Return-Path: Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-me02.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 5D44838000089; Thu, 28 Jun 2012 14:56:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1SkJs0-0007eB-Os for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Thu, 28 Jun 2012 19:55:12 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1SkJrz-0007e2-Tg for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 28 Jun 2012 19:55:11 +0100 Received: from out1.ip02ir2.opaltelecom.net ([62.24.128.238]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1SkJrw-0004xW-OI for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 28 Jun 2012 19:55:10 +0100 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AkcFAIun7E9OlrWL/2dsb2JhbABFAwqCOIJGT5sAkzWCG4EIghMFAQEFCAEBAgEWMwIsAQEDBQIBAQIRBAEBChcHAwICFAEEGgYNCQgGEwoBAgIBAYdsAw8HoX6DTYQqjyaKVGMFBRGEXYESA41NkmiFAIJf X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.77,493,1336345200"; d="scan'208,217";a="397193033" Received: from host-78-150-181-139.as13285.net (HELO xphd97xgq27nyf) ([78.150.181.139]) by out1.ip02ir2.opaltelecom.net with SMTP; 28 Jun 2012 19:55:05 +0100 Message-ID: <007301cd555f$87dfaf10$0401a8c0@xphd97xgq27nyf> From: "mal hamilton" To: References: <4FEB8A2F.3030504@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <7E7DFBB4D102A04DB5ADC88D66628A4A0FAB65D1@ICTS-S-MBX5.luna.kuleuven.be> <82ECFF6D94B94BED9D93B5580549A409@Extensa> <1340872602.49196.YahooMailNeo@web171602.mail.ir2.yahoo.com> <4FEC18F4.9050608@online.fr> <1340875355.96079.YahooMailNeo@web171602.mail.ir2.yahoo.com> <1340876781.29716.YahooMailNeo@web171601.mail.ir2.yahoo.com> <4FEC7DDF.8050906@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <1340908899.62897.YahooMailNeo@web171605.mail.ir2.yahoo.com> Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2012 18:55:05 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Spam-Score: 3.1 (+++) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Pete There are more simple ways to get on 500. Simple dds or sig gen at freq of interest if sine wave just sq it by using a couple of diodes then a driver chip tc4426 use one side and straight into the FET PA then an inductor and a couple of capacitors, an old lopt transformer for matching roughly from 6 ohms to 50 ohms. I built one in a couple of hours away back and it gave good service until I modified a decca unit. Mine was a QRO rig using a big fet at 60 volts to get the required 10w erp You do not need push pull class D to complicate matters. mal/g3kev [...] Content analysis details: (3.1 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, no trust [62.24.128.238 listed in list.dnswl.org] 1.0 FSL_XM_419 Old OE version in X-Mailer only seen in 419 spam -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message 0.5 FSL_UA FSL_UA 1.6 AXB_XMAILER_MIMEOLE_OL_024C2 AXB_XMAILER_MIMEOLE_OL_024C2 X-Scan-Signature: d186a3cb540ae631597f163017de1e53 Subject: Re: LF: Re: RE: 472 kHz PA running at 12 VDC Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0070_01CD555F.87B25D80" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.7 required=5.0 tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_FONTCOLOR_BLUE, HTML_FONT_BIG,HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-SCORE: 0:2:501719200:93952408 X-AOL-SCOLL-URL_COUNT: 0 x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d608a4feca8c32dcd X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0070_01CD555F.87B25D80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Pete There are more simple ways to get on 500. Simple dds or sig gen at freq = of interest if sine wave just sq it by using a couple of diodes then a driver chip tc4426 use one side and straight into the FET PA then = an inductor and a couple of capacitors, an old lopt transformer for = matching roughly from 6 ohms to 50 ohms. I built one in a couple of = hours away back and it gave good service until I modified a decca unit. Mine was a QRO rig using a big fet at 60 volts to get the required 10w = erp You do not need push pull class D to complicate matters. mal/g3kev ----- Original Message -----=20 From: M0FMT=20 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2012 6:41 PM Subject: Re: LF: Re: RE: 472 kHz PA running at 12 VDC Hi Stefan I like this and would like to make to make it. I so far have tracked = down most bits but as usual the Unobtainium of so many construction = projects that fall at the last hurdle unless they are Kits........ no = chance of that I suppose? There will be those who tell me its easy to get the bits but unless = you work for a company that uses this stuff it can not be slipped = through the "Purchasing" it becomes a positive stop!!=20 Like the Litz I just put that in one of our big outfits with min = orders and it said it had over one hundred thousand Litz and promptly = collapsed. But they have one of the toroids (T1) wow and its not a min = order either double wow! Litz can be fabricated from 0.125 Cu/En? Hmm = it's plaited ? Wima caps are available from Maplin haven't checked in depth but they = usually are. I like the idea of using a DDS or Transceiver as a master osc source = div. by four. Generally I buy my power FETs by the hand full off E-bay they may not = be ideal but are cheap!! 50P (eer 60Ec) (Never mind the quality but feel = the width... principle) and the drivers TC range for slightly more. I'll keep searching for a bit but if anyone has a kitting list (UK = source) may be they could publish it?=20 And thanks Stefan nothing under the Sun is "New" but in context it is = new and worth while thanks! 73 es GL Pete M0FMT IO91UX From: Stefan Sch=C3=A4fer To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Thursday, 28 June 2012, 16:53 Subject: Re: LF: Re: RE: 472 kHz PA running at 12 VDC Hi MF,=20 Late at night, i made draw the schematic. Here it is: = https://dl.dropbox.com/u/19882028/MF/100W%20475kHz%20PA.png (picture of = prototype = https://dl.dropbox.com/u/19882028/MF/DK7FC%20472%20kHz%20PA%2015W%2B100W.= JPG) Most of the parts are not critical.=20 The ferrite cores are the blue EPCOS types, N30 material. Details are = in the image. But you may use a FT140-77 alternatively and double the = primary and secondary number of turns. There are many alternatives, also to the FETs. Instead of the IRZF48N = you may try a IRF1405. This one has a lower on-resistance but a higher = input capacity. Maybe it works even better, i didn't try to many parts. = Switching times are not critical. So you need to find a compromise = between low on resistance and input capacity while the Drain-Source = voltage should be 55V for a 12V supply. Instead of RF litz wire (i use this one: = http://www.reichelt.de/index.html?ACTION=3D3;ARTICLE=3D57206;SEARCH=3DCLI= %20200%2F30 ) you can also use 1mm diam. enamel. Cu wire or better = 5x0.4mm or what you have. It just affects the efficiency, more or less. The overall dimensions of this prototype are 15cm x 10cm x 3cm, so it = is quite compact and since it runs from a 12V battery you can use it for = /p tests. Also you can of course use more than 2 power steps by using a = multi step switch and more taps. A DDS signal generator with rectangular wave form or a sine signal = coming from a HF TX may be used. The waveform doesn't matter as long as = the peak input voltage exceeds 5 Vp. 73, Stefan/DK7FC PS: Yes, it is nothing new and someone has done it before! Am 28.06.2012 11:46, schrieb M0FMT:=20 Hi again Stefan The Litz is too, only by the Km or 10Kg reel.......... :@(( Do you create your own I have 0.125 solid C/E guess that could be = stranded up to make a synth? =20 73 es GL Pete M0FMT IO91UX From: M0FMT mailto:m0fmt@yahoo.co.uk To: mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org = mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Thursday, 28 June 2012, 10:22 Subject: Re: LF: Re: RE: 472 kHz PA running at 12 VDC Hi Stefan = http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/IRFZ24N-Transistor-x-1-pieces-IRFZ24-/160818253= 496?pt=3DUK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=3Ditem257183ceb8 Just over =C2=A35 a pop! = http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-ICL7667CPA-MAXIM-IC-DRIVER-MOSFET-DUAL-PWR-= 8-DIP-1-PIECE-B7-/160779362423?pt=3DLH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=3Ditem256f326= 077 Just over =C2=A36 a pop! But what is the =E2=80=9CUnobtainium=E2=80=9D ferrite? = =E2=80=A6=E2=80=A6 ;0) Chees Pete FMT From: Jean-Pierre M=C3=A9r=C3=A9 mailto:jpm.f1afj@online.fr To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Thursday, 28 June 2012, 9:42 Subject: Re: LF: Re: RE: 472 kHz PA running at 12 VDC Hello Stephan , Me too=20 73 , Jean-Pierre F1AFJ =20 Le 28/06/2012 10:36, M0FMT a =C3=A9crit : Hi Stephan Me Too 73 es GL Pete M0FMT IO91UX From: "PA1SDB, Peter" mailto:pa1sdb@amsat.org To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Thursday, 28 June 2012, 9:12 Subject: LF: Re: RE: 472 kHz PA running at 12 VDC like ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Rik Strobbe=20 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2012 6:35 AM Subject: LF: RE: 472 kHz PA running at 12 VDC If someone is interested i may convert the circuit from my mind = into a schematic as a png file. Always interested ;-) 73, Rik ON7YD - OR7T ------=_NextPart_000_0070_01CD555F.87B25D80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =EF=BB=BF
Pete
There are more simple ways to get on 500. Simple = dds or=20 sig gen at freq of interest if sine wave just sq it by using a couple of = diodes
then a driver chip tc4426 use one side and = straight into=20 the FET PA then an inductor and a couple of capacitors, an old lopt = transformer=20 for matching roughly from 6 ohms to 50 ohms. I built one in a couple of = hours=20 away back and it gave good service until I modified a decca = unit.
Mine was a QRO rig using a big fet at 60 volts = to get the=20 required 10w erp
You do not need push pull class D to complicate=20 matters.
mal/g3kev
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 M0FMT
Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2012 = 6:41=20 PM
Subject: Re: LF: Re: RE: 472 = kHz PA=20 running at 12 VDC

Hi Stefan
 
I like this and would like to make to make = it. I so=20 far have tracked down most bits but as usual the Unobtainium of so many construction projects = that fall at=20 the last hurdle unless they are Kits........ no chance of that I=20 suppose?
 
There will be those who tell me its easy to = get the=20 bits but unless you work for a company that uses this stuff it = can not be=20 slipped through the "Purchasing" it becomes a positive stop!!=20
Like the Litz I=20 just put that in one of our big outfits with min orders and it said it = had=20 over one hundred thousand Litz and=20 promptly collapsed. But they = have one=20 of the toroids (T1) wow and = its not a=20 min order either double wow! Litz can be=20 fabricated from 0.125 = Cu/En? =20 Hmm it's plaited = ?
Wima caps are=20 available from Maplin = haven't checked in=20 depth but they usually are.
 
I like the idea of using a DDS or Transceiver as a master osc source div. by four.
 
Generally I buy my power FETs by the hand full off E-bay they may not = be ideal=20 but are cheap!! 50P (eer = 60Ec) (Never mind the quality but = feel the=20 width... principle) and the drivers TC range for slightly=20 more.
 
I'll keep searching for a bit but if anyone has a = kitting=20 list (UK source) may be they could publish it? 
 
And thanks Stefan nothing under the Sun is "New" = but in=20 context it is new and worth while thanks!
73 es GL Pete M0FMT=20 IO91UX
 =20
From:=20 Stefan Sch=C3=A4fer=20 <Stefan.Schaefer@iup.uni-heidelberg.de>
To: = rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20
Sent: Thursday, 28 = June=20 2012, 16:53
Subject: Re: LF:=20 Re: RE: 472 kHz PA running at 12 VDC

Hi MF,

Late at = night, i=20 made draw the schematic. Here it is: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/19882028/MF/100W%20475kHz%20PA.pn= g =20 (picture of prototype https://dl.dropbox.com/u/19882028/MF/DK7FC%20472%20kHz%20P= A%2015W%2B100W.JPG)

Most=20 of the parts are not critical.

The ferrite cores are the blue = EPCOS types, N30 material. = Details are in the=20 image. But you may use a FT140-77 alternatively and double the primary = and=20 secondary number of turns.

There are many alternatives, also to = the=20 FETs. Instead of the IRZF48N you may try a IRF1405. This one has a lower on-resistance = but a higher=20 input capacity. Maybe it works even better, i didn't try to many = parts.=20 Switching times are not critical. So you need to find a compromise = between low=20 on resistance and input capacity while the Drain-Source voltage should = be 55V=20 for a 12V supply.

Instead of RF litz wire (i use this one: http://www.reichelt.de/index.html?ACTION=3D3;ARTICLE=3D572= 06;SEARCH=3DCLI%20200%2F30=20 ) you can also use 1mm diam. enamel. Cu wire or better 5x0.4mm or what = you=20 have. It just affects the efficiency, more or less.

The overall = dimensions of this prototype are 15cm x 10cm x 3cm, so it is quite = compact and=20 since it runs from a 12V battery you can use it for /p tests. Also you = can of=20 course use more than 2 power steps by using a multi step switch and more taps.

A DDS = signal=20 generator with rectangular wave form or a sine signal coming from a HF = TX may=20 be used. The waveform doesn't matter as long as the peak input voltage = exceeds=20 5 Vp.

73, = Stefan/DK7FC

PS: Yes, it is nothing new and = someone has=20 done it before!






Am 28.06.2012 11:46, schrieb M0FMT:=20
Hi again Stefan
 
The Litz is = too, only by=20 the Km or 10Kg reel.......... :@((
 
Do you create your own I have 0.125 solid C/E guess that could = be=20 stranded up to make a synth?

 
73 es GL Pete M0FMT = IO91UX
From: M0FMT mailto:m0fmt@yahoo.co.uk
<= SPAN=20 style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To: mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blac= ksheep.org=20 mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blac= ksheep.org=20
Sent: Thursday, = 28 June=20 2012, 10:22
Subject: Re:=20 LF: Re: RE: 472 kHz PA running at 12 VDC

Hi Stefan
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/IRFZ24N-Transistor-x-1-pieces-IRFZ24-/= 160818253496?pt=3DUK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=3Dite= m257183ceb8
Just over =C2=A35 a pop!
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-ICL7667CPA-MAXIM-IC-DRIVER-MOSFET-= DUAL-PWR-8-DIP-1-PIECE-B7-/160779362423?pt=3DLH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=3D= item256f326077
Just over =C2=A36 a pop!
But what is the =E2=80=9CUnobtainium=E2=80=9D=20 ferrite?   =E2=80=A6=E2=80=A6 = ;0)
Chees Pete=20 FMT
   From: Jean-Pierre = M=C3=A9r=C3=A9 mailto:jpm.f1afj@online.fr
= To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.= org=20
Sent: Thursday, = 28 June=20 2012, 9:42
Subject: Re: LF:=20 Re: RE: 472 kHz PA running at 12 VDC

Hello Stephan ,
Me too
73  , Jean-Pierre = F1AFJ =20



Le 28/06/2012 10:36, M0FMT = a=20 =C3=A9crit :
Hi Stephan
 
Me Too

73 es GL Pete M0FMT IO91UX
From: "PA1SDB, Peter" mailto:pa1sdb@amsat.org
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.= org=20
Sent: = Thursday, 28 June=20 2012, 9:12
Subject: LF:=20 Re: RE: 472 kHz PA running at 12 VDC

like
 
-----=20 Original Message -----
From:=20 Rik Strobbe =
To:=20 rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.= org=20
Sent:=20 Thursday, June 28, 2012 6:35 AM
Subject:=20 LF: RE: 472 kHz PA running at 12 VDC

If someone = is interested=20 i may convert the=20 circuit from my mind into a schematic as = a png=20 file.
 
Always interested = ;-)
 
73, Rik  ON7YD -=20 = OR7T






<= /DIV>



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