Return-Path: Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-dk01.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 666973800008B; Fri, 7 Jun 2013 10:47:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1Ukxvo-00053A-MO for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Fri, 07 Jun 2013 15:46:20 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1Ukxvo-000531-6M for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 07 Jun 2013 15:46:20 +0100 Received: from smtpout4.wanadoo.co.uk ([80.12.242.68] helo=smtpout.wanadoo.co.uk) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1Ukxvm-00013o-6r for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 07 Jun 2013 15:46:19 +0100 Received: from AGB ([2.31.70.31]) by mwinf5d56 with ME id lSmE1l00B0gV6zE03SmEJU; Fri, 07 Jun 2013 16:46:17 +0200 Message-ID: <918650FA5E084EF69FA260EF1BB25BC3@AGB> From: "Graham" To: References: <51AA488C.4020800@eastlink.ca> <9F4D930ED1F64F7C974C9F3570FE5DEA@White> <106509721.20130603101147@mterrier.net> <511259661.20130605104210@mterrier.net> <22F50727DAB943178CABF2FE9A731025@GaryAsus> <89A40DBD5FD24F7DAF1DC48FF71ABC37@White> <006801ce6251$bbd6c290$6401a8c0@JAYDELL> <89839D0C2679435898627697705F04C3@F6CNIAndyHP> <0F9E760BA8A740059FFCE5431EE11E6B@AGB> In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2013 15:46:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 14.0.8117.416 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V14.0.8117.416 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. 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Content preview: Ok Marcus Thanks for the info on the no-go zones , the decoder is quite robust in terms of carrier in the pass band , i think 64 decodes are possible , may be less on the narrow windows , but still only some 5 or 10 hz separation needed [...] Content analysis details: (0.0 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, no trust [80.12.242.68 listed in list.dnswl.org] 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message X-Scan-Signature: cbf9d9751ac5f32708197d03fa6d8d74 Subject: Re: LF: VO1NA - 137.7770 kHz Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_005E_01CE6396.23E75350" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0 tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGE, MISSING_OUTLOOK_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G x-aol-sid: 3039ac1db40551b1f28f6288 X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_005E_01CE6396.23E75350 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ok Marcus=20 Thanks for the info on the no-go zones , the decoder is quite = robust in terms of carrier in the pass band , i think 64 decodes = are possible , may be less on the narrow windows , but still only = some 5 or 10 hz separation needed =20 I was relating to the correlation <> Op signal , where normally = only the time is normally selected by the operator , the software = looking for the lowest s/n to place the carrier , a good idea in = tx/rx but not for tx only , especially if there is a 30 min wait = to see if anything happens .. but better than testing the 4 = hour version .. 73 -G. =20 From: Markus Vester=20 Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2013 11:47 PM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Subject: Re: LF: VO1NA - 137.7770 kHz Hi Graham, yes it's true that the opds correlation detector does not attempt to = directly decode any of the Opera 28-bit message contents (ie. the = callsign). But you do get more than a single yes-or-no information. Opds = tells you fairly reliably which entry from the predefined callsign list = actually produced the hit. The list currently contains 28 candidates = which makes up about 5 bits worth. Also it measures the TX carrier = frequency down to a milli-Hz out of a 100 Hz range, which in itself = could be used to encode another 17 bits... So I'd say it gives you less = than 28 bits but certainly more than one bit. Best wishes, Markus (DF6NM) From: Graham=20 Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2013 7:13 PM To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Subject: Re: LF: VO1NA - 137.7770 kHz ... Where as Op is designed to use standard tx/rx and soundcards with = afc routines , Marcus is running a correlation process , looking = for=20 the pattern match , this in effect is decoding a single data = 'bit'=20 and stability will affect his decode system , but with another 10 = dB=20 s/n it may extend the range considerably ! ... ------=_NextPart_000_005E_01CE6396.23E75350 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ok Marcus
 
Thanks for the  info on the  no-go  zones ,  = the =20 decoder is quite  robust  in terms of  carrier  in = the =20 pass   band , i think  64  decodes are  = possible =20 , may be  less  on the  narrow  windows , but = still =20 only  some  5  or 10 hz separation needed 
 
 
I was  relating to the  correlation <> Op = signal  ,=20 where  normally  only the  time  = is normally=20  selected  by the  operator , the  software =20 looking  for the  lowest s/n to  place the  carrier = , a=20 good  idea in tx/rx   but not  for tx = only  ,=20 especially  if there  is a  30 min wait to  = see =20 if  anything  happens .. but  better  than =20 testing  the  4  hour  version ..
 
73 -G.  

Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2013 11:47 PM
Subject: Re: LF: VO1NA - 137.7770 kHz

Hi Graham,
 
yes it's true that the opds correlation = detector=20 does not attempt to directly decode any of the Opera 28-bit = message=20 contents (ie. the callsign). But you do get more than a single = yes-or-no=20 information. Opds tells you fairly reliably which entry from the = predefined=20 callsign list actually produced the hit. The list currently = contains 28=20 candidates which makes up about 5 bits worth. Also it = measures=20 the TX carrier frequency down to a milli-Hz out of a 100 Hz range,=20 which in itself could be used to encode another 17 bits... So = I'd say=20 it gives you less than 28 bits but certainly more than one = bit.
 
Best = wishes,
Markus = (DF6NM)

From: Graham
Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2013 7:13 PM
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org= =20
Subject: Re: LF: VO1NA - 137.7770 kHz

...
Where  as Op is  designed to  use  standard = tx/rx =20 and  soundcards  with
afc  routines , Marcus  = is =20 running  a  correlation  process  , looking  = for=20
the  pattern  match , this  in effect  is =20 decoding  a single  data  'bit'
and  = stability =20 will  affect his  decode  system , but  with another = 10 dB=20
s/n it  may extend the  range  considerably=20 !

...
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