Return-Path: X-Spam-DCC: paranoid 1290; Body=2 Fuz1=2 Fuz2=2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.3 (2006-06-01) on lipkowski.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DNS_FROM_AHBL_RHSBL, HTML_50_60,HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=3.1.3 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by paranoid.lipkowski.org (8.13.7/8.13.7) with ESMTP id t38KExRE009885 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 2015 22:14:59 +0200 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1YfwKQ-0003mL-Qq for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Apr 2015 21:12:02 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1YfwKQ-0003mC-5x for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Apr 2015 21:12:02 +0100 Received: from smtpout4.wanadoo.co.uk ([80.12.242.68] helo=smtpout.wanadoo.co.uk) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.85) (envelope-from ) id 1YfwKO-0004H0-7Y for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Wed, 08 Apr 2015 21:12:01 +0100 Received: from AGB ([95.150.81.13]) by mwinf5d55 with ME id DYBv1q00e0HEVef03YBw5m; Wed, 08 Apr 2015 22:11:59 +0200 X-ME-Helo: AGB X-ME-Date: Wed, 08 Apr 2015 22:11:59 +0200 X-ME-IP: 95.150.81.13 Message-ID: From: "Graham" To: References: In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2015 21:11:55 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 14.0.8117.416 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V14.0.8117.416 X-Scan-Signature: df2e2c1e83972f6e42eeb17d78e70347 Subject: Re: LF: Re: HP 3586C selective level meter for LF and MF Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0048_01D07240.A47D68A0" X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.56 on 10.1.3.10 Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 2917 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0048_01D07240.A47D68A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Alan, The only addition I would add , is , a pre - amp and band - pass = filter =20 Not forgetting , the =C2=A35 devices are not expecting a signal = injected directly into the AD convertor , the gain falls off = past 2 MHz by some 10 may be 15 dB and there is a image = response , same as a super-het , caused by the sample rate , up = in the HF bands=20 There are various transformer coupling cct's , Ive only ever used = a 0.01 uF to the inter stage coupling cap , a 3 mm surface = mount device , makes a good solder post .. Works behind a ATU , but a pre-amp would not go amiss , though = data seems to decode 'as is' the pre amp ideally would have = a out put Z round 200 ohms , other than that , just select = 'direct sample' in the sdr set up box , that turns off the = vhf front and the scales are direct frequency read out , zero = the off set in the driver and you have a 'good' RX=20 There are various devices about , but for =C2=A35 gives a good = way in , the band pass filter would benefit any of the more = expensive devices , but as to actual realisable advantage , post = processing , that might be difficult to evaluate for data = operation , a pre amp would up the noise floor , as would the band = pass filter , first off try it as is ..=20 I live not far from BBC radio Merseyside , multiple qrg Tx , = and in a direct play off .. the =C2=A35 dongle gives better Rx = on 80 meters and 160 , than the ft897-d , which tends to over = load , neither as good as the ra6790gm lf [no pre-amp], but = that's from a different drawing office , with 5 to 7 watts drive = to the first mixer=20 73-Graham G0NBD From: Alan Melia=20 Sent: Wednesday, April 08, 2015 12:40 AM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Subject: LF: Re: HP 3586C selective level meter for LF and MF Hi Iban, They do work, but you must realise they are not intended as = radio receivers, and in many aspects their performance as radios is = compromised by their design as line measuring instruments. Problems = include IMD and lack of front end filtering, some lack audio output. Yes = you can get round this or you can be lucky that you location and antenna = help mitigate the problems. =20 You might be better to consider an SDR these days but make sure it = really cover the frequencies of interest. Graham G0NBD has information = on direct sampling mods to the DVT-B dongles. In Europe there are a lot = more LF signals from very strong stations than in the US so be careful = of US opinions that rate these as receivers. I have a couple of W&G = units which while useful as test equipment are less than brilliant and = barely worth their cost as receivers. Alan G3NYK ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Iban Cardona=20 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Tuesday, April 07, 2015 11:30 PM Subject: LF: HP 3586C selective level meter for LF and MF Hi,=20 I'm looking to purchase a 3586C. Somebody is using it?=20 Can give-me feedback about to use in 136 and 477 kHz? Thanks for advance 73! Iban eb3frn ------=_NextPart_000_0048_01D07240.A47D68A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Alan,
 
The only  addition I would  add , is ,  a  pre = -=20 amp  and    band - pass  =  filter 
 
Not  forgetting , the  =C2=A35 devices  are  = not =20 expecting  a  signal  injected  directly  into=20 the  AD  convertor ,  the  gain falls  = off =20 past   2 MHz by some   10 may be  15 dB = and =20 there  is  a  image  response , same  as  = a =20 super-het ,  caused  by  the  sample  rate , up = in=20 the  HF bands
 
There  are  various  transformer coupling = cct's  ,=20 Ive  only  ever used  a   0.01 uF  to = the =20 inter stage  coupling  cap  ,  a   3=20 mm   surface mount  device ,  makes  a  = good =20 solder  post ..
 
Works  behind  a    ATU , but a =20 pre-amp  would  not  go  amiss , though  = data =20 seems  to  decode  'as is'  the   pre = amp =20 ideally  would  have  a  out put  Z round  = 200  ohms , other than  that ,   just  = select =20 'direct  sample'  in the  sdr   set  = up =20 box  , that  turns  off  the   vhf  = front=20 and  the  scales  are   direct  =20 frequency   read out  , zero  the  off  = set =20 in the  driver  and  you  have  a  = 'good'  RX=20
 
There  are  various  devices  about ,  = but =20 for  =C2=A35 gives  a  good  way  in  , = the  band=20 pass  filter  would  benefit  any  of the  = more  expensive  devices , but  as  to  = actual =20 realisable  advantage , post  processing ,  =  that =20 might  be  difficult  to  evaluate  for =20 data  operation , a pre amp  would  up the  noise = floor , as=20 would the  band pass  filter ,   first  = off =20 try  it  as  is ..
 
I live  not  far  from  BBC  radio =20 Merseyside , multiple  qrg  Tx  , and in a = direct =20 play off  .. the  =C2=A35  dongle  gives =20 better   Rx  on  80  meters  and  = 160  ,=20 than the  ft897-d    , which tends  to  = over =20 load  , neither  as  good  as  the  = ra6790gm lf=20 [no pre-amp], but  that's  from a  different =20 drawing  office , with   5 to 7 watts  drive  = to=20 the  first  mixer
 
73-Graham
G0NBD
 
 

From: Alan Melia
Sent: Wednesday, April 08, 2015 12:40 AM
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org= =20
Subject: LF: Re: HP 3586C selective level meter for LF and=20 MF

Hi Iban, They do work, but you must = realise they=20 are not intended as radio receivers, and in many aspects their = performance as=20 radios is compromised by their design as line measuring instruments. = Problems=20 include IMD and lack of front end filtering, some lack audio output. Yes = you can=20 get round this or you can be lucky that you location and = antenna help=20 mitigate the problems. 
 
You might be better to consider an SDR = these days=20 but make sure it really cover the frequencies of interest. = Graham G0NBD has=20 information on direct sampling mods to the DVT-B dongles. In Europe = there are a=20 lot more LF signals from very strong stations than in the US so be = careful of US=20 opinions that rate these as receivers. I have a couple of W&G units = which=20 while useful as test equipment are less than brilliant and barely = worth=20 their cost as receivers.
 
Alan
G3NYK
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Iban = Cardona=20
Sent: Tuesday, April 07, 2015 = 11:30=20 PM
Subject: LF: HP 3586C selective = level=20 meter for LF and MF

Hi,=20

I'm looking to purchase a 3586C. Somebody is using = it? 

Can give-me feedback about to use in 136 and 477 kHz?

Thanks for advance

73! Iban
eb3frn

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