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[195.171.43.25]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id wv8si874025wjb.32.2013.12.27.15.10.08 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2013 15:10:09 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 195.171.43.25 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org) client-ip=195.171.43.25; Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 195.171.43.25 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org) smtp.mail=owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; dkim=neutral (bad format) header.i=@mx.aol.com Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1Vwg66-0000ga-1G for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Fri, 27 Dec 2013 22:41:38 +0000 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1Vwg65-0000gR-0C for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 27 Dec 2013 22:41:37 +0000 Received: from omr-d07.mx.aol.com ([205.188.109.204]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1Vwg61-0004Nd-Sh for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 27 Dec 2013 22:41:35 +0000 Received: from mtaout-mce02.mx.aol.com (mtaout-mce02.mx.aol.com [172.29.27.206]) by omr-d07.mx.aol.com (Outbound Mail Relay) with ESMTP id 7B43B70000094 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2013 17:41:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.1.66] (host-92-7-238-1.as43234.net [92.7.238.1]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mtaout-mce02.mx.aol.com (MUA/Third Party Client Interface) with ESMTPSA id 684BD380000A3 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2013 17:41:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <52BE0218.7080008@aol.com> Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2013 22:41:28 +0000 From: g4gvw User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org References: <52BDD7FF.9060300@freenet.de>,<1CAAB4802E504192AD39BC56B0A49ECB@AGB> In-Reply-To: x-aol-global-disposition: G DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mx.aol.com; s=20121107; t=1388184091; bh=nBTgS3E/w6WtLZkkQVywDNwsZl2I3NAxghersqTonvU=; h=From:To:Subject:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=yl62LZMlfxQ7lWsSqVhw++35zmBXZZw3BuohN+NC/bZpOaAWZ5LrYe69rtBn93B4v 0TH/uWaVrRXfu016/XUxfiIkYod9gld+gpCjZu+AIF+z7Cs9mXHzBmwhNZoHtUEse4 KnGbtqmHb4sWC1rLqmLQR213Its3dZbcCng6jdQ0= x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d1bce52be021a0078 X-AOL-IP: 92.7.238.1 X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Surely, Graham, this is dependent on the terms of whatever licence the IP is released. It might be relevant to argue these matters against the terms of the various GPL that have been defined. Richard Stallman presents some good arguments that are particularly relevant to Open Source etc. [...] Content analysis details: (0.8 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, no trust [205.188.109.204 listed in list.dnswl.org] 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (g4gvw[at]aol.com) -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record -0.6 RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message 1.3 GAPPY_SUBJECT Subject: contains G.a.p.p.y-T.e.x.t 0.0 T_DKIM_INVALID DKIM-Signature header exists but is not valid X-Scan-Signature: 3b98ba00e41d0c8844afdaadb28670b6 Subject: Re: LF: RE: [O_P_E_R_A_] Opera upgrades for 2014 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------060400020201040308050006" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.6 required=5.0 tests=GAPPY_SUBJECT,HTML_50_60, HTML_MESSAGE,HTML_TAG_EXISTS_TBODY autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 2680 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------060400020201040308050006 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Surely, Graham, this is dependent on the terms of whatever licence the=20 IP is released. It might be relevant to argue these matters against the=20 terms of the various GPL that have been defined. Richard Stallman=20 presents some good arguments that are particularly relevant to Open=20 Source etc. 73 On 27/12/13 21:23, Graham wrote: > Its the old source code argument > There are plenty of locked systems in use , source code comes=20 > under 'IP' Intellectual Property rights , there is no need to =20 > disclose as long as all can use the same , sure some would =20 > like to see 'how' but that's another angle , same with =20 > encryption, DSSS numeric based data modes like Olivia , chip64,=20 > contessa , ros hf as long as the software has the same keys =20 > then that meets the requirements > The Opera decoder is a data decoder , Marcus is running =20 > correlation , pattern matching , two different things entirely , one=20 > has high equipment over heads , the other uses anti noise/=20 > fec/afc software routines to negate hardware affects on system=20 > performance and counteract propagation conditions , Opera is a =20 > averaging system and requires for a decode , the average of the=20 > min s/n , from 50% of the data randomly dispersed along the time =20 > line , ie first 50 last 50 or any 50% > G, > > *From:* Bob Raide > *Sent:* Friday, December 27, 2013 8:53 PM > *To:* rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > *Subject:* RE: LF: RE: [O_P_E_R_A_] Opera upgrades for 2014 > > What your saying is for those of us wanting to improve things go play=20 > with the other systems and leave OPERA just as it is? Bob > > -----------------------------------------------------------------------= - > From: g8fzk@g8fzk.fsnet.co.uk > To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2013 20:39:58 +0000 > Subject: Re: LF: RE: [O_P_E_R_A_] Opera upgrades for 2014 > > There are plenty of commercial data mode systems in use on the =20 > Ham bands that are locked and not publicised , from my experience=20 > , the locked systems seem to give a superior level of performance=20 > to the open code versions , pactor-4 being a good example ,=20 > using modern ss techniques achieves high data/power ratio , but =20 > missing is the cdma layer that would enhance b/w user=20 > efficiency , but that exists in another locked data mode , which=20 > is free > So where /what is the problem ? > G, > > *From:* wolf_dl4yhf > *Sent:* Friday, December 27, 2013 7:41 PM > *To:* rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > *Subject:* Re: LF: RE: [O_P_E_R_A_] Opera upgrades for 2014 > > Thanks for forwarding the message Bob - so I won't spend any effort in=20 > implementing Opera myself if Markus's DS algorithm is really embedded=20 > in the Ros-software. > Despite the fact that I don't like, and will not use, the original=20 > Opera software myself as long as its author makes such a secret of it,=20 > leaving it to others to reverse-engineer the algorithms. > > Cheers, > Wolf . > > Am 27.12.2013 19:31, schrieb Bob Raide: > > Trevor and all; > Especially #1!!! If that alone could be accomplished the rest > later would do just fine. Bob, WG2XRS/4-4000 meters, WE2XEB-2200 > meters, WE2XGR/6-630/600 meters-W2ZM... > > -------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- > To: O_P_E_R_A_@yahoogroups.com > CC: tsmithers@cix.co.uk > From: tsmithers@cix.co.uk > Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2013 16:48:00 +0000 > Subject: [O_P_E_R_A_] Opera upgrades for 2014 > > A few thoughts for Opera enhancements VLF to 160m > > (1) Deep Search Detector built in to existing Opera system with > ability to run alongside existing > Op decoders and report directly to PSK reporter > > (2) Reinstate the dual receive function without having to open > multiple instances of the software. > > (3) Dynamically resizable screen or replace the dials with led bar > type indicators - would make > the overall screen size a little smaller. > > (4) Option to "tear off" the waterfall to enable positioning on > another part of the monitor screen - > like wsprx for example. > > Trevor G0KTN > > > __._,_.___ > Reply via web post > > Reply to sender > > Reply to group > > Start a New Topic > > Messages in this topic > > (1) > > Recent Activity: > > * New Members > > 3 > > Visit Your Group > > > Yahoo! Groups > > > Switch to: Text-Only > , > Daily Digest > > =95 Unsubscribe > =95 > Terms of Use =95 > Send us Feedback > > . > > __,_._,___ > > --=20 73 de pat g4gvw qth felixstowe, uk (east coast, county of suffolk) --------------060400020201040308050006 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Surely, Graham, this is dependent on the terms of whatever licence the IP is released. It might be relevant to argue these matters against the terms of the various GPL that have been defined. Richard Stallman presents some good arguments that are particularly relevant to Open Source etc.

73
On 27/12/13 21:23, Graham wrote:
Its=A0 the=A0old source=A0 code=A0 argume= nt
=A0
There are plenty of=A0 locked=A0 systems=A0= in use , source code comes under=A0 'IP'=A0Intellectual Property rights , there is no=A0 need=A0 to=A0 disclose=A0 as=A0 long as= =A0 all=A0 can=A0 use=A0 the=A0 same=A0, sure=A0 some=A0=A0would=A0 like t= o=A0 see=A0 'how'=A0 but that's another angle =A0, same=A0 with=A0 encryption, DSSS numeric=A0based data=A0 modes like=A0 Olivia , chip64, contessa= , ros=A0hf =A0 as long=A0 as=A0 the=A0 software=A0 has the=A0 sam= e=A0 keys=A0 then that=A0 meets the=A0 requirements
=A0
The Opera=A0 decoder is=A0 a=A0 data=A0 d= ecoder ,=A0 Marcus is=A0 running=A0 correlation , pattern=A0 matching , two= =A0 different things entirely , one has high=A0 equipment=A0 over heads , the=A0 other=A0 uses=A0anti noise/ fec/afc=A0 software routines to=A0 negate=A0hardware affects on system performance = and counteract propagation conditions , Opera=A0 is a=A0 averaging=A0 system and=A0 requires=A0 for a decode , the=A0 average=A0 of=A0= the=A0 min s/n=A0 , from 50% of the=A0 data=A0 randomly dispersed alon= g the=A0 time=A0 line , ie first 50=A0 last 50=A0 or=A0 any 50% <= /font>
=A0
G,
=A0

From: Bob Raide
Sent: Friday, December 27, 2013 8:53 PM
Subject: RE: LF: RE: [O_P_E_R_A_] Opera upgrades for 2014

What your saying is=A0for those of us wanting to improve things go play with the other systems and leave=A0OPERA just as it is? Bob
=A0
From: g8fzk@g8fzk.fsnet.co.= uk
To: rsgb_lf_group@bl= acksheep.org
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2013 20:39:58 +0000
Subject: Re: LF: RE: [O_P_E_R_A_] Opera upgrades for 2014

There=A0 are plenty of=A0 commercial=A0 data=A0 mode=A0 sy= stems=A0 in use=A0 on the=A0 Ham bands=A0 that=A0 are locked=A0 and not=A0 publicised , from=A0 my experience , the=A0 locked systems se= em to=A0 give a=A0 superior level=A0 of performance =A0to the=A0= open =A0=A0=A0code=A0 versions , pactor-4=A0 being a=A0 good=A0 ex= ample , using=A0 modern=A0 ss techniques=A0 achieves=A0 high data/pow= er=A0 ratio , but=A0 missing=A0 is the=A0 cdma=A0 layer that=A0 wou= ld=A0 enhance=A0 b/w=A0 user efficiency=A0=A0, but=A0 that=A0 exist= s in another locked data=A0 mode , which is=A0 free
=A0
So=A0 where /what=A0 is the=A0 problem ?
=A0
G,

Sent: Friday, December 27, 2013 7:41 PM
Subject: Re: LF: RE: [O_P_E_R_A_] Opera upgrades for 2014

Thanks for forwarding the message Bob - so I won't spend any effort in implementing Opera myself if Markus's DS algorithm is really embedded in the Ros-software.
Despite the fact that I don't like, and will not use, the original Opera software myself as long as its author makes such a secret of it, leaving it to others to reverse-engineer the algorithms.

Cheers,
=A0 Wolf .

Am 27.12.2013 19:31, schrieb Bob Raide:
Trevor and all;
Especially #1!!!=A0 If that alone could be=A0accomplished t= he rest later would do=A0just fine. Bob, WG2XRS/4-4000 meters, WE2XEB-2200 meters, WE2XGR/6-630/600 meters-W2ZM...
=A0
To: O_P_E_R_A_@y= ahoogroups.com
CC: tsmithers@cix.co.uk=
From: tsmithers@cix.co.uk=
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2013 16:48:00 +0000
Subject: [O_P_E_R_A_] Opera upgrades for 2014

=A0
A few thoughts for Opera enhancements VLF to 160m

(1) Deep Search Detector built in to existing Opera system with ability to run alongside existing
Op decoders and report directly to PSK reporter
(2) Reinstate the dual receive function without having to open multiple instances of the software.<= br>
(3) Dynamically resizable screen or replace the dials with led bar type indicators - would make the overall screen size a little smaller.

(4) Option to "tear off" the waterfall to enable positioning on another part of the monitor screen -
like wsprx for example.

Trevor G0KTN


_= _._,_.___
Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (1)
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Switch to: <= a moz-do-not-send=3D"true" style=3D"TEXT-DECORATI= ON: none" href=3D"mailto:O_P_E_R_A_-traditional@yahoogroups.com?subject=3DChange%20= Delivery%20Format:%20Traditional">Text-Only, Daily Digest =95 Unsubscribe =95 Terms of Use =95 Send us Feedback
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__,_.= _,___


--=20
73 de pat g4gvw
qth felixstowe, uk
(east coast, county of suffolk)
--------------060400020201040308050006--