Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [195.171.43.25]) by mtain-da03.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 322A238000093; Tue, 30 Aug 2011 18:57:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1QyXEV-0002uF-AO for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2011 23:56:39 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1QyXEU-0002u6-SF for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2011 23:56:38 +0100 Received: from nm1.bt.bullet.mail.ukl.yahoo.com ([217.146.183.199]) by relay1.thorcom.net with smtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1QyXET-0008KV-MF for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 30 Aug 2011 23:56:38 +0100 Received: from [217.146.183.197] by nm1.bt.bullet.mail.ukl.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Aug 2011 22:56:31 -0000 Received: from [217.146.183.204] by tm3.bt.bullet.mail.ukl.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Aug 2011 22:56:31 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1002.bt.mail.ukl.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Aug 2011 22:56:31 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 245022.71346.bm@omp1002.bt.mail.ukl.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 66331 invoked from network); 30 Aug 2011 22:56:31 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=btopenworld.com; h=DKIM-Signature:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:In-Reply-To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE; b=L6WHsdUbR0o4SdmJNHRXIf6FSbgZMVbWigBIH2zuCUi4NjlyhUG2C6BVer6rHxiKEetpb3gibigJFY3Ep+PIKAus7/t8lf8upn+5CuuO/81PecYRw90b0wuvrD1sCSJU0CgDUT51o50Rfr64TqDxic958zoskux0rIygmnBdvCs= ; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=btopenworld.com; s=s1024; t=1314744991; bh=Oc7oVisqYh+J1AzFuB3n07QzenXH/f1L+lsTAqneVJw=; h=X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:In-Reply-To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE; b=xfJYcXskzGOaEid70cAvTZOYEQstguwSLvGMHZIygMDJmBhqn5OYExGNGxWSpXwqjlRdN0bpOcA4yZYWKqOfL4o3UumyDBJItp+RpvtsZ0JS9dqA6488eEQhBiSSSdWHG8LXnysOUvBu7OTmEmHA/CTk/ibXINUHluhDhfJ/dB0= X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-YMail-OSG: LqGGLKoVM1ksPk_OIvmm2xNMXAS3qkc0d4DnAz9lKc9GFGo _X5lKPBSLItEFr8ruaZXNdtXIcbg777O616BSRUF6bvkcaSPNqFwg._9HYIA GSqA9.yoCmYKpLZU.xF1ao7pRvtUx7cBvzyfRBuHhXuuFH3qH9o6Zb09ozZ9 TzYXqsBeOi_V4xe2mojkTr09QV7GJoxKzq08e.3rcAd4Dp_CIj7vd3HpziAI be5auIKwdUeDmggVB.lhJbcQDxzTjsvKbyKInBOyC0IiUxrbJJILZWeucSHX Jkkl3xchw64_1jCqjREf32lM9MD4um4GSWRwrzCdNOUzI_K0cxBuj6cqh0Gc RnOKwYXpG5Z8WTaqX.y4kRLlu5tjHkoXRUixYY_4xfbMNKo5MZp6dZ9FoKxQ - X-Yahoo-SMTP: Cxhli3eswBD1ozmtAojhjrja86kWx0Qm9tycD5QR1DKWrOLgjJcXkw-- Received: from JimPC (james.moritz@86.174.30.230 with login) by smtp817.mail.ird.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Aug 2011 22:56:30 +0000 GMT Message-ID: <8CA4D9371AE446EDAA7576F42D258CF1@JimPC> From: "James Moritz" To: References: <16BC8B3CA8672445BC2A29B4C14A26D4379ED2AAB4@exlnmb01.eur.nsroot.net> <4DF9EFD1.5010208@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <1313780109.51443.YahooMailNeo@web111907.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <9CD1E11E8BC9402CB4AECECAC4088443@JimPC> <1314394178.5030.YahooMailNeo@web111905.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <1314641183.5605.YahooMailNeo@web111910.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <4E5CBC9A.5020900@iup.uni-heidelberg.de> <1314705226.37125.YahooMailNeo@web111901.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> <4E5CF192.3040905@legal-medicine.de> In-Reply-To: <4E5CF192.3040905@legal-medicine.de> Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 23:57:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Mail 6.0.6002.18197 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.0.6002.18463 DomainKey-Status: good (testing) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=disabled,UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001 Subject: LF: Re: Ferrite wideband antennas? Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=MISSING_OUTLOOK_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-SCORE: 0:2:407380000:93952408 X-AOL-SCOLL-URL_COUNT: 0 X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: mail_rly_antispam_dkim-d243.1 ; domain : btopenworld.com DKIM : fail x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d404b4e5d6af11473 X-AOL-IP: 195.171.43.25 X-AOL-SPF: domain : blacksheep.org SPF : none Dear Peter, LF Group, ----- Original Message ----- From: "pws" > These rods are working fine even at VLF. But according to my own > experiences in the late 90th bundling is not worth the effort. Two tight > (!) stacked 15cm rods achieved better SNR compared to a bundle of 7 rods. > I would be interested to know what method you used to determine SNR for the different rod configurations. In my experiments, the difficult thing is to measure the noise level of the antenna itself, due to the fact that it *is* an antenna and usually picks up plenty of noise from external sources. The "dummy antenna" consisting of a screened inductor with the same inductance and Q as the rod works OK, but not very convenient if you want to try several different rod configurations with varying L and Q. Another possibility is a screened enclosure to exclude all external fields, but that would have to be quite big not to de-tune or increase losses in the antenna, as you mentioned. Cheers, Jim Moritz 73 de M0BMU