Return-Path: Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-mi05.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 69DBA3800011F; Wed, 2 Jan 2013 19:32:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1TqYiD-0004ti-PG for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Jan 2013 00:31:09 +0000 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1TqYiC-0004tZ-Oo for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Jan 2013 00:31:08 +0000 Received: from nm11.bullet.mail.ird.yahoo.com ([77.238.189.64]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1TqYiA-000185-63 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Jan 2013 00:31:07 +0000 Received: from [77.238.189.56] by nm11.bullet.mail.ird.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2013 00:30:45 -0000 Received: from [212.82.108.237] by tm9.bullet.mail.ird.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2013 00:30:45 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1002.mail.ird.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2013 00:30:45 -0000 X-DKIM-Result: Domain=yahoo.co.uk Result=Good and Known Domain X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 80312.28576.bm@omp1002.mail.ird.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 80811 invoked by uid 60001); 3 Jan 2013 00:30:45 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.co.uk; s=s1024; t=1357173044; bh=7os4izlYjGZ/iq3rXbT+sDVRXorNt53+SltDOOHWnUk=; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=Vsmq/M/pwxsJcGCaWmzeivazTxEtK0kCtnM8mjapWztjXDnLV1e9sNZcfEjc6259av6+gBHK7kcrRqVxyJ6ffijtIS0n9oqHTnQAbEUKCNzEKQb2PuGA/AGFbmugMuwFj54K47FDTQB76cwxGEX01/h9QUDufE9vPLn2oe+NqFo= DomainKey-Signature:a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.co.uk; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Rocket-MIMEInfo:X-Mailer:References:Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=XTQZ/6Zw74skJkaFypOjJpDDUTiv8RzcqOEK0iCHf+3xf/z6M4JtRI6dp0pmxX5f9Q2ncRhEAgIyjSIYPyznyh0j0y+wu8T9WTcsjsPi2baucUgiCS1L8y4iWLudpX7jOH0/jfsFIAyuveBdF+b0Eh6f01I1EQ9Z49OsF0HtWjE=; X-YMail-OSG: Li10a3kVM1mlJc6nCLliLWza40BQtlXEpoUdVIYDwaIs4W. 44uZSXSqahQt0O8CZSQ.QRZxeR4R8mz6uPIv7eKoTiNDTPAAc3dU7412Aa59 R5fO2X2bq80uW92mtcAhFPwzrqWCr88Da99L7Nw2QFyBrfD1W.CDAPhMHO4s mNxx_ME6ZzYZMfdegseSqjak.tUTGZ9MY90pdEWtaUm6fo0KJgF30vvHr2_h v0qpQCmS57hO3KR3IG5HHLFDVdbxUoYGavHIaDDyjH3IzaJ3FW1j4vLXQw5B yonKdMaaqn0Bamz5CN43DQFRZfVqj.dRQj6JqtY0wsWsZ1ldkDGbpDVtSTv8 gccnbqyGbJDnVWdB.oynKhVXJ5PTLnd9mTrRTR7gweMdcuzVc9sCIYsKp_d2 jkuOkuTRxwopT7GACtmGNF72HkDW7zEts6ITVoDBtHi5YmaIIMWltUS8XmhQ KeWrZmtHKMulc_i16ZYWEtgSQoWb3oCxTiOk5QkN4dCi_hSZMDQ-- Received: from [86.155.211.73] by web133203.mail.ir2.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 03 Jan 2013 00:30:44 GMT X-Rocket-MIMEInfo: 001.001,SGkgR3JhaGFtIEdlcmkgYW5kIGFsbArCoApXYXJyZW4gaGFzIHNlZW4gU1NCIGZpcnN0IGhhbmQgb24gdGhlIE1GIFFSRyBhbmQgd2UgaGF2ZSB0aGlzIHNpZGUgYWxzby5UaGVyZSB3YXMgYW4gU00gc3RhdGlvbiAoY2FsbCBzaWduIGZvcmdvdHRlbj8pIGluIHRoZSBlYXJseSBkYXlzIG9mIDUwMMKgdGhhdCBhZGRlZCBhbiBTU0IgYW5vdW5jZW1lbnQgb24gaGlzIGJlYWNvbiBhbmTCoGl0IHdvcmtlZCB3ZWxsLgrCoApUbyBteSBzcGVjLiA6LSAiT25lIFNTQiBjaGFubmVsIGF0IHRoZSBoaWdoIGVkZ2Ugb2YBMAEBAQE- X-Mailer: YahooMailWebService/0.8.129.483 References: <0A4D88A68FCB4F22A2BC40825788A6AA@AGB> <1357150913.48886.YahooMailNeo@web133204.mail.ir2.yahoo.com> <63C5AFAA6F8C41A7936F2069D38FAC01@AGB> <81FED2F455C94E45B3BE41353A6D53BC@W1KW> <52B2628757094925BA8206A2C0D9640B@AGB> Message-ID: <1357173044.69099.YahooMailNeo@web133203.mail.ir2.yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 00:30:44 +0000 (GMT) From: M0FMT To: "rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org" In-Reply-To: <52B2628757094925BA8206A2C0D9640B@AGB> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Hi Graham Geri and all Warren has seen SSB first hand on the MF QRG and we have this side also.There was an SM station (call sign forgotten?) in the early days of 500 that added an SSB anouncement on his beacon and it worked well. To my spec. :- "One SSB channel at the high edge of the band only used during daylight hours no DXing!" add " Use VOX, no monologuing allowed" to be a laissez faire operation no band plan, but fair play!.73 es GL es HNY Pete M0FMT IO91UX [...] Content analysis details: (0.0 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, no trust [77.238.189.64 listed in list.dnswl.org] 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (m0fmt[at]yahoo.co.uk) 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message 0.0 T_DKIM_INVALID DKIM-Signature header exists but is not valid X-Scan-Signature: c2d3004053ffd6a8f3b98d2033b61db9 Subject: Re: LF: 477 A local SSB chat band ? Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="313692494-1625757897-1357173044=:69099" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_MESSAGE, TO_ADDRESS_EQ_REAL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: mtain-mi05.r1000.mx.aol.com ; domain : yahoo.co.uk DKIM : fail x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d7b8d50e4d191330a X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none --313692494-1625757897-1357173044=:69099 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Graham Geri and all=0A=A0=0AWarren has seen SSB first hand on the MF QRG= and we have this side also.There was an SM station (call sign forgotten?) = in the early days of 500=A0that added an SSB anouncement on his beacon and= =A0it worked well.=0A=A0=0ATo my spec. :- "One SSB channel at the high edge= of the band only used during daylight hours no DXing!" add " Use VOX, no= monologuing allowed"=A0to be a laissez faire operation no band plan, but f= air play!.73 es GL es HNY Pete M0FMT IO91UX=0A=0A=0A>______________________= __________=0A> From: Graham =0A>To: rsgb_lf_group@= blacksheep.org =0A>Sent: Wednesday, 2 January 2013, 20:48=0A>Subject: Re: L= F: 477 A local SSB chat band ?=0A> =0A>=0A> =0A>Geri =0A>=0A>800 Hz= =A0 B/W ...=A0 May=A0 be this=A0 is=A0 something=A0 =0A'Wolf' can=A0 code= =A0 for=A0 you=A0 ? a=A0 b/w =A0 compression =0A/ expansion=A0 module in SL= =A0, to=A0 limit the=A0 tx b/w=A0 =0Ato=A0 800=A0 Hz must=A0 be=A0 possibl= e to=A0 divide=A0 =0Aby=A0 3=A0 and=A0 mult=A0 by=A0 3=A0 with a=A0 linear = =0Ashift=A0 as=A0 well ? =0A>=0A>G.. =0A>=0A> =0A>From: Holger 'Geri', DK8K= W - DI2BO - W1KW =0A>Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2013 8:36 PM =0A>To: rsg= b_lf_group@blacksheep.org =0A>Subject: Re: LF: 477 A local SSB chat band ?= =0A>=0A> =0A>Hi, =0A>=A0 =0A>I kind of like the idea of an SSB channel. I = just =0Apulled out the conditions of my first secial license for 160m from = 1973 or 1974. =0AThat said 1815 to 1835 kHz with 10 Watts in CW, additional= ly one SSB channel for =0A1832 to 1835 kHz, so why not trying this on 630m,= too? Here in Germany we are =0Acurrently limited to 800 Hz bandwidt but I = am sure we can sork towards a special =0Alicense under certain conditions s= uch as daylight operation only=A0.. sounds =0Agood to me! =0A>=A0 =0A>Vy 73= =0A>=A0 =0A>Geri, DK8KW =0A>=A0 =0A>----- Original Message ----- =0A>>Fro= m: Graham =0A>>To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org =0A>>Sent: Wednesday, Jan= uary 02, 2013 8:58 PM =0A>>Subject: Re: LF: 477 A local SSB chat band ? = =0A>>=0A>> =0A>>Hi Pete =0A>>=0A>>Its=A0 quite=A0 obvious that=A0 the=A0 al= location=A0 is=A0 =A0quite=A0 able=A0 to=A0 support=A0 normal=A0=A0 armat= ure=A0 activity , and=A0 why=A0 not=A0 ? its no=A0 longer a experimental= =A0 allocation , its just the=A0 same=A0 as=A0=A0 10=A0 or top=A0 band , u= n expected=A0 results=A0 today though !=A0 ssb=A0 sounds=A0 odd=A0 , may= =A0 be=A0 as=A0 the=A0 path is=A0 stable ,=A0=A0 sstv ?=A0 must=A0 be a=A0= narrow=A0 mode=A0 , and the=A0 'new'=A0 digital=A0 voice=A0 is 2KHz=A0 , = but that=A0 requires=A0 a=A0 linear=A0 Tx=A0 path=A0 =0A>>=0A>>As=A0 for= =A0 the=A0 band edge =0A>>=0A>>=A0I'm =A0straining=A0 to=A0 find=A0 a=A0 = engineering=A0=A0 reason=A0 , that=A0 wspr=A0 and=A0 qrss=A0 has=A0 decide= d to=A0 run mid band ?=A0Im sure=A0 users had a=A0 reasonable discussion= =A0 at the=A0 introduction=A0 of the=A0 band , to=A0 place the=A0 modes=A0= at the=A0 edges ,=A0with=A0 live=A0 cw a the=A0 lower=A0 portion ?=A0=A0= its well=A0 know=A0 that=A0 these=A0 long=A0 carrier=A0 modes=A0 cause=A0 = disruption=A0 to=A0 other=A0 band=A0 users and=A0 are=A0 well=A0 placed=A0= at the=A0=A0band=A0 edges =A0, 'vanity=A0 beacons'=A0 is a term=A0I have= =A0 seen=A0 noted=A0 in referral, as occupancy=A0 increases , by users=A0 = not=A0 linked or=A0 even=A0 aware=A0 of=A0 =A0discussions=A0=A0 taking pla= ce on these=A0 groups , i'm sure there=A0 will=A0 be=A0=A0problems=A0 lead= ing=A0 to=A0 the=A0 introduction=A0 of =A0band plan's=A0 , for=A0 some=A0= the=A0 plans=A0 form=A0 part of the=A0 licence=A0 conditions .. =0A>>=0A>= >Is Opera=A0 a vanity=A0 system=A0? , actually=A0 no, it=A0 compliments=A0= =A0 ros-=A0 data=A0 mode in that=A0 the=A0 ave s/n=A0=A0 readings=A0 can b= e used to=A0 determine=A0 if=A0 a=A0 path=A0 will=A0 support=A0 the=A0 dat= a=A0 mode , each=A0 having=A0 the=A0 same=A0=A0 averaging=A0 s/n=A0 readi= ng=A0 taken along the=A0 time=A0 line =A0, =0A>>=0A>>73 -G.. =0A>>=0A>>=0A= >>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>> =0A>>From: M0FMT =0A>>Sent: Wednesday, Ja= nuary 02, 2013 6:21 PM =0A>>To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org =0A>>Subject:= Re: LF: 477 A local SSB chat band ? =0A>>=0A>> =0A>>Hi all =0A>>=A0 =0A>>O= ne SSB channel at the high edge of the band only used during daylight hour= s no DXing!=0A>>=0A>> =0A>>73 es GL es HNY=A0Pete M0FMT IO91UX=0A>>=0A>>=0A= >>>________________________________=0A>>>From: Graham =0A>>>To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org =0A>>>Sent: Wednesday, 2 January= 2013, 16:13=0A>>>Subject: LF: 477 A local SSB chat band ?=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A= >>>Quite=A0 intriguing=A0 propagation=A0 on this=A0 'new'=A0 band =0A>>>= =0A>>>From=A0 some=A0 unexpected=A0 early=A0 600 mile=A0 +=A0=A0 Opera=A0 = decodes=A0 last=A0 night=A0 , to=A0 several=A0=A0 wspr=A0=A0 TA=A0 decodes= ,=A0 [G8's=A0 again ..]=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0to=A0=A0 today's=A0=A0 test=A0 wit= h=A0 Gary=A0 using=A0=A0 USB-SSB=A0 voice , =0A>>>=0A>>>Where=A0 as=A0at= =A0=A0=A01300z=A0 =A0we=A0 had=A0 5/9=A0 signals each=A0 way=A0 as=A0 exp= ected=A0=A0 over 25 miles=A0 ,=A0 GI3PDN=A0=A0 Ray=A0 , called=A0 on CW , = to=A0=A0 give=A0 a=A0 report of=A0 5/9 across=A0 the=A0 Irish=A0=A0 Sea=A0= , some=A0 100=A0 miles=A0 for=A0 our=A0 two=A0 signals , his=A0 CW also= =A0 in the=A0 5/9/9=A0 region, one=A0 wonders=A0 how=A0 far=A0 inland=A0 t= he signals=A0 travelled=A0 ? =0A>>>=0A>>>After a=A0 short 3=A0 way=A0 qso,= =A0 we closed the=A0 test=A0 round 1330z=A0 ,=A0 may=A0 not=A0of been =A0= quite=A0 as=A0 sociable=A0 after=A0 dark=A0 , but=A0 with a=A0 small=A0 Ae= =A0 , 40 x 70=A0 ft=A0 iv L=A0 and=A0=A0 35=A0 ft=A0 Top load=A0 vert=A0 ,= 50=A0 watts=A0 pep=A0 , results=A0 defiantly=A0=A0 superior=A0 to=A0 say= =A0 160=A0 mtrs=A0 using=A0 the=A0 same=A0 Ae's =0A>>>=0A>>>73 -G =0A>>>G= 0NBD =0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>> =0A>>>=0A>>> =0A>=0A> --313692494-1625757897-1357173044=:69099 Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Graham Geri and al= l
 
Warren has seen SSB = first hand on the MF QRG and we have this side also.There was an SM station= (call sign forgotten?) in the early days of 500 that added an SSB ano= uncement on his beacon and it worked well.
 
To my spec. :- "One SSB channel at the high edge of the band only used during daylig= ht hours no DXing!" add " Use VOX, no monologuing allowed" to be a lai= ssez faire operation no band plan, but fair play!.73 es GL es= HNY Pete M0FMT IO91UX
From: Graham <g8fzk@g8fzk.fsnet.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Sent: Wednesday, 2 January 2013, 20:4= 8
Subject: Re: LF: 477= A local SSB chat band ?

=0A=0A =0A = =0A=0A=0A
=0A
Geri
=0A
 
=0A
= 800 Hz  B/W ...  May  be this  is  something = =0A'Wolf' can  code  for  you  ? a  b/w   co= mpression =0A/ expansion  module in SL  , to  limit the = ; tx b/w  =0Ato  800  Hz must  be  possible to&nbs= p; divide  =0Aby  3  and  mult  by  3  w= ith a  linear =0Ashift  as  well ?
=0A
 
= =0A
G..
=0A
=0A

=0A
=0A=0A
Sent: Wednesday, January 02, = 2013 8:36 PM
=0A=0A
S= ubject: Re: LF: 477 A local SSB chat band ?
=0A
=0A
Hi,
=0A
 
=0A
I kind of like the idea of an SSB channel. I just =0Apulled ou= t the conditions of my first secial license for 160m from 1973 or 1974. =0A= That said 1815 to 1835 kHz with 10 Watts in CW, additionally one SSB channe= l for =0A1832 to 1835 kHz, so why not trying this on 630m, too? Here in Ger= many we are =0Acurrently limited to 800 Hz bandwidt but I am sure we can so= rk towards a special =0Alicense under certain conditions such as daylight o= peration only .. sounds =0Agood to me!
=0A
 
=0A
Vy 73
=0A
&nbs= p;
=0A
Geri, DK8KW
=0A=
 
=0A
=0A
----- Original Message ----- =0A
From: =0A = Graham
=0A =0A
Sent: Wednesday, Ja= nuary 02, 2013 8:58 =0A PM
=0A
Subject: Re: LF: 47= 7 A local SSB chat =0A band ?
=0A

=0A
Hi Pete=0A
 
=0A
=0A
Its  quite  obvious= that  the  allocation  =0A is   quite  able=   to  support  =0A normal   armature  activi= ty , and  why  not  ? =0A its no  longer a experimenta= l  allocation , its just the  =0A same  as   10&n= bsp; or top  band , un expected  =0A results  today though = !  ssb  sounds  odd  , =0A may  be  as = the  path is  stable ,   sstv =0A ?  must  = be a  narrow  mode  , and the  =0A 'new'  digital=   voice  is 2KHz  , but that  =0A requires  a&nbs= p; linear  Tx  path 
=0A
 
=0A
A= s  for  the  band edge
=0A
 
=0A=
 I'm  straining  to  find  a  =0A eng= ineering   reason  , that  wspr  and  =0A qr= ss  has  decided to  run mid band ? Im sure  users= =0A had a  reasonable discussion  at the  introduction&nbs= p; of =0A the  band , to  place the  modes  at the&nbs= p; edges =0A , with  live  cw a the  lower  porti= on =0A ?  its well  know  that  these  long&= nbsp; =0A carrier  modes  cause  disruption  to  = other  =0A band  users and  are  well  placed&nbs= p; at =0A the  band  edges  , 'vanity  beacons'&n= bsp; is a =0A term I have  seen  noted  in referral, a= s occupancy  =0A increases , by users  not  linked or = even  aware  =0A of   discussions   taking = place on these  groups , =0A i'm sure there  will  be =  problems  leading  =0A to  the  introduction&nbs= p; of  band plan's  , for  =0A some  the  plans&n= bsp; form  part of the  licence  =0A conditions ..
=0A=
 
=0A
Is Opera  a vanity  system ? , = actually  no, it  =0A compliments   ros-  data&nb= sp; mode in that  the  ave =0A s/n   readings  ca= n be used to  determine  if  =0A a  path  will&nb= sp; support  the  data  mode , =0A each  having  = the  same   averaging  s/n  =0A reading  tak= en along the  time  line  ,
=0A
 
=0A =
73 -G..
=0A
 
=0A
 
=0A
&n= bsp;
=0A
 
=0A
 
=0A
 =0A
 
=0A
=0A

=0A
=0A
From: M0FMT
=0A Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2013 6:21 PM
=0A =0A
Subject: Re: LF: 477 A local = SSB chat band ?
=0A

=0A
=0A
Hi all=0A
 
=0A
One SSB channel at the= high edge of the band only used during =0A daylight hours no DXing!

=0A
73 es GL es HNY Pete M0FMT IO91UX
=0A =0A
=0A
=0A
=0A
From:= Graham <g8fzk@= g8fzk.fsnet.co.uk>
To: rsgb_lf_g= roup@blacksheep.org =0A
Se= nt: Wednesday, 2 January =0A 2013, 16:13
Subject: LF: =0A 477 A local SSB chat ba= nd ?

=0A =0A
=0A
= =0A
Quite  intriguing  propagation  on this  = =0A 'new'  band
=0A
 
=0A
From = ; some  unexpected  early  600 mile  =0A + &nbs= p; Opera  decodes  last  night  , to  =0A sever= al   wspr   TA  decodes ,  [G8's  =0A = again ..]     to   today's   = =0A test  with  Gary  using   USB-SSB  voi= ce , =0A
=0A
 
=0A
Where  as a= t   1300z   we  =0A had  5/9  si= gnals each  way  as  =0A expected   over 25 mil= es  ,  GI3PDN   =0A Ray  , called  on CW ,= to   give  a  report =0A of  5/9 across  = the  Irish   Sea  , some  =0A 100  miles&n= bsp; for  our  two  signals , his  CW =0A also = in the  5/9/9  region, one  wonders  =0A how  = far  inland  the signals  travelled  ?
=0A  
=0A
After a  short 3  way  qso,  w= e closed the  =0A test  round 1330z  ,  may  no= t of been =0A  quite  as  sociable  after = dark  , but  =0A with a  small  Ae  , 40 x 70&= nbsp; ft  iv L  =0A and   35  ft  Top load=   vert  , 50  =0A watts  pep  , results  d= efiantly   superior  =0A to  say  160  mtr= s  using  the  same  =0A Ae's
=0A
&nbs= p;
=0A
73 -G
=0A
G0NBD
=0A
 =0A
 
=0A
 
=0A=0A
=0A


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