Return-Path: Received: from mtain-dh09.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtain-dh09.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.65.29]) by air-de03.mail.aol.com (v129.4) with ESMTP id MAILINDE032-5eab4d507ee913a; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 18:23:21 -0500 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-dh09.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 9C0F738000095; Mon, 7 Feb 2011 18:23:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1PmaPI-0001nQ-34 for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 23:22:08 +0000 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1PmaPH-0001nH-It for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 23:22:07 +0000 Received: from mail-iy0-f171.google.com ([209.85.210.171]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1PmaPE-0002qX-0K for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 23:22:07 +0000 Received: by iyh42 with SMTP id 42so2146585iyh.16 for ; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 15:21:57 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=0y5XaEF83+lTeeZJZEvG9br9uLt2284xuND4oLILnDE=; b=vaqupkr8uMVI8DWVatWeyQNSFBGufy5uWjwdo8dovtiDrHkNQ/+6selXjItcOdsYXq OT7y0ojrkn+IFefCovkeTsa/gO+6HCcASEDXzvKUyvxWgE8CLkqOBL+xx2KVXMGSK1s1 tyKGDAh7u/6Iidrfa646YquC6jYx4QhSQE1T8= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; b=XsqzVBzUgjw9J8G33M+mBxykSKR8GCPnvsqSbmKSUkREmvsG+94qrNMRpKXPO3rt0m vssPI+xiiuUXheGpIZvrtbs7fY53IH1uOdt0a0GSIFpUJC7EttH3UFbDj7KYyA9VOrtT iyH+pJ+RIgTaBmHTReRNe5x/YSOXQZSTlVSqs= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.42.225.137 with SMTP id is9mr19173966icb.264.1297120914233; Mon, 07 Feb 2011 15:21:54 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.231.199.4 with HTTP; Mon, 7 Feb 2011 15:21:54 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2011 23:21:54 +0000 Message-ID: From: Andy Talbot To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org, sub9khz@yahoogroups.com DomainKey-Status: good (testing) X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=disabled,HTML_10_20=0.945,HTML_MESSAGE=0.001 Subject: LF: Frequency Shift keying types Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf3054a17152da3a049bb97f5a X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: mail_rly_antispam_dkim-m011.1 ; domain : gmail.com DKIM : fail x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d411d4d507ee61c20 X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none X-Mailer: Unknown (No Version) --20cf3054a17152da3a049bb97f5a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Wolf brought up the subject of coherent Frequency Shifting earlier... See http://www.g4jnt.com/FSK_Types.pdf for spectral plots comparing both types of FSK. These were generated using the PIC DDS source with both software versions in turn. The waveform is made by switching between tones of 1200 and 2200Hz using 25WPM CW from a beacon keyer module to simulate random data. The lack of any structure for the narrowest frequency resolution using phase continuous keying is very obvious. This is the more usualy type of FSK seen in practice, usually generated by altering an oscillator frequency with the input data. The disadvantage when anyone tries to receive one of the tones using ultra narrow band techniques is very obvious. The slightly higher out of band levels due to the hard switching of the coherent waveform are just about noticeable, but don't appear that much worse. Phase coherent (or Frequency Exchange) Keying is more complicated to do in hardware, requiring two oscillators to run continuously and to select one or the other with the input data. However, if implemented using DSP probably the same complexity for either, with two simultaneous NCOs, and selecting one or the other for the tone output but removing the need to change the frequency word regularly. Andy G4JNT > ... ! > > One suggestion for VLFers: A PIC doesn't cost a fortune. Build two of these > generators, and clock them with the same source (GPSDO or OCXO). For the FSK > simply flip between both generators. This has the *big* (cannot emphasize > this enough..) advantage that if the signal is to weak to be seen as DFCW > etc, we can still dig it out through a long FFT because each of the two > carriers remains coherent, and can be coherently averaged as long as > necessary (much longer than a single DFCW symbol). I noticed this on > Stefan's signal today : With the very slow settings, all you see is a > rounded hump in the spectrum because the signal isn't coherent. No chance to > detect it for "DX" receivers. > > Of course flipping the (FSK-) switch may cause a heavy click then > (depending on the momentary phase shift between the two carriers) but I > think a robust PA will survive this. > > Have a nice sunday, > Wolf . > --20cf3054a17152da3a049bb97f5a Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Wolf =A0brought up the subject of coherent Frequency Shifting=A0earli= er...
=A0
See http://www.g4jnt.c= om/FSK_Types.pdf=A0=A0 for spectral plots comparing both types of FSK.= =A0=A0 These were generated using the PIC DDS source with both software ve= rsions in turn.=A0=A0=A0 The waveform is made=A0by switching between=A0ton= es of 1200 and 2200Hz using 25WPM CW from a beacon keyer module=A0to simul= ate random data.

The lack of any structure for the narrowest frequency resolution= using phase continuous keying is very obvious.=A0 This is the=A0more usua= ly=A0type of FSK seen in practice, usually generated by altering an oscill= ator frequency with the input=A0data.=A0The disadvantage when=A0anyone tri= es to receive one of the tones using ultra narrow band techniques is very= obvious.=A0=A0=A0=A0 The slightly higher out of band levels due to the ha= rd switching of the coherent waveform are just about noticeable, but=A0don= 't appear=A0that much worse.
=A0
Phase coherent (or Frequency Exchange) Keying is more complicated to= do in hardware, requiring two oscillators to run continuously and to sele= ct one or the other with the input data.=A0=A0 However, if implemented usi= ng DSP probably the same complexity for either,=A0=A0with two simultaneous= NCOs, and selecting one or the other for the=A0tone output=A0 but removin= g the need=A0to=A0change the frequency word regularly.
=A0
Andy=A0=A0 G4JNT

=A0
... !

One suggestion for= VLFers: A PIC doesn't cost a fortune. Build two of these generators,= and clock them with the same source (GPSDO or OCXO). For the FSK simply= flip between both generators. This has the *big* (cannot emphasize this= enough..) advantage that if the signal is to weak to be seen as DFCW etc,= we can still dig it out through a long FFT because each of the two carrie= rs remains coherent, and can be coherently averaged as long as necessary= (much longer than a single DFCW symbol). I noticed this on Stefan's= signal today : With the very slow settings, all you see is a rounded hump= in the spectrum because the signal isn't coherent. No chance to detec= t it for "DX" receivers.

Of course flipping the (FSK-) switch may cause a heavy click then (dep= ending on the momentary phase shift between the two carriers) but I think= a robust PA will survive this.

Have a nice sunday,
=A0=A0 Wolf= .
--20cf3054a17152da3a049bb97f5a--