X-GM-THRID: 1196684404245296047 X-Gmail-Labels: rsgb lf X-Gmail-Received: 5edde37ac348a6f0cdb39e7ad0e71a22bc35e7e2 Delivered-To: daveyxm@gmail.com Received: by 10.54.71.12 with SMTP id t12cs58859wra; Sun, 5 Mar 2006 01:07:10 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.66.237.14 with SMTP id k14mr2149006ugh; Sun, 05 Mar 2006 01:07:10 -0800 (PST) Return-Path: Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [193.82.116.20]) by mx.gmail.com with ESMTP id e1si1364343ugf.2006.03.05.01.07.10; Sun, 05 Mar 2006 01:07:10 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: neutral (gmail.com: 193.82.116.20 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1FFp8j-0005aI-1Q for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2006 09:02:57 +0000 Received: from [193.82.59.130] (helo=relay2.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1FFp8i-0005a9-Fg for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2006 09:02:56 +0000 Received: from smtp802.mail.ukl.yahoo.com ([217.12.12.139]) by relay2.thorcom.net with smtp (Exim 4.51) id 1FFq62-0005br-Fx for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 05 Mar 2006 10:04:16 +0000 Received: (qmail 19401 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2006 09:02:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO LAPTOP) (peter.martinez@btinternet.com@81.159.66.197 with login) by smtp802.mail.ukl.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2006 09:02:53 -0000 Message-ID: <005d01c64033$9670c340$0300a8c0@LAPTOP> From: "Peter Martinez" To: References: <01cd01c63d73$69bc4f80$0300a8c0@LAPTOP> <4407287F.8000306@freenet.de> <029801c63e22$bb20b190$0300a8c0@LAPTOP> <003a01c63e33$08290cc0$67b0fea9@lark> <02a101c63e36$cf0e6120$0300a8c0@LAPTOP> <7.0.0.10.2.20060302213743.0383a228@spin-it.com> <02b901c63e4c$38a127c0$0300a8c0@LAPTOP> <030401c63ea8$6a6b90e0$0300a8c0@LAPTOP> <002e01c63fe3$35a57600$cb8e7ad5@w4o8m9> Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2006 09:02:53 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: -2.6 (--) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=disabled,BAYES_00=-2.599 Subject: Re: LF: LORAN spurious emission levels Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 6226 Jim, Markus, and the group: First of all, many thanks Jim for doing those measurements. I don't have the test equipment to do these things and I am too far away from Rugby. Your results seem to say that these spurii are even lower in level than 42uW. Your posting may have crossed with my last one in which I revised the estimate of the Rugby mean erp down to 2.45kW, calculated from the published peak value of 250kW and the calculated peak/mean ratio of just under 1%. The difference between our figures is now just 4dB (10*log(42/16)). This 1% peak/mean ratio (for the Rugby tx) comes from the published LORAN waveform which effectively says that the special shape of a LORAN pulse is equivalent in power to a rectangular pulse of 83.2uS duration. Your estimate of 2.2% (45:1) is probably stretched because of the narrow bandwidth of your receiver, or maybe it's stretched by the narrow bandwidth of the Rugby antenna. If the Rugby antenna is indeed smaller, then the pulse peak/mean ratio will be less, the peak erp may be less or the mean power may be more, but I can't figure out if the spurii level would increase or decrease or stay the same! Markus: Thanks for doing the calculations. The small difference between our figures is just the difference between 136 and 137kHz - I forgot to say that I had used a value half-way between the 135 and 137 kHz estimates from the spectrum graph. Incidently, your calculation of the spectrum is interesting. It does show that the Rugby antenna is similar in bandwidth to the mathematical model, so maybe it's smalller size is not so important after all. Thanks again to everyone who replied to my first posting and helped in the investigation. The best guess is that LORAN spurii are in the 16-42uW range. Can I close the topic now -it's taken up enough bandwidth already! 73 Peter