Return-Path: Received: from rly-dc10.mx.aol.com (rly-dc10.mail.aol.com [172.19.136.39]) by air-dc01.mail.aol.com (v123.3) with ESMTP id MAILINDC014-b4c49bfa0c236d; Tue, 17 Mar 2009 09:08:44 -0400 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [193.82.116.20]) by rly-dc10.mx.aol.com (v123.3) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINDC108-b4c49bfa0c236d; Tue, 17 Mar 2009 09:08:19 -0400 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1LjZ0h-0002ew-Cq for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Tue, 17 Mar 2009 13:07:11 +0000 Received: from [83.244.159.144] (helo=relay3.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1LjZ0g-0002en-3d for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 17 Mar 2009 13:07:10 +0000 Received: from smtp5.freeserve.com ([193.252.22.159]) by relay3.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1LjZ0e-0002BE-5Y for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 17 Mar 2009 13:07:10 +0000 Received: from me-wanadoo.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mwinf3414.me.freeserve.com (SMTP Server) with ESMTP id A55AA1C00084 for ; Tue, 17 Mar 2009 14:07:02 +0100 (CET) Received: from AGB (unknown [91.109.15.9]) by mwinf3414.me.freeserve.com (SMTP Server) with SMTP id 4B2421C00081 for ; Tue, 17 Mar 2009 14:06:59 +0100 (CET) X-ME-UUID: 20090317130659307.4B2421C00081@mwinf3414.me.freeserve.com Message-ID: From: "Graham" To: References: <009001c9a588$7eb02c60$6401a8c0@asus> <004501c9a623$a4bf81d0$6401a8c0@asus> <2ED02F4327204E3C903828F9E18AA72B@AGB> <001e01c9a665$ebeac870$6401a8c0@asus> <00be01c9a66e$c8bfdbc0$0900a8c0@AM> <004a01c9a677$2a8b48a0$6401a8c0@asus> <005101c9a679$df148f50$6401a8c0@asus> <916F3329CAA846A19B450540FCC7E0AB@AGB> In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 13:06:58 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 14.0.8064.206 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V14.0.8064.206 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=disabled,HTML_MESSAGE=0.001 Subject: Re: LF: RE: Syncback software Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C9A701.410D5B10" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.1 required=5.0 tests=HTML_30_40, HTML_FONTCOLOR_UNKNOWN,HTML_FONTCOLOR_UNSAFE,HTML_MESSAGE, MISSING_OUTLOOK_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-AOL-IP: 193.82.116.20 ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C9A701.410D5B10 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ok Andy=20 Easily ... that's the problem hihi ..=20 Is there anyone tuned in who could write a short code to say ,select the com= port, time slot and key the com port ? , That way any simple cw tx could=20= be used , as not every one can translate from audio to rf on 500 or 137 ! Thanks=20 Graham ,, From: Andy Talbot=20 Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 7:55 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Subject: Re: LF: RE: Syncback software Easily, all you need is a five second transmission of carrier at xx:05:25 xx= :20:25 etc But accurate timing to at least one second accuracy is essential, so the PC=20= clock will have to be set continuously. Andy G4JNT www.g4jnt.com 2009/3/16 Graham Andy, Is there any way the slots could be filled using a pc ... ? if a small ex= e could be run to make a cw pulse then that would be no problem ? G ..=20 From: Andy Talbot=20 Sent: Monday, March 16, 2009 9:36 PM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Subject: Re: LF: RE: Syncback software See you just have - got quite a shock until I realised the noise had plumm= eted as well. Any takers for the 5 and 6 minute slots? Andy G4JNT www.g4jnt.com 2009/3/16 Gary - G4WGT Andy, OK, I will insert an attenuator at the antenna socket (that=92s an easy=20= move) & watch how it performs. It is switched at 10dB steps so I will start=20= at 10db of course. Cheers, Gary. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@bla= cksheep.org] On Behalf Of Andy Talbot Sent: 16 March 2009 20:45=20 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: RE: Syncback software Doesn't matter which - just total system gain. That S/W works best if t= he noise threshold rides at about 10dB above the baseline, then it allows f= or up to 70 - 80dB of signal peaks. Andy G4JNT www.g4jnt.com 2009/3/16 Gary - G4WGT Alan, When you wrote :- my only comment is that you may have too much gain in the system. Are you meaning sound card or receiver gain? Gary. -----Original Message----- From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Alan Melia Sent: 16 March 2009 19:38 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Subject: Re: LF: RE: Syncback software Hi Gary my only comment is that you may have too much gain in the system= . It is sometimes better to have the noise further down nearer the axis. I am afraid there is a major problem with this kind of beacon, when the fading period is shorter than the sampling interval, so you dont really=20= know what the path is doing. The only reliable points are the peaks, the trou= ghs dont really mean anything without some very sophisticated analysis and probably two spaced receivers. However it does give a snapshot of the ba= nd without taking up too much bandwidth (this was what was required for 5MH= z too). Despite all the data collected very little analysis has actually b= e done on the 5MHz data collected by this program. The one succesfull bit=20= of work was that published in Radcom by Marcis Walden G0IJZ. I used it for=20= some time whilst Andy was testing the Poldhu beacon on 160m and also during t= he 1st two months that ran. I was certainly surprised by the daytime path o= n 160m from here. I have seen the data collected in Canada via Joe Craig V= O1NA and it is difficult to see how to use it. Still if you dont collect the data you will never know!! Alan G3NYK ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary - G4WGT" To: Sent: Monday, March 16, 2009 6:35 PM Subject: RE: LF: RE: Syncback software > Hi Graham, LF, > > > > The original HTML Code for the 2 minute refresh is still inserted into= the > page format, so upload is 30 minute intervals with Syncback & 2 minute > refresh. I have left the refresh in case I revert back to the original > grabber page. I will look at changing it if I continue to use the beac= on > chart upload. > > > > I would like to have feedback from the LF group regarding the page, if= you > check it out periodically, is it useful to you, what are you looking f= or. > > > > You can view the chart on my web site at :- > > > > http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor/grabber3.html > > > > 73 > > > > Gary - G4WGT. > > > > > > _____ > > From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Graham > Sent: 16 March 2009 17:20 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: Re: LF: RE: Syncback software > > > > Hi Gary, > > > > The page seemed to refresh quite often ... are there two settings ? > > > > G .. > > > > From: Gary - G4WGT > > Sent: Monday, March 16, 2009 10:40 AM > > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > > Subject: RE: LF: RE: Syncback software > > > > Hi Graham, LF, > > > > You wrote :- > > >>>Upload is set at 5 minute intervals and auto refresh at 2 minute > intervals. <<< that could be backed off to 15 mins as the beacon only > sends every 15 ?? > > > > I mentioned in my previous mail to ignore the text on the page as it w= as > originally for grabber 1 for when I upgrade the web site (to a new des= ign & > better navigation etc), also mentioned is that upload is every 30 minu= tes. > > > > If the uploaded chart proves useful or interesting to operators & view= ers > then I will change the text & make it a permanent feature for the > foreseeable future. > > > > BTW :- > > > > For those of you who are not familiar with the chart - > > > > The RED trace is Andy's (G4JNT) beacon signal & the BLACK trace is the noise > level at my QTH. > > > > The Blue & GREEN are not in use & should be ignored on this chart as t= hey > are for the other beacons used when monitoring on the 5MHz allocation. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Gary - G4WGT > > > > > > _____ > > From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Graham > Sent: 15 March 2009 22:17 > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Subject: Re: LF: RE: Syncback software > > > > Gary.. > > > > That looks good ... 0500 looks best time for a qso .. see you then Sm= ile > emoticon > > > > >>>Upload is set at 5 minute intervals and auto refresh at 2 minute > intervals. <<< that could be backed off to 15 mins as the beacon only > sends every 15 ?? > > > > the 15 db over the noise in day time is the same at this qth .. look= s like > the big dips round 1900 where just when we where testing .. typical=20= hihi > > > > tnx- G .. > > > > From: Gary - G4WGT > > Sent: Sunday, March 15, 2009 7:55 PM > > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > > Subject: LF: RE: Syncback software > > > > LF, > > > > I have now got the software, Syncback running correctly (I think). > > > > The purpose of this is to upload the chart from Andy's beacon as recei= ved > here to my web site periodically, ie. every 30 minutes. > > > > I now have a receiver running 24/7 monitoring Andy,s beacon on 503.7KH= z. > > > > You can view the chart on my web site at :- > > > > http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor/grabber3.html > > > > For the moment ignore the text on the page as it is originally designe= d to > use with the 500KHz grabber when I renew my web site design. If it is=20= a > useful upload I will make it a permanent feature but may have to exten= d the > frequency coverage of grabber 1 so not to overload the PC with operati= ons > which will cause the PC to struggle. > > > > Let me have your comments please. > > > > 73 > > > > Gary - G4WGT. > > > > _____ > > From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Gary - G4WGT > Sent: 15 March 2009 16:10 > To: LF -RSGB LF Group > Subject: LF: Syncback software > > > > Hi LF, > > > > If anyone is using Syncback software & can help, please. > > > > I am tying to upload a file to my website who's filename does not chan= ge, > only the file size changes. I tried to do it with Argo-upload but fail= ed so > I downloaded Syncback & still failing. > > > > Syncback gives me the following message :- > > > > ********************************** > > Can connect, but unable to change to destination directory: > > /chart01.bmp:not a directory > > ********************************** > > The Syncback help does not give me the answer. > > > > Any help will be appreciated > > > > Or > > > > Will Argo-Upload do it? > > > > Or > > > > Is there something else to do it? > > > > Thanks in anticipation, > > > > 73, > > > > Gary - G4WGT - IO83QP. > > > > _____ > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.13/2001 - Release Date: 03/1= 4/09 > 06:54:00 > > _____ > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.15/2003 - Release Date: 03/1= 5/09 > 14:07:00 > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------= -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com=20 Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.15/2004 - Release Date: 03/16/09= 07:04:00 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com=20 Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.16/2006 - Release Date: 03/17/09 0= 7:23:00 ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C9A701.410D5B10 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ok Andy
 
Easily ... that's the  problem  h= ihi ..=20
 
Is there anyone tuned in who could write a=20= short=20 code to say ,select the com port,  time slot and  key the com= =20 port ? , That way any simple cw tx could be used , as not every  o= ne=20 can translate from audio to  rf on 500 or 137 !
 
Thanks
 
Graham ,,

Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 7:55 AM
Subject: Re: LF: RE: Syncback software

Easily, all you need is a five second transmission of carrier at xx:05:= 25=20 xx:20:25 etc
But accurate timing to at least one second accuracy is essential, so th= e PC=20 clock will have to be set continuously.

Andy  G4JNT
= www.g4jnt.com


2009/3/16 Graham <g8fzk@g8fzk.fsnet.co.uk>
Andy,
 
Is there any way the  slots could be= filled=20 using a pc ... ? if a small exe could be run to  make a cw  puls= e=20 then that would be no problem ?
 
G ..

Sent: Monday, March 16, 2009 9:36 PM
Subject: Re: LF: RE: Syncback=20 software

See you just have - got quite a shock until I realised the noise had=20 plummeted as well.
Any takers for the 5 and 6 minute slots?

Andy  G4JNT
www.g4jnt.com


2009/3/16 Gary - G4WGT <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk= >

Andy,

 

OK,=20 I will insert an attenuator at the antenna socket (that=92s an easy move= )=20 & watch how it performs. It is switched at 10dB steps so I will star= t at=20 10db of course.

 

Cheers,

 

Gary.

 

From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Andy Talbot
Sent: 16 March 2009 20:45=20


To: rsgb_lf_gro= up@blacksheep.org
Subject:= Re: LF: RE: Syncback=20 software

 

Doesn't=20 matter which - just total system gain.  That S/W works best if the=20 noise threshold rides at about 10dB above the baseline,  then it al= lows=20 for up to 70 - 80dB of signal peaks.


Andy  G4JNT
<= A href=3D"http://www.g4jnt.com/" target=3D_blank>www.g4jnt.com

2009/3/16 Gary - G4WGT <g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>

Alan,

When you wrote :-

my only comment is that you may have=20= too much gain=20 in the system.

Are you=20 meaning sound card or receiver gain?

Gary.



-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_gro= up@blacksheep.org

[mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of=20= Alan=20 Melia
Sent: 16 March 2009 19:38

To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Sub= ject: Re: LF: RE:=20 Syncback software

Hi Gary my only comment is that you may have to= o=20 much gain in the system. It
is sometimes better to have the noise fur= ther=20 down nearer the axis.

I am afraid there is a major problem with t= his=20 kind of beacon, when the
fading period is shorter than the sampling=20 interval, so you dont really know
what the path is doing. The only=20 reliable points are the peaks, the troughs
dont really mean anything=20 without some very sophisticated analysis and
probably two spaced=20 receivers. However it does give a snapshot of the band
without taking= up=20 too much bandwidth (this was what was required for 5MHz
too). Despite= all=20 the data collected very little analysis has actually be
done on the 5= MHz=20 data collected by this program. The one succesfull bit of
work was th= at=20 published in Radcom by Marcis Walden G0IJZ. I used it for some
time=20 whilst Andy was testing the Poldhu beacon on 160m and also during the1st=20 two months that ran. I was certainly surprised by the daytime path=20 on
160m from here. I have seen the data collected in Canada via Joe C= raig=20 VO1NA
and it is difficult to see how to use it.

Still if you d= ont=20 collect the data you will never know!!

Alan=20 G3NYK




----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary -=20 G4WGT" <= g4wgt@tiscali.co.uk>
To: <rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org><= BR>Sent: Monday, March=20 16, 2009 6:35 PM
Subject: RE: LF: RE: Syncback software


&g= t;=20 Hi Graham, LF,
>
>
>
> The original HTML Code fo= r=20 the 2 minute refresh is still inserted into the
> page format, so=20 upload is 30 minute intervals with Syncback & 2 minute
> refre= sh.=20 I have left the refresh in case I revert back to the original
>=20 grabber page. I will look at changing it if I continue to use the=20 beacon
> chart upload.
>
>
>
> I would lik= e to=20 have feedback from the LF group regarding the page, if you
> check= it=20 out periodically, is it useful to you, what are you looking=20 for.
>
>
>
> You can view the chart on my web si= te=20 at :-
>
>
>
> http://myweb.tiscali= .co.uk/wgtaylor/grabber3.html
>
>
>
>=20 73
>
>
>
> Gary -=20 G4WGT.
>
>
>
>
>
>  =20 _____
>
> From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=
> [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of=20 Graham
> Sent: 16 March 2009 17:20
> To: rsgb_lf_group@black= sheep.org
> Subject: Re: LF: RE:=20 Syncback software
>
>
>
> Hi=20 Gary,
>
>
>
> The page seemed to  refresh q= uite=20 often ... are there two settings ?
>
>
>
> G=20 ..
>
>
>
> From: Gary - G4WGT <mailto:g4wgt@tiscali.co= .uk>
>
> Sent: Monday,=20 March 16, 2009 10:40 AM
>
> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=
>
> Subject: RE:=20 LF: RE: Syncback software
>
>
>
> Hi Graham,=20 LF,
>
>
>
> You wrote :-
>
>=20 >>>Upload is set at 5 minute intervals and auto refresh at 2=20 minute
> intervals. <<< that could be backed off to  = ;15=20 mins as the beacon only
> sends every 15=20 ??
>
>
>
> I mentioned in my previous mail to ig= nore=20 the text on the page as it was
> originally for grabber 1 for when= I=20 upgrade the web site (to a new design
&
> better navigation= =20 etc), also mentioned is that upload is every 30=20 minutes.
>
>
>
> If the uploaded chart proves us= eful=20 or interesting to operators & viewers
> then I will change the= =20 text & make it a permanent feature for the
> foreseeable=20 future.
>
>
>
> BTW=20 :-
>
>
>
> For those of you  who are not=20 familiar with the chart -
>
>
>
> The RED trace=20= is=20 Andy's (G4JNT) beacon signal & the BLACK trace is the
noise
&g= t;=20 level at my QTH.
>
>
>
> The Blue & GREEN ar= e=20 not in use & should be ignored on this chart as they
> are for= the=20 other beacons used when monitoring on the 5MHz=20 allocation.
>
>
>
>=20 Cheers,
>
>
>
> Gary -=20 G4WGT
>
>
>
>
>
>  =20 _____
>
> From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=
> [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of=20 Graham
> Sent: 15 March 2009 22:17
> To: rsgb_lf_group@black= sheep.org
> Subject: Re: LF: RE:=20 Syncback software
>
>
>
>=20 Gary..
>
>
>
> That looks good  ... 0500 lo= oks=20 best time for a qso .. see you then Smile
>=20 emoticon
>
>
>
> >>>Upload is set at 5=20 minute intervals and auto refresh at 2 minute
> intervals.=20 <<< that could be backed off to  15 mins as the beacon=20 only
> sends every 15 ??
>
>
>
> the  = ;15=20 db over the noise in day time is the  same at this qth ..=20 looks
like
> the big dips round 1900  where just when we w= here=20 testing ..  typical hihi
>
>
>
> tnx- G=20 ..
>
>
>
> From: Gary - G4WGT <mailto:g4wgt@tiscali.co= .uk>
>
> Sent: Sunday,=20 March 15, 2009 7:55 PM
>
> To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org<= /A>
>
> Subject: LF:=20 RE: Syncback software
>
>
>
>=20 LF,
>
>
>
> I have now got the software, Syncbac= k=20 running correctly (I think).
>
>
>
> The purpose= of=20 this is to upload the chart from Andy's beacon as received
> here=20= to=20 my web site periodically, ie. every 30=20 minutes.
>
>
>
> I now have a receiver running 2= 4/7=20 monitoring Andy,s beacon on 503.7KHz.
>
>
>
> Yo= u=20 can view the chart on my web site at :-
>
>
>
>=20= http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/wgtaylor/grabber3.html
><= BR>>
>
>=20 For the moment ignore the text on the page as it is originally designed=20 to
> use with the 500KHz grabber when I renew my web site design.=20= If=20 it is a
> useful upload I will make it a permanent feature but may= =20 have to extend
the
> frequency coverage of grabber 1 so not to=20 overload the PC with operations
> which will cause the PC to=20 struggle.
>
>
>
> Let me have your comments=20 please.
>
>
>
> 73
>
>
>
&g= t;=20 Gary - G4WGT.
>
>
>
>   _____
>
&g= t;=20 From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
> [mailto:owner= -rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org] On Behalf Of Gary -=20 G4WGT
> Sent: 15 March 2009 16:10
> To: LF -RSGB LF=20 Group
> Subject: LF: Syncback software
>
>
>
= >=20 Hi LF,
>
>
>
> If anyone is using Syncback softw= are=20 & can help, please.
>
>
>
> I am tying to up= load=20 a file to my website who's filename does not change,
> only the fi= le=20 size changes. I tried to do it with Argo-upload but failed
so
>= I=20 downloaded Syncback & still failing.
>
>
>
>= =20 Syncback gives me the following message :-
>
>
>
&g= t;=20 **********************************
>
> Can connect, but unab= le=20 to change to destination directory:
>
> /chart01.bmp:not a=20 directory
>
> **********************************
>
= >=20 The Syncback help does not give me the=20 answer.
>
>
>
> Any help will be=20 appreciated
>
>
>
>=20 Or
>
>
>
> Will Argo-Upload do=20 it?
>
>
>
> Or
>
>
>
> I= s=20 there something else to do it?
>
>
>
> Thanks in= =20 anticipation,
>
>
>
>=20 73,
>
>
>
> Gary - G4WGT -=20 IO83QP.
>
>
>
>   _____
>
>
= >=20 No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Vers= ion:=20 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.13/2001 - Release Date: 03/14/09
>= ;=20 06:54:00
>
>   _____
>
>
> No virus f= ound=20 in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version:=20 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.15/2003 - Release Date: 03/15/09
>= ;=20 14:07:00
>
>


 

=


No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
= Version:=20 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.15/2004 - Release Date: 03/16/09 07:04:00=



No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG -=20 www.avg.com
Version: 8.0.237 / Virus Database: 270.11.16/2006 - Release=20 Date: 03/17/09 07:23:00
------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C9A701.410D5B10--