Return-Path: Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-dl05.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 6C4803800008C; Tue, 2 Oct 2012 17:21:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1TJ9tS-0000TL-44 for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 Oct 2012 22:20:42 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1TJ9tR-0000TC-FT for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 Oct 2012 22:20:41 +0100 Received: from blu0-omc1-s38.blu0.hotmail.com ([65.55.116.49]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1TJ9tO-0006Vy-4p for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 02 Oct 2012 22:20:40 +0100 Received: from BLU153-W35 ([65.55.116.7]) by blu0-omc1-s38.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Tue, 2 Oct 2012 14:20:35 -0700 Message-ID: X-Originating-IP: [136.226.254.42] From: Laurence KL7UK To: "rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org" Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2012 13:20:35 -0800 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <506A399A.2070800@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> References: ,<506A399A.2070800@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Oct 2012 21:20:35.0897 (UTC) FILETIME=[C3583290:01CDA0E3] X-Spam-Score: -2.1 (--) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: http://kl7uk.com/850.png Stefan - heres the part of the circuit concerned - its the coupling after the 3rd mixer - so its at TX base band frequency, so I can see perhaps why this C219 could be increased to reduce LF losses, but not a lot me thinks as the reactance to "Earth" is pretty low at 137 - the aim is to improve LF without mucking up the HF side so you can only go so far. I need to move the equipment into the garage from the shack - the garage houses the W@G Pegglemessers so will do that and take some more meaningful readings, but there is a small increase as yet undefined :-) - I need to complete the " (not)Transverter" switching mod to allow the RF to come out of the phono socket at the back, but the MF filter, the "fool the logic for all band tx (30kHz to 30MHz) is complete. More as it develops or smokes. I need around 150 milliVolts to get the RF into the Deccas drivers cct Still very poor LF and MF - nearly no signals from Siberia/Mongolia on LF - still at least the snow has stayed away. Loran was around 15dB down from "average" last nite. Getting very dark in the mornings and a Huge Male Moose ran into a car on the road into work this morning - both car/driver and Moose didnt make it. Im keeping this discussion on here as I know a few chaps have the 850's and (maybe) of interest to the wider audience Laurence KL1X GM4DMA BP51 IP Wasilla Alaska Stefan said - [...] Content analysis details: (-2.1 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, no trust [65.55.116.49 listed in list.dnswl.org] 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (hellozerohellozero[at]hotmail.com) -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record -2.1 RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message X-Scan-Signature: e3d323418d60e0f7f0af176deb9f3e2b Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_62e01363-9ec1-439e-8dc2-2e15d3e3f642_" Subject: Strefans LF: LF/MF modification of TS850 for LF X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_HOTMAIL_RCVD, HTML_MESSAGE,TO_ADDRESS_EQ_REAL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d4ad3506b5ae05bba X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none --_62e01363-9ec1-439e-8dc2-2e15d3e3f642_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable http://kl7uk.com/850.png Stefan - heres the part of the circuit concerned -= its the coupling after the 3rd mixer - so its at TX base band frequency=2C= so I can see perhaps why this C219 could be increased to reduce LF losses= =2C but not a lot me thinks as the reactance to "Earth" is pretty low at 13= 7 - the aim is to improve LF without mucking up the HF side so you can only= go so far. I need to move the equipment into the garage from the shack - t= he garage houses the W@G Pegglemessers so will do that and take some more m= eaningful readings=2C but there is a small increase as yet undefined :-) -= I need to complete the " (not)Transverter" switching mod to allow the RF t= o come out of the phono socket at the back=2C but the MF filter=2C the "foo= l the logic for all band tx (30kHz to 30MHz) is complete. More as it develo= ps or smokes. I need around 150 milliVolts to get the RF into the Deccas d= rivers cct Still very poor LF and MF - nearly no signals from Siberia/Mongo= lia on LF - still at least the snow has stayed away. Loran was around 15dB = down from "average" last nite. Getting very dark in the mornings and a Huge= Male Moose ran into a car on the road into work this morning - both car/dr= iver and Moose didnt make it. Im keeping this discussion on here as I know = a few chaps have the 850's and (maybe) of interest to the wider audience La= urence KL1X GM4DMA BP51 IP Wasilla Alaska Stefan said -=20 =20 Hi Laurence=2C=20 Have you tried to check the increase of the signal voltage at higher frequencies to see what e.g. doubling of that C causes? Is there no increase at all?=20 Do you have the schematic of that section? 73=2C Stefan/DK7FC Am 02.10.2012 02:31=2C schrieb Laurence KL7UK: =20 =20 Looking for a bit of assistance. =20 Ive modded my TS850 to allow LF/MF transmit from info from http://we0h.us= /Amateur_Radio_stuff/TS850/ts_850_lf_tx_mod.pdf=20 (thanks Mike=2C original by Bob ZL2CA) but the "supplemental" parallel capacitor value in uF to increase the LF level isnt mentioned.=20 =20 Ive actually tried another 0.01 and smaller and higher values but at 137kHz it doesnt appear to increase the level - any takers or experiences out there who have modded the beast?=20 =20 We had a load of snow here at the weekend but thankfully its gone already and Im in the garden pulling up new ropes into 2 Spruce trees - a bit stronger than the bendy Birch and Ill attempt to pull up the loop this week. The loop will be slightly bigger=2C about 50m in length and slightly higher than WD2XDW in Bartlesville. We will see. COnditions are lousy at LF and MF given the Geo/Mag at this latitude but I was hearing Eu on 20m over the Pole pre dawn. We lose nearly 6 mins of sun per day at this time of year.... =20 Laurence KL1X =20 =20 =20 "The TS-850 transmit drive to the transverter port is reasonably broadband as manufactured=2C and passes =20 some LF energy for amplification using an external LF amplifier. It is difficult to modify the TS-850 =20 circuitry to decrease the LF droop without impacting on response at other HF bands. One modification =20 to improve low frequency response is to supplement the value of C219 (a 0.01 uF capacitor=2C located =20 near L88). It is possible to solder a parallel capacitor to the top side of the RF Unit PCB. Otherwise =20 the "broadband" circuits in the TS-850 transmit drive are accepted for what they are. With C219 =20 supplemented in value=2C 180 kHz output from IF OUT 1 is between about 100 and 250 millivolts=2C =20 whereas on HF it is more like 1 volt." =20 = --_62e01363-9ec1-439e-8dc2-2e15d3e3f642_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
http://kl7uk.com/850.png
 = =3B
Stefan - heres the part of the circuit concerned =3B- its the co= upling after the 3rd mixer - so its at TX base band frequency=2C so I can s= ee =3Bperhaps why this C219 could be increased to reduce LF losses=2C b= ut not a lot me thinks as the reactance to "Earth" =3Bis pretty low at = 137 - the aim is to improve LF without mucking up the HF side so you can on= ly go so far.
 =3B
I need to move the equipment into the garage f= rom the shack - the garage houses the =3BW@G= Pegglemessers so will do that and take some more meaningful readings=2C bu= t there is a small increase as yet undefined :-)
 =3B
 =3B- I need to complete the " (not)Transverter" switching mod to allow the RF= to come out of the phono socket at the back=2C but the =3BMF filter=2C= the "fool the logic for all band tx =3B(30kHz to 30MHz) is complete. M= ore as it develops or smokes. =3B I need around 150 milliVolts to get t= he RF into the Deccas drivers cct
 =3B
Still very poor LF and MF = - nearly no signals from Siberia/Mongolia on LF - still =3Bat least the= snow has stayed away. Loran was around 15dB down from "average" last nite.= Getting very dark in the mornings and a Huge Male Moose ran into a car on = the road into work this morning - both car/driver and Moose didnt make it.<= BR> =3B
Im keeping this discussion on here as I know a few chaps hav= e the 850's and (maybe) of interest to the wider audience
 =3B
La= urence KL1X GM4DMA
BP51 IP Wasilla Alaska
 =3B
 =3BStefan said -
<= br> =20 Hi Laurence=2C

Have you tried to check the increase of the signal voltage at higher frequencies to see what e.g. doubling of that C causes? Is there no increase at all?
Do you have the schematic of that section?

73=2C Stefan/DK7FC

Am 02.10.2012 02:31=2C schrieb Laurence KL7UK:

Looking for a bit of assistance.
 =3B
 =3BIve modded my TS850 to allow LF/MF transmit from info from =3B = http://we0h.us/Amateur_Radio_stuff/TS850/ts_850_lf_tx_mod.= pdf =3B (thanks Mike=2C original by Bob =3BZL2CA)  =3Bbut the "supplemental" =3Bparallel =3Bcapacitor value in uF to increase the= LF level isnt mentioned.
 =3B
Ive actually tried another 0.01 and smaller and higher values but at 137kHz it doesnt appear to increase the level - any takers or experiences out there who have modded the beast?
 =3B
We had a load of snow here at the weekend but thankfully its gone already and Im in the garden pulling up new ropes into 2 Spruce trees - a bit stronger than the bendy Birch and Ill attempt to pull up the loop this week. The loop will be slightly bigger=2C about 50m in length and slightly higher than WD2XDW in Bartlesville. We will see. COnditions are lousy at LF and MF given the Geo/Mag at this latitude but I was hearing Eu on 20m over the Pole pre dawn. We lose nearly 6 mins of sun per day at this time of year....
 =3B
Laurence KL1X
 =3B
 =3B
 =3B

"The TS-850 transmit drive to the transverter port is reasonably broadband as manufactured=2C and passes


some LF energy for amplification using an external LF amplifier. It is difficult to modify the TS-850


circuitry to decrease the LF droop without impacting on response at other HF bands. One modification


to improve low frequency response is to supplement the value of C219 (a 0.01 uF capacitor=2C located


near L88). It is possible to solder a parallel capacitor to the top side of the RF Unit PCB. Otherwise


the "broadband" circuits in the TS-850 transmit drive are accepted for what they are. With C219


supplemented in value=2C 180 kHz output from IF OUT 1 is between about 100 and 250 millivolts=2C


whereas on HF it is more like 1 volt."
= --_62e01363-9ec1-439e-8dc2-2e15d3e3f642_--