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[195.171.43.25]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id pv1si14932435wjc.65.2014.02.18.07.16.02 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2014 07:16:02 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 195.171.43.25 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org) client-ip=195.171.43.25; Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 195.171.43.25 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org) smtp.mail=owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1WFmKS-0005MJ-JO for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Tue, 18 Feb 2014 15:11:24 +0000 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1WFmKR-0005MA-Td for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 18 Feb 2014 15:11:23 +0000 Received: from out1.ip07ir2.opaltelecom.net ([62.24.128.243]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1WFmKN-0000qO-LN for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Tue, 18 Feb 2014 15:11:22 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Au4EABx3A1NcGSxF/2dsb2JhbAANTIJCfIk2qnoggnOIYQECgS6DGQEBAQEDgQUECwcCCAQBAQEJFggHCQMCAQIBNAkIEwYCAQGIDqhwowYXjh8RAVYBBoIpD4F6BJgsgTKUHoFx X-IPAS-Result: Au4EABx3A1NcGSxF/2dsb2JhbAANTIJCfIk2qnoggnOIYQECgS6DGQEBAQEDgQUECwcCCAQBAQEJFggHCQMCAQIBNAkIEwYCAQGIDqhwowYXjh8RAVYBBoIpD4F6BJgsgTKUHoFx X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.97,502,1389744000"; d="scan'208,217";a="98335440" Received: from host-92-25-44-69.as13285.net (HELO [192.168.1.2]) ([92.25.44.69]) by out1.ip07ir2.opaltelecom.net with ESMTP; 18 Feb 2014 15:11:18 +0000 Message-ID: <53037818.1030804@psk31.plus.com> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2014 15:11:20 +0000 From: g3zjo User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:11.0) Gecko/20120327 Thunderbird/11.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <53036ADF.1090506@psk31.plus.com> In-Reply-To: <53036ADF.1090506@psk31.plus.com> X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: My MF RX set up has just emerged from the pits. I have been using a known dirty, on LF, Computer to monitor other signals. Now switched off and UNPLUGGED from the mains, 474KHz no longer has a 20dB over S9 noise level and I am Spotting PA3ABK/2. [...] Content analysis details: (0.0 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message 0.0 T_REMOTE_IMAGE Message contains an external image X-Scan-Signature: ad4be66560ed407055baa7738753e104 Subject: Re: LF: WSPR Reports - G3XBM, G3ZJO, G4KPX...(2) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------080000080900000403010309" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.7 required=5.0 tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_FONTCOLOR_BLUE, HTML_MESSAGE,HTML_TAG_EXISTS_TBODY,MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------080000080900000403010309 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My MF RX set up has just emerged from the pits. I have been using a known dirty, on LF, Computer to monitor other signals. Now switched off and UNPLUGGED from the mains, 474KHz no longer has a 20dB over S9 noise level and I am Spotting PA3ABK/2. Eddie On 18/02/2014 14:14, g3zjo wrote: > Dave > > Yes put it back to favor Rogers tests for sure. > > I find that tuning my inverted L for 474KHz band makes my 40m OCF > Doublet into a good 474KHz RX antenna, although tuning / loading the > Doublet makes a useless TX antenna (the ends drop). The other > combinations of all antennas influencing each other is no doubt endless. > > Eddie > > On 18/02/2014 13:46, Dave G3WCB. wrote: >> Eddie, Roger, >> Throwing good scientific practice out of the window, I changed two >> things at once (well, almost)! Eddie's transmissions, up to and >> including the 11-46 utc spot, were received using the loop in 60 -240 >> deg orientation, but with the main Tee antenna connected to the TX. I >> now realize that coupling from this main antenna is affecting the >> directionality of the loop, and also it's apparent sensitivity. >> Eddie's 12-06 utc transmission was received with the loop in the >> "favourable" 165- 345 deg direction, but with the TX antenna still >> connected. You can see that the signal is about 9 dB weaker. At this >> point the penny dropped and I realized what was going on. All WSPR >> spots after 12-14 UTC are being received with the loop in the 165-345 >> deg orientation, and the main antenna disconnected. >> Eddie's transmissions now seem to exhibit a lot more signal strength >> variability, and I haven't received any spots from Roger since 12-00 >> today. So it looks like all my "improvements" have made reception >> worse....doh! >> I think that the best course of action would be to put things back to >> the pre-12-00 utc configuration while Roger makes his improvements. >> Suggestions, anyone? >> 73 Dave G3WCB IO91RM >> >> -----Original Message----- >> *From:* owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org >> [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]*On Behalf Of *g3zjo >> *Sent:* 18 February 2014 13:15 >> *To:* rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org >> *Subject:* Re: LF: WSPR Reports - G3XBM, G3ZJO, G4KPX... >> >> Dave >> That will be an interesting test. I have a couple of similar >> loops and they just do not work here due to induced noise from >> the mains, I have tried ground level and bottom of the garden >> test to no avail. As I get away from one source of noise I start >> to approach another. >> I also have a small 'window sill' loop which I took mobile / >> portable and it performs really well, away from home. >> >> Roger >> I will put an RX on and run the Grabber to check if I see you. >> May I suggest that you TX at other than the 6 an 8 minute slots. >> I TX at 06 etc. and also ruin a little of 08 etc. slots. >> >> 73 Eddie >> >> >> On 18/02/2014 12:51, Roger Lapthorn wrote: >>> Thanks Dave, >>> >>> Your reports have been very useful to me. Going to try an >>> auto-transformer to see if I can match the earth-electrode >>> "loop" any better later. Added a series inductor yesterday >>> (about 200uH?) which increased antenna current about 20% >>> >>> 73s >>> Roger G3XBM >>> >>> >>> On 18 February 2014 12:23, Dave G3WCB. >>> >> > wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Chaps, >>> >>> I'm aware that you've been using my WSPR reports to gauge >>> the effectiveness >>> of your various QRP WSPR transmissions. I'm using a 80cm >>> square tuned loop >>> at ground level with a fet pre-amp, feeding my trusty ICOM >>> IC-PCR1000. I've >>> tried to keep the RX set up unchanged, but the loop is >>> inclined to >>> "weathercock" around a bit, especially with the storms recently. >>> >>> Also, my WSPR RX doesn't run 24x7, as I use the PC for other >>> duties. >>> >>> I went out this morning, and found that the loop is aligned >>> along an axis >>> running 60 - 240 deg, which means that stations in the IO92 >>> direction are >>> pretty much in the null direction. As an experiment, from >>> 1214 UTC today I >>> have aligned the loop antenna in a 165 - 345 deg direction. >>> To remove any >>> interaction with the main station "Tee" antenna, which is in >>> the same >>> general area, I have disconnected this and moved my WSPR TX >>> on to the short >>> vertical antenna, which is 30m away from the loop. >>> >>> I'll swap the loop back to it's 60 - 240 deg orientation >>> later on - I'll >>> announce when I've done this. >>> >>> 73, Dave G3WCB IO91RM >>> > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus > protection is active. > > --------------080000080900000403010309 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My MF RX set up has just emerged from the pits. I have been using a known dirty, on LF, Computer to monitor other signals. Now switched off and UNPLUGGED from the mains, 474KHz no longer has a 20dB over S9 noise level and I am Spotting PA3ABK/2.

Eddie
 
On 18/02/2014 14:14, g3zjo wrote:
Dave

Yes put it back to favor Rogers tests for sure.

I find that tuning my inverted L for 474KHz band makes my 40m OCF Doublet into a good 474KHz RX antenna, although tuning / loading the Doublet makes a useless TX antenna (the ends drop). The other combinations of all antennas influencing each other is no doubt endless.

Eddie

On 18/02/2014 13:46, Dave G3WCB. wrote:
Eddie, Roger,
 
Throwing good scientific practice out of the window, I changed two things at once (well, almost)!  Eddie's transmissions, up to and including the 11-46 utc spot, were received using the loop in 60 -240 deg orientation, but with the main Tee antenna connected to the TX. I now realize that coupling from this main antenna is affecting the directionality of the loop, and also it's apparent sensitivity.
 
Eddie's 12-06 utc transmission was received with the loop in the "favourable" 165- 345 deg direction, but with the TX antenna still connected. You can see that the signal is about 9 dB weaker. At this point the penny dropped and I realized what was going on. All WSPR spots after 12-14 UTC are being received with the loop in the 165-345 deg orientation, and the main antenna disconnected.
 
Eddie's transmissions now seem to exhibit a lot more signal strength variability, and I haven't received any spots from Roger since 12-00 today. So it looks like all my "improvements" have made reception worse....doh!
 
I think that the best course of action would be to put things back to the pre-12-00 utc configuration while Roger makes his improvements. Suggestions, anyone?
 
73 Dave G3WCB IO91RM 
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org [mailto:owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org]On Behalf Of g3zjo
Sent: 18 February 2014 13:15
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org
Subject: Re: LF: WSPR Reports - G3XBM, G3ZJO, G4KPX...

Dave
That will be an interesting test. I have a couple of similar loops and they just do not work here due to induced noise from the mains, I have tried ground level and bottom of the garden test to no avail. As I get away from one source of noise I start to approach another.
I also have a small 'window sill' loop which I took mobile / portable and it performs really well, away from home.

Roger
I will put an RX on and run the Grabber to check if I see you. May I suggest that you TX at other than the 6 an 8 minute slots. I TX at 06 etc. and also ruin a little of 08 etc. slots.

73 Eddie


On 18/02/2014 12:51, Roger Lapthorn wrote:
Thanks Dave,

Your reports have been very useful to me. Going to try an auto-transformer to see if I can match the earth-electrode "loop" any better later. Added a series inductor yesterday (about 200uH?) which increased antenna current about 20%

73s
Roger G3XBM


On 18 February 2014 12:23, Dave G3WCB. <ganymede444@btopenworld.com> wrote:


Chaps,

I'm aware that you've been using my WSPR reports to gauge the effectiveness
of your various QRP WSPR transmissions. I'm using a 80cm square tuned loop
at ground level with a fet pre-amp, feeding my trusty ICOM IC-PCR1000. I've
tried to keep the RX set up unchanged, but the loop is inclined to
"weathercock" around a bit, especially with the storms recently.

Also, my WSPR RX doesn't run 24x7, as I use the PC for other duties.

I went out this morning, and found that the loop is aligned along an axis
running 60 - 240 deg, which means that stations in the IO92 direction are
pretty much in the null direction. As an experiment, from 1214 UTC today I
have aligned the loop antenna in a 165 - 345 deg direction. To remove any
interaction with the main station "Tee" antenna, which is in the same
general area, I have disconnected this and moved my WSPR TX on to the short
vertical antenna, which is 30m away from the loop.

I'll swap the loop back to it's 60 - 240 deg orientation later on - I'll
announce when I've done this.

73, Dave G3WCB IO91RM




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