Return-Path: Received: from mtain-dh06.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtain-dh06.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.65.26]) by air-de04.mail.aol.com (v129.4) with ESMTP id MAILINDE041-5eae4d7a825e1a7; Fri, 11 Mar 2011 15:13:18 -0500 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-dh06.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id EA81E38000144; Fri, 11 Mar 2011 15:13:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1Py8hE-0001c8-9M for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Mar 2011 20:12:24 +0000 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1Py8hC-0001bz-HD for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Mar 2011 20:12:22 +0000 Received: from out1.ip02ir2.opaltelecom.net ([62.24.128.238]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1Py8hA-0007QK-5T for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 11 Mar 2011 20:12:22 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Av8AAFcRek1Ok8Nx/2dsb2JhbACCW4FekDSDd41Nd7FgkQ+EbHYEgXSOP4ILeQ X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.62,304,1297036800"; d="scan'208,217";a="358538806" Received: from unknown (HELO xphd97xgq27nyf) ([78.147.195.113]) by out1.ip02ir2.opaltelecom.net with SMTP; 11 Mar 2011 20:12:13 +0000 Message-ID: <009901cbe028$98efd800$0401a8c0@xphd97xgq27nyf> From: "mal hamilton" To: References: <8CDAC566BD54D9E-C98-93FD@Webmail-m125.sysops.aol.com> <4D77B7AF.3040104@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <4D79C6A3.3070900@talktalk.net> <4D7A6700.50104@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <008b01cbe023$1115a720$0401a8c0@xphd97xgq27nyf> <3D616F81-6AAF-4D99-975E-3C08C730CDF3@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2011 20:12:07 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=disabled,HTML_MESSAGE=0.001,HTML_TAG_EXIST_TBODY=0.126 Subject: Re: LF: OK2BVG_TX_8970 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0096_01CBE028.98BDCB80" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0 tests=HTML_20_30, HTML_FONTCOLOR_UNKNOWN,HTML_FONTCOLOR_UNSAFE,HTML_MESSAGE, HTML_TAG_EXISTS_TBODY autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d411a4d7a825c26ba X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none ------=_NextPart_000_0096_01CBE028.98BDCB80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Its the integrations that worry me. A spike could be anyone and freque= ncy alone is not Valid as I said. There has to be proper ID like cutti= ng the carrier or some freq shift etc on these long carrier transmissi= ons. I like proof beyond DOUBT. Others can believe what they like. How about unannounced transmissions that would be a real test of recep= tion. Let the RX station specify the frequency and keying or modulatio= n method heard/seen, then the TX station could confirm the details. I had positive ID on two stations on VLF recently, one cut carrier for= ID and the other changed the keying method so there was no doubt abou= t confirmation and exact frequency was incidental. I also had valid sc= reen captures over a good period of time which I submitted. . MAL/G3KEV =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Roger Lapthorn=20 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Friday, March 11, 2011 7:51 PM Subject: Re: LF: OK2BVG_TX_8970 Mal Don't underestimate Paul's system and capability: he is able to chec= k bearing, frequency very very accurately and do integrations over per= iods of many hours. If he says it is Lubos then it most definitely is,= believe me.=20 73s Roger G3XBM Via my 2.4GHz handheld (iPod Touch 4g) On 11 Mar 2011, at 19:32, "mal hamilton" wro= te: Something wrong. You are close to Lubos and cannot see any signal but the signal is= detected in the UK. Maybe so but but without some ID frequency alone is not a Valid co= nfirmation, a couple of spikes on a screen in meaningless. I am not convinced. I also saw a weak trace that stopped just afte= r 1230 but it could be anything. de G3KEV ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Stefan Sch=C3=A4fer=20 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Friday, March 11, 2011 6:16 PM Subject: Re: LF: OK2BVG_TX_8970 Hello Lubos,=20 Sorry, i haven't seen anything it seems. But 600 km by using 25= W at 8970 Hz would almost be a wonder :-) Go on and good luck 73, Stefan Am 11.03.2011 13:47, schrieb Lubos OK2BVG:=20 Hello Eddie!=20 Thanks, for your receiving! My TX was on from 08:00 to 12:30UT= . Did you detect my signal? Lubos, OK2BVG ----------------------------------------------------------------------= -- Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2011 06:52:19 +0000 From: qrss@talktalk.net To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: OK2BVG_TX_8970 Hi Lubos RX is on this morning awaiting your test. Good Luck Eddie G3ZJO On 10/03/2011 19:08, Lubos OK2BVG wrote:=20 Hello Stefan, Markus, Gerhard and all VLF enthusiasts!=20 I was quite busy during last days, so I am writing just now. Well... I tested my new VLF TX set of the day 5th March. It= was the first test only and I am very pleased, you saw my signal. I= expected, it would be poorly visible on the Gerhard=C2=B4s grabber= only! In fact, it was visible with S/N 10dB. Some information: The antenna is my MW Marconi L (24m up), but I increased top= load on the value 220m. Generator is Wandel/Goltermann PS30, the finest tuning step= 1Hz (OCXO). PA is Seba Dynatronic 25W out. My loading coil is made from 60l barrel, it contains two fix= ed coils 500 + 500 turns of wire 0,4CuL + rotary coil made from 5litr= e bucket. I am going to take some photos and give them on my websides= at the weekend. I will let you know, they are there. My next VLF test will be tomorrow (2011-03-11): =20 I will start transmission on 8970 tomorrow morning at 08:00U= T.=20 Than I won=C2=B4t be at home, so TX will transmit to approxi= mately 12:00UT. It is the best time for VLF TX test, becouse the noise= would be the lowest. Thanks for your encouraging words and help!=20 73! Lubos ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2011 18:23:59 +0100 From: Stefan.Schaefer@iup.uni-heidelberg.de To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: VLF: OK2BVG signal in Todmorden Wow, the next one!=20 Lubos, can you tell us about your station? All parameters an= d data please :-) How strong have you been visible at OE3GHB? Welcome in the VLF TX group ;-) 73, Stefan/DK7FC Am 09.03.2011 10:49, schrieb Markus Vester:=20 Dear Lubos, LF, beneath is a posting from Paul Nicholson in the Yahoo VLF= groop. His spectrum from last Saturday morning shows three amateur si= gnals, including yours. Very good! 73, Markus ________________________________ Re: [VLF_Group] Re: DF6NM on 8970.00=20 Tue Mar 8, 2011 11:54 pm=20 Thanks for the info Markus. > I do not know whether that was really a transmission > from Lubos, or a local pretest from Gerhard. Yes, that long dash was Lubos. OK2BVG was active that morning for a couple of hours. I get this spectrum, (08:00-09:00, 278uHz bins) http://abelian.org/vlf/tmp/110308b.gif which has a small peak at 8970Hz - 3.0mHz, bearing east. To bring this out I found the best S/N at bearing 110 and I synthesised a unidirectional cardioid by combining H and= E fields. Only 3.6 sigma unfortunately. Hopefully Lubos will do further tests. He should be visibl= e here with 30uW at 1423km if the tx frequency is stable eno= ugh. -- Paul Nicholson -- Re: [VLF_Group] Re: DF6NM on 8970.00=20 Thanks for the info Markus. > I do not know whether that was really a transmissi= on > from Lubos, or a local pretest from Gerhard. Yes, that long dash was Lubos. OK2BVG was active that morning for a couple of hours= . I get this spectrum, (08:00-09:00, 278uHz bins) http://abelian.org/vlf/tmp/110308b.gif which has a small peak at 8970Hz - 3.0mHz, bearing= east. To bring this out I found the best S/N at bearing 11= 0 and I synthesised a unidirectional cardioid by combining= H and E fields. Only 3.6 sigma unfortunately. Hopefully Lubos will do further tests. He should be= visible here with 30uW at 1423km if the tx frequency is stab= le enough. -- Paul Nicholson -- =20 =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0096_01CBE028.98BDCB80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Its the integrations that worry me. A spike co= uld be=20 anyone and frequency alone is not Valid as I said. There has to be pro= per ID=20 like cutting the carrier or some freq shift etc on these long carrier= =20 transmissions.
I like proof beyond DOUBT. Others can bel= ieve what=20 they like.
How about unannounced transmissions that would= be a real=20 test of reception. Let the RX station specify the frequency and keying= or=20 modulation method heard/seen, then the TX station could confirm the=20 details.
I had positive ID on two stations on VLF recen= tly, one cut=20 carrier for ID and the other changed the keying method so there was no= doubt=20 about confirmation and exact frequency was incidental. I also had= valid=20 screen captures over a good period of time which I submitted.
.
 
MAL/G3KEV
   
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, March 11, 2011= 7:51=20 PM
Subject: Re: LF: OK2BVG_TX_89= 70

Mal

Don't underestimate Paul's system and capability: he is able to= check=20 bearing, frequency very very accurately and do integrations over per= iods of=20 many hours. If he says it is Lubos then it most definitely is, belie= ve=20 me. 

73s
Roger G3XBM

Via my 2.4GHz handheld (iPod Touch 4g)

On 11 Mar 2011, at 19:32, "mal hamilton" <g3kevmal@talktalk.net>=20 wrote:

Something wrong.
You are close to Lubos and cannot see any= signal but=20 the signal is detected in the UK.
Maybe so but but without some ID frequency= alone is=20 not a Valid confirmation, a couple of spikes on a screen in=20 meaningless.
I am not convinced. I also saw a weak trac= e that=20 stopped just after 1230 but it could be anything.
 
de G3KEV
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Stefan Sch=C3=A4fer= =20
Sent: Friday, March 11,= 2011 6:16=20 PM
Subject: Re: LF: OK2BVG_T= X_8970

Hello Lubos,

Sorry, i haven't seen anythi= ng it=20 seems. But 600 km by using 25 W at 8970 Hz would almost be a won= der=20 :-)

Go on and good luck

73, Stefan


Am= 11.03.2011=20 13:47, schrieb Lubos OK2BVG:=20
Hello Eddie!=20
Thanks, for your receiving! My TX was on from 08:00 to 12= :30UT. Did=20 you detect my signal?

Lubos, OK2BVG

Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2011 06:52:19 +0000
From: qrss@talktalk.net<= BR>To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subj= ect:=20 Re: LF: OK2BVG_TX_8970

Hi Lubos

RX is on this mo= rning=20 awaiting your test.

Good Luck

Eddie G3ZJO
On=20 10/03/2011 19:08, Lubos OK2BVG wrote:=20
Hello Stefan, Markus, Gerhard and all VLF enthusiasts!=20
I was quite busy during last days, so I am writing just= =20 now.
Well... I tested my new VLF TX set of the day  5th= March. It=20 was the first test only and I am very pleased, you saw my si= gnal. I=20 expected, it would be poorly visible  on the Gerhard=C2= =B4s grabber=20 only! In fact, it was visible with S/N 10dB.
Some information:
The antenna is my MW Marconi L (24m up), but I increase= d top load=20 on the value 220m.
Generator is Wandel/Goltermann PS30, the finest tuning= step 1Hz=20 (OCXO).
PA is Seba Dynatronic 25W out.
My loading coil is made from 60l barrel, it contains tw= o fixed=20 coils  500 + 500 turns of wire 0,4CuL + rotary coil mad= e from=20 5litre bucket.

I am going to take some photos and give them on my webs= ides at=20 the weekend. I will let you know, they are there.

My next VLF test will be tomorrow (2011-03-11):  = =20  
I will start transmission on 8970 tomorrow morning at= =20 08:00UT. 
Than I won=C2=B4t be at home, so TX will transmit to ap= proximately=20 12:00UT. It is the best time for VLF TX test, becouse the no= ise would=20 be the lowest.

Thanks for your encouraging words and= =20 help! 

73!

Lubos

Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2011 18:23:59 +0100
From: Stefan.Schaefer@iup.uni-heidelberg.de
To:=20 rsgb_lf_group@bla= cksheep.org
Subject:=20 Re: VLF: OK2BVG signal in Todmorden

Wow, the next one= !=20
Lubos, can you tell us about your station? All parameter= s and data=20 please :-)
How strong have you been visible at=20 OE3GHB?

Welcome in the VLF TX group ;-)

73,=20 Stefan/DK7FC


Am 09.03.2011 10:49, schrieb Markus= Vester:=20
Dear Lubos, LF,<= /DIV>
 
beneath is= a posting=20 from Paul Nicholson in the Yahoo VLF groop. His spect= rum from=20 last Saturday morning shows three amateur signals, includi= ng=20 yours.
 
Very good!
 
73, Markus
 
__= ______________________________
Re: [VLF_Group]= Re: DF6NM on=20 8970.00
Tue Mar 8,&nbs= p;2011=20 11:54 pm


Thanks for the info=20 Markus.

> I do not know whether that was really= a=20 transmission
> from Lubos, or a local pretest from= =20 Gerhard.

Yes, that long dash was Lubos.
OK2BVG= was active=20 that morning for a couple of hours.

I get this spec= trum,=20 (08:00-09:00, 278uHz bins)

http:/= /abelian.org/vlf/tmp/110308b.gif

which=20 has a small peak at 8970Hz - 3.0mHz, bearing east.

= To bring=20 this out I found the best S/N at bearing 110 and
I synt= hesised a=20 unidirectional cardioid by combining H and E fields.
Only 3.6=20 sigma unfortunately.

Hopefully Lubos will do furthe= r tests.=20 He should be visible
here with 30uW at 1423km if the tx= frequency=20 is stable enough.
--
Paul Nicholson
--

Re: [VLF_G= roup] Re:=20 DF6NM on 8970.00


Thank= s for the=20 info Markus.

> I do not know whether that= was really=20 a transmission
> from Lubos, or a local pretes= t from=20 Gerhard.

Yes, that long dash was Lubos.
OK= 2BVG was=20 active that morning for a couple of hours.

I= get this=20 spectrum, (08:00-09:00, 278uHz bins)

http://abel= ian.org/vlf/tmp/110308b.gif

which=20 has a small peak at 8970Hz - 3.0mHz, bearing east.
To=20 bring this out I found the best S/N at bearing 110= and
I=20 synthesised a unidirectional cardioid by combining= H and E=20 fields.

Only 3.6 sigma unfortunately.

= Hopefully=20 Lubos will do further tests. He should be visiblehere with=20 30uW at 1423km if the tx frequency is stable=20 enough.
--
Paul=20 Nicholson
--


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