Return-Path: Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-db02.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 65E4A3800008D; Sat, 12 May 2012 08:23:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1STBKq-00006S-Fv for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 May 2012 13:22:08 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1STBKq-00006J-1X for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 May 2012 13:22:08 +0100 Received: from mail-ob0-f171.google.com ([209.85.214.171]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1STBKn-0003Ef-J9 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sat, 12 May 2012 13:22:06 +0100 Received: by obfk16 with SMTP id k16so10398098obf.16 for ; Sat, 12 May 2012 05:22:03 -0700 (PDT) X-DKIM-Result: Domain=gmail.com Result=Good and Known Domain DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=fz6fGjuBS96mAbmd20+9+sanGN7Zq0LLQvb5mX4bsPc=; b=oRy8RiGwLpobBCvUAQuousJLeDtUwuziXKtvo1RLqqkdpNoZnx55XSm0i1SpBTe2Qn ZOaJ99BekyMB1fOvBf8grJGmVJbByFKnbWCtF3+UC5OBWCNYJUndD45yPz3QJZDftRN4 7UqSlocXjaYjMgSDdtM92oTWSJccRUcWPq3/+DxA6QJsmuwsk+8+OyhsKqDcgYTCsIna UhdGJNjeJ1r+FZ3NtMw5ZBfpTe0hrq5mWzLW/E32az0gDWBh+IuDxsDo96yQ96ED83cL AAseJHSpEt1Fo2S6lHoYh162KQAB2vZci2IS79cynniAQAi9KvnzASdNIqU6BbGXeDtO jOyg== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.10.225 with SMTP id l1mr802265igb.1.1336825323300; Sat, 12 May 2012 05:22:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.60.134 with HTTP; Sat, 12 May 2012 05:22:03 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <000901cd302c$671ed2e0$1502a8c0@Clemens04> References: <000901cd302c$671ed2e0$1502a8c0@Clemens04> Date: Sat, 12 May 2012 13:22:03 +0100 Message-ID: From: Andy Talbot To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Clipping is where the generated samples of signal plus noise exceed the 16 bit range of the .WAV file. All values are calculated as floating point, scaled to keep close to the maximum. ie the tone at 0dB amplitude has a peak of 28282 (RMS = 20000) [...] Content analysis details: (-0.7 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.7 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, low trust [209.85.214.171 listed in list.dnswl.org] 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (andy.g4jnt[at]gmail.com) -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 0.0 T_DKIM_INVALID DKIM-Signature header exists but is not valid X-Scan-Signature: 3b8620872b19e25fb6f4dfaf1256edc3 Subject: Re: LF: Re: Demonstrating audibility of weak signals - utilty to play with. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-SCORE: 0:2:508945088:93952408 X-AOL-SCOLL-URL_COUNT: 0 X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: mail_rly_antispam_dkim-d025.2 ; domain : gmail.com DKIM : pass x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d40564fae563148c9 X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none Clipping is where the generated samples of signal plus noise exceed the 16 bit range of the .WAV file. All values are calculated as floating point, scaled to keep close to the maximum. ie the tone at 0dB amplitude has a peak of 28282 (RMS = 20000) Noise is calculated based on an RMS at 0dB of 20000 in the wav file calculated for teh full sampling rate bandwidth, the same as the tone 0dB level, in a truely statistical manner. So you can see that for noise levels much above -20dB some spikes will occasionally exceed the alllowed maximum. If noise were 0dB at full bandwidth, and output scale factor were also 0dB it would clip something like 63% of the time as the RMS is defined as the one-signma probability. The need to adjust noise amplitude for defined signal bandwidth also adds to the confusion Noise is scaled depending on the requested S/N ratio, and the ratio of defined signal bandwidth ro sampling rate and added to the tone waveform. The resulting sample generated, are converted to integers by multiplying by the scaling factor (0dB = 1) Any that exceed 32767 / -32767 are clipped to those values to prevent overflow, and a count of the number of occurances made If just the odd few are present, the amount of clipping is shown,, but if the number of clipped samples exceeds 1% of the total for the file, this is labelled "Severe" Users can then adjust the output scaling appropriately Andy www.g4jnt.com On 12 May 2012 11:45, Clemens Paul wrote: > Hi Andy, > > thanks for the nice little program. > I've been playing a bit with the utility and wonder under which > circumstances clipping occurs. > See attached screenshot. > With the parameters used in this example there is clipping. > I guess the level in 1Hz BW, here 33dB is the crucial parameter? > Woud you mind to explain what output scaling means? > > 73 > Clemens > DL4RAJ > >