Return-Path: X-Spam-DCC: paranoid 1290; Body=2 Fuz1=2 Fuz2=2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.3 (2006-06-01) on lipkowski.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DNS_FROM_AHBL_RHSBL, HTML_50_60,HTML_MESSAGE,SPF_PASS autolearn=no version=3.1.3 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by paranoid.lipkowski.org (8.13.7/8.13.7) with ESMTP id u2RK3aIr025971 for ; Sun, 27 Mar 2016 22:03:36 +0200 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1akGqb-0004sQ-1O for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Mar 2016 20:59:41 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1akGqV-0004sH-8Z for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Mar 2016 20:59:35 +0100 Received: from omr-m005e.mx.aol.com ([204.29.186.5]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1:DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1akGqS-00030K-Pd for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Mar 2016 20:59:34 +0100 Received: from mtaout-aac01.mx.aol.com (mtaout-aac01.mx.aol.com [172.27.2.33]) by omr-m005e.mx.aol.com (Outbound Mail Relay) with ESMTP id DFE893800090 for ; Sun, 27 Mar 2016 15:59:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from White (ipbcc05f3c.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de [188.192.95.60]) by mtaout-aac01.mx.aol.com (MUA/Third Party Client Interface) with ESMTPA id 286DF3800009D for ; Sun, 27 Mar 2016 15:59:28 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0B13EDC9CB494E698C8EA963619C9032@White> From: "Markus Vester" To: References: <094E96255B2D4EE9886317C115E7E5D9@Clemens0811> Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2016 21:59:26 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 12.0.1606 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V12.0.1606 x-aol-global-disposition: G DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mx.aol.com; s=20150623; t=1459108770; bh=QhHj6Ab0ZJ3XwHdMqxE3ZUU2/C2pkgvgRo+F7LL/jkY=; h=From:To:Subject:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=iBmPQCnxcVIVUKo4n2tND9XUfWyaSY33MYZfjyugWswWjUdRFWdAwSTYGxrpgAdZw UgZstYYot1ZnZvPuPFBz3uX5gw6hL1pwRYzNqPNqrlhUN7FuCQISCiZ9NwgTUv0Aar 5OPVlLZjSq3DkKp6+ChyzJ9vCNKNea7H/riuF5jQ= x-aol-sid: 3039ac1b022156f83ba03020 X-AOL-IP: 188.192.95.60 X-Scan-Signature: 52d17ee6003fa6763aae891a69410baf Subject: LF: WSPR sidebands Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0016_01D18873.EE178370" X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.56 on 10.1.3.11 Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 7491 Dies ist eine mehrteilige Nachricht im MIME-Format. ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01D18873.EE178370 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Clemens, the 1.465 Hz spaced lines around the strong WSPR signals are "clicks" = from the periodic frequency switching, they are supposed to be there. = But as the switching is phase-continuous, these FSK sidebands fall off = much more rapidly than Opera's AM key-clicks. The 100 Hz lines should normally disappear if a properly regulated = ripple-free power supply is used for the TX. Has DJ0ABR rechecked the = voltage ripple after the change?=20 But there may be other subtle causes for low-level 100 Hz modulation = both in the TX and RX chains, e.g. - hum injection into PLL oscillators causing phase modulation, - ground impedance modulated by the rectifier diodes in the power = supply, - modulated scatter from traditional flourescent tubes (more at VHF = though), =20 - noise blanker acting on periodic interference (eg. SMPS or PLC), - hum injection into the audio chain. Spurs from the DDS would not be impossible but usually at lower level, = and unlikely to exactly hit 100 Hz. Best 73, Markus (DF6NM) From: Clemens Paul=20 Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2016 8:47 PM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org ; rsgb_lf_group@yahoogroups.co.uk=20 Subject: RE: Cheap and nasty sources - was LF: DK7FC WSPR bad quality = problem Hello all, I've been watching the 100Hz sideband WSPR multi-decodes also from the = other two strong stations on MW, DH5RAE and DB0ABR.They are located about 65km from me and generate = S9++dB signals here. The deoded sidebands are also about 40dB down. DB0ABR has tried a different power supply to no avail and both believe = that the DDS synthesizer is the culprit. It is a AD9859,see http://www.dj0abr.de/index_english.html I have added a perseus screenshot with a bin width of 0.24Hz showing = strange lines in their signal. I'm not sure if this is the DDS spectrum what we see here. 73 Clemens DL4RAJ=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01D18873.EE178370 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Clemens,
 
the 1.465 Hz spaced lines around the = strong WSPR=20 signals are "clicks" from the periodic frequency switching, = they are=20 supposed to be there. But as the switching is phase-continuous, these = FSK=20 sidebands fall off much more rapidly than Opera's AM = key-clicks.
 
The 100 Hz lines should normally = disappear if a=20 properly regulated ripple-free power supply is used for the TX. Has=20 DJ0ABR rechecked the voltage ripple after the change?
 
But there may be other subtle = causes for=20 low-level 100 Hz modulation both in = the TX and RX=20 chains, e.g.
- hum injection into PLL oscillators = causing phase=20 modulation,
- ground impedance modulated by the = rectifier=20 diodes in the power supply,
- modulated scatter from traditional = flourescent=20 tubes (more at VHF though), 
- noise blanker acting on = periodic interference (eg. SMPS or PLC),
- hum injection into the audio = chain.
 
Spurs from the DDS would not be = impossible but=20 usually at lower level, and unlikely to exactly hit 100=20 Hz.
 
Best 73,
Markus (DF6NM)
 

Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2016 8:47 PM
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org= ; rsgb_lf_group@yahoogroups= .co.uk=20
Subject: RE: Cheap and nasty sources - was LF: DK7FC WSPR = bad=20 quality problem

Hello=20 all,

I've been watching the 100Hz sideband WSPR multi-decodes = also from=20 the other two strong stations on MW,
DH5RAE and DB0ABR.They are = located about=20 65km from me and generate  S9++dB signals here.
The deoded = sidebands are=20 also about 40dB down.
DB0ABR has tried a different power supply to no = avail=20 and both believe that the DDS synthesizer is the culprit.
It is a=20 AD9859,see
http://www.dj0abr.de/ind= ex_english.html
I=20 have added a perseus screenshot with a bin width of 0.24Hz showing = strange lines=20 in their signal.
I'm not sure if this is the DDS spectrum what we see = here.

73
Clemens
DL4RAJ
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