Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6454 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 02:44:34 +0100 Received: from magnus.plus.net.uk (HELO magnus.force9.net) (195.166.128.27) by guiness.force9.net with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 02:44:34 +0100 Received: (qmail 12378 invoked from network); 6 Aug 1999 01:47:43 -0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Received: from unknown (HELO post.thorcom.com) (212.172.148.70) by magnus.plus.net.uk with SMTP; 6 Aug 1999 01:47:43 -0000 X-Priority: 3 Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CYpC-0002EV-00 for rsgb_lf_group-outgoing@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 02:29:34 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Received: from ds9.sci.fi ([195.74.0.54]) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 3.02 #1) id 11CYpB-0002EQ-00 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Fri, 06 Aug 1999 02:29:33 +0100 Received: from pmk1 (MCCXLIII.dyn.saunalahti.fi [195.197.4.43]) by ds9.sci.fi (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id EAA25486 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 1999 04:29:35 +0300 (EET DST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19990806013130.005fee98@pop.sci.fi> X-Sender: keinanen@pop.sci.fi X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 04:31:30 +0300 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org From: "Paul Keinanen" Subject: Re: LF: eclipse Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Sender: At 23:02 5.8.1999 +0200, Johan Bodin wrote: >Hello, > >Forwarded from Rik Strobbe: > >>A software team from the Belgien amateur radio society UBA has developed a >>programme that can be used to register the fieldstrength measurements. All you >>need is a PC with Win95/98 and a soundcard. The audio output of the receiver >>is fed to the input of the soundcard. > >AGC (which is present in most amateur receivers) will make such measurements >almost useless (unless the AGC can be disabled). >From http://www.uba.be/zon/SoftGB.htm it is stated that the receiver is set to a constant gain, i.e. AGC off. In my opinnion, the problem is that the receiver gain should not fluctuate much during a several day period. A typical IF amplifier strip does not use feedback resistors to set the gain, but the gain depends mainly of the transistor parameters, which are known to fluctuate a lot with temperature, operating voltage etc., causing a gain variation of several decibels. Thus, the receiver should be kept at constant temperature for several days and the IF strip operating voltages well regulated in order to give reliable results. In order to compensate for the gain variation, in radio astronomy some form Dicke radiometer is used, in which the receiver input is switched several times a second between the antenna signal and a very well known noise sourse (e.g. a resistor at 300 K or an auxiliar antenna pointing to a cold spot in the sky). The receiver output is a square wave altering between the reference level and signal of interest level and the difference between these two levels are recorded. Looking at the HF test signal for this experiment: a long dash (14 seconds) CW-identification (25 wpm ON4UBA/B) Idle period (5-6 sec) it would be very tempting to use the CW-id to compensate for any gain drift, but unfortunately that would only give the difference between the received beacon signal (mark) and local background noise (space). Unfortunately, the local noise level varies a lot, so this would only give a measure of the signal to noise ratio, not the absolute signal level. To get accurate measurements, a noise source of very precisely known output would be required so that the receiver input could be switched several times a second between the antenna and the noise reference. Unfortunately the noise level at LF/MF/HF is so high that a resistor at 300 K would be useless and some other form of calibrated noise source is required. A well shielded pseudo random noise generator (CMOS or TTL) followed by an attenuator might be useful. If the a.g.c. can not be disabled, the IF-strip acts like an amplifier with very fast gain drift :-). With fast enough switching between the reference noise level and antenna signal, the a.g.c. time constant is so long that the gain variation would be neglectable, thus the Dicke radiometer principle could be used even if the a.g.c could not be disabled. But as I said, using this method would require a calibrated noise source and some extra hardware to switch the receiver input between the antenna and the noise source, so it is understandable that this is not used in this experiment. Paul OH3LWR