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[195.171.43.25]) by mx.google.com with ESMTP id r41si28002193eeo.253.2013.07.11.02.51.59 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2013 02:52:00 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 195.171.43.25 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org) client-ip=195.171.43.25; Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 195.171.43.25 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org) smtp.mail=owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; dkim=pass header.i=@mx.aol.com Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1UxD88-0001Cv-Ja for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 Jul 2013 10:25:40 +0100 Received: from [195.171.43.32] (helo=relay1.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1UxD87-0001Cm-V4 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 Jul 2013 10:25:39 +0100 Received: from omr-m03.mx.aol.com ([64.12.143.77]) by relay1.thorcom.net with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.77) (envelope-from ) id 1UxD85-00005k-3w for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Thu, 11 Jul 2013 10:25:38 +0100 Received: from mtaout-db04.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtaout-db04.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.51.196]) by omr-m03.mx.aol.com (Outbound Mail Relay) with ESMTP id 136217000009F; Thu, 11 Jul 2013 05:25:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [192.168.1.68] (host-92-8-80-39.as43234.net [92.8.80.39]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mtaout-db04.r1000.mx.aol.com (MUA/Third Party Client Interface) with ESMTPSA id 2BE52E000093; Thu, 11 Jul 2013 05:25:34 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <51DE7A0C.4030104@aol.com> Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2013 10:25:32 +0100 From: pat Organization: G4GVW User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130623 Thunderbird/17.0.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org CC: Graham References: <51D975FA.60008@virginbroadband.com.au> <51DD1434.2030300@virginbroadband.com.au> <20130710173020.GA22574@cs.utwente.nl> <51DDADB2.5090905@aol.com> <51DDC00E.1000401@aol.com> In-Reply-To: x-aol-global-disposition: G DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mx.aol.com; s=20121107; t=1373534735; bh=PbmYa0OIMY9DcDcHmJSJA3RslZeJrQFEa5/qIkjbWWA=; h=From:To:Subject:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=N+6pChiTJoVY1rpeO+VWqCOYliIp3jYp4lRLvv3AyLMAAns/oWPpP2/xpAWcsDCNi aLaWDiOgi2/BaASECWSyk2oR+Fztv/hIJ8nTFRs3joWQHaB44iCVatctpSlLYH9WpT AFKMXrY4a+VUfhASEl3tetmSjs7hJ29r2mVCY60o= X-AOL-SCOLL-SCORE: 1:2:470771520:93952408 X-AOL-SCOLL-URL_COUNT: 2 x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d33c451de7a0e29eb X-AOL-IP: 92.8.80.39 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "relay1.thorcom.net", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Thanks, Graham. Looks interesting, will have a proper read later. 73 On 10/07/13 21:41, Graham wrote: > Or if you want a slightly lighter read , try this > http://www.google.com/patents/US4622558 > G ) > *From:* pat > *Sent:* Wednesday, July 10, 2013 9:11 PM > *To:* rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > *Cc:* Warren Ziegler > *Subject:* Re: Fwd: Re: LF: VK1OD's analysis of the MiniWhip antenna > > AND Warren, there are those who hold that the only place from which we > may observe our universe is from one of the other(s)! > > At this point in the narrative the little folk like me retreat deeply > into papers and books by the likes of Hawking and Penrose :>))) > > 73 > > > On 10/07/13 20:06, Warren Ziegler wrote: >> Pat, >> "*There is a theory which >> states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe >> is for and why it is here, >> it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more >> bizarre and inexplicable. **There is another theory which states that >> this has already happened."* >> *-Douglas Adams* >> >> >> On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 2:53 PM, pat > > wrote: >> >> Of course, it also holds to be true that the "rest of the >> universe" that is the "other plate" of my capacitor is also the >> "other plate" of everyone else's similar capacitor and is the >> common circuit element to which we are all referenced! >> >> 73 >> >> >> >> On 10/07/13 18:30, Pieter-Tjerk de Boer wrote: >> >> On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 05:58:44PM +1000, edgar wrote: >> >> Surely every conductor in the unit will have a difference >> in potential >> due to being in a electromagnetic field. >> Even in the legs of the FET. Although the potential will >> be extremely small. >> >> Yes, of course that's correct. >> >> I should have written that with a fiber optic cable instead >> of the coaxial >> cable, all circuit elements are coupled to the field at >> _almost_ the same >> place, and thus [...] Content analysis details: (0.7 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE RBL: Sender listed at http://www.dnswl.org/, no trust [64.12.143.77 listed in list.dnswl.org] 0.0 FREEMAIL_FROM Sender email is commonly abused enduser mail provider (g4gvw[at]aol.com) -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record -0.3 RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message 0.0 LOTS_OF_MONEY Huge... sums of money 0.0 T_DKIM_INVALID DKIM-Signature header exists but is not valid 1.0 FREEMAIL_REPLY From and body contain different freemails X-Scan-Signature: 7503b406b4f0651fec4f329b587588f8 Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: LF: VK1OD's analysis of the MiniWhip antenna Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------080105030900000804080102" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0 tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 1844 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------080105030900000804080102 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks, Graham. Looks interesting, will have a proper read later. 73 On 10/07/13 21:41, Graham wrote: > Or if you want a slightly lighter read , try this > http://www.google.com/patents/US4622558 > G ) > *From:* pat > *Sent:* Wednesday, July 10, 2013 9:11 PM > *To:* rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org > *Cc:* Warren Ziegler > *Subject:* Re: Fwd: Re: LF: VK1OD's analysis of the MiniWhip antenna > > AND Warren, there are those who hold that the only place from which we > may observe our universe is from one of the other(s)! > > At this point in the narrative the little folk like me retreat deeply > into papers and books by the likes of Hawking and Penrose :>))) > > 73 > > > On 10/07/13 20:06, Warren Ziegler wrote: >> Pat, >> "*There is a theory which >> states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe >> is for and why it is here, >> it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more >> bizarre and inexplicable. **There is another theory which states that >> this has already happened."* >> *-Douglas Adams* >> >> >> On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 2:53 PM, pat > > wrote: >> >> Of course, it also holds to be true that the "rest of the >> universe" that is the "other plate" of my capacitor is also the >> "other plate" of everyone else's similar capacitor and is the >> common circuit element to which we are all referenced! >> >> 73 >> >> >> >> On 10/07/13 18:30, Pieter-Tjerk de Boer wrote: >> >> On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 05:58:44PM +1000, edgar wrote: >> >> Surely every conductor in the unit will have a difference >> in potential >> due to being in a electromagnetic field. >> Even in the legs of the FET. Although the potential will >> be extremely small. >> >> Yes, of course that's correct. >> >> I should have written that with a fiber optic cable instead >> of the coaxial >> cable, all circuit elements are coupled to the field at >> _almost_ the same >> place, and thus are at _almost_ the same potential, and thus >> _almost_ no >> signal will come out: very much less than with the coax still >> in place. >> >> B.t.w., some mini-whips are built using a metal can as the >> probe, with >> the entire electronics inside the can; such an arrangement >> would get >> quite close to zero output when the coax is replaced by the >> fiber optics. >> >> Anyway, it was originally claimed that the functioning of the >> mini-whip >> does not depend on the coaxial cable; I just intended to >> explain why I >> think it does. >> >> 73, Pieter-Tjerk, PA3FWM >> >> >> >> >> -- >> 73 de pat g4gvw >> es gd dx >> qth nr Felixstowe >> East Coast UK >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> 73 Warren K2ORS >> WD2XGJ >> WD2XSH/23 >> WE2XEB/2 >> WE2XGR/1 >> > > > -- > 73 de pat g4gvw > es gd dx > qth nr Felixstowe > East Coast UK -- 73 de pat g4gvw es gd dx qth nr Felixstowe East Coast UK --------------080105030900000804080102 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Thanks, Graham. Looks interesting, will have a proper read later.

73



On 10/07/13 21:41, Graham wrote:
Or if you  want a  slightly   lighter   read  , try  this      http://www.google.com/patents/US4622558   
 
G  )
 
From: pat
Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 9:11 PM
Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: LF: VK1OD's analysis of the MiniWhip antenna

AND Warren, there are those who hold that the only place from which we may observe our universe is from one of the other(s)!

At this point in the narrative the little folk like me retreat deeply into papers and books by the likes of Hawking and Penrose :>)))

73


On 10/07/13 20:06, Warren Ziegler wrote:
Pat,
   "There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened."
-Douglas Adams


On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 2:53 PM, pat <g4gvw@aol.com> wrote:
Of course, it also holds to be true that the "rest of the universe" that is the "other plate" of my capacitor is also the "other plate" of everyone else's similar capacitor and is the common circuit element to which we are all referenced!

73



On 10/07/13 18:30, Pieter-Tjerk de Boer wrote:
On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 05:58:44PM +1000, edgar wrote:

Surely every conductor in the unit will have a difference in potential
due to being in a electromagnetic field.
Even in the legs of the FET. Although the potential will be extremely small.
Yes, of course that's correct.

I should have written that with a fiber optic cable instead of the coaxial
cable, all circuit elements are coupled to the field at _almost_ the same
place, and thus are at _almost_ the same potential, and thus _almost_ no
signal will come out: very much less than with the coax still in place.

B.t.w., some mini-whips are built using a metal can as the probe, with
the entire electronics inside the can; such an arrangement would get
quite close to zero output when the coax is replaced by the fiber optics.

Anyway, it was originally claimed that the functioning of the mini-whip
does not depend on the coaxial cable; I just intended to explain why I
think it does.

73, Pieter-Tjerk, PA3FWM




--
73 de pat g4gvw
es gd dx
qth nr Felixstowe
East Coast UK





--
73 Warren K2ORS
                WD2XGJ
                WD2XSH/23
                WE2XEB/2
                WE2XGR/1

  


-- 
73 de pat g4gvw
es gd dx
qth nr Felixstowe
East Coast UK


-- 
73 de pat g4gvw
es gd dx
qth nr Felixstowe
East Coast UK
--------------080105030900000804080102--