Return-Path: Received: from mtain-dd05.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtain-dd05.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.64.145]) by air-me07.mail.aol.com (v129.4) with ESMTP id MAILINME074-8bbb4d6e210f1d8; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 05:50:55 -0500 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-dd05.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 48F60380000B7; Wed, 2 Mar 2011 05:50:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1Pujch-0005WY-4g for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 10:49:39 +0000 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1Pujcg-0005WP-21 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 10:49:38 +0000 Received: from filter02.i-online.fr ([195.200.78.9]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1Pujce-00031n-Dy for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 10:49:38 +0000 Received: from smtp.qtxt.dns-iol.com ([195.200.78.13]) by filter02.i-online.fr (IceWarp 10.0.7 (2010-02-10)) with ESMTP (SSL) id LNZ84017 for ; Wed, 02 Mar 2011 11:49:17 +0100 Received: (qmail 3323 invoked by uid 507); 2 Mar 2011 11:49:25 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO ?192.168.1.102?) (john.rabson@numeo.fr@217.67.155.178) by smtp.qtxt.dns-iol.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2011 11:49:25 +0100 From: John Rabson Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 11:49:26 +0100 In-Reply-To: <547005.33817.qm@web28101.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <4D6D4542.28569.16DBCA9@mike.dennison.ntlworld.com> <4D6D514A.4040602@talktalk.net> <4D6D5477.3050909@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <547005.33817.qm@web28101.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-Id: <779B1D72-F075-4637-9044-D36E3DFFAE67@numeo.fr> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) X-Spam-Score: 1.9 (+) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=disabled,AMATEUR_PORN=1.473,HTML_FONT_BIG=0.256,HTML_MESSAGE=0.001,HTML_TAG_EXIST_TBODY=0.126 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-2-780703520 Subject: Re: LF: Low energy bulbs X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: *** X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.0 required=5.0 tests=AMATEUR_PORN,HTML_FONT_BIG, HTML_MESSAGE,HTML_TAG_EXISTS_TBODY autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d40914d6e210c428a X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none --Apple-Mail-2-780703520 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Fifty plus soldered joints, and such lamps don't seem to last much longer= than tungsten ones here. I wonder what the whole-life energy costs are= compared with filament lamps. John F5VLF On 1 Mar 2011, at 23:21CET, M0FMT wrote: > Hi LF > =20 > If you are a Amateur like me trying to find components the cheap way the= n this may be for you;- > =20 > 9W Philips so called energy saving SFL > =20 > Item Component > type Electrical > value Units Spec > 1 Resistor 5 Ohm 0.125W > 2 Resistor 5 Ohm 0.125W > 3 Resistor 1 Ohm 0.125W > 4 Resistor 700000 Ohm 0.125W > 5 Resistor 387000 Ohm 0.125W > 6 Resistor 48 Ohm 0.25W > 7 Capacitor 100 nF Poly ? > 8 Capacitor 23 nF Poly ? > 9 Capacitor 2.3 nF Poly ? > 10 Capacitor 1.6 nF Poly ? > 11 Capacitor 2.2 Elec Micro F 350Vw > 12 Inductor 2.795 mH Laminate Core > 13 Inductor 2.28 mH Ferite Cylinder > 14 Inductor 131 (for 9T) micro H Toroid R10 N30 > 15 Transistor DK51 Bipolar > 16 Transistor DK51 Bipolar > 17 Diode 1N4007 1000V - 1A Gen Purp Rectifier > 18 Diode 1N4007 1000V - 1A Gen Purp Rectifier > 19 Diode 1N4007 1000V - 1A Gen Purp Rectifier > 20 Diode 1N4007 1000V - 1A Gen Purp Rectifier > 21 Diode 1N4007 1000V - 1A Gen Purp Rectifier > 22 Diode 1N4007 1000V - 1A Gen Purp Rectifier > 23 Diode 1N4007 1000V - 1A Gen Purp Rectifier > 24 Diode !N4141 Fast switch small signal det > =20 >=20 > From this I have made a low power xtal controled Tx for 80m. and the Flu= rescent tube which always seems to be OK in "Failed" SFLs serves as a fine= and spectacular RF indicator when located next to your LF antenna up lead= . > Failed SFL units are a useful source of parts to the real Amateur. > Pictures available on request. > =20 > 73 es GL Pete M0FMT IO91UX >=20 >=20 > From: Stefan Sch=E4fer > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Sent: Tue, 1 March, 2011 20:17:59 > Subject: Re: LF: Low energy bulbs >=20 > Regarding energy bulbs, maybe it is an idea to put a well designed EMI= filter into the bulb cable, as close as possible? >=20 > 73, Stefan/DK7FC >=20 > Am 01.03.2011 21:04, schrieb qrss@talktalk.net: >>=20 >> I have one CFL at the moment which gives the same pattern on 24kHz. Ove= r the years I have had all makes play up, one decided to wipe out 10MHz,= that was due to a dry joint on a suppression capacitor. Dry joints have= also caused other interference and total failure. I have dismantled seve= ral CFL's, poor soldered joints are rife in them, some components can ofte= n be pulled dry from the PCB. >> Some designs are a nice source of a VLF ring core, material / type unk= nown, I have used them for coupling on two 500kHz / 136kHz multi turn RX= Loops. >>=20 >> As for filament lamps, there is always the classic 'candle bulb effect'= which wipes out analogue TV, I did have the pleasure of finding one of= those in a customers house once. >>=20 >> Eddie G3ZJO >>=20 >> On 01/03/2011 19:13, Mike Dennison wrote: >>>=20 >>> Today I noticed QRM on 136kHz that started when my wife switched a=20 >>> light on in our spare room. It had a low energy bulb by Status, and=20 >>> was marked "11W, 220-240V, 50/60Hz, 100mA". It is described on their= =20 >>> web site as "stick type" and is bayonet fitting. The QRM consisted of= =20 >>> rapidly changing noise sweeping back and forth across the band (see=20 >>> attached pic). >>>=20 >>> I replaced it with a Philips Genie WW287 light which did not seem to= =20 >>> generate any noise. >>>=20 >>> The other low energy lights in the house are General Electric E27-ES= =20 >>> 11W bulb types which are very slow to get to full brightness, but are= =20 >>> low QRM at LF. The rest are ancient filament types which are=20 >>> completely QRM-free of course. >>>=20 >>> So if you have this noise, perhaps it's one of your light bulbs. >>>=20 >>> Mike, G3XDV >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> =20 >>>=20 >>> The following section of this message contains a file attachment >>> prepared for transmission using the Internet MIME message format. >>> If you are using Pegasus Mail, or any other MIME-compliant system, >>> you should be able to save it or view it from within your mailer. >>> If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for assistance. >>>=20 >>> ---- File information ----------- >>> File: xdv00137.jpg >>> Date: 1 Mar 2011, 19:10 >>> Size: 22457 bytes. >>> Type: JPEG-image >>> =20 >>=20 >=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail-2-780703520 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Fifty plus soldered joints, and such lamps don't seem to last much= longer than tungsten ones here.  I wonder what the whole-life energy= costs are compared with filament lamps.

John F5VLF

On 1 Mar 2011, at 23:21CET, M0FMT wrote:

Hi LF
 
If yo= u are a Amateur like me trying to find components the cheap way= then this may be for you;-
 
= 9W Philips so called energy saving SFL=      ItemComponent
typeElectrical
valueUnitsSpec1Resistor5Ohm0.125W2Resistor<= td class=3D"xl66" style=3D"border-bottom-color: windowtext; border-bottom-= width: 0.5pt; border-bottom-style: solid; border-left-color: windowtext;= border-left-width: initial; border-left-style: initial; background-color:= transparent; border-top-color: windowtext; border-top-width: initial; bor= der-top-style: initial; border-right-color: windowtext; border-right-width= : 0.5pt; border-right-style: solid; ">5= Ohm0.125W<= /td>3Resistor1Ohm0.125W4<= /td>Resistor<= /font>= 700000Ohm0.125W5Resistor387000Ohm0.125W6Resistor48Ohm0.25W7Capacitor100nFPoly ?8Capacitor23nFPoly ?9Capacitor= 2.3nFPoly ?<= /td>10Capacitor1.6nFPoly= ?11Capa= citor2.2 ElecMicro F350Vw12Inductor2.795mHLaminate  Core13Inductor2.28mHFerite Cylinder14Inductor<= td class=3D"xl66" style=3D"border-bottom-color: windowtext; border-bottom-= width: 0.5pt; border-bottom-style: solid; border-left-color: windowtext;= border-left-width: initial; border-left-style: initial; background-color:= transparent; border-top-color: windowtext; border-top-width: initial; bor= der-top-style: initial; border-right-color: windowtext; border-right-width= : 0.5pt; border-right-style: solid; ">131 (for 9T)<= /font>= micro HToroid R10 N3015Transistor<= font face=3D"Calibri">DK51 Bipolar16TransistorDK51 Bipolar17Diode1N40071000V - 1AGen Pur= p Rectifier18Diode1N40071000V - 1AGen Purp Rectifier19Diode1N40071000V - 1AGen Purp Rectifier<= /font>20Diode= = 1N40071000V - 1AGen Purp Rectifier21Diode1N40071000V - 1AGen Purp Rectifier22= Diode<= /td>1N40071000V= - 1AGen Purp Rectifier23Diode<= font face=3D"Calibri">1N40071000V - 1AGen Purp Rectifier24Diode!N4141<= td class=3D"xl76" style=3D"border-bottom-color: windowtext; border-bottom-= width: 1pt; border-bottom-style: solid; border-left-color: windowtext; bor= der-left-width: initial; border-left-style: initial; background-color: tra= nsparent; border-top-color: windowtext; border-top-width: initial; border-= top-style: initial; border-right-color: windowtext; border-right-width: 0.= 5pt; border-right-style: solid; ">Fast switchsmall signa= l det

From this I have made a low power xtal controled Tx for= 80m. and the Flurescent tube which always seems to be OK in "Failed" SFLs= serves as a fine and spectacular RF indicator when located next to= your LF antenna up lead.
73 es GL Pete M0FMT= IO91UX


Fro= m: Stefan Sch= =E4fer <schaefer@iup.= uni-heidelberg.de>
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Sent: Tue, 1 March, 2011 20:17:59
Subject: Re: LF: Low energy bulbs

Regarding ener= gy bulbs, maybe it is an idea to put a well designed EMI filter into the bulb cable,= as close as possible?

73, Stefan/DK7FC

Am 01.03.2011 21:04,= schrieb qrss@talktalk.net= :
I have one CFL at the moment which gives th= e same pattern on 24kHz. Over the years I have had all makes play up, one= decided to wipe out 10MHz, that was due to a dry joint on a suppression= capacitor. Dry joints have also caused other interference and total failu= re. I  have dismantled several CFL's, poor soldered joints are rife= in them, some components can often be pulled dry from the PCB.
 S= ome designs are a nice source of a VLF ring core, material / type unknown,= I have used them for coupling on two 500kHz / 136kHz multi turn RX Loops.=

As for filament lamps, there is always the classic 'candle bulb ef= fect' which wipes out  analogue TV, I did have the pleasure of findin= g one of those in a customers house once.

Eddie G3ZJO

On 01/= 03/2011 19:13, Mike Dennison wrote:
Today I=
 noticed QRM on 136kHz that started when my wife switched a=20
light on in our spare room. It had a low energy bulb by Status, and=20
was marked "11W, 220-240V, 50/60Hz, 100mA". It is described on their=20
web site as "stick type" and is bayonet fitting. The QRM consisted of=20
rapidly changing noise sweeping back and forth across the band (see=20
attached pic).

I replaced it with a Philips Genie WW287 light which did not seem to=20
generate any noise.

The other low energy lights in the house are General Electric E27-ES=20
11W bulb types which are very slow to get to full brightness, but are=20
low QRM at LF. The rest are ancient filament types which are=20
completely QRM-free of course.

So if you have this noise, perhaps it's one of your light bulbs.

Mike, G3XDV
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D


    

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