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Subject: Re: LF: DX with 472 kHz, earth electrode antenna, 25 Watts output :-)
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Hi Piotr,
congratulations on those results from your ground dipole!
In my opinion, it is somewhat difficult to estimate ERP directly from =
WSPR SNR figures, because the variations in skywave sttenuation and =
receiver noise floor are difficult to predict. I would probably go about =
it by using a receiver to measure the effective loop area Aeff of the =
ground dipole. This can be done with some broadcast station in the lower =
medium wave band, comparing receive level with that from a simple =
nonresonant loop with eg. 1 square meter. Only the voltage ratio (dB =
difference) is required so you don't need an absolutely calibrated =
receiver. Thus
Aeff =3D voltage on ground antenna / voltage on reference loop * 1 m^2
If the frequency of the used broadcast station was significantly higher =
than your transmit frequency, you can make a correction for the =
increased skin depth:
Aeff' =3D Aeff * sqrt (f_broadcast / f_amateur)
Then, during your transmissions you'll only need to measure the current =
to your ground antenna, and calculate ERP as
ERP =3D 1.83 * 62342 ohms * Aeff'^2 / lambda^4 * current^2
Best 73,
Markus (DF6NM)
From: Piotr Herko=20
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2014 8:32 AM
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20
Subject: LF: DX with 472 kHz, earth electrode antenna, 25 Watts output =
:-)
Hi,
I reached OH8HTG WSPR, 1414, km with my earth electrode antenna! TX is =
M1GEO project, DDS RN3AUS, electrodes are 20 meters apart. Antenna is =
directly connected to 50 ohm tx filter with serial 2,2 nF capacitor. SWR =
is about 1,1 to 1.4 according to weather. Direction of the antenna is =
NE, 50 deg.
So far my WSPR was received in DL, OK, OE corner by DH5RAE, DJ0ABR and =
DC1RJJ, about 650 km far. Also closer by SP2OVY and SQ5KLN.
Who can help me estimate EIRP power? I declare now in WSPR beacon 5 mW.
2014-09-20 02:14 SP5XSB 0.475636 -30 0 KO02ld 0.005 =
OH8HTG KP34 1414 12 =20
2014-09-20 02:12 DK7FC 0.475684 -9 0 JN49ik 1 =
SP5XSB KO02ld 911 66 =20
2014-09-20 02:06 SP5XSB 0.475636 -33 0 KO02ld 0.005 =
OH8HTG KP34 1414 12 =20
Piotrek, sp5xsb
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charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Dutf-8 http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META name=3DGENERATOR content=3D"MSHTML 8.00.6001.23588"></HEAD>
<BODY style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 10px; PADDING-RIGHT: 10px; PADDING-TOP: =
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<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>Hi Piotr,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>congratulations on those results =
from your=20
ground dipole!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>In my opinion, it is somewhat difficult =
to estimate=20
ERP directly from WSPR SNR figures, because the variations in skywave=20
sttenuation and receiver noise floor are difficult to predict. =
</FONT><FONT=20
size=3D2 face=3DArial>I would probably go about it by using a =
receiver to=20
measure the effective loop area Aeff of the ground dipole. This can be=20
done with some broadcast station in the lower medium wave band, =
comparing=20
receive level with that from a simple nonresonant loop with eg. 1 =
square=20
meter. Only the voltage ratio (dB difference) is required so you=20
don't need an absolutely calibrated receiver. Thus</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial> Aeff =3D voltage on ground =
antenna / voltage on=20
reference loop * 1 m^2</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>If the frequency of the used broadcast =
station was=20
significantly higher than your transmit frequency, you can make a =
correction for=20
the increased skin depth:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial> Aeff' =3D Aeff * sqrt =
(f_broadcast /=20
f_amateur)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>Then, during your transmissions you'll =
only need to=20
measure the current to your ground antenna, and calculate ERP=20
as</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial> ERP =3D 1.83 * 62342 ohms * =
Aeff'^2 / lambda^4=20
* current^2</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>Best 73,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial>Markus (DF6NM)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2 face=3DArial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt Tahoma">
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV style=3D"BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV style=3D"font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A =
title=3Dsp5xsb@gmail.com=20
href=3D"mailto:sp5xsb@gmail.com">Piotr Herko</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, September 20, 2014 8:32 AM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A=20
title=3D"mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org STRG + Klicken, um =
Verkn=C3=BCpfung zu folgen"=20
href=3D"mailto:rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org">rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=
</A>=20
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> LF: DX with 472 kHz, earth electrode antenna, 25 =
Watts=20
output :-)</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Hi,<BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>I reached OH8HTG WSPR, 1414, km with my earth electrode =
antenna! TX is M1GEO project, DDS RN3AUS, electrodes are 20 meters =
apart.=20
Antenna is directly connected to 50 ohm tx filter with serial 2,2 nF =
capacitor.=20
SWR is about 1,1 to 1.4 according to weather. Direction of the antenna =
is NE, 50=20
deg.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>So far my WSPR was received in DL, OK, OE corner by=20
DH5RAE, DJ0ABR and DC1RJJ, about 650 km far. Also =
closer=20
by SP2OVY and SQ5KLN.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Who can help me estimate EIRP power? I declare now in WSPR beacon 5 =
mW.<BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<TABLE=20
style=3D"LINE-HEIGHT: 17px; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial,Verdana,sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-SIZE: 13px">
<TBODY=20
style=3D"BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; =
BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none">
<TR>
<TD align=3Dright>2014-09-20 02:14 </TD>
<TD align=3Dleft> SP5XSB </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 0.475636 </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> -30 </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 0 </TD>
<TD align=3Dleft> KO02ld </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 0.005 </TD>
<TD align=3Dleft> OH8HTG </TD>
<TD align=3Dleft> KP34 </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 1414 </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 12 </TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=3Dright> 2014-09-20 02:12 </TD>
<TD align=3Dleft> DK7FC </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 0.475684 </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> -9 </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 0 </TD>
<TD align=3Dleft> JN49ik </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 1 </TD>
<TD align=3Dleft> SP5XSB </TD>
<TD align=3Dleft> KO02ld </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 911 </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 66 </TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=3Dright> 2014-09-20 02:06 </TD>
<TD align=3Dleft> SP5XSB </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 0.475636 </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> -33 </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 0 </TD>
<TD align=3Dleft> KO02ld </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 0.005 </TD>
<TD align=3Dleft> OH8HTG </TD>
<TD align=3Dleft> KP34 </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 1414 </TD>
<TD align=3Dright> 12 </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Piotrek, sp5xsb</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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