Return-Path: Received: from mtain-ma12.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtain-ma12.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.96.20]) by air-mc07.mail.aol.com (v129.4) with ESMTP id MAILINMC073-a97d4c05279f3b1; Tue, 01 Jun 2010 11:30:39 -0400 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [193.82.116.20]) by mtain-ma12.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 6E7473800008A; Tue, 1 Jun 2010 11:30:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1OJTPQ-0007mp-3F for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Jun 2010 16:29:40 +0100 Received: from [193.82.116.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1OJTPP-0007mg-J5 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Jun 2010 16:29:39 +0100 Received: from cavuit02.kulnet.kuleuven.be ([134.58.240.44]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1OJTPN-0002Fl-L1 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 01 Jun 2010 16:29:39 +0100 Received: from smtps02.kuleuven.be (smtpshost02.kulnet.kuleuven.be [134.58.240.75]) by cavuit02.kulnet.kuleuven.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4F8651C002 for ; Tue, 1 Jun 2010 17:29:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ICTS-S-HUB-N1.luna.kuleuven.be (icts-s-hub-n1.luna.kuleuven.be [10.112.9.11]) by smtps02.kuleuven.be (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A5EAF3863 for ; Tue, 1 Jun 2010 17:29:29 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ICTS-S-EXC2-CA.luna.kuleuven.be ([10.112.11.13]) by ICTS-S-HUB-N1.luna.kuleuven.be ([10.112.9.11]) with mapi; Tue, 1 Jun 2010 17:29:29 +0200 X-Kuleuven: This mail passed the K.U.Leuven mailcluster From: Rik Strobbe To: "rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org" Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2010 17:29:29 +0200 Thread-Topic: LF: QRO / QRP Thread-Index: AcsBnBJiEi/YiHL3SIqo6t8NF00GUQAAXJ2P Message-ID: References: <4C0505F3.23023.3198CFC@mike.dennison.ntlworld.com>,<1OJR3q-0nK4tk0@fwd09.t-online.de> <81893174-4350-4FE1-8D70-4FF4EBB44BCE@leeds.ac.uk> <13C79C2C1C7C41FB801BC4911C404C52@Hugh>,<4C05212A.4000809@junkshifta.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4C05212A.4000809@junkshifta.co.uk> Accept-Language: nl-NL, nl-BE Content-Language: nl-BE X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: nl-NL, nl-BE MIME-Version: 1.0 X-KULeuven-Information: Katholieke Universiteit Leuven X-KULeuven-Scanned: Found to be clean X-KULeuven-Envelope-From: rik.strobbe@fys.kuleuven.be X-Spam-Score: 1.2 (+) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=disabled,HTML_MESSAGE=0.001,SUBJ_ALL_CAPS=1.166 Subject: RE: LF: QRO / QRP Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_BF4A524700075746A6467658DFC7102C5106464F21ICTSSEXC2CAlu_" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.7 required=5.0 tests=HTML_FONTCOLOR_RED, HTML_MESSAGE,SUBJ_ALL_CAPS,TO_ADDRESS_EQ_REAL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d60144c05279d3659 X-AOL-IP: 193.82.116.20 X-Mailer: Unknown (No Version) --_000_BF4A524700075746A6467658DFC7102C5106464F21ICTSSEXC2CAlu_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Very very small is the answer and smaller at lower frequencies. Indeed, and thus about 73500 times higher at 10GHz than at 136kHz ... Andy will not be happy ;-) 73, Rik ON7YD - OR7T BTW: Planck constant is 6.626*10exp-34 Js thus absolute QRP is about 10exp= -30 W at 136kHz and about 7*10exp-24 W at 10 GHz. If anyone can copy your claimed "absolute QRP" signal there is a 99.99999.= . % chance that you are cheating, if you are copied by 2 stations at the= same time is is 100% sure. ________________________________________ Van: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.or= g] namens Simon Newhouse [Simon@junkshifta.co.uk] Verzonden: dinsdag 1 juni 2010 17:03 Aan: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Onderwerp: Re: LF: QRO / QRP E=3Dhv E=3Denergy of the photon v=3Dfrequency h=3Dplanks constant Very very small is the answer and smaller at lower frequencies. Hugh_m0wye wrote: > Chris and group, > What an intriguing thought - building a village inside a photon. > It reminded me about the article on Toroidal Antennas that Jim M0BMU > drrew our attention to on 1st March. It contained diagrams showing the > phase-closed-loops which constitute photons. > Since fractional photons don't exist, I assume there is a minimum > power level below which nothing is radiated - in other words there is > a lower level of QRP which cannot be received by ANY receiver, no > matter how well endowed with antennas and low noise amplifiers - > simply because it is less than 1 photon. > I wonder how small it is ? > 73 > Hugh M0WYE > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Trayner" > > To: > Sent: Tuesday, June 01, 2010 2:35 PM > Subject: Re: LF: QRO / QRP > > > Hi Rik, > >> interesting approach that QRP not only includes power (input, output, >> ERP ...) but also dimensions. > > We meet something like that at work, where there are THz researchers > as well as those of us interested in (V)LF. > > They look down their noses at it if there aren't twelve zeroes in the > frequency; > we look down our noses at it if you can't build a small village inside > a photon. > > 73, > Chris G4OKW > > ----------------------- > Dr Chris Trayner > School of Electronic & Electrical Engineering, > The University of Leeds, > Leeds LS2 9JT, United Kingdom > Tel: +44 113 34 32053 > Fax: +44 113 34 32032 > > > > > > --_000_BF4A524700075746A6467658DFC7102C5106464F21ICTSSEXC2CAlu_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Very very small is the answer and smaller at lo= wer frequencies.

Indeed, and thus about 73500 times higher at 10GHz than at 136kHz ...

Andy will not be happy ;-)

 

73, Rik  ON7YD - OR7T

 

BTW: Planck constant is 6.626*10exp-34= Js thus absolute QRP is about 10exp-30 W at 136kHz and about 7*10exp-24= W at 10 GHz.

If anyone can copy your claimed "absolute QRP" signal there= is a 99.99999.. % chance that you are cheating, if you are copied by 2 st= ations at the same time is is 100% sure.

________________________________________
Van: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.or= g] namens Simon Newhouse [Simon@junkshifta.co.uk]
Verzonden: dinsdag 1 juni 2010 17:03
Aan: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Onderwerp: Re: LF: QRO / QRP

E=3Dhv
E=3Denergy of the photon
v=3Dfrequency
h=3Dplanks constant

Very very small is the answer and smaller at lower frequencies.

Hugh_m0wye wrote:
> Chris and group,
> What an intriguing thought - building a village inside a photon.
> It reminded me about the article on Toroidal Antennas that Jim M0BMU<= br> > drrew our attention to on 1st March. It contained diagrams showing th= e
> phase-closed-loops which constitute photons.
> Since fractional photons don't exist, I assume there is a minimum
> power level below which nothing is radiated - in other words there is=
> a lower level of QRP which cannot be received by ANY receiver, no
> matter how well endowed with antennas and low noise amplifiers -
> simply because it is less than 1 photon.
> I wonder how small it is ?
> 73
> Hugh M0WYE
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Trayner"
> <C.Trayner@leeds.ac.uk>
> To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, June 01, 2010 2:35 PM
> Subject: Re: LF: QRO / QRP
>
>
> Hi Rik,
>
>> interesting approach that QRP not only includes power (input, out= put,
>> ERP ...) but also dimensions.
>
> We meet something like that at work, where there are THz researchers<= br> > as well as those of us interested in (V)LF.
>
> They look down their noses at it if there aren't twelve zeroes in the=
> frequency;
> we look down our noses at it if you can't build a small village insid= e
> a photon.
>
> 73,
> Chris G4OKW
>
> -----------------------
> Dr Chris Trayner
> School of Electronic & Electrical Engineering,
> The University of Leeds,
> Leeds LS2 9JT, United Kingdom
> Tel: +44 113 34 32053
> Fax: +44 113 34 32032
>
>
>
>
>
>

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