Return-Path: Received: (qmail 9419 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2002 20:36:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO murphys-inbound.services.quay.plus.net) (212.159.14.225) by exhibition.plus.net with SMTP; 7 Jan 2002 20:36:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 9902 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2002 20:36:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by murphys.services.quay.plus.net with SMTP; 7 Jan 2002 20:36:30 -0000 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.33 #2) id 16NgRr-0004xy-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Jan 2002 20:32:47 +0000 Received: from mailman.zeta.org.au ([203.26.10.16]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #2) id 16NgRp-0004xt-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Mon, 07 Jan 2002 20:32:45 +0000 Received: from steve (ppp175.dyn154.pacific.net.au [210.23.154.175]) by mailman.zeta.org.au (8.9.3/8.8.7) with SMTP id HAA20684 for ; Tue, 8 Jan 2002 07:31:54 +1100 Message-ID: <007b01c197bb$2e08ed20$af9a17d2@steve> From: "Steve Olney" To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <3C39E6F2.6C1C0918@netscapeonline.co.uk> Subject: LF: Re: QSO Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2002 07:37:38 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group Sender: G'day Mal, I must admit you DO have a unique sense of humour !!! Either that or the virus program I run now has cleared the BIG KEV virus off my machine. Up until just recently any machine generated mode was referred to in all YOUR posts as "lazy man's CW". Apparently now your posts are not being corrupted by the BIG KEV virus and no longer contain those "lazy man's CW" references. Or have you become "lazy" too ? Perhaps I should refer to you as BIG LAZY KEV :-) G'day All, As far as the bandplan for the UK band. I can't comment on the technical aspects of it as I live in a relatively unpolluted environment down-under RF wise (but don't worry - we are working our way to world standard in this regard). However, I think I can comment on the attitude displayed on this reflector. I was going to say something like "come on girls!!!", but you know I wouldn't do that as it is PI and besides, it insults the maturity of that half of the population. As far as I am concerned our bunch of people who inhabit these areas of interest are no different from the general population in spite of the notion by some that we are "special". As such we are subject to the whole range of attitudes, behaviours and follies of the general population (at least that is my excuse for my behaviour :-). There are the pioneers, the curious, the experimenters, the casual passerbys, the detractors, the nay-sayers, the certificate hunters, the smiley-stamp hunters, the rule-makers and the self-appointed guardians of right. Also there are those who have the temerity to be overcome by the sheer fun of what we do and wander into the nice neat world of others from time to time. This kind of "turf war" bickering is infantile in a world where we are subjected to all kinds of challenges to our beloved hobby from commercial interests for spectrum space. All the energy spent beating each other over the head about where the line is drawn in the dirt in the playground will all be wasted when we wake up and find there is no longer a playground. My observation of "gentleman's agreements" is they have often been hijacked be a vocal minority to further their own interests. Last time I checked CW has a free run to virtually all the spectrum space on the conventional HF bands, while other modes are cramped into smaller sections. Unless things have changed drastically, the same large-scale occupation of the UK band exists for CW now. To suggest that CW proponents have been "run off the band" is ludicrous. I think it is more a case of the shoe being on the other foot. Of course, one response to others showing interest in other modes other than your own favourite mode is to pack up your marbles and go off in a huff. Or you can harass, harangue and privately abuse (by email) those who would dare to experiment with other less familiar modes (until, of course, you have decided that the time is right for you to adopt that mode). This is standard procedure for the managerial or born-to-rule types. Pour scorn on the efforts of others when they are trying to develop new ideas and then when you are good and ready, adopt the those same efforts as your own discovery, and then pour scorn again. In the submissions to gain access to these LF bands over there, did the weight of argument lie with engaging in a mode which (for good reason) has existed for ages, or did it lie with expressing a desire to experiment and develop new modes (at least at an amateur level) ? To get my authorisation I had to argue that I was engaging in new work. Ironically, when I was pressed (I was refused authorisation initially), I didn't cite the UK example to support my argument that new work could still be done - I cited the US LowFers and Europeans as examples of the experimentation that could be done. This apparently won the day for me. Interestingly, there have been those who have tried to hold back the pioneers going off into the experimental wilderness giving all sorts of reasons why those experimenters should not venture outside the nice neat world which these nay-sayers are comfortable with. After those pioneers have weathered the trials of establishing a pathway, those same detractors come along and drive full-speed down the pathway cleared for them by the pioneers and now detract the pioneering efforts by saying "I did that journey in half the time you did" Huh??? In any case, I think in an experimental arena in which we are supposed to operate, the ultimate criteria is "natural selection". If a mode is superior as judged by the majority of users then that mode will prevail to such time as something else shows promise (or, heaven forbid, just be fun). At the same time those who want to experiment with other modes should be allowed to do this with mature tolerance. I am sure I have an article somewhere which details, from memory, the work way back in 1997 of Andy (G4JNT) and Peter (G3PLX) using 25mHz BW on 73kHz. They had apparently pioneered narrowband stuff and hopefully will continue to pioneer in the future despite opposition from some quarters. (P.S. you would think with having had bushfires on three sides for nigh on two weeks I would be wary of throwing petrol onto the reflector fire - but then I didn't ever claim to be smart :-) 73s Steve VK2ZTO