Delivered-To: daveyxm@virginmedia.com Received: by 10.66.155.72 with SMTP id vu8csp12366pab; Thu, 4 Jul 2013 04:58:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.15.102.68 with SMTP id bq44mr6365735eeb.89.1372939099015; Thu, 04 Jul 2013 04:58:19 -0700 (PDT) Return-Path: Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com. [195.171.43.25]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id v7si2179936eew.336.2013.07.04.04.58.18 for ; Thu, 04 Jul 2013 04:58:19 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 195.171.43.25 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org) client-ip=195.171.43.25; Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 195.171.43.25 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org) smtp.mail=owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1UuhhY-0003ob-47 for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 Jul 2013 12:27:52 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1UuhhX-0003oS-8S for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 Jul 2013 12:27:51 +0100 Received: from relay.uni-heidelberg.de ([129.206.100.212]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1UuhhU-00065J-2h for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 04 Jul 2013 12:27:50 +0100 Received: from freitag.iup.uni-heidelberg.de (freitag.iup.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.29.204]) by relay.uni-heidelberg.de (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id r64BRkMX008568 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 4 Jul 2013 13:27:47 +0200 Received: from [129.206.22.206] (pc206.iup.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.22.206]) by freitag.iup.uni-heidelberg.de (8.12.11.20060308/8.11.2) with ESMTP id r64BRhKs030108 for ; Thu, 4 Jul 2013 13:27:43 +0200 Message-ID: <51D55C2D.3020402@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2013 13:27:41 +0200 From: =?UTF-8?B?U3RlZmFuIFNjaMOkZmVy?= User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; de; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100227 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <75EB07EA-3F34-4C53-A7DC-521C099FAB6F@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <75EB07EA-3F34-4C53-A7DC-521C099FAB6F@gmail.com> X-Spam-Score: -0.9 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Oh yes, interesting projects!!! :-) Instead of thick copper pipe one could use the decca RF litz wire (729 strands). That must be very efficient. I feel like a little boy again who wants to play with simple and basic RF stuff, these days :-) [...] Content analysis details: (-0.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.7 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, low trust [129.206.100.212 listed in list.dnswl.org] -0.2 RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message X-Scan-Signature: 2728faa227459cbf7dd0051df2cd1c1d Subject: Re: LF: WSPR-2 on 630m last night, G3YXM indoors Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------010709090802030903030109" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=5.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE, HTML_TAG_EXISTS_TBODY,MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 3306 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------010709090802030903030109 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by relay.uni-heidelberg.de id r64BRkMX008568 Oh yes, interesting projects!!! :-) Instead of thick copper pipe one could use the decca RF litz wire (729=20 strands). That must be very efficient. I feel like a little boy again who wants to play with simple and basic=20 RF stuff, these days :-) Last night i have set up my /p MF RX station. The small RX converter,=20 driven by the 5V USB output of my small netbook (+ a 5V/12V DC/DC=20 converter, 1W), the netbook itselfe and the *ferrite antenna* tuned to=20 475 kHz. Now that i have a smartphone which offers a WLAN hotspot and=20 internet flatrate i can even upload the spots when beeing /p somewhere.=20 The antenna was placed* indoors*, pointing to UK (NW/SE). I actually=20 received *G3YXM* with this setup! Timestamp Call MHz SNR Drift Grid Pwr Reporter RGrid km az 2013-07-04 00:46 G3YXM 0.475712 -24 0 IO92bk 0.5=20 DK7FC/P JN49ij 814 110 Thanks for the transmission Dave. I'm going to play with RX antennas and maybe i will also play with the=20 MF dipole in the forest again :-) 73 all Stefan/DK7FC Am 04.07.2013 08:46, schrieb Roger Lapthorn: > Hi Dimitrios, > > Don't forget to consider wire loop antennas for 630m. My QRP set-up has= got reports from Finland for 3 autumns running at around 1800km with jus= t a thin wire loop in the garden. With thicker wire it could be at least = 3dB more efficient. Larger loops could gain another 6dB at least. They ne= ed no ground, are easy to resonate and match, and have useful directivity. > > I am sure a very efficient fixed MF antenna could be made with thick co= pper pipe without being very big. > > 73s > Roger G3XBM > > On 3 Jul 2013, at 00:10, Dimitrios Tsifakis wrote= : > > =20 >> Hi Dave, >> >> There are no problems here operating portable on 630m. The only >> problem with portable operation is that it is hard to provide a low >> impedance ground system. At home, I have a number of copper plated >> rods and the impedance of my antenna is about 20 ohm, which is great. >> When /P though, this figure is always much higher, and that ain't >> because the radiation resistance has gone up miraculously ;-) >> >> By the way, I am always amazed by the distance covered by such low >> radiated power. Surely this has to do with 630 m but also with the >> WSPR protocol. I routinely reach Tasmania, Brisbane and Adelaide with >> my low power beacon, and the are all just shy of 1000 km away. I have >> also reached a station in Alice Springs, right in the middle of the >> country, and that's closer to 2000 km. If there were more listeners >> further away, I am sure they would report reception too. >> >> 73, Dimitris VK1SV >> >> >> 2013/7/3 Dave G3WCB.: >> =20 >>> Hi, Dimitris, LF. >>> >>> Thanks for posting an interesting article on QRP WSPR. I've been >>> experimenting along similar lines, but in my case I'm using a QRP Lab= s >>> Ultimate 2 kit, which uses the same DDS as your TX, but the WSPR is >>> generated by an ATmega168 AVR microcontroller. No PC necessary. >>> >>> With an RF output of about 2 watts into a 5m high "tee" antenna with = a 20m >>> top, I've been consistently spotted at 363km range during darkness by= PA3ABK >>> and PA0A at 499km, with just one spot by DG3LV at 791km range. >>> >>> My ultimate aim is to assemble a portable WSPR station and hike out t= o a >>> remote location, for example Dartmoor, in Devon. I'll need to check t= o see >>> if the terms of my licence NOV allow portable operation on 630m first= ;-) >>> >>> 73, Dave G3WCB IO91RM >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org >>> [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of Dimitrios >>> Tsifakis >>> Sent: 02 July 2013 00:39 >>> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org >>> Subject: Re: LF: WSPR-2 on 630m last night >>> >>> >>> Hi Stefan, >>> >>> VK dominates WSPR in numbers but not in records - yet! :-) >>> >>> I have been busy with university homework but that's finishing now, s= o >>> I will get busy with radio again. My latest experiment is a very >>> simple WSPR-2 Arduino/DDS/Class-E transmitter. The web page below is >>> work in progress: >>> >>> http://people.physics.anu.edu.au/~dxt103/472/wspr_tx/ >>> >>> I have also been doing some tests with a very restricted antenna just >>> to prove the point that a super large antenna is not the only way to >>> enjoy the new low bands. Last weekend I did a quick test with the WSP= R >>> beacon from my block of land outside Canberra, using the earth dipole >>> antenna. I was able to cover 180 km with only 5 W and I know what to >>> do to improve this. Can't beat a ground antenna when it comes to >>> convenience! >>> >>> 73, Dimitris Vk1SV >>> >>> 2013/7/2 Stefan Sch=C3=A4fer: >>> =20 >>>> Hi Dimitris, >>>> >>>> Am 01.07.2013 06:02, schrieb Dimitrios Tsifakis: >>>> >>>> =20 >>>>> Not only it's winter, but I noticed that VK dominates WSPR on 630m = on a >>>>> regular basis :-) >>>>> =20 >>>> Are you sure? :-) >>>> >>>> >>>> =20 >>>>> There are plenty of stations monitoring, from all over the country, >>>>> including, from time to time, one from Perth, Western Australia. >>>>> =20 >>>> Yes, i see. It is very nice to see so much activity from down under.= But >>>> where are all the ZL stations? >>>> >>>> >>>> =20 >>>>> So far, we haven't managed to repeat the VK1DSH->F6CNI record but >>>>> =20 >>> perhaps, >>> =20 >>>>> if the activity keeps to a high level, it's a matter of time until = an EU >>>>> station is received here. >>>>> =20 >>>> That was a very rare event i guess. But we'll try. Thanks for the >>>> motivation. BTW soon the LF DX season starts again and Edgar has don= e a >>>> =20 >>> lot >>> =20 >>>> of effort to prepare for a new #3 DX WR on LF. I'll try to transmit = as >>>> =20 >>> much >>> =20 >>>> as possible, either on MF or on LF. Actually i should really build a= n >>>> automatic antenna switch. Then i can send a MF WSPR 2 block between = the >>>> =20 >>> gap >>> =20 >>>> of 2 LF DFCW-180 elements :-) >>>> >>>> Have fun and good luck! >>>> Any new /p experiments from your side? And how does the tube PA perf= orm >>>> =20 >>> now? >>> =20 >>>> 73, Stefan/DK7FC >>>> >>>> =20 >>>>> 73, Dimitris VK1SV >>>>> =20 >> =20 > =20 --------------010709090802030903030109 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by relay.uni-heidelberg.de id r64BRkMX008568 Oh yes, interesting projects!!! :-)
Instead of thick copper pipe one could use the decca RF litz wire (729 strands). That must be very efficient.
I feel like a little boy again who wants to play with simple and basic RF stuff, these days :-)

Last night i have set up my /p MF RX station. The small RX converter, driven by the 5V USB output of my small netbook (+ a 5V/12V DC/DC converter, 1W), the netbook itselfe and the ferrite antenna tuned to 475 kHz. Now that i have a smartphone which offers a WLAN hotspot and internet flatrate i can even upload the spots when beeing /p somewhere. The antenna was placed indoors, pointing to UK (NW/SE). I actually received G3YXM with this setup!

Timestamp Call MHz SNR Drift Grid Pwr Reporter RGrid km az
=C2=A02013-07-04 00:46=C2=A0 =C2=A0G3YXM=C2=A0 =C2=A00.475712=C2=A0 =C2=A0-24=C2=A0 =C2=A00=C2=A0 =C2=A0IO92bk=C2=A0 =C2=A00.5=C2=A0 =C2=A0DK7FC/P=C2=A0 =C2=A0JN49ij=C2=A0 =C2=A0814=C2=A0 =C2=A0110=C2=A0

Thanks for the transmission Dave.

I'm going to play with RX antennas and maybe i will also play with the MF dipole in the forest again :-)

73 all

Stefan/DK7FC


Am 04.07.2013 08:46, schrieb Roger Lapthorn:
Hi Dimitrios,

Don't forget to consider wire loop antennas for 630m. My QRP set-up has g=
ot reports from Finland for 3 autumns running at around 1800km with just =
a thin wire loop in the garden. With thicker wire it could be at least 3d=
B more efficient. Larger loops could gain another 6dB at least. They need=
 no ground, are easy to resonate and match, and have useful directivity.=20

I am sure a very efficient fixed MF antenna could be made with thick copp=
er pipe without being very big.=20

73s
Roger G3XBM

On 3 Jul 2013, at 00:10, Dimitrios Tsifakis <dtsifakis@gmail.com>=
 wrote:

  
Hi Dave,

There are no problems here operating portable on 630m. The only
problem with portable operation is that it is hard to provide a low
impedance ground system. At home, I have a number of copper plated
rods and the impedance of my antenna is about 20 ohm, which is great.
When /P though, this figure is always much higher, and that ain't
because the radiation resistance has gone up miraculously ;-)

By the way, I am always amazed by the distance covered by such low
radiated power. Surely this has to do with 630 m but also with the
WSPR protocol. I routinely reach Tasmania, Brisbane and Adelaide with
my low power beacon, and the are all just shy of 1000 km away. I have
also reached a station in Alice Springs, right in the middle of the
country, and that's closer to 2000 km. If there were more listeners
further away, I am sure they would report reception too.

73, Dimitris VK1SV


2013/7/3 Dave G3WCB. <ganymede444@btopenworld.com>:
    
Hi, Dimitris, LF.

Thanks for posting an interesting article on QRP WSPR. I've been
experimenting along similar lines, but in my case I'm using a QRP Labs
Ultimate 2 kit, which uses the same DDS as your TX, but the WSPR is
generated by an ATmega168 AVR microcontroller. No PC necessary.

With an RF output of about 2 watts into a 5m high "tee" antenna with a 20=
m
top, I've been consistently spotted at 363km range during darkness by PA3=
ABK
and PA0A at 499km, with just one spot by DG3LV at 791km range.

My ultimate aim is to assemble a portable WSPR station and hike out to a
remote location, for example Dartmoor, in Devon. I'll need to check to se=
e
if the terms of my licence NOV allow portable operation on 630m first ;-)

73, Dave G3WCB IO91RM

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of =
Dimitrios
Tsifakis
Sent: 02 July 2013 00:39
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: Re: LF: WSPR-2 on 630m last night


Hi Stefan,

VK dominates WSPR in numbers but not in records -  yet!  :-)

I have been busy with university homework but that's finishing now, so
I will get busy with radio again. My latest experiment is a very
simple WSPR-2 Arduino/DDS/Class-E transmitter. The web page below is
work in progress:

http://people.physics.anu.edu.au/~dxt103/472/wsp=
r_tx/

I have also been doing some tests with a very restricted antenna just
to prove the point that a super large antenna is not the only way to
enjoy the new low bands. Last weekend I did a quick test with the WSPR
beacon from my block of land outside Canberra, using the earth dipole
antenna. I was able to cover 180 km with only 5 W and I know what to
do to improve this. Can't beat a ground antenna when it comes to
convenience!

73, Dimitris Vk1SV

2013/7/2 Stefan Sch=C3=A4fer <Stefan.Schaefer@iup.uni-=
heidelberg.de>:
      
Hi Dimitris,

Am 01.07.2013 06:02, schrieb Dimitrios Tsifakis:

        
Not only it's winter, but I noticed that VK domi=
nates WSPR on 630m on a
regular basis :-)
          
Are you sure? :-)


        
There are plenty of stations monitoring, from al=
l over the country,
including, from time to time, one from Perth, Western Australia.
          
Yes, i see. It is very nice to see so much activity from down under. But
where are all the ZL stations?


        
So far, we haven't managed to repeat the VK1DSH-=
>F6CNI record but
          
perhaps,
      
if the activity keeps to a high level, it's a ma=
tter of time until an EU
station is received here.
          
That was a very rare event i guess. But we'll try. Thanks for the
motivation. BTW soon the LF DX season starts again and Edgar has done a
        
lot
      
of effort to prepare for a new #3 DX WR on LF. I'l=
l try to transmit as
        
much
      
as possible, either on MF or on LF. Actually i sho=
uld really build an
automatic antenna switch. Then i can send a MF WSPR 2 block between the
        
gap
      
of 2 LF DFCW-180 elements :-)

Have fun and good luck!
Any new /p experiments from your side? And how does the tube PA perform
        
now?
      
73, Stefan/DK7FC

        
73, Dimitris VK1SV
          
    
  
--------------010709090802030903030109--