Return-Path: Received: (qmail 43638 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2004 16:51:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ptb-spamcore01.plus.net) (192.168.71.1) by ptb-mailstore01.plus.net with SMTP; 29 Nov 2004 16:51:09 -0000 Received: from mailnull by ptb-spamcore01.plus.net with spamcore-l-b (Exim 4.32; FreeBSD) id 1CYp2t-000JGc-2J for dave@picks.force9.co.uk; Mon, 29 Nov 2004 17:10:41 +0000 Received: from [192.168.67.2] (helo=ptb-mxcore02.plus.net) by ptb-spamcore01.plus.net with esmtp (Exim 4.32; FreeBSD) id 1CYp2s-000JGY-TH for dave@picks.force9.co.uk; Mon, 29 Nov 2004 17:10:38 +0000 Received: from post.thorcom.com ([193.82.116.20]) by ptb-mxcore02.plus.net with esmtp (Exim) id 1CYojy-0009TR-1I for dave@picks.force9.co.uk; Mon, 29 Nov 2004 16:51:06 +0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1CYojV-0006en-Vk for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Mon, 29 Nov 2004 16:50:37 +0000 Received: from [193.82.116.30] (helo=relay.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1CYojV-0006ee-IJ for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 29 Nov 2004 16:50:37 +0000 Received: from smtp809.mail.ukl.yahoo.com ([217.12.12.199]) by relay.thorcom.net with smtp (Exim 4.41) id 1CYojQ-0007Kb-5l for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 29 Nov 2004 16:50:37 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Aquarids) (ganymede444@217.42.194.115 with login) by smtp809.mail.ukl.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2004 16:50:25 -0000 From: "G3WCB" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2004 16:49:26 -0000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 In-Reply-To: <000001c4d16f$260c1e80$e6a4c593@RD40002> Importance: Normal X-SPF-Result: relay.thorcom.net: 217.12.12.199 is neither permitted nor denied by domain of btopenworld.com X-Spam-Score: 1.5 (+) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=no,FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS=0.869,RCVD_IN_SORBS=0.1,SUBJ_ALL_CAPS=0.567 Subject: LF: PSK31 + FEC Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS, SUBJ_ALL_CAPS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Filtered: by PlusNet SpamCORE (v3.00) Dear Jim, LF group, There is a variant of PSK31 that incorporates a Viterbi FEC encoder(see link:- http://www.aintel.bi.ehu.es/description )Using this might mitigate the effect of impulse-type QRN mentioned below. This particular implementation might not be ideal for LF use, as it uses QPSK modulation to regain the 50 WPM throughput rate, and QPSK has it's own foibles and drawbacks. >From reading the original G3PLX article, Peter seems to have introduced QPSK to get back the throughput lost by using half-rate coding, but perhaps a BPSK/Viterbi implementation delivering 25WPM would be acceptable for us LF types....it's still faster than I can type! Trouble is, I don't think one exists..... Cheers Dave, G3WCB -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of james moritz Sent: 23 November 2004 15:15 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: LF: RE: Dear Mike, LF Group, The amplifier does not have to be very linear for PSK modes - just so long as you have some sort of ramp up and down to zero amplitude, rather than an abrupt on-off transition, the spectrum of the signal will be reasonably narrow. When I used a linear, I found the best bet was to bias the MOSFETs so they were slightly cut-off, and then over-drive them a bit - more or less class C operation. This improved the efficiency somewhat, but it was still only about 60% at best. For PSK generation at the moment, I amplitude-modulate the HT supply to the Decca class D PA, whilst separately phase modulating the drive carrier. This is much the same as the "envelope elimination and restoration" techniques which now seem to be standard for big AM broadcast transmitters. I keep meaning to write this up, but it is the usual problem of having too many other things to do! The advantages of PSK31 are that there is readily available software, the bandwidth is narrow enough, and people are familiar with it - but it isn't particularly well suited to LF operation; it works fine when the band is very quiet, but QRN impulses corrupt characters each time they occur, so the band does not have to be very noisy to render the mode unusable except for stations very close together. I think there is a case for a similar mode to PSK31, but incorporating error correction, so that a moderate level of QRN corrupting a small proportion of bits does not cause a big problem. VE2IQ's "Coherent" mode did this quite well, but requires MS-DOS and dedicated interface hardware, making it less attractive. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU -----Original Message-----