Return-Path: X-Spam-DCC: paranoid 1233; Body=2 Fuz1=2 Fuz2=2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.3 (2006-06-01) on lipkowski.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=unavailable version=3.1.3 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by paranoid.lipkowski.org (8.13.7/8.13.7) with ESMTP id s94K1t3L001210 for ; Sat, 4 Oct 2014 22:01:55 +0200 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1XaVTJ-0004oR-U7 for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Oct 2014 20:58:29 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1XaVTJ-0004oI-EU for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Oct 2014 20:58:29 +0100 Received: from omr-m01.mx.aol.com ([64.12.143.75]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1:DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1XaVTG-0007ar-Qf for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 04 Oct 2014 20:58:28 +0100 Received: from mtaout-aac01.mx.aol.com (mtaout-aac01.mx.aol.com [172.27.2.33]) by omr-m01.mx.aol.com (Outbound Mail Relay) with ESMTP id 49546700000B3 for ; Sat, 4 Oct 2014 15:58:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from White (unknown [95.91.239.181]) by mtaout-aac01.mx.aol.com (MUA/Third Party Client Interface) with ESMTPA id A7A6538000084 for ; Sat, 4 Oct 2014 15:58:22 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <348B0BEC1F7B46E087035B672ECDF3C0@White> From: "Markus Vester" To: Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2014 21:58:24 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 12.0.1606 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V12.0.1606 x-aol-global-disposition: G DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mx.aol.com; s=20140625; t=1412452704; bh=hNmPDA5E3nAjoLsIa+PfxeqRfTIbef1D82pDbxvvffE=; h=From:To:Subject:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=VFQUVSgW42kpIyzur8/8FoiIE97V1iz5P8CFa1yIuDMyQaR6TxyKHDKxqm9DVIWER DA17xT4BpUJTb80z1vPak4P9sBWhl6jFZgppmlybXQ4Cmg8EaYrPIYM2o0o6LGDqmv th8sLRRp9/XSeNtfIakDIONsQvbqpani1dleJ90c= x-aol-sid: 3039ac1b02215430515e6204 X-AOL-IP: 95.91.239.181 X-Scan-Signature: 46d617994b9fba079dc3ad7182acba54 Subject: LF: ZEVS RX ant question, now success - 60 Hz in Europe Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0042_01CFE01E.5236D680" X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.56 on 10.1.3.10 Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 635 Dies ist eine mehrteilige Nachricht im MIME-Format. ------=_NextPart_000_0042_01CFE01E.5236D680 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Attempting to resend... From: Markus Vester=20 Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2014 1:18 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Subject: Re: LF: ZEVS RX ant question, now success - 60 Hz in Europe Hi Wolf, Stefan, yes I also noticed a weak 60 Hz line during my ELF experiment, and it is = there in the accelerated wav files. Here are two spectrograms with 15.3 = mHz bin width: http://df6nm.bplaced.net/VLF/ELF/elf_140903_1855-2055_60Hz_82Hz.png http://df6nm.bplaced.net/VLF/ELF/elf_140904_0541-0741_60Hz_82Hz.png Unlike Zevs, 60 Hz seems to be more pronounced during 1855-2055 UT = recording, ie our evening when the Atlantic was still in daylight. It = was hardly visible in the morning, 0541-0741 UT. During the two evening hours, the 60 hz line drifted up and down by = about two pixels, 30 mHz. That frequency instability may actually be a = unique signature which can be used to exclude local origin, simply by = comparing simultaneous traces from two different receive sites. I think = there may even be an online log of American line frequency history, but = couldn't find it on the web - any hints from the group? Best 73, Markus (DF6NM) From: wolf_dl4yhf=20 Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2014 12:41 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Subject: Re: LF: ZEVS RX ant question, now success Hi Stefan and all, you wrote: Yes, a good idea. I will try to catch it :-) But how do i know that it = is the US mains instead of a 60 Hz monitor? Is the 60 Hz from the mains = more stable? I guess the opposite: Similar to our Eu mains frequency, the US 60 Hz = signal "wanders around" very slowly, as the load changes, but in the = long run they also keep the frequency stable, nation-wide. Not sure = about the maximum excursion from the nominal frequency (I lost the notes = and screenshots years ago when a harddisk died) and how many mHz per = minute the frequency may drift. But you can see the weak 60 Hz trace in = Renato Romero's ZEVS spectrogram at http://www.vlf.it/zevs/zevs.htm 73, Wolf . ------=_NextPart_000_0042_01CFE01E.5236D680 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Attempting to resend...
 
From: Markus Vester
Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2014 1:18 AM
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org= =20
Subject: Re: LF: ZEVS RX ant question, now success - 60 Hz = in=20 Europe

Hi Wolf, Stefan,
 
yes I also noticed a weak 60 Hz line = during my ELF=20 experiment, and it is there in the accelerated wav files. Here are two=20 spectrograms with 15.3 mHz bin width:
http://df6nm.bplaced.net/VLF/ELF/elf_140903_1855-2055_60Hz_82Hz.png
http://df6nm.bplaced.net/VLF/ELF/elf_140904_0541-0741_60Hz_82Hz.png
 
Unlike Zevs, 60 Hz seems to be = more pronounced=20 during 1855-2055 UT recording, ie our evening when the Atlantic was = still in=20 daylight. It was hardly visible in the morning, 0541-0741 = UT.
 
During the two evening hours, the 60 hz = line=20 drifted up and down by about two pixels, 30 mHz. That frequency = instability=20 may actually be a unique signature which can be used to exclude local = origin,=20 simply by comparing simultaneous traces from two different receive=20 sites. I think there may even be an online log of = American line=20 frequency history, but couldn't find it on the web - any hints = from=20 the group?
 
Best 73,
Markus (DF6NM)
 

From: wolf_dl4yhf
Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2014 12:41 AM
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org= =20
Subject: Re: LF: ZEVS RX ant question, now = success

Hi Stefan and all,

you = wrote:
  Yes, a=20 good idea. I will try to catch it :-) But how do i know that it is the = US mains=20 instead of a 60 Hz monitor? Is the 60 Hz from the mains more = stable?
I=20 guess the opposite: Similar to our Eu mains frequency, the US 60 Hz = signal=20 "wanders around" very slowly, as the load changes, but in the long run = they also=20 keep the frequency stable, nation-wide. Not sure about the maximum = excursion=20 from the nominal frequency (I lost the notes and screenshots years ago = when a=20 harddisk died) and how many mHz per minute the frequency may drift. But = you can=20 see the weak 60 Hz trace in Renato Romero's ZEVS spectrogram = at

http://www.vlf.it/zevs/zevs.htm<= /A>

73,
 =20 Wolf .

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