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The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Stefan; I understand your setup. It is not that hard to move. I am not going to use such low VLF freq but as I mentioned am going for license to try get 28-30 kHz. Then I can run power up with less troubles of 8.9 kHz freq. It won't be till next season but am planning now for coil cover-coil size-etc. I have already 2' piece 18 inch white PVC pipe. Will wind 1000 meters #16 wire to start. I want to use my present 74 kHz coil inside as it is and add the extra coil outside then I can trim inside to hit exact resonance. [...] Content analysis details: (1.1 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, no trust [65.55.116.24 listed in list.dnswl.org] 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (rjraide[at]hotmail.com) 1.6 SUBJ_ALL_CAPS Subject is all capitals -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record -0.6 RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message X-Scan-Signature: 5bc6e377a7e48238fb2d1143b58fab98 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_2d792b04-2155-4742-ae26-fba74cb51555_" Subject: RE: VLF: 8969.99 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.6 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_HOTMAIL_RCVD, HTML_MESSAGE,SUBJ_ALL_CAPS,TO_ADDRESS_EQ_REAL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 1772 --_2d792b04-2155-4742-ae26-fba74cb51555_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Stefan=3B I understand your setup. It is not that hard to move. I am not going to use such low VLF freq but as I mentioned am going for lic= ense to try get 28-30 kHz. Then I can run power up with less troubles of 8= .9 kHz freq. It won't be till next season but am planning now for coil cov= er-coil size-etc. I have already 2' piece 18 inch white PVC pipe. Will wi= nd 1000 meters #16 wire to start. I want to use my present 74 kHz coil ins= ide as it is and add the extra coil outside then I can trim inside to hit e= xact resonance.=20 =20 Date: Thu=2C 26 Dec 2013 19:44:09 +0100 From: Stefan.Schaefer@iup.uni-heidelberg.de To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: VLF: 8969.99 =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= Hi Bob=2C=20 =0A= =0A= Oh=2C you're planning to become QRV on VLF=2C great!=20 =0A= What inductance will you need for your system? What coil diameter and=0A= wire diameter will you use? It is important to calculate the dimension=0A= of that coil before you start to wind it. A diameter of at least 60cm=0A= is to be recommended=2C better 80cm. But of course it depends on the wire= =0A= diameter and isolation (or insulation?). If you just use a coil body=0A= that is on hand and start winding=2C you may find the residual L is much=0A= to low and then you come out with 3 coils in series which will be a=0A= huge construction in very inefficient. You should also leave some=0A= distance to ground=2C to prevent losses into the soil. A distance equal=0A= to the coil diameter is fine. =0A= How will you manage the high voltages on the antenna? You will have to=0A= manage 50 kV rms or so.=20 =0A= =0A= For me=2C the situation is not as easy. I must not leave the coil its=0A= position permanenty. I have to remove it after the experiment. But=0A= that's not so dramatic. I can leave it into the building and we have an=0A= elevator... =0A= Keep us informed by some photos :-) =0A= =0A= 73=2C Stefan/DK7FC =0A= =0A= =0A= Am 26.12.2013 18:58=2C schrieb Bob Raide:=0A= =0A= =0A= Stefan=3B =0A= If I go to VLF I am going to add to my existing inductance outside. I=0A= plan to make a box using "plexiglass" quarter inch thick with glued=0A= seams so is weather proof. It will be clear [no color] and is very=0A= good dielectric. I was going to ask you how much clearance I need and=0A= 30 cm is about 1 foot or 12 inches clearance around the coil. Leave=0A= air gap around bottom so air can circulate so you don't build up=0A= moisture. Small muffin fan with shroud to pull fresh air up and around=0A= coil and out. =0A= Could even use clear vinyl material .025 thick and a clear vinyl box=0A= over a plastic pipe frame would be cheaper. Clear vinyl used for side=0A= curtains on boats-etc.=20 =0A= I am in sewing business [make boat and truck covers] so could make you=0A= cover and you build the frame-I ship clear vinyl cover UPS to you or=0A= you could have local canvas company make it. Use "RTV" over stitches=0A= to make water tight-Bob =0A= =20 =0A= =0A= Date: Thu=2C 26 Dec 2013 18:32:43 +0100 =0A= From: Stefan.Schaefer@iup.uni-heidelberg.de =0A= To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org =0A= Subject: Re: VLF: 8969.99 =0A= =20 =0A= Hi Bob=2C=20 =0A= =20 =0A= Of course=2C if the coil is protected against rain=2C then it is no=0A= problem. But the coil is quite large and due to the high voltage=2C the=0A= housing should ideally have a distance of 30cm or more to the coil. So=0A= the housing must be quite large=2C even more. And that makes it dangerous= =0A= because of wind blasts on the to of the building in 35m AGL...=20 =0A= Anyway it would be nice and i also thought about using a simple foil=0A= across the coil=2C without additional distance.=20 =0A= However on LF=2C there are partial discharges on the top of the coil=0A= which burns holes into the protecting foil. And the VLF winding is=0A= 2000m long. It is a lot of effort to repair it after a short cut=0A= between some turns due to arcing. So it is a high risk.=20 =0A= I think i will make a test in the near future and see if 9 kHz partial=0A= discharges are as agressive as 137 kHz partial discharges :-) =0A= 73=2C Stefan/DK7FC =0A= =20 =0A= Am 26.12.2013 16:32=2C schrieb Bob Raide:=0A= =0A= =0A= Stefan=3B =0A= Even if you have your coils in weather proof housing rain is no good to=0A= transmit on 9 kHz? Bob =0A= =20 =0A= =0A= Date: Thu=2C 26 Dec 2013 13:55:11 +0100 =0A= From: Stefan.Schaefer@iup.uni-heidelberg.de =0A= To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org =0A= Subject: Re: VLF: 8969.99 =0A= =20 =0A= Hi Uwe=2C Tom=2C VLF=2C =0A= =20 =0A= Best signal ever from Tom=2C capture attached. Is it due to the=0A= propagation or did it improve your signal? =0A= What about some tests in OPDS32 or maybe JT9-30? Unfortunately there is=0A= permanent rain here so i have to wait some days longer. =0A= =20 =0A= 73=2C Stefan/DK7FC=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= = --_2d792b04-2155-4742-ae26-fba74cb51555_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Stefan=3B
I understand your s= etup. =3B It is not that hard to move.
I am not going to use such lo= w VLF freq but as I mentioned am going for license to try get 28-30 kHz.&nb= sp=3B Then I can run power up with less troubles of 8.9 kHz freq. =3B I= t won't be till next season but am planning now for coil cover-coil size-et= c. =3B I have already 2' piece 18 inch white PVC pipe. =3B Will win= d 1000 meters #16 wire to start. =3B I want to use my present 74 kHz co= il inside as it is and add the extra coil outside then I can trim inside to= hit exact resonance.
 =3B
Date: Th= u=2C 26 Dec 2013 19:44:09 +0100
From: Stefan.Schaefer@iup.uni-heidelberg= .de
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: Re: VLF: 8969.99
=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= Hi Bob=2C
=0A=
=0A= Oh=2C you're planning to become QRV on VLF=2C great!
=0A= What inductance will you need for your system? What coil diameter and=0A= wire diameter will you use? It is important to calculate the dimension=0A= of that coil before you start to wind it. A diameter of at least 60cm=0A= is to be recommended=2C better 80cm. But of course it depends on the wire= =0A= diameter and isolation (or insulation?). If you just use a coil body=0A= that is on hand and start winding=2C you may find the residual L is much=0A= to low and then you come out with 3 coils in series which will be a=0A= huge construction in very inefficient. You should also leave some=0A= distance to ground=2C to prevent losses into the soil. A distance equal=0A= to the coil diameter is fine.
=0A= How will you manage the high voltages on the antenna? You will have to=0A= manage 50 kV rms or so.
=0A=
=0A= For me=2C the situation is not as easy. I must not leave the coil its=0A= position permanenty. I have to remove it after the experiment. But=0A= that's not so dramatic. I can leave it into the building and we have an=0A= elevator...
=0A= Keep us informed by some photos :-)
=0A=
=0A= 73=2C Stefan/DK7FC
=0A=
=0A=
=0A= Am 26.12.2013 18:58=2C schrieb Bob Raide:=0A=
=0A= =0A=
Stefan=3B
=0A= If I =3Bgo to VLF I am going to add to my existing inductance outside.&= nbsp=3B I=0A= plan to make a box using "plexiglass" quarter inch thick with glued=0A= seams so is weather proof. =3B It will be clear [no color] and is very= =0A= good dielectric. =3B I was going to ask you how much clearance I need a= nd=0A= 30 =3Bcm is about 1 foot or 12 inches clearance around the coil. = =3B Leave=0A= air gap around bottom so air can circulate so you don't build up=0A= moisture. =3B Small muffin fan with shroud to pull fresh air up and aro= und=0A= coil and out.
=0A= Could even use clear vinyl material =3B.025 thick and =3Ba =3Bc= lear vinyl box=0A= over =3Ba plastic pipe frame would be cheaper. =3B Clear vinyl used= for side=0A= curtains on boats-etc.
=0A= I am in sewing business [make boat and truck covers] so could make you=0A= cover and you build the frame-I ship clear vinyl cover UPS to you or=0A= you could have local canvas company make it. =3B Use "RTV" over stitche= s=0A= to make water tight-Bob
=0A=  =3B
=0A=
=0A=
Date: Thu=2C 26 Dec 2013 18:32:43 +0100
=0A= From: Stefan.Schaefer@iup.uni-heidelberg.de
=0A= To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
=0A= Subject: Re: VLF: 8969.99
=0A=
=0A= Hi Bob=2C
=0A=
=0A= Of course=2C if the coil is protected against rain=2C then it is no=0A= problem. But the coil is quite large and due to the high voltage=2C the=0A= housing should ideally have a distance of 30cm or more to the coil. So=0A= the housing must be quite large=2C even more. And that makes it dangerous= =0A= because of wind blasts on the to of the building in 35m AGL...
=0A= Anyway it would be nice and i also thought about using a simple foil=0A= across the coil=2C without additional distance.
=0A= However on LF=2C there are partial discharges on the top of the coil=0A= which burns holes into the protecting foil. And the VLF winding is=0A= 2000m long. It is a lot of effort to repair it after a short cut=0A= between some turns due to arcing. So it is a high risk.
=0A= I think i will make a test in the near future and see if 9 kHz partial=0A= discharges are as agressive as 137 kHz partial discharges :-)
=0A= 73=2C Stefan/DK7FC
=0A=
=0A= Am 26.12.2013 16:32=2C schrieb Bob Raide:=0A=
=0A= =0A=
Stefan=3B
=0A= Even if you have your coils in weather proof housing rain is no good to=0A= transmit on 9 kHz? Bob
=0A=  =3B
=0A=
=0A=
Date: Thu=2C 26 Dec 2013 13:55:11 +0100
= =0A= From: Stefan.Schaefer@iup.uni-heidelberg.de
=0A= To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
=0A= Subject: Re: VLF: 8969.99
=0A=
=0A= Hi Uwe=2C Tom=2C VLF=2C
=0A=
=0A= Best signal ever from Tom=2C capture attached. Is it due to the=0A= propagation or did it improve your signal?
=0A= What about some tests in OPDS32 or maybe JT9-30? Unfortunately there is=0A= permanent rain here so i have to wait some days longer.
=0A=
=0A= 73=2C Stefan/DK7FC
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
= --_2d792b04-2155-4742-ae26-fba74cb51555_--