683 invoked from network); 12 Aug 1999 19:37:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 12 Aug 1999 19:37:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11F0Rb-000431-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 20:23:19 +0100 Received: from iiweb6.webmailer.de ([192.67.198.56] helo=post.webmailer.de) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11F0Ra-00042w-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 20:23:19 +0100 Received: from i6h2d3 (dialup-212.162.12.90.frankfurt1.mik.net [212.162.12.90]) by post.webmailer.de (8.9.3/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA18126 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 1999 21:23:15 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <000601bee4ef$bcb75240$5a0ca2d4@i6h2d3> From: "Andreas Tschammer" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: tnx for info 3C85 Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 21:23:11 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by post.webmailer.de id VAA18126 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi, thank you for the tips concerning the 3C85-cores. I think I will try to get the Siemens N30-cores - as Toni supposed. Hope to be qrv on lf soon ! 73 Andreas, dl2kcl -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: Toni Bärtschi An: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Datum: Mittwoch, 11. August 1999 08:52 Betreff: Re: LF: 3C85 where ?? >In case of difficulties purchasing Philips toroids you may use Siemens >N30 cores as an alternative (I'm using a 58mm Core in my 500W LF PA). In >Germany you can get them from Schuricht. > >73 de Toni, HB9ASB > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12643 invoked from network); 13 Aug 1999 09:48:27 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 13 Aug 1999 09:48:27 +0100 Received: (qmail 18420 invoked from network); 13 Aug 1999 08:52:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 Aug 1999 08:52:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FCde-0000vE-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 09:24:34 +0100 Received: from mail5.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.20]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FCdZ-0000v9-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 09:24:29 +0100 Received: from modem-28.barium.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.27.156] helo=default) by mail5.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 11FCdU-0000P2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 09:24:25 +0100 Message-ID: <000001bee565$40255a80$9c1b883e@default> From: "wireless" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000d01bee4ad$42bfe520$d797b38f@w8k3f0> Subject: LF: report on 1999 earth tests, 73, 136 and 1 Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 09:21:24 +0100 Organization: T@ylor Training MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit ÿþ< From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7859 invoked from network); 13 Aug 1999 11:22:59 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 13 Aug 1999 11:22:59 +0100 Received: (qmail 6107 invoked from network); 13 Aug 1999 10:26:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 Aug 1999 10:26:46 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FEG8-0001ec-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 11:08:24 +0100 Received: from mail2.hamilton-standard.com ([153.4.57.12]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FEG7-0001eU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 11:08:23 +0100 Received: from curly.hsd.utc.com by mail2.hamilton-standard.com; (8.9.1/) id GAA22987; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 06:14:24 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from umrsvr.hsd.utc.com by curly.hsd.utc.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/27Feb96-0334PM) id AA04537; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 06:07:16 -0400 Received: from nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com by umrsvr.hsd.utc.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/27Feb96-0334PM) id AA15502; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 06:05:26 -0400 Received: by nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 12:02:09 +0100 Message-ID: From: "Soegiono, Gamal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: info rgd WWVB Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 12:02:08 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hello all, on my search about LF stations found the following: ============================================================================ ====== http://www.boulder.nist.gov/timefreq/wwvstatus.htm ============================================================================ ====== ------------------------------------------------------------------------ NIST Radio Station WWVB ------------------------------------------------------------------------ NIST Radio station WWVB is located on the WWV site near Ft. Collins, Colorado. The WWVB broadcasts are used by millions of people throughout the United States to synchronize consumer electronic products like wall clocks, clock radios, and wristwatches. In addition, WWVB is widely used for high level applications such as network time synchronization and frequency calibrations. WWVB continuously broadcasts time and frequency signals at 60 kHz. WWVB does not broadcast voice announcements, but provides standard time information, including the year; time intervals; Daylight Saving Time, leap second, and leap-year indicators; and UT1 corrections by means of a BCD time code. In addition, the 60-kHz carrier frequency provides an accurate frequency standard which is referenced to the NIST Frequency Standard. The transmitted accuracy of WWVB is normally better than 1 part in 100 billion (1 x 10-11). Day-to-day deviations are less than 5 parts in 1000 billion (5 x 10-12). The BCD time code can be received and used with an accuracy of approximately 0.1 ms. Propagation effects are minor compared to those of WWV and WWVH. When proper receiving and averaging techniques are used, the received accuracy of WWVB should be nearly as good as the transmitted accuracy. NIST Radio Station WWVB is currently undergoing major equipment upgrades. When finished, the station will have three refurbished longwave transmitters (formerly installed at U.S. Navy facilities), two refurbished 60 kHz antenna systems, a new backup generator and emergency power supply system, and other new equipment to improve signal strength and reliability. The upgrade has progressed in phases; the first involved replacing the original LF transmitters with the first of the more powerful refurbished units, along with rebuilding the first antenna system. This phase raised the radiated power from 13 kW to 23 kW in December 1997. Next, an additional transmitter was brought on-line to provide stand-by capability and improve broadcast reliability. Additional improvements allowed for an increase in radiated power to 30 kW by December 1998. The final phase of the upgrade involves installing a third transmitter and refurbishing the second antenna system. Control systems will be installed with the aim of operating two transmitters into two separate antennas simultaneously. These transmitters will be broadcasting the same 60 kHz signal, but the result is expected to be an increase in radiated power to 45-50 kW for the station. This phase of the WWVB upgrade is expected to be completed by October 1999. Click on the links below to see pictures of the upgrade and to check planned service disruptions. NOTE: On 6 August 1999 at 0130 UTC WWVB began broadcasting at 50kW (up from 27 kW) to test the two antenna system. During the week of 16 August and 23 August the power will be reduced to 27 kW to complete work on the second antenna system. Any changes to this schedule will be posted as soon as possible. Click on the "Status of WWVB operations..." link below for additional information ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Status of WWVB operations/planned service disruptions Pictures of the WWVB upgrade ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Questions? Click on the hyperlink to send mail: nist.radio@boulder.nist.gov ============================================================================ ====== 73 de Gamal From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25031 invoked from network); 13 Aug 1999 12:28:18 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 13 Aug 1999 12:28:18 +0100 Received: (qmail 17944 invoked from network); 13 Aug 1999 11:32:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 Aug 1999 11:32:06 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FFK6-0002AT-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 12:16:34 +0100 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FFK3-0002AH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 12:16:32 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #61) id 11FFIy-0002U5-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 12:15:24 +0100 Received: from miked.rsgbhq by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 12:10:46 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Mike Dennison" Organization: Radio Society of Great Britain To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 12:13:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz correction X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Sorry, brain not working. The frequency I will be transmitting on is 71.80kHz, not 72 ..... Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25094 invoked from network); 13 Aug 1999 12:28:31 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 13 Aug 1999 12:28:31 +0100 Received: (qmail 18008 invoked from network); 13 Aug 1999 11:32:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 Aug 1999 11:32:18 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FFK6-0002AU-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 12:16:34 +0100 Received: from mserv1b.u-net.net ([195.102.240.137]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FFK4-0002AI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 12:16:32 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #61) id 11FFIy-0002U6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 12:15:24 +0100 Received: from miked.rsgbhq by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 12:08:56 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Mike Dennison" Organization: Radio Society of Great Britain To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 12:11:37 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: 73kHz QRS X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: I will be transmitting on 72.80kHz, QRSs (3s dot length) at 0900UTC tomorrow 14 Aug and Sunday 15 Aug. There will be some normal speed CQs from 0845UTC. Any reports welcome. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13710 invoked from network); 14 Aug 1999 07:36:19 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 14 Aug 1999 07:36:19 +0100 Received: (qmail 21457 invoked from network); 13 Aug 1999 20:00:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 13 Aug 1999 20:00:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FN1r-0005Yv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 20:30:15 +0100 Received: from mta2-gui.server.ntli.net ([194.168.54.143] helo=mta2-svc.virgin.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FN1q-0005Yq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 20:30:14 +0100 Received: from default ([212.250.67.98]) by mta2-svc.virgin.net (InterMail v4.01.01.02 201-229-111-106) with SMTP id <19990813192915.DMC29980.mta2-svc@default> for ; Fri, 13 Aug 1999 20:29:15 +0100 Message-ID: <001d01bee5c2$4865cd80$6243fad4@default> From: "peter cleall" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: eclipse report Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 20:26:35 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Thanks to everyone who commented on "Is anyone planning any propagation experiments on136kHz or there abouts during the eclipse next week". After your comments I decided to study it, visually and by radio techniques at home (ON5OO software). Thanks Rik for the detail on the ON5OO software. Its working out very well. I used the software to record the strength of the German station on 138 kHz during the eclipse. Location Yeovil , Somerset , England 50deg 56.5 mins North and 2deg 39mins West I am using a 54 turn 38cm diam. square loop with 0.5cm spaced turns and feeding into a lowe 225 Rx set to SSB and 2200 hz filter. This receiver has a very good AGC system which cannot be switched off. For 2days before the event I experimented to find the linear section of the AGC before the signal hit the noise floor. I needed 30dB's switched in between antenna and Rx tto acheive reasonable results. On the 10th I took a recording which shows an 8dB increase during the evening over the daytime figure with some qsb nulls. Recording was stopped at appox 2130 GMT. After the recording I left the RX on all night for stability but switched off the computer. In the morning to my horror no signal from Rx on138kHz. Eventually I retuned to another station to prove Rx working. Some time later 138 kHz signal returned, but seemed to be at least 20dB down on my previous measurements. Recalibrated the sound card and the software. I was concerned about the station level would be switched during the measurements. So the eclipse data file had a calibration switching in and out of -/+ 10dB at both the start and finish of the recording. Eclipse results 0951 GMT 138 kHz increase in level starts 1002 GMT signal variable average about 3dB up, peaking 6dB up 1025 GMT signal variable average about 3dB up, isolated peak 9dB up 1033 GMT signal returns to the pre eclipse level The follow up must be to find time to build a RX with no agc. Regards Peter G8AFN From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11230 invoked from network); 14 Aug 1999 08:14:01 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 14 Aug 1999 08:14:01 +0100 Received: (qmail 17186 invoked from network); 14 Aug 1999 05:55:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 Aug 1999 05:55:14 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FWUU-0001HQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 06:36:26 +0100 Received: from dh-img-1.compuserve.com ([149.174.206.131] helo=hpdmgaaa.compuserve.com) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FWUT-0001HL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 06:36:25 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by hpdmgaaa.compuserve.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/HP-1.8) id BAA26279 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 01:36:22 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sat, 14 Aug 1999 01:35:56 -0400 From: "Dave Sergeant" Subject: LF: Various To: "rsgb_lf_group" Message-ID: <199908140136_MC2-8102-D360@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: >From Dave G3YMC No radio reports on the eclipse, but just to say that the visual eclipse in Salzburg was superb (2mins 6secs of totality in (surprisingly) an absolutely cloudless sky). No pictures I have seen on TV or elsewhere do justice to the sight. Last Tuesday I had a pleasant evening with Heinz OE5EEP and he showed me his 136 transmitter (with replaced FETs!). It is encouraging that there is growing interest in 136 in Austria and it appears there will be soon other stations active. Good luck with your transmit loop Heinz! I note with interest the mails from Dave ZL3FJ on loop resistances. His estimated resistance of several ohms does not tie in with the experience with my loop. I have not measured the true RF resistance, but a good feel of how it compares to the DC resistance can be found by the values of matching components required in my capacitive match. The loop has a DC resistance of 0.1ohms - however the capacitor values indicate an RF resistance of possibly 0.3ohms, no more. If it had the RF resistance Dave suggests the Q and hence the bandwidth of the loop would be much poorer - bandwidth is around 200Hz. I will try to do some more measurements and calculations to quantify the resistance better, but it is my feeling that at 136 skin effect is an insignificant effect. Possibly it is more significant at 180kHz. 73s Dave G3YMC sergeantd@compuserve.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2150 invoked from network); 14 Aug 1999 18:14:34 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 14 Aug 1999 18:14:34 +0100 Received: (qmail 26771 invoked from network); 14 Aug 1999 17:18:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 Aug 1999 17:18:28 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FgyT-0005VU-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 17:48:05 +0100 Received: from post.webmailer.de ([192.67.198.48]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FgyS-0005VP-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 17:48:04 +0100 Received: from i6h2d3 (dialup-212.162.12.89.frankfurt1.mik.net [212.162.12.89]) by post.webmailer.de (8.9.3/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA03610 for ; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 18:47:59 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <000a01bee66c$646d6560$590ca2d4@i6h2d3> From: "Andreas Tschammer" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: my eclipse report Date: Sat, 14 Aug 1999 18:47:58 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi, on wednesday I tried to reach the totality-zone in Germany but failed to get there (I only made 160km in 4 hours hi).. During the day my PC sampled the signal-strengths of several LW/MW- transmitters. The measurements can be found on my homepage: http://www.datelsoft.de/dl2kcl/page3.html 73 Andreas in Rheinbach, dl2kcl From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 25602 invoked from network); 15 Aug 1999 00:42:28 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 15 Aug 1999 00:42:28 +0100 Received: (qmail 22621 invoked from network); 14 Aug 1999 23:39:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 14 Aug 1999 23:39:43 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FnES-0008Bn-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 15 Aug 1999 00:29:00 +0100 Received: from imo26.mx.aol.com ([198.81.17.70]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FnEP-0008Bg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 15 Aug 1999 00:28:57 +0100 Received: from G0MRF@aol.com by imo26.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id lYORa01827 (322) for ; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 19:28:22 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: G0MRF@aol.com Message-ID: <72b788a7.24e75596@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Aug 1999 19:28:22 EDT Subject: Re: LF: Various To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 135 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: In a message dated 14/08/99 06:45:18 GMT Daylight Time, sergeantd@compuserve.com writes: << From Dave G3YMC No radio reports on the eclipse, but just to say that the visual eclipse in Salzburg was superb (2mins 6secs of totality in (surprisingly) an absolutely cloudless sky). No pictures I have seen on TV or elsewhere do justice to the sight. >> Quite agree Dave. I was also lucky at my eclipse location mid way between Rouen and Abbeville. A 450 mile day trip (and three times the normal price on the Shuttle!) But - what a day. See you in Zimbabwe 2001 73 David G0MRF From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20420 invoked from network); 15 Aug 1999 08:57:09 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 15 Aug 1999 08:57:09 +0100 Received: (qmail 10537 invoked from network); 15 Aug 1999 02:34:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 Aug 1999 02:34:26 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FprI-0000nY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 15 Aug 1999 03:17:16 +0100 Received: from smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.157]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11FprH-0000nT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 15 Aug 1999 03:17:15 +0100 Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-125-141.bellatlantic.net [151.200.125.141]) by smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id WAA05631; Sat, 14 Aug 1999 22:21:16 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37B6235B.24C155AD@bellatlantic.net> Date: Sat, 14 Aug 1999 22:18:04 -0400 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Ozone and LF Propagation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Just in case some of you have not read it yet, the Spring 1999 issue of Communications Quarterly features a thought-provoking article by Dr Robert Brown NM7M, on "Atmospheric Ozone". (pp.97-103) Quoting from his conclusion: "...there can be little doubt that atmospheric ozone plays a role in LF propagation because of its connection to processes in the lower-D region and the fact that ozone can block UV radiation from reaching that altitude range at sunrise. [...] ozone shadow has an effect, to some degree or other, every day of the week, month or year, and requires no special solar or magnetic activity." 73 Andre' N4ICK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19573 invoked from network); 15 Aug 1999 11:50:01 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 15 Aug 1999 11:50:01 +0100 Received: (qmail 32077 invoked from network); 15 Aug 1999 10:53:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 Aug 1999 10:53:59 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Fxg8-0003zz-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 15 Aug 1999 11:38:16 +0100 Received: from imo18.mx.aol.com ([198.81.17.8]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Fxg7-0003zj-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 15 Aug 1999 11:38:15 +0100 Received: from G0MRF@aol.com by imo18.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id lUGMa02400 (14370) for ; Sun, 15 Aug 1999 06:37:32 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: G0MRF@aol.com Message-ID: <9df41c64.24e7f26b@aol.com> Date: Sun, 15 Aug 1999 06:37:31 EDT Subject: Re: LF: 73kHz QRS To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 135 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: In a message dated 13/08/99 12:25:40 GMT Daylight Time, mike.dennison@rsgb.org.uk writes: << I will be transmitting on 71.80kHz, QRSs (3s dot length) at 0900UTC tomorrow 14 Aug and Sunday 15 Aug. There will be some normal speed CQs from 0845UTC. Any reports welcome. >> Received Mike's signal over a 40km path. I had forgotten how difficult 73k was. - Station No 7 heard on 73k An uncompressed screenshot from spectrogram has been added to the "LF on The Air" page on my web site. G0MRF Projects 73 David. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22620 invoked from network); 15 Aug 1999 23:51:05 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 15 Aug 1999 23:51:05 +0100 Received: (qmail 30958 invoked from network); 15 Aug 1999 22:55:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 15 Aug 1999 22:55:05 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11G8lY-0008Kn-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 15 Aug 1999 23:28:36 +0100 Received: from neodymium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.83]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11G8lW-0008Ki-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 15 Aug 1999 23:28:35 +0100 Received: from [62.6.2.88] (helo=default) by neodymium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 11G8lR-0006eM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 15 Aug 1999 23:28:29 +0100 Message-ID: <004c01bee76d$2decd5a0$5802063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: No Cluster postings so Alan,s Ramblings & a new waterfall program Date: Sun, 15 Aug 1999 23:23:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi all, disappointment this week I am afraid, there is a big NIL on postings to the local cluster. The system was rebooted on Friday by the look of the banner. This was probably due to local thunderstorms and power glitches, but no postings to either 136 or 1800.. Not a great deal of personal logging done either. On Friday evening at abt 2000Z, I heard Lech G3KAU (who could miss him!!) working Dave G3YMC ....sorry still can't hear you Dave. At least it shows my rx set-up is consistent (even if its consistently poor) On Saturday no QRS logged, and at 0900Z I went to listen for Mike on 71.8kHz. Sad to say nothing heard, but I did have a highish noise level on that frequency. This was a sweeping 50Hz modulated signal which gave a herringbone effect on the waterfall display. Probably local but not under my control, as I switched everthing in sight off. Listened again on Sunday for Mike but again not the faintest sign from him. I obviously need to do more work on the 73k loop. Sunday Heard ON4ZK on QRS calling .....PV at 0925Z but no sign of a 2nd over, I guess this was a sked with Marco. G3XTZ worked PA0CC at 0845 on normal cw, and heard Dick PA0SE calling cq later. It seemed fairly quiet here and I was surpprised at what seemed a low level of activity, probably the holiday season effect. Remembering the comments about detuning 'T' aerials and longwires when using a loop for rx, I thought I would recount a silly episode from this weekend. I often get a low level of 70Hz harmonics from the VGA monitor displaying on the waterfall (FFTDSP4). I have used this a a confidence booster that the sensitivity is normal. The comb is not audible but would be 'M' as a QRS signal. Because of the lightening I disconnected the local TV and 2m co-linear feeders and connected them to the central heating rad (probably not a good idea if I ever do get a main strike!) I became aware that the noise level on the AOR 7030 reduced if I connected the RF ground to an earthed unused computer chassis (good!). Reading the manual a little more carefully it has separate RF and DC/Audio grounds. A little later I reconnected the 2m co-linear to the 2m FM rig and found that the 70Hz comb reappeared. The rig is fed from a 12v psu which is earthed (and metal cased, passes PAT test), but neither the +12v or return side are actually bonded to ground. A little further checking showed that the comb was getting into the rx via some common coupling in the mains earth, because removing the psu plug also removed the comb. I also noticed changes in noise level as I moved wires near a 4 way distribution block. It just goes to show that a good RF earth is important for RX as well and some care in routing leads and power feeds will pay off. Signal levels do not seem to have declined, but it seems as though the evening noise level which could be affected by TV/Video PSUs seems to be less troublesome, at least on 136. I had expected to have trouble with earth loops around the RX to computer connections, but these have not surfaced. I also came across a commercially produced (but not moulded plug) 'IEC lead' that did not have a through earth connection (that one slipped though my PAT test!) This gave me a tingle when I went to connect up the audio from the rx to the computer sound card on the machine it was powering. SO BE CAREFUL, I GUESS IT COULD HAVE COST ME A SOUND CARD, if I had not realised the problem. I have seen 2 core moulded cable advertised, probably for use with 'double-insulated' kit, but I am not sure whether you can tell this just by looking at it. I have also downloaded a copy of Spectrogram 5.09 and was hoping to run it on a 2nd computer, in parallel with FFTDSP4. (pity there were not more qrs signals this weekend) I did a test with a locally generated weak signal, and found that the indicated S/N on Spectrogram was about 10dB better than FFTDSP4. That was with a 1.3 Hz resolution on 'gram and 2Hz on FFTDSP4. I must admit the screen did not look that much better. I look forward to a longer test. My parameters were 5K6/16bit/mono,60dB,200mS,4096, 300-644, avg=1. I found that unattended logging uses an enormous amount of disc, and I prefer FFTDSP for this purpose (12 hours is abt 25Meg) It will be interesting to get pictures for a weak QRS station to compare, particularly as you seem to be able to reprocess the 'gram file with different parameters. I have also found a shareware package (30days) called Analyser 2000 from Brownbear Software (German). Their download version runs for 15mins per session. There are some nice facilities but I did not find out how to 'tune' the zoom to the part of the audio spectrun where the signal was! The registration fee is $98 and a 'machine ID' must be provided, which could be a little expensive if you want to use it /P on a laptop as well. The URL is http://members.aol.com/btf1 73 de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2888 invoked from network); 16 Aug 1999 10:17:34 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 16 Aug 1999 10:17:34 +0100 Received: (qmail 1275 invoked from network); 16 Aug 1999 09:21:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Aug 1999 09:21:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GIUo-00042h-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 09:51:58 +0100 Received: from [195.102.240.137] (helo=mserv1b.u-net.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GIUo-00042c-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 09:51:58 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #61) id 11GITl-0004a0-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 09:50:54 +0100 Received: from miked.rsgbhq by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 09:46:38 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Mike Dennison" Organization: Radio Society of Great Britain To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 09:49:24 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Weekend report 14/15 August X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Very little radio this weekend as I had to work both days, but what I did proved useful. Saturday 14 August Very low noise, but no time to enjoy it. Spent 15 minutes on 136kHz. Worked PA0LEG (gave 329, got 449). A new station worked two-way (nr 44). Publicised tests on 71.8kHz. Called CQ at 0845UTC in normal CW, followed by extremely slow CW (QRSs) between 0900 and 0925. Nothing heard/seen. E-mails from PA3BSH and G0MRF who were both watching for my 73kHz signals using Spectrogram. No success. Sunday 15 August Another test on 71.8kHz, same as yesterday. My signals seen by G0MRF, 45km away. He is the sixth station to receive me on 73kHz. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22448 invoked from network); 16 Aug 1999 22:26:39 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 16 Aug 1999 22:26:39 +0100 Received: (qmail 8737 invoked from network); 16 Aug 1999 16:46:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Aug 1999 16:46:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GPdM-00077F-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 17:29:16 +0100 Received: from [195.102.240.137] (helo=mserv1b.u-net.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GPdL-00077A-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 17:29:15 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1b.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #61) id 11GPcJ-0005aJ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 17:28:11 +0100 Received: from miked.rsgbhq by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 17:22:21 +0100 From: "Mike Dennison" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Organization: Radio Society of Great Britain To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 17:25:04 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: Re: LF: Solar Flare on LF... In-reply-to: <37B833BF.15126C1C@nephro.uni-kiel.de> X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: DF3LP wrote: > Recording HBG75 (75 kHz) over the whole last week I found a > strong anomaly at Saturday, 14th. I observed a steep > increase of field strength (9dB) followed by a smooth > decrease looking like a typical exponential function. > Looking to sites offering geomagnetic data I could not > explain it. So my first assumption was that it could have > been an artefact. > ==snip== > J.J.Delcourt from RMI gave the explanation: It was the > influence of a Solar Flare on LF propagation. (Thank you!) I > never observed this before... > Wow! Now if that sort of anomoly can be caught in time, it could be well worth using for a QSO - even with extremely slow speed CW. This sort of sudden peak in signal strength has been reported before, when listening to amateur signals. May be the same effect. Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17956 invoked from network); 16 Aug 1999 23:00:43 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 16 Aug 1999 23:00:43 +0100 Received: (qmail 4205 invoked from network); 16 Aug 1999 16:16:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Aug 1999 16:16:08 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GP4T-0006pW-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 16:53:13 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GP4S-0006pR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 16:53:12 +0100 Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Mon, 16 Aug 1999 17:52:39 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC10847.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.47]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA03292 for ; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 17:52:57 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37B833BF.15126C1C@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 17:52:31 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Solar Flare on LF... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Group, Recording HBG75 (75 kHz) over the whole last week I found a strong anomaly at Saturday, 14th. I observed a steep increase of field strength (9dB) followed by a smooth decrease looking like a typical exponential function. Looking to sites offering geomagnetic data I could not explain it. So my first assumption was that it could have been an artefact. Expanding the graph to higher zoom level showed the typical weak 60sec. rhythm of HBG due to my short integration time in front of the A/D-Convertor (time constant 2.6sec.). So I'm sure that it was the signal of HBG and not any kind of noise source. J.J.Delcourt from RMI gave the explanation: It was the influence of a Solar Flare on LF propagation. (Thank you!) I never observed this before... A plot of this event can be found there: ftp://ftp.rz.uni-kiel.de/pub/nephro/nephlab/lp/solarflare.gif 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5243 invoked from network); 16 Aug 1999 23:24:24 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 16 Aug 1999 23:24:25 +0100 Received: (qmail 13613 invoked from network); 16 Aug 1999 20:40:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Aug 1999 20:40:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GT2z-000035-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 21:07:57 +0100 Received: from smtp1.xs4all.nl ([194.109.127.48]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GT2x-000030-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 21:07:56 +0100 Received: from v3q4v1 (dc2-isdn865.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.151.97]) by smtp1.xs4all.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA29093 for ; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 22:07:54 +0200 (CEST) From: "M. Sanders" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: Solar Flare on LF... Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 22:05:07 +0200 Message-ID: <000001bee822$a33f0160$61976dc2@v3q4v1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: <37B833BF.15126C1C@nephro.uni-kiel.de> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by smtp1.xs4all.nl id WAA29093 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi All This effect is als known as the Moegel-Dellinger effekt or SWF (Shorwave Fade Out). A German language description can be found in the Rothammels Antennen Buch chapter 2.3.2.2. Ionosphaerenstoerungen. This text confirms the effect as a D-layer disturbance caused by solar flares. The intense radiation increases the ionisation in the D layer. The HF radio signals do not reach the E or F layers due to increased absorption (fade-out). The LF signals increase as they reflect better against the bottom of the D-layer when the refraction index (ionisation density) increases. The same physics apply to LF/HF as to visible light. Chaos theory and the behavour of other gasses (water-vapour, ozone etc) in the earth atmosphere make it hard form me to beleive the D or E layers are homogeneous. This may account for 'local' observations, measurement variations as well as different effects at different observation distances. Short distances observe mainly groundwave effects and there is a minimum distance for the 'first-skip' from refelction against the D layer. The minimum skip distance is a measure for the hight of the D layer and the refraction index. There is a poor reflection at a high angle. Looking at the data collected during the eclipse on the internet pages gives food for thought! May be there have been made recordings of some more 'anomalities'? I have received HBG75 eclipse measurement data from other amateurs. Will put some combined graphs and an analysis on my homepage soon and ask for comments via the reflector. Does anyone have information about the temperature effect from an ecliipse observed in the ionosphere between 50km and 150km hight? 73's Michael Sanders, PA3BSH mailto:pa3bsh@amsat.org > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: majordom@post.thorcom.com [mailto:majordom@post.thorcom.com]namens > Peter W. Schnoor > Verzonden: maandag 16 augustus 1999 17:53 > Aan: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Onderwerp: LF: Solar Flare on LF... > > > Hello Group, > > Recording HBG75 (75 kHz) over the whole last week I found a > strong anomaly at Saturday, 14th. I observed a steep > increase of field strength (9dB) followed by a smooth > decrease looking like a typical exponential function. > Looking to sites offering geomagnetic data I could not > explain it. So my first assumption was that it could have > been an artefact. > > Expanding the graph to higher zoom level showed the typical > weak 60sec. rhythm of HBG due to my short integration time > in front of the A/D-Convertor (time constant 2.6sec.). So > I'm sure that it was the signal of HBG and not any kind of > noise source. > > J.J.Delcourt from RMI gave the explanation: It was the > influence of a Solar Flare on LF propagation. (Thank you!) I > never observed this before... > > A plot of this event can be found there: > ftp://ftp.rz.uni-kiel.de/pub/nephro/nephlab/lp/solarflare.gif > > 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag > 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21517 invoked from network); 16 Aug 1999 23:58:20 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 16 Aug 1999 23:58:20 +0100 Received: (qmail 15294 invoked from network); 16 Aug 1999 23:02:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 16 Aug 1999 23:02:24 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GVOy-00016f-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 23:38:48 +0100 Received: from rhenium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.93]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GVOx-00016a-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 23:38:47 +0100 Received: from [212.140.8.68] (helo=default) by rhenium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 11GVOv-0007BU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 16 Aug 1999 23:38:46 +0100 Message-ID: <001c01bee837$bcec4a40$44088cd4@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Geri...good copy QRS at 1612Z Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 23:29:37 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi Geri....good copy of your qrs transmission despite a local thunder storm! I was using FFTDSP4 and Spectrogram simultaneously on 2 computers. FFTDSP was chopped up by the crashes which I think may be something to do with an AGC effect either on the card or in the program (the 'auto' palete). Despite some large crashes from strikes within abt a couple of km, I was able to copy your CQ and call perfectly and without guessing on Spectrogram 5.09. I must say I am very impressed. The only thing I have not yet got to grips with is the 'picture saving' ...the BMP file which was the best screen shot was just too big...I guess its got to be .JPG format to mail to you. I do not seem to be able to rescan the wav file and save a jpg from it. Hear you again under less 'hair raising' conditions! 73 Cheers de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8120 invoked from network); 17 Aug 1999 09:25:12 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 17 Aug 1999 09:25:12 +0100 Received: (qmail 11046 invoked from network); 17 Aug 1999 08:25:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 17 Aug 1999 08:25:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ge3f-000529-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 17 Aug 1999 08:53:23 +0100 Received: from mail5.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.20]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ge3e-000524-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 17 Aug 1999 08:53:22 +0100 Received: from modem-46.samarium.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.30.174] helo=default) by mail5.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 11Ge3Z-00086W-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 17 Aug 1999 08:53:17 +0100 Message-ID: <004601bee885$8e617a80$ae1e883e@default> From: "wireless" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <199908111428_MC2-809A-4DFE@compuserve.com> Subject: LF: my test Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 08:37:02 +0100 Organization: T@ylor Training MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Thanks for listening for us, Geri. I got 227 miles, to Ipswich on 136kHz. We'll try again on 73 and 136 sometime. 73 John Taylor G0AKN earth@wireless.freeserve.co.uk From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9428 invoked from network); 17 Aug 1999 09:31:17 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 17 Aug 1999 09:31:17 +0100 Received: (qmail 6869 invoked from network); 17 Aug 1999 08:35:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 17 Aug 1999 08:35:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GeFi-000596-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 17 Aug 1999 09:05:50 +0100 Received: from mail5.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.20]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GeFh-00058p-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 17 Aug 1999 09:05:49 +0100 Received: from modem-118.lidocaine.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.60.118] helo=default) by mail5.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 11GeFe-00004r-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 17 Aug 1999 09:05:47 +0100 Message-ID: <000001bee887$4c889100$763c883e@default> From: "wireless" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <001c01bee837$bcec4a40$44088cd4@default> Subject: LF: psk31 Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 09:04:07 +0100 Organization: T@ylor Training MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Just a note that psk31 also works well with Windows 3.1 on my old 486 - 8MB RAM and 66 MHz. 73 John Taylor G0AKN earth@wireless.freeserve.co.uk From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18680 invoked from network); 17 Aug 1999 18:29:11 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 17 Aug 1999 18:29:11 +0100 Received: (qmail 16088 invoked from network); 17 Aug 1999 17:29:13 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 17 Aug 1999 17:29:13 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GmoF-0000Rp-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 17 Aug 1999 18:14:03 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from oso.slonet.org ([207.114.180.2] ident=cbuttsch) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11GmoE-0000Rk-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 17 Aug 1999 18:14:02 +0100 Received: from localhost (cbuttsch@localhost) by oso.slonet.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA28498; Tue, 17 Aug 1999 10:13:45 -0700 (PDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 10:13:45 -0700 (PDT) From: "Clifford Buttschardt" To: "wireless" Cc: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: psk31 In-reply-to: <000001bee887$4c889100$763c883e@default> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Excellent information John. I have just that configuration but have yet to try an installation with a newer 16 bit card. Did you find any "quirks" to avoid? Cliff K7RR On Tue, 17 Aug 1999, wireless wrote: > Just a note that psk31 also works well with Windows 3.1 on my old 486 - 8MB > RAM and 66 MHz. > 73 > John Taylor G0AKN > earth@wireless.freeserve.co.uk > > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10006 invoked from network); 19 Aug 1999 13:17:53 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 19 Aug 1999 13:17:53 +0100 Received: (qmail 27016 invoked from network); 19 Aug 1999 12:22:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 Aug 1999 12:22:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HQm1-0001kv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 12:54:25 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.u-net.net ([195.102.240.33]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HQly-0001kq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 12:54:22 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from rsgb.u-net.com ([195.102.80.225] helo=rsgb.org.uk) by mserv1c.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #34) id 11HRfW-0004nd-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 12:51:46 +0000 Received: from miked.rsgbhq by rsgb.org.uk with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP5.R) for ; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 12:36:48 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Mike Dennison" Organization: Radio Society of Great Britain To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 12:39:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: LF: Solar Flares X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01d) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Return-Path: miked@mail.rsgbhq Message-ID: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: For those wanting to correlate solar flares with enhancements in sky-wave reception at LF, may like to look at: http://moondog.astro.louisville.edu/flares/info.html Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19115 invoked from network); 19 Aug 1999 13:57:33 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 19 Aug 1999 13:57:33 +0100 Received: (qmail 4455 invoked from network); 19 Aug 1999 13:01:52 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 Aug 1999 13:01:52 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HRXx-00028p-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 13:43:57 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HRXx-00028k-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 13:43:57 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id OAA12528 for ; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 14:50:03 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990819144455.3d4776e4@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 14:44:55 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: high power class E transmitter MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Charmed by the simplicity (only 4 components) and the high efficiency of class E amplifiers I decided to do some experiments with these. As background I used a very good article by Bill Cantrell, WD5CVG, that is available on internet at : http://www.qsl.net/k3pgp/Notebook/Wd5cvg/Classetx/classetx.htm A low power version running on 12V and with the antenna simulated by a 330pF (silver-mica) capacitor and a 50 Ohm resistor had 1.6W output and an efficiency of about 96%. The only drawback was a rather poor harmonic surpression of about 25dB, what would make an additional LPF nessecary (increasing the number of components needed from 4 to 7 or even 9) at higher power (to keep the neighbourgs happy). As next step I calculated the required values for a 500W version, and there comes the disadvantage of this design : Having a loss resistance of about 130 Ohm I will need a 336V power-supply. For less loss the required voltage decreases but still remains high (294V for 100 Ohm, 208V for 50 Ohm). As the voltage over the FET and shuntcapacitor can be up to 4 times the supply-voltage I would also need a 1.4kV FET what makes the cheap power-FET's useless. If I want to use my existing 56V/750W PSU I have to limit the load to 3.6 Ohms (to get 500W power), what means that I will need a 1/36 power transformation (either doing this in some LPF stages or using a 1/6 transformer). But I'm afraid that including LPF (for harmonic surpression) and impedance matching will decarese the efficiency close to values that I have right now with my 'G3YXM-type' PA (= 85%). So I wonder if someone already has experience with a high-power class E amplifier ? 73, Rik Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 668 invoked from network); 19 Aug 1999 20:51:10 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 19 Aug 1999 20:51:10 +0100 Received: (qmail 8079 invoked from network); 19 Aug 1999 19:55:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 Aug 1999 19:55:29 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HXrs-0005CC-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 20:28:56 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HXrr-0005C7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 20:28:56 +0100 Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Thu, 19 Aug 1999 21:28:08 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC10861.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.61]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id VAA14782 for ; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 21:28:26 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37BC5ABF.A04FAE60@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 21:27:59 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Solar Flares References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Group, Hi Mike, Mike Dennison wrote: > > For those wanting to correlate solar flares with enhancements in > sky-wave reception at LF, may like to look at: > > http://moondog.astro.louisville.edu/flares/info.html > > Mike, G3XDV (IO91VT) > http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm Thank you! Main sources of information here are: http://sec.noaa.gov/ace/ACErtsw_home.html and http://www.sel.noaa.gov/today.html 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15662 invoked from network); 19 Aug 1999 22:03:16 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 19 Aug 1999 22:03:17 +0100 Received: (qmail 23511 invoked from network); 19 Aug 1999 21:07:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 Aug 1999 21:07:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HZ5l-0005hf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 21:47:21 +0100 Received: from neodymium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.83]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HZ5l-0005ha-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 21:47:21 +0100 Received: from [212.140.4.83] (helo=default) by neodymium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 11HZ5V-00048w-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 21:47:06 +0100 Message-ID: <000301beea83$9c79dcc0$53048cd4@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Class E...to SM6LKM Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 15:30:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi Johan, sorry for not replying sooner. Yes I would like a copy of the ZIP file you have of Class E articles. I shuddered a little at the thought of downloading a 3meg e-mail, but my system is working a lot better now I replaced the modem. What is activity like in Sweden?? I dont think we have heard any SMs yet. I should be fairly well placed as I am near to the North Sea coast, aand quite often leave spectrogram or FFTDSP4 running for long periods on the top 300Hz of the 136 band. If you are still very limited on power I could easily wind out the averaging and listen for 20sec dots or whatever. 73 de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3938 invoked from network); 19 Aug 1999 23:32:04 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 19 Aug 1999 23:32:04 +0100 Received: (qmail 11255 invoked from network); 19 Aug 1999 22:36:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 Aug 1999 22:36:25 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HaYQ-0006Nu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 23:21:02 +0100 Received: from carbon.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.92]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HaYO-0006Np-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 23:21:00 +0100 Received: from [212.140.1.195] (helo=default) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 11HaYG-0003le-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 23:20:52 +0100 Message-ID: <006301beea90$b7481fa0$53048cd4@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: re Class E amp....Rik` Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 22:38:39 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi Rik that is an interesting article. I haven't had the chance to compare the formulae yet, but the article I was offering around was a slightly later version of Ref 8. I think the parameters in the network may have been optimised a little better by the time the later article was written. It is probably unfair to compare the output after all the filters when you are expecting to loose 15% of the power in the matching and filter network. The advantage I would see is that the dissipation in the fets would be minimised. I also think that Dave's design seems to be particularly good, as from the comments that are made by people who have constructed copies, it does not seem to suffer from a lot of the instability problems that can occur with push-pull class D systems. A 'selling point' made by Sokal is that the class E circuit is virtually bombproof, even if you change transistors, it is very insensitive to device parameters, because the active device is only being used as a switch. He also makes the point on simplicity that it is an inherently single ended design, I suppose this has trade-offs in the level of harmonics. I will be fascinated to see some really high power design using this technique. I believe the circuit on page 4.5 of the LF Sourcebook attributed to Roger ZL2RX is a Class E design, but there are not enough on the component values to check against Sokal's equations. Some of the comeonents look as if they were 'to hand' rather than being calculated values. It has a novel point that the choke, series inductor, and step-up transformer are wound on the same ferrite rod core. On the other hand, bearing in mind what has been said about the losses in some ferrite, that may be where some of the power has gone. All good stuff, get the blow-torches going chaps 73 de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17097 invoked from network); 20 Aug 1999 00:38:17 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 20 Aug 1999 00:38:17 +0100 Received: (qmail 25709 invoked from network); 19 Aug 1999 23:42:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 19 Aug 1999 23:42:39 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HbZS-00071k-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 00:26:10 +0100 Received: from imo13.mx.aol.com ([198.81.17.3]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HbZR-00071f-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 00:26:09 +0100 Received: from G0MRF@aol.com by imo13.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id lWXHa13741 (4354) for ; Thu, 19 Aug 1999 19:25:30 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: G0MRF@aol.com Message-ID: <6d33332c.24edec69@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 19:25:29 EDT Subject: Re: LF: high power class E transmitter To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 135 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Rik and all. I've recently been working (during my 9-5) on some medium wave transmitters. For reference material I've been looking at the Harris DX25U which uses IRFP350 power mosfets in class D with 230V DC to generate 25kW carrier and 100kW peak. claimed efficiency for the PA alone is 92 - 97% with the whole TX operating at 85%. This seems to be the same as all the other class D circuits we're used to on LF. For interest: The PA has 64 amplifier modules combined. 1 module = 1kW+ The combiner has multiple toroids threaded onto a large copper bar. Modulation is 12 bit digital which then switches the drive to the modules on / off PA circuits available if interested. 73 David From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26827 invoked from network); 20 Aug 1999 05:29:30 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 20 Aug 1999 05:29:30 +0100 Received: (qmail 5438 invoked from network); 20 Aug 1999 04:33:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Aug 1999 04:33:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HfzN-0000Wm-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 05:09:13 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailout02.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.150]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11HfzM-0000Wh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 05:09:12 +0100 Received: from fwd10.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.170]) by mailout02.btx.dtag.de with smtp id 11HfzL-00051A-00; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 06:09:11 +0200 Received: (320057114934-0001(btxid)@[62.158.46.67]) by fwd10.btx.dtag.de id ; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 06:09:08 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 06:09:08 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: temporary qrt X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Sender: 320057114934-0001@t-online.de From: "DF2PY" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi Lowfers ! I will retire from LF for a while,as i am tied up in building a 3 el phased array for 160m and my LF antenna tower will be used as a reflector for it. good dx ! de wolf df2py From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10025 invoked from network); 20 Aug 1999 07:41:00 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 20 Aug 1999 07:41:00 +0100 Received: (qmail 21082 invoked from network); 20 Aug 1999 06:45:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Aug 1999 06:45:23 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Hi9X-0001SO-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 07:27:51 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Hi9X-0001SH-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 07:27:51 +0100 Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Fri, 20 Aug 1999 08:27:16 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108110.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.110]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id IAA01145 for ; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 08:27:33 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37BCF53B.E48012A6@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 08:27:07 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: high power class E transmitter References: <3.0.1.16.19990819144455.3d4776e4@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Group, Hi Rik, Rik Strobbe wrote: > > Charmed by the simplicity (only 4 components) and the high efficiency of > class E amplifiers I decided to do some experiments with these. Not at power levels >200Watts. > So I wonder if someone already has experience with a high-power class E > amplifier ? I know this article. Running class-E is not a question of high voltage at first. Class-E means to load a current fed switch (here MOSFet and choke) such that Ud AND dUd/dt at switching time are BOTH zero ("soft landing"). This is the key to class-E! So you have to deal with impedance i.e. "right" phase shifts at input of your output network. What kind of output circuit you want to use doesn't matter if it provides "soft landing". Of course this is easier to achieve at somewhat higher voltages. Class-E designs are very robust since of it's high capacitance at load. I killed most Fets from Gate side (Ugmax +-20V...). I observed the following: One disadvantage is that due to the low resonance frequencies of the output filter circuits the class-E design has a tendency to "stutter" on sub harmonics if mismatched to the "inductance plane" of the smith diagram. But I never observed this, mismatching the PA resistively only. I collected some other articles on class-D/E (the well known QST article included) there: ftp://ftp.rz.uni-kiel.de/pub/nephro/nephlab/lp/MosFet-PA/ Look for: ClassE.pdf, PA_10MHz.pdf, QST.pdf, RFdesign.pdf. (Acrobat Reader or clone required...) 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15953 invoked from network); 20 Aug 1999 19:10:05 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 20 Aug 1999 19:10:05 +0100 Received: (qmail 31029 invoked from network); 20 Aug 1999 18:08:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Aug 1999 18:08:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Hsu6-0006Lv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 18:56:38 +0100 Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.41]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Hsu6-0006Lq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 18:56:38 +0100 Received: from rgcomms.demon.co.uk ([193.237.77.63] helo=default) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 11Hsu2-000GA1-0C for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 17:56:37 +0000 Message-ID: <001901beeb35$4f6892c0$3f4dedc1@default> From: "Graham Phillips" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <6d33332c.24edec69@aol.com> Subject: Re: LF: high power class E transmitter Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 18:56:13 +0100 Organization: rgcomms MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hi David, I am most interested in any info on the Harris DX25U ... is it am AM TX, using Pulse-width modulation by any chance ? Best wishes de Graham B. Phillips - G3XTZ. g3xtz@rgcomms.demon.co.uk ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: 20 August 1999 00:25 Subject: Re: LF: high power class E transmitter > Hello Rik and all. > > I've recently been working (during my 9-5) on some medium wave transmitters. > For reference material I've been looking at the Harris DX25U which uses > IRFP350 power mosfets in class D with 230V DC to generate 25kW carrier and > 100kW peak. > > claimed efficiency for the PA alone is 92 - 97% with the whole TX operating > at 85%. > This seems to be the same as all the other class D circuits we're used to on > LF. > > For interest: > The PA has 64 amplifier modules combined. 1 module = 1kW+ > The combiner has multiple toroids threaded onto a large copper bar. > Modulation is 12 bit digital which then switches the drive to the modules on > / off > PA circuits available if interested. > > 73 > > > David > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29660 invoked from network); 20 Aug 1999 20:14:42 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 20 Aug 1999 20:14:42 +0100 Received: (qmail 14210 invoked from network); 20 Aug 1999 19:12:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 20 Aug 1999 19:12:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Htwr-0006rf-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 20:03:33 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Htwq-0006ra-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 20:03:33 +0100 Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Fri, 20 Aug 1999 21:03:05 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108103.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.103]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id VAA18190 for ; Fri, 20 Aug 1999 21:03:24 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37BDA661.EA8E5DF4@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Fri, 20 Aug 1999 21:02:57 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: high power class E transmitter References: <6d33332c.24edec69@aol.com> <001901beeb35$4f6892c0$3f4dedc1@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello, Graham Phillips wrote: > I am most interested in any info on the Harris DX25U ... is it am AM TX, > using Pulse-width modulation by any chance ? http://www.broadcast.harris.com/transmission/radio/dx25u50.pdf (observing improper PDF...) 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4808 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 08:04:53 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 08:04:53 +0100 Received: (qmail 29117 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 07:03:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 07:03:04 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11I4qJ-0003Fe-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 07:41:31 +0100 Received: from mb06.swip.net ([193.12.122.210]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11I4qI-0003FZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 07:41:30 +0100 Received: from win95 (dialup41-4-45.swipnet.se [130.244.41.237]) by mb06.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA18680 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 08:41:27 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <000601beeba0$859e6e80$ed29f482@win95.swipnet.se> From: "Christer Andersson" To: "RSGB LF group" Subject: LF: Multiple tuned vertical Date: Sat, 21 Aug 1999 08:43:08 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: I would like to hear if anyone have tested the Multiple Tuned Vertical in some form. I have understood that the antenna transforms the feed impedance with a factor equal to the square of the number of wires used. E.g.10 wires would raise the feed impedance about 100 times. I'm just rebuilding my LF-station and this antenna looks very interesting. However, not much information has been found in my litterature. Links or articles would be much appreciated. 73, Christer / sm6pxj From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15832 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 09:39:35 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 09:39:35 +0100 Received: (qmail 8766 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 08:37:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 08:37:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11I6ZG-000410-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 09:32:02 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net ([195.166.128.29]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11I6ZF-00040v-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 09:32:01 +0100 Received: (qmail 9612 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 08:31:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO prstesv1) (212.56.118.58) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 08:31:59 -0000 Message-ID: <001f01beebb0$1db7aa60$0600a8c0@prstesv1.prestel.co.uk> From: "Dave" To: "LF Group" Subject: LF: Lighthouse portable Date: Sat, 21 Aug 1999 09:35:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Dear all, This weekend look out for Alfred DF2BC/P from the Campen Lighthouse. He has an excellent signal into G. He is on 136.53 with a Ropex TX. Dave G3YXM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19771 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 10:06:40 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 10:06:40 +0100 Received: (qmail 12498 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 09:04:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 09:04:50 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11I6zn-0004Cd-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 09:59:27 +0100 Received: from [143.179.236.32] (helo=Lesothosaurus.big-orange.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11I6zm-0004CV-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 09:59:26 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 ([143.179.151.243]) by Lesothosaurus.big-orange.net (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with SMTP id AAA11 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 10:59:14 +0200 Message-ID: <000901beebb4$516a1560$f397b38f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "LF-Group" Subject: LF: Lighthouse station DF2BC/P Date: Sat, 21 Aug 1999 11:04:10 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
To All
 
Worked DF2BC/P at Campen Lighthoudse near Emden this morning with a formidable signal, RST 599 both ways.
 
I would like to QSL direct but do not have the postal address of DF2BC.
 
Can anyone provide that?
 
Many thanks in advance!
 
73, Dick, PA0SE
 
JO22GD
D.W. Rollema
V.d. Marckstraat 5
2352 RA Leiderdorp
The Netherlands
Tel. +31 71 589 27 34
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10067 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 12:58:05 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 12:58:05 +0100 Received: (qmail 3434 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 11:56:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 11:56:16 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11I9c1-0005KH-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 12:47:05 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net ([195.166.128.29]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11I9c0-0005KB-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 12:47:04 +0100 Received: (qmail 19781 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 11:47:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO prstesv1) (212.56.119.223) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 11:47:01 -0000 Message-ID: <004601beebcb$5c7ae940$0600a8c0@prstesv1.prestel.co.uk> From: "Dave" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Lighthouse station DF2BC/P Date: Sat, 21 Aug 1999 12:49:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Dick,
 
It's
 
Alfred KluB  (Kluss)
Osterstrasse 83
26725 Emden
 
 
73, Dave G3YXM.
 
 
 
Worked DF2BC/P at Campen Lighthoudse near Emden this morning with a formidable signal, RST 599 both ways.
 
I would like to QSL direct but do not have the postal address of DF2BC.
 
Can anyone provide that?
 
Many thanks in advance!
 
73, Dick, PA0SE
 
JO22GD
D.W. Rollema
V.d. Marckstraat 5
2352 RA Leiderdorp
The Netherlands
Tel. +31 71 589 27 34
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22153 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 14:40:36 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 14:40:36 +0100 Received: (qmail 17809 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 13:38:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 13:38:48 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IBFt-00062A-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 14:32:21 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.156]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IBFr-000625-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 14:32:20 +0100 Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-125-238.bellatlantic.net [151.200.125.238]) by smtp-out1.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id JAA07251; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 09:29:59 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37BEAA82.B926CC8C@bellatlantic.net> Date: Sat, 21 Aug 1999 09:32:50 -0400 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Multiple tuned vertical References: <000601beeba0$859e6e80$ed29f482@win95.swipnet.se> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Chris, A mathematical (and practical) treatment of Multiple Tuning for vertical antennas can be found in: Radio Antenna Engineering by Edmund Laport McGraw Hill NY 1952 pp. 38-43 This book is obviously out of print, but I could send you photocopies of the relevant pages. 73 Andre' N4ICK *********************************** Christer Andersson wrote: > I would like to hear if anyone have tested the Multiple Tuned Vertical in some form. > I have understood that the antenna transforms the feed impedance with a factor equal to the square of the number of wires used. E.g.10 wires would raise the feed impedance about 100 times. > I'm just rebuilding my LF-station and this antenna looks very interesting. However, not much information has been found in my litterature. Links or articles would be much appreciated. > 73, > Christer / sm6pxj From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 4824 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 16:24:23 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 16:24:23 +0100 Received: (qmail 1230 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 15:22:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 15:22:35 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11ICpH-0006jY-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 16:12:59 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail1-gui.server.ntli.net ([194.168.222.13]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11ICpH-0006jT-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 16:12:59 +0100 Received: from cableol.co.uk ([194.168.18.44]) by mail1-gui.server.ntli.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-33929U70000L2S50) with ESMTP id AAA18291 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 15:59:49 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37BEBDCA.B43489B4@cableol.co.uk> Date: Sat, 21 Aug 1999 15:55:06 +0100 From: "Steve Rawlings" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Lighthouse station DF2BC/P References: <000901beebb4$516a1560$f397b38f@w8k3f0> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Dick Rollema wrote: > Worked DF2BC/P at Campen Lighthoudse near Emden this morning with a > formidable signal, RST 599 both ways. I also worked Ali, DF2BC/P, at 0552 UT today. I sent RST 579; received 339. This was my first QSO into DL using only my 12 m vertical (all other QSOs into DL having been made with my 20 m balloon-supported vertical). So, as well as putting out a fine signal, Ali must have a very good receiving system too. But I was surprised that OZ1KMR was only copying Ali at RST 549. Regards to all, (And thanks to Dave for the QSL info.) Steve GW4ALG From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 26710 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 19:07:39 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 19:07:39 +0100 Received: (qmail 7228 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 18:05:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 18:05:52 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IFGl-0007ou-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 18:49:31 +0100 Received: from [143.179.236.32] (helo=Lesothosaurus.big-orange.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IFGj-0007oL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 18:49:30 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 ([143.179.151.177]) by Lesothosaurus.big-orange.net (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with SMTP id AAA1A24 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 19:49:25 +0200 Message-ID: <001601beebfe$63509ac0$b197b38f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Re: Lighthouse station DF2BC/P Date: Sat, 21 Aug 1999 19:54:57 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
 
-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: Dave <dave@picks.force9.co.uk>
Aan: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Datum: zaterdag 21 augustus 1999 14:08
Onderwerp: LF: Re: Lighthouse station DF2BC/P

Dick,
 
It's
 
Alfred KluB  (Kluss)
Osterstrasse 83
26725 Emden
 
 
73, Dave G3YXM.
 
 
 
Worked DF2BC/P at Campen Lighthoudse near Emden this morning with a formidable signal, RST 599 both ways.
 
I would like to QSL direct but do not have the postal address of DF2BC.
 
Can anyone provide that?
 
Many thanks in advance!
 
73, Dick, PA0SE
 
JO22GD
D.W. Rollema
V.d. Marckstraat 5
2352 RA Leiderdorp
The Netherlands
Tel. +31 71 589 27 34
 
Thanks Dave for your quick service.
 
Enjoyed our QSO of today!
 
73, Dick, PA0SE
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 493 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 19:35:45 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 19:35:45 +0100 Received: (qmail 14906 invoked from network); 21 Aug 1999 18:33:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 21 Aug 1999 18:33:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IFnt-000852-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 19:23:45 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IFns-00084x-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 19:23:44 +0100 Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Sat, 21 Aug 1999 20:23:31 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108185.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.185]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id UAA13196 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 1999 20:23:51 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37BEEE9B.C123696D@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Sat, 21 Aug 1999 20:23:23 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Lighthouse portable References: <001f01beebb0$1db7aa60$0600a8c0@prstesv1.prestel.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello, Dave wrote: > This weekend look out for Alfred DF2BC/P from the Campen Lighthouse. He has > an excellent signal into G. He is on 136.53 with a Ropex TX. Thanks for info Dave! Excellent signal here too (579). Worked him and his collegue DL9BDM/p around 1800z, got 559/449. 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 17743 invoked from network); 22 Aug 1999 09:42:39 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 22 Aug 1999 09:42:39 +0100 Received: (qmail 13085 invoked from network); 22 Aug 1999 08:40:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Aug 1999 08:40:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IT2f-0005fj-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 09:31:53 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from bw86zhb.bluewin.ch ([195.186.1.76]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IT2e-0005fe-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 09:31:52 +0100 Received: from phonakcom.ch ([195.186.111.190]) by bw86zhb.bluewin.ch ( with ESMTP id AAA3536 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 10:31:45 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37BFB572.B07B6BD3@phonakcom.ch> Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 10:31:46 +0200 From: "Toni Bdrtschi" Organization: Phonak Communications AG X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [de] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Super signal from UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: >From HB9ASB, JN36pt Today I heard G3KAU with 599, one of the strongest signals ever received from UK (G3YXM was 579 today). Also good signals from DF2BC/p (579) and DL3FDO (589) plus many others. Sometimes 3 stations calling on the same frequency (136.5) No QSO possible. 73 de Toni From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10696 invoked from network); 22 Aug 1999 13:27:36 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 22 Aug 1999 13:27:36 +0100 Received: (qmail 1548 invoked from network); 22 Aug 1999 12:25:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Aug 1999 12:25:52 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IWad-0007Jr-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 13:19:11 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IWac-0007Jm-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 13:19:10 +0100 Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Sun, 22 Aug 1999 14:16:54 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108138.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.138]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA00802 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 14:17:14 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37BFEA2F.2952AEEA@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 14:16:47 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: SAQ Alexanderson 17.8 kHz transmitter References: <000501beec8e$90129280$4a97b38f@w8k3f0> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Dick, Dick Rollema wrote: > I would like to listen to it as I have never heard how a > VLF-generator sounds. There are still two audio files of the last transmission from Grimeton (Aug. 1998) on my ftp sites available: ftp://ftp.rz.uni-kiel.de/pub/nephro/nephlab/lp/ or ftp://ftp.qsl.net/pub/df3lp (no response this afternoon !?) Please look for "saqshort.wav" or "saqlong.wav" (1.9 Mb !). 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1208 invoked from network); 22 Aug 1999 21:35:40 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 22 Aug 1999 21:35:40 +0100 Received: (qmail 17188 invoked from network); 22 Aug 1999 20:33:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Aug 1999 20:33:57 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ie3O-00025C-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 21:17:22 +0100 Received: from neodymium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.83]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ie3M-00024Z-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 21:17:21 +0100 Received: from [62.6.10.19] (helo=default) by neodymium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 11Ie3H-0001Ug-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 21:17:16 +0100 Message-ID: <000201beecda$f64fc080$130a063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: DX Cluster postings for 21/22 Aug at GB7DXM Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 21:13:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello all, I was rather busy on Saturday so my own log is a bit sparse. There has been a funny on the Cluster where it is posting each spot twice (sometimes!). The result of this is that some of the early postings from Saturday and before 'fell off the end' of the list. I heard Steve GW4ALG work Ali DF2BC/P, and I couldn't believe the strength Ali was comming in at. He is certainly the strongest station out of Germany I have heard. He certainly stirred up the activity, it sounded like one of the busiest weekends for some time. I have a note of Mike G3XDV working DF5DI at 0633Z but I forgot to note whether it was QRS or hand speed cw. I reckon Mike has been sprinkling Miracle Grow on is aerial again! (and splashed some on the PA!) He was the strongest I have heard him, and has now overtaken the signal I get from John G4GVC. Also on the QRS, Mike, you obviously have a new exciter....its rock stable and there isn't a trace here of the old spacer. You are so strong that I can just see your 100Hz sidebands on Spectrogram. On Sunday it seemed very busy, all the usual big UK signals logged. As a bit of interest, as all were up in a relatively short period, I logged the S/N indicated on FFTDSP4 (yes I AM running with AGC on the receiver, mainly to protect my ears when Lech leans on his key, but none of these signals move the S-meter so they are not into the 'active area' of the AGC) G3XDV 22dB G4GVC 19-20dB G3YXM 25dB G3KAU 27-30dB G3BDQ 15 dB DF2BC/P 16dB!! G3XTZ 22dB G8RW 13-15dB G6NB 5-7dB Ok, its not a patch on Dick's measurements, but it's fun. The FFTDSP4 program gives a reading for a 100Hz bandwidth. There is some uncertainty as I use a 1 sec averaging time, which is obviously a lot longer than the normal speed code elements, but all except the reading for Mike, were taken under the same conditions. Mike peaked 22 on his QRS dashes, he was more like 20 indicated on hand speed morse. I have also been able to do a side-by-side test between FFTDSP4 and Spectrogram 5.09 on Mike's QSO with DJ5BV on Saturday morning. I will report that in a separate posting. Below the cluster postings for GB7DXM, slightly edited to take out the 'dupes', and some of the 'qso' between Alain and myself. 136.5 DL3FDO 22-Aug-1999 1648Z cq (569) but no rx.... 137.0 G3YXM 22-Aug-1999 1143Z cq (549) 136.5 DF2BC/P 22-Aug-1999 0429Z cq (559) poor rx... 136.4 G3XTZ 21-Aug-1999 0933Z clng g3aqc 137.7 G3XDV 21-Aug-1999 0916Z slow-cw O/O 136.5 DL3FDO 21-Aug-1999 0856Z cq (569) no rx ?? 136.7 G3YXM 21-Aug-1999 0839Z cq (549) G3NYK de GB7DXM 22-Aug 1840Z > 1800.0 G3XDV 22-Aug-1999 1639Z QRS cq 137.7khz 1800.0 G3KAU 22-Aug-1999 1527Z cq 135.72khz 1800.0 F5MLP 22-Aug-1999 1457Z hi alain can you hear yxm? 1800.0 G3YXM 22-Aug-1999 1455Z QRS cq 137.72khz 1800.0 G4GVC 22-Aug-1999 1443Z cq 136.9khz 1800.0 G3XDV 22-Aug-1999 1402Z QRS cq 136.7khz 1800.0 G8RW 22-Aug-1999 1401Z cq 136.55khz 1800.0 DJ5BV 22-Aug-1999 1128Z 136.9 CQ 1800.0 G3XDV 21-Aug-1999 1846Z QRS cq 137.7khz 1800.0 G3XDV 21-Aug-1999 0919Z clg dj5bv QRS 137.7khz G3NYK de GB7DXM 22-Aug 1840Z > 2000.0 G3NYK 22-Aug-1999 1509Z look at VLF aera 2000.0 G3YXM 22-Aug-1999 1458Z no cpi , heard him this morni 2000.0 G4GVC 22-Aug-1999 1447Z 136.9 only traces , Hi Alan 2000.0 LOWFERS 22-Aug-1999 1417Z channel 15001 TNOS conference 2000.0 DJ5BV 22-Aug-1999 1401Z 136.7 CQ ( 549 ) 2000.0 DF2BC/P 22-Aug-1999 1202Z 136.5 KHz CQ CQ ( 419 in JN38 2000.0 DL3FDO 22-Aug-1999 1156Z 137.0 CQ CQ (419 in JN38VS) 2000.0 G3XDV 21-Aug-1999 0917Z 0/0 Hi Alan & Gerd G3NYK de GB7DXM 22-Aug 1843Z > Cheers and 73 de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24053 invoked from network); 22 Aug 1999 23:55:13 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 22 Aug 1999 23:55:13 +0100 Received: (qmail 11538 invoked from network); 22 Aug 1999 22:53:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Aug 1999 22:53:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IgNL-00034p-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 23:46:07 +0100 Received: from carbon.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.92]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IgNK-00034k-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 23:46:06 +0100 Received: from [62.6.6.149] (helo=default) by carbon.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 11IgNG-0006GR-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 23:46:02 +0100 Message-ID: <002401beecef$c01fc900$130a063e@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: Comparison of FFTDSP4 and Specrogram 5.09 on QRS Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 23:41:54 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: COMPARISON OF FFTDSP4y AND SPECTROGRAM 5.09 with some comments on HAMVIEW Having installed what I think is probably the latest of the Spectrogram upgrades, 5.09, I have arranged the two aux. audio outputs from my receiver to go to the sound cards in 2 separate PCs. One runs FFTDSP4 under DOS 5, the other runs Windows 95 and Spectrogram. Both use genuine Creative Labs SB16 cards. I had an opportunity a few days ago to watch the effect of severe QRN as I monitored Geri DK8KW through a local thunder storm. On that occasion Geri would have been copiable on either system, but the effects of the lightening crashes chopped him up very badly on FFTDSP4. It is possible that a different setting of the colour scale would have improved things, but unfortunately either the version I have has a small bug or there is an incompatibility with my hardware. If I select a manual colour scale and an integration time of greater than 1, the screen does not scroll when it reaches the bottom. It does work well on AUTO. Geri would have been 'M' verging on 'T' on FFTDSP4, but was a perfectly readable 'O' on 'gram with the 4096 point display (similar resultion). For some reason Geri's morse elements were readable right through the crashes (from strikes with 2000m!) This exercise was they first real use of 'gram in anger and it showed up well. I determined to leave the connection (10m of RG-58 allong the passage from the rx to the main room!) to the Windows 95 machine and compare the ultimate performance on a weak QRS signal. On Saturday morning early, Mike G3XDV called Gerd DJ5BV , no trouble reading Mike of course, but I had not heard a signal from Gerd before. FFTDSP4 showed a signal, the noise level was low and there were no static crashes, but the signal was hardly readable. It was bobbing in and out of the noise. I would not have been sure of the call if I hadn't heard Mike calling. Spectrogram was set up for 16K points 60dB range and an averaging of 4....and there was a beautiful solid signal from Gerd at a full 'O' with no compromise. Later in the morning after Mike had called QRZ I went snuffling around in the noise looking for the signal and realised that some weak lines I could see at about 7Hz spacing were the dreaded Loran sidebands (abt 2-3dB above the noise) I'd heard so much about. It is the first time I have seen them, they are not visible on FFTDSP4, even with the 500Hz filter in the rx and the highest resolution. ( It looks as thought the rx hardware is working well, what I need to do now is put the same amount of effort into sorting the aerial out and getting better sensitivity!) In conclusion, I still like FFTDSP4 as an operating aid. I find that on a full scan 200-2500Hz I can quickly locate a new station calling and concentrate the hardware on it. I have a paper template stuck to the bottom edge of the monior screen as there is no offset capability allowing the display to indicate the correct frequency (like there is on 'gram). I can see stations on hand keyed speeds that I cannot hear in the phones. I can see where the QRM is and shift the filter away to to listen to a weak station. Ok, a good CW operator could do this without the aid but it is nice to see what is happening ( and I am not a real morse operator!). I leave my RX tuned to 138.10 kHz LSB and use the pass-band tuning to 'isolate' the signal and BFO shift on the AOR 7030 to adjust to a listenable tone. It is posible to have 3 pre-programmed filter 'positions' for the 500Hz filter within the 2.5kHz view by using the filter select, and the CW and DATA modes. I would normally use Spectrogram on the 4096 point resolution set to cover the top 300Hz of the band, switching to a 16K point resolution and adjusting the position of the display to catch the required signal for weak signals I find averaging between 2 and 10 useful. With a timing of 400mS for 3 sec dots. Sampling is left at 5K and range at 60dB with the standard colour palate. I have not found ,personally, that changing the colour range of the display makes any difference to the visibility of signals on the edge of the noise. It would seem as though Spectrogram has up to about a 10dB advantage over FFTDSP4, this is probably accounted for by the increased resolution of Spectrogram 0.3Hz against 2Hz for FFTDSP4. I also have a copy of Hamview, which I have used for a time. Hamview has the interesting possibility of being able to drop a very narrow filter, or a bandpass filter defined by clicking the mouse, over a signal and listen in the computer speakers to the (delayed) filtered signal (It is essential to turn the rx speaker down or it gets VERY confusing.) It produces a dispay that wraps horizontally around the screen rather than scrolling and will display about 7 minutes of signal in the highest resolution mode. The program does not run well on my system, crashing with a variety of breakpoint numbers, after anything from 2 mins to half an hour. I have run FFTDSP4 for 12 hours using the longtem logging (25Mbyte file) on many occasions. Hamview does enable a display file to be logged and a WAV file (these are enormous after a few hours) to be stored for replay and filtering. Its major disadvantage for QRS work is that the highest resolution (about 2Hz I think) produces a scan of 4kHz and there is no facility to be able to tune the averaging to suit the signal. It is about the same as FFTDSP4 on sensitivity. I might use it more if I had a version that didn't crash on my hardware. It has taught me that audio filters, no matter how good, will not put a weak signal out of the noise and make it more readable! Narrow IF filters do help but not as much as I used to believe. Audio filters are good for reducing the effect of nearby qrm on signals that are otherwise readable. I have found the notch of an external Daiwa filter ,most useful for removing the fatigue of listening to the screech of the Greek RTTY station at night. On the use of filters I have found that putting the required signal near the edge of my 500Hz IF filter, sometimes makes the tone of a weak signal stand out more from the sound of the filtered noise. Is this a normal technique known to morse men? Alan Melia G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2024 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 01:02:42 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 01:02:42 +0100 Received: (qmail 20532 invoked from network); 22 Aug 1999 23:46:23 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 22 Aug 1999 23:46:23 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ih85-0003bs-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 00:34:25 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from oso.slonet.org ([207.114.180.2] ident=cbuttsch) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ih84-0003bn-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 00:34:25 +0100 Received: from localhost (cbuttsch@localhost) by oso.slonet.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id QAA25864; Sun, 22 Aug 1999 16:33:40 -0700 (PDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 16:33:40 -0700 (PDT) From: "Clifford Buttschardt" To: "Alan Melia" Cc: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: Re: LF: Comparison of FFTDSP4 and Specrogram 5.09 on QRS In-reply-to: <002401beecef$c01fc900$130a063e@default> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Alan, your note comparing the these two programs was most valuable. Even though we can not join you on 136 KHz due to a strong US Navy station here in California, there are many other times when the displays of these programs are used. thanks. Cliff K7RR/W6HDO From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11702 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 02:06:20 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 02:06:20 +0100 Received: (qmail 32501 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 01:04:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 01:04:37 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IiRX-0004Bj-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 01:58:35 +0100 Received: from kang.tinet.ie ([159.134.237.28]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IiRV-0004Be-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 01:58:33 +0100 Received: from p138.lifford1.tinet.ie ([159.134.235.138] helo=beachwood.tinet.ie) by kang.tinet.ie with smtp (Exim 2.05 #23) id 11IiRR-0000jL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 01:58:30 +0100 Message-ID: <001201beed03$1ba2ee20$8aeb869f@beachwood.tinet.ie> From: "Finbar O'Connor" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: re: G3XDV QSO Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 02:01:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit
Hi Mike/G3XDV
            Really delighted to work you for the first 2 way on 136 khz on Saturday last, a real pleasure indeed. On your last over your signal kept getting stronger and stronger. However during your initial few calls your signal took a deep dive in qsb, hence my request for a repeat of my RST.  I have given up using my valve amplifer, just using the parallel pair of IRFP450's with  75 volts on load, producing  3 amps  RF current.
Keep up the good work, looking forward to the next qso on LONGWAVE.
73's  
Finbar   EI0CF     Malin Head.
From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18646 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 02:31:15 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 02:31:15 +0100 Received: (qmail 25836 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 00:23:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 00:23:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IhnD-0003v5-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 01:16:55 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IhnC-0003v0-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 01:16:54 +0100 Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Mon, 23 Aug 1999 02:16:46 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC108245.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.245]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id CAA11249 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 02:17:06 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37C092E5.BEEB31DA@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 02:16:37 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Comparison of FFTDSP4 and Specrogram 5.09 on QRS References: <002401beecef$c01fc900$130a063e@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Hello Group, Hi Alan, May be that it could be of interest to have an impression how I'm working here 8-) Alan Melia wrote: > In conclusion, I still like FFTDSP4 as an operating aid. I find that on a > full scan 200-2500Hz I can quickly locate a new station calling and > concentrate the hardware on it. I have a paper template stuck to the bottom > edge of the monior screen as there is no offset capability allowing the > display to indicate the correct frequency (like there is on 'gram). I can > see stations on hand keyed speeds that I cannot hear in the phones. I can > see where the QRM is and shift the filter away to to listen to a weak > station. Ok, a good CW operator could do this without the aid but it is nice > to see what is happening ( and I am not a real morse operator!). I leave my > RX tuned to 138.10 kHz LSB and use the pass-band tuning to 'isolate' the > signal and BFO shift on the AOR 7030 to adjust to a listenable tone. I don't know FFTDSP4 and "'gram" since I'm running SOLARIS/LINUX only. I have minor experiences (bad...) with WINxx. I'm using SPECGRAM2 for UNIX systems on several INTEL platforms. This application is available in source code (!) and can be (re)compiled for X-Window and console (VGA/SVGA) for your own. I'm running two modified versions, one for overview, to watch the whole band, and the other for serious VSCW purposes. There are many colour tables available which can be switched in a turnaround manner (including "embossed" modes). I can confirm your remarks on the worth of observing the whole band for new signals. Behind my convertor there are always two receivers running: One for this overview, switched to USB / 2.4 kHz fixed and the other with approx. 100 Hz to locate an unknown signal for "hearing". So no detectable signal will slip through your fingers. The program never had been crashed even running for days. > On the use of filters I have found that putting the required signal near the > edge of my 500Hz IF filter, sometimes makes the tone of a weak signal stand > out more from the sound of the > filtered noise. Is this a normal technique known to morse men? Yes! But normally this technique works well only if your whole system behind the smallest filter will produce minor noise (ears/hemisperes included...). Psychophysiological studies have shown that some coloured noise may be helpful in detecting weak signals especially in combination with phase shifts between your ears ("Signal Detection in Noise", Peter Montnemery, SM7CMY, MD thesis, Lund 1994, Sweden). May be there are some kind of autocorrelation processes running inside our brains. (Not always reliable here) 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10001 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 07:50:48 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 07:50:48 +0100 Received: (qmail 14249 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 06:24:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 06:24:09 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11InPQ-0006ZR-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 07:16:44 +0100 Received: from neodymium.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.83]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11InPQ-0006ZM-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 07:16:44 +0100 Received: from [195.99.53.242] (helo=zork) by neodymium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 11InPO-00079c-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 07:16:42 +0100 Message-ID: <026f01beed2e$a48c76e0$de46a8c0@unica.co.uk> From: "Peter Bowyer" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Duplicate messages Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 07:13:39 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: Someone's system is resending rsgb_lf_group messages back to the list, causing a mail loop - I'm on the case. Sorry for any inconvenience. 73 Peter G4MJS From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20656 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 08:40:00 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 08:40:00 +0100 Received: (qmail 18044 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 07:38:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 07:38:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IoaH-0007Kb-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 08:32:01 +0100 Received: from artemis.le.ac.uk ([143.210.16.126]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IoaG-0007KV-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 08:32:00 +0100 Received: from pc171.geog.le.ac.uk ([143.210.151.171] helo=kate) by artemis.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 11Ioa5-0000ih-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 08:31:49 +0100 From: "kate moore" To: "lfgroup" Subject: LF: Weekend report Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 08:21:54 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Stations worked here 2-way on 136kHz normal-speed CW this weekend: Friday 20/8: EI0CF (09.27UT: gave him 589, gave me 569)(14.48: 559 @1.5A ant crnt, 569), G0VSJ (15.04: 569, 539), G0VXG (15.28: 569, 599). Saturday 21/8: DJ5DI (06.52: 559, 539), DF2BC/P (07.06: 579, 449QRN), PA0SE (07.24: 579, 579), G3KAU (08.14: 599, 579), G3YXM (08.50: 59+9, 59+9), G0UPU (09.31: 569, 599), G3XDV (09.47: 579, 599), GW4ALG (09.58: 589, 589). Sunday 22/8: G3YMC (07.20: 559, 599), G3XDV (08.03: 57/89, 599), DJ5BV (08.53: 559, 339), G6NB (14.39: 579, 59+9), G8RW (14.54: 56/79, 58/99). Well, it's good to be back on the band again! For those who have been wondering where I've been, I had a second blow up in the TX, but this time things really went up in smoke. I hadn't realised the 'interlock' IC had expired after the first incident and keyed the TX with no drive. It's taken a couple of weeks to repair the damage and get some new FETs (now using 60N10 types - slightly smaller, but cheaper!). I've also modified the drive configuration to AC-couple into the FET gates now, so it should be safer (thanks to Dave 'YXM for help and ideas). It was really frustrating hearing new signals like DK8KW (449) and DL3FDO (559) but not being able to call. Finbar kindly waited around to give me my first QSO and report on Friday and we had a second contact later when he was experimenting with low power. Saturday morning was very busy with lots of activity from Europe, especially from the German expedition to Campen lighthouse. I worked DF2BC but not the other operator (DL9BDM) and they had a really excellent signal using their 75m vertical, although they had some problems on receive due to QRN. With all the activity, the limitations of single frequency transmitters are now beginning to show up. The 'Ropex' frequency around 136.53kHz is getting fairly chaotic at times. I was called at 17.43UT by a new station, G8IK, who was very weak on that frequency. We started a QSO, but he was completely obliterated by all the other stations co-channel (my CQ was on 136.85) - we never completed the QSO as I didn't get my report. Let's hope people find a simple way of changing frequency on these rigs soon....... Sunday was noticibly quieter, although there were still plenty of stations around. Mike G3XDV had completed his work on a new synth and was generating a very clean and commanding signal. Static levels are now starting to reduce at last, so it's much more pleasant operating later in the day again. Regards John G4GVC near Leicester, IO92JP ** TX: Synth + 400W RF from modified 'G3YXM' Mosfet PA ** ** RX: TS-850S with 3 x CW filters and 0.5ppm TCXO ** ** Ant: Inv-L 60m long, 6m high at feed end, 12m high at far end ** From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1544 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 09:17:40 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 09:17:40 +0100 Received: (qmail 26052 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 08:15:59 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 08:15:59 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IpB8-0007e8-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 09:10:06 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IpB5-0007dz-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 09:10:03 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id KAA10602 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 10:16:09 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990823101052.2d4f0714@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 10:10:52 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Multiple tuned vertical In-reply-to: <000601beeba0$859e6e80$ed29f482@win95.swipnet.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 08:43 21/08/99 +0200, you wrote: >I would like to hear if anyone have tested the Multiple Tuned Vertical in some form. >I have understood that the antenna transforms the feed impedance with a factor equal to the square of the number of wires used. E.g.10 wires would raise the feed impedance about 100 times. >I'm just rebuilding my LF-station and this antenna looks very interesting. However, not much information has been found in my litterature. Links or articles would be much appreciated. >73, >Christer / sm6pxj > I found a brief decription of a vertical antenna with multiple tuning in the "Handbuch der Hochfrequenztechnik" by Meinke/Gundlach (p. 531 in in the 1968 edition). I think it works quite similar to the open / folded dipole system where a folded dipole also has 4 times the radiation resistance of an open dipole. So having 2 tuned vertical wires connected to 1 topload will multiple the radiation reststance by 4, 3 wires will multiple by 8 etc ... If each vertical wire is well separated and has its own groundsystem you will also reduce losses. So far 2 things stopped me from testing this system : 1. How far do the vertical parts have to be separated to be effective ? Looking at folded dipoles for HF/VHF the 2 parallel parts are at least 1% spaced, this would mean about 22m on 136kHz. 2. On first sight (and doing some simple calculations) the total antenna capacitance is 'divided' over the multiple verticals. So that would mean that not only each vertical part will need its own loading coil but also that for a 'double tuned' antenna each loading coil will need the double inductance compared to a 'single loaded'. For a 'triple loaded' antenna the inductances of the loading coils will need to be 3 times bigger etc .... Also, if you feed the same current into the antennasystem the antennavoltage will double for an 'double tuned' and triple for a 'triple tuned' antenna. This might also created some practical problems. I am a bit sceptic about the practical use of this antenna, but this should stop nobody from testing it and reporting results to the reflector. 73, Rik ON7YD Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5518 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 11:29:43 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 11:29:43 +0100 Received: (qmail 26514 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 10:28:03 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 10:28:03 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IrBv-00009O-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 11:19:03 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IrBt-00009J-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 11:19:02 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id MAA16707 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 12:25:11 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990823121954.3ff77a60@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 12:19:54 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: weekend report 19-22 august MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Only about 1 hour at the station (30 min on saterday afternoon, 30 min on sunday morning) but a lot of stations heard : DF2BC/P (559), PA0CC (569), G3AQC (529), EI0CF (329), G3YXM (579), G4GVC (549), DJ5BC (569), DL9BDM/P (559), DL3DFO (559), G3XTZ (579), G3XDV (539), G3KAU (569). Worked DF2BC/P (559-339) and got a QRZ (but nothing more) when calling DL3DFO. For those interested in distances : locator of Campen Lighthouse (DF2BC/P and DL9BDM/P) is JO33MJ. 73, Rik Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 18981 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 12:23:32 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 12:23:32 +0100 Received: (qmail 6037 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 11:15:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 11:15:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Irx6-0000Un-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 12:07:48 +0100 Received: from phoenix.earthlight.co.nz ([203.97.8.4] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Irx2-0000Ui-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 12:07:45 +0100 Received: from Computer.earthlight.co.nz (ppp175.earthlight.co.nz [203.97.8.175]) by phoenix.earthlight.co.nz (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA11668 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 23:07:35 +1200 Message-ID: <001a01beed57$536ad300$af0861cb@Computer.earthlight.co.nz> From: "Stan Andrews" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Multiple Tuned Vertical Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 23:03:51 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello All, Was interested in the comments re the M.T.V. Some years ago came across a reference in Technical Topics, RSGB. Unfortunately didn't note which issue or which manual . Did manage to find some data in AMATEUR RADIO VERTICAL ANTENNA Handbook by Paul H. LEE. 1974... CQ Technical Series. Two types discussed. A. NORD Antenna...... for 50 to 150 kc/s/... Has a centre metal pole with a gamma type matching wire from the top of the centre pole. (No detail of the spacing, wire dia or centre pole dia. except that the bottom of centre pole is earthed. From the top of the centre pole there are three sloping wires out to three perimeter poles each of which is earthed through a variable condenser. The three perimeter pole earths are connected back to the earth ing point of the centre pole. Dimensions give by LEE for 50 to 150 kc/s.. Centre pole ( or tower !!) 450 feet. Perimeter towers 150 feet Spacing from centre pole to perimeter poles 500 feet. B. Data for 2 to 4 mc/s... Centre pole 30 feet high Perimeter poles 10 feet high Spacing centre pole to perimeter poles 33 feet. and the total capacity of the three variable condensers , C1 + C2 + C3 is equal to 1500 mmfd. The UG Tyupe Vertical... First Model.... Design for 2 mc/s.. Horizontal wire is 52 foot long. Three down wires, with centre down lead connected to the mid point of the horizontal wire, ( i.e. at the 26 foot point, and the others , one each side at the 25 foot and the 27 foot points..) At the bottom , one of the out side verticals is earthed. The centre wire is connected to the earth point of the earthed vertical through a variable condenser to the earth stake to which the earthed vertical is connected. The other outside vertical comes down to just above ground level and is connected to the feedline system. The length of the verticals is 25 feet for each one.. Second design. Top horizontal wire is 52 foot long supported at the 25 foot level ( above ground ) . The three 25 foot vertivals are attached as follows. First vertical is attached to one end of the horizontal wire and drops down to become the feed element. The second vertical drops down to become the earthed vertical,... one foot away from the feed vertical. the third vertical drops down from the 2 foot point ( from the end of the horizontal wire ) to connect to a variable condenser the other side of which connects to the earthing stake of the centre vertical. As it is quite a few years ago since I made these notes I can not remember if there was any other data. Perhaps a search of the www pages for the NORD or UG Type vertical might bring forth more details. 73 Stan, ZL4MB DUNEDIN NEW ZEALAND.. 23 August 1999 nnnnnnnnn From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13586 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 14:14:59 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 14:14:59 +0100 Received: (qmail 23640 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 12:24:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 12:24:56 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IszO-00011S-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 13:14:14 +0100 Received: from smtp.mail.big-orange.net ([143.179.236.32] helo=Lesothosaurus.big-orange.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11IszN-00011N-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 13:14:14 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 ([143.179.151.28]) by Lesothosaurus.big-orange.net (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with SMTP id AAA602B; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 14:14:10 +0200 Message-ID: <000801beed61$e5c29da0$1c97b38f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "LF-Group" , "Johan Bodin" Subject: LF: Re: SAQ VLF transmitter using the last Alexanderson alternator in the world Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 14:19:37 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To All Johan Bodin wrote to me as an answer to my question when the Alexanderson VLF alternator-transmitter SAQ at Grimeton in Sweden will be on the air the following: I actually know some of the people at "Telia Mobile" who are responsible for the station. I always get an early warning before SAQ goes on the air so I will be able to send an alert message via the RSGB reflector at least a few days in advance. Excellent Johan! Please do keep us posted cos I'm sure not to be the only one in the LF-group that likes to hear this sound of the past. For my e-mail to the Grimeton museum I used the address given by the German "Funk" magazine: grimeton@va.mobitel.telia.se. But the Telia Mobile Postmaster advises me the address has been changed to: grimeton-radio@telia.se. The museum also has a website: http://www.telemuseum.se/Grimeton. I downloaded from Peter Schnoor's website his audio recording of the last transmission from Grimeton in August 1998 (1.9 Mb!). It took almost as long as a telephone call of my XYL to one of her friends... Well done Peter! But there is no substitute for a live performance so let's wait till Johan or Grimeton gives us a signal to fire up our VLF receivers. 73, Dick, PA0SE D.W. Rollema V.d. Marckstraatr 5 2352 RA Leiderdorp The Netherlands Tel. +31 71 589 27 34 E-mail: d.w.rollema@gironet.nl From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11165 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 19:40:59 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 19:40:59 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Received: (qmail 7471 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 18:39:20 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 18:39:20 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Iytm-0003xw-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 19:32:50 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.20]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Iytk-0003xr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 19:32:48 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from dennison.demon.co.uk ([194.222.239.33]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 11Iyth-000CMk-0K for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 18:32:46 +0000 Message-ID: <5AAetAABOZw3EwzN@dennison.demon.co.uk> Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 19:31:29 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Mike Dennison" Subject: LF: weekend report 21/22 August MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: What a weekend! Heard 18 different stations in 7 countries. The Campen Lighthouse expedition caused lots of activity, and a Ropex pile-up, though they couldn't hear me. Worked 6 countries, including a new one. Saturday 21 August Low QRN. Low local noise. Lots of activity. Installed synthesizer on loan from G0MRF (thanks Dave). Works fine, though I had to tweak my PA a little to get rid of some distortion on the finally transmitted waveform. Heard DJ5DI (539); PA0SE (579); DF2BC/P and DL9BDM/P (589); G3YXM (5 9+10 9); G3AQC (599); G3BDQ (599); G3KAU (5 9+20 9); G0UPU (549); G3XTZ (5 9+20 9); G8RW (599). Some very strong signals from the regulars these days. Worked DJ5BV using QRSs ('O'/'O'); G4GVC (gave 599, got 579). Worked EI0CF (559, 3/4 3 9). This QSO was a real pleasure as we have tried to work on many occasions including several skeds. The contact in the end was a random one. He is the 45th station I have worked on 136, and the 9th country. Thanks, Finbar. Sunday 22 August Another noise-free morning. Heard DF2BC/P (up to 599, by far the best signal heard from DL); DJ5BV (539); G3BDQ (5 9+10 9); G3YXM (5 9+10 9); G3XTZ (5 9+20 9); PA0MLC (319 and a new station for me - nr 68 heard); G8RW (599). Worked GW4ALG (599, 589); G4GVC (599, 5 7/8 9). Worked on QRSs ON4ZK ('O'/'O') and heard HB9ASB ('O'). -- Mike, G3XDV http://www.dennison.demon.co.uk/activity.htm From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 12311 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 19:45:26 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 19:45:26 +0100 Received: (qmail 8079 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 18:43:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 18:43:47 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Iyxw-0003yX-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 19:37:08 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo29.mx.aol.com ([198.81.17.73]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Iyxv-0003yN-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 19:37:07 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo29.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id lICOa01989 (3973) for ; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 14:36:15 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: <180b99e7.24f2ee9f@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 14:36:15 EDT Subject: Re: LF: Duplicate messages To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 70 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In a message dated 99-08-23 02:20:55 EDT, G4MJS writes: << Someone's system is resending rsgb_lf_group messages back to the list, causing a mail loop - I'm on the case. Sorry for any inconvenience. >> Thanks, Peter. Best of luck. It's summer re-run season on TV over here, so the first two or three times some of these messages came around, I scarcely noticed. Now it's gotten harder to ignore. :-) 73, John From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13003 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 19:47:57 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 19:47:57 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Received: (qmail 8624 invoked from network); 23 Aug 1999 18:46:19 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 23 Aug 1999 18:46:19 -0000 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Iz0H-00041o-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 19:39:33 +0100 Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.38]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Iz0G-00041j-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 19:39:32 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from dennison.demon.co.uk ([194.222.239.33]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 11Iz0C-000KLv-0A for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 23 Aug 1999 18:39:31 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 19:37:58 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Mike Dennison" Subject: LF: Holiday activity MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Version 3.03a Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Owing to being exhausted after a big job at work, I will not be packing the LF gear when going to GW this week. I will have a receiver and loop antenna, but all the Tx, coils and wire antenna stuff is too much, especially this time of year when QRN is still bad. Will not be idle, though, as some serious planning will be going into finding a location for a 73kHz expedition in October. -- Mike, G3XDV From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28949 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 09:14:49 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 09:14:49 +0100 Received: (qmail 15377 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 08:13:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 08:13:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JBAS-0001Iu-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 08:38:52 +0100 Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JBAR-0001Ip-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 08:38:51 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id JAA15277 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 09:45:01 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990824093942.2dcf930a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 09:39:42 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Multiple tuned vertical In-reply-to: <37BEAA82.B926CC8C@bellatlantic.net> References: <000601beeba0$859e6e80$ed29f482@win95.swipnet.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 09:32 21/08/99 -0400, you wrote: >Hello Chris, >A mathematical (and practical) treatment of Multiple Tuning for vertical antennas can be found in: > > Radio Antenna Engineering > by Edmund Laport McGraw Hill NY 1952 > pp. 38-43 > >This book is obviously out of print, but I could send you photocopies of the relevant pages. >73 >Andre' N4ICK >*********************************** Hello André, I still have to thank you for the article on the meander-antenna you sent me. If it is not asked too much I would be interested in a copy of the Multiple Tuning Antenna too. Please give me your mail address, I will send you some USD as you have already been spending some stamps on my account. Regarding the meander-antenna : if you scale all the described antennas to 136kHz you still get 'monster-antennas'. But the fact that they manage to increase the radiation resistance by a factor up to 20 (compared to an simple vertical of the same height) is impressive. I would be more than happy to get my radiation resistance up to some 100 milliohm instead of the actual 45 millohm. As soon as 'mowing-seazon' os over (october) I intend to do some tests with various antennas. I will try to make some arrangements with Dick, PA0SE (who is living about living about 120km from me and can measure accurate fiedstrenght) to do some good (far-field) measurements on the different antennas. 73, Rik ON7YD Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2215 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 09:30:51 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 09:30:51 +0100 Received: (qmail 19040 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 08:29:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 08:29:14 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JBfp-0001Yv-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 09:11:17 +0100 Received: from smtp.mail.big-orange.net ([143.179.236.31] helo=Iguanodon.big-orange.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JBfo-0001Yq-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 09:11:16 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 ([143.179.151.181]) by Iguanodon.big-orange.net (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with SMTP id AAA81D; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 10:11:11 +0200 Message-ID: <000f01beee09$200ea6a0$b597b38f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "Christer Andersson" Cc: "LF-Group" Subject: Fw: LF: Multiple tuned vertical Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 09:59:42 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dear Christer, In the Dutch Magazine "Radio-Nieuws"of 1 April 1925 I found a treatment of the multiple tuned antenna by Ir. (later Prof.) Huijdts. It confirms what Rik, ON7YD, expected: In a multiple tuned antenna with N radiators each one has a loading coil of N times the selfinductance of the coil for a single radiator. For our amateur antennas on 137 kHz, having small capacitance speaking in LF terms, a single coil already has awkward dimensions, not to speak of coils of N times as large! As to the distance between the radiators we can look at the antenna of station SAQ at Grimeton. It is obviously a multi tuned one, also called an Alexanderson antenna after its inventor who also designed the alternator used at Grimeton. From the description on the website we learn that there are six vertical radiators at intervals of 380 metres. That is for a frequency of about 19 kHz. Scaling the antenna for 137 kHz yields a distance between radiators of (19/137) * 380 = 52.7 metres. I don't think the voltage on the antenna increases as Rik says. In a single radiator with a coil of X ohms and I amps current the voltage is I * X . With N radiators the current in each one is I/N but the reactance of the coil is N * X. So the voltage is (I/N) * N * X = I * X as before. 73, Dick, PA0SE -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: Rik Strobbe Aan: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Datum: maandag 23 augustus 1999 10:41 Onderwerp: Re: LF: Multiple tuned vertical >At 08:43 21/08/99 +0200, you wrote: >>I would like to hear if anyone have tested the Multiple Tuned Vertical in >some form. >>I have understood that the antenna transforms the feed impedance with a >factor equal to the square of the number of wires used. E.g.10 wires would >raise the feed impedance about 100 times. >>I'm just rebuilding my LF-station and this antenna looks very interesting. >However, not much information has been found in my litterature. Links or >articles would be much appreciated. >>73, >>Christer / sm6pxj >> >I found a brief decription of a vertical antenna with multiple tuning in >the "Handbuch der Hochfrequenztechnik" by Meinke/Gundlach (p. 531 in in the >1968 edition). >I think it works quite similar to the open / folded dipole system where a >folded dipole also has 4 times the radiation resistance of an open dipole. >So having 2 tuned vertical wires connected to 1 topload will multiple the >radiation reststance by 4, 3 wires will multiple by 8 etc ... >If each vertical wire is well separated and has its own groundsystem you >will also reduce losses. >So far 2 things stopped me from testing this system : > >1. How far do the vertical parts have to be separated to be effective ? >Looking at folded dipoles for HF/VHF the 2 parallel parts are at least 1% >spaced, this would mean about 22m on 136kHz. > >2. On first sight (and doing some simple calculations) the total antenna >capacitance is 'divided' over the multiple verticals. So that would mean >that not only each vertical part will need its own loading coil but also >that for a 'double tuned' antenna each loading coil will need the double >inductance compared to a 'single loaded'. For a 'triple loaded' antenna the >inductances of the loading coils will need to be 3 times bigger etc .... >Also, if you feed the same current into the antennasystem the >antennavoltage will double for an 'double tuned' and triple for a 'triple >tuned' antenna. This might also created some practical problems. > >I am a bit sceptic about the practical use of this antenna, but this should >stop nobody from testing it and reporting results to the reflector. > >73, Rik ON7YD > > >Rik Strobbe ON7YD >rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be >Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14994 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 12:22:48 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 12:22:48 +0100 Received: (qmail 28244 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 11:21:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 11:21:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JETn-0002sN-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 12:11:03 +0100 Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JETm-0002sI-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 12:11:02 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Tue, 24 Aug 1999 13:10:31 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de ([194.94.166.130]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA22791 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 13:10:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <37C27CF0.AED7C492@nephro.uni-kiel.de> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 13:07:28 +0200 From: "P. W. Schnoor" Organization: Clinic of Nephrology, University of Kiel X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.36 i586) X-Accept-Language: de, en To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Multiple tuned vertical References: <000f01beee09$200ea6a0$b597b38f@w8k3f0> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello, Dick Rollema wrote: > > In the Dutch Magazine "Radio-Nieuws"of 1 April 1925 I found a treatment of > the multiple tuned antenna by Ir. (later Prof.) Huijdts. It confirms what > Rik, ON7YD, expected: In a multiple tuned antenna with N radiators each one > has a loading coil of N times the selfinductance of the coil for a single > radiator. Simulation with ELNEC confirms this in general: Not exactly N times higher but somewhat higher, increasing with N. If mistuned at one leg only this leg will degenerate to a loop antenna (via earth, side fed) and the whole system will be a fine dummy or cloud burner at best. 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10929 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 15:53:01 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 15:53:01 +0100 Received: (qmail 8784 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 14:51:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 14:51:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JHi8-0004Sr-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 15:38:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net ([199.45.39.157]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JHi5-0004Sl-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 15:38:01 +0100 Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-151-200-120-32.bellatlantic.net [151.200.120.32]) by smtp-out2.bellatlantic.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA16917; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 10:42:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <37C2AE82.20DCA90F@bellatlantic.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 10:38:58 -0400 From: "Andre' Kesteloot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Multiple tuned vertical References: <000601beeba0$859e6e80$ed29f482@win95.swipnet.se> <3.0.1.16.19990824093942.2dcf930a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik Strobbe wrote: > If it is not asked too much I would be interested in a copy of the Multiple > Tuning Antenna too. in the mail today :-) > Regarding the meander-antenna : if you scale all the described antennas to > 136kHz you still get 'monster-antennas'. But the fact that they manage to > increase the radiation resistance by a factor up to 20 (compared to an > simple vertical of the same height) is impressive. I would be more than > happy to get my radiation resistance up to some 100 milliohm instead of the > actual 45 millohm. 20 x would be almost 0.1 ohm, would it not? It seems to me that, somewhat like drafts looking for the fountain of eternal youth, all of us are always searching for the perfect small LF antenna :-) (the price Faust paid was a little to steep for me...) See you in October at Winsor? 73 Andre' N4ICK From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24356 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 16:44:53 +0100 Received: from purple.force9.net (195.166.128.228) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 16:44:53 +0100 Received: (qmail 11263 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 15:44:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by purple.force9.net with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 15:44:22 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JIWv-0004st-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 16:30:33 +0100 X-Priority: 3 Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JIWu-0004so-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 16:30:32 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id RAA17412 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 17:36:42 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990824173123.2d0f36f4@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 17:31:23 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Multiple tuned vertical In-reply-to: <37C2AE82.20DCA90F@bellatlantic.net> References: <000601beeba0$859e6e80$ed29f482@win95.swipnet.se><3.0.1.16.19990824093942.2dcf930a@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: At 10:38 24/08/99 -0400, you wrote: >> If it is not asked too much I would be interested in a copy of the Multiple >> Tuning Antenna too. > >in the mail today :-) thanks >> Regarding the meander-antenna : if you scale all the described antennas to >> 136kHz you still get 'monster-antennas'. But the fact that they manage to >> increase the radiation resistance by a factor up to 20 (compared to an >> simple vertical of the same height) is impressive. I would be more than >> happy to get my radiation resistance up to some 100 milliohm instead of the >> actual 45 millohm. > >20 x would be almost 0.1 ohm, would it not? > 20 times 45 millohm would be even close to 1 Ohm >It seems to me that, somewhat like drafts looking for the fountain of >eternal youth, all of us are always searching for the perfect small LF >antenna :-) >(the price Faust paid was a little to steep for me...) Regarding electrical antennas the magic key is 'increase the radiation resistance'. If you cannot increase the height than you have to look for alternatives as 'multiple-tuned' or 'meander' antennas. But I'm afraid you won't get it for free, there will be some drawbacks. For the 'multiple-tuned' antenna it is (at least) the many big inductors you will need. I intend to construct an new (low-loss) loading coil for my antenna. When that is ready I will do some tests with a 'double-tuned' antenna with the 2 downleads about 22 meter separated, I wonder what I will gain. Later I will give the meander-antenna a try and sure I will find out what the drawbacks are on that one .... .. >See you in October at Winsor? I'am afraid not, I will be visiting KH6 and W6/W0 in october. 73, Rik ON7YD PS : still haven't you postal address. I will be happy to send you some USD so I do not have to feel guilty if I ask you for copies. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28872 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 17:01:21 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 17:01:21 +0100 Received: (qmail 24133 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 15:59:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 15:59:46 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JIqK-00051x-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 16:50:36 +0100 Received: from gatef.bbc.co.uk ([132.185.132.15] helo=gatef.kw.bbc.co.uk) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JIqJ-00051s-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 16:50:35 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from sunf0.rd.bbc.co.uk (ddmailgate.rd.bbc.co.uk [132.185.128.104]) by gatef.kw.bbc.co.uk (8.8.5/8.7.2) with SMTP id QAA17618 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 16:50:29 +0100 (BST) Received: from pc523 by sunf0.rd.bbc.co.uk; Tue, 24 Aug 99 16:50:27 BST X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19990824165023.009b02e0@sunf0> X-Sender: simonlh@sunf0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 16:50:23 +0100 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Simon Lloyd-Hughes" Subject: Re: LF: Multiple tuned vertical In-reply-to: <37BEAA82.B926CC8C@bellatlantic.net> References: <000601beeba0$859e6e80$ed29f482@win95.swipnet.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Is there an ISBN number for this? At 09:32 21/08/99 -0400, you wrote: >Hello Chris, >A mathematical (and practical) treatment of Multiple Tuning for vertical antennas can be found in: > > Radio Antenna Engineering > by Edmund Laport McGraw Hill NY 1952 > pp. 38-43 > >This book is obviously out of print, but I could send you photocopies of the relevant pages. >73 >Andre' N4ICK >*********************************** > >Christer Andersson wrote: > >> I would like to hear if anyone have tested the Multiple Tuned Vertical in some form. >> I have understood that the antenna transforms the feed impedance with a factor equal to the square of the number of wires used. E.g.10 wires would raise the feed impedance about 100 times. >> I'm just rebuilding my LF-station and this antenna looks very interesting. However, not much information has been found in my litterature. Links or articles would be much appreciated. >> 73, >> Christer / sm6pxj > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________________________ Email: simon.lloyd-hughes@rd.bbc.co.uk Tel: Internal 36692 External 01737 836692 Mobile 0589 151485 FAX: 01737 836555 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________________________ From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 1162 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 17:09:54 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 17:09:54 +0100 Received: (qmail 26607 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 16:09:55 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 16:09:55 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JIyi-00056s-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 16:59:16 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JIyg-00056l-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 16:59:14 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id SAA17501 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 18:05:24 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990824180005.2d0fd4b2@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 18:00:05 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: direct mails MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: It happened me twice today that I replied to a mail of Nick and did send it to the reflector instead of direct. I appologize for that and promise to check the 'to' address better before sending a mail. 73, Rik ON7YD From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19055 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 18:20:01 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 18:20:01 +0100 Received: (qmail 7780 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 17:18:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 17:18:27 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JJnM-0005V7-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 17:51:36 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from alpha.dii.unisi.it ([193.205.7.2] ident=root) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JJnL-0005V2-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 17:51:35 +0100 Received: from mailsrv.dii.unisi.it (pcfasec.dii.unisi.it [193.205.7.103]) by alpha.dii.unisi.it (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA04935 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 18:49:30 +0200 Message-ID: <37C2CD6E.B3A4D3C5@mailsrv.dii.unisi.it> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 18:50:54 +0200 From: "Valerio Gabbani" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: QRSS QRV Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello lowfers, just to say that the next three days (25/26/27) i'm qrv in QRSS mode from 5.00 to 6.30 UTC at 137.71 kHz. ' 73 and see you on the screen, Valerio (IK5ZPV JN53KX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6204 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 23:19:15 +0100 Received: from purple.force9.net (195.166.128.228) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 23:19:15 +0100 Received: (qmail 4527 invoked from network); 24 Aug 1999 22:18:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by purple.force9.net with SMTP; 24 Aug 1999 22:18:46 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JOjW-0007qT-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 23:07:58 +0100 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au ([203.26.10.9]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JOjO-0007qL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 24 Aug 1999 23:07:54 +0100 Received: from steve (d164.syd2.zeta.org.au [203.26.9.36]) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA12994 for ; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 08:07:28 +1000 Message-ID: <199908242207.IAA12994@godzilla.zeta.org.au> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Steve Olney" To: "RSGB LF Group" Subject: LF: Multiple Tuned Vertical Date: Wed, 25 Aug 1999 08:09:32 +1000 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: G'day All, Here is my two cents worth... I think that there is not a great deal to be gained from using multiple-tuned verticals. The reason I think that is that if you look at the aim of improving our short vertical antennas, we see that we are trying to improve the ratio of radiated power versus applied power. We tend to concentrate on radiation resistance alone, when it is the ratio of radiation resistance to losses which determines how much goes into ether and how much warms up the local environment. Radiation resistance is an entirely ficticious resistance which is evaluated by analysing the impedance at the feed point. Change the feedpoint and you can change the radiation resistance. The notion that there is some inherent radiation resistance for a particular antenna configuration (say 75 ohm for a 1/2 wave dipole) is a mathematical one and arises out of the practice that by convention and convenience the analysis is carried out using a feedpoint where the current is maximum. Radiation resistance is then actually the lowest value of the radiating part of the feedpoint impedance possible. The change in radiation resistance with feedpoint is viewed by some as simply a transformer action. A good explanation except you can not 'transform' the radiation resistance of a given radiating structure to a lower value, only higher. However, transformer action remains a good way of viewing the situation. Where does this leave the multiple-tuned vertical? Well, I think that indeed the radiation resistance will be transformed up as a ratio N * N, and you will need larger coils to resonate each leg, and so on. The fly in the ointment as far as I can see is that while the currents in each leg are reduced, any losses (earth, coil, etc) as seen from the feedpoint are also multiplied up by N * N. So my guess is what you gain on the roundabout (increased apparent radiation resistance) is lost on the swings (increased apparent losses). That is, the ratio of radiation resistance to total losses remains largely the same. So why do commercial installations use the configuration? I suspect it has more to do with the GIGANTIC powers they use and the difficulty of making a single earth connection carry all the current at those powers. By using the multiple-tuned vertical the currents are split and so are reduced at each individual earth point. The above has been seen to be the case using antenna analysis software. Initially I had a great rush of excitement when I saw a 0.01 ohm radiation resistance increased to 1 ohm using ten radiators, but this quickly subsided when I introduced a series loss resistance with each coil and saw that that loss was multiplied by the same factor :-( In conclusion I feel that there might be something to be gained (not a great deal), but also there may be some other factor not accounted for which may produce better results than expected from the above. After all, we are experimenters and are not totally bound by theory, but only imagination :-) 73s Steve Olney (VK2ZTO/AXSO - QF56IK : Lat -33 34 07, Long +150 44 40) ============================================= LowFer URL: http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg/lowfer.htm AXSO Experimental Station URL: http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg/axsoextx.htm LF Receiving - FRG-100 LF Transmitting - 177.5kHz 8W to 7.6m top-loaded vertical Modes - AM, SSB, PSK31, SSTV, Hellschreiber and QRSS ============================================= From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29657 invoked from network); 25 Aug 1999 01:19:27 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 25 Aug 1999 01:19:27 +0100 Received: (qmail 26323 invoked from network); 25 Aug 1999 00:17:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 Aug 1999 00:17:55 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JQe9-0000RV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 01:10:33 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JQe7-0000Q7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 01:10:32 +0100 Received: from [203.96.101.230] by mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <19990824235603.UORW2529197.mta1-rme@[203.96.101.230]> for ; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 11:56:03 +1200 Message-ID: <37C32E50.16E3@xtra.co.nz> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Wed, 25 Aug 1999 11:44:16 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Multiple Tuned Vertical References: <199908242207.IAA12994@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Here is my two cents worth ... done on the fly ... The multiple feedpoints in a multiple tuned antenna give an apparent increase in the real component (resistance) by transformer action (currents divide by the number of separate vertical feeds). However, that does not alter the basic radiation characteristic of THE SYSTEM AS A WHOLE. The radiation resistance of the whole system is still related to overall physical dimensions. Multiple tuning is just a "trick" to get an apparent increase in radiation resistance, but it does not trick the laws of physics! Where gains could be had is with reduced current density at the earth mat around each feedpoint. For a given resistivity earth mat, the power loss is I squared R. As the I values are divided according to vertical feeds, then the current densities and I squared R losses are all much lower than having one feedpoint for the given antenna structure, taking full current. Reducing the ground loss component of an electrically small antenna is an effective way of improving gain (as the radiation resistance is swamped by loss resistance). In an electrically large system (like commercial systems) running high power, the multiple feeds, each with earth mats, disperse the ground current much better than for a single feedpoint system. I have read somewhere that there have been ground systems that have literally "burnt out" trying to work with applied high power. In summary, for a typical amateur system, size limited, I do not see any advantages in trying multiple tunes systems. Neither it seems do the commercial NDB users, where "Marconi T" LF antennas are standard installations. They do however invest in rather good ground radial systems .... Regards, Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6955 invoked from network); 25 Aug 1999 06:19:02 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 25 Aug 1999 06:19:02 +0100 Received: (qmail 19103 invoked from network); 25 Aug 1999 05:17:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 25 Aug 1999 05:17:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JV9e-0002Ww-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 05:59:22 +0100 Received: from mb06.swip.net ([193.12.122.210]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JV9c-0002Wr-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 05:59:21 +0100 Received: from win95 (d212-151-32-25.swipnet.se [212.151.32.25]) by mb06.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id GAA28252 for ; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 06:59:17 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001701beeeb6$ea512e80$192097d4@win95.swipnet.se> From: "Christer Andersson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: SV: Multiple Tuned Vertical Date: Wed, 25 Aug 1999 07:01:37 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thanks for the interest in this issue. Steve Olney wrote: > We tend to >concentrate on radiation resistance alone, when it is the ratio of >radiation resistance to losses which determines how much goes into ether >and how much warms up the local environment. In an article in the Swedish magazine QTC mr Dagaas, chief engineer at SAQ, briefly explains the working principle of the MTA: A single vertical with top loading and earth system would have a feed impedans of approx. 2,5 ohm. If six such antennas are parallelled, the total loss resistance becomes 1/6 while the radiation resistance remains unchanged. The total impedance is now 0,45 ohm due to reduced losses. The antenna input power is fed by 1/6 of the total current (feed impedance is raised by a factor 36). By varying the current distribution between the verticals (by changing the tuning coils) a suitable feed impedance can be achieved. 20 ohm in the SAQ case. It seems like the ratio of Rrad/Rloss is increased. Corresponding thougths can be found in the ARRL Antenna book edition 17 p4-21. In parallell with this discussion on the LF reflector, the subject has been treated in the news group rec.amateur.radio.antenna. /Christer From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28728 invoked from network); 25 Aug 1999 08:59:44 +0100 Received: from purple.force9.net (195.166.128.228) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 25 Aug 1999 08:59:44 +0100 Received: (qmail 17756 invoked from network); 25 Aug 1999 07:59:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by purple.force9.net with SMTP; 25 Aug 1999 07:59:21 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JXlW-0003j9-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 08:46:38 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mail2.hamilton-standard.com ([153.4.57.12]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JXlV-0003ix-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 08:46:37 +0100 Received: from curly.hsd.utc.com by mail2.hamilton-standard.com; (8.9.1/) id DAA24315; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 03:52:55 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Received: from umrsvr.hsd.utc.com by curly.hsd.utc.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/27Feb96-0334PM) id AA03060; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 03:45:31 -0400 Received: from nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com by umrsvr.hsd.utc.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/27Feb96-0334PM) id AA02789; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 03:43:04 -0400 Received: by nmex01nt.hsd.utc.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 10:38:57 +0200 Message-ID: From: "Soegiono, Gamal" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Multiple Tuned Vertical - Example Date: Wed, 25 Aug 1999 10:38:56 +0200 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Content-type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Hello all While compiling an article about the german LW-BC transmitter site "Donebach", I come acros some interesting facts about the first antenna system which was in use there from 1967 through 1970 - a multiple tuned vertical, based on the design principle of Ernst F.W. Alexanderson. Four steel lattice masts, height 200m, cross section 2m by 2m are aligned in a star figure. All mast are isolated from ground at their bases. Each mast has its individual burried radial system consisting of 100 radials 200m each. The radials are made of zinc plated steel "tape" (30mm by 3mm approx.) burried half a meter below ground level. The total length burried calculates as 80km (nowadays system 2*60*360m=43.2 km). The mast feeding the antenna system is placed in the center of a triangle. >From center 330m to zero degrees is placed the first, >From center 330m to 120 degrees is placed the second, >From center 330m to 240 degrees is placed the third periferal mast. A top load is spun from the central mast to each of the periferal masts. Each of the three toploads comprise 10 "wires" spaced by 1m making a rectangle 10m by 330m (there is no means to connect one periferal mast to the other directly, only via central mast). Operating frequency that time was 151.0 kHz (1987m WL). The base of the central mast is fed by a T-Network (base)series L1, shunt C, series L2(coax). The bases of the three periferal mast are connected via L3 to ground. The approximate Reactances are: X(L1)=j157 Ohms X(L2)=j60 Ohms X(L3)=j94 Ohms X(C)=-j60 Ohms The head designer of the first Donebach antenna system Dr. Heinz Graziadei claimes the efficiency of the antenna system to reach 95% (the two mast system in use nowadays is said to have an efficiency of 88%). ----------------------------------------------------- Hi there down under in ZL: ----------------------------------------------------- It is said that in Paengatoa (New Zealand) we may find (if still existing) a 100% copy of the Donebach-1 Antenna System. Perhaps you can check that unconfirmed info and take pictures ?? ----------------------------------------------------- Using a very simplified model (top load modeled by one wire only having 2m equivalent diameter, all masts modeled as wires 2m in diameter) of the antenna, defining Ground as perfect, wire losses as zero (to obtain the radiation resistance only) using a test version of ELNEC I get the following numbers: Rfeedpoint (Rrad) is about 118 Ohms current in central mast (base/top) 1.00A/0.62A current in all periferal masts (base/top) 1.02A/0.65A ----------------------------------------------------- Historical add-on: ----------------------------------------------------- >From 1967-1970 the LW-BC transmitter site Donebach (49N39, 09E11) was allowed to use 250 kW transmitter (HF output power) and an omnidirectional radiation pattern in azimuth on the assigned frequency of 151 kHz. The Romanian LW-BC station in Brasov (45N43, 25E36) used the same frequency with 2000 kW transmitter and omnidirectional radiation pattern in azimuth. There are even more stations sharing the same allocated frequency but their ground distances to Donebach are at least twice as much as in between Donebach and Brasov. The ground distance in between latter sites is about 1300 km and was assumed sufficient to provide protection of each stations intended coverage area - a false assumption. Receiption of Brasov Program in the intended coverage area of Brasov was systematically "jammed" by the Donebach Program - WHY ??? The Donebach site is at 510m above sea level, an area of 2 sqkm with level variations below 10m. The site, in the middle of the little mountain area of "Odenwald", formerely was a marshland. During WW2 there was an attempt to install an airfield there. The terrain was drained and leveled to some extend. The site nowadays is still marshy, i.e. you get wet shoes when walking around, except for the hottest summer season. Ground conductivity approximates three milliSiemens. There is a virtually unobstacled "free-shot" to the horizon in any direction. I do not have details of the Brasov site, all I heared, the ground conductivity is "very bad", perhaps caused by the porous carbon type of ground. The Donebach site therefore has an natural benefit over the Brasov site. Rating the excellent Donebach-1 Antenna System it is easy to understand, why the 250kW classed Donebach site could outperform the 2MW classed site in Brasov in it's own coverage area !! As a temporary countermeasure, Donebach reduced power to 120kW and 60kW without much help for the Brasov coverage area. In 1970 the service in Donebach was stopped (Mainflingen took over temporarily) in order to convert the omnidirectional Donebach-1 Antenna System into a 2 mast directional antenna system (Donebach-2 Antenna System). This did not help either, as two of the former masts were re-used at their original location, the relative distance (330m) was insufficient to provide the required cardioide azimuth pattern with a deep enough Null in direction to Brasov. The final solution was to completely redesign the antenna system (went in operation Oct 1982) to what we know today as the Donebach-3 Antenna System (see my recent "profile"). ----------------------------------------------------- 73 de Gamal From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7614 invoked from network); 25 Aug 1999 19:10:38 +0100 Received: from purple.force9.net (195.166.128.228) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 25 Aug 1999 19:10:38 +0100 Received: (qmail 25687 invoked from network); 25 Aug 1999 18:10:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by purple.force9.net with SMTP; 25 Aug 1999 18:10:22 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JhHK-0008JV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 18:56:06 +0100 Received: from mailout05.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.153]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JhHI-0008JQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 18:56:04 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from fwd01.btx.dtag.de ([194.25.2.161]) by mailout05.btx.dtag.de with smtp id 11JhHG-0000zj-00; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 19:56:02 +0200 Received: (087321565-0001(btxid)@[212.184.145.61]) by fwd01.btx.dtag.de id ; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 19:55:48 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 25 Aug 1999 19:55:48 +0200 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <000501beec8e$90129280$4a97b38f@w8k3f0> Subject: Re: LF: New LF broadcast transmitter at Kootwijk? X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Sender: 087321565-0001@t-online.de From: "Hans-Joachim Brandt" Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi all, I do not know what kind of LF equipment is still existing at Kootwijk but the following news may be of interest to all LF fans: Dick Rollema schrieb: Today even less than before as the only thing that is of > interest to KPN is making money. And to preserve a station like Kootwijk or > SAQ only costs money. On an recent trip to the Netherlands (nr Groningen) I have read in a PTT brochure that plans are underway for a new longwave transmitter at Kootwijk, but EMC problems were also foreseen for this area. Further investigations revealed the idea to operate a broadcast longwave transmitter at Kootwijk and have the programme compiled by a company in the U.K., aiming at listeners in the U.K. HW? 73 Ha-Jo, DJ1ZB From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 8795 invoked from network); 25 Aug 1999 21:24:26 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 25 Aug 1999 21:24:26 +0100 Received: (qmail 22485 invoked from network); 25 Aug 1999 20:24:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 25 Aug 1999 20:24:26 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JjHc-0000oT-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 21:04:32 +0100 Received: from smtp3.xs4all.nl ([194.109.127.49]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JjHb-0000oC-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 21:04:31 +0100 Received: from v3q4v1 (dc2-isdn1731.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.154.195]) by smtp3.xs4all.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA05448 for ; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 22:04:30 +0200 (CEST) From: "M. Sanders" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: RE: LF: New LF broadcast transmitter at Kootwijk? Date: Wed, 25 Aug 1999 22:01:30 +0200 Message-ID: <000001beef34$9fbf3a00$c39a6dc2@v3q4v1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-reply-to: Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All, Public awareness to the effects of extreme high power transmitters have resulted into a public discussion if Kootwijk is a propper site for a Giga powered LW transmitter. Legal procedures are pending to stop the project. A second site off-shore is developed at the moment. The location should be a few miles West of the Zeeland isles (South-East Netherlands). The plan includes antenna masts well over a hundred meters in height to be constructed on top of artificial sand isles in the North-Sea. There have also been asked questions in the Dutch parlament about governement approval given to this enterprise. best 73, Michael Sanders, PA3BSH. > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: majordom@post.thorcom.com [mailto:majordom@post.thorcom.com]namens > Hans-Joachim Brandt > Verzonden: woensdag 25 augustus 1999 19:56 > Aan: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Onderwerp: Re: LF: New LF broadcast transmitter at Kootwijk? > > > Hi all, > > I do not know what kind of LF equipment is still existing at > Kootwijk but the > following news may be of interest to all LF fans: > > Dick Rollema schrieb: > Today even less than before as the only thing that is of > > interest to KPN is making money. And to preserve a station > like Kootwijk or > > SAQ only costs money. > > On an recent trip to the Netherlands (nr Groningen) I have read in a PTT > brochure that plans are underway for a new longwave transmitter > at Kootwijk, but > EMC problems were also foreseen for this area. Further > investigations revealed > the idea to operate a broadcast longwave transmitter at Kootwijk > and have the > programme compiled by a company in the U.K., aiming at listeners > in the U.K. > > HW? > > 73 Ha-Jo, DJ1ZB > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 21312 invoked from network); 26 Aug 1999 00:09:12 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 26 Aug 1999 00:09:12 +0100 Received: (qmail 31306 invoked from network); 25 Aug 1999 23:09:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 25 Aug 1999 23:09:13 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Jm0Z-0002AC-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 23:59:07 +0100 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au ([203.26.10.9]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Jm0X-0002A7-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 23:59:06 +0100 Received: from steve (d179.syd2.zeta.org.au [203.26.9.51]) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA16769 for ; Thu, 26 Aug 1999 08:58:58 +1000 Message-ID: <199908252258.IAA16769@godzilla.zeta.org.au> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Steve Olney" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: SV: Multiple Tuned Vertical Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 08:51:53 +1000 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Christer wrote: > If six such antennas are parallelled, the total loss resistance becomes 1/6 while the radiation resistance remains unchanged. The total impedance is now 0,45 ohm due to reduced losses. > The antenna input power is fed by 1/6 of the total current (feed impedance is raised by a factor 36). > By varying the current distribution between the verticals (by changing the tuning coils) a suitable feed impedance can be achieved. 20 ohm in the SAQ case. > > It seems like the ratio of Rrad/Rloss is increased. Corresponding thougths can be found in the ARRL Antenna book edition 17 p4-21. > mmm... interesting that this description disagrees with the ARRL handbook description.. I quote. "If ground losses are also considered, the effective loss resistance (RL) would also be transformed by the same amount." It goes on to say that it is the distribution of the ground currents which will USUALLY improve the ratio Ra/Rl. So the real improvement seems to come from the reduction in losses through better earth current distribution (see Bob Vernall's post). This is unlikely to be anywhere near an improvement of N*N. I am especially pessimistic as for many of us who are LF-challenged, the major part of the losses are trees and buildings which won't be reduced. As I said before, this is all theory and even practical examples from the commercial world can be unattainable in the less than ideal amateur installations, so the final words on this will have to be practical experimentation from different amateur installations. 73s Steve Olney (VK2ZTO/AXSO - QF56IK : Lat -33 34 07, Long +150 44 40) ============================================= LowFer URL: http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg/lowfer.htm AXSO Experimental Station URL: http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg/axsoextx.htm LF Receiving - FRG-100 LF Transmitting - 177.5kHz 8W to 7.6m top-loaded vertical Modes - AM, SSB, PSK31, SSTV, Hellschreiber and QRSS ============================================= From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 19116 invoked from network); 26 Aug 1999 06:17:03 +0100 Received: from purple.force9.net (195.166.128.228) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 26 Aug 1999 06:17:03 +0100 Received: (qmail 1085 invoked from network); 26 Aug 1999 05:16:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by purple.force9.net with SMTP; 26 Aug 1999 05:16:53 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JrVs-0004ub-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 26 Aug 1999 05:51:48 +0100 Received: from mb06.swip.net ([193.12.122.210]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11JrVr-0004uW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 26 Aug 1999 05:51:47 +0100 Received: from win95 (d212-151-111-230.swipnet.se [212.151.111.230]) by mb06.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id GAA00910 for ; Thu, 26 Aug 1999 06:51:44 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001d01beef7f$06262200$e66f97d4@win95.swipnet.se> From: "Christer Andersson" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Multiple Tuned Vertical reference Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 06:54:03 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: In rec.radio.amateur.antenna, W8JI writes: On Mon, 23 Aug 1999 12:00:31 GMT, 2w8ji@contesting.com (Tom W8JI) wrote: >In the latest installations and rebuilds, VLF stations have removed >multiple downlead systems and improved efficiency. I'm sure I can did >some references. OK Nate. Unlike you, I'll be helpful and post a clear reference that does not reference myself and includes an A-B comparison at one site with only a grounding system change . 19-14 of the Antenna Engineering Handbook by Jasik. A 26 KHz VLF antenna at Marion, Mass in the USA used a mutiple tuned system. The average dry/wet efficiency was 15.6 percent, with ground resistance averaging .32 ohms but with variations up to .615 ohms in dry weather. The Air Force rehabilitated the system with a conventional radial system occupying the same overall area. Average efficiency became 23 percent. An exact quote: "With the same antenna, site, and expanse of ground system and at the same very low frequency, a generally radial ground system resulted in considerably less ground loss than had previously been obtained with a combination of multiple stars, parallel wire grids, and a complex overhead distribution and equalizing system." IMO, with a ham doing things "less perfect" than commercial ventures and on a much higher frequency than 20 KHz, he would be well advised to avoid all the complex theories about multiple distributed grounds. Especially since they don't work as well as a simple, straightforward system of radial wires occupying the same physical area. I'm sure this carries over to HF as well, at least my results and the results at two AM BC stations and reports from others using both "special" and conventional systems compared at one site all agree...the conventional system is better. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 771 invoked from network); 26 Aug 1999 19:08:07 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 26 Aug 1999 19:08:07 +0100 Received: (qmail 4637 invoked from network); 26 Aug 1999 15:52:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 26 Aug 1999 15:52:10 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11K1P7-0001Km-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Thu, 26 Aug 1999 16:25:29 +0100 Received: from smtp1.xs4all.nl ([194.109.127.48]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11K1P6-0001Kh-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 26 Aug 1999 16:25:28 +0100 Received: from v3q4v1 (dc2-isdn1736.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.154.200]) by smtp1.xs4all.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id RAA27789 for ; Thu, 26 Aug 1999 17:25:26 +0200 (CEST) From: "M. Sanders" To: "LF-reflector RSGB" Subject: LF: Solar eclipse effect on LF signals Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 17:22:27 +0200 Message-ID: <000001beefd6$ce758280$c89a6dc2@v3q4v1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2232.26 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All A preliminary report on the effect of the solar eclipse on LF radio signals has been published at the following Internet URL: http://www.xs4all.nl/~misan/eclipse.htm This report is based on the observations of the Swiss radio time signal station HBG 75 kHz. by several European Radio Amateurs. (It might take a little while to download all the graph's.) Reactions and comments are welcome. 73, Michael Sanders, PA3BSH mailto:pa3bsh@amsat.org From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14873 invoked from network); 27 Aug 1999 05:08:05 +0100 Received: from cask.force9.net (195.166.128.29) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 27 Aug 1999 05:08:05 +0100 Received: (qmail 4164 invoked from network); 27 Aug 1999 04:08:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by cask.force9.net with SMTP; 27 Aug 1999 04:08:07 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KD6Y-0007Hd-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 27 Aug 1999 04:55:06 +0100 Received: from mb06.swip.net ([193.12.122.210]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KD6W-0007HY-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 27 Aug 1999 04:55:04 +0100 Received: from win95 (dialup244-3-47.swipnet.se [130.244.244.175]) by mb06.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id FAA15534 for ; Fri, 27 Aug 1999 05:55:00 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <002301bef040$442b1580$aff4f482@win95.swipnet.se> From: "Christer Andersson" To: "RSGB LF group" Subject: LF: Re: Multiple Tuned Vertical Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 05:57:20 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: (from rec.amateur.radio.antenna) From: Reg Edwards Subject: Ah wuz rung ! Date: den 26 augusti 1999 22:33 I agree with Mr Dagaas's reason for efficiency of the 6-mast system being 6 times that of an individual mast. I would like to describe the operation in a little more detail. (1) Each mast has its own set of ground radials. Whether the radial wires of adjacent masts are in contact with each other is of no consequence because no current flows across the junction. (2) The masts are separated by a distance three times their height. This ensures the ground system under each mast provides a ground connection for that mast only. There is no sharing of ground connections between masts. (3) The radiation resistance of an individual mast when considered in isolation is dependent on mast height in wavelengths as affected by its share of the capacitance hat. When F = 16.67 KHz, wavelength = 18 kilo-metres. (11 miles). I estimate the radiation resistance to be approximately 0.05 ohms. (4) If the feedpoint resistance of one mast is 2.50 ohms then its radiating efficiency is 1.96 percent. The input (loss) resistance of one set of radials must be 2.45 ohms. (5) When all 6 masts are parallelled at the top via the top-capacitance wires, each mast draws 1/6th of the total current. For the same total power input the loss in an individual ground system falls to 1/36th of the previously value. So the total loss in all six ground systems is only 1/6th of the previous total loss. (6) The masts are spaced apart by only 0.0217 wavelengths. The distance between the two outermost masts is 0.108 wavelengths. So for practical purposes the masts are all in phase with each other and behave as one vertical mast. So the radiation resistance remains as before, 0.05 ohms. System efficiency is 6 times greater = 12 percent approx. (7) As a bonus, the theoretical feedpoint resistance of one of the masts is increased by 36 times = 88 ohms. But nothing is perfect. The masts are not all exactly in phase with each other. The ground systems are not entirely independent of each other. And so the actual feedpoint resistance is 20 ohms it seems. Question :- Is a conjugate match to the generator appropriate in this case ? So my original statement that multiple antenna conductors do not increase efficiency was wrong. Nevertheless, efficiency increases only when each conductor has its own completely independent ground system by spacing them well apart. But the conductors must not further apart than a small fraction of a wavelength. These two simultaneous conditions cannot be achieved unless efficiency is very low even after the improvement has been obtained. As it is at SAQ. But the design engineer of SAQ deserves our admiration. He certainly understood exactly what he was doing 77 years back. And all he had was a slide rule. Reg, G4FGQ. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2654 invoked from network); 27 Aug 1999 12:49:33 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 27 Aug 1999 12:49:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 7862 invoked from network); 27 Aug 1999 12:47:20 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 27 Aug 1999 12:47:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KLEb-0002ob-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 27 Aug 1999 13:35:57 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KLEa-0002oW-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 27 Aug 1999 13:35:56 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id OAA17043 for ; Fri, 27 Aug 1999 14:42:09 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990827143645.268f4bda@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 14:36:45 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: Multiple Tuned Vertical : simple calculations In-reply-to: <002301bef040$442b1580$aff4f482@win95.swipnet.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Doing some simple maths on a the simple model of a (lossless) double tuned vertical I got this result : 1. Starting from a (lossless) single tuned vertical you get +------+ | | +-+ ----- where L = loading coil L | | ----- C C = antenna capacitance | | | R = radiation resistance +-+ +-+ R Z = antenna impedance | | | -----+ +-+ Z = | ------------+ If the reactance L (XL) cancels the reactance of C (XC) the antenna impeadnce Z equals the radiation resistance R so wL = 1/(wC) (where w = 2 x Pi x frequency) 2. 'Upgrade' the antenna to a double tuned vertical : +------+--------+ | | | +-+ ----- +-+ L' | | ----- C | | L' | | | | | +-+ +-+ R +-+ | | | | -----+ +-+ | Z = | | ------------+--------+ Instead of 1 inductor L we now have 2 inductors L' of the double value (2L) Since the values of C and R are unchanged is wL' = 2/(wC) Further XC = 1/(jwC) = -j/(wC) (where j = square root of -1) and XL' = jwL' = j2/(wC) = -2XC Calculating Z gives Z = XL + (XL x (XC + R)) / (XL + XC + R) -> extract XL Z = XL x (1 + (XC + R) / (XL + XC + R)) -> replace XL by -2XC Z = -2XC x (1 + (XC + R) / (-2XC + XC +R)) -> -2XC + XC = -XC Z = -2XC x (1 + (XC + R) / (R - XC)) -> equalize to (R-XC) Z = -2XC x (R - XC + XC + R) / (R - XC) -> R - XC + XC + R = 2R Z = -2XC x (2R) / (R - XC) for practical antennas will XC be in the range of 500 to 5000 Ohm while R will be well below 1 Ohm so we can say that R - XC = -XC Z = -2XC x (2R) / (-XC) -> -2XC / -XC = 2 Z = 4R So the antenna impedance of a resonant double tuned vertical will be 4 times the impedance of a single tuned vertical. But what to do with the 'loss resistance' (RL) in the real world ? Assume a simple model where both tuned sections share the same ground-system. In that case RL would be in series with R and this would mean that a double tuned vertical would not only quadruple the radiation resistance but also the loss resistance, resulting in an unchanged ratio between radiation resistance and loss resistance. >From the above I expect that a multiple-tuned vertical will only outperform a simple vertical if each tuned section has at least its own independent groundsystem. This would also mean that you need a certain distance between the tuned sections in order to get these independent grounds. Comments welcome ... 73, Rik So Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23644 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 04:48:52 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 04:48:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 32342 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 04:46:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 04:46:44 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ka7x-0001qH-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 05:30:05 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from imo15.mx.aol.com ([198.81.17.5]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Ka7w-0001po-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 05:30:04 +0100 Received: from WarmSpgs@aol.com by imo15.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v22.4.) id lTOWa07446 (4330) for ; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 00:29:22 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: WarmSpgs@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 00:29:21 EDT Subject: Re: LF: Re: Multiple Tuned Vertical To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 70 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: << When all 6 masts are parallelled at the top via the top-capacitance wires . . . >> ...how can it be said that "the ground system under each mast provides a ground connection for that mast only," I wonder. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7333 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 06:03:23 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 06:03:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 7901 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 06:01:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 06:01:15 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KbSW-0002SH-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 06:55:24 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KbSV-0002SC-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 06:55:23 +0100 Received: from [203.96.101.208] by mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <19990828055921.OOIU3442178.mta1-rme@[203.96.101.208]> for ; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 17:59:21 +1200 Message-ID: <37C777F5.3441@xtra.co.nz> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 17:47:34 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Multiple Tuned Vertical : simple calculations References: <3.0.1.16.19990827143645.268f4bda@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Rik Strobbe wrote: > But what to do with the 'loss resistance' (RL) in the real world ? > Assume a simple model where both tuned sections share the same > ground-system. In that case RL would be in series with R and this would > mean that a double tuned vertical would not only quadruple the radiation > resistance but also the loss resistance, resulting in an unchanged ratio > between radiation resistance and loss resistance. Which is basically what I meant in my previous comments about "transformer action" from the division of current between multiple tuned vertical feeds. It is similar to a folded dipole transformation. Overall, multiple tuned verticals are still a similar antenna structure from the point of view of "looking back at it from some distance away". Multiple tuned vertical parts are an "impedance transformation trick" but do very little, if anything, for the net radiation resistance of the whole antenna. Where some advantages are likely is in the multiple grounds. Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6281 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 10:53:50 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 10:53:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 10427 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 10:51:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 10:51:42 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Kfyv-0004Rl-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 11:45:09 +0100 Received: from [143.179.236.31] (helo=Iguanodon.big-orange.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11Kfyu-0004Rg-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 11:45:08 +0100 Received: from w8k3f0 ([143.179.151.15]) by Iguanodon.big-orange.net (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with SMTP id AAB6CF9 for ; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 12:45:00 +0200 Message-ID: <00eb01bef143$4e1a4580$0f97b38f@w8k3f0> From: "Dick Rollema" To: "LF-Group" Subject: Fw: LF: New LF broadcast transmitter at Kootwijk? Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 12:41:11 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: To All, In addition to what Michael Sanders has written I can inform you that KPN (formerly PTT) is already taking away the transmitters at Kootwijk, now that the station has been closed as per 31 December 1998. Some of the modern SW ones made by Marconi go to a station of the Dutch Royal Navy. But the remaining ones, some dating back to the late forties, are broken down. The station manager of Kootwijk Radio, Mr. Martin Nieuwenhuizen, has over the years collected a series of old transmitters that have been used in the past by PTT and our broadcasting companies. Even a pre-war one used by the Dutch World Broadcasting Service of which the first stages were made around 1931! There was ample space for the collection in the main building at Kootwijk, originally built to house a Telefunken AC alternator type of VLF transmitter. But all this has to disappear as KPN wants to get rid of the building. And another place for a voluminous collection like Mr. Nieuwenhuizen's one has not been found. A real pity that this unique collection of historical value will be lost. 73, Dick, PA0SE -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: M. Sanders Aan: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Datum: woensdag 25 augustus 1999 22:33 Onderwerp: RE: LF: New LF broadcast transmitter at Kootwijk? >Hi All, > >Public awareness to the effects of extreme high power transmitters have >resulted into a public discussion if Kootwijk is a propper site for a Giga >powered LW transmitter. Legal procedures are pending to stop the project. A >second site off-shore is developed at the moment. The location should be a >few miles West of the Zeeland isles (South-East Netherlands). The plan >includes antenna masts well over a hundred meters in height to be >constructed on top of artificial sand isles in the North-Sea. There have >also been asked questions in the Dutch parlament about governement approval >given to this enterprise. > >best 73, > >Michael Sanders, PA3BSH. > >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >> Van: majordom@post.thorcom.com [mailto:majordom@post.thorcom.com]namens >> Hans-Joachim Brandt >> Verzonden: woensdag 25 augustus 1999 19:56 >> Aan: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org >> Onderwerp: Re: LF: New LF broadcast transmitter at Kootwijk? >> >> >> Hi all, >> >> I do not know what kind of LF equipment is still existing at >> Kootwijk but the >> following news may be of interest to all LF fans: >> >> Dick Rollema schrieb: >> Today even less than before as the only thing that is of >> > interest to KPN is making money. And to preserve a station >> like Kootwijk or >> > SAQ only costs money. >> >> On an recent trip to the Netherlands (nr Groningen) I have read in a PTT >> brochure that plans are underway for a new longwave transmitter >> at Kootwijk, but >> EMC problems were also foreseen for this area. Further >> investigations revealed >> the idea to operate a broadcast longwave transmitter at Kootwijk >> and have the >> programme compiled by a company in the U.K., aiming at listeners >> in the U.K. >> >> HW? >> >> 73 Ha-Jo, DJ1ZB >> >> >> > > > From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13767 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 11:27:12 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 11:27:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 14956 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 11:25:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 11:25:05 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KgVJ-0004g1-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 12:18:37 +0100 X-Priority: 3 Received: from mail.netlife.fi ([195.74.0.39] helo=laatikko.saunalahti.fi) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KgVH-0004fw-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 12:18:36 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from meisaku (MKLIII.hdyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.165.153]) by laatikko.saunalahti.fi (8.9.1/8.9.0) with SMTP id OAA18556 for ; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 14:18:37 +0300 (EET DST) Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.19990828141830.00823c80@mail.dlc.fi> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: vaiski@mail.dlc.fi X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 14:18:30 +0300 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?V=E4in=F6_Lehtoranta?= Subject: Re: LF: Multiple Tuned Vertical In-reply-to: <37C777F5.3441@xtra.co.nz> References: <3.0.1.16.19990827143645.268f4bda@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: The German Navy VLF antenna at Rhauderfehn (Ramsloh) 23.4 kHz is multiple tuned. It comprises eight 325.5 metre umbrella top loaded antennas. Each antenna is separately fed, and the 8 elements of the antenna array are coupled through radiation. Rr= 1.9 ohm; Rg= 0.15 ohm; Ras= 2.25 ohm; eta= 87%. 73 from Vaino, OH2LX At 17:47 28.8.1999 +1200, >Rik Strobbe wrote: >> But what to do with the 'loss resistance' (RL) in the real world ? >> Assume a simple model where both tuned sections share the same >> ground-system. In that case RL would be in series with R and this would >> mean that a double tuned vertical would not only quadruple the radiation >> resistance but also the loss resistance, resulting in an unchanged ratio >> between radiation resistance and loss resistance. > >Bob ZL2CA wrote:> >Which is basically what I meant in my previous comments about >"transformer action" from the division of current between multiple tuned >vertical feeds. It is similar to a folded dipole transformation. >Overall, multiple tuned verticals are still a similar antenna structure >from the point of view of "looking back at it from some distance away". >Multiple tuned vertical parts are an "impedance transformation trick" >but do very little, if anything, for the net radiation resistance of the >whole antenna. Where some advantages are likely is in the multiple >grounds. > ---------------------------------------------------------- V.K.Lehtoranta, OH2LX, POBox 50, FIN-05401 Jokela, Finland ------ Tel: +358-9-4173965 ---- Fax: +358-9-4173961 ------ E-mail: vaiski@dlc.fi - alias: oh2lx@dlc.fi & oh2lx@sral.fi From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15602 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 13:46:38 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 13:46:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 1336 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 13:44:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 13:44:31 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KiUm-0005b6-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 14:26:12 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mta02-acc.tin.it ([212.216.176.33] helo=fep02-svc.tin.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KiUl-0005b1-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 14:26:11 +0100 Received: from tin.it ([212.171.25.217]) by fep02-svc.tin.it (InterMail v4.01.01.02 201-229-111-106) with ESMTP id <19990828132602.KHBZ16170.fep02-svc@tin.it> for ; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 15:26:02 +0200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37C7DA02.77202DD0@tin.it> Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 14:45:55 +0200 From: "Renato Romero" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.06 [it] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Eclipse Monitoring Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >>From IK1QFK Renato Romero, Italy. Details on recording dates about Eclipse effects on radio waves below 22 kHz are reported on my web page: http://space.tin.it/scienza/rromero/ The site has been written in english (at least in my intentions and with big difficulty) to reach the greatest number of interested people. Comments and critique are appreciated. Many thanks. Bye, Renato. From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23492 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 20:08:16 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 20:08:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 14230 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 20:06:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 20:06:11 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KodR-0008Nd-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 20:59:33 +0100 Received: from nms.rz.uni-kiel.de ([134.245.1.2]) by post.thorcom.com with smtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KodQ-0008NY-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 20:59:32 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de by nms.rz.uni-kiel.de with Local-SMTP (PP); Sat, 28 Aug 1999 21:58:39 +0200 Received: from nephro.uni-kiel.de (PC10840.dial.uni-kiel.de [134.245.108.40]) by srv1.mail.uni-kiel.de (8.9.1b+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id VAA13729; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 21:58:58 +0200 (MET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <37C83F63.2640466F@nephro.uni-kiel.de> Date: Sat, 28 Aug 1999 21:58:27 +0200 From: "Peter W. Schnoor" Organization: University of Kiel, Clinic of Nephrology X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.33 i586) To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: lowfer@qth.net Subject: LF: One Week of HBG75 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello, Placed a graphic of my recordings of HBG75 (Aug. 07-15th) on my website. Look at: http://www.qsl.net/df3lp/projects.html (The solar flare event at Aug. 14th included) If anybody wants the data in ASCII (*.con) or printable PostScript (*.ps) format: ftp://ftp.qsl.net/pub/df3lp/eclipse/ Please update your links... 54°16'N / 10°04'E, JO54ag 73 es gl de Peter, DF3LP From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 3220 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 23:02:17 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 23:02:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 11110 invoked from network); 28 Aug 1999 23:00:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 28 Aug 1999 23:00:12 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KrAG-0000z5-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 23:41:36 +0100 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au ([203.26.10.9]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KrAD-0000z0-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 28 Aug 1999 23:41:34 +0100 Received: from steve (d143.syd2.zeta.org.au [203.26.9.15]) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA23048 for ; Sun, 29 Aug 1999 08:40:15 +1000 Message-ID: <199908282240.IAA23048@godzilla.zeta.org.au> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Steve Olney" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: Re: Eclipse Monitoring Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 08:41:17 +1000 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: G'day Renato, Excellent site!! I found it very interesting and food for thought. Thanks!! 73s Steve Olney (VK2ZTO/AXSO - QF56IK : Lat -33 34 07, Long +150 44 40) ============================================= LowFer URL: http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg/lowfer.htm AXSO LF Experimental Station URL: http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg/axsoextx.htm LF Receiving - FRG-100 LF Transmitting - 177.5kHz 8W to 7.6m top-loaded vertical Modes - AM, SSB, PSK31, SSTV, Hellschreiber and QRSS ============================================= From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13056 invoked from network); 29 Aug 1999 06:25:37 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 29 Aug 1999 06:25:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 13757 invoked from network); 29 Aug 1999 06:23:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Aug 1999 06:23:34 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KyFZ-0004GQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 29 Aug 1999 07:15:33 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ah-img-4.compuserve.com ([149.174.217.158] helo=hpamgaad.compuserve.com ident=mailgate) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11KyFX-0004GL-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 29 Aug 1999 07:15:32 +0100 Received: (from mailgate@localhost) by hpamgaad.compuserve.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/HP-1.8) id CAA04556 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 29 Aug 1999 02:15:29 -0400 (EDT) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 02:15:20 -0400 From: "Dave Sergeant" Subject: LF: Loops - current measurements To: "rsgb_lf_group" Message-ID: <199908290215_MC2-82C5-1427@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: >From Dave G3YMC This is a follow up on the mails earlier this month on this subject. Today, assisted by Steve GW4ALG, we measured the rf current in my transmit loop in a similar fashion to Steve's measurements on his loop. For details of my loop see my web site: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/sergeantd/136.htm I have previously done extensive simulation of my loop and its matching network using a circuit analysis package and from the required values of capacitors in the network to achieve correct match concluded that the effective resistance of my loop at 136 is around 0.6ohms. Measurements are as follows: DC resistance 0.1ohms Wire: twin 79/0.2mm loudspeaker cable, the two pairs joined in parallel Measured input power 5.2W Loop Current 2.64A DC resistance of RF meter 0.09 ohm hence Loop resistance 0.66 ohm (R=P/(I*I) This result fits exactly with my previous simulations! Note that at my normal transmit power of 35W the loop current is 8 A and if I were to put 400W into it I would get 26 A - perhaps the caps would start objecting! At first I thought much of this loss was due to the series loss resistance of the matching capacitors (Philips 376) but further calculations from the datasheets shows this not to be the case, as this is only around 50 milliohms. What I need is an accurate formula for calculating the skin effect resistance of the wire. The 98 ARRL handbook has a 'rough guide' formula which would increase the resistance by a factor of around 3.5, which is not enough, unless there is another effect I have overlooked. As an aside, for those of you who remember the Cross Field Antenna discussion on here a few months back, GM3HAT now has a paper describing the CFA antennas in Egypt (http://www.antennex.com/preview/cfa/nab99cfa.htm) which makes interesting, if amusing reading. It sounds convincing until you start asking yourself how the beasty really works and what it doesn't say... Enough said. Cheers Dave G3YMC sergeantd@compuserve.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28209 invoked from network); 29 Aug 1999 21:07:20 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 29 Aug 1999 21:07:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 7079 invoked from network); 29 Aug 1999 21:05:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Aug 1999 21:05:20 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11LBtg-0001mZ-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 29 Aug 1999 21:49:52 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mta02-acc.tin.it ([212.216.176.33] helo=fep02-svc.tin.it) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11LBtf-0001mU-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 29 Aug 1999 21:49:51 +0100 Received: from tin.it ([212.171.25.213]) by fep02-svc.tin.it (InterMail v4.01.01.02 201-229-111-106) with ESMTP id <19990829204947.OWRA16170.fep02-svc@tin.it> for ; Sun, 29 Aug 1999 22:49:47 +0200 Message-ID: <37C93BDB.54F38C50@tin.it> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 15:55:40 +0200 From: "Renato Romero" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.06 [it] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Re: Eclipse Monitoring References: <199908282240.IAA23048@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Thanks Steve, for the comments and for your expression "food for thought", thanks! Very interesting also your site. I have transmit on 137 kHz band for many months; now I am in QRX but I should like to try to send in FELD mode. May be in the future ... . 73, Renato. Steve Olney ha scritto: > G'day Renato, > > Excellent site!! I found it very interesting and food for thought. > > Thanks!! > > 73s Steve Olney (VK2ZTO/AXSO - QF56IK : Lat -33 34 07, Long +150 44 40) > ============================================= > LowFer URL: > http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg/lowfer.htm > AXSO LF Experimental Station URL: > http://www.zeta.org.au/~ollaneg/axsoextx.htm > LF Receiving - FRG-100 > LF Transmitting - 177.5kHz 8W to 7.6m top-loaded vertical > Modes - AM, SSB, PSK31, SSTV, Hellschreiber and QRSS > ============================================= From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5203 invoked from network); 29 Aug 1999 21:32:39 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 29 Aug 1999 21:32:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 13538 invoked from network); 29 Aug 1999 21:30:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 29 Aug 1999 21:30:39 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11LCN2-00020x-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Sun, 29 Aug 1999 22:20:12 +0100 Received: from tantalum.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.80]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11LCN1-00020s-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 29 Aug 1999 22:20:11 +0100 Received: from [212.140.7.135] (helo=default) by tantalum.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 2.05 #1) id 11LCMv-0000V6-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 29 Aug 1999 22:20:06 +0100 Message-ID: <001901bef263$d90f5f60$87078cd4@default> From: "Alan Melia" To: "rsgb_lf_group" Subject: LF: DX Cluster posting for 28th/29th August at GB7DXM Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 19:22:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hi All, I listened on QRSS for Valerio IK5ZPV on the 25th and 27th but nothing heard here. What was more surprising was I did not hear anyone calling him. The 25th and 26th were very noisy with T&L here but Friday morning was very quiet. Saturday at 0520Z DF3LP copied 'O' on QRS, later at 0600Z and 0704Z copied DJ5BV on QRSS 'O'. No qsos seen on QRS this weekend, all CQs! G3AQC was heard at 0842 136.4 kHz, and G4GVC wkg G0UPU at 0907Z, I could not copy UPU here but the signal was just visible on the FFTDSP4 screen. Sunday hrd ON4ZK on QRS at 0625Z, and DJ5BV at 0645Z and 0830Z also QRS, and no normal logging until about 0900Z when the band seemed to have gone quiet. Noise levels were low here on both days until quite late into the evenings. Cluster spots are listed below. I have had the depth of the archive increased to allow me to get more than 2 days back spots. This seems to have been made worse by the duplicate spots bounced back by, we think, an Internet connected node, who is also making himself very unpopular by circulating rubbish from Japan. 137.2 PA0SE 29-Aug-1999 0902Z now with g4gvc 137.0 G4GVC 29-Aug-1999 0853Z 137.7 ON4ZK 29-Aug-1999 0619Z cq slow-cw (549) 137.0 G3XTZ 28-Aug-1999 0742Z 137.7 G4GVC 28-Aug-1999 0735Z 137.0 PA0MLC 24-Aug-1999 1930Z cq 136.4 PA0CC 24-Aug-1999 1504Z hi I finally got it ! 137.4 PA0CC 24-Aug-1999 1502Z (559) cq 136.7 G3YXM 23-Aug-1999 1757Z (539) clng g0vxg G3NYK de GB7DXM 29-Aug 1740Z > 1800.0 DL3FDO 29-Aug-1999 0737Z 449 on 136.7 1800.0 FISH 28-Aug-1999 0908Z fcc licenced ??????? 1800.0 G4GVC 28-Aug-1999 0912Z cq 136.75khz 1800.0 DJ5BV 28-Aug-1999 0909Z QRS cq 137.7 O 1800.0 DJ5BV 23-Aug-1999 1750Z 136.9 cq G3NYK de GB7DXM 29-Aug 1741Z > The FISH entry was a VE and a W1 spotting fishing bouys on Top Band! 73 de Alan G3NYK Alan.Melia@btinternet.com From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 10247 invoked from network); 30 Aug 1999 09:56:15 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 30 Aug 1999 09:56:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 8495 invoked from network); 30 Aug 1999 09:54:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Aug 1999 09:54:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11LNwm-0007N3-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 30 Aug 1999 10:41:52 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz ([203.96.92.1]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11LNwj-0007My-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 30 Aug 1999 10:41:51 +0100 Received: from [203.96.101.214] by mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP id <19990830094534.HRXS3442178.mta1-rme@[203.96.101.214]> for ; Mon, 30 Aug 1999 21:45:34 +1200 Message-ID: <37CA502E.16C@xtra.co.nz> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 21:34:38 +1200 From: "vernall" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Loops - current measurements References: <199908290215_MC2-82C5-1427@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Dave Sergeant wrote: > At first I thought much of this loss was due to the series loss resistance > of the matching capacitors (Philips 376) but further calculations from the > datasheets shows this not to be the case, as this is only around 50 > milliohms. What I need is an accurate formula for calculating the skin > effect resistance of the wire. The 98 ARRL handbook has a 'rough guide' > formula which would increase the resistance by a factor of around 3.5, > which is not enough, unless there is another effect I have overlooked. I understand from measurements made by Andrew ZL2BBJ, who uses a transmitting loop, that the effective resistance of the wire is increased not only by skin effect, but also by induction losses into lossy ground. The "eddy currents" in the ground reflect a small resistance into the loop impedance. Even a "big diameter tube" for a loop antenna can not avoid the induced ground losses (at practical heights above ground). Bob ZL2CA From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 20503 invoked from network); 30 Aug 1999 12:24:15 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 30 Aug 1999 12:24:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 32478 invoked from network); 30 Aug 1999 12:22:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Aug 1999 12:22:19 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11LQLv-0008RV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 30 Aug 1999 13:15:59 +0100 Received: from mb07.swip.net ([193.12.122.211]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11LQLs-0008RQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 30 Aug 1999 13:15:56 +0100 Received: from s-257519 (dialup243-4-21.swipnet.se [130.244.243.213]) by mb07.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA01802 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 1999 14:15:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <003801bef2e1$78efd6e0$d5f3f482@s-257519> From: "Johan Bodin" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: SV: LF: Loops - current measurements Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 14:15:37 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: Hello Regarding ground induction losses mentioned by Bob ZL2CA: The loop design programs RJELOOP1 and RJELOOP2, written by Reg / G4FGQ, both include induced ground loss when they compute the total loss resistance. These programs, as well as a lot of other useful programs, are available as freeware at Reg's web site: http://www.btinternet.com/~g4fgq.regp/ 73 de Johan, SM6LKM From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24577 invoked from network); 30 Aug 1999 12:40:30 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 30 Aug 1999 12:40:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 2107 invoked from network); 30 Aug 1999 12:38:34 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Aug 1999 12:38:34 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11LQbk-00003g-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 30 Aug 1999 13:32:20 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11LQbj-00003a-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 30 Aug 1999 13:32:19 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id OAA13817 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 1999 14:38:32 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990830143303.221fabaa@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 14:33:03 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: Re: LF: Eclipse Monitoring In-reply-to: <37C7DA02.77202DD0@tin.it> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I just received a preliminary report from the eclipse-experiment of UBA (Belgian amateur radio society) and KMI (Belgian meteorological institute). They received a lot of reports for the 160, 80 and 40m band but only very few for LF/VLF. Therefore I would like to ask everybody who did measurements during the eclipse and wants to help UBA and KMI with the eclipse-experiment to contact the co-ordinator of the experiment, John Devoldere (ON4UN) via e-mail : john.devoldere@village.uunet.be 73, Rik ON7YD Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX) From rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sun Jan 01 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5403 invoked from network); 30 Aug 1999 13:14:11 -0000 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by murphys.force9.net with SMTP; 30 Aug 1999 13:14:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 8326 invoked from network); 30 Aug 1999 13:12:15 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 30 Aug 1999 13:12:15 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11LQqM-00008n-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 30 Aug 1999 13:47:26 +0100 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be ([134.58.8.44]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11LQqL-00008i-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 30 Aug 1999 13:47:25 +0100 Received: from LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be (LCBD15.fys.kuleuven.ac.be [134.58.80.15]) by mailserv.cc.kuleuven.ac.be (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id OAA10442 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 1999 14:53:41 +0200 Message-ID: <3.0.1.16.19990830144810.08efd61c@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Sender: pb623250@mail.cc.kuleuven.ac.be X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 14:48:10 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Rik Strobbe" Subject: LF: Multiple Tuned Vertical : some more maths In-reply-to: <002301bef040$442b1580$aff4f482@win95.swipnet.se> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: I did some calculations on a more 'real-world' model of a MTV antenna, assuming that the second tuned section has its own radial system (loss resistance = R2) +------+---------+ | | | +-+ ----- +-+ L' | | ----- C | | L' | | | | | +-+ +-+ +-+ | | | R1 | | +-+ +-+ | | | | R2 -----+ | +-+ Z = | | ------------+---------+ If we further assume that : - both inductors are equal and have the double reactance as C - the reactances of C and L are large compared to R1 and R2 The the result of the calculations is Z = 4 x R1 + R2 That means that only the 'R1' component is quadrupled, the 'loss resistance' R2 of the second tuned section is just added ! I don't want to bore the whole LF-group with the maths, but I'm willing to mail it direct to those interested (it's only about 5 lines of basic math). 73, Rik ON7YD Rik Strobbe ON7YD rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.ac.be Villadreef 14 B-3128 Baal BELGIUM (JO20IX)