Return-Path: Received: from mtain-dg06.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtain-dg06.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.65.14]) by air-db06.mail.aol.com (v129.4) with ESMTP id MAILINDB063-86484d6ff6b432b; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 15:14:44 -0500 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-dg06.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 8204138000083; Thu, 3 Mar 2011 15:14:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1PvEts-0007Ik-Je for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 20:13:28 +0000 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1PvEtn-0007Ib-Uf for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 20:13:23 +0000 Received: from nm16.bullet.mail.ukl.yahoo.com ([217.146.183.190]) by relay1.thorcom.net with smtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1PvEtm-0003pu-NY for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 03 Mar 2011 20:13:23 +0000 Received: from [217.146.183.214] by nm16.bullet.mail.ukl.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Mar 2011 20:13:17 -0000 Received: from [217.146.183.32] by tm7.bullet.mail.ukl.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Mar 2011 20:13:17 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1021.mail.ukl.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Mar 2011 20:13:17 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 45884.88140.bm@omp1021.mail.ukl.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 76223 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2011 20:13:16 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=btinternet.com; h=DKIM-Signature:Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE; b=CfzJm3701n03k8TOhNrixdxo4XLiOk4rxCUQ2zq0R5s94GugW1dNIzKvXDKQ0px5xMfz5C2csiFMDaDmpz10z8KcYOqgpIyK0c7lXSqhsTSE0cCDYcCj8Eqow6hQvwMP5xyQrc/xI9sefA2cL5uh6VKqTPD/8GuVsZalxwiaMAA= ; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=btinternet.com; s=s1024; t=1299183196; bh=pucdXr7INb8+Zm2MqEiOTvmHrkBHpzPr4OPzfNhOS/4=; h=Received:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE; b=IuAsPhRx67ugjagaUaayjGdBufAptW/PxsyIHiBaMzU7nfW2lKxjNvOmkfE44WKl/aj1nBbZXsawsKqDadM5xBtiRjvS4l1NFLReJ+f/wK+Jk1HlQ9wR2ZT4P/VRqHEJADGA354MuWh/Cd9fUz4nDSpLiZ9QG7vgbb6tV0nw4yo= Received: from IBM7FFA209F07C (c.ashby435@81.153.43.75 with login) by smtp818.mail.ukl.yahoo.com with SMTP; 03 Mar 2011 20:13:16 +0000 GMT X-Yahoo-SMTP: .u8e2g.swBByWKjbpA3lR6Fw.2ZEQrJJpVsTSrpXLCffsPaCEMY- X-YMail-OSG: xcjXtLEVM1kF6FNcOaCkbjDuPCCHgLfqkPeBB_EmqLhsPbv IkH1rz5_WTOgi5duJxmLY20jIFmTHeIP8QlczIadDcrornkCugp2iR_h2gKF Z_CtQCBRgrS2Sd1kcYdCh5Ea0dPDRL5TTl6ugDIAZ5S3BpYZysFwsdMMy9SA FUv0l7ctK52KhX2J5Nzvkt93nNZzVx5uLcqKxs4WnF1cUl7a4NyiyVUd81cL q0UAttnKn2feUfJtdrBQoSne9f2L5ByuII9MZCSDQ3U0sSHOQWkr01K61jlo wV5r6IS4RZAJKD0M6 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Message-ID: <2706FD6CE60C478C888AABA089130824@IBM7FFA209F07C> From: "Chris" To: References: <6C9E0C3D501744C99E11539B7AFCB120@IBM7FFA209F07C> Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2011 20:13:14 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5931 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5994 DomainKey-Status: good (testing) X-Spam-Score: 3.4 (+++) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=disabled,FORGED_MUA_OUTLOOK=3.36,HTML_MESSAGE=0.001,UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001 Subject: Re: LF: Topband Test Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0066_01CBD9DF.6D87ECB0" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: *** X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.3 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_MUA_OUTLOOK, FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: mail_rly_antispam_dkim-m014.1 ; domain : btinternet.com DKIM : pass x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d410e4d6ff6b35238 X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none ------=_NextPart_000_0066_01CBD9DF.6D87ECB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Andy and Stefan, Fascinating pictures etc., many thanks. I am still not 100% sure what= we're seeing in our test result yesterday and hope to investigate fur= ther. The effect we saw looks much more stable. Need to do it again fo= r longer, sharpen up the line(s) on Argo and so on to get more exact= measurements. We are closer than your test as well and would expect= a decent daytime ground wave for QRSS. Thanks for your kind comment Stefan. Vy 73, Chris, G4AYT. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Andy Talbot=20 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2011 7:52 PM Subject: Re: LF: Topband Test http://www.g4jnt.com/Download/1967jnt1.jpg http://www.g4jnt.com/Download/1967jnt3.jpg http://www.g4jnt.com/Download/1967jnt4.jpg Are three plots of a 4 Watt RF (probably no more than 500mW ERP) 19= 67kHz signal transmitted to G3PLX at a distance of 393km. The numbers along the bottom are UTC hours, but I have no record of= the vertical frequency span. Going on distant memory, The EVM driv= er / plotting software writen by Peter used 3.125, 6.25, 12.5 Hz plots= , so I guess the width is one of those two lower values. The signal starts waving about all over the place once it gets dark! These plots were made over the period 20 - 23 Jan 1998 according to= the date on the original files, so roughly 'about' the same point in= the last sunspot cycle as we now are in the current one, but a bit ea= rlier in the year. =20 These plots pre-dated low cost simple GPS stabilised sources, but= I did have a very good ovenned oscillator and an MSF locked standard,= that could maintain 10^-9 over the duration of the transmission; and= a synthesizer. Essential requisites for this at the time ground-bre= aking amateur experimentation. Now anyone can do it :-) Andy 'JNT =20 On 3 March 2011 18:55, Chris wrote: Hi All, Yesterday evening Pete, M0FMT, transmitted QRSS on topband for a= test. An unexpected effect was noticed with the trace splitting in tw= o. Nothing new or 'earth shattering' I expect, but new to us and worth= y of further experimentation. See the result and conclusion on my website http://qsl.net/g4ayt= on the bottom of page 1. I have never seen this effect on 137, even with quite strong audib= le signals, maybe others have. Vy 73, Chris, G4AYT, Whitstable, UK. ------=_NextPart_000_0066_01CBD9DF.6D87ECB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Andy and Stefan,
Fascinating pictures etc., many thank= s. I am still=20 not 100% sure what we're seeing in our test result yesterday and hope= to=20 investigate further. The effect we saw looks much more stable. Need to= do it=20 again for longer, sharpen up the line(s) on Argo and so on to get more= exact=20 measurements. We are closer than your test as well and would expect a= decent=20 daytime ground wave for QRSS.
Thanks for your kind comment Stefan.<= /FONT>
Vy 73,
Chris, G4AYT.
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Andy=20 Talbot
Sent: Thursday, March 03, 201= 1 7:52=20 PM
Subject: Re: LF: Topband Test=

 
Are three plots of a 4 Watt RF  (probably no mor= e than=20 500mW ERP) 1967kHz signal transmitted to G3PLX at a distance of 393k= m.
 
The numbers along the bottom are UTC hours, but I have no recor= d of the=20 vertical frequency span.   Going on distant memory,=  The=20 EVM driver / plotting software writen by Peter used 3.125, 6.25= , 12.5 Hz=20 plots, so I guess the width is one of those two lower values.
 
The signal starts waving about all over the place once it gets= =20 dark!
 
These plots were made over the period 20 - 23 Jan 199= 8=20 according to the date on the original files,  so=20 roughly 'about' the same point in the last sunspot cycle as we= =20 now are in the current one, but a bit earlier in the year. = ; =20
 
These plots pre-dated low cost simple  GPS stabilised= sources,=20 but I did have a very good ovenned oscillator and an MSF locked=20 standard, that could maintain 10^-9 over the duration of the=20 transmission; and a synthesizer.  Essential  req= uisites=20 for this at the time ground-breaking amateur experimentation. &= nbsp; Now=20 anyone can do it :-)
 
Andy
'JNT
 

 
On 3 March 2011 18:55, Chris <c.ashby435@btin= ternet.com>=20 wrote:
Hi All,
Yesterday evening Pete, M0FMT, tr= ansmitted QRSS=20 on topband for a test. An unexpected effect was noticed with the= trace=20 splitting in two. Nothing new or 'earth shattering' I expect, but= new to us=20 and worthy of further experimentation.
See the result and conclusion on= my website htt= p://qsl.net/g4ayt on the=20 bottom of page 1.
I have never seen this effect on= 137, even with=20 quite strong audible signals, maybe others have.
Vy 73,
Chris, G4AYT, Whitstable,=20 UK.

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