Return-Path: Received: from mtain-ma11.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtain-ma11.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.96.19]) by air-ma05.mail.aol.com (v126.13) with ESMTP id MAILINMA051-b5244b40dfdf95; Sun, 03 Jan 2010 13:20:15 -0500 Received: from post.thorcom.com (post.thorcom.com [193.82.116.20]) by mtain-ma11.r1000.mx.aol.com (Internet Inbound) with ESMTP id 3BF43380000BC; Sun, 3 Jan 2010 13:20:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from majordom by post.thorcom.com with local (Exim 4.14) id 1NRV31-0003YK-0L for rs_out_1@blacksheep.org; Sun, 03 Jan 2010 18:19:27 +0000 Received: from [83.244.159.144] (helo=relay3.thorcom.net) by post.thorcom.com with esmtp (Exim 4.14) id 1NRV30-0003YB-48 for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 03 Jan 2010 18:19:26 +0000 Received: from out1.ip07ir2.opaltelecom.net ([62.24.128.243]) by relay3.thorcom.net with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1NRV2x-0001F9-OG for rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org; Sun, 03 Jan 2010 18:19:26 +0000 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AgMGADtuQEtOlW6h/2dsb2JhbACCFRqLDYIJwV+EMAQ X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.47,493,1257120000"; d="scan'208,217";a="404344932" Received: from unknown (HELO xphd97xgq27nyf) ([78.149.110.161]) by out1.ip07ir2.opaltelecom.net with SMTP; 03 Jan 2010 18:19:17 +0000 Message-ID: <006d01ca8ca1$3f4cedf0$0401a8c0@xphd97xgq27nyf> From: "mal hamilton" To: References: <820322.89933.qm@web28107.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <8B155F0217064CB693A2937746504A32@LAPTOP> Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2010 18:19:10 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Spam-Report: autolearn=disabled,HTML_MESSAGE=0.001,HTML_TAG_EXIST_TBODY=0.126 Subject: Re: LF: PA0A on 500kHz / legal or piracy? Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_006A_01CA8CA1.3F162680" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on post.thorcom.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0 tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGE, HTML_TAG_EXISTS_TBODY autolearn=no version=2.63 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes Sender: owner-rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org X-Listname: rsgb_lf_group X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rs_out_1@blacksheep.org X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false x-aol-global-disposition: G x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d60134b40dfde7474 X-AOL-IP: 193.82.116.20 ------=_NextPart_000_006A_01CA8CA1.3F162680 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Michael Misinformation is dangerous. I was PA0A first QSO at midnight 2010, fi= rst ever PA amateur QSO on 500 and first PA0A/G3KEV ie Holland/uk cont= act. mal/g3kev ----- Original Message -----=20 From: M. Sanders=20 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Cc: Ypma, S.H. ; pa3agf@gmail.com ; chmurre@zeelandnet.nl ; Albert= =20 Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 5:13 PM Subject: Re: LF: PA0A on 500kHz / legal or piracy? To All LF, Please be informed some Radio Amateurs in PA have apparently receive= d permissions (via VRZA) to transmit 501-504kHz, as of Jan first 2010.= PA0A has informed me about this and I appologise for any possible mis= understandings caused by my previous email to the reflector. The Dutch= Telecom Authorities nor VRZA have publicised anything on their Intern= et sites until now and the VERON members (like myself) have not been= informed about anything yet. Congratulations to PA0A are in order for his acheivements! Best Regards / Best 73's Michael Sanders, PC4M. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: M0FMT=20 To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org=20 Sent: Sunday, January 03, 2010 5:11 PM Subject: Re: LF: PA0A on 500kHz / legal or piracy? Hi LF I take it that PA0A is one of the non legal stations we've= been warned about (see below). He was CQing last night and no one cal= led him although there were several on the band. Not a good idea to gi= ve Pirates a report not sure how it would affect our licence to use th= e band? 73 es GL petefmt --- On Sat, 2/1/10, M. Sanders wrote: From: M. Sanders Subject: Re: LF: PA0A on 500kHz / legal or piracy? To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.org Cc: pa0shy@veron.nl Date: Saturday, 2 January, 2010, 1:13 To all LF, Please beware that the official Dutch Telecom Agency has= not yet published the issue of experimental licences for the 600m ban= d tot the Dutch Amateur Radio organisations VERON and / or VRZA. For= those able to understand Dutch language the most recent official publ= ication is quoted below. However not all their memebers seem to have= been adequately informed about the process. It is not even clear if= notifications to participate in the experiment by individual Radio Am= ateurs have already been processed by the organisations. I am most sorry to inform all LF interested parties via th= is reflector that the transmissions like the one recorded below and an= d therfore QSO's with PA stations may still be regarded as an act of= 'radio piracy' by the PA stations, transmitting on an frequency band= without official permission. It looks like it is not 'legal' yet to= QSO with PA on 600m unit official publications have been issued by Du= tch Telecom Authorities and VERON and/or VRZA have informed indivual= Radio Amateurs in writing about their participation to the experiment= s transmitting on 600m. I suppose a starting date somewhere in the fut= ure will be in order, and not legalising transmissions 'after the fact= ' as of 1-1-2010 0:00LET.=20 Dutch Amateurs have a rich history of 'illegal' first-QSO'= s, starting in the 1920's with the first succesful trans Atlantic QSO'= s from PA. The Radio Amateur, OM Jesse, was convicted of 'radio piracy= ' but not fined and the Judge congratulated him and complimented him= on his innovative achievement. History sometimes has the tendency to= repeat it self. Kind regards, Best 73's, Michael Sanders, PC4M QUOTE: >> Onderzoek naar toegang tot 500 KHz voor radiozendamateurs 23-12-2009=20 Tijdens het overleg met de belangenverenigingen voor radio= zendamateurs VERON en VRZA op 7 oktober 2009 zijn afspraken gemaakt ov= er de toegang tot de 500 KHz band. De verenigingen zullen onderzoeken= wat de effecten zijn van het uitzenden in deze frequentieband in rela= tie tot de randvoorwaarden die voor de WRC 2012 zijn voorgesteld voor= de 500 KHz band. De resultaten van het onderzoek worden ingebracht bi= j de nationale voorbereidingscommissie voor de WRC 2012 (NVC). De vere= nigingen moeten hiervoor een rapport indienen bij Agentschap Telecom. Om het onderzoek te kunnen uitvoeren vragen de vereniginge= n een collectieve experimenteervergunning aan bij Agentschap Telecom.= Over de inhoud van de aanvraag van de experimenteervergunning voeren= de verenigingen nog overleg met de co=F6rdinator voor amateurzaken.= De randvoorwaarden voor de aanvraag en de uitvoering van het experime= nt zijn inmiddels met de VRON en VRZA besproken.=20 Als vergunninghouder van de experimenteervergunning zijn= de verenigingen verantwoordelijk voor de uitvoering van het experimen= t. Zij kunnen individuele radiozendamateurs informeren hoe zij in aanm= erking kunnen komen voor eventuele deelname aan dit experiment.=20 Individuele aanvragen voor een experimenteervergunning voo= r de 500 kHz zullen door Agentschap Telecom niet worden gehonoreerd . Zodra de experimenteervergunningen zijn verleend, maken wi= j dit bekend via deze website.=20 < I just worked PA0A on 502.5kHz with very good signals. 73, Rik ON7YD - OR7T =20 ------=_NextPart_000_006A_01CA8CA1.3F162680 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Michael
Misinformation is dangerous. I was PA= 0A first QSO=20 at midnight 2010, first ever PA amateur QSO on 500 and first PA0A/G3KE= V ie=20 Holland/uk contact.
mal/g3kev
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 M. Sander= s
Sent: Sunday, January 03, 201= 0 5:13=20 PM
Subject: Re: LF: PA0A on 500k= Hz / legal=20 or piracy?

To All LF,
 
Please be informed some Radio Amate= urs in PA have=20 apparently received permissions (via VRZA) to transmi= t=20 501-504kHz, as of Jan first 2010. PA0A has informed me about this an= d I=20 appologise for any possible misunderstandings caused by my= previous=20 email to the reflector. The Dutch Telecom Authorities nor VRZA&= nbsp;have=20 publicised anything on their Internet sites until now and= the VERON=20 members (like myself) have not been informed about anything yet.
 
Congratulations to PA0A are in orde= r for=20 his acheivements!
 
Best Regards / Best 73's
 
Michael Sanders, PC4M.
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 M0F= MT
Sent: Sunday, January 03,= 2010 5:11=20 PM
Subject: Re: LF: PA0A on 50= 0kHz / legal=20 or piracy?

Hi LF
 
I take it that PA0A is one of the non legal stations we= 've been=20 warned about (see below). He was CQing last night and no one= called=20 him although there were several on the band. Not a good idea= to give=20 Pirates a report not sure how it would affect our licence to= use the=20 band?

73 es GL petefmt

--- On Sat, 2/1/10,= M. Sanders=20 <misan@= xs4all.nl>=20 wrote:

From:=20 M. Sanders <misan@xs4all.nl>
Subject: Re: LF: PA0= A on=20 500kHz / legal or piracy?
To: rsgb_lf_group@blacksheep.= org
Cc:=20 pa0shy@veron.nl
Date: Saturday, 2 January, 2010, 1:13
To all LF,
 
Please beware that the of= ficial Dutch=20 Telecom Agency has not yet published the issue of experime= ntal=20 licences for the 600m band tot the Dutch Amateur Radi= o=20 organisations VERON and / or VRZA. For those abl= e to=20 understand Dutch language the most recent official publica= tion is=20 quoted below. However not all their memeber= s seem=20 to have been adequately informed about the= process.=20 It is not even clear if notifications to=20 participate in the experiment by individual Radio=20 Amateurs have already been processed by the=20 organisations.
 
I am most sorry to inform= all LF=20 interested parties via this reflector that the transm= issions=20 like the one recorded below and and therfore&nbs= p;QSO's=20 with PA stations may still be regarded as an act= of 'radio=20 piracy' by the PA stations, transmitting on an= frequency=20 band without official permission. It looks like it is= not=20 'legal' yet to QSO with PA on 600m unit official= =20 publications have been issued by Dutch Telecom Authorities= =20 and VERON and/or VRZA have informed indivual Radio Am= ateurs in=20 writing about their participation to the=20 experiments transmitting on 600m. I suppose a startin= g date=20 somewhere in the future will be in ord= er, and=20 not legalising transmissions 'after the fact' as= of=20 1-1-2010 0:00LET. 
 
Dutch Amateurs have a ric= h history of=20 'illegal' first-QSO's, starting in the 1920's with the fir= st=20 succesful trans Atlantic QSO's from PA. The Radio Amateur,= OM Jesse,=20 was convicted of 'radio piracy' but not fined and the= Judge=20 congratulated him and complimented him on his=20 innovative achievement. History sometimes has the ten= dency to=20 repeat it self.
 
Kind regards, Best 73's,<= /FONT>
 
Michael Sanders, PC4M
 
 
 
 
QUOTE: >>
 
Onderzoek naar toegang to= t 500 KHz voor=20 radiozendamateurs

23-12-2009 

Tijdens het overleg met=20 de belangenverenigingen voor radiozendamateurs VERON en VR= ZA op 7=20 oktober 2009 zijn afspraken gemaakt over de toegang tot de= 500 KHz=20 band. De verenigingen zullen onderzoeken wat de effecten= zijn van=20 het uitzenden in deze frequentieband in relatie tot de=20 randvoorwaarden die voor de WRC 2012 zijn voorgesteld voor= de 500=20 KHz band. De resultaten van het onderzoek worden ingebrach= t bij de=20 nationale voorbereidingscommissie voor de WRC 2012 (NVC).= De=20 verenigingen moeten hiervoor een rapport indienen bij Agen= tschap=20 Telecom.

Om het onderzoek te=20 kunnen uitvoeren vragen de verenigingen een collectieve=20 experimenteervergunning aan bij Agentschap Telecom. Over= de inhoud=20 van de aanvraag van de experimenteervergunning voeren de= =20 verenigingen nog overleg met de co=F6rdinator voor amateur= zaken. De=20 randvoorwaarden voor de aanvraag en de uitvoering van het= experiment=20 zijn inmiddels met de VRON en VRZA besproken. 
=
Als vergunninghouder=20 van de experimenteervergunning zijn de verenigingen verant= woordelijk=20 voor de uitvoering van het experiment. Zij kunnen individu= ele=20 radiozendamateurs informeren hoe zij in aanmerking kunnen= komen voor=20 eventuele deelname aan dit experiment. 

Ind= ividuele=20 aanvragen voor een experimenteervergunning voor de 500 kHz= zullen=20 door Agentschap Telecom niet worden gehonoreerd .
<= /SPAN>
Zodra de=20 experimenteervergunningen zijn verleend, maken wij dit bek= end via=20 deze website.

<<UNQUOTE

= =20

 
----- Original Message= -----
= From: Gary - G4WGT
Sent: Friday, Jan= uary 01,=20 2010 9:13 PM
Subject: Re: LF:= PA0A on=20 500kHz

Rik,=20

Just looked at my grabber saves - this must be the= two of=20 you.

73

Gary - G4WGT

2010/1/1 Rik Strobbe <Rik.Strobbe@fys.kuleuven.be>
I=20 just worked PA0A on 502.5kHz with very good signals.
73,=20 Rik  ON7YD -=20 OR7T



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