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Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <1523457751831.88599@kuleuven.be> Content-Language: en-US X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:yfrFhp4f4jNQj6dtykxM2DkTcfJ5TB3BRC3F08bqUlDqJ+RowFW No+54o2ucLBwPAxLdgmdYq4HdEdUHKG2BXgpc4bA4Hx2d4rcqhWpdp6Q7dA+GCtDU3maJr9 hoAmEL1SFxQtFMIVxto+rWJZ9DcCNwYSo+sy0bdU7YCXlRPG06mFurBd69MXtlC8UWav3/3 PENfiKN2kgR1MJXQ3UFrw== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:8lFkiC2exi4=:LbPUOfi9KtY420jojpBFue Ge+vZkvD5pg40Vc/MwMTijNg+MCv1vZ1pgwWbYpaVWlK0WlUmZfiuggLIBw9UfogiWfOJOEOo 8kihCPxWP6OXPQDhrQEb/kYlWiFaaLWlnw03gYG3NL2JIToZ2i7zP1ooYpKnJtIHmpGFdHn/n t36Jz7oFD/j4pov8n9x/Utep5+nXFzVWLvcIF4178mhm5fvxs+L+kRiVDgsxXSWcbR3NmGAXW hNQ/Ogy0cJz8NLWL4mAmrp263Jdxxoc4KFDLF13eJ2Lmln5COFdjM0M0uK7vikqG7ttA7LaZQ Z++1nethoPUUyHRTac03ER4WWgCgFACaH0ljIsw2+GnqWEmFaXmA92ghCSKoeC1EiUEdpFdZk 3LWCDJ8Y/hdTJblU9HgwmJdD9yt/XYOlS0YByRJpV7FQq84X80HOGLRa9cdzK0nQR7L2EquGE P8YvzsJGJy9NCVB/sHAXSWc4Hf8VH3UhSMnlDkDyScInatMqWAKy92OgYTs2BaHo3IKcFI+RV e1UU0pIVS39gazDz0IN1d7BLidTIZRNwzbdUPUDWEWlQBw8VT8l19Mt44biOrjYXcDi5PMbt9 zWHGxz0U585awTavbmc/QYxvKCpMrLxGNRdd3CJ7yquJQ750H8UDWEtuUFGtVqAQR4teHOVDF 9+of3CnU/OAPZsTuhGh2hV7pI2uyAEN5s+62ngfp3i/toFe5PiT3BSzEkeOWx8gRq+P4oQMyx 4V+D4rkbRlHsdXYYmMztFRAU4RpWsD+VhCSGGMiqnnNMOk6der7OpYRG4Pc= X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Hi Rik, I don't recall that having been mentioned previously in this discussion. I am sure I have read that somewhere in my studies over the past year but it obviously had not taken root as it seemed all new to me when I read your message today. :-) Your explanation of how the resistor and diode work is helpful. [...] Content analysis details: (0.7 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 0.1 URIBL_SBL_A Contains URL's A record listed in the Spamhaus SBL blocklist [URIs: www.n1bug.com] 0.6 URIBL_SBL Contains an URL's NS IP listed in the Spamhaus SBL blocklist [URIs: www.n1bug.com] X-Scan-Signature: 6be9408bcc63ba5aab6f1e66e2d5b7ce Subject: Re: LF: W1VD amp help - more waveforms Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Hi Rik, I don't recall that having been mentioned previously in this discussion. I am sure I have read that somewhere in my studies over the past year but it obviously had not taken root as it seemed all new to me when I read your message today. :-) Your explanation of how the resistor and diode work is helpful. Today's experiments to update those who are following this story: I moved the driver board so the gate leads are much shorter. I used thicker wire for the gate leads. Result: absolutely no change. At Jay's suggestion I put additional 1000pf caps in a parallel with the existing 1000pf timing caps on the driver board. Result: no change that I can be certain of. If anything, the timing could be just a tiny bit *worse* than before but this might be just my eyes playing tricks. Paul On 04/11/2018 10:42 AM, Rik Strobbe wrote: > Hello Paul, > > I was on holiday last week and didn't pay much attention to what > passed in the reflector. So my appoligies if I tell things that > have been told earlier. > > The "both sides conducting" issue is typical for the power > MOSFETs as the turn off delay is much larger than the turn on > delay. Exactly for that reason most class D push-pull PA's have a > gate resistor to delay the turn on a bit and a "reverse" diode to > bypass the resistor at turn off (so the turn off is not extra > delayed). If you see the one side turning on befor the other side > is turned off it migh be worth to increase the gate resistors > (from 10 Ohm to 15, 18 or even 22 Ohm). This will increase the > turn on delay and maybe solve the issue. > > 73, Rik ON7YD - OR7T > > > ________________________________________ Van: > owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > namens N1BUG > Verzonden: woensdag 11 april 2018 16:10 Aan: > rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Onderwerp: Re: LF: W1VD amp help - > more waveforms > > Hi Rik, > > Of course that is true and I can see a difference in the gate > waveform with Vdd on and off. But it doesn't explain why under > same conditions (Vdd off) Jay and I see quite different gate > waveforms. > > I just did another test, gate waveforms with Vdd on. > > http://www.n1bug.com/gates12-wdv13.jpg > > Depending how I interpret this, I can almost believe I see both > sides conducting for a very brief instant. > > Looking at this critically, I can see that one starts to turn > off before the other starts to turn on. So there is a delay > being generated by the driver circuit. But it's not clear that > one is fully stopped conducting before the other starts. Seems as > if the decay time is not fast enough. Maybe it's the length of > those gate leads messing things up after all... > > Jay's article says the 10 ohm resistors and 1N4148 diodes slow > gate turn on and speed up gate turn off. Given that both my turn > on and turn off seem slower than Jay's, can it be my 1N4148's are > somehow not the same as his? > > Paul