Return-Path: X-Spam-DCC: paranoid 1233; Body=2 Fuz1=2 Fuz2=2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.3 (2006-06-01) on lipkowski.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DNS_FROM_AHBL_RHSBL, FORGED_RCVD_HELO,RATWARE_GECKO_BUILD autolearn=no version=3.1.3 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by paranoid.lipkowski.org (8.13.7/8.13.7) with ESMTP id tBDL6UEj017720 for ; Sun, 13 Dec 2015 22:06:30 +0100 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1a8DnY-0001bc-Hk for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Dec 2015 21:03:16 +0000 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1a8DnY-0001bT-8Q for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Dec 2015 21:03:16 +0000 Received: from parrot.netcom.co.uk ([217.72.171.49]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1a8DmU-0000co-4A for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 13 Dec 2015 21:03:15 +0000 Received: from sb.abelian.org (i-194-106-52-83.freedom2surf.net [194.106.52.83]) by parrot.netcom.co.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B0D63273D6 for ; Sun, 13 Dec 2015 20:52:39 +0000 (GMT) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sb.abelian.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99D7F28A0112 for ; Sun, 13 Dec 2015 21:01:52 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <566DDCC0.2010202@abelian.org> Date: Sun, 13 Dec 2015 21:01:52 +0000 From: Paul Nicholson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130106 Thunderbird/17.0.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <56686FA0.4050707@gmail.com> <56695B15.6010203@abelian.org> <56696950.1040300@abelian.org> <5669B7CE.1090601@freenet.de> <5669E1E3.6070008@abelian.org> <566D6597.4070901@freenet.de> <566D73CD.1070805@freenet.de> <566D8578.3090401@posteo.de> <566DA1BF.9080504@freenet.de> In-Reply-To: <566DA1BF.9080504@freenet.de> X-Scan-Signature: c6a8ca7629fac3d35507e5a7fd3cbf17 Subject: Re: LF: LF EbNaut test from JN80 on 137370 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.56 on 10.1.3.10 Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 5801 I'm puzzled by the I/Q inconsistency. Is there no convention on the signs in the complex mixer? Perhaps it is vlfrx-tools and ebnaut which needs to change Q sign? I'd like to thank everyone for giving this coherent BPSK a try at LF: those taking part and the rest putting up with the extra list traffic. We've got some worthwhile results and pushed things to the limit in a few directions which has revealed a few bugs and weaknesses. Now I'm back to the drawing board to make some alterations. One of the things being looked at is the CRC size which determines the strength of the outer error detection code which selects correct solutions from the Viterbi list output. More CRC bits means less chance of a false detection and therefore more coding gain from the outer layer. But more CRC bits is extra overhead to be carried by the Viterbi layer which reduces its coding gain. Some trials of 4 character messages using 8K19A seem to indicate that when CRC size is increased, the extra outer layer gain is roughly cancelled by an equal loss of inner layer gain. The result being the overall coding gain doesn't change significantly. Some figures after 10 hours of 120 cores running trials at Eb/N0 = -1.0 dB: CRC_bits best_list trials success_rate 8 50 708 51.0% 12 400 605 50.3% 14 3000 973 51.9% 16 11000 1653 53.8% 18 55000 1938 52.8% 20 200000 1131 52.3% 22 500000 1565 54.4% 24 2000000 1767 53.1% For each CRC size there's an optimum list size for best success rate and the success rate drops if you use longer or shorter lists. That's the expected behaviour. But interestingly, there isn't significant change in overall success rate between 8 bits and 24 bits. The outer code strength increases considerably when going up to 24 bits, but the loss of Viterbi gain is also high. The 4 char message itself is only 24 bits, so a 24 bit CRC doubles the number of bits that must be encoded in the same duration of message (necessary to keep Eb/N0 constant). Probably when I repeat this test with longer messages the conclusion may be different because the extra burden of the CRC bits will be a smaller proportion of the message payload. But first I need to work out a faster way of running these trials or AWS/EC2 will be making a profit out of me. I should say a bit about the test protocol. The decoder is allowed to complete its phase search and output the strongest (lowest BER) decode that it found. If this is the correct message it counts as a success. If it's not the correct message it's a false hit. Or there could be no message at all if the Viterbi list failed to turn up any codeword acceptable to the outer layer. Here there is no operator to cast an eye over a list of hits looking for a callsign. Each trial has to take the solution with the lowest number of errors. For this experiment I'm restricting the phase search to only uniform phase in 30 degree steps. A full phase search would probably have an effect on the optimum list sizes. -- Paul Nicholson --