Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.0 (2014-02-07) on lipkowski.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.0 required=5.0 tests=FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN, FREEMAIL_FROM,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,HTML_MESSAGE,SPF_PASS, T_DKIM_INVALID,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.0 X-Spam-DCC: EATSERVER: mailn 1166; Body=2 Fuz1=2 Fuz2=2 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by lipkowski.org (8.14.4/8.14.4/Debian-8+deb8u2) with ESMTP id v7DLNF1N015324 for ; Sun, 13 Aug 2017 23:23:16 +0200 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1dh0Hz-00031b-8z for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Aug 2017 22:19:15 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1dh0Hy-00031S-Gb for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Aug 2017 22:19:14 +0100 Received: from resqmta-ch2-01v.sys.comcast.net ([2001:558:fe21:29:69:252:207:33]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1dh0Hu-0001L5-T7 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Aug 2017 22:19:13 +0100 Received: from resomta-ch2-05v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.101]) by resqmta-ch2-01v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTP id h0HpdQxmQTU0Uh0Hpd1G63; Sun, 13 Aug 2017 21:19:05 +0000 X-DKIM-Result: Domain=comcast.net Result=Signature OK DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20161114; t=1502659145; bh=Gr/guqO3JNnOx4cszMdzZxaPwNGloEqpbg3r/z8a0iI=; h=Received:Received:From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=ZqfgBv5NwYqxce1kvGxvhg+/hmFodCf3kgyeagpsQtUsqmjkhtNRzp548m/M4iZLM gm5IplqzzVI2mHVyidZruxvdnXedcy42jjvfOept5gYCKK1V2iOBwDP5tFfS9x2Eu+ Y9tgsgwGtw5Ld8jMaWXxPnMXjsBvdGwmf9wB8iIju8f5QlAl8cX91B7AhCi1+/9LBp CW2r3R2Sr14ZNnSgFJC7MvEzxMSIGocqW5AHc/wdHoV1q7nTBYvwWAmJScQUMzQcMB V9UUhXZrvXsQG6S3I1tIT3Se2wp3fgE/0tD0dXbYVxcIvZZEnRhkGQkyBiDR6Ma74/ l5kYmHAnrJsww== Received: from Owner ([IPv6:2601:140:8500:7f9f:78f6:dd:b547:d008]) by resomta-ch2-05v.sys.comcast.net with SMTP id h0HmdWr8zegcjh0Hnd4HKa; Sun, 13 Aug 2017 21:19:04 +0000 From: To: References: <5990B3F3.9060502@posteo.de> <15ddd5b39f6-536a-15eab@webprd-m86.mail.aol.com> In-Reply-To: <15ddd5b39f6-536a-15eab@webprd-m86.mail.aol.com> Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2017 17:19:01 -0400 Message-ID: <028c01d31479$c98102f0$5c8308d0$@comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AQIR6qB4zBDmJc6nQuP4vuuWtCwKbKIFHerA Content-Language: en-us X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfHbazcLYJ0BA4ZS02gXPSz+be48YRfB+UjQ7/BHKxSJemUFMKdVe/S2qtOmrkLTtWDyiRNei80dYrCz/Ih2Of9WDgi8DgnjydP12l6DV1nayT27KfnES rj1ux8bs1ncatuSsUI6FuZl4UnFtnFppB3U= X-Scan-Signature: 63130203bdd9ddf2cbf93b2de3d1651e Subject: RE: VLF: Carrier on 3675.005 Hz / EbNaut - YES again Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_028D_01D31458.426F62F0" X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.75 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 12381 This is a multipart message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_028D_01D31458.426F62F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Markus and Stefan, =20 Along with the FDTD diurnal phase simulation, I=E2=80=99ll include = diurnal amplitude for comparison to the prospective path loss = calculation that Markus mentioned.=20 =20 73, =20 Jim AA5BW =20 =20 From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org = [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Markus Vester Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2017 4:49 PM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: VLF: Carrier on 3675.005 Hz / EbNaut - YES again =20 Hi Stefan, despite the 27% loss of signal, the message was decoded fine, = even with a couple of dB to spare - not bad at all! Hope you can repair = your coil and get back on air soon. Jim, some simulation for the 226 km path might indeed be helpful. I = suspect that the path difference between groundwave and first-hop = skywave is close to a half-wavelength, possibly leading to partial = cancellation and stronger diurnal variability. However the carrier SNR = has not been strong enough to make a decently resolved measurement of = diurnal amplitude and phase variations. We could try to obtain a coarse estimate of absolute fieldstrength, = using the received carrier level and e.g. DHO38 for reference. Knowing = Stefan's radiated power, we could then try to derive propagation = attenuation.=20 Best 73, Markus (DF6NM) -----Urspr=C3=BCngliche Mitteilung-----=20 Von: DK7FC An: rsgb_lf_group Verschickt: So, 13. Aug 2017 22:20 Betreff: Re: VLF: Carrier on 3675.005 Hz / EbNaut - YES Hi VLF,=20 The repetition of yesterdays message failed. At 15:38 UTC the safety = function tripped. I've just been on the roof, when re-starting the = transmission i can see a spark in the center of one of the stacks. So = now there is another one which has a flash over! :-( It must be replaced, which is a lot of work. So the tranmissions on 3675 = Hz will stopp for some time. At least we have some carrier detections = and even EbNaut decodes. I need to think about a different coil concept.... More current, more = voltage, more power, more more more! Am 13.08.2017 16:57, schrieb hvanesce@comcast.net:=20 Stephan wrote: =E2=80=9CThe phase of that best decode is quite varying=E2=80=9D Is that observation based on the attached EbNaut Decoder window image = from Markus? It is just based on that decoder data. It is not really proof, just an = idea. Would it help to have an FDTD diurnal phase plot for this path at = 3575Hz? For sure it would be interesting! If you like, do it. I would be curious = to see it. 73, Stefan ------=_NextPart_000_028D_01D31458.426F62F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Markus and Stefan,

 

Along with the FDTD diurnal phase simulation, I=E2=80=99ll include = diurnal amplitude for comparison to the prospective path loss = calculation that Markus mentioned.

 

73,

 

Jim AA5BW

 

 

From:= = owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org = [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Markus = Vester
Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2017 4:49 PM
To: = rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: Re: VLF: Carrier on = 3675.005 Hz / EbNaut - YES again

 

H= i Stefan, despite the 27% loss of signal, the message was decoded fine, = even with a couple of dB to spare - not bad at all! Hope you can = repair your coil and get back on air soon.

Jim, some simulation = for the 226 km path might indeed be helpful. I suspect that the path = difference between groundwave and first-hop skywave is close to a = half-wavelength, possibly leading to partial cancellation and stronger = diurnal variability. However the carrier SNR has not been = strong enough to make a decently resolved measurement of diurnal = amplitude and phase variations.

We could try to obtain a = coarse estimate of absolute fieldstrength, using the received carrier = level and e.g. DHO38 for reference. Knowing Stefan's radiated = power, we could then try to derive propagation attenuation. =

Best 73,
Markus = (DF6NM)



-----Urspr=C3=BCngliche Mitteilung-----
Von: = DK7FC <selberdenken@posteo.de>
= An: rsgb_lf_group <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org= >
Verschickt: So, 13. Aug 2017 22:20
Betreff: Re: VLF: = Carrier on 3675.005 Hz / EbNaut - YES

H= i VLF,

The repetition of yesterdays message failed. At 15:38 UTC = the safety function tripped. I've just been on the roof, when = re-starting the transmission i can see a spark in the center of one of = the stacks. So now there is another one which has a flash over! = :-(
It must be replaced, which is a lot of work. So the tranmissions = on 3675 Hz will stopp for some time. At least we have some carrier = detections and even EbNaut decodes.

I need to think about a = different coil concept.... More current, more voltage, more power, more = more more!

Am 13.08.2017 16:57, schrieb hvanesce@comcast.net: =

Stephan wrote:<= o:p>

=E2=80=9CT= he phase of that best decode is quite = varying=E2=80=9D

Is that observation based on the attached EbNaut Decoder window image = from Markus?<= o:p>

I= t is just based on that decoder data. It is not really proof, just an = idea.

Would it help to have an FDTD diurnal phase plot for this path at = 3575Hz?<= o:p>

F= or sure it would be interesting! If you like, do it. I would be curious = to see it.

73, = Stefan

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