From: Gerhard Hickl <gerhard.hickl@aon.at>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
In-Reply-To: <000d01cc5a75$09030c90$0401a8c0@xphd97xgq27nyf>
References: <4E418609.6020500@iup.uni-heidelberg.de>
	 <67A6F7BF45BF4A0193A3DCB53000A283@PcMinto>
	 <008401cc56ce$2f1fb2c0$0401a8c0@xphd97xgq27nyf>
	 <12C475F3F4C84B818461753F2E8A60A6@PcMinto>
	 <4E41AECB.90808@iup.uni-heidelberg.de>
	 <8D68749D37B94275855FDBA46A3F6C97@PcMinto>  <op.vz0iyui5yzqh0k@pc-roelof>
	 <1313033619.1543.20.camel@gerhard-desktop>
	 <4E438B8B.1060800@iup.uni-heidelberg.de>
	 <00c401cc5826$49523e70$71a9c00a@Clemens04>
	 <1313074781.1701.7.camel@gerhard-desktop>
	 <25D9CE8E-70C7-4FB5-8A10-0ED6B94255EE@numeo.fr>
	 <1313090065.1579.46.camel@gerhard-desktop>
	 <6814B311A817473C8285E3720DC0244A@acer>
	 <1313315184.1533.5.camel@gerhard-desktop>
	 <000d01cc5a75$09030c90$0401a8c0@xphd97xgq27nyf>
Date: Sun, 14 Aug 2011 19:56:04 +0200
Message-ID: <1313344564.1557.4.camel@gerhard-desktop>
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Subject: Re: LF: Re: HB9ASB...
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Mal !

I was talking about the "cheapest" 10m pole and as far as I can see on
the web-page it is for €30....

Don't know about pounds but €30 is at least a very fair price!

I personally one 2 of those 10m poles for €30 and I am very satisfied.

73
OE3GHB
Gerhard




Am Sonntag, den 14.08.2011, 12:26 +0100 schrieb mal hamilton:
> LF
> Euro 55 is not cheap for a 10m fibre glass fishing rod. I paid £60 for a
> German made one several years ago and it is now falling to pieces. They do
> not last and also I paid too much for it.
> Recently I got another Italian one,  same size for £20 which is about the
> right price.
> 
> de mal/g3kev
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gerhard Hickl" <gerhard.hickl@aon.at>
> To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2011 10:46 AM
> Subject: Re: LF: Re: HB9ASB...
> 
> 
> > Henny!
> >
> > Just take a look at: http://www.dx-wire.de/brit/
> >
> > To support a small probe or a vertical wire the cheapest 10m pole is
> > suitable and I think the price is really o.K.
> >
> > For my LF-Antenna with the top-loads I use other types of masts (one 12m
> > and one 18m) available at:
> >
> > http://spiderbeam.com/home/index.php?language=en
> >
> > They are more expensive but really "heavy duty".
> >
> > 73
> > OE3GHB
> > Gerhard
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Am Sonntag, den 14.08.2011, 11:27 +0200 schrieb henny van elst:
> > > Hello Gerhard,
> > > can You give me the addres to order a fiberglasmast?
> > >
> > > henny pa3cpm
> > > best 73's
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Gerhard Hickl" <gerhard.hickl@aon.at>
> > > To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> > > Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 9:14 PM
> > > Subject: Re: LF: Re: HB9ASB...
> > >
> > >
> > > > John!
> > > >
> > > > Actually there is no special guying used since the mast is only the
> > > > lower (and thus thicker) section of an originally 10m high "cheap"
> > > > Fibreglass-Pole like available at http://www.dx-wire.de/fiberglasm.htm
> > > >
> > > > It is tied to the chimney with two tension belts which are commonly
> used
> > > > to fix cargo in a truck. (1 inch wide).
> > > >
> > > > Originally this method of fixing to the chimney was just thought to be
> > > > for testing but meanwhile it is up there for more than a year.
> > > >
> > > > The two probes (LF/VLF) on top of the mast are suspended by a string
> > > > which enables me to maintain the probes without bringing the pole
> down.
> > > >
> > > > 73
> > > > OE3GHB
> > > > Gerhard
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Am Donnerstag, den 11.08.2011, 17:58 +0200 schrieb John Rabson:
> > > >> Gerhard,
> > > >>
> > > >> What guying arrangements do you use for the 5m mast, please?
> > > >>
> > > >> 73
> > > >> John F5VLF
> > > >>
> > > >> On 11 Aug 2011, at 16:59CEST, Gerhard Hickl wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> > Clemens, LF group!
> > > >> >
> > > >> > This is exactly the opposite that I experienced with the Mini-Whip.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > The higher I brought it up (= the farther I brought it away from
> the
> > > >> > noise source, commonly called "house"), the better the SNR.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Today I connected the shield of the cable to the lightning
> protection
> > > >> > system up on the roof and couldn't find any difference so far.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > I'm using a 5m fibre-glass pole fixed to the chimney as a support
> for
> > > >> > the probe and the shield of the feeder is only grounded in the
> shack.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > 73
> > > >> >
> > > >> > OE3GHB
> > > >> > Gerhard
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Am Donnerstag, den 11.08.2011, 13:32 +0200 schrieb Clemens Paul:
> > > >> >> Hi Stefan,
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>> The pole that is on a noisy roof (and its noisy ground) and on
> the
> > > >> >>> other side
> > > >> >>> the pole that is far away in the garden, with its own and clean
> local
> > > >> >>> earth.
> > > >> >>> In the garden a metallic pole should make no difference, as you
> say.
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> How true.
> > > >> >> My miniwhip was completely unusable on the top of my roof,
> > > >> >> with or without connecting the coax shield to the lightning
> > > >> >> gr.. ehm reference plane.
> > > >> >> So I decided to put it in the middle of thegarden where it is only
> > > >> >> 30cm
> > > >> >> above the lawn.
> > > >> >> Here connecting the coax braid to a 3m long earth rod was
> essential
> > > >> >> to get rid of the noise.
> > > >> >> Now this setup is good enough for receiving SAQ with up to 30dB
> S/N.
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> 73
> > > >> >> Clemens
> > > >> >> DL4RAJ
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> ----- Original Message -----
> > > >> >> From: "Stefan Schäfer" <Stefan.Schaefer@iup.uni-heidelberg.de>
> > > >> >> To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> > > >> >> Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 9:58 AM
> > > >> >> Subject: Re: LF: Re: HB9ASB...
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>> Hi Gerhard,
> > > >> >>>
> > > >> >>> I think one has to compare two different situations:
> > > >> >>>
> > > >> >>> The pole that is on a noisy roof (and its noisy ground) and on
> the
> > > >> >>> other side
> > > >> >>> the pole that is far away in the garden, with its own and clean
> local
> > > >> >>> earth.
> > > >> >>> In the garden a metallic pole should make no difference, as you
> say.
> > > >> >>>
> > > >> >>> 73, Stefan
> > > >> >>>
> > > >> >>>
> > > >> >>> Am 11.08.2011 05:33, schrieb Gerhard Hickl:
> > > >> >>>> Roelof!
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>> With interest I was following all the discussions about the
> "Mini
> > > >> >>>> Whip"-like antennas.
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>> In your description of the "PA0RDT Mini Whip" you suggest to use
> a
> > > >> >>>> non
> > > >> >>>> metallic pole for mounting the probe and an (optional) earth-rod
> to
> > > >> >>>> ground (sorry Andy!!) the shield.
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>> I might be completely wrong but isn't it the same when one uses
> a
> > > >> >>>> grounded metallic pole and connect the shield of the coax on top
> of
> > > >> >>>> this
> > > >> >>>> pole?
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>> BTW: I have an insulating pole (5m) on top of the roof and yet
> no
> > > >> >>>> grounded shielding of the coax but just in the shack. I will
> connect
> > > >> >>>> the
> > > >> >>>> shield to the lightning protection system at the bottom of the
> pole
> > > >> >>>> and
> > > >> >>>> see about the difference.
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>> Actually it isn't even a true coax cable but a singe shielded
> > > >> >>>> twisted
> > > >> >>>> pair where the two inner wires are in parallel....Z=? Who
> knows????
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>> So considering my "fluffy" set-up, I think my VLF grabber is
> > > >> >>>> performing
> > > >> >>>> very well but for sure there is room for improvements as well.
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>> 73
> > > >> >>>> OE3GHB
> > > >> >>>> Gerhard
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>> Am Mittwoch, den 10.08.2011, 21:26 +0200 schrieb Roelof Bakker:
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>>> Hello Minto, Stefan,
> > > >> >>>>>
> > > >> >>>>> Some food for thoughts:
> > > >> >>>>>
> > > >> >>>>> When I tested a mini-whip in the garden with battery feed and
> also
> > > >> >>>>> with a
> > > >> >>>>> battery fed SLM, I found the noise lower than when used inside
> and
> > > >> >>>>> operated from the mains.
> > > >> >>>>>
> > > >> >>>>> The coax cable from the house station was connected in parallel
> > > >> >>>>> with the
> > > >> >>>>> mini-whip by means of a BNC T-piece.
> > > >> >>>>> The noise increased by 9 dB. My assumption is that this noise
> is
> > > >> >>>>> received
> > > >> >>>>> on the shield of the coax inside the house.
> > > >> >>>>>
> > > >> >>>>> Without connecting the shield to a separate radio earth, the
> noise
> > > >> >>>>> received on the shield inside the house will travel over the
> shield
> > > >> >>>>> all
> > > >> >>>>> the way to the antenna. There the noise will be received by the
> > > >> >>>>> sensitive
> > > >> >>>>> probe. This will be by means of capacitively coupling, I guess.
> > > >> >>>>> Many
> > > >> >>>>> people have reported a large drop in local noise by connecting
> the
> > > >> >>>>> shield
> > > >> >>>>> at the bottom of the mast.
> > > >> >>>>> This also applies to normal active whips of course.
> > > >> >>>>>
> > > >> >>>>> 73,
> > > >> >>>>> Roelof, pa0rdt
> > > >> >>>>>
> > > >> >>>>>
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>>
> > > >> >>>
> > > >> >>>
> > > >> >>>
> > > >> >>> -----
> > > >> >>> eMail ist virenfrei.
> > > >> >>> Von AVG überprüft - www.avg.de
> > > >> >>> Version: 10.0.1392 / Virendatenbank: 1520/3826 - Ausgabedatum:
> > > >> >>> 10.08.2011
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -----
> > > > Geen virus gevonden in dit bericht.
> > > > Gecontroleerd door AVG - www.avg.com
> > > > Versie: 10.0.1392 / Virusdatabase: 1520/3827 - datum van uitgifte:
> > > > 08/11/11
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> 
>