Return-Path: Received: from mtain-mj09.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtain-mj09.r1000.mail.aol.com [172.21.164.93]) by air-dd07.mail.aol.com (v127_r1.1) with ESMTP id MAILINDD073-865d4baa8ae7d3; Wed, 24 Mar 2010 17:57:59 -0400 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [193.82.116.20]) by mtain-mj09.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 25C7C380000B5; Wed, 24 Mar 2010 17:57:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1NuYYs-0007Bo-Ks for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 Mar 2010 21:56:26 +0000 Received: from [193.82.116.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1NuYYs-0007Bf-7U for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 Mar 2010 21:56:26 +0000 Received: from lnx500.hrz.tu-darmstadt.de ([130.83.156.225]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1NuYYq-0001bb-Ha for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 24 Mar 2010 21:56:26 +0000 Received: from FILE-SERVER-HST.hst.e-technik.tu-darmstadt.de (File-Server-HST.hst.e-technik.tu-darmstadt.de [130.83.212.129]) by lnx500.hrz.tu-darmstadt.de (8.14.2/8.14.2/HRZ/PMX) with SMTP id o2OLuNB6032195 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2010 22:56:23 +0100 (envelope-from schaefer@hst.tu-darmstadt.de) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=File-Server-HST.hst.e-technik.tu-darmstadt.de) by FILE-SERVER-HST.hst.e-technik.tu-darmstadt.de with AVK MailGateway; for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2010 22:56:23 +0100 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 22:56:23 +0100 Message-ID: <38A51B74B884D74083D7950AD0DD85E82A1B93@File-Server-HST.hst.e-technik.tu-darmstadt.de> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: <38A51B74B884D74083D7950AD0DD85E82A1B93@File-Server-HST.hst.e-technik.tu-darmstadt.de> Thread-Topic: AW: LF: Re: Mini-Whip Thread-Index: AcrLmykcs2RCmDi9RkixC0a2f1FgNQAAC2Oe References: <2a2c8.24f60f40.38d54e4e@aol.com> <38A51B74B884D74083D7950AD0DD85E82A1B81@File-Server-HST.hst.e-technik.tu-darmstadt.de> <4BA5CFAA.2030007@freenet.de> <56800827A5644E1BB3F320CB51E2300E@Black> <26E279AD762E44FB937A8A7DF8F934BC@Black> <8C7F2923D86B4517B1C156BA499E96E4@Black> <29746320.1346347.1269244849281.JavaMail.fmail@mwmweb078> <4BA7361F.1030702@abelian.org> <4BA7A586.8080307@abelian.org> <38A51B74B884D74083D7950AD0DD85E82A1B87@File-Server-HST.hst.e-technik.tu-darmstadt.de> <0A742B5B9F6A4E84A802D1F98B670E79@JimPC> <20100323130953.2BEFC31E702@smtps01.kuleuven.be> <38A51B74B884D74083D7950AD0DD85E82A1B91@File-Server-HST.hst.e-technik.tu-darmstadt.de> From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Stefan_Sch=E4fer?= To: X-AVK-Virus-Check: AVB 19.841;24.03.2010 X-PMX-TU: seen v0.99a by 5.5.9.388399, Antispam-Engine: 2.7.2.376379, Antispam-Data: 2010.3.24.214819 X-PMX-SPAMCHECK: outgoing mail X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=disabled,none Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01CACB9C.D7FC8DDF" Subject: AW: AW: LF: Re: Mini-Whip X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-VSS-INFO: 5400.1158/56659 X-AOL-VSS-CODE: clean x-aol-sid: 3039400c89b24baa8adc1f4d X-AOL-IP: 193.82.116.20 X-Mailer: Unknown (No Version) ------_=_NextPart_001_01CACB9C.D7FC8DDF Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Roelof, VLF,=20 =20 Yes, we (and others) arrived there on 137kHz and above. But it is so hard= to belive that this is optimal even in the 33km band. Maybe the optimum= C is not a function of the frequency, if discussing an optimal SNR.=20 But you know i am rather a practical instead of a theoretical OM ;-) There= fore i asked if someone has checked this before on VLF. I also know the eq= uivalent circuit of that probe and the FET input, out of Rs and Cs but any= way ;-) With a stronger input signal and same SNR there could be a benefit to unse= nsitive receivers as well (as you mentioned) as long as the input stage is= not overdriven... =20 Paul, have you a website where your RX equipment is shown? The antenna and= it's environment, cables and so on? Maybe the preamt with the LT1028 and= so on? =20 73, Stefan ________________________________ Von: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org im Auftrag von Roelof Bakker Gesendet: Mi 24.03.2010 22:40 An: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Betreff: Re: AW: LF: Re: Mini-Whip Hello Stefan, Just like you have reported some time ago, I have done tests to establish= =20 the best SNR for a whip antenna at LF in regard to the minimum length. I= =20 arrived at the same length as you did at 137 kHz: 30 cm. A longer antenna= =20 did improve the signal strength, but not the SNR. The capacitive probe is= =20 equivalent to a 30 cm whip. I can't see a reason why the SNR should change with frequency, but I will= =20 test it nevertheless. 73, Roelof, pa0rdt ------_=_NextPart_001_01CACB9C.D7FC8DDF Content-Type: application/ms-tnef; name="winmail.dat" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IhgVAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEgAEAGgAAAEFXOiBBVzogTEY6IFJlOiBN aW5pLVdoaXAAMwcBBYADAA4AAADaBwMAGAAWADgAFwADAGQBASCAAwAOAAAA2gcDABgAFgA4ABcA AwBkAQEJgAEAIQAAADNCNzgzNTYzNzlDQUEyNEFCRjE5MUJBNzdEQjI3RkZGAGYHAQOQBgAMFAAA OAAAAAMANgAAAAAAQAA5AN+N/Necy8oBHgA9AAEAAAAFAAAAQVc6IAAAAAACAUcAAQAAADIAAABj PURFO2E9IDtwPUhTVDtsPUZJTEUtU0VSVkVSLUgtMTAwMzI0MjE1NjIzWi0yMTY2AAAAHgBJAAEA AAAaAAAAUmU6IEFXOiBMRjogUmU6IE1pbmktV2hpcAAAAEAATgCAXpihmsvKAR4AWgABAAAAIwAA AG93bmVyLXJzZ2JfbGZfZ3JvdXBAYmxhY2tzaGVlcC5vcmcAAAIBWwABAAAAYwAAAAAAAACBKx+k vqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAG93bmVyLXJzZ2JfbGZfZ3JvdXBAYmxhY2tzaGVlcC5vcmcAU01UUABv 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