Return-Path: Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by klubnl.pl (8.14.4/8.14.4/Debian-8+deb8u2) with ESMTP id w2TA4ZPY032699 for ; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 12:04:37 +0200 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1f1UIV-0006k7-HS for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 10:56:43 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1f1UIU-0006jx-0m for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 10:56:42 +0100 Received: from omr-a012e.mx.aol.com ([204.29.186.61]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1:DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1f1UIO-00031i-0m for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 10:56:40 +0100 Received: from mtaomg-aac01.mx.aol.com (mtaomg-aac01.mx.aol.com [172.27.2.35]) by omr-a012e.mx.aol.com (Outbound Mail Relay) with ESMTP id 86E513800090 for ; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 05:56:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from core-acd05f.mail.aol.com (core-acd05.mail.aol.com [172.27.22.15]) by mtaomg-aac01.mx.aol.com (OMAG/Core Interface) with ESMTP id 10DE838000081 for ; Thu, 29 Mar 2018 05:56:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from 80.146.228.86 by webjasstg-vaa20.srv.aolmail.net (10.96.25.23) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Thu, 29 Mar 2018 05:56:33 -0400 Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2018 05:56:33 -0400 From: Markus Vester To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Message-Id: <162712ffe9a-c87-9e9c@webjasstg-vaa20.srv.aolmail.net> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI X-MB-Message-Type: User X-Mailer: JAS STD X-Originating-IP: [80.146.228.86] x-aol-global-disposition: G DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mx.aol.com; s=20150623; t=1522317394; bh=RApJe2xW7KmRwTC2dAn1LvdWQhhxcISAEPIal7CybIk=; h=From:To:Subject:Message-Id:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=fKnFy00BWwUZqv5osO5H7zLzngcIrpRRBMcB/PwUunCignuH25aQbpwEeiE0UGeOv eC9kuDUw5j/nABEBWSbtUKfkrsYtIqs+VYbI+AJYBmpokEA6Lo+UG3IqAcpwCo4z5s czeeff/7zZ29SdIAi3SyYi+U6z2xugzundQrH+VM= x-aol-sid: 3039ac1b02235abcb85223cf X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Hi Rob, last night I got valid decodes for every single timeslot between 0 and 4 UT, but none before or after. The decoder always produced the correct result already during one of the initial flat-phase trials, only sometimes the rank improved with later +- 30° variations. [...] Content analysis details: (0.0 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (markusvester[at]aol.com) -0.0 T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message 0.0 T_DKIM_INVALID DKIM-Signature header exists but is not valid X-Scan-Signature: a3fb7b6a9f6d51087b0e6a8a8c0d161f Subject: Re: LF: K3RWR LF EbNaut Trial #2 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_53022_2143907433.1522317393562" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.9 required=5.0 tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGE, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false ------=_Part_53022_2143907433.1522317393562 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Rob, last night I got valid decodes for every single timeslot between 0 and 4 UT= , but none before or after. The decoder always produced the correct result = already during one of the initial flat-phase trials, only sometimes the ran= k improved with later +- 30=C2=B0 variations. 180328-29 start EbN0 rank UT dB 0000 0.4 932 0030 1.4 0 0100 4.4 0 0130 3.6 0 0200 3.0 0 0230 0.3 13 0300 3.3 0=20 0330 1.7 0 0400 4.0 0 Best 73, Markus (DF6NM) -----Urspr=C3=BCngliche Mitteilung-----=20 Von: Rob Renoud An: rsgb_lf_group Verschickt: Mi, 28. Mrz 2018 19:44 Betreff: Re: LF: K3RWR LF EbNaut Trial #2 Marcus, TU for the reports. Very nice signal levels at 0200 and 0400. Yes, 12 char, CRC 15, 2 s symbols is a viable QSO candidate. I will begin transmitting overnight a 12 character message for the next thr= ee days as follows: Coding: 8K19 CRC: 15 Symbol Period: 2 sec Length: 12 characters Duration: 28 minutes Message repeated on the Hour & Half-Hour Frequency: 137.395 KHz Start Time: 2200 UTC daily Stop Time: 1000 UTC daily Days: 28/29 Mar, 29/30 Mar, 30/31 Mar Reports and comments welcome :-) 73, Rob - K3RWR FM18qi On Mar 28, 2018, at 06:11, Markus Vester wrote: Hi Rob, three decodes again last night: UT dB 0100 1.0 0200 8.2 0400 5.4 Although the signal is sometimes quite strong, it is undecodable due to fad= ing or phase variation at other times. For a two-way QSO I would probably p= refer shorter messages (e.g. 12 char, CRC 15, 2 s symbols, 28 minutes total= ) which may come through more reliably. They will also decode more quickly,= ideally allowing an answer in the next time slot. Best 73, Markus (DF6NM) -----Urspr=C3=BCngliche Mitteilung-----=20 Von: Markus Vester An: rsgb_lf_group Verschickt: Di, 27. Mrz 2018 17:06 Betreff: Re: LF: K3RWR LF EbNaut Trial #2 Congratulations Ric and Rob! On their way to Italy, two of last night's transmissions also stopped by in= Nuremberg, 3 UT (3.0 dB) and 4 UT (2.0 dB). Best 73,=20 Markus (DF6NM) -----Urspr=C3=BCngliche Mitteilung-----=20 Von: Rob Renoud An: rsgb_lf_group Verschickt: Di, 27. Mrz 2018 14:01 Betreff: Re: LF: K3RWR LF EbNaut Trial #2 Riccardo, Wow - well done at your QTH! Transmitting at 1W EIRP here. Antenna is a 12.4m vertical wire with 140m o= f top loading. I will transmit overnight 27/28 March again with the 30 character message r= epeating every hour. Will then switch to a 20 character message with 1 sec= ond symbol period repeating every half hour. Will post the details of the = new message on this web site. Thanks & 73, Rob - K3RWR On Mar 27, 2018, at 05:00, Riccardo Zoli wrote: Hi Rob, Markus, Stefan, LF Congrats for recent LF EbNaut success! Last night, I have decoded your message here in JN64bw (Ariano). This is a = new LF EbNaut W->E QRB record: 7048 km. UTC 0200, Eb/N0 =3D 2.2 dB (see attachments). My rig is a homebrew SDR, clocked by a GPSDO. The antenna is an inverted L = 12m height, 36m long. All the best 73 de Riccardo IW4DXW 2018-03-27 1:29 GMT+02:00 Rob Renoud : Stephan, Thank you for your most insightful, and correct comments. I will continue to explore EbNaut as a communications and QSO mode on 2200m= . Your suggestion to focus on messages taking up to 25 minutes and contain= ing 15 characters fits well with using EbNaut as a QSO mode. =20 I have both Windows and Linux computers - plan on starting with Windows and= transition to Linux as I gain confidence with EbNaut RX. Tnx & 73, Rob - K3RWR On Mar 26, 2018, at 15:55, DK7FC wrote: Hi Rob, Am 26.03.2018 19:28, schrieb Rob Renoud:=20 Very nice - thanks for you detailed reception reports for the hours between= 00:00 and 06:00 and, of course, the decode at 03:00. No problem. That's the path: http://k7fry.com/grid/?qth=3DFM18QI&from=3Djn49ik Not bad for the first attempt and such a message in rather poor conds! I believe the tests have shown that EbNaut may well be a viable QSO mode fo= r LF and that my TX station is working well. Implementing RX capability for EbNaut is my next goal. Good. Winodws or Linux? :-) In the mean time, do you see a need to continue with further EbNaut Trial t= ransmissions from my station? For me it is fine. And you know that it's working. In the end it is your de= cision, if you like, then continue.=20 EbNaut needs a stable phase and it could be interesting to see how regular= a reasonably phase stability can be expected.=20 I would focus on messages taking up to 25 minutes and contain 15 character= s because this could be a useful choice for later QSO modes using 30 minute= sequences. Also you never know who's trying to decode you. People are different. Some= say "I'm now preparing my RX to receive you" and then "Now i am ready to r= eceive you this night" an then "Here is my report, i have no copy because t= he local noise was too strong, but tomorrow the QRM should be lower because= ...." and so on. Other people may do the same work and have the same issues= but tell nothing until they can report a successful decode! :-) If you are on the air and offer a possibility to other to detect you, you = can only rise activity, and that's most important! 73, Stefan <03280235_sym.png> ------=_Part_53022_2143907433.1522317393562 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Rob,

last night I got valid deco= des for every single timeslot between 0 and 4 UT, but none before or after.= The decoder always produced the correct result already during one of the i= nitial flat-phase trials, only sometimes the rank improved with later +- 30= =C2=B0 variations.

180328-29
start EbN0 rank
&nb= sp;UT    dB
0000  0.4  932
0030  1.4&nb= sp; 0
0100  4.4  0
0130  3.6  0
0200  3.0=   0
0230  0.3  13
0300  3.3  0
0330 = ; 1.7  0
0400  4.0  0

Best 73,
Ma= rkus (DF6NM)



-----Urspr=C3=BCngliche Mitteilung-----
Von= : Rob Renoud <k3rwr@md.metrocast.net>
An: rsgb_lf_group <rsgb_l= f_group@blacksheep.org>
Verschickt: Mi, 28. Mrz 2018 19:44
Betreff= : Re: LF: K3RWR LF EbNaut Trial #2

Marcus,

TU for the reports.  Very nice signal levels at 0200= and 0400.

Yes, 12 char, CRC 15, 2 s symbols is a = viable QSO candidate.

I will begin transmitting ov= ernight a 12 character message for the next three days  as follows:

Coding: 8K19
CRC:  15
Symbo= l Period: 2 sec
Length:  12 characters
Duration: &= nbsp;28 minutes
Message repeated on the Hour & Half-Hour
Frequency:  137.395 KHz
Start Time:  2200 UTC dai= ly
Stop Time:  1000 UTC daily
Days:  28/29 Ma= r, 29/30 Mar, 30/31 Mar

Reports and comments welco= me :-)

73,
Rob - K3RWR FM18qi
=

On Mar 28, 2018, at 06:11, Markus Vester <= markusvester@aol.com> wrote:

Hi Rob,

three decodes again last night:=

 UT   dB
0100  1.0
0200&nbs= p; 8.2
0400  5.4

Although the signal is someti= mes quite strong, it is undecodable due to fading or phase variation at oth= er times. For a two-way QSO I would probably prefer shorter messages (e.g. = 12 char, CRC 15, 2 s symbols, 28 minutes total) which may come through more= reliably. They will also decode more quickly, ideally allowing an answer i= n the next time slot.

Best 73,
Markus (DF6NM)


-----Urspr=C3=BCngliche Mitteilung-----
Von: Markus Vester &l= t;markusvester@aol.com>
An: rsgb_lf_group <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Verschickt: Di, 27. Mrz= 2018 17:06
Betreff: Re: LF: K3RWR LF EbNaut Trial #2

Congratulati= ons Ric and Rob!

On their way to Italy, two of last ni= ght's transmissions also stopped by in Nuremberg, 3 UT (3.0 dB) and 4 UT (2= .0 dB).

Best 73,
Markus (DF6NM)



---= --Urspr=C3=BCngliche Mitteilung-----
Von: Rob Renoud <k= 3rwr@md.metrocast.net>
An: rsgb_lf_group <r= sgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Verschickt: Di, 27. Mrz 2018 14:01Betreff: Re: LF: K3RWR LF EbNaut Trial #2

Riccardo,

Wow - well= done at your QTH!

Transmitting at 1W EIRP here. &= nbsp;Antenna is a 12.4m vertical wire with 140m of top loading.
<= br>
I will transmit overnight 27/28 March again with the 30 chara= cter message repeating every hour.  Will then switch to a 20 character= message with 1 second symbol period repeating every half hour.  Will = post the details of the new message on this web site.

<= div>Thanks & 73,
Rob - K3RWR





On Mar 27, 2018, at 05:00, Riccar= do Zoli <riccardozoli80@gmail.com> wrote:

<= /div>

Hi Rob, Markus, Stefan, LF<= /div>

Congrats for recent LF EbNaut success!
<= br>
Last night, I have decoded your message here in JN64bw= (Ariano). This is a new LF EbNaut W->E QRB record: 7048 km.
UTC 0200, Eb/N0 =3D 2.2 dB (see attachments).

My rig is a homebrew SDR, clocked by a GPSDO.= The antenna is an inverted L 12m height, 36m long.


All the best


73 de= Riccardo IW4DXW




2018-03-27 1:29 GMT+02:00 Rob R= enoud <k3rwr@md.metrocast.net>:
Stephan,

Thank you for your mo= st insightful, and correct comments.

I will contin= ue to explore EbNaut as a communications and QSO mode on 2200m.  Your = suggestion to focus on messages taking up to 25 minutes and containing 15 c= haracters fits well with using EbNaut as a QSO mode.  

<= /div>
I have both Windows and Linux computers - plan on starting with W= indows and transition to Linux as I gain confidence with EbNaut RX.

Tnx & 73,
Rob - K3RWR

On Mar 26, 2018, at 15:55, DK7FC &= lt;selberdenken@posteo.de> wrote:

=20 Hi Rob,

Am 26.03.2018 19:28, schrieb Rob Renoud:
=20
Very nice - thanks for you detailed reception reports for the hours between 00:00 and 06:00 and, of course, the decode at 03:00.
No problem.
That's the path: http://k7fry.com/g= rid/?qth=3DFM18QI&from=3Djn49ik
Not bad for the first attempt and such a message in rather poor conds!

I believe the tests have shown that EbNaut may well be a viable QSO mode for LF and that my TX station is working well.
Implementing RX capability for EbNaut is my next goal.
Good. Winodws or Linux? :-)

In the mean time, do you see a need to continue with further EbNaut Trial transmissions from my station?
For me it is fine. And you know that it's working. In the end it is your decision, if you like, then continue.

EbNaut needs a stable phase and it could be interesting to see how regular a reasonably phase stability can be expected.
I would focus on messages taking up to 25 minutes and contain 15 characters because this could be a useful choice for later QSO modes using 30 minute sequences.

Also you never know who's trying to decode you. People are different. Some say "I'm now preparing my RX to receive you" and then "Now i am ready to receive you this night" an then "Here is my report, i have no copy because the local noise was too strong, but tomorrow the QRM should be lower because...." and so on. Other people may do the same work and have the same issues but tell nothing until they can report a successful decode! :-)
If you are on the air and offer a possibility to other to detect you, you can only rise activity, and that's most important!

73, Stefan

<raw02.JPG>
<dec02.JPG>

<03280235_sym.png>
<k3rwr_df6nm_180328_logs.txt>
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