Return-Path: X-Spam-DCC: paranoid 1356; Body=2 Fuz1=2 Fuz2=2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.3 (2006-06-01) on lipkowski.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.7 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DNS_FROM_AHBL_RHSBL, HTML_MESSAGE,RATWARE_GECKO_BUILD autolearn=no version=3.1.3 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by paranoid.lipkowski.org (8.13.7/8.13.7) with ESMTP id tA6GZUZB003575 for ; Fri, 6 Nov 2015 17:35:30 +0100 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1Zujv9-00023f-58 for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Nov 2015 16:31:23 +0000 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1Zujv8-00023W-Nf for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Nov 2015 16:31:22 +0000 Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1Zuju4-00082p-E6 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Nov 2015 16:31:21 +0000 Received: from dovecot03.posteo.de (dovecot03.posteo.de [172.16.0.13]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B767F209EF for ; Fri, 6 Nov 2015 17:29:57 +0100 (CET) Received: from mail.posteo.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dovecot03.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3nsnHn4lSFz5vN3 for ; Fri, 6 Nov 2015 17:29:57 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <563CD585.6040209@posteo.de> Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2015 17:29:57 +0100 From: DK7FC User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; de; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100227 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <579355A36AEE9D4FA555C45D556003AB1B27FD3B@servigilant.vigilant.local> In-Reply-To: <579355A36AEE9D4FA555C45D556003AB1B27FD3B@servigilant.vigilant.local> X-Scan-Signature: fd73b8f9df6f2b416d7310bde5bfea2c Subject: Re: LF: RE: EA5DOM Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------090501040603010709000907" X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.56 on 10.1.3.10 Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 4843 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------090501040603010709000907 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Luis, What did i say!?! You can get +40 dB over the horizontal loop and +20 dB over the unloaded vertical :-) Also your PA is more relaxed now i think. You are by far the strongest station in EA so far on MF and it was a first transatlantic decode i think, for EA. 70W? Thought it is a 100W PA. So the matching isn't accurate yet? Or do you run less supply voltage? I also saw the daytime decodes by DH5RAE. A challenge for my tree project! :-) Do you have some further ideas now what to do with the antenna or is the project finished now? :-) OK about Markus' explanations. I think your antenna is something like a short dipole, with one leg close to ground, with an excentric feed point and all this is rotated by 90 deg! :-) 73, Stefan Am 06.11.2015 12:07, schrieb VIGILANT Luis Fernández: > Hi Stefan, MF > A resonating antenna is a blessing ! But a vertical antenna on top > of a 80m building tower is double blessing ;-) > I have a very busy schedule this days, so had to finish the coil and > variometer and installed it yesterday night in darkness > It was a shock to see >30 stations spotting my first WSPR Tx and on > the third got FR5ZX. And the results of this > night produced also decodes in north America by VE1HF and WD2XSH > Even getting daylight decodes this morning by DH5RAE and looks like > the signal is visible at Stefan grabber. Last decode > from DH5RAE at 10:48 UTC -26dB is amazing :-O > I'm also transmitting Opera8 as the PA is just sleeping now that there > is a matched load on the other side (70W output) > The long ground line of the antenna at 80m being a thick water pipe > down to building basements is the key, as Markus predicted > Please let me recall his comments here: > > But the good thing is that effective height will be much larger, > because a significant part of the displacement current will not return > to the roof but go the "long way" down to ground zero. This is also > why a miniwhip on a pole receives larger signals. Details depend on > the exact geometry (eg. the relative thickness of the "mast"), but a > good guess is taking the geometric mean between the height of the > house and the effective height of the antenna itself if it was above > flat ground. > > In your case, this would be sqrt(80m*5.5m) = 21m, which is way above > average compared to most amateur antennas. Radiation resistance would > be 1.75 ohms, so in theory you'd need only 0.56 A to achieve 1 W ERP... > > All the best, > > Markus (DF6NM) > > That was a BINGO Markus ! > Next step is to accurately measure RF current. May be I'm well over 1W > ERP .... > Thank you to all you guys to help me achieve this :-) > Ops ! CW QSOs .... Yes, I can do some CW but need refreshing it a > little. We will make many FIRST as there has been some EA activity > before on MF but not sure if they worked many countries. Workload at > job pressing this days and a trip to Mexico at the end of this month > Keep tuned ;-) > 73 de Luis > EA5DOM > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *De:* owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] *En nombre de *DK7FC > *Enviado el:* viernes, 06 de noviembre de 2015 0:41 > *Para:* rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > *Asunto:* LF: EA5DOM > > Hello Luis, > > Your 11m vertical leaves a SNR of 0 dB here in WSPR > now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :-) > That means we can easily do a CW QSO! > > Timestamp Call MHz SNR Drift Grid Pwr Reporter RGrid km az > 2015-11-05 23:32 EA5DOM 0.475793 0 0 IM98wn 0.5 > DK7FC/P JN49ik 1398 27 > 2015-11-05 23:24 EA5DOM 0.475793 -3 0 IM98wn 0.5 > DK7FC/P JN49ik 1398 27 > > > > Do we want to try soon? Are you a CW man? It would be my first to EA > on that band. > > 73, Stefan > > Am 05.11.2015 23:59, schrieb VIGILANT Luis Fernández: >> Wops !! >> >> 2015-11-05 22:48 EA5DOM 0.475790 -20 0 IM98wn 0.05 FR5ZX LG78pu 8796 >> >> New coil ! Antenna is finally on resonance ..... and seems to work ! ;-) >> >> 73 de Luis >> EA5DOM >> ________________________________________ >> De:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] en nombre de DK7FC [selberdenken@posteo.de] >> Enviado: jueves, 5 de noviembre de 2015 22:39 >> Para:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org >> Asunto: LF: FR5ZX WSPR again >> >> Hi all, >> >> The path is open again! Give it a try. >> >> 73, Stefan >> >> >> >> --------------090501040603010709000907 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Luis,

What did i say!?! You can get +40 dB over the horizontal loop and +20 dB over the unloaded vertical :-) Also your PA is more relaxed now i think.
You are by far the strongest station in EA so far on MF and it was a first transatlantic decode i think, for EA.
70W? Thought it is a 100W PA. So the matching isn't accurate yet? Or do you run less supply voltage?
I also saw the daytime decodes by DH5RAE. A challenge for my tree project! :-)
Do you have some further ideas now what to do with the antenna or is the project finished now? :-)

OK about Markus' explanations. I think your antenna is something like a short dipole, with one leg close to ground, with an excentric feed point and all this is rotated by 90 deg! :-)

73, Stefan

Am 06.11.2015 12:07, schrieb VIGILANT Luis Fernández:
Hi Stefan, MF
 
A resonating antenna is a blessing ! But a vertical antenna on top of a 80m building tower is double blessing  ;-)
 
I have a very busy schedule this days, so had to finish the coil and variometer and installed it yesterday night in darkness
 
It was a shock to see >30 stations spotting my first WSPR Tx and on the third got FR5ZX. And the results of this
night produced also decodes in north America by VE1HF and WD2XSH
 
Even getting daylight decodes this morning by DH5RAE and looks like the signal is visible at Stefan grabber. Last decode
from DH5RAE at 10:48 UTC -26dB is amazing :-O
 
I'm also transmitting Opera8 as the PA is just sleeping now that there is a matched load on the other side (70W output)
 
The long ground line of the antenna at 80m being a thick water pipe down to building basements is the key, as Markus predicted
Please let me recall his comments here:

But the good thing is that effective height will be much larger, because a significant part of the displacement current will not return to the roof but go the "long way" down to ground zero. This is also why a miniwhip on a pole receives larger signals. Details depend on the exact geometry (eg. the relative thickness of the "mast"), but a good guess is taking the geometric mean between the height of the house and the effective height of the antenna itself if it was above flat ground.

In your case, this would be sqrt(80m*5.5m) = 21m, which is way above average compared to most amateur antennas. Radiation resistance would be 1.75 ohms, so in theory you'd need only 0.56 A to achieve 1 W ERP...

All the best,

Markus (DF6NM)

That was a BINGO Markus !
 
Next step is to accurately measure RF current. May be I'm well over 1W ERP ....
 
Thank you to all you guys to help me achieve this :-)
 
Ops ! CW QSOs .... Yes, I can do some CW but need refreshing it a little. We will make many FIRST as there has been some EA activity
before on MF but not sure if they worked many countries. Workload at job pressing this days and a trip to Mexico at the end of this month
 
Keep tuned ;-)
 
73 de Luis
EA5DOM

De: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] En nombre de DK7FC
Enviado el: viernes, 06 de noviembre de 2015 0:41
Para: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Asunto: LF: EA5DOM

Hello Luis,

Your 11m vertical leaves a SNR of 0 dB here in WSPR now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :-)
That means we can easily do a CW QSO!

Timestamp Call MHz SNR Drift Grid Pwr Reporter RGrid km az
 2015-11-05 23:32   EA5DOM   0.475793   0   0   IM98wn   0.5   DK7FC/P   JN49ik   1398   27 
 2015-11-05 23:24   EA5DOM   0.475793   -3   0   IM98wn   0.5   DK7FC/P   JN49ik   1398   27 


Do we want to try soon? Are you a CW man? It would be my first to EA on that band.

73, Stefan

Am 05.11.2015 23:59, schrieb VIGILANT Luis Fernández: 
Wops !! 

 2015-11-05 22:48 	 EA5DOM 	 0.475790 	 -20 	 0 	 IM98wn 	 0.05 	 FR5ZX 	 LG78pu 	 8796 

New coil ! Antenna is finally on resonance  ..... and seems to work ! ;-)

73 de Luis
EA5DOM
________________________________________
De: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] en nombre de DK7FC [selberdenken@posteo.de]
Enviado: jueves, 5 de noviembre de 2015 22:39
Para: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Asunto: LF: FR5ZX WSPR again

Hi all,

The path is open again! Give it a try.

73, Stefan
--------------090501040603010709000907--