Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-db05.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 886E738000269; Tue, 27 Sep 2011 15:16:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1R8d7i-0005Ai-3h for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Tue, 27 Sep 2011 20:15:22 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1R8d7g-0005AZ-Lf for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 27 Sep 2011 20:15:20 +0100 Received: from mta-13.siol.net ([193.189.160.143]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1R8d7d-0007Ib-W9 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 27 Sep 2011 20:15:20 +0100 Received: from CMGW-Slovenia ([10.10.10.103]) by mta-13.siol.net with ESMTP id <20110927191517.KJGN6018.mta-13.siol.net@CMGW-Slovenia> for ; Tue, 27 Sep 2011 21:15:17 +0200 Received: from konda03bf4520e ([109.182.254.40]) by CMGW-Slovenia with Cloudmark Gateway id dvEP1h00B0t4AQl01vEPek; Tue, 27 Sep 2011 21:14:24 +0200 Message-ID: From: "Joze Konda - S52AB" To: References: <16BC8B3CA8672445BC2A29B4C14A26D4379ED2AAB4@exlnmb01.eur.nsroot.net> <4DF9EFD1.5010208@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <1313780109.51443.YahooMailNeo@web111907.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <9CD1E11E8BC9402CB4AECECAC4088443@JimPC> <1314394178.5030.YahooMailNeo@web111905.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <1314641183.5605.YahooMailNeo@web111910.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <4E5CBC9A.5020900@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <1314705226.37125.YahooMailNeo@web111901.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <4E5CF192.3040905@legal-medicine.de> <1317076720.22768.YahooMailNeo@web29509.mail.ird.yahoo.com> <1317077173.13177.YahooMailNeo@web29509.mail.ird.yahoo.com> <1317119515.35504.YahooMailNeo@web29502.mail.ird.yahoo.com> <1317119586.50531.YahooMailNeo@web29505.mail.ird.yahoo.com> <4E81B80E.3030201@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <1317136545.77621.YahooMailNeo@web29513.mail.ird.yahoo.com> <1317147846.59346.YahooMailNeo@web29518.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2011 21:15:18 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5931 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5994 X-Cloudmark-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=gQqrJq+T5+YIcGgqQcp1qlQ3HoD5zk3s/RKVFqBplA4= c=1 sm=0 a=-ZNXOPm9p4UA:10 a=QcIHmIcIByIA:10 a=tJBb3fvPeHMA:10 a=kD9N_VxP5WMA:10 a=F3M5lZpKAAAA:8 a=YfB7hrRgAAAA:8 a=JC8TvPNrAAAA:8 a=CjxXgO3LAAAA:8 a=oCcaPWc0AAAA:8 a=yOy_8tvruZNJFJzRfEwA:9 a=Z0P2BEcvrENdRJoj_NsA:7 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=6pZLENpBjoYA:10 a=wk6s2zzMB60A:10 a=9u5IbzYSgzwA:10 a=rC2wZJ5BpNYA:10 a=VpbdxpvF1z8YO4rkMQMA:9 a=2683hRRik7liu428AX8A:7 a=tXsnliwV7b4A:10 a=HpAAvcLHHh0Zw7uRqdWCyQ==:117 X-Spam-Score: 3.4 (+++) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=disabled,FORGED_MUA_OUTLOOK=3.36,HTML_MESSAGE=0.001 Subject: Re: LF: Re: My first ferrite experiments Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0023_01CC7D5A.8ED4EF70" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.1 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_MUA_OUTLOOK,HTML_40_50, HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-SCORE: 0:2:484706016:93952408 X-AOL-SCOLL-URL_COUNT: 0 x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d40594e8220fc19b2 X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01CC7D5A.8ED4EF70 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ...in the middle of shield. Regards Joze ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Daniele Tincani=20 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2011 8:24 PM Subject: Re: LF: Re: My first ferrite experiments Hi Joze, looks like in your antenna the coil is wound over the shield, am I = correct? Regards Daniele Da: Joze Konda - S52AB A: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Inviato: Marted=EC 27 Settembre 2011 19:42 Oggetto: Re: LF: Re: My first ferrite experiments HI Daniele This is my great ferrite rood RX antenna with aluminium shield: http://lea.hamradio.si/~s52ab/ndb_equipment/slides/great_fer_rood.html Good worked. Regards 73, Joze s52ab ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Daniele Tincani=20 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2011 5:15 PM Subject: Re: LF: Re: My first ferrite experiments Hello Stefan, > but maybe the Q is reduced by the aluminium shield!=20 Do you think the aluminium could be the problem or the distance = between the coil and the core? I could replace the aluminium tube with a = plastic tube, if shielding is not necessary, but this would not improve = the Q if the problem is the gap between the coil and the core. > Are the rods galvanically separated from each other by a thin = plastic tape? What type is the ferrite material? Yes I put two layers of plastic tape on tips of each rod. The = ferrite material is russian MU400HH. Best regards Daniele =20 Da: Stefan Sch=E4fer A: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Inviato: Marted=EC 27 Settembre 2011 13:48 Oggetto: Re: LF: Re: My first ferrite experiments Hello Daniele,=20 Nice work and good equipment. I would suggest to make the wires between coil and cap as short as = possible and not to use these crocodile clamps. HF litz wire should help = about the Q but maybe the Q is reduced by the aluminium shield! Are the = rods galvanically separated from each other by a thin plastic tape? What = type is the ferrite material?=20 73, Stefan/DK7FC PS: Tell me if you need a test signal ;-) Am 27.09.2011 12:33, schrieb Daniele Tincani:=20 Pics 3 and 4 are attached here. Da: Daniele Tincani A: "rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org" Inviato: Marted=EC 27 Settembre 2011 12:31 Oggetto: My first ferrite experiments Hello LF, this evening I had some free time to spend for starting my very = simple tests with ferrite rods. Picture 1 in the attached zip file shows = one of the rods (about 10mm diameter x 200mm long) together with a short = piece of plastic tube that I have used to adapt the rods to a = larger-diameter slotted aluminium tube - shown in picture 2. As you can = see, the longitudinal cut on the tube is not really regular and "clean". = I'm not very good at working with metals. Nevertheless, I hope it will = do the job, that is acting as a shield between the rods and the coil. = Picture 3 shows two of the three rods I used, each inserted in a short = piece of plastic pipe and protected with heat shrink tube and some = masking tape. Finally, picture 4 shows the very provisional setup that I used to = try measuring Q of an LC pair composed by a 2-gangs variable capacitor = plus a 55-turns coil wound over the aluminium tube containing the = ferrite rods. I performed several measures, with 1, 2 or 3 rods inside = the tube. I saw that using 3 rods increases the inductance = significantly. For example, at an intermediate position of the varcap, = resonance was at 1037KHz with only 1 rod inside the tube, but it was at = 767 KHz with 3 rods.The Q value also increases slightly using 3 rods, = even thought in my tests I got only a miserable figure of about 30. = Anyway, I decided to go with 3 rods for my next step, that will be to = try Litz wire for the coil and see what happens. Note: pics 3 and 4 will be attached to a re-sent of this message. Regards D. No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1410 / Virus Database: 1520/3921 - Release Date: = 09/26/11 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1410 / Virus Database: 1520/3922 - Release Date: = 09/27/11 ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01CC7D5A.8ED4EF70 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
...in the middle of = shield.
 
Regards
Joze
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Daniele Tincani
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, = 2011 8:24=20 PM
Subject: Re: LF: Re: My first = ferrite=20 experiments

Hi = Joze,
 
looks like in = your antenna=20 the coil is wound over the shield, am I=20 correct?
 
Regards
Daniele
 

Da: Joze=20 Konda - S52AB <s52ab@siol.com>
A: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=
Inviato: Marted=EC 27 Settembre = 2011=20 19:42
Oggetto: Re: = LF: Re: My=20 first ferrite experiments

HI Daniele
 
This is my great ferrite rood RX = antenna with=20 aluminium shield:
http://lea.hamradio.si/~s52ab/ndb_equipment/slides/great_f= er_rood.html
Good worked.
 
Regards
 
73, Joze s52ab
 
 
----- Original Message -----
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.= org=20
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, = 2011 5:15=20 PM
Subject: Re: LF: Re: My first = ferrite=20 experiments

Hello = Stefan,
 
> but maybe the Q = is=20 reduced by the aluminium shield!
Do you = think the=20 aluminium could be the problem or the distance between the coil and = the=20 core? I could replace the aluminium tube with a plastic tube, if = shielding=20 is not necessary, but this would not improve the Q if the problem is = the gap=20 between the coil and the core.
 
> Are the rods=20 galvanically separated from each other by a thin plastic tape? What = type is=20 the ferrite material?
Yes I = put two=20 layers of plastic tape on tips of each rod. The ferrite material is = russian=20 MU400HH.
 
Best regards
Daniele
 

Da: Stefan Sch=E4fer=20 <Stefan.Schaefer@iup.uni-heidelberg.de>
A:=20 rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Inviato: Marted=EC 27 = Settembre 2011=20 13:48
Oggetto: = Re: LF: Re:=20 My first ferrite experiments

Hello Daniele,

Nice work and good=20 equipment.
I would suggest to make the wires between coil and cap = as=20 short as possible and not to use these crocodile clamps. HF litz = wire should=20 help about the Q but maybe the Q is reduced by the aluminium shield! = Are the=20 rods galvanically separated from each other by a thin plastic tape? = What=20 type is the ferrite material?

73, Stefan/DK7FC

PS: = Tell me if=20 you need a test signal ;-)

Am 27.09.2011 12:33, schrieb = Daniele=20 Tincani:=20
Pics 3 and 4 are attached here.
 

Da:=20 Daniele Tincani <danieletincani@yahoo.com&= gt;
A: "rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep= .org"=20 <rsgb_lf_group@blacksh= eep.org>
Inviato: Marted=EC 27 = Settembre 2011=20 12:31
Oggetto: = My first=20 ferrite experiments

 
Hello LF,
 
this evening I had some free time to spend for starting my = very=20 simple tests with ferrite rods. Picture 1 in the attached zip file = shows=20 one of the rods (about 10mm diameter x 200mm long) together with a = short=20 piece of plastic tube that I have used to adapt the rods to a=20 larger-diameter slotted aluminium tube - shown in picture 2. = As you=20 can see, the longitudinal cut on the tube is not really regular = and=20 "clean". I'm not very good at working with metals. Nevertheless, I = hope it=20 will do the job, that is acting as a shield between the rods and = the coil.=20 Picture 3 shows two of the three rods I used, each = inserted in a=20 short piece of plastic pipe and protected with heat shrink tube = and some=20 masking tape.
Finally, picture 4 shows the very provisional setup = that I=20 used to try measuring Q of an LC pair composed by a 2-gangs = variable=20 capacitor plus a 55-turns coil wound over the aluminium tube = containing=20 the ferrite rods. I performed several measures, with 1, 2 or 3 = rods inside=20 the tube. I saw that using 3 rods increases the inductance = significantly.=20 For example, at an intermediate position of the varcap, = resonance was=20 at 1037KHz with only 1 rod inside the tube, but it was at 767 KHz = with 3=20 rods.The Q value also increases slightly using 3 rods, even = thought=20 in my tests I got only a miserable figure of about 30. = Anyway,=20 I  decided to go with 3 rods for my next step, that will be = to try Litz wire for the = coil and see=20 what happens.
 
Note: pics 3 and 4 = will be=20 attached to a re-sent of this message.
 
Regards
=
D.





=





No virus found in = this=20 message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1410 / Virus = Database:=20 1520/3921 - Release Date: 09/26/11


No virus found in = this=20 message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1410 / = Virus=20 Database: 1520/3922 - Release Date: = 09/27/11

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