Return-Path: Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-df04.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 3008E38000091; Thu, 21 Jun 2012 20:24:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1ShrfI-0003Hm-VG for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Fri, 22 Jun 2012 01:23:56 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1ShrfI-0003Hd-A0 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 22 Jun 2012 01:23:56 +0100 Received: from nm20.bullet.mail.ird.yahoo.com ([77.238.189.77]) by relay1.thorcom.net with smtp (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1ShrfG-0005y3-FQ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 22 Jun 2012 01:23:55 +0100 Received: from [77.238.189.49] by nm20.bullet.mail.ird.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jun 2012 00:23:53 -0000 Received: from [212.82.108.225] by tm2.bullet.mail.ird.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jun 2012 00:23:53 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1002.bt.mail.ird.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jun 2012 00:23:53 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 556662.58684.bm@omp1002.bt.mail.ird.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 38616 invoked from network); 22 Jun 2012 00:23:53 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=btinternet.com; h=DKIM-Signature:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-Antivirus:X-Antivirus-Status; b=4iwLXtKT5bGXecUQFCO32vJqa6g7ht9qOWv3+v/fxkE0IusU46/xWl/4sMnhQUrjjJKEi5ppvPoJapJ5cZtHmcuoMKXqBhgZnYAetLMnQBhlw2www1HvE7lz6HUrQtqLabKNvd18OVHZ+fjWbKfV/Eka/VZKFefwpnhiLhYqo4k= ; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=btinternet.com; s=s1024; t=1340324633; bh=GpFrqZlGn+iDV5jBNAEfEa3sswpP6N31L0QnsR2fEik=; h=X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-Antivirus:X-Antivirus-Status; b=pNWjFHBP/XZXnBmF6ZSlKCf3B7Dd18TNzKU1ZEMCeun14W9NJsxjSPDi79jbi3d/m+1i0IW6TAsG1a0q3U7vh62lYHWQSXY3N/G47pJNQXAWcNhj2IrrM20+hD/veBKTLLhaigihY/Dje6dk+LlAEyR0GcYWPkLVXXzr/qdWv8Q= X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-YMail-OSG: y8xKzaQVM1mbBMJK03pf9i8cnA7EE_ICb8HMAu4zatHkiXA YE97cTMUD4qy4RioIjv916t5P4mM6RV2xyojvB1flP5RpjL3Y9QaRgJA4juJ bFepDfQypXjhGRTlKWFbF.8cBIyhdZHKSfEEK66HRtZN0XD5J3o6osFbHk.7 kY2wv1phLUt0BNsK10stjy0AfUTdhFuzo8v4enm7Og0iucjBn3AaKEYkM7kt LDty7ItnHmCXMODICv66b1jRszOKIjOsrNMdLsv70T7N7beaEaT4wlr1Olc7 1MP6WDYHoDLTe0nxsthOcUUOcrnev2rC321upqVKv80PZDsbqc2sM4wo.4eu t2G9W60dp6KeRrD0i2QifLnNKwUPBg_lCM.KXbK.F4_Kgg9OWG5YBVlvSRwo XU.ci9Z5iIAgAeQD9H59Gx1J124dIZg-- X-Yahoo-SMTP: fpz.2VeswBBs59bVshRPmMN51lcO2lgFRIvE4XTqE8dRwOxd70E- Received: from gnat (alan.melia@109.145.215.32 with login) by smtp826.mail.ird.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jun 2012 17:23:53 -0700 PDT Message-ID: From: "Alan Melia" To: References: <452F9ADDDA624E5EB9C8246BDDC6D264@gnat> <6FDC0CECCC3645EB922AF21E66965518@AGB> <90E09B502D3D481992365586D42423DA@AGB> <5D772617FCC94283913EDABE7CB175FE@gnat> <5D44E645126C4841A77C08064C39E92C@AGB> Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2012 01:22:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5931 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.6157 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 120621-1, 21/06/2012), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Hi Grahan .mmmmm 10 feet?? that could reduce your effective height to 10feet makingi it 6dB (maybe not quite that bad) worse than the 40 foot pole on its own. The only plus point would be if that "radial" gives you a substantial reduction in ground loss.....which I doubt is the case. [...] Content analysis details: (0.0 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, no trust [77.238.189.77 listed in list.dnswl.org] 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message 0.0 T_DKIM_INVALID DKIM-Signature header exists but is not valid 0.0 UNPARSEABLE_RELAY Informational: message has unparseable relay lines X-Scan-Signature: 118b9e608370528226a3c3b3aedcdda0 Subject: Re: LF: Re: InV L Top wire config - Best Option ?? Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00F5_01CD5015.726947D0" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.1 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_MUA_OUTLOOK,HTML_20_30, HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-SCORE: 0:2:280510400:93952408 X-AOL-SCOLL-URL_COUNT: 0 X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: mail_rly_antispam_dkim-d005.1 ; domain : btinternet.com DKIM : pass x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d40d84fe3bb544d04 X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00F5_01CD5015.726947D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Grahan .mmmmm 10 feet?? that could reduce your effective height to = 10feet makingi it 6dB (maybe not quite that bad) worse than the 40 foot = pole on its own. The only plus point would be if that "radial" gives you = a substantial reduction in ground loss.....which I doubt is the case.=20 Seriously you do need to measure it to get the best out of a difficult = situation.......no amount of urban myth will give the right answer. = Remember higher "aerial current" is no use if its going straight to = ground (like a shunt cap across the feed point) and not traversing the = radiation resistance. You want as much current as possible to flow = though the radiation resistance (the vertical bit connected to the feed = point) then you want a big cap (=3Dlow impedance) from the top of the = loading coil to earth for the "return current" (low loss resistance) = Not a very technical way of describing it :-)) even capacitance from = the active pole to ground gives some loss....the inductive top load = reduces that by reducing the voltage on that section. Alan ------=_NextPart_000_00F5_01CD5015.726947D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Grahan .mmmmm 10 feet?? that could = reduce your=20 effective height to 10feet makingi it 6dB (maybe not quite that = bad) worse=20 than the 40 foot pole on its own. The only plus point would be if that = "radial"=20 gives you a substantial reduction in ground loss.....which I doubt is = the case.=20
 
Seriously you do need to measure it to = get the best=20 out of a difficult situation.......no amount of urban myth will give the = right=20 answer. Remember higher "aerial current" is no use if its going straight = to=20 ground (like a shunt cap across the feed point) and not traversing the = radiation=20 resistance. You want as much current as possible to flow though the = radiation resistance (the vertical bit connected to the feed point) then = you=20 want a big cap (=3Dlow impedance) from the top of the loading coil =  to earth=20 for the "return current" (low loss resistance)  Not a very = technical way of=20 describing it :-))  even capacitance from the active pole to ground = gives=20 some loss....the inductive top load reduces that by reducing the voltage = on that=20 section.
 
Alan
 
------=_NextPart_000_00F5_01CD5015.726947D0--