Return-Path: Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by klubnl.pl (8.14.4/8.14.4/Debian-8+deb8u2) with ESMTP id w88B2BOT031216 for ; Sat, 8 Sep 2018 13:02:12 +0200 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1fyauJ-0005Vf-Ch for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Sat, 08 Sep 2018 11:56:03 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1fyars-0005UR-Lf for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 08 Sep 2018 11:53:32 +0100 Received: from smtp-out-3.talktalk.net ([62.24.135.67]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.91_59-0488984) (envelope-from ) id 1fyarl-0003OP-J4 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 08 Sep 2018 11:53:27 +0100 Received: from mal ([79.69.133.251]) by smtp.talktalk.net with SMTP id yarjfzPZ2bZX5yarjfGjnE; Sat, 08 Sep 2018 11:53:24 +0100 X-DKIM-Result: Domain=talktalk.net Result=Signature OK DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=talktalk.net; s=cmr1711; t=1536404004; bh=r5dbm97/udDZ3gYueiVBpFzQ3h784CbQYZkD4DHp8vw=; h=From:To:References:In-Reply-To:Subject:Date; b=gmXcxQB29XxOcJggzrczU6nhSScLqxYVd3S4H4Jy03pjYuoPj+eV3uYmpCuuauN2o WMQ4ETy4oNp0dCAHNVawM935FhfKaKPkKnmwCe0BBDtzh8PS17xttAzyhN54oFsSI+ ieblLqoPqkOLIFsrvOj1PDK2arA4tr9KvGQ9sq/A= X-Originating-IP: [79.69.133.251] X-Spam: 0 X-OAuthority: v=2.3 cv=Poq9kTE3 c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=qnylMyfBFOqhtNdCjFDDBw==:117 a=qnylMyfBFOqhtNdCjFDDBw==:17 a=r77TgQKjGQsHNAKrUKIA:9 a=C_IRinGWAAAA:8 a=F3M5lZpKAAAA:8 a=o1OHuDzbAAAA:8 a=3VjfWj81xXUyyFz4u-UA:9 a=I30-w7BIKt2pqk-A:21 a=Md4LoN2DK-ECafri:21 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=wJEB6GBnoWQA:10 a=1ClY0wHZAAAA:8 a=cEF7jSvsVGx6Qkp3:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=frz4AuCg-hUA:10 a=slCku8JSH3TyizEDQ3pD:22 a=5YQ6H4ZxyGn-KoBYtt8s:22 a=Dwc7NTFYBNswNknFQOzV:22 Message-ID: <0BF8B4E3CE9F4A55BF885AA362E8AE5E@mal> From: To: References: <165b516335a-1ebf-5174@webjas-vad091.srv.aolmail.net> <1UQaCcOJTL.4J2b3qBPXRi@optiplex980-pc> In-Reply-To: <1UQaCcOJTL.4J2b3qBPXRi@optiplex980-pc> Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2018 11:53:24 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 16.4.3528.331 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V16.4.3528.331 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfP0FLEWjpiHbxgIvgbMAM1JssALWuGkEo2oi5dRljqErtu+gcmhmlaXMuVEvUc0A0jYe7f3qCH96tL69MqLuSJBV94yisU3gYsYMA5F5ZVGFpTcA9KIR bAjhcugkgi3kh31aYpayoXB4FBio7m2UNFZGwsYnWlvpRDAWh53XOoxc X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Use LOBSTER POT SPINNERS as insulators, they are figure of 8 construction made of polystyrene and handle very high voltages. Available at boat yards or ships chandlers 73 de mal/g3kev From: jrusgrove@comcast.net Sent: Saturday, September 8, 2018 11:29 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: Porcelain insulators on rope guys for a vertical antenna [...] Content analysis details: (0.0 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, no trust [62.24.135.67 listed in list.dnswl.org] -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record -0.0 T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message 0.0 T_DKIM_INVALID DKIM-Signature header exists but is not valid X-Scan-Signature: aaa907f1cfed2776dbc1341844857d57 Subject: LF: Re: Porcelain insulators on rope guys for a vertical antenna Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01D4476A.8C386A80" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0 tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGE, MISSING_OUTLOOK_NAME,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01D4476A.8C386A80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Use LOBSTER POT SPINNERS as insulators, they are figure of 8 = construction made of polystyrene and handle very high voltages. Available at boat yards or ships chandlers=20 73 de mal/g3kev From: jrusgrove@comcast.net=20 Sent: Saturday, September 8, 2018 11:29 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Subject: Re: LF: Porcelain insulators on rope guys for a vertical = antenna Stan If you're planning on using this mast as the radiating element on MF and = especially LF with any appreciable power, egg insulators will be = problematic. The relatively small physical separation with normal = moisture and 'contaminents' will carbon track. I've had good luck using = black delrin rod ~ 6 - 10 inches in length with holes drilled in each = end. Countersink the holes to remove the sharp edges. =20 Jay W1VD WD2XNS WE2XGR/2 ----- Original Message ----- From: Stan, W1LE Reply-To: To: Sent: 9/7/2018 3:45:48 PM Subject: Re: LF: Porcelain insulators on rope guys for a vertical = antenna -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- Hello Mike, Thanks for your comments. I have plenty of the egg insulators in stock. I will be sure to have 1 = in each guy . Once I get the final version of the vertical up in the = air, I hope to keep it there for a couple of decades. And I will plan to instrument the final install for impedance changes = with the weather, and hi-pot. All of the original 3/16" twisted nylon guys in the set, will be = replaced with the double braid. Here on Cape Cod we have the typical New England weather, plenty of = rain, snow, ice, and wind. Stan, W1LE On 9/7/2018 1:30 PM, wa3tts@verizon.net wrote: Stan: For what it is worth, I found a piece of 3/16" nylon covered = polyester line removed from my HF vertical after 15 years of outdoor = exposure. The line was dry and some dried mold present on the nylon = jacket. My electronic megger indicated over 20 Giga-ohms at 2500VDC test = voltage, even at 1 inch separation along the line. Then I wetted the = line with tap water. Resistance fell to 1/2 megaohm at 500VDC test = voltage over a 6 inch span of the line. Perhaps if you live in the Arizona desert with low humidity most of = the year, it may not matter much. Would you rather radiate energy, or = use it to dry out your guy lines? For the few extra $, I would stick = with the guy line insulators. 73, Mike wa3tts -----Original Message----- From: Stan, W1LE mailto:stanw1le@verizon.net To: rsgb_lf_group mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sent: Fri, Sep 7, 2018 12:40 pm Subject: LF: Porcelain insulators on rope guys for a vertical = antenna Hello The Net: For my vertical antenna guyed in three direction at 4 levels, I am=20 planning to use 3/16", polyester, braided, of double braid = construction.=20 Original guys were of the military surplus type, part of a GRA-4 = antenna=20 system and part number MX-383A/GRA-4, that uses, 1 each, insulator = in line. For replacement guys, can I remove the insulator and only use the=20 braided line ? With wet guys (after rainstorm) I measure the (~ DC) resistance from = the=20 vertical to ground as greater than 6 megohms, my meters capability. What are your thoughts ? I can add the insulators, but I would also need to add crimped=20 connectors or other rope clamps, that would reduce the ultimate=20 reliability of the guy. The vertical is constructed of MS-44 aluminum masting sections = stacked=20 up to 50', (maybe 55 or 60'+ later). Final plan is to add a = capacitive=20 top hat with 8 each, 20' radials and a center loading coil for use = on=20 2200M and 630M. Probably a additional switchable base loading coil = for=20 2200M tuning (TBD). Stan, W1LE Cape Cod FN41sr ZZZZz ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01D4476A.8C386A80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Use LOBSTER POT SPINNERS as = insulators, they are=20 figure of 8 construction made of polystyrene and handle very high=20 voltages.
Available at boat yards or ships = chandlers=20
73 de mal/g3kev
 
 
From: jrusgrove@comcast.net
Sent: Saturday, September 8, 2018 11:29 AM
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org =
Subject: Re: LF: Porcelain insulators on rope guys for a = vertical=20 antenna
 
Stan
 
If you're planning on using this mast as the radiating element on = MF and=20 especially LF with any appreciable power, egg insulators will be = problematic.=20 The relatively small physical separation with normal moisture and = 'contaminents'=20 will carbon track. I've had good luck using black delrin rod ~ 6 - 10 = inches in=20 length with holes drilled in each end. Countersink the holes to remove = the sharp=20 edges.  
 
Jay W1VD  WD2XNS  WE2XGR/2
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Stan, W1LE <stanw1le@verizon.net>
Sent: 9/7/2018 3:45:48 PM
Subject: Re: LF: Porcelain insulators on rope guys for a = vertical=20 antenna

Hello Mike,

Thanks for your comments.

I have plenty of the egg insulators in stock. I will be sure to = have 1 in=20 each guy . Once I get the final version of the vertical up in the air, = I hope=20 to keep it there for a couple of decades.

And I will plan to instrument the final install for impedance = changes with=20 the weather, and hi-pot.

All of the original 3/16" twisted nylon guys in the set, will be = replaced=20 with the double braid.

Here on Cape Cod we have the typical New England weather, plenty of = rain,=20 snow, ice, and wind.

Stan, W1LE

 


On 9/7/2018 1:30 PM, wa3tts@verizon.net = wrote:
Stan:=20 For what it is worth, I found a piece of 3/16" nylon covered = polyester line=20 removed from my HF vertical after 15 years of outdoor exposure. The = line was=20 dry and some dried mold present on the nylon jacket.
  My=20 electronic  megger indicated over 20 Giga-ohms at 2500VDC test = voltage,=20 even at 1 inch separation along the line. Then I wetted the line = with tap=20 water. Resistance fell to 1/2 megaohm at 500VDC test voltage over a = 6 inch=20 span of the line.   Perhaps=20 if you live in the Arizona desert with low humidity most of the = year, it may=20 not matter much. Would you rather radiate energy, or use it to dry = out your=20 guy lines?  For the few extra $, I would stick with the guy = line=20 insulators.   73,=20 Mike wa3tts


-----Original Message-----
From: Stan, = W1LE mailto:stanw1le@verizon.net
To: = rsgb_lf_group mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
= Sent:=20 Fri, Sep 7, 2018 12:40 pm
Subject: LF: Porcelain insulators on = rope guys=20 for a vertical antenna

Hello The Net:

For my = vertical=20 antenna guyed in three direction at 4 levels, I am
planning to = use=20 3/16", polyester, braided, of double braid construction. =
Original guys=20 were of the military surplus type, part of a GRA-4 antenna =
system and=20 part number MX-383A/GRA-4, that uses, 1 each, insulator in = line.

For=20 replacement guys, can I remove the insulator and only use the =
braided=20 line ?

With wet guys (after rainstorm) I measure the (~ DC)=20 resistance from the
vertical to ground as greater than 6 = megohms, my=20 meters capability.

What are your thoughts ?

I can add = the=20 insulators, but I would also need to add crimped
connectors or = other=20 rope clamps, that would reduce the ultimate
reliability of the=20 guy.

The vertical is constructed of MS-44 aluminum masting = sections=20 stacked
up to 50', (maybe 55 or 60'+ later). Final plan is to = add a=20 capacitive
top hat with 8 each, 20' radials and a center loading = coil=20 for use on
2200M and 630M. Probably a additional switchable base = loading=20 coil for
2200M tuning (TBD).

Stan, W1LE    = Cape=20 Cod  =20 = FN41sr





ZZZZz







------=_NextPart_000_000D_01D4476A.8C386A80--