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Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2012 14:51:45 +0100
Message-ID: <CAA8k23R7RGXov0RHjSDfPCvuK5XspfbRSqRCVRsrTfiPM80Now@mail.gmail.com>
From: Andy Talbot <andy.g4jnt@gmail.com>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: Re: LF: Re: PIC Projects with no HEX code
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Pete -
I'm not sure what you really mean when you say printed hex, text etc.
The .HEX file is the binary contents of the PIC as produced by the
compiler / assembler, stored in a manner that is pure ASCII text, but
pretty meaningless to the human miind.  It contains the HEXadecimal
contents of the programme space and any EE memory, address locations
and checksums.    Provided printed versions of that totally
pointless, and no one should ever dream of trying to modify them with
an editor.   Not least, you would destroy the checksum and any
programmer worth its salt would throw out the corrupted file.

Have you been trying to do that?

As Alan pointed out previously, many software authors provide .HEX
files so their own IP isn't taken / stolen while at the same time
making the result freely availalble.   All you can do with that is
load it and 'blow' your own devices.

The next atage is to look at published source code.  This wil be a
.ASM (or assembler) file and may often have several include files in
addition (often of file type  .INC, but could be anything the author
calls them)  These are turned into .HEX files by the assembler.

BUT these days not all assembly files are created equal.  I have
always only ever exclusively used Microchip standards and all their
products, namely the MPASM assembler for producing the code.   But I
think some other third party  designers of PIC development "systems"
have in their infinite wisdom decided to use their own assembly
instructions.   Hence not all .ASM files compile universally.   I have
met this twice now when users have reported not being able to assemble
the many .ASM files I provide.

Well, Caveat Emptor.   If they choose to not use Microchip standard
products for Microchip design products... that's just Tough and their
problem..   And if, as I suspect may occasionally be the case, they
don't spot the difference between true assembly and PIC code written
in C well .    there's not much more to add!

For device programmers for "blowing",  its a lot simpler.  Any
programmer can make use of the .HEX files generated when the assembler
has done its job correctly.  At least here the standards are universal
- mostly thanks to Intel back in the year dot minus one.  And if some
obscure programmer can't understand that format, throw it away and get
a better one.

Andy
www.g4jnt.com


On 30 April 2012 14:18, M0FMT <m0fmt@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> Hi Alan
>
> Thanks for coming back it was really a rhetorical outburst at yet other
> project failure. But in a way its nice to know I am not entirely alone.
> It looks as though you have been there before me. I am relatively new to =
PIC
> programming and I don't know what I am doing. Try to "Save" from my
> programmer does not work it saves the text file OK but not completely. So=
 if
> loaded into a new=A0 or blank=A0PIC it won't run. However if=A0say down l=
oaded
> from an operational PIC held in the=A0programmer S/W and modified at HEX =
level
> then load into a blank PIC its OK!! I have a lot to learn.
>
> I have a "store" of stolen routines that will run so I am trying to modif=
y
> them to my applications. Several have worked OK but its too much to ask t=
o
> get a good one every time=A0I suppose. Like changing call signs and locat=
or in
> ROM=A0and altering the configuration of speed etc for a CW beacon. Straig=
ht
> forward keyer no memory is another and Johan's SM6LKM stuff is very good =
I
> have found. A lot of articles promise a lot but don't deliver, it would b=
e
> really nice if they always attached a text file of HEX because otherwise
> whats the point? Its easy enough to use character recognition to down loa=
d
> HEX from the printed page ... it works for me. It just means you have to =
be
> very diligent checking each line of text. A ruler and strong glasses it
> works every time.
>
> I suppose I am at the stage where I just want to build projects as
> advertised I don't=A0have the knowledge to write from scratch=A0but have =
managed
> to modify some=A0programs.
>
> This may seem a bit off topic but now we seem to be into automated Beacon=
ing
> at each other on MF/LF ......"if you can't beat 'em .......... " PIC is o=
ne
> way to go . Saves tying a up a PC.
>
> Any way its stopped raining, garden to work=A0 to do and another lot of B=
ees
> to hive. This is not how I saw retirement.
>
> Thanks for the info and encouragement.
> 73 es GL Pete M0FMT IO91UX
> From: Alan Melia <alan.melia@btinternet.com>
> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
> Sent: Monday, 30 April 2012, 0:21
> Subject: LF: Re: PIC Projects with no HEX code
>
> Hi Peter my success is much higher than that BUT I have found some PICs w=
ont
> program correctly on some programmers though the s/w indicates the ought =
to.
> I would say if you are not using a Microchip programmer and s/w this migh=
t
> be part of the cause.?? This is one I have run into.
>
> Reasons for lack of source inclusde, shyness and not wanting to be cricis=
ed
> for poor or naive programming. Producing commented source is quite a labo=
ur
> intensive job. If an "outsider" is to understand exactly what you have do=
ne.
> Many who reuse chunks of code cant be bother with the hassle
>
> Then I have seen code "stolen" and used for profit making ventures, or 98=
%
> copied, without any reference to the originator. Does it matter.....well =
it
> does to some people. The code is the majority of the investement in a PIC
> project. Remember a assembly coders stock-in-trade is a large collection =
of
> small routines which he used continually to achieve standard operations.
> Because these are used more than once they are usually well tested.
>
> I like to see source because I can learn how to write it myself from othe=
r
> peoples approaches. The most exasperating thing is if you suspect a bug (=
not
> just not working, but an exotic one)=A0 you have no way of. helping the
> originator
>
> Alan
> G3NYK
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "M0FMT" <m0fmt@yahoo.co.uk>
> To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2012 11:33 PM
> Subject: LF: PIC Projects with no HEX code
>
>
>
>
> Success rate is about 10% on projects with the HEX code attached.
>
> If people don't want their projects duplicated then don't publish them
> FCS!!!
>
> Its pointless!
>
>
> M0fmt exasperated!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>
>
>
>