Return-Path: Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-mh05.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 81E3E380000BC; Thu, 31 May 2012 18:56:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1SaEHB-0000E5-97 for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Thu, 31 May 2012 23:55:29 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1SaEHA-0000Dw-Dj for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 31 May 2012 23:55:28 +0100 Received: from relay.uni-heidelberg.de ([129.206.100.212]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1SaEH7-0006WS-QC for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 31 May 2012 23:55:27 +0100 Received: from freitag.iup.uni-heidelberg.de (freitag.iup.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.29.204]) by relay.uni-heidelberg.de (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id q4VMtNdP010344 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 00:55:23 +0200 Received: from [129.206.22.206] (pc206.iup.uni-heidelberg.de [129.206.22.206]) by freitag.iup.uni-heidelberg.de (8.12.11.20060308/8.11.2) with ESMTP id q4VMtNPt021903 for ; Fri, 1 Jun 2012 00:55:23 +0200 Message-ID: <4FC7F686.3020304@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2012 00:53:58 +0200 From: =?windows-1252?Q?Stefan_Sch=E4fer?= User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; de; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100227 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <8BE4322932454ABBAF36917E7F0B7293@uwePC> <4FC74C16.1050905@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <4FC75239.6090105@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <000601cd3f2d$7877fca0$6d01a8c0@DELL4> <4FC76ECD.8040401@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <002f01cd3f35$a45c6e70$6d01a8c0@DELL4> <4FC79E2E.4070101@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <002801cd3f5b$067ecec0$6d01a8c0@DELL4> In-Reply-To: <002801cd3f5b$067ecec0$6d01a8c0@DELL4> X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by relay.uni-heidelberg.de id q4VMtNdP010344 X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Hi Jay, LF, Thanks very much again! Well, if the PA efficiency is 90% with standard parts, what can you achieve with the speial core material? I can obtain the 77 ferrite material here but never heard about the 79 material. I can hardly imagine that there is much more room for significant improvements. More infos apprechiated. [...] Content analysis details: (-0.7 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.7 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, low trust [129.206.100.212 listed in list.dnswl.org] -0.0 T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain X-Scan-Signature: b4085bc26841e34d79a2f3beb8f287b1 Subject: Re: LF: Re: Current mode class D PA for 475 kHz - success Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-SCORE: 0:2:485729024:93952408 X-AOL-SCOLL-URL_COUNT: 0 x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d60d94fc7f7262eee X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none Hi Jay, LF, Thanks very much again! Well, if the PA efficiency is 90% with standard parts, what can you=20 achieve with the speial core material? I can obtain the 77 ferrite=20 material here but never heard about the 79 material. I can hardly=20 imagine that there is much more room for significant improvements. More=20 infos apprechiated. For now, as a result of this day i want to show some photos i've just=20 taken. BTW the PA is now driven from the Elecraft K2 which i built in=20 2003. Just 1W RF is needed (at 1900 kHz =3D> 475 kHz) to drive the PA inp= ut! Gate voltage waveform from the ICL7667:=20 http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19882028/LF/Gate%20voltage%20475%20kHz%205VperDIV= %20ICL7667%2BIRFZ48N.JPG Drain, unloaded:=20 http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19882028/LF/Drain%20Source%20voltage%20without%20= a%20load.JPG Drain at 40W RF:=20 http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19882028/LF/Drain%20Source%20voltage%20%40%2040W%= 20RF%20out.JPG Comments? No, i don't have a Hello Kitty scope, the pink colour comes from the=20 auto adjustment of the image... 73, Stefan/DK7FC Am 31.05.2012 20:27, schrieb jrusgrove@comcast.net: > Stefan > > Well ... guess you have already answered your own question ;~) > > I've stuck with transformer coupled designs ... VMCD for 137 / 500=20 > kHz and CMCD for 160 / 75 / 40 meters. I don't have much experience=20 > with the bridge circuits which I believe is what you normally use. > > Without a load at the transmitter output both types behave well - they=20 > act as though they aren't even keyed. I've mistakenly keyed them into=20 > incorrect loads (antennas for other bands) with no ill effects.=20 > Operating into impedances other than 50 ohms cause a shift in the=20 > drain voltage/current ratio as expected ... so there are limits. From=20 > experience a 1.5:1 VSWR during normal operation isn't a concern. > > The ringing on the off FET drain is an issue with VMCD and is mainly=20 > due to leakage reactance of the transformer. In my experience, this is=20 > best minimized by choosing a core material that provides enough=20 > winding reactance for the frequency in use without going overboard.=20 > For my 137 kHz KW transmitter (yet to be written up) I used an=20 > FT-240-78 core. 78 material was specifically developed for the=20 > frequency range between 100 and 200 kHz and works excellent. These=20 > cores are standard parts. For my 500 kHz KW transmitter (yet to be=20 > written up) I used an FT-240-79 core. 79 material is even better than=20 > 78 material at 500 kHz. Unfortunately, these are not readily available=20 > - 79 is a newer material and available in only a few sizes that aren't=20 > conducive to what we're doing. I parted with some NRE money last year=20 > and got Fair Rite to make some FT-240-79 cores for me. Last I checked=20 > they hadn't added it to their catalog ;~( > > Even with the correct core material and winding technique (interleaved=20 > primary and secondary windings) some form of snubber from each drain=20 > to source is required. Choosing the correct R and C is an interesting=20 > exercise. Rather than go over it here check out this paper by Rudy=20 > Severn: > > http://www.ee.bgu.ac.il/~pel/links/DESIGN_OF_SNUBBERS_FOR_POWER_CIRCUIT= S.pdf=20 > > > BTW, Rudy is one of the WD2XSH 500 kHz group. He also has a You Tube=20 > videos on the subject ... and a book as well. > > In my experience the ringing is not a problem as long as it is=20 > controlled and well under the voltage limits of the FET. In my KW VMCD=20 > the drain square wave is 100 V (2 X supply voltage (50VDC)) and the=20 > first peak of the ringing voltage brings this up to about 140 V. The=20 > FETs in use here are 240 volt parts. > > Jay > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stefan Sch=E4fer"=20 > > To: > Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2012 12:37 PM > Subject: Re: LF: Re: Current mode class D PA for 475 kHz - success > > >> Jay, MF, >> >> I just tried the CMCD and immediately achieved 89% efficiency at=20 >> 12VDC and 36W RF at 475 kHz (dummy load). Just a first result. I can=20 >> answer my own question now: Without a load the PA behaves not=20 >> critical! The current consumption is 0.2A only (including the current=20 >> of the VFO and exciter) !! :-) I'm going to improve the design now=20 >> and will publish some photos soon... >> >> 73, Stefan/DK7FC >> >> Am 31.05.2012 15:59, schrieb jrusgrove@comcast.net: >>> Stefan >>> >>> Thanks for the positive comments. >>> >>> Have to admit I haven't been following what you're up to ... curious=20 >>> what problems you're running into with VMCD at 500 kHz? >>> >>> Jay >>> >>> >> >