Return-Path: X-Spam-DCC: paranoid 1233; Body=3 Fuz1=3 Fuz2=3 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.3 (2006-06-01) on lipkowski.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DNS_FROM_AHBL_RHSBL, FORGED_RCVD_HELO,RATWARE_GECKO_BUILD autolearn=no version=3.1.3 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by paranoid.lipkowski.org (8.13.7/8.13.7) with ESMTP id t8R7Ls1U000604 for ; Sun, 27 Sep 2015 09:21:54 +0200 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1Zg6Al-0001zq-BW for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Sep 2015 08:14:59 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1Zg6Ak-0001zh-Iy for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Sep 2015 08:14:58 +0100 Received: from parrot.netcom.co.uk ([217.72.171.49]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1Zg69g-0006m5-AO for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 27 Sep 2015 08:14:57 +0100 Received: from sb.abelian.org (i-194-106-52-83.freedom2surf.net [194.106.52.83]) by parrot.netcom.co.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4D973273F0 for ; Sun, 27 Sep 2015 08:06:06 +0100 (BST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sb.abelian.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A44728A1129 for ; Sun, 27 Sep 2015 07:13:35 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <5607971E.1010700@abelian.org> Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2015 07:13:34 +0000 From: Paul Nicholson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130106 Thunderbird/17.0.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <5601EC9F.2010607@gmail.com> <56059B48.80606@freenet.de> <56069AD1.4040303@abelian.org> In-Reply-To: X-Scan-Signature: 1c38f63d01970a2bf149f660c9cb2a37 Subject: Re: LF: Coherent BPSK on LF using EbNaut Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.56 on 10.1.3.10 Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 4163 The soundcard becomes a liability for coherent signalling at LF. The fiddly software is all concerned with coping with the wandering soundcard conversion rate. Andy wrote: > direct I/Q downconversion from LF to baseband, low pass > filtering then I/Q sampling into an A/D at something like > 1kHz (or even lower), Yes, a small amount of hardware replaces a lot of software once you move away from the soundcard. And because the signal is shifted to a carrier frequency of zero, the A/D sampling of the baseband I/Q doesn't need to be super accurately timed - it merely affects the symbol timing, which needs only 1/10th second accuracy. No doubt there is scope for some direct conversion LF electronics to take over most of the work (certainly the timing critical part). An opportunity here to revive some traditional techniques that are simple and ideal for this. Time to revisit some projects from a couple of decades ago. Just needs a GPS-locked DDS for the LO and a simple A/D for the I/Q. Probably not many bits wide - 8 plenty, maybe 2 enough. 100Hz sampling is more than fast enough considering bandwidths are 1Hz or less. Even the DDS probably doesn't need to be very good. Needs the long term stability of a GPS lock but it probably doesn't matter if it has 5 degrees or so RMS phase noise. I suppose at LF, you reach a point where your antenna is as large as it will go and the house lights dim when you key. How do you go further from there? One avenue might be this coherent signalling where you try to maintain an almost constant phase for the duration of a transmission. The rx does likewise and the decoder expects the signal to be so weak it can't rely on picking out a reference phase, so it guesses. Then you're suddenly several dB more capable. You'll find yourself exchanging messages that are not just 50dB short of being audible, but can't even be seen on a spectrogram. Hmm... Have I nearly talked myself into setting up something here? -- Paul Nicholson --