Return-Path: Received: from mtain-dh12.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtain-dh12.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.65.32]) by air-mb01.mail.aol.com (v127_r1.1) with ESMTP id MAILINMB012-a0784b87e24c2c5; Fri, 26 Feb 2010 10:01:32 -0500 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [193.82.116.20]) by mtain-dh12.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 2586B3800031A; Fri, 26 Feb 2010 10:01:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1Nl1fQ-0005zA-VK for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 Feb 2010 14:59:48 +0000 Received: from [193.82.116.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1Nl1fQ-0005z1-Ek for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 Feb 2010 14:59:48 +0000 Received: from mail-bw0-f215.google.com ([209.85.218.215]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1Nl1fO-0006Ki-D5 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 26 Feb 2010 14:59:48 +0000 Received: by bwz7 with SMTP id 7so139033bwz.4 for ; Fri, 26 Feb 2010 06:59:38 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=c1CfeUuB63BtnvoRaOa6CrwOyBtrnV8Ix51NI+NjMTU=; b=n8uUBPgaF5CnBoTc3AX7aF6sMh4O9UYE3P7c1cTeWEVQUFL99LY9G2GjkCTmOl8aZe yFjjhvXq7VDZeJsH2GnUGHvhn18VPp8eEqpBq89h3Nz2JpAq8YUVTRidSEBx20XTAXPL 9D0P823OvTYqVyPDu301XPexiHiMMK4yszdmA= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlemail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=jrt+IPsNDvsqLc5FPj+pwgR9PU4t+DOSECHFbDxxIfOJi4pjraVwt5qrCi8fCoKrlQ gWzWNEyzLr++OlAP66ux2CIrvxbyubSD8inKsL3flqtT4yotRtqdhYv7ahlZihhybq16 26Tp4fuBgZXVFyzXwk0IyDVrtu4nhbIeprFv8= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.204.152.153 with SMTP id g25mr361858bkw.158.1267196377426; Fri, 26 Feb 2010 06:59:37 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <61C255CA083040EDA5A011C0B0572524@AGB> References: <9afca2641002221442s72f18373t26847ca0487ac2b1@mail.gmail.com> <9afca2641002230232k3af949e6kcd2fe2a53b11d822@mail.gmail.com> <9afca2641002250919y7bdb25ebq8b913bb7d210e488@mail.gmail.com> <57a24ca71002251331m10d45acfo2284f6cfe89f5607@mail.gmail.com> <61C255CA083040EDA5A011C0B0572524@AGB> Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 14:59:37 +0000 Message-ID: From: Andy Talbot To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org DomainKey-Status: good (testing) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=disabled,HTML_MESSAGE=0.001 Subject: Re: LF: Fwd: Special Permits for Amateur Radio Operation below 9kHz? Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0015175d04faefebde0480822554 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: mail_rly_antispam_dkim-m258.2 ; domain : googlemail.com DKIM : pass x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d41204b87e24506c5 X-AOL-IP: 193.82.116.20 X-Mailer: Unknown (No Version) --0015175d04faefebde0480822554 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Yes, unbelievable isn't it! Been going gon for abt 4 weeks now. Andy www.g4jnt.com On 26 February 2010 13:46, Graham wrote: > Warren , > > If you think this is bad, you should take a look at the 'ROS' > discussion's in the yahoo digital data group .. SS paranoia has taken > hold ! > > G .. > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: "Warren Ziegler" > Sent: Thursday, February 25, 2010 9:31 PM > To: > Subject: Re: LF: Fwd: Special Permits for Amateur Radio Operation below > 9kHz? > > >> Asking Ofcom for a license or Nov to generate a signal that will not >> extend past your own garden seems like a lot of trouble for >> nothing.... >> >> -- >> 73 Warren K2ORS >> WD2XGJ >> WD2XSH/23 >> WE2XEB/2 >> WE2XGR/1 >> >> >> On Thu, Feb 25, 2010 at 3:28 PM, Jacek Lipkowski >> wrote: >> >>> On Thu, 25 Feb 2010, Roger Lapthorn wrote: >>> >>> People may be interested in the reply from Rod Wilkinson at OFCOM >>>> received >>>> today. I asked him what OFCOM's view would be. >>>> >>> >>> [...] >>> >>>> >>>> They state that ITU Radio Regs indicate that there is no allocation for >>>> frequencies below 9 kHz. However in the UK, a licence would be required >>>> as >>>> there is no lower frequency limit for wireless telegraphy under the WT >>>> Act >>>> 2006. [...] >>>> >>> >>> there is already a very big commercial user of the elf and vlf spectrum, >>> they inject very big power into ground dipoles. emissions from one >>> continent >>> can be heard on another. and they do this without any license from the >>> radio >>> authorities. the only regulation they need regards maximum field >>> strengths >>> (and this is usually the realm of some environmental protection authority >>> and not the radio authority). the operating frequency varies, but is >>> usually >>> 50Hz, 60Hz, 16.6Hz etc :) >>> >>> sometimes when dealing with the goverment, the best practice is not to >>> ask >>> at all :) even if they agree with you there will always be a "but you >>> will >>> need a license for that" clause. >>> >>> if you have to ask, ask them if it is their duty to regulate potential >>> electromagnetic wave transmission from instalations operating on 50Hz (or >>> any other frequency in the 0-9kHz region, that is not ITU regulated). you >>> would probably get an entirely different answer :) >>> >>> VY 73 >>> >>> Jacek / SQ5BPF >>> >>> ps. the answer that you got from OFCOM is actually very nice >>> >> >> >> > > > --0015175d04faefebde0480822554 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Yes, unbelievable isn't it!
Been going gon for=A0abt 4=A0weeks now.
On 26 February 2010 13:46, Graham <g8fzk@g8fzk.fsnet.co.u= k> wrote:
Warren ,

If you =A0thin= k this is bad, you =A0should take a =A0look at the =A0'ROS' discus= sion's in the yahoo =A0 digital data group .. =A0SS =A0paranoia has ta= ken hold !

G ..

--------------------------------------------------
From= : "Warren Ziegler" <wd2xgj@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 25, 2010= 9:31 PM
To: <= rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org>
Subject: Re: LF: Fwd: Special Perm= its for Amateur Radio Operation below 9kHz?


Asking Ofcom for a license= or Nov to generate a signal that will not
extend past your own garden= seems like a lot of trouble for
nothing....

--
73 Warren K2ORS
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0= WD2XGJ
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 WD2XSH/23
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 = =A0 =A0 WE2XEB/2
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 WE2XGR/1


On Thu= , Feb 25, 2010 at 3:28 PM, Jacek Lipkowski <sq5bpf@lipkowski.org> wrote:
On Thu, 25 Feb 2010, Roger Lap= thorn wrote:

People may be interested in th= e reply from Rod Wilkinson at OFCOM received
today. I asked him what OF= COM's view would be.

[...]

They state that ITU Radio= Regs indicate that there is no allocation for
frequencies below 9 kHz.= However in the UK, a licence would be required as
there is no lower frequency limit for wireless telegraphy under the WT Act=
2006. [...]

there is already a very big commercial= user of the elf and vlf spectrum,
they inject very big power into grou= nd dipoles. emissions from one continent
can be heard on another. and they do this without any license from the rad= io
authorities. the only regulation they need regards maximum field str= engths
(and this is usually the realm of some environmental protection= authority
and not the radio authority). the operating frequency varies, but is usual= ly
50Hz, 60Hz, 16.6Hz etc :)

sometimes when dealing with the gov= erment, the best practice is not to ask
at all :) even if they agree wi= th you there will always be a "but you will
need a license for that" clause.

if you have to ask, ask them= if it is their duty to regulate potential
electromagnetic wave transmi= ssion from instalations operating on 50Hz (or
any other frequency in th= e 0-9kHz region, that is not ITU regulated). you
would probably get an entirely different answer :)

VY 73

Jac= ek / SQ5BPF

ps. the answer that you got from OFCOM is actually very= nice






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