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Content preview: thanks Markus-very helpful-very interesting-Bob From: Wed, 25 Dec 2013 00:38:59 +0100 Subject: Re: VLF: SAQ Hi Bob, [...] Content analysis details: (1.1 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, no trust [65.55.116.14 listed in list.dnswl.org] 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (rjraide[at]hotmail.com) 1.6 SUBJ_ALL_CAPS Subject is all capitals -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record -0.6 RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message X-Scan-Signature: 60cd3dc4440dc5d656099dfe3d5cf4d2 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_56d29685-3020-4eb2-a954-4b8a9ee0835b_" Subject: RE: VLF: SAQ X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.1 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_HOTMAIL_RCVD,HTML_40_50, HTML_MESSAGE,SUBJ_ALL_CAPS,TO_ADDRESS_EQ_REAL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 1780 --_56d29685-3020-4eb2-a954-4b8a9ee0835b_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable thanks Markus-very helpful-very interesting-Bob =20 From: markusvester@aol.com To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Wed=2C 25 Dec 2013 00:38:59 +0100 Subject: Re: VLF: SAQ =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= Hi Bob=2C=0A= =0A= I've never been to Grimeton myself yet=2C so only a =0A= lttle understanding from reading and pictures. Recently there have been art= icles =0A= on SAQ in two German ham radio magazines (Funkamateur and cq-DL). =0A= Other members of the LF group may have much more knowledge=2C eg a =0A= couple of interesting tech notes from Dick PA0SE available on the =0A= web:=0A= http://hamradio.nikhef.nl/amrad/history/saq1.pdf=0A= http://hamradio.nikhef.nl/amrad/history/saq2.pdf=0A= Perhaps more loosely related=2C there's also the =0A= unforgettable electro-mechanical VLF receiver from Jim M0BMU=0A= http://www.wireless.org.uk/mechrx.htm =0A= =0A= =0A= > =0A= Is SAQ transmitter output determined by tuning of antenna. If =0A= over coupled would signal loose it's nice T9 tone and signal =0A= widen? =0A= > The giant alternator essentially behaves like a self excited osc =0A= transmitter? Setting antenna couple just right for max output with stable = =0A= chirp free tone?=20 =0A= No=2C I think the stability and tone quality of an =0A= alternator is solely related to the regulated speed of the motor and the ev= en =0A= tooth pitch in the generator. Antenna coupling will affect the output power= =2C but =0A= the frequency only indirectly due to a slight slowdown of the motor under = =0A= load..=0A= > It is essentially dumping keyup into a =0A= large dummy ant like an arc transmitter? Then simplifying tune-up so ant = =0A= match and coupling be similar to keyup condition into dummy =0A= ant?=0A= My understanding is that at keyup the antenna is detuned by =0A= a saturating inductor=2C there is no RF dumping into a dummy load. However = =0A= there seems to be an external chirp compensation circuit in the motor drive= =0A= which increases torque immediately on key down=2C preempting the slower =0A= frequency regulator loop. =0A= =0A= =0A= All the best to you and yours=2C=0A= =0A= 73=2C Markus (DF6NM)=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= From: Bob Raide =0A= Sent: Tuesday=2C December 24=2C 2013 5:59 PM=0A= To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org =0A= =0A= Subject: RE: VLF: SAQ=0A= =0A= Markus=3B If you have the time-hasn't got to be right now-first=2C =0A= Merry Xmas to you and family from us. Is SAQ transmitter output =0A= determined by tuning of antenna. If over coupled would signal loose it's = =0A= nice T9 tone and signal widen?=20 The giant alternator essentially behaves =0A= like a self excited osc transmitter? Setting antenna couple just right for= =0A= max output with stable chirp free tone?=20 It is essentially dumping =0A= keyup into a large dummy ant like an arc transmitter? Then simplifying =0A= tune-up so ant match and coupling be similar to keyup condition into dummy = =0A= ant?=0A= Bob =20 =0A= =0A= =0A= From: markusvester@aol.com To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Tue=2C 24 =0A= Dec 2013 09:24:13 +0100 Subject: VLF: SAQ =0A= =0A= =0A= Very nice reception here in Nuernberg as =0A= well:=0A= =0A= http://www.df6nm.darc.de/vlf/vlfgrabber.htm=0A= =0A= Merry Christmas to all!=0A= =0A= 73=2C Markus (DF6NM)=0A= =0A= = --_56d29685-3020-4eb2-a954-4b8a9ee0835b_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
thanks Markus-very helpful-very = interesting-Bob
 =3B
From: markusves= ter@aol.com
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Wed=2C 25 Dec 2013= 00:38:59 +0100
Subject: Re: VLF: SAQ

=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A=
Hi Bob=2C
=0A=
 =3B
=0A=
I've never been to Grimeton myself yet= =2C so only a =0A= lttle understanding from reading and pictures. Recently there have been art= icles =0A= on SAQ in =3Btwo German =3Bham radio magazines (Funkamateur and cq-= DL). =0A= Other members of the LF group =3Bmay have much more knowledge=2C eg&nbs= p=3Ba =0A= couple of interesting tech notes from Dick PA0SE available on the =0A= web:
=0A= =0A= =0A=
Perhaps more loosely related=2C there'= s also the =0A= unforgettable electro-mechanical VLF receiver from Jim M0BMU
= =0A= =0A=
 =3B
=0A=
 =3B
=0A=
>=3B =0A= Is =3BSAQ =3Btransmitter output determined by tuning of antenna.&nb= sp=3B If =0A= over coupled would signal loose it's nice T9 tone and signal =0A= widen? =3B
=0A=
>=3B The giant alternator essentially behaves like a self excited os= c =0A= transmitter? =3B Setting antenna couple just right for max output with = stable =0A= chirp free tone? =3B
=0A=
No=2C I think the stability and tone q= uality of an =0A= alternator is solely related to the regulated speed of the motor and the ev= en =0A= tooth pitch in the generator. Antenna coupling will affect the output power= =2C but =0A= the frequency only indirectly due to a slight slowdown of the motor under = =0A= load..
=0A=

>=3B =3BIt is essentially dumping keyup into a =0A= large dummy ant like an arc transmitter? =3B Then simplifying tune-up s= o ant =0A= match and coupling be similar to keyup condition into dummy =0A= ant?
=0A=

My understanding is that at keyup the antenna is detuned =3Bby= =0A= a =3Bsaturating inductor=2C there is no RF dumping into a dummy load. H= owever =0A= there seems to be an external chirp compensation circuit in the motor drive= =0A= which increases torque =3Bimmediately on key down=2C =3Bpreempting = the slower =0A= frequency regulator loop. =3B =3B
=0A=
 =3B
=0A=
 =3B
=0A=
All the best to you and yours=2C
=0A=
 =3B
=0A=
73=2C Markus (DF6NM)
=0A=
 =3B
=0A=
=0A=

=0A=
=0A=
From: Bob Raide=
=0A=
Sent: Tuesday=2C December 24=2C 2013 5:59 PM
=0A= =0A=
Subject: RE: VLF: SAQ
=0A=

=0A=
Markus=3B
If you have the time-hasn't got to be right n= ow-first=2C =0A= Merry Xmas to you and family from us.
Is =3BSAQ =3Btransmitter o= utput =0A= determined by tuning of antenna. =3B If over coupled would signal loose= it's =0A= nice T9 tone and signal widen? =3B
The giant alternator essentially = behaves =0A= like a self excited osc transmitter? =3B Setting antenna couple just ri= ght for =0A= max output with stable chirp free tone? =3B
 =3BIt is essentiall= y dumping =0A= keyup into a large dummy ant like an arc transmitter? =3B Then simplify= ing =0A= tune-up so ant match and coupling be similar to keyup condition into dummy = =0A= ant?
=0A=
Bob
 =3B
=0A=
=0A=
=0A= From: markusvester@aol.com
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Date: Tue= =2C 24 =0A= Dec 2013 09:24:13 +0100
Subject: VLF: SAQ

=0A= =0A= =0A=
Very nice reception here in Nuernberg = as =0A= well:
=0A=
 =3B
=0A= =0A=
 =3B
=0A=
Merry Christmas to all!
= =0A=
 =3B
=0A=
73=2C Markus (DF6NM)
=0A=
 =3B
=0A=
 =3B
=
= --_56d29685-3020-4eb2-a954-4b8a9ee0835b_--