Return-Path: X-Spam-DCC: paranoid 1233; Body=2 Fuz1=2 Fuz2=2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.3 (2006-06-01) on lipkowski.org X-Spam-Level: *** X-Spam-Status: No, score=3.1 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DNS_FROM_AHBL_RHSBL, FORGED_MUA_OUTLOOK,HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGE,NO_REAL_NAME,SPF_PASS autolearn=no version=3.1.3 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by paranoid.lipkowski.org (8.13.7/8.13.7) with ESMTP id u88BE8ul021247 for ; Thu, 8 Sep 2016 13:14:08 +0200 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1bhxEK-0002Ut-IH for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Thu, 08 Sep 2016 12:10:52 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1bhxEK-0002Ug-4c for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 08 Sep 2016 12:10:52 +0100 Received: from resqmta-ch2-04v.sys.comcast.net ([2001:558:fe21:29:69:252:207:36]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.87) (envelope-from ) id 1bhxEI-0008Tq-7k for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 08 Sep 2016 12:10:50 +0100 Received: from resomta-ch2-20v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.116]) by resqmta-ch2-04v.sys.comcast.net with SMTP id hxEBbZ6dO8PeahxEDby3Gn; Thu, 08 Sep 2016 11:10:45 +0000 X-DKIM-Result: Domain=comcast.net Result=Signature OK DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20140121; t=1473333045; bh=UkGQKRogMJrkvnWkJwbQ+xlJXrY0hFaGNsEtsNVmvcE=; h=Received:Received:Message-ID:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=h73EeJs/maW8zWx3BZAQnHoR4tJHAyiFXnMF7JREbnZzDntRiJg8QoWTMTzmhl8mG +MfCqFjsgMvlyc1nRcrjTcevelNs4jCg2PiRBJSqo9ZGdtks9lEfcjzYz3R23yafxE 0i0v8E+nGHNTxvdPweY/DEqJDUlhD6Q6DLUVesT6LnvJ7CqtYAgf1spBXChMcY+E35 nCHwd+YAsBEfX/53WR5wYboFd6AyEcDAFddQ4JXo0OdNNl0bLEM/WBjWqBQrI0XY2J 2TEc/EuEA1TAOkz0aNd9FM3Lm16hoEAHmVxJoXUgxePbVkLbABxrTeF42YSbqhycbL 8n5dEmGdgZosg== Received: from JAYDELL ([71.234.119.9]) by resomta-ch2-20v.sys.comcast.net with SMTP id hxECbaj5ntzqthxECbmiE2; Thu, 08 Sep 2016 11:10:45 +0000 Message-ID: <713F7138B219460DB1DEFCECE0EDE025@JAYDELL> From: To: References: <157095e78c5-65fd-15de8@webprd-m32.mail.aol.com> Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2016 07:10:44 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5512 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfJKi/X/HElmTAFrLJfsDGQEZ7UI6k6LaVsxaxdTEiEE2E96pZJ5qfM/knZke+x++i3M0//tqrcG8GuuUj7/V5/1QcUwwGke9z40pImTHYDkr+X8DBQZM prnRR/u20DWAggdeEwevQTYjLcvKqBjPoKmpMgTssnyYMQP0JfVVPAmD X-Scan-Signature: 617a5faed955112e448650f4d003a84d Subject: Re: LF: OPDS bandwidth (was EA5DOM LF tests) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01D209A0.1DE01DD0" X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.56 on 10.1.3.11 Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 8707 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01D209A0.1DE01DD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit For anyone considering building the W1VD transmitters, I would recommend using the driver circuit from the kW unit even if building a 500 watt unit. Jay W1VD WD2XNS WE2XGR/2 ----- Original Message ----- From: Markus Vester To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sent: Thursday, September 08, 2016 6:36 AM Subject: Re: LF: OPDS bandwidth (was EA5DOM LF tests) Yes, Mike is right. Zooming the spectrogram on Luis' signal did not show any central carrier, so subsequent dashes seem to have random phase. An additional problem could be the temperature drift of the master crystal oscillator (neither the common 125 MHz-clocked AD9850 modules nor the Si570 source are very stable). Regarding a new transmitter, I would recommend starting with a stable continuous signal from an OCXO or TCXO, and applying the keying only directly before the PA, after any divider stages. As far as I can see, this is done right in the W1VD design, where the flipflop runs through and keying is applied to the FET drivers. All the best, Markus (DF6NM) -----Ursprüngliche Mitteilung----- Von: Mike Dennison An: rsgb_lf_group Verschickt: Do, 8 Sept 2016 12:12 pm Betreff: LF: OPDS bandwidth (was EA5DOM LF tests) The wider bandwidth seen on OPDS may be key clicks but I have found it can be caused by a non-coherent signal, ie the 'oscillator' is not continuously running. I found this, for instance, when keying a divider chip on my GW3UEP 472kHz rig, and it was cured by keying the PA instead. Mike, G3XDV ============ On 7 Sep 2016 at 11:20, DK7FC wrote: > date time call distance frequency bandwidth snr > correlation > > 2016-09-07 04:35:08 EA5DOM 1398km 137519.960Hz 97mHz -37.7dBOp 100% > 20.2dB 2016-09-07 03:35:08 EA5DOM 1398km 137519.910Hz 112mHz > -48.5dBOp 100% 19.8dB 2016-09-07 02:35:09 EA5DOM 1398km 137519.928Hz > 75mHz -42.0dBOp 46% 16.6dB 2016-09-07 01:35:07 EA5DOM 1398km > 137519.926Hz 71mHz -99.9dBOp 77% 16.6dB > > > Somehow the bandwidth values are quite high. Normally it is arround < > 10 mHz. Anyway, a nice result. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01D209A0.1DE01DD0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =EF=BB=BF
For anyone considering building the = W1VD=20 transmitters, I would recommend using the driver circuit from the = kW unit=20 even if building a 500 watt unit.
 
Jay W1VD  WD2XNS  = WE2XGR/2
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Markus=20 Vester
Sent: Thursday, September 08, = 2016 6:36=20 AM
Subject: Re: LF: OPDS bandwidth = (was=20 EA5DOM LF tests)

Yes,=20 Mike is right. Zooming the spectrogram on Luis' signal did not=20 show any central carrier, so subsequent dashes seem to have = random=20 phase. An additional problem could be the temperature drift of the = master=20 crystal oscillator (neither the common 125 MHz-clocked AD9850 modules = nor the=20 Si570 source are very stable).

Regarding a new = transmitter, I=20 would recommend starting with a stable continuous signal from an OCXO = or TCXO,=20 and applying the keying only directly before the PA, after any divider = stages.=20 As far as I can see, this is done right in the W1VD design, where the = flipflop=20 runs through and keying is applied to the FET drivers.

All = the=20 best,
Markus (DF6NM)

-----Urspr=C3=BCngliche Mitteilung----- =
Von:=20 Mike Dennison <mike.dennison@ntlworld.com>
An: rsgb_lf_group=20 <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Verschickt: Do, 8 Sept 2016 = 12:12=20 pm
Betreff: LF: OPDS bandwidth (was EA5DOM LF = tests)

The wider=20 bandwidth seen on OPDS may be key clicks but I have found
it can = be caused=20 by a non-coherent signal, ie the 'oscillator' is not
continuously = running.=20 I found this, for instance, when keying a
divider chip on my = GW3UEP 472kHz=20 rig, and it was cured by keying the
PA instead.

Mike,=20 G3XDV
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

On 7 Sep 2016 at = 11:20, DK7FC wrote:

>=20 date time call distance frequency bandwidth snr
> = correlation
>=20
> 2016-09-07 04:35:08 EA5DOM 1398km 137519.960Hz 97mHz = -37.7dBOp=20 100%
> 20.2dB 2016-09-07 03:35:08 EA5DOM 1398km 137519.910Hz=20 112mHz
> -48.5dBOp 100% 19.8dB 2016-09-07 02:35:09 EA5DOM 1398km = 137519.928Hz
> 75mHz -42.0dBOp 46% 16.6dB 2016-09-07 01:35:07 = EA5DOM=20 1398km
> 137519.926Hz 71mHz -99.9dBOp 77% 16.6dB
> =
>=20
> Somehow the bandwidth values are quite high. Normally it is = arround=20 <
> 10 mHz. Anyway, a nice=20 result.


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